2025 NBA Draft Roundtable Preview | Pelicans Podcast

Who will the New Orleans Pelicans select with the 7th and 23rd pick in the 2025 NBA Draft?

Jim Eichenhofer and Gus Kattengell discuss with Pelicans radio analyst John DeShazier and Pelicans TV sideline reporter Andrew Lopez about what the team could be looking with their selections on Wednesday evening in Brooklyn at 7PM on ABC and ESPN.

The Pelicans Podcast crew also checks in with Times-Picayune columnist Rod Walker to discuss his takeaways from a sit-down interview with Executive Vice President of Basketball Operations Joe Dumars.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
This is an I Heart podcast. Welcome in to the New Orleans
Pelicans podcast, the official podcast of your New Orleans
Pelicans, a podcast dedicated toeverything you need to know

(00:20):
about the. Squad hear from players,
coaches, broadcasters and those who cover the NBA on a daily
basis. It's time to flock up.
The New Orleans Pelicans Podcaststarts right now.
Hello. Everyone and welcome to New
Orleans Pelicans podcast, official podcast of your New

(00:42):
Orleans Pelicans. The NBA draft is here, round one
on Wednesday and on Thursday, Round 2, the Pelicans right now
as we answer the NBA draft with the 7th and 23rd pick of the
first round. That is what's guaranteed to
them. On Wednesday, we'll see what
takes place with all the other teams, including your Birds on

(01:03):
draft night. To kind of help you get ready
for that, Rod Walker, columnist of the Times Picayune, is going
to join us and talk about his thoughts as to what maybe the
team may do on draft night. More importantly, this
conversation with Joe Dumars, brand new Vice President of
Basketball Operations for New Orleans.
And also we're going to get someinsider expert analysis from

(01:23):
John Deshazer, analyst for the Pelicans Radio Network, and
Andrew Lopez. Sign my reporter for the Pels
television side of things along with Jim
eichenhofferpelicans.com. We're going to go over
possibilities of what could be there at 7:23 and take a look at
where the team is going as we get closer and closer to the
start of the new season now thatOklahoma City is your champions

(01:47):
of this past NBA year. So let's get started with our
conversation with Rod Walker, followed by, of course, John
Deshaser, Andrew Lopez and Jim Ikenhofer right here on the New
Orleans Pelicans Podcast. You know, Rod, as we kind of
turn our focus to the Pelicans in this draft with this is the
reason that we wanted to have you on today was, you know,
obviously had a really good conversation with Joe Dumars

(02:10):
and, and have written a bunch ofstuff throughout the month
about, you know, what his plans are.
I I guess we could start with interms of your perspective on Joe
Dumars. Obviously people know that he's
one of the most respected peoplein the NBA as a player.
He was that as well. The sportsmanship award is named
after him. So that should tell you a little
bit too about his, his, the respect that people have for

(02:33):
him. But I guess we could start with
what, what, what were your firstimpressions of, of getting a
chance to sit down with him and,and we meet with him in terms of
the kind of person he is? I think the thing that stood out
the most of me, yet you could just tell that he was like this
really genuine guy. I mean, he's from Louisiana, so
he gets it. He understands the landscape of
this city. He know how much this city

(02:53):
craves a winner. And I think this is the respect
that he's earned from being a player, being an executive in
the league. I think that's going to earn
some of the respect for some of his players, especially Zion.
I mean, Zion's a guy that obviously, you know, he's had
his issues here with with injuries and just kind of
sometimes not doing everything that you expect from a pro

(03:14):
basketball player. I think Joe can probably get
that out of him because I think he's just so respected.
I think he's going to connect with Zion a little bit better
just because he's played in the league for so long and, you
know, 1 championship. So I think Zion would probably
appreciate that. And I just think they're going
to connect. I mean, they they talked a lot,
he said. They went to dinner, they
watched some playoff games together, which would have been
like, I guess back in the first round maybe.

(03:35):
But so I think he's kind of getting, you know, I think
Zion's listening to him, which is, you know, I think that's a
really big key to the future of this franchise.
They're going to be good. It's obviously going to center
around Zion, since, you know, Dumar said.
We're committed to this guy. We we want him to be the face of
this franchise. So they need to have that
connection and I think they haveit.
Do you have a feel for, you know, based on sitting down and

(03:56):
talking to Joe Dumars as we get ready for, you know, the draft
Wednesday night? And I'm not, I don't mean like
in terms of predicting what, whothe Pelicans are going to take
or, but in term or, or what's going to happen in, in terms of
trades, Because I think that there will be whether it's in
New Orleans or across the league, it seems like there's
going to be a lot of trade activity.
But from from speaking with him and getting a feel for what he's

(04:17):
about, do you have kind of a take away in terms of what he
wants to do generally with this roster in terms of what kind of
traits in players that he's going to try to focus on
bringing in here? I think the main thing was,
well, one of the things he did say is, you know, a lot of
people upset when they Pelica slip from 4:00 to 7:00 in in the
draft lottery. And Joe said he wasn't fazed by

(04:38):
that at all. He feels like they can get a
good player at 7. And so as far as specifically
what he wants, he didn't really,you know, they'll never go into
that anyway. Sure, but I think he I think
he's going to be like a big character guy too, kind of like
kind of like some same stuff David Griffin talked about as
far as the kind of players he want.
I mean, he wants guys who are going to come in here and kind

(05:01):
of buy into the to what they want to do.
And so I mean, I think that's going to be the main thing for
him. I don't know as far as, you
know, what kind of player he won't.
We don't know because we don't. He likes this roster and he
feels like they have some good pieces already.
So I think they they want to supplement that with some guys,
but I don't know if, I mean, he doesn't need somebody to come in
here and be the face of the team.

(05:21):
Sure, he's going to come in and and fit, you know, just be the
perfect fit for this team. Is there an element, too?
I mean, we know from his playingcareer and also when, when the
Pistons were at their peak, whenhe was an executive, they won
the championship in 2004. And I think the common
denominator between the teams that he played for that won two
championships and the one that he he led was the defense and
the toughness. I mean, do you feel like that's

(05:42):
something that I would think that when he went back and
watched the tape of last season and saw that they were 29th in
defense, that that's something that would immediately be
something that needs to be addressed?
Yeah. And that's one of the things he
did talk about was he wanted a team that was going to be really
good on both ends of the court. And he wanted, I think this team
is going to play really hard. Like, I think that's something
he wants. He talks about the city of New

(06:03):
Orleans. He wants this team to kind of be
a reflection of what the city ofNew Orleans is.
And you know, this city's out. You know, people always talk
about how resilient people in New Orleans are.
He wants this team to play like that.
He wants them to, you know, justkind of get after it and kind of
give you something to be proud, even if you don't win.
I mean, obviously you want to win, but if you don't win, he
wants fans to be able to look atthis team and say, man, this
team was really playing hard andfighting to the end.

(06:25):
Not, I mean, we saw, we seen a lot of games where this team
just kind of let go of the rope in the fourth quarter.
And I don't think we're going tosee that anymore because that's
part of the culture he wants to build here.
You obviously wrote people that follow the team closely.
I'm sure read a lot of what you wrote throughout the month from
talking to Joe Dumars. You also recently wrote an
article about Troy Weaver as well.

(06:47):
Can you kind of talk about what you what was in that article and
just what your impressions of his, what his role is going to
be? Yeah, with Troy, you know, he
was, he didn't want to talk withit.
He didn't want to. Like, he just, he wasn't really
ready to do that right now. I think he's kind of locked in
on this draft, which is which isunderstandable.
But, you know, that's one of thethings that Joe Dumars talked
about was, you know, with Troy, he feels like he has a guy who

(07:09):
in the word, Joe uses elite in finding talent.
And so I talked to some other people.
I talked to Will Dawkins, who's now the GM at the Washington
Wizards. He worked with Troy in Oklahoma
City in 2008. They got there at the same time.
OK, See, it just moved from Seattle and that was the year
that OK C drafted Russell Westbrook with the number four
overall pick. And Russell Westbrook wasn't

(07:31):
really, you know, most people didn't have him slated as a #4
pick in the draft. But Troy Weaver went in there
and talked to Sam Preston. You know, he was like, look,
this is the guy we need to get. And one of the quotes that Will
Dawkins gave me that I thought was really interesting was that
when I was asking him about the strengths of Troy Weaver, he
said that he's a guy who he didn't just look at a player for
what he is now. Like Troy can kind of see what

(07:51):
this player can become like. He kind of can't project like,
OK, he might be just just the average guy now, but this guy
has like Hall of Fame potential and he saw that in Russell
Westbrook and you know, they draft him in.
I mean, he was he was right. I mean, Russell Westbrook end up
being one of the, you know, bestpoint guard.
So I mean, he saw that and you look at the Detroit Pistons
roster and obviously we didn't have a lot of success as far as

(08:14):
wins and losses in Detroit, but he he laid the I mean, he he got
the pieces there that got them to where they are this year.
And I mean, he drafted some really good players.
I mean, they, they may not have had the right coaches and maybe
denial mesh, but you look at their roster, I mean he is
responsible to drafting the guysthat that have made his team
successful. Yeah, it seemed like what they
really needed was, and they did this successfully, Trajan

(08:37):
Langdon, another, you know, coincidentally came from here,
was they needed to add some veteran guys that would help
them become a more mature team. Just adding that experience.
But like you said, some of the players that Troy Weaver
drafted, like a SAR Thompson to me fits the mold of some not
exactly the same thing, but withRussell Westbrook, but kind of
that thing where it's like you can see the raw ability that

(08:58):
this guy has. And you I mean, same thing with
his brother who's in Houston nowthat I think the Pelicans are
going to see a lot, unfortunately, in the next
decade or so. You can see that what the player
is now, you know, 2-3, four years from now, he's going to be
at a level that I think is dangerous.
So I think those are all those are all interesting points
about, you know, his time in in Detroit as we go into this

(09:20):
draft. Another thing I want to ask you
about was you. I remember I think this was a
little bit maybe right after JoeDumars came in or maybe it might
have been right around the time you spoke with him, you tweeted
or axed the the point about you think that Joe Joe Dumars impact
could be the greatest on Zion. Can you kind of expound?

(09:40):
On yeah, I just I kind of go. That's what I was saying
earlier. I just think his his ability to
haven't played in the league. I just, you know, I mean, we've
talked to Zion over the years, you know, he's always Zion kind
of keeps up with NBA like he knows the history of the game,
like more than most people you'dexpect at at Zion's age.
So I think he knows what Joe Dumars did in Detroit as a

(10:03):
player and as an executive. And I just think he can really
appreciate it and respect it. And I think the fact that Joe
Dumars trusts Zion, I mean, Joe talked about how when he sent
Zion to the lottery, he did thatfor a reason.
He wanted Zion to like, you know, kind of take ownership and
be the face of this team, be theguy that sits at the podium on
on lottery night. And I think, I think, I think

(10:24):
sometimes you have to give people responsibility and like
make them own it. And I think that's what Joe's
going to do with Zion. And if Zion, you know, if he
accepts it and does what he's supposed to do with it, I mean,
I think he can run with it, say,OK, this is my team and I am the
face of this team. And I, I just think, you know, I
think that's probably going to work.
And I get, I mean, time will tell.
I don't, I don't think Joe, Joe doesn't even, I mean, he can't

(10:44):
guarantee that it's going to work.
And one thing he said is that, hey, time will tell.
But he, he's at least given, youknow, trust and Zion with it.
And, you know, we'll see what hedoes with it.
It's interesting you said that Iwas talking to Jim a little bit
about it before we're recording today and I kind of feel your
interview and others that he's done since he's come here this
summer leading into the draft. It's kind of, I don't know, a

(11:05):
theme or a message I'm taking from him is he's looking at this
roster, he's looking at this team, he's looking at this
coaching staff, Coach Green, everybody and and seeing what he
has first. You know, a lot of times, Rod,
when change happens, you know, Jim's moving cubicles.
I mean, you know, it's just different things.
You know, different people come in, want their own.

(11:25):
But I almost feel like he's being very purposeful and he's
vocalized that that he wants to see what he has, what kind of
team they are this year before we start clinic kind of grading.
We were talking about the Finalsbefore recording.
We know the identity of the Pacers.
They got to run you down, you know, up and down the court.
We know the identity of OK C, get ready because they're going

(11:45):
to play hard defense. And I think that's almost him.
He wants to see what the identity of not only the roster,
but the organization is. He has an idea what he wants.
But don't you get that feel fromhim that instead of just coming
in, going this is it, This is why I want all that.
And that kind of leads to what you're talking about with Zion.
All right, look, you want to be this guy.
I want to see how you act to this.

(12:06):
Here you go. Here's the responsibility.
Let me see it. Yeah.
I mean, one of the things that Joe always talks, he said it
twice, he said at his introductory press conference,
and he said it when he was talking to me, is that, you
know, when he came in, he didn'tcome in here just doing a lot of
talking. He did more listening than
talking. He talked to everybody in this
building about just, you know, kind of trying to get a feel for
what was going on here. And that went from players to

(12:29):
coaches to the medical staff because, I mean, Andrews is
definitely a thing that he wantsto get a handle on.
And, you know, he said, you know, they're doing a lot of
work on that now. I mean, they're following up
with these players make, you know, when are we going to visit
this guy? When are we, you know, what's
the latest on history have like they're really like, you know,
just honing in on that And, you know, hopefully that makes a

(12:50):
difference because I mean, obviously Andrews decimated this
team. I know a lot of fans were down
on on Willie this season, but you look at what the year before
that, he won 49 games. I don't think Willie Green just
all of a sudden forgot how to coach or anything.
So I think just addressing the injuries is is going to be a big
thing. I think Joe's done that, but I
think he's just really like donea good job of just trying to see

(13:12):
where this franchise is without him just coming here, just
making wholesale changes becausehe's, you know, he was in New
York. He didn't, he wouldn't, he
wouldn't hear seeing all the day-to-day things.
So I think he wants to fix whatever it is that he wants to.
He knows the people are the onesthat you have to listen to in
that situation. Definitely not going to sit here
and ask you to do a Rod Walker mock draft or predict who's
going to be the picks. But I mean, as we kind of talk

(13:36):
specifically about the fact thatthe Pelicans go in with the 7th
pick in the 23rd pick as, as we record this, that's what it is.
We don't know if that's going tochange by the time we post.
But what's your feel for #7 are there guys that you like or is
just in general? I mean, do you feel like that's
a good spot even though that there was obvious disappointment
that they had the 4th worst record and ended up picking 7th?

(13:58):
No, I think there's some good guys at 7.
I think to me, I think you maybeeven up to 8.
I think once you get past eight you might be dropping off a
little bit. But I really like what they can
get. I don't know if like Con
Canepple from Duke is the guy who I really like.
I just it seems like he's kind of moving up, so I don't I don't
know if he'll be there still at 7:00.
The center who I would try to pronounce his name.

(14:21):
Come on. Yeah, yeah, him.
He's a guy that, you know, that could be really good.
Obviously Ace Bailey has been a lot of talk about him just, you
know, people thinking he wants to play with Brooklyn, but he's
a guy that. And again, we don't know who
Troy Weaver likes, but I mean, if he likes these guys, we don't
know who Dumar's like, but Ace Bailey is a guy that 7.

(14:42):
If you get him, you might you might go for him.
And there's some other guys thatJeremiah fears like these guys
could fall. And if they fall to seven, I
mean, I think this pellets will have some really good options
with that draft pick. Yeah, Ace Bailey seems like he's
already had a dramatic NBA career, even though he hasn't
officially been hired yet by anyone.
But But yeah, as far as #23 goes, are are there certain

(15:03):
players that you like? Or I mean, is it, is this the
kind of thing you you mentioned how I think a lot of people feel
the same way that maybe there's a tier that ends at 8:00 and
then there's a drop off. But I mean, where does 23 fit
right now? Is it the kind of thing where
it's like, OK, maybe that you can find somebody that's a good
role player and that's. I think you can.
I think, I think this draft is probably deep deeper on where

(15:26):
you can get you a good role player there at least.
And and I don't even know if this guy be a role player.
I think Walter Clayton junior inFlorida, if he happens to, if he
happened to be at 20, at 23, I think you're getting a really
good, a really good player. And I go back to that 2008 draft
in Oklahoma City with Troy. We've he got Russell Westbrook

(15:46):
at four and he got Serge Ibaka at 24.
They had two first round picks that year.
So I mean, Serge Ibaka had a good, I take that he was a big
part of that of OK CS, you know,a little run they had there when
they were a really good team. So I mean, you, you might can
get a good, I mean, you can get a good player there.
And you know, and I think that'swhat they, you know, first I was

(16:10):
thinking how they make packages this pick and try to move up
with something else. But now I think they may, you
know, say, OK, we can find us a guy at 23.
That's that's really good. It's interesting.
Well, Walter Clayton, Senior right out of Florida and.
Junior. He's junior.
You got a, you got a senior. Next to him, yeah.
Regardless, he's an upper class man.
He's not a rookie or a freshman,so see senior up here.

(16:32):
But my point is this team, this organization likes having guys
that, you know, has a little experience under their belts.
Yeah. I mean that, that, that, that
that would be good for them if they can get a guy who you can
play, right. Away along those lines that I
thought was been really cool during our what we did a six
podcast looking at every team and all those players.

(16:52):
I'm with you and I'm with Joe. I think you're going to find a
player somebody yeah around 7:00but I find interesting too.
It's going to be fit a lot with these teams, right?
Whether it's do they need shooting during a defensive
player, 3 point shooting. And I was just thinking,
watching LSU win the national championship and what Jay
Johnson was saying, how he builtthat roster.
I almost feel like the NBA sort of going to like an NIL era

(17:13):
build. You get that star, you get that
guy. Look at the two teams that play
in the Finals, right? Their two stars weren't drafted
by the Pacers and OKC and Halliburton and SGA.
But building through the draft helped surround those two guys
with young players. Then to Jim's point, sprinkling
a vet here or there there. I almost feel like today's

(17:34):
college NIL roster almost is what I think the NBA roster is
going to be over the next coupleyears.
All of a sudden, I was probably yawning.
We got a, we got a whole day forround two.
Like teams didn't care about it.I don't think that's the case
moving forward with that new CBA.
That's kind of what I felt in talking to a lot of riders that
cover these teams that from now on you to your .20, you got 23,

(17:57):
you got two first round picks, make use of them, make sure they
hit, make sure you there's something that they can bring to
your roster. You kind of feel that.
Way, I mean, I think, yeah, I think that's kind of the way
things are going right now. And I mean, you do that,
obviously you got to hit in freeagency.
But yeah, I think that's the that's probably the wave of the
future. For the one of the things kind
of tie everything together that you just said too.

(18:17):
I'm, I'm wondering if one of theimpacts of the NIL is that
you're going to start to see some of these players who a few
years ago were coming out in thedraft, even though they weren't
sure whether they were going to be a first round pick or not.
And it was a gamble because it was like, well, what if you
don't get picked? Or what if you get picked 50th?
I think some of these guys now are going to stay in college
and, and I wonder as time goes on, are we going to see more

(18:38):
second round picks be the Herb Jones types where they played
four or five years in college. And even though people try to
downgrade the the players who were 20 to 23 years old, the the
best part about those guys is beyond the fact that if you're
getting them in the second round, they're cheap contracts
that under the new CBA is great,is that these guys are more
ready sometimes at 20 to 23. So I wonder if the NIL is going

(19:02):
to indirectly have an impact on the NBA draft because you're
going to start to see. I mean, it feels like we've had
years where the entire draft wasguys who played one year in
college and then a bunch of guysfrom international ball that
were, you know, also 19 or 20 years old.
It seems like maybe it's going to flip back the other way.
And I mean, we've seen that withthe Pelicans, not just Herb
Jones, but Trey Murphy also played multiple years.

(19:24):
Antonio Reeves played four or five years, I think it was in
college. So I mean, is that going to be
an outlier or is that going to be part of a trend that we see
that is a result of partly of the nil?
And to your point, guys, we've seen I think in the last couple
months, couple of reports due towhat Jim just said, with NIL
money now being available, some Euro leagues maybe either

(19:45):
shutting down or not playing because they're seeing a lot of
those young kids that were that's where they got their
experience. They're going to college because
they can make more money on NIL.So that's going to be
interesting to see the influx offoreign players now playing at
Duke, UNC, some of the bigger schools and stuff.
And if that keeps kids around orif that just strengths of it, I
don't know. I just I get a feel that all of

(20:06):
a sudden we're going to be paying a little bit more
attention to Wednesday, Thursdays, you know, in the
draft. And I think you're going to be
getting better players as opposed to what you just said,
being able to project 5-6 years.I think teams are going to need
guys that can come in and do something within relative, you
know, future. And stuff, you look right across
the street at the sights. They they drafted a quarterback
who's 25 years old. So, yeah, I mean, I think that's

(20:29):
kind of, you know, you get theseguys who can come in and play
right away a little bit more established.
You don't have to groom them. And so, yeah, I mean, I think
that definitely helps. Yeah.
You know, it's funny. One of the things you said, Gus
reminded me, one of the players that we profiled that we
analyzed was Kasparis Yakochonis.
I think I I got it right. He's so good at that, isn't he?
He's a, he's a good example. He's from Lithuania, but he came

(20:51):
over to play college ball. I don't know the full story, but
I think that was partly because of the nil to that it's just and
he's going to be maybe top ten, Top 14 lottery pick as well.
So maybe we will see that something that happens more.
Often, yeah. It reminds me of the podcast we
had when we featured Carlo Makovich, you know, talk about
how any kind of money helps, where he comes from, You know,
he's setting up his family and stuff like that and things that

(21:13):
nature. So, you know, again, start
thinking of things that, that nature where you can get, you
know, I don't know, go, go hawk some chicken fingers or
something somewhere and you get a couple mil or a couple
100,000. I mean, that's a big thing, you
know, for a lot of people in a lot of areas.
So I think All in all, though, I, I do feel excited about this
draft. I feel like let's see what takes
place. And I for one, don't tell Graff.

(21:36):
I, I don't mind OKC or even Indiana being in the finals in
OK C winning because look, I, I love seeing that.
I mean, I'm a dad and seeing oneof those players yesterday
holding the baby in there and the other players making sure
his head's OK. I love how they play together
and I love how together that team is.
So I like it. I like it because it wasn't just

(21:57):
about, hey, let's grab some stars together and go win that.
It was a process. They're together, they're within
the community, they care. It almost seems like a almost a
very New Orleans sort of style when teams win here.
It's like that. It's all for one kind of a
thing, so I don't mind it, man, in this day and Aaron, that's
seven straight new NBA championsin seven straight years.

(22:17):
Yeah, that was my most, that wasthe thing I was most impressed
with about OKC, just how they all bought in.
Nobody was there were no, it didn't like there were any egos
on that team. I mean for the past two seasons,
every post game interview you'd have the guy that interviewing
and the rest of the teams coming.
Around they haven't followed. Them, yeah.
And they just you thought that would like say, OK, this is
going to get old eventually, butit didn't for them.
And I don't think it will even next.

(22:38):
I think they can kind of ride this out.
I mean, they're, you know, the youngest team to win a, you
know, to win a title in 40 something years.
Yeah, Yeah, since Portland in like 1977, I guess.
Yeah. I mean, you didn't take it in
this direction. I thought maybe you were going
to. But I think another part of it,
Gus, is the small market part ofit.
And and you, you mentioned that seven different champions in the
last seven years. To me, it's part of it is just

(23:01):
kind of the hope that it provides.
I think a lot of franchises across the league, Eastern
Conference is a different conversation right now with
terms of how wide open it is because of some of the injuries
that have happened. But overall, I just feel like
there's maybe never been a time where most of the teams in the
league can look around and be like, if we make a bunch of good
decisions with the draft, obviously being part of that, we

(23:22):
can put ourselves in a lot better position and maybe we can
get to where we're at that levelwhere we can compete.
So I mean, I, I think one of my takeaways from Oklahoma City
winning 2 is I've heard people say before about international
fans of basketball that aren't from America, They say, like, if
you ask them, they think Oklahoma City is the same size
as like Chicago. They have no idea because.

(23:44):
And I think that's a credit to the, the way that the NBA has
made it so where it is a more ofa level playing field where you
don't feel like you have to be in one of the biggest markets to
win the championship. And if you look at several of
the teams that have won in recent years, it's similar size
to New Orleans. Milwaukee won it in 2021.
Oklahoma City is one of the smallest markets in the league

(24:05):
as well. So I mean, it just seems like
it's becoming more of where the opportunity is there.
You just, you have to make the right decisions, though.
You have to nail the draft. You have to make sure you're
signing the right free agents. And, and it seems like I think
this is something we'll see on Wednesday and Thursday, too, is
the trade part of it to me is sohuge now because free agency has

(24:26):
almost dwindled to nothing. It's like the the star players
are not becoming free agents anymore.
It's like if they have a year left on their contract, they're
either getting extended or get they're getting traded.
So I the trade part of it to me is is also maybe bigger than
it's ever been. With with Joe Dumar that I I
specifically asked him about thesmall market versus big market
thing. You know, one of the things he

(24:47):
said is he's he he don't think that's really a big thing.
He says if you have the right culture in a small market, you
know, players would rather go toa small market team with a good
culture then go to New York at the cultures past.
So that's why he's focusing on, you know, building right culture
and make making this a place where, you know, you're treating
the families right. You have guys that want to come
to New Orleans and like, hey, they treat people right in New

(25:08):
Orleans. So that's going to be his big
thing. And I think that you know that
that pays off if you if you could do that.
Like I said, I'm excited. Let's see what happens.
And there's no doubt he he's allabout Louisiana.
He has no problem saying that and that look and around these
parts, you know how that works, right?
It, it, it helps the fan base and if you're trying to get
people to buy in and have some excitement, yeah, it's kind of

(25:29):
the the approach to go with it, man.
Yeah, winning eventually wins them all.
Winning does make out great. There's no doubt.
Mr. Rod Walker X and blue sky aswell.
Go check him out. Column this over there with the
time speaking as always, man, I appreciate your time.
Thank you for coming in. No problem, thanks for having
me. Oh.
Thanks Ron all. Right, getting you ready for the
NBA draft. Round one Wednesday.

(25:49):
Round two Thursday. Mr. John Deshazer, analyst for
your New Orleans Pelicans. Andrew Lopez.
Good to see you, man. How are you doing?
I'm good, very good. Excited for for this draft.
I'm glad that it's it's finally here and I can stop looking at
mock drafts over and over and over and over.
A bit of action leading into thedraft, JD Couple of teams making

(26:11):
some moves, having a little fun.Yeah, I mean, everybody trying
to improve and then you'll see everybody saying, you know, this
team won the summer when, well, I'll take that back because
everybody always says the Lakerswin the summer every summer,
right? So, you know, they'll be talking
about who won the summer and that kind of thing.
And and look, nobody knows nothing until they hit the
court, and that's when you decide who won the summer.

(26:33):
I believe Philadelphia won the summer last year too, so.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, well, I mean, it must have
been Philly and the Lakers because the Lakers win every
summer. The Lakers win every summer,
according the TV, they win everysummer.
And it's like, man, this team should have like 72
championships because they win every summer.
Well, we only have 2025 minutes to get into what the Pels are
going to do, but Jim could take all of that time based on just a

(26:55):
simple discussion in the last 2448 hours.
Jim, after the Thunder win the finals and it's all about, well,
nobody cares. It's all about when LA or
anybody else wins the finals, so.
True, you know true it works. Yeah, it doesn't count for the
same amount some. You're absolutely right that I
saw them ranking in order of thelast 7, the least of importance.

(27:16):
Anyway, bottom line, we'd like to see the pills, right?
Hoist the Larry O'Brien, get back into the postseason, do
those things. So JD, we'll start with you.
Scale of one to 10, very simple,10 being obviously the most
important. How important is this draft for
the Pelicans relative to perhapsother years?
I would say I'm not really alarmed by anything.

(27:37):
So I, I, I'd say A2 right now because I think the Pelicans are
more interested in who they havecoming back.
When you're talking about Zion and when you're talking about
Trey Murphy and you're talking about, you know, Dejonte Murray
coming back at some point the next season, Herb Jones, really
you're more invested in the now if you're the Pelicans.
So yeah, the draft picks, if youuse both picks will be obviously

(28:01):
something that you can hopefully, hopefully build with
for the future. But the Pelicans is is right
now. I'm, I'm not, I probably
shouldn't say this as an employee of the team, but I'm
not interested in three years from now.
I want it now. I want I, I see, I see Oklahoma
City and I see Indiana and I say, you know what, small market
teams can make this thing go, sowhy can't the Pelicans make this

(28:23):
thing go in? The Pelicans really are kind of
centralized on health, as they have been for the last several
seasons. And we we've seen what happens
when Zion Williamson is healthy and he's playing that 28 to 3032
minute mark. What some of what this team can
be. And then now you bring back Herb

(28:43):
Jones and you bring back Trey Murphy healthy and you get an
improved E me see and get an improved Carlo Mackovic and you
know, you add in a Kelly Olynyk and you know you've got some
parts that look really good. So the the draft part for me for
the Pelicans is are they going to find a point?
Because they kind of need one. So are they going to find a

(29:06):
point? And, and you know, who will that
be? And even then, you don't want to
necessarily throw rookie point guards into the fire.
But I still think this team has to have one.
I think it's, it's probably a 4.Like I still don't think nailing
the draft is as high on the listas it is of making sure you have

(29:26):
the right tools going into the to next year.
They're like for your toolbox, you mentioned, you know, needing
a point because at some point, you know, Desjante will come
back, but he is going to miss a,a, a chunk of time.
I think getting the extra pick kind of adds a little to the

(29:46):
importance of it because now younow you got 2.
Now you can try to like there's two swings at it, if you will.
Obviously you would like to, to get hits with both of the, the
swings that you take here, but I, I think it's, you know, it's,
it's not, you know, if you were one or two in a drive like you
need to, you need to hit those. You know, you obviously when

(30:09):
you're picking 7, you're pickingmid Lotto, you want to hit on
the number seven pick. But all of these other tools
like how much is that number? I mean, depending on what
position, like how much is that #7 going to pick, going to play
right away? I mean, we saw Eve get kind of
thrown into the fire last year, but he was the number 21 pick
and we thought he was going to spend most of his time in

(30:30):
Birmingham last season. So seven pick obviously is you
would think is going to play a little bit more because of how
things are slotted, but probablythat's I'd say 3 or 4.
I think the way this was worded was kind of open to
interpretation. I mean, I had a 7, but on the
scale, but only because I feel like I, I was maybe more

(30:54):
emphasizing the part about relative to other years that the
Pelicans have drafted. And I, I, I kind of look at it
more as like, you're not going to get this opportunity to pick
this high very much. I mean besides buddy heal.
Right. Besides.
Besides, I don't like to be picking 30, that's just me.
So, yeah, I, I had a 7, but I, on the other hand, I, I think

(31:18):
short term, it's the kind of thing where they don't need a
savior. My, the reason I put the
importance as high as I do is because I feel like down the
road, this is, you know, hopefully this will be the last
time they pick this high in two or three years from now.
You want to be able to look backat 2025 and say, Hey, they got
somebody that is a big pillar for the future, somebody that
they can build around. And this opportunity doesn't

(31:40):
come around very often. So I had a 7, but I, I, I guess
I kind of looked at the, the question just from a slightly
different angle, But to, to, I think what a lot of what JD
mentioned too, is the thing thatmakes them an outlier compared
to a bunch of the other teams picking near them, especially,
you know, the Washington's and the Charlotte's, is that they're
not at the first step of rebuilding the way that

(32:01):
Washington is where they're justtrying to figure out.
Let's just put a bunch of guys out there, they drafted 3 or
they had three or four first round picks that all played a
lot. It's not that kind of situation.
So they don't need someone to come in and save everything.
But I also think for long term, if even if they take somebody
this year who as a rookie isn't ready to be a dominant player or

(32:23):
be a huge part of what they do, but a couple years down the road
pays off, I think that'll be huge as well.
Yeah, no doubt, JD, we mentionedsome teams maybe perhaps making
some moves beforehand. I know Jim's been saying this
during our the process leading up to the draft.
Look up for trades as opposed tomaybe for agency and stuff.
Pell's getting the 23rd pick as of now as we go into the draft

(32:44):
as well to go with the 7th pick overall.
When you saw the news you heard this team acquired another first
round pick. First thing that went through
your mind was. First thing I thought was
probably developmental guy, a Geely guy that you can you can
hopefully shape into what you want them to be.
Now the Pels have had some success, obviously with later
picks, whether it be Eve Macy orher Jones, they've shown the

(33:07):
ability to pick the right guy for what it is they do.
So you don't necessarily say that the number 23 guy will will
spend, you know, even the whole season in Birmingham, but you
don't know. But I think it's I don't want to
say a luxury, but kind of is a luxury that you have that that
guy that you can that you can kind of stash away and you can

(33:27):
you can refine him and you know,when you bring him in, he's a
little bit more prepared to playin the NBA.
Now, that's assuming that they're not going to do anything
with these picks because you canalways take these picks and you
can package them up and you can try to do some stuff.
Who knows? But if you keep him, I think
it's more of a developmental guide for for Birmingham.
Because again, if if you're if you're looking at the Pelicans

(33:49):
roster now, there just didn't a whole lot of space for a guy to
play, especially when you're talking about a team that wants
to be in the playoffs and get inthe playoffs.
You go ahead and win at 50 at least.
I think it's, I, I think it's a little of this like you make
this trade because there's somebody in that range that

(34:11):
you'd like and you did not want to wait and use that pick the
following year. You went and got it because you
know, there's somebody in that range.
If we're talking about tiers in this draft, we've, we've heard
people talk about it's a, you know, an 8 person draft in the
top three tiers that 4th and 5thtier are wide open for some

(34:31):
teams. When we're looking, we've talked
about when we've looked at mock drafts, when we were trying to
make the draft rankings. And, and you know, a guy like
Noah Asingay from, you know, I've seen him as high as nine,
I've seen him as low as 23. Cedric Coward, I've seen him as
high as 10, as low as 2425. There are guys in this 4th and

(34:52):
5th tier that you could, there'sa wide range on and you have 23.
You're now in a position maybe you do get somebody who was 14th
on your board, 16th on your board.
And if you can take somebody whoyou had labeled as a late
lottery pick at 23 to win, all of a sudden you're you're

(35:14):
feeling pretty good about that. So I think if that's the case,
if that's where you're kind of going with it, if you're also
taking somebody and this is we don't, we look, we don't.
We knew a little bit about what Chris Craft draft strategy was.
We've seen what Troy Weaver did in Detroit.
We've seen his kind of background.
We've seen what Joe Dwight was able to do.
But it's maybe you go get the guy who's played four or five

(35:37):
years in college. And if you're adding a 2223 year
old to this team, I don't know how much time they're going to
spend in Birmingham, but maybe they come and they do push
somebody for some minutes. And if you're creating
competition, even with some of these guys who are coming back,
I think that then elevates everything that you're trying to
do. My immediate reaction to them

(35:59):
getting the 23rd pick was man I'm not prepared for this.
I've only studied the top 15 guys.
So luckily in the days since then though, I've just about
tripled maybe the amount of players that I've watched a
video of and and read about and tried to do a little bit of
amateur scouting on so that I'm not completely blindsided when

(36:20):
the 23rd pick comes up and they take someone.
But yeah, I mean, I think to to one of the things that JD said
about, you know, if it's a late 1st rounder, maybe it's a guy
who plays a little bit in the G League.
But I also think too that I think we talked about this a
little bit with Rod Walker in the previous segment that
there's more, there's more guys that are coming out of college

(36:42):
that have played four or five years.
So from that standpoint, maybe there's somebody in the later
part of the first round or even second round.
I think we're going to see a trend that there's more
experienced guys coming out. So I mean, is the guy at 23
going to play a lot if if they pick someone next season for the
Pelicans? I don't know, maybe, maybe not.
But I either way, I think there's there's a possibility

(37:04):
you get somebody that fits the mold.
I mean, this would be amazing ifit's anybody that's as
productive as Herb Jones, who played four years in college,
Trey Murphy, who played multipleyears, Antonio Reeves, I thought
was really good last year. So I mean, maybe just giving
yourself an extra swing at that part of the draft, whether it's
late first round or second round.

(37:24):
I think it's a, it looks a little different than it did a
few years ago just because of the group of players that are
available. You're just getting more of
those 2223 year olds. It's not guys that you have to
kind of wait for them, their bodies to develop the way that
you have to do with a lot of the19 year olds.
So I mean, I'm excited for it from that standpoint of however
they use it. Yeah, the more at bats you have,
the, the better the percentage of, of getting a hit.

(37:46):
I mean, so you know, you might, you know, you might have 15 at
bats, but if you get two hits, hey, that's all you need.
Got to be the right to. Yeah, I know.
Sometimes I I make analogies to in the NFL because of where we
are and things, but we all covered football in some way she
perform. It's almost like when you had
that training camp roster right.Try to cry as much talent as
possible and see what pulls out because that leads us to our

(38:08):
next topic. When I look at the Western
Conference, I mean, you almost chuckle, right.
I mean, it's like we already know it's difficult.
And as I pull up the standings I'm looking at is about to ask
John here, this question about what other team in the Western
Conference and what they've donein the offseason intrigues you
when I look one through. Whatever.
All of the teams in it, every team's either done something

(38:29):
already or as I look to my rightat the draft order or drafting
above the. Pelicans.
You know, he like there's the Spurs above the pals in the
standings and obviously we know they're picking second.
Dallas is there. They're going to be making
moves. So you're looking at all these
teams, JD in the West that have either made offseason moves
already or picking high in the draft.

(38:50):
Yeah. And we should preface this by
saying too, that this isn't justlike what they've done so far.
It's more like projecting forward as well.
Of which, which offseason is themost intriguing to you as you
look forward to just kind of looking, looking ahead and being
like, what are some of these teams, up to which which ones
That's the most interesting to me.
I, I want to know what's going on with, with Memphis because

(39:14):
look, I, I don't want to see Memphis succeed, obviously, but
but to, to let go of Desmond Bain.
Desmond Bain can be a first, second or third option any given
night. And to have a guy who can shoot
with his splits, who can play the way he plays, who when John

(39:34):
Moran is out, can play the point, can then go back and play
the 2 when Triple J is not having a great night, who can
give you 2830. Those kinds of guys are are kind
of hard to come by and so to to let him go and to say, well, you
know, I guess they're trying to,you know, do some things salary
rise with Jai and and Triple J, but who that is a valuable piece

(39:58):
to let get out of the door. And so I want to see how they're
going to, how they're going to replace that because look, I, I
fully intend for them to hopefully step, to take a step
back because when you're talkingabout the, the, the Western
Conference playoffs, obviously for the Pelicans to get in,
somebody's going to have to comeout.
Sure. And and somebody's got to step
out even of that play in race. And I think the entry with

(40:19):
Memphis started with 9 games left in the regular season when
Taylor Jenkins got fired. So that has been a thing.
Am I allowed to cheat and just say the entire the rest of the
Southwest Division? Why not the entire rest of the
Southwest Division? We've already seen Houston make
their move and go get Kevin Durant and how they're going to

(40:41):
continue to build around him. But unfortunately, let's start
with the teams who have one and two in the draft who just
happened to be in your division,the Dallas Mavericks and how
they're going to kind of tool this roster around Cooper Flag.
Remember, they're also not they're they're in a position
similar to New Orleans where they're not going to have their
lead guard for a majority of next season because of Kyrie's

(41:04):
ACL. Do you go out and get a veteran
point guard to kind of run the show for a little while?
You know, maybe somebody who hasplayed a lot of defense in their
life since defense wins championship.
So I've been told, but then the San Antonio Spurs, they're

(41:25):
they're doing this very patiently.
There was a lot of I mean, I made I made the jokes right
after with as soon as the lottery happened.
You're like, all right, well, one or two gets traded for
Giannis. If he gets if he decides he's
going to ask out and instead it's no, we're going to go ahead
and we're going to build. We're going to probably take
Dylan Harper. And now you've made your trade
for dear and fox. You took Stefan Castle.

(41:48):
Now you have another third in theory lead guard possibly
coming to you and Dylan Harper all building around Victor one
vinyama. They're not trying to speed that
process up. And I think you know that the
year I spent there, there was a huge emphasis on that.
Let them kind of grow. And I think, you know, do they

(42:08):
make any of a smaller trades out?
You know, they were in the KD trucks reportedly.
So what do they do? Because I think it's it's going
to be scary when you have a 75200 and 4550 LB guy roaming
the. Paint, but you just missed it.
I mean, they've got a lot of repetitiveness.
At the especially at the one. So what do you do?

(42:31):
Does somebody move off? I mean, look, if if anybody
knows how to use a a player as asix six man, I mean they it's
the Spurs, you know which, you know, you would think two of
those guys are going to start. One of those guys is going to
come off. Where does Devin Vassell work?
There was even a little bit of him playing some four last year,

(42:52):
like in some some smaller lineups.
But they have a lot of tradable contracts, a lot of good numbers
to be able to kind of move some things around.
So if they do make a swing, or are they lining themselves up
and they made one swing with Darren Fox, but are they lining
themselves up to take another swing?
And they got a guy who can, who can win me, who can, who can

(43:15):
make you right. You know, I'm saying, you know,
you can have some mismatched pieces, but you can just say,
you know what? OK, we're a little small, but
you know what, We're going to funnel them down there and.
The Shaolin monk that is. Victor Women.
Yama What is? Yeah.
So you got a guy who can make you, right?
Yeah, I'm, I'm curious with themtoo, that it seems like to me,
generally speaking, you want to surround him with shooting.

(43:37):
But they're if they take Dylan Harper, they just have a bunch
of attacking guards. Now they don't have the spot up
shooters. So that I'll be curious to see
how that works because it seems like obviously if we've seen
Darren Fox for years and years that he's a guy that gets into
the paint. And it seems like Harper is the
same way. And Castle is not really like a
three-point gunner spot up guy either.

(43:57):
So I mean that'll be it'll be interesting to see how they
figure that out. I actually had the two teams
that I had that I'm the most intrigued by their off seasons
in the West are same as JD. I said Memphis.
I mean, I think they it's kind of like the Brian Windhorse meme
of like, why would they do that?Why would they trade Desmond
Bain when I first heard about it.
I mean I. That is I just want to point out

(44:19):
that that the picture like what what has happened that is like
my profile picture for like whenit so like if I called it like
that just shows up on my phone. Nice.
Yeah, I mean, it, it it's I guess it's why I've heard people
say, I mean, who knows that it was one of those things where
they got such a great offer thatthey were like, we love we we
love Desmond Bain's Bain. But for this, we have to do this

(44:39):
trade because of how much they were putting in that package.
But I just want to see what elseare they up to?
They they have you think they have there has to be something
else going on with them. They're that it wouldn't make
sense. I mean that there has to be
other moves if that's the only move they make.
I I don't understand necessarilyhow they treated this offseason.
And it is part of part of that is now when you have first and

(44:59):
2nd apron rules, I mean, a lot of your team building rules have
changed. Look, we look, we just saw what
Boston did. You know, they, they have to
they're they're moving Drew Holiday, you know, and they're
only saving. I think there's they say five,
4.6 million, whatever it was in salary.
They save 41 million on their ontheir tax bill.

(45:21):
And there's probably more to come.
So part of that is as J, as JD alluded to, if you're going to
extend JA and you're going to extend Jaren Jackson junior,
somebody in that group had to go.
But I agree, I do think there's there's probably at least one
more thing as they continue to kind of reshape this team,

(45:44):
right, how they want to do undertheir their new regime.
And I think one of the most interesting things about the
holiday move too, is that to me,I haven't really studied this
that closely, but it seems like the kind of one of the first
moves that clearly would never have been done without the new
CBA rules in place that there's no way with the team that they
have given. Obviously, the the Jason Tatum

(46:04):
injury is a factor in how they're going to look at next
season. But you would think that you
would just keep as much of that group together as you can.
And that drew still a productiveplayer.
So that that's part of his all the second team that I had
though for intriguing offseason and not because I necessarily
think that they're going to be acontender, but Phoenix Suns,
because I think after the trade that they made, they have so

(46:25):
many guys at the same position. So I'm curious of what direction
are they going to take? Because on one hand, you would
think that in the situation thatthey're in, they're going to try
to rebuild a little bit, kind ofretool what's going to happen
with Jalen Green. They also have Devin Booker and
Bradley Beal, but they also don't have their picks going
forward. So they can't really go into the
mode of like, OK, we're going tojust gear up for the next couple

(46:48):
years. So I just, I'm just curious to
see how they're going to approach the the rest of this
offseason and, and how that's going to affect other teams as
well. And I think what that does is it
it continues to kind of push this thing that in the Western
Conference, you got your like, next year, how many teams are
trying to win 1314 maybe in Utahapparently says they're going to

(47:14):
win. But are are they going to
really, really push for it? You know, Portland's making this
trade for Drew. They had a very good record
after January. They extended Chauncey, Bill
UPS, OK, they're into it. Spurs are in it.
Pels are going to try to retool.Kings are going to kings.
So they're going to try like nobody's really taken in the

(47:34):
Western Conference. And to your point, the Suns
can't so it. Doesn't benefit them at all to
do that, yeah. Everybody, everybody loves the
West, guys. Devin Booker will lead the
league and score. Yeah, there you go.
Everybody loves the West. Get get ready, right?
And remember, the Lakers have been linked to everybody.
So just that's the rule of thumb.

(47:57):
Give me a hot take. Hot take for the draft or
prediction? I don't know if this is a hot
take or not, but I like Walter Clayton junior from Florida and
I don't I'm going to this is forthe future.
I think he's going to be I thinkhe's going to be on the all
rookie team. I just like it.
I just, I just, I like the way he handles everything.

(48:22):
And he just got it. He's got to be with the right
team. But watching him in the NCAA
tournament, he was one of those guys who, you know, nothing
shakes him, nothing rattles him.You don't really speed him up.
He's able to, he's able to handle it.
And he's an older guy. And so I, I just, I just like
him. I, I just like him.
I've got a feeling in which I'vebeen wrong with a whole lot of

(48:44):
feelings, but this one I I I just I.
Like him, I like, I like the guy.
I'm I'm with you on that. I think there's going to be a
lot of movement in the late lottery, early 20s for a lot of
teams. I'm not saying spell Pell

(49:04):
specific, but I think as guys start to to fall or there's
going to be a lot of movement inthere because like I said
before, there's a guy who you might have as 14 on your board
available at 20 or 21 to 20, whatever it is.
I think there's just going to bea lot of movement, a lot of
teams going back and forth because to build off of 1 of
Jim's points earlier because of NIL, the guy who if I'm not,

(49:30):
we're seeing a lot of 19 year olds, 20 year olds pull out.
If you're a freshman, sophomore,you're getting out of the draft
so I can go make more money. We saw this with Drew Timmy.
Drew Timmy who who finally made a splash, was making a splash
with Brooklyn at the end of the year, but he was able to make
more money at Gonzaga than he was on a a rookie deal.

(49:50):
You're seeing more and more and those numbers, they're getting
higher and higher and higher as we go through.
I think the the the early entrance of some of the lowest
numbers, it's been in a very, very long time.
So I think you're going to see more and more of those guys
start to stay in. You're going to see a lot more
of these 4-5 year seniors filling in the back end of the

(50:14):
first round. Whoever thought we'd see the day
where it was more of a risk to go to the NBA financially than
in college? But I think that's what's
happening right now to some extent.
I mean, my hot take for the draft is someone picked very
late in this draft will be amongthe best players in the end as a
as a pro. And I I guess I have a little

(50:34):
bit of evidence. I don't want to get too deep
into the numbers on this, but they're all Syracuse players.
No, I'm. Actually.
Not going to pick any, I'm not going to say anyone specifically
from this draft, but from the last three drafts.
For example, if you look, if you, I went to Basketball
Reference and I looked up careerminutes played by each draft
class. So if you go back to last year's

(50:56):
rookie class, Jalen Wells was the 39th pick in the draft.
He played the third most minutesof any rookie in the league.
By the way, Eve Misi played the 4th most minutes.
He was the 21st pick. You go back two years to Monte
Camaro was the 52nd pick in thatdraft.
He's played more minutes than anyone from that class, which I
thought is interesting. And then from 2022, Andrew
Nemhard was the 31st pick that year and he's played the six

(51:19):
most minutes of anyone from thatclass.
So I guess my point is that if you, if you look at it, there's
been there's been at least one player from each of the last few
drafts who's turned out to be super productive.
And among the the guys that teams maybe look back at and
say, man, I wish we would have taken that guy because he's much
better than the player that we that we picked earlier in the
draft. Herb Jones.

(51:40):
Yeah, hats off the scouting departments because if, if you
can find the guy who fits what you do, you've got a guy and he
might be second round, he might be undrafted.
You know, Naji Marshall and you know, Jose Alvarado.
If you can find a guy who does what you do, the guy can stick.
Yeah. Yeah, no doubt.
I think one of the things that'sgoing to be interesting too is

(52:01):
obviously we talked about it with health and what this team
is. Is it a playoff roster?
Do you have that kind of talent?Is there a vet that you're kind
of excited about here? Because we're not that far away.
July, August, September, we start getting ready in training
camp and preseason, but is therea vet you think that you're
excited about maybe improving the most next year?
See, I was, I was going to say, you know, Carlo Mackovic because

(52:22):
that's my due, or or Eve Macy, but I don't feel like they're
vet enough, you know, second year guys.
So I'm I'm going to go with withHerb Jones and I'm going to go
with Herb for this reason. 1 youknow, he's coming back from
injury. We know that.
But I will say this, I hope, I hope that NBA officials allow
Herb Jones to defend the way they allow Lou Dort to defend.

(52:43):
And if you see that he's going to jump off the pace because
he's already first team all DA anyway.
A couple of years ago when they were giving him still still
rookie calls. Now, if you let him defend,
defend and, you know, grab people's wrists at half court
like we saw in the NBA Finals, then then he's going to because
I mean, Herb is a legit great defender who doesn't have to do

(53:05):
all the little tricks and you know that stuff.
But if he's allowed to, to play,we know he's a guy who can, you
know, he's going to shoot, you know, 35 to 40% from three and
he's probably going to shoot, you know, 48% from the field
because he's, you know, he's going to get on run.
He, you know, gets layups and dunks And we he probably shoot
80% from the line plus. But I think he'll he'll make

(53:26):
another jump, especially if he'sgot his healthy teammates around
him. I think the key for Herbis is to
get back into that. We've seen his shooting
percentage go up. We saw it go down a little bit.
So that's your But if you go back to the to the previous
season, he did start that year, not very good from three and
then shot tremendously the rest of the year.

(53:48):
I'm going to I'm going to say Trey Murphy because I think
we've seen Trey take a jump every single year and I he is
he's going to be rehabbing his shoulder this summer.
So there's going to probably be a little like a slower when he
when he does get back on onto the court of how much is he
going to be able to kind of takeoff right away?
But this team needs another jumpfrom him and I think he is, is,

(54:15):
is poised to do it. I think again, Trey's not a guy.
I think at this point in his, he's not a guy you have to tell
that, hey, keep shooting the ball.
We've, we've, we've heard WillieGreen kind of say that a few
times over the last few years. I've got to tell him to do.
I don't think you got to tell Trey to do that anymore.
And the, the way, especially on this team and how, how things
are going to shake out. I think looking at Trey as the

(54:38):
guy who I I, I need one more jump.
I went with Herb Jones for this as, as JD did.
And I'm sure Herb doesn't see itthis way because he's, you know,
going back and forth between thegym and a fishing hole
somewhere. But I, I kind of see this as the
revenge of Herb. And I I guess part of why I say
that is it feels like from some of the discussion that I've

(54:59):
heard this offseason or some of the completely moronic trade
rumors that we see people post that I think to some extent
people have forgotten how good Herb is.
I mean, the fact that he only played 20 something games, I
think makes it easy for people to forget just how much of A
force that guy was. The fact that he was and.
How many of those games were on a bad shoulder anyway?
Yeah, Yeah. That's a good.

(55:20):
That's a really good point as well that he was he was first
team all defense the year beforethat.
So I I just feel like it's goingto be a chance for him to and
again, I'm sure he doesn't care about this or look at it this
way, but just for him, a chance for him to to serve everyone a
reminder of like how good of a player he is and just how much
of AA factor he is. So please stop posting trade

(55:43):
rumors where it's like the Pelicans trade Herb Jones and
they get back me in the trade. Like please.
Please stop this. Jim, don't undersell yourself.
You got value. Jim.
Knows his value. But Jim also knows Herb Jones
value Zach. He knows.
He knows her. It's interesting.
I know we did this obviously at the end of the season.
Is Z Zion an understood in termsof most approved?

(56:06):
Because like when I think of himlike I'm I'm excited not and I'm
not even talking about the health aspect though, but you
can develop a shot and stuff. I mean, we saw a lab video we've
seen the last couple of days where he's shooting threes, he's
driving to the basket, he's in the elbow jumpers.
Angel. We talk about that all the time.
If he can add to that game, although we know he can drive.
We know we can do that. But we saw at the end of last

(56:27):
year when he was really in that stretch with that minute
restriction, but just in that stretch though of of the season,
he was playing incredible defense out in the perimeter.
He was really active like that. So I some say like I'm talking
about improving his game on the court.
Like for me that's exciting. If he could add other.
I have one one number that I would like to see Z improve next
year and this is not so much that I think Z has to improve,

(56:51):
but it's everything that has to go around.
ZI want to see his minutes ago from 28 to 33 to 34.
So yours is menace, That's what you want?
To see that's all I want to see because with that means he's
healthy, means he's probably look, we talk about the need for
a one let that's your starting point guard.

(57:12):
Next year when it's October and you're getting on the floor for
the first time, no matter how you want to say it, that's
probably your starting point guard.
Yeah. And we saw what he could do when
he was kind of unleashed as thatwith these lineups at the end of
the year. This is a guy who we we were in
Minnesota, he Pelzer Mason a lotthat game.

(57:37):
And he took minutes. He he beat that team.
But like, call it what it is. I mean, I think when you have a
lot, when you have him healthiernext season and he's not on that
restriction that he was for the second-half of the year, If he
can get to that 3334 minute range, you're going to see all
those other numbers go up. And that I think is the key.

(58:01):
That's that's the number one thing I want to see from Scenic.
If Z makes a couple of middies agame, that's that's really
because teams, you know, obviously they back off and they
wait for him at the ramp, makes a couple of middies, stretches
the defense just a little bit. That'll be plenty.
He doesn't have to, he doesn't have to be a guy who shoots a
ton of threes, but if he makes acouple of middies to force you
to be a little bit more honest defensively, then because you

(58:25):
know, we've seen Z, it's it's one of the most incredible
things I've ever seen in my life.
You know he's going left, right and he can't stop.
You can't stop. You know he's going left.
You know he's going to end up atthe rim and you can't stop him.
So if he makes you come out justa little bit and have to play
just a little bit, honestly, he'll get everything you want.

(58:47):
And I think the the other key wetalked about sort of like having
herb get back to being, you know, a 3637% shooter, having
Trey out there, having CJ out there, having whoever else is
out there, but having eve me seein that dunker spot, because
when Z drives, it's all eyes on Z.
And if that dunker spot, if you're there, if you can, if you

(59:09):
can slip to the rim and get it, cool.
But if you can add that little push shot.
We if you if you listen to any broadcast last year, you heard
AD you heard myself talk about the the little 8 to 10 foot push
shot the little jumper there from Eve, which he he threw a
couple and he sprinkled a littlein late in the season.

(59:30):
But he's got to get that part ofhis game more than I think he
needs to shoot a three in the corner do anything else.
Because if all eyes are still going to be on Z, nobody's going
to be watching a dunker spot that person is going to who is
protecting the rim is going to have to step up and Eve's going
to be there and then being able to make the right pass.
He can make an easy living. All that kind of ties itself

(59:53):
together. Yeah, Andrew, when you when you
were talking about the number that you were looking forward
to, maybe this was too obvious. I thought you were going to go
with games played, but I like the minute as well.
But I mean, I think one of the things I'm looking forward to
too is just seeing the impact ofwhat Joe Dumars is going to have
on Zion. We talked about this already a
little bit with Rod in the previous.
Segment of just the approach andit's kind of like a blank slate.

(01:00:15):
I think a a new, it's a it's a fresh start, I guess with with
Joe Dumars here. So I'm curious to see what what
is going to result from that forZion.
See, I think Joe's going to be alittle bit more demanding, if
you want to call it that, a little bit more account heavy.
I think he does, you know, I think, you know, having spoken
to him a few times, he just seems like one of those this is

(01:00:38):
what we expect from you deliver and that's, you know.
That simple. Yeah, don't, don't know.
There's no, you know, sugar coating and dancing around.
This is what we expect. Do it.
And that's going to be, I think that because you have to have,
you know, most guys, when you think about it, I think with the

(01:00:58):
Stan Van Gundy, who said Mike Schefsky told him, you know,
playing, playing, practicing. Get him on the club.
Practicing. Get him he he wants to play.
So OK, here we go play. I would say before we get into
our final question, I guess justto wrap that up to, I think what
I'm interested in is to to your point and Andrew, can you kind

(01:01:20):
of talk about getting that opportunity to it?
Who's the unequivocal leader on this team?
I know it's just like, hey, could be, should be the face.
You look the two teams in the finals, Tyrese Halliburton LED
that team right in Indiana, SGA leaves the Thunder.
When you look at the teams that are successful, then there, you
know who that is unequivocally, one way, shape or form.

(01:01:42):
The other guys are one and they're about it, right?
Would you all agree? Like that to me is one of that
steps. I want to see this here.
Unequivocally to your point, that's in men, it's played.
That's in leaders. That's helping others grow.
Like that is our guy. We can depend on each and every
night, one way, shape or form. I'm going to do what I can to
not lose this game. Like that's what I think we need
here regardless. Now we like to think it's him,

(01:02:04):
but that's that's part of that step.
It's got to be him. I mean, it has to be him.
Your best player has to be that guy.
Now, I think Dejeante Murray probably has the personality for
it, and I think CJ McCollum has kind of the temperament for it.
But your best player is the guy that everybody looks at and
says, OK, we we go as he goes. And when you got a guy like

(01:02:24):
Zion, we've seen Zion, you know,short spans, but we've seen him
freaking win games, just take them over.
And it didn't matter who was on the other team.
We've seen him take games over and win them.
When you've got that kind of guy, everybody's looking around
like we got Superman, OK, now wecan, you know, OK, we'll do our

(01:02:45):
part. But if all else fails, we throw
it at this dude and he can, he can go in the phone booth and he
can win one for us. So, you know, that's the kind of
guy that that leads by default because he's so much of A
gravitational pull and he's so talented, he leads by default.
So he's got to assume the rest of the responsibilities, which
is a maturity aspect I think, but hopefully he will he will

(01:03:09):
grow into. That and I think to to JD's
earlier point about Joe Dumars, I think that is he's going to
put that pressure on him and he's going to push Z to be the
best version of himself to try and draw as much of that out as
he can. Final thing, give me 30 seconds,
man. You touched on the Desmond Bain
thing. Any other of those trades that

(01:03:30):
move so far as we head into the NBA draft that has stood out to
you? I mean, the KD thing was
intriguing because you know, youget Dylan Brooks off the floor,
which I think it's a plus for everybody who plays against
Houston because now you don't have that guy who to aggravate
the heck out of you. But Jalen Green, I thought, you
know, he was, he was ascending and I know he had a bad playoff
series, but man, that's you giveup young talent like that, man,

(01:03:52):
you better. You better be right.
I'll, I'll just say that you better be right.
I think in the East I'm very intrigued to see how that how
the standards are going to shakeout because you have 3
contenders who are not going to have either their their their
best or second best player because of Achilles injuries
next year, Jayson Tatum, Damian Lillard and Tyrese Halliburton.

(01:04:14):
And it really can shake up what the East can be.
I think all three of those teamsstill compete just because of
the other players on their roster, no matter what other
moves they're making. But I think the East is is wide
open. You meant to them in the Desmond
Bane trade now, but you know, does Orlando try to jump?
Is Orlando a top four seed? Is does the door wide open for
Cleveland, Detroit? Back in the cut line.

(01:04:36):
Oh, that's a shame. New York, NY sitting there, you
know, New York can try to retoolsome some things, get their guy,
get their right coach and make some splash.
So I'm I'm really intrigued to see how the East shakes out.
I think one of my reactions to the Houston trade was that
although they did give up Jalen Green and for he's been in the

(01:04:56):
league for four years and Dylan Brooks I think was a big part of
their defense. When you look at the Houston
roster, to me, I was disappointed from a Pelican
standpoint that they didn't giveup.
One of their other pieces that are young players that haven't
played that much, whether it's, you know, Reed Shepherd or Cam
Whitmore or Tari Eason, they just have a bunch of guys to the
point where even after that trade, they still also have

(01:05:19):
future picks from other teams. And they also have young guys
like they could make another deal based basically if they
wanted to try to get somebody who comes available on the trade
market that you don't expect. So I mean that was the part of
it that was I guess kind of a negative if you're a Southwest
Division team of saying like that there's other moves that
they could make because they've done so well with adding talent.

(01:05:41):
Some of the talent we haven't seen play a lot with Shepherd
being the probably the most prominent example.
But I like what I've seen from Whitmore when he's played, but
he hasn't gotten in the in the rotation consistently either.
So I mean, the fact that they were able to do that, I mean,
I'm sure Phoenix didn't have a lot of leverage.
I think that was part of the problem.
But but yeah, I mean, Houston's in good position.

(01:06:01):
Unfortunately for some of the other teams, I think they they
moved up. Durant is a huge upgrade over,
you know, if either way, I guessGreen or Brooks.
And then they have other playersthat can step in and fill some
of those roles. Abolish divisions.
Abolish conferences. I want to see you.

(01:06:21):
I want to see you can defend because like I said, Dylan
Brooks is a is a is a professional adjutant.
And so you lose that edge and I want to see how they defend
because I mean, not Kevin Durant's going to look, he going
he roll out of bed and give you 28.
He just does. But you know you're going to
have to. Defend I will say this, if any

(01:06:42):
team is equipped to do that because of their head coach,
it's the Houston Rockets and he made Adoka because they have the
adjutant in Tar Eason like they there's a lot of guys ready to
step up and when you have Amin Thompson, I think you're I mean
a future probably defensive player of the year, yeah, I
think you're in a good spot no matter.
If you. Have.
That's what I was going to say. That's a big vote of confidence

(01:07:04):
for him as well. Yeah, they have so many guys
that they need to get on the court that it was almost like
you kind of have. Somebody have a couple guys to
do that? Yeah, yeah.
It's crazy how tough the the league looks.
Already polished. See what happens, of course, the
the draft Wednesday, Thursday and we'll be back with you to
kind of get you ready for it. Before you know it, guys,
September, Australia preseason are off and running, you know.

(01:07:28):
So let's see what takes place. Andrew Lopez, silent reporter,
analyst for the Pelicans Radio Network.
Mr. Jaundice Caesar, as always, may appreciate the time and
thank you, Sir. Mr. Jim, I can offer all of his
stuff, joining, leading to the draft and then after the draft
go to pelicans.com. All your mocks, all your notes,
it's almost over. No doubt.
Hey, thank you, as always, for tuning us in on the New Orleans
Pelicans Podcast. Thanks for listening to the New

(01:07:52):
Orleans Pelicans Podcast. Join us three times per week on
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(01:08:12):
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