November 25, 2025 • 33 mins
This Thanksgiving, My Legacy is taking a moment to reflect on gratitude – the kind that carries us through life’s highs and lows.
From breakthroughs to breakdowns, every moment teaches us something about love, resilience, and grace. In this special episode, we revisit some of the most powerful lessons from our guests:
- Gabby Bernstein on transforming pain into purpose,
- Sarah Jakes Roberts on finding strength in self-love,
- Simon Sinek on joy through connection,
- Sophia Bush on gratitude in truth and change, and
- Jay Shetty and Radhi Devlukia on the quiet acts of love that sustain us.
Because gratitude isn’t just for the good times; it’s what helps us grow through the hard ones.
Regular episodes return next Tuesday, with bonus drops on Thursday.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
As we enter this season of gratitude, we're reminded it
can take many forms, in the people who lift us up,
in the communities that shape us, and even in the
challenges that make us who we are. This week's episode
of My Legacy, we're reflecting back on voices who've lived
that truth, from Gabby Bernstein's journey of transformation and Sarah
(00:23):
Jakes Roberts finding grace and growth, to Simon Sinek on
the power of connection, and Sophia Bush drawing strength from community,
to Ja Shetty and Roddy dev Lukia on true partnership.
May their stories inspire you to look around and give
thanks for the journey and everyone who's part of it.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Let's jump in.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
Gabby, you have gone through a remarkable transformation, and your
transformational journey is nothing short to profound. Can you take
us back to that time and help our listeners and
our viewers understand what that transformation was like? Because in
your memoir you were raw and you were vulnerable, and
you spoke about drug addiction and I'll call addiction. You
spoke about eating disorders, you spoke about self loathing. What
(01:04):
was that moment of like hitting that rock bottom that
made you change your perspective as saying, I need to
have a different life. Can you take us back to
that moment.
Speaker 4 (01:13):
Yeah, And it's actually a very timely conversation because we're
entering into the fall and I'm coming up on twenty
years of sobriety in October.
Speaker 5 (01:25):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (01:26):
Yes, And that commitment to get clean and sober was
not just a commitment to a life of sobriety, but
it was a commitment to a spiritual life. It was
a commitment to becoming a teacher, to stepping into a
higher purpose that I chose the day October second of
(01:46):
two thousand and five when I made the choice to
get clean and sober, I not only chose a life
of sobriety, but I chose a life of service. That
choice was always in front of me. So there was
a period in my life when I was really struggling
towards the end of my addiction, and I went and
I got a psychic greeting with someone that my mom
(02:08):
referred me to, and the psychic kept saying to me
over and over, you're struggling with addiction. And I would
listen to this cassette tape back over and over listening
to her voice, it might beat up Toyota Corolla. And
I'd be doing the alternate side of the street parking
in New York City and I'd listen to this cassette
tape over and over while I waited for the parking
to change over, and I remember hearing her voice saying,
(02:31):
you're struggling with addiction, and my voice quivering on the
other end, saying, well, it's not that bad. And then
she went on and she said, well, you have two
choices in this lifetime. You can stay on the path
that you're on and it will be very difficult, or
you can get clean and make a major impact on
the world. And I just remember listening to that over
(02:52):
and over and over and being in such a precipice
of making that choice. And I could have gone either way.
And I know that my soul, when I signed up
to come to this world at this time, in this way,
my soul made that choice that my soul said, I'm
going to go through this journey of trauma and addiction
and discomfort so that I can resurrect myself in this
(03:15):
lifetime and live to tell what it means to transcend
those fear based worldly experiences and live in that light
and that magnitude, and so I can reflect back now
twenty years and just with so much joy and gratitude
for the commitment and the choice that I made to
get clean and sober, but most importantly for the commitment
and the choice that I've made every single day since
(03:37):
to one day at a time just keep surrendering to
a higher power, surrendering to a spiritual practice, surrendering to
a therapeutic journey, so that I could just keep shining
the crystal and get to the place that I'm met
now today, where I feel very free, and I feel
very clear, and I feel very aligned and the most
ready that I've ever felt before to actually do the
(03:58):
serface work that I'm really here to do.
Speaker 3 (04:00):
Wow, Gabya, that first of all blown away. Collectively, we're
all blown away sitting here, lots of nods, lots of energy,
lots of love to you. But I understand October second,
two thousand and five was that date. But take us
back to October first, two thousand and five. What did
you say to yourself, yes, the day before, to say
I need to change because our listeners are viewers may
be stuck on the other side of the road waiting
(04:21):
for parking to change, listening to their version of the
cassette and what came through to you to talk to
your soul.
Speaker 4 (04:28):
Now, at the time, I had a spiritual awareness. I
was brought up very spiritual, and I had awareness of spirituality,
but I'd really turned my back on it in my
days of my addiction. And so that day when I
was coming down from the drugs and the alcohol from
the night before, and I'm sitting on my knees in
my dirty, my dirty studio apartment in the West Village,
and I'm on my knees and I said a prayer.
(04:50):
But at the time I didn't know who I was
talking to. And I said, God, Universe, whoever's out there,
I need a miracle. And I heard a inner voice,
a voice speaking to me through me, say get clean
and you will live a life beyond your wildest dreams.
And that voice was so undeniable that I made the
(05:16):
choice that day to get my butt out the door,
walked into a twelve step room, sat amongst strangers who
felt like brothers and sisters because we were all there
for the same reason. Very different archetypes in one room
all with the same intention, and I knew I'd found
my home, and I knew I'd found my path. That
inner voice, that voice of wisdom, that voice of spiritual
(05:38):
console connection, is a voice that I rely on. It's
a voice that I've developed as a medium. It's a
voice that I attuned to and that I listened to
and I allow guide my life to this day. But
that was a real spiritual intervention that came through for
me to put me on the right truck.
Speaker 6 (05:55):
Sarah, Now I'm going to turn to your husband, because
you've said in the past that toxic relationships used to
be your drug of choice. I want to know what
helped you finally break that pattern.
Speaker 7 (06:14):
I think what really helped me was really realizing that
the toxic relationship wasn't with the other person, it was
with myself. Like I think that part of the reason
why I was so drawn to people who I felt
like I could save or make better, or who could
add it worth or value to me if they were
(06:34):
able to be loyal and significant, significantly present in my life,
was because I felt so devalued myself.
Speaker 8 (06:42):
I was so insecure myself.
Speaker 7 (06:44):
I was so frustrated with who I was that that
person became a distraction and a trophy that would make
me feel better if ever they would just get it together,
and so I made the pursuit of them my focus
instead of really trying to figure out who I was.
And there was really one thought that really changed my life.
(07:06):
But it was after we got into a really bad
argument and the police were called, so maybe more than
an argument, and I had to go to CPS to
just tell them, like, hey, the kids are okay, you
guys can continue to check in on me because the
police had been involved, and I was walking out of
that CPS office and I just said, I can do
(07:27):
better than this.
Speaker 8 (07:28):
I can do better than this.
Speaker 7 (07:30):
And it wasn't like I thought, I'm going to be
a New York Times bestselling author and I'm gonna host
an event with forty thousand people. I meant, I can
avoid going to CPS offices, I can avoid getting so
angry that the police are called on me. I can
do better than this. And I just did what was
a little bit better than that, and then I would
(07:51):
get on that level and I would think I could
probably do a little bit better than this.
Speaker 8 (07:55):
I moved back.
Speaker 7 (07:56):
Home with my parents and I had the kids, and
I thought, well, if I could just get my own place,
and better and better and better just became my pursuit.
Not better for the pursuit of moments like this, but
just better, because I just felt like anything is better
than this, you know, anything is better than this, And
(08:18):
if to not pursue better is to move backwards, and
I was moving backwards quickly. And I think that that's
what we have to understand in these toxic relationships, whether
it's with ourselves or with other people. Cause you canna
have a toxic relationship with yourself that makes you just
get degree after dr degree after degree because you think
that's gonna make you feel better. A toxic relationship that
makes you achieve and pour yourself out every Anyone who's
(08:41):
dealing with some type of trauma that is unresolved may
have a toxic relationship somewhere, but better. It's just I
think I can experience better health than where I currently am,
and I'm really grateful for who I am now on
the inside. Like I I've had all of these different
things happen to me. I have not changed my bio
on Instagram. My bio is the same bio that I
(09:03):
ever had because like I, you know, the books are nice,
the things are nice, but like, if that ever becomes
my bio for me, it just feels like I miss
something because I'm so proud of the girl who like
finally figured out who Jesus is, who loves her husband,
whose children are her teacher.
Speaker 8 (09:19):
Like, I'm so proud of who she is.
Speaker 7 (09:21):
That That's what I want you to know about me
more than all of these things I achieved, because that's
what I fought for and that's what I thought was
never possible.
Speaker 8 (09:28):
The other things are, they're just carries on top.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
We love it if you could share this episode with
someone who you admire, someone who shows up for you,
who cares about you, who lives their legacy every day.
We'll be back in a moment.
Speaker 6 (09:47):
Now, back to my legacy.
Speaker 9 (09:49):
The last time we spent meaningful time together, we were
in a far off corner of the world, and we
were reflecting on the McMansions, the gated communities, the closed doors,
and how in North America people seem to strive to
work so hard to earn enough money to pull themselves
away from everyone else. They want to be on the
private plane, they want to be on the McMansion. They
(10:11):
want to be in the gated community, and the irony
is that they are shutting themselves off from others. And
so when I look at our time in Kenya, I
was reflected by the fact that you said one of
the most inspirational people you ever met was Mama Jane.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
So one of the things that is for anybody who
comes from the West when you go to Africa, especially
when you go to rural Africa, which is where we were,
where there is real poverty, like the tropes of the
mud huts yep that live in mud huts. Yeah, that
we have this assumption that because they have less in
terms of money or material wealth, that they are unhappy.
(10:48):
And yet you meet people who are in these circumstances
who don't die of heart disease, they don't get as
many cancers as we do, they don't have to diabetes,
and they're smiling all the time. Now, let's not confuse
feeling wealthy and happy with struggle. They absolutely struggle. Their
(11:10):
lives are absolutely difficult, and they are with each other
and help each other. And the lesson that I learned
from that trip is we are so arrogant in our
wealth that we just assume that people who don't have
our wealth must be unhappy, which is the same mentality
as a heroin addict feeling unhappy for all the people
(11:32):
who don't do heroin because they don't have hour high. Ah,
all you people who are sober, you don't feel how
good I feel, completely neglecting the fact that we're addicts.
We are addicted to money and they are not. And
yes they have struggle, and yes they have needs, and
yes we want to help them and they should be helped,
(11:53):
and they're learning how to help themselves. But they are happier.
And you look at the kids too, and there's data
on this. There's data that shows that kids who have
fewer toys have better imaginations and actually have more excitement.
So like, again, we go from the West and we
go to Africa and we see the kids playing with
a stick and attire and we're like, oh, poor kids,
(12:15):
they only have a stick and attire. And yet they're
laughing and they're smiling and they're giggling the whole time.
You know why, because they have an imagination that is
not a stick and attire, that is something that is
a game they're playing in their minds, and I came
back from that trip realizing that I'm an addict like
everybody who lives in the West, and I would rather
foster a relationship and relationships like theirs, and again the
(12:39):
ability to separate struggle from happiness. They're not the same thing.
And Mama Jane is this self appointed community leader because
she decided she wanted a house that wasn't a mud hut.
She wanted a brick house, which is expensive, and she
figured out a way to sell the milk from her
cows that she would walk out hours to go to
(13:00):
the center of the city to sell her milk, and
over the course of time, she saved up enough money.
She goes into the village. She goes into the center
of town, finds a builder and says, I want to
build a house. She says, this is the money I have.
He goes, well, that won't build your house. That'll build
you a couple of walls. She goes, well, let's start there.
And she eventually saves up enough money and works hard enough,
and she builds a house, a house that she invited
(13:20):
us into and is immensely proud of. And she helped
the other mamas, the other women, the other mothers in
the area, to teach them how to also save up
and also build their own houses. And the part that
really got me was the joy that she had, the
smile on her face, the expression of absolute pride when
(13:45):
describing one of her friends or one of the people
in her community who built a better house than hers. Now,
we don't do that in the West. We want our
house to be the biggest, We want our house to
be the best we want. You know, what did Teddy
Roosevelt say? You know, comparison is the thief of joy.
And I love that he used the word thief. It
(14:05):
steals a feeling for me. That's why he was like,
comparison is the thief of joy. And we live a world.
We live a world where we watch social media, where
everybody's friends are prettier, everybody's vacations are better, everybody's life
is more complete, everybody's achieving their financial goals, everybody's in shape,
everybody's going out to great meals. I can know because
(14:25):
they keep taking pictures of their food. And we sit
at home by ourselves, scrolling thinking, I hate my life.
And the thing that I found so amazing about these
magical human beings. Is also when we went to one
of the schools and we met. We went to a
(14:45):
girls school of high school, as you know, because you
took me there. And they have cell phones, they have Instagram,
they have social media, they have access to the internet.
They are not addicted. They spent a life fostering relationship
and they're just not addicted because they have real friends.
(15:06):
And it reminds me of an experiment. You know. Most
of our understanding of addiction comes from some experiments that
were done in the fifties and sixties where they put
a rat in a cage and they gave it two
flasks of water, one just plain water and one that's
laced with drugs. It tries both of them, it likes
(15:27):
the drug laced one. It eventually gets addicted and drinks
so much of the drug laced water until it dies. Okay,
And most of our understanding of addiction comes from these experiments,
except the experiment is flawed. A guy Bey, the them
of Bruce Alexander recognizes that rats, like human beings, are
social animals, and if you put a social animal by
itself in a cage with drugs, it's going to get
(15:48):
addicted to the drugs. So he recreated the experiment, except
he made it more realistic. He called it rat Park.
He put a huge cage with lots of rats and
mazes and wheels, and they are having babies and community
and friends, the whole deal. And they put up two
flasks of water, one plane, one drug lace. They all
tried both. They all tried enough of the drug lace
one to get addicted, except they didn't. They can see
(16:08):
from the data that they drank the plane water. So
it starts to give evidence that if we have a
strong set of community, and if we have close relationships,
we become less susceptible to all addiction. And so, yes,
social media is insidious. Yes, the social media companies actually
absolutely bear some responsibility and they can't do buyer beware.
That's nonsense. That's like giving somebody you know a phentanyl
(16:32):
and saying, well, not our problem. No no, no, no.
Speaker 5 (16:34):
No.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
Buyer beware is you don't get You don't get a
free pass. If you don't like it, turn it off.
That doesn't it's not how addiction works. But if you
take lonely people and you give them an addictive thing,
they're more likely to get addicted. These kids in this
high school in Kenya, because they had such close friendships
and they were taught how to be friends, and they
help each other because they had to. Just aren't addicted
(16:56):
to the same addictive things that we are. And so
it it becomes I think we have a lot more
to learn from rural Kenyons than we can teach them.
I think we are so arrogant to think that they
should learn our way of life. I think we should
learn theirs. Yeah, I came away pretty humbled, Sophia.
Speaker 6 (17:25):
Now I want to turn to a deeply personal essay
that you wrote in Glamour last April about your coming
out journey, and I want to read something that you
wrote because I thought that it was just so, so
very powerful. So I want to quote your exact words,
(17:46):
which is I finally feel like I can breathe. I
don't think. I don't think I can explain how profound
that is. I feel like I was wearing a weighted
vest for who knows how long I hadn't realized how
heavy it was until I finally just put it down.
(18:08):
That kind of clarity doesn't usually come without heartbreak. So
what was the turning point for.
Speaker 10 (18:15):
You if I may. You know, it's interesting how bite
sized the world wants to make your life or your
experiences when you are a public person. And I understand
why the totality of a life, you know, someone's journey
(18:37):
is it's not clickbait material and so you won't expect this.
But the reason this really relates back to Nia and
our friendship is because there was so much public fascination
about well, what is she? How does she identify?
Speaker 11 (18:55):
Is?
Speaker 10 (18:56):
Explain? Explain? Explain, and they wanted to make it about
this coming out, you know, and part of me and
part of me were like, has nobody been paying attention
to like anything I've ever said since I've been on
TV or all the people I've kissed since I've been
on TV? Like what are we doing? So there was
humor in it, certainly there there was absolutely given again
(19:19):
this rising fear mongering. There was a real importance I
understood for saying the words and saying them in a
way where they could be both hopefully inspiring or freeing
to someone else, but also to say all of us
deserve to take up space and deserve to have a
(19:40):
full spectrum of rights. But the thing that people didn't
see behind the scenes was the journey to get there.
And the vest wasn't just about identity. The vest was
about society. The vest was about the expectation on women,
the exhausting demand to be small, but not so small,
(20:06):
to no matter what you do, you have a career.
How dare you not have kids? You have kids? How
dare you not have a career? You wait to consider
getting married, You're a crone. You got married young. You
must have been dumb and you didn't know what you
were doing. It's just we can't quite get it right.
And what I had to come to terms with was
(20:28):
that I'd carried certain traumas rather than push them back
on the people who'd given them to me, I'd tried
to make everybody happy. I'd lost my individual way, maybe
in a way because I'd prioritized community so much that
I finally said, well, I guess it's time, And I
(20:50):
guess it's time I do the thing everybody tells me
to do, and I'll make the list and check the boxes.
And everybody says, once you've done it, you'll be happy.
And I checked all the boxes and I really wasn't happy,
and I didn't know how to say that to anyone
but Nia, and I didn't know how to say when
(21:14):
people said, well, why did you get married and why
did you do this? I didn't know I would go
through the next step, the family building stuff by myself.
I didn't know until it happened to me. And I
didn't know how to say that. I didn't know how
to deal with the shame and the kind of embarrassment
that I'd been wrong and that I'd been wrong really publicly.
(21:35):
And I called my best friend and she if I may,
I'm just making sure I'm allowed to say the thing,
but she said me too, And we both knew what
was going on, obviously with each other. We talk one
hundred times a day. But when I said I think
I have to be done and in her own life
(21:55):
and in her own world with her own young son,
she said, I do too.
Speaker 8 (22:03):
I can't.
Speaker 10 (22:04):
I would never wish for someone else to be heartbroken,
but to have my best friend in the world having
her version of the same experience, and both of us
saying we got to like, we got to put it down,
and we got to try to make a new way
in the most profound way. I knew I wasn't crazy.
(22:26):
I knew I wasn't doing something rash. I knew I'd
literally exhausted every option, I'd gone to, every therapy, I'd
done every bit of the homework, and I had to
just say, it's okay to change your mind, It's okay
to learn something and based on that learning, make a
(22:47):
new decision for your future. And so everybody wanted to
make it about, you know, the next person in my life.
Because the next person in my life was a woman.
Plenty of people were shocked. It wasn't nea by the way.
I was like, I was like, she is my wife,
Just not like that. But you know what, I think
(23:07):
what people didn't understand was that the journey started again
in a community of women. And there were two of us,
and then there was a best friend from college, and
then there was a woman I would eventually fall in
love with. And then there was another friend, you know,
dealing with will I stay or will I go because
of addiction in her family with her husband, and the
community of women who who didn't go really bad timing.
(23:33):
You know, you just had this whole big thing. They
didn't lean out and critique, They leaned in and said
it's okay. Those women helped me take off forty years
of expectation and people pleasing and just trying to do
it right because it hadn't felt right ever, no matter
how hard I tried. And it was yes about stepping
(23:56):
into that portion of my identity in a way, but
what it really was in totality was a homecoming and
a learning to honor myself. And I learned how to
honor myself watching the strongest woman that I know and
a group of the most impressive women we love honor themselves.
(24:20):
I had the courage of that conviction because of what
I was being shown in both love and example by
the women in my life.
Speaker 12 (24:29):
Scrolling won't change your life, but subscribing just might tap
that button and stay connected to conversations that can't. Now
back to my legacy.
Speaker 13 (24:45):
This is a very simple thing, but it's very important.
I rarely get sick, and I'm blessed and fortunate, but
a lot of that, in my mind is because every day,
not a day goes by that Andrew doesn't put out
vitamins from me. Now, I would like to be That's
a simple thing. I'd love to be able to do that,
(25:06):
and I will get there, but that constantly reinforces. You know,
when your partner loves you so much that they're very
concerned about your being healthy, being able to go out
into the world as many of us have to do.
Speaker 3 (25:21):
So I want to ask.
Speaker 13 (25:23):
You both, what simple thing does your partner do to
show that they love you?
Speaker 11 (25:29):
Ah, my gosh, Jason, Well, Jason very expressive person, but
it's not just the words that he uses, like he
is someone who will verbally check in and be like,
what can I do to make you happier? Is there
anyway I can help you? And he says that to
me on a regular basis. So I think one part
of it is being vocal about how you want to
(25:49):
be there for your partner, which I actually wasn't very
good at and I'm still getting better at to actually
vocalize it. I've you know, in my mind, I'm I
see myself more of an active service, which is how
I've seen my parents. So I'd be like, oh, but
in my mind, I've cooked a meal, and I've done
this little thing and and but sometimes you realize that
actually having those vocal moments are really important and how
(26:11):
much that makes a difference in a relationship. But then
in action it's like the little things of you know,
even if he's just sat down, when I've sat down
and I need something, he'll get back up, Like if
I won't get back up, he'll get back up to
get it for me. Or if I am feeling I
know you.
Speaker 8 (26:30):
Still do it.
Speaker 11 (26:31):
And you know, it's those little things where you just
notice someone going out of their way for you, because
not many people want to go out of their way
for you. And then another one is whenever I'm having
I'm quite an emotional person, and whenever he feels my
energy is a little bit off, he'll always no matter
what he's got going on, he'll always make space and
time to just check in and be like, do you
need do you need help with anything? Can I sit
(26:52):
with you? I can work through whether it's a work thing,
whether it's a family thing. You know, he always creates
the time and space, no matter how busy, to have
those moments of connection if he feels like I really
need it. And so, I mean I could probably go on,
but I'll leave it that. There's there a couple of them.
But yeah, there's so many different ways he expresses himself.
Speaker 5 (27:10):
Actually, JA, yeah, so many as well. I think for me,
The biggest one is I think when we first got
married and we moved to New York and then we
were kind of there for a couple of years, then
moving to LA and we've just been through so much change,
and change that wasn't anticipated or expected, so change that
(27:33):
we both had planned to live our whole lives fifteen
minutes from our local temple in England and five minutes
away from Radi's parents home. And actually that was one
of her requirements for us getting married, was that she
could be a one mile radius away from her parents' home.
And I committed to that, and I genuinely had committed
(27:56):
to that. It was something that I thought was very real.
All of our friends are in that area, families in
that area. It made sense. And then all of a sudden,
my career took a turn in twenty sixteen when this
part of my life started to grow, and it's continued
to for the nine years, thankfully. And if I'm completely honest,
that was completely not part of the plan, not my plan,
(28:17):
not her plan, not our plan, but it was what
I couldn't even have dreamed of. And not once in
the last nine years has Radi ever said to me,
look what I gave up for you, And oh god,
I could cry saying this, but it's one of those things.
It's like, I know how much her parents mean to her,
(28:41):
no much her family friends mean to her. I know
how much London means to her, and for her to
move away, for her to give that up when we
didn't have clarity, like you know, we're very fortunate today
to have a wonderful life, but getting here wasn't easy.
I was away a lot, I traveled a lot for work,
(29:02):
I was building things, moving around And never once did
she say I gave this all up for you. You're
never around, you work too hard. And I think that
kind of trust without nagging, without making someone feel bad
when I was already carrying the burden of it myself.
(29:22):
And I think that's the feeling that makes you feel
loved where you're Like, I was already feeling that way myself.
So if she would have said it to me, probably
would have broken me. But the fact that she didn't
feel that she had to say it to me makes
me feel loved. So not blaming, not shaming, not pushing,
not prodding is is. It feels like a small thing,
(29:44):
but actually it's huge. And even at the most difficult
times in our life, whether we were financially struggling, you know,
struggling with moving, changing, whatever things were going on in
our life. Every time I'd update her on what would happen,
She'd always say, I trust you. And hearing your partner
(30:05):
say that when you don't even know what's going to
happen next is the greatest sign of love. And so
and and you know, she RADI decided to date me
and commit to a relationship with me when I had
nothing to offer about myself, and so that's a pretty
big thing. She she could have married anyone she wanted
(30:26):
to marry, and so her decision to be with someone
who didn't have a even a secure job when we
first started dating, and you know, someone who'd been in
the monastery for three years and didn't have any sort
of savings or any sort of plan, I think it
shows her character and her ability to you know, go
beyond material things. And and the more recent one, I mean,
(30:50):
I could go on as well. I think the more
recently you need to get one. Radi's never let me
define my self worth based on my success. So when
I first started to experience success, Rady didn't celebrate it
in the way I wanted her to and I would want. Look,
(31:11):
I'd wanted my wife to be my number one fan
and my biggest cheerleader, and she wasn't for my career.
But I had to realize if I skewed my perspective,
she was for who I was. So if it came
to my character, that's what she was backing. She wasn't
backing me because of my career. And that took me.
That helped me detach from valuing myself based on the
(31:34):
success of my career because I think that's what I
would have done and what I would have wanted if
she had fallen in that way. And so her lack
of validation for my career was the greatest validation for I'm.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
Great.
Speaker 8 (31:51):
I think it's a cue.
Speaker 5 (31:52):
And again going back to the men point, I think
a lot of men like we want our partners to
be like front Row. We want them to be the leader,
like we've we've got that culture. And I'm not saying
that my wife isn't my cheerleadering that, but I'm saying,
your wife's cheerleading your character, not your career. That's better
because the career is up and down, like the career
is going to do whatever it's going to do, But
(32:13):
your characters who you are, Like, what do you want
to be loved for? Do you want to be loved
for the amount of followers you have? Or do you
want to be loved for who you are and how
you show up and what she believes you represent? And
so I think it's genuinely we're laughing about it and
it can have funny connotations, but I want to clarify,
Like the point is, I think we all want to
be loved for who we are and not loved for
what we achieve.
Speaker 11 (32:34):
I did start listening to a podcast last year.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
Thank you for joining us. If you enjoy today's conversation, subscribe, share,
and follow us on at my Legacy Movement on social
media and YouTube. New episodes drop every Tuesday, with bonus
content every Thursday. At its core, This podcast honors doctor
King's vision of the Beloved community and the power of connection.
(33:01):
A Legacy Plus Studio production distributed by iHeartMedia creator and
executive producer Suzanne Hayward co executive producer Lisa Lyle. Listen
on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts,
As we enter this season of gratitude, we're reminded it
can take many forms, in the people who lift us up,
in the communities that shape us, and even in the
challenges that make us who we are. This week's episode
of My Legacy, we're reflecting back on voices who've lived
that truth, from Gabby Bernstein's journey of transformation and Sarah
(00:23):
Jakes Roberts finding grace and growth, to Simon Sinek on
the power of connection, and Sophia Bush drawing strength from community,
to Ja Shetty and Roddy dev Lukia on true partnership.
May their stories inspire you to look around and give
thanks for the journey and everyone who's part of it.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Let's jump in.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
Gabby, you have gone through a remarkable transformation, and your
transformational journey is nothing short to profound. Can you take
us back to that time and help our listeners and
our viewers understand what that transformation was like? Because in
your memoir you were raw and you were vulnerable, and
you spoke about drug addiction and I'll call addiction. You
spoke about eating disorders, you spoke about self loathing. What
(01:04):
was that moment of like hitting that rock bottom that
made you change your perspective as saying, I need to
have a different life. Can you take us back to
that moment.
Speaker 4 (01:13):
Yeah, And it's actually a very timely conversation because we're
entering into the fall and I'm coming up on twenty
years of sobriety in October.
Speaker 5 (01:25):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (01:26):
Yes, And that commitment to get clean and sober was
not just a commitment to a life of sobriety, but
it was a commitment to a spiritual life. It was
a commitment to becoming a teacher, to stepping into a
higher purpose that I chose the day October second of
(01:46):
two thousand and five when I made the choice to
get clean and sober, I not only chose a life
of sobriety, but I chose a life of service. That
choice was always in front of me. So there was
a period in my life when I was really struggling
towards the end of my addiction, and I went and
I got a psychic greeting with someone that my mom
(02:08):
referred me to, and the psychic kept saying to me
over and over, you're struggling with addiction. And I would
listen to this cassette tape back over and over listening
to her voice, it might beat up Toyota Corolla. And
I'd be doing the alternate side of the street parking
in New York City and I'd listen to this cassette
tape over and over while I waited for the parking
to change over, and I remember hearing her voice saying,
(02:31):
you're struggling with addiction, and my voice quivering on the
other end, saying, well, it's not that bad. And then
she went on and she said, well, you have two
choices in this lifetime. You can stay on the path
that you're on and it will be very difficult, or
you can get clean and make a major impact on
the world. And I just remember listening to that over
(02:52):
and over and over and being in such a precipice
of making that choice. And I could have gone either way.
And I know that my soul, when I signed up
to come to this world at this time, in this way,
my soul made that choice that my soul said, I'm
going to go through this journey of trauma and addiction
and discomfort so that I can resurrect myself in this
(03:15):
lifetime and live to tell what it means to transcend
those fear based worldly experiences and live in that light
and that magnitude, and so I can reflect back now
twenty years and just with so much joy and gratitude
for the commitment and the choice that I made to
get clean and sober, but most importantly for the commitment
and the choice that I've made every single day since
(03:37):
to one day at a time just keep surrendering to
a higher power, surrendering to a spiritual practice, surrendering to
a therapeutic journey, so that I could just keep shining
the crystal and get to the place that I'm met
now today, where I feel very free, and I feel
very clear, and I feel very aligned and the most
ready that I've ever felt before to actually do the
(03:58):
serface work that I'm really here to do.
Speaker 3 (04:00):
Wow, Gabya, that first of all blown away. Collectively, we're
all blown away sitting here, lots of nods, lots of energy,
lots of love to you. But I understand October second,
two thousand and five was that date. But take us
back to October first, two thousand and five. What did
you say to yourself, yes, the day before, to say
I need to change because our listeners are viewers may
be stuck on the other side of the road waiting
(04:21):
for parking to change, listening to their version of the
cassette and what came through to you to talk to
your soul.
Speaker 4 (04:28):
Now, at the time, I had a spiritual awareness. I
was brought up very spiritual, and I had awareness of spirituality,
but I'd really turned my back on it in my
days of my addiction. And so that day when I
was coming down from the drugs and the alcohol from
the night before, and I'm sitting on my knees in
my dirty, my dirty studio apartment in the West Village,
and I'm on my knees and I said a prayer.
(04:50):
But at the time I didn't know who I was
talking to. And I said, God, Universe, whoever's out there,
I need a miracle. And I heard a inner voice,
a voice speaking to me through me, say get clean
and you will live a life beyond your wildest dreams.
And that voice was so undeniable that I made the
(05:16):
choice that day to get my butt out the door,
walked into a twelve step room, sat amongst strangers who
felt like brothers and sisters because we were all there
for the same reason. Very different archetypes in one room
all with the same intention, and I knew I'd found
my home, and I knew I'd found my path. That
inner voice, that voice of wisdom, that voice of spiritual
(05:38):
console connection, is a voice that I rely on. It's
a voice that I've developed as a medium. It's a
voice that I attuned to and that I listened to
and I allow guide my life to this day. But
that was a real spiritual intervention that came through for
me to put me on the right truck.
Speaker 6 (05:55):
Sarah, Now I'm going to turn to your husband, because
you've said in the past that toxic relationships used to
be your drug of choice. I want to know what
helped you finally break that pattern.
Speaker 7 (06:14):
I think what really helped me was really realizing that
the toxic relationship wasn't with the other person, it was
with myself. Like I think that part of the reason
why I was so drawn to people who I felt
like I could save or make better, or who could
add it worth or value to me if they were
(06:34):
able to be loyal and significant, significantly present in my life,
was because I felt so devalued myself.
Speaker 8 (06:42):
I was so insecure myself.
Speaker 7 (06:44):
I was so frustrated with who I was that that
person became a distraction and a trophy that would make
me feel better if ever they would just get it together,
and so I made the pursuit of them my focus
instead of really trying to figure out who I was.
And there was really one thought that really changed my life.
(07:06):
But it was after we got into a really bad
argument and the police were called, so maybe more than
an argument, and I had to go to CPS to
just tell them, like, hey, the kids are okay, you
guys can continue to check in on me because the
police had been involved, and I was walking out of
that CPS office and I just said, I can do
(07:27):
better than this.
Speaker 8 (07:28):
I can do better than this.
Speaker 7 (07:30):
And it wasn't like I thought, I'm going to be
a New York Times bestselling author and I'm gonna host
an event with forty thousand people. I meant, I can
avoid going to CPS offices, I can avoid getting so
angry that the police are called on me. I can
do better than this. And I just did what was
a little bit better than that, and then I would
(07:51):
get on that level and I would think I could
probably do a little bit better than this.
Speaker 8 (07:55):
I moved back.
Speaker 7 (07:56):
Home with my parents and I had the kids, and
I thought, well, if I could just get my own place,
and better and better and better just became my pursuit.
Not better for the pursuit of moments like this, but
just better, because I just felt like anything is better
than this, you know, anything is better than this, And
(08:18):
if to not pursue better is to move backwards, and
I was moving backwards quickly. And I think that that's
what we have to understand in these toxic relationships, whether
it's with ourselves or with other people. Cause you canna
have a toxic relationship with yourself that makes you just
get degree after dr degree after degree because you think
that's gonna make you feel better. A toxic relationship that
makes you achieve and pour yourself out every Anyone who's
(08:41):
dealing with some type of trauma that is unresolved may
have a toxic relationship somewhere, but better. It's just I
think I can experience better health than where I currently am,
and I'm really grateful for who I am now on
the inside. Like I I've had all of these different
things happen to me. I have not changed my bio
on Instagram. My bio is the same bio that I
(09:03):
ever had because like I, you know, the books are nice,
the things are nice, but like, if that ever becomes
my bio for me, it just feels like I miss
something because I'm so proud of the girl who like
finally figured out who Jesus is, who loves her husband,
whose children are her teacher.
Speaker 8 (09:19):
Like, I'm so proud of who she is.
Speaker 7 (09:21):
That That's what I want you to know about me
more than all of these things I achieved, because that's
what I fought for and that's what I thought was
never possible.
Speaker 8 (09:28):
The other things are, they're just carries on top.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
We love it if you could share this episode with
someone who you admire, someone who shows up for you,
who cares about you, who lives their legacy every day.
We'll be back in a moment.
Speaker 6 (09:47):
Now, back to my legacy.
Speaker 9 (09:49):
The last time we spent meaningful time together, we were
in a far off corner of the world, and we
were reflecting on the McMansions, the gated communities, the closed doors,
and how in North America people seem to strive to
work so hard to earn enough money to pull themselves
away from everyone else. They want to be on the
private plane, they want to be on the McMansion. They
(10:11):
want to be in the gated community, and the irony
is that they are shutting themselves off from others. And
so when I look at our time in Kenya, I
was reflected by the fact that you said one of
the most inspirational people you ever met was Mama Jane.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
So one of the things that is for anybody who
comes from the West when you go to Africa, especially
when you go to rural Africa, which is where we were,
where there is real poverty, like the tropes of the
mud huts yep that live in mud huts. Yeah, that
we have this assumption that because they have less in
terms of money or material wealth, that they are unhappy.
(10:48):
And yet you meet people who are in these circumstances
who don't die of heart disease, they don't get as
many cancers as we do, they don't have to diabetes,
and they're smiling all the time. Now, let's not confuse
feeling wealthy and happy with struggle. They absolutely struggle. Their
(11:10):
lives are absolutely difficult, and they are with each other
and help each other. And the lesson that I learned
from that trip is we are so arrogant in our
wealth that we just assume that people who don't have
our wealth must be unhappy, which is the same mentality
as a heroin addict feeling unhappy for all the people
(11:32):
who don't do heroin because they don't have hour high. Ah,
all you people who are sober, you don't feel how
good I feel, completely neglecting the fact that we're addicts.
We are addicted to money and they are not. And
yes they have struggle, and yes they have needs, and
yes we want to help them and they should be helped,
(11:53):
and they're learning how to help themselves. But they are happier.
And you look at the kids too, and there's data
on this. There's data that shows that kids who have
fewer toys have better imaginations and actually have more excitement.
So like, again, we go from the West and we
go to Africa and we see the kids playing with
a stick and attire and we're like, oh, poor kids,
(12:15):
they only have a stick and attire. And yet they're
laughing and they're smiling and they're giggling the whole time.
You know why, because they have an imagination that is
not a stick and attire, that is something that is
a game they're playing in their minds, and I came
back from that trip realizing that I'm an addict like
everybody who lives in the West, and I would rather
foster a relationship and relationships like theirs, and again the
(12:39):
ability to separate struggle from happiness. They're not the same thing.
And Mama Jane is this self appointed community leader because
she decided she wanted a house that wasn't a mud hut.
She wanted a brick house, which is expensive, and she
figured out a way to sell the milk from her
cows that she would walk out hours to go to
(13:00):
the center of the city to sell her milk, and
over the course of time, she saved up enough money.
She goes into the village. She goes into the center
of town, finds a builder and says, I want to
build a house. She says, this is the money I have.
He goes, well, that won't build your house. That'll build
you a couple of walls. She goes, well, let's start there.
And she eventually saves up enough money and works hard enough,
and she builds a house, a house that she invited
(13:20):
us into and is immensely proud of. And she helped
the other mamas, the other women, the other mothers in
the area, to teach them how to also save up
and also build their own houses. And the part that
really got me was the joy that she had, the
smile on her face, the expression of absolute pride when
(13:45):
describing one of her friends or one of the people
in her community who built a better house than hers. Now,
we don't do that in the West. We want our
house to be the biggest, We want our house to
be the best we want. You know, what did Teddy
Roosevelt say? You know, comparison is the thief of joy.
And I love that he used the word thief. It
(14:05):
steals a feeling for me. That's why he was like,
comparison is the thief of joy. And we live a world.
We live a world where we watch social media, where
everybody's friends are prettier, everybody's vacations are better, everybody's life
is more complete, everybody's achieving their financial goals, everybody's in shape,
everybody's going out to great meals. I can know because
(14:25):
they keep taking pictures of their food. And we sit
at home by ourselves, scrolling thinking, I hate my life.
And the thing that I found so amazing about these
magical human beings. Is also when we went to one
of the schools and we met. We went to a
(14:45):
girls school of high school, as you know, because you
took me there. And they have cell phones, they have Instagram,
they have social media, they have access to the internet.
They are not addicted. They spent a life fostering relationship
and they're just not addicted because they have real friends.
(15:06):
And it reminds me of an experiment. You know. Most
of our understanding of addiction comes from some experiments that
were done in the fifties and sixties where they put
a rat in a cage and they gave it two
flasks of water, one just plain water and one that's
laced with drugs. It tries both of them, it likes
(15:27):
the drug laced one. It eventually gets addicted and drinks
so much of the drug laced water until it dies. Okay,
And most of our understanding of addiction comes from these experiments,
except the experiment is flawed. A guy Bey, the them
of Bruce Alexander recognizes that rats, like human beings, are
social animals, and if you put a social animal by
itself in a cage with drugs, it's going to get
(15:48):
addicted to the drugs. So he recreated the experiment, except
he made it more realistic. He called it rat Park.
He put a huge cage with lots of rats and
mazes and wheels, and they are having babies and community
and friends, the whole deal. And they put up two
flasks of water, one plane, one drug lace. They all
tried both. They all tried enough of the drug lace
one to get addicted, except they didn't. They can see
(16:08):
from the data that they drank the plane water. So
it starts to give evidence that if we have a
strong set of community, and if we have close relationships,
we become less susceptible to all addiction. And so, yes,
social media is insidious. Yes, the social media companies actually
absolutely bear some responsibility and they can't do buyer beware.
That's nonsense. That's like giving somebody you know a phentanyl
(16:32):
and saying, well, not our problem. No no, no, no.
Speaker 5 (16:34):
No.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
Buyer beware is you don't get You don't get a
free pass. If you don't like it, turn it off.
That doesn't it's not how addiction works. But if you
take lonely people and you give them an addictive thing,
they're more likely to get addicted. These kids in this
high school in Kenya, because they had such close friendships
and they were taught how to be friends, and they
help each other because they had to. Just aren't addicted
(16:56):
to the same addictive things that we are. And so
it it becomes I think we have a lot more
to learn from rural Kenyons than we can teach them.
I think we are so arrogant to think that they
should learn our way of life. I think we should
learn theirs. Yeah, I came away pretty humbled, Sophia.
Speaker 6 (17:25):
Now I want to turn to a deeply personal essay
that you wrote in Glamour last April about your coming
out journey, and I want to read something that you
wrote because I thought that it was just so, so
very powerful. So I want to quote your exact words,
(17:46):
which is I finally feel like I can breathe. I
don't think. I don't think I can explain how profound
that is. I feel like I was wearing a weighted
vest for who knows how long I hadn't realized how
heavy it was until I finally just put it down.
(18:08):
That kind of clarity doesn't usually come without heartbreak. So
what was the turning point for.
Speaker 10 (18:15):
You if I may. You know, it's interesting how bite
sized the world wants to make your life or your
experiences when you are a public person. And I understand
why the totality of a life, you know, someone's journey
(18:37):
is it's not clickbait material and so you won't expect this.
But the reason this really relates back to Nia and
our friendship is because there was so much public fascination
about well, what is she? How does she identify?
Speaker 11 (18:55):
Is?
Speaker 10 (18:56):
Explain? Explain? Explain, and they wanted to make it about
this coming out, you know, and part of me and
part of me were like, has nobody been paying attention
to like anything I've ever said since I've been on
TV or all the people I've kissed since I've been
on TV? Like what are we doing? So there was
humor in it, certainly there there was absolutely given again
(19:19):
this rising fear mongering. There was a real importance I
understood for saying the words and saying them in a
way where they could be both hopefully inspiring or freeing
to someone else, but also to say all of us
deserve to take up space and deserve to have a
(19:40):
full spectrum of rights. But the thing that people didn't
see behind the scenes was the journey to get there.
And the vest wasn't just about identity. The vest was
about society. The vest was about the expectation on women,
the exhausting demand to be small, but not so small,
(20:06):
to no matter what you do, you have a career.
How dare you not have kids? You have kids? How
dare you not have a career? You wait to consider
getting married, You're a crone. You got married young. You
must have been dumb and you didn't know what you
were doing. It's just we can't quite get it right.
And what I had to come to terms with was
(20:28):
that I'd carried certain traumas rather than push them back
on the people who'd given them to me, I'd tried
to make everybody happy. I'd lost my individual way, maybe
in a way because I'd prioritized community so much that
I finally said, well, I guess it's time, And I
(20:50):
guess it's time I do the thing everybody tells me
to do, and I'll make the list and check the boxes.
And everybody says, once you've done it, you'll be happy.
And I checked all the boxes and I really wasn't happy,
and I didn't know how to say that to anyone
but Nia, and I didn't know how to say when
(21:14):
people said, well, why did you get married and why
did you do this? I didn't know I would go
through the next step, the family building stuff by myself.
I didn't know until it happened to me. And I
didn't know how to say that. I didn't know how
to deal with the shame and the kind of embarrassment
that I'd been wrong and that I'd been wrong really publicly.
(21:35):
And I called my best friend and she if I may,
I'm just making sure I'm allowed to say the thing,
but she said me too, And we both knew what
was going on, obviously with each other. We talk one
hundred times a day. But when I said I think
I have to be done and in her own life
(21:55):
and in her own world with her own young son,
she said, I do too.
Speaker 8 (22:03):
I can't.
Speaker 10 (22:04):
I would never wish for someone else to be heartbroken,
but to have my best friend in the world having
her version of the same experience, and both of us
saying we got to like, we got to put it down,
and we got to try to make a new way
in the most profound way. I knew I wasn't crazy.
(22:26):
I knew I wasn't doing something rash. I knew I'd
literally exhausted every option, I'd gone to, every therapy, I'd
done every bit of the homework, and I had to
just say, it's okay to change your mind, It's okay
to learn something and based on that learning, make a
(22:47):
new decision for your future. And so everybody wanted to
make it about, you know, the next person in my life.
Because the next person in my life was a woman.
Plenty of people were shocked. It wasn't nea by the way.
I was like, I was like, she is my wife,
Just not like that. But you know what, I think
(23:07):
what people didn't understand was that the journey started again
in a community of women. And there were two of us,
and then there was a best friend from college, and
then there was a woman I would eventually fall in
love with. And then there was another friend, you know,
dealing with will I stay or will I go because
of addiction in her family with her husband, and the
community of women who who didn't go really bad timing.
(23:33):
You know, you just had this whole big thing. They
didn't lean out and critique, They leaned in and said
it's okay. Those women helped me take off forty years
of expectation and people pleasing and just trying to do
it right because it hadn't felt right ever, no matter
how hard I tried. And it was yes about stepping
(23:56):
into that portion of my identity in a way, but
what it really was in totality was a homecoming and
a learning to honor myself. And I learned how to
honor myself watching the strongest woman that I know and
a group of the most impressive women we love honor themselves.
(24:20):
I had the courage of that conviction because of what
I was being shown in both love and example by
the women in my life.
Speaker 12 (24:29):
Scrolling won't change your life, but subscribing just might tap
that button and stay connected to conversations that can't. Now
back to my legacy.
Speaker 13 (24:45):
This is a very simple thing, but it's very important.
I rarely get sick, and I'm blessed and fortunate, but
a lot of that, in my mind is because every day,
not a day goes by that Andrew doesn't put out
vitamins from me. Now, I would like to be That's
a simple thing. I'd love to be able to do that,
(25:06):
and I will get there, but that constantly reinforces. You know,
when your partner loves you so much that they're very
concerned about your being healthy, being able to go out
into the world as many of us have to do.
Speaker 3 (25:21):
So I want to ask.
Speaker 13 (25:23):
You both, what simple thing does your partner do to
show that they love you?
Speaker 11 (25:29):
Ah, my gosh, Jason, Well, Jason very expressive person, but
it's not just the words that he uses, like he
is someone who will verbally check in and be like,
what can I do to make you happier? Is there
anyway I can help you? And he says that to
me on a regular basis. So I think one part
of it is being vocal about how you want to
(25:49):
be there for your partner, which I actually wasn't very
good at and I'm still getting better at to actually
vocalize it. I've you know, in my mind, I'm I
see myself more of an active service, which is how
I've seen my parents. So I'd be like, oh, but
in my mind, I've cooked a meal, and I've done
this little thing and and but sometimes you realize that
actually having those vocal moments are really important and how
(26:11):
much that makes a difference in a relationship. But then
in action it's like the little things of you know,
even if he's just sat down, when I've sat down
and I need something, he'll get back up, Like if
I won't get back up, he'll get back up to
get it for me. Or if I am feeling I
know you.
Speaker 8 (26:30):
Still do it.
Speaker 11 (26:31):
And you know, it's those little things where you just
notice someone going out of their way for you, because
not many people want to go out of their way
for you. And then another one is whenever I'm having
I'm quite an emotional person, and whenever he feels my
energy is a little bit off, he'll always no matter
what he's got going on, he'll always make space and
time to just check in and be like, do you
need do you need help with anything? Can I sit
(26:52):
with you? I can work through whether it's a work thing,
whether it's a family thing. You know, he always creates
the time and space, no matter how busy, to have
those moments of connection if he feels like I really
need it. And so, I mean I could probably go on,
but I'll leave it that. There's there a couple of them.
But yeah, there's so many different ways he expresses himself.
Speaker 5 (27:10):
Actually, JA, yeah, so many as well. I think for me,
The biggest one is I think when we first got
married and we moved to New York and then we
were kind of there for a couple of years, then
moving to LA and we've just been through so much change,
and change that wasn't anticipated or expected, so change that
(27:33):
we both had planned to live our whole lives fifteen
minutes from our local temple in England and five minutes
away from Radi's parents home. And actually that was one
of her requirements for us getting married, was that she
could be a one mile radius away from her parents' home.
And I committed to that, and I genuinely had committed
(27:56):
to that. It was something that I thought was very real.
All of our friends are in that area, families in
that area. It made sense. And then all of a sudden,
my career took a turn in twenty sixteen when this
part of my life started to grow, and it's continued
to for the nine years, thankfully. And if I'm completely honest,
that was completely not part of the plan, not my plan,
(28:17):
not her plan, not our plan, but it was what
I couldn't even have dreamed of. And not once in
the last nine years has Radi ever said to me,
look what I gave up for you, And oh god,
I could cry saying this, but it's one of those things.
It's like, I know how much her parents mean to her,
(28:41):
no much her family friends mean to her. I know
how much London means to her, and for her to
move away, for her to give that up when we
didn't have clarity, like you know, we're very fortunate today
to have a wonderful life, but getting here wasn't easy.
I was away a lot, I traveled a lot for work,
(29:02):
I was building things, moving around And never once did
she say I gave this all up for you. You're
never around, you work too hard. And I think that
kind of trust without nagging, without making someone feel bad
when I was already carrying the burden of it myself.
(29:22):
And I think that's the feeling that makes you feel
loved where you're Like, I was already feeling that way myself.
So if she would have said it to me, probably
would have broken me. But the fact that she didn't
feel that she had to say it to me makes
me feel loved. So not blaming, not shaming, not pushing,
not prodding is is. It feels like a small thing,
(29:44):
but actually it's huge. And even at the most difficult
times in our life, whether we were financially struggling, you know,
struggling with moving, changing, whatever things were going on in
our life. Every time I'd update her on what would happen,
She'd always say, I trust you. And hearing your partner
(30:05):
say that when you don't even know what's going to
happen next is the greatest sign of love. And so
and and you know, she RADI decided to date me
and commit to a relationship with me when I had
nothing to offer about myself, and so that's a pretty
big thing. She she could have married anyone she wanted
(30:26):
to marry, and so her decision to be with someone
who didn't have a even a secure job when we
first started dating, and you know, someone who'd been in
the monastery for three years and didn't have any sort
of savings or any sort of plan, I think it
shows her character and her ability to you know, go
beyond material things. And and the more recent one, I mean,
(30:50):
I could go on as well. I think the more
recently you need to get one. Radi's never let me
define my self worth based on my success. So when
I first started to experience success, Rady didn't celebrate it
in the way I wanted her to and I would want. Look,
(31:11):
I'd wanted my wife to be my number one fan
and my biggest cheerleader, and she wasn't for my career.
But I had to realize if I skewed my perspective,
she was for who I was. So if it came
to my character, that's what she was backing. She wasn't
backing me because of my career. And that took me.
That helped me detach from valuing myself based on the
(31:34):
success of my career because I think that's what I
would have done and what I would have wanted if
she had fallen in that way. And so her lack
of validation for my career was the greatest validation for I'm.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
Great.
Speaker 8 (31:51):
I think it's a cue.
Speaker 5 (31:52):
And again going back to the men point, I think
a lot of men like we want our partners to
be like front Row. We want them to be the leader,
like we've we've got that culture. And I'm not saying
that my wife isn't my cheerleadering that, but I'm saying,
your wife's cheerleading your character, not your career. That's better
because the career is up and down, like the career
is going to do whatever it's going to do, But
(32:13):
your characters who you are, Like, what do you want
to be loved for? Do you want to be loved
for the amount of followers you have? Or do you
want to be loved for who you are and how
you show up and what she believes you represent? And
so I think it's genuinely we're laughing about it and
it can have funny connotations, but I want to clarify,
Like the point is, I think we all want to
be loved for who we are and not loved for
what we achieve.
Speaker 11 (32:34):
I did start listening to a podcast last year.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
Thank you for joining us. If you enjoy today's conversation, subscribe, share,
and follow us on at my Legacy Movement on social
media and YouTube. New episodes drop every Tuesday, with bonus
content every Thursday. At its core, This podcast honors doctor
King's vision of the Beloved community and the power of connection.
(33:01):
A Legacy Plus Studio production distributed by iHeartMedia creator and
executive producer Suzanne Hayward co executive producer Lisa Lyle. Listen
on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts,
Hosts And Creators
Craig Kielburger
Marc Kielburger
Martin Luther King III
Arndrea Waters King
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