November 22, 2025 • 11 mins
Ever find yourself dreading the thought of starting something new, already envisioning the uphill battle ahead?
Join us for the third episode of our series 5 Signs Your Food Struggles Actually Have NOTHING To Do With Food, where we shine a light on the frustration of grappling with tasks that feel overwhelmingly difficult or draining.
We'll explore why certain approaches leave you feeling depleted and disheartened, and how this impacts your overall mood and motivation. Tune in as we dissect the root of the struggle and uncover strategies to shift your mindset and approach towards a more sustainable and fulfilling path.
HOSTS:
Amy Brown // RadioAmy.com // @RadioAmy
Leanne Ellington // StresslessEating.com // @leanneellington
To learn more about re-wiring your brain to heal from the all-or-nothing diet mentality for good....but WITHOUT restricting yourself, punishing your body, (and definitely WITHOUT ever having to use words like macros, low-carb, or calorie burn) check out Leanne's FREE Stressless Eating Webinar @ www.StresslessEating.com
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I won't let my body out outwait everything that I'm made,
don't won't spend my life trying to change.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
I'm learning to love who I am again, Stan, I
feel free. I know every part of me it's beautiful.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
And that will always out way if.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
You feel it with your hands in the air. She'll
some love to the d why get there? Take you
one day? Editor? Did you and die out way?
Speaker 3 (00:35):
Happy Saturday, Amy here and I'm with Leanne four Part
three of a five part series which is actually signed three.
That your food struggles actually have nothing to do with food.
That's the name of the series. And Leanne take us
into sign number three. Before you start talking, I'll just say, hey,
if you're just now finding this, Part two was last
(00:57):
Saturday and Part one was two Saturdays ago, so you
can go check those out as well. I don't really
think it matters in which order you listen to these,
and so you can go ahead and keep listening now
and then just make sure you go back and check
Sign one and two.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
Yeah, absolutely, and this one.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
There's so much overlap and crossover because they're all with
that same you know, our brains just need the love,
the repetition, and this one actually does play off really
well off of last week, where it's almost like its
own cause and effect. And so this one is, you know,
if you hear yourself saying things like gosh, this is
so hard, like I wish I didn't have to do
this anymore, and you're in the stress and the struggle
(01:34):
of the actual thing that you're committing to, and then
of course the effect of that is like your mood
just takes a major nose dive when you start it.
That is a sign that again has nothing to do
with food. And so we talked about last week this
idea of if you go to start something every Monday
and you're like, Okay, you know, I'm gung ho, but
really subconsciously you don't trust yourself.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
That's really a symptom.
Speaker 1 (01:53):
Of this, which is like the way that you're choosing,
like the modality, the strategy, the tax that is the
problem because if it drains you, if it takes you
ungodly amounts of time, energy, mental real estate, you're setting
yourself up for failure.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
It's not sustainable, it's not practical.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
And again, if you're here, you're probably in your own
version of the mental emotional, food and body prison, it's
going to contribute to the disorder, to the dysmorphia. So
I really want you to notice, you know, it's not
one of those things of like just you know, no pain,
no gain.
Speaker 3 (02:26):
Right.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
First of all, that's not how the nervous system works. Okay,
the nervous system says, do not move into pain. That's
like rule number one of the nervous system. And here's
the thing, discomfort and pain. That's another distinction in itself, right,
Like sometimes you have to get uncomfortable, right, but when
you are just like hating the process, hating who you
have to be, what you have to do, how you
have to feel to get there, that is again not
(02:48):
a food problem. It is a strategy and a tactic
and a way of doing things. Problem that will not
get better with motivation and raw rah. That will not
get better with you know, positive mantras and faked you
make it. You need a better strategy, one that keeps
the end in mind.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
Where you know.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
The way I look at it is I invite women
to start at healthy, like a three dimensional version of healthy,
like nervous system health, mental, emotional, spiritual health, all of
it physical health of course, right, and then start it
happy and then bring that with you into your relationship
with food, bring that with you into your relationship with
your body. So I know, for me, I was chasing
things like skinny or chasing lean or chasing you know whatever,
(03:28):
at the expense of my health, at the expense of
my happiness, at the expense of my sanity. Right And
that again, what we're talking about here has nothing to
do with food. It was the modality, the tactic, the
strategy was never gonna work. And then again, like we said,
it spills over into what we talked about last week,
where it's like, of.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
Course, no wonder.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
You start things on Monday and you're like, dah, this
is not gonna last very long. Like I know myself,
this isn't my first rodeo. There's no way I'm going
to finish this. And not only do you not finish it,
but then you witness yourself making a promise and not
keeping it, and it falls into that category of great,
here's another thing I said I was going to do
and I didn't do it, or here now I can't
be trusted or just great.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
This is who I'm always going to be.
Speaker 3 (04:07):
I remember when I would think like I wish I
didn't have to do this anymore. Yes, but oh well,
this is just going to be me, my brain, my life. Yeah,
my way of living and thinking, and a lot of
it was private nobody was ever going to know about.
But I was just gonna think this way and live
this way till I died.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
Absolutely. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
And I know I'll make the disclaimer that this isn't
a one and done, but I know we love to
give you, know, takeaways and tips and all that. Like
if you were to just identify one, like one belief
that I could invite you to take on to kind
of address what you just said, Emi, because it's so important.
Another way of saying it is like people think unconsciously
or subconsciously or now we're making it conscious of Like
(04:51):
this is just hard, Like it's always going to be hard,
Like my body's going to be hard, my weight's going
to be hard, my health, it's always going to be hard.
And so my invitation for you is just literally asking yourself,
what would it look like if it was easy? What
would it look like if it was simple? And that
is a question in itself that people have probably never
asked themselves, right, because they're usually asking themselves like Okay,
(05:12):
what should I eat? What plan should I follow? Right,
instead of asking them like what would it look like
if it was easy? Like oh, well, I would have
you know, X, Y, and Z available to me so
I didn't have to think about it so much. Or
I would have a really cool understanding with my husband
so that when I wanted to go to yoga and
blow off some steave or whatever, it is like the
things that make up the things that have nothing to
do with food, exercise, Right, what if it was easy?
Speaker 3 (05:31):
Yeah, And then something that came to my mind and
how I used to speak to myself. I probably do
still sometimes regarding other things. But that the always language,
the never language, like I am never going to eat
sugar again. I am always going to eat this way
after today. Of course, when I'm done eating all the
sugar and all the land, I'm never having it again.
(05:54):
So I really use that type of definitive language.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
Yeah, and the extremism and we're in.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
It's so funny because I said from the very first
episode of this that there's so much crossover and the distinctions,
and that's that's actually what we're going to be talking
about next week, is the extremism side of things, of
the language of your thinking. So there's those distinctions within
the distinction because this week we're talking about the actual
plan the program, right, and within that there's so many distinctions,
(06:21):
So like the language itself, the good, bad, the right, wrong,
the should shouldn't.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
So you know, part of it too is.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
If you notice yourself saying what you were just saying, Amy,
like why is this so hard?
Speaker 2 (06:31):
Or it shouldn't have to be so hard? Right?
Speaker 1 (06:34):
That is a very problem focused question, right, and it's
we find whatever we're looking for, we're going to create
more of that problem.
Speaker 3 (06:41):
Why is this so hard? Forever? Yes, this is going
to be hardly forever dot dot dot for I'll talk
about the definitive stuff next week for sure. But yeah,
but you're right, that's that's how my brain was operating.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
Of course. Yeah, totally never gonna end.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
And I love that you brought that up because it's
not one of those things of like when we talked about,
you know, in the very first episode, what what do
you mean by healing? Right, So it's not this one
and done thing where it's like, oh, you know, some
high mountaintop of I've got my healing I got the
T shirt and I'm done. It's like no, it's this constant,
ever evolving evolution, and that's an opportunity because you can
just constantly have this new, renewed, beautiful relationship with food
(07:13):
in your body once once you start in that direction.
But coming back to this idea of like creating solution
focused questions so that you can actually find answers, and
it's just like, what if this was easy, or even
if you're going like that direction, what if this wasn't
so hard? How could I make this a little bit
less hard? If your brain gravitates towards hard, right, But
just like, what if it was easy? What if it
(07:34):
was simpler? What if I was set up for success?
One of the questions that my clients and I play
around with a lot is like, what would it look
like if I reverse engineered convenience and health Because a
lot of times they're just like unconsciously reversing ease but
not convenience.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
Well, explain that.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
So a lot of people think their problem is I
don't have time, right, But when you think about it,
if you really ought a their time, how much time
are they spending on social media? How much time are
they spending thinking about food? How much time are they
in money are they spending going through Starbucks, you know, grocery.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
Store, whatever it is.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
We know statistically the average overeater, binge eater spends about
five thousand dollars a year just on binge foods and
drive throughs. So the cost of not fixing this is expensive, right,
that's just a financial thing. But the time investment, like,
how much time are you spending on this?
Speaker 2 (08:17):
Right?
Speaker 1 (08:18):
So when I hear people say I don't have you know,
the time? Really, and I mean this with so much love,
but it can be a little convicting. It's like, we
make time for whatever is important to us. But so
part of it too is because exactly what we're talking about,
the plan, the strategy that we've chosen, isn't sustainable. It
takes an ungodly amount of time, energy, thought, soul to
get there. Right, So that's the sign and symptom that
(08:39):
you're on the wrong plan. But in terms of answering,
and I say plan to me, the antidote to that
is like a new way of thinking, so that the
last diet you went on is the last diet you
ever go on.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
So it's not this on a wagon, off a wagon.
Speaker 1 (08:51):
But in answer your question of reverse engineering convenience and health,
at the same time, people think like, oh, if I'm
in a reverse engineer, like, oh, I got stuck going
through the drive through. Okay, If I was gonna reverse
engineer convenience and health right now, it would be me
ordering the salad and the baked potato and the chili
at Wendy's because I'm going to feel really good and
there's some nutrients and I'll feel full from the fat
and the carbs.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
And all the things.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
And we're not getting intigritty here, but I'm still reverse
engineering convenience and health, right It's that and slash both
mentality versus the either or mentality. And so a lot
of times that either or mentality comes alongside when we
are attracting or creating a planner program that is just
too unsustainable and we feel like we have to choose.
So there's so many distinctions within the distinctions obviously, and
(09:33):
then this crosses over into last weeks and next weeks.
But this is these are the things that matter, and
these are the things that again they disguise themselves as
ugh self sabotageer I'll never do this.
Speaker 2 (09:45):
This is just too hard. It's always going to be hard,
and we and it.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
Disguises itself as those beliefs, but the real problem is, like, no,
the plan of attack is not the right one for you.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
You haven't earned back your trust.
Speaker 1 (09:54):
So even if you had the perfect plan, it's not
going to work for you because you're assuming failure. From
the beginning, we're going to talk about the think the
black and white are nothing extremism, because again, you can
have this beautiful, freedom driven plan, but if you don't
address the black white all or nothing thinking. So that's
why I'm saying, there's all that crossover and the teeniest
little distinctions, but they're important and these are the things
that nobody told me about.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
Yeah, well, I love the question what if this was easy?
And I feel like there's so many ways I can
ask myself that throughout the day regarding all kinds of
things in my life. Nothing to do with any of this, Yep,
Just okay, let's step back and ask ourselves what if
this was easy?
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Absolutely and definitely but aught at my time.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
For Leanne, where can people find you?
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Absolutely Leanne ellington over on Instagram. If you want to
turn off the part of your brain that's obsessed with
food NonStop.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
Head on over to stressful seeding dot com, and.
Speaker 1 (10:45):
Then over here on iHeart We've Got What's God Got
to Do with It?
Speaker 2 (10:48):
New episodes air every Tuesday.
Speaker 3 (10:50):
Well, it's wherever you listen to podcasts, Yes as well,
I Heeart, Apple, Spotify, and I'm at Radio Amy on socials.
We will see you next Saturday for part four, which
will be assigned number four five five
I won't let my body out outwait everything that I'm made,
don't won't spend my life trying to change.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
I'm learning to love who I am again, Stan, I
feel free. I know every part of me it's beautiful.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
And that will always out way if.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
You feel it with your hands in the air. She'll
some love to the d why get there? Take you
one day? Editor? Did you and die out way?
Speaker 3 (00:35):
Happy Saturday, Amy here and I'm with Leanne four Part
three of a five part series which is actually signed three.
That your food struggles actually have nothing to do with food.
That's the name of the series. And Leanne take us
into sign number three. Before you start talking, I'll just say, hey,
if you're just now finding this, Part two was last
(00:57):
Saturday and Part one was two Saturdays ago, so you
can go check those out as well. I don't really
think it matters in which order you listen to these,
and so you can go ahead and keep listening now
and then just make sure you go back and check
Sign one and two.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
Yeah, absolutely, and this one.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
There's so much overlap and crossover because they're all with
that same you know, our brains just need the love,
the repetition, and this one actually does play off really
well off of last week, where it's almost like its
own cause and effect. And so this one is, you know,
if you hear yourself saying things like gosh, this is
so hard, like I wish I didn't have to do
this anymore, and you're in the stress and the struggle
(01:34):
of the actual thing that you're committing to, and then
of course the effect of that is like your mood
just takes a major nose dive when you start it.
That is a sign that again has nothing to do
with food. And so we talked about last week this
idea of if you go to start something every Monday
and you're like, Okay, you know, I'm gung ho, but
really subconsciously you don't trust yourself.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
That's really a symptom.
Speaker 1 (01:53):
Of this, which is like the way that you're choosing,
like the modality, the strategy, the tax that is the
problem because if it drains you, if it takes you
ungodly amounts of time, energy, mental real estate, you're setting
yourself up for failure.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
It's not sustainable, it's not practical.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
And again, if you're here, you're probably in your own
version of the mental emotional, food and body prison, it's
going to contribute to the disorder, to the dysmorphia. So
I really want you to notice, you know, it's not
one of those things of like just you know, no pain,
no gain.
Speaker 3 (02:26):
Right.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
First of all, that's not how the nervous system works. Okay,
the nervous system says, do not move into pain. That's
like rule number one of the nervous system. And here's
the thing, discomfort and pain. That's another distinction in itself, right,
Like sometimes you have to get uncomfortable, right, but when
you are just like hating the process, hating who you
have to be, what you have to do, how you
have to feel to get there, that is again not
(02:48):
a food problem. It is a strategy and a tactic
and a way of doing things. Problem that will not
get better with motivation and raw rah. That will not
get better with you know, positive mantras and faked you
make it. You need a better strategy, one that keeps
the end in mind.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
Where you know.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
The way I look at it is I invite women
to start at healthy, like a three dimensional version of healthy,
like nervous system health, mental, emotional, spiritual health, all of
it physical health of course, right, and then start it
happy and then bring that with you into your relationship
with food, bring that with you into your relationship with
your body. So I know, for me, I was chasing
things like skinny or chasing lean or chasing you know whatever,
(03:28):
at the expense of my health, at the expense of
my happiness, at the expense of my sanity. Right And
that again, what we're talking about here has nothing to
do with food. It was the modality, the tactic, the
strategy was never gonna work. And then again, like we said,
it spills over into what we talked about last week,
where it's like, of.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
Course, no wonder.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
You start things on Monday and you're like, dah, this
is not gonna last very long. Like I know myself,
this isn't my first rodeo. There's no way I'm going
to finish this. And not only do you not finish it,
but then you witness yourself making a promise and not
keeping it, and it falls into that category of great,
here's another thing I said I was going to do
and I didn't do it, or here now I can't
be trusted or just great.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
This is who I'm always going to be.
Speaker 3 (04:07):
I remember when I would think like I wish I
didn't have to do this anymore. Yes, but oh well,
this is just going to be me, my brain, my life. Yeah,
my way of living and thinking, and a lot of
it was private nobody was ever going to know about.
But I was just gonna think this way and live
this way till I died.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
Absolutely. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
And I know I'll make the disclaimer that this isn't
a one and done, but I know we love to
give you, know, takeaways and tips and all that. Like
if you were to just identify one, like one belief
that I could invite you to take on to kind
of address what you just said, Emi, because it's so important.
Another way of saying it is like people think unconsciously
or subconsciously or now we're making it conscious of Like
(04:51):
this is just hard, Like it's always going to be hard,
Like my body's going to be hard, my weight's going
to be hard, my health, it's always going to be hard.
And so my invitation for you is just literally asking yourself,
what would it look like if it was easy? What
would it look like if it was simple? And that
is a question in itself that people have probably never
asked themselves, right, because they're usually asking themselves like Okay,
(05:12):
what should I eat? What plan should I follow? Right,
instead of asking them like what would it look like
if it was easy? Like oh, well, I would have
you know, X, Y, and Z available to me so
I didn't have to think about it so much. Or
I would have a really cool understanding with my husband
so that when I wanted to go to yoga and
blow off some steave or whatever, it is like the
things that make up the things that have nothing to
do with food, exercise, Right, what if it was easy?
Speaker 3 (05:31):
Yeah, And then something that came to my mind and
how I used to speak to myself. I probably do
still sometimes regarding other things. But that the always language,
the never language, like I am never going to eat
sugar again. I am always going to eat this way
after today. Of course, when I'm done eating all the
sugar and all the land, I'm never having it again.
(05:54):
So I really use that type of definitive language.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
Yeah, and the extremism and we're in.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
It's so funny because I said from the very first
episode of this that there's so much crossover and the distinctions,
and that's that's actually what we're going to be talking
about next week, is the extremism side of things, of
the language of your thinking. So there's those distinctions within
the distinction because this week we're talking about the actual
plan the program, right, and within that there's so many distinctions,
(06:21):
So like the language itself, the good, bad, the right, wrong,
the should shouldn't.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
So you know, part of it too is.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
If you notice yourself saying what you were just saying, Amy,
like why is this so hard?
Speaker 2 (06:31):
Or it shouldn't have to be so hard? Right?
Speaker 1 (06:34):
That is a very problem focused question, right, and it's
we find whatever we're looking for, we're going to create
more of that problem.
Speaker 3 (06:41):
Why is this so hard? Forever? Yes, this is going
to be hardly forever dot dot dot for I'll talk
about the definitive stuff next week for sure. But yeah,
but you're right, that's that's how my brain was operating.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
Of course. Yeah, totally never gonna end.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
And I love that you brought that up because it's
not one of those things of like when we talked about,
you know, in the very first episode, what what do
you mean by healing? Right, So it's not this one
and done thing where it's like, oh, you know, some
high mountaintop of I've got my healing I got the
T shirt and I'm done. It's like no, it's this constant,
ever evolving evolution, and that's an opportunity because you can
just constantly have this new, renewed, beautiful relationship with food
(07:13):
in your body once once you start in that direction.
But coming back to this idea of like creating solution
focused questions so that you can actually find answers, and
it's just like, what if this was easy, or even
if you're going like that direction, what if this wasn't
so hard? How could I make this a little bit
less hard? If your brain gravitates towards hard, right, But
just like, what if it was easy? What if it
(07:34):
was simpler? What if I was set up for success?
One of the questions that my clients and I play
around with a lot is like, what would it look
like if I reverse engineered convenience and health Because a
lot of times they're just like unconsciously reversing ease but
not convenience.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
Well, explain that.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
So a lot of people think their problem is I
don't have time, right, But when you think about it,
if you really ought a their time, how much time
are they spending on social media? How much time are
they spending thinking about food? How much time are they
in money are they spending going through Starbucks, you know, grocery.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
Store, whatever it is.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
We know statistically the average overeater, binge eater spends about
five thousand dollars a year just on binge foods and
drive throughs. So the cost of not fixing this is expensive, right,
that's just a financial thing. But the time investment, like,
how much time are you spending on this?
Speaker 2 (08:17):
Right?
Speaker 1 (08:18):
So when I hear people say I don't have you know,
the time? Really, and I mean this with so much love,
but it can be a little convicting. It's like, we
make time for whatever is important to us. But so
part of it too is because exactly what we're talking about,
the plan, the strategy that we've chosen, isn't sustainable. It
takes an ungodly amount of time, energy, thought, soul to
get there. Right, So that's the sign and symptom that
(08:39):
you're on the wrong plan. But in terms of answering,
and I say plan to me, the antidote to that
is like a new way of thinking, so that the
last diet you went on is the last diet you
ever go on.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
So it's not this on a wagon, off a wagon.
Speaker 1 (08:51):
But in answer your question of reverse engineering convenience and health,
at the same time, people think like, oh, if I'm
in a reverse engineer, like, oh, I got stuck going
through the drive through. Okay, If I was gonna reverse
engineer convenience and health right now, it would be me
ordering the salad and the baked potato and the chili
at Wendy's because I'm going to feel really good and
there's some nutrients and I'll feel full from the fat
and the carbs.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
And all the things.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
And we're not getting intigritty here, but I'm still reverse
engineering convenience and health, right It's that and slash both
mentality versus the either or mentality. And so a lot
of times that either or mentality comes alongside when we
are attracting or creating a planner program that is just
too unsustainable and we feel like we have to choose.
So there's so many distinctions within the distinctions obviously, and
(09:33):
then this crosses over into last weeks and next weeks.
But this is these are the things that matter, and
these are the things that again they disguise themselves as
ugh self sabotageer I'll never do this.
Speaker 2 (09:45):
This is just too hard. It's always going to be hard,
and we and it.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
Disguises itself as those beliefs, but the real problem is, like, no,
the plan of attack is not the right one for you.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
You haven't earned back your trust.
Speaker 1 (09:54):
So even if you had the perfect plan, it's not
going to work for you because you're assuming failure. From
the beginning, we're going to talk about the think the
black and white are nothing extremism, because again, you can
have this beautiful, freedom driven plan, but if you don't
address the black white all or nothing thinking. So that's
why I'm saying, there's all that crossover and the teeniest
little distinctions, but they're important and these are the things
that nobody told me about.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
Yeah, well, I love the question what if this was easy?
And I feel like there's so many ways I can
ask myself that throughout the day regarding all kinds of
things in my life. Nothing to do with any of this, Yep,
Just okay, let's step back and ask ourselves what if
this was easy?
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Absolutely and definitely but aught at my time.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
For Leanne, where can people find you?
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Absolutely Leanne ellington over on Instagram. If you want to
turn off the part of your brain that's obsessed with
food NonStop.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
Head on over to stressful seeding dot com, and.
Speaker 1 (10:45):
Then over here on iHeart We've Got What's God Got
to Do with It?
Speaker 2 (10:48):
New episodes air every Tuesday.
Speaker 3 (10:50):
Well, it's wherever you listen to podcasts, Yes as well,
I Heeart, Apple, Spotify, and I'm at Radio Amy on socials.
We will see you next Saturday for part four, which
will be assigned number four five five
Hosts And Creators
Amy Brown
Leanne Ellington
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