March 31, 2021 • 43 mins
Just as he was contemplating if music was the right path, Chuck reveals how his 30 year gig with The Rolling Stones came in the nick of time, as well as the most embarrassing moment of his career while on tour with Eric Clapton. Chuck takes us back to how he got his start with The Allman Brothers, how Dr. John’s voodoo magic may have brought him years of good luck and ends with a hysterical conversation in the gym with Paul McCartney.
We also touch on Chuck’s side job as a tree farmer that just earned him a national award and documentary film that features interviews with over 80 musicians with a combined 58 Grammy Awards.
Check out Chuck's website: https://chuckleavell.com for his new music and the film: Chuck Leavell: The Tree Man at: https://www.chuckleavellthetreeman.com
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
On tour as a production of I Heart Radio and
Black Barrel Media. I'm your host, Brian Ray. I've been
a musician for forty years. I started as a teenager
with Etta James and most recently with Paul McCartney for
nineteen years. On this show, we'll take you behind the
scenes of the music business to give you the most
raw and real tales you've likely never heard before. We'll
(00:34):
get into the highs and lows of the touring industry,
who these people were before they played on the biggest
stages in the world. And we'll share our wildest, most unbelievable,
and yes, most embarrassing moments while on tour. In this episode,
we're talking to Chuck Lavell. Although most of you know
Chuck as the master keyboard player and musical director for
The Rolling Stones, you've also heard his work on albums
(00:56):
with John Mayer, The Black Crows and many more. Chuck
and I discussed our biggest disappointments and greatest wins, including
his years with the Allman Brothers, his genuine moments with
Eric Clapton and George Harrison, voodoo magic with Dr John,
and we wrap up his musical journey with how he
got a thirty year gig with the greatest rock and
(01:16):
roll band in the world. As if his music journey
wasn't remarkable enough. Chuck is also an environmentalist and was
recently named National Tree Farmer of the Year. Be sure
to check out the film Chuck Lavell The Tree Man
that includes interviews with over eighty artists with a combined
fifty eight Grammy Awards. Here's my conversation with Chuck Lavell. Chuck,
(01:50):
welcome to my show, The Sidemen Gigs Go. You certainly
have one of the most prominent, longstanding for the past
thirty six years as a member of and musical director
for the Rolling Stones. I want to talk first about
how you got here and what led you to this
um And for me, rarely is there an overnight success
(02:11):
in this industry. The journey has often met with mixed
emotions and doubt along the way. But what started you
on this path? Well, you're right, it's a journey, isn't
it for all of us? Uh? You know, we're in
the same boat here and you're great work with Paul
And by the way, when we get down the road
a little piece and I got to tell you a
(02:31):
story when we were doing the desert trip a couple
of years back. But to answer your question, Um, I
learned the piano from my mom. I was a baby
of the family. Uh three children, my brother fourteen years
my older, my sister five years, my elder, and the
out working uh So oftentimes just me and mom in
the house. She was not a professional, not a teacher
(02:54):
or anything like that, but she played for family enjoyment.
And I just love to listen to her play, you know,
and tug on her skirt and say, Mamma, play me something,
watching her hands move up and down that keyboard, and
listening to the melodies and the harmonies. It just it
was great. And I'm sure there was also the mother
son connection. So she would get me up on the
(03:16):
stool and show me very simple things, you know, simple
try ads and a melody here and there. And sometimes
she'd go about her housework and leave me up there
to my own resources, and she'd say, well, Chuck, I
gotta go work, but you just make something up, play
whatever comes to your mind, and I'll be listening, you know,
(03:37):
I'll be checking you out. And so this went on
for a period of a couple of years, and one
of the things she did for me, Brian, it was
so helpful and that I still think a lot about today.
And she would say things well, and of course you
got to appreciate them six seven years old, you know.
But she'd say, well, Chuck, what would it sound like
if there was a big storm outside. Oh, I'd rumbled
(03:59):
down on the low unto the keyboard and do some
lightning strikes up on high. You know, what would it
What do you think it might sound like if you
hit a home run in your baseball team? Or what
what might not sound like if you were got mad
at your best friend or something. So music has always
been that, uh, not so much notes and chords as
(04:19):
it is feelings, emotions and painting pictures. Wow. What what
a wonderful tutelage, you know, to get that, especially in
the family. Uh, And to learn that music is an
expression of emotion more than it is a technical event.
How fortunate for you. My My first memories were, uh,
(04:42):
my mother playing classical music as a little kid and
played it all the time when I was a little kid,
and I picked up on that and later, like you did,
I had a relative who is a folk rocker who
turned me onto music at a very young age, and
my earliest memories were playing of saying piano it was
my first instrument. Was that I just wanted to teach
(05:03):
her to teach me boogie woogie. I didn't want to
learn this little cute stuff media. I'm six years old
and say, of course my hands were big enough to
play boogie will you? But that's what I wanted to do.
I know that you're from the South and you moved
around quite a bit in Alabama as a kid growing
up with the desire to be a musicians. It seems
(05:24):
like you were heading that way. What was that like
among your peers? Did they accept that or did they
think that this was a silly pipe dream or what
was that like for you? It was good for me.
Our first band was called the Misfits and we played
the y m c A every Friday night. We had
a steady gig, and you know, we were young, were
I guess, uh fourteen fifteen years old, and so it
(05:47):
was cool to have a band. And because we did
the y m c A gig, the kids would come
and they would dance on Friday night, you know, and
it was steady. We did it for probably a whole year.
And when the first television station came to Tuscaloosa, where
we were living at the time, they wanted to emulate
(06:09):
American Bandstand, so they cleverly called the show Tuscaloosa Bandstand
and they hired us to be the band. There was
a local DJ named Tiger Jack Garrett that was the
MC for the show, and he was pretty well known
DJ on radio. And so we put that together Friday
night at the y Saturday morning on the television show,
(06:33):
and it became an enterprise for us at a very
young age. So, uh, you know, and it was worked too,
as you well know, once you had that band and
you had to learn these songs to be fresh every
Friday night Saturday morning. Uh you know, you listened to
the radio all week. Mom would let us move the
furniture around and we would rehearse in our living room
(06:54):
and uh so it was work, it was fun work,
uh and it was an enterprise and that early age.
And did you have the feeling that you had to
be the best band in town to keep that gigg
and learn new songs every week? Yes? Absolutely, you know
there was pressure there because it was a band that
was older than us, called the Gents, and they were
really good, dude. They had you know, their musicianship was
(07:16):
tied and we admired them, but we were also like,
we gotta get that good, you know, we we we
gotta we gotta make sure we can you know, be
comfortable on the same stage with those guys. And and
interesting it is working. A lot of people think that
music is just fun. It is that we're lucky, but
(07:37):
it takes work, you know. I remember Paul once saying
that they just wanted to be the best band in
Liverpool so they could get out and travel around the world.
And it's such a simple thing, but it seems like
that's the same that was driving you in the Misfits
and up against the Gents. Absolutely, but also the same
you know, with the Stones, they wanted I think their
(07:59):
first goal was to be the best blues ban in
London and then in England, and then you know, then
they started writing songs and everything changed, but those early
goals it's so important. I'm sure you had the same
experience as a young musician. You know. It's uh, you
want to learn, Uh, you look for opportunities to learn
(08:21):
and look for opportunities to play with better musicians. You know,
once the Misfits broke up, that was my goal. Who
were the cool players in town? And how can I
get up with those guys? And uh? And that's what
I think both of our careers has centered around ever
since then. Right, absolutely. And I'm sure like most of us,
you realize that music can be an uncertain path. It
(08:44):
seems to me you can't have a long and storied
careers such as yours without hearing no when yes would
have felt so much better. What was the biggest or
most impactful no you ever received? Oh? Man, I guess
my biggest just appointment was that I got to audition
for James Taylor uh at a certain point in time.
(09:06):
And man, you know I wanted that gig really bad.
He's such a wonderful artist and a great, great guy. Uh.
And it came down to I, thank me and another guy,
and you know, the other guy got it, and James
was so gracious, you know, he called up and he said, man,
this is a tough decision. Thank you so much for
coming out. You know, I really appreciate it. And and
(09:27):
you know he lied and said you did will because
I didn't do well? Man, I I don't know what
it was. Maybe I was nervous. I usually don't get
nervous in those situations. But I did not really perform
that will at that audition, so I didn't really deserve
the gig, to be honest with you, But of course
it was a big disappointment to hear you know, we're
(09:47):
going with someone else about how old were you in
that happening? You know I would have been that's a
good question. Um, probably twenty seven somewhere. And have you
run into him sense now is the musical director for
the greatest rock and roll banding. No, I haven't, but
I still have a great admiration for him and all
(10:09):
the guys that worked with him. He's had some beautiful,
beautiful players through the years and his bands and on
his records. Yeah, my disappointing no story was that I
auditioned for Tina Turner right around the private dancer time
and I had like teased out blonde of course hair
and big old shoulder pads. I look like MTV. Why
(10:31):
was anyway I walk in there and plug in and
it's going, okay, I'm not feeling that ton of you know,
synergy going on yet The other guitar player. James was
very nice, but right in front of me saying, and
Tina was not there, It's just the band. Right in
front of me on a couch was that big, sort
(10:52):
of shiny guy with the long hair that played saxophone.
Was a muscle guy. Do you remember that guy that
was in the videos? And I it would be more
opposite that guy. And I just remember him looking at
me and like looking kind of up from down like
you could tell this what'sn't going? Well, this might not
work right, not work, but hey man, you gotta you
(11:15):
gotta get through some nose to get to the yes,
don't you know. Let's talk about your experience with the
bands before you got into the Rolling Stone. Well, it
was just one thing leads to another, bron and I'm
sure that's happened with you and your career as will.
(11:37):
But from Sundown, that connection got me to Alex Tyler.
Alex had done a couple of records on Capricorn, and
we became his touring band as well as doing his
second album. That led to a lot of session work.
Bonnie Brandlet Um, Oh my goodness. Uh. Tim Weissberg, Uh.
(12:03):
Johnny Sandlin was a producer that favored me and we
became very good friends, and Johnny would use me on
a lot of the records that he was producing. And
eventually it was Greg Almond's first solo album, Laid Back Uh,
and Dwayne had died you know the history there, tragic
motorcycle accident in nine and the band had some obligations
(12:29):
that had to go out as a five piece without
a replacement, and anyway, you don't replace Dwayne Alman period.
So but that puts so much pressure as I'm sure
you can you can appreciate on Dicky Betts because Dicky
was not the slide player that Dwayne was. But he
had to step up to the plate and he did.
But the band came off this little short run after
(12:51):
Dwyane's death as a five piece band, physically exhausted, mentally exhausted,
and they took a break and Gregg wanted to do
this solo record and that's when I got to call.
That led to jam sessions after hours as we were
recording U and so all the Almond brothers would come down,
even though we had a different set of musicians recording
(13:13):
Gregg's record, and so h it was pretty much pick
a key and go, you know, and anything can happen,
and things started happening. Uh. And they had no design
to go get a keyboard player in the Almond Brothers band,
but by osmosis, that's what happened. And so after these
(13:36):
jam sessions, about three weeks or so, I get a
call from the manager of the band that also on
the label, Phil Walden. Phil would like to see in
your office. I thought, what have I done wrong? Yeah?
Here he comes. I go in there and there's all
the guys in the band. Some pleasantries go down, the
shoe drops. The guys feel like this is an interesting direction.
(13:56):
Would you like to join the Almond Brothers band. I
was barely tw t, so we know the answer to
the question. Yes, please please? When do I start? Exactly? Amazing?
It sounded like it sounds like you had already started
with the jams. There was a new direction coming. Yeah. Absolutely,
And uh, you know, Capricorn had a lot of interaction
(14:19):
between the artists anyway, Marshall Tucker band was on Capricorn.
Allman Brothers band. Dickie did a solo record that I
worked on during those years. Um and of course Gregg
laid back record and then the first record I did
with the Almonds was Brothers and Sisters and that had
rambling Man and Jessica and Come and Go Blues and
(14:40):
those songs on that record, Huge album, huge album. All
your work had paid off, right then, that's amazing. Well,
tell me if you have any great stories of your
time working with Dr John. Oh, mag it was such
a trip. Uh and God rested. So you know Mac
Rebanack as you know was it was his real name,
(15:03):
and uh, all right, so here's a story for you.
As we were auditioning, because what had happened was I
was working with Alex Taylor with a set of musicians.
Alex had a falling out with the manager, decided not
to tour anymore. We were a band without an artist.
And Phil had just signed Dr John to a management contract.
So he said he had finished recording uh in the
(15:26):
right Place LP and was going to go out and
tour and needed a band. So Phil said, why don't
you guys audition for for Mac? Okay, so we go
and Uh, the first couple of days did not go
so well. We were trying to get that New Orleans
field that Mac was looking for, and Mac would say, man,
you guess y'all ain't got that second line thing. Man,
(15:48):
y'all got to can do some study and get get right,
you know. So we were listening to records and this
goes on for about three days, and I really wanted
this gig. I really wanted this gig, right, So I thought, well,
I gotta go spend a little face time with him,
you know. So I go. He was staying at the
holiday inn. I go knock on the door and oh,
little Chucky, Oh man, come on, it's good to see you. Man, Yeah,
(16:11):
come on in here. Now. You have to appreciate Mac
at the time was on the methodone program. I've heard
about that, and he was also, unbeknownst to us, he
was copying on the streets still see, and so I
didn't know anything about that, right with with Mac double dipping,
yeah exactly. So we're together in his hotel room and
(16:36):
he's really, you know, very gracious, and we talked a
little bit and then he said, hey, Chucky, I just
stay here cool man. I'll be back in and just
to us short. And he goes to the bathroom and
he's gone for like half an hour. Okay, so we
know what that's all. And I'm you know, I'm looking
around and waiting. I'm waiting, and so curiosity gets the
(16:56):
best of me, and I look over at the table
and there's there's a book like a journal kind of
looking thing, and you know, I'm looking at the bathroom
door and I'm I'm looking around. Nobody's in there, and
so I couldn't help myself. I flipped the cover of
the book and a page or two and then I
see all of the names of us, of the band members,
(17:18):
and by our names were these weird voodoo symbols And
what was going on? I have no idea, but there
was some spirit happening, you know, some spirits floating around.
And the bottom line is we got the gig, and uh,
we had a great little run. I learned so much
from Mac, you know, he was really nice to me.
(17:40):
And when I joined the Almond Brothers, Mac was opening
up some of those shows and so Mac stayed around.
This was one of my first shows with the Alman Brothers.
He had opened up. Afterwards, Uh, he said, oh, Chucky,
you gotta come to my room. Man. Let's hang out
a little bit, go lose room. And so we talk
(18:02):
and he's very generous and giving me some nice compliments
and the night is about to end. And I said, well,
Matt God, I love you so much, man, thank you,
thanks for staying and you know, watching me, and thanks
for all you've taught me. And I just love you
so much. And you know, I hope our paths will
keep crossing. And he said, well, wait a minute for
you go, man, let me get you a little something.
He goes over to the corner of his room and
(18:23):
he gets an envelope and he's got his back to me,
and he's putting some things in the envelope and he
seals it up and he comes over to me and
he said, Chucky, here's some very special things in here.
And you don't need to need to even look at it, man,
I mean you don't. I don't want you to have
and nobody see what it is, but you try to
keep it around you as much as you can, and
(18:46):
I think it might bring you some good luck. And
I still have that. I put it in a leather
bag and there's just some very special, very special juju
in that leather bag. And I'll tell you what. I
don't know whether it's due to that or not, but
I've I've had a nice career that I'm very grateful for.
So thank you. Mat. Wow, that's a great story. Well, Mac,
(19:06):
thank you. It sounds like him working out that little
notebook journal with all of your names and the symbols
by It was his way of sort of bringing you
guys to his comfort, to his world. Yeah, you thought,
oh no, he's got voodoo on us, but instead you
got the gig. But it was good voodoo. Isn't that
(19:27):
something else? I mean, I know you've done uh you
did a huge record with John Mayre Born and Raided,
which is a number one album. But I'd love to
also ask you about similarly, do you have any stories
about your time with Eric Clapton. Well, um, first of all,
Eric was a special guest on the Steel Wheels tour
in nine right, that's right, And fortunately for me, they
(19:50):
set him up physically right next to me on stage
and we were doing a little Red Rooster, you know,
great blue song, and we had a nice musical conversation
back in fourth you know, and I mean, he's Eric Clapton,
didn't he? And so the tour ends and I go
home and this is back before the digital days, and
I had a cassette answering machine and there's Eric's voice
(20:13):
on it saying, this is Eric Clapton calling from Hong
Kong for Chuck Lavell to see if he might be
interested in doing some shows at the Royal Albert Hall. Yes,
I would thank you very much. That's another big yes.
So um, you know, we we go over there. And
this was the twenty four Nights record, the live record
that he did twenty four nights at the Albert Hall,
(20:34):
divided by six different sets. You know. He had a
quartet which I was not a part of. That was
Greg filling Games and Steve Ferroni and h and Nathan East.
But then there was six nights of a regular I
think it was a seven piece band that I was
a part of, six Nights with Blues that I was
a part of, and six nights of orchestra that I
was a part of. So that was the first experience
(20:57):
with with Eric. Uh then this horrible tragedy happens with
his son, you know, because he was going to take
a year off after that and spend time with Connor,
his son. And it was a matter of weeks, maybe
a month after the twenty four Nights thing, that Connor
(21:20):
had the terrible accident falling out of the building in
New York City and was killed. Uh. And so the
manager called me up and he said, you know, we're
not going to take a year off. Eric needs to work,
He needs to try to get his mind off this
tragedy and and just continue to work. Uh. So the
next thing that happened was the tour with George Harrison.
(21:40):
And you know the relationship that George and Eric had,
very famous relationship, and uh, Eric pretty much challenged George
to tour. You know, he said, hey, man, you're never
get in the trenches with the rest of us. You
do a record about every five years or so, but
you hadn't been touring, you know, come on, come on,
he said, But it don't have a band deliver that.
(22:02):
And Eric says, well, I got a band, you can
have it, and you can have me. So we did
this incredible tour of Japan, the last tour that George
did with Eric Clapton and the same band. I was
there were are you really Tokyo don Mano or something? Yeah? Three? Maybe?
(22:22):
Okay right in there. Yeah, I was up in the nosebleeds.
I was there doing a gig with Weed to Coolidge
fantastic and somehow got tickets to come and see that,
and I was so excited, so exciting. Well, you know
what a great honor. I mean, George was the sweetest
cat in the world. You probably met him along the way,
and but he really was so down to earth. And
(22:44):
you know, going back to what you and I were
talking about earlier about the Beatles and them just wanting
to be the best band in London or in England
or whatever it was, George just wanted to be in
the band. You know, that was his whole thing is.
He never really wanted to be the front guy. But
of course when he did, all things must pass, all
(23:05):
that change. He made a place for himself as a
front man because it was such a great record and
his songs were so beautiful. So we finished the tour
with George. We had encouraged him and really wanted to
bring it to America. But for whatever reason, I don't
I don't think George liked touring that much, to be
honest with you, but so he said he didn't want
(23:25):
to do it. Eric said, well, I'm gonna continue, and
of course Greg filling Gaines was in the band. Uh,
so we had two keyboard players on the twenty four
Nights thing and on the Harrison tour, and Greg uh
decides he didn't want to tour that much anymore. He
wanted to come back to l A, be on records,
(23:46):
produce records, and so he resigned. Uh, you know, and
it was a very congenial situation, you know, there was
nobody was upset about it. He just needed a change.
So Eric comes to me and he says, so Greg's resigning,
We're gonna do this unplugged thing and I'm going to
continue to tour. Um, do you think we need another
(24:07):
keyboard player or would you like to have it all
to yourself? And I said, well, if it's all the
same to you, man, I wouldn't mind having it on
my own for a while. Good answer. I love that.
So Um. The next thing we did was the Unplugged record,
and I was kind of like a cold up spring
because you know, God bless Gregg. He's one of my
(24:27):
best friends in the world, and he's such an amazing
player and I've learned so much from him. But he
had most of the solos before this time, and so
it was like, Wow, I get to do the solosn't,
so we uh, we do the unplugged thing and it
goes very very well. And during the rehearsal segment, UM
we tried out a lot of songs and one of
(24:49):
that we tried out was old Love, you know, that
beautiful ballad and um. For whatever reasons, Eric decided he
didn't think it should be the show. Maybe one slow
song too many or something. I don't know. But we
do the hole set and it goes really great. We've
played everything. The crowd is still asking for more. Now.
(25:09):
I don't know why he turned to me, but he
kind of leaned over my way and said, you've got
any ideas? Man, is there anything else we could do?
I said, do oh love, very do love? And we
did and and uh, you know, I think it turned
out to be one of the best songs on the record.
Is an incredible and and tell me when you're not
on tour, I know that you've been doing, uh your gig.
(25:31):
On the side, the side of being a sideman is
um is tree farming, and I'd love to hear more
about that. Well, people ask me how in the world
did a rock and roll piano player get involved in
tree farming? Of all things, and it's all my wife's fault.
Of course, when we were first dating and decided to
get married, and she said, you have to come meet
(25:54):
my family, and she had not really told me anything
about her family at that time. It turns out that
they were all farmers for generation as cattle farmers, roe
crop farmers, forest tree all of the above. And as
I got to know the family, I began to realize
this deep seated passion love respect for the land that
(26:17):
they had as stewards of the land. Well in her
grandmother passes away and leaves rose Lane about a thousand
acres of land, and that responsibility fell on our shoulders,
very important family land. We knew we wanted to keep it,
didn't want to sell it. I'm not sure what to
do with it right. One day we're at the breakfast
(26:38):
table and rose Lane's brother said, you know, there's this
fifty acre field down here. We're usually planting corn or
cotton or swordbeans every year. If you're not gonna plant
a crop, you might consider planting trees there. And lightbulbs
sort of went off in my head and I started forestry.
You know, yeah, I could go out and tour. You
can look after the land. You can plant the trees
(26:59):
and manage them, but not have to be there all
the time to make it make sense. So there was
another connection. And I know you'll appreciate this as a musician.
Where does that thing that's given us so much joy
and a great career come from? It comes from wood
and so many other things I like to point out
(27:22):
to people. Will you know? It gives us materials to
make our books and magazines and newspapers and packaging projects. Uh,
materials to build our homes and schools and churches. UM.
It sequesters carbon, it filters our water. UH. It provides
home and shelter to all manner of wildlife. And it's,
in my opinion, the most important natural resource that we have,
(27:45):
that it gives us all these things. And so I
began to study forestry. And when I was touring with
the fabulous Thunderbirds for about a year, I took a
correspondence course, doing the work and the back of the
bus or in the hotel rooms whenever I could. It
took about a year to get through the course, and
I began to feel fairly confident about managing our own
(28:08):
forest land. And fortunately, through the years we've been able
to add to that acreage. Now we have about four
thousand acres, and um, it's just become as equally a
passion for me as music is. That's so beautiful. Plus,
I mean the planet is in need of obviously more forestation,
especially with the fires going on. Just a mind blowers.
(28:30):
So good on you for offering, uh, some more oxygen
and some more photosynthesis to the planet. So let's move
on really quickly to the stones here. When when was
your very first exposure to the rolling stones? How did
(28:51):
that develop and land you in this gig of a
lifetime that you find yourself in. Well, Um, most all
of us remember the late great Bill Graham And when
I was in the Almand Brothers band. Um, Bill loved
that band, and I think when I came in he
looked at it somewhat skeptically. What's a piano player doing
(29:12):
in a guitar band? But I want him over. We
became friends, uh after the Brothers broke up in seventy
six and we formed Sea Level. He was kind enough
to promote a lot of shows for Sea Level through
the years. Then there was a gap when I didn't
hear from him, and he became tour director in one
for the Stones, which was kind of a new position altogether.
(29:34):
He was he was running the whole shebang, and uh
he they wanted to try some different guys out on keyboard,
and he suggested me, God bless your soul, thank you Bill. So,
out of the blue, I get a call and here's
the story. So this is also right when Rose Lane
had inherited her land and um, I was se I
(30:00):
had broken up. I had a little trio. The phone
wasn't ringing for sessions. I was a little concerned about
the musical career. I go home one day, I say,
rose Line, you know, I'm never gonna quit music. I'm
always going to do it. But you know, the phone's
not ringing. I've got this little podunk trio not doing much,
and maybe I should just focus on this. And she
(30:20):
listened very patiently, and she said, well that's interesting. But
guess what the Rolling Stones called you today? Really absolutely
true man. So she I said, don't pull my chain now.
She said, no, I'm serious. Here's the number. Go there's
a telephone. Go call. I did, and later that day
(30:41):
I got a call from a woman that was, you know,
working with the band and I said, well, listen, I
don't know if it's true or not, but if they're
looking for me, here I am Ian Stewart. The next
day call me. Stew was of course a confidant of
the band and also a great piano player, and had
been with him since the beginning. And um, I actually
(31:01):
had a little club date with my trio that weekend
and I said, man, yeah, I want to come up.
Can I come up on Monday? I got a little
gig this weekend. He said, would really long to have
you that tomorrow. So I had to call the club
say listen, forgive me, but this is important. They well
you why later Yeah, they were cool with it, and
(31:21):
I was on a plane. They had just put out
tattoo you. So I did a cram course on that.
But Brian, and I'm sure if you'd have had to
call you would have felt the same way. It was like,
wait a minute, I know all these songs. I played
them when I was fourteen, you know, yeah, exactly. So
I kind of relaxed and said, well, I learned the
new stuff, but gosh, I know just about every other
(31:43):
Rolling Stone song there is. Yeah, and it's not page
you know, that's usual it's the Rolling Stones, and like
you say, we've been living and breathing it since we
were kids, so it should what a great story. It's
funny you know that, you say Bill Graham when he
became tour director. It was at that time that I
got a job opening for the Stones. At that same
(32:03):
time when Ian Stewart and Ian McLagan were both like,
he's right before you came in from seventy eight till
eighty one, eat uh some Girls through emotional Rescue, opening
a bunch of shows for the Stones with Adda James,
how about unforgettable period of my life? And I thought
at that time, you know, if this is it, you
(32:25):
know now that was I was twenty four. If that's
as good as it gets, I'm good. I'm out like
a dealer if the blackjack table claps his hands together
and walks away. But it continued to get good, you know,
not without its scary years here and there. But we've
had those. And so Chucky released six solo albums, if
(32:48):
I'm not mistaken, uh, including a brand new thrilling big
band album which I checked out this morning. I highly
recommend to all of your listeners out there, Why don't
you tell us a little bit about that. Well, I
had done a tour of Germany with a five piece band.
It was, you know, with me as the artist, and
(33:08):
a couple of these guys worked with the HR one
big band. HR one in Germany is very much like
public radio is to the U S. It's a little
different but similarities, and they maintain two um bands year round.
One is a full orchestra and one is this big
band that they now call the Frankfurt Radio Big Band.
(33:29):
So after I did this five piece tour and a
couple of these guys being connected to the big band,
I had an invitation to come back and play with
the big band to a concert. So I sent a
dozen MP three's over and they had three different arrangers.
Do these arrangements for these songs? The charts were just brilliant,
(33:51):
the voicings, the harmonies, Uh, the dynamics, yeah, wonderful dynamics,
great arrangements, really intr saying kind of out stuff going
on a little bit more harmonically out than you would
expect on a big band record. And then your your
lead singing and your great piano playing. It was really
thrilling and listen to that well, thank you. And briefly,
(34:14):
what we did was we did the live concert and
that's what the record is. But when we opened up
the files and listened, the isolation was so great and
I said to the engineer, my friend Jerry Hanson, I said, Jerry,
let's see if we can take the audience out of
this thing. And we did, really because I wanted it
to be focused more on the music and not the
(34:35):
distraction of applause and other sounds, and to make it
a tighter presentation. So that's what we did, and so
it's it is actually a live record, but you know,
with without the distraction, I'm blown away because it sounds
like Guess two the album. It sounds like a lot
of big band records were cut in a room with
real people playing together, and so the brightest horns are
(34:59):
placed in the back of the room because they're the loudest,
and the sacks is up close, the drums in the back.
It has that feel to it that I had no
idea there was a live audience that you've somehow obscured
in your recording. It's really great, really really cool, Chuck.
It's been said that tragedy plus time equals humor. Tell
us what is the most embarrassing thing that's ever happened
(35:20):
to you on stage? I don't even want to tell
this one. You gotta you gotta say it, all right.
I'm usually pretty good at focusing and and you know,
have a decent memory and and keep myself together generally.
I'm on stage with Eric. Uh. This is at the
point where I've got the keyboard duties all to myself
(35:41):
and we're touring behind the unplugged record. It's going great.
I can't tell you what city it was. I don't
want to remember. We come to Layla and we come
to the refrain at the ending, my mind completely blanked.
I didn't know where, what what. I'm looking out at
(36:05):
thirty thousand people waiting for me to play that part,
and I don't know what I played, but it was
very wrong. It was extremely wrong. And you know, afterwards,
oh my god, I was so embarrassed. And I went
straight up to Eric and I said, Eric, I'm sorry
(36:25):
about the jazz bit in Layla. And he was so gracious,
he said, what are you talking about? Man? You know,
he was like ignoring the fact that it happened, and
it happened in such a big way, I can't tell you.
Did you go to the front of house man and say,
what do I need to pay you to make sure
there are no recordings of this? I hope there's no
(36:46):
minutes of tape from God from Nixon's Watergate tape? Did
you just delete that part? But how did you get
through it? Like? Once you played the jazz? I mean,
what did you do after that? I mean, I'm sure
you turned white as a ghost and then probably as
red as a beat. What did you do for the
rest of the band? Save the day the band comes
in playing the property? Oh, yeah, that's it. And yeah,
(37:10):
I just wanted to talk a little bit about inspiration.
People look up to people like you and and I
who have been working so hard for such a long time.
Is there one piece of advice you'd give to an
artist who would like to be in your position one day?
You'd probably give the same answer, and that is, there's
(37:31):
no magic wand there's no magic wand man, it's um.
It's up to you to learn your instrument, to get
proficient at it, to continue to grow as a musician.
To listen. It's so important to listen, whether you're doing
a recording session or you're on stage with your brothers
and sisters making music. Um My dad loved old sayings
(37:55):
and one of one of the things was you make
your own luck. What does that mean? Well, I think
could large part it means learning how to be in
the right place at the right time, you know, keep
your eyes and ears open for opportunities. I used to
go stand outside the door of Muscle Shoals Sound. I
knew one of the engineers, and it was a very
small studio and I couldn't go in while they were recording,
(38:17):
but I could stay outside and when they had a break,
go inside and hope that I could make somebody and
sit down and play a little bit and try to
get noticed. So, you know, looking for those opportunities is
what I would think you would say is making your
own love. That's brilliant. I love that. So finally, Chuck,
this has been so great to talk to and catch
(38:38):
up on all things Chuck. Um, is there any music
that you've been checking out lately that you're fond of
that you would like to tell people about? St. Paul
and the Broken Bones? Love them, aren't they amazing? Yeah?
They friends with the guitar player and his wife and
their brilliant young kid. Yes, and uh Al the organ player,
(38:59):
the Hammond player as brilliant. And Paul the singer, Oh
my god. You know they're just such a great band.
I saw them open for you in Bufhalo. Yeah, there
you go, really on fire. Well, before we put it
to bed, I want to share Paul McCartney story with
because I don't know Paul that will. But when we
were doing the Desert Trip, which was what two years ago,
(39:20):
I guess, we were all staying here at the Four
Seasons and I kept running into Paul in the gym,
you know, and and it was there weren't too many
people in there, so you know, I had the a
moment I said I'm gonna go. I had met him once,
Wicks had introduced me at a party one time here
again at the Four Seasons. Well, anyway, I go up
(39:41):
to him just to say like, hey man, I'm a fan.
I love you, you know, and I know the guys
in the band. You've got a brilliant band. Love all
the cats, and uh looking forward to this Desert trip thing.
It's gonna be fun. And I'm the keyboard player with
the Stones. And he says, well, that's a good gig. An,
that's not not bad. I said, are you looking forward
(40:02):
to the thing? He said, yeah, yeah, I'm coming to
see your show. I said, well, that's fantastic. So we
worked up uh Come Together as a little tip to
the Beatles, and performed it. And paul was in a
suite watching the show. And for some reason, this is
the only time they've done this. The production had an
(40:22):
overhead camera on top of me, so you know, you
could see my moves from one keyboard to the other,
and it was featured a few times, which is kind
of fun. So the gig ends and uh, we find
ourselves in the gym again, you know. And by the way,
I told him about working with George and we had
a nice conversation about George. And so this is after
(40:43):
our show. We bump into each other and I said, well, Paula,
I hope you enjoyed our Oh it's great. Man really
loved it. Uh, And I said, well, we enjoyed doing
Come Together. Oh brilliant, man, brilliant. It was really sweet
casts to do that. And he said, and I really
dug the overhead cameras on you. I could see all
your mistakes like a good crap, brilliant, brilliant. You know,
(41:09):
you get to this point and people like Paul and
I would assume make and Keith just want to have
a good laugh. Yeah, they're going to get the work done,
but it's got to be fun for them. Absolutely. They've
been doing it for so long, they've already given so much.
They just want it to be fun. Yeah. We're lucky
guys in that way. And don't we love great one liners?
You know, I mean, Keith brilliant at it and and
(41:31):
uh but but Paul, such a great artist, and you've
had that seat for a long time. You do such
a brilliant job, and all the guys in the band.
So congratulations, Thank you so much. I appreciate that. Thank
you very much. It's been a blast, man, what a pleasure,
been a joy for me. Thank you, Brom. I'd like
(42:01):
to thank everyone for listening and take you to my
friend Chuck Lavell for giving us a peek into his
gig of a lifetime. In addition to being the keyboard
player musical director for The Rolling Stones, Chuck is also
an environmentalist and published author. Check out his store on
his website Chuck Lavell dot com On Tour is the
production of I Heart Radio and Black Barrel Media. This
(42:22):
show is produced by Mandy Wimmer with executive producer Noel
Brown and I'm Your host Brian Ray. For more information
about on Tour, visit our website black Barrel Media dot com.
For behind the scenes photos from these interviews and interact
with us. Visit our social media at ontour pod on Facebook, Instagram,
(42:43):
and Twitter. For more shows from My Heart Radio and
Black Barrel Media, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you get your favorite podcasts.
On tour as a production of I Heart Radio and
Black Barrel Media. I'm your host, Brian Ray. I've been
a musician for forty years. I started as a teenager
with Etta James and most recently with Paul McCartney for
nineteen years. On this show, we'll take you behind the
scenes of the music business to give you the most
raw and real tales you've likely never heard before. We'll
(00:34):
get into the highs and lows of the touring industry,
who these people were before they played on the biggest
stages in the world. And we'll share our wildest, most unbelievable,
and yes, most embarrassing moments while on tour. In this episode,
we're talking to Chuck Lavell. Although most of you know
Chuck as the master keyboard player and musical director for
The Rolling Stones, you've also heard his work on albums
(00:56):
with John Mayer, The Black Crows and many more. Chuck
and I discussed our biggest disappointments and greatest wins, including
his years with the Allman Brothers, his genuine moments with
Eric Clapton and George Harrison, voodoo magic with Dr John,
and we wrap up his musical journey with how he
got a thirty year gig with the greatest rock and
(01:16):
roll band in the world. As if his music journey
wasn't remarkable enough. Chuck is also an environmentalist and was
recently named National Tree Farmer of the Year. Be sure
to check out the film Chuck Lavell The Tree Man
that includes interviews with over eighty artists with a combined
fifty eight Grammy Awards. Here's my conversation with Chuck Lavell. Chuck,
(01:50):
welcome to my show, The Sidemen Gigs Go. You certainly
have one of the most prominent, longstanding for the past
thirty six years as a member of and musical director
for the Rolling Stones. I want to talk first about
how you got here and what led you to this
um And for me, rarely is there an overnight success
(02:11):
in this industry. The journey has often met with mixed
emotions and doubt along the way. But what started you
on this path? Well, you're right, it's a journey, isn't
it for all of us? Uh? You know, we're in
the same boat here and you're great work with Paul
And by the way, when we get down the road
a little piece and I got to tell you a
(02:31):
story when we were doing the desert trip a couple
of years back. But to answer your question, Um, I
learned the piano from my mom. I was a baby
of the family. Uh three children, my brother fourteen years
my older, my sister five years, my elder, and the
out working uh So oftentimes just me and mom in
the house. She was not a professional, not a teacher
(02:54):
or anything like that, but she played for family enjoyment.
And I just love to listen to her play, you know,
and tug on her skirt and say, Mamma, play me something,
watching her hands move up and down that keyboard, and
listening to the melodies and the harmonies. It just it
was great. And I'm sure there was also the mother
son connection. So she would get me up on the
(03:16):
stool and show me very simple things, you know, simple
try ads and a melody here and there. And sometimes
she'd go about her housework and leave me up there
to my own resources, and she'd say, well, Chuck, I
gotta go work, but you just make something up, play
whatever comes to your mind, and I'll be listening, you know,
(03:37):
I'll be checking you out. And so this went on
for a period of a couple of years, and one
of the things she did for me, Brian, it was
so helpful and that I still think a lot about today.
And she would say things well, and of course you
got to appreciate them six seven years old, you know.
But she'd say, well, Chuck, what would it sound like
if there was a big storm outside. Oh, I'd rumbled
(03:59):
down on the low unto the keyboard and do some
lightning strikes up on high. You know, what would it
What do you think it might sound like if you
hit a home run in your baseball team? Or what
what might not sound like if you were got mad
at your best friend or something. So music has always
been that, uh, not so much notes and chords as
(04:19):
it is feelings, emotions and painting pictures. Wow. What what
a wonderful tutelage, you know, to get that, especially in
the family. Uh, And to learn that music is an
expression of emotion more than it is a technical event.
How fortunate for you. My My first memories were, uh,
(04:42):
my mother playing classical music as a little kid and
played it all the time when I was a little kid,
and I picked up on that and later, like you did,
I had a relative who is a folk rocker who
turned me onto music at a very young age, and
my earliest memories were playing of saying piano it was
my first instrument. Was that I just wanted to teach
(05:03):
her to teach me boogie woogie. I didn't want to
learn this little cute stuff media. I'm six years old
and say, of course my hands were big enough to
play boogie will you? But that's what I wanted to do.
I know that you're from the South and you moved
around quite a bit in Alabama as a kid growing
up with the desire to be a musicians. It seems
(05:24):
like you were heading that way. What was that like
among your peers? Did they accept that or did they
think that this was a silly pipe dream or what
was that like for you? It was good for me.
Our first band was called the Misfits and we played
the y m c A every Friday night. We had
a steady gig, and you know, we were young, were
I guess, uh fourteen fifteen years old, and so it
(05:47):
was cool to have a band. And because we did
the y m c A gig, the kids would come
and they would dance on Friday night, you know, and
it was steady. We did it for probably a whole year.
And when the first television station came to Tuscaloosa, where
we were living at the time, they wanted to emulate
(06:09):
American Bandstand, so they cleverly called the show Tuscaloosa Bandstand
and they hired us to be the band. There was
a local DJ named Tiger Jack Garrett that was the
MC for the show, and he was pretty well known
DJ on radio. And so we put that together Friday
night at the y Saturday morning on the television show,
(06:33):
and it became an enterprise for us at a very
young age. So, uh, you know, and it was worked too,
as you well know, once you had that band and
you had to learn these songs to be fresh every
Friday night Saturday morning. Uh you know, you listened to
the radio all week. Mom would let us move the
furniture around and we would rehearse in our living room
(06:54):
and uh so it was work, it was fun work,
uh and it was an enterprise and that early age.
And did you have the feeling that you had to
be the best band in town to keep that gigg
and learn new songs every week? Yes? Absolutely, you know
there was pressure there because it was a band that
was older than us, called the Gents, and they were
really good, dude. They had you know, their musicianship was
(07:16):
tied and we admired them, but we were also like,
we gotta get that good, you know, we we we
gotta we gotta make sure we can you know, be
comfortable on the same stage with those guys. And and
interesting it is working. A lot of people think that
music is just fun. It is that we're lucky, but
(07:37):
it takes work, you know. I remember Paul once saying
that they just wanted to be the best band in
Liverpool so they could get out and travel around the world.
And it's such a simple thing, but it seems like
that's the same that was driving you in the Misfits
and up against the Gents. Absolutely, but also the same
you know, with the Stones, they wanted I think their
(07:59):
first goal was to be the best blues ban in
London and then in England, and then you know, then
they started writing songs and everything changed, but those early
goals it's so important. I'm sure you had the same
experience as a young musician. You know. It's uh, you
want to learn, Uh, you look for opportunities to learn
(08:21):
and look for opportunities to play with better musicians. You know,
once the Misfits broke up, that was my goal. Who
were the cool players in town? And how can I
get up with those guys? And uh? And that's what
I think both of our careers has centered around ever
since then. Right, absolutely. And I'm sure like most of us,
you realize that music can be an uncertain path. It
(08:44):
seems to me you can't have a long and storied
careers such as yours without hearing no when yes would
have felt so much better. What was the biggest or
most impactful no you ever received? Oh? Man, I guess
my biggest just appointment was that I got to audition
for James Taylor uh at a certain point in time.
(09:06):
And man, you know I wanted that gig really bad.
He's such a wonderful artist and a great, great guy. Uh.
And it came down to I, thank me and another guy,
and you know, the other guy got it, and James
was so gracious, you know, he called up and he said, man,
this is a tough decision. Thank you so much for
coming out. You know, I really appreciate it. And and
(09:27):
you know he lied and said you did will because
I didn't do well? Man, I I don't know what
it was. Maybe I was nervous. I usually don't get
nervous in those situations. But I did not really perform
that will at that audition, so I didn't really deserve
the gig, to be honest with you, But of course
it was a big disappointment to hear you know, we're
(09:47):
going with someone else about how old were you in
that happening? You know I would have been that's a
good question. Um, probably twenty seven somewhere. And have you
run into him sense now is the musical director for
the greatest rock and roll banding. No, I haven't, but
I still have a great admiration for him and all
(10:09):
the guys that worked with him. He's had some beautiful,
beautiful players through the years and his bands and on
his records. Yeah, my disappointing no story was that I
auditioned for Tina Turner right around the private dancer time
and I had like teased out blonde of course hair
and big old shoulder pads. I look like MTV. Why
(10:31):
was anyway I walk in there and plug in and
it's going, okay, I'm not feeling that ton of you know,
synergy going on yet The other guitar player. James was
very nice, but right in front of me saying, and
Tina was not there, It's just the band. Right in
front of me on a couch was that big, sort
(10:52):
of shiny guy with the long hair that played saxophone.
Was a muscle guy. Do you remember that guy that
was in the videos? And I it would be more
opposite that guy. And I just remember him looking at
me and like looking kind of up from down like
you could tell this what'sn't going? Well, this might not
work right, not work, but hey man, you gotta you
(11:15):
gotta get through some nose to get to the yes,
don't you know. Let's talk about your experience with the
bands before you got into the Rolling Stone. Well, it
was just one thing leads to another, bron and I'm
sure that's happened with you and your career as will.
(11:37):
But from Sundown, that connection got me to Alex Tyler.
Alex had done a couple of records on Capricorn, and
we became his touring band as well as doing his
second album. That led to a lot of session work.
Bonnie Brandlet Um, Oh my goodness. Uh. Tim Weissberg, Uh.
(12:03):
Johnny Sandlin was a producer that favored me and we
became very good friends, and Johnny would use me on
a lot of the records that he was producing. And
eventually it was Greg Almond's first solo album, Laid Back Uh,
and Dwayne had died you know the history there, tragic
motorcycle accident in nine and the band had some obligations
(12:29):
that had to go out as a five piece without
a replacement, and anyway, you don't replace Dwayne Alman period.
So but that puts so much pressure as I'm sure
you can you can appreciate on Dicky Betts because Dicky
was not the slide player that Dwayne was. But he
had to step up to the plate and he did.
But the band came off this little short run after
(12:51):
Dwyane's death as a five piece band, physically exhausted, mentally exhausted,
and they took a break and Gregg wanted to do
this solo record and that's when I got to call.
That led to jam sessions after hours as we were
recording U and so all the Almond brothers would come down,
even though we had a different set of musicians recording
(13:13):
Gregg's record, and so h it was pretty much pick
a key and go, you know, and anything can happen,
and things started happening. Uh. And they had no design
to go get a keyboard player in the Almond Brothers band,
but by osmosis, that's what happened. And so after these
(13:36):
jam sessions, about three weeks or so, I get a
call from the manager of the band that also on
the label, Phil Walden. Phil would like to see in
your office. I thought, what have I done wrong? Yeah?
Here he comes. I go in there and there's all
the guys in the band. Some pleasantries go down, the
shoe drops. The guys feel like this is an interesting direction.
(13:56):
Would you like to join the Almond Brothers band. I
was barely tw t, so we know the answer to
the question. Yes, please please? When do I start? Exactly? Amazing?
It sounded like it sounds like you had already started
with the jams. There was a new direction coming. Yeah. Absolutely,
And uh, you know, Capricorn had a lot of interaction
(14:19):
between the artists anyway, Marshall Tucker band was on Capricorn.
Allman Brothers band. Dickie did a solo record that I
worked on during those years. Um and of course Gregg
laid back record and then the first record I did
with the Almonds was Brothers and Sisters and that had
rambling Man and Jessica and Come and Go Blues and
(14:40):
those songs on that record, Huge album, huge album. All
your work had paid off, right then, that's amazing. Well,
tell me if you have any great stories of your
time working with Dr John. Oh, mag it was such
a trip. Uh and God rested. So you know Mac
Rebanack as you know was it was his real name,
(15:03):
and uh, all right, so here's a story for you.
As we were auditioning, because what had happened was I
was working with Alex Taylor with a set of musicians.
Alex had a falling out with the manager, decided not
to tour anymore. We were a band without an artist.
And Phil had just signed Dr John to a management contract.
So he said he had finished recording uh in the
(15:26):
right Place LP and was going to go out and
tour and needed a band. So Phil said, why don't
you guys audition for for Mac? Okay, so we go
and Uh, the first couple of days did not go
so well. We were trying to get that New Orleans
field that Mac was looking for, and Mac would say, man,
you guess y'all ain't got that second line thing. Man,
(15:48):
y'all got to can do some study and get get right,
you know. So we were listening to records and this
goes on for about three days, and I really wanted
this gig. I really wanted this gig, right, So I thought, well,
I gotta go spend a little face time with him,
you know. So I go. He was staying at the
holiday inn. I go knock on the door and oh,
little Chucky, Oh man, come on, it's good to see you. Man, Yeah,
(16:11):
come on in here. Now. You have to appreciate Mac
at the time was on the methodone program. I've heard
about that, and he was also, unbeknownst to us, he
was copying on the streets still see, and so I
didn't know anything about that, right with with Mac double dipping,
yeah exactly. So we're together in his hotel room and
(16:36):
he's really, you know, very gracious, and we talked a
little bit and then he said, hey, Chucky, I just
stay here cool man. I'll be back in and just
to us short. And he goes to the bathroom and
he's gone for like half an hour. Okay, so we
know what that's all. And I'm you know, I'm looking
around and waiting. I'm waiting, and so curiosity gets the
(16:56):
best of me, and I look over at the table
and there's there's a book like a journal kind of
looking thing, and you know, I'm looking at the bathroom
door and I'm I'm looking around. Nobody's in there, and
so I couldn't help myself. I flipped the cover of
the book and a page or two and then I
see all of the names of us, of the band members,
(17:18):
and by our names were these weird voodoo symbols And
what was going on? I have no idea, but there
was some spirit happening, you know, some spirits floating around.
And the bottom line is we got the gig, and uh,
we had a great little run. I learned so much
from Mac, you know, he was really nice to me.
(17:40):
And when I joined the Almond Brothers, Mac was opening
up some of those shows and so Mac stayed around.
This was one of my first shows with the Alman Brothers.
He had opened up. Afterwards, Uh, he said, oh, Chucky,
you gotta come to my room. Man. Let's hang out
a little bit, go lose room. And so we talk
(18:02):
and he's very generous and giving me some nice compliments
and the night is about to end. And I said, well,
Matt God, I love you so much, man, thank you,
thanks for staying and you know, watching me, and thanks
for all you've taught me. And I just love you
so much. And you know, I hope our paths will
keep crossing. And he said, well, wait a minute for
you go, man, let me get you a little something.
He goes over to the corner of his room and
(18:23):
he gets an envelope and he's got his back to me,
and he's putting some things in the envelope and he
seals it up and he comes over to me and
he said, Chucky, here's some very special things in here.
And you don't need to need to even look at it, man,
I mean you don't. I don't want you to have
and nobody see what it is, but you try to
keep it around you as much as you can, and
(18:46):
I think it might bring you some good luck. And
I still have that. I put it in a leather
bag and there's just some very special, very special juju
in that leather bag. And I'll tell you what. I
don't know whether it's due to that or not, but
I've I've had a nice career that I'm very grateful for.
So thank you. Mat. Wow, that's a great story. Well, Mac,
(19:06):
thank you. It sounds like him working out that little
notebook journal with all of your names and the symbols
by It was his way of sort of bringing you
guys to his comfort, to his world. Yeah, you thought,
oh no, he's got voodoo on us, but instead you
got the gig. But it was good voodoo. Isn't that
(19:27):
something else? I mean, I know you've done uh you
did a huge record with John Mayre Born and Raided,
which is a number one album. But I'd love to
also ask you about similarly, do you have any stories
about your time with Eric Clapton. Well, um, first of all,
Eric was a special guest on the Steel Wheels tour
in nine right, that's right, And fortunately for me, they
(19:50):
set him up physically right next to me on stage
and we were doing a little Red Rooster, you know,
great blue song, and we had a nice musical conversation
back in fourth you know, and I mean, he's Eric Clapton,
didn't he? And so the tour ends and I go
home and this is back before the digital days, and
I had a cassette answering machine and there's Eric's voice
(20:13):
on it saying, this is Eric Clapton calling from Hong
Kong for Chuck Lavell to see if he might be
interested in doing some shows at the Royal Albert Hall. Yes,
I would thank you very much. That's another big yes.
So um, you know, we we go over there. And
this was the twenty four Nights record, the live record
that he did twenty four nights at the Albert Hall,
(20:34):
divided by six different sets. You know. He had a
quartet which I was not a part of. That was
Greg filling Games and Steve Ferroni and h and Nathan East.
But then there was six nights of a regular I
think it was a seven piece band that I was
a part of, six Nights with Blues that I was
a part of, and six nights of orchestra that I
was a part of. So that was the first experience
(20:57):
with with Eric. Uh then this horrible tragedy happens with
his son, you know, because he was going to take
a year off after that and spend time with Connor,
his son. And it was a matter of weeks, maybe
a month after the twenty four Nights thing, that Connor
(21:20):
had the terrible accident falling out of the building in
New York City and was killed. Uh. And so the
manager called me up and he said, you know, we're
not going to take a year off. Eric needs to work,
He needs to try to get his mind off this
tragedy and and just continue to work. Uh. So the
next thing that happened was the tour with George Harrison.
(21:40):
And you know the relationship that George and Eric had,
very famous relationship, and uh, Eric pretty much challenged George
to tour. You know, he said, hey, man, you're never
get in the trenches with the rest of us. You
do a record about every five years or so, but
you hadn't been touring, you know, come on, come on,
he said, But it don't have a band deliver that.
(22:02):
And Eric says, well, I got a band, you can
have it, and you can have me. So we did
this incredible tour of Japan, the last tour that George
did with Eric Clapton and the same band. I was
there were are you really Tokyo don Mano or something? Yeah? Three? Maybe?
(22:22):
Okay right in there. Yeah, I was up in the nosebleeds.
I was there doing a gig with Weed to Coolidge
fantastic and somehow got tickets to come and see that,
and I was so excited, so exciting. Well, you know
what a great honor. I mean, George was the sweetest
cat in the world. You probably met him along the way,
and but he really was so down to earth. And
(22:44):
you know, going back to what you and I were
talking about earlier about the Beatles and them just wanting
to be the best band in London or in England
or whatever it was, George just wanted to be in
the band. You know, that was his whole thing is.
He never really wanted to be the front guy. But
of course when he did, all things must pass, all
(23:05):
that change. He made a place for himself as a
front man because it was such a great record and
his songs were so beautiful. So we finished the tour
with George. We had encouraged him and really wanted to
bring it to America. But for whatever reason, I don't
I don't think George liked touring that much, to be
honest with you, but so he said he didn't want
(23:25):
to do it. Eric said, well, I'm gonna continue, and
of course Greg filling Gaines was in the band. Uh,
so we had two keyboard players on the twenty four
Nights thing and on the Harrison tour, and Greg uh
decides he didn't want to tour that much anymore. He
wanted to come back to l A, be on records,
(23:46):
produce records, and so he resigned. Uh, you know, and
it was a very congenial situation, you know, there was
nobody was upset about it. He just needed a change.
So Eric comes to me and he says, so Greg's resigning,
We're gonna do this unplugged thing and I'm going to
continue to tour. Um, do you think we need another
(24:07):
keyboard player or would you like to have it all
to yourself? And I said, well, if it's all the
same to you, man, I wouldn't mind having it on
my own for a while. Good answer. I love that.
So Um. The next thing we did was the Unplugged record,
and I was kind of like a cold up spring
because you know, God bless Gregg. He's one of my
(24:27):
best friends in the world, and he's such an amazing
player and I've learned so much from him. But he
had most of the solos before this time, and so
it was like, Wow, I get to do the solosn't,
so we uh, we do the unplugged thing and it
goes very very well. And during the rehearsal segment, UM
we tried out a lot of songs and one of
(24:49):
that we tried out was old Love, you know, that
beautiful ballad and um. For whatever reasons, Eric decided he
didn't think it should be the show. Maybe one slow
song too many or something. I don't know. But we
do the hole set and it goes really great. We've
played everything. The crowd is still asking for more. Now.
(25:09):
I don't know why he turned to me, but he
kind of leaned over my way and said, you've got
any ideas? Man, is there anything else we could do?
I said, do oh love, very do love? And we
did and and uh, you know, I think it turned
out to be one of the best songs on the record.
Is an incredible and and tell me when you're not
on tour, I know that you've been doing, uh your gig.
(25:31):
On the side, the side of being a sideman is
um is tree farming, and I'd love to hear more
about that. Well, people ask me how in the world
did a rock and roll piano player get involved in
tree farming? Of all things, and it's all my wife's fault.
Of course, when we were first dating and decided to
get married, and she said, you have to come meet
(25:54):
my family, and she had not really told me anything
about her family at that time. It turns out that
they were all farmers for generation as cattle farmers, roe
crop farmers, forest tree all of the above. And as
I got to know the family, I began to realize
this deep seated passion love respect for the land that
(26:17):
they had as stewards of the land. Well in her
grandmother passes away and leaves rose Lane about a thousand
acres of land, and that responsibility fell on our shoulders,
very important family land. We knew we wanted to keep it,
didn't want to sell it. I'm not sure what to
do with it right. One day we're at the breakfast
(26:38):
table and rose Lane's brother said, you know, there's this
fifty acre field down here. We're usually planting corn or
cotton or swordbeans every year. If you're not gonna plant
a crop, you might consider planting trees there. And lightbulbs
sort of went off in my head and I started forestry.
You know, yeah, I could go out and tour. You
can look after the land. You can plant the trees
(26:59):
and manage them, but not have to be there all
the time to make it make sense. So there was
another connection. And I know you'll appreciate this as a musician.
Where does that thing that's given us so much joy
and a great career come from? It comes from wood
and so many other things I like to point out
(27:22):
to people. Will you know? It gives us materials to
make our books and magazines and newspapers and packaging projects. Uh,
materials to build our homes and schools and churches. UM.
It sequesters carbon, it filters our water. UH. It provides
home and shelter to all manner of wildlife. And it's,
in my opinion, the most important natural resource that we have,
(27:45):
that it gives us all these things. And so I
began to study forestry. And when I was touring with
the fabulous Thunderbirds for about a year, I took a
correspondence course, doing the work and the back of the
bus or in the hotel rooms whenever I could. It
took about a year to get through the course, and
I began to feel fairly confident about managing our own
(28:08):
forest land. And fortunately, through the years we've been able
to add to that acreage. Now we have about four
thousand acres, and um, it's just become as equally a
passion for me as music is. That's so beautiful. Plus,
I mean the planet is in need of obviously more forestation,
especially with the fires going on. Just a mind blowers.
(28:30):
So good on you for offering, uh, some more oxygen
and some more photosynthesis to the planet. So let's move
on really quickly to the stones here. When when was
your very first exposure to the rolling stones? How did
(28:51):
that develop and land you in this gig of a
lifetime that you find yourself in. Well, Um, most all
of us remember the late great Bill Graham And when
I was in the Almand Brothers band. Um, Bill loved
that band, and I think when I came in he
looked at it somewhat skeptically. What's a piano player doing
(29:12):
in a guitar band? But I want him over. We
became friends, uh after the Brothers broke up in seventy
six and we formed Sea Level. He was kind enough
to promote a lot of shows for Sea Level through
the years. Then there was a gap when I didn't
hear from him, and he became tour director in one
for the Stones, which was kind of a new position altogether.
(29:34):
He was he was running the whole shebang, and uh
he they wanted to try some different guys out on keyboard,
and he suggested me, God bless your soul, thank you Bill. So,
out of the blue, I get a call and here's
the story. So this is also right when Rose Lane
had inherited her land and um, I was se I
(30:00):
had broken up. I had a little trio. The phone
wasn't ringing for sessions. I was a little concerned about
the musical career. I go home one day, I say,
rose Line, you know, I'm never gonna quit music. I'm
always going to do it. But you know, the phone's
not ringing. I've got this little podunk trio not doing much,
and maybe I should just focus on this. And she
(30:20):
listened very patiently, and she said, well that's interesting. But
guess what the Rolling Stones called you today? Really absolutely
true man. So she I said, don't pull my chain now.
She said, no, I'm serious. Here's the number. Go there's
a telephone. Go call. I did, and later that day
(30:41):
I got a call from a woman that was, you know,
working with the band and I said, well, listen, I
don't know if it's true or not, but if they're
looking for me, here I am Ian Stewart. The next
day call me. Stew was of course a confidant of
the band and also a great piano player, and had
been with him since the beginning. And um, I actually
(31:01):
had a little club date with my trio that weekend
and I said, man, yeah, I want to come up.
Can I come up on Monday? I got a little
gig this weekend. He said, would really long to have
you that tomorrow. So I had to call the club
say listen, forgive me, but this is important. They well
you why later Yeah, they were cool with it, and
(31:21):
I was on a plane. They had just put out
tattoo you. So I did a cram course on that.
But Brian, and I'm sure if you'd have had to
call you would have felt the same way. It was like,
wait a minute, I know all these songs. I played
them when I was fourteen, you know, yeah, exactly. So
I kind of relaxed and said, well, I learned the
new stuff, but gosh, I know just about every other
(31:43):
Rolling Stone song there is. Yeah, and it's not page
you know, that's usual it's the Rolling Stones, and like
you say, we've been living and breathing it since we
were kids, so it should what a great story. It's
funny you know that, you say Bill Graham when he
became tour director. It was at that time that I
got a job opening for the Stones. At that same
(32:03):
time when Ian Stewart and Ian McLagan were both like,
he's right before you came in from seventy eight till
eighty one, eat uh some Girls through emotional Rescue, opening
a bunch of shows for the Stones with Adda James,
how about unforgettable period of my life? And I thought
at that time, you know, if this is it, you
(32:25):
know now that was I was twenty four. If that's
as good as it gets, I'm good. I'm out like
a dealer if the blackjack table claps his hands together
and walks away. But it continued to get good, you know,
not without its scary years here and there. But we've
had those. And so Chucky released six solo albums, if
(32:48):
I'm not mistaken, uh, including a brand new thrilling big
band album which I checked out this morning. I highly
recommend to all of your listeners out there, Why don't
you tell us a little bit about that. Well, I
had done a tour of Germany with a five piece band.
It was, you know, with me as the artist, and
(33:08):
a couple of these guys worked with the HR one
big band. HR one in Germany is very much like
public radio is to the U S. It's a little
different but similarities, and they maintain two um bands year round.
One is a full orchestra and one is this big
band that they now call the Frankfurt Radio Big Band.
(33:29):
So after I did this five piece tour and a
couple of these guys being connected to the big band,
I had an invitation to come back and play with
the big band to a concert. So I sent a
dozen MP three's over and they had three different arrangers.
Do these arrangements for these songs? The charts were just brilliant,
(33:51):
the voicings, the harmonies, Uh, the dynamics, yeah, wonderful dynamics,
great arrangements, really intr saying kind of out stuff going
on a little bit more harmonically out than you would
expect on a big band record. And then your your
lead singing and your great piano playing. It was really
thrilling and listen to that well, thank you. And briefly,
(34:14):
what we did was we did the live concert and
that's what the record is. But when we opened up
the files and listened, the isolation was so great and
I said to the engineer, my friend Jerry Hanson, I said, Jerry,
let's see if we can take the audience out of
this thing. And we did, really because I wanted it
to be focused more on the music and not the
(34:35):
distraction of applause and other sounds, and to make it
a tighter presentation. So that's what we did, and so
it's it is actually a live record, but you know,
with without the distraction, I'm blown away because it sounds
like Guess two the album. It sounds like a lot
of big band records were cut in a room with
real people playing together, and so the brightest horns are
(34:59):
placed in the back of the room because they're the loudest,
and the sacks is up close, the drums in the back.
It has that feel to it that I had no
idea there was a live audience that you've somehow obscured
in your recording. It's really great, really really cool, Chuck.
It's been said that tragedy plus time equals humor. Tell
us what is the most embarrassing thing that's ever happened
(35:20):
to you on stage? I don't even want to tell
this one. You gotta you gotta say it, all right.
I'm usually pretty good at focusing and and you know,
have a decent memory and and keep myself together generally.
I'm on stage with Eric. Uh. This is at the
point where I've got the keyboard duties all to myself
(35:41):
and we're touring behind the unplugged record. It's going great.
I can't tell you what city it was. I don't
want to remember. We come to Layla and we come
to the refrain at the ending, my mind completely blanked.
I didn't know where, what what. I'm looking out at
(36:05):
thirty thousand people waiting for me to play that part,
and I don't know what I played, but it was
very wrong. It was extremely wrong. And you know, afterwards,
oh my god, I was so embarrassed. And I went
straight up to Eric and I said, Eric, I'm sorry
(36:25):
about the jazz bit in Layla. And he was so gracious,
he said, what are you talking about? Man? You know,
he was like ignoring the fact that it happened, and
it happened in such a big way, I can't tell you.
Did you go to the front of house man and say,
what do I need to pay you to make sure
there are no recordings of this? I hope there's no
(36:46):
minutes of tape from God from Nixon's Watergate tape? Did
you just delete that part? But how did you get
through it? Like? Once you played the jazz? I mean,
what did you do after that? I mean, I'm sure
you turned white as a ghost and then probably as
red as a beat. What did you do for the
rest of the band? Save the day the band comes
in playing the property? Oh, yeah, that's it. And yeah,
(37:10):
I just wanted to talk a little bit about inspiration.
People look up to people like you and and I
who have been working so hard for such a long time.
Is there one piece of advice you'd give to an
artist who would like to be in your position one day?
You'd probably give the same answer, and that is, there's
(37:31):
no magic wand there's no magic wand man, it's um.
It's up to you to learn your instrument, to get
proficient at it, to continue to grow as a musician.
To listen. It's so important to listen, whether you're doing
a recording session or you're on stage with your brothers
and sisters making music. Um My dad loved old sayings
(37:55):
and one of one of the things was you make
your own luck. What does that mean? Well, I think
could large part it means learning how to be in
the right place at the right time, you know, keep
your eyes and ears open for opportunities. I used to
go stand outside the door of Muscle Shoals Sound. I
knew one of the engineers, and it was a very
small studio and I couldn't go in while they were recording,
(38:17):
but I could stay outside and when they had a break,
go inside and hope that I could make somebody and
sit down and play a little bit and try to
get noticed. So, you know, looking for those opportunities is
what I would think you would say is making your
own love. That's brilliant. I love that. So finally, Chuck,
this has been so great to talk to and catch
(38:38):
up on all things Chuck. Um, is there any music
that you've been checking out lately that you're fond of
that you would like to tell people about? St. Paul
and the Broken Bones? Love them, aren't they amazing? Yeah?
They friends with the guitar player and his wife and
their brilliant young kid. Yes, and uh Al the organ player,
(38:59):
the Hammond player as brilliant. And Paul the singer, Oh
my god. You know they're just such a great band.
I saw them open for you in Bufhalo. Yeah, there
you go, really on fire. Well, before we put it
to bed, I want to share Paul McCartney story with
because I don't know Paul that will. But when we
were doing the Desert Trip, which was what two years ago,
(39:20):
I guess, we were all staying here at the Four
Seasons and I kept running into Paul in the gym,
you know, and and it was there weren't too many
people in there, so you know, I had the a
moment I said I'm gonna go. I had met him once,
Wicks had introduced me at a party one time here
again at the Four Seasons. Well, anyway, I go up
(39:41):
to him just to say like, hey man, I'm a fan.
I love you, you know, and I know the guys
in the band. You've got a brilliant band. Love all
the cats, and uh looking forward to this Desert trip thing.
It's gonna be fun. And I'm the keyboard player with
the Stones. And he says, well, that's a good gig. An,
that's not not bad. I said, are you looking forward
(40:02):
to the thing? He said, yeah, yeah, I'm coming to
see your show. I said, well, that's fantastic. So we
worked up uh Come Together as a little tip to
the Beatles, and performed it. And paul was in a
suite watching the show. And for some reason, this is
the only time they've done this. The production had an
(40:22):
overhead camera on top of me, so you know, you
could see my moves from one keyboard to the other,
and it was featured a few times, which is kind
of fun. So the gig ends and uh, we find
ourselves in the gym again, you know. And by the way,
I told him about working with George and we had
a nice conversation about George. And so this is after
(40:43):
our show. We bump into each other and I said, well, Paula,
I hope you enjoyed our Oh it's great. Man really
loved it. Uh, And I said, well, we enjoyed doing
Come Together. Oh brilliant, man, brilliant. It was really sweet
casts to do that. And he said, and I really
dug the overhead cameras on you. I could see all
your mistakes like a good crap, brilliant, brilliant. You know,
(41:09):
you get to this point and people like Paul and
I would assume make and Keith just want to have
a good laugh. Yeah, they're going to get the work done,
but it's got to be fun for them. Absolutely. They've
been doing it for so long, they've already given so much.
They just want it to be fun. Yeah. We're lucky
guys in that way. And don't we love great one liners?
You know, I mean, Keith brilliant at it and and
(41:31):
uh but but Paul, such a great artist, and you've
had that seat for a long time. You do such
a brilliant job, and all the guys in the band.
So congratulations, Thank you so much. I appreciate that. Thank
you very much. It's been a blast, man, what a pleasure,
been a joy for me. Thank you, Brom. I'd like
(42:01):
to thank everyone for listening and take you to my
friend Chuck Lavell for giving us a peek into his
gig of a lifetime. In addition to being the keyboard
player musical director for The Rolling Stones, Chuck is also
an environmentalist and published author. Check out his store on
his website Chuck Lavell dot com On Tour is the
production of I Heart Radio and Black Barrel Media. This
(42:22):
show is produced by Mandy Wimmer with executive producer Noel
Brown and I'm Your host Brian Ray. For more information
about on Tour, visit our website black Barrel Media dot com.
For behind the scenes photos from these interviews and interact
with us. Visit our social media at ontour pod on Facebook, Instagram,
(42:43):
and Twitter. For more shows from My Heart Radio and
Black Barrel Media, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you get your favorite podcasts.
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