I Survived Church Abuse

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
Pay Professional Homegirls and Men. Before we dive into this
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(00:31):
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star review on Apple Podcasts.

Speaker 2 (00:36):
Remember hoe me down, don't hold me up.

Speaker 3 (00:38):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (00:39):
I hope you all enjoyed this week's episode, but if
the conversation starts to become triggering, please remember to put
your well being and your mental health first. Love y'all,
deep and until next time later. Coming up on this
week's episode of the Professional Homegirl Podcast, we are diving
into a crucial topic, sexual abuse within the walls of churches.

(01:01):
It is a tough subject, but one that needs our attention.
Way too often, the voices of those who've gone through
this have been pushed to the side, hidden away by
feelings of guilt and fear. On today's show, I got
an amazing guest joining us. She's brave enough to share
her own story as a survivor of church related abuse,
and I think that her perspective will open our eyes
to the challenges that survivors face and the steps we

(01:23):
need to take for prevention. So to my guests, thank
you so much for sharing your story on the show.
How you doing, how you feeling.

Speaker 3 (01:30):
I'm great? Thank you for having me, Thank you so much.

Speaker 4 (01:34):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (01:35):
So, since sharing your story, have you had any encounters
with others who have experienced similar abuse in the church setting?

Speaker 4 (01:42):
Absolutely? In two ways.

Speaker 3 (01:45):
I've had people that men and women that have come
to me and shared their stories about how they were
abused by men, and they were men and women that
was abused by women.

Speaker 4 (02:03):
Talk about Yes, absolutely.

Speaker 3 (02:06):
And then I have the other side of it where
that some of the people from that denomination, Church of
God in Christ, have been threatening me since I told
my story.

Speaker 2 (02:18):
Really yes from the church day you grew up in.

Speaker 3 (02:23):
Or just no, just the the people in that denomination.
What they've been saying, Yeah, well I'm threatening me not
to write my book. First of all, they were saying
how I was bashing the Church of God in Christ,
their denomination. This one, this one lady told me that

(02:46):
the abuse was my fault. I was thirteen when it
happened thirteen fourteen, she told you that she did, and
she she is a diehard Church of God in Christ,
born and bred.

Speaker 4 (02:58):
You know.

Speaker 3 (02:58):
That's how they rolled for that denomination. That is not
but it but it's it's when you have that loyalty
to man and a denomination rather than that loyalty to God.
That's how it that's how it works.

Speaker 4 (03:16):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (03:16):
And that's what I actually told her. If you need,
you need to start being loyal to God and that
not his denomination.

Speaker 1 (03:23):
Absolutely, how anybody gave you any physical threats.

Speaker 4 (03:29):
No, just uh, they'll inbox me.

Speaker 3 (03:32):
Considered this a warning if you keep talking, you know,
crazy stuff like that. But my assignment is not the
Bachelor Church. My assignment is to help those that are
still crying silent tears, those that are still struggling with
that guilt and that shame and thinking that it was

(03:54):
their fault the abused. I dealt with that for forty years,
and I shut my mouth for forty years.

Speaker 4 (04:02):
And I just started telling my story.

Speaker 3 (04:04):
Last year and oh wow, yeah yeah, just last year.

Speaker 2 (04:11):
So what as are you to share your story?

Speaker 4 (04:14):
Well, I had buried it for forty years.

Speaker 3 (04:16):
As I said, I was at work one night, and.

Speaker 4 (04:24):
I said it was this big bright.

Speaker 3 (04:26):
Light just shined in that area of that dark place
where I had kept it buried for forty years. And
I started panicking and I said, Lord, why are you
showing me this? And he told me. God told me
that it was time for me to be made whole.
And he said, go and tell your children. And I

(04:49):
told him, I said, I don't want to be made whole,
you know, because I knew that to be made whole,
I had to confront what I buried. I had to
deal with it. I had to embrace it. I had
to I mean, I had to feel everything that I
felt the forty years that I buried, and I don't want.

Speaker 4 (05:09):
To do that was too painful.

Speaker 3 (05:12):
And so when he told me to go and tell
my children, that was hard too, because in the midst
of the abuse that I went through, when I was
thirteen fourteen, I got pregnant.

Speaker 2 (05:25):
Right was we going to talk about?

Speaker 4 (05:28):
Yes?

Speaker 3 (05:28):
And so I had a daughter at fifteen and children
service were put up for adoption. But they I told
them that she was their sister by the same father
that they had, Okay, But in actuality, I didn't know
if she was the elder that raped me's child or

(05:54):
the younger boy that was involved with taking my virginity,
which I ended up marrying.

Speaker 4 (05:59):
Him right and had four and had four more children
with him.

Speaker 2 (06:03):
Did you ever find out who the father was?

Speaker 4 (06:06):
I not yet.

Speaker 3 (06:07):
I want daughter, I do, but I have to wait
on her. You know what I'm saying. I found my
daughter after forty years.

Speaker 2 (06:17):
That's right, that's right.

Speaker 3 (06:19):
Yes, yes, and so she still you know, we we
we're getting there, but I have to just totally wait
and respect her because she Yeah, be patient with her
because it was a lot for her as well.

Speaker 1 (06:37):
Do you feel like the discussions about church abuse within
especially within black communities, have been lacking.

Speaker 4 (06:44):
Oh?

Speaker 3 (06:44):
Absolutely yeah. They sweep it under the rug. They don't
want to hear about it. They they'll blame you, you know,
as they are blaming me. And I was a child,
as I said, And the lady said, well, what part
did you take in it? You know, I was in
children's service board, I was in a foster home. I

(07:06):
didn't take no part in it. And when I told
the pastor that at this elder was doing this to me,
he told me to keep bringing him reports. So after
I told the pastor, and he told me to keep
bringing reports. I had to process that, like, okay, does

(07:29):
this mean to keep letting this man do what he
wanted to do to me?

Speaker 4 (07:32):
Just keep bringing reports?

Speaker 2 (07:33):
And what's the report? Like what do you want to know?

Speaker 3 (07:35):
Just well, okay, well he touched me here today and
he did right, very weird.

Speaker 4 (07:43):
And so.

Speaker 3 (07:46):
I kept taking reports every time this this man would
touch me. And because I'm thinking, okay, after one of
these reports, it's.

Speaker 4 (07:56):
Going to stop. You know.

Speaker 3 (07:59):
So as a child, you know you're told to go
tell another adult when we're being touched inappropriately.

Speaker 4 (08:05):
I did that. I went to the pastor.

Speaker 3 (08:09):
Nothing ever happened because I was waiting on that meeting
with my foster mother, the elder and the pastor.

Speaker 4 (08:17):
You know, I was waiting. But that needing never happened.

Speaker 3 (08:21):
What actually happened was the pastor himself started molesting me.

Speaker 1 (08:26):
Right now before we continue, where was your I know
where your mom was at, but where was your mom
and your family?

Speaker 2 (08:32):
Because I know you come from a large family.

Speaker 3 (08:35):
Yes, So the reason I got into foster cares. Both
of my parents died when I was twelve years old,
and so stay got wind of it and they came
and took me because I was the youngest of the
nine children, and they put I became a ward of

(08:58):
the state pretty much. And then they put me I
was twelve, tenn and thirteen. They put me in a
foster home with the church mother who was over the
in you know, in the Church of God in Christ,
you got church mothers, you got pastor's aide, you got
all those type of.

Speaker 4 (09:18):
Titles.

Speaker 3 (09:19):
But she was a church mother and she was, you know,
always busy doing stuff for her first family, you know,
and things like that. And that's how my doom started
because prior to my mom died and I was playing kickball.

Speaker 4 (09:34):
You know, I was still playing.

Speaker 3 (09:36):
I was a child, you know, I wasn't a bass
girl and none of that. So when my mom died,
and then we found out four months later that my
dad died, so my mom was all I had because
her and my dad had separated. And that's how I

(09:56):
got into this whole situation. Children's Service Board put me
in a foster home, and you know, it was.

Speaker 2 (10:05):
A church, not the country.

Speaker 1 (10:09):
I feel like because I had a lot of conversations
with survivors and some of them stories.

Speaker 2 (10:15):
A lot of this stem from foster care.

Speaker 4 (10:18):
Yeah I've heard that too.

Speaker 1 (10:20):
Yeah, yeah, like that it had to be something that
needs to be changed because this is like.

Speaker 2 (10:27):
Children a lot.

Speaker 3 (10:29):
And but this is what one of the ladies that
was said, it was my fault. She said, well, you
need to blame foster care. No, I was placed in
foster care. But those men chose to do what they
did to me.

Speaker 4 (10:45):
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 (10:46):
Like I could have been in a hundred looster homes,
but it was still that pastor and that elder's decision.

Speaker 4 (10:54):
It was their choice to do what they did.

Speaker 2 (10:57):
So and this is something they've been doing.

Speaker 3 (11:01):
Oh yeah, yeah, I mean it goes, it goes a
long way back, and that's why they try to keep
it quiet. Hush hush. I mean I was quiet for
forty years, and when I started telling my story, I
became the villain, you know, I became you know, you're

(11:23):
trying to bash our denomination and things like that, And
it was never about that I was.

Speaker 4 (11:29):
I was telling my truth.

Speaker 3 (11:31):
It's not the cycle, absolutely absolutely, And so you know,
when you know you've been assigned to do a thing, I'm.

Speaker 4 (11:42):
Unbothered by you. I laugh at at.

Speaker 3 (11:44):
It most times, but I know that there are still
people that are out there that are still feeling guilty
because I felt guilty.

Speaker 4 (11:54):
I felt like it was my fault. What could have
done differently?

Speaker 3 (11:58):
I did everything right, but I didn't get to that
place until last year. And that happened to me when
I was thirteen fourteen. But I just got to that
place where I did everything right. I told the adult
I did everything right, But for forty years I blamed myself.

Speaker 1 (12:18):
Yeah, and by this time, did you find it difficult
to trust anyone else, especially since the pastor was asking
you to bring in reports? Like was there anybody else
you felt comfortable with within the church?

Speaker 4 (12:29):
You know what I would say?

Speaker 3 (12:33):
My trauma started when I was about five years old,
when my father would beat me unmercifully. So I was
a child of an abused home to where he would
beat me and my sisters and my mother. He would
never touch the boys. But that's when my trauma started.
And I didn't know anything about trauma or anything or

(12:54):
child abused.

Speaker 4 (12:55):
I didn't know anything about that.

Speaker 2 (12:56):
But you didn't have the language work back then, and yeah,
I didn't.

Speaker 3 (12:59):
Have the language, didn't know anything. I just knew I
would get beat by this my dad. And so after
my mom died, they took children serve board took me
from the rest of my family. So it was like
my mom died, my dad, dad, and the rest of
my family died because they snatched me from my older
brothers and sisters.

Speaker 4 (13:20):
So I was just alone. I felt like.

Speaker 3 (13:24):
And when I went to the church and I grew
up coaching, I grew up Church of God in Christ
till my mom died. Like I said, I'm not as twelve.
But after telling the pastor, it was like I couldn't
even think to even tell somebody else. My mind just

(13:44):
would not let me even think to tell somebody because
the foster mother knew, his wife knew. I mean, I
mean they knew. So it's like, you know, who do
I tell? So eventually when the young man he took

(14:05):
advantage of me, he took my virginity, but he was sixteen.

Speaker 1 (14:08):
This is a young boy that just said and when
he interviews he like dart scan women.

Speaker 3 (14:13):
Yes, yes, yes, And I gravitated toward him and we
started talking. He hated me, but he just kind of
used me for a sex and experiencing things like that.
But when I told him about the pastor and the elder.

Speaker 4 (14:34):
My abuse stopped. It stopped.

Speaker 3 (14:37):
So now my loyalty went to this boy that saved
me from the bad men.

Speaker 2 (14:46):
Do you think they was all in conhudive with each other.

Speaker 3 (14:49):
Well, I think there's a whole chain of that stuff
going on, not the boy, but there's a spirit in
that that has play the church. You know, we talk
about the Catholic church, but that thing happens everywhere, and
it's it's a it's a spirit, that's what I call it.

(15:12):
But when the boys saved me, my loyalty went to him.
So now I knew that he was using me, but
he saved me.

Speaker 2 (15:24):
You think what I.

Speaker 3 (15:26):
Felt protected, And so he actually became one of my
abusers as well. But it didn't matter what he did
because I was still I think I had arrested development.

(15:46):
And that is when you had so much trauma in
your life, you stopped right where that trauma happens.

Speaker 4 (15:53):
And so no.

Speaker 3 (15:54):
Matter what I was twelve thirteen, fourteen, fifteen, twenty twenty
five cents, I was still that at thirteen fourteen year
old girl that he's.

Speaker 2 (16:02):
Saved, and that's all you at that point.

Speaker 3 (16:05):
Yeah, and so whatever I mean I I ended up
marrying him.

Speaker 1 (16:11):
Before you continue, I think that whole situation was crazy too.
Like the mom, the way these moms protect these boys. Yeah,
it's disgusting.

Speaker 4 (16:23):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (16:25):
You also mentioned about the elder coming over one night,
and you said that he had this look in his
eyes that frightened you.

Speaker 3 (16:32):
Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. So I'm fourteen and when
I told the young man the abuse stopped, well, the pastor,
he's he just went on, probably somebody else, but the
elder has stopped for us a season. And then he

(16:54):
came over to the foster home and he was able
to do that because he was part of the click,
you know, the church click. And I told him, you know,
my foster mother's not home, and he came in. He
was just like he knew about me telling the boy
what they did, right, and so, you know, all of

(17:18):
a sudden he got this this. I don't know how
long he had been planning this, but that look it
frightened the heck out of me. In his eyes. I
found myself fighting with this man. I'm fourteen, he was
thirty something and he did this move, twist my arm
and I went down to the floor and that's where

(17:41):
he raped me, and so after that he told me
I'd better not say anything. And I felt nasty, just
just horrible. And it was like he wore this cologne

(18:02):
that that I literally just stopped smelling about three years ago.
And now I was fourteen when it happened, and every
time I would.

Speaker 2 (18:14):
You just stop smelling it, like I literally.

Speaker 3 (18:16):
Just stop smelling that that smell. It'll come, you know,
at will. And when the smell would come, I would
I start getting sick.

Speaker 4 (18:26):
I would start dry heving.

Speaker 3 (18:28):
Just it was just a crazy, maybe psychological thing that
that was going.

Speaker 2 (18:33):
On, because physically this person.

Speaker 3 (18:37):
No, no, but I would smell that cologne and it
would just I don't know it was I don't know,
it had to be psychologically, but I would start just
throwing up or getting sick when I smell it.

Speaker 4 (18:52):
You know, maybe a.

Speaker 3 (18:55):
Therapist that would listen to this broadcast would know exactly
what I'm talking about. But I literally just stopped smelling
it three years ago. And so yeah, it was bad.

Speaker 4 (19:07):
It was bad.

Speaker 3 (19:08):
He left, and then it was crazy because once Children's
Service Board and I don't know how they heard what
was going on over there, but they came and removed
me from that foster home and then put me in
another foster home. These are church people too, but they

(19:30):
were throwing shoes at me. And you know the mother church,
the mother, she wasn't a church mother, but she was
a foster mother, throwing shoes at me, you know, calling
me dumb, stupid, things like that. So it was one
night they were going to church and nobody knew where
I was, I mean Children's Service board, because I was

(19:51):
in their custody.

Speaker 4 (19:52):
They didn't have to tell, you know.

Speaker 3 (19:55):
And I went to that home and when they went
to church one night, I got on the phone and
called my brother. I'm like, look, call my casework and
this lady is throwing shoes at me, calling me dumb, stupid.

Speaker 4 (20:09):
You know.

Speaker 3 (20:09):
I was already in enough trauma, you know. And by
the time they got home, it was like my brother
had called everybody, right, you know, my sisters and brothers,
and she was like, I told you, we should have
took that dummy to church with us.

Speaker 5 (20:25):
You know.

Speaker 4 (20:25):
It's just horrible.

Speaker 3 (20:27):
And you know people that some people just do that foster.

Speaker 4 (20:32):
Care for money, Yeah, for a check for a check.

Speaker 3 (20:37):
It's not and it's not fair to the children because
we didn't act to be there, so as a service
board came and got us or took us from our
families and things like that. And it's just so unfair
how foster kids aren't treated.

Speaker 4 (20:52):
You were going through.

Speaker 1 (20:53):
Enough, right, and then they wonder why we have a
lot of messed up individuals in the world.

Speaker 4 (20:58):
Exactly and exactly.

Speaker 3 (21:01):
So my brother, my caseworker, came and got me the
next day from that house and put me in a
group home.

Speaker 4 (21:10):
Right. And so after.

Speaker 3 (21:14):
After some time went by, I started and this is
when the boy had taken my virginally and I was
with him and.

Speaker 4 (21:24):
Things like that. So I felt something moving to my stomach.

Speaker 3 (21:27):
And I'm like, you know, I told one of the
house parents, something is something is in my stomach, you know.

Speaker 4 (21:34):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (21:35):
And at this point, did you even know what sex
was like like physically?

Speaker 4 (21:40):
No, I mean he.

Speaker 3 (21:41):
Actually, the fourteen year old boy, actually, I mean the
sixteen year old boy actually took my virginity. And he
had brothers that were advanced, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 4 (21:53):
He had brothers that was.

Speaker 3 (21:55):
Teaching him stuff. So and I just clinged on to him.
But you know, I didn't know. I just did it
because I had loved that boy. From the first time
I saw him, it was like love first sight. So
I can't even say I cling to him, you know,
after that, But.

Speaker 4 (22:14):
It was before that. It was before that. It was
before that.

Speaker 5 (22:17):
It was before that.

Speaker 4 (22:35):
And he was light skinned it, you know, so.

Speaker 3 (22:40):
But he I mean, and his brothers were I mean,
they find brothers, you know, and they like light skinned
girls or Puerto Rican girls with long hair. And I
knew I didn't stand a chance. But I guess I
was his test dummy for him because he told me
that I was the first girl that he had he

(23:00):
slept with. So yeah, and so but you know who knows,
I just know, yeah, yeah, and I just think that.
But but but when I look back at that, I
look at how I was being trained to be the

(23:21):
side chick because he was grooming me.

Speaker 4 (23:25):
And he was, I mean, he was mature, but even sixteen.

Speaker 3 (23:28):
But yeah, I mean when I would go around, I
couldn't talk to him, you know, he could only I
couldn't approach him. And I did it because I loved him,
you know what I'm saying. I loved him, and then
he saved me from the bad men. And so this
is on through you know, my teenage, my my mid twenties.

Speaker 4 (23:49):
I mean, I just stayed. You know.

Speaker 3 (23:51):
He told me that nobody's going to want me. You know,
I'm ugly. All I'm good for is a good screw,
and you know, and I believed that because you are
what you eat. And so he would tell me that,
you know, all the time when we had got together,
and I just I just stay.

Speaker 4 (24:13):
You know.

Speaker 1 (24:15):
One of the things that I saw in one of
your interviews is when you said that it was very
difficult for you to say the word word rape over
forty years ago.

Speaker 4 (24:24):
Ya, Oh, my gosh, yes, it was.

Speaker 3 (24:27):
It was difficult until I started writing my book.

Speaker 4 (24:33):
December of last year, I believe, And.

Speaker 3 (24:40):
It wasn't until then actually that I was able to
say I was raped. I believe that I was in denial.
I believe that, you.

Speaker 5 (25:05):
Know.

Speaker 3 (25:06):
I used to use where it's like, you know, he
he was touching me, you know, he you know, I
would actually say the things, but I would never say
what it was. You know, it was just something Once again,
I would say something mentally that where I just couldn't

(25:27):
bring myself to say, wow, I was raped, you know
what I'm saying. I was just in denial. Of that
until and that's when when the Lord was telling me
I have to.

Speaker 5 (25:39):
I have to.

Speaker 4 (25:40):
It's tied me to be made whole.

Speaker 3 (25:42):
I knew that I had to face and deal with
all of that, like I had to feel everything that.

Speaker 4 (25:48):
I went through all over again.

Speaker 3 (25:53):
And because I was so used to just burying things
after so many things that happened to me, and I
wouldn't get any help or support, I would just bury it.

Speaker 2 (26:04):
Yeah, I mean that's all you knew.

Speaker 3 (26:06):
Yeah, I just buried it. And I said, well, I'm
just gonna go ahead and take this to the grave
because it was so painful and embarrassing too, because the
devil called me a whore for forty years, You a whore,
you don't know who your child's father is, and he would,
you know, beat that thing in me mentally my mental

(26:29):
thoughts that it was embarrassing. So when the Lord had
actually told me, go and tell your children, I said,
I can't tell them that because for all this time
I've been telling them that they had a sister and
she's their father's daughter. But in actuality, I don't know
whose child she is. I don't know if she was

(26:51):
the elder that raped me or his Actually, both of
them dinied ever.

Speaker 1 (26:55):
Touching me, right, So when you found out that she
was pregnant in the group home or it was like
an on wet home for mothers.

Speaker 3 (27:03):
Well it it was a group home first, because after
I left the second foster home, they took me to
what was called a receiving home. That's what they were
calling them back then. Yeah, it was back in the eighties.
So when I started feeling something flooding in my stomach,

(27:23):
I didn't know what it was, so I just kind
of let it happen. And as time went on, I
told him in the house, Princess, something is in my stomach,
and she was saying, well, are you pregnant? Of course
I didn't know, you know, but they found out that, yes,
I was fourteen and pregnant. Yeah, I was fourteen and pregnant.

(27:45):
And so they took me to another group home. This
home was for unweb mothers. I was the youngest person there,
of course, and there was other young girls there were
I was the youngest, and so, you know, my family
didn't know where I was children's service board. They pretty

(28:09):
much dropped me off like I was a straight cat,
you know that they would drop off at the shelter
and I didn't see them anymore until I had my daughter.

Speaker 4 (28:22):
But there was.

Speaker 3 (28:25):
Somehow the boy, and that's who I call him in
my book.

Speaker 4 (28:28):
The boy.

Speaker 3 (28:31):
Found out where I was and.

Speaker 4 (28:34):
They told me, you have a phone call.

Speaker 3 (28:35):
We had to walk down this long haul and I'm
thinking it was my brother or you know, some of
my family, but it was him.

Speaker 4 (28:44):
He started having these girls called me.

Speaker 3 (28:47):
And yeah, it was horrible, Like it was so mentally
stressful that I literally contemplated suicide and and it just
and you know, there was one point I said, I'm
not even going to answer this spoone anymore because I

(29:10):
know that it's it's those girls again. And I heard
the guys in the background, and you ball aheaded.

Speaker 4 (29:17):
I didn't have no hair. I don't have the hair no.

Speaker 3 (29:19):
Hair today because COVID took my hair. But back then
you had your hair.

Speaker 4 (29:24):
Oh it was horrible. Really, I had. I had locks
down to my but and you can see me. This
is this is what I was left with. So it
was horrible.

Speaker 2 (29:35):
How many time did you have it once?

Speaker 3 (29:37):
I had it twice, actually twice, but that first time
almost took me out.

Speaker 4 (29:43):
Yeah, it was horrible, but.

Speaker 3 (29:48):
You know, so constantly hearing what you're not constantly hearing
you you know, you're doing nothing, no work. You believe,
you start believing it, right, And I was so connected
to him, it was like, you know, my family's like,
why don't you leave him?

Speaker 4 (30:07):
He's going And I was.

Speaker 3 (30:10):
So stuck on this guy that I believe.

Speaker 4 (30:13):
It was a trauma bond. There was a trauma bond,
and I just stayed, like, you know, through the.

Speaker 3 (30:18):
Beatings, through the cheatings, you know, all of that. I
just stayed because nobody else.

Speaker 4 (30:25):
Would want me, right.

Speaker 1 (30:27):
I'm just curious if there is one thing that you
can change or improve about the foster care system based
on your experience, what would it be.

Speaker 3 (30:37):
Well, I would think, I mean people they act a
certain way, so you can't really you can't really say, well,
these people are the best people because they you have
a lot of pretenders.

Speaker 2 (30:50):
Yeah, they show face when it's time to show face.

Speaker 4 (30:53):

Speaker 3 (30:54):
So it's kind of hard to detect a predator or
to detect someone.

Speaker 4 (31:03):
That's an abuser.

Speaker 3 (31:05):
But I would but I would say the false hit.
The care would have to do more visits, do pop
up visits, you know what? I'm saying, I know that's
probably not possible. That they have to call the people
and let them know that they're coming. So when they
do that, you can put on your face, you know
what I'm saying. So it's kind of a hard thing

(31:28):
to do. But I mean, just be more careful when
you put these children.

Speaker 2 (31:33):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (31:34):
Yeah, And I feel like up until this point, I mean,
you definitely went through a lot. So how does how
did this affect your relationship with God?

Speaker 5 (31:42):
Oh?

Speaker 4 (31:43):
It didn't.

Speaker 3 (31:45):
And that's what people say, Well, how are you still
you know, talking about God?

Speaker 4 (31:50):
And how are you still?

Speaker 3 (31:53):
For some reason, my focus was on him taking my mother,
Like why did you take my mom?

Speaker 2 (32:02):
The only really loved me?

Speaker 3 (32:04):
Yes, And that's where my focus state every time I
will go through something. It was like I need my mom,
you know my mom? And I never I never blamed
him because and even though these were men of the claw,
I never blamed him. And I was just mature enough

(32:26):
or in him enough, even as a child or a
teenager to know that he didn't.

Speaker 4 (32:32):
Cause that right, those men did that.

Speaker 3 (32:36):
And then as I got older, reading a scripture for
we rousing out against flesh and blood, but against principalities
and spirits and weakness to high places. It was, it was,
it was. It was the enemy that actually tried to
keep me off my path. But however, he don't know
what he did. Because now I'm telling my story, I

(32:58):
want to tell it everywhere because there are some people
that are still saying it was my fault. There's still
people that's crying silent tears, and so now that's my assignment.
My people say, well, why do you name your music?
Because I've already given them forty years?

Speaker 2 (33:18):
What more do you want?

Speaker 4 (33:19):
Why do I have to name them? You know? This
one incident with.

Speaker 3 (33:27):
After I after I had my baby at fifteen, they
came and took her because.

Speaker 2 (33:33):
I'm like, how does she get into system? They took her.

Speaker 3 (33:37):
They so when I was at the well mother's home
I had and I hadn't seen you the service boards
since they dropped me off. When I had my baby
August twenty first, her birthday is coming up.

Speaker 2 (33:49):
Oh happy birthdays listening to.

Speaker 3 (33:51):
This, yes, And I asked them if I could see
her because again I'm I'm fifteen. I don't know nothing
about nothing. I was a child doing grown up things.
You know, that landed me in this predicament that I
was in, and so they took the baby out really quickly,

(34:15):
and it was getting night at this point, and I
asked one of the nurses, I said, can I see
my baby? And she said, well, you can't see her
because we were under the impression that you were putting
her up for adoption.

Speaker 4 (34:30):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (34:31):
Well, I didn't tell you all that because I don't
know nothing about adoption.

Speaker 4 (34:35):

Speaker 3 (34:37):
Children's Service board. They had already you know, sign sealed
and delivered my fate and my daughter's fade.

Speaker 4 (34:46):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (34:46):
And so they did get to let me see. They
did let me see her the next day when the
social worker came in and she also said, well, you know,
I can let you see her for a few minutes.
But we were under the impression that she was giving
her a for adoption. I never said that, and that
thing just, oh my god, it's it did something to me.

(35:13):
Once I got back to Youngstown and in another group home,
which is where I ended up staying till like graduating
and things like that.

Speaker 4 (35:25):
From high school.

Speaker 3 (35:26):
The ran school, they asked me what was my plan?
So I said, well, I'm gonna ask my sister if
she can get us till I'm.

Speaker 4 (35:37):
Eighteen, or get the baby, I asked the boy's mother.

Speaker 3 (35:41):
She was like, no, you know, my son said he
never touched you, so it's a no, you know. But
they told me, well, being that you're fifteen, we think
it's best that.

Speaker 4 (35:57):
We put the.

Speaker 3 (35:58):
Baby a for adoption. So why take me through asking
me what are my plans?

Speaker 2 (36:05):
You know, because you already made the decision for me.

Speaker 3 (36:08):
You already made this decision for me. And so that
was such a hard thing. I don't know how long
I cried.

Speaker 4 (36:14):
I cried for forty years, I'll tell you that. But
I told them I want to call. I wanted to call.

Speaker 3 (36:20):
I wanted to name her Brion. I'm telling them all,
you know, and.

Speaker 2 (36:26):
Do something about that dog something.

Speaker 4 (36:29):
You know what.

Speaker 3 (36:31):
I had to deal with Children Service Board, with something
that happened with one of my daughters, with her children,
not me, And I'm telling you everybody was at fault.
I carried that thing for forty years the way they
did me. And when I had to meet with them,
I said, y'all, I took my daughter. Y'all, I took

(36:52):
my daughter, and they didn't know what I was talking about.
Because it was forty years ago, right right, you know.

Speaker 2 (36:58):
But but you find it was on your voice.

Speaker 4 (37:00):
Yes, and so.

Speaker 3 (37:02):
But last, like I said, last year, I've done I've
done two conferences titled this is My Exodus, and it
was last year was the very first one that I did.
And that was the time that the day after the conference,
and it's tailor made for those that have been abused,

(37:27):
because abuse is abused, So it was for everyone that
have been abused, because it was tailor made for those
that have been abused and sexually valiated within the walls
of the church. And so I have sessions and just
powerful and the day, the last day of the conference,

(37:49):
I didn't know if I could make it. I was
so full because everybody had got free in everybody praison Lord,
and it's like God, but what about me? You know,
I haven't met my daughter. I don't know she is,
I don't know her name. And so I just poured out,
I emptied out. I cried so much, so long. I

(38:09):
didn't even know if I could make it to the service,
because that's how bad off I was. And I had
a counselor that was present, and I called her and
I said, you know, they took my daughter.

Speaker 4 (38:22):
They took her.

Speaker 3 (38:22):
They I mean, it was just like a floodgate. But
I had been holding that for for forty years.

Speaker 1 (38:28):
Those emotions, yes, yeah, yeah, I know, to be a
very overwhelming, like.

Speaker 4 (38:36):
It was so overwhelming. It was so overwhelming every day.

Speaker 3 (38:40):
And finally I got to the point where I said,
I forgive children service board because I held on. I
held on to the hate and the anger with them
for two reasons. I felt like because the way y'all
did me. And then secondly, if I had, if I
had let it go, I would have been letting my
daughter go, right, you know what I'm saying. So, but

(39:04):
I got to the point where I said I forgive them.

Speaker 4 (39:07):
I forgive them.

Speaker 3 (39:08):
And that very next day, which was May twenty third,
someone caught me and said, I found your daughter.

Speaker 4 (39:19):
Oh wow, after forty years.

Speaker 1 (39:24):
You know, I always tell people when you surrender, to render.
I'm telling you that I would make things move so fast.

Speaker 4 (39:34):
Oh my god.

Speaker 3 (39:36):
And you know what happened is my nephew, Richard, had
taken a twenty three and me DNA test because he
was looking for he was looking for his father's side
of the family, right, And so my granddaughter, My daughter's
daughter had taken the same test and it came.

Speaker 4 (39:59):
Back that they were first cousins.

Speaker 3 (40:01):
And so when she emailed him on the site April ninth,
I think he didn't go back and check out the
site till May twenty third, that was the day after
the conference. And so when he did that, he saw
her email from April ninth.

Speaker 4 (40:22):
Isn't that something?

Speaker 3 (40:24):
He didn't open it until May twenty third?

Speaker 4 (40:27):
What's the site? Oh my god?

Speaker 3 (40:31):
And so when I was talking to her, her son,
my grandson. I have two grand dollars and one grandson,
my first sat he told me, he says.

Speaker 4 (40:41):
Well, her middle name is Brion.

Speaker 3 (40:46):
And I was like, because this is when we're still
trying to find out is this really her? And I
don't know if that caseworker had a sense of decency,
but she I don't know. She told the lady that
adopted her that I wanted to name her Brion, but

(41:10):
I couldn't believe it.

Speaker 4 (41:11):
I knew that that's my daughter.

Speaker 3 (41:13):
And when I talked to my daughter, she was like,
I just loved my middle name so much. She didn't
even know I name I game with that name, but
she said she just loved it so much.

Speaker 4 (41:24):
So I'm telling you God was just all in the
workings of it. It can't nobody get the glory. But
what happened? But God powerful?

Speaker 2 (41:34):
Now, how did you reconnect with the boy?

Speaker 1 (41:36):
Because I feel like, if I'm not mistaken, you wanted
to like speak to him, like you want to reach
out and have a conversation with him about something.

Speaker 4 (41:43):
Yes.

Speaker 3 (41:43):
Yes, So I was now sixteen because I have my
daughter at fifteen, so I'm sixteen. I'm at the back
of the group home where I was graduated. And you know,
again it was like he saved me, you know, and

(42:04):
I just dusted off my loyal t hat and I
put it right back on. So when I went back
this time, we had a talk and again I started
to giving myself away to him.

Speaker 4 (42:19):
Protected this time I still loved him.

Speaker 3 (42:23):
After all of that, I still loved this boy.

Speaker 4 (42:31):
And so one.

Speaker 2 (42:33):
Night also he was your first, so and he was my.

Speaker 4 (42:36):
First, and so.

Speaker 3 (42:38):
You know, it was just but it was still the
light skinned girls was around. I couldn't you know, it's
the same same cycle. I couldn't say anything to him,
and I was okay with that. Well, you know, he'll
call her, he'll come over. I just I just was
in that space like this is even in my twenties, okay,

(42:59):
because I was with them up until like thirties up
and actually, oh wow, but there was there was one
night we were at church because now he's a van driver.
He's eighteen now, and so all the girls will paling
and see who's gonna take home last, you know, whatever happened.

(43:19):
So even me, like I wanted it to be with
this guy, like I just loved him, right, So there
was one night he and one of his friends was
on the vand and me, so I'm thinking, Okay, they're
gonna drop me off and you know, go do whatever
they're gonna do. But when I was looking down, I
found looked up. We're on this dark.

Speaker 2 (43:41):
Road, right, and so you him and his friend.

Speaker 4 (43:46):
Meet him and his friend.

Speaker 3 (43:48):
So at first glance, fear hit me, and I talked
myself through, Okay, you know, no, he's not gonna let
anything happen to me. That's how much confidence I had
in him. But so he wanted to have sex. We
on the church band sex and and of course whatever

(44:09):
he wanted to wanted me to do, I would do it.
And so I said, well, what about him. He's out
there because he got out. The friend got out. He said,
oh no, it's cool. So after he has sex with me,
I'm trying to get up to put my clothes on,
to get home, to get showering things like that.

Speaker 4 (44:29):
He told me to stay right there, and I'm like
for what?

Speaker 3 (44:34):
And he had my arm and so as I'm trying
to get up because now this fear is overwhelming, now
like this is not right, Some's not right, he tapped
on the window, told his frint to come in. They
started fighting with me and I'm kicking. I'm screaming, like
what are you doing? What are you doing? But he

(44:54):
let the guy get between my legs and penetrate me,
and he had sex with me, walked out, he got
out the band.

Speaker 1 (45:02):
Wow, is it hard for you to like tell you
to share your story because you have a lot of
in your story?

Speaker 5 (45:09):
You know what?

Speaker 3 (45:09):
Because I am hell and I am made whole now I.

Speaker 4 (45:16):
Can I can talk about it.

Speaker 3 (45:19):
I hit it, I buried it for forty years until
the Lord started dealing with me and tell me what
I need to do to be made hole.

Speaker 4 (45:29):
Because I was healed.

Speaker 3 (45:31):
I walked around here, but I was still bleeding on
the inside, you know, spiritually, and.

Speaker 4 (45:40):
You know when we when he.

Speaker 3 (45:41):
Got done, they high fived each other, and I was
crying and I was used to just inverting my tears
and you know, things like that, because I just buried everything.
But when I got back to the house, he just
told me get out.

Speaker 4 (45:58):
I just got out and walk.

Speaker 3 (45:59):
They just rove off and left me to get up
to the house by myself.

Speaker 2 (46:06):
Now, how did you and him get married? And I
felt like one.

Speaker 1 (46:09):
Of the main reasons why he got y'all got married
because he was in trouble. Yes, And was he in
trouble for messing with underage girls?

Speaker 3 (46:17):
Oh no, no, no, no, not not my ex husband.

Speaker 2 (46:21):
No, okay.

Speaker 3 (46:22):
What happened is he had gotten in some trouble, okay,
And because I had already had the four children by him, okay,
hopefully five with my daughter, I had the four children.
So he called me one day and said, guess what.

Speaker 4 (46:44):
Me and my mother and my sister's doing.

Speaker 3 (46:47):
I said, what, I was pregnant with my youngest daughter
at that time.

Speaker 2 (46:52):
And how old?

Speaker 4 (46:52):
I said?

Speaker 2 (46:53):
How old was he?

Speaker 3 (46:54):
Ooh, my goodness, I was probably like thirty something.

Speaker 2 (46:59):
Wow, So you've been knowing this man since you was fourteen.

Speaker 3 (47:03):
Twelve twelve, after my mom died, they took me to
the foster home.

Speaker 4 (47:08):
I was twelve, twenty thirteen.

Speaker 2 (47:09):
And he yes, if you was thirty, that means he
was what thirty five, thirty.

Speaker 4 (47:14):
Four somewhere in there.

Speaker 3 (47:16):
Yeah, yeah, I mean yeah, I have five kids by
the black kids, right, black kids, right, black kids?

Speaker 5 (47:23):
Right?

Speaker 3 (47:41):
Yeah, hopefully five. But he called me one day and said,
guess what me and my mother my sisters are doing.

Speaker 4 (47:51):
I said what he says, We're.

Speaker 3 (47:54):
Planning our wedding and I said, and I'm not there,
you know, you know, it was just it was just bad.

Speaker 4 (48:05):
But he saved me.

Speaker 3 (48:07):
And that's that's where my mind was. I was still
a thirteen fourteen year old when I was thirty thirty five.
I was still that thirteen fourteen year old girl that
he's saved.

Speaker 4 (48:18):
So my loyalty was still there.

Speaker 3 (48:21):
And he says, well, yeah, so I mean they made
I said, well, you know, well, how's this gonna work?
I mean, what if I don't want to marry you?
But I married him, you know, And so everyone knew
what was going on, accepts me. But one of our
mutual friends, she said, read that's my nickname.

Speaker 4 (48:43):
Read. I don't want you to look stupid no more.
I have to tell you something.

Speaker 3 (48:47):
I said, okay, yeah, and she says she told me
that he had gotten in some trouble and their attorney,
his attorney suggested that he married me because I have
the children.

Speaker 4 (49:04):
It will look good in front of the judge.

Speaker 2 (49:07):
Do you have any other children?

Speaker 4 (49:09):
No?

Speaker 2 (49:10):
Oh wow, No.

Speaker 3 (49:13):
Not at that time, and so he said he would
it would look good if he married me. So that's
the only reason he married me, so he can get
less time in prison. And when I found that out,
I was just you know how you cry and you

(49:33):
won't have no more tears to cray, but you're still crying.
That's how I was, because I cried so many years,
you know.

Speaker 4 (49:41):
And after that it was like.

Speaker 3 (49:42):
Wow, I don't know if you remember the original Perry
when her mother was dancing a rock saying, they're gonna
laugh at you, They're gonna laugh at you. You know,
it was like they had already been laughing at me
because I was the only one that didn't know what
was actually going on. I mean, the family knew, obviously,

(50:05):
she knew. I just didn't know. And it was like, wow,
I mean that did something to me. So I pretty
much saved him too. You know, I saved him from
prison time when you look at it. But how long,
I'm telling her, I'm not sure. It wasn't that long,

(50:27):
you know. So I guess it worked that.

Speaker 4 (50:30):
You know, he was a family man. You know, lawiers
be lying was looking good, right, so you know.

Speaker 3 (50:39):
He said whatever he said, and he did not spend
a lot of time.

Speaker 4 (50:45):
In there.

Speaker 3 (50:46):
But I got to a place where and then I
had my son, okay, and so but I got to
a place that I'm better than this. I have these children.
I can't let them see that what I'm going through

(51:06):
is okay because I don't want them to experience that.

Speaker 4 (51:12):
Right. That's how so I got to the place where
I was. I was done. I mean the the marriage.

Speaker 3 (51:22):
Lasted, you know, honestly, evy, I I don't even know
when I got married, because I it was so bad
that I suppressed the memories. But I remember when I
I remember I did get divorced.

Speaker 4 (51:39):
I remember that.

Speaker 5 (51:42):
Well.

Speaker 3 (51:42):
The ring had like tape on it, and it wasn't
like a diamond in there.

Speaker 4 (51:50):
It was just it looked like it was something about
the cracker jack box. You know.

Speaker 2 (51:56):
It, mama, his sisters.

Speaker 4 (52:00):
Spot wou Yes, you know. I was so taken advantage
of I'm telling.

Speaker 2 (52:09):
You, took advantage of you to the max. Like my god.

Speaker 4 (52:15):
Yeah, it was bad. It was bad.

Speaker 3 (52:19):
And and you know, people said, well, why did you
keep going back?

Speaker 4 (52:22):
It was a trauma bond, that's all you knew. That's
that's all I knew.

Speaker 3 (52:26):
And that it was trauma, that's all I can think of.
That's when I could because I was like, why why
did I keep going back?

Speaker 5 (52:34):
Right?

Speaker 3 (52:35):
And yeah? And I was just connected to him. He
told me would nobody want me? And things like that.
So I believed it. When you when you hands up
constantly every day, day and day out, you just you
just believe it.

Speaker 2 (52:51):
So what did you relationship like now?

Speaker 1 (52:53):
Since since he is the father of your children and
you know where everything that taking place between y'all, Like,
do y'all speak?

Speaker 4 (53:01):
No contact? No contact?

Speaker 3 (53:06):
He has he's married and have other children now, and
I pray that he well, he's taking care of those
children because he didn't take care of mine. They my
children don't have any contact with.

Speaker 4 (53:20):
Them at all.

Speaker 1 (53:22):
So when you told your children everything about your story,
especially him being involved in and what was their response.

Speaker 3 (53:29):
All the emotions flew. It was That's why I knew.
That's why I told God. I can't tell them. It
is too much, it's too much, it's too painful. I
tell them that I was raped, you know, I can't.
But when I got to that place that loved that
that it be because it became a part of me.

(53:53):
That that that story, my abuse, all of that, it
was a part of my skin. So that's just like
peeling your skin back.

Speaker 4 (54:03):
It was.

Speaker 3 (54:04):
It was Hororfye, it was painful. It was so painful,
but I got to that place. I did it. You know, tears,
the crying, you know, I got my son, he was
It was just a horrible scene, but I got through it.

Speaker 2 (54:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (54:23):
So have you encountered any challenges in rebuilding a sense
of safety and security within the church.

Speaker 3 (54:35):
See, the church and and and my relationship with God
is just two different things.

Speaker 4 (54:43):

Speaker 3 (54:45):
We are the church and so I don't really I mean,
I just started going to a church. I loved the
pastor and his wife and we're friends. So but for
a long time, it was like, you know, I'm really
over the church thing. Because my relationship is with God.

(55:06):
So I buried it.

Speaker 4 (55:08):
You know what.

Speaker 3 (55:09):
But I always tell people, I said, people that have
been abused, we're pretenders. We are great pretenders because on
the outside we paint this picture to you so you
can see a smiling so you can see us. But
on the inside we tore up from the flow up.
You know, we're great pretenders. So I don't have to

(55:31):
pretend anymore because I'm free now, you know. And so
that's the place that I want to get the people
that I talked to, I want them to get to
a place of freedom, into a place of victory. And
when you say this is when I say, this is
my exodus. When you think about Moses and how he
was delivering the people out of Egypt, it was a

(55:55):
place of bondage, it was a place of read And
that's how I like it, unto my book and my conferences,
Like we're in Egypt, we're still stuck in our minds,
in our emotions and our mental states, and we don't
have to be there.

Speaker 4 (56:15):
We don't have to be there. We can be free.
We can make our exodus.

Speaker 1 (56:18):
So what happened to the pastor and the elder? Like
did they ever, like, like are they in jail?

Speaker 2 (56:26):
Or like are they still? Like what's going on with them?

Speaker 4 (56:28):
So I don't actually know.

Speaker 3 (56:30):
I don't see or hear about any of them at
this point.

Speaker 4 (56:37):
I know the pastors, he's probably really old now. But
the elder, I don't know. I don't know. I don't
know where they at. But it was.

Speaker 3 (56:52):
And and I probably and I'm sure I wasn't the
only one.

Speaker 2 (56:55):
I'm sure you wasn't the last one.

Speaker 3 (57:00):
And I'm pretty sure I wasn't the last one. But
God has to deal with them on that. And I
told people, I said, look, if that was my assignment
to to to throw off names, I would have been
shooting from both hips, you know, to you know, but
that's not my assignment. My assignment is truly to the

(57:22):
people that have been.

Speaker 4 (57:24):
Heard and wounded.

Speaker 3 (57:27):
I'm struggling with their identity, their sexual identity because of
what they've gone through in these churches and and and
a period because of abuse is abused, its abused. But
because I've actually went through pretty much all of the abuses,
you know, I can.

Speaker 4 (57:49):
I want to be there and help those to get
to come across to their promised land.

Speaker 2 (57:55):
Yeah, you know, what just came to mind.

Speaker 1 (57:57):
I was thinking about your self love and your self war,
like how did you rebuild that or did you have
to like discover it all over again.

Speaker 4 (58:05):
So it took me longer to.

Speaker 3 (58:10):
Love myself because I was told that I was ugly
and I wasn't loved and I'm only worth a good screw,
you know. Those were the things that he would pound
in me. And because I believed that, I started being

(58:31):
her miscalous and trying to make him my ex husband
out of a liar, like, no, somebody else is going
to want me, I know. But and it was crazy
because even though he said those things to me and
I knew that they were alive, I started living that lie.

Speaker 4 (58:50):
I started.

Speaker 3 (58:53):
Looking for love and all the wrong on places, if
you will. And it was like every guy that I
laid with, yeah it was it was just a good
it was just a screw. No, And so I believed
a lie and I started living a life. But I
got to a place, probably like fourteen years ago, where

(59:18):
I was with this guy and I wanted and he
was like one of the best guys that I had
ever been with. And it wasn't a lot of guys
that I had dealt with. I had my share, you
know what I'm saying. So, but he was cool, but

(59:39):
it didn't look like he wanted to marry. And I
wanted to get married only because but I was using
marriage for a crutch.

Speaker 4 (59:47):
I was using.

Speaker 3 (59:49):
I was using my desire to be married to fill
a hole that I had in my.

Speaker 4 (59:55):
In my heart and in myself.

Speaker 3 (59:57):
That's what you need, because I felt like that's what
I needed, especially when I Yeah, but when I got
to the point where I didn't want it as a
crutch anymore. I don't need to be married. If I
don't get married, i'm cool. If I do, I'm cool.
But it was like I was running after this thing,
like I need to get married. I need to get married,

(01:00:19):
because again I was still trying to prove my ex
husband wrong. Then somebody would want me on their arm,
you know, somebody would want me not just to lay
with me, but otherwise, you know. So I was trying
to prove that point. But I gave that up. And
so I was with this guy like fourteen years.

Speaker 4 (01:00:40):
Ago, and.

Speaker 3 (01:00:43):
Listen, I told him, I said, I'm done with this.
I said, yeah, this is the last time you get
my pussick.

Speaker 5 (01:00:54):
That's it.

Speaker 3 (01:00:55):
I'm better than this. And I walked away. And I've
been sullibant for fourteen years.

Speaker 5 (01:01:04):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (01:01:05):
So, by the grace of God, because I told God us,
I made a vow. I said, the next man I
sleep with, he's gonna be my husband, because I got
tired of giving myself away, just giving myself away, you know,
giving myself away, giving myself away, just for the sake
of feeling love, just for the sake of you know,

(01:01:27):
even though it wasn't love, but it felt like love
to me for even for a night, for a night,
you know. And so I did that and I just
walked away. I said, yeah, I'm done. I'm done. And
so saying laws than fourteen years now, I know, help

(01:01:47):
us to stay out, you know.

Speaker 4 (01:01:50):
But you know, I just I.

Speaker 3 (01:01:54):
Just I'm married to ministry.

Speaker 4 (01:01:58):
You know, I'm married to ministry.

Speaker 3 (01:02:00):
And yeah, sometimes when I have those lonely moments, I
think about what he said about nobody's.

Speaker 4 (01:02:07):
Gonna want you.

Speaker 3 (01:02:09):
You know, those thoughts try to come back and haunt me.
But that's why I have a session during my conferences
that it's called put something in the house here. So yes,
so if I put I have self worth in my house.
It doesn't matter if you tell me I'm ugly, I

(01:02:31):
have something in my house.

Speaker 4 (01:02:33):
So those thoughts.

Speaker 3 (01:02:35):
I still fight with those thoughts because they come back.
After they leave, they come back. So you have to
know how to not entertain them. You have to know
how to cut them off at the gate. Don't even
listen to the thoughts. When those negative thoughts come to you,
you can't even entertain them, because once you entertain them,

(01:02:55):
you're gonna find yourself looking back in Egypt, you know.

Speaker 4 (01:02:59):
And that's what my book and.

Speaker 3 (01:03:01):
My conferences all surround, because each was a place of bondage,
Each was a place of captivity, And so you don't
want your thoughts to be in captivity of anything negative.
So yeah, it's still a fight, but I'm there. I'm
here for it because you have to be able to
do maintenance for your soul.

Speaker 2 (01:03:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:03:23):
Now, what's some steps or actions that you think that
the religious communities can take to become more responsive and
supportive to survivors of church abuse.

Speaker 3 (01:03:32):
First of all, admit that it happened that part, you
know what I'm saying, Because they sweep it under rock,
they don't want to deal with it, and I told
I told somebody sometimes if you could just say, we
know that it wasn't our fault, but we know that
you went through it.

Speaker 2 (01:03:52):
We're just acknowledge it, right.

Speaker 3 (01:03:54):
Just acknowledge it. And I say that about Bishop Shared
and evangelist Karen Clark shared. There they are now at
the helm of this Church of God in Christ organization.
They didn't do it. It's not their fault. But if

(01:04:18):
they can get to a place where they've come and
say acknowledge it, we're sorry this happened to you, that
alone will bring healing. Just acknowledge it, because when we
do acknowledge it, and when we do talk about it,
we're the villain.

Speaker 4 (01:04:35):
You know. They sweep it under.

Speaker 3 (01:04:36):
The rug as if we did something, the those that
have been abused, that did something wrong. But I hope,
I hope I get a chance to talk to them,
Bishop shared and.

Speaker 4 (01:04:48):
Evangelist Karen Clark.

Speaker 3 (01:04:50):
Shared, I would love to sit down and talk with them,
uh to do a conference there. This is my exodus.
I'm just acknowledging the fact that this happened, and it
has happened over and over and over again, and they're
still shouting, still raising money, still having the convocation, and

(01:05:12):
you have all these people that are misguided, they're hurt,
they're wounded.

Speaker 4 (01:05:18):
What about them?

Speaker 1 (01:05:19):
Yeah, people will feel comfortable with just finally like just
wanted to come back to church and wanted to be
more involved because they finally feel seen.

Speaker 3 (01:05:29):
Exactly, just because they acknowledged it.

Speaker 4 (01:05:33):
So I'm definitely praying for them.

Speaker 3 (01:05:35):
And it's like I was doing a radio interview one
time and I was talking to the interviewer and she said, well,
tell me your story kind of like you did Evaney.
And I begin to tell them how you know this
pastor and this elder and you know, things like that,
and she stopped the interview and she said, well, we

(01:05:59):
don't want you to talk about what the pastor and
the elder did because that'll stop people from wanting to
come to church.

Speaker 4 (01:06:08):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (01:06:09):
And I said, but what about the people that have
already stopped coming to church because.

Speaker 4 (01:06:18):
Exactly exactly what about them?

Speaker 1 (01:06:22):
Like, we got to ask the right questions, why are
people not coming to church because.

Speaker 4 (01:06:28):
Of what the pastor and the elder.

Speaker 2 (01:06:29):
Did, because the words has always been the same exactly.

Speaker 3 (01:06:33):
And so I was just like I started to just
get up and just walk away.

Speaker 4 (01:06:38):
But the LRD said, No, you go through that interview,
because these are the things that you're going to encounter
as you move forward and possess your land, as you
move forward and make get the people out of Egypt, as.

Speaker 3 (01:06:54):
You make your exodus out of Egypt with the people.
These are the type of things that you're going to
go through. So no, go ahead and and and and
tell your story, you know. And so I want to
tell them. I was like, you know, what about them?
What about what about the people that are struggling now
with their sexualities because they've been What about women?

Speaker 4 (01:07:17):
What about them? So, you know, but I'm encouraged.

Speaker 3 (01:07:22):
You know, I don't have I don't have no bitterness
in me about anything.

Speaker 4 (01:07:27):
I'm not angry. I'm not, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:07:30):
But I was right every rightfully, So I have a right.
Those that have been abused, they have a right to
be angry. And and but what is that going to
do for you?

Speaker 4 (01:07:44):
You know what I'm saying. Some of these people have
gone on, you have.

Speaker 3 (01:07:47):
I had got to a place where I had to forgive,
you know, and I didn't want some thing.

Speaker 4 (01:07:52):
God, well, I have to forget them they did this
to me. But forgiveness is not for that person.

Speaker 2 (01:07:57):
It's for you.

Speaker 4 (01:07:59):
It's for you, It's for you. It's like I'm going
to get this strong.

Speaker 3 (01:08:04):
I'm holding a hot cold I'm holding a hot coal
in my head and I'm gonna throw it at the person.
But you're getting burned, not the person the call, my
mix is the person. But you've gotten burned. So we
have to get in a place where we can release
all of that stuff and we're going to recover from it.
I'm in my recovery. That's why I can talk about

(01:08:26):
it how I talk about it because I'm free of it.
But that just happened after forty years that I'm even
able to sit here and have a full on conversation
with you about what I went through just forty years.

Speaker 1 (01:08:42):
So what is your advice that you would like to
give to other survivors who may be struggling to overcome
the aftermath of church abuse.

Speaker 3 (01:08:50):
I would say, tell somebody, Tell somebody. I would say,
you have to get to a place to where you
are able to confront it, because if you don't confront it.

Speaker 4 (01:09:07):
It's gonna keep haunting you.

Speaker 3 (01:09:09):
It's gonna if you don't confront it, if you don't
deal with it, if you don't release it, if you
don't repent. If you don't you don't.

Speaker 2 (01:09:25):
You won't be in it.

Speaker 4 (01:09:28):
And when that's right, you take your power back.

Speaker 3 (01:09:31):
And when I say repent, we we're not repenting because
of what happened. We're repenting because we thought it was
our fault. We're repenting because we felt guilty, you know,
and it wasn't our fault. And I would tell them,
it's not your fault. What you went through is not

(01:09:51):
your fault. So you have to have to get to
a place where you have to you have to deal
with that stuff. You have to deal with it, and
you have to feel every ounce of emotion that you felt.

Speaker 4 (01:10:02):
And once you.

Speaker 3 (01:10:02):
Do all of that, you release it. You have to
get your place to release it. You know, you have,
you know that that movies is waiting to exhale.

Speaker 4 (01:10:12):
You have.

Speaker 3 (01:10:13):
You have to exhale at some point and release it.
Then your recovery comes.

Speaker 1 (01:10:19):
My favorite jay Z lyrics is you can't heal what
you don't reveal.

Speaker 4 (01:10:24):
That's it. Yeah, you can't heal.

Speaker 3 (01:10:26):
I mean, and I'm telling you I had high moments
where I would, you know, go to church, I would sing,
I would preach I will prophesy, you know, and do
all these things, and when I go home, here come
those thoughts. You're a whore, you're no good, you don't
have no self work, and it would it would beat

(01:10:47):
me down, and I would say, these thoughts they came
like they became a god to me, because when you
talk about God or whoever God or whatever God they served,
it's like you reverenced that God. And when these thoughts
would come, I didn't have nothing to fight with, so
I had to reverence them. I stopped and listened to

(01:11:11):
the lives that the devil was telling me. I had
to reverence them. But now I can say, oh, yes,
I am working, I have self work. I love myself.
It's not my fault, you know what I'm saying. But
it took me some time to get there. So I'm excited.
I'm so excited that you allowed me to come on

(01:11:31):
your platform and just share.

Speaker 4 (01:11:32):
I so enjoyed this.

Speaker 2 (01:11:35):
Oh, this is a really great conversation.

Speaker 1 (01:11:37):
I feel like a lot of women, especially women in
our communities, is going to definitely feel seen once they
hear this conversation, because I feel like this is a
topic that nobody talks about.

Speaker 4 (01:11:47):
Yes, yes, and men too.

Speaker 3 (01:11:49):
When I started telling my story, it was like I
was getting inboxes for mentioning.

Speaker 4 (01:11:54):
I went through this. You know, this one young.

Speaker 3 (01:11:57):
Man, he was fifteen and was sexually valated by evangelists
in the Church of God in Christ and she took
advantage of him. And then there was another guy telling
me about one of the deacons took advantage of It's terrible.
It's terrible, and it needs to be talked about. It

(01:12:17):
needs to be discussed. And again, I don't have any anger,
you know, Yeah, I just want to share.

Speaker 4 (01:12:25):
I just want to help.

Speaker 3 (01:12:27):
And there were those that were trying to make me
feel like I had a problem with the Church of
God in Christ, But nope, I'm telling my story. I'm free,
I'm healed. I want others to be free and healed.
That's my position and that's my assignment.

Speaker 1 (01:12:41):
You know, I really appreciate you coming on the show.
I think by shinening a light on this, it's definitely
going to help to create a more inclusive conversation that
recognizes the unique struggles that survivors, survivors in this community endors.
So I really appreciate you coming on the show to
share your story. Thank you for the listeners. If you
have any questions, comments, is concerns, please make sure to

(01:13:03):
reach out to me and hello at thepgpodcast dot com.

Speaker 2 (01:13:07):
And until next time.

Speaker 1 (01:13:08):
Everyone Later, I piece yes, peace and light okay, blessed
be yes. The Professional Homegirl Podcast is a production of
the Black Effect podcast Network. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio,
visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen

(01:13:30):
to your favorite shows. Don't forget to subscribe and rate
the show, and you can connect with me on social
media at the PG podcast

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Host

Eboné Almon

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}I Survived Church Abuse