March 24, 2025 • 38 mins
On this episode of Our American Stories, Dr. Dennis Sempebwa shares how his faith propelled him from war-torn Uganda to America—and beyond.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:10):
This is Lee Habib and this is our American stories.
And we tell stories about everything here on this show.
But our favorite subject, well, it's redemption stories. Stories of
faith and hope and love and my goodness, that's the
story of so many Americans, and faith, by the way,
being a fundamental part of a large majority of the
(00:31):
people of this country. And that's why we tell those stories.
And up next the story of doctor Dennis Simpebwe. Dennis,
you were born on April twentieth, nineteen sixty seven, in
a small town in the African nation of Uganda.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Tell us about it, Yo, Ganda, Eastern Africa. Winston Churchill
called it the pearl of Africa, perfect whether they say,
and happy people, but in the midst of that anarchy
because we had idiomine if you remember the famous dy
I mean, so life was tough. I remember earliest memory.
I'm clutching my baby sister's hand. We have to go
to school and there's a dead body in the pathway,
(01:09):
but we're too young to jump over the body. And
so I remember the big debate should I go home?
If I go home, get into trouble, but I can't really,
So I remember getting to tell Sylvia. Sylvia, closed your
eyes as we get through the body, and then we
counted one to three and jumped over. And then it
goes back from then. The army wasn't paid, so at
(01:30):
night they would come to our villages and loot and steal,
raping as young as three years old. In fact, at
one point my village almost told the girls were pregnant
by soldiers. And so that's life for me, and not
enough food. I didn't have shoes till I was six.
We'd climb mango trees for lunch, guava trees for late
(01:50):
for breakfast. It was just tough, tough.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
How did Daman come to power? How does this happen
in a country?
Speaker 2 (01:58):
Ida mean?
Speaker 1 (01:59):
Was?
Speaker 2 (02:00):
It's almost like the same story repeated. You look at
Saddam and some of the some of these other big guys.
He was, it was a it was a favorite of
the British. In fact, it was a colonel in the
British army. So so he comes on. He was a
hero at first, but but he turns, he turns on us,
and and he gets greedy and starts to then tribalism.
(02:23):
Then it's it's the same old story of Africa when
the power. It's it's a power issue, and and and
so he begins to to get nervous when there's a listen,
there's a power struggle between him and the West, and
like like Gaddafi, you know, it sounds like because he's
he's very he's he's too independent, he won't be a puppet.
(02:44):
But with that comes the subjugation. And his didn't go
to school, so he thinks money can be printed. Then
he's irritated by the Asians, the Indians, because they're they're
running everything. So one day he decides, you know what,
no more Indians will want the Uganda to be run
by Ugandans. And he and he just exists three days.
He expels all Indians in for seventy two hours to
(03:06):
leave the country and he literally takes Uganans and gives them.
I mean, I remember this picture. I was young. I
remember seeing him on TV walking down the main street.
We had one main street in Kampala, and it was
literally giving shops that you that belonged to Asians has
given them to You take that one, you take, the
shoe shop, you take. And and of course what happened
(03:26):
is hear these Africans who are now running things, but
they were not trained to run. So of course everything plummets, turmoil, inflation,
and so poverty sets in. And what used to be
the pearl of Africa, Uganda was the bread basket of
his Eastern East African cradle before before then the best
(03:46):
hospital was in Kampala, now idiomen. Initially as he as
he got nervous, he wanted to squelch rebellion. Of course
it became heavier handed. Then he decided to pivot to
the Arab world, and so he won to turn Uganda
into a Muslim nation with Sharia law. So it was
illegal to wear mini skirts and it was illegal. One
(04:07):
day he woke up, he said, I don't want to
see slippers, sandals, slippers, I don't want to see people's feet.
And people were actually literally arrested for for wearing slippers
and sandals in town in Kampala, they'd arrest you. So
it was chaotic, chaotic, but so and then it can
of course then makes it comes after church, after church.
(04:29):
Then he had to see he didn't like any of
the independent religions expressions of religion where Friday became a
public holiday. So Friday was a public holiday for the
Muslims Sunday was a public holiday for the so we
had like four days of work, you know. And of
course all of this is his plummet in the economy.
If things are getting worse and worse and worse, and
(04:50):
so persecution, then he began to outlaw all all independent
religions or expressions of faith. And so thus began the
person cution, and the archbishop was arrested and killed and
so so that was life under idi Amin until he
was ousted. And then what happened is all the then
(05:11):
the tribalism, and now those factions of military soldiers, and
then the anarchyst said in just like some of these
other places like Gaddafi and Libya and Iraq, that's what
happened in Uganda. So we have factions all over, anarchy,
rule of law, nothing, nothing, The army wasn't paid and
(05:32):
they'd come every night to rape and steal and kill,
and it was it was disaster.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
So talk about your parents and what role did they play.
Talk about that.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Mine was tragic. My dad was their provider. But he
had other women. In fact, they were more like concubines,
more open. We knew them, we knew them. In fact,
one of them was my what had been my mother's
best friend who lived next door. So Daddy would come
(06:05):
back home and we would see him go to the
neighbors and I remember seeing mommy, you know, just dealing
with wow wow and so and so that was confusing
for me as a boy. And he'd come up drunk
at night at eleven PM, usually beating mommy and and
but then every time I came out, I was the
first born. Every time I came out to their little
(06:28):
room as this beating her, he would stop. So that
that caused me to think, oh, oh, I can help you.
I can help mommy. And and over the next few months,
every time I'd make sure to be awake, don't go
to sleep, because you need to rescue mommy. And she
didn't know until recently that I barely slept because whenever
(06:52):
they went to their room. In my little brain, my
little seven year old brain, I was thinking, what if
he beats her and kills her? So I'll sit right
at their door, oh night, And it made me rescue it.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
And when we come back, more of this remarkable life
story and how he ends up coming here to the
United States and doing remarkable things with his life. More
of the life story of doctor Dennis Simpebwe here on
our American Stories.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
Folks.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
If you love the great American stories we tell and
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Go to our American Stories dot com now and go
(07:50):
to the donate button and help us keep the great
American stories coming. That's our American Stories dot Com. And
we continue with our American Stories in the life of
(08:11):
doctor Dennisimpebwe. We just heard why seven year old Dennis
wouldn't sleep at night, knowing that he was the only
person around who could rescue his mom from being abused
by his alcoholic father. Dennis tell us the effects your
family environment have on you.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
I'm getting depressed. I'm learning about my history. I'm learning
that no Sempebwa that's my last name, had lived beyond
age forty. They were all womanizes and alcoholcolics, and they
had died young and so but I strolled into an event.
You know, one time Mommy said, there's a crusade. This
guy was coming from Nigeria and he was going to
talk about crusade God. And so mom mom took me
(08:55):
to this crusade, a big open air event, and this
guy was talking about peace. He said, God can give
you peace, and in my brain I was thinking, yeah,
but how? And then it was as as it's as
though this man could hear me because all the questions
I asked, he would scream out, don't you wonder how
you don't need us? So I'm like, well, but I
(09:16):
have to how is he gonna do? You want to
know how I was gonna do it. I'm like, I'm
thinking you can read my mind? What's kind on? But
but you know, then eventually said, if you want this peace,
come and I was the first time, Mommy, let's go.
I want I want peace. I want peace, And and
we prayed a prayer. And as I was going home
that night because it was five o'clock and five o'clock
(09:37):
was scary for me because the sun was gonna set
and and was that the night I would see my
sisters raped, my mother raped? Was I going to die?
Was I going to spend the night outside because sometimes
we didn't. It was too dangerous to sleep in the house,
so we'd run around all night well during these military raids,
looking for places to hide. But this particular night, January twelfth,
(09:58):
nineteen eighty, there was peace and I was thinking, ooh,
I'm not scared. I got home. My sister asks me, Denis,
what are you happy? What are you giddy about? I said,
I don't know. I just I think God's given me peace.
And she looked at me, rolled her eyes and says,
go to sleep, you're tired. Next morning, I woke up
and pining, I still have peace. I still have peace, said,
(10:18):
And I couldn't wait to go to school. Now, mornings
were terrible in class because every empty seat meant they
were either killed or their mothers were raped or whatever
they were displaced. So but this morning, January thirteenth, nineteen eighty,
I'm like, I'm a little smiles where friends are looking
at me. What's wrong with you? Dennis? I was the
class captain. I said, I don't know, guys, I just
(10:41):
know that yesterday I prayed a prayer and I asked
God to be part of my life. And I think
it did, and after a while they wanted me to
explain why I was happy, and I said it he said,
you know what, I give my life to God because
he They said, what do you mean God? I said,
I don't know. It's God loves us, that he cares
that what it and for me, he can do for you.
And I become an instant evangelist. In fact, because after
(11:04):
thirty days, after the first month, I had had like
fifty of my friends all coming to church with me
and we were all then we had a happy corner
and they knew it that that's the happy corner. Dennis said,
it's happy corner and people were curious. But I began
to see to have this this idea that the God
(11:24):
gave me peace that transcended my environment, something that was
that blew my mind that I still can't explain to
this day. But it's as real because I've lived it.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
And this would be why dictators hate God.
Speaker 2 (11:38):
Yeah, yeah, because they couldn't. In fact, the peace came
from inside. It didn't matter. In fact, it got worse
my environment. This is what I have a problem with,
the simplistic perspective on God fixing. And so even though
a man was ousted, and there was other very term
(12:00):
dictators that came around that actually killed end mass. But
I mean would have barrio or a barrier almost every
week of a friend or But but I was giddy
and happy, not not giddy, giddy, but I had joy.
The Bible talks about it as as joy unspeakable, joy unspeakable.
(12:21):
I was peaceful, had shalom. You just called it shalom,
the piece that transcends circumstances. That's what I got, and
I could share it with I've shared it over eighty
countries now forty for forty years. It's the same. Whether
it's a prostitute in Amsterdam and a beggar in India,
it doesn't matter, or a multi millionaire in Beverly Hills.
(12:45):
There's this peace that God gives that is this unmatched.
I was ready to pour out what I had inside
of me, so excited that that a path was created
for me. We began, We formed a singing group, began singing,
and as we sang, Oh, the schools wanted to hear us.
All of a sudden, We're the biggest thing in town.
(13:08):
We started to Then we started to we had we
had a church service, we go to church, but we
started to we told I told the pastor, hey, can
we just come play music a whole hour before the
church starts. He said, I okay, And so we just
started playing. We would play music and six seven thousand
kids would just come listen. They were mesmerized. And of course,
(13:30):
of all, I wasn't promising, which is cool is I
wasn't saying God's going to come fix your world. But
have God in your life and your world will make sense.
But not be fixed makes sense. You'll have a reason
to wake up the spring in your in your feet,
and he can do that. He can do that. I've
seen him do that. And so that began to change.
My father would die of aides, which was like okay,
(13:55):
because he was a womanizer and all that. And then
then for a while we're thinking mom is going to
die too, but and that America happened. You know, Mommy
isn't dying. And so a lot of people now after
Amen leaves or the anarchy, now we had AIDS aids epidemic.
Entire villages had just kids running around with their parents dead,
(14:17):
rotting in their homes because remember those anarchy, so all
the services are there's no services. There's no there's one
doctor to fifty seventy thousand people. So so so again
more chaos. In fact, that's when the British media said
to say Uganda is cursed after a men after all
this now aids so this again in the midst of that.
(14:42):
We kept preaching singing Joy transcendent in the midst of death,
and some group came from England heard us sing. They
invited us to England. We went and sang in this
one church. That church happened to have the editor of
Voice magazine and the Black Britain and BBC, and they're
(15:03):
all going to this iconic church called Kensington Temple. And
when we sang, they all like, next day we're on
radio where all over they called it the African group
from Africa that's taking England by storm. And that year
we won the award for Best British New Artist. We're
not even English, we're not even British. But but but
(15:24):
again the same message. I remember when we recorded. Then
we recorded one song that became a club hit in London.
All all the nightclubs praying playing the songs called's go
Don't pass Me By, Lord, Don't Pass Me By. But
they loved it again, the message transcending culture. And here
we are now in nightclubs, the biggest nightclubs in Europe.
(15:48):
I remember seeing Muhammad Ali and all these guys, and
you know, just the there we were, the group, a
gospel group in the midst of like some of us
have never even been to a club, but we were featured.
So so the music opening doors, the message transcending received
an invitation to America Chicago. Same thing happened before we
(16:09):
know it, where all this in all these places get
a five album deal and and that opens up a global,
global ministry of music that took us to forty countries
and same song, same same message piece peace.
Speaker 1 (16:28):
So how does the singer become a doctor?
Speaker 2 (16:31):
Ah? I bump into this, this gentleman who had a
distance learning program and so a record time bachelor's, master's PhD,
all still singing. As soon as I was done doing that,
a church approached me and said, can you start a
(16:52):
college for us? I said, I'm a singer. I said no,
but you're singer with a PhD. So we a lot
of founded a college because the International College of Excellence,
and that got me into academics instead of twenty two
compasses in eight countries and then filmed an organization called
Egos Wings International and I'm just going to just wear
(17:13):
good hubs now in twenty six countries again. You know
the message, say message, God's amazing.
Speaker 1 (17:20):
God's amazing. Simple words words he absorbed and then words
well that drove the rest of his life and his
core message. When we come back, this remarkable story and
a remarkable immigrant story, an American dreamers story like almost
none other. We've told here on this show, the story
(17:42):
of doctor Dennis Simpebwe here on our American stories, and
(18:08):
we continue with our American stories and doctor Dennis in
Pebwe's story. Dennis, your band's success took you to the
heights of music in Africa. You took Europe by storm,
and then you were invited to America.
Speaker 2 (18:22):
Tell us about it. It was stumbled to Chicago first
nineteen ninety three, came sung in this little Romanian church.
You know, we're like heay, put your house together. Yeah,
And they were like looking on us like we were
the first black people to ever Greeze that stage. They
almost fell over and they were like these Africa so
they almost patronizingly. Then I found out the Baptists don't
(18:46):
clap hands, and I'm like, okay, okay, but but we
just we just you know what. And so the next
next tomorrow, you're going to sing again tomorrow, but could
you not have the music because they didn't like the tracks,
they didn't like guitars and and all that. So so
we said, okay, So we decided to sing a cappella
and so my wife was in there, which was she
(19:08):
was She said, we loved you, and I'm like, you sure, yeah.
With the church, it was a little tough for them,
but but I don't think they're going to have you back,
but you know, so, so but she and her friend
took us to the next church and and there that
was a black church. I was like, I wouldn't going crazy.
(19:28):
They had never seen Africans like us doing we we
were just wearing all African hats and we just went
outrageous on them and they just loved it. And she
almost fainted because it was now it was too loud.
She's from Romania, so she shared a similar story of chowcheschool.
While she was sharing about waking up at five am
landing out for groceries, I said, yeah, we did too.
(19:50):
We had no gas, Yeah we did too. The if
you had a car you just looked at Yeah we
did too. The blackouts.
Speaker 1 (19:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
So so that connected us and very diff diferent stories.
Speaker 1 (20:01):
My dictator is worse than your dictator.
Speaker 2 (20:03):
Yes, yeah, exactly. Her Dictata was more dignified. Hours when
he was deposed, he had heads of his enemies in
his refrigerator. It was. It was, yeah, it was, it was.
It was terrible. He believed the Wish doctors had told
him keep them, you need to eat their brains. It was,
it was. It was actually a true story. But we
connected and and and you know, got married. Very difficult
(20:25):
because I'm the heir of the family and I had
to maintain the integrity of my bloodline and there I
was going to contaminate it with with white blood. So
that was that was a tribal, major tribal issue. But
they got over it and it became a story. I
was the couple of the year in the Uganda and
at the time, and how did.
Speaker 1 (20:46):
Her Romanian family feel about you?
Speaker 2 (20:49):
Ah, that was different because again she was the only daughter.
Her dad, an ex Navy officer who who had migrated
from religious prosecution to come to Chicago. They were okay.
It was interesting. They were okay. They would have black
people come to their house. They were okay until one
of the black people wanted to marry their only daughter.
(21:11):
Because then and so Ingrid was saying, but my dad's
not racist. I'm like, I know, I know, I said,
I said, you know, if I was your dad and
all I saw on television was black people from the
South Side of Chicago involved in gangs and Da dah
dah and hip hop and and you know, I'd be scared.
(21:34):
I would be concerned. Your dad's and this is worse
than those black people. I'm from Africa. I'm dude, he
doesn't it doesn't even know where he doesn't. And then
I had this funny hair, I had half a head shaved.
So so I said, I understand your dad, and she's like,
you do, you don't. I said, no, it's not. It's
(21:55):
it's it's a tribal thing. It's it's it's it's he's
used to white, used to which is for me. It
helps me also understand that some of the because I've
been all over the world and I don't think people
are all as racists like that. I think I think
it's an affinity issue. When a white person sees another
(22:15):
white person, there's a natural affinity to white. When you
see black, you're like, okay black because because I've been
to certain countries where I'm on the only black person
for our like a week and so so like somewhere.
We went to Siberia once and I didn't see anybody
until one Nigerian girl. And the minute I saw how,
(22:35):
I was like who because it was like, oh, my kind,
that's my kind. He's here, he's here, you know. So
there's a lot of that that's in play many times
when we get overly simplistic about race. In fact, you
got on the phone one time and said, I don't
want you to marry my daughter. I don't want mixed kids,
he told me, And she was like, so like Dad,
(22:59):
you can't say that, you god fearing man. But the
challenge they had come to his home and he had
to decide, can I love this guy who's different than me?
Can my faith the faith that i've because it's one
thing talking about and singing about it, but now it
was in your home, is this my brother? It didn't
(23:19):
matter that I was a Christian just like him. I
had I was a different color, and he didn't know
what to do with that. Eventually, though, they reluctantly and
we said, you know, we're not gonna get married until
they are okay, which took another three years. My whole
country became okay. But her her family had a problem
until they said, okay, I guess we got married today.
(23:44):
Of course, where where the the You know, I'm the favorite,
favorite son in law and we're so Titan've given him
and them five grandkids and it's just a beautiful story.
Speaker 1 (23:57):
I've heard you talk about the simployer city of faith,
but talk about simplicity of faith and wrapping your head
around faith intellectually.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
See when when we were brought, when faith came to us,
it wasn't it didn't make sense. In fact, I remember
the first time I had to sit down, sit my
friends down, when they cornered me and said, explain why
you're happy? There's death all around? Why are you happy?
I said, okay, sit down, So I said, okay. In
two thousand years ago, God loved the world.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
Ah.
Speaker 2 (24:31):
I lost them right away, Lee, because five of them
one was Muslim, when there was one was was a
traditionalist that had no which which is he had all
this talent, talents ban from from from the gods. So
but he was old, like ready to just kill me,
you know, because I had to. I was going to
explain why I was happy, why God faith made sense.
(24:53):
So I said, two thousand and years ago the Bible says,
what do you mean the Bible? I'm like, oh, I'm
in trouble. Yeah, this book it said he said God
sent his son. First of all, said God love the
When I said God love the world, they just like, ah, Dennis,
because gods don't love. In our culture, God is a
(25:13):
mean They they restrict the rain, so you have to
sacrifice to them so rain can come and crops can grow,
and they take away your fertility. You have to So
that's that's what they used to sow. God and love
was like, eh said, I said, wait, you want to
know why I'm happy? Sit down. So I carry the
story and says he sent He sent his only son
(25:36):
to die for you and me. Ah, I lost them
again because they might try. In fact, one of them said,
what sort of God is that? What sort of he
is a weak God? He said, because in my tribe,
you don't give your only son for nothing. Because you
only your son is your future. How could God give
his son for people he doesn't even know? So I said,
(25:58):
just keep quiet. Now. Now I'm noticing I'm in trouble
already because the story is gonna get more ridiculous. So
I'm thinking, oh God, And they told us Dennis, if
you can't explain, we're going to beat you. It was
it was like where they going to beat me up
or whatever? So so I said, I said, okay, he
gave his son, his son died. He said, ah huh.
(26:18):
Then I said, then it rose again.
Speaker 1 (26:20):
Ah.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
I lost them again because because they was saying, oh,
how can he rise again? I said, okay, okay, he
rose again. Okay, and then I and then I said,
then I said, I said, I'm going to be in trouble. Said,
I said, and and you know what, he's he's here
right now. And they're like, what do you mean he's here?
I told he said two thousand and said, well, his
(26:41):
presence is here. And I said, now keep quiet, and
he wants to be part of your life. And I said,
if you if you believe this ridiculous story, you can
have what I have.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
If you believe this ridiculous story, you can have what
I have when we come back. This remarkable American story.
Sorry continues here on our American stories, and we continue
(27:37):
with our American stories and doctor Dennis and Pebwe's story. Dennis,
we left off with you sharing your faith in Christ
with your African friends. You ended with these words, if
you believe this ridiculous story, you can have what I have.
What happened next.
Speaker 2 (27:55):
And they looked at me like, and I said, you know,
I might as well go. Friend, I said, you know what,
you know what I did to aet this. I prayed
this prayer, pray with this prayer with me, and they
looked at me like, I said, pray, pray, pray, pray
this prayer. Say said, God, thank you for sending your
son to die for me. I believe this, this amazing, crazy,
crazy story come into my life. And they looked at
(28:16):
me like, and then Lee, I saw one of them
was shedding a tear. He had shed a tear, the
meanest one, but he was being mature of course, he's like.
So the meeting ended and next day, yeah, you know
that story. I think it's real. I said it is, yeah,
(28:40):
because he said yeah, because I feel the piece the
piece you talked about, I want to know, tell me
to church. And I was like, then I am, I am.
I'm like, whoa, It's it's powerful. It's not just a
nice little story. The story has power. And that there
was my beginning. And I've gone around the world that
(29:04):
I lived in England for a while, and I had
an option to live in Sweden and Australia at a
certain point, and I've been to eighty of them, eighty two.
In fact, there's no place like America. There's no place
there's no place like this. In fact, I have friends
who even are in leadership in those countries wanting to come.
(29:27):
I remember sitting with this Malaysian billionaire. He had actually
rented out the whole theater one of the Transformers movies
was coming out. He says, I hate America, he said.
He said, but ah, it's good that America is good though.
We like America, and it's good to America. Is America.
Something was happening here to intellect, she said, Americans, don't
(29:49):
be stupid. Why are you tearing your country country or
part way. I hate that you're on top, but I
won't kind of like it that you're on top. It was.
It was interesting to hear him say that. My friends
call me, especially with all the race things, Rachel. You know,
you know they call and say, oh, Dennis, praying for you.
(30:11):
You must be running for your life. You must be,
you must be. You're hunted, right, And I'm like, what
do you mean hunted? Yeah, because they're hunting black people.
I said no, wah wait wait wait wait do you
mean hunted? I said no, no, no, no said I said, no, no, no, no,
I'm okay. This is beautiful country. See see, I don't
have And I and I talked. I've got tons of
black friends, of course, and sometimes they I'm getting this
(30:34):
one award and some some some we got this. I
got this award and and my name was red last.
And my friend calls me, do you know what your
name was? Red last? Because you're black? I'm like, no,
because some s my last name is S alphabetically I'm
going to be I said no, no, I said, because say,
I don't have the the history that that some of
(30:58):
my friends do. But it's a but it's not an
experienced history. It's a it's a borrowed history. There's no
black man here who's who's ever been a slave, you know,
so so, and there's no white man who's her owned
slaves that is alived here today. But yet in Africa
we still own slaves, we still have slaves. Slavery is
not an American invention, and and and so and so
(31:22):
for me here this is a beautiful country and and
the freedoms. When I'm stopped by the police, yes, I
Sometimes I walk into the grocery, into a jury store
with my wife. She's white. Of course, sometimes they look
at her more and they think she's the one going
to buy and and maybe I shouldn't be there. I've
had that, but I don't go like me, So, so
(31:45):
she goes and picks this stone, and she likes to
do this, she says, and because they don't think that
we arrived together. And she will say, honey, should I
get this one? Then all of a sudden they look
at me like, oh, he's paying. But I don't go like, yeah,
you see it's me. No, I'm like I understand because
(32:06):
based on the conditioning this this again exposure. So so,
is this is this a racist country? Absolutely not. Is
there historic racism yes, of course the books, Yes, when
a cop stops me, I'm not thinking racism. I'm like, ah,
I probably fit a profile, a profile of and then
(32:30):
when it comes and it's nervous around me, it's because
there's numbers that show that people like me could do more.
He doesn't know, so I don't go like I I, well,
here's my because I want to get home. I want
to go home, go home. So so here's my license.
Are you okay, ELVISA? Are you doing officer? I'm pleasant
(32:52):
and I have never had problems. I drive a nicer car,
and so if I'm watched, I understand. I don't go
into because I have lived an experience that is far worse.
And so I appreciate the wealth of America. I see
what this country. There is no country like this, Lee,
(33:13):
I know that for a fact, there's no country that
offers these unsurpassed, unmatched freedoms and opportunities like this country does.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
And let's talk last about what you hope and pray
for America and some of the things you worry about
for the country that adopted you and that you call home.
Speaker 2 (33:36):
I worry about the loss of some of the things
that made this country amazing. In fact, when we talk
with my in laws, my Ingrid's parents are still alive,
and they're from Romania, and they run away from that.
So we could we talk almost commiserating. You're like, oh
(33:57):
my god, all this is how because they talk, he says.
He says, they said, Dennis, I remember when they told us,
because it's Romani Romania. I remember when they first said,
they came to my mother and my my father in
law said, they came to my mom and they said,
you have the shop. We have to we have to
get we have the government has to take over your
shop because it's the biggest and we need to make
(34:20):
sure this equal distribution of wealth. So they took it,
he said. I remember that. I remember when they offered
us free health care. We were so excited, he said,
but that created this this craziness where few people had
the power and and and and they said and and
(34:41):
then and so we're terrifyingly listen to some of the news,
and we watched the news, and we're like, this is
what we run away from. We run away from. We
fled our countries to come here to experience certain freedoms
which are fleeting. We're forgetting the I worry about God,
(35:03):
even God the place for God the place, because if
there's no absolute truth seeing my tribe. I've written a
book called Timeless Truths and and and Africa the richest proverb,
richest cultures were preserved by these sayings, these proverbs, and
and and it's at the fireplaces that where we learned
(35:23):
what a man does, a woman does. Men they care,
they protect, they treat their wives, and we learn these things.
That's that's lost. It's getting lost here because there's everything
is subjective. I want to be this kind of man.
I don't want to work, really, yeah, because I don't
(35:44):
want to work. Sorry. So so so that that is
now becoming mainstream. I've got a sad Jos in college.
He just finished. I call it college actually, And my
daughter said that that is the things we're learning that
America is not great, that our history is you know,
every country has history, has every country like slavery has
(36:08):
been in every culture. African's own slaves, Like I said,
so yes, we have a path that's gone here, but
there's no country two hundred years. Look what America has
done in two hundred years. It's an incredible experiment. So
we worry that we're borrowing too much of we're idealizing
(36:28):
what other countries have, and we're losing what's made as great.
There's no country as benevolent as this. We're good people here.
There is no country quite like this, And I don't
see any on the horizon because because it's getting crazier
out there. I think right now the values that made us,
(36:48):
Oh yeah, if there's ever been a time for us
to trumpet these values, it's now America, the Free, the brave,
Home of the brave and the free.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
Loujah, And you've been listening to doctor Dennis in Pebue,
And what a storyteller, and what a story to tell,
and what a perspective to see America the lens with
which he views this country as an immigrant from some
place like Uganda, or his bride coming from a communist
bloc country and having to deal with the false promises
(37:23):
of the regime that took over her country. And for
those who have faith, Oh my goodness, doctor Dennis in
the end was happy in Uganda. In Uganda, and by
the way, to learn more about doctor Dennis, who now
has PhDs, has co founded an international college in Chicago,
(37:45):
which quickly grew to twenty two extension campuses in eight countries,
and he's also founded a global missionary organization and started
one of the largest and fastest growing fully accredited ministry
training institutions in the world. And this is what he's
managed to do with his life in this country. Doctor
Dennison Pebwe's story here on our American Stories
This is Lee Habib and this is our American stories.
And we tell stories about everything here on this show.
But our favorite subject, well, it's redemption stories. Stories of
faith and hope and love and my goodness, that's the
story of so many Americans, and faith, by the way,
being a fundamental part of a large majority of the
(00:31):
people of this country. And that's why we tell those stories.
And up next the story of doctor Dennis Simpebwe. Dennis,
you were born on April twentieth, nineteen sixty seven, in
a small town in the African nation of Uganda.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Tell us about it, Yo, Ganda, Eastern Africa. Winston Churchill
called it the pearl of Africa, perfect whether they say,
and happy people, but in the midst of that anarchy
because we had idiomine if you remember the famous dy
I mean, so life was tough. I remember earliest memory.
I'm clutching my baby sister's hand. We have to go
to school and there's a dead body in the pathway,
(01:09):
but we're too young to jump over the body. And
so I remember the big debate should I go home?
If I go home, get into trouble, but I can't really,
So I remember getting to tell Sylvia. Sylvia, closed your
eyes as we get through the body, and then we
counted one to three and jumped over. And then it
goes back from then. The army wasn't paid, so at
(01:30):
night they would come to our villages and loot and steal,
raping as young as three years old. In fact, at
one point my village almost told the girls were pregnant
by soldiers. And so that's life for me, and not
enough food. I didn't have shoes till I was six.
We'd climb mango trees for lunch, guava trees for late
(01:50):
for breakfast. It was just tough, tough.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
How did Daman come to power? How does this happen
in a country?
Speaker 2 (01:58):
Ida mean?
Speaker 1 (01:59):
Was?
Speaker 2 (02:00):
It's almost like the same story repeated. You look at
Saddam and some of the some of these other big guys.
He was, it was a it was a favorite of
the British. In fact, it was a colonel in the
British army. So so he comes on. He was a
hero at first, but but he turns, he turns on us,
and and he gets greedy and starts to then tribalism.
(02:23):
Then it's it's the same old story of Africa when
the power. It's it's a power issue, and and and
so he begins to to get nervous when there's a listen,
there's a power struggle between him and the West, and
like like Gaddafi, you know, it sounds like because he's
he's very he's he's too independent, he won't be a puppet.
(02:44):
But with that comes the subjugation. And his didn't go
to school, so he thinks money can be printed. Then
he's irritated by the Asians, the Indians, because they're they're
running everything. So one day he decides, you know what,
no more Indians will want the Uganda to be run
by Ugandans. And he and he just exists three days.
He expels all Indians in for seventy two hours to
(03:06):
leave the country and he literally takes Uganans and gives them.
I mean, I remember this picture. I was young. I
remember seeing him on TV walking down the main street.
We had one main street in Kampala, and it was
literally giving shops that you that belonged to Asians has
given them to You take that one, you take, the
shoe shop, you take. And and of course what happened
(03:26):
is hear these Africans who are now running things, but
they were not trained to run. So of course everything plummets, turmoil, inflation,
and so poverty sets in. And what used to be
the pearl of Africa, Uganda was the bread basket of
his Eastern East African cradle before before then the best
(03:46):
hospital was in Kampala, now idiomen. Initially as he as
he got nervous, he wanted to squelch rebellion. Of course
it became heavier handed. Then he decided to pivot to
the Arab world, and so he won to turn Uganda
into a Muslim nation with Sharia law. So it was
illegal to wear mini skirts and it was illegal. One
(04:07):
day he woke up, he said, I don't want to
see slippers, sandals, slippers, I don't want to see people's feet.
And people were actually literally arrested for for wearing slippers
and sandals in town in Kampala, they'd arrest you. So
it was chaotic, chaotic, but so and then it can
of course then makes it comes after church, after church.
(04:29):
Then he had to see he didn't like any of
the independent religions expressions of religion where Friday became a
public holiday. So Friday was a public holiday for the
Muslims Sunday was a public holiday for the so we
had like four days of work, you know. And of
course all of this is his plummet in the economy.
If things are getting worse and worse and worse, and
(04:50):
so persecution, then he began to outlaw all all independent
religions or expressions of faith. And so thus began the
person cution, and the archbishop was arrested and killed and
so so that was life under idi Amin until he
was ousted. And then what happened is all the then
(05:11):
the tribalism, and now those factions of military soldiers, and
then the anarchyst said in just like some of these
other places like Gaddafi and Libya and Iraq, that's what
happened in Uganda. So we have factions all over, anarchy,
rule of law, nothing, nothing, The army wasn't paid and
(05:32):
they'd come every night to rape and steal and kill,
and it was it was disaster.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
So talk about your parents and what role did they play.
Talk about that.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Mine was tragic. My dad was their provider. But he
had other women. In fact, they were more like concubines,
more open. We knew them, we knew them. In fact,
one of them was my what had been my mother's
best friend who lived next door. So Daddy would come
(06:05):
back home and we would see him go to the
neighbors and I remember seeing mommy, you know, just dealing
with wow wow and so and so that was confusing
for me as a boy. And he'd come up drunk
at night at eleven PM, usually beating mommy and and
but then every time I came out, I was the
first born. Every time I came out to their little
(06:28):
room as this beating her, he would stop. So that
that caused me to think, oh, oh, I can help you.
I can help mommy. And and over the next few months,
every time I'd make sure to be awake, don't go
to sleep, because you need to rescue mommy. And she
didn't know until recently that I barely slept because whenever
(06:52):
they went to their room. In my little brain, my
little seven year old brain, I was thinking, what if
he beats her and kills her? So I'll sit right
at their door, oh night, And it made me rescue it.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
And when we come back, more of this remarkable life
story and how he ends up coming here to the
United States and doing remarkable things with his life. More
of the life story of doctor Dennis Simpebwe here on
our American Stories.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
Folks.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
If you love the great American stories we tell and
love America like we do, we're asking you to become
a part of the our American Stories family. If you
agree that America is a good and great country, please
make a donation. A monthly gift of seventeen dollars and
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Go to our American Stories dot com now and go
(07:50):
to the donate button and help us keep the great
American stories coming. That's our American Stories dot Com. And
we continue with our American Stories in the life of
(08:11):
doctor Dennisimpebwe. We just heard why seven year old Dennis
wouldn't sleep at night, knowing that he was the only
person around who could rescue his mom from being abused
by his alcoholic father. Dennis tell us the effects your
family environment have on you.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
I'm getting depressed. I'm learning about my history. I'm learning
that no Sempebwa that's my last name, had lived beyond
age forty. They were all womanizes and alcoholcolics, and they
had died young and so but I strolled into an event.
You know, one time Mommy said, there's a crusade. This
guy was coming from Nigeria and he was going to
talk about crusade God. And so mom mom took me
(08:55):
to this crusade, a big open air event, and this
guy was talking about peace. He said, God can give
you peace, and in my brain I was thinking, yeah,
but how? And then it was as as it's as
though this man could hear me because all the questions
I asked, he would scream out, don't you wonder how
you don't need us? So I'm like, well, but I
(09:16):
have to how is he gonna do? You want to
know how I was gonna do it. I'm like, I'm
thinking you can read my mind? What's kind on? But
but you know, then eventually said, if you want this peace,
come and I was the first time, Mommy, let's go.
I want I want peace. I want peace, And and
we prayed a prayer. And as I was going home
that night because it was five o'clock and five o'clock
(09:37):
was scary for me because the sun was gonna set
and and was that the night I would see my
sisters raped, my mother raped? Was I going to die?
Was I going to spend the night outside because sometimes
we didn't. It was too dangerous to sleep in the house,
so we'd run around all night well during these military raids,
looking for places to hide. But this particular night, January twelfth,
(09:58):
nineteen eighty, there was peace and I was thinking, ooh,
I'm not scared. I got home. My sister asks me, Denis,
what are you happy? What are you giddy about? I said,
I don't know. I just I think God's given me peace.
And she looked at me, rolled her eyes and says,
go to sleep, you're tired. Next morning, I woke up
and pining, I still have peace. I still have peace, said,
(10:18):
And I couldn't wait to go to school. Now, mornings
were terrible in class because every empty seat meant they
were either killed or their mothers were raped or whatever
they were displaced. So but this morning, January thirteenth, nineteen eighty,
I'm like, I'm a little smiles where friends are looking
at me. What's wrong with you? Dennis? I was the
class captain. I said, I don't know, guys, I just
(10:41):
know that yesterday I prayed a prayer and I asked
God to be part of my life. And I think
it did, and after a while they wanted me to
explain why I was happy, and I said it he said,
you know what, I give my life to God because
he They said, what do you mean God? I said,
I don't know. It's God loves us, that he cares
that what it and for me, he can do for you.
And I become an instant evangelist. In fact, because after
(11:04):
thirty days, after the first month, I had had like
fifty of my friends all coming to church with me
and we were all then we had a happy corner
and they knew it that that's the happy corner. Dennis said,
it's happy corner and people were curious. But I began
to see to have this this idea that the God
(11:24):
gave me peace that transcended my environment, something that was
that blew my mind that I still can't explain to
this day. But it's as real because I've lived it.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
And this would be why dictators hate God.
Speaker 2 (11:38):
Yeah, yeah, because they couldn't. In fact, the peace came
from inside. It didn't matter. In fact, it got worse
my environment. This is what I have a problem with,
the simplistic perspective on God fixing. And so even though
a man was ousted, and there was other very term
(12:00):
dictators that came around that actually killed end mass. But
I mean would have barrio or a barrier almost every
week of a friend or But but I was giddy
and happy, not not giddy, giddy, but I had joy.
The Bible talks about it as as joy unspeakable, joy unspeakable.
(12:21):
I was peaceful, had shalom. You just called it shalom,
the piece that transcends circumstances. That's what I got, and
I could share it with I've shared it over eighty
countries now forty for forty years. It's the same. Whether
it's a prostitute in Amsterdam and a beggar in India,
it doesn't matter, or a multi millionaire in Beverly Hills.
(12:45):
There's this peace that God gives that is this unmatched.
I was ready to pour out what I had inside
of me, so excited that that a path was created
for me. We began, We formed a singing group, began singing,
and as we sang, Oh, the schools wanted to hear us.
All of a sudden, We're the biggest thing in town.
(13:08):
We started to Then we started to we had we
had a church service, we go to church, but we
started to we told I told the pastor, hey, can
we just come play music a whole hour before the
church starts. He said, I okay, And so we just
started playing. We would play music and six seven thousand
kids would just come listen. They were mesmerized. And of course,
(13:30):
of all, I wasn't promising, which is cool is I
wasn't saying God's going to come fix your world. But
have God in your life and your world will make sense.
But not be fixed makes sense. You'll have a reason
to wake up the spring in your in your feet,
and he can do that. He can do that. I've
seen him do that. And so that began to change.
My father would die of aides, which was like okay,
(13:55):
because he was a womanizer and all that. And then
then for a while we're thinking mom is going to
die too, but and that America happened. You know, Mommy
isn't dying. And so a lot of people now after
Amen leaves or the anarchy, now we had AIDS aids epidemic.
Entire villages had just kids running around with their parents dead,
(14:17):
rotting in their homes because remember those anarchy, so all
the services are there's no services. There's no there's one
doctor to fifty seventy thousand people. So so so again
more chaos. In fact, that's when the British media said
to say Uganda is cursed after a men after all
this now aids so this again in the midst of that.
(14:42):
We kept preaching singing Joy transcendent in the midst of death,
and some group came from England heard us sing. They
invited us to England. We went and sang in this
one church. That church happened to have the editor of
Voice magazine and the Black Britain and BBC, and they're
(15:03):
all going to this iconic church called Kensington Temple. And
when we sang, they all like, next day we're on
radio where all over they called it the African group
from Africa that's taking England by storm. And that year
we won the award for Best British New Artist. We're
not even English, we're not even British. But but but
(15:24):
again the same message. I remember when we recorded. Then
we recorded one song that became a club hit in London.
All all the nightclubs praying playing the songs called's go
Don't pass Me By, Lord, Don't Pass Me By. But
they loved it again, the message transcending culture. And here
we are now in nightclubs, the biggest nightclubs in Europe.
(15:48):
I remember seeing Muhammad Ali and all these guys, and
you know, just the there we were, the group, a
gospel group in the midst of like some of us
have never even been to a club, but we were featured.
So so the music opening doors, the message transcending received
an invitation to America Chicago. Same thing happened before we
(16:09):
know it, where all this in all these places get
a five album deal and and that opens up a global,
global ministry of music that took us to forty countries
and same song, same same message piece peace.
Speaker 1 (16:28):
So how does the singer become a doctor?
Speaker 2 (16:31):
Ah? I bump into this, this gentleman who had a
distance learning program and so a record time bachelor's, master's PhD,
all still singing. As soon as I was done doing that,
a church approached me and said, can you start a
(16:52):
college for us? I said, I'm a singer. I said no,
but you're singer with a PhD. So we a lot
of founded a college because the International College of Excellence,
and that got me into academics instead of twenty two
compasses in eight countries and then filmed an organization called
Egos Wings International and I'm just going to just wear
(17:13):
good hubs now in twenty six countries again. You know
the message, say message, God's amazing.
Speaker 1 (17:20):
God's amazing. Simple words words he absorbed and then words
well that drove the rest of his life and his
core message. When we come back, this remarkable story and
a remarkable immigrant story, an American dreamers story like almost
none other. We've told here on this show, the story
(17:42):
of doctor Dennis Simpebwe here on our American stories, and
(18:08):
we continue with our American stories and doctor Dennis in
Pebwe's story. Dennis, your band's success took you to the
heights of music in Africa. You took Europe by storm,
and then you were invited to America.
Speaker 2 (18:22):
Tell us about it. It was stumbled to Chicago first
nineteen ninety three, came sung in this little Romanian church.
You know, we're like heay, put your house together. Yeah,
And they were like looking on us like we were
the first black people to ever Greeze that stage. They
almost fell over and they were like these Africa so
they almost patronizingly. Then I found out the Baptists don't
(18:46):
clap hands, and I'm like, okay, okay, but but we
just we just you know what. And so the next
next tomorrow, you're going to sing again tomorrow, but could
you not have the music because they didn't like the tracks,
they didn't like guitars and and all that. So so
we said, okay, So we decided to sing a cappella
and so my wife was in there, which was she
(19:08):
was She said, we loved you, and I'm like, you sure, yeah.
With the church, it was a little tough for them,
but but I don't think they're going to have you back,
but you know, so, so but she and her friend
took us to the next church and and there that
was a black church. I was like, I wouldn't going crazy.
(19:28):
They had never seen Africans like us doing we we
were just wearing all African hats and we just went
outrageous on them and they just loved it. And she
almost fainted because it was now it was too loud.
She's from Romania, so she shared a similar story of chowcheschool.
While she was sharing about waking up at five am
landing out for groceries, I said, yeah, we did too.
(19:50):
We had no gas, Yeah we did too. The if
you had a car you just looked at Yeah we
did too. The blackouts.
Speaker 1 (19:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
So so that connected us and very diff diferent stories.
Speaker 1 (20:01):
My dictator is worse than your dictator.
Speaker 2 (20:03):
Yes, yeah, exactly. Her Dictata was more dignified. Hours when
he was deposed, he had heads of his enemies in
his refrigerator. It was. It was, yeah, it was, it was.
It was terrible. He believed the Wish doctors had told
him keep them, you need to eat their brains. It was,
it was. It was actually a true story. But we
connected and and and you know, got married. Very difficult
(20:25):
because I'm the heir of the family and I had
to maintain the integrity of my bloodline and there I
was going to contaminate it with with white blood. So
that was that was a tribal, major tribal issue. But
they got over it and it became a story. I
was the couple of the year in the Uganda and
at the time, and how did.
Speaker 1 (20:46):
Her Romanian family feel about you?
Speaker 2 (20:49):
Ah, that was different because again she was the only daughter.
Her dad, an ex Navy officer who who had migrated
from religious prosecution to come to Chicago. They were okay.
It was interesting. They were okay. They would have black
people come to their house. They were okay until one
of the black people wanted to marry their only daughter.
(21:11):
Because then and so Ingrid was saying, but my dad's
not racist. I'm like, I know, I know, I said,
I said, you know, if I was your dad and
all I saw on television was black people from the
South Side of Chicago involved in gangs and Da dah
dah and hip hop and and you know, I'd be scared.
(21:34):
I would be concerned. Your dad's and this is worse
than those black people. I'm from Africa. I'm dude, he
doesn't it doesn't even know where he doesn't. And then
I had this funny hair, I had half a head shaved.
So so I said, I understand your dad, and she's like,
you do, you don't. I said, no, it's not. It's
(21:55):
it's it's a tribal thing. It's it's it's it's he's
used to white, used to which is for me. It
helps me also understand that some of the because I've
been all over the world and I don't think people
are all as racists like that. I think I think
it's an affinity issue. When a white person sees another
(22:15):
white person, there's a natural affinity to white. When you
see black, you're like, okay black because because I've been
to certain countries where I'm on the only black person
for our like a week and so so like somewhere.
We went to Siberia once and I didn't see anybody
until one Nigerian girl. And the minute I saw how,
(22:35):
I was like who because it was like, oh, my kind,
that's my kind. He's here, he's here, you know. So
there's a lot of that that's in play many times
when we get overly simplistic about race. In fact, you
got on the phone one time and said, I don't
want you to marry my daughter. I don't want mixed kids,
he told me, And she was like, so like Dad,
(22:59):
you can't say that, you god fearing man. But the
challenge they had come to his home and he had
to decide, can I love this guy who's different than me?
Can my faith the faith that i've because it's one
thing talking about and singing about it, but now it
was in your home, is this my brother? It didn't
(23:19):
matter that I was a Christian just like him. I
had I was a different color, and he didn't know
what to do with that. Eventually, though, they reluctantly and
we said, you know, we're not gonna get married until
they are okay, which took another three years. My whole
country became okay. But her her family had a problem
until they said, okay, I guess we got married today.
(23:44):
Of course, where where the the You know, I'm the favorite,
favorite son in law and we're so Titan've given him
and them five grandkids and it's just a beautiful story.
Speaker 1 (23:57):
I've heard you talk about the simployer city of faith,
but talk about simplicity of faith and wrapping your head
around faith intellectually.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
See when when we were brought, when faith came to us,
it wasn't it didn't make sense. In fact, I remember
the first time I had to sit down, sit my
friends down, when they cornered me and said, explain why
you're happy? There's death all around? Why are you happy?
I said, okay, sit down, So I said, okay. In
two thousand years ago, God loved the world.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
Ah.
Speaker 2 (24:31):
I lost them right away, Lee, because five of them
one was Muslim, when there was one was was a
traditionalist that had no which which is he had all
this talent, talents ban from from from the gods. So
but he was old, like ready to just kill me,
you know, because I had to. I was going to
explain why I was happy, why God faith made sense.
(24:53):
So I said, two thousand and years ago the Bible says,
what do you mean the Bible? I'm like, oh, I'm
in trouble. Yeah, this book it said he said God
sent his son. First of all, said God love the
When I said God love the world, they just like, ah, Dennis,
because gods don't love. In our culture, God is a
(25:13):
mean They they restrict the rain, so you have to
sacrifice to them so rain can come and crops can grow,
and they take away your fertility. You have to So
that's that's what they used to sow. God and love
was like, eh said, I said, wait, you want to
know why I'm happy? Sit down. So I carry the
story and says he sent He sent his only son
(25:36):
to die for you and me. Ah, I lost them
again because they might try. In fact, one of them said,
what sort of God is that? What sort of he
is a weak God? He said, because in my tribe,
you don't give your only son for nothing. Because you
only your son is your future. How could God give
his son for people he doesn't even know? So I said,
(25:58):
just keep quiet. Now. Now I'm noticing I'm in trouble
already because the story is gonna get more ridiculous. So
I'm thinking, oh God, And they told us Dennis, if
you can't explain, we're going to beat you. It was
it was like where they going to beat me up
or whatever? So so I said, I said, okay, he
gave his son, his son died. He said, ah huh.
(26:18):
Then I said, then it rose again.
Speaker 1 (26:20):
Ah.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
I lost them again because because they was saying, oh,
how can he rise again? I said, okay, okay, he
rose again. Okay, and then I and then I said,
then I said, I said, I'm going to be in trouble. Said,
I said, and and you know what, he's he's here
right now. And they're like, what do you mean he's here?
I told he said two thousand and said, well, his
(26:41):
presence is here. And I said, now keep quiet, and
he wants to be part of your life. And I said,
if you if you believe this ridiculous story, you can
have what I have.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
If you believe this ridiculous story, you can have what
I have when we come back. This remarkable American story.
Sorry continues here on our American stories, and we continue
(27:37):
with our American stories and doctor Dennis and Pebwe's story. Dennis,
we left off with you sharing your faith in Christ
with your African friends. You ended with these words, if
you believe this ridiculous story, you can have what I have.
What happened next.
Speaker 2 (27:55):
And they looked at me like, and I said, you know,
I might as well go. Friend, I said, you know what,
you know what I did to aet this. I prayed
this prayer, pray with this prayer with me, and they
looked at me like, I said, pray, pray, pray, pray
this prayer. Say said, God, thank you for sending your
son to die for me. I believe this, this amazing, crazy,
crazy story come into my life. And they looked at
(28:16):
me like, and then Lee, I saw one of them
was shedding a tear. He had shed a tear, the
meanest one, but he was being mature of course, he's like.
So the meeting ended and next day, yeah, you know
that story. I think it's real. I said it is, yeah,
(28:40):
because he said yeah, because I feel the piece the
piece you talked about, I want to know, tell me
to church. And I was like, then I am, I am.
I'm like, whoa, It's it's powerful. It's not just a
nice little story. The story has power. And that there
was my beginning. And I've gone around the world that
(29:04):
I lived in England for a while, and I had
an option to live in Sweden and Australia at a
certain point, and I've been to eighty of them, eighty two.
In fact, there's no place like America. There's no place
there's no place like this. In fact, I have friends
who even are in leadership in those countries wanting to come.
(29:27):
I remember sitting with this Malaysian billionaire. He had actually
rented out the whole theater one of the Transformers movies
was coming out. He says, I hate America, he said.
He said, but ah, it's good that America is good though.
We like America, and it's good to America. Is America.
Something was happening here to intellect, she said, Americans, don't
(29:49):
be stupid. Why are you tearing your country country or
part way. I hate that you're on top, but I
won't kind of like it that you're on top. It was.
It was interesting to hear him say that. My friends
call me, especially with all the race things, Rachel. You know,
you know they call and say, oh, Dennis, praying for you.
(30:11):
You must be running for your life. You must be,
you must be. You're hunted, right, And I'm like, what
do you mean hunted? Yeah, because they're hunting black people.
I said no, wah wait wait wait wait do you
mean hunted? I said no, no, no, no said I said, no, no, no, no,
I'm okay. This is beautiful country. See see, I don't
have And I and I talked. I've got tons of
black friends, of course, and sometimes they I'm getting this
(30:34):
one award and some some some we got this. I
got this award and and my name was red last.
And my friend calls me, do you know what your
name was? Red last? Because you're black? I'm like, no,
because some s my last name is S alphabetically I'm
going to be I said no, no, I said, because say,
I don't have the the history that that some of
(30:58):
my friends do. But it's a but it's not an
experienced history. It's a it's a borrowed history. There's no
black man here who's who's ever been a slave, you know,
so so, and there's no white man who's her owned
slaves that is alived here today. But yet in Africa
we still own slaves, we still have slaves. Slavery is
not an American invention, and and and so and so
(31:22):
for me here this is a beautiful country and and
the freedoms. When I'm stopped by the police, yes, I
Sometimes I walk into the grocery, into a jury store
with my wife. She's white. Of course, sometimes they look
at her more and they think she's the one going
to buy and and maybe I shouldn't be there. I've
had that, but I don't go like me, So, so
(31:45):
she goes and picks this stone, and she likes to
do this, she says, and because they don't think that
we arrived together. And she will say, honey, should I
get this one? Then all of a sudden they look
at me like, oh, he's paying. But I don't go like, yeah,
you see it's me. No, I'm like I understand because
(32:06):
based on the conditioning this this again exposure. So so,
is this is this a racist country? Absolutely not. Is
there historic racism yes, of course the books, Yes, when
a cop stops me, I'm not thinking racism. I'm like, ah,
I probably fit a profile, a profile of and then
(32:30):
when it comes and it's nervous around me, it's because
there's numbers that show that people like me could do more.
He doesn't know, so I don't go like I I, well,
here's my because I want to get home. I want
to go home, go home. So so here's my license.
Are you okay, ELVISA? Are you doing officer? I'm pleasant
(32:52):
and I have never had problems. I drive a nicer car,
and so if I'm watched, I understand. I don't go
into because I have lived an experience that is far worse.
And so I appreciate the wealth of America. I see
what this country. There is no country like this, Lee,
(33:13):
I know that for a fact, there's no country that
offers these unsurpassed, unmatched freedoms and opportunities like this country does.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
And let's talk last about what you hope and pray
for America and some of the things you worry about
for the country that adopted you and that you call home.
Speaker 2 (33:36):
I worry about the loss of some of the things
that made this country amazing. In fact, when we talk
with my in laws, my Ingrid's parents are still alive,
and they're from Romania, and they run away from that.
So we could we talk almost commiserating. You're like, oh
(33:57):
my god, all this is how because they talk, he says.
He says, they said, Dennis, I remember when they told us,
because it's Romani Romania. I remember when they first said,
they came to my mother and my my father in
law said, they came to my mom and they said,
you have the shop. We have to we have to
get we have the government has to take over your
shop because it's the biggest and we need to make
(34:20):
sure this equal distribution of wealth. So they took it,
he said. I remember that. I remember when they offered
us free health care. We were so excited, he said,
but that created this this craziness where few people had
the power and and and and they said and and
(34:41):
then and so we're terrifyingly listen to some of the news,
and we watched the news, and we're like, this is
what we run away from. We run away from. We
fled our countries to come here to experience certain freedoms
which are fleeting. We're forgetting the I worry about God,
(35:03):
even God the place for God the place, because if
there's no absolute truth seeing my tribe. I've written a
book called Timeless Truths and and and Africa the richest proverb,
richest cultures were preserved by these sayings, these proverbs, and
and and it's at the fireplaces that where we learned
(35:23):
what a man does, a woman does. Men they care,
they protect, they treat their wives, and we learn these things.
That's that's lost. It's getting lost here because there's everything
is subjective. I want to be this kind of man.
I don't want to work, really, yeah, because I don't
(35:44):
want to work. Sorry. So so so that that is
now becoming mainstream. I've got a sad Jos in college.
He just finished. I call it college actually, And my
daughter said that that is the things we're learning that
America is not great, that our history is you know,
every country has history, has every country like slavery has
(36:08):
been in every culture. African's own slaves, Like I said,
so yes, we have a path that's gone here, but
there's no country two hundred years. Look what America has
done in two hundred years. It's an incredible experiment. So
we worry that we're borrowing too much of we're idealizing
(36:28):
what other countries have, and we're losing what's made as great.
There's no country as benevolent as this. We're good people here.
There is no country quite like this, And I don't
see any on the horizon because because it's getting crazier
out there. I think right now the values that made us,
(36:48):
Oh yeah, if there's ever been a time for us
to trumpet these values, it's now America, the Free, the brave,
Home of the brave and the free.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
Loujah, And you've been listening to doctor Dennis in Pebue,
And what a storyteller, and what a story to tell,
and what a perspective to see America the lens with
which he views this country as an immigrant from some
place like Uganda, or his bride coming from a communist
bloc country and having to deal with the false promises
(37:23):
of the regime that took over her country. And for
those who have faith, Oh my goodness, doctor Dennis in
the end was happy in Uganda. In Uganda, and by
the way, to learn more about doctor Dennis, who now
has PhDs, has co founded an international college in Chicago,
(37:45):
which quickly grew to twenty two extension campuses in eight countries,
and he's also founded a global missionary organization and started
one of the largest and fastest growing fully accredited ministry
training institutions in the world. And this is what he's
managed to do with his life in this country. Doctor
Dennison Pebwe's story here on our American Stories
Host
Lee Habeeb
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