March 8, 2025 • 30 mins
Newt talks with Ambassador Gregory Slayton about his new book, "Portraits of Ukraine: A Nation at War," which provides an in-depth analysis of the 2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine. The book explores Ukraine's history, culture, and the resilience of its people, complemented by hundreds of images. Slayton, a former US Consul General and Chief of Mission to Bermuda, shares his experiences from Kyiv and Washington, emphasizing the importance of peace through strength and the critical role of US support for Ukraine. He highlights the challenges posed by Russian disinformation and the necessity of continued Western aid. Their conversation underscores the significance of supporting Ukraine's fight for democracy and freedom.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
On this episode of Neutch World.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
In his new book Portraits of Ukraine, A Nation at War,
Gregory Slatin provides a comprehensive analysis into the realities of
the brutal twenty twenty two Russian invasion within the context
of Ukraine's people, history, arts, culture, traditions, and geography. Compelling
(00:26):
and well researched Portraits of Ukraine is enhanced by hundreds
of beautiful images that draw us into the complex, riveting
history that has made Ukraine what it is today, an independent,
democratic European nation of forty million people who are defending
their freedom, their families, and their future. I'm really pleased
(00:47):
to welcome my guest, Ambassador Gregory W. Slayton, former US
Consul General in chief of Mission to Bermuda and author
of the book Portraits of Ukraine A Nation of War. Gregory,
(01:10):
welcome and thank you for joining me on news World.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
Thank you, nud It's an honor to be here and
it's great to see you again.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
You know you were in Kiev on the third anniversary
of the invasion of Ukraine on February twenty fourth. What
was that occasion like, Well, it.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Was a very somber occasion, as you can imagine. I
was invited by President Zelenski's office, which was a great honor.
It was actually the official launch date of our book,
Portraits of Ukraine, a Nation at War, and that was
an honor. Also. The amazing thing, Newt is that the
following Friday, I was in Washington for that incredible dust
(01:46):
up at the White House. So it was really a
crazy juxtaposition, and I think I was one of the
very few Americans to be in both places that week.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
That's amazing.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
So I'm very curious what was your reaction to how
the White House evolved.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
Well, obviously I was deeply disappointed. I appreciate President Trump's
effort to bring peace. I very much believe that peace
through strength. As Ronald Reagan said, trust but verify. And
with a guy like Vladimir Putin, you know, his record
is crystal clear. We just can't trust him. I wish
we could, but we can't. So peace through strength is
(02:25):
the way forward.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
Already, since that meeting, there's seemed to be steps to
get back together again and to find a common ground.
I mean, do you think this is sort of just
a temporary dust up between countries who are in the
long run have a natural interest in each other.
Speaker 3 (02:40):
I do, I do nude, and I've tried to do
my best to kind of bring the parties together in
a small way, many other people more important than me
doing the same thing. I do think that Ukraine, a democratic,
freedom loving country based on the rule of law, has
a lot in common with our nation, and I believe
we will come back together. I believe that minerals deal
(03:01):
will be signed, and I applaud President Trump and his
efforts to really get the parties together again. Peace through strength.
We must avoid at all costs the Nixon Kissinger disaster
in South Vietnam, which I know you remember, you know
there were peace, so called peace. Six months later, the
North Vietnamese overrun the South and twenty years of a
(03:23):
communist hellhole ensues that we cannot allow.
Speaker 2 (03:27):
So the President's address to the Joint Session, he suddenly
stopped and says, quote earlier today, I received an important
letter from President Zelenski of Ukraine. The letter reads, quote,
Ukraine is ready to come to the negotiating table as
soon as possible to bring last team piece closer. Nobody
wants peace more than the Ukrainians. My team and I
(03:47):
A stening ready to work under President Trump's strong leadership
to get a piece that last. We do really value
how much America has done to help Ukraine maintain its
sovereignty independence. Regarding the Agreement on Minerals and Security, Ukraine
is ready to sign it at any time. First of all,
I thought it was kind of dramatic to read the
letter in the middle of his speech. But second, it
(04:08):
sounds to me like they're finding a way to make
up inch by inch and get back in the right direction.
Speaker 1 (04:14):
Is that sort of your read of it?
Speaker 3 (04:16):
Absolutely nude? In fact, I was one of probably many
people who recommended to President Zelensky's office to do a letter,
because in a letter you can control exactly what you say.
There's no chance of a blowback from anybody else. And
I thought they did a good job. Had to be
a little humble, little contracte, had to be thankful, and
(04:36):
had to let everybody know that they want peace also,
and frankly, Newton, nobody wants peace and needs peace more
than the Ukrainians because they have suffered so much.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
So along that line, I noticed that, you know, Zolensky
left from the White House, went to London, but that
in fact, after I met with all the Europeans. They
seem to all be saying to him, you know, you
better find a way to get to work with Trump,
because in the end, the United States is central and
whether not this thing happens.
Speaker 3 (05:04):
You're absolutely right, dude, as you full well know, there
are a number of key military systems that the Europeans
just don't make, and then in terms of volume, they
absolutely need the haft and the breadth of the US
military industrial complex to keep this war going. I mean,
Ukraine will be in very deep trouble within six to
(05:24):
eight months and basically out of keymunitions within twelve months
under any circumstances without the US continued support.
Speaker 2 (05:33):
Now, the Europeans, of some of them, I shouldn't say
the Europeans, but Bretain and France, Turkey have all said
they would be willing to have a European force in
eastern Ukraine as sort of a guaranteur of the agreement.
I'm curious, how do you think Putin will respond to
the idea of Western European troops on the Russian border.
Speaker 3 (05:56):
Well, Putin's already told us, he's already said that's unacceptable,
that's not going to be part of the negotiations. But
what we have to realize about Vladimir Putin he is
at his weakest point in the twenty five years of
his absolute dictatorship. He's lost Syria. His army's been bloody,
just horrible, to the point where they have to get
North Korean basically untrained conscripts to fight alongside the Russians.
(06:21):
Putin has been dramatically weakened. He can, you know, shout
and roar all he wants, but he's in a very
weak position. And I believe that President Trump is a
good negotiator, and we'll understand that, and we'll push for
the kind of guarantees we need, including that minerals deal.
Remember having American contractors, American companies, you know, exploring those
(06:44):
mineral deposits. I don't think Putin's going to want to
kill Americans who happen to be in Ukraine.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
The minute President Trump suggested this, I thought, in a sense,
he's trying to indirectly recreate the hostage environment where you
have so many Americans working in Ukraine that you have
functionally blocked the Russians even if you have not signed
an explicit security agreement.
Speaker 3 (07:09):
You're absolutely right dude, and just look back. Even during
this three year conflict Russia, Putin has specifically said, oh,
we're going to use nukes, We're thinking about using nukes.
We may use nukes. He's never used nukes. He's not
gonna do it now. Of course, do I want to
bet on World War three? Of course not. But sometimes
you have to call out a bully, and you have
(07:29):
to call out a dictator. We learned in World War
Two that appeasing Hitler was a complete and total failure.
We cannot appease Vladimir Putin. That would be an equal well,
I don't know equal, but that would also be a
tremendous failure.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
Part of what's fascinating about the Cold War is we
maintained a balance from the time we published our Grand
Strategy in nineteen fifty until nineteen ninety one when it collapse.
We were able to sort of brush up against each
other in Vietnam and Korea, Cuba, Granada, but orderly we
(08:05):
were very careful not to get to a nuclear war
because both sides knew how trouble was. Because you do
know Ukraine, I have to ask you about one thing.
Is Zelenski said that I was puzzled by he said, quote,
we hear from the US that America has given Ukraine
hundreds of billions, specifically one hundred and seventy seven billion.
To be precise, he says, this is Lelenski. As the
(08:25):
president of a country of war, I tell you we
have received a little over seventy five billion. That means
we never received one hundred billion of that one seventy
seven and that is important. We're talking about specific things.
We did not receive this as cash, but as weapons.
We have received over seventy billion dollars. In weapons, there's training, transport, humanitarian,
social programs, and so forth. But when people say that
(08:46):
Ukraine received two hundred billion dollars to support the army
during the war, that's not true. I don't know where
all that money is. Maybe it exists on paper or
maybe so we don't argue. We're grateful for everything. But
as president, I record that we've received over seventy billion.
That is significant aid, but it's not two hundred I mean,
what do you make.
Speaker 1 (09:02):
Of all that?
Speaker 3 (09:03):
Well, there's a lot of confusion. I mean President Trump
has set three hundred and fifty that's manifestly false. The
number that we put confidence in and we've done some
research on this about one hundred and twenty one hundred
and twenty five billion, which is a big number. One
of the problems, as you know well Newt, is that
the US government, we record the value of our weapons
(09:25):
at the value of the time they were made. Okay,
So it's like I buy a car twenty years ago,
I paid twenty thousand dollars for Well, it's not worth
twenty thousand dollars today. Same thing with weapons systems. A
lot of the weapons systems, in fact, the large majority
that we're giving to Ukraine are weapon systems that are
coming to the end of their useful life. We're paying
American military companies to use American employees to make American
(09:51):
munitions that are fully and totally new and fresh and
ready to go. So I think that Zelensky's wrong. To
be honest, I think the number is big than seventy five,
but it's certainly not three hundred and fifty. Let's say
it's one hundred to one hundred and fifty. I'm very
confident saying it's in that range. That is a huge
amount of money, huge amount of weapons, And Zelensky's right
(10:13):
to be thankful, because without those weapons, this war is over.
Speaker 1 (10:31):
Were you surprised?
Speaker 2 (10:32):
You know, you remember just before the war you had
General Millie, that's trying to joint chief say, you know,
testimony at the Senate that he thought the Russians would
be in Kiev in three days, which I have a
hunch is what Putin's generals told him. Were you surprised
that they were able to stop them so decisively?
Speaker 3 (10:49):
I absolutely was new Do we go into this in
great detail in the book, this Portraits of Ukraine book,
we have a whole chapter on the Russian invasion and
how the Russian military made fundamental mistakes. For instance, you
might know that they only had four or five days
of bullets of equipment of gasoline, for instance, because they
(11:11):
expected to take Kiev. Their spies had told Putin over
and over the Ukrainians Hateselenski. They love Russia, which, of
course is Anybody who knows anything about Ukrainian industry knows
that that's not true. Yes, there is a small portion
of Ukraine, the far East where they are Russian speaking,
but the vast majority of Ukrainians they remember the Holomodore,
(11:32):
the genocide of the twenties and thirties, and the Ukrainians
were ready to fight. Now, it's true that our CIA
and almost all the Western intelligence services said one week,
maximum two, but they didn't take into account the huge
mistakes that the Russian army made splitting into three instead
(11:53):
of just going for Kiev and cutting off the head,
which they could have done. You know, they had three
or four assassination teams in Kiev to assassinate Zelensky, in
his entire cabinet, his wife, everybody. Those assassin nation teams
were taken out and the Ukrainians rallied in what can
only be described as a miracle. And I know, as
(12:14):
a believing person, knew you believe in miracles. And it's
the second day of Lent, and I'm super thankful.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
Well, it's a little bit like the survival of Israel
in forty seven forty eight. The balance of forces are
offset by the balance of morale and moral courage. I
was noticing, while you've done this amazing work on Ukraine
that originally your background when you went to Dartmouth was
in Asian studies, and you were a fulbright scholar in Asia.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
I mean, what was that like?
Speaker 3 (12:45):
Well, that was a wonderful job being a Fulbright scholar
as one of the great honors. I was able to
do a master's in Asian studies. I actually grew up
partially in a Chinese family, and that's a much longer story.
My father abandoned me and my family away and that's
how I came to faith. And you know, here we
are in Lent. I had a wonderful Chinese family, very
(13:06):
strong believing family. They did things I'd never heard of before.
They prayed before meals, they went to church, they read
the Bibles. Like, what are you talking about? But I
saw that they were a wonderful family. They were very close,
they loved each other like everybody. They made mistakes, but
they forgave each other and that made me really interested
in this whole Christianity stuff. I started to read the
(13:28):
Bible with my Chinese brother and a few years later
I converted and I came to Christ and has been
the most important decision of my whole life.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
That's a remarkable story. Where all were you in Asia?
Speaker 3 (13:40):
I was a Fulbright scholar in the Philippines, but my
master's thesis was economic comparison of six different Southeast Asian nations.
And Japan. So I really did economic comparison, macroeconomic comparison,
and I came to see, you know, I'll be honest
new When I was in college, I was pretty much
of a socialist. And then you know, like when in
(14:00):
Churchill said, if you know you're not a liberal when
you're twenty, you have no heart. Right. But I came
to faith, I started to pay taxes. I did this study,
and I saw that big government doesn't work. There's no doubt.
It just was clear that big government didn't work. And
where you had the rule of law, strong currency and
(14:22):
allowed people to just get after their business, like Hong
Kong and Singapore, everything flowered, the economy flowered, the civil
society flowered. It was just a beautiful thing. Taiwan is
a little bit slower, but the same example. So you
see again and again and again that rule of law,
strong currency, government, you know, staying out of the way,
(14:43):
setting the rules and then letting people, letting the free
market work. That is the way, as you've always preached Newton,
I've always appreciated this about you. That's the way to
benefit society.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
When you were doing there scholarship, you end up working
for World Vision, International World Vision International.
Speaker 3 (15:02):
World Vision International was then and is still today, one
of the largest Christian relief organizations in the world. I
specifically was in West Africa, and you'll probably remember nut
that in the middle of the eighties there were tremendous
famines caused by drought in both West Africa and East Africa.
The World Vision had one portion of West Africa, specifically
(15:24):
the Seventh Region of Mali. Now, let me just say
the only reason the Seventh Region of Mali has ever
been heard of. It is the only place in the
world that can legitimately say it is beyond Timbuk two.
This Timbuk Too is the capital of the sixth Region
of Mali. So anyway, I lived there for about three years.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
That puts you on the edge of the Sahara, didn't it.
Speaker 3 (15:46):
Yeah, exactly right, dude. In fact, I own my own
camel and use my camel to commute. We had a
very large operation of maternal child feeding centers and helping
moms to understand how to defeat diarrhea. Back then, the
belief was if your kid had diarrhea, you didn't feed
them anything, didn't give them anything to drink. Well, they
(16:08):
either died or they recover. Most died. So we help
people understand, help moms understand. You have to feed them.
Here's the specific formula. Especially have to give them drink.
It was very rewarding work. I'm still proud of that today.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
That's great.
Speaker 2 (16:23):
But then you ended up with President George W. Bush
named you as the Consul General and Chief of Mission
to Bermuda. That's a pretty big jump in patterns.
Speaker 3 (16:34):
Well, there was a long way between that. We had
four kids, and I was with McKinsey and Company for
a long time and anyway, but yes, I was deeply
honored when President Bush asked me to be the Chief
of Mission to Bermuda. There were some other posts that
were discussed. They were also excellent posts, but we decided
on Bermuda. At that point, Bermuda was the tenth most
(16:57):
visited country by US citizens and and it's still today
one of the largest centers of the reinsurance industry. So
if you have insurance anywhere in the United States, certainly
some of that is laid off in Bermuda. So it's
an important country for US economically. And it was a
great delight and a real pleasure from my family and myself.
Speaker 2 (17:18):
So you mentioned being with McKenzie company. Where did you
live while you worked with them?
Speaker 3 (17:22):
I first worked with mackenzie in Paris. They gave me
a summer internship between my first and second year at
Harvard Business School. I speak French pretty fluently and that
was a great honor. Then I work with them in
New York City. I went down to Buenos Aires to
help found the mckinzian Company in Argentina, which was also
a great honor. I love McKenzie. It's a great firm,
(17:44):
great people. That was a real pleasure. I still stay
in touch with a lot of my former colleagues from
mckenzian company. Really fine firm.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
That's great.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
To go back to your book, One of your major
themes is about the scale of the Russian disinformation campaign.
Can you explain how the Russians approach all this and
how they do it?
Speaker 3 (18:03):
Yes, this dates back to the KGB days of the
Soviet Union, what they called active measures. Now the FSB
doesn't use that term anymore, but of course, as you know,
Vladimir Putin is a former KGB officer and he loves
that kind of stuff. So they have accelerated their misinformation
(18:24):
and disinformation campaigns. Western intelligence services believe that they spent
at least one point two billion dollars a year on disinformation,
misinformation propaganda, and I think that is a more or
less accurate number that buys you an awful lot of
(18:44):
you know, I want to be diplomatic. I mean, we
can disagree about things, but to say that NATO started
this war, Ukraine started this war, or Ukraine doesn't have
freedom of religion, when our book documents over five hundred
Christian churches that have been closed, have been bombed, have
been destroyed, or the priests or pastors had been jailed
(19:05):
in the occupied Ukrainian territories over the last two years,
over five hundred. There is no religious freedom in Russia.
There is religious freedom in Ukraine. And that's the type
of disinformation we want to take head.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
Off part of what I'm struck with.
Speaker 2 (19:36):
And I'm very much for the survival of Ukraine, and
I think that there's qualitatively no comparison between the dictatorship
in Moscow and the efforts of the Ukrainian people to
be self governing. But at the same time, Putin has
been very open for a very long time that in
his worldview, the greatest disaster in the twentieth century was
(19:58):
the collapse of the Soviet Union, and that, in a
sense he represents a kind of almost paranoid Russian nationalism
which sees itself permanently under siege, not just from the Americans,
but from everybody. Do you think that he is tired enough,
or that his system, not him personally, is tired enough
(20:20):
that it is plausible that they will in fact accept
a serious truth.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
Well, I can only hope. But what you say must
be noted, because Putin has said over and over what
you just mentioned. The greatest tragedy of the twentieth centuries
followed the Soviet Union, and he sees himself as Peter
the Great. He wants to re establish Soviet Union. What
does that mean for Poland? What does it mean for
all the former Soviet states? That's why Poland is in
(20:48):
this battle. That's why Poland is one of the greatest
allies of Ukraine, and not just Poland, all those former
Soviet states except the ones that are lap dogs, like Belarus.
Belarus is not dependent country in any way. They do
whatever Putin wants them to do, but everyone else is
opposed because they know they are next and that's what
(21:08):
we've got to think is members of NATO.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
I was reviewing GO today.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
The Western countries in NATO have actually put forces into Lithuania, Latvia,
in Estonia. They're not big forces, but they're enough that
they would be signaling devices, if you want to think
of it that way.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
But again, from a.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
Prudent standpoint, it's almost like his aggressiveness has backfired totally me.
You now have Sweden and Finland in NATO, which they
never would have done it. You have the Swiss buying
F thirty five's and talking about increasing their defense budget.
Speaker 1 (21:40):
I mean, in a lot of ways.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
His aggressiveness, it seems to me, has actually put Russia
at a greater disadvantage.
Speaker 3 (21:48):
I totally agree. New But remember one of the greatest
weaknesses of any dictatorship, not just Russia, right, is that
the paramount leader doesn't hear bad news. He just doesn't.
That's why the Russian military split up their forces into
three different because he was told, and they were told
time and time again. Ukrainians are going to greet you
(22:08):
with bread and salt, they love you, blah blah blah.
And that's why Putin is not hearing about all these
military disasters, that his army has been absolutely pummeled in
terms of material losses, in terms of manpower. From what
I understand, Putin is not hearing that because you do
(22:29):
not bring bad news to the boss.
Speaker 2 (22:31):
Given all that, is there a circumstance where we could
develop a truce that would actually stick as opposed to
just being a breathing space for Putin to rebuilder.
Speaker 3 (22:42):
That's the million dollar question. And I believe that what
France and England are talking about European boots on the ground,
as much as Putin hates that, with an American backstop,
that doesn't really work without American intelligence, American oversight, American
military backstop, but with an American military backstep, and especially
(23:03):
the minerals deal, where Americans are exploring and mining and
refining large amounts. These are not poultry amounts of critical minerals.
These are large amounts of critical minerals. I think it
could hold. Remember that Putin not only has suffered great
losses geopolitically, the loss of Syria was a huge blow
(23:23):
to his prestige because Big called and said we have this.
We know that the former dictator called Russia and asked
Putin for help, and Putin said effectively. Yet that is
not a good look for a wanna be ruler of
the world.
Speaker 2 (23:39):
It's also interesting because the Western allies in the United
States bought Ukraine time.
Speaker 1 (23:45):
People forget.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Ukraine used to be a very important manufacturing center for
the Civil Union. They built the largest freight carrying aircraft
in the world, they built nuclear weapons. Today they're building
I think forty thousand drones.
Speaker 3 (23:59):
Of I think the number is actually substantially higher than
that new but it's impressive.
Speaker 2 (24:05):
That would suggest they may be much harder for the
Russians to defeat than people think.
Speaker 3 (24:10):
Yeah, well, you're absolutely right. Ukrainians are smart, they're resourceful,
they're good business people, and yeah, the actual number from
what I've told from Kiev is far higher than that.
And that's great news because otherwise it's asymmetric in terms
of the number of soldiers as you know, and shells
(24:30):
and everything. But it's been the drones that have been
super impressive. Something else most people don't realize is Russia
just doesn't have the manpower to occupy Ukraine. Just doesn't.
Depending on different calculations and how rest of the Ukrainians
would be under Russian occupation. You're talking about maybe a
quarter of a million troops in Ukraine. That doesn't work
(24:51):
for Russia if you want to have forces elsewhere as well.
You know, we see the losses of Russian ally in
the occupied territories. Almost every day, some Russian mayor or
vice mayor or someone is getting killed. That's just not
going to work. A Russian occupation of Ukraine just will
not work.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
One of the things that was sort of an amazing
technological change was Elon Musk shifting the starlink system to
put it over Ukraine.
Speaker 1 (25:23):
How big a deal was that.
Speaker 3 (25:25):
Starlink is absolutely critical to the Ukrainian military, absolutely critical.
There's a few alternatives of starlink that have been developed,
but starlink is absolutely critical and the Ukrainians use it
all the time. By the way, the Russians are using
it now too, as you probably know, but the Ukrainians
use it extensively, and it has been super helpful because
(25:45):
without information, you know, you can't use drones, you can't
use anything, right, if you don't know where your enemy is,
you can't hit it.
Speaker 2 (25:54):
In the early phase of the war, to a degree
you wouldn't expect from an individual, even the richest in
the world as opposed to a country.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
His decisions were really.
Speaker 3 (26:03):
Important, critically important, and you know, I appreciate he comes
in for a lot of criticism, and maybe some of
it is justifiable. But that decision, just like when Zelensky said, Hey,
I don't need a ride, I need ammunition. The fight
is right here. That's the kind of Winston Churchill type
statement that really rallied the Ukrainians, helped them to kick
(26:24):
the Russians out of Kiev. And here we are three
years later, still fighting.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
What led you to decide to do portraits of Ukraine
a nation of war?
Speaker 3 (26:33):
Thank you, Nude. I appreciate your asking that. Since very
early after the Russian invasion, we began with a number
of other great Christian faith based organizations to deliver large
trucks into the war zones of Eastern and southern Ukraine,
trucks full of food, some medical supplies, but I'd say
ninety eight percent food because people were starving. I mean
(26:55):
that all the grocery stores had been destroyed, there was
nothing there. We have a network of over one hundred
small distribution centers, many or churches, some are synagogue, some
are community centers. And what we saw there is that
the need was just escalating and donor fatigue was understandably
setting in. So we decided together as a family that
(27:17):
we wanted to do something for Ukraine, both to generate
revenue for these great Ukrainian nonprofits, but also we kept
hearing these crazy stories from people. You know, I'm not
going to mention any names, but maybe Tucker Carlson comes
to mind. Where does he get this stuff? He's a
Kremlin mouthpiece and he knows better. I really believe that.
(27:38):
I don't think Tucker Carlson is stupid or whatever, but
for whatever reason, he and a whole bunch of other
people are spreading a lot of stuff that's just playing wrong. Yes,
there is corruption in Ukraine, there's corruption in every former
Soviet Union nation, but according to Transparency International and a
number of others, Ukraine has gotten much much better over
(27:59):
the life last four or five years. They're working hard
on that. And of course, freedom, democracy, the rule of law.
Those are the cornerstones of civilization and that's what Americ
stands for. I don't believe that we can wash our
hands of this, and that's why we did the book Nude,
because helping people understand this is not just a Ukrainian battle,
(28:21):
This is not just a European battle. This is a
battle for everyone who believes in freedom, in democracy, freedom
of religion, freedom of speech, freedom of assembly. You try
to go to Russia and criticize Vladimir Putin, you'll be
there for less than a day, less than a day
until you're thrown in jail. There is no freedom in Russia. No.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
I think that's right, and we get reminded of it regularly. Gregory,
I want to thank you for joining me. Your new book,
Portraits of Ukraine a National War is available now on
Amazon and in bookstores everywhere. It's an extraordinary book. I
recommend everyone get a copy of it, and I do
want to mention that all profit from the sale of
your book go to pro Ukrainian charities that are helping
(29:04):
the many millions of Ukrainians who've been deeply wounded by
Russia's ongoing war. This is a real act of love
and dedication on your part, and you're taking the time
to talk with us. I hope we'll educate some of
our listeners into understanding how important it is that Ukraine
not be defeated and that Ukraine continue as independent country,
and that we do have an obligation to find a
(29:26):
solution which hopefully will end the fighting, but will end
the fighting in ways that are permanent and that mean
that Russia cannot come back and try again.
Speaker 3 (29:36):
Well, you're exactly right, nude. It's such a pleasure and
an honor to be with you. Thank you for standing
for freedom and democracy and the rule of law all
your life. That's a big deal. So I'm honored to
be here. Thank you for having me, and let me
also wish God bless you and happy Easter and Slava Ukrainian.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
Thank you to my guest, Gregory W. Slayton.
Speaker 2 (30:00):
You can get a link to buy his new book,
Portraits of Ukraine, A Nation at War on our show
page at.
Speaker 1 (30:06):
Newtsworld dot com.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Newt World is produced by Ginglish three sixty and iHeartMedia.
Our executive producer is Guernsey Sloan. Our researcher is Rachel Peterson.
The artwork for the show was created by Steve Penley.
Special thanks to the team at ginglishtree sixty. If you've
been enjoying Newtsworld, I hope you'll go to Apple Podcast
and both rate us with five stars and give us
(30:28):
a review so others can learn what it's all about.
Right now, listeners of Newtsworld can sign up for my
three free weekly columns at gingishtree sixty dot com slash newsletter.
Speaker 1 (30:40):
I'm Nute, gingrich. This is Newtsworld.
On this episode of Neutch World.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
In his new book Portraits of Ukraine, A Nation at War,
Gregory Slatin provides a comprehensive analysis into the realities of
the brutal twenty twenty two Russian invasion within the context
of Ukraine's people, history, arts, culture, traditions, and geography. Compelling
(00:26):
and well researched Portraits of Ukraine is enhanced by hundreds
of beautiful images that draw us into the complex, riveting
history that has made Ukraine what it is today, an independent,
democratic European nation of forty million people who are defending
their freedom, their families, and their future. I'm really pleased
(00:47):
to welcome my guest, Ambassador Gregory W. Slayton, former US
Consul General in chief of Mission to Bermuda and author
of the book Portraits of Ukraine A Nation of War. Gregory,
(01:10):
welcome and thank you for joining me on news World.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
Thank you, nud It's an honor to be here and
it's great to see you again.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
You know you were in Kiev on the third anniversary
of the invasion of Ukraine on February twenty fourth. What
was that occasion like, Well, it.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Was a very somber occasion, as you can imagine. I
was invited by President Zelenski's office, which was a great honor.
It was actually the official launch date of our book,
Portraits of Ukraine, a Nation at War, and that was
an honor. Also. The amazing thing, Newt is that the
following Friday, I was in Washington for that incredible dust
(01:46):
up at the White House. So it was really a
crazy juxtaposition, and I think I was one of the
very few Americans to be in both places that week.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
That's amazing.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
So I'm very curious what was your reaction to how
the White House evolved.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
Well, obviously I was deeply disappointed. I appreciate President Trump's
effort to bring peace. I very much believe that peace
through strength. As Ronald Reagan said, trust but verify. And
with a guy like Vladimir Putin, you know, his record
is crystal clear. We just can't trust him. I wish
we could, but we can't. So peace through strength is
(02:25):
the way forward.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
Already, since that meeting, there's seemed to be steps to
get back together again and to find a common ground.
I mean, do you think this is sort of just
a temporary dust up between countries who are in the
long run have a natural interest in each other.
Speaker 3 (02:40):
I do, I do nude, and I've tried to do
my best to kind of bring the parties together in
a small way, many other people more important than me
doing the same thing. I do think that Ukraine, a democratic,
freedom loving country based on the rule of law, has
a lot in common with our nation, and I believe
we will come back together. I believe that minerals deal
(03:01):
will be signed, and I applaud President Trump and his
efforts to really get the parties together again. Peace through strength.
We must avoid at all costs the Nixon Kissinger disaster
in South Vietnam, which I know you remember, you know
there were peace, so called peace. Six months later, the
North Vietnamese overrun the South and twenty years of a
(03:23):
communist hellhole ensues that we cannot allow.
Speaker 2 (03:27):
So the President's address to the Joint Session, he suddenly
stopped and says, quote earlier today, I received an important
letter from President Zelenski of Ukraine. The letter reads, quote,
Ukraine is ready to come to the negotiating table as
soon as possible to bring last team piece closer. Nobody
wants peace more than the Ukrainians. My team and I
(03:47):
A stening ready to work under President Trump's strong leadership
to get a piece that last. We do really value
how much America has done to help Ukraine maintain its
sovereignty independence. Regarding the Agreement on Minerals and Security, Ukraine
is ready to sign it at any time. First of all,
I thought it was kind of dramatic to read the
letter in the middle of his speech. But second, it
(04:08):
sounds to me like they're finding a way to make
up inch by inch and get back in the right direction.
Speaker 1 (04:14):
Is that sort of your read of it?
Speaker 3 (04:16):
Absolutely nude? In fact, I was one of probably many
people who recommended to President Zelensky's office to do a letter,
because in a letter you can control exactly what you say.
There's no chance of a blowback from anybody else. And
I thought they did a good job. Had to be
a little humble, little contracte, had to be thankful, and
(04:36):
had to let everybody know that they want peace also,
and frankly, Newton, nobody wants peace and needs peace more
than the Ukrainians because they have suffered so much.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
So along that line, I noticed that, you know, Zolensky
left from the White House, went to London, but that
in fact, after I met with all the Europeans. They
seem to all be saying to him, you know, you
better find a way to get to work with Trump,
because in the end, the United States is central and
whether not this thing happens.
Speaker 3 (05:04):
You're absolutely right, dude, as you full well know, there
are a number of key military systems that the Europeans
just don't make, and then in terms of volume, they
absolutely need the haft and the breadth of the US
military industrial complex to keep this war going. I mean,
Ukraine will be in very deep trouble within six to
(05:24):
eight months and basically out of keymunitions within twelve months
under any circumstances without the US continued support.
Speaker 2 (05:33):
Now, the Europeans, of some of them, I shouldn't say
the Europeans, but Bretain and France, Turkey have all said
they would be willing to have a European force in
eastern Ukraine as sort of a guaranteur of the agreement.
I'm curious, how do you think Putin will respond to
the idea of Western European troops on the Russian border.
Speaker 3 (05:56):
Well, Putin's already told us, he's already said that's unacceptable,
that's not going to be part of the negotiations. But
what we have to realize about Vladimir Putin he is
at his weakest point in the twenty five years of
his absolute dictatorship. He's lost Syria. His army's been bloody,
just horrible, to the point where they have to get
North Korean basically untrained conscripts to fight alongside the Russians.
(06:21):
Putin has been dramatically weakened. He can, you know, shout
and roar all he wants, but he's in a very
weak position. And I believe that President Trump is a
good negotiator, and we'll understand that, and we'll push for
the kind of guarantees we need, including that minerals deal.
Remember having American contractors, American companies, you know, exploring those
(06:44):
mineral deposits. I don't think Putin's going to want to
kill Americans who happen to be in Ukraine.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
The minute President Trump suggested this, I thought, in a sense,
he's trying to indirectly recreate the hostage environment where you
have so many Americans working in Ukraine that you have
functionally blocked the Russians even if you have not signed
an explicit security agreement.
Speaker 3 (07:09):
You're absolutely right dude, and just look back. Even during
this three year conflict Russia, Putin has specifically said, oh,
we're going to use nukes, We're thinking about using nukes.
We may use nukes. He's never used nukes. He's not
gonna do it now. Of course, do I want to
bet on World War three? Of course not. But sometimes
you have to call out a bully, and you have
(07:29):
to call out a dictator. We learned in World War
Two that appeasing Hitler was a complete and total failure.
We cannot appease Vladimir Putin. That would be an equal well,
I don't know equal, but that would also be a
tremendous failure.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
Part of what's fascinating about the Cold War is we
maintained a balance from the time we published our Grand
Strategy in nineteen fifty until nineteen ninety one when it collapse.
We were able to sort of brush up against each
other in Vietnam and Korea, Cuba, Granada, but orderly we
(08:05):
were very careful not to get to a nuclear war
because both sides knew how trouble was. Because you do
know Ukraine, I have to ask you about one thing.
Is Zelenski said that I was puzzled by he said, quote,
we hear from the US that America has given Ukraine
hundreds of billions, specifically one hundred and seventy seven billion.
To be precise, he says, this is Lelenski. As the
(08:25):
president of a country of war, I tell you we
have received a little over seventy five billion. That means
we never received one hundred billion of that one seventy
seven and that is important. We're talking about specific things.
We did not receive this as cash, but as weapons.
We have received over seventy billion dollars. In weapons, there's training, transport, humanitarian,
social programs, and so forth. But when people say that
(08:46):
Ukraine received two hundred billion dollars to support the army
during the war, that's not true. I don't know where
all that money is. Maybe it exists on paper or
maybe so we don't argue. We're grateful for everything. But
as president, I record that we've received over seventy billion.
That is significant aid, but it's not two hundred I mean,
what do you make.
Speaker 1 (09:02):
Of all that?
Speaker 3 (09:03):
Well, there's a lot of confusion. I mean President Trump
has set three hundred and fifty that's manifestly false. The
number that we put confidence in and we've done some
research on this about one hundred and twenty one hundred
and twenty five billion, which is a big number. One
of the problems, as you know well Newt, is that
the US government, we record the value of our weapons
(09:25):
at the value of the time they were made. Okay,
So it's like I buy a car twenty years ago,
I paid twenty thousand dollars for Well, it's not worth
twenty thousand dollars today. Same thing with weapons systems. A
lot of the weapons systems, in fact, the large majority
that we're giving to Ukraine are weapon systems that are
coming to the end of their useful life. We're paying
American military companies to use American employees to make American
(09:51):
munitions that are fully and totally new and fresh and
ready to go. So I think that Zelensky's wrong. To
be honest, I think the number is big than seventy five,
but it's certainly not three hundred and fifty. Let's say
it's one hundred to one hundred and fifty. I'm very
confident saying it's in that range. That is a huge
amount of money, huge amount of weapons, And Zelensky's right
(10:13):
to be thankful, because without those weapons, this war is over.
Speaker 1 (10:31):
Were you surprised?
Speaker 2 (10:32):
You know, you remember just before the war you had
General Millie, that's trying to joint chief say, you know,
testimony at the Senate that he thought the Russians would
be in Kiev in three days, which I have a
hunch is what Putin's generals told him. Were you surprised
that they were able to stop them so decisively?
Speaker 3 (10:49):
I absolutely was new Do we go into this in
great detail in the book, this Portraits of Ukraine book,
we have a whole chapter on the Russian invasion and
how the Russian military made fundamental mistakes. For instance, you
might know that they only had four or five days
of bullets of equipment of gasoline, for instance, because they
(11:11):
expected to take Kiev. Their spies had told Putin over
and over the Ukrainians Hateselenski. They love Russia, which, of
course is Anybody who knows anything about Ukrainian industry knows
that that's not true. Yes, there is a small portion
of Ukraine, the far East where they are Russian speaking,
but the vast majority of Ukrainians they remember the Holomodore,
(11:32):
the genocide of the twenties and thirties, and the Ukrainians
were ready to fight. Now, it's true that our CIA
and almost all the Western intelligence services said one week,
maximum two, but they didn't take into account the huge
mistakes that the Russian army made splitting into three instead
(11:53):
of just going for Kiev and cutting off the head,
which they could have done. You know, they had three
or four assassination teams in Kiev to assassinate Zelensky, in
his entire cabinet, his wife, everybody. Those assassin nation teams
were taken out and the Ukrainians rallied in what can
only be described as a miracle. And I know, as
(12:14):
a believing person, knew you believe in miracles. And it's
the second day of Lent, and I'm super thankful.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
Well, it's a little bit like the survival of Israel
in forty seven forty eight. The balance of forces are
offset by the balance of morale and moral courage. I
was noticing, while you've done this amazing work on Ukraine
that originally your background when you went to Dartmouth was
in Asian studies, and you were a fulbright scholar in Asia.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
I mean, what was that like?
Speaker 3 (12:45):
Well, that was a wonderful job being a Fulbright scholar
as one of the great honors. I was able to
do a master's in Asian studies. I actually grew up
partially in a Chinese family, and that's a much longer story.
My father abandoned me and my family away and that's
how I came to faith. And you know, here we
are in Lent. I had a wonderful Chinese family, very
(13:06):
strong believing family. They did things I'd never heard of before.
They prayed before meals, they went to church, they read
the Bibles. Like, what are you talking about? But I
saw that they were a wonderful family. They were very close,
they loved each other like everybody. They made mistakes, but
they forgave each other and that made me really interested
in this whole Christianity stuff. I started to read the
(13:28):
Bible with my Chinese brother and a few years later
I converted and I came to Christ and has been
the most important decision of my whole life.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
That's a remarkable story. Where all were you in Asia?
Speaker 3 (13:40):
I was a Fulbright scholar in the Philippines, but my
master's thesis was economic comparison of six different Southeast Asian nations.
And Japan. So I really did economic comparison, macroeconomic comparison,
and I came to see, you know, I'll be honest
new When I was in college, I was pretty much
of a socialist. And then you know, like when in
(14:00):
Churchill said, if you know you're not a liberal when
you're twenty, you have no heart. Right. But I came
to faith, I started to pay taxes. I did this study,
and I saw that big government doesn't work. There's no doubt.
It just was clear that big government didn't work. And
where you had the rule of law, strong currency and
(14:22):
allowed people to just get after their business, like Hong
Kong and Singapore, everything flowered, the economy flowered, the civil
society flowered. It was just a beautiful thing. Taiwan is
a little bit slower, but the same example. So you
see again and again and again that rule of law,
strong currency, government, you know, staying out of the way,
(14:43):
setting the rules and then letting people, letting the free
market work. That is the way, as you've always preached Newton,
I've always appreciated this about you. That's the way to
benefit society.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
When you were doing there scholarship, you end up working
for World Vision, International World Vision International.
Speaker 3 (15:02):
World Vision International was then and is still today, one
of the largest Christian relief organizations in the world. I
specifically was in West Africa, and you'll probably remember nut
that in the middle of the eighties there were tremendous
famines caused by drought in both West Africa and East Africa.
The World Vision had one portion of West Africa, specifically
(15:24):
the Seventh Region of Mali. Now, let me just say
the only reason the Seventh Region of Mali has ever
been heard of. It is the only place in the
world that can legitimately say it is beyond Timbuk two.
This Timbuk Too is the capital of the sixth Region
of Mali. So anyway, I lived there for about three years.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
That puts you on the edge of the Sahara, didn't it.
Speaker 3 (15:46):
Yeah, exactly right, dude. In fact, I own my own
camel and use my camel to commute. We had a
very large operation of maternal child feeding centers and helping
moms to understand how to defeat diarrhea. Back then, the
belief was if your kid had diarrhea, you didn't feed
them anything, didn't give them anything to drink. Well, they
(16:08):
either died or they recover. Most died. So we help
people understand, help moms understand. You have to feed them.
Here's the specific formula. Especially have to give them drink.
It was very rewarding work. I'm still proud of that today.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
That's great.
Speaker 2 (16:23):
But then you ended up with President George W. Bush
named you as the Consul General and Chief of Mission
to Bermuda. That's a pretty big jump in patterns.
Speaker 3 (16:34):
Well, there was a long way between that. We had
four kids, and I was with McKinsey and Company for
a long time and anyway, but yes, I was deeply
honored when President Bush asked me to be the Chief
of Mission to Bermuda. There were some other posts that
were discussed. They were also excellent posts, but we decided
on Bermuda. At that point, Bermuda was the tenth most
(16:57):
visited country by US citizens and and it's still today
one of the largest centers of the reinsurance industry. So
if you have insurance anywhere in the United States, certainly
some of that is laid off in Bermuda. So it's
an important country for US economically. And it was a
great delight and a real pleasure from my family and myself.
Speaker 2 (17:18):
So you mentioned being with McKenzie company. Where did you
live while you worked with them?
Speaker 3 (17:22):
I first worked with mackenzie in Paris. They gave me
a summer internship between my first and second year at
Harvard Business School. I speak French pretty fluently and that
was a great honor. Then I work with them in
New York City. I went down to Buenos Aires to
help found the mckinzian Company in Argentina, which was also
a great honor. I love McKenzie. It's a great firm,
(17:44):
great people. That was a real pleasure. I still stay
in touch with a lot of my former colleagues from
mckenzian company. Really fine firm.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
That's great.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
To go back to your book, One of your major
themes is about the scale of the Russian disinformation campaign.
Can you explain how the Russians approach all this and
how they do it?
Speaker 3 (18:03):
Yes, this dates back to the KGB days of the
Soviet Union, what they called active measures. Now the FSB
doesn't use that term anymore, but of course, as you know,
Vladimir Putin is a former KGB officer and he loves
that kind of stuff. So they have accelerated their misinformation
(18:24):
and disinformation campaigns. Western intelligence services believe that they spent
at least one point two billion dollars a year on disinformation,
misinformation propaganda, and I think that is a more or
less accurate number that buys you an awful lot of
(18:44):
you know, I want to be diplomatic. I mean, we
can disagree about things, but to say that NATO started
this war, Ukraine started this war, or Ukraine doesn't have
freedom of religion, when our book documents over five hundred
Christian churches that have been closed, have been bombed, have
been destroyed, or the priests or pastors had been jailed
(19:05):
in the occupied Ukrainian territories over the last two years,
over five hundred. There is no religious freedom in Russia.
There is religious freedom in Ukraine. And that's the type
of disinformation we want to take head.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
Off part of what I'm struck with.
Speaker 2 (19:36):
And I'm very much for the survival of Ukraine, and
I think that there's qualitatively no comparison between the dictatorship
in Moscow and the efforts of the Ukrainian people to
be self governing. But at the same time, Putin has
been very open for a very long time that in
his worldview, the greatest disaster in the twentieth century was
(19:58):
the collapse of the Soviet Union, and that, in a
sense he represents a kind of almost paranoid Russian nationalism
which sees itself permanently under siege, not just from the Americans,
but from everybody. Do you think that he is tired enough,
or that his system, not him personally, is tired enough
(20:20):
that it is plausible that they will in fact accept
a serious truth.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
Well, I can only hope. But what you say must
be noted, because Putin has said over and over what
you just mentioned. The greatest tragedy of the twentieth centuries
followed the Soviet Union, and he sees himself as Peter
the Great. He wants to re establish Soviet Union. What
does that mean for Poland? What does it mean for
all the former Soviet states? That's why Poland is in
(20:48):
this battle. That's why Poland is one of the greatest
allies of Ukraine, and not just Poland, all those former
Soviet states except the ones that are lap dogs, like Belarus.
Belarus is not dependent country in any way. They do
whatever Putin wants them to do, but everyone else is
opposed because they know they are next and that's what
(21:08):
we've got to think is members of NATO.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
I was reviewing GO today.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
The Western countries in NATO have actually put forces into Lithuania, Latvia,
in Estonia. They're not big forces, but they're enough that
they would be signaling devices, if you want to think
of it that way.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
But again, from a.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
Prudent standpoint, it's almost like his aggressiveness has backfired totally me.
You now have Sweden and Finland in NATO, which they
never would have done it. You have the Swiss buying
F thirty five's and talking about increasing their defense budget.
Speaker 1 (21:40):
I mean, in a lot of ways.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
His aggressiveness, it seems to me, has actually put Russia
at a greater disadvantage.
Speaker 3 (21:48):
I totally agree. New But remember one of the greatest
weaknesses of any dictatorship, not just Russia, right, is that
the paramount leader doesn't hear bad news. He just doesn't.
That's why the Russian military split up their forces into
three different because he was told, and they were told
time and time again. Ukrainians are going to greet you
(22:08):
with bread and salt, they love you, blah blah blah.
And that's why Putin is not hearing about all these
military disasters, that his army has been absolutely pummeled in
terms of material losses, in terms of manpower. From what
I understand, Putin is not hearing that because you do
(22:29):
not bring bad news to the boss.
Speaker 2 (22:31):
Given all that, is there a circumstance where we could
develop a truce that would actually stick as opposed to
just being a breathing space for Putin to rebuilder.
Speaker 3 (22:42):
That's the million dollar question. And I believe that what
France and England are talking about European boots on the ground,
as much as Putin hates that, with an American backstop,
that doesn't really work without American intelligence, American oversight, American
military backstop, but with an American military backstep, and especially
(23:03):
the minerals deal, where Americans are exploring and mining and
refining large amounts. These are not poultry amounts of critical minerals.
These are large amounts of critical minerals. I think it
could hold. Remember that Putin not only has suffered great
losses geopolitically, the loss of Syria was a huge blow
(23:23):
to his prestige because Big called and said we have this.
We know that the former dictator called Russia and asked
Putin for help, and Putin said effectively. Yet that is
not a good look for a wanna be ruler of
the world.
Speaker 2 (23:39):
It's also interesting because the Western allies in the United
States bought Ukraine time.
Speaker 1 (23:45):
People forget.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Ukraine used to be a very important manufacturing center for
the Civil Union. They built the largest freight carrying aircraft
in the world, they built nuclear weapons. Today they're building
I think forty thousand drones.
Speaker 3 (23:59):
Of I think the number is actually substantially higher than
that new but it's impressive.
Speaker 2 (24:05):
That would suggest they may be much harder for the
Russians to defeat than people think.
Speaker 3 (24:10):
Yeah, well, you're absolutely right. Ukrainians are smart, they're resourceful,
they're good business people, and yeah, the actual number from
what I've told from Kiev is far higher than that.
And that's great news because otherwise it's asymmetric in terms
of the number of soldiers as you know, and shells
(24:30):
and everything. But it's been the drones that have been
super impressive. Something else most people don't realize is Russia
just doesn't have the manpower to occupy Ukraine. Just doesn't.
Depending on different calculations and how rest of the Ukrainians
would be under Russian occupation. You're talking about maybe a
quarter of a million troops in Ukraine. That doesn't work
(24:51):
for Russia if you want to have forces elsewhere as well.
You know, we see the losses of Russian ally in
the occupied territories. Almost every day, some Russian mayor or
vice mayor or someone is getting killed. That's just not
going to work. A Russian occupation of Ukraine just will
not work.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
One of the things that was sort of an amazing
technological change was Elon Musk shifting the starlink system to
put it over Ukraine.
Speaker 1 (25:23):
How big a deal was that.
Speaker 3 (25:25):
Starlink is absolutely critical to the Ukrainian military, absolutely critical.
There's a few alternatives of starlink that have been developed,
but starlink is absolutely critical and the Ukrainians use it
all the time. By the way, the Russians are using
it now too, as you probably know, but the Ukrainians
use it extensively, and it has been super helpful because
(25:45):
without information, you know, you can't use drones, you can't
use anything, right, if you don't know where your enemy is,
you can't hit it.
Speaker 2 (25:54):
In the early phase of the war, to a degree
you wouldn't expect from an individual, even the richest in
the world as opposed to a country.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
His decisions were really.
Speaker 3 (26:03):
Important, critically important, and you know, I appreciate he comes
in for a lot of criticism, and maybe some of
it is justifiable. But that decision, just like when Zelensky said, Hey,
I don't need a ride, I need ammunition. The fight
is right here. That's the kind of Winston Churchill type
statement that really rallied the Ukrainians, helped them to kick
(26:24):
the Russians out of Kiev. And here we are three
years later, still fighting.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
What led you to decide to do portraits of Ukraine
a nation of war?
Speaker 3 (26:33):
Thank you, Nude. I appreciate your asking that. Since very
early after the Russian invasion, we began with a number
of other great Christian faith based organizations to deliver large
trucks into the war zones of Eastern and southern Ukraine,
trucks full of food, some medical supplies, but I'd say
ninety eight percent food because people were starving. I mean
(26:55):
that all the grocery stores had been destroyed, there was
nothing there. We have a network of over one hundred
small distribution centers, many or churches, some are synagogue, some
are community centers. And what we saw there is that
the need was just escalating and donor fatigue was understandably
setting in. So we decided together as a family that
(27:17):
we wanted to do something for Ukraine, both to generate
revenue for these great Ukrainian nonprofits, but also we kept
hearing these crazy stories from people. You know, I'm not
going to mention any names, but maybe Tucker Carlson comes
to mind. Where does he get this stuff? He's a
Kremlin mouthpiece and he knows better. I really believe that.
(27:38):
I don't think Tucker Carlson is stupid or whatever, but
for whatever reason, he and a whole bunch of other
people are spreading a lot of stuff that's just playing wrong. Yes,
there is corruption in Ukraine, there's corruption in every former
Soviet Union nation, but according to Transparency International and a
number of others, Ukraine has gotten much much better over
(27:59):
the life last four or five years. They're working hard
on that. And of course, freedom, democracy, the rule of law.
Those are the cornerstones of civilization and that's what Americ
stands for. I don't believe that we can wash our
hands of this, and that's why we did the book Nude,
because helping people understand this is not just a Ukrainian battle,
(28:21):
This is not just a European battle. This is a
battle for everyone who believes in freedom, in democracy, freedom
of religion, freedom of speech, freedom of assembly. You try
to go to Russia and criticize Vladimir Putin, you'll be
there for less than a day, less than a day
until you're thrown in jail. There is no freedom in Russia. No.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
I think that's right, and we get reminded of it regularly. Gregory,
I want to thank you for joining me. Your new book,
Portraits of Ukraine a National War is available now on
Amazon and in bookstores everywhere. It's an extraordinary book. I
recommend everyone get a copy of it, and I do
want to mention that all profit from the sale of
your book go to pro Ukrainian charities that are helping
(29:04):
the many millions of Ukrainians who've been deeply wounded by
Russia's ongoing war. This is a real act of love
and dedication on your part, and you're taking the time
to talk with us. I hope we'll educate some of
our listeners into understanding how important it is that Ukraine
not be defeated and that Ukraine continue as independent country,
and that we do have an obligation to find a
(29:26):
solution which hopefully will end the fighting, but will end
the fighting in ways that are permanent and that mean
that Russia cannot come back and try again.
Speaker 3 (29:36):
Well, you're exactly right, nude. It's such a pleasure and
an honor to be with you. Thank you for standing
for freedom and democracy and the rule of law all
your life. That's a big deal. So I'm honored to
be here. Thank you for having me, and let me
also wish God bless you and happy Easter and Slava Ukrainian.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
Thank you to my guest, Gregory W. Slayton.
Speaker 2 (30:00):
You can get a link to buy his new book,
Portraits of Ukraine, A Nation at War on our show
page at.
Speaker 1 (30:06):
Newtsworld dot com.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Newt World is produced by Ginglish three sixty and iHeartMedia.
Our executive producer is Guernsey Sloan. Our researcher is Rachel Peterson.
The artwork for the show was created by Steve Penley.
Special thanks to the team at ginglishtree sixty. If you've
been enjoying Newtsworld, I hope you'll go to Apple Podcast
and both rate us with five stars and give us
(30:28):
a review so others can learn what it's all about.
Right now, listeners of Newtsworld can sign up for my
three free weekly columns at gingishtree sixty dot com slash newsletter.
Speaker 1 (30:40):
I'm Nute, gingrich. This is Newtsworld.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!