October 16, 2025 • 25 mins
Knowa is joined by the dynamic hosts of Native Land Pod — Angela Rye, Andrew Gillum, and Tiffany Cross — for a conversation about the current political landscape, the culture of truth-telling in media, and what it takes to lead with integrity. Part of the Reasoned Choice Media family of political shows, this episode brings together sharp minds, fearless voices, and a shared commitment to reasoned dialogue and accountability in the public square.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Now you know. No de Barrosso is a production of
iHeartMedia and partnership with Recent Choice Media. All Right, what's
going on everyone, It's Noah And if you're tuned in
to now you know this show is about the people
who shape influence and about a year ago, America had
Hope hopeing a candidate named Kamala Harris. Her campaign invited
(00:21):
me out to the Democratic National Convention where I asked
Charlemagne the God for a picture. The Native Lampod family
and our friends all at the Breakfast Club had my
back after a viral run in with a few Republicans,
one deceased and one Mike Lindell. Charlemagne actually threatened to
fight one of them during our live taping and Angela
Urrai had to calm him down. Ten minutes later, they
(00:43):
offered me a podcast and here we are. Now you know.
That collab with the Breakfast Club and Native Lampod was
the perfect homecoming after that wild moment. The Native Lampod
has been stirring up the conversations where we need to
have it the most, what it means to exist, resist
and speak truth to power. And now they've added a
fourth host, Bacari sellers, so you know what's popping over there.
(01:06):
So today's episode is special. I'm sitting down with Angela Rye,
Tiffany Cross, and Andrew Gillam to talk about how they're
shaping culture and influence. Let's do it. Hey, we outside
inside at the studio. No, we didn't already talked about this.
We inside. We can't give the kids misinformation. Noah, I'm
(01:26):
friend of disinformation.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
You're right, You're right, You're right, Noah, Noa, Noah. Man, Listen,
welcome back, Welcome home, welcome back. It's been about a year,
right since we last saw you.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Last Yeah, and I didn't know it was you. I
was like, you were on my list of people I
wanted me. I was like, I want to meet Andrew
Gillim and I'm being so for real, And you interviewed me,
and I didn't know you were on this show, so
I was It was a surprise to me that Andrew
Gillam was interviewing with me, and I couldn't look for
(01:57):
you because you were right there.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
I love it.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Man.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Well, listen, you'll get the chance to interview us now.
You know, at some point with this new kickoff of
the show. Tell me what drove you to this decision?
Why now? Why this? You're thirteen, you know you're about
to you know you're the man, You've been the man.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
Appreciate that.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
But but but but life is about to get more hectic.
Why this podcast? Now?
Speaker 1 (02:21):
The podcast now? It is a crucial time. I am
not only going to combat misinformation like I just read
about being outside real misinformation and combat the worst people
that that I can combat. Not only that, but I
am in it to make and get people, get people
in a good move because people need to laugh in
(02:43):
this moment, and we're not. I'm not going to bore anyone.
I'm going to spread good information while being entertaining at
the same time.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
I love it. I love it.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
That's the nonscripted answer.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Well, that's what we say.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
We want the unscripted answer. Noah. You know one of
the things that drew all of our attention to you,
I believe last summer during the Democratic National Convention, you
were going up to people giving it to him. You
were debating people that are about five times your age,
all with facts, and I was like, he is so impressive,
he knows his stuff. We got to have him on
(03:19):
the show. Everybody agreed, So again, it is a thrill
to have you back on with us and most importantly
a part of the Reason Choice Media family. So we
do welcome you. We look forward to listening to all
of the breakdowns. But we want to know where you
got that from? You I had. It took me a
while to be able to combat the worst among us
factually and took a little bit of political background. You're
(03:41):
too young to have a job, So where did you
get that from? It's look, it's so important. I love
debating people. Like if someone says he that that thinga
beans got thirty eight calories, I'm like no, And especially
if they're so loud and wrong about it, I'm like no.
And then I google it. And then if they find
a way to try to find an excuse and back
(04:02):
out of it, I can get them back. It's like
you're pivoting, So I am. I love to debate and
I love to call out, like you said, the worst
among us, and I do that with only facts, and
then on the long way I might crackle a joke
on their head about the bankruptcy or whatever. So it's
just good.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
No, I got a quick question about most folks your age,
I think you probably would agree, are not as deeply
rooted in politics. How do you help your generation and
frankly those above your generation, because there are a lot
of folks who are feeling disaffected, right, how do you
help them to relate to what's happening in politics and
(04:42):
how it relates to their everyday lives.
Speaker 1 (04:45):
Yeah, just tell them why they should care. Like, I
don't think the saying, oh, we need to go vote
because they people going to do the roles in the bridges.
They didn't really care about that. But if you're saying
these tariffs are going to start affecting your ps five, right,
they're gonna start caring and they're gonna go to the polls.
There's some elections I don't pay attention. I need to
start paying attention to more local stuff. But there was
(05:06):
a something going on in Georgia state wide and they
were like, okay, but how will this affect my utility bill?
And I was like, personally, I don't know about your
utility bill, but what I can tell you is that
this directly impacts your bills, and so you should go
out and vote in this election. And they and they
did so because it affected them directly, but saying we
need to save democracy that didn't really work for Joe Biden.
(05:29):
That did that cost them to drop out. So you
got to use messaging that really that they care about,
that works for them. Nice when you consider again, and
I hate to make everything about your age, but no,
you know you are the exception for your demographic Oh
let me say this way. How did you get so
interested in the political process and making sure that people
(05:52):
got involved. Are voting really on your behalf because you
can't vote yet. Yeah, well it comes from an obligation.
It was not always political. I used to do roadblocks videos,
I used to do lifestyle content. I just used to
do you do public stuff, And so I started making
endorsements because I don't really do a lot of I
don't do a crazy amount of Like a lot of
(06:15):
people tweet out charity links. I tweet out political fundraisers
because it's more of a direct impact. And so if
I can make that kind of direct impact, it's great.
And use a platform to really promote good candidates like
mister Gillan was over here and in tight, tight tight
races and make sure that they get through the finish line.
But what made you So you're at thirteen years old
(06:36):
when we met you last year year twelve? Uh huh?
What made you care about this? Like most you know,
young people, if they're talking about a fundraiser link, they're like,
this is for my Christmas money, right, Like, so it's like, girl,
it's still different. So is there somebody in your family
who's into political content or someone who ran for office?
(06:56):
What made you personally want to get involved? Not necessarily so,
so I actually got everyone registered and active, and so
I got everyone following y'all before and everyone, and so
they can get into more people that are involved. And
they said, you saw what Angela Rya posted, But she
was like, they just took away this and I was like, yeah,
I'm the one who told you about it, and so
not from that, but it really comes from it really
(07:19):
stems from just having having the obligation to do it
and giving people the opportunity to promote their campaigns. I
mainly care because it's a direct impact on me. Even
I want to be able to look up when I
am able to vote and have a good nominee for president.
And so it's a it's a it's a great sense
of obligation as well as interests. Okay, wait, no, this
(07:40):
is my last one. I'm defering my co host. I'm
gonna push on you a little bit since you like
to debate. You have an obligation that came from somewhere
and now you know, with no dey brosso, we'll be
right back. So I'm not saying it had to be
in your home direct family. Is there a teacher, is
(08:01):
there you know, somebody at your church? Like where did this?
Did you turn on the TV one day and you
were like, that is not true. I could debate them.
I would win something. What was the spark? Yes, So
I met Stacy Abrams in twenty twenty two and a
bunch of people I posted the picture and a bunch
of people were asking me, okay why and so every
time I would tell them they had some type of rebuttal.
(08:22):
I think you asked the question perfectly. They had some
type of rebuttal, and then I had some type of rebuttal,
and then I won the rebuttal. And so I can
do if I can do that with everyone on a
mass scale, That's why I'm so excited about the opening
of the podcast. To do that on a mass scale,
give that type of rebuttal, give people talking points. It's
a great deal. I love it.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
Now, let me ask you, the podcast space is very,
very crowded, and so for all the people who are
listening to this episode, listening to you, what's your pitch
to them? Why should they tune into your podcast given
the three million podcasts that exists.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
So I'm gonna look at the camera, I'm gonna give
my pitch. So first things first, I think I'm going
to give logical information that makes sense that you didn't
have beforehand, while also being entertaining. And I think a
lot of problem with a lot of podcasts, maybe two million,
eight hundred thousand of those podcasts, I cannot get into them.
A lot of podcasts are not interesting and they bore
you halfway the thirty minutes. So for enable to me,
(09:19):
for me to keep track of the podcast, they have
to say something that I can pick up on. And
so if you're just saying information after information, I'm like,
hold up, wait, let me get my pen and write
down what you're saying because it's constant. So I think
I am going to provide a good logical breakdown while
also entertaining you at the same time.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
Well, you'd be doing more than the cable news outlets
are doing that.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
Oh my god, the fake news. Oh what you said?
Speaker 2 (09:46):
You hope the audience will be what you want, younger folks,
you want older folks. Does it matter?
Speaker 1 (09:54):
Well, everyone's invited to everyone's invited my cookout. It's I'm
gonna have the aunties. I'ma have the gen z Us y'all.
Speaker 2 (10:00):
Y'all heard that, right, Yeah, everybody's invited to hear cookout.
Y'all had some discriminatory practices around our cookout. Really, yeah,
you gotta check out the episode. Go back a little bit,
lady thirteen year old? Acceptable, but we'll see.
Speaker 1 (10:14):
Can I pull up? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (10:16):
Absolutely?
Speaker 1 (10:17):
Okay, all right, cool cool. I'm gonna get a kids
plate though, I know. Yeah, we don't play about that.
So I got you, but for sure, So I am
welcoming everyone. I'm welcoming gen Z. I think I can
appeal to gen Z for obvious reasons, like when Kamala
harris them the campaign trail. They sent me to talk
to a certain demographic eighteen through twenty four, and they're
(10:38):
so hard headed that only I can get to them.
And so it worked greatly and the Aunties. I'm welcoming
the Aunties because they send in such great suggestions and
such great You should talk to Stacy Abrams about this,
and I don't know what the pot where the podcast
would be production wise without the Aunties and Aunks and
everyone else. Everyone is welcome and everyone will have a
(10:59):
place to applay, to listen, to be entertained at. Well.
Speaker 3 (11:03):
No, We've definitely asked you a lot about you, but
I've been told that you actually have some questions for us.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
Right now, I do. I have a question. So, do
you guys see anything positive, all of you? Anything positive
coming out of the Trump administration? I always say that
you don't have to You don't have to criticize everything
he does, because then he doesn't know what he's doing. Well, right, right,
So do you see anything anything positive come out of
(11:29):
the Trump administration thus far?
Speaker 3 (11:32):
I would say the one thing I see I guess
positive is subjective. But I think he's taken the hood
off part in the pun of what we as black
folks have been trying to scream about in this country
for so long. It would be hard right now for
someone to say that our policy is not entrenched in
white supremacy, and he has given license to people to
(11:57):
say the quiet part out loud. Certainly, we know that
this is not new policy. He's introducing. Ronald Reagan, the
first Make America Great Again president, Richard Nixon, even Lyndon Johnson.
We can go back through a lot of presidents who
you know, get to curate their narrative. But this isn't
the first time that a white supremacist has occupied the
(12:17):
White House. But Donald Trump has given license to people
to say the horrific things. So while other presidents may
have been more articulate and less clumsy, their policies were
just as damaging. So I would say that's the one positive.
If I have to name something, Noah, I would say,
that's the one thing for me.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
Would you be willing to name drop who? Who? Other?
What other presidents have done it? But behind the behind
the closed doors.
Speaker 3 (12:41):
What other presidents have done?
Speaker 1 (12:43):
What you know? The the the.
Speaker 3 (12:45):
Presidents I just named. So Ronald Reagan, for sure, he
referred to black women as welfare queens. He UH devastated
UH mental health policies. Reaganomics devastated UH our economic aspirations
in this country. George HW. Bush tripled the dlj's budget
(13:06):
to incarcerate. They helped usher in the mass incarceration era.
Richard Nixon jailed an entire generation of black thinkers. We
could even go as far back as the New Deal
that had an old problem, which was racism. So that's
a long, boring podcast, Noah, But I could go even
George W. Bush had some challenges. But I would say,
(13:30):
just in my lifetime, I'll keep it simple. Ronald Reagan
has probably been the most damaging and set up a
case where they literally addicted the black community, made the
CIA was the biggest drug dealer in the marketplace to
raise funds for their aspirations in Central America and o
Ran Contra. That might be something that predates, you know,
(13:51):
I don't even know if you know about that, but
I would say that's probably the most damaging president, who
set the course for Donald Trump to take office today.
Speaker 1 (13:59):
I think on that point around him kind of taking
the hood off of American politics. I would say one
thing that has been positive from my vantage point is
not what he's done, but what has happened as a
result of what he does and how he exists in
the world, And that to me is black people coming
together so I'm seeing that as a positive thing. I
(14:22):
wish that we mobilize a little bit better, not in crisis,
but I'm grateful for whatever means we need to come together.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
I think last I would say Donald Trump, if there
was I don't know, a good thing or certainly not
a terrible effect, and that is he's stress testing, has
in real time stress tested our system. We say we
have three branches of government, we say that they're checks
and balances. We say there's equality between the two, with
none set above the other, and now we have to
(14:50):
prove it. And it's not just the people who are
sitting in those positions Congress persons or Supreme Court justices,
but the founders in saying we hand to a republic
if you can keep it, if you can keep it,
part is being stressed tested. So Angela talked about, you know,
the black folks coming together, but there are a lot
of communities that are right now assessing like is this
(15:12):
what we signed up for? And if it isn't, it
is requiring us to do something about it. Democracy I
think is becoming very clear that it is not a
passive activity. And if you've treated it as a passive
activity before, you might want to rethink that thing. Now.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
Don't you think he needs to take the clan hood
off before trying to take any hoods off anything.
Speaker 2 (15:37):
I think it is no longer necessary. Is what I
think Tiffany was getting at, is that they don't have
to cloak themselves anymore. They don't have to run around
in anonymity. With some exception of course, all law enforcement
under Trump apparently hides their faces, but in general they're
doing the quiet part out loud, the piece they whispered
about before and didn't want anybody to hear or know.
(16:00):
There's no repercussion for that, there's no penalty to that.
And I think that's what Donald Trump has done. He's
basically said, this is who we are. What you going
to do about it?
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Yeah, mister Gillen, what have you been doing to make
sure more head to head races like eve that, even
ones that you were in, More head to head races
are one closely for Democrats, So stuff like this, Oh,
I'm supposed to say good candidates, but Democrats. Yeah, in
the future, more had to head racers are one, so
(16:30):
this is prevented. You know.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
I talked to a lot of people who are thinking
about running for office and those who have run for office,
and at the earlier part of my professional career, spend
a great deal of time trying to build infrastructure training programs,
candidate training programs. What does it mean to be a
campaign manager, finance director, communication specialist, was polling, what's the
nature of that and why you should be interested? And
(16:55):
then after that, when I realized that it wasn't enough
to just train people for office, I began working on
what it means to support people while they're in office,
to do the right things when they're there. Because the
other side spends untold amounts of money trying to corrupt
those individuals and make them their politicians. How do we
hold them and keep them closer that they remain the
(17:16):
people's representatives, you know, in these in these halls of power.
So I continue talking to people individually. I pull back
largely from the political infrastructure, party infrastructure, you know, campaign infrastructure,
because I'm actually uninspired by the models that exist right
now and really think that we have to do this differently.
(17:38):
Part of what Angela and I think Tiffany experience do
the State of the People Tour was the fact that
so many of the participants who came and get who
bared witness, who talked openly about their struggles and their
hopes and ambitions. You know, felt pretty dislocated from the
political process, and we're pretty much down on their elected representatives.
(18:00):
We can't have a thriving democracy and our voices can't
be represented if everybody's view of the institutions who are
supposed to be changing things is that nothing changes. That's
antithetical to our systems. So I think we got to
dismantle that and build something that's real and that's lasting,
and that's representative.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
Yeah, we got to hit a quick break, So don't
go anywhere you're listening to now, you know, I have
a question for everyone. I was very excited to ask
you this question because it's not I think it goes
both ways for everyone. Which is more important for winning elections?
This was a debate during the election season December, after
(18:42):
the election season, when we were pointing fingers, it's your fault,
it's your fault, it's your fault. Which is more important
for elections? Do you think grassroots organizing or influencer and
celebrity endorsements like if mister Gillam tweets out, go vote,
and his supporters go and comment, we will go vote
because mister Gillum told them, would go vote. Which one
is more important and which one works more? I think
(19:04):
grassroots works more, And what my calculation would be is math,
And no matter how bad I am at it, I
do know that if you can move bodies to the
polls and those people vote, those votes count, right. So
I think there was a time where influencer engagement was
new and it was fresh. I think, particularly in twenty
(19:25):
eight and twenty twelve around President Obama, there was a
way that influencers and athletes and entertainers and actors and
actresses got involved in that election. Designers like never before.
And now it's not the new thing. It's now it's
expected that you have, you know, somebody designing a sweatshirt
for you that goes for one hundred and twenty dollars
(19:47):
on your site if you're running for president. So now
that it's not the new novel thing, I think that
it's kind of warm, thin and at the end of
the day, old fashioned door knocking, you know, samp well ballots,
phone banking and text banking is what moves bodies to
the polls. Because a lot of times people, if you're
(20:07):
not immersed in this space, you don't even know when
election day is. So that is what mostly matters for
my estimation. I think that the days of influencers, especially
if they're not niche or micro influencers, is gone. You
think niche influencers move the needle more. I do because
I think that. I think if you look at the numbers,
(20:27):
and this is just from campaigns that I've run, this
is my business, what I've run. What I've seen is
that even when people have large followings, they don't necessarily
move the needle in targeted geographic areas, whereas niche and
micro niche and micro influencers move the needles in particular
geographic locations, and their folks are more than more likely
(20:50):
to respond to a specific call to action, and that
is not always the case with people that have twenty
million or one hundred million followers.
Speaker 3 (20:58):
Miss Cross, Yeah, I would just echo Angela. That's Angela's opinion.
But I would also say it's a fact. The data
shows us that these influencers quote unquote, when celebrities get
involved in campaigns, it doesn't necessarily move anything. I don't
want to be an echo chamber, But I definitely punctuate
everything Angela just said. In two thousand and eight, it
was a big deal because President Obama was this novelty
(21:21):
to people, and it was a geographic wrinkle between Hollywood
and DC, and it cast a wide net of influence
across the country and across the globe arguably. But since
then we have seen that because Will Smith could tweet
out like I'm endorsing this candidate, OPRA can tweet out
I'm endorsing this candidate and it doesn't matter. So when
Angela's talking about Nietzsche, it's yes, those community validators matter
(21:44):
a lot more. You know, if it's a preacher in
a neighborhood, his endorsement might matter.
Speaker 1 (21:49):
A lot more than a rapper.
Speaker 3 (21:52):
If it's that community mother, his endorsement or her mother
endorsement might matter a lot more than an actress. Latasha,
who I think would be an amazing guest for your show.
She's right there in Atlanta with you. She's an organizer,
and you know, she reminds us that grassroots organizing does
not mean impoverished communities. It doesn't mean black communities, it
(22:13):
doesn't mean Api communities. It is grassroots in your neighborhood.
So even wealthy uppercrest white women could be doing grassroots
organizing to ally with us and interest that impact and
help raise the level of the greater good when it
comes to organizing. So yeah, I definitely celebrity endorsements do
not matter. And I think there's quite frankly been a
(22:34):
lack of trust that has expanded since celebrity endorsements became
a thing.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
So I think celebrity endorsements, at least from my experience,
matter to do a couple of things. One is it
helps to get attention media attention media loves the celebrity.
And if you're local and people are curious how it
is that you could be running for a local mayor's race,
but have someone like Beyonce who is saying, you know,
I'm with gell them, what that does is it puts
(23:02):
eyeballs on the thing that you're supposedly supporting. I think
celebrity endorsements could go a lot further if those endorsers
frankly stayed in their lane of sorts. In other words,
the reason why you're following is following you is largely
because of your music, or you're entertainment. They're not following
(23:23):
you necessarily for your politics. They don't know your politics,
they haven't followed it. They don't know if you vote
or not. But what could be helpful, I think is
if an athlete comes out and wants to be involved
in a race, maybe it is lifting their voice and
saying I need all of my followers. If you like me,
if you support me, if you think that you know,
I'm the best thing that's happened in basketball since its creation.
(23:44):
I want you to do me this lift by going
and registering to vote, wherever you are, wherever you live,
whatever it is you do, register or go out and vote.
I think they would have a different kind of outsize
impact if it were not trying to convince people that
they have studied up on global economic politics and now
know who the best next FED chair would be. Most
(24:08):
people don't trust that the information coming is coming necessarily
from the best source on that issue, and then from
the grassroots thing. The only other piece that I would
add to it is that it ought to be grassroots
inside of an election cycle, but also mostly outside of
an election cycle. If you're showing up to say go vote,
you are likely far too late, and you're not going
(24:28):
to have the desired outcome that you want if you're
showing up when nothing, nothing is on the ballot, and
you're talking to people about what their needs are, their
wants are, their highest hopes and desires, and also their
fears and what we can do together to address that.
You have greater, much greater opportunity as success that turning
them out then showing up. You know, while everybody blitzing
(24:50):
doors saying you knock five hundred doors, but you had
no penetration. You move nobody, no spirits were moved by that.
You've got to be a trusted source, a trust its source,
and that includes celebrities in some cases. In some cases
it doesn't in order to move the needle on voting.
If they trust you, they'll listen to you. If they
don't trust you on that issue, they won't thank you.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
Well, folks, I just want to thank you for a moment.
Thank you to Angela Rye for the show and for
trusting me to live alongside your network. And that was
a very powerful interview. So as always, I know Debrosso
and this is now you know with no de Brosso
follow me on all platforms at yess it. No de
brosso newse hashtag. Now you know to talk back and
(25:33):
let me know what happens until next time I see you.
Now you know and know. Dea Brosso is a production
of iHeartMedia and partnership with Recent Choice Media
Now you know. No de Barrosso is a production of
iHeartMedia and partnership with Recent Choice Media. All Right, what's
going on everyone, It's Noah And if you're tuned in
to now you know this show is about the people
who shape influence and about a year ago, America had
Hope hopeing a candidate named Kamala Harris. Her campaign invited
(00:21):
me out to the Democratic National Convention where I asked
Charlemagne the God for a picture. The Native Lampod family
and our friends all at the Breakfast Club had my
back after a viral run in with a few Republicans,
one deceased and one Mike Lindell. Charlemagne actually threatened to
fight one of them during our live taping and Angela
Urrai had to calm him down. Ten minutes later, they
(00:43):
offered me a podcast and here we are. Now you know.
That collab with the Breakfast Club and Native Lampod was
the perfect homecoming after that wild moment. The Native Lampod
has been stirring up the conversations where we need to
have it the most, what it means to exist, resist
and speak truth to power. And now they've added a
fourth host, Bacari sellers, so you know what's popping over there.
(01:06):
So today's episode is special. I'm sitting down with Angela Rye,
Tiffany Cross, and Andrew Gillam to talk about how they're
shaping culture and influence. Let's do it. Hey, we outside
inside at the studio. No, we didn't already talked about this.
We inside. We can't give the kids misinformation. Noah, I'm
(01:26):
friend of disinformation.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
You're right, You're right, You're right, Noah, Noa, Noah. Man, Listen,
welcome back, Welcome home, welcome back. It's been about a year,
right since we last saw you.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Last Yeah, and I didn't know it was you. I
was like, you were on my list of people I
wanted me. I was like, I want to meet Andrew
Gillim and I'm being so for real, And you interviewed me,
and I didn't know you were on this show, so
I was It was a surprise to me that Andrew
Gillam was interviewing with me, and I couldn't look for
(01:57):
you because you were right there.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
I love it.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Man.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Well, listen, you'll get the chance to interview us now.
You know, at some point with this new kickoff of
the show. Tell me what drove you to this decision?
Why now? Why this? You're thirteen, you know you're about
to you know you're the man, You've been the man.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
Appreciate that.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
But but but but life is about to get more hectic.
Why this podcast? Now?
Speaker 1 (02:21):
The podcast now? It is a crucial time. I am
not only going to combat misinformation like I just read
about being outside real misinformation and combat the worst people
that that I can combat. Not only that, but I
am in it to make and get people, get people
in a good move because people need to laugh in
(02:43):
this moment, and we're not. I'm not going to bore anyone.
I'm going to spread good information while being entertaining at
the same time.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
I love it. I love it.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
That's the nonscripted answer.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Well, that's what we say.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
We want the unscripted answer. Noah. You know one of
the things that drew all of our attention to you,
I believe last summer during the Democratic National Convention, you
were going up to people giving it to him. You
were debating people that are about five times your age,
all with facts, and I was like, he is so impressive,
he knows his stuff. We got to have him on
(03:19):
the show. Everybody agreed, So again, it is a thrill
to have you back on with us and most importantly
a part of the Reason Choice Media family. So we
do welcome you. We look forward to listening to all
of the breakdowns. But we want to know where you
got that from? You I had. It took me a
while to be able to combat the worst among us
factually and took a little bit of political background. You're
(03:41):
too young to have a job, So where did you
get that from? It's look, it's so important. I love
debating people. Like if someone says he that that thinga
beans got thirty eight calories, I'm like no, And especially
if they're so loud and wrong about it, I'm like no.
And then I google it. And then if they find
a way to try to find an excuse and back
(04:02):
out of it, I can get them back. It's like
you're pivoting, So I am. I love to debate and
I love to call out, like you said, the worst
among us, and I do that with only facts, and
then on the long way I might crackle a joke
on their head about the bankruptcy or whatever. So it's
just good.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
No, I got a quick question about most folks your age,
I think you probably would agree, are not as deeply
rooted in politics. How do you help your generation and
frankly those above your generation, because there are a lot
of folks who are feeling disaffected, right, how do you
help them to relate to what's happening in politics and
(04:42):
how it relates to their everyday lives.
Speaker 1 (04:45):
Yeah, just tell them why they should care. Like, I
don't think the saying, oh, we need to go vote
because they people going to do the roles in the bridges.
They didn't really care about that. But if you're saying
these tariffs are going to start affecting your ps five, right,
they're gonna start caring and they're gonna go to the polls.
There's some elections I don't pay attention. I need to
start paying attention to more local stuff. But there was
(05:06):
a something going on in Georgia state wide and they
were like, okay, but how will this affect my utility bill?
And I was like, personally, I don't know about your
utility bill, but what I can tell you is that
this directly impacts your bills, and so you should go
out and vote in this election. And they and they
did so because it affected them directly, but saying we
need to save democracy that didn't really work for Joe Biden.
(05:29):
That did that cost them to drop out. So you
got to use messaging that really that they care about,
that works for them. Nice when you consider again, and
I hate to make everything about your age, but no,
you know you are the exception for your demographic Oh
let me say this way. How did you get so
interested in the political process and making sure that people
(05:52):
got involved. Are voting really on your behalf because you
can't vote yet. Yeah, well it comes from an obligation.
It was not always political. I used to do roadblocks videos,
I used to do lifestyle content. I just used to
do you do public stuff, And so I started making
endorsements because I don't really do a lot of I
don't do a crazy amount of Like a lot of
(06:15):
people tweet out charity links. I tweet out political fundraisers
because it's more of a direct impact. And so if
I can make that kind of direct impact, it's great.
And use a platform to really promote good candidates like
mister Gillan was over here and in tight, tight tight
races and make sure that they get through the finish line.
But what made you So you're at thirteen years old
(06:36):
when we met you last year year twelve? Uh huh?
What made you care about this? Like most you know,
young people, if they're talking about a fundraiser link, they're like,
this is for my Christmas money, right, Like, so it's like, girl,
it's still different. So is there somebody in your family
who's into political content or someone who ran for office?
(06:56):
What made you personally want to get involved? Not necessarily so,
so I actually got everyone registered and active, and so
I got everyone following y'all before and everyone, and so
they can get into more people that are involved. And
they said, you saw what Angela Rya posted, But she
was like, they just took away this and I was like, yeah,
I'm the one who told you about it, and so
not from that, but it really comes from it really
(07:19):
stems from just having having the obligation to do it
and giving people the opportunity to promote their campaigns. I
mainly care because it's a direct impact on me. Even
I want to be able to look up when I
am able to vote and have a good nominee for president.
And so it's a it's a it's a great sense
of obligation as well as interests. Okay, wait, no, this
(07:40):
is my last one. I'm defering my co host. I'm
gonna push on you a little bit since you like
to debate. You have an obligation that came from somewhere
and now you know, with no dey brosso, we'll be
right back. So I'm not saying it had to be
in your home direct family. Is there a teacher, is
(08:01):
there you know, somebody at your church? Like where did this?
Did you turn on the TV one day and you
were like, that is not true. I could debate them.
I would win something. What was the spark? Yes, So
I met Stacy Abrams in twenty twenty two and a
bunch of people I posted the picture and a bunch
of people were asking me, okay why and so every
time I would tell them they had some type of rebuttal.
(08:22):
I think you asked the question perfectly. They had some
type of rebuttal, and then I had some type of rebuttal,
and then I won the rebuttal. And so I can
do if I can do that with everyone on a
mass scale, That's why I'm so excited about the opening
of the podcast. To do that on a mass scale,
give that type of rebuttal, give people talking points. It's
a great deal. I love it.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
Now, let me ask you, the podcast space is very,
very crowded, and so for all the people who are
listening to this episode, listening to you, what's your pitch
to them? Why should they tune into your podcast given
the three million podcasts that exists.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
So I'm gonna look at the camera, I'm gonna give
my pitch. So first things first, I think I'm going
to give logical information that makes sense that you didn't
have beforehand, while also being entertaining. And I think a
lot of problem with a lot of podcasts, maybe two million,
eight hundred thousand of those podcasts, I cannot get into them.
A lot of podcasts are not interesting and they bore
you halfway the thirty minutes. So for enable to me,
(09:19):
for me to keep track of the podcast, they have
to say something that I can pick up on. And
so if you're just saying information after information, I'm like,
hold up, wait, let me get my pen and write
down what you're saying because it's constant. So I think
I am going to provide a good logical breakdown while
also entertaining you at the same time.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
Well, you'd be doing more than the cable news outlets
are doing that.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
Oh my god, the fake news. Oh what you said?
Speaker 2 (09:46):
You hope the audience will be what you want, younger folks,
you want older folks. Does it matter?
Speaker 1 (09:54):
Well, everyone's invited to everyone's invited my cookout. It's I'm
gonna have the aunties. I'ma have the gen z Us y'all.
Speaker 2 (10:00):
Y'all heard that, right, Yeah, everybody's invited to hear cookout.
Y'all had some discriminatory practices around our cookout. Really, yeah,
you gotta check out the episode. Go back a little bit,
lady thirteen year old? Acceptable, but we'll see.
Speaker 1 (10:14):
Can I pull up? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (10:16):
Absolutely?
Speaker 1 (10:17):
Okay, all right, cool cool. I'm gonna get a kids
plate though, I know. Yeah, we don't play about that.
So I got you, but for sure, So I am
welcoming everyone. I'm welcoming gen Z. I think I can
appeal to gen Z for obvious reasons, like when Kamala
harris them the campaign trail. They sent me to talk
to a certain demographic eighteen through twenty four, and they're
(10:38):
so hard headed that only I can get to them.
And so it worked greatly and the Aunties. I'm welcoming
the Aunties because they send in such great suggestions and
such great You should talk to Stacy Abrams about this,
and I don't know what the pot where the podcast
would be production wise without the Aunties and Aunks and
everyone else. Everyone is welcome and everyone will have a
(10:59):
place to applay, to listen, to be entertained at. Well.
Speaker 3 (11:03):
No, We've definitely asked you a lot about you, but
I've been told that you actually have some questions for us.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
Right now, I do. I have a question. So, do
you guys see anything positive, all of you? Anything positive
coming out of the Trump administration? I always say that
you don't have to You don't have to criticize everything
he does, because then he doesn't know what he's doing. Well, right, right,
So do you see anything anything positive come out of
(11:29):
the Trump administration thus far?
Speaker 3 (11:32):
I would say the one thing I see I guess
positive is subjective. But I think he's taken the hood
off part in the pun of what we as black
folks have been trying to scream about in this country
for so long. It would be hard right now for
someone to say that our policy is not entrenched in
white supremacy, and he has given license to people to
(11:57):
say the quiet part out loud. Certainly, we know that
this is not new policy. He's introducing. Ronald Reagan, the
first Make America Great Again president, Richard Nixon, even Lyndon Johnson.
We can go back through a lot of presidents who
you know, get to curate their narrative. But this isn't
the first time that a white supremacist has occupied the
(12:17):
White House. But Donald Trump has given license to people
to say the horrific things. So while other presidents may
have been more articulate and less clumsy, their policies were
just as damaging. So I would say that's the one positive.
If I have to name something, Noah, I would say,
that's the one thing for me.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
Would you be willing to name drop who? Who? Other?
What other presidents have done it? But behind the behind
the closed doors.
Speaker 3 (12:41):
What other presidents have done?
Speaker 1 (12:43):
What you know? The the the.
Speaker 3 (12:45):
Presidents I just named. So Ronald Reagan, for sure, he
referred to black women as welfare queens. He UH devastated
UH mental health policies. Reaganomics devastated UH our economic aspirations
in this country. George HW. Bush tripled the dlj's budget
(13:06):
to incarcerate. They helped usher in the mass incarceration era.
Richard Nixon jailed an entire generation of black thinkers. We
could even go as far back as the New Deal
that had an old problem, which was racism. So that's
a long, boring podcast, Noah, But I could go even
George W. Bush had some challenges. But I would say,
(13:30):
just in my lifetime, I'll keep it simple. Ronald Reagan
has probably been the most damaging and set up a
case where they literally addicted the black community, made the
CIA was the biggest drug dealer in the marketplace to
raise funds for their aspirations in Central America and o
Ran Contra. That might be something that predates, you know,
(13:51):
I don't even know if you know about that, but
I would say that's probably the most damaging president, who
set the course for Donald Trump to take office today.
Speaker 1 (13:59):
I think on that point around him kind of taking
the hood off of American politics. I would say one
thing that has been positive from my vantage point is
not what he's done, but what has happened as a
result of what he does and how he exists in
the world, And that to me is black people coming
together so I'm seeing that as a positive thing. I
(14:22):
wish that we mobilize a little bit better, not in crisis,
but I'm grateful for whatever means we need to come together.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
I think last I would say Donald Trump, if there
was I don't know, a good thing or certainly not
a terrible effect, and that is he's stress testing, has
in real time stress tested our system. We say we
have three branches of government, we say that they're checks
and balances. We say there's equality between the two, with
none set above the other, and now we have to
(14:50):
prove it. And it's not just the people who are
sitting in those positions Congress persons or Supreme Court justices,
but the founders in saying we hand to a republic
if you can keep it, if you can keep it,
part is being stressed tested. So Angela talked about, you know,
the black folks coming together, but there are a lot
of communities that are right now assessing like is this
(15:12):
what we signed up for? And if it isn't, it
is requiring us to do something about it. Democracy I
think is becoming very clear that it is not a
passive activity. And if you've treated it as a passive
activity before, you might want to rethink that thing. Now.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
Don't you think he needs to take the clan hood
off before trying to take any hoods off anything.
Speaker 2 (15:37):
I think it is no longer necessary. Is what I
think Tiffany was getting at, is that they don't have
to cloak themselves anymore. They don't have to run around
in anonymity. With some exception of course, all law enforcement
under Trump apparently hides their faces, but in general they're
doing the quiet part out loud, the piece they whispered
about before and didn't want anybody to hear or know.
(16:00):
There's no repercussion for that, there's no penalty to that.
And I think that's what Donald Trump has done. He's
basically said, this is who we are. What you going
to do about it?
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Yeah, mister Gillen, what have you been doing to make
sure more head to head races like eve that, even
ones that you were in, More head to head races
are one closely for Democrats, So stuff like this, Oh,
I'm supposed to say good candidates, but Democrats. Yeah, in
the future, more had to head racers are one, so
(16:30):
this is prevented. You know.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
I talked to a lot of people who are thinking
about running for office and those who have run for office,
and at the earlier part of my professional career, spend
a great deal of time trying to build infrastructure training programs,
candidate training programs. What does it mean to be a
campaign manager, finance director, communication specialist, was polling, what's the
nature of that and why you should be interested? And
(16:55):
then after that, when I realized that it wasn't enough
to just train people for office, I began working on
what it means to support people while they're in office,
to do the right things when they're there. Because the
other side spends untold amounts of money trying to corrupt
those individuals and make them their politicians. How do we
hold them and keep them closer that they remain the
(17:16):
people's representatives, you know, in these in these halls of power.
So I continue talking to people individually. I pull back
largely from the political infrastructure, party infrastructure, you know, campaign infrastructure,
because I'm actually uninspired by the models that exist right
now and really think that we have to do this differently.
(17:38):
Part of what Angela and I think Tiffany experience do
the State of the People Tour was the fact that
so many of the participants who came and get who
bared witness, who talked openly about their struggles and their
hopes and ambitions. You know, felt pretty dislocated from the
political process, and we're pretty much down on their elected representatives.
(18:00):
We can't have a thriving democracy and our voices can't
be represented if everybody's view of the institutions who are
supposed to be changing things is that nothing changes. That's
antithetical to our systems. So I think we got to
dismantle that and build something that's real and that's lasting,
and that's representative.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
Yeah, we got to hit a quick break, So don't
go anywhere you're listening to now, you know, I have
a question for everyone. I was very excited to ask
you this question because it's not I think it goes
both ways for everyone. Which is more important for winning elections?
This was a debate during the election season December, after
(18:42):
the election season, when we were pointing fingers, it's your fault,
it's your fault, it's your fault. Which is more important
for elections? Do you think grassroots organizing or influencer and
celebrity endorsements like if mister Gillam tweets out, go vote,
and his supporters go and comment, we will go vote
because mister Gillum told them, would go vote. Which one
is more important and which one works more? I think
(19:04):
grassroots works more, And what my calculation would be is math,
And no matter how bad I am at it, I
do know that if you can move bodies to the
polls and those people vote, those votes count, right. So
I think there was a time where influencer engagement was
new and it was fresh. I think, particularly in twenty
(19:25):
eight and twenty twelve around President Obama, there was a
way that influencers and athletes and entertainers and actors and
actresses got involved in that election. Designers like never before.
And now it's not the new thing. It's now it's
expected that you have, you know, somebody designing a sweatshirt
for you that goes for one hundred and twenty dollars
(19:47):
on your site if you're running for president. So now
that it's not the new novel thing, I think that
it's kind of warm, thin and at the end of
the day, old fashioned door knocking, you know, samp well ballots,
phone banking and text banking is what moves bodies to
the polls. Because a lot of times people, if you're
(20:07):
not immersed in this space, you don't even know when
election day is. So that is what mostly matters for
my estimation. I think that the days of influencers, especially
if they're not niche or micro influencers, is gone. You
think niche influencers move the needle more. I do because
I think that. I think if you look at the numbers,
(20:27):
and this is just from campaigns that I've run, this
is my business, what I've run. What I've seen is
that even when people have large followings, they don't necessarily
move the needle in targeted geographic areas, whereas niche and
micro niche and micro influencers move the needles in particular
geographic locations, and their folks are more than more likely
(20:50):
to respond to a specific call to action, and that
is not always the case with people that have twenty
million or one hundred million followers.
Speaker 3 (20:58):
Miss Cross, Yeah, I would just echo Angela. That's Angela's opinion.
But I would also say it's a fact. The data
shows us that these influencers quote unquote, when celebrities get
involved in campaigns, it doesn't necessarily move anything. I don't
want to be an echo chamber, But I definitely punctuate
everything Angela just said. In two thousand and eight, it
was a big deal because President Obama was this novelty
(21:21):
to people, and it was a geographic wrinkle between Hollywood
and DC, and it cast a wide net of influence
across the country and across the globe arguably. But since
then we have seen that because Will Smith could tweet
out like I'm endorsing this candidate, OPRA can tweet out
I'm endorsing this candidate and it doesn't matter. So when
Angela's talking about Nietzsche, it's yes, those community validators matter
(21:44):
a lot more. You know, if it's a preacher in
a neighborhood, his endorsement might matter.
Speaker 1 (21:49):
A lot more than a rapper.
Speaker 3 (21:52):
If it's that community mother, his endorsement or her mother
endorsement might matter a lot more than an actress. Latasha,
who I think would be an amazing guest for your show.
She's right there in Atlanta with you. She's an organizer,
and you know, she reminds us that grassroots organizing does
not mean impoverished communities. It doesn't mean black communities, it
(22:13):
doesn't mean Api communities. It is grassroots in your neighborhood.
So even wealthy uppercrest white women could be doing grassroots
organizing to ally with us and interest that impact and
help raise the level of the greater good when it
comes to organizing. So yeah, I definitely celebrity endorsements do
not matter. And I think there's quite frankly been a
(22:34):
lack of trust that has expanded since celebrity endorsements became
a thing.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
So I think celebrity endorsements, at least from my experience,
matter to do a couple of things. One is it
helps to get attention media attention media loves the celebrity.
And if you're local and people are curious how it
is that you could be running for a local mayor's race,
but have someone like Beyonce who is saying, you know,
I'm with gell them, what that does is it puts
(23:02):
eyeballs on the thing that you're supposedly supporting. I think
celebrity endorsements could go a lot further if those endorsers
frankly stayed in their lane of sorts. In other words,
the reason why you're following is following you is largely
because of your music, or you're entertainment. They're not following
(23:23):
you necessarily for your politics. They don't know your politics,
they haven't followed it. They don't know if you vote
or not. But what could be helpful, I think is
if an athlete comes out and wants to be involved
in a race, maybe it is lifting their voice and
saying I need all of my followers. If you like me,
if you support me, if you think that you know,
I'm the best thing that's happened in basketball since its creation.
(23:44):
I want you to do me this lift by going
and registering to vote, wherever you are, wherever you live,
whatever it is you do, register or go out and vote.
I think they would have a different kind of outsize
impact if it were not trying to convince people that
they have studied up on global economic politics and now
know who the best next FED chair would be. Most
(24:08):
people don't trust that the information coming is coming necessarily
from the best source on that issue, and then from
the grassroots thing. The only other piece that I would
add to it is that it ought to be grassroots
inside of an election cycle, but also mostly outside of
an election cycle. If you're showing up to say go vote,
you are likely far too late, and you're not going
(24:28):
to have the desired outcome that you want if you're
showing up when nothing, nothing is on the ballot, and
you're talking to people about what their needs are, their
wants are, their highest hopes and desires, and also their
fears and what we can do together to address that.
You have greater, much greater opportunity as success that turning
them out then showing up. You know, while everybody blitzing
(24:50):
doors saying you knock five hundred doors, but you had
no penetration. You move nobody, no spirits were moved by that.
You've got to be a trusted source, a trust its source,
and that includes celebrities in some cases. In some cases
it doesn't in order to move the needle on voting.
If they trust you, they'll listen to you. If they
don't trust you on that issue, they won't thank you.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
Well, folks, I just want to thank you for a moment.
Thank you to Angela Rye for the show and for
trusting me to live alongside your network. And that was
a very powerful interview. So as always, I know Debrosso
and this is now you know with no de Brosso
follow me on all platforms at yess it. No de
brosso newse hashtag. Now you know to talk back and
(25:33):
let me know what happens until next time I see you.
Now you know and know. Dea Brosso is a production
of iHeartMedia and partnership with Recent Choice Media
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