October 7, 2025 • 17 mins
On this episode of Our American Stories, Art Rooney, Sr., the founding owner of the Pittsburgh Steelers, believed that the measure of a man was often found in the quiet things he chose to do. Jim O'Brien, who came to see Rooney as the grandfather he had been missing, remembers one moment that revealed exactly who Rooney was. Rooney attended the funeral of a man he hardly knew because he believed showing respect in times of loss mattered more than anything else. O’Brien joins us to share how that simple act left a lasting impression on his life.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
This is Lee Habib and this is Our American Stories,
the show where America is the star and the American people.
And to search for the Our American Stories podcast, go
to the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.
Up next, we bring you Jim O'Brien, a Pittsburgh native,
a sports journalist and the author of the Pittsburgh Proud
(00:33):
series of books. Today, Jim brings us a story about
Steeler's legend, the chief, the founding owner of the franchise,
Art Rooney Senior.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
I'd like to tell you a story about my favorite
person in all of pro sports. He's like the grandfather
that I never had. My grandparents were all gone by
the time I was a little boy, so I guess
I needed a grandpap, and Art Rooney filled the bill.
(01:13):
He was the nicest guy that I ever met in
the sports world. I met him when I was a
teenager and I went out to see the Steelers practice
one day at the Fairgrounds in the South Park area
of Pittsburgh. Boy was that of dump and they had
(01:33):
horses out there during the week, and sometimes the players
had to watch where they stepped on the grass. But
somehow the Steelers back in the fifties, managed to practice
there and Art Rooney was normally on the sideline. I
met him one day on the sideline and talked to him,
and he told me who some of his favorite players were,
(01:55):
some of his favorite sports writers, and just to shay
what kind of a man he was. The next day,
he sends me a postcard and he apologizes for having
the temerity to tell me who his favorite sports writers were. Now,
(02:15):
I was a freshman at University of Pittsburgh. I was
nineteen years old, and Art Rooney's apologizing to me. You know,
I was the sports editor of the student newspaper and
he's apologizing to me. But that's what a humble man
he was. And Art Rooney is responsible for the reason
(02:38):
that I go to so many funerals today. He says,
you can't miss a funeral of a friend or an acquaintance.
You've got to show up. And if you never hear
another story about Art Rooney, this one should suffice to
tell you exactly what a wonderful man he was. I
(03:07):
went to the funeral when his wife, Kathleen died. I
was covering the Pittsburgh stories at the time for the
Pittsburgh Press and she had died while we were in Seattle,
and a couple days later they had a funeral at
what they called the Rooney Church, which was Saint Peter's
on the north side of Pittsburgh. The reason they called
(03:30):
it the Rooney Church was for twofold one is mister
Rooney was always seated in one of the first pews
in that church on a daily basis. And secondly, no
one in the community gave more money to Saint Peter's
than did Art Rooney. So his wife Kathleen dies and
(03:57):
the funeral was held at Devlin's Funeral Home, also on
the north side of Pittsburgh, and just about everybody in
Pittsburgh showed up for the funeral, and just about every
priest when they had the Mass at Saint Peter's, just
about every priest showed up for the funeral. George Young,
(04:21):
a good friend of the Rooneys and at the time
the general manager of the New York Giants, said that
nobody in Pittsburgh, no Catholic, should be dying at that
particular time because there wouldn't be any priest to offer
the last rites. So a friend of mine, Dan Lackner,
(04:46):
who owned a paper Company in Pittsburgh, and of course
had the Steelers' account. He was a good Catholic and
he had worked for the Steelers when he was a
teenager at Central Catholic High School in Pittsburgh, a school
well known for later producing the likes of Danny Marino,
(05:06):
who went on to become an All America quarterback at
the University of Pittsburgh and then an All Pro quarterback
for the Miami Dolphins. So Art Rooney's at the door
greeting all of his friends and acquaintances as they come
through the front door of Devlin's funeral home and offer
their condolences for the death of Kathleen. And Art Rooney
(05:30):
was almost dismissing most of their comments because they were
usually the same. And my friend Dan Lackner showed up,
and Dan was getting in line, getting ready to talk
to mister Rooney, when all of a sudden, somebody to
his left went hey, Dan, Dan, and Dan looked over
(05:57):
and it was a fellow named Joe McNamara, been a
classmate of his Ecentral Catholic and Dan said, what are
you doing here? And he said, I'm here because my
father died and we have him in the back room here,
he said. I didn't know what to do. He said,
(06:18):
we don't have many people left that still knew my dad.
My mom's been gone, but I thought i'd have him
here for at least a day. I didn't know that
Art Rooney's wife was going to be at the same
funeral home. But we're doing the best we can. And
since Dan Lackner had to wait a while before we
could get to see Art Rooney, he said, come on,
(06:41):
I'll go in the back with you to offer my condolences.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
And you're listening to author Jim O'Brien, a sports journalist,
a Pittsburgh native, and the author of Pittsburgh Proud, a
series of books about his hometown, telling the story of
the legendary Art Rooney Senor. You can't miss a funeral,
he said, a friend, anyone you know or care about,
(07:07):
you've got to show up when we come back. More
of the story of Art Rooney Senior, as told by
the man who considered Art Rooney Senior his grandfather, the
grandfather he never had here on Our American Stories, Lie
(07:29):
Hibib here, the host of Our American Stories. Every day
on this show, we're bringing inspiring stories from across this
great country, stories from our big cities and small towns.
But we truly can't do the show without you. Our
stories are free to listen to, but they're not free
to make. If you love what you hear, go to
Ouramerican Stories dot com and click the donate button. Give
(07:51):
a little, give a lot. Go to Auramerican Stories dot
com and give. And we're back with our American Stories
and Jim O'Brien's story about the Pittsburgh Steelers founding owner
(08:16):
Art Rooney Sr. We just left off with Jim's friend
Dan Lackner at the funeral of Rooney's wife, Kathleen. While
in line to give Rooney his condolences, Dan ran into
a friend and former classmate whose father was also being
remembered at the funeral home, Joe McNamara. Let's pick up
where we last left off.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
So he gets in the back room with his former classmate,
Joe McNamara, and he walks into the room and there's
a pop. There's a little dais there so to speak,
a table where you could sign your name that you
had paid your respects. And he signs his name and
(09:01):
he said there were only about three or four other
signatures on the pad, and he said, there weren't many
flowers in that room at the funeral home. He went
back out, and as he entered the lobby of the
funeral home, Art Rooney spied him, and Art Rooney walks
(09:23):
over to him, and he didn't miss a trick, and
he said, hey, Dan, what are you doing in the
back room. Kathleen's over here. And then Lachner said, oh,
an old friend of mine from Central Catholic High School.
His father died, a guy named Joe McNamara, same name
(09:44):
as his son. And mister Rooney says, well, come on,
let's go back, show me where he is, and I'll
pay my respects to your friend. You got to remember
that Art Rooney was known for going to mo or
funerals in Pittsburgh than anybody. He just always showed up,
(10:06):
said a prayer, and he had a very comforting effect
on people. I remember when my brother Danny died. I
was editing a newspaper that had a circulation of about
five thousand at best, and mister Rooney and all the
club officials from the Steelers showed up at that funeral
home to pay their respects and everybody he touched in
the room, felt like a cardinal or a bishop had
(10:30):
just blessed them. So Art Runey's in the back room
with his friend Dan Lackner. He signs ann. He tells
the son that he's sorry that his father had died,
and he learns that his father had lived on Dawson
Street in Oakland, not far from Forbesfield or Pitts Stadium,
(10:53):
and he had died at the VA Hospital in Oakland.
It was very familiar to Art Rooney because in addition
to going to so many funerals, he also paid many
visits to friends that were in hospitals in the community.
So he's back there talking to Joe McNamara. You thought
he was the mayor of Pittsburgh, and mister Rooney remembered
(11:17):
that his dad had been a city fireman. He always
had a soft spot and his hard for them. So
now he goes back out in the lobby and lo
and behold, the Mayor of Pittsburgh is in the doorway,
and that was Pete Flaherty, good irishman from the North side.
(11:39):
And another north Sider, Tom Forster, the Allegheny County Commissioner,
one of the top politicians in the City. He was
in the doorway with his friend Pete Flaherty and they
were ready to offer their condolences to Art Rooney said
how sorry they were that Kathleen had died, and Art
(12:01):
Rooney kind of shrugs it off, and he says to him,
he says, hey, listen, he said, you fellas, don't forget
to go to the back room and pay your respects
to our friend McNamara. And Forster shoots a look at
Flerty to see if he knows the McNamara that Art
(12:23):
Rooney's referring to. He gets a blank look, and Forster says,
I don't know any fireman named McNamara, And Rooney, rather testily,
he was a little upset with him, says, yes, you do,
the one from Dawson Street out in Oakland. So Forrester
(12:46):
and Flarerty look at each other and they sort of
gave a look like they knew what mister Rooney was
talking about. And Forest says, oh, that one, and he
and Pete Flarerty go back to the other room. So
the rest of the day that weekend, Art Rooney had
(13:06):
everyone pay their respects to our friend McNamara, and he
had them sign the Visitors Book. It went like that
the rest of the day. And when I came back
the next day, my friend Lackner was still there, and
so was McNamara. He said, we decided to stay another day.
(13:29):
So Dan Lackner said that he went into the back
room to see Joe McNamara's father once again, and he said,
you could hardly see Joe McNamara in the casket. He said,
the room was full of flowers. It looked like Phipps Conservatory.
(13:52):
And young McNamara showed the Visitor's Book to Dan Lackner.
And there's so many famous Steelers who had signed the book,
such as Joe Green and Mel Blunt and Terry Bradshaw,
Andy Russell, so many Hall of famers get this. It
(14:18):
was signed by Pete Roselle, the NFL commissioner, and Al Davis,
the owner of the Oakland Raiders. They'd been there too.
Everybody who was anybody in the National Football League had
signed the book. That's just showing you the way that
Art Rooney was and how respected he was in the league,
(14:42):
and how he got all these people who had come
to see him and offer him their condolences, that he
got them while they were there to sign the book
for his friend McNamara. And I'll tell you you know,
at the church itself, funny things happened. Al Davis was
(15:10):
seated in a pew on the aisle in front of
Pete Roselle. Well, they had been at odds with each
other because they were fighting about the things, and the
Davis was threatening to take the NFL to court and
so forth for differences that they had. But even on
(15:32):
that day, when the priests, who was officiating a mass,
told everybody to give the sign of peace to the
person in front of them or behind him, I saw
Al Davis shake hands with Pete Roselle, And somehow I
thought that Art Rooney arranged it, I guess in his
(15:57):
own way. But think of that, Just think of that
Art Rooney's wife has died and Art Rooney is steering
everybody that comes to the funeral home to a man
that he doesn't even know. But he's from Pittsburgh. He
was a fireman and as far as Art Rooney was concerned,
(16:17):
he was the best of friends. That's all you need
to know about Art Rooney.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
And a terrific job on the production by Robbie and
a spectacular piece of storytelling by Jim O'Brien about a
legend in the sports business, an owner's owner, literally one
of the men who started the NFL, started it from
scratch when there was nothing there and built it up.
And anyone who's known Art Rooney or his family will
(16:49):
say one thing. He was a Catholic. He was a
Catholic before he was anything. And this is what the
Catholic Church aspires to be. It's what any church or
sin or mosque aspires to be, and that is a
servant to the city and a servant to the people
around them. And there is no better story to tell
about Art Rooney than that story. It shows his heart,
(17:12):
It shows his compassion for others, even at the greatest
moment of his grieving the loss of his wife, who
was everywhere with him in Pittsburgh and always at that church,
the Daily Mass. The story of Art Rooney Senior, a
Catholic story, a story of faith, and so much more
here on our American Stories
This is Lee Habib and this is Our American Stories,
the show where America is the star and the American people.
And to search for the Our American Stories podcast, go
to the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.
Up next, we bring you Jim O'Brien, a Pittsburgh native,
a sports journalist and the author of the Pittsburgh Proud
(00:33):
series of books. Today, Jim brings us a story about
Steeler's legend, the chief, the founding owner of the franchise,
Art Rooney Senior.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
I'd like to tell you a story about my favorite
person in all of pro sports. He's like the grandfather
that I never had. My grandparents were all gone by
the time I was a little boy, so I guess
I needed a grandpap, and Art Rooney filled the bill.
(01:13):
He was the nicest guy that I ever met in
the sports world. I met him when I was a
teenager and I went out to see the Steelers practice
one day at the Fairgrounds in the South Park area
of Pittsburgh. Boy was that of dump and they had
(01:33):
horses out there during the week, and sometimes the players
had to watch where they stepped on the grass. But
somehow the Steelers back in the fifties, managed to practice
there and Art Rooney was normally on the sideline. I
met him one day on the sideline and talked to him,
and he told me who some of his favorite players were,
(01:55):
some of his favorite sports writers, and just to shay
what kind of a man he was. The next day,
he sends me a postcard and he apologizes for having
the temerity to tell me who his favorite sports writers were. Now,
(02:15):
I was a freshman at University of Pittsburgh. I was
nineteen years old, and Art Rooney's apologizing to me. You know,
I was the sports editor of the student newspaper and
he's apologizing to me. But that's what a humble man
he was. And Art Rooney is responsible for the reason
(02:38):
that I go to so many funerals today. He says,
you can't miss a funeral of a friend or an acquaintance.
You've got to show up. And if you never hear
another story about Art Rooney, this one should suffice to
tell you exactly what a wonderful man he was. I
(03:07):
went to the funeral when his wife, Kathleen died. I
was covering the Pittsburgh stories at the time for the
Pittsburgh Press and she had died while we were in Seattle,
and a couple days later they had a funeral at
what they called the Rooney Church, which was Saint Peter's
on the north side of Pittsburgh. The reason they called
(03:30):
it the Rooney Church was for twofold one is mister
Rooney was always seated in one of the first pews
in that church on a daily basis. And secondly, no
one in the community gave more money to Saint Peter's
than did Art Rooney. So his wife Kathleen dies and
(03:57):
the funeral was held at Devlin's Funeral Home, also on
the north side of Pittsburgh, and just about everybody in
Pittsburgh showed up for the funeral, and just about every
priest when they had the Mass at Saint Peter's, just
about every priest showed up for the funeral. George Young,
(04:21):
a good friend of the Rooneys and at the time
the general manager of the New York Giants, said that
nobody in Pittsburgh, no Catholic, should be dying at that
particular time because there wouldn't be any priest to offer
the last rites. So a friend of mine, Dan Lackner,
(04:46):
who owned a paper Company in Pittsburgh, and of course
had the Steelers' account. He was a good Catholic and
he had worked for the Steelers when he was a
teenager at Central Catholic High School in Pittsburgh, a school
well known for later producing the likes of Danny Marino,
(05:06):
who went on to become an All America quarterback at
the University of Pittsburgh and then an All Pro quarterback
for the Miami Dolphins. So Art Rooney's at the door
greeting all of his friends and acquaintances as they come
through the front door of Devlin's funeral home and offer
their condolences for the death of Kathleen. And Art Rooney
(05:30):
was almost dismissing most of their comments because they were
usually the same. And my friend Dan Lackner showed up,
and Dan was getting in line, getting ready to talk
to mister Rooney, when all of a sudden, somebody to
his left went hey, Dan, Dan, and Dan looked over
(05:57):
and it was a fellow named Joe McNamara, been a
classmate of his Ecentral Catholic and Dan said, what are
you doing here? And he said, I'm here because my
father died and we have him in the back room here,
he said. I didn't know what to do. He said,
(06:18):
we don't have many people left that still knew my dad.
My mom's been gone, but I thought i'd have him
here for at least a day. I didn't know that
Art Rooney's wife was going to be at the same
funeral home. But we're doing the best we can. And
since Dan Lackner had to wait a while before we
could get to see Art Rooney, he said, come on,
(06:41):
I'll go in the back with you to offer my condolences.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
And you're listening to author Jim O'Brien, a sports journalist,
a Pittsburgh native, and the author of Pittsburgh Proud, a
series of books about his hometown, telling the story of
the legendary Art Rooney Senor. You can't miss a funeral,
he said, a friend, anyone you know or care about,
(07:07):
you've got to show up when we come back. More
of the story of Art Rooney Senior, as told by
the man who considered Art Rooney Senior his grandfather, the
grandfather he never had here on Our American Stories, Lie
(07:29):
Hibib here, the host of Our American Stories. Every day
on this show, we're bringing inspiring stories from across this
great country, stories from our big cities and small towns.
But we truly can't do the show without you. Our
stories are free to listen to, but they're not free
to make. If you love what you hear, go to
Ouramerican Stories dot com and click the donate button. Give
(07:51):
a little, give a lot. Go to Auramerican Stories dot
com and give. And we're back with our American Stories
and Jim O'Brien's story about the Pittsburgh Steelers founding owner
(08:16):
Art Rooney Sr. We just left off with Jim's friend
Dan Lackner at the funeral of Rooney's wife, Kathleen. While
in line to give Rooney his condolences, Dan ran into
a friend and former classmate whose father was also being
remembered at the funeral home, Joe McNamara. Let's pick up
where we last left off.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
So he gets in the back room with his former classmate,
Joe McNamara, and he walks into the room and there's
a pop. There's a little dais there so to speak,
a table where you could sign your name that you
had paid your respects. And he signs his name and
(09:01):
he said there were only about three or four other
signatures on the pad, and he said, there weren't many
flowers in that room at the funeral home. He went
back out, and as he entered the lobby of the
funeral home, Art Rooney spied him, and Art Rooney walks
(09:23):
over to him, and he didn't miss a trick, and
he said, hey, Dan, what are you doing in the
back room. Kathleen's over here. And then Lachner said, oh,
an old friend of mine from Central Catholic High School.
His father died, a guy named Joe McNamara, same name
(09:44):
as his son. And mister Rooney says, well, come on,
let's go back, show me where he is, and I'll
pay my respects to your friend. You got to remember
that Art Rooney was known for going to mo or
funerals in Pittsburgh than anybody. He just always showed up,
(10:06):
said a prayer, and he had a very comforting effect
on people. I remember when my brother Danny died. I
was editing a newspaper that had a circulation of about
five thousand at best, and mister Rooney and all the
club officials from the Steelers showed up at that funeral
home to pay their respects and everybody he touched in
the room, felt like a cardinal or a bishop had
(10:30):
just blessed them. So Art Runey's in the back room
with his friend Dan Lackner. He signs ann. He tells
the son that he's sorry that his father had died,
and he learns that his father had lived on Dawson
Street in Oakland, not far from Forbesfield or Pitts Stadium,
(10:53):
and he had died at the VA Hospital in Oakland.
It was very familiar to Art Rooney because in addition
to going to so many funerals, he also paid many
visits to friends that were in hospitals in the community.
So he's back there talking to Joe McNamara. You thought
he was the mayor of Pittsburgh, and mister Rooney remembered
(11:17):
that his dad had been a city fireman. He always
had a soft spot and his hard for them. So
now he goes back out in the lobby and lo
and behold, the Mayor of Pittsburgh is in the doorway,
and that was Pete Flaherty, good irishman from the North side.
(11:39):
And another north Sider, Tom Forster, the Allegheny County Commissioner,
one of the top politicians in the City. He was
in the doorway with his friend Pete Flaherty and they
were ready to offer their condolences to Art Rooney said
how sorry they were that Kathleen had died, and Art
(12:01):
Rooney kind of shrugs it off, and he says to him,
he says, hey, listen, he said, you fellas, don't forget
to go to the back room and pay your respects
to our friend McNamara. And Forster shoots a look at
Flerty to see if he knows the McNamara that Art
(12:23):
Rooney's referring to. He gets a blank look, and Forster says,
I don't know any fireman named McNamara, And Rooney, rather testily,
he was a little upset with him, says, yes, you do,
the one from Dawson Street out in Oakland. So Forrester
(12:46):
and Flarerty look at each other and they sort of
gave a look like they knew what mister Rooney was
talking about. And Forest says, oh, that one, and he
and Pete Flarerty go back to the other room. So
the rest of the day that weekend, Art Rooney had
(13:06):
everyone pay their respects to our friend McNamara, and he
had them sign the Visitors Book. It went like that
the rest of the day. And when I came back
the next day, my friend Lackner was still there, and
so was McNamara. He said, we decided to stay another day.
(13:29):
So Dan Lackner said that he went into the back
room to see Joe McNamara's father once again, and he said,
you could hardly see Joe McNamara in the casket. He said,
the room was full of flowers. It looked like Phipps Conservatory.
(13:52):
And young McNamara showed the Visitor's Book to Dan Lackner.
And there's so many famous Steelers who had signed the book,
such as Joe Green and Mel Blunt and Terry Bradshaw,
Andy Russell, so many Hall of famers get this. It
(14:18):
was signed by Pete Roselle, the NFL commissioner, and Al Davis,
the owner of the Oakland Raiders. They'd been there too.
Everybody who was anybody in the National Football League had
signed the book. That's just showing you the way that
Art Rooney was and how respected he was in the league,
(14:42):
and how he got all these people who had come
to see him and offer him their condolences, that he
got them while they were there to sign the book
for his friend McNamara. And I'll tell you you know,
at the church itself, funny things happened. Al Davis was
(15:10):
seated in a pew on the aisle in front of
Pete Roselle. Well, they had been at odds with each
other because they were fighting about the things, and the
Davis was threatening to take the NFL to court and
so forth for differences that they had. But even on
(15:32):
that day, when the priests, who was officiating a mass,
told everybody to give the sign of peace to the
person in front of them or behind him, I saw
Al Davis shake hands with Pete Roselle, And somehow I
thought that Art Rooney arranged it, I guess in his
(15:57):
own way. But think of that, Just think of that
Art Rooney's wife has died and Art Rooney is steering
everybody that comes to the funeral home to a man
that he doesn't even know. But he's from Pittsburgh. He
was a fireman and as far as Art Rooney was concerned,
(16:17):
he was the best of friends. That's all you need
to know about Art Rooney.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
And a terrific job on the production by Robbie and
a spectacular piece of storytelling by Jim O'Brien about a
legend in the sports business, an owner's owner, literally one
of the men who started the NFL, started it from
scratch when there was nothing there and built it up.
And anyone who's known Art Rooney or his family will
(16:49):
say one thing. He was a Catholic. He was a
Catholic before he was anything. And this is what the
Catholic Church aspires to be. It's what any church or
sin or mosque aspires to be, and that is a
servant to the city and a servant to the people
around them. And there is no better story to tell
about Art Rooney than that story. It shows his heart,
(17:12):
It shows his compassion for others, even at the greatest
moment of his grieving the loss of his wife, who
was everywhere with him in Pittsburgh and always at that church,
the Daily Mass. The story of Art Rooney Senior, a
Catholic story, a story of faith, and so much more
here on our American Stories
Host
Lee Habeeb
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