Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hello, everyone, Welcome to the Creation Podcast, the show where
we discuss the science that confirmed scripture. I'm your host, Trey,
and I have with me today I see ours resident
geologist and northern expert because he is from Michigan, correct
the Great White nor So we have with us doctor Clary.
(00:25):
Thank you so much for being here, doctor Clary.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
That was a pleasure.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
Awesome. Well, it's always a pleasure to have you on.
We have a lot of fun here. We talked about
rocks here. We're going to be talking about rocks a
little bit today, not just rocks, but more of a
process that affects rocks, destroys rocks. What you know what
we're talking about? Yes, you do know what we're talking about.
(00:48):
I did, all right, So we're gonna be talking about erosion.
So when I think of erosion, I think of my
high school years and they're like, erosion is what happens
to you know, rocks and dirt and it just wears
things down and even like concrete gets eroded. There's water erosion,
there's air erosion. Right, let's just wipe all that away.
(01:11):
We're not going to think about what I learned in
high school. What do you say that erosion is.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Well, I would just say it's a removal of material,
whether it's the rock or sand or whatever. It's The
erosion is the actual you know, you can talk about weathering.
Weathering breaks stuff down, but the erosion is actually the
removal of that material from one place to another place.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
So erosion affects our planet and not just our planet,
but I guess every terrestrial planet that's out there. But
we're focused on Earth and so we do experience erosion here.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
Well, the other planets probably don't erode if they don't
have an atmosphere, you know what, doctor Clary, But they
probably don't eroad, like you know, the way we think
of it, there's there's things that are going to hit
them space. There's gonna be some impacts and things like that,
and there is some.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Well this is off topic, but aren't there storms on
some planets?
Speaker 2 (02:07):
Well, there are. Some of them do have an atmosphere,
like Jupiter and say and Venus, and Mercury doesn't really.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Okay, so it's just sitting there, nothing to erodiate it.
Speaker 2 (02:16):
Really, it gets really hot on one side, really cool
to another because it rotates so slowly. But other than
the solar wind maybe blasting off some Well, if you
did have an atmosphere at some point after the creation,
it's gone.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Now.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
So there's there's there's, yeah, there's there's maybe different scales
of erosion. Talking about.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
I love the little the little side tangent, thank you,
though I don't want to be incorrect. Okay, So we
have seen on our planet something very different than what
we would see on the other planets, I guess, uh,
and that is rapid erosion. We see things like floods
or catastrophes whatever that caused rapid erosion to happen. And
(03:03):
so this kind of stands in contrast to the supposed
millions or billions of years of layers that supposedly are
Earth has. Specifically, I think of like cliff collapses, which
is because you know, you see that cliff and then
if you talk to someone who's you know, uniformitarianist, and
(03:25):
they'll they'll be like, oh, that cliff side is four
point three five billion years old, not that old. That's
as old as I think the Earth is. But then
like if it collapses, it's gone. And then it's like, now,
what so we've seen I actually have a list here
if you don't mind a list of some of these,
(03:46):
like major collapses of cliff sides, the broad Church Cliffs
that have collapsed twice in twenty seventeen to twenty twenty three,
the White Cliffs of Dover two thousand and one and twelve,
the Australian Coastline two thousand and five and two thousand
and nine. Uh, that's all just within the last couple
(04:07):
of decades. And so that is erasing what is supposedly
millions of years of geologic history. And am I right
in saying that.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
Well, that's that's that's correct. I mean maybe at least
from their point of view, yea hundreds of thousands or
maybe even millions of years because those cliffs, you know,
supposedly we're always were taught in school like you were
that those cliffs you rode really slowly, but what would
you actually examine them for fifty years, one hundred years
or more. We're seeing it's a lot quicker than they
thought than they say.
Speaker 1 (04:38):
Right, And so these these cliff collapses, these these erosions,
even at current rates of erosion. Uh, I see, like
the continents wouldn't be here at all. Right if if
we follow.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
That most of the continents except maybe active mountain areas.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
Okay, So that's that's really.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
What's been measured. And I think there was a study
down in twenty eleven, most probably one of the more
recent studies, and they showed that the average rate of
erosion on the surface of the Earth above the sea
is about forty feet per million years. That's the rest
of its slow, but over millions of years of time,
that's a lot of erosion. So you're looking at areas
(05:19):
in the eastern US, they've experienced no uplift, even in
the conventional time of for about two hunred fifty million
years or more, maybe three hundred million years since the
appllations were supposedly formed that long ago. We don't believe that,
but that's what they say. And so the area, the
east coast and the midwest, all those areas were exposed
for several hundred million years. Well, if it's forty feet
(05:42):
per million years, there should almost be no continent left.
The should be right down to sea level in that
amount of time. So if you do the math, it
really adds up to a lot of hundreds of feet
of erosion, and the most of the area in that
continent is only five six hundred feet above sea level,
the applations themselves at all higher maybe a little island
strings sticking out there, but the rest of the Midwest,
(06:03):
you know, my home state of Michigan, as you mentioned,
that's six seven hundred maybe one thousand feet above sea level.
That should have all runned away and including most of
these coast should be gone. We wouldn't have anywhere to
live except maybe around the Rockies, which are more recent
in terms of the geodesic deep time paradigm type of
thing from there.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
From their point of.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
Right, so there's no active uplift to rescue. We talk
about rescuing device, there's no way to rescue the eastern
US because there hasn't been any active uplift and in
their time two hundred and fifty to three hundred million years.
So why do we still have these continents all over
the world There haven't been active geologically, haven't been uplifted.
(06:44):
Why are they still there?
Speaker 1 (06:45):
Right before we dive into some of these like how
does it? How do they how do they answer this?
Can you explain like what today that we see not
not catastrophic rates, just standard erosion rates. What causes that?
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Well, you know, just rain, heavy rainfall washed things away
and move things. Ice. You can argue the ice age
moved a lot of material around, gets caught in the
ice and gets transported. Or even say wind. Wind's not
very effective, just mostly for small sand sized particles. But
for the most part it's water, big floods, you know,
major local floods, all these types of things. You really
(07:26):
can move a lot of material very quickly in a
short amount of time. You know, you go back to
the classical studies at Mount Saint Helen's even in nineteen
eighty two the eruption, the second eruption after the nineteen
eighty eruption, the ice that had built up in the
crater melted away real quickly from this big slurry and
craved about things one hundred and forty foot deep canyon
like literally overnight. In Some of that was solid rock,
(07:47):
you know from previous eruptions, So under the right conditions,
erosion cannot be really fast. If you go back to
the origin of Deep Time and rode article about this
at our ICR you know, posted or a web page.
You can do a search under deep the Origin of
Deep Time. It was a James Hutton and he was
in the late later part of the eighteenth century seventeen nineties,
(08:10):
he was proposing the earth is millions of years old.
He wanted to get away from the studies, you know,
or the written record in the Book of Genesis, right
and when to get that out of science all together.
And so, but he was looking at erosion in areas
that were very very slowly months of erosion, and so
he wasn't seeing even a rapid catastrophic event like a
big major flood. He was just looking at day to
(08:32):
day erosion in the fields and the hills and the
rocks around Scotland, and he didn't really see evidence of
any rapid erosion. So he was saying, well, that much erosion,
you know, to to write a lot of rock and
deposit a lot of rock was to take in millions
of years. He just threw that number out there that
nobody can really fathom in their head. You know, try
to go home and think about a millionaires. You can't really,
(08:53):
I can't ask, I can't get yours, and so you know,
I consider like monopoly money, you can't. You know, he
just do such a big number out there, and this
is before they even had these you know techniques that
where they can try to get that from their age dating,
which is another whole story in itself.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
And so what you've talked about, we've had a broadcast
on dating that all.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
The assumptions built into it. But anyway, nonethe last day,
you know, that's what he saw, and so he kind
of said, that's slow erosion. That's what we say. But
yet we don't really see evidence of slow erosion in
the rock record. We see evidence of rapid erosion in
many places. Is kind of the name of the game.
It just sits there and sits there, and then all
of a sudden, the big piece of the cliff will
fall off, big chunks at a time. So it's whether
(09:36):
that's some that you want to call that the natural
process over time, it is a lot quicker than what
you think, because it happens. You know, big chunks will
fall off these cliffs, as you mentioned, very very quickly,
and huge sections will fall off. Really, the earth, you know,
I will say stuff like the earth like it's something,
but the earth really is built the way God built
(09:57):
the atmosphere, and the hydrologic cycle is built to destroy cliffs.
The cycles will destroy cliffs, waterfalls. All these waterfalls we
see over the earth. All these cliffs we see over
the earth, those are temporary features. They shouldn't be there.
They can't last for millions of years because they do
ear roads so quickly. Yeah, we see them all over
the world. We see them in Hawaii. We see waterfalls,
we see a lot of tubes in Hawaii. Wrote another
(10:19):
article about that in our web page. You know, there's
a lot of evidence in Hawaii that it's very, very young,
and part of it's the waterfalls and the cliffs. You know,
those are very temporary structures. They can't last for millions
of years. They should have been rooted flat by now.
It's just like the kindness themselves should have been routed
down at their own erosion rates at forty feet per year.
And in some ways Hawaii is even more interesting because
(10:42):
you got these islands out there. They're supposed to be.
You know, Kawaii is supposed to be around five million
years old, and I think I'm always supposed to be
two or three million years old, you know a while
who's somewhere around four give it take a little bit.
And but they're very small islands and they've measured the
erosion rate since nineteen hundred on the beaches. The beach erosion,
(11:03):
which is really is the erosion. The beach erosion on
the islands of Hawaii several islands is about point four
or feet per year, or about five inches per year,
and so you know, it doesn't seem like a lot,
but the islands are getting smaller every year by about
five inches all around.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
And if they're millions of years old.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
And after millions of years old, that's I think that
ends up being seventy six miles in one million years.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
How big are the island elans?
Speaker 2 (11:28):
Aren't that big? Yeah, And so there should be no
islands at all. There should be no islands at that rate,
which has been measured for over one hundred years now.
And so you know, you can't argue that there's hesibated waves.
You can't say the wave patterns changed. You know that
the oceans were always there, presumably even in deep time.
And so why are these islands there. The volcanic activity
(11:48):
stopped millions of years ago on some of these islands
in their worldview, so why are they still there. The
only island that should be there could still be there
would be the big island where you still have active
volcanic creating the others should be gone. They should become
seamounts like we see, you know, further west of Kawhi.
You see the seamounts.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
Interesting. Okay, So I've actually heard of a couple of,
like I guess, counter arguments for this, and I'll just
present them to you and if you think that they're valid,
give your opinion on them, Tear them to shreds if
you want. So. One that I've seen is that actually
the erosion rates were even slower in the past. They're
(12:31):
much more quick today because of the way we do
modern agriculture so.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
Well, and that may be a little bit of truth
in that. I mean, there's you know, we stir up
their soils more a little bit, and so you allow
more of our soil to wash up. But it isn't
really increasing the erosion rate of the rocks.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (12:52):
Yeah, people argue in the islands maybe because we're stirring
things up a little bit, but you're not really running away.
It's the waves are still the waves, and the wave action,
the wave erosion is probably fairly consistent. You know, where
an island comes up, it's going to be you know,
that particular area of the waves and that latitude and longitude.
That's kind of what it's been at. And you know
over several million years. One million years is all you
(13:13):
need to them. That's nothing. And so why are there
islands because that would be seventy six miles of erosion
in a million years. That's in four inch five inches
a year. Doesn't seem like a lot, but multiply it
by a lot of zeros and you get a lot
of erosion.
Speaker 1 (13:30):
So whereas you're essentially saying agriculture could be causing high
erosion rates, but it's not enough to make a difference
in the timescale that much.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
I mean, it's it's gonna e road, maybe a little
bit allow water access a little bit easier to some places.
It might double the erosion rates or something like that.
But even then you're looking at a lot of erosion.
Even if it's two you're looking at thirty five miles
in a million years. And that's about the islands there.
And if you look at the edges of the islands
where they come up by the water and the edges
where they come up because they make these big old
(14:00):
volcanoes that come out of the ocean, they had to
build up and build up, which I believe built up,
you know, almost catastrophic eruptions during the flood. You're and
maybe right after the flood, but you're looking at according
to my notes, about a third of a mile in
forty five hundred years. Okay, so you're looking at you know,
and it's not that much time. That's kind of what
we see. We don't see a big, huge, just a
(14:21):
little remnant sticking up, and everything just planed off like
you should see if it's millions of years old, maybe
just a little speck or nothing left at all. Okay,
they should just be planed off right below the wave base,
which is what a seamount really.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
Is, right. Okay, So another I guess rescue device that
I've seen is that the old rocks that we see
were actually like shielded by newer rocks. And I guess
that implies, you know, volcanic activity, right.
Speaker 2 (14:50):
Well, or you have to have a lot of deposition.
You know, you're looking at rocks that it would have
to be much much much thicker, Okay, you know, you
have to have thousands of feet more sediments that are
just gone and in many cases no evidence that they
were over there, just kind of wiped away. You know,
we believe that did happen in the receding phase of
the flood, but a lot of times those rocks maybe
weren't solid rock at the time, so there was a
(15:11):
umre erosion I think even of the contents as the
water was receding. So the water built up deposit a
lot of settlements rapidly as it eroded and receded. Of
course we saw thousands of feet of erosion, but again
that's it's a major cash traphic, one time event.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
So that happened, it's not been protected for millions and
millions of years, you know.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
But one other thing I know we've talked about in
the past is just like in the studio here, we
see these these big blocks, big bricks, that's what we see.
We see layer upon layer upon layer with almost no
erosion in between. And when you're a grand canyon, they
say that canyon formed. I think the current rate of
six million years formed that canyon. But when you look
(15:52):
at the rocks in between, some of the layers just
spits three million years between these two layers and one
hundred and sixty million years between these two layers, and
there's no canyons at all, Right, you know, you got
one hundred and sixty million years between the red wall
and the moo of limestones. One hundred and sixty million
years of time. Why is it perfectly flat?
Speaker 1 (16:09):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (16:09):
Everywhere you look, and those layers that time go. Yeah,
and by the studies I've been doing across the country,
those oil wells show that those same layers continue not
just in Grand CanYa, they go across the entire forty
eight states. Some of them go up into Canada and
New Mexico, and the same layers are found the same
way around the world. So we see these flat layers
(16:30):
of supposedly millions of years of time between many of them,
and there's no evidence of erosion. Right, So I challenge
the deep time people to explain, why is there no
erosion between all these layers.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Yeah, the rescue devices are all fine and good, even
if they don't make sense, but it's still the evidence
shows that that's not the case regardless. Okay, So there's
even some I guess, logical inconsistencies within the idea of
this erosion of deep time. One that comes to mind is,
(17:05):
you know, we see things like chimney rock or other
geologic features that seem very from a geologic standpoint, they
seem very fragile, and I think in my limited knowledge
that if they were that old, they would be just
like the islands, they would be gone already, right.
Speaker 2 (17:25):
Right, Yeah, Like Monument Valley. You see all these little
remnants sticking up and place, but most of it's gone.
Most of sandstone in between those little spires sticking up
is gone. We believe that's best explained by the receding
phase of the flood were huge, you know, chunks of
the sandstone where he rode it away by the by
the receding water, But they left a few remnants behind, right,
And so those few remnants showed that there was a
(17:45):
lot more sediment there at one point, but it's now gone.
But there's always gonna be some remnants when water washes off,
you know, is off a little bit here and there.
For whatever reason, this area is more resistant to the erosion,
or the currents were going in a different direction or
kind of swirled around some. Then they protected it, and
so you can just like you get sea cliffs and
stuff that eventually do we rode away, which you get
(18:06):
him temporarily, and that's kind of what Chimney Rock is
all these features are just temporary features that you know
that would take. Today's rates of erosion are slower than
the floods rates which was very fast, so they are
going slower. But you know, even things like delicate arch
in Arches National Park, same sort of thing. It looks
really delicate because it is, and it's probably going to collapse,
(18:28):
maybe in our lifetime, maybe your lifetime, but it's gonna
some of these features are going to collapse. And there's
a case in my home state of Michigan of the
pictured Rocks National Lake Shore along the Lake Superior. And
every year these guys, the boat guys used to take
tours there with students and every year the boat captains
will come through and say, big chunks of the cliff
are missing. That was there, you know the winter storms
(18:50):
and the ice. But one of the iconic symbols of
that park was called Miners Castle. It was two spires
of rock sticking up at five or ten feet and
one's April one spring when of them just slid into
the lake, just cracked off and there it went. So
there's only one spy or left, so it's not quite
as pretty. And the same thing happening out in Vermont,
(19:12):
didn't one of the faces or something collapse out there?
And the you know the White the White Mountains, one
of the old man of the some old old mountains face,
I forget the name of the rock that was really famous,
and it kind of collapsed away. So, as you mentioned
early on, that's kind of what's happening. We see hetastrophic
collapses that are more frequent than you know, people have
(19:34):
think about because it doesn't happen every year, twenty years,
three years down the line, but over centuries, these things
are collapsing even before our eyes today. So erosion is
pretty fast. I mean these rates and forty feet per
million years, you know, those they're just projected out assuming
conditions don't change too much. I think they're trying to
take into some of the effects of an occasional storm.
(19:56):
Storms are two that are going to increase the erosional rights.
But again it comes back to a well, why don't
you see canyons and curved valleys and gullies in between
these layers that are deposited. You know, there's really not
a lot of evidence of time between most these layers
that should be there. If you believe in even this
kind of erosion that they come up with. John Bomgunn
did some calculating. He's a geophysicist. Creation the geophysicist. He
(20:18):
calculated that you can have the tsunami waves that he's modeling,
can you road materials slid rock up to forty feet
per day?
Speaker 1 (20:26):
That's very fast if.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
You have these massive tsunami waves coming in one af
to that other, one after the other, like he envisions
for the flood, when you have rapid plate movement going
on and lots of tsunami waves generats, so you can
erode really quickly under the right conditions, and you can
also deposit very quickly under the right conditions.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
Okay, well, before we get to the right conditions, if
you will, it's time for our random science question of
the day. All right, are you ready?
Speaker 2 (20:50):
He's always worry me.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
These good I like to keep you worried. Uh So,
you mentioned Hutton earlier today, and I think that's a
pro i'me. Example, maybe not so much because he was
kind of like one of the first. But when people
look at rocks, why the so many people, I guess
(21:13):
people who aren't geologists, you know, the average person. Why
do rocks appear old? Why is there this idea that
any sort of like stone thing that isn't man made
is so ancient.
Speaker 2 (21:29):
Well, I think a lot of That's a couple of things.
Number One, as humans are short life spans that we
have on Earth, we don't see a lot of change.
Most places don't experience major catastrophes, you know, like eruptions,
thatch and manse helens. If you're living a long way
from that area, your terrain doesn't seem to change. We
look back at pictures one hundred years ago, they look
almost the same. Grand cane looks almost the same. And
(21:52):
so we don't see the change in our little temporary
life span of one human life span at all. And
we're not experiencing unless you experienced a major catastrophe in
that area. Secondly, where somewhat brainwashed by what's taught in
the schools, what's taught by geologists, what's been taught since
the times of hunting, that the Earth is old, extremely old,
(22:12):
too old for the Bible. You know, it's billion years old.
Like you said, over four billion years old is the
accepted age of the Earth. And so you're taught that,
you know, these rocks are old, and you go to
parks and wherever you go and visit the sign as
you'll always say these rocks are two point eight billion
years old, and these rocks are you know, million years
old whatever. That's always kind of being thrown out there.
(22:35):
So between not seeing a whole lot of erosion in
our short human lifespan and then the constant environment of
being told these are millions or billions of years old.
Everybody can say, ideah, that rocks are old. But the
rocks don't tell you time. They just they're just there.
Speaker 1 (22:50):
You tell us they're just there.
Speaker 2 (22:51):
Well, I tell time because the Bible tells us. Right.
You know, the Earth is about six thousand years old
and the flood was about forty five hundred years ago,
and everything I see in geology fits that.
Speaker 1 (23:03):
Right. So we're now done with the random science question
of the day. Thank you, I appreciate. Yeah. Well, so
you're saying the other ones are bad.
Speaker 2 (23:15):
This was better than so doesn't nothing bad.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
It's just you were prepared for this one.
Speaker 2 (23:20):
No, it was. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:22):
I had a better answer, maybe, speaking of than this
more biblically grounded worldview. We know that given current erosion rates,
just our planet can't be as old as they say
it is, So, where does erosion fit when it comes
(23:44):
to a biblical time scale? What role does it play
in getting the earth to where we see it today.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
Well, we see the evidence, especially when you look at
like air photos and you get up and look at
saddle views. You can really see that there's areas of
the earth that have experienced lots of erosion, you know,
where you can see just mature has been stripped away,
and you can almost see the transport directions by where
the settiments end up in the oceans. So you can
see thick areas in the oceans, you know with oil
(24:16):
well drilling and tied it into what we can see
from looking up kind of the big picture view, the
bird's eye view, you can see major areas that eroded
and were stripped away and material was transported. You might
not be able to tell the exact time. You can
see a common direction, you know, a common build up.
But there's a lot of evidence of massive erosion, which
(24:36):
I think most of that took place probably in the
receding phase of the flood.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
Okay, so according to I guess ICR and your view
of this progressive flood, it goes up to day one
fifty it reaches the top, then it starts to recede,
and you so like during that receding phase is when major,
major ma erosion takes place.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
You know, probably in some places tens of thousands of
feet of erosion, especially as the mountains were coming up,
and so all those sediments that went over from one
side of the rockets to the other. It might have
been five to ten thousand feet or more of sediment
that was all stripped off in many places, right down
to the crust out of the crystaline Precumbian rock we
call it in most cases. And so we knew we
(25:21):
can actually measure from one side of a mountain to
the other and you can get a pretty good estimate
of the same material is probably went over the top
or something close to it, and so you can estimate
how much erosion. So there's been a lot of erosion
in a very short amount of time in terms of
the biblical time frame. But it all seems to be
the best explanation for that would would be the flood,
(25:42):
the receding phase of the.
Speaker 1 (25:43):
Flood, because as you mentioned, the like, there is ice
and there is air sort of, but the main factor
in erosion is water. And so if there, if there was,
which we believe there was, and the evidence points that direction,
if there was a global flood, that would cause the
(26:04):
erosion that we.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
See, I think most is at the surface anyway today. Okay,
And the reason there's not much erosion today, why it
is you knowly forty feet per million years or whatever
the current rate seems to be, is because there isn't
a major receding phase. There isn't the land kind of
smarn't flooded anymore. They've all drained away. So now we
just have kind of going back to the normal hydrologic
(26:25):
cycle that we see occasional really heavy storms and landslides
here and there occasionally, but there's no big major event
that's going to really wash away tremendous amounts of rock
im material on a regional scale. You get some local
ones here and there, but there's no activity really it's
going to rode away in a regional scale. But even that,
like I said earlier, even that slow erosion is too
(26:47):
much for what we see. You know, most of the
contents should be gone, just like the Hawaiian islands should
be gone. The continents should be eroded right down to
the right down the sea.
Speaker 1 (26:57):
Level much of them, much of them, as I say,
except for.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
That, you know, again the rescuing device. You can argue
the rockies and the more recent mountain ranges, which all
most of them happened during the receding phase, those would
probably still be there. But most of the flatter areas,
you know, the Midwest, the east coast of the United States,
east of the Appalachians, there should shouldn't even be there.
Speaker 1 (27:21):
There wouldn't be enough room for.
Speaker 2 (27:24):
And again they don't have a rescuing devices. Oh there's
tectonic uplift to keep them above sea level. And it's
the same way. And most of the kindess of the world,
there's no Africa doesn't have a lot of tectonic uplift.
There's no big andes mountains or rockies run the length
of Africa. So it shouldn't be there. But you see
all this evidence of erosion massive erosion, these plaination surfaces
(27:46):
that Mike Kellig and friend Mike Ordan talks about. He
sees all over his evidence of erosion massive erosion at
some point in the past, which we again think is
the receding phase.
Speaker 1 (27:57):
Okay, so the flood answers the flood.
Speaker 2 (27:59):
The flood's the best explanation of what we see. It's
just people don't want to think about it, you know,
the geologists, uniformitarianists, you know, the whole idea is starting
with Hutting, and many of the nineteenth century geologists started
pushing the Bible out, you know, trying to separate the
Bible from science, and in fact, by the Bible and
science actually match up perfectly when they look at the
(28:21):
data and just look at the data at an interpretation
of the data, but the actual data itself does support
a young Earth with one major period of massive deposition
and then massive erosion as that water went up and
as the water went down. Okay, all right, And there's
a lot of features alter like you talked about cliffs, waterfalls,
all these things. They're shown us. This landscape is youthful.
(28:43):
It's not that old because that would have smoothed all that.
Speaker 1 (28:46):
Off, and a lot of it's really intriguing, and it's
almost like these like I guess we can call them
like flood remnants almost are like beautiful. Like I think
of the Old Testament when God tells the Israelites to
set up stones so that you will remember your God.
(29:08):
Your children will remember your God. I think I see
some of those and I'm like, God's reminding us of
what actually happened.
Speaker 2 (29:15):
I think that's a grand canyon kind of is. I
was just out there with a group of people, and
I think it's almost like God ran his finger down
there as the water receded and corved it out, and said,
now look at all these layers. Yeah, you know, and
look how they're just stacked on top of each other
like pancakes. And knowing that we you know, the future
scientists would say there's gonna be millions years between this
layer and this layer and this layer. They say, look here,
(29:35):
it is right before your eyes, these rapidly deposited layers
and then rapid erosion to expose them. Well, we see
that all over the world. There's major canyons at that
same level, all over the world, many of the many
of the contents, and you don't see those canyons before
that level. So it's all at the end, just what
you'd expect in a global flood.
Speaker 1 (29:53):
Awesome. Well, I know that you've done a lot of
work along these lines. You have a book called Carved
in Stone, you have a DVD called carved in stone.
Speaker 2 (30:05):
Yes, it's it just came out.
Speaker 1 (30:07):
Well when yeah, when this releases. Uh, it would have
come out in December of twenty twenty three, so I
think it'll have been out for a month or so. Uh,
but we'll go ahead and plug it anyway. So get
your copy today. Do you have any final thoughts, anything
(30:27):
to any wisdom to impart to our viewers and listeners.
Speaker 2 (30:31):
I don't know about I don't know about wisdoms.
Speaker 1 (30:33):
About that Michigan wisdom.
Speaker 2 (30:36):
Let me just well, I don't know if it's any
different than any other state. But nonetheless, the I think
the wisdom here is that the Bible talks about creation,
the Bible talks about a flood, and to me, the
age that's you know, it's pretty clear in the genealogy
tells us it was only thousands of years ago, and
that millions and billions, and the evidence that we see
(30:56):
in the rocks all supports thousands of years ago. That
there was a major global flood just thousands of years
ago as well, not millions or billions, as the conventional
over secular community says. So there's a lot of evidence.
It isn't like science in religion, conflict science in the
(31:16):
Bible don't conflict at all. They actually match up perfectly
when you look at the rocks themselves, not looking at
the interpretations. When you're looking at the erosion rates that
we see today and compare them to what happened in
the flood. That's what we see. We don't see. We
see slow today. But there was a period of very,
very rapid deposition.
Speaker 1 (31:36):
Especially when the idea of those long years came from
someone who was trying to get rid of the Biblical account.
Speaker 2 (31:43):
And all these cliffs, you know, all those are things
that tell us this landscape is young. You know, all
these waterfalls over the world, cliffs and land and those
should have been rolled away, just like a lot of
the continents should rode away. So the evidence is there.
We just have to kind of open our eyes and
get in tune and look for it.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
Okay, not ever one's a geologist, so.
Speaker 2 (32:01):
You don't have to be Yea. Even the things you
know I talked about today, You see a waterfall, you think,
oh that that cliff. That cliff shouldn't be there. It
can't last millions and millions of years.
Speaker 1 (32:10):
So now I expect our listeners and viewers leave a
comment with your favorite geologic evidence of a young Earth,
and if it's incorrect, I'll talk to doctor Claary about
it and we'll we'll we'll reply to that. But yeah,
so young Earth, young rocks, erosion show, erosion rate show
(32:33):
that it can't be that old. So thank you, correct,
thank you, and to all of our listeners and viewers,
thank you so much for joining us. We asked that
you'd like subscribe, share this video with your friends and family.
If you have any questions, leave them in the comments
and I will get them to doctor Clary so that
he can answer them. And we also u if you
(32:54):
want to receive this podcast a week early or Watchcreation
dot live, I have two weeks early. You can always
become a member. You can join us here on YouTube
or on Patreon. We have lots of different perks, different tiers,
so give that a look. Links are in the description.
And of course I've been Trey and we'll see you
next time on the Creation Podcast
Hello, everyone, Welcome to the Creation Podcast, the show where
we discuss the science that confirmed scripture. I'm your host, Trey,
and I have with me today I see ours resident
geologist and northern expert because he is from Michigan, correct
the Great White nor So we have with us doctor Clary.
(00:25):
Thank you so much for being here, doctor Clary.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
That was a pleasure.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
Awesome. Well, it's always a pleasure to have you on.
We have a lot of fun here. We talked about
rocks here. We're going to be talking about rocks a
little bit today, not just rocks, but more of a
process that affects rocks, destroys rocks. What you know what
we're talking about? Yes, you do know what we're talking about.
(00:48):
I did, all right, So we're gonna be talking about erosion.
So when I think of erosion, I think of my
high school years and they're like, erosion is what happens
to you know, rocks and dirt and it just wears
things down and even like concrete gets eroded. There's water erosion,
there's air erosion. Right, let's just wipe all that away.
(01:11):
We're not going to think about what I learned in
high school. What do you say that erosion is.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Well, I would just say it's a removal of material,
whether it's the rock or sand or whatever. It's The
erosion is the actual you know, you can talk about weathering.
Weathering breaks stuff down, but the erosion is actually the
removal of that material from one place to another place.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
So erosion affects our planet and not just our planet,
but I guess every terrestrial planet that's out there. But
we're focused on Earth and so we do experience erosion here.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
Well, the other planets probably don't erode if they don't
have an atmosphere, you know what, doctor Clary, But they
probably don't eroad, like you know, the way we think
of it, there's there's things that are going to hit
them space. There's gonna be some impacts and things like that,
and there is some.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Well this is off topic, but aren't there storms on
some planets?
Speaker 2 (02:07):
Well, there are. Some of them do have an atmosphere,
like Jupiter and say and Venus, and Mercury doesn't really.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Okay, so it's just sitting there, nothing to erodiate it.
Speaker 2 (02:16):
Really, it gets really hot on one side, really cool
to another because it rotates so slowly. But other than
the solar wind maybe blasting off some Well, if you
did have an atmosphere at some point after the creation,
it's gone.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Now.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
So there's there's there's, yeah, there's there's maybe different scales
of erosion. Talking about.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
I love the little the little side tangent, thank you,
though I don't want to be incorrect. Okay, So we
have seen on our planet something very different than what
we would see on the other planets, I guess, uh,
and that is rapid erosion. We see things like floods
or catastrophes whatever that caused rapid erosion to happen. And
(03:03):
so this kind of stands in contrast to the supposed
millions or billions of years of layers that supposedly are
Earth has. Specifically, I think of like cliff collapses, which
is because you know, you see that cliff and then
if you talk to someone who's you know, uniformitarianist, and
(03:25):
they'll they'll be like, oh, that cliff side is four
point three five billion years old, not that old. That's
as old as I think the Earth is. But then
like if it collapses, it's gone. And then it's like, now,
what so we've seen I actually have a list here
if you don't mind a list of some of these,
(03:46):
like major collapses of cliff sides, the broad Church Cliffs
that have collapsed twice in twenty seventeen to twenty twenty three,
the White Cliffs of Dover two thousand and one and twelve,
the Australian Coastline two thousand and five and two thousand
and nine. Uh, that's all just within the last couple
(04:07):
of decades. And so that is erasing what is supposedly
millions of years of geologic history. And am I right
in saying that.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
Well, that's that's that's correct. I mean maybe at least
from their point of view, yea hundreds of thousands or
maybe even millions of years because those cliffs, you know,
supposedly we're always were taught in school like you were
that those cliffs you rode really slowly, but what would
you actually examine them for fifty years, one hundred years
or more. We're seeing it's a lot quicker than they
thought than they say.
Speaker 1 (04:38):
Right, And so these these cliff collapses, these these erosions,
even at current rates of erosion. Uh, I see, like
the continents wouldn't be here at all. Right if if
we follow.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
That most of the continents except maybe active mountain areas.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
Okay, So that's that's really.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
What's been measured. And I think there was a study
down in twenty eleven, most probably one of the more
recent studies, and they showed that the average rate of
erosion on the surface of the Earth above the sea
is about forty feet per million years. That's the rest
of its slow, but over millions of years of time,
that's a lot of erosion. So you're looking at areas
(05:19):
in the eastern US, they've experienced no uplift, even in
the conventional time of for about two hunred fifty million
years or more, maybe three hundred million years since the
appllations were supposedly formed that long ago. We don't believe that,
but that's what they say. And so the area, the
east coast and the midwest, all those areas were exposed
for several hundred million years. Well, if it's forty feet
(05:42):
per million years, there should almost be no continent left.
The should be right down to sea level in that
amount of time. So if you do the math, it
really adds up to a lot of hundreds of feet
of erosion, and the most of the area in that
continent is only five six hundred feet above sea level,
the applations themselves at all higher maybe a little island
strings sticking out there, but the rest of the Midwest,
(06:03):
you know, my home state of Michigan, as you mentioned,
that's six seven hundred maybe one thousand feet above sea level.
That should have all runned away and including most of
these coast should be gone. We wouldn't have anywhere to
live except maybe around the Rockies, which are more recent
in terms of the geodesic deep time paradigm type of
thing from there.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
From their point of.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
Right, so there's no active uplift to rescue. We talk
about rescuing device, there's no way to rescue the eastern
US because there hasn't been any active uplift and in
their time two hundred and fifty to three hundred million years.
So why do we still have these continents all over
the world There haven't been active geologically, haven't been uplifted.
(06:44):
Why are they still there?
Speaker 1 (06:45):
Right before we dive into some of these like how
does it? How do they how do they answer this?
Can you explain like what today that we see not
not catastrophic rates, just standard erosion rates. What causes that?
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Well, you know, just rain, heavy rainfall washed things away
and move things. Ice. You can argue the ice age
moved a lot of material around, gets caught in the
ice and gets transported. Or even say wind. Wind's not
very effective, just mostly for small sand sized particles. But
for the most part it's water, big floods, you know,
major local floods, all these types of things. You really
(07:26):
can move a lot of material very quickly in a
short amount of time. You know, you go back to
the classical studies at Mount Saint Helen's even in nineteen
eighty two the eruption, the second eruption after the nineteen
eighty eruption, the ice that had built up in the
crater melted away real quickly from this big slurry and
craved about things one hundred and forty foot deep canyon
like literally overnight. In Some of that was solid rock,
(07:47):
you know from previous eruptions, So under the right conditions,
erosion cannot be really fast. If you go back to
the origin of Deep Time and rode article about this
at our ICR you know, posted or a web page.
You can do a search under deep the Origin of
Deep Time. It was a James Hutton and he was
in the late later part of the eighteenth century seventeen nineties,
(08:10):
he was proposing the earth is millions of years old.
He wanted to get away from the studies, you know,
or the written record in the Book of Genesis, right
and when to get that out of science all together.
And so, but he was looking at erosion in areas
that were very very slowly months of erosion, and so
he wasn't seeing even a rapid catastrophic event like a
big major flood. He was just looking at day to
(08:32):
day erosion in the fields and the hills and the
rocks around Scotland, and he didn't really see evidence of
any rapid erosion. So he was saying, well, that much erosion,
you know, to to write a lot of rock and
deposit a lot of rock was to take in millions
of years. He just threw that number out there that
nobody can really fathom in their head. You know, try
to go home and think about a millionaires. You can't really,
(08:53):
I can't ask, I can't get yours, and so you know,
I consider like monopoly money, you can't. You know, he
just do such a big number out there, and this
is before they even had these you know techniques that
where they can try to get that from their age dating,
which is another whole story in itself.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
And so what you've talked about, we've had a broadcast
on dating that all.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
The assumptions built into it. But anyway, nonethe last day,
you know, that's what he saw, and so he kind
of said, that's slow erosion. That's what we say. But
yet we don't really see evidence of slow erosion in
the rock record. We see evidence of rapid erosion in
many places. Is kind of the name of the game.
It just sits there and sits there, and then all
of a sudden, the big piece of the cliff will
fall off, big chunks at a time. So it's whether
(09:36):
that's some that you want to call that the natural
process over time, it is a lot quicker than what
you think, because it happens. You know, big chunks will
fall off these cliffs, as you mentioned, very very quickly,
and huge sections will fall off. Really, the earth, you know,
I will say stuff like the earth like it's something,
but the earth really is built the way God built
(09:57):
the atmosphere, and the hydrologic cycle is built to destroy cliffs.
The cycles will destroy cliffs, waterfalls. All these waterfalls we
see over the earth. All these cliffs we see over
the earth, those are temporary features. They shouldn't be there.
They can't last for millions of years because they do
ear roads so quickly. Yeah, we see them all over
the world. We see them in Hawaii. We see waterfalls,
we see a lot of tubes in Hawaii. Wrote another
(10:19):
article about that in our web page. You know, there's
a lot of evidence in Hawaii that it's very, very young,
and part of it's the waterfalls and the cliffs. You know,
those are very temporary structures. They can't last for millions
of years. They should have been rooted flat by now.
It's just like the kindness themselves should have been routed
down at their own erosion rates at forty feet per year.
And in some ways Hawaii is even more interesting because
(10:42):
you got these islands out there. They're supposed to be.
You know, Kawaii is supposed to be around five million
years old, and I think I'm always supposed to be
two or three million years old, you know a while
who's somewhere around four give it take a little bit.
And but they're very small islands and they've measured the
erosion rate since nineteen hundred on the beaches. The beach erosion,
(11:03):
which is really is the erosion. The beach erosion on
the islands of Hawaii several islands is about point four
or feet per year, or about five inches per year,
and so you know, it doesn't seem like a lot,
but the islands are getting smaller every year by about
five inches all around.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
And if they're millions of years old.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
And after millions of years old, that's I think that
ends up being seventy six miles in one million years.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
How big are the island elans?
Speaker 2 (11:28):
Aren't that big? Yeah, And so there should be no
islands at all. There should be no islands at that rate,
which has been measured for over one hundred years now.
And so you know, you can't argue that there's hesibated waves.
You can't say the wave patterns changed. You know that
the oceans were always there, presumably even in deep time.
And so why are these islands there. The volcanic activity
(11:48):
stopped millions of years ago on some of these islands
in their worldview, so why are they still there. The
only island that should be there could still be there
would be the big island where you still have active
volcanic creating the others should be gone. They should become
seamounts like we see, you know, further west of Kawhi.
You see the seamounts.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
Interesting. Okay, So I've actually heard of a couple of,
like I guess, counter arguments for this, and I'll just
present them to you and if you think that they're valid,
give your opinion on them, Tear them to shreds if
you want. So. One that I've seen is that actually
the erosion rates were even slower in the past. They're
(12:31):
much more quick today because of the way we do
modern agriculture so.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
Well, and that may be a little bit of truth
in that. I mean, there's you know, we stir up
their soils more a little bit, and so you allow
more of our soil to wash up. But it isn't
really increasing the erosion rate of the rocks.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (12:52):
Yeah, people argue in the islands maybe because we're stirring
things up a little bit, but you're not really running away.
It's the waves are still the waves, and the wave action,
the wave erosion is probably fairly consistent. You know, where
an island comes up, it's going to be you know,
that particular area of the waves and that latitude and longitude.
That's kind of what it's been at. And you know
over several million years. One million years is all you
(13:13):
need to them. That's nothing. And so why are there
islands because that would be seventy six miles of erosion
in a million years. That's in four inch five inches
a year. Doesn't seem like a lot, but multiply it
by a lot of zeros and you get a lot
of erosion.
Speaker 1 (13:30):
So whereas you're essentially saying agriculture could be causing high
erosion rates, but it's not enough to make a difference
in the timescale that much.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
I mean, it's it's gonna e road, maybe a little
bit allow water access a little bit easier to some places.
It might double the erosion rates or something like that.
But even then you're looking at a lot of erosion.
Even if it's two you're looking at thirty five miles
in a million years. And that's about the islands there.
And if you look at the edges of the islands
where they come up by the water and the edges
where they come up because they make these big old
(14:00):
volcanoes that come out of the ocean, they had to
build up and build up, which I believe built up,
you know, almost catastrophic eruptions during the flood. You're and
maybe right after the flood, but you're looking at according
to my notes, about a third of a mile in
forty five hundred years. Okay, so you're looking at you know,
and it's not that much time. That's kind of what
we see. We don't see a big, huge, just a
(14:21):
little remnant sticking up, and everything just planed off like
you should see if it's millions of years old, maybe
just a little speck or nothing left at all. Okay,
they should just be planed off right below the wave base,
which is what a seamount really.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
Is, right. Okay, So another I guess rescue device that
I've seen is that the old rocks that we see
were actually like shielded by newer rocks. And I guess
that implies, you know, volcanic activity, right.
Speaker 2 (14:50):
Well, or you have to have a lot of deposition.
You know, you're looking at rocks that it would have
to be much much much thicker, Okay, you know, you
have to have thousands of feet more sediments that are
just gone and in many cases no evidence that they
were over there, just kind of wiped away. You know,
we believe that did happen in the receding phase of
the flood, but a lot of times those rocks maybe
weren't solid rock at the time, so there was a
(15:11):
umre erosion I think even of the contents as the
water was receding. So the water built up deposit a
lot of settlements rapidly as it eroded and receded. Of
course we saw thousands of feet of erosion, but again
that's it's a major cash traphic, one time event.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
So that happened, it's not been protected for millions and
millions of years, you know.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
But one other thing I know we've talked about in
the past is just like in the studio here, we
see these these big blocks, big bricks, that's what we see.
We see layer upon layer upon layer with almost no
erosion in between. And when you're a grand canyon, they
say that canyon formed. I think the current rate of
six million years formed that canyon. But when you look
(15:52):
at the rocks in between, some of the layers just
spits three million years between these two layers and one
hundred and sixty million years between these two layers, and
there's no canyons at all, Right, you know, you got
one hundred and sixty million years between the red wall
and the moo of limestones. One hundred and sixty million
years of time. Why is it perfectly flat?
Speaker 1 (16:09):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (16:09):
Everywhere you look, and those layers that time go. Yeah,
and by the studies I've been doing across the country,
those oil wells show that those same layers continue not
just in Grand CanYa, they go across the entire forty
eight states. Some of them go up into Canada and
New Mexico, and the same layers are found the same
way around the world. So we see these flat layers
(16:30):
of supposedly millions of years of time between many of them,
and there's no evidence of erosion. Right, So I challenge
the deep time people to explain, why is there no
erosion between all these layers.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Yeah, the rescue devices are all fine and good, even
if they don't make sense, but it's still the evidence
shows that that's not the case regardless. Okay, So there's
even some I guess, logical inconsistencies within the idea of
this erosion of deep time. One that comes to mind is,
(17:05):
you know, we see things like chimney rock or other
geologic features that seem very from a geologic standpoint, they
seem very fragile, and I think in my limited knowledge
that if they were that old, they would be just
like the islands, they would be gone already, right.
Speaker 2 (17:25):
Right, Yeah, Like Monument Valley. You see all these little
remnants sticking up and place, but most of it's gone.
Most of sandstone in between those little spires sticking up
is gone. We believe that's best explained by the receding
phase of the flood were huge, you know, chunks of
the sandstone where he rode it away by the by
the receding water, But they left a few remnants behind, right,
And so those few remnants showed that there was a
(17:45):
lot more sediment there at one point, but it's now gone.
But there's always gonna be some remnants when water washes off,
you know, is off a little bit here and there.
For whatever reason, this area is more resistant to the erosion,
or the currents were going in a different direction or
kind of swirled around some. Then they protected it, and
so you can just like you get sea cliffs and
stuff that eventually do we rode away, which you get
(18:06):
him temporarily, and that's kind of what Chimney Rock is
all these features are just temporary features that you know
that would take. Today's rates of erosion are slower than
the floods rates which was very fast, so they are
going slower. But you know, even things like delicate arch
in Arches National Park, same sort of thing. It looks
really delicate because it is, and it's probably going to collapse,
(18:28):
maybe in our lifetime, maybe your lifetime, but it's gonna
some of these features are going to collapse. And there's
a case in my home state of Michigan of the
pictured Rocks National Lake Shore along the Lake Superior. And
every year these guys, the boat guys used to take
tours there with students and every year the boat captains
will come through and say, big chunks of the cliff
are missing. That was there, you know the winter storms
(18:50):
and the ice. But one of the iconic symbols of
that park was called Miners Castle. It was two spires
of rock sticking up at five or ten feet and
one's April one spring when of them just slid into
the lake, just cracked off and there it went. So
there's only one spy or left, so it's not quite
as pretty. And the same thing happening out in Vermont,
(19:12):
didn't one of the faces or something collapse out there?
And the you know the White the White Mountains, one
of the old man of the some old old mountains face,
I forget the name of the rock that was really famous,
and it kind of collapsed away. So, as you mentioned
early on, that's kind of what's happening. We see hetastrophic
collapses that are more frequent than you know, people have
(19:34):
think about because it doesn't happen every year, twenty years,
three years down the line, but over centuries, these things
are collapsing even before our eyes today. So erosion is
pretty fast. I mean these rates and forty feet per
million years, you know, those they're just projected out assuming
conditions don't change too much. I think they're trying to
take into some of the effects of an occasional storm.
(19:56):
Storms are two that are going to increase the erosional rights.
But again it comes back to a well, why don't
you see canyons and curved valleys and gullies in between
these layers that are deposited. You know, there's really not
a lot of evidence of time between most these layers
that should be there. If you believe in even this
kind of erosion that they come up with. John Bomgunn
did some calculating. He's a geophysicist. Creation the geophysicist. He
(20:18):
calculated that you can have the tsunami waves that he's modeling,
can you road materials slid rock up to forty feet
per day?
Speaker 1 (20:26):
That's very fast if.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
You have these massive tsunami waves coming in one af
to that other, one after the other, like he envisions
for the flood, when you have rapid plate movement going
on and lots of tsunami waves generats, so you can
erode really quickly under the right conditions, and you can
also deposit very quickly under the right conditions.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
Okay, well, before we get to the right conditions, if
you will, it's time for our random science question of
the day. All right, are you ready?
Speaker 2 (20:50):
He's always worry me.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
These good I like to keep you worried. Uh So,
you mentioned Hutton earlier today, and I think that's a
pro i'me. Example, maybe not so much because he was
kind of like one of the first. But when people
look at rocks, why the so many people, I guess
(21:13):
people who aren't geologists, you know, the average person. Why
do rocks appear old? Why is there this idea that
any sort of like stone thing that isn't man made
is so ancient.
Speaker 2 (21:29):
Well, I think a lot of That's a couple of things.
Number One, as humans are short life spans that we
have on Earth, we don't see a lot of change.
Most places don't experience major catastrophes, you know, like eruptions,
thatch and manse helens. If you're living a long way
from that area, your terrain doesn't seem to change. We
look back at pictures one hundred years ago, they look
almost the same. Grand cane looks almost the same. And
(21:52):
so we don't see the change in our little temporary
life span of one human life span at all. And
we're not experiencing unless you experienced a major catastrophe in
that area. Secondly, where somewhat brainwashed by what's taught in
the schools, what's taught by geologists, what's been taught since
the times of hunting, that the Earth is old, extremely old,
(22:12):
too old for the Bible. You know, it's billion years old.
Like you said, over four billion years old is the
accepted age of the Earth. And so you're taught that,
you know, these rocks are old, and you go to
parks and wherever you go and visit the sign as
you'll always say these rocks are two point eight billion
years old, and these rocks are you know, million years
old whatever. That's always kind of being thrown out there.
(22:35):
So between not seeing a whole lot of erosion in
our short human lifespan and then the constant environment of
being told these are millions or billions of years old.
Everybody can say, ideah, that rocks are old. But the
rocks don't tell you time. They just they're just there.
Speaker 1 (22:50):
You tell us they're just there.
Speaker 2 (22:51):
Well, I tell time because the Bible tells us. Right.
You know, the Earth is about six thousand years old
and the flood was about forty five hundred years ago,
and everything I see in geology fits that.
Speaker 1 (23:03):
Right. So we're now done with the random science question
of the day. Thank you, I appreciate. Yeah. Well, so
you're saying the other ones are bad.
Speaker 2 (23:15):
This was better than so doesn't nothing bad.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
It's just you were prepared for this one.
Speaker 2 (23:20):
No, it was. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:22):
I had a better answer, maybe, speaking of than this
more biblically grounded worldview. We know that given current erosion rates,
just our planet can't be as old as they say
it is, So, where does erosion fit when it comes
(23:44):
to a biblical time scale? What role does it play
in getting the earth to where we see it today.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
Well, we see the evidence, especially when you look at
like air photos and you get up and look at
saddle views. You can really see that there's areas of
the earth that have experienced lots of erosion, you know,
where you can see just mature has been stripped away,
and you can almost see the transport directions by where
the settiments end up in the oceans. So you can
see thick areas in the oceans, you know with oil
(24:16):
well drilling and tied it into what we can see
from looking up kind of the big picture view, the
bird's eye view, you can see major areas that eroded
and were stripped away and material was transported. You might
not be able to tell the exact time. You can
see a common direction, you know, a common build up.
But there's a lot of evidence of massive erosion, which
(24:36):
I think most of that took place probably in the
receding phase of the flood.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
Okay, so according to I guess ICR and your view
of this progressive flood, it goes up to day one
fifty it reaches the top, then it starts to recede,
and you so like during that receding phase is when major,
major ma erosion takes place.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
You know, probably in some places tens of thousands of
feet of erosion, especially as the mountains were coming up,
and so all those sediments that went over from one
side of the rockets to the other. It might have
been five to ten thousand feet or more of sediment
that was all stripped off in many places, right down
to the crust out of the crystaline Precumbian rock we
call it in most cases. And so we knew we
(25:21):
can actually measure from one side of a mountain to
the other and you can get a pretty good estimate
of the same material is probably went over the top
or something close to it, and so you can estimate
how much erosion. So there's been a lot of erosion
in a very short amount of time in terms of
the biblical time frame. But it all seems to be
the best explanation for that would would be the flood,
(25:42):
the receding phase of the.
Speaker 1 (25:43):
Flood, because as you mentioned, the like, there is ice
and there is air sort of, but the main factor
in erosion is water. And so if there, if there was,
which we believe there was, and the evidence points that direction,
if there was a global flood, that would cause the
(26:04):
erosion that we.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
See, I think most is at the surface anyway today. Okay,
And the reason there's not much erosion today, why it
is you knowly forty feet per million years or whatever
the current rate seems to be, is because there isn't
a major receding phase. There isn't the land kind of
smarn't flooded anymore. They've all drained away. So now we
just have kind of going back to the normal hydrologic
(26:25):
cycle that we see occasional really heavy storms and landslides
here and there occasionally, but there's no big major event
that's going to really wash away tremendous amounts of rock
im material on a regional scale. You get some local
ones here and there, but there's no activity really it's
going to rode away in a regional scale. But even that,
like I said earlier, even that slow erosion is too
(26:47):
much for what we see. You know, most of the
contents should be gone, just like the Hawaiian islands should
be gone. The continents should be eroded right down to
the right down the sea.
Speaker 1 (26:57):
Level much of them, much of them, as I say,
except for.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
That, you know, again the rescuing device. You can argue
the rockies and the more recent mountain ranges, which all
most of them happened during the receding phase, those would
probably still be there. But most of the flatter areas,
you know, the Midwest, the east coast of the United States,
east of the Appalachians, there should shouldn't even be there.
Speaker 1 (27:21):
There wouldn't be enough room for.
Speaker 2 (27:24):
And again they don't have a rescuing devices. Oh there's
tectonic uplift to keep them above sea level. And it's
the same way. And most of the kindess of the world,
there's no Africa doesn't have a lot of tectonic uplift.
There's no big andes mountains or rockies run the length
of Africa. So it shouldn't be there. But you see
all this evidence of erosion massive erosion, these plaination surfaces
(27:46):
that Mike Kellig and friend Mike Ordan talks about. He
sees all over his evidence of erosion massive erosion at
some point in the past, which we again think is
the receding phase.
Speaker 1 (27:57):
Okay, so the flood answers the flood.
Speaker 2 (27:59):
The flood's the best explanation of what we see. It's
just people don't want to think about it, you know,
the geologists, uniformitarianists, you know, the whole idea is starting
with Hutting, and many of the nineteenth century geologists started
pushing the Bible out, you know, trying to separate the
Bible from science, and in fact, by the Bible and
science actually match up perfectly when they look at the
(28:21):
data and just look at the data at an interpretation
of the data, but the actual data itself does support
a young Earth with one major period of massive deposition
and then massive erosion as that water went up and
as the water went down. Okay, all right, And there's
a lot of features alter like you talked about cliffs, waterfalls,
all these things. They're shown us. This landscape is youthful.
(28:43):
It's not that old because that would have smoothed all that.
Speaker 1 (28:46):
Off, and a lot of it's really intriguing, and it's
almost like these like I guess we can call them
like flood remnants almost are like beautiful. Like I think
of the Old Testament when God tells the Israelites to
set up stones so that you will remember your God.
(29:08):
Your children will remember your God. I think I see
some of those and I'm like, God's reminding us of
what actually happened.
Speaker 2 (29:15):
I think that's a grand canyon kind of is. I
was just out there with a group of people, and
I think it's almost like God ran his finger down
there as the water receded and corved it out, and said,
now look at all these layers. Yeah, you know, and
look how they're just stacked on top of each other
like pancakes. And knowing that we you know, the future
scientists would say there's gonna be millions years between this
layer and this layer and this layer. They say, look here,
(29:35):
it is right before your eyes, these rapidly deposited layers
and then rapid erosion to expose them. Well, we see
that all over the world. There's major canyons at that
same level, all over the world, many of the many
of the contents, and you don't see those canyons before
that level. So it's all at the end, just what
you'd expect in a global flood.
Speaker 1 (29:53):
Awesome. Well, I know that you've done a lot of
work along these lines. You have a book called Carved
in Stone, you have a DVD called carved in stone.
Speaker 2 (30:05):
Yes, it's it just came out.
Speaker 1 (30:07):
Well when yeah, when this releases. Uh, it would have
come out in December of twenty twenty three, so I
think it'll have been out for a month or so. Uh,
but we'll go ahead and plug it anyway. So get
your copy today. Do you have any final thoughts, anything
(30:27):
to any wisdom to impart to our viewers and listeners.
Speaker 2 (30:31):
I don't know about I don't know about wisdoms.
Speaker 1 (30:33):
About that Michigan wisdom.
Speaker 2 (30:36):
Let me just well, I don't know if it's any
different than any other state. But nonetheless, the I think
the wisdom here is that the Bible talks about creation,
the Bible talks about a flood, and to me, the
age that's you know, it's pretty clear in the genealogy
tells us it was only thousands of years ago, and
that millions and billions, and the evidence that we see
(30:56):
in the rocks all supports thousands of years ago. That
there was a major global flood just thousands of years
ago as well, not millions or billions, as the conventional
over secular community says. So there's a lot of evidence.
It isn't like science in religion, conflict science in the
(31:16):
Bible don't conflict at all. They actually match up perfectly
when you look at the rocks themselves, not looking at
the interpretations. When you're looking at the erosion rates that
we see today and compare them to what happened in
the flood. That's what we see. We don't see. We
see slow today. But there was a period of very,
very rapid deposition.
Speaker 1 (31:36):
Especially when the idea of those long years came from
someone who was trying to get rid of the Biblical account.
Speaker 2 (31:43):
And all these cliffs, you know, all those are things
that tell us this landscape is young. You know, all
these waterfalls over the world, cliffs and land and those
should have been rolled away, just like a lot of
the continents should rode away. So the evidence is there.
We just have to kind of open our eyes and
get in tune and look for it.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
Okay, not ever one's a geologist, so.
Speaker 2 (32:01):
You don't have to be Yea. Even the things you
know I talked about today, You see a waterfall, you think,
oh that that cliff. That cliff shouldn't be there. It
can't last millions and millions of years.
Speaker 1 (32:10):
So now I expect our listeners and viewers leave a
comment with your favorite geologic evidence of a young Earth,
and if it's incorrect, I'll talk to doctor Claary about
it and we'll we'll we'll reply to that. But yeah,
so young Earth, young rocks, erosion show, erosion rate show
(32:33):
that it can't be that old. So thank you, correct,
thank you, and to all of our listeners and viewers,
thank you so much for joining us. We asked that
you'd like subscribe, share this video with your friends and family.
If you have any questions, leave them in the comments
and I will get them to doctor Clary so that
he can answer them. And we also u if you
(32:54):
want to receive this podcast a week early or Watchcreation
dot live, I have two weeks early. You can always
become a member. You can join us here on YouTube
or on Patreon. We have lots of different perks, different tiers,
so give that a look. Links are in the description.
And of course I've been Trey and we'll see you
next time on the Creation Podcast
Popular Podcasts
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Therapy Gecko
An unlicensed lizard psychologist travels the universe talking to strangers about absolutely nothing. TO CALL THE GECKO: follow me on https://www.twitch.tv/lyleforever to get a notification for when I am taking calls. I am usually live Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays but lately a lot of other times too. I am a gecko.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.