April 17, 2023 • 62 mins
Veteran NBA player and analyst, Jalen Rose joins us on today's episode. We discuss the yesteryears; the unhealthy anger he carried as a young Jalen from the North West Side of Detroit, the Fab FIVE Era/the documentary, and the regrets of not winning more championships. Who doesn't know a child named, "Jalen" despite all odds he is inspiring and evolving.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
And so he wanted me to know like he's seeking
me out, not the other way around. The problem Carrie,
and this is something that I had to unpack as
I got older that I never really talked about is
I got that letter during the Final four.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
And I was so not ready for that.
Speaker 3 (00:23):
So you guessed it. The infamous and famous Fab five member.
Speaker 4 (00:27):
Jalen Rose on the podcast today getting Naked.
Speaker 5 (00:45):
Every Champion and Kerry Champions to be a Champion a
Champion and Kerry Champion and Kerry Chat be out a
Champion and Kerry Champion and Kerry Champire's Sports and Entertainment
and Naked. We're in the world with vulnerable considered were
coming moved to veil from entertainments the league. It's the
difference between what it's real and with the public seas.
So here's your favorite celebrities behind the scenes. Just refresh
(01:08):
you uped in the whole story, specific life alter rend
events to shake the person that you hear we gotta
champion and carry Champion nigger who did it? It's the
greatest dispersion entertainment connecked with Kerry Champion and Carry Champion
is to be a champion? Got a Champion and Carrie Champion,
Niggery got a champion and Carry Champion and Carrie Sheppi
g greatest sportsion entertainment can Naked War Today.
Speaker 4 (01:29):
Our guest is a friend, a colleague, an excellent NBA player,
NBA vet retired most notable though, if I have to
be honest, for me, I came to know when Jalen
Rose when he was playing at the University of Michigan.
Y'all know the Fab Five and if you don't do
your homework excellent documentary on ESPN produced by Jalen Rose
(01:52):
that tells the story of a group of kids who
were from the street who did something special. You know
what I mean, And by special, I mean change the
way we see college basketball unbeknownst to them. I believe
in the process. But they were able as freshman's sophomores
make it to the championship game a lot of I
think a lot of rules were made and rules were
(02:14):
broken to introduce them as they were in terms of
the Fab Five. But Jalen Rose is just much more
than the Fab five, right he is. He's a good guy.
He's a friend, as I mentioned earlier, and I'm I
like telling the story of people that I know, but
actually knowing more about them. So when I interviewed him
in particular, it was to find out what I didn't know,
(02:37):
and his story is layered and deep. I didn't know
his father was a number one draft pick. I didn't
know he didn't know his dad. I didn't know that
there were letters or a letter written from his father
that really perhaps affected him while playing in a very
important game. I share all this with you all to
tell you that this story is special and Jaylen took
some time to really get naked for us, and I
(02:58):
appreciate you.
Speaker 3 (02:59):
My friend.
Speaker 4 (03:00):
Well pick it up where he starts talking about you
know what made you? I love to ask that question
because we have energetic imprints of our family members on
us as we become adults, and he has a very
special story. Jalen Rose gets naked. I hope you all enjoy.
Speaker 5 (03:15):
It and carry Chepian and Carrie Chevy.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
While I'm in this single parent situation, the youngest of four,
I never met my biological father, who was the number
one pick in the nineteen sixty seven NBA draft. I
always felt like I was more special than everybody else.
I used to say that when I was young, I
had a rational confidence, like people see me talk trash
(03:41):
when I got to college. That didn't just start then,
you know that I've been doing that my entire life.
It was almost a way of survival sometimes in a
lot of ways. And so even though we were poor,
the entire block, the entire neighborhood, the entire community was
as well. So I didn't necessarily feel like it because
(04:04):
you get teased about anything anyway, Bumps on your face,
being skinny, having patches in your pants holes and your shoes.
People gonna tease you anyway, you know, and then you
realize sometimes people are gonna teach you that can also
beat you in the fight. So you got to you
gotta accept it and live to see another day. And
(04:26):
so for me, it was about survival. It was about
having a goal of trying to take my family out
of the neighborhood. I never liked having kerosene heaters in
the house. There were certain some there were certain winners
where we didn't have heat, and I boil water to
(04:47):
wash up that type of thing. But it didn't feel
abnormal because we weren't the only family on the block
that was required to do that.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
But I definitely was alway.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
It felt like I was driven to do something special,
but it takes a long time to get there.
Speaker 4 (05:05):
If you didn't have to boil water growing up, then
you're not a real one and you can't be on
a podcast.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Okay, no doubt, no doubt. A toast to that.
Speaker 4 (05:16):
She was like you, if you didn't have to do water,
you too, fancy me?
Speaker 2 (05:22):
Mm hmm correct.
Speaker 4 (05:25):
What I have noticed about you is your incredible and
I don't know if it is a personality that you've
learned growing up, but your incredible way of connecting people.
As long as I've known you, you've always been a connector.
You've always been easy. And some people might say, oh,
he Politiican, you know that's that word we use, right,
(05:47):
But why not why not just try to get along?
Why not try to make people come together? Why not
be pleasant when the situation isn't pleasant? Where does that
come from?
Speaker 1 (06:00):
It came from being a half not and always feeling
and appreciating the people that I saw gift back to
me in their own way.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
And it wasn't only always about money. So like my grandfather,
Paramour Hicks Senior, Bainbridge, Georgia, we used to go down
there in the summer. He had a grocery store, so
he had his house, but he turned the you know,
the garage into a like a grocery store, a penny
(06:33):
candy store. And he was always like ammaculate dressed. He
always had nice hats. He used to smoke cigarettes, and
he used to smoke cools, and he used to always
tell me, don't smoke cool, be cool.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
And then he started calling me long boy when I
was young, because obviously I was tall or whatever. So
that's what my grandparents and my mother and uncles called
me and my family since I was young and like
like just growing, continuing to like see role models in
(07:08):
my life. His son, Paramour Hicks Junior, was like the
Muhammad Ali of my family. He worked at the plant
forty plus hours a week. I'm gonna get this double time.
I'm gonna work Saturdays. But he also was a great artist.
He is the president of the bowling league, is the
president of the community block club. Like he was that
person drive past the house and check on everybody and
(07:30):
bring food at night.
Speaker 2 (07:33):
And so I had those people in my life.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
I had an older brother, I had two older I
have two older brothers and so I I have a
really great family dynamic, had a great high school coach,
and Perry Washson was like a father figure to.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
Me and Ed Martin.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
You know, during the fab five years, his name took
a lot of slander, but for those that don't know,
like the money that he ended up getting was because
he worked at the plant and he got an eye
injury and now was his settlement money. And he was
basically somebody that was just trying to influence young people
in the community ten years before I ever got to Southwestern.
(08:15):
So like seeing other people give and I don't talk
about it a lot publicly, but I have a tattoo
to say God's favor.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Like, my faith is really strong.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
And we joke as black people that our faith had
better been strong after four fifty years of slavery and
all the hymns and all the stuff we've gone through, Right,
but my faith is really strong. So I think all
of those things kind of carried me to the point
where if I had something to give back, I was
willing to do it. And it just as I started
(08:47):
to be able to give back more, I tried to
do it more responsibly, but also try to do it
where it could be meaningful.
Speaker 4 (08:55):
You mentioned, you mentioned the male figure, strong male figures
in your life, but you all so said your father
wasn't there and you never you never met him. Is
that as of late have you met your father?
Speaker 1 (09:06):
So, Jimmy Walker died in the late two thousands, I
believe it was two thousand and seven, and I went
to his funeral with Dave Bean. They were back courtinates
with the Pistons, and I was young. I did my intel.
I was like, oh, the reason why he ain't around
is because I as a basketball card. I'm like, you know,
(09:28):
he got traded in December, but I was born in January.
So in my mind as a kid, I validated it.
So I didn't really even ask my mother about my
father or about our circumstances or surroundings. I saw what
it was. He just wasn't there, so I wasn't gonna
burden her with it. I was like, I'm gonna be
(09:52):
what he was supposed to be mine. So he wore
number twenty four in high school. I wore number forty
two out of spite. I was like, he gonna know
my name, and I'm gonna make a name for myself
and for my family, and so I did use that
as motivation, definitely coming from a single parent situation, never
(10:15):
knowing my father, knowing that he also was a professional
athlete that allegedly had thirteen kids by eleven women.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
Wow, Wow, you know what that's called?
Speaker 4 (10:30):
Right? When you don't talk about something that's blatantly missing
in your life, do you know? My therapist told me
that's called fragmentation. My father wasn't around and we never
talked about it, and I thought that was dope.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
Like I never brought it up until it was time
for me to bring it up because other kids bring
it up. So you talk about it, but.
Speaker 4 (10:52):
It causes something that I wasn't familiar with. It's called fragmentation,
which sometimes forces us to to question our realities because
we don't know what's right and what's wrong or what's
real or is that real or is that really happening?
And I've seen that play out in my life. I'm like,
what I see is different from what everybody else sees.
(11:12):
There's this fragmentation there because no one's talking about it.
It's the elephant in the room.
Speaker 3 (11:17):
Forty two.
Speaker 4 (11:19):
He gonna know me, but it's never talked about. How
do you see and you may not feel like it's fragmentation,
but how do you see that disconnect playing out when
you become this superstar player on the first of all,
obviously collegiate level, that's when the world knew you. But
you had this level of fame prior to you get
(11:42):
to the collegiate level. And it's crazy. Do you see
it playing out your father not being there now that
you look back on it, because hindsight is always twenty
twenty cliche.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
Yes, and that fragmentation played out via jealousy.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
And I always looked at Grant Hill is somebody that
had the life that I wanted, and like many when
the Cosby Show happened or the Jeffersons happened, like to
see families together that were well dressed, that were well spoken,
that were like entrepreneurs, like that was rare.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
So I looked up to people like.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
Don Cornelius on Soul Train, and I knew that he
made sure that they never got the answer wrong because
he never wanted to make us look bad, and he
was putting on all of the artists and allowing us
to express ourselves. You know, like there's a many years
that we've been you know, suppressed, and so that is
(12:45):
a level of fragmentation. You're right, and out of sight,
out of mind for me allowed me to stay focused
on myself and not try to take on a lot
of pain or anger or disappointment of a relationship that
(13:05):
I wasn't old enough to nurture what might be the
results of it. So I got a letter from him
while I was in college, and he wrote it because
Mitch Album was doing the Fab five book and he
was never seeking to like, you know, get in my
shadow or nothing like that. He had his own career.
(13:28):
He's a better player than me. He had was like
forty in college, like he was a beast, and so
he wanted me to know like he's seeking me out,
not the other way around. The problem carry and this
is something that I had to unpack as I got
older that I never really talk about is I got
that letter during the Final four.
Speaker 2 (13:52):
And I was so not ready for that.
Speaker 3 (13:55):
No, that wasn't the time.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
That wasn't ready for that.
Speaker 4 (14:00):
But the set the scene, set the scene for the
folks who may not know the legacy of the Fab
five in the Final four and when.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
You get this, so like one of the beautiful things
about the Fab five brotherhood. Shout the Seaweb, Juwan Ray
and Jimmy, and shout to the Wolverines. Finally beat Ohio State.
We're gonna act like we do this.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
That's a deal. That's congratulations.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
I subs it to that being Buck Eye. Y'all know
how we do it. You know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (14:36):
Shout to my brother Jim Jackson, so many cats. I
got love for Ohio State, y'all know what it is.
And so, being a member of the Fab Five, Mitch Album,
who covered the team, ultimately wrote a best selling book
about our group, and he had the access because obviously
(14:57):
he's working in the media, and so while he was
writing that book, he was clearly reaching out to certain
people to talk to about it, and Jimmy Walker was
one of the people he reached out to. Jimmy Jimmy
didn't necessarily want to do it, but Jimmy wrote me
a letter that said that he did it, and da
da da. But anyway, Mitch got the letter and he
(15:18):
gave it to me the night before the game. And
by no means is he the reason why we ain't
win the championship.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
I'm blaming him. I'm making a.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
Connect by no means, but I can't front like the
Carolina game, people look at seaway of time out like
that's my brother and I'm a teammate. And if you
ever played team sports or like really being invested in
something you really love the people that you're rocking with, everybody,
when you lose, go look at what they could have
(15:49):
did better, including me. And I feel like that was
the worst game I played of the year, not even close.
Like this is not the rest of the world saying it,
this is me saying it. And as I got older,
I was like, wait a minute, I'm still walking around
with the same letter seven years ago that I got
(16:13):
as a college kid that I wasn't ready to open then.
So clearly that has some mental trauma. Yeah, because I
didn't open it until seven years later. I carried around
like lanus in a in a blanket, like just with
me everywhere I went, just kept it Kevin in the backpack,
(16:33):
Kevin and the stuff, kept it with me, with me,
with me, with me.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
Never opened it.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
I ain't open it until I was in the league
and I was like, you know what I'm about to
I'm about to read this. It was the last dance
year that was the year I actually I actually read
it too, and in the letter, he just let me
know that he wasn't trying to ride my cotel or
nothing like that, that he was proud of me. It
was all positive, and we kept some dialogue and our
(17:00):
I told him I was gonna try to come see him.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
I never tried to.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
I wasn't able to go see him, and ultimately he
ended up passing, but I did get a chance to
tell him I love him. I'm grateful for him that.
You know, he gave me the basketball jeans, and him
not being around gave me the motivation that gave me
the courage.
Speaker 3 (17:18):
Do you know how much pain I hear in that statement.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
I'm pretty sure it exists.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
So people see me now, right, they like, he got
nears now, yeah, he's for fars.
Speaker 2 (17:36):
I got as soon as I got d.
Speaker 3 (17:38):
You look good, You look good, You look good.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
You know he grew in his hair out.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
Like I look back at pictures of me when I
was in college, ball head, bumpy face, bad.
Speaker 2 (17:51):
Team Jalen like he was hazardous to my health?
Speaker 3 (17:56):
What do you mean? Like, why was that Jalen hazardous
to you?
Speaker 2 (18:00):
Because he had no filter and he was.
Speaker 1 (18:06):
He was willing to be reckless, and he was also
willing to not only do that for himself, but definitely
willing to do it for the people that he loved.
Like that's that, That's just that, that was just the
nature of a young, angry person that I was. And
(18:28):
I think back to this interview that we had when
we was about to play Duke and we was all
sitting there and I was like, I don't have a
fresh cut, Like I'm broke, Like I don't even want
to do this right now.
Speaker 3 (18:43):
I don't even that's not even what you should have
been worried about.
Speaker 1 (18:47):
Right Like to me, I was like, I don't even
feel like doing this right now. And it was the
one when we like and you hear it and I said,
I said, oh what up, Detroit can't get a fresh
cut every day, you know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (19:03):
Like that was the insecurity.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
I was broke, couldn't get a fresh cut, and like,
I'm on national I'm on the big stage. So yes,
I look at my younger self and I do see
his anger. I do see his pain and frustration with family,
with society and all of that. And so I'm so
(19:32):
very fortunate that I've been able to mature and overcome
a lot of that anger and that hostility that I
had in my head, in.
Speaker 4 (19:40):
My heart, and also the way that the men in
your life that were in your life poured back into you.
You know, yes, the way in which how you describe
your grandfather and how people take care of you and
showed you things that you remember. I see that playing
out because I met Jalen, met him, knew of him
(20:01):
way before, but met him, uh, when he was an adult.
You do what you I don't know if you remember this.
I I often told you. Do you remember the time
I met you at the bar with my homegirl and
he was trying to holler at her.
Speaker 3 (20:12):
Remember that.
Speaker 4 (20:15):
Before I Before I got he said, here's the scene.
I'm out with my homegirl in La. We're in downtown,
I think, And maybe you were already working at ESPN,
but you weren't, you know, Jalen Rose NBA analysts at ESPN,
but she was an analyst. And my homegirl comes in.
She was bad, like you're bad broad and I remember, okay,
(20:37):
battye probably like six one light skin mix, you know,
yo m O, and and we all sitting there and
I was working at the Tennis channel at the time
when we were talking, and you was at my girl
like ad her, but real respectful, not inappropriate.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
I don't have a disrespectful story. And I was like, yeah, no,
we're going tennis channel. I bet you I'll probably work
at ESPN sooner. He's like, good for you.
Speaker 4 (20:57):
Like kind of like, okay, how about Broad's I'd me
telling me that's what it's gonna work, and and and
and then and then you and my friend exchanged numbers.
I don't know whatever happened. And she wasn't like a
close friend. She was just some somebody was hanging out
with for a couple of years. But I exchanged numbers
and y'all hung out, and he.
Speaker 3 (21:16):
Was real smooth with it. He was just like, let
me call you, and.
Speaker 4 (21:24):
She was trying to and she was trying to act
like she wasn't excited, but she was excited. She went
to the bathroom, she was excited to talk to you.
She's like, oh my god. And I thought it was
I thought it was cute. I felt a way. I
felt away because you ignored me. But I was like,
my ego, my ego as big as hell. I was
like I'm mad too, ship. I know I ain't light
skinned with good hair, but still I'm cute, and it
(21:48):
was don't try to smooth it out now and then,
which was great because to me, I think God works
in mysterious ways. Because I didn't get to experience you
like that. I'm pretty sure you do even know who
that is. I don't remember her name either at the time.
But the reality is is that I got to meet
you in a real, full experience way when I worked
(22:08):
with you, and there wasn't none of this awkwardness like, oh, well,
im out another day, you know, so it all works.
It worked out perfectly. But I do remember thinking, what
a nice man, because you know, you meet you live
in LA you meet athletes all the time, and then
it's not always the best story. You meet famous people
all the time, it's not always the best story. But
I remember you being like good for you try it
like encouraging. That's why I said, you always have the
(22:30):
ability to be kind no matter what. You should always
know your surroundings and your circumstances. So for that I
appreciate you. Whether people want to believe like cause I
do know that when we're really kind, people don't want.
Speaker 3 (22:45):
To believe it.
Speaker 4 (22:45):
We always want to take the worst. We think there's
some agenda behind people being kind, and that's just not
the case.
Speaker 3 (22:51):
So then here you go.
Speaker 4 (22:52):
You are coming off of I think arguably, if not
the most defining moment in college sports. What you all
did with the Fab five really redefined what college athletics
look like for basketball players, for black men specific leagues,
(23:14):
very very similarly to what Allen Iverson did for when
he decided to change the face of the game. People
develop when you don't live up to that level of
excellence or people say you haven't lived up to that
level of excellence, i e. For you not winning the
national championship. People develop habits. They either have like they
(23:36):
try to medicate their way through the disappointment, whether that
be alcohol and drinking, or people lie and create different realities.
How did you cope with not winning? Did you have
to medicate? I mean, yes, you went to the league,
But did you have to medicate? Did you have to
find a way to cope with what wasn't No matter
(23:58):
how popular you guys were, at the end of the day,
you know, everybody want to win it all. We're competitors
at all correct.
Speaker 1 (24:05):
So, as I mentioned, I'm from the northwest side of Detroit.
I was born in seventy three, raised in the eighties
during the Reagan crack era. Ye, and a lot of cities,
clearly the entire nation and urban communities were affected, and
Detroit was hit hard, if not just as hard.
Speaker 2 (24:26):
And so I've been hardened by my upbringing.
Speaker 1 (24:33):
And as I'm older now, man, I look back at
it and it just it's just like a great foundation
that I could keep building on and building on and
building on, and it's like, well, it's like ask for
the Simpson. You build it up and build it.
Speaker 6 (24:49):
Up, and then we silid exact So like that, that's
that's kind of how I approach, like the journey and
the things that I've overcome that were.
Speaker 1 (25:05):
Failures, because a lot of times what you may see
is a success, accomplishing a goal, accomplishing a dream. Everybody
else can still try to act like, oh, it ain't
all that y'all.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
Won a championship, but you only had five points. Oh
y'all had a six game win streak, but you ain't
play right.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
So people can always minimize what you do, no matter
what it is. Hey to Bron you got fold championships,
but hey, you had to go to three different teams, like.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
It can always make right.
Speaker 1 (25:41):
So when I was in high school going to Southwestern,
our school had lost the state championship eight years in
a row before I got there. Okay, I played jv
my freshman year and I played varsity my sophomore year.
My sophomore year, we want to PSL. We won the
city and we lost the state championship for the ninth
(26:04):
consecutive time.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
It was like, Jerry West, are your Lakers?
Speaker 1 (26:08):
It's crazy, right, And my junior year, going into that season,
there was a writer that still rights in Detroit.
Speaker 2 (26:17):
Shout out to Mick mccab I'll say your name good,
Mick mccab.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
You know fel good. I love you, you know what
I'm saying. He always wrote bad about our program. He
always you know, whatever, whatever, whatever. And I know he
didn't know me, you know what I'm saying. And I
saw that he was only writing that about me because
of how well we was doing.
Speaker 2 (26:41):
It bugged me.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
Out, like wait a minute, Like we got the number
one team in the city, the state, in the country,
and and I'm like hold on, like this, can't you
lif and so that started to teach me about it.
Speaker 4 (26:59):
We learn that no matter what you do, they will
still find something correct.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
People go, people can criticize whatever you do.
Speaker 1 (27:08):
Like and so when I realized that, I was like,
I'm gonna do my best to be my best, make
all of the sacrifices I can make.
Speaker 2 (27:18):
And yeah, losing stinks. It hurts. When we lost the duke,
Yeah stunk. It hurt.
Speaker 1 (27:22):
We cried, But I did say I looked up to
Vegas and they just beat them the.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
Year before, like they was better than us. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:30):
Right, At some point you got to look in the
mirror and do you see yourself or your representatives?
Speaker 4 (27:35):
Right, So you learned in high school not to medicate
when people criticize or you in a different way, meaning
like you're like, all right, look, no matter what, Like
I got to look at this big picture.
Speaker 1 (27:48):
Well, the word medicating started way before the fab fives. Right,
I'm the product of my environment. And I might have
been exposed two joints in forty ounces as a teenager.
Sure that might have been something I might have had
somebody cop for me as an underage.
Speaker 4 (28:06):
By the way, that it's legal, it's fine, it's legal
now right.
Speaker 1 (28:10):
That may have happened before and around fifteen years of age.
Speaker 2 (28:15):
That might have happened. Sure, and it wasn't because I
won a loss a basketball game.
Speaker 3 (28:24):
But what I'm saying is, did you use it to cope?
Speaker 2 (28:28):
Yes? Okay, it's it's it's.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
One of the things I try to encourage adults to
do is to try to allow people to keep their innocence,
young people to keep their innocence as long as possible.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
Like, I know, the.
Speaker 1 (28:42):
Internet exists, television exists, sex, drugs, exposure to everything, music
or whatever. But the more you could keep their minds
and their hearts like focus on their goals and dreams
and pure and innocent and like happy about the journey
and not hardened by the journey, you give them.
Speaker 2 (29:02):
A chance to like shape who they are. Yeah, I
ain't get that chance.
Speaker 1 (29:06):
Yeah, you know I was one of those kids, like
I might have been a youngster, like, hey, you about
to get some of this cold forty five?
Speaker 2 (29:14):
Put you to sleep? You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (29:18):
You know, my mom my.
Speaker 4 (29:21):
Mom would be like, I'd be like, mom, let me.
My mom would be mad at me if I made
her drink wrong. And then if I made it wrong.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
She make me have it. She'd be like sit that.
Speaker 4 (29:29):
I'm like, I don't want it, but I was like,
but maybe yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:34):
And by the way, for those that don't know, when
I say cold forty five, that's Billy d You know.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (29:43):
He was a legendary pitchman, hand so well spoken guy.
Speaker 4 (29:49):
Hey, everybody, don't go anywhere. You know what we gotta do.
We gotta pay the bills, will be back. And just
a moment with Jalen Rose on Naked.
Speaker 5 (29:57):
Every Champion and every Champions to be a Champion of
Champion and Carrie Sheppion and Carrie chabyyaa Champion and Carrie
Sheppion and Carrie Sheby Sports.
Speaker 2 (30:06):
And Entertainment k Naked Word, Harry.
Speaker 5 (30:10):
Champion and Carrie Chappion is going to be a Champion
a Champion and Carrie Chappie and the Girl a Champion
and Carrie Sheppion and Carried Sheppy Entertainment Cat Naked Word.
Speaker 4 (30:20):
Hey, everybody, thank you for hanging in there. I gotta
pay these bills. As I often say every single week,
I'm glad you stayed because Jalen tells a very beautiful
story and I think this will help you understand who
he is and how he moves.
Speaker 3 (30:34):
Jalen, what's up the beauty of your story?
Speaker 4 (30:39):
As we talk about what what didn't happen, is what
you did make happen? Like you know, I was there.
I'm old enough to remember when you produced a beautiful
Fab five doc. And I'm old enough to remember that
you were able to tell your own story and create
your own narrative in spite of what people may have said.
You know what I mean Ooz, you were able to
(31:01):
tell your own story. I think that's the most important
thing for any human being, it's to create their own narrative,
because people will tell you a story, not the way
in which you wanted to be told. And I remember thinking,
what a wonderful, beautiful accomplishment and for someone who lived
through the Fab five era and have my Michigan shirt
from Target. I used to be like, y'all made y'all
(31:23):
made paraphernalia popular. My mom's like, why you want a Michigan.
C's like, cause I'm gonna go to the She's like, no.
Speaker 3 (31:27):
You not. I was like, that won't be happening, but okay.
Speaker 4 (31:32):
But the point of the matter is that it was cool,
it was popular, it was you know, I I was
proud of you, you know, as a colleague, but also
as somebody who came full circle.
Speaker 3 (31:50):
The story has.
Speaker 4 (31:51):
Always been and you always your line is always the same,
Your story is always the same. It's always been like
see Web is never recovered. He's fine, We're all good,
We're all friends. Now when I go back to being
that politician and taking care of everybody, do you have
the rapport with him that and the rest of the
crew that you wish you you wish you should have had,
(32:13):
or is has that ship sailed?
Speaker 2 (32:16):
That's a terrific question.
Speaker 1 (32:18):
I'm glad you asked that in the context of the
Fab five doc. And that was still a time I
remember I had the like legendary debate with Skip and
I talked about his high school status and whatnot. Like
that was at a time where athletes were required to
only either stick the sports or only talk about the
(32:42):
sport that they played. So I just remember, like from
two thousand and seven to twenty twelve, like I was
just working at best down from two thousand and two
to two thousand and seven doing MTV Movie Awards, Top
rain Box and NFL network sidelined all of a sudden,
I'm here, and it's like, hold on, y'all think and
(33:05):
this is like the public and like just you know,
people that see you as a former athlete, like oh
he could he talking about football, talking about baseball, talking
about boxing.
Speaker 2 (33:19):
You can do it all right, So let me get
this right.
Speaker 1 (33:22):
So you didn't play anything about everything, but don't put
me in a box. And so executive producing that documentary
was also important to me because as an athlete having
his own production company, I just did a play called
The Greatest Love Story Ever Told, where the story of
(33:45):
Mary and Joseph. And it was around the time when
Tyler Perry started his Chilling Circuit stage plays, and so
I was taking pride in doing a lot of things
that athletes are doing now that seemed normal, not clearly
that I was the first. I mean Shaq was doing movies,
(34:08):
I mean Fred Hammer Williamson in the sixties and Jim.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Brown was doing the movies.
Speaker 1 (34:12):
Like, by no means am I the first, But like
if doing that documentary meant that, So hiring Aaron Cohen,
who now is going on to do.
Speaker 2 (34:24):
Multiple projects with ESPN.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
Jason Air first project he did was Fab five doc,
and he just crushed it with.
Speaker 2 (34:33):
The last dance. Now he's turning down work.
Speaker 1 (34:37):
So I turned around and say them like, so I
ain't got another project, you know what I mean? And
to answer your Fab five part of it, I had
two endings. The ending that I wanted was gonna have
it mafioso, who's gonna be suited and booted, hats on
(34:57):
scarves on big ta my big chairs, lobster, double triple
bottles of champagne all on the table like we won
the game of life. That's what I'm wanted the ending
to be. If we weren't gonna get a current interview
(35:19):
from Cee, well then it ended up being what it
ended up being. And so in theory over that ten
year period, I mean, we can't hide the fact that
y'all ain't seeing us in the front row at the
Piston game. You know what I mean, y'all ain't seeing
us in the front row at the Michigan game in
Jauan coaching, right, So I can't act like it's where
(35:44):
I thought it would end up currently. But what I
will say, it's a lot better than it used to be.
And I see a time in the near future where
we'll get in the same place at the same time
and bring bread and as brothers and talking about the
things we like and don't like, and hopefully we'll get
(36:06):
past it and break another barrier, because like, we've invested
so much in each other and the public, and so
many people have invested so much in us. And I
know what it looked like to see your favorite group
break up. I remember epm D broke up.
Speaker 3 (36:24):
Yo, Oh my god, how Cas like Fuji? You know
what I mean? Don't listen, listen you like how no addition?
Speaker 2 (36:36):
Oh my god, this is the fact of my life.
Ice Cube was leaving.
Speaker 3 (36:40):
N w A that changed my entire world. That that crushed.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
Into the world right right, So I know, I understand
how it's important for the public and the culture who
made us.
Speaker 2 (36:58):
We didn't even want to be called Fast, We want
to be called five times. That was a dumb name.
Speaker 3 (37:06):
Like yeah, you guys didn't know, right.
Speaker 1 (37:11):
And so based on all of those things, like I
was there when he got inducted into the Hall of Fame.
I was happy to go support them type of thing.
And hopefully we can be in that arbor to support
Juwana and the team.
Speaker 4 (37:23):
So you know, it's uh, this world, what's the here's
the here's the thing when you when you guys are
because you guys are kids, kids like we don't we forget,
especially when you when you're calling games and these these
your kids. You don't grow up man, especially no offense,
y'all don't grow up too much much much later in life.
(37:44):
I'm not even talking about in your twenties, maybe your thirties,
you know what I mean, kind of getting it in
your forties. So you take these kids and you put
them in these positions and they can't process a lot,
so it's hard and if you're not doing the work
to understand what's going on. I don't know se Web,
but I I feel like I see a lot in him,
(38:06):
and I see a lot of disappointment and rage and
sadness and what about me? And and I deserve and
a lot of I am, you know, And that happens
when you feel like you have been treated unfairly in life,
which brings me back to what I have been able
(38:28):
to see you do with the cars that you have
been given, which is a beautiful thing and it's and
it's and it's rare as a black man to see
you to prosper in that way, and then they get
then you. Then you get the naysayers who who will
try to say, oh, but he didn't, but he, like
you said earlier, they're always finding something wrong. Do you
(38:48):
have any regrets about your professional career and how you
handled it on and off the court, and regrets may
not be the word. Do you have any redos? You
have any redos in a professional career as a basketball player,
not as an analyst, but as a basketball player that
you would rather do.
Speaker 2 (39:06):
Again on redos?
Speaker 1 (39:09):
I definitely would have won one championship in college, definitely
would have won one in the league.
Speaker 3 (39:18):
But what does that do when you win a chip?
Speaker 4 (39:20):
What does that do? Why would that be a redo
for you? Does it solidify your legacy? Does it make
your words more powerful when you talk on TV?
Speaker 2 (39:27):
What?
Speaker 1 (39:28):
No and no and no no no. I'm glad. I'm
glad you deciphered that. And I have an example for that. Okay,
and his name is Scottie Pippen.
Speaker 4 (39:37):
You ain't lying, and I want Scotty, if you're listening,
stop talking.
Speaker 3 (39:41):
Go ahead.
Speaker 1 (39:42):
As much as we talk about winning at all costs
you right, And how it seems to be the thing
that's gonna make us the most happy. And I know
some of that's out of his control, because when people
rapping about you in songs, and they ain't necessarily rapping
about you, but they rapping about some to carry your name, like,
you can't control that.
Speaker 2 (40:02):
But either way, he reminds me that.
Speaker 1 (40:09):
Just winning championships doesn't necessarily make you happy. And I'm
glad you asked the question that you asked, because in theory, no,
winning those championships does not validate me more to myself.
It probably validates more me more to some people who're
(40:30):
gonna shallow look at me shallow like a job anyway,
and put me in that box. But it's just a
sense of being able to see your hard work in
the journey that you've accomplished to get a chance to
compete against the best and the best, to have that
crown and achievement. It's more for that reason than it
(40:56):
is for people to pat me on the back, because
all people that turn around to do and say all
you want is one like you.
Speaker 3 (41:05):
Re got you only got one. You're like, damn, that's
one more than you, that's one more than you.
Speaker 4 (41:13):
Dog, Yeah, you are now working at ESPN and you
have been able to take yourself. I remember you even
explaining this to me and telling me how the journey
started for you, what you were doing and how you
like you mentioned earlier, free lance and working all these
different places, and then you work yourself into the spot,
(41:33):
the position where you want to be, and you find
yourself on all these different platforms and you're live in
and you get to the point where you're like the
face a countdown and you're doing all these different things.
Jalen Ninja Kobe get up, You get these big deals,
and then you find that the business is the business.
What's your overall takeaway? Because for me it was different.
(41:56):
I came in as a journalist and you know what
my story is, and I've shared that with you personally
and professionally. But you know I had to walk away
because I had to find my worth and find where
I felt appreciated, as we all have to do in
all relationships. What's your overall takeaway when you look at
from the moment you started your analyst career to where
(42:17):
you are now, also including the moments when everybody loves
you and you got a pilot on ABC and you
acting in it.
Speaker 3 (42:26):
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 4 (42:27):
Good job, by the way, but take all of that,
like all the things that you've been able to do,
and then where you are now, I see ebbs and flows,
I see highs and lows, but I see you staying consistent.
What's your biggest takeaway of this post NBA career now
working as an analyst? What are you giving that information
(42:50):
out right?
Speaker 1 (42:51):
So my biggest takeaway, and by the way, congratulations on
everything you accomplished then and now. Like to see you, Jamail,
Michael Smith, people that I consider family, brothers and sisters.
You know I work with Michael numbers never live before
(43:12):
it became his and hers. Jamail's from Detroit like best family,
and you talked about your relationship with me as well.
I think my biggest takeaway has its thread in each
of you guys. Is woven in each of you guys situations.
It's continue to fight for my voice and what ends
(43:36):
up happening is there are times when I need to
go to work and do come down on a Sunday
afternoon after like understanding what just happened with Breonna Taylor
and I'm just like sweating through my shirt and we've
seen the political cycle change from a lot of more
(43:59):
of stick to sports when Colin was taking the knee too,
like when the presidential cycle kind of changed and it
became a lot more divisive. It became like politics immersed
itself so much into sports that we couldn't even act
like we were ignoring it anymore.
Speaker 2 (44:20):
Yeah, yeah, right. And so.
Speaker 1 (44:25):
As as somebody that my culture has named their kids
after me, and.
Speaker 4 (44:34):
I don't know that's I don't know. I don't know
a kid that's not named Jalen. Sorry, so I don't
know what kid that's not named Jalen.
Speaker 1 (44:41):
Go ahead, Pablo Tori, And I just saw an article
that somebody sent me today, like the most popular name
in college basketball. But understanding where I came from and
starting to make a lot of my goals and dreams
come true, it never took me away from the authenticity
(45:03):
of who I am, and I make sure that those
don't get separated. And I don't have to tell you
that's the toughest thing to do. I'll give you a
perfect example. The Kyle Rittenhouse verdict came out. Yeah, and
I've been watching the try, saw how the judge was behaving,
(45:27):
saw the jokes that he was making, and I saw
like the politicism of who was backing him sure, and
the things that were being said, to the point where
they started to make sure that we know, so y'all
ain't surprised, there's a good chance that he gonna get off.
Speaker 3 (45:48):
Don't be surprised, like we don't want y'all.
Speaker 1 (45:51):
Be surprised, right, And so he gets off and we're
about to do a show. I think we were in
the garden or in Barclays, one of them, and I
just remember standing in I was so disappointed, and I
was glad that we were addressing the topic, and I
(46:12):
was just trying to recall so many different stories of
black men that have been murdered by the police. And
so as we started to talk about the Jacob Blake thing,
I misspeak and say that he was murdered by police.
Greeney corrects me, I correct myself, say he was shot
(46:33):
seven times. And I definitely want to apologize to his
family for misspeaking, But I do understand he was paralyzed.
Speaker 2 (46:41):
I do understand that.
Speaker 1 (46:44):
Because of that, Milwaukee Bucks were the first team that
eventually led to so many different teams and sports and
ultimately the NBA, not playing, and to be honest, I'm
happy that they got rewarded ultimately by winning the championship. Later,
I felt like that was karma that worked in their favor.
But what I noticed is there was a segment of
(47:06):
the population that sees me not normal NBA analysts. They
see me as the figure and the culture that I
just described. They see me as a founder of a
high school for a decade, and I have to remind
myself that they see me as red. I'm not just
(47:29):
here to talk about ball, so when I make a mistake,
they're going to try to reverse engineer the mistake and
act like they care about what I said about him,
But really they're just trying to make it like people
like me are spreading misinformation to create a narrative, but
(47:51):
ignore the facts of what happened in the case, whether
he got acquitted or not. To your question, those circumstances
continue to remind me how the work that's happening in
the community is so precious, and it inspires me to
(48:13):
continue to do it and do more.
Speaker 3 (48:16):
And that's why you have more.
Speaker 2 (48:18):
I know.
Speaker 1 (48:21):
That when I speak, it's not just exititing those normal analysts.
Speaker 2 (48:27):
It's like he's talking for his people and you ready
for this carrier?
Speaker 1 (48:34):
Do you other thing about tearing me down with that
use certain buzzwords like dumb.
Speaker 2 (48:43):
So just think about this now.
Speaker 1 (48:45):
As an honor roll student in high school, I mean
the deans list in college, I graduated from the college,
I'm a founder of a school, my best selling author,
I currently write a column for The New York Post
and do a podcast.
Speaker 2 (49:00):
Are the renaissance men.
Speaker 1 (49:01):
So if you can try to paint me as dumb,
you then try to elevate the journey of the people
behind me, and then you can now roll that same
thing rent and repeat over to the people that look
like me.
Speaker 2 (49:18):
But we're not going for that. And so that's what
I continue to learn, and I know I get.
Speaker 1 (49:26):
It, like like I guess, if I guess if I
was a woman, I could say there are times, unfortunately
that I see in the industry that as they start
to get older, their bodies changed, how they're fashion changes,
Dona Lah, they may not be.
Speaker 2 (49:46):
The flavor of the moment for people like me.
Speaker 1 (49:51):
Wearing a gold tee and saying arrest the cops that
murdered Bereonna Taylor like that don't necessarily endear you.
Speaker 2 (50:04):
In a lot of spaces.
Speaker 3 (50:06):
Yeah, of course. Well I don't think.
Speaker 4 (50:08):
I don't think that speaking truth to power endears you
to anybody. I think sometimes it's a necessary evil, like
washing your own clothes because I don't like to wash
wi somebody else is doing.
Speaker 3 (50:20):
But it's a necessary evil. Speaking truth to.
Speaker 4 (50:22):
Power doesn't endear you to anybody. Woman, man, child, boy girl.
Which is what I'm hearing you say is and this
may not be what you're saying, but what I'm hearing
is that the I need to be on this platform.
It's necessary because I'm speaking for people that don't have
a voice.
Speaker 7 (50:41):
And it also also, to be honest, not many people
that have my background that you can take them to
the chapel, you can take them to the block, you
can take them to the White House.
Speaker 2 (50:56):
You want to go to barbershop, you want you want
to go to the Taylor like where you want to go?
You want, you want to go to school? What you
want to do?
Speaker 1 (51:04):
Yeah, And so that is the value. It's almost like
when rap started to become popular. Remember EPMD made the
song keep the Crossover, Like we was trying to keep
rap yeah from becoming mainstream because we knew what's rap
became mainstream, we was.
Speaker 2 (51:25):
Gonna lose it to the almighty dollars.
Speaker 1 (51:29):
Yeah, right, And so that is the that's the importance
for me is if I'm able to continue to maintain
the way I've been able to, I know I can
be that credible voice that may not always, you know,
(51:50):
get I guess appreciated by mainstream America.
Speaker 2 (51:55):
Yeah, but I know I'm speaking, but sure for sure.
Speaker 4 (52:02):
And by the way, though Jalen he says something about like,
you know, getting older and changing at different women, Like
I might hope for everybody in this business to who
does what we do is to watch that we can
watch them evolve. Like if I'm still talking about the
same that I was talking about and trying to dress
how I dress when I was on first take, I'm
an idiot. If I'm still trying to sell sex, I'm
(52:22):
an idiot. Like that don't work. We've seen we have
colleagues who have gone way beyond that, and they still
selling sex.
Speaker 3 (52:30):
I'm talking about men and women.
Speaker 4 (52:31):
If they still doing that same that same stick twenty
thirty years later, I don't care how much money it's making. You,
you're an idiot and you're really not for the cause,
You're for the fame, and so you have to realize that.
As I've watched you evolve and transition, it's a welcome transition.
It's a welcome transition, and it allows you to live
(52:51):
in a lot of different worlds where you are very impactful.
Everybody can't live in a different world. Like you just
talked about all the places you can be in you
can live and everyone thinks they can do that.
Speaker 3 (53:01):
Everybody can't do that.
Speaker 4 (53:03):
So so the goal I would hope is that I'm
not Carrie from twenty twelve when the world was introduced
to me, that I am living in a world where
I know what my purpose is and that's to help
brown girls, Like it's a brown woman to be a face.
To be unapologetic about that, I say, whether you like
it or not, but I know that the work that
(53:26):
I'm doing, because being the first is always the hardest.
You've been the first in a lot of situations, so
you got to take the heat. You're the you, like
maybe the only constant I think on countdown, I'm thinking, like,
who else is the constant?
Speaker 2 (53:38):
Right?
Speaker 4 (53:39):
Like that's a first in itself, especially on that platform
where they change it every five minutes, and they met
at everybody every five seconds. And know that when people
come to you, they're trying to be you or some
form of you, Like I know that these girls are
trying to be some form of me and what I
used to be, right, and but know that what you're
(54:00):
doing is defining so much for so many men. I
had a conversation with Draymond the other day. He told
me some stuff you said to him. He was like,
that's my dog. I was like, right, Like, you're doing
what you supposed to do, right, the first real big
superstar in basketball from his home state. I think I
maybe I may be making that up, but I really
(54:21):
think it is and ultimately what he wants to do right.
Say what you want about Chuck, He's the first to
be so ridiculous in so many ways would still be accepted.
Speaker 3 (54:29):
Right.
Speaker 4 (54:30):
So it's a beautiful thing that I'm witnessing happen. And
I love what you said about where you find yourself
now and being a mainstay at the network. And who
cares what I think about? Like I have my own experience,
You have your own experience. We process it differently. I
came in very differently than you came in. I was
treated very differently than you retreated all the same, but
(54:50):
you know what I mean, everyone has their own experience.
I want to end this podcast with what I asked
you before off the top, because you said something I
thought was powerful and I think it'll be helpful. Do
you ever find yourself because what wasn't present in your
life doesn't necessarily determine who you are because you've made
the best of it. But do you ever find yourself
(55:11):
wishing you could have had a conversation with your father.
Speaker 2 (55:15):
I wanted to meet him in person for sure.
Speaker 1 (55:17):
Like It's one thing to be able to talk to
him on the phone, and I'm glad I had that
piece and be able to tell him that I appreciate him,
I love him, and I don't have any hard feelings,
but to meet him in person would have provided a
different level of gravity to the circumstance, like a sense
(55:38):
of closure.
Speaker 2 (55:40):
You know what I mean That I didn't get a.
Speaker 1 (55:42):
Chance to look him in his eyes, shake his hand,
hug his neck type of thing.
Speaker 3 (55:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (55:47):
So yeah, that bothered me for a while, and that
ultimately is what made me walk away from the game.
When I stopped playing, I could have played a couple
of more years, and I decided to go work for
ESPN at that time because I was already working at media.
(56:09):
You don't just walk away from the league making what
I made and then making what I may start doing multimedia,
and so I just felt like I wanted to start
something different. So, yes, I do feel like that has
a purpose in my head and heart.
Speaker 2 (56:27):
That's definitely unfulfilled.
Speaker 3 (56:30):
And what do you do with that? Do you know?
Or is it to be continued?
Speaker 2 (56:34):
I don't mean to be mean. I don't mean to
be rude. I don't mean to be disrespectful. I don't
mean to like be naive.
Speaker 1 (56:43):
Maybe right there were days, weeks, months, and years that
I didn't think about my father.
Speaker 3 (56:52):
Understandable.
Speaker 2 (56:53):
I had to focus on what was happening right now,
this concrete jungle that I'm growing up in, Like I'm
gonna get to school, you know what I'm saying, I
gotta worry about all of this. And so.
Speaker 1 (57:07):
As I matriculated as a young man, I tried to
like not worry about the things that I could control.
And I had a terrific mom. I lost my mother
in February, and I miss her so much. February second,
and she protected me from all of that stuff because
she worked at the plant, but she also worked at
(57:29):
the bar, so I got a chance to see all
sides of working nine to five. Genie Rose. But then
we at the bar, I'm giving people they drinks and
giving and I'm drinking Shirley Temples and putting money in
the pinball machine.
Speaker 2 (57:46):
You know what I'm saying. And that that gave me
a level of.
Speaker 1 (57:53):
It gave me a level of perseverance that I felt
like failure wasn't an option. So as I started having
success and all of my goals and dreams started to
come true. And I say this to any people, especially
black people, guys that don't know your father or don't
know your mother or whatever, like at some point you
gotta let it go. Like you can't be out here
(58:17):
thirty five, still blaming your mother and father beautiful decisions
you made, like you just can't.
Speaker 2 (58:25):
I'm live this. I'm telling you you can't do that.
Speaker 1 (58:27):
You sound crazy now, Like address your trauma, Like get
the therapy and the support that you need. But sometimes
that dysfunction is what can actually that stumbling bot can
actually be your stepping stone to your opportunities, but it's
dressed in overalls and you don't even see.
Speaker 2 (58:49):
It, and so you can't. I can't.
Speaker 1 (58:53):
And I didn't always blame what I didn't have for
what wasn't happening. I was like, I'm be the guy
that that breaks this glass ceiling. And I'm so very
fortunate that sports and entertainment and being educated and doing
that in this doggy dog field where you know how
(59:14):
it works, you know, rense and repeat. When you're the player,
it's like, after a couple of years, how much he make? Oh,
it's just somebody that's cheaper, you know. And so I've
been really fortunate that I've been able to maintain doing
what I'm doing. And we'll see, you know, how long
it continues to happen like this.
Speaker 4 (59:34):
Yeah, but you never you never fallen off because you've
got too many talents. I already know that there's just
that next chapter of greatness. It's never and it's not
for the approval of anybody else, but just for yourself,
you know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (59:48):
Thank you, I.
Speaker 4 (59:48):
See I see it a big, huge, gigantic future. Thank
you so much for joining us on Naked. I appreciate you.
Jalen Rose, my pleasure. Cheers, cheers, porn of dumb that's
been sitting in the fringe for a year. You rich this,
(01:00:10):
We're rich black side over here, real rich black are
Why hit my hands.
Speaker 2 (01:00:14):
On the date?
Speaker 1 (01:00:15):
If she ain't even know what it was he was born,
it is she? He was like, that's domb perry on.
It s opposed the bull.
Speaker 3 (01:00:23):
It's supposed to bull boo.
Speaker 4 (01:00:30):
I say this because it's true. All of us, as adults,
especially when you become aware of yourself as an adult,
spend a lot of time trying to figure out our
childhood and how it made us who we are today.
And once we break down those images, those ideas, those memories,
and we really come into our own we blossom into
something special and beautiful. And I believe that is what
(01:00:52):
is happening with my friend Jalen Rose. Nothing is wrong,
Everything is right, Everything is as it should be right.
We judge ourselves so much, but everything is as it
should be. I appreciate him telling his story about his
father because it really does show me two things. One
incredible determination. He has been able to succeed in spite
(01:01:14):
of because of the images that were in his life
his mother. He talks about that he lost his mother recently.
I know that had to be painful, and again I'm
sending you so much love, my brother.
Speaker 3 (01:01:22):
I'm sorry.
Speaker 4 (01:01:24):
But then look at what he's been able to do.
He's the guy that I know as an NBA player,
as a veteran that is giving great analysis on ESPN.
There's the actor in him that I'm pretty sure that
he has yet to talk about. But I love that
he is so much more than what we see on
the surface. I say that for you all as well.
There's so much more. Don't be afraid to go out
(01:01:45):
and show people who you are. Don't be afraid to
make mistakes, Don't be afraid to be like I don't
have it. It's so beautiful to be authentic and true
and naked. We spend so much time pretending like everything
is okay, myself included. But I'm glad Jalen took some
time today to share his story, but back next week.
Speaker 3 (01:02:03):
I appreciate you all support
And so he wanted me to know like he's seeking
me out, not the other way around. The problem Carrie,
and this is something that I had to unpack as
I got older that I never really talked about is
I got that letter during the Final four.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
And I was so not ready for that.
Speaker 3 (00:23):
So you guessed it. The infamous and famous Fab five member.
Speaker 4 (00:27):
Jalen Rose on the podcast today getting Naked.
Speaker 5 (00:45):
Every Champion and Kerry Champions to be a Champion a
Champion and Kerry Champion and Kerry Chat be out a
Champion and Kerry Champion and Kerry Champire's Sports and Entertainment
and Naked. We're in the world with vulnerable considered were
coming moved to veil from entertainments the league. It's the
difference between what it's real and with the public seas.
So here's your favorite celebrities behind the scenes. Just refresh
(01:08):
you uped in the whole story, specific life alter rend
events to shake the person that you hear we gotta
champion and carry Champion nigger who did it? It's the
greatest dispersion entertainment connecked with Kerry Champion and Carry Champion
is to be a champion? Got a Champion and Carrie Champion,
Niggery got a champion and Carry Champion and Carrie Sheppi
g greatest sportsion entertainment can Naked War Today.
Speaker 4 (01:29):
Our guest is a friend, a colleague, an excellent NBA player,
NBA vet retired most notable though, if I have to
be honest, for me, I came to know when Jalen
Rose when he was playing at the University of Michigan.
Y'all know the Fab Five and if you don't do
your homework excellent documentary on ESPN produced by Jalen Rose
(01:52):
that tells the story of a group of kids who
were from the street who did something special. You know
what I mean, And by special, I mean change the
way we see college basketball unbeknownst to them. I believe
in the process. But they were able as freshman's sophomores
make it to the championship game a lot of I
think a lot of rules were made and rules were
(02:14):
broken to introduce them as they were in terms of
the Fab Five. But Jalen Rose is just much more
than the Fab five, right he is. He's a good guy.
He's a friend, as I mentioned earlier, and I'm I
like telling the story of people that I know, but
actually knowing more about them. So when I interviewed him
in particular, it was to find out what I didn't know,
(02:37):
and his story is layered and deep. I didn't know
his father was a number one draft pick. I didn't
know he didn't know his dad. I didn't know that
there were letters or a letter written from his father
that really perhaps affected him while playing in a very
important game. I share all this with you all to
tell you that this story is special and Jaylen took
some time to really get naked for us, and I
(02:58):
appreciate you.
Speaker 3 (02:59):
My friend.
Speaker 4 (03:00):
Well pick it up where he starts talking about you
know what made you? I love to ask that question
because we have energetic imprints of our family members on
us as we become adults, and he has a very
special story. Jalen Rose gets naked. I hope you all enjoy.
Speaker 5 (03:15):
It and carry Chepian and Carrie Chevy.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
While I'm in this single parent situation, the youngest of four,
I never met my biological father, who was the number
one pick in the nineteen sixty seven NBA draft. I
always felt like I was more special than everybody else.
I used to say that when I was young, I
had a rational confidence, like people see me talk trash
(03:41):
when I got to college. That didn't just start then,
you know that I've been doing that my entire life.
It was almost a way of survival sometimes in a
lot of ways. And so even though we were poor,
the entire block, the entire neighborhood, the entire community was
as well. So I didn't necessarily feel like it because
(04:04):
you get teased about anything anyway, Bumps on your face,
being skinny, having patches in your pants holes and your shoes.
People gonna tease you anyway, you know, and then you
realize sometimes people are gonna teach you that can also
beat you in the fight. So you got to you
gotta accept it and live to see another day. And
(04:26):
so for me, it was about survival. It was about
having a goal of trying to take my family out
of the neighborhood. I never liked having kerosene heaters in
the house. There were certain some there were certain winners
where we didn't have heat, and I boil water to
(04:47):
wash up that type of thing. But it didn't feel
abnormal because we weren't the only family on the block
that was required to do that.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
But I definitely was alway.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
It felt like I was driven to do something special,
but it takes a long time to get there.
Speaker 4 (05:05):
If you didn't have to boil water growing up, then
you're not a real one and you can't be on
a podcast.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Okay, no doubt, no doubt. A toast to that.
Speaker 4 (05:16):
She was like you, if you didn't have to do water,
you too, fancy me?
Speaker 2 (05:22):
Mm hmm correct.
Speaker 4 (05:25):
What I have noticed about you is your incredible and
I don't know if it is a personality that you've
learned growing up, but your incredible way of connecting people.
As long as I've known you, you've always been a connector.
You've always been easy. And some people might say, oh,
he Politiican, you know that's that word we use, right,
(05:47):
But why not why not just try to get along?
Why not try to make people come together? Why not
be pleasant when the situation isn't pleasant? Where does that
come from?
Speaker 1 (06:00):
It came from being a half not and always feeling
and appreciating the people that I saw gift back to
me in their own way.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
And it wasn't only always about money. So like my grandfather,
Paramour Hicks Senior, Bainbridge, Georgia, we used to go down
there in the summer. He had a grocery store, so
he had his house, but he turned the you know,
the garage into a like a grocery store, a penny
(06:33):
candy store. And he was always like ammaculate dressed. He
always had nice hats. He used to smoke cigarettes, and
he used to smoke cools, and he used to always
tell me, don't smoke cool, be cool.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
And then he started calling me long boy when I
was young, because obviously I was tall or whatever. So
that's what my grandparents and my mother and uncles called
me and my family since I was young and like
like just growing, continuing to like see role models in
(07:08):
my life. His son, Paramour Hicks Junior, was like the
Muhammad Ali of my family. He worked at the plant
forty plus hours a week. I'm gonna get this double time.
I'm gonna work Saturdays. But he also was a great artist.
He is the president of the bowling league, is the
president of the community block club. Like he was that
person drive past the house and check on everybody and
(07:30):
bring food at night.
Speaker 2 (07:33):
And so I had those people in my life.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
I had an older brother, I had two older I
have two older brothers and so I I have a
really great family dynamic, had a great high school coach,
and Perry Washson was like a father figure to.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
Me and Ed Martin.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
You know, during the fab five years, his name took
a lot of slander, but for those that don't know,
like the money that he ended up getting was because
he worked at the plant and he got an eye
injury and now was his settlement money. And he was
basically somebody that was just trying to influence young people
in the community ten years before I ever got to Southwestern.
(08:15):
So like seeing other people give and I don't talk
about it a lot publicly, but I have a tattoo
to say God's favor.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Like, my faith is really strong.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
And we joke as black people that our faith had
better been strong after four fifty years of slavery and
all the hymns and all the stuff we've gone through, Right,
but my faith is really strong. So I think all
of those things kind of carried me to the point
where if I had something to give back, I was
willing to do it. And it just as I started
(08:47):
to be able to give back more, I tried to
do it more responsibly, but also try to do it
where it could be meaningful.
Speaker 4 (08:55):
You mentioned, you mentioned the male figure, strong male figures
in your life, but you all so said your father
wasn't there and you never you never met him. Is
that as of late have you met your father?
Speaker 1 (09:06):
So, Jimmy Walker died in the late two thousands, I
believe it was two thousand and seven, and I went
to his funeral with Dave Bean. They were back courtinates
with the Pistons, and I was young. I did my intel.
I was like, oh, the reason why he ain't around
is because I as a basketball card. I'm like, you know,
(09:28):
he got traded in December, but I was born in January.
So in my mind as a kid, I validated it.
So I didn't really even ask my mother about my
father or about our circumstances or surroundings. I saw what
it was. He just wasn't there, so I wasn't gonna
burden her with it. I was like, I'm gonna be
(09:52):
what he was supposed to be mine. So he wore
number twenty four in high school. I wore number forty
two out of spite. I was like, he gonna know
my name, and I'm gonna make a name for myself
and for my family, and so I did use that
as motivation, definitely coming from a single parent situation, never
(10:15):
knowing my father, knowing that he also was a professional
athlete that allegedly had thirteen kids by eleven women.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
Wow, Wow, you know what that's called?
Speaker 4 (10:30):
Right? When you don't talk about something that's blatantly missing
in your life, do you know? My therapist told me
that's called fragmentation. My father wasn't around and we never
talked about it, and I thought that was dope.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
Like I never brought it up until it was time
for me to bring it up because other kids bring
it up. So you talk about it, but.
Speaker 4 (10:52):
It causes something that I wasn't familiar with. It's called fragmentation,
which sometimes forces us to to question our realities because
we don't know what's right and what's wrong or what's
real or is that real or is that really happening?
And I've seen that play out in my life. I'm like,
what I see is different from what everybody else sees.
(11:12):
There's this fragmentation there because no one's talking about it.
It's the elephant in the room.
Speaker 3 (11:17):
Forty two.
Speaker 4 (11:19):
He gonna know me, but it's never talked about. How
do you see and you may not feel like it's fragmentation,
but how do you see that disconnect playing out when
you become this superstar player on the first of all,
obviously collegiate level, that's when the world knew you. But
you had this level of fame prior to you get
(11:42):
to the collegiate level. And it's crazy. Do you see
it playing out your father not being there now that
you look back on it, because hindsight is always twenty
twenty cliche.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
Yes, and that fragmentation played out via jealousy.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
And I always looked at Grant Hill is somebody that
had the life that I wanted, and like many when
the Cosby Show happened or the Jeffersons happened, like to
see families together that were well dressed, that were well spoken,
that were like entrepreneurs, like that was rare.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
So I looked up to people like.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
Don Cornelius on Soul Train, and I knew that he
made sure that they never got the answer wrong because
he never wanted to make us look bad, and he
was putting on all of the artists and allowing us
to express ourselves. You know, like there's a many years
that we've been you know, suppressed, and so that is
(12:45):
a level of fragmentation. You're right, and out of sight,
out of mind for me allowed me to stay focused
on myself and not try to take on a lot
of pain or anger or disappointment of a relationship that
(13:05):
I wasn't old enough to nurture what might be the
results of it. So I got a letter from him
while I was in college, and he wrote it because
Mitch Album was doing the Fab five book and he
was never seeking to like, you know, get in my
shadow or nothing like that. He had his own career.
(13:28):
He's a better player than me. He had was like
forty in college, like he was a beast, and so
he wanted me to know like he's seeking me out,
not the other way around. The problem carry and this
is something that I had to unpack as I got
older that I never really talk about is I got
that letter during the Final four.
Speaker 2 (13:52):
And I was so not ready for that.
Speaker 3 (13:55):
No, that wasn't the time.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
That wasn't ready for that.
Speaker 4 (14:00):
But the set the scene, set the scene for the
folks who may not know the legacy of the Fab
five in the Final four and when.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
You get this, so like one of the beautiful things
about the Fab five brotherhood. Shout the Seaweb, Juwan Ray
and Jimmy, and shout to the Wolverines. Finally beat Ohio State.
We're gonna act like we do this.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
That's a deal. That's congratulations.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
I subs it to that being Buck Eye. Y'all know
how we do it. You know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (14:36):
Shout to my brother Jim Jackson, so many cats. I
got love for Ohio State, y'all know what it is.
And so, being a member of the Fab Five, Mitch Album,
who covered the team, ultimately wrote a best selling book
about our group, and he had the access because obviously
(14:57):
he's working in the media, and so while he was
writing that book, he was clearly reaching out to certain
people to talk to about it, and Jimmy Walker was
one of the people he reached out to. Jimmy Jimmy
didn't necessarily want to do it, but Jimmy wrote me
a letter that said that he did it, and da
da da. But anyway, Mitch got the letter and he
(15:18):
gave it to me the night before the game. And
by no means is he the reason why we ain't
win the championship.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
I'm blaming him. I'm making a.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
Connect by no means, but I can't front like the
Carolina game, people look at seaway of time out like
that's my brother and I'm a teammate. And if you
ever played team sports or like really being invested in
something you really love the people that you're rocking with, everybody,
when you lose, go look at what they could have
(15:49):
did better, including me. And I feel like that was
the worst game I played of the year, not even close.
Like this is not the rest of the world saying it,
this is me saying it. And as I got older,
I was like, wait a minute, I'm still walking around
with the same letter seven years ago that I got
(16:13):
as a college kid that I wasn't ready to open then.
So clearly that has some mental trauma. Yeah, because I
didn't open it until seven years later. I carried around
like lanus in a in a blanket, like just with
me everywhere I went, just kept it Kevin in the backpack,
(16:33):
Kevin and the stuff, kept it with me, with me,
with me, with me.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
Never opened it.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
I ain't open it until I was in the league
and I was like, you know what I'm about to
I'm about to read this. It was the last dance
year that was the year I actually I actually read
it too, and in the letter, he just let me
know that he wasn't trying to ride my cotel or
nothing like that, that he was proud of me. It
was all positive, and we kept some dialogue and our
(17:00):
I told him I was gonna try to come see him.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
I never tried to.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
I wasn't able to go see him, and ultimately he
ended up passing, but I did get a chance to
tell him I love him. I'm grateful for him that.
You know, he gave me the basketball jeans, and him
not being around gave me the motivation that gave me
the courage.
Speaker 3 (17:18):
Do you know how much pain I hear in that statement.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
I'm pretty sure it exists.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
So people see me now, right, they like, he got
nears now, yeah, he's for fars.
Speaker 2 (17:36):
I got as soon as I got d.
Speaker 3 (17:38):
You look good, You look good, You look good.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
You know he grew in his hair out.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
Like I look back at pictures of me when I
was in college, ball head, bumpy face, bad.
Speaker 2 (17:51):
Team Jalen like he was hazardous to my health?
Speaker 3 (17:56):
What do you mean? Like, why was that Jalen hazardous
to you?
Speaker 2 (18:00):
Because he had no filter and he was.
Speaker 1 (18:06):
He was willing to be reckless, and he was also
willing to not only do that for himself, but definitely
willing to do it for the people that he loved.
Like that's that, That's just that, that was just the
nature of a young, angry person that I was. And
(18:28):
I think back to this interview that we had when
we was about to play Duke and we was all
sitting there and I was like, I don't have a
fresh cut, Like I'm broke, Like I don't even want
to do this right now.
Speaker 3 (18:43):
I don't even that's not even what you should have
been worried about.
Speaker 1 (18:47):
Right Like to me, I was like, I don't even
feel like doing this right now. And it was the
one when we like and you hear it and I said,
I said, oh what up, Detroit can't get a fresh
cut every day, you know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (19:03):
Like that was the insecurity.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
I was broke, couldn't get a fresh cut, and like,
I'm on national I'm on the big stage. So yes,
I look at my younger self and I do see
his anger. I do see his pain and frustration with family,
with society and all of that. And so I'm so
(19:32):
very fortunate that I've been able to mature and overcome
a lot of that anger and that hostility that I
had in my head, in.
Speaker 4 (19:40):
My heart, and also the way that the men in
your life that were in your life poured back into you.
You know, yes, the way in which how you describe
your grandfather and how people take care of you and
showed you things that you remember. I see that playing
out because I met Jalen, met him, knew of him
(20:01):
way before, but met him, uh, when he was an adult.
You do what you I don't know if you remember this.
I I often told you. Do you remember the time
I met you at the bar with my homegirl and
he was trying to holler at her.
Speaker 3 (20:12):
Remember that.
Speaker 4 (20:15):
Before I Before I got he said, here's the scene.
I'm out with my homegirl in La. We're in downtown,
I think, And maybe you were already working at ESPN,
but you weren't, you know, Jalen Rose NBA analysts at ESPN,
but she was an analyst. And my homegirl comes in.
She was bad, like you're bad broad and I remember, okay,
(20:37):
battye probably like six one light skin mix, you know,
yo m O, and and we all sitting there and
I was working at the Tennis channel at the time
when we were talking, and you was at my girl
like ad her, but real respectful, not inappropriate.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
I don't have a disrespectful story. And I was like, yeah, no,
we're going tennis channel. I bet you I'll probably work
at ESPN sooner. He's like, good for you.
Speaker 4 (20:57):
Like kind of like, okay, how about Broad's I'd me
telling me that's what it's gonna work, and and and
and then and then you and my friend exchanged numbers.
I don't know whatever happened. And she wasn't like a
close friend. She was just some somebody was hanging out
with for a couple of years. But I exchanged numbers
and y'all hung out, and he.
Speaker 3 (21:16):
Was real smooth with it. He was just like, let
me call you, and.
Speaker 4 (21:24):
She was trying to and she was trying to act
like she wasn't excited, but she was excited. She went
to the bathroom, she was excited to talk to you.
She's like, oh my god. And I thought it was
I thought it was cute. I felt a way. I
felt away because you ignored me. But I was like,
my ego, my ego as big as hell. I was
like I'm mad too, ship. I know I ain't light
skinned with good hair, but still I'm cute, and it
(21:48):
was don't try to smooth it out now and then,
which was great because to me, I think God works
in mysterious ways. Because I didn't get to experience you
like that. I'm pretty sure you do even know who
that is. I don't remember her name either at the time.
But the reality is is that I got to meet
you in a real, full experience way when I worked
(22:08):
with you, and there wasn't none of this awkwardness like, oh, well,
im out another day, you know, so it all works.
It worked out perfectly. But I do remember thinking, what
a nice man, because you know, you meet you live
in LA you meet athletes all the time, and then
it's not always the best story. You meet famous people
all the time, it's not always the best story. But
I remember you being like good for you try it
like encouraging. That's why I said, you always have the
(22:30):
ability to be kind no matter what. You should always
know your surroundings and your circumstances. So for that I
appreciate you. Whether people want to believe like cause I
do know that when we're really kind, people don't want.
Speaker 3 (22:45):
To believe it.
Speaker 4 (22:45):
We always want to take the worst. We think there's
some agenda behind people being kind, and that's just not
the case.
Speaker 3 (22:51):
So then here you go.
Speaker 4 (22:52):
You are coming off of I think arguably, if not
the most defining moment in college sports. What you all
did with the Fab five really redefined what college athletics
look like for basketball players, for black men specific leagues,
(23:14):
very very similarly to what Allen Iverson did for when
he decided to change the face of the game. People
develop when you don't live up to that level of
excellence or people say you haven't lived up to that
level of excellence, i e. For you not winning the
national championship. People develop habits. They either have like they
(23:36):
try to medicate their way through the disappointment, whether that
be alcohol and drinking, or people lie and create different realities.
How did you cope with not winning? Did you have
to medicate? I mean, yes, you went to the league,
But did you have to medicate? Did you have to
find a way to cope with what wasn't No matter
(23:58):
how popular you guys were, at the end of the day,
you know, everybody want to win it all. We're competitors
at all correct.
Speaker 1 (24:05):
So, as I mentioned, I'm from the northwest side of Detroit.
I was born in seventy three, raised in the eighties
during the Reagan crack era. Ye, and a lot of cities,
clearly the entire nation and urban communities were affected, and
Detroit was hit hard, if not just as hard.
Speaker 2 (24:26):
And so I've been hardened by my upbringing.
Speaker 1 (24:33):
And as I'm older now, man, I look back at
it and it just it's just like a great foundation
that I could keep building on and building on and
building on, and it's like, well, it's like ask for
the Simpson. You build it up and build it.
Speaker 6 (24:49):
Up, and then we silid exact So like that, that's
that's kind of how I approach, like the journey and
the things that I've overcome that were.
Speaker 1 (25:05):
Failures, because a lot of times what you may see
is a success, accomplishing a goal, accomplishing a dream. Everybody
else can still try to act like, oh, it ain't
all that y'all.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
Won a championship, but you only had five points. Oh
y'all had a six game win streak, but you ain't
play right.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
So people can always minimize what you do, no matter
what it is. Hey to Bron you got fold championships,
but hey, you had to go to three different teams, like.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
It can always make right.
Speaker 1 (25:41):
So when I was in high school going to Southwestern,
our school had lost the state championship eight years in
a row before I got there. Okay, I played jv
my freshman year and I played varsity my sophomore year.
My sophomore year, we want to PSL. We won the
city and we lost the state championship for the ninth
(26:04):
consecutive time.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
It was like, Jerry West, are your Lakers?
Speaker 1 (26:08):
It's crazy, right, And my junior year, going into that season,
there was a writer that still rights in Detroit.
Speaker 2 (26:17):
Shout out to Mick mccab I'll say your name good,
Mick mccab.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
You know fel good. I love you, you know what
I'm saying. He always wrote bad about our program. He
always you know, whatever, whatever, whatever. And I know he
didn't know me, you know what I'm saying. And I
saw that he was only writing that about me because
of how well we was doing.
Speaker 2 (26:41):
It bugged me.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
Out, like wait a minute, Like we got the number
one team in the city, the state, in the country,
and and I'm like hold on, like this, can't you
lif and so that started to teach me about it.
Speaker 4 (26:59):
We learn that no matter what you do, they will
still find something correct.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
People go, people can criticize whatever you do.
Speaker 1 (27:08):
Like and so when I realized that, I was like,
I'm gonna do my best to be my best, make
all of the sacrifices I can make.
Speaker 2 (27:18):
And yeah, losing stinks. It hurts. When we lost the duke,
Yeah stunk. It hurt.
Speaker 1 (27:22):
We cried, But I did say I looked up to
Vegas and they just beat them the.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
Year before, like they was better than us. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:30):
Right, At some point you got to look in the
mirror and do you see yourself or your representatives?
Speaker 4 (27:35):
Right, So you learned in high school not to medicate
when people criticize or you in a different way, meaning
like you're like, all right, look, no matter what, Like
I got to look at this big picture.
Speaker 1 (27:48):
Well, the word medicating started way before the fab fives. Right,
I'm the product of my environment. And I might have
been exposed two joints in forty ounces as a teenager.
Sure that might have been something I might have had
somebody cop for me as an underage.
Speaker 4 (28:06):
By the way, that it's legal, it's fine, it's legal
now right.
Speaker 1 (28:10):
That may have happened before and around fifteen years of age.
Speaker 2 (28:15):
That might have happened. Sure, and it wasn't because I
won a loss a basketball game.
Speaker 3 (28:24):
But what I'm saying is, did you use it to cope?
Speaker 2 (28:28):
Yes? Okay, it's it's it's.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
One of the things I try to encourage adults to
do is to try to allow people to keep their innocence,
young people to keep their innocence as long as possible.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
Like, I know, the.
Speaker 1 (28:42):
Internet exists, television exists, sex, drugs, exposure to everything, music
or whatever. But the more you could keep their minds
and their hearts like focus on their goals and dreams
and pure and innocent and like happy about the journey
and not hardened by the journey, you give them.
Speaker 2 (29:02):
A chance to like shape who they are. Yeah, I
ain't get that chance.
Speaker 1 (29:06):
Yeah, you know I was one of those kids, like
I might have been a youngster, like, hey, you about
to get some of this cold forty five?
Speaker 2 (29:14):
Put you to sleep? You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (29:18):
You know, my mom my.
Speaker 4 (29:21):
Mom would be like, I'd be like, mom, let me.
My mom would be mad at me if I made
her drink wrong. And then if I made it wrong.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
She make me have it. She'd be like sit that.
Speaker 4 (29:29):
I'm like, I don't want it, but I was like,
but maybe yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:34):
And by the way, for those that don't know, when
I say cold forty five, that's Billy d You know.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (29:43):
He was a legendary pitchman, hand so well spoken guy.
Speaker 4 (29:49):
Hey, everybody, don't go anywhere. You know what we gotta do.
We gotta pay the bills, will be back. And just
a moment with Jalen Rose on Naked.
Speaker 5 (29:57):
Every Champion and every Champions to be a Champion of
Champion and Carrie Sheppion and Carrie chabyyaa Champion and Carrie
Sheppion and Carrie Sheby Sports.
Speaker 2 (30:06):
And Entertainment k Naked Word, Harry.
Speaker 5 (30:10):
Champion and Carrie Chappion is going to be a Champion
a Champion and Carrie Chappie and the Girl a Champion
and Carrie Sheppion and Carried Sheppy Entertainment Cat Naked Word.
Speaker 4 (30:20):
Hey, everybody, thank you for hanging in there. I gotta
pay these bills. As I often say every single week,
I'm glad you stayed because Jalen tells a very beautiful
story and I think this will help you understand who
he is and how he moves.
Speaker 3 (30:34):
Jalen, what's up the beauty of your story?
Speaker 4 (30:39):
As we talk about what what didn't happen, is what
you did make happen? Like you know, I was there.
I'm old enough to remember when you produced a beautiful
Fab five doc. And I'm old enough to remember that
you were able to tell your own story and create
your own narrative in spite of what people may have said.
You know what I mean Ooz, you were able to
(31:01):
tell your own story. I think that's the most important
thing for any human being, it's to create their own narrative,
because people will tell you a story, not the way
in which you wanted to be told. And I remember thinking,
what a wonderful, beautiful accomplishment and for someone who lived
through the Fab five era and have my Michigan shirt
from Target. I used to be like, y'all made y'all
(31:23):
made paraphernalia popular. My mom's like, why you want a Michigan.
C's like, cause I'm gonna go to the She's like, no.
Speaker 3 (31:27):
You not. I was like, that won't be happening, but okay.
Speaker 4 (31:32):
But the point of the matter is that it was cool,
it was popular, it was you know, I I was
proud of you, you know, as a colleague, but also
as somebody who came full circle.
Speaker 3 (31:50):
The story has.
Speaker 4 (31:51):
Always been and you always your line is always the same,
Your story is always the same. It's always been like
see Web is never recovered. He's fine, We're all good,
We're all friends. Now when I go back to being
that politician and taking care of everybody, do you have
the rapport with him that and the rest of the
crew that you wish you you wish you should have had,
(32:13):
or is has that ship sailed?
Speaker 2 (32:16):
That's a terrific question.
Speaker 1 (32:18):
I'm glad you asked that in the context of the
Fab five doc. And that was still a time I
remember I had the like legendary debate with Skip and
I talked about his high school status and whatnot. Like
that was at a time where athletes were required to
only either stick the sports or only talk about the
(32:42):
sport that they played. So I just remember, like from
two thousand and seven to twenty twelve, like I was
just working at best down from two thousand and two
to two thousand and seven doing MTV Movie Awards, Top
rain Box and NFL network sidelined all of a sudden,
I'm here, and it's like, hold on, y'all think and
(33:05):
this is like the public and like just you know,
people that see you as a former athlete, like oh
he could he talking about football, talking about baseball, talking
about boxing.
Speaker 2 (33:19):
You can do it all right, So let me get
this right.
Speaker 1 (33:22):
So you didn't play anything about everything, but don't put
me in a box. And so executive producing that documentary
was also important to me because as an athlete having
his own production company, I just did a play called
The Greatest Love Story Ever Told, where the story of
(33:45):
Mary and Joseph. And it was around the time when
Tyler Perry started his Chilling Circuit stage plays, and so
I was taking pride in doing a lot of things
that athletes are doing now that seemed normal, not clearly
that I was the first. I mean Shaq was doing movies,
(34:08):
I mean Fred Hammer Williamson in the sixties and Jim.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Brown was doing the movies.
Speaker 1 (34:12):
Like, by no means am I the first, But like
if doing that documentary meant that, So hiring Aaron Cohen,
who now is going on to do.
Speaker 2 (34:24):
Multiple projects with ESPN.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
Jason Air first project he did was Fab five doc,
and he just crushed it with.
Speaker 2 (34:33):
The last dance. Now he's turning down work.
Speaker 1 (34:37):
So I turned around and say them like, so I
ain't got another project, you know what I mean? And
to answer your Fab five part of it, I had
two endings. The ending that I wanted was gonna have
it mafioso, who's gonna be suited and booted, hats on
(34:57):
scarves on big ta my big chairs, lobster, double triple
bottles of champagne all on the table like we won
the game of life. That's what I'm wanted the ending
to be. If we weren't gonna get a current interview
(35:19):
from Cee, well then it ended up being what it
ended up being. And so in theory over that ten
year period, I mean, we can't hide the fact that
y'all ain't seeing us in the front row at the
Piston game. You know what I mean, y'all ain't seeing
us in the front row at the Michigan game in
Jauan coaching, right, So I can't act like it's where
(35:44):
I thought it would end up currently. But what I
will say, it's a lot better than it used to be.
And I see a time in the near future where
we'll get in the same place at the same time
and bring bread and as brothers and talking about the
things we like and don't like, and hopefully we'll get
(36:06):
past it and break another barrier, because like, we've invested
so much in each other and the public, and so
many people have invested so much in us. And I
know what it looked like to see your favorite group
break up. I remember epm D broke up.
Speaker 3 (36:24):
Yo, Oh my god, how Cas like Fuji? You know
what I mean? Don't listen, listen you like how no addition?
Speaker 2 (36:36):
Oh my god, this is the fact of my life.
Ice Cube was leaving.
Speaker 3 (36:40):
N w A that changed my entire world. That that crushed.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
Into the world right right, So I know, I understand
how it's important for the public and the culture who
made us.
Speaker 2 (36:58):
We didn't even want to be called Fast, We want
to be called five times. That was a dumb name.
Speaker 3 (37:06):
Like yeah, you guys didn't know, right.
Speaker 1 (37:11):
And so based on all of those things, like I
was there when he got inducted into the Hall of Fame.
I was happy to go support them type of thing.
And hopefully we can be in that arbor to support
Juwana and the team.
Speaker 4 (37:23):
So you know, it's uh, this world, what's the here's
the here's the thing when you when you guys are
because you guys are kids, kids like we don't we forget,
especially when you when you're calling games and these these
your kids. You don't grow up man, especially no offense,
y'all don't grow up too much much much later in life.
(37:44):
I'm not even talking about in your twenties, maybe your thirties,
you know what I mean, kind of getting it in
your forties. So you take these kids and you put
them in these positions and they can't process a lot,
so it's hard and if you're not doing the work
to understand what's going on. I don't know se Web,
but I I feel like I see a lot in him,
(38:06):
and I see a lot of disappointment and rage and
sadness and what about me? And and I deserve and
a lot of I am, you know, And that happens
when you feel like you have been treated unfairly in life,
which brings me back to what I have been able
(38:28):
to see you do with the cars that you have
been given, which is a beautiful thing and it's and
it's and it's rare as a black man to see
you to prosper in that way, and then they get
then you. Then you get the naysayers who who will
try to say, oh, but he didn't, but he, like
you said earlier, they're always finding something wrong. Do you
(38:48):
have any regrets about your professional career and how you
handled it on and off the court, and regrets may
not be the word. Do you have any redos? You
have any redos in a professional career as a basketball player,
not as an analyst, but as a basketball player that
you would rather do.
Speaker 2 (39:06):
Again on redos?
Speaker 1 (39:09):
I definitely would have won one championship in college, definitely
would have won one in the league.
Speaker 3 (39:18):
But what does that do when you win a chip?
Speaker 4 (39:20):
What does that do? Why would that be a redo
for you? Does it solidify your legacy? Does it make
your words more powerful when you talk on TV?
Speaker 2 (39:27):
What?
Speaker 1 (39:28):
No and no and no no no. I'm glad. I'm
glad you deciphered that. And I have an example for that. Okay,
and his name is Scottie Pippen.
Speaker 4 (39:37):
You ain't lying, and I want Scotty, if you're listening,
stop talking.
Speaker 3 (39:41):
Go ahead.
Speaker 1 (39:42):
As much as we talk about winning at all costs
you right, And how it seems to be the thing
that's gonna make us the most happy. And I know
some of that's out of his control, because when people
rapping about you in songs, and they ain't necessarily rapping
about you, but they rapping about some to carry your name, like,
you can't control that.
Speaker 2 (40:02):
But either way, he reminds me that.
Speaker 1 (40:09):
Just winning championships doesn't necessarily make you happy. And I'm
glad you asked the question that you asked, because in theory, no,
winning those championships does not validate me more to myself.
It probably validates more me more to some people who're
(40:30):
gonna shallow look at me shallow like a job anyway,
and put me in that box. But it's just a
sense of being able to see your hard work in
the journey that you've accomplished to get a chance to
compete against the best and the best, to have that
crown and achievement. It's more for that reason than it
(40:56):
is for people to pat me on the back, because
all people that turn around to do and say all
you want is one like you.
Speaker 3 (41:05):
Re got you only got one. You're like, damn, that's
one more than you, that's one more than you.
Speaker 4 (41:13):
Dog, Yeah, you are now working at ESPN and you
have been able to take yourself. I remember you even
explaining this to me and telling me how the journey
started for you, what you were doing and how you
like you mentioned earlier, free lance and working all these
different places, and then you work yourself into the spot,
(41:33):
the position where you want to be, and you find
yourself on all these different platforms and you're live in
and you get to the point where you're like the
face a countdown and you're doing all these different things.
Jalen Ninja Kobe get up, You get these big deals,
and then you find that the business is the business.
What's your overall takeaway? Because for me it was different.
(41:56):
I came in as a journalist and you know what
my story is, and I've shared that with you personally
and professionally. But you know I had to walk away
because I had to find my worth and find where
I felt appreciated, as we all have to do in
all relationships. What's your overall takeaway when you look at
from the moment you started your analyst career to where
(42:17):
you are now, also including the moments when everybody loves
you and you got a pilot on ABC and you
acting in it.
Speaker 3 (42:26):
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 4 (42:27):
Good job, by the way, but take all of that,
like all the things that you've been able to do,
and then where you are now, I see ebbs and flows,
I see highs and lows, but I see you staying consistent.
What's your biggest takeaway of this post NBA career now
working as an analyst? What are you giving that information
(42:50):
out right?
Speaker 1 (42:51):
So my biggest takeaway, and by the way, congratulations on
everything you accomplished then and now. Like to see you, Jamail,
Michael Smith, people that I consider family, brothers and sisters.
You know I work with Michael numbers never live before
(43:12):
it became his and hers. Jamail's from Detroit like best family,
and you talked about your relationship with me as well.
I think my biggest takeaway has its thread in each
of you guys. Is woven in each of you guys situations.
It's continue to fight for my voice and what ends
(43:36):
up happening is there are times when I need to
go to work and do come down on a Sunday
afternoon after like understanding what just happened with Breonna Taylor
and I'm just like sweating through my shirt and we've
seen the political cycle change from a lot of more
(43:59):
of stick to sports when Colin was taking the knee too,
like when the presidential cycle kind of changed and it
became a lot more divisive. It became like politics immersed
itself so much into sports that we couldn't even act
like we were ignoring it anymore.
Speaker 2 (44:20):
Yeah, yeah, right. And so.
Speaker 1 (44:25):
As as somebody that my culture has named their kids
after me, and.
Speaker 4 (44:34):
I don't know that's I don't know. I don't know
a kid that's not named Jalen. Sorry, so I don't
know what kid that's not named Jalen.
Speaker 1 (44:41):
Go ahead, Pablo Tori, And I just saw an article
that somebody sent me today, like the most popular name
in college basketball. But understanding where I came from and
starting to make a lot of my goals and dreams
come true, it never took me away from the authenticity
(45:03):
of who I am, and I make sure that those
don't get separated. And I don't have to tell you
that's the toughest thing to do. I'll give you a
perfect example. The Kyle Rittenhouse verdict came out. Yeah, and
I've been watching the try, saw how the judge was behaving,
(45:27):
saw the jokes that he was making, and I saw
like the politicism of who was backing him sure, and
the things that were being said, to the point where
they started to make sure that we know, so y'all
ain't surprised, there's a good chance that he gonna get off.
Speaker 3 (45:48):
Don't be surprised, like we don't want y'all.
Speaker 1 (45:51):
Be surprised, right, And so he gets off and we're
about to do a show. I think we were in
the garden or in Barclays, one of them, and I
just remember standing in I was so disappointed, and I
was glad that we were addressing the topic, and I
(46:12):
was just trying to recall so many different stories of
black men that have been murdered by the police. And
so as we started to talk about the Jacob Blake thing,
I misspeak and say that he was murdered by police.
Greeney corrects me, I correct myself, say he was shot
(46:33):
seven times. And I definitely want to apologize to his
family for misspeaking, But I do understand he was paralyzed.
Speaker 2 (46:41):
I do understand that.
Speaker 1 (46:44):
Because of that, Milwaukee Bucks were the first team that
eventually led to so many different teams and sports and
ultimately the NBA, not playing, and to be honest, I'm
happy that they got rewarded ultimately by winning the championship. Later,
I felt like that was karma that worked in their favor.
But what I noticed is there was a segment of
(47:06):
the population that sees me not normal NBA analysts. They
see me as the figure and the culture that I
just described. They see me as a founder of a
high school for a decade, and I have to remind
myself that they see me as red. I'm not just
(47:29):
here to talk about ball, so when I make a mistake,
they're going to try to reverse engineer the mistake and
act like they care about what I said about him,
But really they're just trying to make it like people
like me are spreading misinformation to create a narrative, but
(47:51):
ignore the facts of what happened in the case, whether
he got acquitted or not. To your question, those circumstances
continue to remind me how the work that's happening in
the community is so precious, and it inspires me to
(48:13):
continue to do it and do more.
Speaker 3 (48:16):
And that's why you have more.
Speaker 2 (48:18):
I know.
Speaker 1 (48:21):
That when I speak, it's not just exititing those normal analysts.
Speaker 2 (48:27):
It's like he's talking for his people and you ready
for this carrier?
Speaker 1 (48:34):
Do you other thing about tearing me down with that
use certain buzzwords like dumb.
Speaker 2 (48:43):
So just think about this now.
Speaker 1 (48:45):
As an honor roll student in high school, I mean
the deans list in college, I graduated from the college,
I'm a founder of a school, my best selling author,
I currently write a column for The New York Post
and do a podcast.
Speaker 2 (49:00):
Are the renaissance men.
Speaker 1 (49:01):
So if you can try to paint me as dumb,
you then try to elevate the journey of the people
behind me, and then you can now roll that same
thing rent and repeat over to the people that look
like me.
Speaker 2 (49:18):
But we're not going for that. And so that's what
I continue to learn, and I know I get.
Speaker 1 (49:26):
It, like like I guess, if I guess if I
was a woman, I could say there are times, unfortunately
that I see in the industry that as they start
to get older, their bodies changed, how they're fashion changes,
Dona Lah, they may not be.
Speaker 2 (49:46):
The flavor of the moment for people like me.
Speaker 1 (49:51):
Wearing a gold tee and saying arrest the cops that
murdered Bereonna Taylor like that don't necessarily endear you.
Speaker 2 (50:04):
In a lot of spaces.
Speaker 3 (50:06):
Yeah, of course. Well I don't think.
Speaker 4 (50:08):
I don't think that speaking truth to power endears you
to anybody. I think sometimes it's a necessary evil, like
washing your own clothes because I don't like to wash
wi somebody else is doing.
Speaker 3 (50:20):
But it's a necessary evil. Speaking truth to.
Speaker 4 (50:22):
Power doesn't endear you to anybody. Woman, man, child, boy girl.
Which is what I'm hearing you say is and this
may not be what you're saying, but what I'm hearing
is that the I need to be on this platform.
It's necessary because I'm speaking for people that don't have
a voice.
Speaker 7 (50:41):
And it also also, to be honest, not many people
that have my background that you can take them to
the chapel, you can take them to the block, you
can take them to the White House.
Speaker 2 (50:56):
You want to go to barbershop, you want you want
to go to the Taylor like where you want to go?
You want, you want to go to school? What you
want to do?
Speaker 1 (51:04):
Yeah, And so that is the value. It's almost like
when rap started to become popular. Remember EPMD made the
song keep the Crossover, Like we was trying to keep
rap yeah from becoming mainstream because we knew what's rap
became mainstream, we was.
Speaker 2 (51:25):
Gonna lose it to the almighty dollars.
Speaker 1 (51:29):
Yeah, right, And so that is the that's the importance
for me is if I'm able to continue to maintain
the way I've been able to, I know I can
be that credible voice that may not always, you know,
(51:50):
get I guess appreciated by mainstream America.
Speaker 2 (51:55):
Yeah, but I know I'm speaking, but sure for sure.
Speaker 4 (52:02):
And by the way, though Jalen he says something about like,
you know, getting older and changing at different women, Like
I might hope for everybody in this business to who
does what we do is to watch that we can
watch them evolve. Like if I'm still talking about the
same that I was talking about and trying to dress
how I dress when I was on first take, I'm
an idiot. If I'm still trying to sell sex, I'm
(52:22):
an idiot. Like that don't work. We've seen we have
colleagues who have gone way beyond that, and they still
selling sex.
Speaker 3 (52:30):
I'm talking about men and women.
Speaker 4 (52:31):
If they still doing that same that same stick twenty
thirty years later, I don't care how much money it's making. You,
you're an idiot and you're really not for the cause,
You're for the fame, and so you have to realize that.
As I've watched you evolve and transition, it's a welcome transition.
It's a welcome transition, and it allows you to live
(52:51):
in a lot of different worlds where you are very impactful.
Everybody can't live in a different world. Like you just
talked about all the places you can be in you
can live and everyone thinks they can do that.
Speaker 3 (53:01):
Everybody can't do that.
Speaker 4 (53:03):
So so the goal I would hope is that I'm
not Carrie from twenty twelve when the world was introduced
to me, that I am living in a world where
I know what my purpose is and that's to help
brown girls, Like it's a brown woman to be a face.
To be unapologetic about that, I say, whether you like
it or not, but I know that the work that
(53:26):
I'm doing, because being the first is always the hardest.
You've been the first in a lot of situations, so
you got to take the heat. You're the you, like
maybe the only constant I think on countdown, I'm thinking, like,
who else is the constant?
Speaker 2 (53:38):
Right?
Speaker 4 (53:39):
Like that's a first in itself, especially on that platform
where they change it every five minutes, and they met
at everybody every five seconds. And know that when people
come to you, they're trying to be you or some
form of you, Like I know that these girls are
trying to be some form of me and what I
used to be, right, and but know that what you're
(54:00):
doing is defining so much for so many men. I
had a conversation with Draymond the other day. He told
me some stuff you said to him. He was like,
that's my dog. I was like, right, Like, you're doing
what you supposed to do, right, the first real big
superstar in basketball from his home state. I think I
maybe I may be making that up, but I really
(54:21):
think it is and ultimately what he wants to do right.
Say what you want about Chuck, He's the first to
be so ridiculous in so many ways would still be accepted.
Speaker 3 (54:29):
Right.
Speaker 4 (54:30):
So it's a beautiful thing that I'm witnessing happen. And
I love what you said about where you find yourself
now and being a mainstay at the network. And who
cares what I think about? Like I have my own experience,
You have your own experience. We process it differently. I
came in very differently than you came in. I was
treated very differently than you retreated all the same, but
(54:50):
you know what I mean, everyone has their own experience.
I want to end this podcast with what I asked
you before off the top, because you said something I
thought was powerful and I think it'll be helpful. Do
you ever find yourself because what wasn't present in your
life doesn't necessarily determine who you are because you've made
the best of it. But do you ever find yourself
(55:11):
wishing you could have had a conversation with your father.
Speaker 2 (55:15):
I wanted to meet him in person for sure.
Speaker 1 (55:17):
Like It's one thing to be able to talk to
him on the phone, and I'm glad I had that
piece and be able to tell him that I appreciate him,
I love him, and I don't have any hard feelings,
but to meet him in person would have provided a
different level of gravity to the circumstance, like a sense
(55:38):
of closure.
Speaker 2 (55:40):
You know what I mean That I didn't get a.
Speaker 1 (55:42):
Chance to look him in his eyes, shake his hand,
hug his neck type of thing.
Speaker 3 (55:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (55:47):
So yeah, that bothered me for a while, and that
ultimately is what made me walk away from the game.
When I stopped playing, I could have played a couple
of more years, and I decided to go work for
ESPN at that time because I was already working at media.
(56:09):
You don't just walk away from the league making what
I made and then making what I may start doing multimedia,
and so I just felt like I wanted to start
something different. So, yes, I do feel like that has
a purpose in my head and heart.
Speaker 2 (56:27):
That's definitely unfulfilled.
Speaker 3 (56:30):
And what do you do with that? Do you know?
Or is it to be continued?
Speaker 2 (56:34):
I don't mean to be mean. I don't mean to
be rude. I don't mean to be disrespectful. I don't
mean to like be naive.
Speaker 1 (56:43):
Maybe right there were days, weeks, months, and years that
I didn't think about my father.
Speaker 3 (56:52):
Understandable.
Speaker 2 (56:53):
I had to focus on what was happening right now,
this concrete jungle that I'm growing up in, Like I'm
gonna get to school, you know what I'm saying, I
gotta worry about all of this. And so.
Speaker 1 (57:07):
As I matriculated as a young man, I tried to
like not worry about the things that I could control.
And I had a terrific mom. I lost my mother
in February, and I miss her so much. February second,
and she protected me from all of that stuff because
she worked at the plant, but she also worked at
(57:29):
the bar, so I got a chance to see all
sides of working nine to five. Genie Rose. But then
we at the bar, I'm giving people they drinks and
giving and I'm drinking Shirley Temples and putting money in
the pinball machine.
Speaker 2 (57:46):
You know what I'm saying. And that that gave me
a level of.
Speaker 1 (57:53):
It gave me a level of perseverance that I felt
like failure wasn't an option. So as I started having
success and all of my goals and dreams started to
come true. And I say this to any people, especially
black people, guys that don't know your father or don't
know your mother or whatever, like at some point you
gotta let it go. Like you can't be out here
(58:17):
thirty five, still blaming your mother and father beautiful decisions
you made, like you just can't.
Speaker 2 (58:25):
I'm live this. I'm telling you you can't do that.
Speaker 1 (58:27):
You sound crazy now, Like address your trauma, Like get
the therapy and the support that you need. But sometimes
that dysfunction is what can actually that stumbling bot can
actually be your stepping stone to your opportunities, but it's
dressed in overalls and you don't even see.
Speaker 2 (58:49):
It, and so you can't. I can't.
Speaker 1 (58:53):
And I didn't always blame what I didn't have for
what wasn't happening. I was like, I'm be the guy
that that breaks this glass ceiling. And I'm so very
fortunate that sports and entertainment and being educated and doing
that in this doggy dog field where you know how
(59:14):
it works, you know, rense and repeat. When you're the player,
it's like, after a couple of years, how much he make? Oh,
it's just somebody that's cheaper, you know. And so I've
been really fortunate that I've been able to maintain doing
what I'm doing. And we'll see, you know, how long
it continues to happen like this.
Speaker 4 (59:34):
Yeah, but you never you never fallen off because you've
got too many talents. I already know that there's just
that next chapter of greatness. It's never and it's not
for the approval of anybody else, but just for yourself,
you know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (59:48):
Thank you, I.
Speaker 4 (59:48):
See I see it a big, huge, gigantic future. Thank
you so much for joining us on Naked. I appreciate you.
Jalen Rose, my pleasure. Cheers, cheers, porn of dumb that's
been sitting in the fringe for a year. You rich this,
(01:00:10):
We're rich black side over here, real rich black are
Why hit my hands.
Speaker 2 (01:00:14):
On the date?
Speaker 1 (01:00:15):
If she ain't even know what it was he was born,
it is she? He was like, that's domb perry on.
It s opposed the bull.
Speaker 3 (01:00:23):
It's supposed to bull boo.
Speaker 4 (01:00:30):
I say this because it's true. All of us, as adults,
especially when you become aware of yourself as an adult,
spend a lot of time trying to figure out our
childhood and how it made us who we are today.
And once we break down those images, those ideas, those memories,
and we really come into our own we blossom into
something special and beautiful. And I believe that is what
(01:00:52):
is happening with my friend Jalen Rose. Nothing is wrong,
Everything is right, Everything is as it should be right.
We judge ourselves so much, but everything is as it
should be. I appreciate him telling his story about his
father because it really does show me two things. One
incredible determination. He has been able to succeed in spite
(01:01:14):
of because of the images that were in his life
his mother. He talks about that he lost his mother recently.
I know that had to be painful, and again I'm
sending you so much love, my brother.
Speaker 3 (01:01:22):
I'm sorry.
Speaker 4 (01:01:24):
But then look at what he's been able to do.
He's the guy that I know as an NBA player,
as a veteran that is giving great analysis on ESPN.
There's the actor in him that I'm pretty sure that
he has yet to talk about. But I love that
he is so much more than what we see on
the surface. I say that for you all as well.
There's so much more. Don't be afraid to go out
(01:01:45):
and show people who you are. Don't be afraid to
make mistakes, Don't be afraid to be like I don't
have it. It's so beautiful to be authentic and true
and naked. We spend so much time pretending like everything
is okay, myself included. But I'm glad Jalen took some
time today to share his story, but back next week.
Speaker 3 (01:02:03):
I appreciate you all support
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