October 14, 2025 • 43 mins
From addiction and trauma to spiritual teacher and #1 New York Times bestselling author, Gabby Bernstein's story is one of radical transformation. Known for her soulful guidance and bestselling books like The Universe Has Your Back, Gabby has inspired millions to live with more purpose, peace, and power.
Joined by her longtime friend and collaborator Tara Stiles, founder of Strala Yoga, Gabby sits down with hosts Martin Luther King III, Arndrea Waters King, Marc Kielburger, and Craig Kielburger for a raw and powerful conversation about what it really takes to heal – and stay healed.
Together, they reveal how:
- Hitting rock bottom can be the beginning of your true path
- Relationships mirror our inner wounds—and can help us heal them
- Parenting becomes sacred when we choose humility over perfection
- Trauma lives in the body—and how to listen to what it’s trying to say
- Softness isn’t weakness; it’s where your true strength begins
Don’t miss an episode – subscribe now to catch new episodes every Tuesday and bonus drops every Thursday.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
That day when I was coming down from the drugs
and the alcohol from the night before, and I'm sitting
on my knees in my dirty studio apartment in the
West Village, and I said, God, Universe, whoever's out there,
I need a miracle.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Gabby Bernstein grows from rock bottom to global phenomenon, number
one New York Times best selling author and spiritual teacher,
turning her darkest moments into a mission to help millions.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
That moment was the most terrifying moment and the most
relieving moment.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
From breakdowns to breakthroughs. This is a deeply personal reckoning
with what it takes to truly heal.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
The people that we choose to be in relationship with. Particular,
our romantic partners often are a reflection of our own.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Joined by our best friend and yoga teacher, Terra Styles, I'm.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Ready to fall apart again so I can put myself
back together, because the more we allow ourselves to do that,
the stronger we become.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Join host Martin Luther King the Third, Andrea Waters, k,
Mark Kilberger, and Craig Kilberger for an honest, soul stirring
conversation about breaking cycles, reclaiming purpose, and what it takes
to begin again.
Speaker 4 (01:09):
What did you say to yourself the day before to
say I need to change?
Speaker 1 (01:14):
I still made that twice that my soul.
Speaker 5 (01:16):
Said, Welcome to my legacy. Today's guest is Gabby Bernstein.
Gabby Bernstein has built a global following by opening up
about her personal journey from addiction to trauma to transformation. Gabby,
we are so honored and so excited all of us,
(01:38):
particularly this wonderful woman, to have you with us here today. So, Gabby,
could we ask you to introduce your close friend who
is your plus one here today?
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Well? I love this format, I love being with you guys.
I'm so thrilled to be here. And when I was
invited to ask a plus one to join me, there
was literally no question in my mind that my beloved
soul sister Tara Styles was going to be joining us today.
And Tara is the founder of Stralla Yoga. I'm not
(02:10):
the biggest yogi. I'm not. I like a hit workout,
I like something. I like my deep meditation, and I
like my big hit workouts. The only yoga that I
love is Stralla Yoga. I could say in a two
hours Stralla class with Tara and ask for more. And
so that's my testimonial today for Tara. But she's a
world renowned yogi and spiritual teacher and also one of
(02:33):
my best friends in the world. And have the privilege
of both actually living in towns right next to each
other and having children that are growing up together and
being a spiritual family in our little country town. And
so you're going to see our connection and our shared
love for each other here today. So thank you for
letting me bring my plus one.
Speaker 6 (02:49):
Well, what a beautiful day. I have to tell all
of our listeners and viewers that both of these ladies
live in my phone. I want to start with your
incredible friend, because I know that you've described each other
as lifelines. So, Gabby, how did you meet Tara and
what about her made you think?
Speaker 4 (03:08):
You know?
Speaker 6 (03:09):
I need her in my life.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Tara and I are amongst this community of a generation
of spiritual teachers that started to do things in a
new way, you know, even sort of being named by
in the media as the rebel yogi or the next
generation thought leader. And so it was around it was
in the early two thousands, really around two thousand and
(03:32):
five that my career began as a spiritual teachers we're
talking about twenty years ago, and at the same time
Tara was in the same position, and we were sort
of redefining the rules and expanding the spiritual lexicon and
giving people permission to do it their way and to
have a faith of their own understanding or a yoga
of their own, and to sort of be more flexible
(03:54):
with practice and to translate and demystify spiritual principles in
a way that our generation was going to really get it.
And so, as you can imagine, we really found each
other like magnetized towards each other at that time. And
I believe that in many ways we really grew up
together as teachers because we had a shared mission and
(04:14):
a shared intention, and we found our ways working together
in really beautiful, creative, collaborative ways. And then as we
grew up, we were the kind of friendship where we
could meet up randomly in Berlin and have dinner and
having not haven't seen each other for two years, but
we're both working in Berlin and have this incredible dinner
that we'll never forget. And then fast forward twenty years later,
(04:35):
we live in the same community and this is when
the friendship is just escalated to the point where our children,
our dear friends, our husbands or friends, we will sit
around the kitchen and just make food and do tied
she and the second that I lie on the floor,
it's like I'm a cat around Tara. The second I
(04:56):
sit on the floor, Tara starts giving me adjustments. It's
just the most extraordinary friendship. But the thing I'll say
that that is the most beautiful part of our friendship
is that Tara's tuned into me, and we're tuned to
each other in a frequency that's really special. And at
a time when I was going through a lot in
December and January, out of nowhere, I would get these
(05:17):
voice memos from Tara saying, I want you to know
how much I love you. I want you to know
how proud I am of you. You're serving the world,
You're you know, you keep going, don't stop. You're you're
doing exactly what you need to be doing, or doing
God's work. And she didn't necessarily know, but this was
at moments when I'd be out traveling or really stressed
out or struggling, and then right there her words would
(05:38):
come to me in a text message. Those are the
kinds of friendships that you can't manufacture. There, They're a gift.
They're a gift that you're given. You have to nurture them.
Speaker 6 (05:47):
And those moments too, right moment people just you're thinking
about someone or you just need it, and without words,
they know and you get that. It really is like
a kiss from the ethers as well. I like that
And what it also resonates with me the fact of
stepping into something with all of these preconceived notions. For us,
(06:08):
it is the work of the king legacy, and you know,
the building of the beloved community, and how do you
keep the integrity of that but still do it in
your own way and your own voice and for this generation.
And I think that's something that both of you all
have done so brilliantly. And Tara, I know that you
and Gabby met when she was literally at the beginning
(06:28):
of her spiritual journey. What stood out about her to
you in the early days before her best selling books
and before you know, all of this worldwide fame.
Speaker 7 (06:39):
Oh my gosh, yeah, I see Gabby's you know, whenever
you walk around the street with her, whether somebody knows
her from her books or just sees her.
Speaker 3 (06:50):
She's always kind of coaching and helping and cheering people on.
Speaker 7 (06:53):
She's doing that all the time.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
And you know, back when we were sort of stumping
around New York City trying to figure this out and
help people, she was doing that. So that's the same Gabby,
that same spirit, and I felt very similar. I mean,
we came up before social media. If we had something
we wanted to share with the world, we literally wrote
down a flyer, posted it up in the East village,
(07:16):
stepped a few steps back and said, does anybody care
about this? Does anybody want to get together to connect
with themselves?
Speaker 7 (07:22):
You know, Gabby was doing it in.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
These beautiful ways that I was so impressed with, just
sitting people down in chairs and talking to them about things,
and to me, that was so courageous. I did it,
of course, with yoga mats and help people get into
their bodies and connect and feel. And then we would
chitchat it for a little bit afterwards, but we kept
circling around and finding each other and cheering each other on.
And I think at that time too, we both got
(07:47):
these special gifts. Just like today being around the incredible
people you are, we both got to meet deep Buck
Chopra and Jane Fondon.
Speaker 7 (07:53):
Gabby was all of a sudden.
Speaker 3 (07:54):
Oprah was scooping her up and putting her in you know,
really cool things and these wonderful people.
Speaker 7 (08:00):
Of course they boosted our careers, but they gave us
this emotional courage to stay connected with each other.
Speaker 3 (08:07):
And they kept telling us, you know, sort of behind
the scenes, keep going, stay connected with yourself, keep learning
new things, keep improving what you're doing, but keep going
and stay with each other.
Speaker 7 (08:18):
So I've just held.
Speaker 3 (08:19):
On to Gabby in my whole life, and I feel
my whole life with yoga, life, with trying to do
these things and really help people, and she's, you know,
that root of the tree.
Speaker 7 (08:30):
For me for sure.
Speaker 4 (08:32):
You know, we've seen this incredible movement that you're creating
collectively on places like Oprah, Deepactobra and so forth, But
it wasn't always that easy, and I want to honor
that part too. Gabby, you have gone through a remarkable transformation,
and your transformational journey is nothing short to profound.
Speaker 8 (08:49):
Can you take us back to that time.
Speaker 4 (08:51):
And help our listeners and our viewers understand what that
transformation was like, because in your memoir. You were raw
and you were vulnerable, and you spoke about drug addiction
and then I'll call addiction. You spoke about eating disorders,
you spoke about self loathing. What was that moment of
like hitting that rock bottom that made you change your
perspective as saying I need to have a different life.
Speaker 8 (09:11):
Can you take us back to that moment?
Speaker 1 (09:13):
Yeah, And it's actually a very timely conversation because we're
entering into the fall and I'm coming up on twenty
years of sobriety in October. Yes. Yes, And that commitment
to get clean and sober was not just a commitment
to a life of sobriety, but it was a commitment
(09:34):
to a spiritual life. It was a commitment to becoming
a teacher, to stepping into a higher purpose that I
chose the day October second of two thousand and five
when I made the choice to get clean and sober,
I not only chose a life of sobriety, but I
chose a life of service. That choice was always in
(09:57):
front of me. So there was a peer in my
life when I was really struggling towards the end of
my addiction, and I went and I got a psychic
geting with someone that my mom referred me to, and
the psychic kept saying to me over and over, you're
struggling with addiction. And I would listen to this cassette
tape back over and over, listening to her voice. It
(10:18):
might beat up Toyota Corolla and I'd be doing the
alternate side of the street parking in New York City
and I'd listen to this cassette tape over and over
while I waited for the parking to change over, and
I remember hearing her voice saying, you're struggling with addiction,
and my voice quivering on the other end, saying, well,
it's not that bad. And then she went on and
she said, well, you have two choices in this lifetime.
(10:41):
You can stay on the path that you're on and
it will be very difficult, or you can get clean
and make a major impact on the world. And I
just remember listening to that over and over and over
and being in such a precipice of making that choice.
And I could have gone either way. And I know
(11:01):
that my soul, when I signed up to come to
this world at this time in this way, my soul
made that choice that my soul said, I'm going to
go through this journey of trauma and addiction and discomfort
so that I can resurrect myself in this lifetime and
live to tell what it means to transcend those fear
based worldly experiences and live in that light and that magnitude,
(11:23):
And so I can reflect back now twenty years and
just with so much joy and gratitude for the commitment
and the choice that I made to get clean and sober,
but most importantly for the commitment and the choice that
I've made every single day since to one day at
a time just keep surrendering to a higher power, surrendering
to a spiritual practice, surrendering to a therapeutic journey, so
(11:45):
that I could just keep shining the crystal and get
to the place that I'm met now today, where I
feel very free, and I feel very clear, and I
feel very aligned and the most ready that I've ever
felt before to actually do the serface work that I'm
really here to do.
Speaker 4 (12:00):
Wow, Gabia, that first of all blown away. Collectively, we're
all blown away sitting here. Lots of nods, lots of energy,
lots of love to you, But I understand. October second,
two thousand and five was that date. But take us
back to October first, two thousand and five. What did
you say to yourself, yes the day before, to say,
I need to change because our listeners are viewers may
be stuck on the other side of the road waiting
(12:21):
for parking to change, listening to their version of the cassette.
Speaker 8 (12:24):
And what came through to you to talk to your soul?
Speaker 1 (12:28):
Now, at the time, I had a spiritual awareness. I
was brought up very spiritual, and I had awareness of spirituality,
but I'd really turned my back on it in my
days of my addiction. And so that day when I
was coming down from the drugs and the alcohol from
the night before, and I'm sitting on my knees in
my dirty, my dirty studio apartment in the West Village,
and I'm on my knees and I said a prayer.
(12:50):
But at the time I didn't know who I was
talking to. And I said, God, Universe, whoever's out there,
I need a miracle. And I heard a inner voice,
a voice speaking to me through me, say get clean
and you will live a life beyond your wildest dreams.
And that voice was so undeniable that I made the
(13:16):
choice that day to get my butt out the door,
walked into a twelve step room, sat amongst strangers who
felt like brothers and sisters because we were all there
for the same reason, very different archetypes in one room,
all with the same intention, And I knew I'd found
my home, and I knew I'd found my path. That
inner voice, that voice of wisdom, that voice of spiritual
(13:38):
console connection, is a voice that I rely on. It's
a voice that I've developed as a medium. It's a
voice that I attuned to and that I listened to
and I allow guide my life to this day. But
that was a real spiritual intervention that came through for
me to put me on the right truck.
Speaker 8 (13:53):
Wow, thank you, Tara.
Speaker 9 (13:55):
You've become one of the most influential and inspiring yoga
instructors in the world. I know my wife loves you.
Early in your career. What's something you had to unlearn
to find your own voice?
Speaker 3 (14:10):
I think the the one big thing that I'm continuing
to learn is to reject rigidity, dogma, stress, force, push
and struggle. And it's funny because when I come over
to Gabby's how she says, I lean lean on her
and do these things for her. But you know, I
(14:32):
think most of us that and you probably identify with
this as well. Most of us that try to teach something,
we need to do it for ourselves too. So I
lean on people so I can remember to soften myself
that rigidity I used to, you know, when I first
started out. You know, Gabby and I both got a
lot of you know, this rebel yoga kind of punk
(14:53):
rock press, and we both identified abusers.
Speaker 7 (14:58):
And control and a system. You know that you will
educate us on, and we try our.
Speaker 3 (15:03):
Best to fight back and to call out things that
are bad out there. You know, there's plenty of bad
in the yoga community as well. But it took me
a long time to realize there's a lot of rigidity,
stress and tension and stuff in the inside that continues
to need to be addressed with every single breath. So
that's something that I've worked on the moment that identified
(15:25):
that the rigidity out there, the chaos and the violence
out there, is also in here, and we need that
inner peace.
Speaker 7 (15:32):
With every moment, every breath.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
And that's something that I that gives me a voice,
that gives me something to talk about, to share about
to practice and connect with that, that connection to the
choice and the action of softness.
Speaker 6 (15:46):
That the idea of softness, the idea I think a
lot about the idea of power versus force, you know,
in this world where it's so forceful, but there is
a true power in that softness as well. Yeah, and
I know all three of us are mothers, and I
(16:08):
don't know for you all. We have a seventeen year
old daughter starting her senior year of high school. And
for me, as someone that has been a seeker and
on spiritual journeys for so long, there is nothing like
motherhood that will try your spirituality on every level. Gabby,
(16:31):
as a mother, what has surprised you the most?
Speaker 1 (16:36):
Being a mother is a very humbling experience because you
think you've learned all these great personal development tools.
Speaker 10 (16:46):
You know, you write the books about it, you get
on the stage and you give lots of talks, and
then you enter your home with your six year old
and you realize how little you know and how much
growth and opportunity there is every single day, in every
waking moment with your child. So for me, I remember
(17:09):
making the decision to really be a student with my
kid and let my kid be my guru.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
I remember the day that my child was born. I
got a text message from doctor Shefali, who's a tremendous
therapist and particularly in the space of parenting, and she said,
welcome to the world, your new guru. And she couldn't
have been more accurate, because the choices that I'm making
as a parent are spiritually guided choices. And well, I
(17:36):
may be leaning into specific therapeutic practices and philosophies that
have transformed my relationship with my child, they're spiritually led
because there's moments where I remember, at different stages of
his development, I've been on my knees like what do
I do here? And then this beautiful message would come
through a podcast or I would get a text from
(17:59):
a friend who's this child psychologists. So I feel that
guidance and that wisdom always around me and I use it.
I use it, I ask and I and it's given
and I show up for it. The more foundational knowledge
I get, and the more humble I am that I
do not know the answers, and the more teachable I am,
the easier it is for me to navigate parenting. Because
(18:20):
there's there's there's real truth in the psychology of a
child and the psychology of the parent child dynamic and
to be able to create that that's that's that calm
and that stability and that self led energy. And I'm
also while I'm a spiritual teacher, I'm also I'm also
trained in a therapy called internal family Systems therapy, which
is all about healing the inner children inside of us.
(18:44):
And so the greatest gift I've given my child is
the devotional practice of my inner child healing. Because the
more I heal the burden parts of myself, the more
access I have to my inner parent, that self energy
of compassion and calm and clarity and connectedness. And in
that energy I can be a great stable force for
(19:06):
him to coregulate with. So it's a balance of being
humble and doing the therapeutic work to be a parent, but
also the inner work to repaarent myself so that I
can show up with the greatest energy.
Speaker 6 (19:20):
And let me just say that the older they get,
I always say that being a mother is like literally
putting taking your heart and putting it outside your body.
Speaker 4 (19:29):
And the older they get, the more of a guru
they become, the better teachers they become right.
Speaker 6 (19:34):
It depends on the.
Speaker 1 (19:34):
Time seventeen year old girl I was like exactly.
Speaker 2 (19:40):
Exactly exactly coming up the childhood memory that nearly broke
Gabby Bernstein, how facing it led her to the most
powerful way she could show up as a mother.
Speaker 6 (19:54):
Now back to my legacy.
Speaker 5 (19:56):
I love the idea that it's both archchildren and candiate
our life partners, the relationships we have that are a
gurus in our lives, like I've learned, like we've been lucky.
In this podcast, we sit down with Deepak Choprah, Gavera Mitte,
all these great people, which is incredible wisdom, present company
very much included. But it is our relationships. It's the
people closest in our life is holding our child or children,
(20:18):
it's our loved ones. And so if Gaby I could ask,
as you reflect on your child as your guru, or
reflect on those relationships closest to you, what have those
connections taught you that no traditional spiritual practice, no dogmatic
spiritual practice to already use your words, ever, could I think.
Speaker 1 (20:38):
That the people that we choose to be in relationship with,
particular romantic partners often are a reflection of our own
shadow parts. So they can be at times a false
match for the parts of ourselves that we may feel
are incomplete, and then when you come together with those partners,
(21:01):
those incomplete parts can be activated. And the beauty of
that is that if you are in a partnership where
there's a choice, once again, let's use the word choice,
to grow together, and to heal together, and to develop together,
you can together allow those triggered sparks that happen in
the relationship be your greatest learning device. So for myself
(21:24):
and my husband, we've had the willingness to be the
witness of the ways that we can activate those younger
wounded parts of ourselves and then together join and healing.
And I'm really quite one of the things I'm most
proud of in my life actually is the therapeutic work
I've done with my husband, which has been very very
spiritual work, but very devotional work of staying in it
(21:47):
even in the hard moments, staying committed, even when everything
seems like it's breaking down, because like I said earlier,
our wounded parts of ourselves oftentimes have these false pretenses
that some other human can be the source of healing,
that someone outside of us can fill that hole. When
we really find that we come together with the partner
(22:09):
that's going to actually activate those parts the most so
that the hole can be filled through the greater healing.
And that, for me has been my experience. It's been
not about filling a hole, but actually filling that energy
together through collective healing and through witnessing and through the
(22:30):
It's almost like you tighttright in and come out a
little bit in and a little bit out, so that
you're not just ripping off the band aid all at once,
but you're allowing the collective healing to happen over time,
and then you wake up one day and you're like, wow,
we're new, We're in a different place. This is a miracle.
So if you can look at your relationships through that lens,
(22:50):
whether it be a marriage, whether it be a business partnership,
whether it be a child, and instead of saying this
is such a difficult relationship, I can't stand this, look
at the difficult relationships or the difficult moments in your
life and say thank you for being my greatest learning
device and then show up for it.
Speaker 6 (23:06):
Gabby, I want to talk a little bit about you
just mentioned healing, the collective healing, but I want to
turn to your childhood and something devastating that you didn't
remember until thirty years later. I too was molested as
(23:26):
a child, and so I know that path of healing,
even though we're all so unique in individuals and our
paths are unique. But your memories of being molested as
a child came flooding back to you doing a therapy session, right,
So what shifted for you in those sessions to allow
(23:51):
that memory to come back.
Speaker 1 (23:54):
Well, it was around the time I was thirty six
years old and I was newly married. My husband had
left his job of a decade to come work with me.
A lot of the sort of structural things that were
holding things together were being dismantled, and so there was
a little bit of a shakiness in my life. And
I remember the months leading up to remembering, I kept
saying this mantra over and over, I can't go on
(24:16):
like this. And I was having these mental breakdowns, and
I was having numbness in my body and these gastrointestinal
issues and just panic attacks and just night sweats and
just consistent somatic signs of chaos. But I couldn't really
put my finger on it. And then I had a dream,
(24:36):
and in the dream, I remembered the sexual abuse from
my childhood. I woke up that morning with such a
strong knowing not, oh wow, that was a terrible dream,
but that is real. That is real. That has been
given to me as a reminder. But it was so
(24:56):
terrifying and re traumatizing that I just pushed it down
and just let's say, let's lock that back up. And
a week later, I was in my therapy and on
my therapist sofa, lying down. She just asked one question
that just reactivated and triggered me to fully embrace and
accept that memory. And that moment was the most terrifying
(25:20):
moment and the most relieving moment at the same time.
The terror of accepting an exiled memory that I had
dissociated from and pushed down and numbed out for decades,
but the relief simultaneously of recognizing that's why I was
a drug addict, That's why I was a workaholic. That's
(25:42):
why I'm hypervigil at. That's why I have an anxiety disorder.
That's why I have chronic gastrone testinal issues. That's why,
that's why, that's why, that's why, that's which is all
the answers just flooding in for me, that moment was
so so scary. And it was actually at a time
when I wrote my most profound work, which is my
book The Universe Has Your Back. I would wake up
(26:04):
every day in complete terror because I was reactivated into
the trauma and I didn't really it was on a
big trauma journey to uncover this and to heal, but
it took a long time. So it was sort of
catapulted out of my body and very much re traumatized
by remembering this. And the only thing I had at
that time as an anchor was my writing. So I'd
wake up every day with these pangs of anxiety, and
(26:26):
I'd go up to my little office at the time,
and it was this whitewashed room with these white floors
and this white ceiling, and I'd sit at this little
desk and I just kept writing and writing and writing.
And I wrote that book to heal myself. That's why
I know that that book is the one that through
all throughout the world, if I meet people in any
country and any airport, they read The Universe Has Your
Back and the Why because it healed me and in
(26:50):
the healing transmission that that book gave me, that it
healed others. And so the memory, once again, while horrific
as it was, and it was probably the it was
a difficult time of my life, was the most important time
of my life because it was a rebirthing. It was
a time of saying, this is the lowest that we
can be. Let's get back up from here.
Speaker 6 (27:10):
That story and your process reminds me sometimes as Rumy says,
are the lightest where our wounds.
Speaker 1 (27:19):
The wound is the place where the light enters exactly.
Speaker 6 (27:22):
And what that also brings up or remembering for me
is that so many times when my father in law,
when your father was at some of his lowest moments,
he would literally go up and preach himself out of
being in despair, depression or you know, so you go
and you think or you see, some of his greatest
(27:44):
speeches was because he was at his lowest emotionally. And
it seems that you were writing yourself through your healing
and taking so many others with you.
Speaker 5 (27:57):
Scrolling won't change your life, but subscribing just might tap
that button and stay connected to conversations that can't. Now
back to my legacy, Gabby.
Speaker 4 (28:09):
On that journey you have spoken about how somebody we're
a big fan of as well, and I want to
give him the love that he deserves.
Speaker 8 (28:16):
Here, Gabor Matte helped.
Speaker 4 (28:18):
You, and I really want to encourage people to read
some of his books at some point. The myth of
normal when the body says no. These are incredible seminal
works in my mind in terms of people going on
their own healing journey, and for those who do not
fully understand or maybe not fully appreciate the connection between
childhood wounds. So as you were as a child, what
(28:41):
happened to you traumatic events as a child, and how
you are now conducting yourself as an adult in terms
of adult behaviors. Help us understand that connection.
Speaker 1 (28:49):
I'll speak to it from the work of also internal
family systems therapy, which is another guide of mine, which
is doctor Richard Schwortz. So I highly recommend you guys
bring on the show. I'll introduce you to Dick uh
So So Richard Towards, a brother and contemporary of Gobramante
and Peter Levine, and they all kind of collectively heal
these these incredible soul teachers, these men and women uh
(29:12):
and and from an IFS perspective, the the traumatized moment
was a moment from a spiritual place. We can quota
course in miracles. It's from the descent from magnitude to littleness.
It's it's when when when we forgot to laugh. And
it's these moments when when our little child brain gets
(29:35):
the memo that there is terror, that there is fear,
that there is extreme circumstances, that we are not safe,
that we are alone, that we are unlovable, that we
are inadequate, and as little children, our brains do not
have the capacity to process those big emotions so very quickly.
What we do is we exile those feelings and beliefs
(29:55):
and we push them down, we lock them up, and
these are what an i f S are called exiled part.
We say Nope, not going to deal with that, not
going to touch that, and it's under lock and key.
And at a very very young age, even as an
infant or one year old, two year old three, we
start building up protection mechanisms which are called protector parts.
And so what do these protection mechanisms look like? They
(30:17):
look like maybe in my case, hypervigilance and control. Because
I was a little child that felt so out of
control that I was going to start controlling everything around
me to feel safe. Or it could look like the
child that feels so inadequate starts to become a people
pleaser because they feel like if I'm not loved unless
I'm pleasing, or the child that feels so in soo
(30:38):
much terror shuts down and numbs out and starts using
sugar or shows or games to just check out. And
these protection mechanisms never leave us. They become protector parts
that begin to run the show that is our life,
and we start to live as adults from protector part
to protector part to protector part. And if you think
(30:59):
all of us here on this call right now, if
you think about the parts of yourselves that are the
most extreme, or the parts of yourselves that you're often like, oh,
there it is again. It's a habit or a pattern
or belief that just won't go away. You know that's's
holding you back. And you think about those parts of
yourselves and you ask yourself, how long has this been around?
(31:20):
Likely you're going to say forever, as long as I
can remember, because we build up these protection mechanisms so
that we never have to face the impermissible feelings of
those traumas, and so the genuine healing, the real root
cause healing, begins by healing and befriending these protection mechanisms
(31:40):
and softening to them, like Tera might say, softening, just
gently softening into these protection mechanisms, getting into relationship with them,
as we were talking about earlier. Those are the inner children,
These innered children that are just working on overdrive to
protect us from having to feel that inciting incident of trauma.
Speaker 4 (32:03):
So keby when somebody comes to you, taking that knowledge
of somebody being in survival mode, they're disconnected there on
edges that are reactive, reactive, whatever that might be. What's
the first thing they needed to do. What's the first
thing that you would tell them to do?
Speaker 1 (32:17):
Okay, so I would first tell them to choose to
check in instead of check out, so in my presence
or even in a safe environment for themselves to focus
their attention inward. Because our knee jerk reaction is I
don't want to feel this. I'm going to go run
to the refrigerator. I'm going to go numb out on YouTube.
I'm going to go pick up that drink. I'm going
to run instead of running and checking out check in.
(32:40):
That's step one, and so you focus your attention inward.
And then the second step is to become curious, just
offering some curiosity inside and noticing where does this feeling
live in my body? And what do I know about it?
You know, are there any thoughts or sensations or images
or stories that come forward for me? And the third
(33:02):
step is compassionate connection. And that's when you'd ask yourself
or the part of you, what do you need? Asking
the little child inside of you, what do you need?
And if you go through those three steps in one
minute or more, the fourth step is revealed. You might
check in, and you check in to the fourth step
(33:22):
and you say, well, how do I feel right now?
And you'll notice maybe I feel more calm, maybe I
feel more connected to that part of myself. Oftentimes people
will say I feel more compassion towards that part of myself.
And so these se qualities of compassion and calm and
connection and clarity and courage and confidence. This is what
(33:43):
in IFS is known as self with a capital S.
It's our spirit, It's the God within us, is the
internal parent within us, is the internal teacher, the inner
healer inside. That true self is revealed when we help
these activated parts of ourselves calm and settle. There's a
quick way of describing the process, but it's an internal
(34:07):
check in rather than check out.
Speaker 8 (34:08):
Wow, thank you, so check in, check in, check in.
Speaker 9 (34:13):
Tara, what was it like for you as her friend
watching her go through that realization and that pain.
Speaker 3 (34:22):
I think it's such a gift to have a friend
who's willing to check in instead of check out the
thing around Gabby. If she has a crisis, that's an
exciting moment, you know, like she shared when she was
on her therapist couch, sharing that that's the goal, that's
the stuff that we're I'm comfortable there because I know
(34:43):
she's okay. She's not okay when she's checked out. None
of us are okay. When we're checked out. We kind
of appear okay to ourselves, to the world. We're holding on,
we're sort of getting by, we're doing the things. But
when we break down, when we're vulnerable. We all love
that about each each other. You know, when your best
friend calls and said, I've got this horrible problem. You know,
(35:05):
we don't really rush in and try to solve it.
We just we'd love to listen. We love to be there,
we love to connect and be together. So whenever Gabby
calls me and she's like, this is going on or
I can just you know, sometimes with your friends, you
just feel it intuitively, and I send her some other
random voice note about how much I love her. How
you know, I am so grateful that she is available
and is excited to dive into these situations. And it
(35:29):
gives other people permission. It gives me permission. You know,
I do this work too, But when you have a
friend that does it, you say, Okay, where's my next
fault line. I'm ready to fall apart again so I
can put myself back together. Because the more we allow
ourselves to do that, the stronger we become.
Speaker 7 (35:46):
And I love that concept that softness is.
Speaker 3 (35:51):
Power, and when we're relaxed and calm and soft, we
have so much more to give. When we're rigid and
stiff and protecting ourselves, we feel in control, but we're
really so.
Speaker 7 (36:03):
Close to burning out, and we're not.
Speaker 3 (36:06):
Going to be ever able to even reach our full potential,
even when we're sort of tricked into it by this
feeling of stress and struggle and accomplishment. So I get
excited whenever Gabby's having a moment because it allows allows
her to have a moment, allows me to have a moment,
and you know she's going to come back stronger and
so much more happens.
Speaker 9 (36:25):
Wow, that's amazing, Yabby. How to Terror show up for
you in your toughest moments?
Speaker 1 (36:32):
Well, I think that she continues to. I think that
that what Terror just said that's so beautiful is that
when I'm going through something difficult, it's an exciting moment.
I love that that way of perceiving one difficult moments
in general, but also my take on difficult moments because
for me, the critical moments in my life have been
(36:54):
like like you said earlier, the wound, where the plate light,
where the light enters, the breaking down to break through.
So it is those those moments that are the juicy
moments where you know you're on the precipice of another
up leveling or of a new experience. And so having
a friend that is a stable energy in your life,
(37:18):
who you know that you can rely on, who you
know is energetically there even when you're not speaking to them,
who you know will be a phone call away or
a ten minute drive away to lean on, to rely
on is one of the absolute most incredible gifts of
my lifetime having a friend like Tara. Having a friend
(37:41):
like that not only is so soothing to my nervous
system and I know that it is mutual, but it's
also this incredible reflection. You know, I really look at
the rise of our friendship and how close we've become
in the recent years, and I see it's such a
reflection of both where we both are. The devotional commitment
(38:03):
to service, the devotional commitment to spiritual development, the devotional
commitment to softening. To have a friend like that is
also a reflection of where you're at in your life.
The people that we surround ourselves with are a mirror
of who we are, and so to be able to
say this is my plus one today, guys, that's a
pat on my own back, right, that's a go girl.
(38:26):
You know I'm doing pretty good and that's my plus one.
Speaker 4 (38:30):
You're both voices who inspire people to seek wellness, seek guidance,
and to truly protect their peace. Tara, what about you,
what do you do to protect your piece?
Speaker 3 (38:43):
Oh? My goodness, Well, if it's all right with you?
Can I lead us through about a thirty second little
thing to experience inner piece.
Speaker 7 (38:52):
Oh, thank you so much, wow, so grateful.
Speaker 3 (38:56):
So you know, I think it's practiced, or at least
something to do these many things to do is have
a bit of a brief practice. So wherever you are
and where everybody at home is listening, finding a place
where you're actually comfortable. And something that yoga in Taichi
teaches us is to never suffer a bad position. So
(39:17):
if you can get more comfortable, simply do it. Don't
suffer here, So you can roll around a bit side
to side or easy for it and back. It can
be any direction that feels right for you, and simply,
like a tree responding to the breeze, allow yourself to
(39:40):
find that nice centered place and simply notice how you feel,
without trying to change or fix anything at all. Notice
what's going on with you right now, what's happening physically, mentally, emotionally,
(40:03):
simply noticed and let your whole self soften here. So first,
a bit movable, a bit of a bend in your
physical places, your joints, your knees, your elbows, your mechanical
body parts that keep us moving around and keep us
living our lives. And let your whole self soften that mental, emotional, enigmatic,
(40:31):
spiritual part of you, AH, your whole self everything together
AH soften here and simply notice what happens. Your breath
starting to move you, every inhale.
Speaker 7 (40:48):
Expanding making more room.
Speaker 3 (40:50):
And every exhale release relax moving you a bit inward
your breath, helping you be in harmony.
Speaker 7 (41:05):
Simply notice how you feel.
Speaker 3 (41:10):
And either eyes opened or closed, or to notice a
bit what's happening around you and how you relate to
your environment. If there's people around you, if there's objects
or animals, notice that you're a part of everything happening
around you. Coming back to simply noticing how you feel.
(41:32):
One more big breath together, big and hell long, excel
easy and that's simple. I think that's a simple way
to come back to that hopefully inner peace, or at
(41:52):
least noticing what's happening with us so we can make
a good choice to take better care and if they
can take better care of ourselves, we have a better
chance to use our gifts for good and use that
higher good.
Speaker 8 (42:05):
Thank you, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 6 (42:08):
What came to me is that so sometimes peace and
harmony is just a few breaths away.
Speaker 7 (42:15):
So beautiful, beautiful.
Speaker 5 (42:16):
It has been a lightening, beautiful conversation. The friendship that
you two have. I love how it dates back at
decades and just to reflect back subtly finding our daily prayer,
humbly surrendering and asking what miracles can we perform today?
Thank you both so much for your incredible wisdom and
(42:39):
life work.
Speaker 1 (42:40):
Thank you, guys the beautiful, Thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (42:45):
Thank you for joining us. If you enjoy today's conversation, subscribe, share,
and follow us on at my Legacy movement on social
media and YouTube. New episodes drop every Tuesday, with bonus
content every Thursday. This podcast honors doctor King's vision of
the beloved community and the power of connection. A Legacy
(43:07):
Plus Studio production distributed by iHeartMedia creator and executive producer
Suzanne Hayward come executive producer Lisa Lyle. Listen on the
iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.
That day when I was coming down from the drugs
and the alcohol from the night before, and I'm sitting
on my knees in my dirty studio apartment in the
West Village, and I said, God, Universe, whoever's out there,
I need a miracle.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Gabby Bernstein grows from rock bottom to global phenomenon, number
one New York Times best selling author and spiritual teacher,
turning her darkest moments into a mission to help millions.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
That moment was the most terrifying moment and the most
relieving moment.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
From breakdowns to breakthroughs. This is a deeply personal reckoning
with what it takes to truly heal.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
The people that we choose to be in relationship with. Particular,
our romantic partners often are a reflection of our own.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Joined by our best friend and yoga teacher, Terra Styles, I'm.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Ready to fall apart again so I can put myself
back together, because the more we allow ourselves to do that,
the stronger we become.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Join host Martin Luther King the Third, Andrea Waters, k,
Mark Kilberger, and Craig Kilberger for an honest, soul stirring
conversation about breaking cycles, reclaiming purpose, and what it takes
to begin again.
Speaker 4 (01:09):
What did you say to yourself the day before to
say I need to change?
Speaker 1 (01:14):
I still made that twice that my soul.
Speaker 5 (01:16):
Said, Welcome to my legacy. Today's guest is Gabby Bernstein.
Gabby Bernstein has built a global following by opening up
about her personal journey from addiction to trauma to transformation. Gabby,
we are so honored and so excited all of us,
(01:38):
particularly this wonderful woman, to have you with us here today. So, Gabby,
could we ask you to introduce your close friend who
is your plus one here today?
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Well? I love this format, I love being with you guys.
I'm so thrilled to be here. And when I was
invited to ask a plus one to join me, there
was literally no question in my mind that my beloved
soul sister Tara Styles was going to be joining us today.
And Tara is the founder of Stralla Yoga. I'm not
(02:10):
the biggest yogi. I'm not. I like a hit workout,
I like something. I like my deep meditation, and I
like my big hit workouts. The only yoga that I
love is Stralla Yoga. I could say in a two
hours Stralla class with Tara and ask for more. And
so that's my testimonial today for Tara. But she's a
world renowned yogi and spiritual teacher and also one of
(02:33):
my best friends in the world. And have the privilege
of both actually living in towns right next to each
other and having children that are growing up together and
being a spiritual family in our little country town. And
so you're going to see our connection and our shared
love for each other here today. So thank you for
letting me bring my plus one.
Speaker 6 (02:49):
Well, what a beautiful day. I have to tell all
of our listeners and viewers that both of these ladies
live in my phone. I want to start with your
incredible friend, because I know that you've described each other
as lifelines. So, Gabby, how did you meet Tara and
what about her made you think?
Speaker 4 (03:08):
You know?
Speaker 6 (03:09):
I need her in my life.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Tara and I are amongst this community of a generation
of spiritual teachers that started to do things in a
new way, you know, even sort of being named by
in the media as the rebel yogi or the next
generation thought leader. And so it was around it was
in the early two thousands, really around two thousand and
(03:32):
five that my career began as a spiritual teachers we're
talking about twenty years ago, and at the same time
Tara was in the same position, and we were sort
of redefining the rules and expanding the spiritual lexicon and
giving people permission to do it their way and to
have a faith of their own understanding or a yoga
of their own, and to sort of be more flexible
(03:54):
with practice and to translate and demystify spiritual principles in
a way that our generation was going to really get it.
And so, as you can imagine, we really found each
other like magnetized towards each other at that time. And
I believe that in many ways we really grew up
together as teachers because we had a shared mission and
(04:14):
a shared intention, and we found our ways working together
in really beautiful, creative, collaborative ways. And then as we
grew up, we were the kind of friendship where we
could meet up randomly in Berlin and have dinner and
having not haven't seen each other for two years, but
we're both working in Berlin and have this incredible dinner
that we'll never forget. And then fast forward twenty years later,
(04:35):
we live in the same community and this is when
the friendship is just escalated to the point where our children,
our dear friends, our husbands or friends, we will sit
around the kitchen and just make food and do tied
she and the second that I lie on the floor,
it's like I'm a cat around Tara. The second I
(04:56):
sit on the floor, Tara starts giving me adjustments. It's
just the most extraordinary friendship. But the thing I'll say
that that is the most beautiful part of our friendship
is that Tara's tuned into me, and we're tuned to
each other in a frequency that's really special. And at
a time when I was going through a lot in
December and January, out of nowhere, I would get these
(05:17):
voice memos from Tara saying, I want you to know
how much I love you. I want you to know
how proud I am of you. You're serving the world,
You're you know, you keep going, don't stop. You're you're
doing exactly what you need to be doing, or doing
God's work. And she didn't necessarily know, but this was
at moments when I'd be out traveling or really stressed
out or struggling, and then right there her words would
(05:38):
come to me in a text message. Those are the
kinds of friendships that you can't manufacture. There, They're a gift.
They're a gift that you're given. You have to nurture them.
Speaker 6 (05:47):
And those moments too, right moment people just you're thinking
about someone or you just need it, and without words,
they know and you get that. It really is like
a kiss from the ethers as well. I like that
And what it also resonates with me the fact of
stepping into something with all of these preconceived notions. For us,
(06:08):
it is the work of the king legacy, and you know,
the building of the beloved community, and how do you
keep the integrity of that but still do it in
your own way and your own voice and for this generation.
And I think that's something that both of you all
have done so brilliantly. And Tara, I know that you
and Gabby met when she was literally at the beginning
(06:28):
of her spiritual journey. What stood out about her to
you in the early days before her best selling books
and before you know, all of this worldwide fame.
Speaker 7 (06:39):
Oh my gosh, yeah, I see Gabby's you know, whenever
you walk around the street with her, whether somebody knows
her from her books or just sees her.
Speaker 3 (06:50):
She's always kind of coaching and helping and cheering people on.
Speaker 7 (06:53):
She's doing that all the time.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
And you know, back when we were sort of stumping
around New York City trying to figure this out and
help people, she was doing that. So that's the same Gabby,
that same spirit, and I felt very similar. I mean,
we came up before social media. If we had something
we wanted to share with the world, we literally wrote
down a flyer, posted it up in the East village,
(07:16):
stepped a few steps back and said, does anybody care
about this? Does anybody want to get together to connect
with themselves?
Speaker 7 (07:22):
You know, Gabby was doing it in.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
These beautiful ways that I was so impressed with, just
sitting people down in chairs and talking to them about things,
and to me, that was so courageous. I did it,
of course, with yoga mats and help people get into
their bodies and connect and feel. And then we would
chitchat it for a little bit afterwards, but we kept
circling around and finding each other and cheering each other on.
And I think at that time too, we both got
(07:47):
these special gifts. Just like today being around the incredible
people you are, we both got to meet deep Buck
Chopra and Jane Fondon.
Speaker 7 (07:53):
Gabby was all of a sudden.
Speaker 3 (07:54):
Oprah was scooping her up and putting her in you know,
really cool things and these wonderful people.
Speaker 7 (08:00):
Of course they boosted our careers, but they gave us
this emotional courage to stay connected with each other.
Speaker 3 (08:07):
And they kept telling us, you know, sort of behind
the scenes, keep going, stay connected with yourself, keep learning
new things, keep improving what you're doing, but keep going
and stay with each other.
Speaker 7 (08:18):
So I've just held.
Speaker 3 (08:19):
On to Gabby in my whole life, and I feel
my whole life with yoga, life, with trying to do
these things and really help people, and she's, you know,
that root of the tree.
Speaker 7 (08:30):
For me for sure.
Speaker 4 (08:32):
You know, we've seen this incredible movement that you're creating
collectively on places like Oprah, Deepactobra and so forth, But
it wasn't always that easy, and I want to honor
that part too. Gabby, you have gone through a remarkable transformation,
and your transformational journey is nothing short to profound.
Speaker 8 (08:49):
Can you take us back to that time.
Speaker 4 (08:51):
And help our listeners and our viewers understand what that
transformation was like, because in your memoir. You were raw
and you were vulnerable, and you spoke about drug addiction
and then I'll call addiction. You spoke about eating disorders,
you spoke about self loathing. What was that moment of
like hitting that rock bottom that made you change your
perspective as saying I need to have a different life.
Speaker 8 (09:11):
Can you take us back to that moment?
Speaker 1 (09:13):
Yeah, And it's actually a very timely conversation because we're
entering into the fall and I'm coming up on twenty
years of sobriety in October. Yes. Yes, And that commitment
to get clean and sober was not just a commitment
to a life of sobriety, but it was a commitment
(09:34):
to a spiritual life. It was a commitment to becoming
a teacher, to stepping into a higher purpose that I
chose the day October second of two thousand and five
when I made the choice to get clean and sober,
I not only chose a life of sobriety, but I
chose a life of service. That choice was always in
(09:57):
front of me. So there was a peer in my
life when I was really struggling towards the end of
my addiction, and I went and I got a psychic
geting with someone that my mom referred me to, and
the psychic kept saying to me over and over, you're
struggling with addiction. And I would listen to this cassette
tape back over and over, listening to her voice. It
(10:18):
might beat up Toyota Corolla and I'd be doing the
alternate side of the street parking in New York City
and I'd listen to this cassette tape over and over
while I waited for the parking to change over, and
I remember hearing her voice saying, you're struggling with addiction,
and my voice quivering on the other end, saying, well,
it's not that bad. And then she went on and
she said, well, you have two choices in this lifetime.
(10:41):
You can stay on the path that you're on and
it will be very difficult, or you can get clean
and make a major impact on the world. And I
just remember listening to that over and over and over
and being in such a precipice of making that choice.
And I could have gone either way. And I know
(11:01):
that my soul, when I signed up to come to
this world at this time in this way, my soul
made that choice that my soul said, I'm going to
go through this journey of trauma and addiction and discomfort
so that I can resurrect myself in this lifetime and
live to tell what it means to transcend those fear
based worldly experiences and live in that light and that magnitude,
(11:23):
And so I can reflect back now twenty years and
just with so much joy and gratitude for the commitment
and the choice that I made to get clean and sober,
but most importantly for the commitment and the choice that
I've made every single day since to one day at
a time just keep surrendering to a higher power, surrendering
to a spiritual practice, surrendering to a therapeutic journey, so
(11:45):
that I could just keep shining the crystal and get
to the place that I'm met now today, where I
feel very free, and I feel very clear, and I
feel very aligned and the most ready that I've ever
felt before to actually do the serface work that I'm
really here to do.
Speaker 4 (12:00):
Wow, Gabia, that first of all blown away. Collectively, we're
all blown away sitting here. Lots of nods, lots of energy,
lots of love to you, But I understand. October second,
two thousand and five was that date. But take us
back to October first, two thousand and five. What did
you say to yourself, yes the day before, to say,
I need to change because our listeners are viewers may
be stuck on the other side of the road waiting
(12:21):
for parking to change, listening to their version of the cassette.
Speaker 8 (12:24):
And what came through to you to talk to your soul?
Speaker 1 (12:28):
Now, at the time, I had a spiritual awareness. I
was brought up very spiritual, and I had awareness of spirituality,
but I'd really turned my back on it in my
days of my addiction. And so that day when I
was coming down from the drugs and the alcohol from
the night before, and I'm sitting on my knees in
my dirty, my dirty studio apartment in the West Village,
and I'm on my knees and I said a prayer.
(12:50):
But at the time I didn't know who I was
talking to. And I said, God, Universe, whoever's out there,
I need a miracle. And I heard a inner voice,
a voice speaking to me through me, say get clean
and you will live a life beyond your wildest dreams.
And that voice was so undeniable that I made the
(13:16):
choice that day to get my butt out the door,
walked into a twelve step room, sat amongst strangers who
felt like brothers and sisters because we were all there
for the same reason, very different archetypes in one room,
all with the same intention, And I knew I'd found
my home, and I knew I'd found my path. That
inner voice, that voice of wisdom, that voice of spiritual
(13:38):
console connection, is a voice that I rely on. It's
a voice that I've developed as a medium. It's a
voice that I attuned to and that I listened to
and I allow guide my life to this day. But
that was a real spiritual intervention that came through for
me to put me on the right truck.
Speaker 8 (13:53):
Wow, thank you, Tara.
Speaker 9 (13:55):
You've become one of the most influential and inspiring yoga
instructors in the world. I know my wife loves you.
Early in your career. What's something you had to unlearn
to find your own voice?
Speaker 3 (14:10):
I think the the one big thing that I'm continuing
to learn is to reject rigidity, dogma, stress, force, push
and struggle. And it's funny because when I come over
to Gabby's how she says, I lean lean on her
and do these things for her. But you know, I
(14:32):
think most of us that and you probably identify with
this as well. Most of us that try to teach something,
we need to do it for ourselves too. So I
lean on people so I can remember to soften myself
that rigidity I used to, you know, when I first
started out. You know, Gabby and I both got a
lot of you know, this rebel yoga kind of punk
(14:53):
rock press, and we both identified abusers.
Speaker 7 (14:58):
And control and a system. You know that you will
educate us on, and we try our.
Speaker 3 (15:03):
Best to fight back and to call out things that
are bad out there. You know, there's plenty of bad
in the yoga community as well. But it took me
a long time to realize there's a lot of rigidity,
stress and tension and stuff in the inside that continues
to need to be addressed with every single breath. So
that's something that I've worked on the moment that identified
(15:25):
that the rigidity out there, the chaos and the violence
out there, is also in here, and we need that
inner peace.
Speaker 7 (15:32):
With every moment, every breath.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
And that's something that I that gives me a voice,
that gives me something to talk about, to share about
to practice and connect with that, that connection to the
choice and the action of softness.
Speaker 6 (15:46):
That the idea of softness, the idea I think a
lot about the idea of power versus force, you know,
in this world where it's so forceful, but there is
a true power in that softness as well. Yeah, and
I know all three of us are mothers, and I
(16:08):
don't know for you all. We have a seventeen year
old daughter starting her senior year of high school. And
for me, as someone that has been a seeker and
on spiritual journeys for so long, there is nothing like
motherhood that will try your spirituality on every level. Gabby,
(16:31):
as a mother, what has surprised you the most?
Speaker 1 (16:36):
Being a mother is a very humbling experience because you
think you've learned all these great personal development tools.
Speaker 10 (16:46):
You know, you write the books about it, you get
on the stage and you give lots of talks, and
then you enter your home with your six year old
and you realize how little you know and how much
growth and opportunity there is every single day, in every
waking moment with your child. So for me, I remember
(17:09):
making the decision to really be a student with my
kid and let my kid be my guru.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
I remember the day that my child was born. I
got a text message from doctor Shefali, who's a tremendous
therapist and particularly in the space of parenting, and she said,
welcome to the world, your new guru. And she couldn't
have been more accurate, because the choices that I'm making
as a parent are spiritually guided choices. And well, I
(17:36):
may be leaning into specific therapeutic practices and philosophies that
have transformed my relationship with my child, they're spiritually led
because there's moments where I remember, at different stages of
his development, I've been on my knees like what do
I do here? And then this beautiful message would come
through a podcast or I would get a text from
(17:59):
a friend who's this child psychologists. So I feel that
guidance and that wisdom always around me and I use it.
I use it, I ask and I and it's given
and I show up for it. The more foundational knowledge
I get, and the more humble I am that I
do not know the answers, and the more teachable I am,
the easier it is for me to navigate parenting. Because
(18:20):
there's there's there's real truth in the psychology of a
child and the psychology of the parent child dynamic and
to be able to create that that's that's that calm
and that stability and that self led energy. And I'm
also while I'm a spiritual teacher, I'm also I'm also
trained in a therapy called internal family Systems therapy, which
is all about healing the inner children inside of us.
(18:44):
And so the greatest gift I've given my child is
the devotional practice of my inner child healing. Because the
more I heal the burden parts of myself, the more
access I have to my inner parent, that self energy
of compassion and calm and clarity and connectedness. And in
that energy I can be a great stable force for
(19:06):
him to coregulate with. So it's a balance of being
humble and doing the therapeutic work to be a parent, but
also the inner work to repaarent myself so that I
can show up with the greatest energy.
Speaker 6 (19:20):
And let me just say that the older they get,
I always say that being a mother is like literally
putting taking your heart and putting it outside your body.
Speaker 4 (19:29):
And the older they get, the more of a guru
they become, the better teachers they become right.
Speaker 6 (19:34):
It depends on the.
Speaker 1 (19:34):
Time seventeen year old girl I was like exactly.
Speaker 2 (19:40):
Exactly exactly coming up the childhood memory that nearly broke
Gabby Bernstein, how facing it led her to the most
powerful way she could show up as a mother.
Speaker 6 (19:54):
Now back to my legacy.
Speaker 5 (19:56):
I love the idea that it's both archchildren and candiate
our life partners, the relationships we have that are a
gurus in our lives, like I've learned, like we've been lucky.
In this podcast, we sit down with Deepak Choprah, Gavera Mitte,
all these great people, which is incredible wisdom, present company
very much included. But it is our relationships. It's the
people closest in our life is holding our child or children,
(20:18):
it's our loved ones. And so if Gaby I could ask,
as you reflect on your child as your guru, or
reflect on those relationships closest to you, what have those
connections taught you that no traditional spiritual practice, no dogmatic
spiritual practice to already use your words, ever, could I think.
Speaker 1 (20:38):
That the people that we choose to be in relationship with,
particular romantic partners often are a reflection of our own
shadow parts. So they can be at times a false
match for the parts of ourselves that we may feel
are incomplete, and then when you come together with those partners,
(21:01):
those incomplete parts can be activated. And the beauty of
that is that if you are in a partnership where
there's a choice, once again, let's use the word choice,
to grow together, and to heal together, and to develop together,
you can together allow those triggered sparks that happen in
the relationship be your greatest learning device. So for myself
(21:24):
and my husband, we've had the willingness to be the
witness of the ways that we can activate those younger
wounded parts of ourselves and then together join and healing.
And I'm really quite one of the things I'm most
proud of in my life actually is the therapeutic work
I've done with my husband, which has been very very
spiritual work, but very devotional work of staying in it
(21:47):
even in the hard moments, staying committed, even when everything
seems like it's breaking down, because like I said earlier,
our wounded parts of ourselves oftentimes have these false pretenses
that some other human can be the source of healing,
that someone outside of us can fill that hole. When
we really find that we come together with the partner
(22:09):
that's going to actually activate those parts the most so
that the hole can be filled through the greater healing.
And that, for me has been my experience. It's been
not about filling a hole, but actually filling that energy
together through collective healing and through witnessing and through the
(22:30):
It's almost like you tighttright in and come out a
little bit in and a little bit out, so that
you're not just ripping off the band aid all at once,
but you're allowing the collective healing to happen over time,
and then you wake up one day and you're like, wow,
we're new, We're in a different place. This is a miracle.
So if you can look at your relationships through that lens,
(22:50):
whether it be a marriage, whether it be a business partnership,
whether it be a child, and instead of saying this
is such a difficult relationship, I can't stand this, look
at the difficult relationships or the difficult moments in your
life and say thank you for being my greatest learning
device and then show up for it.
Speaker 6 (23:06):
Gabby, I want to talk a little bit about you
just mentioned healing, the collective healing, but I want to
turn to your childhood and something devastating that you didn't
remember until thirty years later. I too was molested as
(23:26):
a child, and so I know that path of healing,
even though we're all so unique in individuals and our
paths are unique. But your memories of being molested as
a child came flooding back to you doing a therapy session, right,
So what shifted for you in those sessions to allow
(23:51):
that memory to come back.
Speaker 1 (23:54):
Well, it was around the time I was thirty six
years old and I was newly married. My husband had
left his job of a decade to come work with me.
A lot of the sort of structural things that were
holding things together were being dismantled, and so there was
a little bit of a shakiness in my life. And
I remember the months leading up to remembering, I kept
saying this mantra over and over, I can't go on
(24:16):
like this. And I was having these mental breakdowns, and
I was having numbness in my body and these gastrointestinal
issues and just panic attacks and just night sweats and
just consistent somatic signs of chaos. But I couldn't really
put my finger on it. And then I had a dream,
(24:36):
and in the dream, I remembered the sexual abuse from
my childhood. I woke up that morning with such a
strong knowing not, oh wow, that was a terrible dream,
but that is real. That is real. That has been
given to me as a reminder. But it was so
(24:56):
terrifying and re traumatizing that I just pushed it down
and just let's say, let's lock that back up. And
a week later, I was in my therapy and on
my therapist sofa, lying down. She just asked one question
that just reactivated and triggered me to fully embrace and
accept that memory. And that moment was the most terrifying
(25:20):
moment and the most relieving moment at the same time.
The terror of accepting an exiled memory that I had
dissociated from and pushed down and numbed out for decades,
but the relief simultaneously of recognizing that's why I was
a drug addict, That's why I was a workaholic. That's
(25:42):
why I'm hypervigil at. That's why I have an anxiety disorder.
That's why I have chronic gastrone testinal issues. That's why,
that's why, that's why, that's why, that's which is all
the answers just flooding in for me, that moment was
so so scary. And it was actually at a time
when I wrote my most profound work, which is my
book The Universe Has Your Back. I would wake up
(26:04):
every day in complete terror because I was reactivated into
the trauma and I didn't really it was on a
big trauma journey to uncover this and to heal, but
it took a long time. So it was sort of
catapulted out of my body and very much re traumatized
by remembering this. And the only thing I had at
that time as an anchor was my writing. So I'd
wake up every day with these pangs of anxiety, and
(26:26):
I'd go up to my little office at the time,
and it was this whitewashed room with these white floors
and this white ceiling, and I'd sit at this little
desk and I just kept writing and writing and writing.
And I wrote that book to heal myself. That's why
I know that that book is the one that through
all throughout the world, if I meet people in any
country and any airport, they read The Universe Has Your
Back and the Why because it healed me and in
(26:50):
the healing transmission that that book gave me, that it
healed others. And so the memory, once again, while horrific
as it was, and it was probably the it was
a difficult time of my life, was the most important time
of my life because it was a rebirthing. It was
a time of saying, this is the lowest that we
can be. Let's get back up from here.
Speaker 6 (27:10):
That story and your process reminds me sometimes as Rumy says,
are the lightest where our wounds.
Speaker 1 (27:19):
The wound is the place where the light enters exactly.
Speaker 6 (27:22):
And what that also brings up or remembering for me
is that so many times when my father in law,
when your father was at some of his lowest moments,
he would literally go up and preach himself out of
being in despair, depression or you know, so you go
and you think or you see, some of his greatest
(27:44):
speeches was because he was at his lowest emotionally. And
it seems that you were writing yourself through your healing
and taking so many others with you.
Speaker 5 (27:57):
Scrolling won't change your life, but subscribing just might tap
that button and stay connected to conversations that can't. Now
back to my legacy, Gabby.
Speaker 4 (28:09):
On that journey you have spoken about how somebody we're
a big fan of as well, and I want to
give him the love that he deserves.
Speaker 8 (28:16):
Here, Gabor Matte helped.
Speaker 4 (28:18):
You, and I really want to encourage people to read
some of his books at some point. The myth of
normal when the body says no. These are incredible seminal
works in my mind in terms of people going on
their own healing journey, and for those who do not
fully understand or maybe not fully appreciate the connection between
childhood wounds. So as you were as a child, what
(28:41):
happened to you traumatic events as a child, and how
you are now conducting yourself as an adult in terms
of adult behaviors. Help us understand that connection.
Speaker 1 (28:49):
I'll speak to it from the work of also internal
family systems therapy, which is another guide of mine, which
is doctor Richard Schwortz. So I highly recommend you guys
bring on the show. I'll introduce you to Dick uh
So So Richard Towards, a brother and contemporary of Gobramante
and Peter Levine, and they all kind of collectively heal
these these incredible soul teachers, these men and women uh
(29:12):
and and from an IFS perspective, the the traumatized moment
was a moment from a spiritual place. We can quota
course in miracles. It's from the descent from magnitude to littleness.
It's it's when when when we forgot to laugh. And
it's these moments when when our little child brain gets
(29:35):
the memo that there is terror, that there is fear,
that there is extreme circumstances, that we are not safe,
that we are alone, that we are unlovable, that we
are inadequate, and as little children, our brains do not
have the capacity to process those big emotions so very quickly.
What we do is we exile those feelings and beliefs
(29:55):
and we push them down, we lock them up, and
these are what an i f S are called exiled part.
We say Nope, not going to deal with that, not
going to touch that, and it's under lock and key.
And at a very very young age, even as an
infant or one year old, two year old three, we
start building up protection mechanisms which are called protector parts.
And so what do these protection mechanisms look like? They
(30:17):
look like maybe in my case, hypervigilance and control. Because
I was a little child that felt so out of
control that I was going to start controlling everything around
me to feel safe. Or it could look like the
child that feels so inadequate starts to become a people
pleaser because they feel like if I'm not loved unless
I'm pleasing, or the child that feels so in soo
(30:38):
much terror shuts down and numbs out and starts using
sugar or shows or games to just check out. And
these protection mechanisms never leave us. They become protector parts
that begin to run the show that is our life,
and we start to live as adults from protector part
to protector part to protector part. And if you think
(30:59):
all of us here on this call right now, if
you think about the parts of yourselves that are the
most extreme, or the parts of yourselves that you're often like, oh,
there it is again. It's a habit or a pattern
or belief that just won't go away. You know that's's
holding you back. And you think about those parts of
yourselves and you ask yourself, how long has this been around?
(31:20):
Likely you're going to say forever, as long as I
can remember, because we build up these protection mechanisms so
that we never have to face the impermissible feelings of
those traumas, and so the genuine healing, the real root
cause healing, begins by healing and befriending these protection mechanisms
(31:40):
and softening to them, like Tera might say, softening, just
gently softening into these protection mechanisms, getting into relationship with them,
as we were talking about earlier. Those are the inner children,
These innered children that are just working on overdrive to
protect us from having to feel that inciting incident of trauma.
Speaker 4 (32:03):
So keby when somebody comes to you, taking that knowledge
of somebody being in survival mode, they're disconnected there on
edges that are reactive, reactive, whatever that might be. What's
the first thing they needed to do. What's the first
thing that you would tell them to do?
Speaker 1 (32:17):
Okay, so I would first tell them to choose to
check in instead of check out, so in my presence
or even in a safe environment for themselves to focus
their attention inward. Because our knee jerk reaction is I
don't want to feel this. I'm going to go run
to the refrigerator. I'm going to go numb out on YouTube.
I'm going to go pick up that drink. I'm going
to run instead of running and checking out check in.
(32:40):
That's step one, and so you focus your attention inward.
And then the second step is to become curious, just
offering some curiosity inside and noticing where does this feeling
live in my body? And what do I know about it?
You know, are there any thoughts or sensations or images
or stories that come forward for me? And the third
(33:02):
step is compassionate connection. And that's when you'd ask yourself
or the part of you, what do you need? Asking
the little child inside of you, what do you need?
And if you go through those three steps in one
minute or more, the fourth step is revealed. You might
check in, and you check in to the fourth step
(33:22):
and you say, well, how do I feel right now?
And you'll notice maybe I feel more calm, maybe I
feel more connected to that part of myself. Oftentimes people
will say I feel more compassion towards that part of myself.
And so these se qualities of compassion and calm and
connection and clarity and courage and confidence. This is what
(33:43):
in IFS is known as self with a capital S.
It's our spirit, It's the God within us, is the
internal parent within us, is the internal teacher, the inner
healer inside. That true self is revealed when we help
these activated parts of ourselves calm and settle. There's a
quick way of describing the process, but it's an internal
(34:07):
check in rather than check out.
Speaker 8 (34:08):
Wow, thank you, so check in, check in, check in.
Speaker 9 (34:13):
Tara, what was it like for you as her friend
watching her go through that realization and that pain.
Speaker 3 (34:22):
I think it's such a gift to have a friend
who's willing to check in instead of check out the
thing around Gabby. If she has a crisis, that's an
exciting moment, you know, like she shared when she was
on her therapist couch, sharing that that's the goal, that's
the stuff that we're I'm comfortable there because I know
(34:43):
she's okay. She's not okay when she's checked out. None
of us are okay. When we're checked out. We kind
of appear okay to ourselves, to the world. We're holding on,
we're sort of getting by, we're doing the things. But
when we break down, when we're vulnerable. We all love
that about each each other. You know, when your best
friend calls and said, I've got this horrible problem. You know,
(35:05):
we don't really rush in and try to solve it.
We just we'd love to listen. We love to be there,
we love to connect and be together. So whenever Gabby
calls me and she's like, this is going on or
I can just you know, sometimes with your friends, you
just feel it intuitively, and I send her some other
random voice note about how much I love her. How
you know, I am so grateful that she is available
and is excited to dive into these situations. And it
(35:29):
gives other people permission. It gives me permission. You know,
I do this work too, But when you have a
friend that does it, you say, Okay, where's my next
fault line. I'm ready to fall apart again so I
can put myself back together. Because the more we allow
ourselves to do that, the stronger we become.
Speaker 7 (35:46):
And I love that concept that softness is.
Speaker 3 (35:51):
Power, and when we're relaxed and calm and soft, we
have so much more to give. When we're rigid and
stiff and protecting ourselves, we feel in control, but we're
really so.
Speaker 7 (36:03):
Close to burning out, and we're not.
Speaker 3 (36:06):
Going to be ever able to even reach our full potential,
even when we're sort of tricked into it by this
feeling of stress and struggle and accomplishment. So I get
excited whenever Gabby's having a moment because it allows allows
her to have a moment, allows me to have a moment,
and you know she's going to come back stronger and
so much more happens.
Speaker 9 (36:25):
Wow, that's amazing, Yabby. How to Terror show up for
you in your toughest moments?
Speaker 1 (36:32):
Well, I think that she continues to. I think that
that what Terror just said that's so beautiful is that
when I'm going through something difficult, it's an exciting moment.
I love that that way of perceiving one difficult moments
in general, but also my take on difficult moments because
for me, the critical moments in my life have been
(36:54):
like like you said earlier, the wound, where the plate light,
where the light enters, the breaking down to break through.
So it is those those moments that are the juicy
moments where you know you're on the precipice of another
up leveling or of a new experience. And so having
a friend that is a stable energy in your life,
(37:18):
who you know that you can rely on, who you
know is energetically there even when you're not speaking to them,
who you know will be a phone call away or
a ten minute drive away to lean on, to rely
on is one of the absolute most incredible gifts of
my lifetime having a friend like Tara. Having a friend
(37:41):
like that not only is so soothing to my nervous
system and I know that it is mutual, but it's
also this incredible reflection. You know, I really look at
the rise of our friendship and how close we've become
in the recent years, and I see it's such a
reflection of both where we both are. The devotional commitment
(38:03):
to service, the devotional commitment to spiritual development, the devotional
commitment to softening. To have a friend like that is
also a reflection of where you're at in your life.
The people that we surround ourselves with are a mirror
of who we are, and so to be able to
say this is my plus one today, guys, that's a
pat on my own back, right, that's a go girl.
(38:26):
You know I'm doing pretty good and that's my plus one.
Speaker 4 (38:30):
You're both voices who inspire people to seek wellness, seek guidance,
and to truly protect their peace. Tara, what about you,
what do you do to protect your piece?
Speaker 3 (38:43):
Oh? My goodness, Well, if it's all right with you?
Can I lead us through about a thirty second little
thing to experience inner piece.
Speaker 7 (38:52):
Oh, thank you so much, wow, so grateful.
Speaker 3 (38:56):
So you know, I think it's practiced, or at least
something to do these many things to do is have
a bit of a brief practice. So wherever you are
and where everybody at home is listening, finding a place
where you're actually comfortable. And something that yoga in Taichi
teaches us is to never suffer a bad position. So
(39:17):
if you can get more comfortable, simply do it. Don't
suffer here, So you can roll around a bit side
to side or easy for it and back. It can
be any direction that feels right for you, and simply,
like a tree responding to the breeze, allow yourself to
(39:40):
find that nice centered place and simply notice how you feel,
without trying to change or fix anything at all. Notice
what's going on with you right now, what's happening physically, mentally, emotionally,
(40:03):
simply noticed and let your whole self soften here. So first,
a bit movable, a bit of a bend in your
physical places, your joints, your knees, your elbows, your mechanical
body parts that keep us moving around and keep us
living our lives. And let your whole self soften that mental, emotional, enigmatic,
(40:31):
spiritual part of you, AH, your whole self everything together
AH soften here and simply notice what happens. Your breath
starting to move you, every inhale.
Speaker 7 (40:48):
Expanding making more room.
Speaker 3 (40:50):
And every exhale release relax moving you a bit inward
your breath, helping you be in harmony.
Speaker 7 (41:05):
Simply notice how you feel.
Speaker 3 (41:10):
And either eyes opened or closed, or to notice a
bit what's happening around you and how you relate to
your environment. If there's people around you, if there's objects
or animals, notice that you're a part of everything happening
around you. Coming back to simply noticing how you feel.
(41:32):
One more big breath together, big and hell long, excel
easy and that's simple. I think that's a simple way
to come back to that hopefully inner peace, or at
(41:52):
least noticing what's happening with us so we can make
a good choice to take better care and if they
can take better care of ourselves, we have a better
chance to use our gifts for good and use that
higher good.
Speaker 8 (42:05):
Thank you, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 6 (42:08):
What came to me is that so sometimes peace and
harmony is just a few breaths away.
Speaker 7 (42:15):
So beautiful, beautiful.
Speaker 5 (42:16):
It has been a lightening, beautiful conversation. The friendship that
you two have. I love how it dates back at
decades and just to reflect back subtly finding our daily prayer,
humbly surrendering and asking what miracles can we perform today?
Thank you both so much for your incredible wisdom and
(42:39):
life work.
Speaker 1 (42:40):
Thank you, guys the beautiful, Thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (42:45):
Thank you for joining us. If you enjoy today's conversation, subscribe, share,
and follow us on at my Legacy movement on social
media and YouTube. New episodes drop every Tuesday, with bonus
content every Thursday. This podcast honors doctor King's vision of
the beloved community and the power of connection. A Legacy
(43:07):
Plus Studio production distributed by iHeartMedia creator and executive producer
Suzanne Hayward come executive producer Lisa Lyle. Listen on the
iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.
Hosts And Creators
Craig Kielburger
Marc Kielburger
Martin Luther King III
Arndrea Waters King
Popular Podcasts
CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist
It’s 1996 in rural North Carolina, and an oddball crew makes history when they pull off America’s third largest cash heist. But it’s all downhill from there. Join host Johnny Knoxville as he unspools a wild and woolly tale about a group of regular ‘ol folks who risked it all for a chance at a better life. CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist answers the question: what would you do with 17.3 million dollars? The answer includes diamond rings, mansions, velvet Elvis paintings, plus a run for the border, murder-for-hire-plots, and FBI busts.
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.