May 19, 2025 • 52 mins
In Florida they’re calling her ‘MAGA Marva’ Johnson, the ally of Governor DeSantis who is very nearly the 13th president of the historically Black university, FAMU. How did we get here, where a nominee who is roundly rejected by the community is STILL being lifted to the highest office? And what happens next?
To answer these questions, Andrew Gillum is joined by two guests. Dr. Keneshia Grant, PhD and professor of political science at Howard U, and Monica Williams Harris, an attorney who serves on FAMU Foundation’s board of directors.
Stay current on the situation at FAMU, check out https://www.keepersoftheflame1887.com/ and register to receive email updates.
Check out this spreadsheet of organizations to join, volunteer, or donate to: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/13Qxu32zcQNhVRNkhSy2oy0IDLY4VVLhuZC9N-2FXLTQ/edit?usp=sharing
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Native Land Pod is a production of iHeartRadio in partnership
with Reasoned Choice Media.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome was that was that
was of good afternoon, everyone, everyone's, everyone's. I should say
thank y'all for joining us for our solo pod. For
those of you all who have been rocking with us
on this for a couple of for a couple of
weeks or months, I should say, you know that we've
(00:28):
been trying to organize this, these particular lives to be
around well. The process of organizing, how do we movement build?
How do we how do we bring together people with
share belief systems who are either excited or agitated by
the same thing, get us on common accord and uh
(00:49):
define a clear objective and go after it. And over
the last couple of weeks, I've been personally involved as
an alumni of Florida and Universe City and as a
former member of the university's board of trustees, involved in
the pushback effort at Florida and M University, which of
(01:11):
course is the largest single campus HBCU in the country.
I would argue probably responsible for the production of more
of Florida's black middle class than any other singular institution.
But together with our other HBCU partners, the others being
private throughout the state, and obviously brothers and sisters at
(01:33):
PWIS as well, you know, I've come together to really
have significant impact. And of late the university has been
in an effort to find a new president. Not an
uncommon thing. However, what does strike uncommon in this situation
has been the really heavy hand of the far right
(01:54):
in this state, and frankly, i'd argue, maybe suggest in
this country to really want to take over the helm
of Florida m University at every level, wholesale university president,
chair of the university's board of trustees. You know, we've
already heard them speak out loud about their efforts to
purify these campuses, to get rid of certain books, to
(02:16):
extinguish a way, a certain curriculum, And honestly, I fear
that in this situation, everything they have already told us
out loud, everything that they think about us from DEI,
which they are the masters of right, didn't earn it
(02:37):
all the way down to what we've seen happen to
our museums, our books. The Librarian of Congress, who was
accused by the White House Press secretary of putting improper
books at the at the Congressional Library, which by the way,
collects two copies of every single book that has ever
(02:57):
been copywritten in this country. That's as job. But leasing
books out to young students that are inappropriate just a
quick correction, a matter of secretary. The Library of Congress
does not have an interface with the public subs that
they can books. They can't check them out, can't get
a card and go and take books off the shelf,
(03:17):
take them home and read them. Okay, you have the
local public library. That's not what the Library of Congress's
job is. Let's look that up, especially when you're speaking
from the perch of the presidential podium. That being said, y'all,
I digress. This is a real serious matter, a serious topic.
And whether you are a alumnus of an HBCU and
alumnus of FAM, a supporter of those institutions or support
(03:38):
specifically at Florida a m university, if you care about HBCUs,
if you care about the future of the contributions that
black folks make in this country writ large period, then
you've got to be paying attention to what's happening when
they go after again the largest single campus HBCU in
the country in the top one hundred rated by Princeton
(04:04):
Review Time magazine. All of the evaluators who put us
in good company with some of our private HBCU partners,
really at the top of the heap, and our recruitment
and retention, graduation and then placement of black people from
all parts of the world in this country. That process
at Florida am University has consumed a lot of us
(04:27):
because we don't just see it as a candidate that
has not qualified for the position. We see a candidate
and not qualified for the position. Yes, that was forged
into a list of finalists of which she was not
an initial part of. But we also see the play
behind the play, and even if the candidate that they
(04:48):
selected is not complicit with it. You've heard of the
term useful idiots and those of folks who may pursue
a mission and may not be aware of the mission
behind the mission. I don't know what it's true about that.
I don't know what's false about it either, but I
do know what I hear from Trump. I do know
what I hear, and I've seen from DeSantis. I know
(05:09):
that their leadership style is that of a totalitarian leader,
a dictator of some sort, a strong man, and that
they both frankly have the same Achilli's heel, which is,
while they project an image of strength, all powerful, all knowing,
all seeing, I know very specifically into Santis case, he
(05:30):
really is a four year old throwing a temper cancer
when he doesn't have his way. There's some thing strong
about that. There's nothing strong about strong arming people, using
the weight and power of the government and taxpayers resources
to beat people into complicity. See that they do what
you want them to do well. I've invited a few friends, experts,
(05:51):
folks who have a relationship with Florida University but are
expert in other places as well. One of my yes,
maybe having a few technical problems, so we may bring
her in a little bit later. I hope Monica is
able to join us, but right now I want to
invite on doctor Kanisha Grant, tenured professor at the Howard University,
(06:17):
a graduate of Florida a M University, a former student
government vice president at the Campus of fam you Uh,
and a dear, dear, dear personal friend. Doctor Grant welcome.
Hopefully we can bring a guest you go, guess you go.
Hey there, Doc, welcome.
Speaker 3 (06:34):
Hey, hey, thank you for having me. I'm so happy
to be with you.
Speaker 2 (06:37):
I appreciate that you see. Normally, my good friend doctor Grant,
as you know, she does the Christian Amanpour and she's
Al Jazeera and she's doing all the international things. But
like all good rattlers, when we hear a call, we
show up. Uh, and we show up ready for it
to go down.
Speaker 4 (06:58):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
And Kanisha, I'm so sorry, doctor Grant. I just want
to I want to one thank you for making time
to congratulate you. She is one of the youngest tenured
professors at Howard University and is again continue to give
back to the College of Love and Charity. But Knisian,
(07:19):
you know this well. Fam You told us to fight
and win whatever the battle be. That is in ol
al Mamria, which we both know well. So the battle
is upon us. Tell me, in your own words, what
about this presidential search process and where we are in it,
which you can bring people up to speed on which
(07:40):
I've not done yet. That gives you the greatest degree
of concern heartburn, not for yourself, per se but for
the future of the institution.
Speaker 3 (07:50):
There are so many answers to that question. So first
let me say thanks for being out and happy to
be here, Thank you for inviting me. I can be
Kindichians today. I don't have to be doctor Grant. I
mean the world is about slip up. No, I mean
like called Mekindicia. But in terms of what is I
think wrong, I come to this as a scholar. I
come to this as a person with a PhD.
Speaker 4 (08:12):
Right.
Speaker 3 (08:12):
I come to this as a person who is considered
being in university leadership. And so the thing that strikes
me first as a function of my lived experience, is
that an individual who's wholly unqualified to be an academic,
to be leading an academic institution, to be leading academicians,
would think that they could just show up and do
(08:36):
the job. That an academic institution is no different than
any other institution. I think it's the thing that I
find most defensive. I show up at Howard University every day,
and I show up to fight for fam you today
with the understanding that academic institutions are not corporations. They
are different, They are set apart. They are places where
we create new knowledge there are places where we shape
the minds of young people. There are places where you
(08:58):
have space to think, where we are supposed to be
trying to make the world a better place. They are
not corporations. My students are not my customers. And so
the idea that this person would show up with a
clear without a clear understanding of what academia is, what
we're doing, what we're about, what we value, what we
care for, I find problematic as a scholar, but then
(09:19):
as a rattler, as a person who bleeds orange and green,
who believes that like who I am is powerfully and
positively shaped by Famiu's role in my life, I am
pissed off that this person would show up with a
lack of understanding about our culture, about what family means
to us personally, about what it means to the state,
(09:40):
about what it means for upward mobility for people in
the state of Florida. But the people on this stream
right now, you and I are first generation college graduates,
right and in your particular case, the people who come
behind you end up getting baccalaureate degrees because that's what
college does. The people who come after you generally do
better as a result of your having participated. And so
(10:02):
I think the things that frustrate me are the deep
lack of qualifications, the deep lack of understanding, not to
mention the issues around process. How did this person get
to be in the pool of finalists is a question
that I have as a person who knows how search
committees work. Why is it the case that Florida is
(10:23):
a place where government is supposed to be in the
sunshine and Florida and them, it's supposed to be a
public institution, Yet they have these presidential searches set up
in a way where you can't know anything about what's
happening until it's almost finished.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (10:36):
So these kind of inconsistencies are the things that are
under my skin, in addition to the fundamental misunderstanding of
what we are doing at a place like Famue.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Yeah, Canisia. You mentioned something I think we should deepen
into because a lot I've seen a lot of folks
say or call and text and ask how did this
happen at fam You like, what is going y'all sleep
at the wheel? What's going on? And I try to
explain to them what you just alluded to, which was
in the quest to really control all instruments of the state.
(11:05):
The government has gone against the will of the people,
which said we want sunshine, We want to know every
if we elect you in or if you serve the
public in a public position, a public facing position paid
for by my tax dollars here in this government, what
you do in that position, the negotiations you have, who
(11:26):
you communicate with, how you communicate with them. That all
becomes available for the public to scrutinize, to make sure
that everything is on the up and up, to reduce
corruption and the kind of grip that you see happening
when people don't get to see what's happening behind the process.
It used to be when a presidential search process opened
in the state of Florida, everybody knew it. You saw
(11:47):
candidate applications as they were rolling in quite literally. And
since the days of Rohnda Scientis and the few years
of Rick Scott as governor, we've seen a shutting down
of that process. They have decided to close the process
from the public until the committee that has been assigned
(12:09):
to vet the candidates come out with their set of recommendations.
And what a number of universities have done in this
state is they've gone through that secretive process and then
the committee produces one name, one name that they would
recommend for consideration out of god knows how many applicants,
and the public has no clue what happened behind those
(12:29):
closed doors and how we got there. In our case,
typically the process has been to produce three names from
that process. In this case, family produced how many names
from their search committee?
Speaker 3 (12:40):
It was four? And originals about how we got to
those four?
Speaker 4 (12:44):
Right?
Speaker 3 (12:44):
So originally the idea that that was that there were
three candidates, that these candidates were traditional candidates, individuals who
have higher education experience. And then word is that suddenly
there was a fourth candidate, a non traditional candidate, I
think is the language that they would use, who was
added to this set of three kind of standard issue
(13:06):
candidates that we would expect to see in this kind
of search. And so then the question becomes, well, how
did that happen? And why is that person there? And
what purpose does this person serve? And if we had
three and then we ended up with this extra person,
how do you go from being the extra person to
the whole president? Right? Make that make sense? And so
I want to like Okay, I work in an academic exstitution.
(13:28):
I know what it means to be looking for a
job while you have a job, and that's kind of tricky.
So to the extent that they want to make the
case that maybe we shouldn't tell a lot about the
presidential Search Committee because we don't want to discourage people
from applying. Maybe, right, But I think there can be
some space between this person submitted an application, or even
here are all the names of people who submitted applications
(13:50):
and nothing at all. Right, Like, I'm not suggesting that
every bit of everything and every conversation necessarily needs to
be open to the public. I understand what confidence confidentiality is,
but I think it's also the case that we can't
go from just knowledge that a search is happening to
here are the finalists. There has to be some way
to do something in between.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
You know, you're saying going from you know where the
confidential process is. Well, I don't know about y'all, you
all on the viewing end, but I am pretty new
to hearing that a public search process, that a public
of a entity like a university can conduct a search
process and require the members of the committee who are
(14:32):
part of the Presidential Search Committee to sign non disclosure agreements.
They NDA's that I guess supposedly are legally binding. We're in.
They can't talk about the process. So the reason why
doctor Grant Canisha mentioned we don't know how this sports
person got there. What we do know, and it's on
the record. They were not one of the three that
(14:54):
were recommended by the search firm. They were not one
of the three shortlisted candidates who the search identified as
qualified to move forward to take the time and attention
of the President's Search Committee to then interview that those individuals.
So the fourth candidate who was added, and again we
don't know what the motivations were, We don't know who
(15:15):
made the motion, how it was seconded, what the debate
consisted of, any of that. They then elevate out of
it as the fourth candidate in the process, and when
it becomes our view of it, the only unqualified candidate,
not by just our assessment. I trust doctor Greenston's assessment
because she is an academician. She understands the academies of
(15:37):
the nuances of within the academy. But this is clearly
unqualified based off the job description that you the board
of Trustees advertised when you were recruiting candidates. So how
do you go from advertising these criteria to a candidate
who doesn't possess the collective of that criteria, to that
candidate then being your recommendation for president. Matt ask you
(16:00):
your reaction. I know you listened like I did to
the presidential search interviews that were made public. When you
heard the candidate Marbat Johnson say, I always knew in
my profession, at some point in my career that I
wanted to go sunset in academia, and so I knew
I was going to round my way back to this,
and so it is all fitting. And I'm thinking, Wow,
(16:23):
if I knew I was gone, if this was a
thing I wanted to settle up on before I die,
I want to go into academics. I'm thinking I might
do some things to put me on that trajectory. Tell
me if you envisioned yourself Kenisha as a president one day,
what steps might seem just base level basic things you do.
Speaker 3 (16:43):
Well, You might move to Syracuse from Florida and live
in the snow for five years working on a PhD
so that you could be credentialed in the way that
scholars are credentialed.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
You might Syracuse University at or PhD.
Speaker 3 (16:58):
Sorry and Andrew was at the graduation, and so you
might also though, like let's say for some reason she
decided not to get a PhD. I have issues with that,
but I maybe could find a way to get past it.
Maybe if you wanted to be a leader of a
university one day, you would immerse yourself in higher education things,
(17:21):
which she argued a little bit that she did, but
it was like, this is mostly about your work in
K twelve. That work is really important work. There is
no way to discount it. Period. Yes, but K twelve
work is not higher ed work. It's two different things.
And so I think if she wanted to be involved
in higher ed as a leader in higher ed, it
(17:43):
might be useful to just be around, right, like if
you are in Florida and you are from Florida, and
I think she talks about like loving Fami you in particular, Well,
why we don't know you? You know, like I don't
have no pictures of you at the Classic, I haven't
seen you at the Orange Bowl, Like what is happening?
Why don't we know? If you love fam you so much?
(18:04):
Where the pictures are you at Buday, Like, we don't
have any evidence to support these claims that she's making
about being truly interested in higher education or even being
truly interested in fam You.
Speaker 2 (18:14):
It's also possible if you have a full time career
that you could take up in that jump ship. You
could learn the academy from you know, again, you don't
have to be a PhD most institutions to be an
adjunct professor. You can come in. She's a specialist as
a lobbyist. She is very good at lobbying. I've worked
with Marvel before in that capacity around broadband issues, and
(18:34):
I salute her in that work. However, my opposition is
completely and totally rooted not in a friendship, in an
affiliation and what we may have done together as it
relates to various projects of import but whether or not
you meet the expectations that I would have for my
alma mater, the university where I was an SGA president,
(18:56):
where I served on the board of trustees, where my
sister went behind me and graduated and went on to
get our law degree. Like, you got to come very
different for that conversation than you do. If you're asking
me about whether or not I'll write a letter of
recommendation for your appointment to the twenty first century innovation
(19:18):
and technology and gigabytes of Internet access or whatever that is.
Those are those are just those are just different things.
And so I know that we can be alarmists sometimes,
you know, when we get really egged up on our end.
But if you were to draw this to its fullest conclusion,
(19:41):
what would you And I know you're an academician, so
you're not in the field of speculation. But if we
could play for a moment, knowing what you know about
Rond De Santis, governor of Florida, Knowing what you know
about Donald Trump and the policy se is pursued up
to this point, Knowing what you know about Rick Scott,
the former governor of the state of Florida now US Senator.
(20:02):
All three Republicans, all three have engaged with this candidate
Marca Johnson, and have in the case of Rick Scott
in both Rondo scientists made appointments of her to various
boys and commissions. Knowing that if we were to put
it out there, they type, you know, she's their type girl.
What could you imagine might be in the making or
(20:27):
fam you with that kind of background and what and
what we know about what their supports looked like for
our institution. And I'm hearing doctor Grant that a Tony
Monica is in the waiting rooms. I want you to production
to go ahead and bring Monica out so she can
join us as as Kennicius substances the question.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
Yeah, so you're right that I am a scholar and
not a strategist. But at the same time, the work
that I study is about how politics changes over long
swats of time fifty years in most instances, And so
when I think about this, I think that we can't
think about it as what's happening today, but we have
to think about ourselves as being located in a long
strategy and feel how you want to feel about the
(21:12):
Republicans but they're masterful strategists, and feel how you want
to feel about Marvel. But at this point it's not
about her anymore. This is about understanding the bigger thing
that's happening here. So to answer your question directly, what
I think is happening is their attempt to fundamentally reshape
the society as a whole and black people in it.
(21:33):
So we go back. I want to remind people paying
attention or the viewers here that some of this might
seem disconnected. But I would say starts with the attack
on critical race theory.
Speaker 4 (21:43):
Right.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
Critical race theory is actually an idea that comes out
of Harvard Law. That is like a thing that you
only deal with in law school. But you know those
words because they made you know those words, and you
know those words because they use them as code language
to get people to stop thinking about what's happening in history.
I'm thinking about what's happening in history when it starts
to repeat it. So we're not gonna know that this
(22:03):
has already happened because we haven't read the history. So
put that in your mind, and then next to it,
I want you to have this idea that fam You
is a place where a person like me, single parent, household,
first generation goes on to get the highest level of
education possible. Right, Like, there is no indicator when I
walk onto the campus of fam You for the first
(22:24):
time that my life will ever be what it is today.
Fam You is a life changer.
Speaker 4 (22:28):
Right.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
Family is a place where you can go and be
a new person. Does this set of people who are
seeking to change society. Seek to have me replicated over
and over again. Andrew Gillen replicated over and over again. No,
they don't want that, right, So I want you to
not know your history. I want it to be the
case that you don't have the ability to change your life.
(22:49):
I'm always yelling at you to pull yourself up by
your bootstraps, but God forbid, I actually give you some bootstraps, right,
and you not only pull yourself up, but you pull
your family up behind you. I think this is a
bad about dismantling who we are as a people. I
think this is about sending Black people backwards. And I
think this is about undoing institutions that have anything to
(23:10):
do with making us better. And I think Marva is
maybe a happy messenger for that, and maybe not. I
think she might think that she's doing great things, but
I think that she is a symptom of a broader thing.
And we have to be less concerned about her now
that she has gotten well, now that she's at this
point in the process, yeah, and more worried about, Okay,
(23:33):
what's the bigger thing that's happening that we might have been,
we might have missed, or might not have been paying
attention to.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
That's powerful me. Monica Harris Williams. I want to all
the names right. I introduced you before you were you
(23:58):
were with us, so that the audience familiar with you.
I want to just drag you right on into this.
Maka is an attorney also by by training and profession.
And I had just left the question with Kanisha on
what might we derive from people like Rick Scott, Donald Trump,
Ron de Santis appointing this woman, bringing her into the fold,
(24:19):
What what what could we possibly derive from that as
a signal of what their plans may be for the institution.
And I want to now lean, you know, sort of
lean on you around this question of what is the
as you understand it, where we are in the process
her selection by the Board of Trustees, a condition I
(24:42):
covered already. You know this, this very trunk created process
that keeps the public out into their very last minute.
Everybody's calling us, texting you, asking us, how do we
let this happen? And fam you it's a fate of
complete She is the next you know, the thirteenth President,
thirteenth and unlucky number. Even hotels admit the thirteenth floor anyway,
So how do we get here and how do we
(25:02):
let the doors fly open here? Can you please, for
the record straighten where we are in the process. Number one,
Monica that there's some steps remaining. And then two, if
I'm not a rattler, if I'm not a fam you
and maybe I didn't go to college, why is this
important to me?
Speaker 4 (25:21):
Yeah? So, first of all, thank you for the patients
and for inviting me.
Speaker 5 (25:26):
So I think where we are in the process is
the Border Trustees has tentatively approved her to be the
thirteenth president. Now it's contingent upon them negotiating her employment
contract because there's a salary involved in that. There's some
other things that are involved in that too, and so
there's a negotiation of her employment contract that has to happen.
Speaker 4 (25:47):
And then once that's.
Speaker 5 (25:50):
Negotiated between the Border Trustees and her or her attorney. Arguably,
based on the statute, the state of Florida can only
where the university system can only provide tw hundred and
fifty thousand dollars towards her salary. So the remaining amount
of that money has to come from an alternative source. Right,
So the statue from our recollection is pretty vague on
what that alternative source is. Typically it comes from the foundation.
(26:13):
And so once that is approved, and once the contract
is negotiated, it will go to the Board of Governors,
and the Board of Governors will either say yes or no.
Typically they're probably going to say yes, they will interview,
they will interview her. I've not seen a situation where
in this new process where the Board of Governors has
(26:33):
said no to the Board of Trustees or particular universities
selection of a president. I could be wrong, You're probably
more okay, So I would say that that's probably other
than the negotiation of her employment contract. That's the next step, right,
So there are some additional steps that have to go
along before she's permanent.
Speaker 4 (26:53):
So I hear a lot of people saying.
Speaker 5 (26:55):
She's the thirteenth, she's the thirteenth, she's the thirteenth selected tentative.
Speaker 4 (27:00):
New subjected, Yeah, tentatively.
Speaker 5 (27:03):
Because there's a lot of other steps that have to
go along the process.
Speaker 4 (27:06):
And so go ahead.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
Don't go to that second question that I asked you,
because I want you to further on this one. I
want you to further on the Board of Governors does
not typically disagree with the board of trustees from a
university and their recommendation for their president. But in this case,
I want you to just illuminate how active this board
of governors has been up into including the day before
(27:30):
the vote. Something very interesting happening in the process. Can
you bring us a speed on that.
Speaker 5 (27:35):
Yeah, so if you all recall, for those who have
not been really kind of paying attention to the process.
Any board of member of a board of trustees, for
any member of the any university in the state university system,
a trustee must be confirmed by the Senate. There was
a trustee that was there tentatively, Ernie Ellison, who was
there during the selection process, and I think what happened,
(28:01):
from my understanding, is that Trustee Ellison, mister Ellison, questioned
the process, the selection process in terms of how miss
Johnson elevated to the four finalists. There was some questions
about perhaps there was not necessarily impropriety, but there were
some questions and conversations about how it is she got
to be one of the four. And he apparently made
(28:22):
a motion.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
It did not pass, but to hold the process, you
need to stop this process.
Speaker 5 (28:28):
The process correctly. Did they stop it or to you
know undo it. He just said, let's pause it, which
is right to take a look at it, since there's
so many questions and to eliminate any notion of impropriety
or look of impropriety.
Speaker 4 (28:40):
Let's take a look at this process.
Speaker 5 (28:41):
And just pose it for a second, just to answer
the questions that are out there in the public sphere.
People didn't like that he was not confirmed by the Senate.
Speaker 4 (28:50):
So the day.
Speaker 5 (28:51):
Before the vote, the Board of Governors selects a person
to become onto the trustee board.
Speaker 2 (28:59):
He's pulled off the board. He comes off in the
middle of this process.
Speaker 4 (29:03):
Right, correct.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
And then and.
Speaker 5 (29:05):
Then so he's pulled off the board. The Board of
Governors selects another person, appoints another person to be on
the Board of Trustees, who also happened to also be
on the selection committee. Right, He's let's the vote happened
on Friday. He was appointed on Thursday afternoon. There's been
no confirmation from the Senate. Right, so you're appointed on date,
(29:27):
you're pointed on Thursday, you on the board on Friday,
and you have the opportunity to vote. Because there's apparently
a loophole in the statue. And you know, I've been
kind of looking at this to figure out whether or
not his vote was legitimate vote, because you do have
to be confirmed by the Senate. So there, to me,
there's a I'm gonna use shadiness in my opinion and
(29:48):
my estimation. I don't think they would do that with
any other university in the state university a system. To
be frank, I think it's questionable how someone can become
a trustee on day one and vote for the next
president on day two. Would arguably you've not sit on
any of the interviews. I will suggest that you have
not paid attention to any of the things that have
happened throughout the process of the week, and so kind
(30:11):
of like coming in blind and saying, yeah, I'll pick
that person. And so I think people have a right
to question the process from the beginning to the end,
question whether or not there's been some undue inappropriate influence
from other people relative to that particular trustees and other
trustees of the eight that voted for her. So there's
(30:31):
a lot of questions, a lot of red flags yellow
flags for me throughout this whole process, and so people
have a right to be extremely concerned about what's going on.
Speaker 2 (30:43):
So I want to. I appreciate you bringing us to
speed on that. So y'all got it, got a new
board member the day before the board in full is
to select who they want to be the next president
of the university. Now, I just want to pull back
with our remaining few minutes and I'll invite Lolo in
to address any pressing questions. Is we talk very specifically
(31:05):
about FAM you and I'm sure there are people here
who are not family graduates maybe could care less about
their atlas, but they may themselves being to graduate and
therefore are are listening, and they may not be at all,
but are just curious about this conversation. I want you
all each Monica, you'll go first, just to enlighten us
(31:25):
from your perspective, why should anyone around the country care
about what's happening as it relates to this process.
Speaker 5 (31:35):
I think the first for me, if you are a
graduate of an HBCU, particularly a public HBCU, this should
be very concerning for you.
Speaker 4 (31:44):
FAM.
Speaker 5 (31:44):
You is the largest arguably public HBCU in the country,
and so if MAGA, if they're able to manipulate the
process to do what they've done with us, to me,
that would suggest that there are smaller universities that should
be on guard. I mean, you saw what they did
to Harvard, and Harvard's a huge private institution, right. I
think for me, it's kind of the dumbing down of America.
Speaker 4 (32:08):
Right. If your goal is to eliminate.
Speaker 5 (32:11):
The workers, the people that are on the ground, the
people that are undocumented workers, and you're shipping them out.
Speaker 4 (32:16):
Somebody has to do that work, right.
Speaker 5 (32:19):
If someone's going to do that work, the way you
get those people to do the work is you ensure,
in my opinion, that the folks are not college educated
or you're not leaning them towards the college education track.
Speaker 4 (32:30):
Right.
Speaker 5 (32:31):
I'm not going out to pick blueberries for eleven dollars
an hour. I'm just not doing that, right. The folks
that are at HBCUs, who are getting at education are
not going to do that. But if you dumb down America,
you come in, You control what's being taught, what people
are allowed to say, challenging the First Amendment, people's a
right to gather and protest. It looks a lot like fascism.
(32:56):
I know that's a little boogey word that everybody's kind
of throwing out there, but it's starting at the university level.
Speaker 4 (33:02):
It will actually started at the K through twelve level
in Florida.
Speaker 5 (33:05):
I think you know where Florida is, everybody else goes.
And so I think, and I said this before Project
twenty twenty five.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
You saw it.
Speaker 4 (33:14):
People who are in Florida saw it before it went national.
Speaker 5 (33:17):
And so what I would suggest is you need to
kind of keep your eyes open because if they can
do it in Florida, they will absolutely.
Speaker 4 (33:22):
Do it anywhere they want.
Speaker 5 (33:24):
And the goal, in my estimation, is to control what's taught,
to control speech on the university level. Universities or places
where people have the ability to exchange thought, to have
discuss We may not agree on everything, but it's a
place where you can engage in free thought, free thought
and discussion without any punishment. Generally speaking, the goal in
(33:47):
my mind is to limit that or to stop eliminated
or reduce it significantly where you're just kind of creating
these cutting paste folks that kind of go, yeah, go
along with whatever it is you're saying, and just kind
of regurgitating the nonsense and information that's provided to you.
So it's scary. I think that we need to be
(34:08):
on extreme high alert. And I think that Florida is
a chess case for where everything else is going to go.
Speaker 2 (34:16):
I appreciate that.
Speaker 3 (34:17):
Again, I agree with most of what Monica said. I
think she's sitting in nails on the head. There's a
story that we could tell about what's happening to fam you,
in part because it's happening to fam you and that's
what we care about. So yes, but I think there's
a broader story that we could tell about black colleges
in general. But I would tell a story about like
(34:38):
black institutions in general. So we talk about black college,
we talk about black church. If you're listening in You
and the Links and you in D nine and all
of these kinds of things. Like, it is the case
that these places exists because we were in a society
in which we were segregated, and we had to go
off and make our own space and all of this
kind of thing. So we have done that, but as
(34:58):
society of all, we did that and did other things.
But these places that we created that we own have
been safe places for us to think, to organize, to live,
to be. And so what does it mean for folks
to come in and undo this kind of safe space?
I think to the extent that I'm worried about anything.
It's about like where this ends? Today? Has spam you?
(35:21):
Is it the ame church? Tomorrow? Are they going to
start telling adultas that the Deltas can't? I don't know,
march about stuff like where does this end? Would be
the question that I have. And I think to the
point that we are kind of alluding to, but that
I want to be very explicit about. This feels like
an attempt to reshape society. And I would say it
(35:42):
feels like trying to be friendly, but like they have
been very clear that they seek to reshape our society. So,
if we're going to make America great again, which America
are we making it great?
Speaker 4 (35:53):
Like?
Speaker 3 (35:53):
Are we making it great like the America where I
was enslaved?
Speaker 2 (35:56):
Is it great?
Speaker 3 (35:57):
Like the one where I didn't have access to abortion?
Is it great? Like the one where I was even
further disenfranchised than I currently am?
Speaker 4 (36:05):
Like?
Speaker 3 (36:05):
Which one are we trying to get back to? And
so I think that we have to take these things
as a note that they're coming for us. And they
start with the educated negroes, but it don't end there.
It's everybody that.
Speaker 2 (36:17):
They get it that's real, you know, the only other.
So a few quick responses. One, when you talk about
who they came for. First, we know that when first
generation black folks go, they get their degrees. Oftentimes they
turn right back around. They're paying rents and mortgages, intuitions
(36:39):
and mentoring cousins, siblings, and friends on what it means
to change your life. That you and I came up
right next to each other cause you saw the same
stuff I did. You experienced the same stuff that I did.
And guess what, I made a choice to do it
different this day, and this is how it's turning out.
And you can make the same choice. My older four
brothers didn't go to college because they weren't smart, the
(37:01):
avenues weren't there, and they didn't necessarily pursue them. When
I did, what happened the same. My two behind me
did the same damn thing. And one of the board
chair at Florida and the board chair Hopeful, Devron Gibbons
is I've noticed going around basically talking in audiences that
are not us, basically slamming family alumni about what alumni
(37:23):
giving levels are right if you meant that in love
and in charity and in friendship with the institution that's
your vice chair of the board and hoping to be chair.
You wouldn't go to disparate audiences that aren't us and
talk that up. You would find a loving way to
communicate it. So even black folks can be co opted
and take on the majority white man perspective of treating
(37:47):
our institutions in US very paternalistically like they are the deciders.
They know better, and pity, pity, pity, pity, pity you
the reason they come after those who excel in this
society and chop the heads off first, because the effect
that we have on those who we're in close association
with can then also be cut off. Donald Trump has
(38:10):
given no apologies, neither has Rohnda Santis about the insecurity
they have with their children having to compete with us.
You see, they've been sold alive for so long about
being better, set apart, excellent in all ways, with no
competition and no comparable in close distance, and then reality
it me right. Then they meet you, and they meet Lolo,
(38:34):
and they meet Monica, and the story continues, and then
that life starts to be peeled apart because in competition
and the cream rises We're going to rise. Period. That's
why we are the way we are at FMU and
other hbc us because we are taught to believe that
we can do wherever and be wherever our mind and
(38:55):
our effort will take us. Lolo is in here, and
I want you, Lolo, to let us know if there's
some questions with our final five minutes that we've got
together that KG is going to speed through. And I
(39:17):
don't want to shut.
Speaker 6 (39:18):
Up, I do have so Whitney Scott and Allison Smith
asked something there is like a similar question. Whitney says,
I am alone. How can I get involved? I'm ready
to get my boots on the ground to protect the
future of Van You and a lot of people said
the same thing, like what are the next steps?
Speaker 4 (39:37):
What can we do about that?
Speaker 2 (39:38):
That's where we were going to actually wrap what was
gonna be on next steps, But KG, I want you
to go directly to that. We've already let folks know
that while the process is along, that it is not complete,
and that means that there are other things that can
be done. What would you want people to do leaving
this if they want to take action?
Speaker 3 (39:58):
So the first thing I want people to know is
that they're like ratlers thinking about this, and so you
at home, you're thinking about it. You stressed out, me too, girl.
But I'm calling my ratler friends to see what we
can do. And one of the things that I will
ask Whitney in particular to do is go to Keepers
of Flame eighteen eighty seven dot com into your information of.
Speaker 2 (40:16):
The Flame eighteen eighty seven dot com and we'll also
include in the show notes.
Speaker 3 (40:20):
Yes, and so as soon as we have a worked
out destination for you a thing for you to do,
we are going to email you. And when I say
as soon as, I mean like check your email. We
will be in touch soon this week, within the coming day.
Speaker 2 (40:35):
Is it is it? Is it free? Is it too free? Okay? Okay,
in the.
Speaker 3 (40:39):
Coming days, we'll have something to tell you. Certainly they
can do it this week.
Speaker 2 (40:43):
Yes, But if you're going to that website, you can
enlist your name and your email addressing, contact information, and
that's how you'll you'll the informational filter. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (40:53):
And the other thing is that I want to say
that I have been in conversations with people who are
like ready to cut their spite their face. Bam, you
is my house. That's my yard. That's not Marve's yard,
that's not Ron Desant's yard. And if you want to
come from my yard, you're gonna have to come through me.
And so I'm not about to not send money to
take care of my cousins in school because Marva's there.
(41:15):
I'm not about to not go to homecoming because Marva's there.
I'm gonna go to homecoming. And when Marve started talking,
I might, you know, turn around and not, you know,
have something say to Marvor. But I'm gonna go to
my homecoming. She's not gonna run me out of my house,
all right, She's not gonna run me away from my foundation.
And so the other thing that I would say to
Route is who are paying attention? Is you could be
mad at the governor, you'd be mad at Marva, but
(41:37):
don't take that out. That's our house, that's our yard.
We defended at all costs, and they have to do
what we say do, not the other way around.
Speaker 2 (41:43):
That's real, Monica, You're back in this. I want we
were just sharing what could people do? And I think
KGI wrap that well. So I want you to take
this next question, lo Low, if there is one more
that we may have time to hit before.
Speaker 6 (41:59):
So the last question. We had a few more, but
I think you all did a really great job of
answering them. The last question would be why does this
even matter? And I've seen a lot of people in
the comments, people are talking about them being nervous about
this happening that their HBCU Tennessee state in general, I
mean in particular. So if you all wanted to answer
(42:21):
or talk to that question.
Speaker 2 (42:23):
Yeah, Monica, you want to hit that the threat that
appears to be. Well, there was the question which is
why does it matter? Which I think you all kind
of hit on a little bit two questions back. But
if you're at an HBC and you're worried about this
coming down your street, what do you say? I mean,
(42:45):
I think you just have to stay vigilant.
Speaker 4 (42:46):
I think Kenisian mentioned it.
Speaker 5 (42:48):
One of the things I really tell alumni is HBCUs,
particularly public HBCUs, we cannot just solely rely on state dollars.
We've got it as alumni, give back and give back consistently, right,
That's the first thing. Secondly, you just have to kind
of stay involved and engaged. You can't just be engaged
once a year during homecoming. You have to stay engaged
(43:10):
and stay vigilant consistently throughout the year. The third thing
I will say is a lot of this has to
do with and people hate to go back to this,
people got to vote. Some of this has a lot
to do with the fact of who's in office. Like
in Florida, the person, the person that makes these decisions
and placing these people on the board of trustees is
the governor.
Speaker 4 (43:29):
The board of government, the board of governors.
Speaker 5 (43:30):
The governor puts those people in positions, puts those people
in those positions. The folks on the board of trustees,
the governor appoints those individuals.
Speaker 4 (43:39):
So a lot of this kind of goes down.
Speaker 5 (43:41):
I know people hate to say that, but you got
to stay engaged in your alumni you have and your
alumni association, stay engaged, and you with your school and
give back consistently, increase those give rates.
Speaker 3 (43:53):
And then you got people have to vote.
Speaker 5 (43:55):
I mean, bottom line, And I know people hate when
you say that, but that really is what this is.
But but for but for with the governor that we have,
things could look a lot different.
Speaker 3 (44:07):
I just leave that there.
Speaker 2 (44:08):
That's real. That's real. I wouldn't be moderating this panel
had it looked quite different. And I'm joking, but I
will say this there might well quite serious. I will,
I would, I would. I would only add to what
Monica said that in this day and age, the reason
why you have to care about what is happening at
(44:31):
FAM you is because they chose the largest single campus,
HBCU to try to infiltrate from MAGA first. And it's
their belief. And by the way, if you watch Trump
at all, if you watched the sentence at all, it
was the first thing this net is did. He punched
Walt Disney World. Trump gets in office, he punches all
of us, right, Ain't nobody left safe? And the reason
(44:53):
they do that is if you take out the biggest,
baddest thing you see on the block, no disrespect to
anybody else, then everything else falls falls like the house
of cards. And so know that this is them perfecting
the strategy of what it means to not just get
(45:15):
into Harvard, into Columbia and destruct those institutions because the
kids can't get it. But it is to come now
for black folk who you already think nothing of, You
already say we don't earn what it is that we've got.
You already think that we're not worth the time that
is spent or the resources that are allocated. So now
(45:40):
let's just figure out how we start to you know,
take those away too. Look, y'all, over the course of
history we have to learn from it. Cinicians already alluded
to this. We had slavery, we had emancipation. After emancipation,
we had reconstruction. Right, things started to look better, at
least they said they were going to be better. And
then what did they do? They caught it back and
we had Jim Crow. And then we have, you know,
(46:02):
the answer to Jim Crow, where we then get equality
laws and amendments of the constitution that make us more
full and more hole in the eyes of the law.
And guess what, y'all, We then go on to elect
a black president and then a woman nominee, a black
woman to come to have the audacity to pursue the
position as well. And now this society, based off its
(46:23):
majority's actions, are in full cell panic. And we're going
back to the take back. You make a game and
you get a clawback, and this clawback now is coming
up all of our avenues, all of our avenues, Kanisha.
As we round out right now, I want you to please, please, please,
because this is a large part about organizing, is when
(46:45):
you get a setback as big as the one that
was delivered to those who care about fam you and
his future with the Board of Trustees deciding as it
did to elevate Marva to the Board of Governors as
its next president. That's a big, big setback. But contextualize
a setback when we're thinking about a war, right, so
(47:07):
a battle of a president or of any battle that
you're in, and contextualize that in the scope of a war.
Speaker 3 (47:15):
Yeah, So I will say I think two things, one
on fame you and then maybe one more broadly. The
first is that the rallies, as we say, will strike
and strike and strike again, and so it's three strikes,
it's not one strike. And so you have to remember always.
So first of all, we have feelings, right, and so
feel your feelings right, you're mad, you jumping up and
(47:36):
like you want to punch the all whatever. You are
allowed to have your feelings. But after you let your
feelings pass through, then it's time for work. And so
we did suffer a major setback. But This is a
battle in a larger war for our university, for the
soul of Famu, and for I would say, the whole society.
Education is a piece of a bigger thing. And so
(47:58):
once you get your emotions out, I think you have
to take a step back and realize, Okay, this is
a small piece of a bigger thing. Let me attack
the bigger thing. How do you eat an elephant? An elephant,
You eat it bite by bite, right like. You can't
get overwhelmed. You can't drop out because something went badly
or went wrongly. You have to keep at it. One
of the things that I tell my students at Howard,
(48:19):
and one of the things I say often is I'm
reminded about Melissa Harris Perry, who was talking one day
about the movement, and she talks about how it was
the case that individuals lived and died enslaved, lived and
died as enslaved people, and every day they woke up
and fought, never knowing when freedom was going to come.
(48:42):
You have to carry your water, you have to carry
your ball down the field. Maybe freedom will come for
you while you are alive. The people who got emancipated
didn't know emancipation was coming. They didn't have Twitter, they
weren't on TikTok, they didn't have a way to know
that it was about to happen. But they got up
and fought anyway. Some of them got up, fought, lived
and died with nothing. And so happened that some of
(49:03):
them got up, fought, lived and saw the other side.
And so if my ancestors, you know, we're in the
fields of Georgia, slaving away right in Chris County, who
am I today to say that I'm too tired to
fight for the institution that has changed the life of
this same family from Chris County, Georgia. I can't do that,
(49:25):
and I would suggest that you can't either. And so
today we're talking about FAMU, but we could be talking
about what's in the library at your local elementary school.
We could be talking about heads start funding for your
baby and her daycare. We could be talking about any
number of educational things that are not just about college,
but that are about making life better for people. And
if we got to fight to make sure that these
(49:47):
babies are okay, I think that's a worthy fight that
we can deal with. It ain't enslavement and if they
can do it in this slavement, surely we could do it.
Here's for mmm.
Speaker 2 (49:54):
Girl, that's a word you just preached, You preached, and
you were closing on that, yall. I want to welcome
everybody home who decided to tune in. Know that we're
going to stay on this not only because it's failed,
but we will continue to project out so that all
of us get to see ourselves in this picture. If
you don't see it clearly, we want to make it
clear for you, for those HBCUs that are afraid of
(50:16):
what's coming down the tracks.
Speaker 4 (50:18):
For you.
Speaker 2 (50:19):
We got to get in communication and coordination and in
contact with each other because the battle. Know this, if
we do what we're supposed to do and hold our
ground and keep fighting until there's no longer breath in
our bodies. But so long as we have it, we
will fight. Let me tell you, they'll think twice about
the next time that they want to come after us. Right,
(50:39):
So the lesson is going to be the shot of
the bout has come from them. And now we got
to sink the ship. And when we sink the ship,
that means that ship ain't coming for you at least
no time soon so y'all help us sink this ship
right now, because whether you know it or not, we
all in the boat together. Man, We are all in
this together. Lolo, thank you very much facilitating the question,
(51:00):
kg dtr Grant, Kenesha, all the names, all the things,
all the fields. I love you like my little sister,
because you are and I am so proud of you
and the knowledge you dropped today extremely extremely important and powerful.
Y'all are going to hear from her again because we're
bringing her back to talk about her book on Natal
Damn Pod. Thank y'all, welcome home. This has been an
(51:22):
episode of.
Speaker 3 (51:23):
Our mini pod on organizing, Stay connect and don't forget
to meet us here into the next Monday or the monday, not.
Speaker 2 (51:31):
This upcoming but the one after every other. All right, y'all,
take care of peace.
Speaker 1 (51:49):
Native Land Pod is a production of iHeartRadio and partnership
with Reason Choice Media. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit
iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or where ever you listen to
your favorite shows.
Native Land Pod is a production of iHeartRadio in partnership
with Reasoned Choice Media.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome was that was that
was of good afternoon, everyone, everyone's, everyone's. I should say
thank y'all for joining us for our solo pod. For
those of you all who have been rocking with us
on this for a couple of for a couple of
weeks or months, I should say, you know that we've
(00:28):
been trying to organize this, these particular lives to be
around well. The process of organizing, how do we movement build?
How do we how do we bring together people with
share belief systems who are either excited or agitated by
the same thing, get us on common accord and uh
(00:49):
define a clear objective and go after it. And over
the last couple of weeks, I've been personally involved as
an alumni of Florida and Universe City and as a
former member of the university's board of trustees, involved in
the pushback effort at Florida and M University, which of
(01:11):
course is the largest single campus HBCU in the country.
I would argue probably responsible for the production of more
of Florida's black middle class than any other singular institution.
But together with our other HBCU partners, the others being
private throughout the state, and obviously brothers and sisters at
(01:33):
PWIS as well, you know, I've come together to really
have significant impact. And of late the university has been
in an effort to find a new president. Not an
uncommon thing. However, what does strike uncommon in this situation
has been the really heavy hand of the far right
(01:54):
in this state, and frankly, i'd argue, maybe suggest in
this country to really want to take over the helm
of Florida m University at every level, wholesale university president,
chair of the university's board of trustees. You know, we've
already heard them speak out loud about their efforts to
purify these campuses, to get rid of certain books, to
(02:16):
extinguish a way, a certain curriculum, And honestly, I fear
that in this situation, everything they have already told us
out loud, everything that they think about us from DEI,
which they are the masters of right, didn't earn it
(02:37):
all the way down to what we've seen happen to
our museums, our books. The Librarian of Congress, who was
accused by the White House Press secretary of putting improper
books at the at the Congressional Library, which by the way,
collects two copies of every single book that has ever
(02:57):
been copywritten in this country. That's as job. But leasing
books out to young students that are inappropriate just a
quick correction, a matter of secretary. The Library of Congress
does not have an interface with the public subs that
they can books. They can't check them out, can't get
a card and go and take books off the shelf,
(03:17):
take them home and read them. Okay, you have the
local public library. That's not what the Library of Congress's
job is. Let's look that up, especially when you're speaking
from the perch of the presidential podium. That being said, y'all,
I digress. This is a real serious matter, a serious topic.
And whether you are a alumnus of an HBCU and
alumnus of FAM, a supporter of those institutions or support
(03:38):
specifically at Florida a m university, if you care about HBCUs,
if you care about the future of the contributions that
black folks make in this country writ large period, then
you've got to be paying attention to what's happening when
they go after again the largest single campus HBCU in
the country in the top one hundred rated by Princeton
(04:04):
Review Time magazine. All of the evaluators who put us
in good company with some of our private HBCU partners,
really at the top of the heap, and our recruitment
and retention, graduation and then placement of black people from
all parts of the world in this country. That process
at Florida am University has consumed a lot of us
(04:27):
because we don't just see it as a candidate that
has not qualified for the position. We see a candidate
and not qualified for the position. Yes, that was forged
into a list of finalists of which she was not
an initial part of. But we also see the play
behind the play, and even if the candidate that they
(04:48):
selected is not complicit with it. You've heard of the
term useful idiots and those of folks who may pursue
a mission and may not be aware of the mission
behind the mission. I don't know what it's true about that.
I don't know what's false about it either, but I
do know what I hear from Trump. I do know
what I hear, and I've seen from DeSantis. I know
(05:09):
that their leadership style is that of a totalitarian leader,
a dictator of some sort, a strong man, and that
they both frankly have the same Achilli's heel, which is,
while they project an image of strength, all powerful, all knowing,
all seeing, I know very specifically into Santis case, he
(05:30):
really is a four year old throwing a temper cancer
when he doesn't have his way. There's some thing strong
about that. There's nothing strong about strong arming people, using
the weight and power of the government and taxpayers resources
to beat people into complicity. See that they do what
you want them to do well. I've invited a few friends, experts,
(05:51):
folks who have a relationship with Florida University but are
expert in other places as well. One of my yes,
maybe having a few technical problems, so we may bring
her in a little bit later. I hope Monica is
able to join us, but right now I want to
invite on doctor Kanisha Grant, tenured professor at the Howard University,
(06:17):
a graduate of Florida a M University, a former student
government vice president at the Campus of fam you Uh,
and a dear, dear, dear personal friend. Doctor Grant welcome.
Hopefully we can bring a guest you go, guess you go.
Hey there, Doc, welcome.
Speaker 3 (06:34):
Hey, hey, thank you for having me. I'm so happy
to be with you.
Speaker 2 (06:37):
I appreciate that you see. Normally, my good friend doctor Grant,
as you know, she does the Christian Amanpour and she's
Al Jazeera and she's doing all the international things. But
like all good rattlers, when we hear a call, we
show up. Uh, and we show up ready for it
to go down.
Speaker 4 (06:58):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
And Kanisha, I'm so sorry, doctor Grant. I just want
to I want to one thank you for making time
to congratulate you. She is one of the youngest tenured
professors at Howard University and is again continue to give
back to the College of Love and Charity. But Knisian,
(07:19):
you know this well. Fam You told us to fight
and win whatever the battle be. That is in ol
al Mamria, which we both know well. So the battle
is upon us. Tell me, in your own words, what
about this presidential search process and where we are in it,
which you can bring people up to speed on which
(07:40):
I've not done yet. That gives you the greatest degree
of concern heartburn, not for yourself, per se but for
the future of the institution.
Speaker 3 (07:50):
There are so many answers to that question. So first
let me say thanks for being out and happy to
be here, Thank you for inviting me. I can be
Kindichians today. I don't have to be doctor Grant. I
mean the world is about slip up. No, I mean
like called Mekindicia. But in terms of what is I
think wrong, I come to this as a scholar. I
come to this as a person with a PhD.
Speaker 4 (08:12):
Right.
Speaker 3 (08:12):
I come to this as a person who is considered
being in university leadership. And so the thing that strikes
me first as a function of my lived experience, is
that an individual who's wholly unqualified to be an academic,
to be leading an academic institution, to be leading academicians,
would think that they could just show up and do
(08:36):
the job. That an academic institution is no different than
any other institution. I think it's the thing that I
find most defensive. I show up at Howard University every day,
and I show up to fight for fam you today
with the understanding that academic institutions are not corporations. They
are different, They are set apart. They are places where
we create new knowledge there are places where we shape
the minds of young people. There are places where you
(08:58):
have space to think, where we are supposed to be
trying to make the world a better place. They are
not corporations. My students are not my customers. And so
the idea that this person would show up with a
clear without a clear understanding of what academia is, what
we're doing, what we're about, what we value, what we
care for, I find problematic as a scholar, but then
(09:19):
as a rattler, as a person who bleeds orange and green,
who believes that like who I am is powerfully and
positively shaped by Famiu's role in my life, I am
pissed off that this person would show up with a
lack of understanding about our culture, about what family means
to us personally, about what it means to the state,
(09:40):
about what it means for upward mobility for people in
the state of Florida. But the people on this stream
right now, you and I are first generation college graduates,
right and in your particular case, the people who come
behind you end up getting baccalaureate degrees because that's what
college does. The people who come after you generally do
better as a result of your having participated. And so
(10:02):
I think the things that frustrate me are the deep
lack of qualifications, the deep lack of understanding, not to
mention the issues around process. How did this person get
to be in the pool of finalists is a question
that I have as a person who knows how search
committees work. Why is it the case that Florida is
(10:23):
a place where government is supposed to be in the
sunshine and Florida and them, it's supposed to be a
public institution, Yet they have these presidential searches set up
in a way where you can't know anything about what's
happening until it's almost finished.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (10:36):
So these kind of inconsistencies are the things that are
under my skin, in addition to the fundamental misunderstanding of
what we are doing at a place like Famue.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Yeah, Canisia. You mentioned something I think we should deepen
into because a lot I've seen a lot of folks
say or call and text and ask how did this
happen at fam You like, what is going y'all sleep
at the wheel? What's going on? And I try to
explain to them what you just alluded to, which was
in the quest to really control all instruments of the state.
(11:05):
The government has gone against the will of the people,
which said we want sunshine, We want to know every
if we elect you in or if you serve the
public in a public position, a public facing position paid
for by my tax dollars here in this government, what
you do in that position, the negotiations you have, who
(11:26):
you communicate with, how you communicate with them. That all
becomes available for the public to scrutinize, to make sure
that everything is on the up and up, to reduce
corruption and the kind of grip that you see happening
when people don't get to see what's happening behind the process.
It used to be when a presidential search process opened
in the state of Florida, everybody knew it. You saw
(11:47):
candidate applications as they were rolling in quite literally. And
since the days of Rohnda Scientis and the few years
of Rick Scott as governor, we've seen a shutting down
of that process. They have decided to close the process
from the public until the committee that has been assigned
(12:09):
to vet the candidates come out with their set of recommendations.
And what a number of universities have done in this
state is they've gone through that secretive process and then
the committee produces one name, one name that they would
recommend for consideration out of god knows how many applicants,
and the public has no clue what happened behind those
(12:29):
closed doors and how we got there. In our case,
typically the process has been to produce three names from
that process. In this case, family produced how many names
from their search committee?
Speaker 3 (12:40):
It was four? And originals about how we got to
those four?
Speaker 4 (12:44):
Right?
Speaker 3 (12:44):
So originally the idea that that was that there were
three candidates, that these candidates were traditional candidates, individuals who
have higher education experience. And then word is that suddenly
there was a fourth candidate, a non traditional candidate, I
think is the language that they would use, who was
added to this set of three kind of standard issue
(13:06):
candidates that we would expect to see in this kind
of search. And so then the question becomes, well, how
did that happen? And why is that person there? And
what purpose does this person serve? And if we had
three and then we ended up with this extra person,
how do you go from being the extra person to
the whole president? Right? Make that make sense? And so
I want to like Okay, I work in an academic exstitution.
(13:28):
I know what it means to be looking for a
job while you have a job, and that's kind of tricky.
So to the extent that they want to make the
case that maybe we shouldn't tell a lot about the
presidential Search Committee because we don't want to discourage people
from applying. Maybe, right, But I think there can be
some space between this person submitted an application, or even
here are all the names of people who submitted applications
(13:50):
and nothing at all. Right, Like, I'm not suggesting that
every bit of everything and every conversation necessarily needs to
be open to the public. I understand what confidence confidentiality is,
but I think it's also the case that we can't
go from just knowledge that a search is happening to
here are the finalists. There has to be some way
to do something in between.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
You know, you're saying going from you know where the
confidential process is. Well, I don't know about y'all, you
all on the viewing end, but I am pretty new
to hearing that a public search process, that a public
of a entity like a university can conduct a search
process and require the members of the committee who are
(14:32):
part of the Presidential Search Committee to sign non disclosure agreements.
They NDA's that I guess supposedly are legally binding. We're in.
They can't talk about the process. So the reason why
doctor Grant Canisha mentioned we don't know how this sports
person got there. What we do know, and it's on
the record. They were not one of the three that
(14:54):
were recommended by the search firm. They were not one
of the three shortlisted candidates who the search identified as
qualified to move forward to take the time and attention
of the President's Search Committee to then interview that those individuals.
So the fourth candidate who was added, and again we
don't know what the motivations were, We don't know who
(15:15):
made the motion, how it was seconded, what the debate
consisted of, any of that. They then elevate out of
it as the fourth candidate in the process, and when
it becomes our view of it, the only unqualified candidate,
not by just our assessment. I trust doctor Greenston's assessment
because she is an academician. She understands the academies of
(15:37):
the nuances of within the academy. But this is clearly
unqualified based off the job description that you the board
of Trustees advertised when you were recruiting candidates. So how
do you go from advertising these criteria to a candidate
who doesn't possess the collective of that criteria, to that
candidate then being your recommendation for president. Matt ask you
(16:00):
your reaction. I know you listened like I did to
the presidential search interviews that were made public. When you
heard the candidate Marbat Johnson say, I always knew in
my profession, at some point in my career that I
wanted to go sunset in academia, and so I knew
I was going to round my way back to this,
and so it is all fitting. And I'm thinking, Wow,
(16:23):
if I knew I was gone, if this was a
thing I wanted to settle up on before I die,
I want to go into academics. I'm thinking I might
do some things to put me on that trajectory. Tell
me if you envisioned yourself Kenisha as a president one day,
what steps might seem just base level basic things you do.
Speaker 3 (16:43):
Well, You might move to Syracuse from Florida and live
in the snow for five years working on a PhD
so that you could be credentialed in the way that
scholars are credentialed.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
You might Syracuse University at or PhD.
Speaker 3 (16:58):
Sorry and Andrew was at the graduation, and so you
might also though, like let's say for some reason she
decided not to get a PhD. I have issues with that,
but I maybe could find a way to get past it.
Maybe if you wanted to be a leader of a
university one day, you would immerse yourself in higher education things,
(17:21):
which she argued a little bit that she did, but
it was like, this is mostly about your work in
K twelve. That work is really important work. There is
no way to discount it. Period. Yes, but K twelve
work is not higher ed work. It's two different things.
And so I think if she wanted to be involved
in higher ed as a leader in higher ed, it
(17:43):
might be useful to just be around, right, like if
you are in Florida and you are from Florida, and
I think she talks about like loving Fami you in particular, Well,
why we don't know you? You know, like I don't
have no pictures of you at the Classic, I haven't
seen you at the Orange Bowl, Like what is happening?
Why don't we know? If you love fam you so much?
(18:04):
Where the pictures are you at Buday, Like, we don't
have any evidence to support these claims that she's making
about being truly interested in higher education or even being
truly interested in fam You.
Speaker 2 (18:14):
It's also possible if you have a full time career
that you could take up in that jump ship. You
could learn the academy from you know, again, you don't
have to be a PhD most institutions to be an
adjunct professor. You can come in. She's a specialist as
a lobbyist. She is very good at lobbying. I've worked
with Marvel before in that capacity around broadband issues, and
(18:34):
I salute her in that work. However, my opposition is
completely and totally rooted not in a friendship, in an
affiliation and what we may have done together as it
relates to various projects of import but whether or not
you meet the expectations that I would have for my
alma mater, the university where I was an SGA president,
(18:56):
where I served on the board of trustees, where my
sister went behind me and graduated and went on to
get our law degree. Like, you got to come very
different for that conversation than you do. If you're asking
me about whether or not I'll write a letter of
recommendation for your appointment to the twenty first century innovation
(19:18):
and technology and gigabytes of Internet access or whatever that is.
Those are those are just those are just different things.
And so I know that we can be alarmists sometimes,
you know, when we get really egged up on our end.
But if you were to draw this to its fullest conclusion,
(19:41):
what would you And I know you're an academician, so
you're not in the field of speculation. But if we
could play for a moment, knowing what you know about
Rond De Santis, governor of Florida, Knowing what you know
about Donald Trump and the policy se is pursued up
to this point, Knowing what you know about Rick Scott,
the former governor of the state of Florida now US Senator.
(20:02):
All three Republicans, all three have engaged with this candidate
Marca Johnson, and have in the case of Rick Scott
in both Rondo scientists made appointments of her to various
boys and commissions. Knowing that if we were to put
it out there, they type, you know, she's their type girl.
What could you imagine might be in the making or
(20:27):
fam you with that kind of background and what and
what we know about what their supports looked like for
our institution. And I'm hearing doctor Grant that a Tony
Monica is in the waiting rooms. I want you to production
to go ahead and bring Monica out so she can
join us as as Kennicius substances the question.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
Yeah, so you're right that I am a scholar and
not a strategist. But at the same time, the work
that I study is about how politics changes over long
swats of time fifty years in most instances, And so
when I think about this, I think that we can't
think about it as what's happening today, but we have
to think about ourselves as being located in a long
strategy and feel how you want to feel about the
(21:12):
Republicans but they're masterful strategists, and feel how you want
to feel about Marvel. But at this point it's not
about her anymore. This is about understanding the bigger thing
that's happening here. So to answer your question directly, what
I think is happening is their attempt to fundamentally reshape
the society as a whole and black people in it.
(21:33):
So we go back. I want to remind people paying
attention or the viewers here that some of this might
seem disconnected. But I would say starts with the attack
on critical race theory.
Speaker 4 (21:43):
Right.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
Critical race theory is actually an idea that comes out
of Harvard Law. That is like a thing that you
only deal with in law school. But you know those
words because they made you know those words, and you
know those words because they use them as code language
to get people to stop thinking about what's happening in history.
I'm thinking about what's happening in history when it starts
to repeat it. So we're not gonna know that this
(22:03):
has already happened because we haven't read the history. So
put that in your mind, and then next to it,
I want you to have this idea that fam You
is a place where a person like me, single parent, household,
first generation goes on to get the highest level of
education possible. Right, Like, there is no indicator when I
walk onto the campus of fam You for the first
(22:24):
time that my life will ever be what it is today.
Fam You is a life changer.
Speaker 4 (22:28):
Right.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
Family is a place where you can go and be
a new person. Does this set of people who are
seeking to change society. Seek to have me replicated over
and over again. Andrew Gillen replicated over and over again. No,
they don't want that, right, So I want you to
not know your history. I want it to be the
case that you don't have the ability to change your life.
(22:49):
I'm always yelling at you to pull yourself up by
your bootstraps, but God forbid, I actually give you some bootstraps, right,
and you not only pull yourself up, but you pull
your family up behind you. I think this is a
bad about dismantling who we are as a people. I
think this is about sending Black people backwards. And I
think this is about undoing institutions that have anything to
(23:10):
do with making us better. And I think Marva is
maybe a happy messenger for that, and maybe not. I
think she might think that she's doing great things, but
I think that she is a symptom of a broader thing.
And we have to be less concerned about her now
that she has gotten well, now that she's at this
point in the process, yeah, and more worried about, Okay,
(23:33):
what's the bigger thing that's happening that we might have been,
we might have missed, or might not have been paying
attention to.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
That's powerful me. Monica Harris Williams. I want to all
the names right. I introduced you before you were you
(23:58):
were with us, so that the audience familiar with you.
I want to just drag you right on into this.
Maka is an attorney also by by training and profession.
And I had just left the question with Kanisha on
what might we derive from people like Rick Scott, Donald Trump,
Ron de Santis appointing this woman, bringing her into the fold,
(24:19):
What what what could we possibly derive from that as
a signal of what their plans may be for the institution.
And I want to now lean, you know, sort of
lean on you around this question of what is the
as you understand it, where we are in the process
her selection by the Board of Trustees, a condition I
(24:42):
covered already. You know this, this very trunk created process
that keeps the public out into their very last minute.
Everybody's calling us, texting you, asking us, how do we
let this happen? And fam you it's a fate of
complete She is the next you know, the thirteenth President,
thirteenth and unlucky number. Even hotels admit the thirteenth floor anyway,
So how do we get here and how do we
(25:02):
let the doors fly open here? Can you please, for
the record straighten where we are in the process. Number one,
Monica that there's some steps remaining. And then two, if
I'm not a rattler, if I'm not a fam you
and maybe I didn't go to college, why is this
important to me?
Speaker 4 (25:21):
Yeah? So, first of all, thank you for the patients
and for inviting me.
Speaker 5 (25:26):
So I think where we are in the process is
the Border Trustees has tentatively approved her to be the
thirteenth president. Now it's contingent upon them negotiating her employment
contract because there's a salary involved in that. There's some
other things that are involved in that too, and so
there's a negotiation of her employment contract that has to happen.
Speaker 4 (25:47):
And then once that's.
Speaker 5 (25:50):
Negotiated between the Border Trustees and her or her attorney. Arguably,
based on the statute, the state of Florida can only
where the university system can only provide tw hundred and
fifty thousand dollars towards her salary. So the remaining amount
of that money has to come from an alternative source. Right,
So the statue from our recollection is pretty vague on
what that alternative source is. Typically it comes from the foundation.
(26:13):
And so once that is approved, and once the contract
is negotiated, it will go to the Board of Governors,
and the Board of Governors will either say yes or no.
Typically they're probably going to say yes, they will interview,
they will interview her. I've not seen a situation where
in this new process where the Board of Governors has
(26:33):
said no to the Board of Trustees or particular universities
selection of a president. I could be wrong, You're probably
more okay, So I would say that that's probably other
than the negotiation of her employment contract. That's the next step, right,
So there are some additional steps that have to go
along before she's permanent.
Speaker 4 (26:53):
So I hear a lot of people saying.
Speaker 5 (26:55):
She's the thirteenth, she's the thirteenth, she's the thirteenth selected tentative.
Speaker 4 (27:00):
New subjected, Yeah, tentatively.
Speaker 5 (27:03):
Because there's a lot of other steps that have to
go along the process.
Speaker 4 (27:06):
And so go ahead.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
Don't go to that second question that I asked you,
because I want you to further on this one. I
want you to further on the Board of Governors does
not typically disagree with the board of trustees from a
university and their recommendation for their president. But in this case,
I want you to just illuminate how active this board
of governors has been up into including the day before
(27:30):
the vote. Something very interesting happening in the process. Can
you bring us a speed on that.
Speaker 5 (27:35):
Yeah, so if you all recall, for those who have
not been really kind of paying attention to the process.
Any board of member of a board of trustees, for
any member of the any university in the state university system,
a trustee must be confirmed by the Senate. There was
a trustee that was there tentatively, Ernie Ellison, who was
there during the selection process, and I think what happened,
(28:01):
from my understanding, is that Trustee Ellison, mister Ellison, questioned
the process, the selection process in terms of how miss
Johnson elevated to the four finalists. There was some questions
about perhaps there was not necessarily impropriety, but there were
some questions and conversations about how it is she got
to be one of the four. And he apparently made
(28:22):
a motion.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
It did not pass, but to hold the process, you
need to stop this process.
Speaker 5 (28:28):
The process correctly. Did they stop it or to you
know undo it. He just said, let's pause it, which
is right to take a look at it, since there's
so many questions and to eliminate any notion of impropriety
or look of impropriety.
Speaker 4 (28:40):
Let's take a look at this process.
Speaker 5 (28:41):
And just pose it for a second, just to answer
the questions that are out there in the public sphere.
People didn't like that he was not confirmed by the Senate.
Speaker 4 (28:50):
So the day.
Speaker 5 (28:51):
Before the vote, the Board of Governors selects a person
to become onto the trustee board.
Speaker 2 (28:59):
He's pulled off the board. He comes off in the
middle of this process.
Speaker 4 (29:03):
Right, correct.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
And then and.
Speaker 5 (29:05):
Then so he's pulled off the board. The Board of
Governors selects another person, appoints another person to be on
the Board of Trustees, who also happened to also be
on the selection committee. Right, He's let's the vote happened
on Friday. He was appointed on Thursday afternoon. There's been
no confirmation from the Senate. Right, so you're appointed on date,
(29:27):
you're pointed on Thursday, you on the board on Friday,
and you have the opportunity to vote. Because there's apparently
a loophole in the statue. And you know, I've been
kind of looking at this to figure out whether or
not his vote was legitimate vote, because you do have
to be confirmed by the Senate. So there, to me,
there's a I'm gonna use shadiness in my opinion and
(29:48):
my estimation. I don't think they would do that with
any other university in the state university a system. To
be frank, I think it's questionable how someone can become
a trustee on day one and vote for the next
president on day two. Would arguably you've not sit on
any of the interviews. I will suggest that you have
not paid attention to any of the things that have
happened throughout the process of the week, and so kind
(30:11):
of like coming in blind and saying, yeah, I'll pick
that person. And so I think people have a right
to question the process from the beginning to the end,
question whether or not there's been some undue inappropriate influence
from other people relative to that particular trustees and other
trustees of the eight that voted for her. So there's
(30:31):
a lot of questions, a lot of red flags yellow
flags for me throughout this whole process, and so people
have a right to be extremely concerned about what's going on.
Speaker 2 (30:43):
So I want to. I appreciate you bringing us to
speed on that. So y'all got it, got a new
board member the day before the board in full is
to select who they want to be the next president
of the university. Now, I just want to pull back
with our remaining few minutes and I'll invite Lolo in
to address any pressing questions. Is we talk very specifically
(31:05):
about FAM you and I'm sure there are people here
who are not family graduates maybe could care less about
their atlas, but they may themselves being to graduate and
therefore are are listening, and they may not be at all,
but are just curious about this conversation. I want you
all each Monica, you'll go first, just to enlighten us
(31:25):
from your perspective, why should anyone around the country care
about what's happening as it relates to this process.
Speaker 5 (31:35):
I think the first for me, if you are a
graduate of an HBCU, particularly a public HBCU, this should
be very concerning for you.
Speaker 4 (31:44):
FAM.
Speaker 5 (31:44):
You is the largest arguably public HBCU in the country,
and so if MAGA, if they're able to manipulate the
process to do what they've done with us, to me,
that would suggest that there are smaller universities that should
be on guard. I mean, you saw what they did
to Harvard, and Harvard's a huge private institution, right. I
think for me, it's kind of the dumbing down of America.
Speaker 4 (32:08):
Right. If your goal is to eliminate.
Speaker 5 (32:11):
The workers, the people that are on the ground, the
people that are undocumented workers, and you're shipping them out.
Speaker 4 (32:16):
Somebody has to do that work, right.
Speaker 5 (32:19):
If someone's going to do that work, the way you
get those people to do the work is you ensure,
in my opinion, that the folks are not college educated
or you're not leaning them towards the college education track.
Speaker 4 (32:30):
Right.
Speaker 5 (32:31):
I'm not going out to pick blueberries for eleven dollars
an hour. I'm just not doing that, right. The folks
that are at HBCUs, who are getting at education are
not going to do that. But if you dumb down America,
you come in, You control what's being taught, what people
are allowed to say, challenging the First Amendment, people's a
right to gather and protest. It looks a lot like fascism.
(32:56):
I know that's a little boogey word that everybody's kind
of throwing out there, but it's starting at the university level.
Speaker 4 (33:02):
It will actually started at the K through twelve level
in Florida.
Speaker 5 (33:05):
I think you know where Florida is, everybody else goes.
And so I think, and I said this before Project
twenty twenty five.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
You saw it.
Speaker 4 (33:14):
People who are in Florida saw it before it went national.
Speaker 5 (33:17):
And so what I would suggest is you need to
kind of keep your eyes open because if they can
do it in Florida, they will absolutely.
Speaker 4 (33:22):
Do it anywhere they want.
Speaker 5 (33:24):
And the goal, in my estimation, is to control what's taught,
to control speech on the university level. Universities or places
where people have the ability to exchange thought, to have
discuss We may not agree on everything, but it's a
place where you can engage in free thought, free thought
and discussion without any punishment. Generally speaking, the goal in
(33:47):
my mind is to limit that or to stop eliminated
or reduce it significantly where you're just kind of creating
these cutting paste folks that kind of go, yeah, go
along with whatever it is you're saying, and just kind
of regurgitating the nonsense and information that's provided to you.
So it's scary. I think that we need to be
(34:08):
on extreme high alert. And I think that Florida is
a chess case for where everything else is going to go.
Speaker 2 (34:16):
I appreciate that.
Speaker 3 (34:17):
Again, I agree with most of what Monica said. I
think she's sitting in nails on the head. There's a
story that we could tell about what's happening to fam you,
in part because it's happening to fam you and that's
what we care about. So yes, but I think there's
a broader story that we could tell about black colleges
in general. But I would tell a story about like
(34:38):
black institutions in general. So we talk about black college,
we talk about black church. If you're listening in You
and the Links and you in D nine and all
of these kinds of things. Like, it is the case
that these places exists because we were in a society
in which we were segregated, and we had to go
off and make our own space and all of this
kind of thing. So we have done that, but as
(34:58):
society of all, we did that and did other things.
But these places that we created that we own have
been safe places for us to think, to organize, to live,
to be. And so what does it mean for folks
to come in and undo this kind of safe space?
I think to the extent that I'm worried about anything.
It's about like where this ends? Today? Has spam you?
(35:21):
Is it the ame church? Tomorrow? Are they going to
start telling adultas that the Deltas can't? I don't know,
march about stuff like where does this end? Would be
the question that I have. And I think to the
point that we are kind of alluding to, but that
I want to be very explicit about. This feels like
an attempt to reshape society. And I would say it
(35:42):
feels like trying to be friendly, but like they have
been very clear that they seek to reshape our society. So,
if we're going to make America great again, which America
are we making it great?
Speaker 4 (35:53):
Like?
Speaker 3 (35:53):
Are we making it great like the America where I
was enslaved?
Speaker 2 (35:56):
Is it great?
Speaker 3 (35:57):
Like the one where I didn't have access to abortion?
Is it great? Like the one where I was even
further disenfranchised than I currently am?
Speaker 4 (36:05):
Like?
Speaker 3 (36:05):
Which one are we trying to get back to? And
so I think that we have to take these things
as a note that they're coming for us. And they
start with the educated negroes, but it don't end there.
It's everybody that.
Speaker 2 (36:17):
They get it that's real, you know, the only other.
So a few quick responses. One, when you talk about
who they came for. First, we know that when first
generation black folks go, they get their degrees. Oftentimes they
turn right back around. They're paying rents and mortgages, intuitions
(36:39):
and mentoring cousins, siblings, and friends on what it means
to change your life. That you and I came up
right next to each other cause you saw the same
stuff I did. You experienced the same stuff that I did.
And guess what, I made a choice to do it
different this day, and this is how it's turning out.
And you can make the same choice. My older four
brothers didn't go to college because they weren't smart, the
(37:01):
avenues weren't there, and they didn't necessarily pursue them. When
I did, what happened the same. My two behind me
did the same damn thing. And one of the board
chair at Florida and the board chair Hopeful, Devron Gibbons
is I've noticed going around basically talking in audiences that
are not us, basically slamming family alumni about what alumni
(37:23):
giving levels are right if you meant that in love
and in charity and in friendship with the institution that's
your vice chair of the board and hoping to be chair.
You wouldn't go to disparate audiences that aren't us and
talk that up. You would find a loving way to
communicate it. So even black folks can be co opted
and take on the majority white man perspective of treating
(37:47):
our institutions in US very paternalistically like they are the deciders.
They know better, and pity, pity, pity, pity, pity you
the reason they come after those who excel in this
society and chop the heads off first, because the effect
that we have on those who we're in close association
with can then also be cut off. Donald Trump has
(38:10):
given no apologies, neither has Rohnda Santis about the insecurity
they have with their children having to compete with us.
You see, they've been sold alive for so long about
being better, set apart, excellent in all ways, with no
competition and no comparable in close distance, and then reality
it me right. Then they meet you, and they meet Lolo,
(38:34):
and they meet Monica, and the story continues, and then
that life starts to be peeled apart because in competition
and the cream rises We're going to rise. Period. That's
why we are the way we are at FMU and
other hbc us because we are taught to believe that
we can do wherever and be wherever our mind and
(38:55):
our effort will take us. Lolo is in here, and
I want you, Lolo, to let us know if there's
some questions with our final five minutes that we've got
together that KG is going to speed through. And I
(39:17):
don't want to shut.
Speaker 6 (39:18):
Up, I do have so Whitney Scott and Allison Smith
asked something there is like a similar question. Whitney says,
I am alone. How can I get involved? I'm ready
to get my boots on the ground to protect the
future of Van You and a lot of people said
the same thing, like what are the next steps?
Speaker 4 (39:37):
What can we do about that?
Speaker 2 (39:38):
That's where we were going to actually wrap what was
gonna be on next steps, But KG, I want you
to go directly to that. We've already let folks know
that while the process is along, that it is not complete,
and that means that there are other things that can
be done. What would you want people to do leaving
this if they want to take action?
Speaker 3 (39:58):
So the first thing I want people to know is
that they're like ratlers thinking about this, and so you
at home, you're thinking about it. You stressed out, me too, girl.
But I'm calling my ratler friends to see what we
can do. And one of the things that I will
ask Whitney in particular to do is go to Keepers
of Flame eighteen eighty seven dot com into your information of.
Speaker 2 (40:16):
The Flame eighteen eighty seven dot com and we'll also
include in the show notes.
Speaker 3 (40:20):
Yes, and so as soon as we have a worked
out destination for you a thing for you to do,
we are going to email you. And when I say
as soon as, I mean like check your email. We
will be in touch soon this week, within the coming day.
Speaker 2 (40:35):
Is it is it? Is it free? Is it too free? Okay? Okay,
in the.
Speaker 3 (40:39):
Coming days, we'll have something to tell you. Certainly they
can do it this week.
Speaker 2 (40:43):
Yes, But if you're going to that website, you can
enlist your name and your email addressing, contact information, and
that's how you'll you'll the informational filter. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (40:53):
And the other thing is that I want to say
that I have been in conversations with people who are
like ready to cut their spite their face. Bam, you
is my house. That's my yard. That's not Marve's yard,
that's not Ron Desant's yard. And if you want to
come from my yard, you're gonna have to come through me.
And so I'm not about to not send money to
take care of my cousins in school because Marva's there.
(41:15):
I'm not about to not go to homecoming because Marva's there.
I'm gonna go to homecoming. And when Marve started talking,
I might, you know, turn around and not, you know,
have something say to Marvor. But I'm gonna go to
my homecoming. She's not gonna run me out of my house,
all right, She's not gonna run me away from my foundation.
And so the other thing that I would say to
Route is who are paying attention? Is you could be
mad at the governor, you'd be mad at Marva, but
(41:37):
don't take that out. That's our house, that's our yard.
We defended at all costs, and they have to do
what we say do, not the other way around.
Speaker 2 (41:43):
That's real, Monica, You're back in this. I want we
were just sharing what could people do? And I think
KGI wrap that well. So I want you to take
this next question, lo Low, if there is one more
that we may have time to hit before.
Speaker 6 (41:59):
So the last question. We had a few more, but
I think you all did a really great job of
answering them. The last question would be why does this
even matter? And I've seen a lot of people in
the comments, people are talking about them being nervous about
this happening that their HBCU Tennessee state in general, I
mean in particular. So if you all wanted to answer
(42:21):
or talk to that question.
Speaker 2 (42:23):
Yeah, Monica, you want to hit that the threat that
appears to be. Well, there was the question which is
why does it matter? Which I think you all kind
of hit on a little bit two questions back. But
if you're at an HBC and you're worried about this
coming down your street, what do you say? I mean,
(42:45):
I think you just have to stay vigilant.
Speaker 4 (42:46):
I think Kenisian mentioned it.
Speaker 5 (42:48):
One of the things I really tell alumni is HBCUs,
particularly public HBCUs, we cannot just solely rely on state dollars.
We've got it as alumni, give back and give back consistently, right,
That's the first thing. Secondly, you just have to kind
of stay involved and engaged. You can't just be engaged
once a year during homecoming. You have to stay engaged
(43:10):
and stay vigilant consistently throughout the year. The third thing
I will say is a lot of this has to
do with and people hate to go back to this,
people got to vote. Some of this has a lot
to do with the fact of who's in office. Like
in Florida, the person, the person that makes these decisions
and placing these people on the board of trustees is
the governor.
Speaker 4 (43:29):
The board of government, the board of governors.
Speaker 5 (43:30):
The governor puts those people in positions, puts those people
in those positions. The folks on the board of trustees,
the governor appoints those individuals.
Speaker 4 (43:39):
So a lot of this kind of goes down.
Speaker 5 (43:41):
I know people hate to say that, but you got
to stay engaged in your alumni you have and your
alumni association, stay engaged, and you with your school and
give back consistently, increase those give rates.
Speaker 3 (43:53):
And then you got people have to vote.
Speaker 5 (43:55):
I mean, bottom line, And I know people hate when
you say that, but that really is what this is.
But but for but for with the governor that we have,
things could look a lot different.
Speaker 3 (44:07):
I just leave that there.
Speaker 2 (44:08):
That's real. That's real. I wouldn't be moderating this panel
had it looked quite different. And I'm joking, but I
will say this there might well quite serious. I will,
I would, I would. I would only add to what
Monica said that in this day and age, the reason
why you have to care about what is happening at
(44:31):
FAM you is because they chose the largest single campus,
HBCU to try to infiltrate from MAGA first. And it's
their belief. And by the way, if you watch Trump
at all, if you watched the sentence at all, it
was the first thing this net is did. He punched
Walt Disney World. Trump gets in office, he punches all
of us, right, Ain't nobody left safe? And the reason
(44:53):
they do that is if you take out the biggest,
baddest thing you see on the block, no disrespect to
anybody else, then everything else falls falls like the house
of cards. And so know that this is them perfecting
the strategy of what it means to not just get
(45:15):
into Harvard, into Columbia and destruct those institutions because the
kids can't get it. But it is to come now
for black folk who you already think nothing of, You
already say we don't earn what it is that we've got.
You already think that we're not worth the time that
is spent or the resources that are allocated. So now
(45:40):
let's just figure out how we start to you know,
take those away too. Look, y'all, over the course of
history we have to learn from it. Cinicians already alluded
to this. We had slavery, we had emancipation. After emancipation,
we had reconstruction. Right, things started to look better, at
least they said they were going to be better. And
then what did they do? They caught it back and
we had Jim Crow. And then we have, you know,
(46:02):
the answer to Jim Crow, where we then get equality
laws and amendments of the constitution that make us more
full and more hole in the eyes of the law.
And guess what, y'all, We then go on to elect
a black president and then a woman nominee, a black
woman to come to have the audacity to pursue the
position as well. And now this society, based off its
(46:23):
majority's actions, are in full cell panic. And we're going
back to the take back. You make a game and
you get a clawback, and this clawback now is coming
up all of our avenues, all of our avenues, Kanisha.
As we round out right now, I want you to please, please, please,
because this is a large part about organizing, is when
(46:45):
you get a setback as big as the one that
was delivered to those who care about fam you and
his future with the Board of Trustees deciding as it
did to elevate Marva to the Board of Governors as
its next president. That's a big, big setback. But contextualize
a setback when we're thinking about a war, right, so
(47:07):
a battle of a president or of any battle that
you're in, and contextualize that in the scope of a war.
Speaker 3 (47:15):
Yeah, So I will say I think two things, one
on fame you and then maybe one more broadly. The
first is that the rallies, as we say, will strike
and strike and strike again, and so it's three strikes,
it's not one strike. And so you have to remember always.
So first of all, we have feelings, right, and so
feel your feelings right, you're mad, you jumping up and
(47:36):
like you want to punch the all whatever. You are
allowed to have your feelings. But after you let your
feelings pass through, then it's time for work. And so
we did suffer a major setback. But This is a
battle in a larger war for our university, for the
soul of Famu, and for I would say, the whole society.
Education is a piece of a bigger thing. And so
(47:58):
once you get your emotions out, I think you have
to take a step back and realize, Okay, this is
a small piece of a bigger thing. Let me attack
the bigger thing. How do you eat an elephant? An elephant,
You eat it bite by bite, right like. You can't
get overwhelmed. You can't drop out because something went badly
or went wrongly. You have to keep at it. One
of the things that I tell my students at Howard,
(48:19):
and one of the things I say often is I'm
reminded about Melissa Harris Perry, who was talking one day
about the movement, and she talks about how it was
the case that individuals lived and died enslaved, lived and
died as enslaved people, and every day they woke up
and fought, never knowing when freedom was going to come.
(48:42):
You have to carry your water, you have to carry
your ball down the field. Maybe freedom will come for
you while you are alive. The people who got emancipated
didn't know emancipation was coming. They didn't have Twitter, they
weren't on TikTok, they didn't have a way to know
that it was about to happen. But they got up
and fought anyway. Some of them got up, fought, lived
and died with nothing. And so happened that some of
(49:03):
them got up, fought, lived and saw the other side.
And so if my ancestors, you know, we're in the
fields of Georgia, slaving away right in Chris County, who
am I today to say that I'm too tired to
fight for the institution that has changed the life of
this same family from Chris County, Georgia. I can't do that,
(49:25):
and I would suggest that you can't either. And so
today we're talking about FAMU, but we could be talking
about what's in the library at your local elementary school.
We could be talking about heads start funding for your
baby and her daycare. We could be talking about any
number of educational things that are not just about college,
but that are about making life better for people. And
if we got to fight to make sure that these
(49:47):
babies are okay, I think that's a worthy fight that
we can deal with. It ain't enslavement and if they
can do it in this slavement, surely we could do it.
Here's for mmm.
Speaker 2 (49:54):
Girl, that's a word you just preached, You preached, and
you were closing on that, yall. I want to welcome
everybody home who decided to tune in. Know that we're
going to stay on this not only because it's failed,
but we will continue to project out so that all
of us get to see ourselves in this picture. If
you don't see it clearly, we want to make it
clear for you, for those HBCUs that are afraid of
(50:16):
what's coming down the tracks.
Speaker 4 (50:18):
For you.
Speaker 2 (50:19):
We got to get in communication and coordination and in
contact with each other because the battle. Know this, if
we do what we're supposed to do and hold our
ground and keep fighting until there's no longer breath in
our bodies. But so long as we have it, we
will fight. Let me tell you, they'll think twice about
the next time that they want to come after us. Right,
(50:39):
So the lesson is going to be the shot of
the bout has come from them. And now we got
to sink the ship. And when we sink the ship,
that means that ship ain't coming for you at least
no time soon so y'all help us sink this ship
right now, because whether you know it or not, we
all in the boat together. Man, We are all in
this together. Lolo, thank you very much facilitating the question,
(51:00):
kg dtr Grant, Kenesha, all the names, all the things,
all the fields. I love you like my little sister,
because you are and I am so proud of you
and the knowledge you dropped today extremely extremely important and powerful.
Y'all are going to hear from her again because we're
bringing her back to talk about her book on Natal
Damn Pod. Thank y'all, welcome home. This has been an
(51:22):
episode of.
Speaker 3 (51:23):
Our mini pod on organizing, Stay connect and don't forget
to meet us here into the next Monday or the monday, not.
Speaker 2 (51:31):
This upcoming but the one after every other. All right, y'all,
take care of peace.
Speaker 1 (51:49):
Native Land Pod is a production of iHeartRadio and partnership
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your favorite shows.
Hosts And Creators
Tiffany Cross
Andrew Gillum
Angela Rye
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