April 17, 2025 • 42 mins
Gen Z Responds to Roland’s Black Bank of Justice Pt. 1
This week hosts Tiffany Cross, Angela Rye, and Andrew Gillum host a cross-generational discussion with three politically active youths. Our young guests respond to Roland Martin’s statement from last week’s show that young folks are withdrawing from the Black bank of justice without making their own deposits.
Our guests provide an alternative perspective to Roland’s–a perspective that our hosts will (politely) challenge.
OUR GUESTS:
Victoria Pannell is an organizer with Until Freedom and Social Impact Advisor with We Inspire Justice.
Ty Hobson-Powell led the “51 For 51” Washington D.C. statehood campaign and founded Concerned Citizens Demanding Change. In 2024, he managed the Mail-In Ballot Processing Division for D.C.’s Board of Elections. He’s been appointed State Political Program Director in Mississippi, supporting a major voter engagement initiative with Mississippi Votes. His upcoming book, The Fire Right Now—a nod to James Baldwin—is slated for release this summer.
Marley Dias is a celebrated changemaker and one of the youngest people to appear on Forbes 30 Under 30. She launched #1000BlackGirlBooks, collecting over 15,000 books featuring Black girl protagonists. A junior at Harvard, Marley is also the host and executive producer of Netflix’s Bookmarks: Celebrating Black Voices.
And of course we’ll hear from you! If you’d like to submit a question, check out our tutorial video: http://www.instagram.com/reel/C5j_oBXLIg0/ and send to @nativelandpod.
We are 565 days away from the midterm elections. Welcome home y’all!
—---------
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Native Land Pod is brought to you by Reasoned Choice Media.
Thank you to the Native Land Pod team:
Angela Rye as host, executive producer and cofounder of Reasoned Choice Media; Tiffany Cross as host and producer, Andrew Gillum as host and producer, and Lauren Hansen as executive producer; Loren Mychael is our research producer, and Nikolas Harter is our editor and producer. Special thanks to Chris Morrow and Lenard McKelvey, co-founders of Reasoned Choice Media.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Native Land Pod is a production of iHeartRadio in partnership
with Reason Choice Media.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Welcome, Welcome home, y'all. This is episode counted seventy five.
I seventy five. I don't know. I'm thinking of, you know,
driving the state of Florida. Anyway of Native Lamp Pod.
That seventy fifth episode, and we're excited to continue to
break down all things politics and culture. We're so happy
to be back with you today. I'm joined, of course,
(00:31):
by my fellow co hosts. We are Tiffany Crass, tiff
Aziel Lai, and I'm Andrew Guillam. What's up here?
Speaker 3 (00:40):
Is the only one that will introduce you or me first,
and never himself.
Speaker 4 (00:44):
It is fascinating. Appreciate you, I know, but you introduced
us first.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
I'm never gonna say first with y'all.
Speaker 4 (00:53):
I know you're a gentleman. I just want to say,
servant of the most tired God. But praise we we
miss you. Did did you go on the space shuttle
with Gail?
Speaker 1 (01:08):
You know what you got?
Speaker 5 (01:08):
Jokes?
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Did you see how horrified Gil looked Gail?
Speaker 4 (01:12):
Look?
Speaker 6 (01:13):
Yeah, I'm not happy about it. Even the comments that
she made afterwards when she was talking about Jeff Bezos
is doing wonderful things, it just feels like a real
strong disconnect with community. It was we all rooting for
Caitlyn Clark. Now is Jeff Bezos is doing wonderful things
somewhere between Chicago and Santa Barbara Oprah and Gale's like,
I love you.
Speaker 4 (01:34):
Sign up for this shade.
Speaker 3 (01:35):
I was just asking about the Space Shuttle, cheat, I
just I just, oh, you.
Speaker 6 (01:39):
Well, you know, I'm I'm very honest, and so the honest.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Take for me, And she was just asking about Andrew
being at NASA and the Space Shuttle.
Speaker 4 (01:47):
That's all.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
Oh lord, I think I'm going back to NASA next week.
All right, So I've got all that I missed y'all
so much last week out of my out of my system,
and I want to know what are we talking about today,
what's on the what's on our minds?
Speaker 3 (02:04):
Well, Tips likes to be in the comments, So it
sounds like we got a little dragged in the comments.
A lot of folks not watching the whole show for context,
and some folks who did and still there are I
think disagreeing and dissentive views on this, But we really
want to talk about is this narrative I think of
rest and recovery and whether you're working or not, are
you doing both, especially when it comes to the young people.
(02:27):
So I'd love to hear what y'all think about that.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Yeah, rest as resistance, as as I've been hearing former resistance. Yeah, okay, tip,
But for what.
Speaker 6 (02:37):
I just wanted to say, we want to thank Roland
Martin for he joined us in your stead and what
happened in your absence Andrew is there was a conversation
around young folks. Yes, and Angela has some strong thoughts
as their Row, so I think that was the clipper
about the place.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
Sorry, well yes, but let me just say this again, Row.
I said it in a video I sent, but the
show hadn't run yet. Thank you brother, as always for
stepping in and holding all of us down. In this case,
I appreciate you holding holding me down and you know,
getting some conversation started. Row.
Speaker 4 (03:16):
Row check as only he does.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
As only you do. Let's check out what you started.
Speaker 7 (03:20):
Man, gen X, millennials and gen Z. This is the
generations that are what I call post civil rights movement babies.
Those three generations have been making withdraws from the Black
(03:44):
Bank of Justice and have not made reciprocal deposits. We
cannot continue to ask baby boomers, who are now in
their seventies and eighties to keep doing work while we
sit our asset brunch, while we hang out, or we
(04:05):
take multiple vacations, or while we check out of the
process and sit down on the couch. The reason Black
voter turnout is down is not because we just so
just checked out.
Speaker 8 (04:16):
It's because the black infrastructure going door to door free
syncs vota mobilization. Those people are retired or they died,
and we have to somehow wake the hell up and
realize now is our time.
Speaker 7 (04:32):
You've been bitching about the baton. Now it's time for
your ass to run the race.
Speaker 4 (04:37):
What's up?
Speaker 9 (04:38):
Native Lampid? First of all, let me start by saying,
I love y'all's down. Okay. My name is Avian. I'm
a civil rights lawyer, and I am a millennial. I
listened to last week's episode, and I have a lot
of thoughts. I got a lot of feelings, okay, but
one of those thing that I feel like it kind
of lacked nuances. So I'm really excited that you all
are open to having younger voices to engage in this conversation.
(05:00):
I really think we should consider all of the factors
that go into play as to why certain people are
choosing to withdraw from movement spaces and choosing not to
engage in the ways that we've seen before. I think
that black people are right now are choosing rest as
resistance and intentionally creating spaces of black joy. But I
(05:20):
totally agree with the premise of what you all were saying.
I just think we need to dig a little bit
deeper and consider the why. Why are younger generations not
showing up?
Speaker 7 (05:30):
How does community look.
Speaker 9 (05:31):
Different for us than it did in the civil rights movement?
How have we been siloed and individualized in a way
that is harming us and impacting our community.
Speaker 4 (05:41):
There's so many things.
Speaker 10 (05:42):
That I have to say, so many thoughts.
Speaker 9 (05:44):
Thank you again for considering opening up this space, and
y'all continue to do the work that you're doing. I
appreciate y'all, and y'all have a good one.
Speaker 4 (05:53):
Thanks.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
I love it, I love it, I love that, I
love the ownership.
Speaker 6 (06:01):
So if you're wondering what we're talking about today, that
is what we're talking about today young folks and what
is going on with young people, particularly as it relates
to our politics. So I just want to give the
listeners and viewers a little bit of background. There are
currently in the United States just sigh of seventy million
gen Zers living in America. Gen Zers are born between
(06:22):
nineteen ninety seven and twenty twelve. They represent, you guys,
about twenty five percent of the American population, which is
a sizable portion. In this year, they will be turning
between fourteen and twenty eight years old. This is the
newest generation to gain influence across the world in the
workforce now that they're old enough to vote.
Speaker 4 (06:42):
They are the.
Speaker 6 (06:43):
Last generation, the last generation in which the majority identifies
as white. Fourteen percent of this generation identifies as black,
which is pretty much on par with the national population,
given that black folks represent fourteen percent of the US
popular This last or in November twenty twenty two, they
(07:05):
had both the lowest registration voting rate of all generations.
So I'm excited to dig in and actually hear from
folks from this generation.
Speaker 3 (07:16):
So we have some young folks to get it off
their chests with us. They are doing amazing things. Victoria
Panel is someone who I have known since her eighth grade.
She was very, very active in the National Action Network.
She asked me to speak at her eighth grade graduation.
She is now one of our lead soldiers on State
of the People's Power Tour and she is also an
(07:38):
organizer with Untel Freedom and social impact advisor with we
Inspire Justice.
Speaker 4 (07:43):
Welcome To's sister.
Speaker 3 (07:45):
We have ty Hobson Powell who's an international community advocate
and he is joining us as well. He's a native
Washingtonian and lifelong community advocate. Welcome Tie. And we also
have Marlee Das. I know y'all know this young lady,
very very powerful, doing incredible work. She's an activist and author,
(08:07):
a producer and creator of one thousand Black Girls Black
Girl Books. And I got to tell you, I remember
when Marley was a small little child. I used to
hate when people did it. So when we were growing up, y'all,
I remember when you was this big, and Marley is
still killing it. So these young foot soldiers are made
for the work. So we welcome y'all, and thank you
so much for joining.
Speaker 10 (08:27):
Welcome home, Thank you, thank you all.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
Are you kidding we're honored, we're under to haf y'all.
So I understand now I missed last week's episode, so
I get to play real ignorant on some things, so
long as my opinion isn't being asked. I'm curious as
you all listen to the episode, I assume you make
a Maybe I shouldn't assume, but I hope you make
a regular habit of listening from week to week, and
(08:52):
you can sort of tell when dynamics are are excitable
in the space and when you know, you know, we're
just chilling a little bit. And it's seems like last
week I listened to the show as well and had
some thoughts. But I'm curious to know what prick, y'all,
what what made you say a man? What made you say?
Speaker 5 (09:08):
Ouch?
Speaker 9 (09:11):
I mean?
Speaker 1 (09:11):
And don't all jump it once?
Speaker 3 (09:13):
I think Marley started, Marley you had the floor.
Speaker 10 (09:16):
Yeah, no worries. I think one thing that I really
enjoyed the conversation. First of all, I think that it's
very important to hear perspectives from all generations about what's
happening and kind of the stagnation that we're all feeling
when it comes to justice. That like we are experiencing
the beginning of a fascist country, and we are not
seeing people jump up in the streets or you know,
walk out every day speaking on this in the way
(09:37):
that we need to speak about it. I think the
one thing that pricked me the most, that I feel
like is kind of a related to that stagnation, is
how how little a conversation around racial capitalism has had
and how much of the difference between this is kind
of the civil rights movement being understood as a civic
and legal issue where we're looking for the passing of
a civil Rights Act, we're looking for the end of
(09:57):
an apartheid between black folks and white folks, but now recognizing,
just as we said with gen Z, that we're moving
into this multi racial, multi ethnic, incredibly diverse society where
we have nine hundred billionaires in the United States, and
that you know, the black bank of justice in many
ways has just been completely upturned by racial capitalism. And
(10:18):
I think it's an important conce part of the conversation.
Why it was so eager to talk is because I
agree with the points that are being made, and I
think so much more of this is an issue around
the breaking down of like our wealth gap is the
same as it was in the nineteen sixties. Black folks
still are meeting and wealth. Their median wealth becomes like
ten percent. I'm pretty sure of white folks on average,
and that hasn't moved since the sixties, And I think
(10:39):
that plays a big role in this idea of our bank.
Is like, if the bank is staying the same size
for us, but the bank is growing at these exponential
rates for tech billionaires and tech CEOs, that means our
bank exists, but it's just so small now, and we
didn't know that it would need to get that big.
So I'm excited to talk about ways that we can
make it bigger and hopefully make it more expansive.
Speaker 4 (11:00):
That uh, Victoria, what about you?
Speaker 11 (11:13):
Oh all right now?
Speaker 10 (11:14):
You know I love young folks.
Speaker 11 (11:16):
I have been in this movement for a long time,
since I was twelve years old, and so I'm automatically
going to defend young people. For me, it was the
withdrawal statement. You know, I don't think that we're withdrawn
from the movement. I think our deposits just look different.
They show up differently. I think young people are organizing
on a true grassroots level with mutual aid, showing up
(11:37):
for each other, raising money for each other, cooking meals
for each other, Like we often use our joy as
our weapon, and our fight looks different, but we're still
in the ring. And you also have to think too.
This generation has lived through COVID. We've watched pillars in
our community and our families quite literally die, and then
we're not able to see them. Some young people didn't
even get to enjoy their graduations. We've lived through Trayvon Martin,
(11:58):
which for a lot of young people served as the
catalyst to their advocacy. We've been a countless funerals of
young black folks who are killed by police officers who
are supposed to serve and protect us. I mean George Floyd,
Eric Gardner, Mike Brown, Sameer Y, Sandra Blain. I mean,
the list, unfortunately just goes on and on and on.
I mean, we've lived through watching our friends get deported,
like people are getting deported. We're watching colleges that we
(12:21):
work so hard to get into study day in and
day out, erasing our history and telling us that the
efforts for DEI are just not important. Students are being
arrested on campus or protesting. I mean with a stroke
of a pen. We're watching students who work so hard
to make it into a university be deported. We've lived
through now too, Trump presidencies where we are watching this
orange man literally strip everything that our ancestors have fought for.
(12:45):
So should we be outraged, Hell yeah, But I can
also understand why young people are exhausted and while we're drained,
we have to create space for people who are watching
everything that's happening and feel like all they can do
is ensure their own survival because it's honestly, it's scary
out there, and I think that that's where our compassion
and our empathy come into play. It's a movement of love.
(13:08):
There is no movement without love, and that has to
include people who just want to exist.
Speaker 4 (13:14):
I am.
Speaker 3 (13:15):
I know we just lost Tie, and I just want
to know we are having some production challenges, but I'm
sure we're going to have him back. I have one question,
and I really Tiff and Andrew, I want to hear
this from y'all too. When I went back, I don't
know why I thought that the conversation was just on
young people. When we heard Roland today, he said gen
X millennials and gen Z are withdrawing more than their depositing.
(13:38):
I'm curious to know if you all think that when
we consider the masses, are people doing more withdraws or
are they doing more deposits? And like why, like what
do we really believe about all across generations, tiff to
shout out your show, what do we think about that?
Like that is that really a thing? Do we really
think people are depositing more in the Bank of Black Justice?
Knowing that that's not a check you can necessary of
(14:00):
the cash, but it's about a movement?
Speaker 1 (14:02):
Do you really think that, Angela and asking that when
we talk about just for the audience and ourselves, we're
not talking about a little This is not a literal
banks should be a literal base. There should be a
literle bank. There ain't no doubt about it. There's no
doubt about it. But in this instance, we're trying to say,
are people on the whole giving more to this universal
(14:23):
movement based fight toward I hope freedom, or are folks
sort of kind of laying on the laurels of what's
come before and the fights that are being had and
the fighters who are acting on their behalf? Is it
more of one or the other, or do you reject
the premise of the question. It's it's y'all's turn.
Speaker 10 (14:44):
Us as the young folks.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
Well, yeah, weigh in that, Yeah on that, Yeah, I
think it's a conversation.
Speaker 10 (14:51):
Yeah, I mean I think that I do not think
first of all, outright, I don't think that gen Z
is laying on their laurels. I mean I can speak
for my own personal experience of the work. I is
that I started at ten years old collecting and donating
books with black girls as the main character and have
now collected fifteen thousand. So I feel like with my
work on its own, can speak for a lot of
the experiences for like young black educational justice. But I
(15:13):
really think once again that like this question I rejected
in a certain sense because there's also a question of
like modernity and a question of America changing from nineteen
fifty to nineteen sixty to twenty twenty four and twenty
twenty five where I feel like like social media and
smartphones have democratized activism, and when we think about the
Black Lives Matter movement, even George Floyd's death, it was
(15:35):
filmed because of a seventeen year old on their phone.
So when we think about the actual beginning of what
happened in twenty twenty, that was started by a young
teenage Black girl who recorded and started that like started
that movement up again in twenty twenty, obviously still founded
by millennials and Gen X who put that deposit in
the bank. So I feel like we can even see
then how it's intergenerational and how that's a major deposit.
(15:57):
I think one big thing to also shout out is
climate justice. That younger generations and Gen Z have been
so focused on climate emergencies since I mean, for me,
like I could say since twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen, but
because that is oftentimes an intersectional movement that talks about humanity, right,
we're talking about the earth. A lot of the times
(16:17):
older generations don't feel or understand the ways that it's
directly impacting Black communities. And I think now there's so
many more organizations like Black Girl and environmentalists or young
black climate leaders who are doing that work. But you know,
thirteen four percent of Black children have asthma, which is
double the rate of white children. That we are seventy
five percent more likely to live near industrial facilities, and
(16:38):
these you know, and these exposures to environmental harm play
the same amount of role in like this need to
rest as the issues happening in politics, where like if
we live in communities that are killing us, This is
why people feel that rest is resistance. And I think
those are kind of forces that combine themselves, as like
over half of people living and have and had near
hazardous waste, our people of color would make you want
(17:00):
to lay down too. So I think it's an important
thing that was that isn't always addressed in this conversation
around why people feel the need to rest, is that
so much of this environmental race, this environmental racism disparity,
directly impacts black health, which directly creates like the stagnation
that we're seeing.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
I gotta I gotta just say, though, I'm gonna push
y'all a little bit because I've known about you all,
have known you for a long time. You all are,
to me are the exception and not the norm. I
think that when I consider Andrew, Andrew is an exception
and not the norm. Tiff is an exception and not
the norm. When we talk about this space, this isn't
a place that people volunteer to get in with at
(17:40):
massive numbers. They might go to a fight back protest
or fight the Oligarchy rally with Bernie and AOC and
even a lot of they don't look like us. You know,
Black Lives Matter was started by three black women, so
it was supported by the masses. But when we think
about how we are contributing to movements rit large, are
you y'all really going to tell me that more often
(18:01):
than not, the black people in your families and your
friend groups are overwhelmingly supporting these movements. Because that's not
my testimony. That's not true. I was born by raised
born and raised by an activists. Most of my family
doesn't even they support it, but they're not engaged. So
if y'all are telling.
Speaker 4 (18:18):
Me they're engaged, I just want to see the math.
I haven't seen the math, just I can tell you.
Speaker 1 (18:23):
Not true for any generation, by the way, But I
love what I'm saying.
Speaker 10 (18:26):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean I can tell you the math.
Speaker 4 (18:28):
I can.
Speaker 10 (18:29):
I've worked and grown up in Essex County, New Jersey,
and I've worked with fifteen other girls who have done
social justice projects around STEM based education, done social just
like STEM based education wellness, mental health like all disability
access like I have seen this happen in Essex County,
New Jersey, where I am from, with the help of
the Grassroots Community Foundation. That there are so many grassroots
(18:51):
organizations that are leading and creating nonprofits to train young
girls of color. There's Girls for Gender Equity in New
York City. There's so many organizations that are doing this work.
I think that a lot of this comes from this
idea that folks aren't engaged is because of this. I
think there's a lot of a focus on culture when
we talk about representation in black folks and pushing things forward,
and when we look in our culture right now, we
(19:12):
see black like black leaders being arrested on sex crime,
sexual assaulting. We see drama all over with former gen
X and millennial black leaders. A lot of black men
right now are being kind of policed in the public
eye for their celebrity and at the same time as
that that's what gets the highlight and not the story
of the young fifteen year old girls that are creating
mental health Day legislation, running a program like Greener Been
(19:35):
Week in New Jersey. That a lot of the times
when we think about where the lenses on black people
and what they are doing. They're being policed, but there
is no desire to cover a story of successful young
black girls and the stories of the twenty other girls
that have grown up doing the same work that I
do have just not received the same amount of media coverage,
have not received the same amount of funding. But I
think that to suggest that there are less people that
(19:57):
are engaged is it's an only issue of spotlight.
Speaker 4 (20:00):
It's not an.
Speaker 10 (20:00):
Issue of engagement.
Speaker 5 (20:03):
That's fair.
Speaker 6 (20:15):
Let me just give a little pushback on that, because
what we looked at is the data of gen Z
ers who are participating in the electoral process. So perhaps
what you're saying is maybe you all don't view voting
as the only definition of being active in your community.
But the reality is that gen Z was the had
(20:38):
lower rates of civic engagement than any other generation. That's
true relatives, yes, but comparatively speaking to other generations. So
let me just let's get through and ask my question.
(20:59):
I'm curious. It's kind of like when you go to
a school and you say, hey, we're having an after
school program for anyone who wants to go to college.
Speaker 4 (21:10):
Come.
Speaker 6 (21:11):
I would often have to tell educators and people in
the classroom. The people who show up to that program
are not always the people who need the most help.
They're the people who need the least help. Because they're
showing up, they're participating. So the young people I talk
to are not talking about climate justice. I applaud you
for doing that. I think that's amazing, but we have
to engage in the reality of this. The young people
(21:33):
I'm following. My feed is not full of young people
talking about climate justice. My feed is not full of
young people talking about registering the vote, and the data
doesn't support that itself. So it's not I'm certainly not
here to impugne the younger generation at all. It's more
of a case study. I want to listen and understand.
So for the people who might not be like you,
(21:53):
For the people who are saying I don't participate, those
are people. Those are your peers and folks you talk to.
You've laid out some of the challenges looking at the
sixties to today, But what are things you're hearing from people,
your friends, your peers, who are not organizing around climate justice,
and who can't tell you who their member of Congress is,
and who have never voted in their life and they
(22:15):
don't feel any kind of way about it. And that's
it either one of you ladies who are willing to answer.
And I see we do have tie back tie. I
know we have a lot of technical difficulties.
Speaker 4 (22:24):
So if you want to jump in.
Speaker 6 (22:25):
On this question while we have you, please feel free,
sir h yeah, I just.
Speaker 5 (22:30):
Really quickly while you guys, can you hear me now?
Speaker 4 (22:32):
Yes, yes, so hear you go right.
Speaker 12 (22:34):
I wanted to jump in on something that I didn't
get a chance to comment on, which is that I
do think that it's important to hear what's true about
the critiques about this generation so that we can improve.
I think, you know, same as every generation. Some folks
don't adequately deposit into the bank of justice. That was
true back in my Auntie's day. That was true back
in Grandma's day. It is true now. You know, you
have folks who say trendy shit like we are not
(22:55):
our ancestors, and it's not true in the flattering way
they think, because we can't give up Target or Starbucks
for our revolution, right, we aren't doing that. So I
do believe that there is some validity to the idea
that we are not doing all that we can. I mean,
the underground railroad was created with less than the resources.
Where's our support of infrastructure? Now with all of the
infrastructure on social media and things that we have, we
(23:16):
don't have it. So I think that some of those
critiques are true about their generation and the fact that
we don't show up in the way.
Speaker 5 (23:22):
That we could.
Speaker 12 (23:22):
But also think about the reasons why we aren't always
valued as leaders. Think about how many times that there
were voices under twenty five centered in those town halls
and panels leading up to the election. The same ones
who we tell are important for their vote didn't have
any representation on those big stages to talk to them
about why they should care or why they should have
a task. How many young voices are substantivity brought to
(23:44):
the table as collaborators. I mean I was in direct
contact with the Office of Public Engagement and they decided
that they would rather have K pop singers comes to
the White House than have black organizers from around the country.
We with the Domestic Policy Council, But.
Speaker 5 (23:56):
It's not just that.
Speaker 12 (23:57):
I was just a discernment in the past weekend with
Jamal Bryant where he was talking about how this is
the largest generation of black people making the exit from
the church. And when you look at church and its
ability to anchor movement, what are the reasons why church
isn't speaking our language. It's a reason why young people
want to go and sit bottomless mimosas then sit in
the church and be told a language that no longer
(24:19):
speaks to them. Right, and so it is something for
the church to say, Okay, I am losing my folks.
Let's make this adjustment. Because again, when we look at
this iteration of Black Lives Matter, it represents one of
the few movements social justice anchored that was not born
in the church where people were not getting their mandate
during Sunday sermon to be able to move around where there.
(24:39):
So we don't see the organization in that same way. Obviously,
there is some apathy as well, because we are stuck
in this lesser of the two evils paradigm where we
sitting there, we're looking at the inherently racist GOP and
then the slightly to the left Democrats who don't dare
do any damn bold thing. I mean, the thing is,
I was having a question with Lolo yesterday and she
asked me. She said, Hi, do you feel at aesthetic?
(25:00):
I said, I'm the father of a three year old
daughter who's going to grow up to be a black woman.
I can't afford to be apathetic. But I'm pissed off,
and I'm pissed off that I'm more pissed off than
the Democrats who say they are all leaders are. I'm
pissed off that we have somehow allowed diversity in pissed
poor leadership to be our mark of success, to be
how we measure success, to have somebody like a Kamala
(25:22):
Harris who has the chance to make history, but not
feel that we can push hard enough on her to say, hey, look,
it's not just enough to be black. Say something about
that genocide over there, right like, we cannot afford to
be content with diversity at the helm of a vehicle
that doesn't drive us to where we're going.
Speaker 5 (25:37):
I know, I said a whole lot and nothing. I'm sorry.
Speaker 12 (25:40):
I just had to get that in there while y'all
got me, because I wanted to cover as much as
I heard.
Speaker 3 (25:44):
But man, yes, power, and then I just Marley, I
know your hand went up. I know we lose you
in ten minutes so I want to go to you,
and then I do want y'all to answer my question,
and we got to get more people involved overall. Yes,
Marly Well, I think that.
Speaker 10 (26:00):
Kind of exact. I think that the exact kind of
way that of the question towards me at least was
framed about being like tif you spoke of. You said
that you wanted to ask about reality, and I just
shared with you the reality of what young people in
my community are doing. And I think that exact sense
that it's denied or seen as not enough because it
is not on your feed or does not have a
spotlight on your algorithm. It is designed to be that
(26:21):
way that there are the organizations that we speak on
do exist, and that I think it requires a true
genuine effort to accept people that present their ideas both
the same way that Tie does with a beautiful you
know kind of like there's a there's a you have
a real power, Tie, like you have that voice, the
voice of change that speaks across generations, and people like
me who have crazy funky posters on their wall and
(26:44):
love to read books. That there are two kinds. There
will be many different kinds of people that speak out
about these missions. But once again, like and I think
when we watch this, you can see in real time
how asking me about a reality that I'm telling you
as a reality is the exact conversation that in the
school board meetings, in the council meetings make young people
like myself not want to engage in those conversations. I
(27:07):
cannot done it for ten years, but I think it's
really important to see that in real time. We just
watch what happens when I'm when young people speak on
their realities and they are denied it because the algorithms
don't show the work they're doing.
Speaker 6 (27:18):
Well, let me let me follow up on because I
appreciate your pot I think that's such a good perspective,
particularly or when it comes to the algorithm, because these,
you know, the wealthiest men in the world are poon speeding,
are spoon feeding us phone slops, so we don't pay
attention to what's going on, as Adam Serwerz term, by
the way, phone slop. So I appreciate that point, but
I don't just mean on my algorithm, so I want
to be more clear. It's also the young people I
(27:41):
talk to the kids of my friend's kids are in
their early twenties now from different socioeconomic backgrounds. It's the
kids in my family. And it's not that they're apathetic.
I mean they are frustrated. They have their frustrations too,
But I guess I'm saying your reality is also not
everyone's reality. When the young people who sit down and
(28:03):
reach out to me and talk to me like these
are the people who are trying to do something I have,
like young makeup artists who are doing my makeup, who
are gen zers, who talk to me about what they're
going through. So I didn't want to give you the
impression that it's just an algorithm, but I do think
that your reality does not cast the net over all
young folks, particularly when we see just the numbers don't lie.
(28:24):
And again it's not in puning a generation. I celebrate
and commend you, but I do think when you just
take a step back and look at it, I don't
know that it's an overwhelming amount of activism among gen zers.
But to be fair, I think time made this point,
or one of you all made this point that in
any generation you know, Andrew, I still haven't been able
to find where you got this data from, but you
(28:46):
made a really good point around the Montgomery bus boycott,
and you said only ten percent of people I believe
participated in the bus boycott.
Speaker 4 (28:55):
So I take your point.
Speaker 6 (28:57):
That you know, like every generation, there's been a small
group of people. I guess for me, I'm just a
little nervous about what's happening in the country now. I'm exhausted,
and I when when we're at tables and convening, I
don't hear a lot. I see a you at some
of these tables. I don't see hundreds of yous at
(29:18):
these tables.
Speaker 4 (29:18):
But it could be me.
Speaker 3 (29:20):
Okay, everybody, this is an intense episode. It's giving teens
summit back in the day.
Speaker 4 (29:25):
We'll be back after this prison.
Speaker 3 (29:41):
Victoria was gonna yeah, sorry, Victoria was.
Speaker 4 (29:45):
Trying to weigh in two powers.
Speaker 11 (29:46):
Ah No, I will say, you know, I definitely think
that these that there are young people who aren't having
the conversation, even if they don't know how to necessarily
have the conversation the right way or the way that
we expect them to. But I also think that young
people don't know what to do with the conversation once
they have it. I think there's an argument to be
made that we have to make politics and advocacy and
(30:06):
social justice work accessible. So many young people stick to
what they know because they feel like there is no
accessible entry points of social justice outside of showing up
to a march or a rally. And yes, we can
chat GPT things and look up how to change the
law and how to start a movement, but AI isn't personal.
It doesn't take you by the hand and show you
the ropes you know. It doesn't show you how to
create community in a meaningful, a lasting, and impactful way.
(30:28):
It might tell you the issues, but it won't show
you the experiences. It won't show you the joy, the pain,
the trauma behind why we fight the way we do.
And that only comes from community. That only comes from mentorship.
It comes from the principles of each one and teach one.
I'm grateful to have literally grown up in this movement
under the leadership of people like Reverend Sharkton, Hazel Dukes,
Tamika Mallory, you, Angela. That was a privilege in and
(30:49):
of itself. But not all young people have that, and
so of these some of the young people that are
entering this field are literally entering with nothing but emotions
from lived experiences, emotion and conversation, and it's on us
to make sure that we're creating spaces for them to
harness that emotion into change. There are young people who
want to get involved but feel like they have no reach,
no power, no entry way, and it's our job as activists.
(31:11):
It's also the job of older generations to call us
in instead of calling us out. I agree that there's
a disconnect between the season generation and my generation, but
I don't necessarily think it's accurate to say that it's.
Speaker 10 (31:21):
All on us.
Speaker 11 (31:22):
The art of mentorship and guidance is completely lost. Like
how do you call yourself a mentor and say that
you're passing the baton, but the first time your mentee
makes some mistakes you dip out on them, or because
you disagree on our versions of liberation, we're not worthy
of teaching anymore. The baton can only be passed if
one person lets go of the end. And so we're
constantly being told that we have to abide by the hierarchy,
(31:43):
that we have to wait our turn, that we have
to you know whether when we try, we're literally dismissed
or gaslighted. So which one is it? Do you want
us to stand up or do you want us to
stand behind you. You can't just teach our history to
those who already know it. Sometimes you have to pick
the young person who you might not usually pick out
of the crowd. You have to pick the young person
that needs it the most, that might not show up
(32:04):
to the events, that might not show up to the rally,
the protest. You pick the young person who needs the
help the most. And while we're also at it, we
kind of have to acknowledge that we play right into
the hands of respectability politics, Like why do I have
to have look at my nails, y'all? Why do I
have to have short nails and no lashes because to
you know, to fight for my people? Like who's respecting
my trying to earn I can't tell you how many
(32:26):
times I've heard, even from my own mom, shot out, Mom,
I love you, But I can't tell you how many
times I've heard or your lashes are too long, or
your shorts are too shorter, you have tattoos, and they're
gonna look at you differently, like my own people are
looking at me different. Please tell me how that's any
different than poulp colored folks looking at from what they do,
and that in and of itself is white supremacy. But
a lot of the older generation is not trying to
have that conversation because they grew up in the era
(32:48):
where Sunday Best is every single day, which I absolutely respect.
But why can't you respect my choice to not play
into the hands of white supremacy? And why can't you
acknowledge that I can still fight the same fight with
my long hair, my long lashes, and my sharp nails.
Speaker 3 (33:00):
I love this can well, you guys are always welcome
here to have this conversation. Ty you were gonna say something.
Speaker 12 (33:06):
Yeah, good, And I'm glad that Victoria went first because
she says so much that I don't got to be
repetitive in that way. I think that, you know, just
one thing that I want to say is that mentorship
pieces is key. You know, we stand on the shoulders
of giants, But what good is it if those giants
don't converse with us and in part wisdom while they're
here and still standing tall. You know, all too often
there has been too much friction, And like I said,
(33:27):
it's not that we're unwilling to learn. I think that
a lot of the times the older generation is unwilling
to value.
Speaker 5 (33:33):
Us, like I said, as co collaborators.
Speaker 12 (33:35):
They think that somehow that age throws them into a
hierarchy like and I mean, I have done so much
in my life, Victoria Marley as well. These experiences are valued.
They're different, but they're valued. There was a point that
Tiffany made about the fact that in our generation, she's
not seeing a whole bunch of folks. I would be
lying to you to say everybody is out here trying
(33:56):
to be the next MLK or you know, the next
that's not everybody, but it was never everybody. And I
think that's the point that I was trying to make earlier,
is that it only takes a dedicated few to get
that movement started, to organize the information, to figure out
how to reach people where they are, to get it started.
We never had a million in one thought leaders. Just
the few that we had out there were intentional about
(34:17):
how they were spreading their practice, and so I think
that's how we get it done.
Speaker 5 (34:21):
It doesn't take every.
Speaker 12 (34:22):
Single person being able to do what Victoria does or
what Marley does, or what I do, but it takes
us being able to reach those people in a language
that lets them know, Hey, maybe your front lines isn't protesting,
but if you're a teacher, go dismantle white supremacy in
the classroom.
Speaker 5 (34:37):
Maybe your front lines is not going to.
Speaker 12 (34:39):
Be direct action, but if you're in a hospital and
you can make sure that a positive health outcome happens
for a black woman because you listen, let that be
your fight against white supremacy. Because you see, there are
different ways to fight this fight, and it's going to
take all of the approaches. No one way will save us.
It's not going to be a bunch of talking heads
on these podcasts. It's not going to be the folks
that get arrested. It's not going to be the folks
(34:59):
that or pushing policy. It is going to be all
of us in concert. And even then we're still gonna
be working to get to where.
Speaker 5 (35:04):
We want to get.
Speaker 12 (35:05):
So I think that it's important to understand that, like
we are working on a thing that will consistently be
worked on. The best way that we can work on it, though,
is having conversation. And the last thing I want to
say about that in Bridging Gaps, sort of re revisiting
that first point is these legacy organizations got to open up.
Speaker 5 (35:24):
They gotta open up.
Speaker 12 (35:25):
They and they gotta really reimagine what it can look
like to be a community leader. Maybe it isn't suited
and buddhed in Sunday's best. Times have changed. I mean, look,
I love the NAACP, right but that's the National Association
for the Advancement of Color People. Are we around here
calling folks colored anymore?
Speaker 5 (35:44):
So? Right there?
Speaker 12 (35:44):
Even in the name, and unless you know, there's something
that's a bit answer created in how you're programming. And
that's not to say NAACP does do great things. I
just collaborated with the Legal Defense Fund on some project
a while back, so I know that they're doing awesome work.
I know Nan is doing awesome work. What I'm saying
is the thing things that got us here will not
be the things that get us there. And it is
important to take away the beautiful things that were successful
(36:08):
and worked, but understand that we're going to have to
put in motion some new things for a new generation.
Speaker 3 (36:14):
I want to just go to sorry toy. I want
to go to Marley real quick. You or you had
a heart out at at thirty and we're at thirty once.
I want to give you a chance to offer any
party or exifty stop to go.
Speaker 4 (36:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 10 (36:24):
I mean, I think that I believe that the kid
to a better future will be intergenerational exchange. And I
think in my time as an activist, I've felt the
most heard and supported by It takes gen x women,
it takes millennial women, it takes people of all backgrounds,
and I think once again, we need to make sure
that we're having this bottom up approach within our own
Black community. That for folks who are like queer, like myself,
(36:48):
I think especially like organizations, older organizations that were founded
on these principles that are kind of highly tied to
errors which were more homophobic, can make us feel like
we don't have a space there, but are attached to
certain religious beliefs makes U feel like we don't have
a space there, and really making sure that we're doing
the work we can to. If we notice apathy, see
that as an opportunity rather to see it as something
(37:09):
to fear. That when there are young people that are
in your life that aren't demonstrating the things that you
want them to do, that you don't feel are on
the right path, there is an art of mentorship. There
is an ability to give resources. There is capital to
be spent between people using the Bank of justice and
not just towards systems or towards a goal that we
can share our resources amongst each other, and that it
(37:30):
requires losing so much of the judgment we have against
people who are different than us, people who approach activism
different than us, and people who will not sound, speak,
act or think like Martin Luther King or Malcolm X.
And you will not see those leaders again. And we
need to recognize that there will be a new era
that will require turning this apathy, noticing this apathy and
(37:51):
transforming it rather than using it in such an accusatory
in a way to accuse a generation of doing something
that I fully believe they do. That hope is the
hope has always been the way, and I think so
it's really important to just reframe and say, like, why
are we so hope? Why do we not believe in
young black youth? And is it not to be young,
gifted and black? Like even if you see and notice
(38:13):
these things, do you not believe there is a goodness
inside them that can be unlocked? And do you not
are you not willing to do the work to unlock
that for your future, for their children's future, for your
children's future, you want to come and accuse them and
make them feel small. That will always be the biggest
challenge to me, and I think it's the most important
part of the daily ways that we treat each other
with care as a community, and that we shall respect
(38:34):
to all the ideas and all the experience, even if
it comes in the package of someone that does not
look like us.
Speaker 1 (38:40):
Well, y'all all brilliant, And to part two of the conversation,
I didn't want to. I just wanted to quickly weigh
in here and say because I wasn't part of last
week's episode, so I haven't really opined it all here.
I just want to say I respect every every word
that you all uttered. It was. It was delivered with
such great, deep in our felt meaning. And on the
(39:03):
latter points here I would simply remind us and I'm
almost embarrassed to be at the other end of the conversation,
we're Angela tivvying out of the old people at the table,
when it feels like just yesterday we were each striking
out in our own rebellious ways to start new organizations
and entities and reimagine what freedom look like for black folk.
And that brings me to the point of this road
(39:26):
of respect and mutuality flows many different directions. And so
just as it is wholly inappropriate for entrenched members of
our community to make an organizing space uncomfortable for you
in any way, shape or form, it is likewise also
(39:46):
a real stick in the chest for many of our
leaders in the community and our singers, who are told
that their tactics are antiquated and don't work, and are
in some ways held responsible for the retrading of fights
that we're continuing to have to have today. And I
don't think that it represents everybody. And by the way,
(40:08):
not a movement we can think of included the majority
of people, let alone everybody and making them move to
know it today everybody we know march in the civil
rights movement. Not true, But the reflective history causes us
a thing differently. I just say we could go so
much further when we suspend with ego judgment and enhance
(40:31):
the ability to be curious about what you don't know
or what might be different, curiosity leading rather than judgment. Man,
I mean, we'd be unstoppable and I'm just glad to
know that y'all are in this pipeline here and thank you, and.
Speaker 3 (40:45):
I think, okay, great.
Speaker 6 (40:49):
Yeah, So I'm glad you're Sam Marlin because you've had
a lot to say. I appreciate all all your points,
all of you guys, and I think is healthy for
us to hear, you know, the healthy exchange of ideas
and ideology. Ty you talked about. You know, it doesn't
take you know everybody. I wonder this is really for
(41:11):
all of you all, but I'll start with Hi. I wonder,
do you feel like you're reaching people?
Speaker 4 (41:18):
Woo?
Speaker 6 (41:19):
Okay, I listen, these young people are giving us the business,
but we got some business for the young people. So
I think we're gonna have to make this a two parter.
I hope you guys will tune in when the next
episode of Native Lamppod drops, where we get deeper with
the young folks on this podcast, because honey, they got
a lot to say. They certainly had a lot to
say to us, So please be sure to tune in
(41:41):
on the next episode. Also, while you're at it, don't
forget to subscribe. Tell your friends, Tell your friends to
tell their friends, tune in, Tell your young people, tell
your children to tune in because this is a conversation
that we need to be having across all generations. So
we'll see you on the next episode on Native Lampod
when we revisit this conversation for.
Speaker 5 (42:00):
The last morning see.
Speaker 2 (42:01):
Thank you for joining the Natives attention of with the
info and all of the latest roy Gillem and cross
connected to the statements that you leave on our socials.
Thank you sincerely for the patients reason for your choices cleared.
Speaker 1 (42:14):
So grateful it took the OAT to execute.
Speaker 2 (42:16):
Rolls for serve, defend and protect the truth even in paint.
Go walking home to all of the Natives wait.
Speaker 5 (42:22):
Thank you.
Speaker 6 (42:35):
Native land Pod is the production of iHeartRadio in partnership
with Reason Choice Media. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit
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Native Land Pod is a production of iHeartRadio in partnership
with Reason Choice Media.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Welcome, Welcome home, y'all. This is episode counted seventy five.
I seventy five. I don't know. I'm thinking of, you know,
driving the state of Florida. Anyway of Native Lamp Pod.
That seventy fifth episode, and we're excited to continue to
break down all things politics and culture. We're so happy
to be back with you today. I'm joined, of course,
(00:31):
by my fellow co hosts. We are Tiffany Crass, tiff
Aziel Lai, and I'm Andrew Guillam. What's up here?
Speaker 3 (00:40):
Is the only one that will introduce you or me first,
and never himself.
Speaker 4 (00:44):
It is fascinating. Appreciate you, I know, but you introduced
us first.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
I'm never gonna say first with y'all.
Speaker 4 (00:53):
I know you're a gentleman. I just want to say,
servant of the most tired God. But praise we we
miss you. Did did you go on the space shuttle
with Gail?
Speaker 1 (01:08):
You know what you got?
Speaker 5 (01:08):
Jokes?
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Did you see how horrified Gil looked Gail?
Speaker 4 (01:12):
Look?
Speaker 6 (01:13):
Yeah, I'm not happy about it. Even the comments that
she made afterwards when she was talking about Jeff Bezos
is doing wonderful things, it just feels like a real
strong disconnect with community. It was we all rooting for
Caitlyn Clark. Now is Jeff Bezos is doing wonderful things
somewhere between Chicago and Santa Barbara Oprah and Gale's like,
I love you.
Speaker 4 (01:34):
Sign up for this shade.
Speaker 3 (01:35):
I was just asking about the Space Shuttle, cheat, I
just I just, oh, you.
Speaker 6 (01:39):
Well, you know, I'm I'm very honest, and so the honest.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Take for me, And she was just asking about Andrew
being at NASA and the Space Shuttle.
Speaker 4 (01:47):
That's all.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
Oh lord, I think I'm going back to NASA next week.
All right, So I've got all that I missed y'all
so much last week out of my out of my system,
and I want to know what are we talking about today,
what's on the what's on our minds?
Speaker 3 (02:04):
Well, Tips likes to be in the comments, So it
sounds like we got a little dragged in the comments.
A lot of folks not watching the whole show for context,
and some folks who did and still there are I
think disagreeing and dissentive views on this, But we really
want to talk about is this narrative I think of
rest and recovery and whether you're working or not, are
you doing both, especially when it comes to the young people.
(02:27):
So I'd love to hear what y'all think about that.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Yeah, rest as resistance, as as I've been hearing former resistance. Yeah, okay, tip,
But for what.
Speaker 6 (02:37):
I just wanted to say, we want to thank Roland
Martin for he joined us in your stead and what
happened in your absence Andrew is there was a conversation
around young folks. Yes, and Angela has some strong thoughts
as their Row, so I think that was the clipper
about the place.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
Sorry, well yes, but let me just say this again, Row.
I said it in a video I sent, but the
show hadn't run yet. Thank you brother, as always for
stepping in and holding all of us down. In this case,
I appreciate you holding holding me down and you know,
getting some conversation started. Row.
Speaker 4 (03:16):
Row check as only he does.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
As only you do. Let's check out what you started.
Speaker 7 (03:20):
Man, gen X, millennials and gen Z. This is the
generations that are what I call post civil rights movement babies.
Those three generations have been making withdraws from the Black
(03:44):
Bank of Justice and have not made reciprocal deposits. We
cannot continue to ask baby boomers, who are now in
their seventies and eighties to keep doing work while we
sit our asset brunch, while we hang out, or we
(04:05):
take multiple vacations, or while we check out of the
process and sit down on the couch. The reason Black
voter turnout is down is not because we just so
just checked out.
Speaker 8 (04:16):
It's because the black infrastructure going door to door free
syncs vota mobilization. Those people are retired or they died,
and we have to somehow wake the hell up and
realize now is our time.
Speaker 7 (04:32):
You've been bitching about the baton. Now it's time for
your ass to run the race.
Speaker 4 (04:37):
What's up?
Speaker 9 (04:38):
Native Lampid? First of all, let me start by saying,
I love y'all's down. Okay. My name is Avian. I'm
a civil rights lawyer, and I am a millennial. I
listened to last week's episode, and I have a lot
of thoughts. I got a lot of feelings, okay, but
one of those thing that I feel like it kind
of lacked nuances. So I'm really excited that you all
are open to having younger voices to engage in this conversation.
(05:00):
I really think we should consider all of the factors
that go into play as to why certain people are
choosing to withdraw from movement spaces and choosing not to
engage in the ways that we've seen before. I think
that black people are right now are choosing rest as
resistance and intentionally creating spaces of black joy. But I
(05:20):
totally agree with the premise of what you all were saying.
I just think we need to dig a little bit
deeper and consider the why. Why are younger generations not
showing up?
Speaker 7 (05:30):
How does community look.
Speaker 9 (05:31):
Different for us than it did in the civil rights movement?
How have we been siloed and individualized in a way
that is harming us and impacting our community.
Speaker 4 (05:41):
There's so many things.
Speaker 10 (05:42):
That I have to say, so many thoughts.
Speaker 9 (05:44):
Thank you again for considering opening up this space, and
y'all continue to do the work that you're doing. I
appreciate y'all, and y'all have a good one.
Speaker 4 (05:53):
Thanks.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
I love it, I love it, I love that, I
love the ownership.
Speaker 6 (06:01):
So if you're wondering what we're talking about today, that
is what we're talking about today young folks and what
is going on with young people, particularly as it relates
to our politics. So I just want to give the
listeners and viewers a little bit of background. There are
currently in the United States just sigh of seventy million
gen Zers living in America. Gen Zers are born between
(06:22):
nineteen ninety seven and twenty twelve. They represent, you guys,
about twenty five percent of the American population, which is
a sizable portion. In this year, they will be turning
between fourteen and twenty eight years old. This is the
newest generation to gain influence across the world in the
workforce now that they're old enough to vote.
Speaker 4 (06:42):
They are the.
Speaker 6 (06:43):
Last generation, the last generation in which the majority identifies
as white. Fourteen percent of this generation identifies as black,
which is pretty much on par with the national population,
given that black folks represent fourteen percent of the US
popular This last or in November twenty twenty two, they
(07:05):
had both the lowest registration voting rate of all generations.
So I'm excited to dig in and actually hear from
folks from this generation.
Speaker 3 (07:16):
So we have some young folks to get it off
their chests with us. They are doing amazing things. Victoria
Panel is someone who I have known since her eighth grade.
She was very, very active in the National Action Network.
She asked me to speak at her eighth grade graduation.
She is now one of our lead soldiers on State
of the People's Power Tour and she is also an
(07:38):
organizer with Untel Freedom and social impact advisor with we
Inspire Justice.
Speaker 4 (07:43):
Welcome To's sister.
Speaker 3 (07:45):
We have ty Hobson Powell who's an international community advocate
and he is joining us as well. He's a native
Washingtonian and lifelong community advocate. Welcome Tie. And we also
have Marlee Das. I know y'all know this young lady,
very very powerful, doing incredible work. She's an activist and author,
(08:07):
a producer and creator of one thousand Black Girls Black
Girl Books. And I got to tell you, I remember
when Marley was a small little child. I used to
hate when people did it. So when we were growing up, y'all,
I remember when you was this big, and Marley is
still killing it. So these young foot soldiers are made
for the work. So we welcome y'all, and thank you
so much for joining.
Speaker 10 (08:27):
Welcome home, Thank you, thank you all.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
Are you kidding we're honored, we're under to haf y'all.
So I understand now I missed last week's episode, so
I get to play real ignorant on some things, so
long as my opinion isn't being asked. I'm curious as
you all listen to the episode, I assume you make
a Maybe I shouldn't assume, but I hope you make
a regular habit of listening from week to week, and
(08:52):
you can sort of tell when dynamics are are excitable
in the space and when you know, you know, we're
just chilling a little bit. And it's seems like last
week I listened to the show as well and had
some thoughts. But I'm curious to know what prick, y'all,
what what made you say a man? What made you say?
Speaker 5 (09:08):
Ouch?
Speaker 9 (09:11):
I mean?
Speaker 1 (09:11):
And don't all jump it once?
Speaker 3 (09:13):
I think Marley started, Marley you had the floor.
Speaker 10 (09:16):
Yeah, no worries. I think one thing that I really
enjoyed the conversation. First of all, I think that it's
very important to hear perspectives from all generations about what's
happening and kind of the stagnation that we're all feeling
when it comes to justice. That like we are experiencing
the beginning of a fascist country, and we are not
seeing people jump up in the streets or you know,
walk out every day speaking on this in the way
(09:37):
that we need to speak about it. I think the
one thing that pricked me the most, that I feel
like is kind of a related to that stagnation, is
how how little a conversation around racial capitalism has had
and how much of the difference between this is kind
of the civil rights movement being understood as a civic
and legal issue where we're looking for the passing of
a civil Rights Act, we're looking for the end of
(09:57):
an apartheid between black folks and white folks, but now recognizing,
just as we said with gen Z, that we're moving
into this multi racial, multi ethnic, incredibly diverse society where
we have nine hundred billionaires in the United States, and
that you know, the black bank of justice in many
ways has just been completely upturned by racial capitalism. And
(10:18):
I think it's an important conce part of the conversation.
Why it was so eager to talk is because I
agree with the points that are being made, and I
think so much more of this is an issue around
the breaking down of like our wealth gap is the
same as it was in the nineteen sixties. Black folks
still are meeting and wealth. Their median wealth becomes like
ten percent. I'm pretty sure of white folks on average,
and that hasn't moved since the sixties, And I think
(10:39):
that plays a big role in this idea of our bank.
Is like, if the bank is staying the same size
for us, but the bank is growing at these exponential
rates for tech billionaires and tech CEOs, that means our
bank exists, but it's just so small now, and we
didn't know that it would need to get that big.
So I'm excited to talk about ways that we can
make it bigger and hopefully make it more expansive.
Speaker 4 (11:00):
That uh, Victoria, what about you?
Speaker 11 (11:13):
Oh all right now?
Speaker 10 (11:14):
You know I love young folks.
Speaker 11 (11:16):
I have been in this movement for a long time,
since I was twelve years old, and so I'm automatically
going to defend young people. For me, it was the
withdrawal statement. You know, I don't think that we're withdrawn
from the movement. I think our deposits just look different.
They show up differently. I think young people are organizing
on a true grassroots level with mutual aid, showing up
(11:37):
for each other, raising money for each other, cooking meals
for each other, Like we often use our joy as
our weapon, and our fight looks different, but we're still
in the ring. And you also have to think too.
This generation has lived through COVID. We've watched pillars in
our community and our families quite literally die, and then
we're not able to see them. Some young people didn't
even get to enjoy their graduations. We've lived through Trayvon Martin,
(11:58):
which for a lot of young people served as the
catalyst to their advocacy. We've been a countless funerals of
young black folks who are killed by police officers who
are supposed to serve and protect us. I mean George Floyd,
Eric Gardner, Mike Brown, Sameer Y, Sandra Blain. I mean,
the list, unfortunately just goes on and on and on.
I mean, we've lived through watching our friends get deported,
like people are getting deported. We're watching colleges that we
(12:21):
work so hard to get into study day in and
day out, erasing our history and telling us that the
efforts for DEI are just not important. Students are being
arrested on campus or protesting. I mean with a stroke
of a pen. We're watching students who work so hard
to make it into a university be deported. We've lived
through now too, Trump presidencies where we are watching this
orange man literally strip everything that our ancestors have fought for.
(12:45):
So should we be outraged, Hell yeah, But I can
also understand why young people are exhausted and while we're drained,
we have to create space for people who are watching
everything that's happening and feel like all they can do
is ensure their own survival because it's honestly, it's scary
out there, and I think that that's where our compassion
and our empathy come into play. It's a movement of love.
(13:08):
There is no movement without love, and that has to
include people who just want to exist.
Speaker 4 (13:14):
I am.
Speaker 3 (13:15):
I know we just lost Tie, and I just want
to know we are having some production challenges, but I'm
sure we're going to have him back. I have one question,
and I really Tiff and Andrew, I want to hear
this from y'all too. When I went back, I don't
know why I thought that the conversation was just on
young people. When we heard Roland today, he said gen
X millennials and gen Z are withdrawing more than their depositing.
(13:38):
I'm curious to know if you all think that when
we consider the masses, are people doing more withdraws or
are they doing more deposits? And like why, like what
do we really believe about all across generations, tiff to
shout out your show, what do we think about that?
Like that is that really a thing? Do we really
think people are depositing more in the Bank of Black Justice?
Knowing that that's not a check you can necessary of
(14:00):
the cash, but it's about a movement?
Speaker 1 (14:02):
Do you really think that, Angela and asking that when
we talk about just for the audience and ourselves, we're
not talking about a little This is not a literal
banks should be a literal base. There should be a
literle bank. There ain't no doubt about it. There's no
doubt about it. But in this instance, we're trying to say,
are people on the whole giving more to this universal
(14:23):
movement based fight toward I hope freedom, or are folks
sort of kind of laying on the laurels of what's
come before and the fights that are being had and
the fighters who are acting on their behalf? Is it
more of one or the other, or do you reject
the premise of the question. It's it's y'all's turn.
Speaker 10 (14:44):
Us as the young folks.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
Well, yeah, weigh in that, Yeah on that, Yeah, I
think it's a conversation.
Speaker 10 (14:51):
Yeah, I mean I think that I do not think
first of all, outright, I don't think that gen Z
is laying on their laurels. I mean I can speak
for my own personal experience of the work. I is
that I started at ten years old collecting and donating
books with black girls as the main character and have
now collected fifteen thousand. So I feel like with my
work on its own, can speak for a lot of
the experiences for like young black educational justice. But I
(15:13):
really think once again that like this question I rejected
in a certain sense because there's also a question of
like modernity and a question of America changing from nineteen
fifty to nineteen sixty to twenty twenty four and twenty
twenty five where I feel like like social media and
smartphones have democratized activism, and when we think about the
Black Lives Matter movement, even George Floyd's death, it was
(15:35):
filmed because of a seventeen year old on their phone.
So when we think about the actual beginning of what
happened in twenty twenty, that was started by a young
teenage Black girl who recorded and started that like started
that movement up again in twenty twenty, obviously still founded
by millennials and Gen X who put that deposit in
the bank. So I feel like we can even see
then how it's intergenerational and how that's a major deposit.
(15:57):
I think one big thing to also shout out is
climate justice. That younger generations and Gen Z have been
so focused on climate emergencies since I mean, for me,
like I could say since twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen, but
because that is oftentimes an intersectional movement that talks about humanity, right,
we're talking about the earth. A lot of the times
(16:17):
older generations don't feel or understand the ways that it's
directly impacting Black communities. And I think now there's so
many more organizations like Black Girl and environmentalists or young
black climate leaders who are doing that work. But you know,
thirteen four percent of Black children have asthma, which is
double the rate of white children. That we are seventy
five percent more likely to live near industrial facilities, and
(16:38):
these you know, and these exposures to environmental harm play
the same amount of role in like this need to
rest as the issues happening in politics, where like if
we live in communities that are killing us, This is
why people feel that rest is resistance. And I think
those are kind of forces that combine themselves, as like
over half of people living and have and had near
hazardous waste, our people of color would make you want
(17:00):
to lay down too. So I think it's an important
thing that was that isn't always addressed in this conversation
around why people feel the need to rest, is that
so much of this environmental race, this environmental racism disparity,
directly impacts black health, which directly creates like the stagnation
that we're seeing.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
I gotta I gotta just say, though, I'm gonna push
y'all a little bit because I've known about you all,
have known you for a long time. You all are,
to me are the exception and not the norm. I
think that when I consider Andrew, Andrew is an exception
and not the norm. Tiff is an exception and not
the norm. When we talk about this space, this isn't
a place that people volunteer to get in with at
(17:40):
massive numbers. They might go to a fight back protest
or fight the Oligarchy rally with Bernie and AOC and
even a lot of they don't look like us. You know,
Black Lives Matter was started by three black women, so
it was supported by the masses. But when we think
about how we are contributing to movements rit large, are
you y'all really going to tell me that more often
(18:01):
than not, the black people in your families and your
friend groups are overwhelmingly supporting these movements. Because that's not
my testimony. That's not true. I was born by raised
born and raised by an activists. Most of my family
doesn't even they support it, but they're not engaged. So
if y'all are telling.
Speaker 4 (18:18):
Me they're engaged, I just want to see the math.
I haven't seen the math, just I can tell you.
Speaker 1 (18:23):
Not true for any generation, by the way, But I
love what I'm saying.
Speaker 10 (18:26):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean I can tell you the math.
Speaker 4 (18:28):
I can.
Speaker 10 (18:29):
I've worked and grown up in Essex County, New Jersey,
and I've worked with fifteen other girls who have done
social justice projects around STEM based education, done social just
like STEM based education wellness, mental health like all disability
access like I have seen this happen in Essex County,
New Jersey, where I am from, with the help of
the Grassroots Community Foundation. That there are so many grassroots
(18:51):
organizations that are leading and creating nonprofits to train young
girls of color. There's Girls for Gender Equity in New
York City. There's so many organizations that are doing this work.
I think that a lot of this comes from this
idea that folks aren't engaged is because of this. I
think there's a lot of a focus on culture when
we talk about representation in black folks and pushing things forward,
and when we look in our culture right now, we
(19:12):
see black like black leaders being arrested on sex crime,
sexual assaulting. We see drama all over with former gen
X and millennial black leaders. A lot of black men
right now are being kind of policed in the public
eye for their celebrity and at the same time as
that that's what gets the highlight and not the story
of the young fifteen year old girls that are creating
mental health Day legislation, running a program like Greener Been
(19:35):
Week in New Jersey. That a lot of the times
when we think about where the lenses on black people
and what they are doing. They're being policed, but there
is no desire to cover a story of successful young
black girls and the stories of the twenty other girls
that have grown up doing the same work that I
do have just not received the same amount of media coverage,
have not received the same amount of funding. But I
think that to suggest that there are less people that
(19:57):
are engaged is it's an only issue of spotlight.
Speaker 4 (20:00):
It's not an.
Speaker 10 (20:00):
Issue of engagement.
Speaker 5 (20:03):
That's fair.
Speaker 6 (20:15):
Let me just give a little pushback on that, because
what we looked at is the data of gen Z
ers who are participating in the electoral process. So perhaps
what you're saying is maybe you all don't view voting
as the only definition of being active in your community.
But the reality is that gen Z was the had
(20:38):
lower rates of civic engagement than any other generation. That's
true relatives, yes, but comparatively speaking to other generations. So
let me just let's get through and ask my question.
(20:59):
I'm curious. It's kind of like when you go to
a school and you say, hey, we're having an after
school program for anyone who wants to go to college.
Speaker 4 (21:10):
Come.
Speaker 6 (21:11):
I would often have to tell educators and people in
the classroom. The people who show up to that program
are not always the people who need the most help.
They're the people who need the least help. Because they're
showing up, they're participating. So the young people I talk
to are not talking about climate justice. I applaud you
for doing that. I think that's amazing, but we have
to engage in the reality of this. The young people
(21:33):
I'm following. My feed is not full of young people
talking about climate justice. My feed is not full of
young people talking about registering the vote, and the data
doesn't support that itself. So it's not I'm certainly not
here to impugne the younger generation at all. It's more
of a case study. I want to listen and understand.
So for the people who might not be like you,
(21:53):
For the people who are saying I don't participate, those
are people. Those are your peers and folks you talk to.
You've laid out some of the challenges looking at the
sixties to today, But what are things you're hearing from people,
your friends, your peers, who are not organizing around climate justice,
and who can't tell you who their member of Congress is,
and who have never voted in their life and they
(22:15):
don't feel any kind of way about it. And that's
it either one of you ladies who are willing to answer.
And I see we do have tie back tie. I
know we have a lot of technical difficulties.
Speaker 4 (22:24):
So if you want to jump in.
Speaker 6 (22:25):
On this question while we have you, please feel free,
sir h yeah, I just.
Speaker 5 (22:30):
Really quickly while you guys, can you hear me now?
Speaker 4 (22:32):
Yes, yes, so hear you go right.
Speaker 12 (22:34):
I wanted to jump in on something that I didn't
get a chance to comment on, which is that I
do think that it's important to hear what's true about
the critiques about this generation so that we can improve.
I think, you know, same as every generation. Some folks
don't adequately deposit into the bank of justice. That was
true back in my Auntie's day. That was true back
in Grandma's day. It is true now. You know, you
have folks who say trendy shit like we are not
(22:55):
our ancestors, and it's not true in the flattering way
they think, because we can't give up Target or Starbucks
for our revolution, right, we aren't doing that. So I
do believe that there is some validity to the idea
that we are not doing all that we can. I mean,
the underground railroad was created with less than the resources.
Where's our support of infrastructure? Now with all of the
infrastructure on social media and things that we have, we
(23:16):
don't have it. So I think that some of those
critiques are true about their generation and the fact that
we don't show up in the way.
Speaker 5 (23:22):
That we could.
Speaker 12 (23:22):
But also think about the reasons why we aren't always
valued as leaders. Think about how many times that there
were voices under twenty five centered in those town halls
and panels leading up to the election. The same ones
who we tell are important for their vote didn't have
any representation on those big stages to talk to them
about why they should care or why they should have
a task. How many young voices are substantivity brought to
(23:44):
the table as collaborators. I mean I was in direct
contact with the Office of Public Engagement and they decided
that they would rather have K pop singers comes to
the White House than have black organizers from around the country.
We with the Domestic Policy Council, But.
Speaker 5 (23:56):
It's not just that.
Speaker 12 (23:57):
I was just a discernment in the past weekend with
Jamal Bryant where he was talking about how this is
the largest generation of black people making the exit from
the church. And when you look at church and its
ability to anchor movement, what are the reasons why church
isn't speaking our language. It's a reason why young people
want to go and sit bottomless mimosas then sit in
the church and be told a language that no longer
(24:19):
speaks to them. Right, and so it is something for
the church to say, Okay, I am losing my folks.
Let's make this adjustment. Because again, when we look at
this iteration of Black Lives Matter, it represents one of
the few movements social justice anchored that was not born
in the church where people were not getting their mandate
during Sunday sermon to be able to move around where there.
(24:39):
So we don't see the organization in that same way. Obviously,
there is some apathy as well, because we are stuck
in this lesser of the two evils paradigm where we
sitting there, we're looking at the inherently racist GOP and
then the slightly to the left Democrats who don't dare
do any damn bold thing. I mean, the thing is,
I was having a question with Lolo yesterday and she
asked me. She said, Hi, do you feel at aesthetic?
(25:00):
I said, I'm the father of a three year old
daughter who's going to grow up to be a black woman.
I can't afford to be apathetic. But I'm pissed off,
and I'm pissed off that I'm more pissed off than
the Democrats who say they are all leaders are. I'm
pissed off that we have somehow allowed diversity in pissed
poor leadership to be our mark of success, to be
how we measure success, to have somebody like a Kamala
(25:22):
Harris who has the chance to make history, but not
feel that we can push hard enough on her to say, hey, look,
it's not just enough to be black. Say something about
that genocide over there, right like, we cannot afford to
be content with diversity at the helm of a vehicle
that doesn't drive us to where we're going.
Speaker 5 (25:37):
I know, I said a whole lot and nothing. I'm sorry.
Speaker 12 (25:40):
I just had to get that in there while y'all
got me, because I wanted to cover as much as
I heard.
Speaker 3 (25:44):
But man, yes, power, and then I just Marley, I
know your hand went up. I know we lose you
in ten minutes so I want to go to you,
and then I do want y'all to answer my question,
and we got to get more people involved overall. Yes,
Marly Well, I think that.
Speaker 10 (26:00):
Kind of exact. I think that the exact kind of
way that of the question towards me at least was
framed about being like tif you spoke of. You said
that you wanted to ask about reality, and I just
shared with you the reality of what young people in
my community are doing. And I think that exact sense
that it's denied or seen as not enough because it
is not on your feed or does not have a
spotlight on your algorithm. It is designed to be that
(26:21):
way that there are the organizations that we speak on
do exist, and that I think it requires a true
genuine effort to accept people that present their ideas both
the same way that Tie does with a beautiful you
know kind of like there's a there's a you have
a real power, Tie, like you have that voice, the
voice of change that speaks across generations, and people like
me who have crazy funky posters on their wall and
(26:44):
love to read books. That there are two kinds. There
will be many different kinds of people that speak out
about these missions. But once again, like and I think
when we watch this, you can see in real time
how asking me about a reality that I'm telling you
as a reality is the exact conversation that in the
school board meetings, in the council meetings make young people
like myself not want to engage in those conversations. I
(27:07):
cannot done it for ten years, but I think it's
really important to see that in real time. We just
watch what happens when I'm when young people speak on
their realities and they are denied it because the algorithms
don't show the work they're doing.
Speaker 6 (27:18):
Well, let me let me follow up on because I
appreciate your pot I think that's such a good perspective,
particularly or when it comes to the algorithm, because these,
you know, the wealthiest men in the world are poon speeding,
are spoon feeding us phone slops, so we don't pay
attention to what's going on, as Adam Serwerz term, by
the way, phone slop. So I appreciate that point, but
I don't just mean on my algorithm, so I want
to be more clear. It's also the young people I
(27:41):
talk to the kids of my friend's kids are in
their early twenties now from different socioeconomic backgrounds. It's the
kids in my family. And it's not that they're apathetic.
I mean they are frustrated. They have their frustrations too,
But I guess I'm saying your reality is also not
everyone's reality. When the young people who sit down and
(28:03):
reach out to me and talk to me like these
are the people who are trying to do something I have,
like young makeup artists who are doing my makeup, who
are gen zers, who talk to me about what they're
going through. So I didn't want to give you the
impression that it's just an algorithm, but I do think
that your reality does not cast the net over all
young folks, particularly when we see just the numbers don't lie.
(28:24):
And again it's not in puning a generation. I celebrate
and commend you, but I do think when you just
take a step back and look at it, I don't
know that it's an overwhelming amount of activism among gen zers.
But to be fair, I think time made this point,
or one of you all made this point that in
any generation you know, Andrew, I still haven't been able
to find where you got this data from, but you
(28:46):
made a really good point around the Montgomery bus boycott,
and you said only ten percent of people I believe
participated in the bus boycott.
Speaker 4 (28:55):
So I take your point.
Speaker 6 (28:57):
That you know, like every generation, there's been a small
group of people. I guess for me, I'm just a
little nervous about what's happening in the country now. I'm exhausted,
and I when when we're at tables and convening, I
don't hear a lot. I see a you at some
of these tables. I don't see hundreds of yous at
(29:18):
these tables.
Speaker 4 (29:18):
But it could be me.
Speaker 3 (29:20):
Okay, everybody, this is an intense episode. It's giving teens
summit back in the day.
Speaker 4 (29:25):
We'll be back after this prison.
Speaker 3 (29:41):
Victoria was gonna yeah, sorry, Victoria was.
Speaker 4 (29:45):
Trying to weigh in two powers.
Speaker 11 (29:46):
Ah No, I will say, you know, I definitely think
that these that there are young people who aren't having
the conversation, even if they don't know how to necessarily
have the conversation the right way or the way that
we expect them to. But I also think that young
people don't know what to do with the conversation once
they have it. I think there's an argument to be
made that we have to make politics and advocacy and
(30:06):
social justice work accessible. So many young people stick to
what they know because they feel like there is no
accessible entry points of social justice outside of showing up
to a march or a rally. And yes, we can
chat GPT things and look up how to change the
law and how to start a movement, but AI isn't personal.
It doesn't take you by the hand and show you
the ropes you know. It doesn't show you how to
create community in a meaningful, a lasting, and impactful way.
(30:28):
It might tell you the issues, but it won't show
you the experiences. It won't show you the joy, the pain,
the trauma behind why we fight the way we do.
And that only comes from community. That only comes from mentorship.
It comes from the principles of each one and teach one.
I'm grateful to have literally grown up in this movement
under the leadership of people like Reverend Sharkton, Hazel Dukes,
Tamika Mallory, you, Angela. That was a privilege in and
(30:49):
of itself. But not all young people have that, and
so of these some of the young people that are
entering this field are literally entering with nothing but emotions
from lived experiences, emotion and conversation, and it's on us
to make sure that we're creating spaces for them to
harness that emotion into change. There are young people who
want to get involved but feel like they have no reach,
no power, no entry way, and it's our job as activists.
(31:11):
It's also the job of older generations to call us
in instead of calling us out. I agree that there's
a disconnect between the season generation and my generation, but
I don't necessarily think it's accurate to say that it's.
Speaker 10 (31:21):
All on us.
Speaker 11 (31:22):
The art of mentorship and guidance is completely lost. Like
how do you call yourself a mentor and say that
you're passing the baton, but the first time your mentee
makes some mistakes you dip out on them, or because
you disagree on our versions of liberation, we're not worthy
of teaching anymore. The baton can only be passed if
one person lets go of the end. And so we're
constantly being told that we have to abide by the hierarchy,
(31:43):
that we have to wait our turn, that we have
to you know whether when we try, we're literally dismissed
or gaslighted. So which one is it? Do you want
us to stand up or do you want us to
stand behind you. You can't just teach our history to
those who already know it. Sometimes you have to pick
the young person who you might not usually pick out
of the crowd. You have to pick the young person
that needs it the most, that might not show up
(32:04):
to the events, that might not show up to the rally,
the protest. You pick the young person who needs the
help the most. And while we're also at it, we
kind of have to acknowledge that we play right into
the hands of respectability politics, Like why do I have
to have look at my nails, y'all? Why do I
have to have short nails and no lashes because to
you know, to fight for my people? Like who's respecting
my trying to earn I can't tell you how many
(32:26):
times I've heard, even from my own mom, shot out, Mom,
I love you, But I can't tell you how many
times I've heard or your lashes are too long, or
your shorts are too shorter, you have tattoos, and they're
gonna look at you differently, like my own people are
looking at me different. Please tell me how that's any
different than poulp colored folks looking at from what they do,
and that in and of itself is white supremacy. But
a lot of the older generation is not trying to
have that conversation because they grew up in the era
(32:48):
where Sunday Best is every single day, which I absolutely respect.
But why can't you respect my choice to not play
into the hands of white supremacy? And why can't you
acknowledge that I can still fight the same fight with
my long hair, my long lashes, and my sharp nails.
Speaker 3 (33:00):
I love this can well, you guys are always welcome
here to have this conversation. Ty you were gonna say something.
Speaker 12 (33:06):
Yeah, good, And I'm glad that Victoria went first because
she says so much that I don't got to be
repetitive in that way. I think that, you know, just
one thing that I want to say is that mentorship
pieces is key. You know, we stand on the shoulders
of giants, But what good is it if those giants
don't converse with us and in part wisdom while they're
here and still standing tall. You know, all too often
there has been too much friction, And like I said,
(33:27):
it's not that we're unwilling to learn. I think that
a lot of the times the older generation is unwilling
to value.
Speaker 5 (33:33):
Us, like I said, as co collaborators.
Speaker 12 (33:35):
They think that somehow that age throws them into a
hierarchy like and I mean, I have done so much
in my life, Victoria Marley as well. These experiences are valued.
They're different, but they're valued. There was a point that
Tiffany made about the fact that in our generation, she's
not seeing a whole bunch of folks. I would be
lying to you to say everybody is out here trying
(33:56):
to be the next MLK or you know, the next
that's not everybody, but it was never everybody. And I
think that's the point that I was trying to make earlier,
is that it only takes a dedicated few to get
that movement started, to organize the information, to figure out
how to reach people where they are, to get it started.
We never had a million in one thought leaders. Just
the few that we had out there were intentional about
(34:17):
how they were spreading their practice, and so I think
that's how we get it done.
Speaker 5 (34:21):
It doesn't take every.
Speaker 12 (34:22):
Single person being able to do what Victoria does or
what Marley does, or what I do, but it takes
us being able to reach those people in a language
that lets them know, Hey, maybe your front lines isn't protesting,
but if you're a teacher, go dismantle white supremacy in
the classroom.
Speaker 5 (34:37):
Maybe your front lines is not going to.
Speaker 12 (34:39):
Be direct action, but if you're in a hospital and
you can make sure that a positive health outcome happens
for a black woman because you listen, let that be
your fight against white supremacy. Because you see, there are
different ways to fight this fight, and it's going to
take all of the approaches. No one way will save us.
It's not going to be a bunch of talking heads
on these podcasts. It's not going to be the folks
that get arrested. It's not going to be the folks
(34:59):
that or pushing policy. It is going to be all
of us in concert. And even then we're still gonna
be working to get to where.
Speaker 5 (35:04):
We want to get.
Speaker 12 (35:05):
So I think that it's important to understand that, like
we are working on a thing that will consistently be
worked on. The best way that we can work on it, though,
is having conversation. And the last thing I want to
say about that in Bridging Gaps, sort of re revisiting
that first point is these legacy organizations got to open up.
Speaker 5 (35:24):
They gotta open up.
Speaker 12 (35:25):
They and they gotta really reimagine what it can look
like to be a community leader. Maybe it isn't suited
and buddhed in Sunday's best. Times have changed. I mean, look,
I love the NAACP, right but that's the National Association
for the Advancement of Color People. Are we around here
calling folks colored anymore?
Speaker 5 (35:44):
So? Right there?
Speaker 12 (35:44):
Even in the name, and unless you know, there's something
that's a bit answer created in how you're programming. And
that's not to say NAACP does do great things. I
just collaborated with the Legal Defense Fund on some project
a while back, so I know that they're doing awesome work.
I know Nan is doing awesome work. What I'm saying
is the thing things that got us here will not
be the things that get us there. And it is
important to take away the beautiful things that were successful
(36:08):
and worked, but understand that we're going to have to
put in motion some new things for a new generation.
Speaker 3 (36:14):
I want to just go to sorry toy. I want
to go to Marley real quick. You or you had
a heart out at at thirty and we're at thirty once.
I want to give you a chance to offer any
party or exifty stop to go.
Speaker 4 (36:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 10 (36:24):
I mean, I think that I believe that the kid
to a better future will be intergenerational exchange. And I
think in my time as an activist, I've felt the
most heard and supported by It takes gen x women,
it takes millennial women, it takes people of all backgrounds,
and I think once again, we need to make sure
that we're having this bottom up approach within our own
Black community. That for folks who are like queer, like myself,
(36:48):
I think especially like organizations, older organizations that were founded
on these principles that are kind of highly tied to
errors which were more homophobic, can make us feel like
we don't have a space there, but are attached to
certain religious beliefs makes U feel like we don't have
a space there, and really making sure that we're doing
the work we can to. If we notice apathy, see
that as an opportunity rather to see it as something
(37:09):
to fear. That when there are young people that are
in your life that aren't demonstrating the things that you
want them to do, that you don't feel are on
the right path, there is an art of mentorship. There
is an ability to give resources. There is capital to
be spent between people using the Bank of justice and
not just towards systems or towards a goal that we
can share our resources amongst each other, and that it
(37:30):
requires losing so much of the judgment we have against
people who are different than us, people who approach activism
different than us, and people who will not sound, speak,
act or think like Martin Luther King or Malcolm X.
And you will not see those leaders again. And we
need to recognize that there will be a new era
that will require turning this apathy, noticing this apathy and
(37:51):
transforming it rather than using it in such an accusatory
in a way to accuse a generation of doing something
that I fully believe they do. That hope is the
hope has always been the way, and I think so
it's really important to just reframe and say, like, why
are we so hope? Why do we not believe in
young black youth? And is it not to be young,
gifted and black? Like even if you see and notice
(38:13):
these things, do you not believe there is a goodness
inside them that can be unlocked? And do you not
are you not willing to do the work to unlock
that for your future, for their children's future, for your
children's future, you want to come and accuse them and
make them feel small. That will always be the biggest
challenge to me, and I think it's the most important
part of the daily ways that we treat each other
with care as a community, and that we shall respect
(38:34):
to all the ideas and all the experience, even if
it comes in the package of someone that does not
look like us.
Speaker 1 (38:40):
Well, y'all all brilliant, And to part two of the conversation,
I didn't want to. I just wanted to quickly weigh
in here and say because I wasn't part of last
week's episode, so I haven't really opined it all here.
I just want to say I respect every every word
that you all uttered. It was. It was delivered with
such great, deep in our felt meaning. And on the
(39:03):
latter points here I would simply remind us and I'm
almost embarrassed to be at the other end of the conversation,
we're Angela tivvying out of the old people at the table,
when it feels like just yesterday we were each striking
out in our own rebellious ways to start new organizations
and entities and reimagine what freedom look like for black folk.
And that brings me to the point of this road
(39:26):
of respect and mutuality flows many different directions. And so
just as it is wholly inappropriate for entrenched members of
our community to make an organizing space uncomfortable for you
in any way, shape or form, it is likewise also
(39:46):
a real stick in the chest for many of our
leaders in the community and our singers, who are told
that their tactics are antiquated and don't work, and are
in some ways held responsible for the retrading of fights
that we're continuing to have to have today. And I
don't think that it represents everybody. And by the way,
(40:08):
not a movement we can think of included the majority
of people, let alone everybody and making them move to
know it today everybody we know march in the civil
rights movement. Not true, But the reflective history causes us
a thing differently. I just say we could go so
much further when we suspend with ego judgment and enhance
(40:31):
the ability to be curious about what you don't know
or what might be different, curiosity leading rather than judgment. Man,
I mean, we'd be unstoppable and I'm just glad to
know that y'all are in this pipeline here and thank you, and.
Speaker 3 (40:45):
I think, okay, great.
Speaker 6 (40:49):
Yeah, So I'm glad you're Sam Marlin because you've had
a lot to say. I appreciate all all your points,
all of you guys, and I think is healthy for
us to hear, you know, the healthy exchange of ideas
and ideology. Ty you talked about. You know, it doesn't
take you know everybody. I wonder this is really for
(41:11):
all of you all, but I'll start with Hi. I wonder,
do you feel like you're reaching people?
Speaker 4 (41:18):
Woo?
Speaker 6 (41:19):
Okay, I listen, these young people are giving us the business,
but we got some business for the young people. So
I think we're gonna have to make this a two parter.
I hope you guys will tune in when the next
episode of Native Lamppod drops, where we get deeper with
the young folks on this podcast, because honey, they got
a lot to say. They certainly had a lot to
say to us, So please be sure to tune in
(41:41):
on the next episode. Also, while you're at it, don't
forget to subscribe. Tell your friends, Tell your friends to
tell their friends, tune in, Tell your young people, tell
your children to tune in because this is a conversation
that we need to be having across all generations. So
we'll see you on the next episode on Native Lampod
when we revisit this conversation for.
Speaker 5 (42:00):
The last morning see.
Speaker 2 (42:01):
Thank you for joining the Natives attention of with the
info and all of the latest roy Gillem and cross
connected to the statements that you leave on our socials.
Thank you sincerely for the patients reason for your choices cleared.
Speaker 1 (42:14):
So grateful it took the OAT to execute.
Speaker 2 (42:16):
Rolls for serve, defend and protect the truth even in paint.
Go walking home to all of the Natives wait.
Speaker 5 (42:22):
Thank you.
Speaker 6 (42:35):
Native land Pod is the production of iHeartRadio in partnership
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Hosts And Creators
Tiffany Cross
Andrew Gillum
Angela Rye
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