May 9, 2025 • 47 mins
Breaking down everything you need to know about the New Orleans Pelicans ahead of the 2025 NBA Draft Lottery.
Pelicans Radio play-by-play announcer Todd Graffagnini and color analyst John DeShazier join Jim Eichenhofer and Gus Kattengell for a special Pelicans Draft Lottery radio roundtable.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
Welcome in to the New Orleans Pelicans Podcast, the official
podcast of your New Orleans Pelicans, a podcast dedicated to
everything you need to know about the squad. Here from players, coaches, broadcasters,
and those who cover the NBA on a daily basis.
It's time to flock up. The New Orleans Pelicans Podcast
(00:29):
starts right now.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
All right, Tom, now for a very special radio roundtable
as we get you ready for the NBA Draft Lottery.
Here to explain everything is none other than NBA Commissioner
Adam Silver actually is too busy, so Jim I can
offer Pelicans dot Com.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
We'll get a chance to explain it to us.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
John the Chaser Tigraph needing, the voices of the radio
network for the Pelicans. We'll give their takes in and all.
But Jim, let's just kind of start with that overall
aspect of it. Why the lottery, what's the lottery and
what does it mean to the pouse.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
The lottery is for the fourteen teams that did not
make the playoffs. There's going to be some details that
make it a lot more complicated than that. This year,
with some of the trades that have happened, some of
the teams that have protected picks. Maybe we'll get into
that later, don't have enough time to do that right
now before we get into the roundtable. But Pelicans, to
make a long story short, they have a twelve point
five percent chance of winning the lottery. This is actually
(01:24):
the highest pre lottery slot that they've had since they
were also fourth in twenty twelve, so it's been a
while that they've gone into the lottery with this kind
of chance to actually be a winner, even though they
did win it in twenty nineteen as well, with only
six percent chance to win. They also have about a
forty eight percent chance of finishing in the top four.
And just as a reminder, that's the only thing that's
(01:45):
really determined that the lottery is the first four picks
after that five through fourteen are based on reverse order
of record from the previous regular season, so that's what
the Pelicans are looking at the look. They've got a
roughly half and half chance of finishing in the top four.
They also they actually could pick anywhere from one through
eight in any of those eight spots, so hopefully a
(02:07):
worst case scenario doesn't happen where they drop all the
way down to eighth. There's only a two point two
percent chance of that happening. But Monday night, six pm Central,
that is the lottery. That's what we're gonna be looking
forward to, one of the biggest nights of the offseason.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
All Right, Todd and JD. That's a lot of math
for me.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
I'll just wait to see the you know, team logos
on those envelopes. But Todd, we have seen the Pelicans
logo Horns logo pop up twice before in franchise history.
Zion Williamson, Anthony Davis, So start with you, sir, What
would winning the lottery or finishing even the top four
mean for this team, a team that you saw up
in close and personal.
Speaker 5 (02:48):
Well, a couple things, gus mean. Obviously, getting a top
four pick would uninject some life into the franchise. You know,
after the tough year, you know, twenty one wins. You
get some people that are going to get excited about
the possibility of getting a good player, whoever it may be.
The other thing is, depending on what Joe Dumars in
(03:12):
company want to do other than the number one pick,
who I think is a consensus right now and everybody
knows who that is. They might want to get Rid
of the pick and maybe acquire some other assets. Maybe
that's what their game plan is. So you know, that's
a little tougher to do when you're six or above.
But when you're in the top four, especially maybe two
(03:34):
through four, you're going to have some opportunities or some
options as a franchise to maybe say, look, we don't
like maybe two, three or four, whoever that may be,
and maybe try to trade back, acquire some other assets
and try to help yourself down the road. So I
think it's important to get that top four in a
(03:55):
couple of different ways.
Speaker 6 (03:57):
Yeah, I can't say much better than that, you know,
I think obviously it means hope after after that kind
of season, you inject the new life, as Grass just said,
and that's what we're looking for, some some kind of
adrenaline jolt. You know, you had kind of one adrenaline
jolt and Joe Dumars being hired as you know, president
(04:18):
of basketball ops. That's not sexy, Okay, it's not. What
is sexy is the infusion of talent on the court,
where you get a player who can who can add
into this mix that you have. And and look, I
don't I don't necessarily as Graft said, you know, unless
it's the number one overall pick, I will say this,
this team has shown the ability to develop its draft
(04:41):
picks Eve mecI, Herb Jones, Trey Murphy. It has shown
the ability to develop its draft picks. And we're still
along the lines with Jordan Hawkins. We'll see how that goes,
but it has shown that it can. It can find
a guy who fits what they do and work that
guy in so hopefully, you know, worst case scenario, you
(05:01):
figure they'll be able to do that. Best case scenario,
you get the guy that you really really want and
you get that jolto adrenaline.
Speaker 4 (05:09):
I think finishing the top four to me, would also
soothe kind of some of the pain that we experienced
from the season. I feel like in the entire time
we've been here, there haven't been that many extended stretches
where the team's out of the race. So I thought
what we went through in March and April was definitely difficult.
So I would feel a little bit better about that
that some of the agony that we went through in
the last few weeks of the season, that it was
(05:30):
worth it that you ended up with a pick in
the top four and also too, I mean just I mean,
if you get the number one pick, number two pick,
I think one of the impacts could be too that
maybe it changes the entire perspective of what other moves
you're gonna make during the course of the offseason. So
I think it would be it would be very significant
to finish in the top four, but especially obviously number one.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
Well, I can't think of a more superstitious person in
the world, literally other than you maybe head coach Rick
Jones from back in the day to lane baseball tiger An. So,
do you have any good luck charm or do you
or you know, will you not watch the television, you
go take a walk, will you blindfold yourself? Like do
you Is there anything you're going to do to try
(06:12):
to get the best possible outcome scenario for the Pelicans.
Speaker 5 (06:18):
No, I do not have any type of or No,
I'm I am a game day type, routine oriented superstition type.
I don't have any physical rabbit's foot or or a
four leaf clover or anything like that. That stuff doesn't work. Uh,
it's only during the game that that's what That's how
(06:41):
I roll, That's how I've always rolled. It's called routine oriented.
It's not superstition. Gust let's kind of trade.
Speaker 7 (06:47):
That's the thing.
Speaker 6 (06:48):
I'm not superstitious. I'm not a little stitious. I'm no stitious.
It doesn't it doesn't if I don't have any control
over it, it doesn't really bother me.
Speaker 7 (06:57):
Now, do I want the team to get the number one?
But of course I did.
Speaker 6 (07:00):
But you know, in terms of being on pins and needles,
I mean, I'll watch it for the drama of seeing
you know, where the team is going to draft, obviously,
and and will hope for the best. But you know,
I'm not gonna you know, I'm not gonna double over
in the fetal position if they if they don't get
you know, one or two overall, because again, I figure
they'll be able to pick a good player who'll fit in.
(07:21):
And and it's not like I don't think that the
Pelicans need like reconstructive surgery. I mean, you know, we're
depending a lot on on on ifs and help. But
you know, you're talking about some of the freakish injuries
to Herb Jones and Trey Murphy and the John Tay Murray,
and you know, you look at the possibilities of getting
those guys back, and then you don't feel like you
(07:42):
have to have Cooper flag, although that would be wonderful,
wouldn't it. But you don't feel like you just have
to get the guy. You feel like you can make
do with the guys you have. And if those guys
are playing to their capabilities and get and get reasonable
health and I just say reasonable health, I don't even
say good health now, just reasonable health, that they'll be
a pretty good team.
Speaker 7 (08:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
I want to echo a lot of what JD talked
about too, in terms of, you know, it's important, it
would be amazing for the Pelicans have a number one pick,
But there's no way that you can go into this
saying like your day is going to be ruined if
they don't win the lottery or if they don't finish
top two or three. I mean I talked to a
lot of people throughout the season who said, you know,
talking about different teams like Utah or Washington, Oh, you
(08:24):
know their plan is going to.
Speaker 8 (08:25):
Be the get the number one pick and blah blah blah.
Speaker 4 (08:27):
I'm like, fourteen percent is not a plan, which is
the odds that you have for to win, even if
you you could go oh in eighty two in the
regular season, and you still only have a fourteen percent chance.
Speaker 8 (08:37):
So that's why I say, like, that's not a plan.
That's a hope. That's a good hope, is not a plan,
right right, And then in.
Speaker 4 (08:43):
Terms of the superstition part of it, along the same lines,
I think of what both of you guys said. I'm
operating by the philosophy that you know what worked for
me in twenty twelve and in twenty nineteen doing absolutely nothing.
So I'm gonna stick with that philosophy and that strategy.
I have no SUPERSTI I have no trinkets, I have
no lucky charm, and it works before, so maybe it'll work.
Speaker 8 (09:05):
Again for a third time. In the last fifteen years or.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
So, I forgot about it. I was outside playing with
the kid.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
Actually, I was waiting for Air Force one to fly over,
you know me, Todd, I love my planes. And there
it goes, and then I hear from the inside somebody yelling.
I think it was Anna, we won the lottery, so
right inside it looked at what it was. So maybe
I don't pay attention to it. I don't know you're
talking about.
Speaker 8 (09:29):
Twenty nineteen, Yes, yeah, okay, so I didn't really.
Speaker 3 (09:32):
Pay attention to that. All right, So I guess all
of us will wait and see.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
Here's an interesting one based on records, right, I mean,
or I guess chances Jazz, Wizards, Hornets, Pails, seventy six Ers, Nets, Raptors, Spurs, Blazers,
all within that area there. If the Pels don't win it, Todd,
is there a team that you would or fanshire root
for to win? I think I can safely say you
don't want the.
Speaker 3 (09:56):
Jest to win it.
Speaker 5 (09:58):
Well, Gus, I mean you're gonna take all my answers.
That's fine, Yeah, thank you. If it's not the Pelicans,
then you would hope it'd be Washington or Charlotte or
even Philly. You know, Washington and Charlotte they pose no
threat to the Pelicans what the Pelicans are trying to
do Philly. I mean, I don't feel sorry for anybody,
(10:19):
but you kind of kind of feel sorry for him
a little bit considering what happened MBID in the last
couple of years. Again, I don't feel sorry for anybody,
but it's been tough for them. Uh maybe could they
could use a jolt, But yeah, Washington and Charlotte. Yeah,
And as far as the other side, the Utah Jazz
absolutely positively cannot, must not, will not, would not be
(10:40):
allowed to win the lottery, even though it's not technically
being allowed to win the lottery. But what they have
done in the last couple of years, which is basically
make the game a sham with what they have done
as far as what they have you know, reported injury wise,
and who is played and who has not played. For
them to be rewarded with winning the lottery Carmel wise
would just be a It'd be a crime in my estimation.
(11:03):
And let me put it to you this way. They
just extended their head coach will Hardy. He just got
a contract extension after tanking the last two years. Now
you think they're tanking on purpose?
Speaker 8 (11:15):
This is saying, of course they are. This is saying,
thank you for putting up with the misery.
Speaker 5 (11:19):
That you through perfectly, Coach Marty, you have done everything
we have asked you to do. How can you allow
that team to win the lottery.
Speaker 6 (11:27):
I believe we would call that the process two point
zero or something or some such. I wouldn't mind Charlotte
or winning it, or Philly winning it from a purely
selfish standpoint of I want the Pelicans to get a
point guard. Those two teams have point guard and they'll
need one, So so from a selfish standpoint, those are
(11:48):
the two picks I'm totally in in Graft's corner with
with Utah not winning it. But you know, those two
teams I could live with winning the lottery because they
don't need with the Pelicans need, I think, and so
then they would therefore bypass the point guard, and that
would give the Pills another opportunity, a better opportunity to
(12:09):
get one that I think. You know, I'm not in
anybody's head over there, but I think they need one.
Speaker 4 (12:15):
I also had Washington and Charlotte as the main teams
that I'm going to root for. One of the notes
about the Hornets that I thought was really unbelievable is
they've made the playoffs three times out of the last
twenty one years, but during that entire span where they've
been in the lottery eighteen times, they've only won it once.
And a lot of those years they've had bad records too,
where the percentage was really high. So I feel a
(12:36):
little bit of sympathy towards them that I would like
to see them win it. Personal note too, I also
have a good friend who works for Charlotte who was
furious with me in twenty nineteen when the Pelicans won
the lottery and the Hornets didn't. And also in twenty twelve,
the Pelican when it was still the New Orleans Hornets,
they got the number one pick Anthony Davis. The Charlotte
ened up a second they were the Bobcats and had
(12:58):
Michael kid Gilchrist like.
Speaker 8 (13:00):
There's a little bit of luck.
Speaker 4 (13:02):
Maybe that needs to go towards Charlotte. You guys mentioned
Philly too. If they win the lottery, that means that
okay See doesn't get a first round pick. Philly's pick
is only top six protected, so if it drops to
okay Se could end up with a seventh pick in
this draft, which is unbelievable. So I guess if you
don't want to see okay See end up with a pick,
you could also root for Philly. I will say, though,
(13:25):
I'm against Philly winning the lottery only because they've had
so much success the last few years. It doesn't feel
like they're a team that deserves a lot number one pick,
because I mean, they've had a bunch of maybe they
haven't gotten past the second round famously, but they also
have won a ton of regular season games in recent years.
Speaker 5 (13:41):
I will say this though, Jim and j D. If
Charlotte does win, I mean again, you know who they're
gonna pick, who, of course goes to school just right
down the road from Charlotte. Are we uh gonna get
into the frozen envelope? Patrick Ewing? Of course there's gonna
be some because it Charlotte does win. Are we going
(14:02):
to get into all that?
Speaker 4 (14:03):
You realize though that I say this almost every year
there's fourteen teams in the lottery. There's usually about ten
to twelve conspiracies that you could come up with before
the lottery happens. So I feel like the frozen envelope
conspiracy thing, there's almost always a way that you can
say it for every team, so it's it doesn't really
I don't know how much stock you can really put
(14:23):
in that. When you can find a theory for just
about every team that's involved in the lottery.
Speaker 6 (14:27):
Well, the biggest theory is if they've been in the
lottery eighteen years out of the last twenty one and
Adam Silver wants them obviously to get the hometown boy
to make up for some of that agony of them
just out. Jim said that a while ago, and there
I can't think of a better word to fit last season.
It got to be pretty agonizing at times.
Speaker 3 (14:47):
It's interesting.
Speaker 2 (14:48):
Out of the first I guess eight teams worst record wise,
three are in the Western Conference, so a lot of
Eastern Conference teams gentlemen that are in there as well.
Pells four double of the pells would be the eight spot.
That's where the Spurs imagined Wenby.
Speaker 3 (15:01):
With yeah exactly.
Speaker 2 (15:02):
So yeah, you're giving me so we don't even want
to speak that and too fruition here.
Speaker 3 (15:08):
But look, we will keep an eye on it and
see what happens here. But I'm going to give you
all a little.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
Bit more responsibility here in this podcast graph JD. Jim
going to make you The lotteries are about that.
Speaker 3 (15:19):
So do you like the format? Do you not like
the format? Would you make changes to the format.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
There's been a lot of different discussions about the lottery format.
Speaker 3 (15:28):
If you were to make a change, what would.
Speaker 5 (15:30):
Be the change. I don't think I would have a change,
per se. I think the only thing And again I'm
going into the who's winning on who's winning and who
is losing on purpose. I just think it's it's difficult to,
you know, give the flowers to a team that you
(15:52):
know has not been trying their best, and that's where
we are with the Jazz. But I would what I
would say is the bottom four teams should be almost
guaranteed to have top four picks. That that, to me
would be the change. Like if you're the fourth worst
team like the Pelicans are, and you pick eighth, that's
(16:15):
that's tough. You know what, though, you're gonna be that's tough.
Speaker 4 (16:18):
You're gonna make the teams losing at the end of
the season problem worse by doing it that way, though, that's.
Speaker 8 (16:22):
With you, and that's the project.
Speaker 5 (16:23):
I'm gonna have any type of real significant change.
Speaker 8 (16:27):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (16:27):
I mean, look, I watched the This Magic Moment thirty
for thirty just a couple of days ago, which was
just you know, they had Shack and Penny the Magic
got the number one pick two drafts in a row.
They were they had the worst record one year they
got Shack, then they improved twenty five games, they had
(16:49):
fifty wins, but didn't make the playoffs, so they got
into the lottery. They had one ping pong ball in
the sixty five ping pong balls in the hopper, and
they won.
Speaker 7 (17:01):
That was the cold one.
Speaker 5 (17:04):
But again, what do you They had the least amount
of chance to win, but they won, So in that essence,
that truly was a lottery and they got penny hardaway.
But so I don't think I would have any type
of major changes per se. I just the only thing
is you would hope there'd be some type of better
guarantee that you'd get a really good pick if you
(17:25):
were that bad.
Speaker 7 (17:27):
See.
Speaker 6 (17:27):
I've seen some theories because I wanted to be equitable.
I don't want Utah to be rewarded for what for
the mockery it made of the game. And I saw
a theory that said, you know, maybe the bottom I
don't know, four or eight teams or something, you know,
the last fifteen twenty games, whoever has the best one
loss record showing they're trying to win is the lottery winner. Yeah,
(17:53):
And that way you don't, And that way you don't
have teams purposefully trying to lose.
Speaker 7 (17:59):
And be reward it for it. You're more rewarded.
Speaker 6 (18:02):
Even though you're not a winning team that year, you're
more rewarded for trying to win down the stretch. And
so I don't now, I don't know how that can
be implemented, and I don't have any great ideas on
it because I was I was like, look, just figure
out a way to just go back and make it
even across the board for all those teams and that way,
(18:22):
you know, but then you have a team in the
lottery who's you know, a fifty win team that wins
the lottery that wasn't designed to win the lottery over
an eighteen win team. So I don't know of a
good solution for it, but I know the NBA has
got to figure out something because you cannot have teams
do what Utah has done.
Speaker 7 (18:41):
You cannot.
Speaker 6 (18:42):
You you spit on the integrity of the game, and
it really is off putting, an unattractive and all those
things when you're seeing teams not trying to compete.
Speaker 5 (18:53):
And then you extend their coach.
Speaker 6 (18:55):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, and which is which is the
tell that hey, we were trying to lose, you're safe,
You're good to go. And in this game, in everything's
supposed to be about winning, That that's the essence of it.
You know, as as Bill Parcells famously said, you are
what your record says you are, well, obviously Will hard
and what his record says he is, because if scene
(19:17):
extended him, gave him more years and more money for
having the kinds of seasons that they've had a couple
of years.
Speaker 7 (19:24):
And that's just that's an awful, awful look for the league.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
Real quickly before we get to Gym's format change or
just the thoughts on it. And I want to ask you,
because you covered the Saints as well, why does it
work in the NFL?
Speaker 4 (19:37):
Then?
Speaker 2 (19:37):
Because, like I tell I listened to you know, I
go back to the final week this past season of
the regular season, Saints at Tampa.
Speaker 3 (19:44):
They let at halftime like they were trying to win
that game. You can see it. They were competitive towards
the end of the season there. So why why is
the NFL work? I know they they changed it well,
but the.
Speaker 7 (19:56):
NFL kind of has a little soft tank too. I
mean it's not you know, you we don't have everybody
like really really really trying.
Speaker 6 (20:03):
And I'm not saying the Saints were one of those teams,
but the Saints were five and twelve last year, and
they were working with backup quarterbacks at the time. But
I've seen situations where I remember a couple of years
ago Tampa Bay and I don't know if it was
before Jamis was drafted to what, but they were leading
the Saints at halftime in Tampa and pulled their players,
pulled them all, pulled all the starters, pulled them and said,
(20:26):
we don't want to win this game basically, And so
you can see that in the NFL. It can happen
in the NFL, it just it just looks different.
Speaker 7 (20:34):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (20:35):
I've started to have that debate with some football people too,
who say to me, there's no tanking in the NFL.
And as you mentioned in the example that you came
up with, I definitely think it's starting to creep into
the NFL. I mean, there was a team that was
fined heavily a couple of years ago because of well,
I can't remember the specific details with Miami, but there
was something like they publicly more or less admitted that
(20:56):
they were losing games. Yeah, the allegation was that the
owner told a head coach to throw some games. And look,
last year the Giants were gonna say the Giants were
trying to win. Yeah, the Giants did not look like
a franchise that was trying to win.
Speaker 8 (21:11):
I mean, the fact that it's starting to seep in
the NFL is a bad idea. It's a bad thing.
Speaker 4 (21:16):
I mean, there's It just has such a kind of
a deteriorating effect on a league and a sport and
just the I don't know, at the end of the season,
it just makes things so much worse and so much
less interesting to watch. To go back to a couple
before I get into my commissioner for a day, ideas
to go back to a couple of things that you
said JD two, I think one of the things that's
(21:37):
the most disturbing about what Utah has done recently and
what Philadelphia did during the process, is that it's a
multi year thing. I think it's not great. If a
team does it once, it's still bad for the league.
And I think it's something that if the NBA can
root this out, would be great. But the fact that Utah,
it seems like they've had three years in a row
where they either were competitive for the first couple.
Speaker 8 (21:59):
Months and then we're just like, ah, now we're good.
Let's just not be competitive or.
Speaker 4 (22:02):
This season where I mean they were sitting guys in
December and January for rest On, not in back to backs.
Speaker 8 (22:08):
That's the part of it that was so alarming to me.
Speaker 5 (22:11):
I'm not trying to cut you off, Jim, You're good.
Oklahoma City did it too. They just finished what do
you think Oklahoma City is so good right now? And
all the first round picks and getting chet Holme.
Speaker 7 (22:22):
They did the same thing too.
Speaker 5 (22:24):
People forget that they're lost for three years, for three
years to get to where they are right now.
Speaker 6 (22:30):
And unless you I mean, if you're the league, how
do you how do you regulate that? How do you
manage it? Because if you're not boots on the ground
and in the franchise headquarters, how do you say that
guy and hurt he should be playing?
Speaker 7 (22:46):
How do you say? You know what? Well, Walker Kessler
shouldn't be shooting three?
Speaker 4 (22:50):
You know?
Speaker 7 (22:51):
How do you you know? I mean, how do you
how do you regulate it? Yeah?
Speaker 4 (22:56):
I think the I think from the comments that the
league has made about it, they've said the same thing
that you just mentioned. It's just like impossible from the
outside looking in to legislate this. They don't want to
get into playing time decisions. They want to get into
injuries with certain guys and certain teams.
Speaker 8 (23:12):
So that is the difficult part about it.
Speaker 4 (23:13):
But I mean, I think that kind of leads me
to I have two separate ideas that I think could
help fix this or at least help the situation a
little bit. One the first one is The Athletic had
an article a few weeks ago where they said they
floated the idea that I really like and I think
is interesting that if you finish with the worst record
in the league, you can't pick number one. They said,
(23:35):
if you finished with the worst record, you automatically end
up with a fourth pick.
Speaker 8 (23:40):
What that would do obviously, it would make.
Speaker 4 (23:42):
It so you're not rewarded for being the worst team
in the league, But it also would make it so
that teams would at the bottom of the standings would
try everything they could to not be the worst team.
So all of a sudden, instead of having teams like
Utah and Washington that went down to the last day
of this past regular season where they had the same
number of wins and everybody was like, oh, the Wizards
won the last game. I can't believe it. They lost
(24:03):
a chance to be the number one spot. Instead, you
would have those teams in that situation trying to win
so they didn't have the worst record.
Speaker 8 (24:10):
So I really like that idea.
Speaker 4 (24:11):
I think there's a lot of potential to that because
the race to the bottom wouldn't be possible because teams
would say, we can't finish number one because there's a
guy coming out in the draft that we really like,
and we know if we finished with the worst record,
we have no chance to get them.
Speaker 8 (24:24):
So I like that idea.
Speaker 4 (24:26):
And the other thing I think JD referenced this a
little bit, but kind of just fleshing this out a
little bit more. I think the downside of having equal
odds for everyone in the lottery is what JD said,
where you could have a team that just misses the
playoffs and ends up with the number one pick, and
everyone across the leams the league screams bloody murder because
(24:46):
this team that doesn't deserve to pick number one has
the pick. But I think, what's with what's happened at
the end of the regular season in the last few years.
I think I'm not I'm way less concerned about that
than I am. Making the end of the regular season
more of a legit thing and did not have all
these situations where on April fifth, there's six games in
the league and four of them are waste of your
(25:06):
time because in four of the games there's a team
that is playing guys that don't deserve to be in
the NBA, et cetera, et cetera. So I would like
to see equal odds for the lottery for all fourteen teams,
because I think that would solve so many things at
the end of the season. It would completely take out
the motivation to lose because you would know going into
the lottery that if you're in the lottery, you have
(25:28):
exactly the same odds as the other thirteen teams that
are in it. It doesn't help you to lose a
game at the end of the season at all because
it's not going to change your status. And so I
think that's an idea that and I think we've also
seen too that whoever you want to blame for this,
you want to blame analytics, you want to blame front
offices that think that they're smarter than everybody. I feel
(25:49):
like that's become a problem as well as that some
of the front offices have gotten to the point where
it's like they just think that they're smarter than everyone.
You if you have any situation and you guys can
tell me if you agree with this or not. If
you have a situation where it's the last day of
the season and you tell a team, if you lose
this game, you have a fourteen point one percent chance.
(26:11):
If you win it, you have a thirteen point nine
percent chance. I feel like we've gotten to the point
in the NBA, and it's kind of embarrassing to say
this where a lot of the teams are like, we
want that fourteen point one, we want that zero point
two better increased chance. So the point being that as
long as you have any incentive at all to me
to reward teams that lose, you're gonna see teams do it,
even if it's the most minuscule thing.
Speaker 8 (26:33):
And I guess if you think about it too.
Speaker 4 (26:36):
In twenty nineteen, they flatten the odds to make it
so that the worst teams in the league had less
of a chance to win. It didn't really solve it
because as long as teams have any shred of an
advantage with the way that they look at things and
the way they look at analytics and the way that
some of these teams are clearly willing and able to
throw away the latter part of.
Speaker 8 (26:54):
The season, they're gonna do it.
Speaker 4 (26:56):
So to me, the only way that you can purely
get to the point where it's like no team is
motivated and no team is doing brash things to lose
games the way that allegedly Utah did this season. The
only way to fix that, to me is to make
it equal odds, so that I would be in favor
of that, even if there's a downside of you're going
(27:16):
to have teams that are winning a lot more games
that still end up winning the lottery.
Speaker 6 (27:21):
Well, you said a phrase there that caught my ear
as the writer gym is. He said, it doesn't help
you to lose, which the flip side is it doesn't
hurt you to win. You can win and it doesn't
hurt you. I mean, you still can compete and still
be in the lottery and still have the exact same odds.
And I think something like that that will level it out,
because again, you got to be able to regulate this,
(27:43):
and that maybe that's the only way to regulate this
is to get teams off their rear ends and say, look,
it doesn't matter if if you don't want to play
your guys, go ahead, because that team that's playing their
guys that's going to win forty seven has got just
as good a chance of winning it as you do.
Speaker 4 (27:57):
I also thought the league believed that, not to put
words in other people's mouths, when they went from the
worst team in the league has twenty five percent chances
to win the lottery the way it used to be
to fourteen percent. I think the league believes, Okay, now
that that number has dropped so much, we're going to
see a drastic change in teams losing at the end
of the season, knowing that even if we have the
worst record, we only have a fourteen percent chance. But
(28:19):
that I don't think that's played out that way at all.
I think you still are seeing teams, as I referenced earlier,
people saying coming up to me and being like, oh,
you know, Utah is just gonna win the lottery, or
Washington's win the lottery.
Speaker 8 (28:29):
So even if it's fourteen.
Speaker 4 (28:31):
Percent, which is like we were saying, is not a plan,
you still see teams that are so motivated to end
up with that fourteen percent regardless.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
I think it's an interesting point both of you guys
bring it up, JD and Jim, and that I do
love the competitive nature of it, Toy. What if there's
the deadline, says all right, with six games left, best
record of those six in that order, right, good? So
it gives you incentive to try to win games, because
we even saw with this team, the guys that were
getting minutes on the court were there, they had f there, right,
(29:00):
they were trying.
Speaker 7 (29:01):
To do that.
Speaker 2 (29:02):
And I like what Jim is saying, Hey, I'm gonna
not make it complicated here. You finish with the worst record,
you're not.
Speaker 3 (29:08):
Getting the top seed. So it's up to y'all to
try to make that happen.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
I kind of like that aspect of it too, because
when you look at it at the end of the day,
it's about competitiveness. And maybe I wouldn't know if president
is the word that I would use, but the end
season tournament that the league has, right, it's only a
handful of games, not even six, right, it's like three
or four something like that. That you look at it
(29:33):
and you are doing win lost record, so you don't
really need that many games, but you do sort of
competitive dach on it. So maybe the cut off is
final five games of the year, best record gets the
top spot. So you know, the top four cut off
right there? Boom, top four, top six. I don't know
what are you think of that?
Speaker 5 (29:52):
You know, I think Jim's theory might work the best.
Speaker 8 (29:56):
Thank you.
Speaker 5 (29:56):
I was thinking about the athletic look. I was thinking
about the athletic article, which is very intriguing. The problem
I have with that is, what if you really are
truly bad?
Speaker 8 (30:08):
Too bad? That's the that's the answer that I would give,
you know, to bad.
Speaker 5 (30:14):
Okay, Okay, So the Pels have all the injuries that
we had this year, and you you just don't have
the horses to win games, and you're the and you
have the worst record.
Speaker 4 (30:25):
I mean, my counter to that would be that if
if it's because of the injuries, you're you weren't the
worst team in the league really anyways, you know what
I mean. But setting aside that specific example, I heard
somebody talk to me about this who's more of a
football guy than a basketball guy, and they made a
really good point that I thought.
Speaker 8 (30:43):
They said at this point the NBA, the.
Speaker 4 (30:45):
Bottom teams don't deserve fairness. They don't deserve the equity,
the equitable nature of the lottery, And I agree with that.
If you have if you have multiple occasions every year
of egregious cases of what some of what we talked
about today, where it's team that you know don't care
and aren't trying like to me, at that point, you
forfeit the ability to say, like, we need to be
(31:06):
treated fairly. It's it's the reason the system was put
in place was on the assumption that it works because
everyone's motivated to try to win, and that the team
that at the bottom purely is legitimately the worst team.
But I don't even know, can we really say that
in the last few years that the team that has
the worst record is really the quote unquote worst team.
Speaker 8 (31:26):
I think a lot of cases, well you can't tell
now exactly exactly. So the system is broken because of that.
Speaker 6 (31:32):
If a naive system, you're working on the honor system
you're talking about professional sports.
Speaker 7 (31:37):
Nobody's got that kind of honor.
Speaker 8 (31:39):
I meant, every man for himself.
Speaker 5 (31:41):
Let's be real, not the ultimate solution, but it will
never happen. You go like Premier League and regulate the
bottom three teams and they said, you send them to
the G League. Yeah, yeah, that'll get you winning.
Speaker 8 (31:52):
I have a feeling, I have a feeling the owners
will not go for that.
Speaker 7 (31:58):
I mean, I can. I can live with I can
live with gyms.
Speaker 6 (32:00):
I can live with flattening it out and everybody having
the same odds, which I've suggested before. Or I can
I can live with you know, maybe not the final
five games because that's a small sample size, but you know,
the last ten games, to make you hustle to the
finish line, you know, to make you hustle to the
finish line.
Speaker 7 (32:16):
I can. I can live with that. I can.
Speaker 6 (32:17):
I mean because now you won't get those situations where
you can look, you can look at the mashups and say, Okay,
we know this guy and this guy and this guy
ain't gonna play because they're trying to lose, you know,
this handful of guy look, and I know Philly was
banged up. Philly came in here and put a would
(32:38):
you call it a G League team? I mean, they
ran a G League team out on the on the court,
and some of the guys you know, you know, I
think Maxie probably would have been able to play if
they if there was something to play four and so
I just those situations just you know, you see where
fans get really turned off by the prop by what's
going on because they saying, we're not seeing you know,
(33:02):
not just not just the attempt to win, but we're
not seeing good faith effort.
Speaker 5 (33:06):
Look, we could really get in the weeds in this
thing because you throw on top of that, John, I mean,
these teams that are actively trying to lose towards the
end of the season are playing teams that are actively
trying to win, yes, and improve their playoff positions. So
you're giving these teams that are fighting for fifth or
fourth or second or third, you're giving them free wins,
(33:28):
and that affects everybody else they're playing. Again, So again,
we could go, we could go all day on this.
Speaker 2 (33:34):
I love what you guys are coming up on from
this aspect. We all agree, and it's all four of
us that is palpable.
Speaker 3 (33:40):
It's visible. We can see whether.
Speaker 7 (33:43):
Look, the league find people because they know.
Speaker 2 (33:47):
I've said that during the regular season on one of
the broadcasts that if you get fined, you're done. You're
automatically eliminated from being able to win it.
Speaker 3 (33:55):
Right, I mean if the league for the league to
find you.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
They must feel you egregiously or tanking or not putting
in the best product.
Speaker 3 (34:04):
So you're done. So maybe we start with that, Hey,
I find you for specifically not competing, you have lost
the shot.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
But to back up on your point, there's three instances
that popped in my head that you were talking about
where competing actually has helped the league. And in instances
you're a baseball guy. I'm a baseball guy. Adding those
extra wildcards? How exciting is the final week? How many
times in the last couple of years it's made September better?
Speaker 3 (34:27):
Right, we've seen those last weekends.
Speaker 2 (34:30):
We've had to play Monday Tuesday games right to get
to that wallcard spot. In the NFL, adding that extra
wildcard spot right at first, I don't know what.
Speaker 3 (34:39):
Now it's seven teams.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
And that and baallet for that extra spot means a
little bit. And as we said in the NBA, oh man, wait,
you already put in eight. We don't need nine or ten.
How exciting has the play in been for that league.
So that's three leagues, three instances where competing.
Speaker 3 (34:57):
At the end, four teams that are at the top.
Speaker 1 (34:59):
But it.
Speaker 2 (35:00):
That extra shot to get in makes it worth well.
So maybe I like what we're seeing here. Maybe competition
is the best way to go about it.
Speaker 7 (35:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (35:09):
And you know, by the way, Gus, you realize too,
if the NBA had your rule instituted, your rule about
if you get fined, you get bumped out of the lottery,
you don't get to participate, Derek Lively would not be
a Dallas Maverick right now, because they the league, actually
the Mavericks. And I can't explain the wisdom the lack
of intelligence here. They basically public publicly said we don't
(35:30):
want to make the play in. We're going to lose
these games on the last weekend and the league find them.
But because they lost those couple games two years ago,
they ended up in the lottery. They picked I think
was eleventh or twelfth. They ended up with Derek Lively.
He was a huge component to them making the finals
the next year. So I love that idea, though, I
think if you if you're at the point where the
league is finding you, you don't deserve to be participating it.
Speaker 6 (35:52):
But I mean, that's that's grab me. I mean, that's
just so far into weeds. That's so nuanced, because if
I'm saying we're holding the guy out because of his ankle,
the league can't till me his ankle don't hurt. If
we're holding the guy out because of his back, the
league can't till me his back don't hurt.
Speaker 4 (36:09):
I think you if you do it only in cases though,
where there's a clear I mean, if if it's so egregious,
I think when yeah, what Utah did was a clear
violation of the rules that have been laid out, and
then obviously Dallas admitted that they that they weren't following
the policy. So I think if you if you just
limit it to those, I think you avoid the league
being in some you know, dicey situations or some you
(36:32):
know where you're it's kind of vague of whether they
should step in or not. I think if you leave
it to just the times where there's been a jury
has ruled against you, I think then that's fine.
Speaker 8 (36:43):
If we could just stick to that, I'll love.
Speaker 7 (36:45):
It all right.
Speaker 3 (36:45):
Final thing for you guys, twenty twelve, twenty nineteen.
Speaker 2 (36:48):
The last two times and only two times, the franchise
has won the lottery, So titles start with you, JD
and Jim, give me your most vivid memory of twenty
twelve twenty nineteen.
Speaker 5 (36:57):
I can't help you with twenty twelve. That that's too
far back. I got a great twenty nineteen story, if
you can bear.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
Yes.
Speaker 5 (37:05):
So uh so, Gus did his talk show, you know,
for many, many years, and he was on the air
all during that time. When of course it's Alloyd, the
Pelicans are gonna win the lottery. They're gonna get Zion Williamson,
They're gonna get in. I'm you know, listening to the
show or being on the show, and all I'm doing
is roll in my eyes day after day or texting him.
(37:26):
I'm like, you're insane. The Pelicans will never win the lottery.
They have no chance or wasting everybody's time. I mean,
this was a daily, daily thing. Hey, maybe Gus talked
it into it, you know, he spoke it into existence. Anyway,
let's go to lottery night. I'm with Tulane. I'm doing
a baseball game that night. I'm broadcasting the game floor level.
(37:48):
I actually was doing it next to the dugout and
lottery's going on or it's about to start, and we're
about in the third inning and it's about what seven ten,
so yeah, it's about the third inning. And my phone
just starts exploding and I'm like, well, what's going on.
I'm looking on Pelicans win lottery, but you know, I'm
(38:09):
getting all then I'm like no in a way, and
I'm on the air and I'm like, the Pelicans just
won the lottery. I don't believe this. I can't and
this is during the baseball game. So I just I
was just mind blown off. Could think about was Gus
who literally spoke it into existence today day after day
after day when I said there was no chance whatsoever.
(38:31):
So that's my story.
Speaker 3 (38:33):
Packs by the way, thank you.
Speaker 6 (38:35):
Well, I'm I'm I can't remember the exact words, but
but my memory is from twenty nineteen, and I'm pretty
sure with Alvin Gentry, who when they won it said
blank yeah.
Speaker 5 (38:47):
Which I thought, which I thought was a huge myth.
Speaker 7 (38:51):
Marketing wife, just you print those T shirts T shirt?
Speaker 5 (38:56):
My wife had one. They passed the t all day.
Speaker 7 (38:59):
Do I didn't see one because I would have five.
Speaker 5 (39:02):
They passed those T shirts out on Draft night in
uh in the Square. Okay, no, no, no no, but
I did not see the you and the first word
had an asterisk.
Speaker 8 (39:16):
Okay, I don't know had a shirt.
Speaker 6 (39:18):
Look, I'd have done it and I'd have stuck it
on every seat in the arena for the opening.
Speaker 7 (39:23):
I mean, I just and I was like, where is
that shirt? And why don't we have them?
Speaker 4 (39:29):
By the way, I've always said that the video of
Elvin Gentry in that room that that the NBA put
out was a true test of people's character and what
kind of person if you look at the other if
you look at the other executives in that room, there
was a couple guys, I think the guy from Miami,
his name is Andy Elsberg. He gave Elvin a pat
(39:49):
on the back, he congratulated him, he said, yeah, awesome man.
And then there's a couple other people that were nearby, including,
if I believe, a certain Lakers executive who had a
very angry look on his There was no you know,
it's not like Elvin could control winning it or not.
But I just thought it was funny to see the
different reactions of the people in the room. Some people
were very gracious in congratulating him, others were not so
(40:12):
much so. But my memory from that from twenty nineteen
actually was so I was in Chicago for the lottery
in the room when the Pelicans won it, and all
the people that were there covering the team were looking
at each other like, we can't believe that just happened,
because they had if you remember, they had the seventh
pre lottery slot, so they had they only had the
seventh best chance to win the lottery, and then they
(40:33):
ended up winning it. But one of the funny vivid
memories for me was so I was in Chicago for
the lottery and then there to cover the draft combine,
and so the next day the draft combine started, and
everyone who knew that I was there with the Pelicans
or covering the Pelicans was tapping me on the back
saying congratulations, and they were also like, they're also like,
I guess you could leave now, right, because what's the
(40:55):
point of you even being here for the draft combine.
So I always thought that was funny that people it.
It made me feel good that people were happy for me,
but also it was kind of it was hilarious that
people were just saying to me, like, you can just
leave now, Like what's the point of even scouting. It's
not like you don't know who they're gonna pick. So
there's my memory, by.
Speaker 5 (41:12):
The way, and the timing is everything thing. Little did
I know that about a month later I would get
the job here after that a lottery so perfect it
was pretty awesome when you think about it.
Speaker 2 (41:23):
Close off here, let's thirty seconds or less. I feel different, though,
don't yoe from twenty twelve to nineteen?
Speaker 3 (41:30):
Or is it the same?
Speaker 2 (41:31):
And what I mean by that is like I look
at twelve and nineteen You're like, can we just get
a player to sort of build? Or I look at
this team and maybe I don't know, it's wishful thinking,
but we've done our our podcast gym and in player profiles.
You guys have been a part of that here as
well into the season reviews.
Speaker 3 (41:49):
Unlike those seasons, this team has talent. It's just getting healthy.
I mean, am I wrong with that?
Speaker 2 (41:55):
Like did you feel going into twenty twelve like they
had time and this would just help? And in nineteen
whereas he or I'm like, whatever you get in the
lottery is going to help. What I believe is a
team with talent? Does that make sense? I feel different?
Speaker 3 (42:11):
I mean I thought we.
Speaker 5 (42:12):
Had talent in twenty nineteen. Personally, I mean I thought
we had enough players to win. I mean, but you
know what really nobody could have foreseen was Zion got
hurt in the fifth game of the preseason and we
really never recovered if you think about it, because he
was supposed to really be the missing piece that was
going to bring it all together. You know, you had
(42:33):
Lonzo Ball, you had Drew Holliday, you had Brandon Ingram.
He would have been another. I mean, we saw how
well that team was playing towards the end, and then
Covid hit. I mean they were playing their best basketball
because they had all their pieces. So now twenty twelve
was a different story all to god. I mean, that
was just a bad team. If I'm not mistaken. I
(42:56):
mean I just thought twenty nineteen was a little bit different.
But no, I mean I'm with you, Gus, because I mean,
you're getting all these guys back next year. It's almost
like winning the lottery. You're getting Trey Murphy back, You're
getting Herb Jones back. You know, you're getting these pieces
that you did not have most of the season.
Speaker 4 (43:13):
I think to Gus's point that I would characterize each
of those three situations, including with this, you're being the
third one as different In that twenty twelve I think
you needed a franchise savior, needed somebody to and a
lot of teams that were in the lottery that year
looked at it like we got to win them. We
gotta get the number one pick because the drop off
after Anthony Davis is huge, and we need somebody who's
(43:34):
gonna come in and just change everything.
Speaker 8 (43:36):
But then twenty nineteen to.
Speaker 4 (43:38):
Me, wasn't It wasn't necessarily that you needed a savior
as much as you needed that huge jolt of positivity
after what we went through with Anthony Davis situation during
the eighteen nineteen season. This year is different because you
don't need a savior, you don't need talent. To me,
this is more of a supplement to what you already have.
So I do think that this year is different compared
(43:59):
to those previous times what they when they want it
just because of the circumstances around the team or roster
are different.
Speaker 6 (44:04):
Yeah, I feel no sense of desperation. As you mentioned
supplemental pieces, and I mean, you know thee the cel
Pells might pick somebody who who isn't necessarily a sexy
pick for the for the fan base, but might be
a good player for them. But you also can pick
a guy who who won't immediately be in a rotation.
This this team, if everybody is healthy, y'all hear me,
(44:28):
I'm knocking wood. If everybody is healthy, this is a
this is a fairly deep team. So you bring in
a guy one, you don't have to rush him.
Speaker 7 (44:37):
Two.
Speaker 6 (44:38):
He doesn't have to have that kind of pressure on
him to step out there and be and and be
a leader of the team immediately, and you can ease
him in while hopefully this team is winning games during
the process. So it just it feels a lot different
from that standpoint to where you know, yeah, I say,
I say, I want to see this team get a
(44:58):
point and if in, but even in a rookie point
going to a somewhat veteran team, it's gotta there's there's
a learning curve, you know. There, there's growing pains that
go along with it. I don't care how talented you are,
there are growing pains that go along with it. So
you know, I I but and yet still I want
one just because you know, I know that's the position
(45:20):
that I think the Bells need the most, just because
of the Johnte Murray. But again, I just I don't
feel a sense of, you know, just desperation that like, man,
if you don't get Man, if you don't get Cooper Flag,
what's gonna happen?
Speaker 4 (45:33):
Right?
Speaker 6 (45:33):
Well, if you don't get Cooper flag and okay, that
you can make do with you know, plear X or
player Y or player Z and be and be fairly
satisfying with him.
Speaker 3 (45:44):
I couldn't agree with you more.
Speaker 2 (45:46):
I was fun, guys, being able to discuss it a
little bit. And what's really fun is it really looks
like at least Round two of the NBA Playoffs has
often run and has had some really good games this week.
Speaker 3 (45:56):
So let's see what takes place.
Speaker 2 (45:58):
We'll catch up again here is or get closer to
Jim the regular lottery or not lottery draft, which will
come up in the final week of June, and then
we're off and running into the off season free agency
and such. So always fun when we get a chance
to catch up. Mister John Deschaser, analyst for the Pelicans
Radio Network and the Pells voice on the Radius to Tadgraphinee,
(46:19):
thank you for that backpack.
Speaker 5 (46:20):
By the way, You're welcome and Thank you guys, and
thank you Jim.
Speaker 3 (46:25):
I didn't forget about you here of course. Thank you
as always for tuning us.
Speaker 2 (46:28):
Hey, you be listening to special edition of the New
Orleans Pelicans podcast.
Speaker 3 (46:32):
We'll see you next time.
Speaker 1 (46:33):
Thanks for listening to the New Orleans Pelicans Podcast. Join
us three times per week on pelicans dot com, the
Pelicans mobile app, the iHeartRadio app, or where you get
your podcast, and be sure to give Jim and Guss
a follow on x at Jim Underscore I can offer
(46:54):
and Gcap Underscore seventeen. We'll see you next time right
here on the New Orleans Pelicans Podcast
Welcome in to the New Orleans Pelicans Podcast, the official
podcast of your New Orleans Pelicans, a podcast dedicated to
everything you need to know about the squad. Here from players, coaches, broadcasters,
and those who cover the NBA on a daily basis.
It's time to flock up. The New Orleans Pelicans Podcast
(00:29):
starts right now.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
All right, Tom, now for a very special radio roundtable
as we get you ready for the NBA Draft Lottery.
Here to explain everything is none other than NBA Commissioner
Adam Silver actually is too busy, so Jim I can
offer Pelicans dot Com.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
We'll get a chance to explain it to us.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
John the Chaser Tigraph needing, the voices of the radio
network for the Pelicans. We'll give their takes in and all.
But Jim, let's just kind of start with that overall
aspect of it. Why the lottery, what's the lottery and
what does it mean to the pouse.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
The lottery is for the fourteen teams that did not
make the playoffs. There's going to be some details that
make it a lot more complicated than that. This year,
with some of the trades that have happened, some of
the teams that have protected picks. Maybe we'll get into
that later, don't have enough time to do that right
now before we get into the roundtable. But Pelicans, to
make a long story short, they have a twelve point
five percent chance of winning the lottery. This is actually
(01:24):
the highest pre lottery slot that they've had since they
were also fourth in twenty twelve, so it's been a
while that they've gone into the lottery with this kind
of chance to actually be a winner, even though they
did win it in twenty nineteen as well, with only
six percent chance to win. They also have about a
forty eight percent chance of finishing in the top four.
And just as a reminder, that's the only thing that's
(01:45):
really determined that the lottery is the first four picks
after that five through fourteen are based on reverse order
of record from the previous regular season, so that's what
the Pelicans are looking at the look. They've got a
roughly half and half chance of finishing in the top four.
They also they actually could pick anywhere from one through
eight in any of those eight spots, so hopefully a
(02:07):
worst case scenario doesn't happen where they drop all the
way down to eighth. There's only a two point two
percent chance of that happening. But Monday night, six pm Central,
that is the lottery. That's what we're gonna be looking
forward to, one of the biggest nights of the offseason.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
All Right, Todd and JD. That's a lot of math
for me.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
I'll just wait to see the you know, team logos
on those envelopes. But Todd, we have seen the Pelicans
logo Horns logo pop up twice before in franchise history.
Zion Williamson, Anthony Davis, So start with you, sir, What
would winning the lottery or finishing even the top four
mean for this team, a team that you saw up
in close and personal.
Speaker 5 (02:48):
Well, a couple things, gus mean. Obviously, getting a top
four pick would uninject some life into the franchise. You know,
after the tough year, you know, twenty one wins. You
get some people that are going to get excited about
the possibility of getting a good player, whoever it may be.
The other thing is, depending on what Joe Dumars in
(03:12):
company want to do other than the number one pick,
who I think is a consensus right now and everybody
knows who that is. They might want to get Rid
of the pick and maybe acquire some other assets. Maybe
that's what their game plan is. So you know, that's
a little tougher to do when you're six or above.
But when you're in the top four, especially maybe two
(03:34):
through four, you're going to have some opportunities or some
options as a franchise to maybe say, look, we don't
like maybe two, three or four, whoever that may be,
and maybe try to trade back, acquire some other assets
and try to help yourself down the road. So I
think it's important to get that top four in a
(03:55):
couple of different ways.
Speaker 6 (03:57):
Yeah, I can't say much better than that, you know,
I think obviously it means hope after after that kind
of season, you inject the new life, as Grass just said,
and that's what we're looking for, some some kind of
adrenaline jolt. You know, you had kind of one adrenaline
jolt and Joe Dumars being hired as you know, president
(04:18):
of basketball ops. That's not sexy, Okay, it's not. What
is sexy is the infusion of talent on the court,
where you get a player who can who can add
into this mix that you have. And and look, I
don't I don't necessarily as Graft said, you know, unless
it's the number one overall pick, I will say this,
this team has shown the ability to develop its draft
(04:41):
picks Eve mecI, Herb Jones, Trey Murphy. It has shown
the ability to develop its draft picks. And we're still
along the lines with Jordan Hawkins. We'll see how that goes,
but it has shown that it can. It can find
a guy who fits what they do and work that
guy in so hopefully, you know, worst case scenario, you
(05:01):
figure they'll be able to do that. Best case scenario,
you get the guy that you really really want and
you get that jolto adrenaline.
Speaker 4 (05:09):
I think finishing the top four to me, would also
soothe kind of some of the pain that we experienced
from the season. I feel like in the entire time
we've been here, there haven't been that many extended stretches
where the team's out of the race. So I thought
what we went through in March and April was definitely difficult.
So I would feel a little bit better about that
that some of the agony that we went through in
the last few weeks of the season, that it was
(05:30):
worth it that you ended up with a pick in
the top four and also too, I mean just I mean,
if you get the number one pick, number two pick,
I think one of the impacts could be too that
maybe it changes the entire perspective of what other moves
you're gonna make during the course of the offseason. So
I think it would be it would be very significant
to finish in the top four, but especially obviously number one.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
Well, I can't think of a more superstitious person in
the world, literally other than you maybe head coach Rick
Jones from back in the day to lane baseball tiger An. So,
do you have any good luck charm or do you
or you know, will you not watch the television, you
go take a walk, will you blindfold yourself? Like do
you Is there anything you're going to do to try
(06:12):
to get the best possible outcome scenario for the Pelicans.
Speaker 5 (06:18):
No, I do not have any type of or No,
I'm I am a game day type, routine oriented superstition type.
I don't have any physical rabbit's foot or or a
four leaf clover or anything like that. That stuff doesn't work. Uh,
it's only during the game that that's what That's how
(06:41):
I roll, That's how I've always rolled. It's called routine oriented.
It's not superstition. Gust let's kind of trade.
Speaker 7 (06:47):
That's the thing.
Speaker 6 (06:48):
I'm not superstitious. I'm not a little stitious. I'm no stitious.
It doesn't it doesn't if I don't have any control
over it, it doesn't really bother me.
Speaker 7 (06:57):
Now, do I want the team to get the number one?
But of course I did.
Speaker 6 (07:00):
But you know, in terms of being on pins and needles,
I mean, I'll watch it for the drama of seeing
you know, where the team is going to draft, obviously,
and and will hope for the best. But you know,
I'm not gonna you know, I'm not gonna double over
in the fetal position if they if they don't get
you know, one or two overall, because again, I figure
they'll be able to pick a good player who'll fit in.
(07:21):
And and it's not like I don't think that the
Pelicans need like reconstructive surgery. I mean, you know, we're
depending a lot on on on ifs and help. But
you know, you're talking about some of the freakish injuries
to Herb Jones and Trey Murphy and the John Tay Murray,
and you know, you look at the possibilities of getting
those guys back, and then you don't feel like you
(07:42):
have to have Cooper flag, although that would be wonderful,
wouldn't it. But you don't feel like you just have
to get the guy. You feel like you can make
do with the guys you have. And if those guys
are playing to their capabilities and get and get reasonable
health and I just say reasonable health, I don't even
say good health now, just reasonable health, that they'll be
a pretty good team.
Speaker 7 (08:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
I want to echo a lot of what JD talked
about too, in terms of, you know, it's important, it
would be amazing for the Pelicans have a number one pick,
But there's no way that you can go into this
saying like your day is going to be ruined if
they don't win the lottery or if they don't finish
top two or three. I mean I talked to a
lot of people throughout the season who said, you know,
talking about different teams like Utah or Washington, Oh, you
(08:24):
know their plan is going to.
Speaker 8 (08:25):
Be the get the number one pick and blah blah blah.
Speaker 4 (08:27):
I'm like, fourteen percent is not a plan, which is
the odds that you have for to win, even if
you you could go oh in eighty two in the
regular season, and you still only have a fourteen percent chance.
Speaker 8 (08:37):
So that's why I say, like, that's not a plan.
That's a hope. That's a good hope, is not a plan,
right right, And then in.
Speaker 4 (08:43):
Terms of the superstition part of it, along the same lines,
I think of what both of you guys said. I'm
operating by the philosophy that you know what worked for
me in twenty twelve and in twenty nineteen doing absolutely nothing.
So I'm gonna stick with that philosophy and that strategy.
I have no SUPERSTI I have no trinkets, I have
no lucky charm, and it works before, so maybe it'll work.
Speaker 8 (09:05):
Again for a third time. In the last fifteen years or.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
So, I forgot about it. I was outside playing with
the kid.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
Actually, I was waiting for Air Force one to fly over,
you know me, Todd, I love my planes. And there
it goes, and then I hear from the inside somebody yelling.
I think it was Anna, we won the lottery, so
right inside it looked at what it was. So maybe
I don't pay attention to it. I don't know you're
talking about.
Speaker 8 (09:29):
Twenty nineteen, Yes, yeah, okay, so I didn't really.
Speaker 3 (09:32):
Pay attention to that. All right, So I guess all
of us will wait and see.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
Here's an interesting one based on records, right, I mean,
or I guess chances Jazz, Wizards, Hornets, Pails, seventy six Ers, Nets, Raptors, Spurs, Blazers,
all within that area there. If the Pels don't win it, Todd,
is there a team that you would or fanshire root
for to win? I think I can safely say you
don't want the.
Speaker 3 (09:56):
Jest to win it.
Speaker 5 (09:58):
Well, Gus, I mean you're gonna take all my answers.
That's fine, Yeah, thank you. If it's not the Pelicans,
then you would hope it'd be Washington or Charlotte or
even Philly. You know, Washington and Charlotte they pose no
threat to the Pelicans what the Pelicans are trying to
do Philly. I mean, I don't feel sorry for anybody,
(10:19):
but you kind of kind of feel sorry for him
a little bit considering what happened MBID in the last
couple of years. Again, I don't feel sorry for anybody,
but it's been tough for them. Uh maybe could they
could use a jolt, But yeah, Washington and Charlotte. Yeah,
And as far as the other side, the Utah Jazz
absolutely positively cannot, must not, will not, would not be
(10:40):
allowed to win the lottery, even though it's not technically
being allowed to win the lottery. But what they have
done in the last couple of years, which is basically
make the game a sham with what they have done
as far as what they have you know, reported injury wise,
and who is played and who has not played. For
them to be rewarded with winning the lottery Carmel wise
would just be a It'd be a crime in my estimation.
(11:03):
And let me put it to you this way. They
just extended their head coach will Hardy. He just got
a contract extension after tanking the last two years. Now
you think they're tanking on purpose?
Speaker 8 (11:15):
This is saying, of course they are. This is saying,
thank you for putting up with the misery.
Speaker 5 (11:19):
That you through perfectly, Coach Marty, you have done everything
we have asked you to do. How can you allow
that team to win the lottery.
Speaker 6 (11:27):
I believe we would call that the process two point
zero or something or some such. I wouldn't mind Charlotte
or winning it, or Philly winning it from a purely
selfish standpoint of I want the Pelicans to get a
point guard. Those two teams have point guard and they'll
need one, So so from a selfish standpoint, those are
(11:48):
the two picks I'm totally in in Graft's corner with
with Utah not winning it. But you know, those two
teams I could live with winning the lottery because they
don't need with the Pelicans need, I think, and so
then they would therefore bypass the point guard, and that
would give the Pills another opportunity, a better opportunity to
(12:09):
get one that I think. You know, I'm not in
anybody's head over there, but I think they need one.
Speaker 4 (12:15):
I also had Washington and Charlotte as the main teams
that I'm going to root for. One of the notes
about the Hornets that I thought was really unbelievable is
they've made the playoffs three times out of the last
twenty one years, but during that entire span where they've
been in the lottery eighteen times, they've only won it once.
And a lot of those years they've had bad records too,
where the percentage was really high. So I feel a
(12:36):
little bit of sympathy towards them that I would like
to see them win it. Personal note too, I also
have a good friend who works for Charlotte who was
furious with me in twenty nineteen when the Pelicans won
the lottery and the Hornets didn't. And also in twenty twelve,
the Pelican when it was still the New Orleans Hornets,
they got the number one pick Anthony Davis. The Charlotte
ened up a second they were the Bobcats and had
(12:58):
Michael kid Gilchrist like.
Speaker 8 (13:00):
There's a little bit of luck.
Speaker 4 (13:02):
Maybe that needs to go towards Charlotte. You guys mentioned
Philly too. If they win the lottery, that means that
okay See doesn't get a first round pick. Philly's pick
is only top six protected, so if it drops to
okay Se could end up with a seventh pick in
this draft, which is unbelievable. So I guess if you
don't want to see okay See end up with a pick,
you could also root for Philly. I will say, though,
(13:25):
I'm against Philly winning the lottery only because they've had
so much success the last few years. It doesn't feel
like they're a team that deserves a lot number one pick,
because I mean, they've had a bunch of maybe they
haven't gotten past the second round famously, but they also
have won a ton of regular season games in recent years.
Speaker 5 (13:41):
I will say this though, Jim and j D. If
Charlotte does win, I mean again, you know who they're
gonna pick, who, of course goes to school just right
down the road from Charlotte. Are we uh gonna get
into the frozen envelope? Patrick Ewing? Of course there's gonna
be some because it Charlotte does win. Are we going
(14:02):
to get into all that?
Speaker 4 (14:03):
You realize though that I say this almost every year
there's fourteen teams in the lottery. There's usually about ten
to twelve conspiracies that you could come up with before
the lottery happens. So I feel like the frozen envelope
conspiracy thing, there's almost always a way that you can
say it for every team, so it's it doesn't really
I don't know how much stock you can really put
(14:23):
in that. When you can find a theory for just
about every team that's involved in the lottery.
Speaker 6 (14:27):
Well, the biggest theory is if they've been in the
lottery eighteen years out of the last twenty one and
Adam Silver wants them obviously to get the hometown boy
to make up for some of that agony of them
just out. Jim said that a while ago, and there
I can't think of a better word to fit last season.
It got to be pretty agonizing at times.
Speaker 3 (14:47):
It's interesting.
Speaker 2 (14:48):
Out of the first I guess eight teams worst record wise,
three are in the Western Conference, so a lot of
Eastern Conference teams gentlemen that are in there as well.
Pells four double of the pells would be the eight spot.
That's where the Spurs imagined Wenby.
Speaker 3 (15:01):
With yeah exactly.
Speaker 2 (15:02):
So yeah, you're giving me so we don't even want
to speak that and too fruition here.
Speaker 3 (15:08):
But look, we will keep an eye on it and
see what happens here. But I'm going to give you
all a little.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
Bit more responsibility here in this podcast graph JD. Jim
going to make you The lotteries are about that.
Speaker 3 (15:19):
So do you like the format? Do you not like
the format? Would you make changes to the format.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
There's been a lot of different discussions about the lottery format.
Speaker 3 (15:28):
If you were to make a change, what would.
Speaker 5 (15:30):
Be the change. I don't think I would have a change,
per se. I think the only thing And again I'm
going into the who's winning on who's winning and who
is losing on purpose. I just think it's it's difficult to,
you know, give the flowers to a team that you
(15:52):
know has not been trying their best, and that's where
we are with the Jazz. But I would what I
would say is the bottom four teams should be almost
guaranteed to have top four picks. That that, to me
would be the change. Like if you're the fourth worst
team like the Pelicans are, and you pick eighth, that's
(16:15):
that's tough. You know what, though, you're gonna be that's tough.
Speaker 4 (16:18):
You're gonna make the teams losing at the end of
the season problem worse by doing it that way, though, that's.
Speaker 8 (16:22):
With you, and that's the project.
Speaker 5 (16:23):
I'm gonna have any type of real significant change.
Speaker 8 (16:27):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (16:27):
I mean, look, I watched the This Magic Moment thirty
for thirty just a couple of days ago, which was
just you know, they had Shack and Penny the Magic
got the number one pick two drafts in a row.
They were they had the worst record one year they
got Shack, then they improved twenty five games, they had
(16:49):
fifty wins, but didn't make the playoffs, so they got
into the lottery. They had one ping pong ball in
the sixty five ping pong balls in the hopper, and
they won.
Speaker 7 (17:01):
That was the cold one.
Speaker 5 (17:04):
But again, what do you They had the least amount
of chance to win, but they won, So in that essence,
that truly was a lottery and they got penny hardaway.
But so I don't think I would have any type
of major changes per se. I just the only thing
is you would hope there'd be some type of better
guarantee that you'd get a really good pick if you
(17:25):
were that bad.
Speaker 7 (17:27):
See.
Speaker 6 (17:27):
I've seen some theories because I wanted to be equitable.
I don't want Utah to be rewarded for what for
the mockery it made of the game. And I saw
a theory that said, you know, maybe the bottom I
don't know, four or eight teams or something, you know,
the last fifteen twenty games, whoever has the best one
loss record showing they're trying to win is the lottery winner. Yeah,
(17:53):
And that way you don't, And that way you don't
have teams purposefully trying to lose.
Speaker 7 (17:59):
And be reward it for it. You're more rewarded.
Speaker 6 (18:02):
Even though you're not a winning team that year, you're
more rewarded for trying to win down the stretch. And
so I don't now, I don't know how that can
be implemented, and I don't have any great ideas on
it because I was I was like, look, just figure
out a way to just go back and make it
even across the board for all those teams and that way,
(18:22):
you know, but then you have a team in the
lottery who's you know, a fifty win team that wins
the lottery that wasn't designed to win the lottery over
an eighteen win team. So I don't know of a
good solution for it, but I know the NBA has
got to figure out something because you cannot have teams
do what Utah has done.
Speaker 7 (18:41):
You cannot.
Speaker 6 (18:42):
You you spit on the integrity of the game, and
it really is off putting, an unattractive and all those
things when you're seeing teams not trying to compete.
Speaker 5 (18:53):
And then you extend their coach.
Speaker 6 (18:55):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, and which is which is the
tell that hey, we were trying to lose, you're safe,
You're good to go. And in this game, in everything's
supposed to be about winning, That that's the essence of it.
You know, as as Bill Parcells famously said, you are
what your record says you are, well, obviously Will hard
and what his record says he is, because if scene
(19:17):
extended him, gave him more years and more money for
having the kinds of seasons that they've had a couple
of years.
Speaker 7 (19:24):
And that's just that's an awful, awful look for the league.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
Real quickly before we get to Gym's format change or
just the thoughts on it. And I want to ask you,
because you covered the Saints as well, why does it
work in the NFL?
Speaker 4 (19:37):
Then?
Speaker 2 (19:37):
Because, like I tell I listened to you know, I
go back to the final week this past season of
the regular season, Saints at Tampa.
Speaker 3 (19:44):
They let at halftime like they were trying to win
that game. You can see it. They were competitive towards
the end of the season there. So why why is
the NFL work? I know they they changed it well,
but the.
Speaker 7 (19:56):
NFL kind of has a little soft tank too. I
mean it's not you know, you we don't have everybody
like really really really trying.
Speaker 6 (20:03):
And I'm not saying the Saints were one of those teams,
but the Saints were five and twelve last year, and
they were working with backup quarterbacks at the time. But
I've seen situations where I remember a couple of years
ago Tampa Bay and I don't know if it was
before Jamis was drafted to what, but they were leading
the Saints at halftime in Tampa and pulled their players,
pulled them all, pulled all the starters, pulled them and said,
(20:26):
we don't want to win this game basically, And so
you can see that in the NFL. It can happen
in the NFL, it just it just looks different.
Speaker 7 (20:34):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (20:35):
I've started to have that debate with some football people too,
who say to me, there's no tanking in the NFL.
And as you mentioned in the example that you came
up with, I definitely think it's starting to creep into
the NFL. I mean, there was a team that was
fined heavily a couple of years ago because of well,
I can't remember the specific details with Miami, but there
was something like they publicly more or less admitted that
(20:56):
they were losing games. Yeah, the allegation was that the
owner told a head coach to throw some games. And look,
last year the Giants were gonna say the Giants were
trying to win. Yeah, the Giants did not look like
a franchise that was trying to win.
Speaker 8 (21:11):
I mean, the fact that it's starting to seep in
the NFL is a bad idea. It's a bad thing.
Speaker 4 (21:16):
I mean, there's It just has such a kind of
a deteriorating effect on a league and a sport and
just the I don't know, at the end of the season,
it just makes things so much worse and so much
less interesting to watch. To go back to a couple
before I get into my commissioner for a day, ideas
to go back to a couple of things that you
said JD two, I think one of the things that's
(21:37):
the most disturbing about what Utah has done recently and
what Philadelphia did during the process, is that it's a
multi year thing. I think it's not great. If a
team does it once, it's still bad for the league.
And I think it's something that if the NBA can
root this out, would be great. But the fact that Utah,
it seems like they've had three years in a row
where they either were competitive for the first couple.
Speaker 8 (21:59):
Months and then we're just like, ah, now we're good.
Let's just not be competitive or.
Speaker 4 (22:02):
This season where I mean they were sitting guys in
December and January for rest On, not in back to backs.
Speaker 8 (22:08):
That's the part of it that was so alarming to me.
Speaker 5 (22:11):
I'm not trying to cut you off, Jim, You're good.
Oklahoma City did it too. They just finished what do
you think Oklahoma City is so good right now? And
all the first round picks and getting chet Holme.
Speaker 7 (22:22):
They did the same thing too.
Speaker 5 (22:24):
People forget that they're lost for three years, for three
years to get to where they are right now.
Speaker 6 (22:30):
And unless you I mean, if you're the league, how
do you how do you regulate that? How do you
manage it? Because if you're not boots on the ground
and in the franchise headquarters, how do you say that
guy and hurt he should be playing?
Speaker 7 (22:46):
How do you say? You know what? Well, Walker Kessler
shouldn't be shooting three?
Speaker 4 (22:50):
You know?
Speaker 7 (22:51):
How do you you know? I mean, how do you
how do you regulate it? Yeah?
Speaker 4 (22:56):
I think the I think from the comments that the
league has made about it, they've said the same thing
that you just mentioned. It's just like impossible from the
outside looking in to legislate this. They don't want to
get into playing time decisions. They want to get into
injuries with certain guys and certain teams.
Speaker 8 (23:12):
So that is the difficult part about it.
Speaker 4 (23:13):
But I mean, I think that kind of leads me
to I have two separate ideas that I think could
help fix this or at least help the situation a
little bit. One the first one is The Athletic had
an article a few weeks ago where they said they
floated the idea that I really like and I think
is interesting that if you finish with the worst record
in the league, you can't pick number one. They said,
(23:35):
if you finished with the worst record, you automatically end
up with a fourth pick.
Speaker 8 (23:40):
What that would do obviously, it would make.
Speaker 4 (23:42):
It so you're not rewarded for being the worst team
in the league, But it also would make it so
that teams would at the bottom of the standings would
try everything they could to not be the worst team.
So all of a sudden, instead of having teams like
Utah and Washington that went down to the last day
of this past regular season where they had the same
number of wins and everybody was like, oh, the Wizards
won the last game. I can't believe it. They lost
(24:03):
a chance to be the number one spot. Instead, you
would have those teams in that situation trying to win
so they didn't have the worst record.
Speaker 8 (24:10):
So I really like that idea.
Speaker 4 (24:11):
I think there's a lot of potential to that because
the race to the bottom wouldn't be possible because teams
would say, we can't finish number one because there's a
guy coming out in the draft that we really like,
and we know if we finished with the worst record,
we have no chance to get them.
Speaker 8 (24:24):
So I like that idea.
Speaker 4 (24:26):
And the other thing I think JD referenced this a
little bit, but kind of just fleshing this out a
little bit more. I think the downside of having equal
odds for everyone in the lottery is what JD said,
where you could have a team that just misses the
playoffs and ends up with the number one pick, and
everyone across the leams the league screams bloody murder because
(24:46):
this team that doesn't deserve to pick number one has
the pick. But I think, what's with what's happened at
the end of the regular season in the last few years.
I think I'm not I'm way less concerned about that
than I am. Making the end of the regular season
more of a legit thing and did not have all
these situations where on April fifth, there's six games in
the league and four of them are waste of your
(25:06):
time because in four of the games there's a team
that is playing guys that don't deserve to be in
the NBA, et cetera, et cetera. So I would like
to see equal odds for the lottery for all fourteen teams,
because I think that would solve so many things at
the end of the season. It would completely take out
the motivation to lose because you would know going into
the lottery that if you're in the lottery, you have
(25:28):
exactly the same odds as the other thirteen teams that
are in it. It doesn't help you to lose a
game at the end of the season at all because
it's not going to change your status. And so I
think that's an idea that and I think we've also
seen too that whoever you want to blame for this,
you want to blame analytics, you want to blame front
offices that think that they're smarter than everybody. I feel
(25:49):
like that's become a problem as well as that some
of the front offices have gotten to the point where
it's like they just think that they're smarter than everyone.
You if you have any situation and you guys can
tell me if you agree with this or not. If
you have a situation where it's the last day of
the season and you tell a team, if you lose
this game, you have a fourteen point one percent chance.
(26:11):
If you win it, you have a thirteen point nine
percent chance. I feel like we've gotten to the point
in the NBA, and it's kind of embarrassing to say
this where a lot of the teams are like, we
want that fourteen point one, we want that zero point
two better increased chance. So the point being that as
long as you have any incentive at all to me
to reward teams that lose, you're gonna see teams do it,
even if it's the most minuscule thing.
Speaker 8 (26:33):
And I guess if you think about it too.
Speaker 4 (26:36):
In twenty nineteen, they flatten the odds to make it
so that the worst teams in the league had less
of a chance to win. It didn't really solve it
because as long as teams have any shred of an
advantage with the way that they look at things and
the way they look at analytics and the way that
some of these teams are clearly willing and able to
throw away the latter part of.
Speaker 8 (26:54):
The season, they're gonna do it.
Speaker 4 (26:56):
So to me, the only way that you can purely
get to the point where it's like no team is
motivated and no team is doing brash things to lose
games the way that allegedly Utah did this season. The
only way to fix that, to me is to make
it equal odds, so that I would be in favor
of that, even if there's a downside of you're going
(27:16):
to have teams that are winning a lot more games
that still end up winning the lottery.
Speaker 6 (27:21):
Well, you said a phrase there that caught my ear
as the writer gym is. He said, it doesn't help
you to lose, which the flip side is it doesn't
hurt you to win. You can win and it doesn't
hurt you. I mean, you still can compete and still
be in the lottery and still have the exact same odds.
And I think something like that that will level it out,
because again, you got to be able to regulate this,
(27:43):
and that maybe that's the only way to regulate this
is to get teams off their rear ends and say, look,
it doesn't matter if if you don't want to play
your guys, go ahead, because that team that's playing their
guys that's going to win forty seven has got just
as good a chance of winning it as you do.
Speaker 4 (27:57):
I also thought the league believed that, not to put
words in other people's mouths, when they went from the
worst team in the league has twenty five percent chances
to win the lottery the way it used to be
to fourteen percent. I think the league believes, Okay, now
that that number has dropped so much, we're going to
see a drastic change in teams losing at the end
of the season, knowing that even if we have the
worst record, we only have a fourteen percent chance. But
(28:19):
that I don't think that's played out that way at all.
I think you still are seeing teams, as I referenced earlier,
people saying coming up to me and being like, oh,
you know, Utah is just gonna win the lottery, or
Washington's win the lottery.
Speaker 8 (28:29):
So even if it's fourteen.
Speaker 4 (28:31):
Percent, which is like we were saying, is not a plan,
you still see teams that are so motivated to end
up with that fourteen percent regardless.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
I think it's an interesting point both of you guys
bring it up, JD and Jim, and that I do
love the competitive nature of it, Toy. What if there's
the deadline, says all right, with six games left, best
record of those six in that order, right, good? So
it gives you incentive to try to win games, because
we even saw with this team, the guys that were
getting minutes on the court were there, they had f there, right,
(29:00):
they were trying.
Speaker 7 (29:01):
To do that.
Speaker 2 (29:02):
And I like what Jim is saying, Hey, I'm gonna
not make it complicated here. You finish with the worst record,
you're not.
Speaker 3 (29:08):
Getting the top seed. So it's up to y'all to
try to make that happen.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
I kind of like that aspect of it too, because
when you look at it at the end of the day,
it's about competitiveness. And maybe I wouldn't know if president
is the word that I would use, but the end
season tournament that the league has, right, it's only a
handful of games, not even six, right, it's like three
or four something like that. That you look at it
(29:33):
and you are doing win lost record, so you don't
really need that many games, but you do sort of
competitive dach on it. So maybe the cut off is
final five games of the year, best record gets the
top spot. So you know, the top four cut off
right there? Boom, top four, top six. I don't know
what are you think of that?
Speaker 5 (29:52):
You know, I think Jim's theory might work the best.
Speaker 8 (29:56):
Thank you.
Speaker 5 (29:56):
I was thinking about the athletic look. I was thinking
about the athletic article, which is very intriguing. The problem
I have with that is, what if you really are
truly bad?
Speaker 8 (30:08):
Too bad? That's the that's the answer that I would give,
you know, to bad.
Speaker 5 (30:14):
Okay, Okay, So the Pels have all the injuries that
we had this year, and you you just don't have
the horses to win games, and you're the and you
have the worst record.
Speaker 4 (30:25):
I mean, my counter to that would be that if
if it's because of the injuries, you're you weren't the
worst team in the league really anyways, you know what
I mean. But setting aside that specific example, I heard
somebody talk to me about this who's more of a
football guy than a basketball guy, and they made a
really good point that I thought.
Speaker 8 (30:43):
They said at this point the NBA, the.
Speaker 4 (30:45):
Bottom teams don't deserve fairness. They don't deserve the equity,
the equitable nature of the lottery, And I agree with that.
If you have if you have multiple occasions every year
of egregious cases of what some of what we talked
about today, where it's team that you know don't care
and aren't trying like to me, at that point, you
forfeit the ability to say, like, we need to be
(31:06):
treated fairly. It's it's the reason the system was put
in place was on the assumption that it works because
everyone's motivated to try to win, and that the team
that at the bottom purely is legitimately the worst team.
But I don't even know, can we really say that
in the last few years that the team that has
the worst record is really the quote unquote worst team.
Speaker 8 (31:26):
I think a lot of cases, well you can't tell
now exactly exactly. So the system is broken because of that.
Speaker 6 (31:32):
If a naive system, you're working on the honor system
you're talking about professional sports.
Speaker 7 (31:37):
Nobody's got that kind of honor.
Speaker 8 (31:39):
I meant, every man for himself.
Speaker 5 (31:41):
Let's be real, not the ultimate solution, but it will
never happen. You go like Premier League and regulate the
bottom three teams and they said, you send them to
the G League. Yeah, yeah, that'll get you winning.
Speaker 8 (31:52):
I have a feeling, I have a feeling the owners
will not go for that.
Speaker 7 (31:58):
I mean, I can. I can live with I can
live with gyms.
Speaker 6 (32:00):
I can live with flattening it out and everybody having
the same odds, which I've suggested before. Or I can
I can live with you know, maybe not the final
five games because that's a small sample size, but you know,
the last ten games, to make you hustle to the
finish line, you know, to make you hustle to the
finish line.
Speaker 7 (32:16):
I can. I can live with that. I can.
Speaker 6 (32:17):
I mean because now you won't get those situations where
you can look, you can look at the mashups and say, Okay,
we know this guy and this guy and this guy
ain't gonna play because they're trying to lose, you know,
this handful of guy look, and I know Philly was
banged up. Philly came in here and put a would
(32:38):
you call it a G League team? I mean, they
ran a G League team out on the on the court,
and some of the guys you know, you know, I
think Maxie probably would have been able to play if
they if there was something to play four and so
I just those situations just you know, you see where
fans get really turned off by the prop by what's
going on because they saying, we're not seeing you know,
(33:02):
not just not just the attempt to win, but we're
not seeing good faith effort.
Speaker 5 (33:06):
Look, we could really get in the weeds in this
thing because you throw on top of that, John, I mean,
these teams that are actively trying to lose towards the
end of the season are playing teams that are actively
trying to win, yes, and improve their playoff positions. So
you're giving these teams that are fighting for fifth or
fourth or second or third, you're giving them free wins,
(33:28):
and that affects everybody else they're playing. Again, So again,
we could go, we could go all day on this.
Speaker 2 (33:34):
I love what you guys are coming up on from
this aspect. We all agree, and it's all four of
us that is palpable.
Speaker 3 (33:40):
It's visible. We can see whether.
Speaker 7 (33:43):
Look, the league find people because they know.
Speaker 2 (33:47):
I've said that during the regular season on one of
the broadcasts that if you get fined, you're done. You're
automatically eliminated from being able to win it.
Speaker 3 (33:55):
Right, I mean if the league for the league to
find you.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
They must feel you egregiously or tanking or not putting
in the best product.
Speaker 3 (34:04):
So you're done. So maybe we start with that, Hey,
I find you for specifically not competing, you have lost
the shot.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
But to back up on your point, there's three instances
that popped in my head that you were talking about
where competing actually has helped the league. And in instances
you're a baseball guy. I'm a baseball guy. Adding those
extra wildcards? How exciting is the final week? How many
times in the last couple of years it's made September better?
Speaker 3 (34:27):
Right, we've seen those last weekends.
Speaker 2 (34:30):
We've had to play Monday Tuesday games right to get
to that wallcard spot. In the NFL, adding that extra
wildcard spot right at first, I don't know what.
Speaker 3 (34:39):
Now it's seven teams.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
And that and baallet for that extra spot means a
little bit. And as we said in the NBA, oh man, wait,
you already put in eight. We don't need nine or ten.
How exciting has the play in been for that league.
So that's three leagues, three instances where competing.
Speaker 3 (34:57):
At the end, four teams that are at the top.
Speaker 1 (34:59):
But it.
Speaker 2 (35:00):
That extra shot to get in makes it worth well.
So maybe I like what we're seeing here. Maybe competition
is the best way to go about it.
Speaker 7 (35:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (35:09):
And you know, by the way, Gus, you realize too,
if the NBA had your rule instituted, your rule about
if you get fined, you get bumped out of the lottery,
you don't get to participate, Derek Lively would not be
a Dallas Maverick right now, because they the league, actually
the Mavericks. And I can't explain the wisdom the lack
of intelligence here. They basically public publicly said we don't
(35:30):
want to make the play in. We're going to lose
these games on the last weekend and the league find them.
But because they lost those couple games two years ago,
they ended up in the lottery. They picked I think
was eleventh or twelfth. They ended up with Derek Lively.
He was a huge component to them making the finals
the next year. So I love that idea, though, I
think if you if you're at the point where the
league is finding you, you don't deserve to be participating it.
Speaker 6 (35:52):
But I mean, that's that's grab me. I mean, that's
just so far into weeds. That's so nuanced, because if
I'm saying we're holding the guy out because of his ankle,
the league can't till me his ankle don't hurt. If
we're holding the guy out because of his back, the
league can't till me his back don't hurt.
Speaker 4 (36:09):
I think you if you do it only in cases though,
where there's a clear I mean, if if it's so egregious,
I think when yeah, what Utah did was a clear
violation of the rules that have been laid out, and
then obviously Dallas admitted that they that they weren't following
the policy. So I think if you if you just
limit it to those, I think you avoid the league
being in some you know, dicey situations or some you
(36:32):
know where you're it's kind of vague of whether they
should step in or not. I think if you leave
it to just the times where there's been a jury
has ruled against you, I think then that's fine.
Speaker 8 (36:43):
If we could just stick to that, I'll love.
Speaker 7 (36:45):
It all right.
Speaker 3 (36:45):
Final thing for you guys, twenty twelve, twenty nineteen.
Speaker 2 (36:48):
The last two times and only two times, the franchise
has won the lottery, So titles start with you, JD
and Jim, give me your most vivid memory of twenty
twelve twenty nineteen.
Speaker 5 (36:57):
I can't help you with twenty twelve. That that's too
far back. I got a great twenty nineteen story, if
you can bear.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
Yes.
Speaker 5 (37:05):
So uh so, Gus did his talk show, you know,
for many, many years, and he was on the air
all during that time. When of course it's Alloyd, the
Pelicans are gonna win the lottery. They're gonna get Zion Williamson,
They're gonna get in. I'm you know, listening to the
show or being on the show, and all I'm doing
is roll in my eyes day after day or texting him.
(37:26):
I'm like, you're insane. The Pelicans will never win the lottery.
They have no chance or wasting everybody's time. I mean,
this was a daily, daily thing. Hey, maybe Gus talked
it into it, you know, he spoke it into existence. Anyway,
let's go to lottery night. I'm with Tulane. I'm doing
a baseball game that night. I'm broadcasting the game floor level.
(37:48):
I actually was doing it next to the dugout and
lottery's going on or it's about to start, and we're
about in the third inning and it's about what seven ten,
so yeah, it's about the third inning. And my phone
just starts exploding and I'm like, well, what's going on.
I'm looking on Pelicans win lottery, but you know, I'm
(38:09):
getting all then I'm like no in a way, and
I'm on the air and I'm like, the Pelicans just
won the lottery. I don't believe this. I can't and
this is during the baseball game. So I just I
was just mind blown off. Could think about was Gus
who literally spoke it into existence today day after day
after day when I said there was no chance whatsoever.
(38:31):
So that's my story.
Speaker 3 (38:33):
Packs by the way, thank you.
Speaker 6 (38:35):
Well, I'm I'm I can't remember the exact words, but
but my memory is from twenty nineteen, and I'm pretty
sure with Alvin Gentry, who when they won it said
blank yeah.
Speaker 5 (38:47):
Which I thought, which I thought was a huge myth.
Speaker 7 (38:51):
Marketing wife, just you print those T shirts T shirt?
Speaker 5 (38:56):
My wife had one. They passed the t all day.
Speaker 7 (38:59):
Do I didn't see one because I would have five.
Speaker 5 (39:02):
They passed those T shirts out on Draft night in
uh in the Square. Okay, no, no, no no, but
I did not see the you and the first word
had an asterisk.
Speaker 8 (39:16):
Okay, I don't know had a shirt.
Speaker 6 (39:18):
Look, I'd have done it and I'd have stuck it
on every seat in the arena for the opening.
Speaker 7 (39:23):
I mean, I just and I was like, where is
that shirt? And why don't we have them?
Speaker 4 (39:29):
By the way, I've always said that the video of
Elvin Gentry in that room that that the NBA put
out was a true test of people's character and what
kind of person if you look at the other if
you look at the other executives in that room, there
was a couple guys, I think the guy from Miami,
his name is Andy Elsberg. He gave Elvin a pat
(39:49):
on the back, he congratulated him, he said, yeah, awesome man.
And then there's a couple other people that were nearby, including,
if I believe, a certain Lakers executive who had a
very angry look on his There was no you know,
it's not like Elvin could control winning it or not.
But I just thought it was funny to see the
different reactions of the people in the room. Some people
were very gracious in congratulating him, others were not so
(40:12):
much so. But my memory from that from twenty nineteen
actually was so I was in Chicago for the lottery
in the room when the Pelicans won it, and all
the people that were there covering the team were looking
at each other like, we can't believe that just happened,
because they had if you remember, they had the seventh
pre lottery slot, so they had they only had the
seventh best chance to win the lottery, and then they
(40:33):
ended up winning it. But one of the funny vivid
memories for me was so I was in Chicago for
the lottery and then there to cover the draft combine,
and so the next day the draft combine started, and
everyone who knew that I was there with the Pelicans
or covering the Pelicans was tapping me on the back
saying congratulations, and they were also like, they're also like,
I guess you could leave now, right, because what's the
(40:55):
point of you even being here for the draft combine.
So I always thought that was funny that people it.
It made me feel good that people were happy for me,
but also it was kind of it was hilarious that
people were just saying to me, like, you can just
leave now, Like what's the point of even scouting. It's
not like you don't know who they're gonna pick. So
there's my memory, by.
Speaker 5 (41:12):
The way, and the timing is everything thing. Little did
I know that about a month later I would get
the job here after that a lottery so perfect it
was pretty awesome when you think about it.
Speaker 2 (41:23):
Close off here, let's thirty seconds or less. I feel different, though,
don't yoe from twenty twelve to nineteen?
Speaker 3 (41:30):
Or is it the same?
Speaker 2 (41:31):
And what I mean by that is like I look
at twelve and nineteen You're like, can we just get
a player to sort of build? Or I look at
this team and maybe I don't know, it's wishful thinking,
but we've done our our podcast gym and in player profiles.
You guys have been a part of that here as
well into the season reviews.
Speaker 3 (41:49):
Unlike those seasons, this team has talent. It's just getting healthy.
I mean, am I wrong with that?
Speaker 2 (41:55):
Like did you feel going into twenty twelve like they
had time and this would just help? And in nineteen
whereas he or I'm like, whatever you get in the
lottery is going to help. What I believe is a
team with talent? Does that make sense? I feel different?
Speaker 3 (42:11):
I mean I thought we.
Speaker 5 (42:12):
Had talent in twenty nineteen. Personally, I mean I thought
we had enough players to win. I mean, but you
know what really nobody could have foreseen was Zion got
hurt in the fifth game of the preseason and we
really never recovered if you think about it, because he
was supposed to really be the missing piece that was
going to bring it all together. You know, you had
(42:33):
Lonzo Ball, you had Drew Holliday, you had Brandon Ingram.
He would have been another. I mean, we saw how
well that team was playing towards the end, and then
Covid hit. I mean they were playing their best basketball
because they had all their pieces. So now twenty twelve
was a different story all to god. I mean, that
was just a bad team. If I'm not mistaken. I
(42:56):
mean I just thought twenty nineteen was a little bit different.
But no, I mean I'm with you, Gus, because I mean,
you're getting all these guys back next year. It's almost
like winning the lottery. You're getting Trey Murphy back, You're
getting Herb Jones back. You know, you're getting these pieces
that you did not have most of the season.
Speaker 4 (43:13):
I think to Gus's point that I would characterize each
of those three situations, including with this, you're being the
third one as different In that twenty twelve I think
you needed a franchise savior, needed somebody to and a
lot of teams that were in the lottery that year
looked at it like we got to win them. We
gotta get the number one pick because the drop off
after Anthony Davis is huge, and we need somebody who's
(43:34):
gonna come in and just change everything.
Speaker 8 (43:36):
But then twenty nineteen to.
Speaker 4 (43:38):
Me, wasn't It wasn't necessarily that you needed a savior
as much as you needed that huge jolt of positivity
after what we went through with Anthony Davis situation during
the eighteen nineteen season. This year is different because you
don't need a savior, you don't need talent. To me,
this is more of a supplement to what you already have.
So I do think that this year is different compared
(43:59):
to those previous times what they when they want it
just because of the circumstances around the team or roster
are different.
Speaker 6 (44:04):
Yeah, I feel no sense of desperation. As you mentioned
supplemental pieces, and I mean, you know thee the cel
Pells might pick somebody who who isn't necessarily a sexy
pick for the for the fan base, but might be
a good player for them. But you also can pick
a guy who who won't immediately be in a rotation.
This this team, if everybody is healthy, y'all hear me,
(44:28):
I'm knocking wood. If everybody is healthy, this is a
this is a fairly deep team. So you bring in
a guy one, you don't have to rush him.
Speaker 7 (44:37):
Two.
Speaker 6 (44:38):
He doesn't have to have that kind of pressure on
him to step out there and be and and be
a leader of the team immediately, and you can ease
him in while hopefully this team is winning games during
the process. So it just it feels a lot different
from that standpoint to where you know, yeah, I say,
I say, I want to see this team get a
(44:58):
point and if in, but even in a rookie point
going to a somewhat veteran team, it's gotta there's there's
a learning curve, you know. There, there's growing pains that
go along with it. I don't care how talented you are,
there are growing pains that go along with it. So
you know, I I but and yet still I want
one just because you know, I know that's the position
(45:20):
that I think the Bells need the most, just because
of the Johnte Murray. But again, I just I don't
feel a sense of, you know, just desperation that like, man,
if you don't get Man, if you don't get Cooper Flag,
what's gonna happen?
Speaker 4 (45:33):
Right?
Speaker 6 (45:33):
Well, if you don't get Cooper flag and okay, that
you can make do with you know, plear X or
player Y or player Z and be and be fairly
satisfying with him.
Speaker 3 (45:44):
I couldn't agree with you more.
Speaker 2 (45:46):
I was fun, guys, being able to discuss it a
little bit. And what's really fun is it really looks
like at least Round two of the NBA Playoffs has
often run and has had some really good games this week.
Speaker 3 (45:56):
So let's see what takes place.
Speaker 2 (45:58):
We'll catch up again here is or get closer to
Jim the regular lottery or not lottery draft, which will
come up in the final week of June, and then
we're off and running into the off season free agency
and such. So always fun when we get a chance
to catch up. Mister John Deschaser, analyst for the Pelicans
Radio Network and the Pells voice on the Radius to Tadgraphinee,
(46:19):
thank you for that backpack.
Speaker 5 (46:20):
By the way, You're welcome and Thank you guys, and
thank you Jim.
Speaker 3 (46:25):
I didn't forget about you here of course. Thank you
as always for tuning us.
Speaker 2 (46:28):
Hey, you be listening to special edition of the New
Orleans Pelicans podcast.
Speaker 3 (46:32):
We'll see you next time.
Speaker 1 (46:33):
Thanks for listening to the New Orleans Pelicans Podcast. Join
us three times per week on pelicans dot com, the
Pelicans mobile app, the iHeartRadio app, or where you get
your podcast, and be sure to give Jim and Guss
a follow on x at Jim Underscore I can offer
(46:54):
and Gcap Underscore seventeen. We'll see you next time right
here on the New Orleans Pelicans Podcast
Host
Jim Eichenhofer
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