James Hart du Preez Interview: How the South African’s strength drives insane distances throughout his bag and ball speed challenges led to bonding with Bryson DeChambeau

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:10):
It's episode forty of Off Course with Claude Harmon. You
Knew the Drill. We come to you every Wednesday. This
week's guests South Africans James Hart Dupris. You might not
know who he is, might not be a household name.
He's six ft nine, he's two sixty pounds UM, and
he's playing golf. He's part of the new craze of
distance on the tours around the world. And I got

(00:31):
to watch this guy hit balls up close a couple
of weeks ago in Saudi Arabia and he bombs it.
So it's fascinating. UM, listen to kind of the new
breed of players who are hitting the golf ball distances
that you know, we've never seen before. And speaking of distance,
our friends at Cobra Golf have three new drivers out
for two. They've got the l T d X, the

(00:54):
l t D l S, but I want to focus
today on the l t d X Max driver. If
you're looking for new more draw bias driver, I think
the lt D Max is for you. Shares the same
extreme forgiveness and distance of the standard l t d
X model, but it's got a weight in the heel
and it's going to help you straighten out those slices,

(01:15):
and a lot of people slice the golf ball that
a little bit more weight in the heel. It's got
all the same technology as the l T d X,
and I think it's going to be a game changer
if you are slicing the golf ball. So if that's
kind of your miss, go ahead and check it out.
But back to our guests this week. James Hart dupre Um.
He got into the American Express on a sponsors invite,

(01:37):
he got into Saudi Arabia on a sponsors invite, and
I mean, this guy is hitting the golf ball long
drive distances and I think, um, we were going to
see more guys like him, Um, we are going to
see more people that could play rugby, They could play
other sports, but he's choosing to play golf. Um started
his kind of his golf career at TCU only last

(01:59):
TEW year there, but I think it was interesting he
talks in the part about he's hitting the golf ball
at distances that we're seeing world long drive guys hit it.
And the goal for him is going to be to
try and take this fantastic, you know, weapon that he
has in distance and see if he can harness it
and try and you know, get onto the Asian Tour,
get onto the European Tour, maybe get onto the corn Ferry,

(02:22):
and obviously the goal is to play on the PGA Tour.
So um, we've just never seen players do what guys
like him are doing. Bryson has been doing a little
bit of it. Obviously, guys like Kyle Berk shar Um,
they've got that type of distance. But to have this
type of distance and to be trying to play legitimate
competitive golf, I think it's a fascinating story. So sit
back and enjoy listening to James Heart depre alright, my

(02:51):
guest today, James Heart could pre James. The first time
I'd even heard of you was when you qualified for
the American Express out in pomp Spring a couple of
weeks ago. Um Trevor and Wleman, one of my good friends,
hosted a video of you hitting golf balls. I'm just
gonna run you through. Tell me if these numbers for
your your clubs sound right, driver and carry it probably

(03:14):
three fifty ish three would three or five over three hundred? Yeah,
stock should be flying between three iron obviously don't carry
a five but arrivory three iron to seventy five stocks
to seventy three iron, four iron two fifty ish stock

(03:37):
five iron right around to forty is if I'm carrying
it that week. Okay, six iron to to twenty seven
seven iron around two a six eight iron ninety one
m nine iron should be between seventy three wedge one

(04:02):
sixty So you've got three wedges fifty or four wedges.
But what's the good number for you? Stocks forty four.
But I can hit it anything between. I mean, you're
hitting the golf ball distances that the people listening to

(04:23):
this podcast. I mean, it doesn't even seem like it's
real life, obviously, being six nine and how much do
you we right now towns wise on two to sixty
six nine to sixty you should hit the golf ball
of ship tone, right. But we are in an age, James,
to where we're seeing golfers and we've just never seen
players like yourself at the size there. I mean, you

(04:47):
could play in the NFL. I mean, everybody says Brooks
kept us built like a linebacker. You're actually built like
a linebacker. You're actually built like an athlete. Did you
play other sports growing up or was it always golf?
I knew when I was younger, um that golf is
what I wanted to do. But like I come from
a family that really loves sports, played a ton of
different sports growing up. My first sports were actually swimming

(05:10):
and squash. Swimming is a six nine guy, I'm sure
that was that was six as a kid, but yeah,
I mean huge wingspan. Yeah, I mean when did you
start to really hit that gross spurred? Um? It was
in tenth grade when I was between the edges of
fifteen and seventeen, So right around sixteen I grew close
on seven inches and twelve months and so you went
from what height talk? Um, I was like centimeters easier

(05:35):
for me to work in. So I was like one
seven three um, and got to just shy of six six. Yeah.
Growing up in South Africa, I mean obviously South Africa
and Australia from a golf standpoint, are always kind of
remote areas. Was it hard for you to get equipment
because who can build? There isn't a lot of equipment

(05:57):
in those countries anyway, right specifically essay, I mean the
guys that come out of South Africa, I mean, I
worked with Trevor in Woman for a long time. He
used to always talk about, you know, we didn't get
any equipment growing up as kids. We had to kind
of play with what was given to us, what we
got from other people and stuff. And it's not like
it is now to where you go and get fitted
and stuff. So playing back then, it must have been

(06:17):
really difficult for you to even find equipment that could
work for you. Yeah. Look, I think luckily when I
was a kid, it was late enough that in the
sense of that stuff, it kind of changed a lot.
But um, I think the really difficult process was during
those growths. But it's because my swing plane and distance
from the ball would change almost every two weeks, um.

(06:38):
So to kind of be consistent in that aspect and
have a club set up that would last me, I
played the same clubs for a couple of years through
that time, which was evidently wrong for me because obviously
your art changes learned from the ball speed forces, all
that type of stuff changes. Um. But the harder part
of it was not necessarily finding the equipment, but finding
the couping for the right time because it was raging

(07:00):
so quickly and so rapidly too from a financial standpoint,
Like we couldn't just buy clubs and we couldn't keep
buying new sets and irons. Many people that can buy
a new sets of irons every week. But once my
body kind of settled at twenty three, it took a
really long time for all of that to settled. Then
it became I mean, it's still a challenge the guys

(07:20):
that picked the great job with it, but then it
became a lot easier. But during that phase it was tough.
I write a good article on golf w RX about
when you went out there. I mean, one of the
things with someone your size in fitting golf clubs that
match the length and the distance away from the golf
ball you need. They end up being sledgehammers. Some of them.

(07:40):
They're really really heavy, and that can have a massive
impact on what you're trying to do as the player. Yeah,
So for the golf nots out there, my iron swing
way is that I think it's E four, which claude
knowing a lot about this type of stuff. That's why
it's last because most guys would operate a seendjays rather

(08:01):
on D one. Yeah. Yes, it's super heavy and there
are two inches over and the Lie Lie I think
I standard two inches, but for every inch, I think
it's like two degrees up, so it's about between four
and five up from standards. When you finally went out
to paying and got you know, you know, got really

(08:21):
really fitted. Was it eye opening for you? All the
things that all of the manufacturers in the game that
they can do for a player like you because you're
you're a very very unique, specific individual. You can't pick
up golf clubs just off. Somebody can't build you a
set of irons without actually getting you on a launch monitor,

(08:44):
seeing what works, what the what shafts are you using?
Flex wise? Um So, I think the more eye opening
thing was the fact that Pin in South Africa, they've
got a big presence back there in the Villas family,
and I think we fall into these traps where we
think once we get to bigger and better places, things
are going to be bigger and better. But that was

(09:05):
really comforting thing in the sense that the fitting I
did in South Africa with those guys, and then the
fitting I did at Pining Scottsdale as there wasn't a
massive change, which was an incredible, incredibly good thing for
me because it gave me comfortable knowing that the guys
that I deal with on a week to week basis
are really really competent at the job. Um. And I
think that's a great thing about pins. The standard they
have right across the world is really good. But the

(09:27):
one thing that we did change was my iron shaft, um,
and that was simply because the fitting. At the time
of that, the fitting in South Africa, those shaft hadn't
been released. Um. They the Dynamic Goal X sevens, so
the X one hundreds the toys shue that a lot
of guys uses that. Um, I think it's right around
a hundred and thirty grams extra stuff and these X
sevens are just heavier and stuffer than though, so there's

(09:49):
a there's a couple of guys Jason Dave used them
for a little while. Um, he's moved out of them
because his ball flight was super high, so he gave
them a try. And but those are kind of tightened
up the dispersion of my own player, which has been helpful.
But yeah, it's been a really cool process to try
and find what can fit in my bag. And the
big thing as well has been the addition of a
sixty two degree wedge. Um, it's made have a big

(10:12):
impact on shots between footy and sixty because I'm guessing
with your speed and your length, there are dead zones
for you from a gapping standpoint on the shorter stuff.
The longer stuff, it's easy to get. I mean, you're,
like we were joking, you're never gonna have a five world.
You're never gonna have anything hybrid because you just spin
that thing off the planet. But you get to the
shorter stuff, and we see that with a lot of

(10:34):
I see that, James, with a lot of young kids
that have obviously not the distance you have, but you know,
you see these college kids there's dead zones in their
short irons that they don't have a club for that distance.
How have you worked on trying to figure out the
gapping in your wedge game, because I'm guessing, I mean
you could if you needed to, you could hit your

(10:58):
sand wedge. How far few maxed out, So it's an
interesting thing. I don't like maxing out were just but
if I really tried, I would assume I'd be able
to get my sandwich close to one forty And so
I mean that's no way close to being controllable, right.
But so the fact that you have the ability to
do that means that trying to get all of those

(11:18):
nuanced distances and trying to find it was it. Has
it been hard for you? The length obviously for someone
like yourself, comes easy, comes naturally. Has it been hard
for you to try and gain that control and that
kind of consistency and figuring out what are my optimal
numbers from inside of a D fifty yards? Yeah? Look,

(11:40):
going back to your point, I think the dead zones
is not a unique issue that I have. I think
it's a a lot of players have it, and I
think it's down to a couple of things. For me,
it's the massive gaps I have, but also just the
lack of I think attention to those areas in our game,
because it's not a sexy out of the game to practice.

(12:00):
It's not bombs off the tea, it's not holding long parts.
It's but that's essentially where the bread and butter has
made um and that's been a really important part of
my game. That's changed in the time that I've got
a flight scope for the last seven months. Um. But
it's it's an ongoing process, and I think the reason
why it's still a part of my game that's developing

(12:21):
a lot and I'm I'm working a lot on is
because my body is only so recently settled into what
I have now. Um So, coming out of high school,
I've put on Since my freshman year in college, I
think I've put on about eighty pounds UM and that's
been over a six year period. And once my body

(12:42):
settled at twenty three with all the growing because men
our body settled, but later on around twenty twenty three,
we kind of stopped developing and settled into that. But
then getting accustomed to the speed that I have, the
length of ark that I have, the arms that I
have with regards to the wingspan UM and having the
ability to match those different and numbers into the bag

(13:02):
with different lines. The obvious question is you have incredible length,
You've got speed, which in the modern game is such
an advantage, But how do you take that as a
strength and then build on the nuances because listen, I mean,
if it's part five and guys can't reach it, you're

(13:25):
gonna be one of those four or five guys regardless
of the conditions that can say listen, I've got the
ability to take advantage of my length, you know, very
similar to what Bryson has done. You know, you've got
these guys, you know, this upper echelon of guys that
have speed and power, but you know you're outside the
top thousand in the world. The goal is to get

(13:46):
to that next level, to get to you know, full
status on you know, the PGA Tour, European Tour agent
or have that full full status. So what do you
feel like in your game? You've got this incredible horsepower,
what are the areas you feel like, Okay, I've got
to try and get better at this to help me
get to that next level. It's actually it's interesting I'd

(14:08):
breakfast with Bryson this morning because I think him and
I have kind of we met for the first time
a couple of days a couple of days ago, but
we have this kinship because we kind of understand things
that other people don't. Yeah, I mean you've got I
mean your ball speed kind of cruises around two or two.
That's just normal, kind of every day in your clubhead
speed kind of. Yeah, so you're thirty five thousand feet

(14:31):
take the seatbelt off. Is numbers that people. I mean
it's long drive numbers. Yeah. So an example yesterday on
eighteen off the back teeth, there's a bunk at three
to carry and it was done with yesterday, and the
fairway runs left to those bunkers and then around them.
And I told my Caddy, like, listen, if I step
on one and frying the bunk over. Um, there was

(14:53):
a good wind blowing. But and I hit one forty
past those traps. So knowing that have that capacity is
really cool. Yeah, of course, kind of in the flick
of a switch is just bomb one, um, But you've
gotta be able to hit a green from a hundred
and fifty yards. But I was speaking to Bryson about
it and the speeds that him and I have and

(15:14):
other players have, and DJA is really fast as well.
But I don't think it's an equipment thing. The reason
why we have these speeds. I think what's changed in
the last ten fifteen years, and it's part of the
Tiger effect, is the way in which the golf has
trained athletes has changed the ton. And I also think, James,
you know, I've seen players, I mean I see more
college players now that are over six ft tall my

(15:38):
dad played. My dad talks about that all the time.
He talks about when he played the tour. You know,
everybody was kind of under six ft tall, and they
used to say if you were tall. You know Davis Love,
he worked with Davis in the early nineties and it
was hard for Davis back then to find equipment. People said, oh,
you know, you're going to struggle coming out of college.
I think I remember Davis Love telling me that his

(15:59):
college off coach told him to get into the PGA
of America program and try and become a club pro
because he was never going to be good enough to
play competitive golf. I think it up and he turned
out to be pretty good. So for someone like you,
we're seeing more athletes. I'm seeing more athletes play golf
choose golf. Is it somewhat refreshing for you to be

(16:21):
able to sit down and have a conversation with someone
like Bryson who is, like you said, he can speak
your language. You know, I've spent time around you know,
some time around Kyle Berkshire, and that's why you know
he and Bryson have that kind of relationship because they're
doing things that other people can. Yeah, I think it's
also nice for Bryson to speak to someone who's kind

(16:41):
of experienced some of the struggles as to what he's
going through the last I think eighteen months. But I mean,
I remember I started really having proper horsepower from the
edge of seventeen, so I've had a longer time to
kind of understand and all that was through the period
of my body was changing a lot. I understand the
struggles that it's going through. Um. But I was talking
to him this morning about the that we have the
speed now, and it's really really cool. But there's a

(17:05):
reason that the best players in the world operate at
certain speeds, and it's not because they can't get faster. Look,
there's some guys who physically, like MORICOA being whatever is
six ft five eleven, he is never gonna be able
to swing the club at hundred miles now. It's a reality. Um.
But there's a reason the guys who are the best

(17:25):
in the world operate at a certain level. UM. So
him and I had a pretty interesting conversations morning where
I challenged him in the sense of, look, I understand
what you're trying to do, and we have the speed,
which is an incredible thing to have where you can decide, listen,
I'm gonna pump one out at three ninety or whatever
it is, but at what point? And it was kind
of a question to myself, are you gonna say, I'm

(17:47):
going to drive this Ferrari in second? Yeah? Because I
can keep it on the road. Because the thing is
that these speeds you're hitting shots that people would look
and be like, you're a professional golfer, what are you doing?
But the margins are so so small, and at the
speed you're going at it, you know the miss he's
going to be offline. And then something really wild that

(18:11):
I found out through him because he has access to
information that I don't simply due to the resources that's
available to him, is that so the gear effect on
a driver being hitting it off the heet'll start left, comeback, toe,
start right, drawback at our speeds. With the way in
which these balls are made, seven out of fifteen shots
don't operate according to the gear law, So you'll hit.

(18:34):
If you had fifteen shots off the toe two and
our ball speeds, seven of them will drawback, eight of
them will start right, go right, which makes no sense,
not because according to what the drivers but no one
understands what happens. I've I've watched him when he's last
year at the US Open. He had all the cobra guys.
I'm I'm a cobra puma guys. He had the cobra
guys there. They were all there and he was he

(18:57):
was doing that. He was saying they were they were
looking where the balls were being hit on the face
and he was like, that ball, based off of the
launch monitor numbers, where I hit that ball on the
face should not be going in that direction. It should
be going in the opposite direction. Yeah. And that's the
thing is these the balls, the way that they are
made is made for mass consumers because that's where your

(19:19):
money is, UM, and that's where called nine of the
World operates as in those margins UM. And he's his
big mission now is to work with guys at Bridgetone
to see if there's materials that they can include in
the golf ball manufacturing process to get it more consistent.
Because the polymer is that they use they overcompressed at

(19:42):
our speed, so the way in which they return and
the rate of return is so different that the ball
starts reacting really weirdly. UM. But I asked him, listen,
understand where you go in with us, and it's it's
only going to help guys like myself. But what you're
trying to do is you're hoping to fly to the moon,
where at the literally only have cars available. If that
makes sense, that there the manufacturing process as they're the

(20:05):
materials that are there are not there to fix the
problem you're going after. So at what point in your
current game are you gonna be like, listen, I know
what I want, but I can't get it because of
where things are at the moment. Let's play with what
we have. And I think that's been one of the
frustrations and talking to not only Bryson, but talking to
the all the amazing people at Cobra that work with him,

(20:28):
is everything that they're making him is a one off.
Like every driver head that he you know, he had
this week here in Saudi, he's got, you know, on
the range of that, I think he had twelve driver heads.
Every single one of those is a completely bespoke one off.
It's like an engine for a Formula One car where
you've got twelve engines and every single one of them

(20:50):
does something specific. Has it been Um, have you had
conversations with you know, the guys at paying to say, listen,
you know what information can I give you? Because I
think the back and forth, you know, I spent a
lot of time with with with Ben Showman and James
Posey who worked at Cobra for Bryson and there it's
a constant trying to figure this stuff out. Um No,

(21:15):
I have an approach being I think simply out of
the fact that I'm not a Brison. Yeah, you're not
very sense. I'm not someone where you can go to
manufacturing come and be like, pay attention to what I'm saying.
It's easier. It's easier if you're if you're you've won
a major championship exactly. But like interesting things that I've
never cracked the pink driver in my life, and I've
been with them now this will be my I year.

(21:36):
Never in my life have I cracked the ping driver,
and I think it's done to a couple of things.
I never hit drive on the driving range because firstly,
the rangers are I mean, where can you hit drivers?
But secondly, in my opinion, off my irons, things pretty good,
like the drivers there to be stepped on. Most of
the time. UM. But similarly to Bryson, the driver that

(21:58):
they've built me so one or like, it's it's kind
of fun to see people try and hit it because
it's forty five and three quarter in shaft tip twice
eight point seven degrees, have loft with hot melt in
the face, so the shaft is playing eddy four grounds.
It's as stiff as a lamp post. And to watch
people try it, that's really fun. Have you messed around

(22:19):
with any of the low loft stuff that Bryson and
the long drivers have have messed around with? You know
that kind of four and a half five six degrees,
you know, because Bryson is always trying to you know,
to get the guys at curb height. I need less
loft and they're like, and then he's trying to get
them to make them a three wood that's got nine.
He's just like, yeah, And I think, like, firstly, I've

(22:43):
never messed around with that because I think it's hard
enough to keep the ball straight at these It's like
and people think the harder you hit at the list
and you need so you need to go to a
harder ball, actually play the softer titles ball. UM. I
can laughed my driver down too under eight degrees, but
I don't because spin equals consistent see um. But yeah,

(23:04):
those those types of things are I don't know why
you would want to go with that little loft. Um.
The margins already so small. But I think, like meeting
Bryson this week, as it's been really interesting because you
obviously only see what what's in the media. Um, And
he's been a victim in the media, I think a
number of times. And he's an easy target. Yeah, and

(23:25):
he'd be willing to say that. Yeah. And he's also
willing at times to say that he makes it. He
makes himself an easy talk. But I think the thing
is that he is so intelligent. He's pushing the envelope.
He's so smart, and many many people who operate at
the cognitive level that he does aren't in the public eye.

(23:46):
They're doing research papers, they're setting in labs and things
like that. So for a guy with that brain to
have to ar be in the public eye talking to
people the whole time, I think it can be a
difficult space for him to operate in. Um. He's a
really smart guy, super passionate guy. He was just trying
to find a new way of playing. Yeah, he's when
I talked to him, James I I went to when

(24:08):
I first met him, he was, you know, he was
using the one length clubs and you know, I was
trying to talk to him about it. And you know,
sometimes you know, if you're not in the Bryson world,
he can talk to you. Like last year at bay Hilly,
we played a practice round with a with a player,
young kid um that I was working with at the time,
Chrispin Tura, and I saw him talking to Bryson and
I was like, what are you talking to him about?

(24:28):
And Chris is like he was trying to tell me
how the ball wasn't doing what he wanted to do,
and and Chris was like, I just checked out because
I didn't know what the hell he was talking about.
So there are things that because I think he's trying
to push the envelope so far that you know, if
you're if you're not in that orbit, you just you know,
like you can check out on it because and you

(24:50):
can just discount that what he's trying to do is
there is a method to the madness. So he talked
to me about doing you know, trying out the one
length clubs and I was like, uh, I'll never go back.
I started using the one links and they've been a
complete game change of me. So this this mad scientist
that that he gets called, there is a lot of

(25:10):
truth that. Do you feel like in some ways you're
lucky that you've kind of found someone like you, because
you know, if you if there wasn't a Bryson pushing
the envelope trying the long drive championships, spending time around that,
you basically don't have anyone that you can talk to

(25:31):
that can relate to anything that you're doing unless you
meet a long drive guy who isn't trying to play
golf competitive golf for a living. Yeah, I think it's
interesting because even from a coaching perspective, um like your
dad being probably the most prolific coach in history and
having learned from him, those laws don't apply it to

(25:53):
six nine guy who can sing a d And the
speed thing is one thing. But the part of challenges
being so big because the like a slight change in
your posture, the change that it has with impact laws
and swing plane and all of that is massive when
it comes to being this big um. But I think

(26:16):
like Bryson was kind of to give me his number,
and he lives out in Dallas, and I spent a
lot of time for work, so I think we'll end
up spending quite a bit of time together. Um. But
it is interesting to speak to someone who understands and
kind of puts answers to things I never even knew
I should ask, like why does the ball come off
the tern go right because it shouldn't. It should be

(26:36):
coming back. But now knowing that at our speeds over
compression and all of these types of things that he's
still trying to figure out as the reason for some
of the missages I have. And I'm not bad at golf. Um,
it's really cool. But I think like we end up
being friends. I think I'll probably end up being a
neutralizing agent to him in a sense because I'm more
of the school of golf. So it's so hard and

(27:00):
of the things that you're trying to figure out out
of our control. So operate with what we got and
make the best of it. You played college golf at TCU.
What how did you get to to TCU and Fort Worth?
What was did you look at other colleges? What? What
was what brought you to that program. Yes, so I was. UM.
I was recruited by coach Bill Monago. Unbelievable guy. He

(27:23):
threw out South Africa. I think I was Jess must
have been fifteen years old. He came to can watch events,
had no idea who he was, and it was so
weird because of all the in my opinion, stupid n
C double A rules, Like he's standing six ft from
speaking to my coach to speak to me, Like, it's ridiculous. Um.

(27:45):
And we kind of had it back and forth. And
the South African on the team there yonder Bo who
was who had graduated by the time I got there,
but we just continued to stay in contact and way
as we were allowed to UM. And then my senior
year of school, I committed to TCU. I've looked at
a couple of schools and gotten a couple of offers,
but UM, that was the only place I did an

(28:07):
official visit to really love for worth. People were really nice.
TCU is an unbelievable school. I enjoyed the fact that
it's not a massive school, so the classes were a
really small. I mean it's like thirty thirty five kids
in a class, which is really cool. But um, I
never got to graduate there, which I think is one
of the big regrets in my life. It's the way

(28:28):
things panned out. I got injured, went back to South Africa. Um.
But yeah, I mean there's a plan for all of
us in the way, and which has worked out. Has
been an incredible girl that I met in my freshman
years now my fiance. UM. So we'll get married in
October and I'll probably end up moving up there. You
mentioned a lot You've had a good share of injuries,

(28:50):
and I think for the sport that you're trying to play, um,
the injuries were ware. Um So I had a lot
of back problems when from when our fifty years old. UM,
and that was literally I would urge anyone to find
someone who's growing that fast who hasn't had either pains
and their knees hips it back. I mean, essentially, what

(29:10):
happens is your bones are moving so quickly that your
muscles just grab it and say it stop. This is
trying to protectively stop, and through that you're playing a
rotational sport away from your center of gravity, applying forces
to places that are trying to slow down. Um. And
that all settled when I was twenty three years old.
My back has been really fine, and that's part of
putting on the eights, just to try and get strong

(29:31):
and stable to handle all the forces. But the injury
when I turned pro was a tall legment to my wrist.
Just I would have been shocked if you didn't have
some sort of At the speed you're going at, I
mean your wrists, your back, your neck, your wrists and
your shoulders are going to be just getting um. But
it's I don't necessarily think it was a speed injury.

(29:53):
It's an injury that happens a lot to golfers through
a repetitive stress motion. So there's a ligament that sits
your wrist in the side they called the triangular fiber
cartilage complex um. It actually sits that way in your wrist,
which is super weird, and just you roll over it
every time you hear a show you're hitting a lot
of balls off of mats. No, just no, I just
hit a shot was the first one I players played

(30:14):
as a Probe became a little soul that week. I said,
never thought anything of it. Then got a quarter zone objection,
and I've had a few of those in my life
and ten days after those you should be good to go.
UM got back and it was actually worse than before
the injection. I was like, something's not right yere. I
had an m R I and the orthopedic surgeons like, listen,

(30:35):
I can number this for you, but we're gonna have
to fix it at some point. So I said, screed,
let's do it's only even before months it's fine. UM
had surgery. Recovery process was slow and things a little
bit weird. Went for another consult and my hand ended
up being locked. A bunch of scar tissue falled in
my arm was fused like this, couldn't turn it up,

(30:57):
couldn't move it at all. Say. Con operation went to
clean out all the scar tissue, which helped that element
of it, but then recovery process, my hand was fused again. UM.
And so then the third surgery was almost a year
off the first one. This whole process, like the focus

(31:17):
had shifted from trying to play golf again to just
getting function back and just getting healthy. Yeah I couldn't.
I mean, I'll try to find your photos. But I
had lost so much weight in my upper body because
I couldn't do anything. I couldn't lift. You couldn't do anything.
I couldn't pick up bags. My arm was literally fixed
in this position, could not turn it at all. And
then the third operation that they did, they essentially so

(31:42):
they went the wayness they fixed it as they split
the ligament that runs down the outside of your arm
um and then drill a hole through your on the bone,
create a sling through and then sew it back where
they cut it. And what they did was in the
third one is they cut that sling portion of the
ligament away because it already fused through the bone um.

(32:05):
And off that surgery. The authopedicas literally in the recovery
rooms like listen, I've done everything I can. If this
doesn't work, I'm sorry. I'm like, bro, I'm twenty three
years old. You're telling me I might not use my
hand again, Like what then is it? Um? And luckily
I made some incredible physiotherapists and bios who literally just
through the language that they used, UM got me back

(32:28):
to playing and practicing. And I've lost I mean, I
can't turn my wrist in that way, So the DJ
Morikawa risk position is not not for me. You can't
get your kid, So I can turn it down, but
if you apply forces it into radial deviation, I've got
none none, which is okay, Um, it is what it is.

(32:49):
But yeah, that was a super difficult process. But I
think the personal growth through that whole process was it
was really good. And I think like as a sportsman,
and I was speaking to Bryson, but it this morning,
all the energy that you're spending on all this golf
ball driver and all this type of stuff, how much
energy is spending on you? Because I think a lot
of guys like I don't go that is Bryce and

(33:11):
he's within the world, Like you're a human being before
you're an athlete. And that process, that eighteen month process,
was probably the most difficult part of my life. But
it's solidified a lot of things personally, in systems personally
that I know I'll never change and no matter what happens,
I'll be able to fall back on those systems and
those people who are there and it will be good.

(33:32):
So at this stage of your life and at this
stage of your career, status wise, where do you have status?
Where are you trying to get status? I mean, you know,
like like everybody that says, oh listen, I just want
to want to be a professional golfer. You see, you
know at this tournament. You know, you look at the
American guys that have come over here. You know, these

(33:53):
are guys that you know, they have huge houses, they
fly private every week, they make a tremendous amount the money.
Those are the outliers. There are so many more people
that are just trying to figure out where they can
get money for entry fees. I mean, it's it's tough
to be not only a professional golfer. I look at

(34:13):
the guys that are trying to play in the States,
but you're from South Africa. To go anywhere. If you
get a call and say, hey, you've got a tournament
that we've got you in and wherever, You've got to
get on a plane for eight to fifteen hours. It's
not like it's just around the corner. Yeah. That Like
a good example was amex Is. I was on location

(34:35):
with my fiance that you got engaged in South Africa. Yeah,
I got the in the friday before the Monday. So
how long did it? I mean the friday before for months? Yeah,
And it's not like again it's you're in South It's
not like it's if it was Florida, it'd be tough
to get to, but now you've got to get all
the way out to Palm Springs. So the travel time
from when I left my home in Victoria two when

(34:57):
I got to my accommodation the Hideaway and look until
it was four year two hours. It was a good time.
And I think, like, like, I'm super fortunate and I
feel very lucky, and I'm appreciative of these invites. But
it's people who have been in this position. I think
that's why a lot of the guys and that's been
striking the last two weeks with that maxing. This week

(35:17):
is half friendly the guys on tour because I think
they can all empathize with the fact that they've been
in these situations. And like, I don't care what people say.
If you're playing on an exemption, that week's got a
lot more appreciation than anything else because you know, you
don't have time to build up. I remember earlier this
year we were talking about, you know, the tour started
out in Maui. Normally DJ plays in Maui, and um

(35:39):
he didn't make it this year and the first time
in his career, and I said to him, the following
week was you know the one in Hunnulu and Hawaii.
I said, if you ever played there, he goes bro
I played there my my first year on tour. I
think I finished top time, he said. I think I
made like a hundred grand. He said, I thought I
was a millionaire. Yeah, So, like the financial aspect is.

(36:00):
I was actually speaking to my manager Ben Harrison about this, like,
these last two weeks for me have been like a
super accelerated learning process. I haven't played the way I
wanted to, which it's okay, Like it's I started working
with a good friend of yours, Brett McCabe. Brett I
had him on the podcast. He's a fantastic so I've
consumed a lot of his material and your podcast is

(36:22):
actually catalyst for me to kind of reach out to
him and been working with him for like six days.
I shout out to you, Mr breath Um. But I
was talking to me about the fact that the perspective
of every week's not make or break, and that's really
difficult from a professional golfing standpoint, because you know, we
can change your whole life, but to understand that these

(36:42):
weeks are the part of your career, like if I'm
lucky enough, I'll be playing for another thirty years. I
don't necessary it's necessarily think on the forty seven one
said back and be like, I can't believe it. Mr
contin Sudi and the amet um. But to have that
growth mindset of every single day is in a better
to apply skills that you have learned under the pressure environment.

(37:04):
And I feel this week I applied a lot of
the skills that I've learned in practice, because another thing
is practice and preparation don't translates performance um and having
that shift that Bread and I spoken about where playing
is just a challenge to apply learned skills under pressure

(37:25):
and to see if you can become more proficient at
that week after week after week is it's a fun challenge.
And that's why I love these games because it's so hard. Yeah,
I mean, I think one of the things that I've
that I that I talk a lot about on the podcast,
and I talk a lot about it two players that
I work with, there is a massive, massive difference between
technique and execution. And I think most players that don't

(37:46):
have status on tour, whether it's in Asia, whether it's
in Europe, whether it's on the corn ferry, whether it's
in the on the PGA Tour, the output wherever. Everybody
has this notion that the way I'm going to make
it is from my TECHNI to get better. But what
they don't realize is John Ram's trying to improve his technique,
you know, DJ, Justin, Thomas, Rory, Nelly Quarter, doesn't matter

(38:08):
who does. Your technique can always get better. But the
best players in the world have the ability to execute
on the golf course. Do you feel like you're getting
better at trying to take? Like I said, it's a
blessing and a curse, James, to have the speed and
the power you have, because it's the best part of

(38:29):
what you've got as a player, and at times it
can be the worst. And I think, like my off
weeks are really off because of that, the margins that
those speeds are so small that when you offer it's
like wha, yeah, it's not there's the right semi arf
this week. It's it's like, okay, do we have enough golf? Yeah?
I missed the fair, I missed the I missed the

(38:49):
cart path exactly. Um. Do I feel that I'm getting better? Yes? Um, well,
let me rephrase that I know what I need to
get better. And so if you had to describe as
someone that's got you know, like I said, you've got
long drive ball speed, You've got the ability to carry bunkers.

(39:09):
You know that are three fifty three eight. What do
you feel like to to get to the levels that
you want to? What do you feel like you have
to change or what do you feel like you have
not changed? What do you feel like you have to improve? Yeah, Like,
I think that's also the thing that Bret and I
spoke about is accepting the fact that who you are
enough as a player. Um. I think the ingredients that

(39:32):
I have as a player will make me one of
the best in the world. And I truly believe that
people might think it's arrogant, but if you don't back yourself,
nothing else is gonna. Um. I can hit the ball
really far. I'm learning how to hit Australia and I
put unbelievably well. Um my first job on Sancho led
the tom platting stats um and through the whole of

(39:54):
last year through the decade system average point at strokes
again putting per um UM put really well. So those
two ingredients of being able to hit it farm. Putting
really good, So the obvious question out here, distance is
a huge key, and being a good putter or a
great potter is a good So is it the iron

(40:17):
game that is where you feel like you can make
some gains and shift things in the right direction? Um?
I think it's a number of things. I think the
dispersion in the iron game can get a little tighter,
but I think that's going hand in hand with the
the body settling and getting more proficient at my technique.
But what I've learned the last two weeks is it's

(40:38):
not a skill thing. The difference between where I'm now
and where now I'll be, it's the ability to play
with freedom. Um. Because guys like DJ and Ram and
Morico are like you said, they're always trying to improve something,
but their ability to apply skills that they've learned under
pressure is better than everyone else's. And a big reason
for me is a complete lack of fear of consequence,

(41:02):
because the only way in which you can get gain
some controls to relinquish all controls like they play with
pure freedom and allow the talent and natural ability to
come out on the course. And that is a separate
it's not a technique thing, because otherwise everyone in the
top two in the world will have the same swing.
I think one of the things that I have noticed
around elite elite golfers and champions is and I used

(41:26):
DJ as as an example for this, um he's never
fearful that he's lost it. He doesn't think that it's
going away, like if he plays a bad round, like
a lot of times yesterday he came off the golf
course didn't really play well. A lot of guys would
have said, hey, I'm gonna go hit a few balls.
He'll always kind of say, you know what, I don't

(41:46):
really play that bad today, focus on the positives and say, yeah,
you know what, I know what I need to work
on to more. Whereas I think a lot of players
that aren't at that level, that don't have that kind
of full status on a tour somewhere, they get in
to that panic mode of I've played bad today, Like
you said, I've missed a cut. Oh man, oh you
know I've I've lost it and what am I going

(42:08):
to do to try and find it back? And I
think there is a comfort level at the elite top
level that they don't have that fear that they're gonna
keep missing cuts. They feel like it's around the corner. Yeah,
And look, I think it's easy for people to say
they don't have to worry about it because they have
so much money than everything, have to want for anything.
But they played like that before they were who they are,

(42:30):
um And I think that's the critical element. And it's
I think as I work more closely with Breton, as
I become more comfortable with who I am and understand
after these two weeks that what I have is enough.
I can hit every shot that these guys can. I
can probably hit some that they can't. My ability to
hit the ball really far. But it's while I'm playing

(42:53):
two not. Let me put it this way, a lot
of the times I play not to make a mistake.
That makes you're trying not to mess up as opposed
to just trying to hit good shot. It's not necessarily rounds.
It's even you can put pointed two shots, um and
in practice rounds or practice that's never in your mind
because the consequence is not there. You're not playing for

(43:15):
your manager, the crowd, to try and get a sponsor.
None of that stuff matters when you're practicing, So your
ability to hit these shots, to learn these shots is
super high in my opinion, because that freedom is there,
so a lot of the talent that you have is
able to come out, and you refined that through technical work. Um.
But that freedom and the attitude to allow yourself to play,

(43:37):
I think is the differentiator. And that's probably well I
spend most of my time because I mean, firstly, golf
is hard enough that be kind to yourself and make
an enjoyable experience. But I mean, I think that's the
critical element to get into our large Yeah. And the
other thing James that I saw, I mean, for the
almost decade that I was lucky enough to be around
Tiger when he was working with my dad, Tiger loved

(43:59):
the challenge. And everybody says, oh yeah, I like it
when it's really really tough, but they not a lot
of people do. And that was the thing that always
floored me about the first time. The first day I
met Brooks, kept guy asked him what his goals were,
and he said, I feel like I'm good enough to
be the number one player in the world. I feel
like I'm good enough to win a major. I feel
like I'm good enough to win multiple majors, And I'm

(44:21):
sitting there in my head thinking, dude, you're on the
Challenge Tour and you haven't really won maybe a couple
of turns. You haven't done anything that would lead. But
he really believed that, and then once he won that
first major at Aaron Hills, the flip switch to where
he went, Okay, that was really difficult, and I kind

(44:43):
of liked it. And I think the great ones, you know,
Roger Federer always says pressure is a privilege. And the
great athletes that I've been lucky enough to meet in
all different sports, and it's just not golfers, they all
have this innate thing that they love it when the
pressure gets heightened the most. And I truly believe that
the greatest athletes they play for free because they just

(45:07):
want to compete their competitors first and foremost. They're not practicers.
They're not technicians their competitors. So how do you get
into that headspace of being a competitor as opposed to
being a technician. Um, look, I think naturally my sisters

(45:30):
would tell you this. I'm probably the most competitive person
you'll meet, Like I would want to win when I
was a kid, I'd want to win, to be the
first at the car, first to finish moment. It will
be snot out of you in cards or board games
or whatever it was. UM. And I think that's that
eighteen month injury period that I alluded to. Why I

(45:51):
was so powerful for me as a person is because
I know, no matter how difficult it's going to be
on the golf course, nothing I face will be stuff
of that because I was faced with losing something that
I've wanted to do, something that you loved, um. And
then secondly losing the ability his mom sitting down for
eighteen months, not having the ability to do anything because

(46:13):
it's you'll be ready about X. And then that just
keeps moving, so you can't plan to do something constructive
for a long period of time because the goal post
keeps shifting. UM. But I love pressure. It's because I
think everyone who enjoys that there's some level of arrogance
in them to be like, screw you, watch what I'm
about to do. Um. And yesterday was reminded of again

(46:39):
and like his golf is all people listening is gonna
sound stupid, but it's much harder to fight for a
cut than to win an event in my opinion, because
if you in to win event, you're playing well. Yeah,
if you're fighting for a cut, you have you haven't
been playing that good and there's demons in your game
somewhere and you're fighting, it becomes a massive mental battle. Um.
And yesterday was super super difficult conditions, blowing probably three

(47:00):
miles and oh at some point, um and I fought
back really really well and super difficult conditions And that
to me was a personal victory in the sense that
it shows me that's still who I am. Like, I
haven't played very well in a little while, but that
is my DNA is to be someone who will never

(47:21):
just pack it up. And because I mean, it could
have been easy for me with nine hours to go
yesterday being whatever my school was, to be like, okay,
let's just changing flights. But I found something the last
nine holes in my swing that's going to help me
going forward. It was a really really productive nine oles
for me, and that was cool. Um. But like I said, that,

(47:43):
to allow that competitive nature to flourish is going to
be work that I put into get out of my
own way in the sense of who I am is
good enough, what I have is good enough. The consequences
of what I'm doing is so much less than what
I make it up to be mean. And once you
allow yourself to operating that freedom, I think it becomes

(48:06):
a lot easier to allow the competitive side to flourish.
And the other thing that I think that people that
haven't played golf competitively, that aren't you know, that haven't
played on tour, that aren't trying to you can play okay,
but you can get into that rout to where every
Friday morning or afternoon, you're on the cut line, right,
you're one, you're one inside the cut line, you're one

(48:28):
outside the cut line, and you know that with nine
holes to go, you kind of have an idea of
what the cut line is, and you have those consecutive
weeks to where you're like, man, right on this, so
that any mistake you make, you know is just like man,
I've just made bogey here on a par five, and
now I'm right on the cut line. And there is

(48:50):
a huge difference between playing the first two rounds not
really doing anything great but just not making any mistakes,
to where you're on the back with three or four
holes left and you know you're gonna make the cut. Right,
you're not leading the golf tournament, but you know you're
going to get to the weekend. You're two or three
shots inside the cut line. You're not one of the leaders,

(49:11):
but you're like, Okay, I know that I've got two
more days and then I can go over the weekend
and free it up. But when you're constantly weekend week out,
and I see that so much of of players, you
can tell they're struggling because they just don't have those
first two days that give them that ability to exhale
while they're playing. And then okay, maybe now I take

(49:34):
a little bit more chances. Do you feel like you're
close to getting to where you can get that? I mean,
obviously the other thing that helps is to get full
status somewhere where you know, for an entire year you
can plan your life and your schedule. Yeah, so I've
got full status Sunshine to and um I'll play does

(49:57):
He'll play close to sixteen events in the challenge tone,
So I know. I think that's also a helpful thing,
is that these events not going the way I wanted
them to go. I know what's coming up. I've got
a ton of turn and I'm playing. I think, including Amex,
is going to be fourteen of seventeen weeks UM and
that does make it a lot easier. But yeah, I
mean once you get into a rut, it's pretty difficult

(50:18):
because what I find a lot of players do, including myself,
as you kind of start to dissect your game in
the sense that there is a massive problem and there isn't.
The margins in this game are so so close. And
I think it's like that with any professional sport that,
like a baseball you can overthink it. A baseball batter,
I mean, he can go through a slump, but the

(50:38):
margin between him being in a slump and having what
quarter three fifty average is a whisker. It's the whisker
of the bat's edge. UM. And I think that's an
attitude that I've taken into this year is it's it's
better to be consistently good than occasionally great um. And
I'm alluding to that more in the sense of preparational practice,

(51:00):
the necessarily performance too, because that freedom that's the best
and all of play with is not based off performance,
is to consistently go through their structures on the course,
whether it be routine decision making short choice commitment and
be consistent in those acts bests that lead to performance,
as opposed to being like, I'm going to shoot fifty
under this week, okay, but there's so many things we

(51:20):
need to do on the road to fifty under and
do those things well that are in your control, because
you can't control if you're cana shoot fifty under. Um.
But yeah, it's to be consistently good in those aspects
to me, will show a lot more value then being
occasionally great and being like, I'm going to excuse me,
I'm going to dissect my game and be so great

(51:42):
at picking it apart that you're just leading down a
rabbit hole of misery. So I'd like for me to
just stick to what I'm doing. I know what I'm
doing is the right things, but with the addition of
guys like Bread to narrow down those processes and attitudes
and mental structures to just consistently chop away doing good things. Lastly,

(52:04):
coming from South Africa, Gary Player, Ernie Els Retief Goosen,
Charles Swaltzel, Louis ustaz In, Trevor im Molement. I mean
the list of players and the fabric, and again I
always like in the South Africans to the Australians in
that geographically you can feel like you're in kind of

(52:25):
a remote part of the world. You have to travel
enormous distances to get other places, but you have such
an amazing history of players. Have you gotten to spend
time with any of the great South African guys and
kind of picked their brain? And if you have, what
did you you learn from those guys? Yes, I was
lucky enough as a kid. My dad played with Gary

(52:48):
in prom I think I was seven or eight years
old and we started in contact um for a number
of years, every year of checking in. And he's an
incredible guy. I think the same way as Bryce. And
he's a victim of the media sometimes UM, and that's
a lesson for me as well. This week there's a
lot of guys have seen the meeting and who the

(53:08):
was a person. It's a completely different story. But he's
a really good man with a really good heart. UM.
I've enjoyed spending time with him. I managed to play
with Ernie I think was last year or two years
ago in advantage to me, it was a dream come true.
He was one of my idols growing up. He's an
incredibly good Man. Um I learned a time from him.
I think caught him at the back end of his career,

(53:31):
so he maybe it wasn't as intense as he was
early on, but managed to speak to him. I've spent
time with with sharl And Louis and Brandon Grace, not
necessarily personally, but just rubbing shoulders at events. But I
think what I've taken away from those guys more is firstly,

(53:52):
they're all really good people. UM. I think it's a
theme throughout the South African golfers who have made it
as they prioritize their family over their career. Um. Like
I personally believe Louis westays and has the ability to
be top five player in the world. He's so much
better than people think is it's ridiculous, but he loves
spending time with his family, loves spending time with his kids,

(54:14):
and he prioritized it over his career. UM. Same with Ernie.
He loves spending time with his kids. And like for me,
what I've taken aways be a dog when you're in
the arena. I mean, it's unfortunately the way you've got
to be if you're in any competitive sport. There's some
part of you that's like if you I don't care

(54:34):
who I'm gonna beat you today. Um. But there's also
more to it than just a golf um. They've made
incredible in roads into their foundations with Louie fifty seven
and Earnis what he's done for autism and his earnings
foundation for golf back home, and so I think that's
something i'd definitely like to follow, regardless of how I play.
I'd like to to leave a legacy of of changing

(54:55):
people's lives of the course as well, and they've done
a really good job of that. You're goals for two
and beyond your short term. In your long term goals
would be one, firstly, get married, getting married in October,
so as anyone who's gotten married knows a lot of
planning that goes into that stuff. But luckily my fiance's

(55:18):
a beast at admin um. But secondly, I'd like to
to win a couple of times. But I think I've
learned earlier on, even in my amateate career, to steer
away from goals where you're just outright state you want
to win, because obviously the goal, but I think a
massive process for me would be to feel in an

(55:41):
honest assessment that I've played freely in events and get
to at a point where the result isn't necessarily what
drives the way I feel about my game, but my
bologistical processes is um and to stay consistent in refining
the areas of my game that I think need work.
So wedge play needs a lot to work. I'm like,

(56:01):
it's gonna sounds too, but I know I'm so close
to clicking into the player that I know I am,
And people are going to be like, where where did
you come from? Um, it'll be a overnight success. It's
and and it's the way it's been for a lot
of players. But I know I'm close. So to just
continually chip away the things that I know I need
to improve that and to have a good attitude about

(56:21):
it is pretty much all I can control. Well, I
got to watch your balls today are this week for
the first time, and there have been a number of
the best players in the world when you've been hitting
golf balls that while they're warming up for their rounds,
have kind of looked over the shoulder and watched you.
I mean DJ with hitting balls not far from you
yesterday and when you were hitting drivers and you kind
of he was kind of going back to the bag

(56:43):
and getting a club, and you kind of hammered a
driver and he just kind of looked at me in
age and just kind of shook his head. And So
for someone like that to kind of look at what
you're doing and kind of marvel at it. Um, I'm
really excited to uh, to see kind of what you
do and kind of see where your journey kind of
takes you. And um, and best of luck, hopefully we'll

(57:04):
start seeing on the leaderboard soon. Thank you appreciate. Thanks.
So that was rising Star James hart Upre and I
can't wait to see what he does. I mean, you know,
I got to watch him hit some golf balls, did
a little work with him on his golf swing and
the move, the sound, the way that this kid hits

(57:25):
the golf ball. Um, other than the long drive guys
and maybe Bryce and I haven't seen anybody doing what
he's doing. So it's going to be a really really
interesting road for him to see if he can somehow
manage to just harness all this unbelievable power that he's got.
And UM, I think it's a cool story. He can
stay healthy and Um, if he can figure it out, UM,

(57:48):
he could be a force to be reckoned with on
any of the tours around the world. Last week, Waste Management,
huge first win for Scotty Scheffler. I was really glad
to see Scotty kind of get that big first win,
and I certainly don't think it's going to be the
last one. Um. Scotty had an unbelievable amateur career. It
just took him a little bit longer the win. I thought,

(58:08):
the way he played in the Ryder Cup, I was
going to be surprised in two if he didn't get
a w Good to see him get it. But I
just want to talk about what happened at the Waste
Management last week. UM. I'm a fan. UM. I don't
think that we're going to see that every single week
on the PGA Tour, and I don't think we're gonna
need to see that every single week on the PGA Tour.
But I think for one week a year, Um, what happened,

(58:31):
you know on the sixteenth hole. I just don't have
a problem with it. I'm just not one of those
guys that think golf needs to be, you know, the
way it was in the thirties, forties and fifties. I
think golf can grow and evolve. Everybody can still follow
the rules, everybody can still play the game the way
it was intended. But people can have fun playing golf.
You don't have to just be so so just traditional

(58:56):
to go out and enjoy golf. I mean, if you
look at the way that the Masters is run by UM,
Augusta National is a very very specific tournament. UM. The
patrons are expected to act a very specific way. You're
not allowed to bring your phone in UM and and
I don't have a problem with that either. It's one

(59:16):
week a year. They run their tournament the way they
want to, and I think what they do out of
waste management the way they've embraced it. UM I bought
cult nost and Amanda Balionis did an unbelievable job on
the call. UM. It felt like you were watching golf
and the way that they were talking about what just
happened was was what you'd be saying sitting on your couch.

(59:37):
And and and maybe that's some people think golf needs
more of that, But UM embracing kind of the craziness,
embracing the chaos, embracing the fun um two holding ones
on consecutive days. Um, I think Saturday. The golf that
was was played at Waste Management over last weekend is
some of the the coolest, most exciting golf I've seen. Yeah,

(59:58):
everybody was throwing beer and throwing them on it's it's
waste management. That's what they do. They they clean up
people's garbage. So it didn't really impede play. The players
know what the situation is going to be. Um, some
players skip that tournament. I know players that say, listen,
it's just not for me. I don't want to play
under all that chaos. And then I think, if you

(01:00:19):
look at a guy that's had tremendous success there, he
had a chance to win again, Brooks kept and he
was going for his third winner in in nineteen winner
and or excuse me winner last year and twenty winner
in two thousand and fifteen. He embraces it, he likes it.
There are players that don't. And if you don't like it,
you don't have to go. You've got free will. You
can choose which schedule you want to play. And um,

(01:00:39):
I thought when Sam Ryder made that hole in one,
it was just it was just a culmination of of
a big, giant party and listen, I'm here for it.
And um, I don't think every single tournament needs to
be like that, but for one week a year, count
me as being all in on it. And if that
gets more eyeballs and gets more people that maybe aren't golfers,

(01:01:02):
you know, I see a bunch of stuff on social
media about how many people on the sixteenth hole are
actually real golfers. I don't care, and I don't think
we should care. I think we need golf to be
a legitimate sport. Not everybody that went to the Super
Bowl last weekend played football growing up, played competitive football. Um,

(01:01:23):
so they're still able to go watch, They're still able
to go get excited, and I don't think golf should
be any different. That's just my feelings on it. I
could be wrong, but um I liked it, and um
I thought it was cool and I thought, you know,
the hole and one by Sam Writer at the end
of the year will go down as one of the
most memorable shots on the PGA Tour and that's a

(01:01:45):
cool thing for me. We've got a bonus episode, of
of course, with Claudeman coming out Friday, and as you
know we always come to you every Wednesday, and make
sure you check out the bonus episode on Friday, and
we will see you next week.

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Josh Martin

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