Zach Gilford Meets World

Clear Eyes, Full Hearts, Be Good! The gang from John Adams High takes a field trip to Dillon, Texas when they hang out with Zach Gilford (a.k.a. QB1) from Friday Night Lights!

Zach takes us through the crazy audition process that led him to Matt Saracen, and shares the cast’s thoughts on the infamous “murder” storyline.

And no guest is more in tune with Rider Strong, and he’s got the bear encounter to prove it.

There are very few cult classic TV shows that can compete with “Boy Meets World,” but FNL is one of the chosen few. Learn all about the similarities on a “Texas Forever” edition of Pod Meets World!

Follow @podmeetsworldshow on Instagram and TikTok!

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:19):
One of my children bit another kid at school.

Speaker 2 (00:24):
So as as somebody who loves your kids, what did
the other kid do to deserve it?

Speaker 3 (00:29):
Is my question.

Speaker 1 (00:32):
Oh my gosh, I'm telling you. I so.

Speaker 4 (00:35):
About a year ago, we went to uh this little
play place in the mall and Adler and Keaton were
running around. One of the reasons we love this play
place is that it's perfectly enclosed. The kids are totally
safe in there, and everything's padded and it's like you
can really like.

Speaker 1 (00:55):
Take off their leash let them run in there. You
don't even have to put a helmet on them. They're fine.

Speaker 4 (01:01):
And then on the outside are all these tables and
you can just sit there and work or drink your
coffee or eat your lunch or whatever you want.

Speaker 1 (01:09):
And so we had let the kids go.

Speaker 4 (01:11):
And run around, and then all of a sudden, Adler
comes flying around the corner with another kid chasing after him,
and Adler's like screaming, bloody murder. And it's a different
kind of scream, you know, playing screaming, which is still annoying,
but like, okay, I can tell you're playing. Adler was
like scared, and there was a three year old running

(01:34):
after him, and as Adler came flying around the corner,
he like tripped and fell and the kid jumped on
top of him and picked up Adler's arm and bit
it like a piece of corn on the car.

Speaker 3 (01:45):
Oh my god. So first he pounced and then he bit.

Speaker 4 (01:48):
And I don't I don't see the bite because it's
on the floor. But I had seen the coming around
the corner and the like hysterics, so I had already
jumped up and was walking over there. And and I
arrived there was another mom who's not the mom of
the bier, a different a different parent, who says he

(02:10):
bit him. And as she's saying this, Adler's holding up
his arm and I see teeth marks in his arm
and no broken skin, no broken skin, just but definite
teeth marks in the arm. And I look down and
I go, I look at the kid who bit and
I go, oh my god.

Speaker 1 (02:31):
Just a totally like justin.

Speaker 4 (02:33):
I did not even have time to think of it,
just natural reaction. The mom who's not the mom of
the bier goes, okay, no need to shame the child.

Speaker 3 (02:42):
Oh god.

Speaker 4 (02:45):
And first of all, I'm a little like maybe there
is a little bit of a reason, But okay, I
understand that kids don't fully they're not well developed. So
this kid, this is how he's gonna learn not to bite.
I shouldn't shame, but I'll so like just me saying,
oh my god, didn't really feel super shaming, but sure whatever. Anyway,

(03:05):
I'm like, okay, well, can you just give me a
second to process what just happened. My kid just got bit.
So of course I pick up Adlar.

Speaker 1 (03:11):
I'm like, are you okay? And he's like, man, all
this hysterics.

Speaker 4 (03:17):
The family ends up coming over and saying, you know,
we're really sorry.

Speaker 1 (03:22):
This is he's in a new school we're visiting. He's
from the East Coast.

Speaker 4 (03:26):
This sumone at school is a bier and he's learning
it from.

Speaker 2 (03:30):
The people from East Coast because like we didn't he's
from the East Coast.

Speaker 5 (03:36):
Sorry to get here, excuse.

Speaker 4 (03:42):
I think they were just letting us know he doesn't
live here, like we're not from here. And so they
just leave with the kid, which was the right thing
to do. Get your kid out of here, Yeah, just
you go handle him, don't leave me to shame him.

(04:03):
So they leave. Now it was so traumatizing for Adler.
There were a few, like a few weeks after that,
where sometimes as he was falling asleep, he'd be like,
do you remember.

Speaker 1 (04:15):
That time that that kid bit me? That was really scary.
I I didn't like that, and I was like, I know,
so we made a big deal.

Speaker 4 (04:24):
It was a big deal, like oh yeah, you'd we
just know, no matter what you do, not bite. So yesterday,
oh gosh, Jensen gets a phone call from Keaton's school.
Keaton bit a friend name it was a nameless friend
at the time and broke skin.

Speaker 3 (04:45):
Oh geez, he went all in.

Speaker 1 (04:49):
We were like, what happened?

Speaker 4 (04:52):
Apparently they were pretending and Keaton was a spider and
he in the pretend play.

Speaker 6 (05:00):
He was a character. He was committed, he was method.

Speaker 4 (05:04):
His friend so hard he broke skin. Apparently there was
no anger, there was no malice. It was it was
pretend play. The friend, although hurt immediately after, was okay
and they were friends. Come to find out then, because
they don't tell you who who whenever some whenever your
kid gets hurt or your kid hurts another person hippa,

(05:26):
I'm gonna call it hippo rules. They don't tell you
friend exactly friend friend.

Speaker 1 (05:34):
These friends are still friends.

Speaker 4 (05:36):
But so this morning I have to talk to Keaton
about it and I say, so, who you know who
did you bite?

Speaker 1 (05:43):
And he goes, I don't want to tell you, and
I was like who is?

Speaker 4 (05:48):
It turns out it's his best friend. Are very good friends,
Michelle and Poria's son, who you guys know because they
came with us to Vegas and we made Kean a card.
I had to have a very long conversation with Keaton
about how absolutely incredibly serious biting is that even if

(06:09):
it's make believe there's no reason to bite, it's very
very and I reminded him. I was like, don't you
remember when that kid tackled your brother please and bit
him on the arm.

Speaker 1 (06:22):
It was like traumatizing, and.

Speaker 4 (06:23):
Keaton had this whole thing, but I was a spy
but I had to It was like no, never ever. Okay,
Pinky promised me you'll never bite anyone again. So anyway,
I'm I just feeling that in one year I went
from shaming a child for biting to being the mother
of a bier.

Speaker 2 (06:43):
Okay, I have a serious question though, Okay, are either
Adler or Keaton do they have a sudden aversion to sunlight?

Speaker 3 (06:51):
Or garlic. At this point, I'm.

Speaker 1 (06:54):
Just some basic questions, right, you know what You're not
wrong to ask?

Speaker 5 (07:00):
Walking around with pop callars, Yeah, exactly, sleep the time
they want to move to Seattle, there's they're glittering exactly.

Speaker 3 (07:10):
Also, you mentioned something that was a little triggering for me.
Oh no, I'm going to be totally honest with you.

Speaker 1 (07:14):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (07:15):
I don't know if I've ever told either you or
ride or this because it is something from my past
that I try.

Speaker 3 (07:20):
To keep to myself.

Speaker 1 (07:21):
Oh my gosh, but I was a leash child.

Speaker 7 (07:25):
Wait wait, wait, I was harness was actually run your
neck exactly.

Speaker 3 (07:33):
It was the body harness, seventies leash thing.

Speaker 6 (07:36):
I don't even know there were around in the seventies.

Speaker 2 (07:38):
I don't think they started in the seventies. I don't
think they're allowed even allowed anymore, can you?

Speaker 6 (07:44):
I saw it was like in the nineties because yeah.

Speaker 3 (07:48):
Yeah, I Wilfredell was a leash child.

Speaker 1 (07:50):
Wow, So because you were a sprinter, you were a darter.

Speaker 3 (07:54):
I don't know, I don't know what it was.

Speaker 2 (07:56):
I think it was just by the third kid, just
easier to leash the kid up, tie me to a
tree so I could hand me a pack of smokes
and call it a day.

Speaker 3 (08:04):
So you know I was a leash kid.

Speaker 8 (08:08):
Yeah, that's amazing.

Speaker 2 (08:09):
So when you said the leash like take put on
a helmet, that was I didn't have a helmet, but
because no one wore helmets of the seventies.

Speaker 1 (08:15):
Of course not.

Speaker 2 (08:16):
It's like, hey, then throw the kid in the back
of a motorcycle, We're fine.

Speaker 3 (08:18):
But no, I was a leash child.

Speaker 8 (08:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (08:20):
Wow, Indy had a friend who would just run, like.

Speaker 1 (08:24):
Just didn't like a dog.

Speaker 6 (08:26):
Did you have that like radar to stay near his parents?

Speaker 8 (08:29):
Like?

Speaker 5 (08:30):
He would just disappear, So they had to start writing
their phone number on his arm, you know, just a
case across.

Speaker 9 (08:37):
What about a dog?

Speaker 3 (08:39):
Airt who sponsored us?

Speaker 1 (08:42):
So don't we have an air tag sponsor somebody like that? Yeah, yeah,
we sure do.

Speaker 2 (08:45):
Yeah, if your if your child runs away on pod
Meats World.

Speaker 1 (08:50):
Wow, that's so funny. Welcome to pod Meets World. I'm
Daniel Fishel, I'm rather strong, and I'm Wilford.

Speaker 4 (09:08):
Over the years, there's been a certain type of television
show that emerges from the depths of low Nielsen ratings.
This isn't the Friends or Cheers or Seinfeld's of its day.
It's the cult classic, the one that may not have
received the kudos and awards during its initial run, but
over time, decades later, it somehow survived and outlasted its

(09:31):
peers shows like Freaks and Geeks, Get a Life, The
Dana Carvey Show, Boy Meets World, and the show we
will be talking about today because our guest is none
other than the beloved QB two from a little show
called Friday Night Lights. Much like Tapanga, Sean or Eric,
he'll always be known as Matt Sarason, the scrawnee kid

(09:53):
who was thrust into the Texas football spotlight when the
star player went down with a career ending injury during
the season opener, and somehow that was his first real
job in Hollywood. He has since gone on to appear
in dozens of TV shows, including Good Girls and his
current run as a serial killer on Criminal Minds. And

(10:14):
he's part of the Mike Flanagan Netflix Cinematic Universe, starring
in The Great Midnight Mass and appearing in the Fall
of the House of Usher and The Midnight Club. But
he's here with us today to talk about what it's
like to be part of a show that will just
never go away, despite the fact that it was always
on the bubble of cancelation. We have a similar best

(10:35):
case scenario in our lives and we wanted to see
what he thought. Now approaching Friday Night Light's twentieth anniversary, so.

Speaker 1 (10:42):
Welcome to Pod meets World.

Speaker 4 (10:43):
Ready to throw a perfect spiral to our hearts.

Speaker 1 (10:46):
It's Zach Gilford.

Speaker 2 (10:49):
Zach, are you.

Speaker 8 (10:52):
Guys are so professional with your setups? I got this
stupid death though?

Speaker 1 (10:57):
Is that a bunch of booze in the top left?

Speaker 8 (11:00):
Don't worry about what's in the top.

Speaker 6 (11:06):
To some breakfastin.

Speaker 8 (11:07):
It's not using. It's just there for later.

Speaker 1 (11:13):
Zach, thank you so much for hanging out with us.

Speaker 4 (11:16):
We have been trying to get you on the podcast
for a while because we often talk about modern day
equivalents to Boy Meets World, and the best example we
can come up with is Friday Night Lights.

Speaker 9 (11:29):
Well, that's way too kind because y'all show is like
iconic to me and people don't even know my character.

Speaker 1 (11:35):
Name, So no, that's not true.

Speaker 4 (11:39):
Actually, have you accepted that the first line of your
obituary will probably say Saracen.

Speaker 8 (11:44):
It will probably say like Sorensen or something like that. No,
it's like people they're like Matt Scarison. I'm like, enough.

Speaker 5 (11:56):
Now we still get like Boys meets Boys, get the
title right, and we're like, it's fun.

Speaker 8 (12:01):
It's while ago it.

Speaker 3 (12:03):
Was a show that's like, yeah, exactly, I was on
the show on the.

Speaker 4 (12:11):
Oh. Well, next year is going to mark the twenty
twentieth anniversary since the premiere, fifteen years since it went
off the air. How often does Friday night Lights still
come up for you?

Speaker 8 (12:23):
I mean all the time. Sorry, I have like fidget toys,
I can't sit still.

Speaker 3 (12:27):
That's okay, it comes up a lot.

Speaker 8 (12:30):
I mean it's great.

Speaker 9 (12:30):
It's I mean, as you guys know, it's so cool
to be associated with something that holds such a.

Speaker 8 (12:36):
Special part in people's lives.

Speaker 9 (12:39):
And I think as actors, you're lucky to have one
project that really kind of strikes with people. And I
think for me, I always feel kind of like, because
I play Make Belief for a living.

Speaker 8 (12:52):
To have people validate that for me good. It's really
nice because I love you believe. You're still getting baking
and I'm like, don't talk to my kids about it.

Speaker 9 (13:04):
They're like, pretend you're a tiger and you said, Oh
my god, you're so cute. I'm like, oh my god,
you're so cute.

Speaker 6 (13:12):
Let's try it again. Let's try it again.

Speaker 8 (13:16):
A commitment. I can't.

Speaker 4 (13:20):
I know that you grew up near Chicago. You're not
a Hollywood kid at all.

Speaker 1 (13:25):
So how did you get into acting?

Speaker 9 (13:29):
I mean I got into it, I mean my story,
your origin. I remember I saw Diehard Too and Bruce
Willis was hanging off the wing of a plane, and
I just.

Speaker 8 (13:40):
Thought, that looks so cool. I want to do that.
And I realized the only way I'll ever do that
is if.

Speaker 9 (13:45):
I'm an actor and I make believe to hang off
the wing of a plane.

Speaker 8 (13:50):
Then I just said I want to be an actor.

Speaker 9 (13:52):
My parents were very supportive, and they were like, well,
if you want to be an actor, you got to
go to Northwestern.

Speaker 8 (13:57):
I grew up around Chicago.

Speaker 3 (14:00):
I went to Northwestern.

Speaker 2 (14:02):
Yeah, Bill, Bill Daniels, and Bonnie I think went to Northwestern.

Speaker 8 (14:05):
Oh okay, yeah, yeah, pretty sure.

Speaker 3 (14:07):
That's where they met.

Speaker 9 (14:08):
They brainwashed people into thinking it's one of the top
acting schools. So I was brainwashed earlier that I had
to go there, and and everyone was surprised I got
in me more than anyone, and I went there and
you know, just took classes, did a bunch of plays,
and then I just got very very very lucky early
in my career. And not just lucky like preparation meets opportunity,

(14:32):
but like they didn't even want me for the show.
They wanted someone else and they couldn't work out the
dates with him. This kid was like already pre booked
on a Disney TV movie that was shooting in New Zealand,
and I guess his manager had, you know, just kept
telling NBC, we can work out the dates. We can
work out the dates, and they kept trying, and they
finally are like, we shoot this show in like four days,

(14:55):
and they didn't have time to cast anyone else. And
I was the first to have tested against him, and
just by default because people wanted this kid, and Linda Lowie,
the casting director, was like, well, you need to have
someone else there. He's like, I don't need anyone else there.
That's who I want, and they're like, well, just bring
someone else in. He's like why, and Linda was like,
well what about Zach.

Speaker 2 (15:12):
He was good.

Speaker 8 (15:13):
He's like, I don't care, bring it. Sorry. He was like,
I don't care, bring whoever you want.

Speaker 9 (15:17):
And then I was last man standing and got the
job and just did my best.

Speaker 2 (15:22):
Wow, I'm sorry, I have why why did you start
with die Hard too?

Speaker 1 (15:29):
Yeah? Not even one.

Speaker 9 (15:31):
I didn't want to walk across broken glass, you know,
I don't know.

Speaker 8 (15:37):
I just remember that being the moment when I was like,
that seems fun. Yeah, I want to do that, and
I guess this is the only way it's going to happen.

Speaker 4 (15:45):
So you did that one test where you tested opposite
the guy they really wanted I know who?

Speaker 8 (15:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 9 (15:54):
No, I actually I had auditioned originally for Taylor Kitchen's
role for Riggins while I was in New York, and
it was like a month later because I was before
the holidays. And then it was January and I was
in LA for my first pilot season and my manager
was like, they want to see you again for Friday Lights.

Speaker 8 (16:10):
I said, oh great. When he said this afternoon, I
was like, I literally just drove into La. I'm not
even into the place I'm staying yet.

Speaker 9 (16:18):
So I went I printed like I think I have
the sides in my email somewhere, and I went to
Starbucks and like hand wrote the sides out and remember these.

Speaker 8 (16:27):
And I go in.

Speaker 9 (16:28):
I talked to Linda Lowie and she's like, okay, great,
you're a read. I said, yeah, let's go and she
said you're reading for Matt right, And I was like
what I thought I was reading for Tim. She's like, oh, no,
I wanted to.

Speaker 8 (16:39):
See you for Matt.

Speaker 9 (16:40):
And I said, oh, well, can I just look at
it real quick? Like can I have five minutes you
can see someone else? And then she said don't don't
worry about it, and I said no.

Speaker 8 (16:49):
No, I'm very worried. I would love to do this.

Speaker 9 (16:52):
Look, I'll do cold read. Just give it to me,
like I'll go. And she was like, no, no, I'm
sure you'll be fine. I'll bring you in for producers
next week. And I was like okay. So there was
like many roles, rolls, rounds of you know, going in
my first time. When I was suposed to go in
for producers, Pete Berg came story like. I was like, next,
I was in the on deck chair sitting by the

(17:12):
door to go in, and he like stormed out on
the phone and got in the elemantor and the.

Speaker 8 (17:17):
Casting came out and said sorry, he just needed to
take a phone call. He'll be back in a minute.

Speaker 9 (17:22):
I was like, okay, I mean, I got no order
to be And so then he came back in and
there's this kid who I'm convinced just for the lore
of the story was the kid that he wanted, and
it was this I call.

Speaker 8 (17:35):
Him football Boy. He's literally holding a football for the audition,
like bro, like what a nerd? And of course Pete
Burg goes, who are you. He's like, I'm I don't
even remember his name.

Speaker 6 (17:49):
Football guy.

Speaker 8 (17:50):
Yeah, he's like, I'm a football boy. And he's like,
I want to see football boy. And the casting director
was like, well.

Speaker 9 (17:55):
It's Zach's up. We can see football boy. Next he
was like, no, I want to see football boy. They're like, okay, Zach,
you might like I don't mind, Sure, go ahead, st
I have fun, right, So football boy goes.

Speaker 6 (18:05):
In, go for it, Brad.

Speaker 9 (18:07):
Yeah. Football boy comes out, and then Pete Burg comes
out again and gets the elevator.

Speaker 8 (18:11):
And leaves again. Oh Goshin comes out again and says.

Speaker 9 (18:14):
I'm so sorry Pete had to leave reading to the
other producers. Of course, you're like, no, I don't mind
reading for the producer so I go in, I read,
and then like, we're gonna bring it back for Pete.

Speaker 8 (18:24):
And then oh gosh, I came back for Pete.

Speaker 9 (18:26):
And then I tested for the studio and got to
go to the network. And the super fun thing about
Pete Burg and the way we did that show is
he likes to improve a lot. So I go in
for my network test, which is at that point in time,
it was the version where you go into a room
and there's all these execs sitting on like window sills
and like desks and like in one office, and Pete's like,

(18:47):
all right, I'm gonna read with you, like okay, and
he gives me the first line of the scene, which
is with my Grandma, and I give him a second
and then he just starts.

Speaker 8 (18:54):
Making it up.

Speaker 1 (18:55):
Oh my gosh.

Speaker 9 (18:56):
I was just like in my head, I was just like,
I guess I'll just go with it. And he did
that to everyone. I think part of it was that's
the way he likes to work on sets. We wanted
to see, yeah, sure could do it, so you know,
eventually blah blah blah, football boy couldn't do it.

Speaker 1 (19:11):
And so there it was unbelievable.

Speaker 3 (19:14):
Well, you were great, but you weren't holding the football next, you.

Speaker 1 (19:17):
Know, and no imagination.

Speaker 8 (19:20):
I brought a prop to every audition.

Speaker 4 (19:21):
So now, had you read the book or seen the
documentary before you read the pilot?

Speaker 8 (19:32):
Both?

Speaker 9 (19:33):
Yeah, I'd seen the movie and I loved it. And
I actually had read the book because I loved.

Speaker 8 (19:39):
The movie so much and I'm a pretty avid reader.

Speaker 9 (19:43):
And Pete said, which is really cool, that when he
was making the movie, he realized it needed to be
a TV show because he said, you know, I have
ninety minutes to tell one story. It's the story of
the season of this team, and the movie was based
on a true story, so you have to tell that.
But he was like, I want to know story about
this car salesman or you know Connie Britton's she was

(20:04):
the coach's wife in the movie, and they wanted to
hear do the show, and she said no several times
because she's just appt I wasn't in the movie, like
my goal was on the cutting room floor, and he
just had to convince her and say, no, no, no, the
show is going to be it's not about football, which
became kind of like the big thing with the show, right,
and you know, obviously she went on to be nominated

(20:24):
for Emmys and all this sort of stuff.

Speaker 8 (20:25):
It was an amazing role, but it is it's not
about football.

Speaker 9 (20:29):
It's about this town and this culture and these people
and how it affects them. And you know, I last
a couple of years ago, for the first time I
ever went back and watched some of the show, and
I was really not surprised but excited.

Speaker 8 (20:43):
How well it held up.

Speaker 9 (20:44):
But it really made me realize, man, like some of
the actors on that show, like Adrian Pelicky is just
like the unsung hero of that show.

Speaker 8 (20:52):
I feel like what she brought to this character that's
supposed to just be like, you.

Speaker 9 (20:56):
Know, the kind of like not slutty, but like promiscuous,
tall blonde who's not a cheerleader, and how they fleshed
out that character and she just brought so much to it.
And then you know, had the infamous season two storyline
of the murder with.

Speaker 4 (21:12):
Justin Yeah I wanted to get into the murder, oh.

Speaker 9 (21:15):
Yeah, and like only a future Oscar nominated actor and
Adrian could pull off this plot line because the whole
time I'm watching him like this storyline is so bad.

Speaker 8 (21:26):
But they're so good at acting it.

Speaker 4 (21:28):
Yeah, So I want to talk to you about the
murder because, uh, they decided it was season two, right
that they decided to bring in the storyline of a murder.

Speaker 8 (21:39):
Well, no, actually it was season one. In the finalite,
they have no so they do the whole murder, okay.

Speaker 9 (21:46):
And I remember reading it and talking to Sarah auvery
one of our producers, and I wasn't involved in it.

Speaker 8 (21:50):
That I was like, this seems like a bit of
a stretch, I know, but we just.

Speaker 9 (21:57):
Think and we just we really wanted a world where
we really linked Tyra and Landry together because we just
love those two characters together, and we thought we'd give
it a try. And she told me before permiere, she
was like, you're gonna be really happy. We had to
cut the murder storyline, like it just didn't fit in
the finale. I was like, oh, thank goodness. And then
we go back for a season two. They're like, but
we loved it so much. So this poor guy that

(22:21):
they murdered in the finale season one, not poor guy,
he got paid again, but like he had to come
in and get murdered again.

Speaker 4 (22:29):
Okay, it was a pretty flawless show. Up until the
point of that storyline, and then it was pretty universally
agreed this was not good and so how.

Speaker 1 (22:43):
Did they just move on from that?

Speaker 4 (22:47):
Like, let's pretend that didn't happen and not mention it again.

Speaker 2 (22:50):
SOWANSI lands the motorcycle after he jumps the shark.

Speaker 3 (22:54):
That's how you keep going totally.

Speaker 8 (22:56):
I think it's It's one of the beauties of TV
is you can.

Speaker 1 (22:59):
Just yeah, ten things didn't happen right right.

Speaker 9 (23:02):
And you know we we wel always ust around. Like
I said, we got to improv a lot, and so
often in scenes.

Speaker 8 (23:07):
For the duration of the show, we'd be, you know,
shooting some scene in the locker room or something and
just out of know everything.

Speaker 9 (23:14):
Oh hey, hey, remember when you murdered that guy?

Speaker 8 (23:18):
That was crazy. I'm glad you got away with it.

Speaker 4 (23:29):
I want to talk to you about I want to
flatter you a bit, because it is true. You play
Saracen with such a subtle under just a really subtle performance,
and you have a lot of layers. When I have
worked with young actors who aren't super experienced, the usual
go to is they turn it up to eleven and

(23:51):
we're always trying to bring people back. How did you
just kind of instinctually or how did you know to
play so many off layers and emotions?

Speaker 9 (24:01):
Ah, Man, I don't know. I think I think again,
I think I got lucky. I think I'm very scared
to do anything over the top.

Speaker 1 (24:09):
Ever, okay, me too, Not true, Not true.

Speaker 8 (24:16):
So I just try to underplay everything.

Speaker 9 (24:19):
And you know, after a while, as you guys know
so well on TV, you know your character so well,
and on the pilot even we got rewrites, you know,
at that point they were slid under our hotel room
door and it was blue pages, yellow pages, whatever. And
I remember going up to Pete Bergen saying, Hey, I
think can we talk about these rewrites? And he was
like huh, And I was like, I just feel like

(24:40):
you gave me too many lines, Like this kid doesn't
talk a lot, and like now he's like and he
was like, what are you talking about.

Speaker 8 (24:49):
It's like the rewrits we got to goes. Don't read those,
We're not gonna shoot those.

Speaker 9 (24:52):
Those are just for the studio because they don't understand
what's going on, so we have to spell it out.

Speaker 8 (24:58):
So often.

Speaker 9 (24:58):
And I think a lot of this trick down obviously
from Pete, and then Jeffrey Ryaner who I was, who
was our producing director, took over and I think really
took the baton from Pete really well.

Speaker 8 (25:08):
But Kyle was great about it, where you would get
these long, page long.

Speaker 9 (25:13):
TV monologues that just really laid pipe and explained everything,
just to make sure the audience really understood what was
going on inside of a character. And Kylo would be like,
I'm just gonna say this one sentence, that's it. I'd
be like, you're right, that is all we need. I
had this one, I think it was season two. My
dad comes back from you know, Iraq or something, and

(25:36):
I just remember being in the he's like working as
a used car sales and I got him the job
and I go up and there's been all this friction
and they gave me this whole long.

Speaker 8 (25:43):
Thing and and part of one line was like Dad,
look at me. I'm a man now. And I was
just like, oh god, I'm not going to say that.

Speaker 9 (25:52):
And like what it boiled down to was on said
I just said, Dad, I got this, and they're like, yeah,
that's all we need. That's great, that explains it. So
I think we liked that in that. But really I
think a lot of us learn from Kyle just how to, like,
you know, explain, not explain the show what's going on
with a character, not by explaining it, which I don't know.

Speaker 8 (26:16):
It was the tone of the show. I learned so
much from it. I think one of my strengths now
when I'm working is being able to.

Speaker 9 (26:24):
Boil things down kind of like cut some fat. And
I've been really lucky to work with a lot of creators,
a lot of writers who are very open to it
and very much know, like this thing has gone through
so many drafts and you know the characters so well,
and now we're collaborating with you. So it's it's always
fun for me to see, like how how how few

(26:47):
lines can I say across when I have one? One
director I worked with several times and I love him,
and he was like, I also do this thing where
a lot of times I'll be like, I don't think
I need to be in this scene.

Speaker 8 (27:05):
I mean, you know you're gonna have to shoot so
many angles. I don't think I'm important and you could
get out of here in two hours instead of four.
And he was like, Zach is the only actor I've
ever met who doesn't want to act.

Speaker 2 (27:16):
Yeah, so far you've said there's too many lines.

Speaker 3 (27:19):
I don't need to be in the scene. These are
things on no actors Bengo card Ever.

Speaker 8 (27:24):
I think I also just did so much because that
was a football shuttle. So there's so many scenes where
you're in them but not in them. It's like it's
in the locker room there, you gotta be there.

Speaker 9 (27:32):
So I mean, if I don't know how much you'll
actually see, but there's so many scenes where you'll probably
see me in the background just tying my shoe, yeah,
and then walking out.

Speaker 8 (27:40):
I'm like, if I mean, I don't know what I'm doing.

Speaker 1 (27:42):
I come in, I grab an apple, and I leave.

Speaker 8 (27:45):
Yeah, exactly. I put on my shoulder pads and so
I did.

Speaker 9 (27:48):
I recently was directing in an episode of something that
I was working on, Criminal Minds, and I told our idea.
I was like, I want in the background one of
these FBI agents to stop and tie their shoe.

Speaker 1 (28:02):
That's what happens in real life we have.

Speaker 8 (28:05):
Yeah, I was like, I don't want you to tell
me who it is. I just wanted to happen. It's
gonna be like a game of where's Waldo? For me?

Speaker 9 (28:13):
And it was just like this game that we played
and it so is like in the background I can
see it. I'm so mad because in the cut I
see the guy walk in and start to bend down
and just at the angle you can't see it happen.
It was a really fun game we played.

Speaker 5 (28:28):
So you were you guys improv all through all five seasons.
You were always allowed to like sort of yeah, I
mean that that sets you up. I mean I think
that's amazing. But there are a lot of sets where
they don't want that. So have you run into the
problem of like trying to do it on another set
and like they'll be like, say, what's written?

Speaker 9 (28:48):
Yeah, and a little bit. I will say most most sets.
I have not been on Gilmore Girls, Oddly enough, I did.
I auditioned for Aaron Sorkin one, and this feedback was like,
good job, you knew all the lines.

Speaker 3 (29:05):
Well, that's what it takes to be on a narrow
sorcin show.

Speaker 2 (29:07):
Yeah, can you talk and say all the lines at
the same time.

Speaker 3 (29:10):
Great, you're an actor, baste. Yeah, that's it.

Speaker 9 (29:12):
But most people love to collaborate and they like really
respect what actors bring to it, and I think I'm.

Speaker 8 (29:19):
Very fortunate to be a point in my career where
people know, like they know who I.

Speaker 9 (29:24):
Am and they think I know what they're getting. And
I always try to now as opposed to just mess around.
Like there's certain things on set where like I just
it's in the moment I'm like, oh, this is what
needs to happen, or it's ever like I'm just going
to change the scene.

Speaker 8 (29:38):
What's happening right now. The real thing that happened would
be this.

Speaker 9 (29:43):
But I try to like go through it and do
my homework before and go to the give them the
respect of like, hey, I want to change this to this.

Speaker 8 (29:51):
I kind of want to do that.

Speaker 9 (29:52):
I'm feeling here, I'm going to have this kind of
impulse and they're usually like, all right, great, let's see
what happens.

Speaker 8 (29:57):
I do remember I didn't know this.

Speaker 9 (30:02):
But so I just finished my run on Criminal Minds
and it was such an amazing set and they were
very open to my way of working, which was great
for me. And apparently they call it rehearsal Zach because
I don't rehearse. I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, what
is the point I'm not going to do this until
the cameras are running. They're like, and I'm just like,

(30:25):
I make fun of the lines the whole time if
we're rehearsing, which is kind of just like a jerk
move on my part.

Speaker 8 (30:30):
But so apparently during we had had we were on
set and.

Speaker 9 (30:34):
There was one line and I came up to Eric
our show and I was like, hey, Erica, hey this line.
She's like, You're not going to say it. I was
like yeah, She's like I could tell on the table
read you were.

Speaker 8 (30:43):
Never going to say it. I said, I'm literally during
the table because it was on zoom, she said. I
turned to the director. I was like, he's never going
to say this line.

Speaker 9 (30:52):
And then the funny thing is I didn't make the connection,
but I was so a j Cook, who's one of
my co stars, was joking about rehearsal Zach and this
was during the finale, and I was like yeah, and
I said the story about the table reach. He goes,
was it the line something about and I was like yes,
She's like that was my episode. I remember in the
table read, Eric attorney to me and be like, he's

(31:12):
never going to say it.

Speaker 1 (31:13):
Bother Oh my gosh, that's so funny.

Speaker 4 (31:17):
Another similarity between Friday Night Lights and Boy Meets World
is that we were both told that we were.

Speaker 1 (31:23):
Always on the bubble. It must have.

Speaker 4 (31:25):
Been very I mean we've heard nah since then that
we weren't as much on the bubble as.

Speaker 1 (31:31):
We were told.

Speaker 3 (31:32):
We didn't know that.

Speaker 4 (31:33):
We did not know that. And literally, at the end
of every season, it was a big who knows, fingers crossed,
maybe we'll get to do another season.

Speaker 1 (31:44):
Were did you have that same feeling? Were you always
nervous at the end of a season?

Speaker 8 (31:49):
Oh? Yeah, I mean I think we are canceled twice.

Speaker 9 (31:53):
And then I think it was and then a bunch
of people sent Light Bulbs to NBC because they were.

Speaker 8 (31:58):
Owned by ge at the time.

Speaker 9 (32:00):
I don't know if they still Oh, and there was
this ground swell which helped. And then so season's four
and five, Direct TV swooped in and they basically took
over half the cost of production and they got to
air it first on DirecTV in the fall, and then
it aired on NBC in the spring. So the last

(32:20):
two seasons, we knew we had two more seasons and
that was the end. But yeah, it always was like man,
I hope. I you know, as much as I wanted
to do the show, I also was like I just
need to.

Speaker 1 (32:31):
Plan my rent in my yeah and got bills.

Speaker 6 (32:35):
Yeah.

Speaker 8 (32:36):
And it was me.

Speaker 6 (32:37):
You were always critically doing incredibly well right like.

Speaker 9 (32:40):
And it was really annoying, but it was like, I
feel like more people watch it now than did then,
and you know, they are a sour grapes about like
I think our first season we premiered on Tuesdays and everyone's.

Speaker 8 (32:51):
Like, how could you put Friday Lights on Tuesdays? That's
confusing and I'm.

Speaker 1 (32:54):
Like, really your calendar.

Speaker 2 (33:01):
But ways, there another similarity that our shows have is
the fandom, because Friday Night Lights has a rabid fandom.
So have you had an opportunity, I mean we've we've
been really lucky in doing some conventions and things like
that where we can really get in there and interact
and see how much the show has impacted people. Have
you had that opportunity to kind of be with some

(33:24):
of your fans and realize how important Friday Night Lights
was to them?

Speaker 9 (33:27):
I mean just in like passing people coming up to
me and stuff. I haven't done any consent or anything.

Speaker 1 (33:31):
I have tried to get Zacha Khan agent.

Speaker 8 (33:35):
I'm gonna do my first one, okay in Detroit next month.
But I've gone.

Speaker 9 (33:41):
I have a friend who does them a lot, and
I've gone and visited her just to like break break
it up for her. And it is funny like people
they get so confused you.

Speaker 8 (33:53):
I'm like, no photos are free with me.

Speaker 1 (33:56):
I'm just here for the fun of it.

Speaker 8 (33:58):
I'm just here. I'm a big fan to hold the football. Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 4 (34:08):
You shared so much of your storyline with Landry, who
was played by a young, very green actor named Jesse Plemmons.
Your chemistry was so real, so believable. What do you
think made that such a good partnership between you two him?

Speaker 9 (34:27):
I mean, I always say, and I don't mean this jokingly,
like I lucked out on that show so much because
most of myself was with Jesse or Kyle or my grandmother.

Speaker 1 (34:37):
Yeah, Kyle Chandler who played the coach.

Speaker 9 (34:39):
Yeah, and we went Stevens, Who's like I loved this
day and just like we had this. I was like
protective over her and she would bring me newspaper clippings
from Dallas.

Speaker 8 (34:49):
Where she lived.

Speaker 9 (34:50):
If I was in the newspaper, and she was just phenomenal.
But Jesse and I, I don't know, we just hit
it off. And I remember during the pilot I told
because he's from Texas, he's from Waco, and I was like, hey, man,
if my accent sounds stupid or fake or whatever, like,
please tell me.

Speaker 8 (35:06):
He's like, okay, he.

Speaker 9 (35:08):
Never did it, thankfully, but we just hit it off
and we're still like super close friends to this day.
And I remember when we were shooting the pilot in
the first week, during like prep, he had an episode
of Gray's Anatomy that was gonna air where he was
like something that made his face look like a lion.
I don't know, oh crazy anatomy.

Speaker 8 (35:30):
So I was like, oh, I should watch this episode.
I remember watching him like, oh my god, this kid
is so.

Speaker 1 (35:36):
Good, right, even with the lion face.

Speaker 9 (35:38):
Yeah, even with the lion face, I could see I
can see the boy beneath the lion face, and yeah,
he just was so good.

Speaker 8 (35:47):
And we just hit it off.

Speaker 9 (35:48):
And he's such an old soul. I mean, this makes
me sound like a loser, but you know, I think
he was seventeen or eighteen when we shot.

Speaker 8 (35:56):
It, and I was like twenty two. Or twenty three.
But yeah, we were.

Speaker 9 (35:59):
Just like super close, those super fast friends. And he's
so funny man. Like again, I feel like I'm edited
out of those scenes so often because I couldn't keep
a straight face and due to the improv and it lends.

Speaker 8 (36:13):
Itself so well to his character. He could just say
the randomest things, but they were so within character that
you're just like.

Speaker 6 (36:22):
What are you talking about.

Speaker 9 (36:24):
I was to be here and like go with it.
And the one thing I couldn't I couldn't realize watching
it back a couple of years ago, some of the
things that we got to say I am embarrassed and offended.

Speaker 8 (36:37):
By, Like we had to drop the R word. Not
got to, but we would like drop the R word,
like you'd say something stupid.

Speaker 9 (36:43):
I'm like, you're really right, and I'm just like this
was on NBC.

Speaker 8 (36:49):
Oh my god. So yeah, I don't know.

Speaker 9 (36:52):
We just had like an instant chemistry. He's such a
good guy. He's just the most amazing person to be
in a scene with. And I remember I've seen probably
all of his work, but I remember watching Killer the
Flower Moon and just being so proud of him.

Speaker 8 (37:05):
Nothing I need to, but he's just in scenes with.

Speaker 9 (37:08):
De Niro and DiCaprio, just like holding his own like, yeah,
I should be here, you should be good for you
so great.

Speaker 4 (37:17):
Oh, I know we saw Scott Porter at your daughter's
birthday a few years ago.

Speaker 1 (37:20):
So are you guys still close to Yeah.

Speaker 8 (37:22):
We're still good buddies. Him and I have always been like.

Speaker 9 (37:26):
We lived together for part of the first season because
I was off. I used to lead like backpacking trips
or high school kids, and that going into the first
season after the pilot I worked in I worked in
New Zealand leading trips for kids, and I was there
for months, and so I literally flew from New Zealand

(37:47):
to Texas, you know, a day before we started shooting.
I had like a duffel bag and I hadn't gone
down and figured out a place to live. So I
slept on his couch for like a month, and we
just got really tight. And then the last season two
and three or season two, I forget when he left,
but we were roommates.

Speaker 8 (38:05):
Yeah, we're just like very brotherly.

Speaker 9 (38:07):
And we actually were at the final network test together,
which was an odd one.

Speaker 8 (38:12):
I don't think they usually do it this.

Speaker 9 (38:13):
Way, but they were testing like six roles, and so
we're in a conference room and it's me and football
Boy and you know, it was Minka and whoever else
was testing for her part, Annie, whoever was testing for
her part. Jesse was not there, Amy was there, Scott
was there, and maybe Guias and whoever else we're testing
for their roles and you're kind of there. You're like

(38:34):
getting to know people because you're sitting there for hours
and you're being nice to the person you're testing again,
but you don't really want to get to know them, right,
And me and Scott hit it off, and he had
been flown in from New York, and I was like, do.

Speaker 8 (38:46):
You need a ride home?

Speaker 9 (38:49):
And I didn't know that wasn't something you really did
in LA, right because I didn't live here, and so.

Speaker 8 (38:54):
I gave him right home.

Speaker 9 (38:54):
We're like, you know, I feel like it should be
that person and that person, and we named everyone, including me,
but we were wrong about me.

Speaker 8 (39:01):
But we got But yeah, we've headed off ever since,
Like the testing process.

Speaker 1 (39:07):
That's so funny.

Speaker 4 (39:08):
I can only imagine people kind of freak out when
they see QB one and QB two out together.

Speaker 8 (39:13):
Yeah, well, well always QB two always.

Speaker 4 (39:30):
There have been whispers over the last year or so
about a possible reboot. Would you be willing to come
back and play a coach or what could you tell
us about that?

Speaker 8 (39:43):
I mean, I know nothing about it.

Speaker 9 (39:44):
All I know is it's Pete and it's Jason Catoms, who.

Speaker 8 (39:47):
Is our head writer for the run of the show.
So and I know it's I know it's meant to
be a complete reboot where it's just the same concept,
but it's a different town. It's I think there was
like a hurricane that's ravaged. I don't know, I've just
heard whispers. As far as I know, none of us
are supposed to be involved because it's supposed to be all.

Speaker 1 (40:08):
New, like a whole thing.

Speaker 8 (40:09):
Yeah, if there was an authentic version where Matt Sarason
showed up for some reason, okay, cool.

Speaker 9 (40:18):
But I think the beauty of that show was that
it felt so real, like so many of us left
the show.

Speaker 8 (40:24):
And Pete had planned that at the beginning, because he
was like.

Speaker 9 (40:26):
This is about a high school football team in the
community around it, and people graduate and they leave, some don't,
but a lot of you do. And so a lot
of us left the show. And I think if we
just found reasons to keep all of us around for
five seasons or whatever. I would have taken away from it.
And I think to just like have all of us

(40:47):
cameo on the show might seem a little wonky and
take away from it. The funny thing was, you know,
the first season, we all assumed that Taylor was a senior,
and like because he was best friends with Jason Street,
it was a senior blah blah blah, and then nothing
against it. I love Taylor and his characters great. In
season two, it's like, oh, he's on the football team again.

(41:09):
I guess he was a junior last year. And then
it was season three and we're like, oh, you're still.

Speaker 2 (41:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 8 (41:20):
What a loser I was because I was treating this
guy like he's two years older than me, but apparently
we're peers.

Speaker 4 (41:29):
I also wanted to ask you about your numerous collaborations
with Mike Flanagan and Netflix.

Speaker 1 (41:34):
You were also in a Purge movie. You did you
like horror movies before all of this?

Speaker 9 (41:40):
You know, I like good movies, and we're such like,
I've come to learn such a huge umbrella. I think
growing up, I just thought it was like slasher films,
like the thirteenth third we're in Elm Street. But you know,
it's just all sorts of films, and I do know
like with Flanning In I had seen Haunting a Hell
House and thought it was amazing, and I remember binging

(42:01):
it like the holiday weekend, the Halloween weekend it came out,
and so when I got that audition, it was, you know,
super top secret. All I had was the sides. I
had no idea anything about the show, and so I
just had to like memorize these two scenes, go in
and do them and hope for the best, knowing absolutely nothing,

(42:21):
and working with him was so awesome. Like he is again,
he's someone who really wants you to memorize his lines.

Speaker 8 (42:26):
He's very much in a tour and to fear them
all out.

Speaker 9 (42:30):
And I knew that going in, So when I would
do my homework, I would send him screenshots or photos
of like my notes and say.

Speaker 8 (42:37):
Can I change this? Can I do that nine ten
times out of ten? And he'd be like, that's great,
go for it. All good. And he has.

Speaker 9 (42:44):
Everything shot listed, as I know most directors do, but
like super shot listed, where he makes this huge poster
board that's out for the whole crew to see, so
everyone knows exactly what's gonna happen all day. But at
the same time, if he had planned a scene where
I'm standing in the corner, my dad comes in and
we're talking, and then I was like, I feel like
I'd be sitting on the bed, like why am I
standing in the corner, he'd be like, and it totally

(43:07):
changes the cameras.

Speaker 8 (43:08):
He just yeah, you're right, okay, and like change it
all up.

Speaker 9 (43:12):
My one favorite thing with him was when I did
follow the House Usher with him. There was these lines
where my character is saying a poem in bed to
his wife, and I guess I'm dumb because I thought
it was just a poem that my character was making up.
And I write Mike and I was like, you know,
I feel like it would flow better if it was

(43:34):
diplay And I said that, and he's like, yeah, that's
an actual word poem.

Speaker 8 (43:43):
We're gonna go ahead and give it the way it is.

Speaker 10 (43:47):
Knew what he was doing, but anyway, I was like, oh,
I want to read the rest of this poem, and
I googled it and I was like, well, Mike, I'm
sorry to tell you this, but you guys.

Speaker 9 (43:59):
Wrote the poem wrong them really, that's like I wasn't
exactly right, but my version is closer to the real thing.

Speaker 8 (44:06):
That fair enough, fair enough.

Speaker 1 (44:10):
That's so funny.

Speaker 4 (44:12):
I mean these projects have like twenty five minute one shots.

Speaker 1 (44:17):
What is it? What is it like working on something
like that?

Speaker 8 (44:20):
You know, I've always been really lucky.

Speaker 9 (44:21):
Memorizing lines is pretty easy for me, and that's kind
of the first step for me is I know my
stuff so that then I can just like do something else,
or if the lines work perfect, I can just do
them and be interacting with people as opposed to like
I mean, it drives me nuts when actors don't. Yeah,
like as an actor, as a director, I'm like, oh god, please,

(44:44):
like just.

Speaker 8 (44:44):
Know your lines.

Speaker 1 (44:45):
Yes, this is the one your one job, the one thing.

Speaker 8 (44:47):
My biggest thing I learned in college.

Speaker 9 (44:50):
I had a professor and he was like, know your lines,
know you're blocking, and don't bump into the furniture.

Speaker 8 (44:56):
That's all you have to do. And it's like kind
of true. But yeah, those one ares they're so fun.
I mean they're like a play and you go through
it a lot.

Speaker 9 (45:08):
And we had this one where I remember midnight mass
our Big Wonner was on a beach with all these
dead seagulls and it's going through all the people of
the town. And yeah, we rehearsed it like four times.

Speaker 8 (45:18):
We shot it. I think we got it in like
five takes, because once you get.

Speaker 9 (45:22):
It, you're like, well, we were we gonna we just
did it. We're not gonna cut anywhere, so like let's
move on. And that scene actually was it was the
day my son was due to be born, and so
they're like, we got you set up, like we've got
Wi Fi over there, so if you need to FaceTime you.

Speaker 8 (45:42):
Know, the birth of your child.

Speaker 9 (45:43):
And I was just like, because it was during the pandemic,
and like we shot in Cannon all this stuff, and
luckily he took a while to come so I didn't
have to run away from set. But I also was like,
what am I gonna just like in the middle of this,
Wonner be like, sorry, guys, can everyone is like.

Speaker 1 (46:00):
Give me give me two hours?

Speaker 8 (46:03):
Two hours, we can shoot this tomorrow.

Speaker 9 (46:05):
Right, It all worked out, But really, so much of
that is like on the steady cam operator. I sorry,
I'm so bad with names and his years ago, but
I'm pretty sure his name was James, and this guy is.

Speaker 8 (46:14):
Just like he does.

Speaker 9 (46:15):
He's done all of Mike's big one ers and he
It really makes you realize, if you haven't already, how
much the cameraman are just like the unsung heroes set
and obviously there because you're doing this dance with them
and figuring it out where you need to be and
where they need to be and how to like go
at a pace where like they can keep up with you.

Speaker 8 (46:35):
It keeps the frame right.

Speaker 9 (46:36):
But then even when I started directing, my kind of
like Mentor had told me he was like Jamie on
this set, he's like your secret weapon because he he's like,
don't call cut when the scene's over, like he'll find
like a transition for you or he'll just like make
the shot go somewhere where you can use it in
the edit.

Speaker 8 (46:55):
And and it's and it was such a great little
tibit of knowledge.

Speaker 9 (47:00):
That they just find so much cool stuff. And then
I love, like my favorite thing. We do a lot
of Steay cam on Caural Minds and like watching the
steadi cam operator learn the scene and so you know
their first take they're figuring out where everyone is and
there the lines are and then by the second tape
and you know you're watching, you're like, oh, no, you
need to go to in your head. And then you're
like and he'll be like, can we just go again?

(47:21):
You're like yeah, and then he's already figured out we're
a little fascinating, Like you don't even need to.

Speaker 1 (47:25):
Tell them exactly.

Speaker 8 (47:26):
I know.

Speaker 4 (47:27):
That's always my favorite part two of even for multiicam.
It's just like, you know, watching watching the camera operators
who've been doing this forever, it's like their first pass
at it. They may have a question like do you
want this to be a you know, do you want
this as a single or do you want a two shot?
But for the most part, you do it once and
then they're like, you know what's better, I'm gonna do this,
and it's just like, yeah, let the experts do what
they are good at doing.

Speaker 8 (47:47):
Yeah, totally.

Speaker 9 (47:47):
And that's what I learned that on Friday lights so
much because our kind of way of doing things was
you know what, like I hired you to do lights,
I'm gonna let you do lights.

Speaker 8 (47:58):
Ye, yeah, I can tell you how to do lights.
If I have an idea, I'll whatever. But everyone was
everyone from the camera to.

Speaker 9 (48:04):
The props that deck was so respected and given agency
to do their job and not micromanaged. And you know,
I've been on sets where people are very much micromanaged
and no one really likes it. Yes, theator's in charge
and they have a vision, but there's also it's a collaboration.
And that's what I love about it is everyone's thumb
print is on it, and from that first draft some

(48:26):
writer came up with to once it goes through the
edit and the editor does stuff and then the sound design,
it's like you got to like give up some control
and some trust and collaborate.

Speaker 1 (48:36):
Yeah, what was the first project you directed?

Speaker 8 (48:39):
I didn't get to direct until I was on Criminal Minds.
And I lucked out.

Speaker 9 (48:42):
There too, because I was only supposed to be there
for one season, but apparently they liked me and they
kept asking me back, and it's like cool, but can
I direct one? They're like okay, And on a show
like that, I was lucky to come in on the reboot,
which was called Evolution, and you know, it'd been on
CBS for fifteen years. It's kind of even freak of

(49:02):
the week procedural. And when we went to Paramount, when
I came on, they revamped it. It was only ten
episodes and it was serialized, and so they very much
were like, we don't want to do the same thing
we've been doing for fifteen years. And when I finally
got to direct, Erica was like, just go make your episode,
like you can't mess this up, like the show is
the show, and we want to see like your ideas

(49:24):
and what you have. And it was really fun and
she just always supported me, and I did a lot
more kind of like not a lot, but I had
a couple of like needle drops in my episode which
were not really I mean it's not that they never
have them, but it wasn't like the norm. And I
had one in my teaser and I got the cut

(49:44):
of my teaser and I was just like, yes, my
editor gets it, like I've give them notes and I
brought it in and showed her like on my directors first.

Speaker 8 (49:52):
Past or whatever. She watched my teaser and she was
just like holy Zach, like that's a teaser right, Well
it's so fun.

Speaker 9 (50:01):
But I remember watching I literally like saw it. I
saw the first cut. I gave him my notes, he
took them perfectly.

Speaker 8 (50:06):
I watched it.

Speaker 1 (50:06):
I literally go Yes, such a great feeling.

Speaker 9 (50:12):
It's so fun and like, my favorite part of directing
is when someone comes up to you like, Okay, do
you want the the blue or the purple napkin?

Speaker 8 (50:23):
I really don't give him what do you like? Whatever
you want? When it comes to.

Speaker 9 (50:29):
People were like, well, I really like the purple because
of whatever. I'm like, I think you're right.

Speaker 1 (50:34):
It is the way to go purple.

Speaker 9 (50:37):
I never thought about how that represents royalty. And this is,
you know, about a serial killer.

Speaker 8 (50:42):
But you're right, you're right.

Speaker 4 (50:45):
You play a psychopath serial killer on Criminal Minds, which
is obviously a total departure from.

Speaker 3 (50:50):
On a show. Thank god, I thought you were going
somewhere totally different with that.

Speaker 1 (50:54):
Now just on the show. Were you excited to play
a bad guy?

Speaker 9 (50:59):
Yeah, I mean it's always fun to play the bad guy.
The fun thing about that one is which I think
was so cool about the character and why I loved
playing him, was the first season they were so smart
because you know, he's this prolific serial killer, but you
never see him do it. You just see him as
this family man with two kids, and he's this great dad,
and it just makes you creeped out. Because you're kind

(51:19):
of like this guy, but then you know all this
stuff he's done, and then I always said, it makes
you kind of realize, like, man, this person in the
grocery store could be a serial killer. Yeah, like it
it could be a drop off with my kids. And
so then you know, I got to kind of play
that and you see kind of it come out. And
then in season two, I'm in jail and I get
to play this other side of me where I'm just

(51:40):
kind of this guy who loves to push people's buttons.

Speaker 8 (51:42):
I'm smarter than everyone. I'm a bit of a smart
which was.

Speaker 9 (51:44):
Like so fun because at that point of season two,
I knew the cast and I could just mess with
them and like this is they let me like just
go loose. And you know Ajkoch who I mentioned earlier.
She was one of the first people i'd met when
I got when I worked on that show, and we
got along really well, and so I would just mess
with her and like call.

Speaker 8 (52:05):
Her Fbi Barbie or like Blondie or whatever.

Speaker 9 (52:08):
Like I would just come up with all these names,
and I could see what I'm messing with them, them
all being like Zach.

Speaker 8 (52:15):
Together. And then there's this one actor r. J.

Speaker 9 (52:17):
Hakanaka, who is so funny, well he's funny in real life,
but his character is so like I was ex militarian,
I'm this and that and there's. I had this one
scene with him where like him and I are trying
to break something down and it's something about like some
number you.

Speaker 8 (52:33):
Call for like escorts or I don't know, it's like
a sex line or something.

Speaker 9 (52:38):
And I just would go on and on and say
the randomest like goes off the wall, like inappropriate stuff,
and he was just like uh huh mm hm oh okay,
so it's that. So it's like that, And I was like,
I can't break you, Like, none of this is ever
gonna make it in the show.

Speaker 8 (52:56):
I'm just trying to get you to crack a smile
and you're like a robot.

Speaker 4 (52:58):
No, yes, Zach. You have two beautiful children. Do you
think either one of them will ever want to get
into acting? And if so, how would you feel about that?

Speaker 8 (53:09):
I hope not. Yeah, I think my daughter will.

Speaker 9 (53:13):
She's apparently in some school play right now, which I
only say apparently I'm a very bother.

Speaker 1 (53:21):
I'm pretty in school.

Speaker 9 (53:23):
She came home and she's like, yeah, no, I'm in
Lion King. I'm like, oh cool, Like what is like?
It's all kind of very cryptic, like, well, what part
are you? She's like, I don't know today. I hope
I'm not Scar And I'm like, I don't understand what's
going on in school. But she she's very i mean
she loves role play and make believe and all this stuff,

(53:45):
and she's very artistic. I'm scared that she'll want to
go into it just because I mean, you guys, how
old were we all when you did the show?

Speaker 8 (53:56):
Well?

Speaker 1 (53:56):
I was ten when I started acting. Writer was even younger.

Speaker 6 (53:59):
No, I was ten when I started.

Speaker 3 (54:00):
We were all three of us were ten when we
started a professional.

Speaker 8 (54:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 9 (54:04):
I mean, you guys have all turned out like normal humans.

Speaker 6 (54:07):
Someone.

Speaker 3 (54:13):
Adjusted enough. It's a perfect way to put it.

Speaker 8 (54:16):
If you have a whole podcast like look at you.

Speaker 4 (54:19):
Oh yeah, everyone knows that's the sign out.

Speaker 8 (54:25):
Okay, they have a podcast. Their parents must be proud.

Speaker 4 (54:43):
A little known fact, well not I mean not little
to most people who know Zach. Zach and Wryter are
the two people I would say are number one and
number two, or maybe tied for number one, of people
who know how to be outdoorsy, and I've said all
along that I've been interested in. I want to camp,
but I will only go if I can go with

(55:04):
Writer's family or Zach, because Jensen and I cannot be
trusted alone in the wilderness.

Speaker 1 (55:11):
Everyone will die, it will be bad news.

Speaker 4 (55:13):
But if I go with either of you, I think
I'll have food to eat, I'll be able to set
up shelter.

Speaker 3 (55:19):
Where am I on that list?

Speaker 4 (55:20):
I'm just curious, will your as outdoorsy as I am?

Speaker 11 (55:25):
I met Zach like fifteen years ago. We've been friends
for a long time, and it was just this.

Speaker 6 (55:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 11 (55:30):
We sat next to each other at a movie theater
and we were talking and I go, I'm a big
fan of Friday the Lights. He goes thanks, and he
literally was like, you know, I'm thinking about not acting anymore.
I'm going to become a professional camp counselor. And my
immediate reaction was, Oh, we'll never be friends. This is
humanly impossible.

Speaker 1 (55:47):
Not too bad, I dig you.

Speaker 11 (55:51):
He's yeah, he beats Writer, which is hard to do.

Speaker 6 (55:54):
Wow. I wanted to ask about New Zealand. When you
through that, I was like, what where'd you go? What
were you doing? That sounds so cool.

Speaker 2 (56:01):
No.

Speaker 8 (56:01):
I camped all growing up, and like.

Speaker 9 (56:05):
During my like sixteen seventeen eighteen year old summers, me
and my then girlfriend, we'd go for like months and
go camping in the Rockies or Canada or something like that.
And then when I turned twenty one, I started working
for this company called Adventures Cross Country, which is.

Speaker 8 (56:19):
Kind of like noles are out, We're bound, and you know,
I got to spend a summer working in Alaska, like.

Speaker 9 (56:25):
Literally where you're just backpacking stuff on your back for
three weeks at a time.

Speaker 8 (56:29):
We had like a seaplane comeing to like restock us,
but I did.

Speaker 9 (56:34):
There was a couple of hiatuses of Friday night Lights
where either I had a chunk of time or like
something I was supposed to do fell through.

Speaker 8 (56:43):
And this company they'd always I'd be their first call
if they had.

Speaker 9 (56:46):
To fire someone or something, and so New Zealand literally
was they called and they were like, hey we had
to fire someone.

Speaker 8 (56:51):
Was there anyway?

Speaker 9 (56:52):
You go to Australia and New Zealand for like two
months and I was like I sure can't. That's and
I worked on other ones, two of them, but the kids.
There was one where it was like after six weeks,
one of the kids was like, are you on that
football show? And I was like, oh, yeah, I am,

(57:12):
and they're like, oh yeah, you seem so familiar. I'm like,
oh yeah, that's me. And they're like, all right, well anyway, Zach.
And then like another kid was like, what do you
mean you're on the show. I'm like, I don't know,
like I'm on it. He goes so like you're on
the team, and I'm like yeah, he goes.

Speaker 8 (57:26):
So if I watch it when I when I see
and I.

Speaker 3 (57:29):
Was like, this is how television works.

Speaker 8 (57:31):
Yeah, in the background shoes exactly.

Speaker 9 (57:38):
It just like makes no sense because like kids that
age are showing their own world.

Speaker 8 (57:41):
They're just yeah, well whatever. Anyway, I was this person,
so wait, how old are the kids on something like that? Anyway?
From like fourteen to seventeen or eighteens? So cool?

Speaker 6 (57:52):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (57:52):
Do you do you normally?

Speaker 2 (57:54):
Do you return with the same number of kids that
you leave with or you expected to lose one or
two along the way.

Speaker 8 (58:00):
You know, I had a pretty good track record. Okay, okay,
but I have had trips where I had to like
evat kids.

Speaker 9 (58:05):
I had one where I was working in semite and
this girl this is literally this is the craziest day
of my life.

Speaker 8 (58:12):
And I'll try to streamline it for you.

Speaker 9 (58:14):
But we wake up and all of our bear canisters,
which are like mini kegs which you keep your food
in because bears can't get into them. A bear had
taken them, and like they try to throw them against
trees and stuff to open.

Speaker 1 (58:25):
Oh my god, they're too smart. Sorry smart.

Speaker 9 (58:28):
So we go and we open them and a bunch
of our food is like exploded and it's ruined.

Speaker 8 (58:31):
So we need more food.

Speaker 9 (58:33):
And one of my co leaders there were three of us,
her name is Liz. She was like a marathon runner,
running like the Boston Marathon blah blah blah, and she
was and we were supposed to summit at Half Dome
that day, and she was like, all right, I'll run
down and get more food.

Speaker 8 (58:46):
But I really want to sum at Half Dome first.
And I was like, wait, if you're gonna get us
more food, you can do whatever you want.

Speaker 9 (58:52):
Yeah, okay, So we go up half Dome. We have
this girl start having an asthma attack. We have her
inhaler and we knew she had bad ass, so we
also have like a nebulizer for her. So we start
giving her a nebulizer and I just said, look, if
this doesn't work, we're screwed. She's really screwed, but we're
gonna be screwed. And so I was like, we have

(59:13):
to call a helicopter, Like we can't chance this. So
she's sitting there like turning blue. Helicopter lands on top
of a half dome. Medics get out strap or to
a thin oxygen put it in the helicopter. My other
co leader, Kim, gets in the helicopter and it.

Speaker 8 (59:26):
Just flies away.

Speaker 9 (59:28):
And so then meeting Liz look at each other like Okay,
it's just the two of us now, and I'm like,
and you need.

Speaker 8 (59:33):
To go get us some more food. So it's just
me And so then she like runs down like the
mountains into Yo sementy villages. I think it's like a
nine mile track. I take the kids back to our campsite.
I start making dinner.

Speaker 9 (59:46):
I'm sitting there, I have like three or four kids
on the other side of the stove, and I'm I'm like, okay,
blah blah blah.

Speaker 8 (59:51):
Caesadilla, this is how you make it. And then I look.

Speaker 9 (59:54):
Up and behind a tree like thirty feet behind us.
This bear comes out from behind a tree, and I'm
just like and it's like what I'm like, just get
behind me now, Like what I'm like, get behind me.
So they all get behind me and we like make
ourselves big, and you're like, hey bear, hey there, and
you because you want us to know you're there, but
you don't want to startle it. And we're like slowly
back away, and it just starts like kind of like

(01:00:15):
pacing towards us. Yeah, they wanted the case idea, and
they do bluff charges, so it charges us.

Speaker 8 (01:00:24):
But if you run, it instinctually thinks it needs to
chase you.

Speaker 2 (01:00:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 9 (01:00:29):
I had to just stand there with these kids with
like pocket knives out as if it were going to
do anything, and it stopped right here and I could
like feel its breath on me, Oh my gosh, and
just slowly like hey, heymar and like back the kids away.
And once we're far enough away, when it ate our
case ideas and I got the kids like to our
campsite and I kind of wait for it to go away.

Speaker 8 (01:00:49):
And so then the kids are like, oh my god,
I'm pumped. I'm so jazz Yeah, and it. Finally Liz
comes back with food. She's like, how do it go.

Speaker 9 (01:00:55):
I'm like, you have no idea and luckily and you know,
we're far enough removed. I don't think either of us
can get in trouble. But uh, she was like, hey,
I am I put two beers in our bag.

Speaker 8 (01:01:07):
But I was like, thank god, my life. But yeah,
that was like one of the craziest days. So we
had to back that girl.

Speaker 6 (01:01:16):
We did.

Speaker 8 (01:01:17):
On another trip, I had to evac a couple.

Speaker 9 (01:01:18):
Of kids because these poor girls they had strainus, which
is essentially the strap virus in your anus, and they
were very itchy and the temfortable, and so my co leader,
there were only two of us on that one, she
had to take them out to get them to We
didn't know what it was. We just knew they were
very uncomfortable and in that reason, you're not like tough

(01:01:39):
it out for five more days, right, So they left,
and then I have all the kids, and of course
this is a younger group.

Speaker 8 (01:01:44):
They were like fourteen. There was a girl who got
her period for the.

Speaker 9 (01:01:47):
First time and none of the other girls had their period,
so I had to like talk her through. I'd be like, okay,
so you're gonna go over there and like explain how
to put a tampon.

Speaker 12 (01:02:00):
God, God, see this is what happens when you go outside.
You Oh my god.

Speaker 3 (01:02:10):
This sounds awful.

Speaker 4 (01:02:11):
I am gonna need to know more about straightus questions.

Speaker 9 (01:02:18):
You still have to say, I don't have the same
guidelines we learned in COVID wash your hands?

Speaker 3 (01:02:25):
How are you to other people as much?

Speaker 9 (01:02:28):
I think they didn't wash their hands well enough, and
so the bacteria is just on your hands, and if
you touch someone that's on there.

Speaker 8 (01:02:34):
They wipe.

Speaker 1 (01:02:36):
Oh man, I don't know.

Speaker 4 (01:02:38):
Maybe they got it from dirty leaves, being outdoorsy, you know, yeah, exactly.

Speaker 8 (01:02:42):
No.

Speaker 9 (01:02:43):
I am terrified of my son because he's five, and
he'll go to the bathroom and I'll be like, do.

Speaker 8 (01:02:47):
You know wipe? He's like, no, I can do it.
I'm like, no, you can't. Broa you just like really
take a lot and like wipe, like rub your hip, like.

Speaker 9 (01:03:00):
I'll brush my kids teeth and wipe my thoughts until
I'm fully confident that they are capable.

Speaker 4 (01:03:04):
Correct, I'm exactly the same way I asked the dentist
recently about Adler because he's six and I still help
brush his teeth, and I was like, am I supposed to.

Speaker 1 (01:03:13):
Just be letting him fully brush his own teeth? Now?

Speaker 4 (01:03:15):
She goes, absolutely not, not if you don't want him
to have cavities, And I was like.

Speaker 1 (01:03:18):
Great, and then I'm going to just keep helping. He
does it.

Speaker 4 (01:03:22):
He does it teeth brushing, But then I also get
to go in there for my little round and then
I'm like, Okay, now at least I know you got
one decent brushing in there. Well. Anyway, Zach, thank you
so much for being here with us. I always enjoy
talking to you. I adore you, I adore your family.
You and writer would absolutely be friends.

Speaker 8 (01:03:41):
I'd be down anytime I got you know, I think
I'm free tomorrow.

Speaker 5 (01:03:48):
Hard you can't find backpacking site. It's like within like
driving distance of LA.

Speaker 6 (01:03:52):
It sucks. Like I've always tried.

Speaker 7 (01:03:53):
To do like weekend trips with my friends from up north,
and it's like, man, we always just have to drive
like six to eight hours, you know, is like the
only I mean, yeah you can.

Speaker 8 (01:04:02):
There's if you look it up, you can do him
in a day.

Speaker 9 (01:04:04):
There's like the so called six pack, which is right.
And I had friends we did it for a while,
but you know sometimes it was like in the car at.

Speaker 8 (01:04:10):
Four am to drive like two and a half hours.

Speaker 9 (01:04:13):
So then ike, all, I mean it's fun and it's
worth it, but yeah, you would think to really get
out there.

Speaker 7 (01:04:19):
Yeah, when I've gone up to Bishop and done trips
out of there every time, I get elevation sickness because,
like you just because I only have like three days
and like without failed, like day two.

Speaker 6 (01:04:28):
I'm just on the trail like throwing up and like
it sucks, Like I can't do this.

Speaker 8 (01:04:32):
You're really selling this.

Speaker 2 (01:04:33):
Yeah, my Chipotle yesterday ran out of chicken. I had
to wait like twenty minutes while they made a new
batch of chicken, and it was like, drop was a
hard time dude.

Speaker 5 (01:04:44):
I just met an editor who actually got bit by
a bear. He was he was in he was sleeping
in a hammock. He had like one of those hammock setups,
and he just he heard the bear and was just like, oh,
I'm just gonna ignore it, and then it just literally
came over started pushing against him. He's like, I'll just
go to play dead, which is not the right thing
to do, and it just took a bite.

Speaker 6 (01:05:04):
I know, and then he's like, then I made no.

Speaker 5 (01:05:07):
I was like, yeah, dude, if a bear was like
sniffing around for food and you're in a cocoon, you're
just like a meal.

Speaker 6 (01:05:12):
Like just And I think he actually did have.

Speaker 5 (01:05:14):
Something in his pocket, like you know, a mosquito repelling
or something, because like usually they wouldn't, you know, go
near a person, but I think he had some.

Speaker 1 (01:05:21):
Yeah, I think it was just it was just my son.
It wasn't even a bear.

Speaker 9 (01:05:30):
Zach.

Speaker 1 (01:05:30):
Thank you so much for being here with us. Always
a pleasure to see you.

Speaker 8 (01:05:33):
Oh my god, thank you for having me. What an honor.

Speaker 9 (01:05:36):
No, I mean I watched your all show growing up.
It's iconic to me. So it's edited in any way.

Speaker 1 (01:05:42):
Thank you, Zach.

Speaker 2 (01:05:43):
We always do a test run, and so the next
time we have you on, we'll record it.

Speaker 8 (01:05:47):
Will Yeah, I love that my bear story we got.

Speaker 3 (01:05:53):
We're gonna send over notes.

Speaker 1 (01:05:54):
I love if you could do this podcast in only
one sentence.

Speaker 8 (01:06:02):
I mean, do I really do? I really need to
be honest?

Speaker 3 (01:06:09):
Well, you're the best Matt's Borings and that's ever played.

Speaker 8 (01:06:12):
So that's that's I like that one.

Speaker 1 (01:06:20):
Thank you, Zach. I'll see you talk to you soon.
He's funny, funny, he is amazing.

Speaker 2 (01:06:31):
I have one quick change which which some people obviously
caught and other people didn't. I said a while back
that Phonsie landed the motorcycle after he jumped the shark.
And what clearly I meant was he landed on his
water skis when he was not on the motorcycle. So
I'd like to just no, he jumped the shark on
water skis.

Speaker 6 (01:06:49):
Was jumping theyle.

Speaker 3 (01:06:51):
He jumped the shark on water skis.

Speaker 8 (01:06:53):
So there you.

Speaker 4 (01:06:53):
I wanted to, you know, okay, just make sure yeah,
you've been holding onto bat this time.

Speaker 8 (01:06:58):
I have.

Speaker 2 (01:06:58):
I literally wrote it down, like, brought it down. Yeah,
Phonzie waterski.

Speaker 3 (01:07:03):
So there you go.

Speaker 4 (01:07:05):
Thank you all for joining us for this episode of
Pod Meets World. As always, you can follow us on
Instagram pod Meets World Show. You can send us your
emails pod meets World Show at gmail dot com.

Speaker 1 (01:07:14):
And we've got March Hey.

Speaker 5 (01:07:16):
March, Hey, March hey, March hey, March.

Speaker 2 (01:07:23):
Straightus is my new favorite word.

Speaker 8 (01:07:28):
Actually it is just a.

Speaker 3 (01:07:33):
I did not ever get straightus.

Speaker 2 (01:07:34):
I did get strenus, which is something totally different.

Speaker 3 (01:07:37):
Unfortunately, so that you're not.

Speaker 2 (01:07:45):
You haven't gotten stratus, you never got struck.

Speaker 3 (01:07:49):
It's the word.

Speaker 1 (01:07:59):
Oh my god, the World Show.

Speaker 11 (01:08:07):
Oh are We're making? Are we making strockomer?

Speaker 8 (01:08:15):
We love you all.

Speaker 7 (01:08:19):
Pod Meets World is an iHeart podcast producer hosted by
Danielle Fischel, Wilfridell and Ryder Strong Executive producers Jensen Carp
and Amy Sugarman, Executive in charge of production, Danielle Romo,
producer and editor, Tarasubasch producer, Maddy Moore, engineer and Boy
Meets World superman Easton Allen. Our theme song is by
Kyle Morton of Typhoon. Follow us on Instagram at Podmeats

(01:08:39):
World Show or email us at Podmeats World Show at
gmail dot com