Chris Robinson Part 2

In Part 2 of his Questlove Supreme interview, Chris Robinson discusses his creative process in making legendary music videos for Alicia Keys, N.O.R.E., and Busta Rhymes. He also speaks candidly about changing business models in music, video, and film—including the ongoing fight. Chris sheds some details on directing The New Edition Story as well.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio.

Speaker 2 (00:06):
Hey y'all, this is on paid bill from Team Supreme.
We're back with part two of our QLs interview with
Chris Robinson. Part one. Chris spoke about growing up in
Baltimore and cultivating a career as one of the biggest
music video directors of the nineteen nineties and two thousands.
He shared some secrets about working with Eric Abadu, Lord Treka,
Peter Gunns, and Ella Cool Jay. He also discussed his
new project, Shooting Stars, which covers the upbringing of bron James.

(00:28):
If you haven't already, please check out that episode. Now
here's part two.

Speaker 3 (00:35):
I want to hear if there's a way that you
can give cautionary tales without compromising your position or your
relationships and whatnot. But this is a theory that I
have now at this stage of my life, which is
I think when we turn thirty or forty, this is
when we start to become experts. And I don't think

(00:57):
it's more or less that we become experts more than then.
I think in the first twenty twenty five thirty years
of our life we take an assessment of Okay, this
is pleasurable and this is painful, and so we basically
want to just do the greatest hits and just take
a compilation of all the pleasurable things and then apply
that to it, and then we become experts, Like we

(01:18):
know that you know, if you touch the soul if you're.

Speaker 4 (01:21):
Going to get burnt.

Speaker 3 (01:22):
You know, if you walk across the street without looking
both ways, you're going to get hit. So basically, you
know it's a compilation of life lessons, and then that's
how you're supposed to proceed on from forty and above.
So for you are there never again moments for directing

(01:42):
in terms of and I don't mean like I'll never
work with this particular person again, but you already know that,
Like all right, I can't double book that, Like what
what lessons have you learned that are like never again?

Speaker 5 (01:55):
That's a crazy question. Open my brain up. It's wanting
the gigs so bad that you compromise what your vision is.
It is never ever, ever, ever ever worked for me, Right.

Speaker 3 (02:16):
And so you said yes to an artist before you
even have a solid creative vision for it.

Speaker 5 (02:24):
Oh, I've definitely done that and that's worked out. That
might be a timing thing right. What I what I'm
talking about is like, you have to take this job,
but you have to use this DP and you have
to shoot in this city, or you have to use

(02:45):
use this use either use someone or put a patina
on it that we want it to be right now.
Commercials are different, right because an ad agency works on
that for a year before you ever get a phone call,
so we understand their vision of what they're looking for.
But when it comes to something creative, anytime I've attempted

(03:06):
to do it it it didn't work or it wasn't satisfying.
So my advice would be, never compromise your your your
thought for the money. You know it just doesn't work.
I have a dad thing, as I always tell my son,

(03:28):
I go okay. When I was on JV, I could kick,
like so we were just in practice and I was kicking,
booming the ball and the coach was like, Robinson, you
could kick, you're aligneman. I ain't never seen a lineman kick.
I go, yeah, I can kick, so he gives me
the job. I'm kicking off. So before that, a coach
comes up to me and he goes, hey, man, you're

(03:48):
planning your foot all wrong. You got to put your
foot closer to the ball so you can get more
lyft on. So here we go our first scrimmage against
our high school rival, and I go out to the coach.
I plant my footwear, he tells me, and the ball
goes straight up and straight down, and I get fired.
I'm no longer kicking the ball, And that, to me

(04:09):
is the metaphor of when I'm listening, I'm in my flow.
I know how to do this, I know the people
I want to use, because it's a it's a business
in an art form where you you collaborate, but then
somebody tells you not to do what you do with
you working for you. And the reason you called me
because this is what I do, and I've done it

(04:32):
a couple times regretfully, because the opportunity was so big.
And so when they come at you, when they go, hey, man,
this opportunity is big. You're going to do what we say.
It's difficult to turn it down, you know, and if
you have enough political acumen, then you know how to
twist it and turn it to still do what you
want to do. Cool. I really don't have that gift,

(04:56):
you know what I mean. I'm like I'm true to
whatever that so I would say, never ever do that.
And I know it's a difficult thing, you know, because
the opportunities are what they are. But I think that
for me is the biggest one.

Speaker 4 (05:11):
Are you the type of director?

Speaker 3 (05:13):
And I don't mean micromanaging that annoying way, like always
over your shoulder looking, But for me, I feel like
at the editing is the most important part of your presentation,
like because editing can be I know, for some what's say, well, no,
the story concepts the most important part. And some people
would say no, it's actually the look of it, like

(05:34):
the art, direction, the lighting. Some people say the SHOT's
the most important part. For me, I fall in love
with the editing. I mean a lot of you know,
nine times out of ten, I'm working with footage that
already exists already, so it's not like I have to
shoot all my content. But in terms of storytelling, do
you allow your lighting person, your linsman, your editor, do

(06:00):
you give them free reign to do what they do?
Or are you always over their shoulder from soup to nuts,
like micromanaging what it is.

Speaker 5 (06:11):
Like I do in that I'm giving everyone the vision.
I'm going, Hey, this is how I see it before
we ever get out there on the playing field, and
before we ever roll one second of zeros and ones.
It's not film anymore. So I always like to meet.

(06:33):
I like pre pro I like setting down, I like
looking at references, and I include the editor in that, right,
I'll send the treatment. If it was a video, I
would send the treatment to the editor before we ever shot,
you know. And there were certain guys like Jeff Sellers,
amazing dude, and he was like Scorsesees editor to me

(06:54):
because I could give him, you know, when we were
shooting two videos a week back in the day, I
had to have trust, you know, to go all right,
here's this, I'm going to shoot this. When I get back,
we'll talk. And Jeff ninety percent of the time, you know,
he would hit it, you know. So, But those kind
of relationships are few and far between, right, So in videos,

(07:19):
I worked with like four or five different editors.

Speaker 3 (07:22):
When you were in the in the eye of the
storm of video making, how many videos, well, you said
a week, how many videos a month would you book?

Speaker 5 (07:35):
Well, I know this, for three years in a row,
I hit between forty eight and fifty.

Speaker 4 (07:43):
Wait, wait.

Speaker 5 (07:47):
For three years in a row, right, I noticed because
that's when I had left part as in left HSI
and I had my own company. I did between fifty
videos a year to fifty. Probably the year I did
the most videos were like fifty six, so that was

(08:09):
doing a video one by the video with and Had.
I had three rotating producers who only worked with me.
I had about five rotating editors and my executive producer Roseanne,
which too early as well. He really managed all that well.

(08:30):
And it was go ahead, Chris, get on a plane,
go and I would have to show up and do
my job. And I you know, it was such a
beautiful time that we were able to do it and
still keep the integrity of the art right, because that

(08:50):
was big on that too.

Speaker 6 (08:51):
No vacation, No vacation Crystal in three years.

Speaker 5 (08:54):
Let me tell you, I was upset, but wanted to
take a vacation. I remember, listen, you are the roots.
I had this guy, Michael Lucero. I don't know if
you guys know, yeah, Michael Sarah was amazing. He's passed,

(09:15):
you know, rec in peace. Michael Lucero did ninety three
to Infinity. Yes, he did busting dirty And when I
when I first had a company interested in me, which
is where I met Roseanne. She was the executive producer
of his company. It was called What You See Is
What You Get and they were in San Francisco, so

(09:39):
I flew out from Baltimore to San Francisco, met them,
and the whole nine. Well. He was such a good dude.
He was kind of like a you know, one of
these guys who climbed mountains and you know, kind of
kind of that kind of dude, but an amazing.

Speaker 4 (09:52):
Direction as that video. Okay, Yeah, learned.

Speaker 5 (09:55):
A lot from him, learned a lot from him, learned
how to write treatments. Was such a such a good man.
But he every year he would take us on vacation
and we would going to Mexico. He would take the
company on vacation. And the first year I was there,
I wasn't really you know, getting a lot of work.
And I was pissed that they wanted to take a

(10:18):
vacation and he wanted to fly me in, pay for it,
pay for my room, and I did not go. And
I was like, who's taking a vacation. We need to work.
So I was a little over indexing. I was sitting
back then because I wanted it so bad. And you know,
there's great photos that Robin Frank, who was my rep,

(10:38):
has sent to me recently, like of that trip that
I missed that that I could have been at. You know, well,
I was sitting at home and Baltimore convention about you know,
not working instead of going on vacation exactly.

Speaker 3 (10:52):
So can you walk me through the process, because I'm
learning now that in order to be creative, you should
really dedicate, or at least for me, what works for
me is a lot of silence, a lot of soulas
a lot of silence. I used to be the type

(11:12):
of person that sort of reveled and chaos, but I realized, like, oh,
like during the pandemic, then every idea came to me
and suddenly inspiration came. So okay, so in the eye
of that storm, So all right, let's go to let's
go to two thousand and five. Okay, right, Like, how

(11:36):
long do you sit with And I'm going back to
videos because I feel like video I feel like videos
are harder than movies because you basically have four minutes
to tell a story and really knock it out the park.
So what is your process? How long do you sit
with the song? Do you sit with a team of

(11:57):
people and think of ideas? Do you look at the
physical go build to the person. Do you do you
get to know them and see if they're athletic, if
they know how to run, if they know how to
drive a car, like what they're in.

Speaker 4 (12:07):
Walk me through the basic like.

Speaker 3 (12:10):
How long do you sit with the song before you
suddenly see what it is?

Speaker 5 (12:16):
It for music videos? Man, it is it was. It's different.
It depends on what the song. The song truly inspired me, right,
So a script will inspire you, but the song really
inspired would inspire me. For instance, you know when I

(12:37):
heard you know, I received Nojega song what what what? What? What? What? What? What?
So super Thug? I got super Doug. I wrote that
in twenty minutes because I had had this idea about
camels in the desert and it had been around for
a long time in my head, is rolling around in

(12:58):
my head. So I wrote that. And it's funny because
my rep was like, this is the quickest treatment you've
ever written. Are you sure you want me to turn
this in? And I was like, yeah, this is it.
Because I was a little notorious for sending in a
treatment late because of exactly what you're describing or taking
your time living with it. So when I did, I

(13:20):
received you don't Know my Name from Alicia. I remember
sitting in the house eight hours just listening to it,
and I kept almost s getting it. Then I flew
to LA and I had an assistant. Her name was
Nia Andrews. She's in music like her dad was in

(13:44):
He wrote all freak Out like he's part of that legacy.
So we drove around LA for eight hours. I remember
we went to Mallebook. We just were listening to this
song on repeat. And then later that night she called
me and she goes, well, what about you know? And

(14:05):
then the idea so she it would pingpong back and forth.
So there's some things I would do totally solo. There's
some things. Jesse Terrero used to be my assistant, good
brother and one of my best friends, and he would
he may come up with something. Neil Feldman was an
assistant minor. I'd given the outline and do it. But

(14:26):
about I'd say a good seventy percent of the time
it was just me dipping out. You know. I got
a house in Maryland, sitting on the back porch and
playing it in the headphones and just vibing and sometimes
that could take me two days, three days.

Speaker 6 (14:45):
And I just say, says you mentioned Alicia Keys video.

Speaker 7 (14:47):
Did did you have everything in your head even the
casting of that video when you were thinking of the concept.
You don't know my name?

Speaker 4 (14:53):
And did most steps show up on time?

Speaker 5 (14:57):
Listen? I don't remember, Listen. He's an artist, brother, he
was never on schedule, always on time.

Speaker 6 (15:16):
But yeah, but did you think so in your mind?

Speaker 7 (15:18):
Is that did that come out the deck directly way
you wanted it to players and everything, or that just
came later.

Speaker 5 (15:24):
Most, however, I really truly can't remember how most became involved.
But Alicia's very she still isn't she was? She lives
that whole, complete life, right, So she wasn't just down
for some video model, you know, coming through. She wasn't
down for people all up in her mouth kissing her,

(15:46):
you know, even no matter what the concept was. She
was very focused on, you know, being authentic telling the
story but also being respectful in her life versus just
just the art. And I don't I I've known most
through my boy set Free another Philly Cat for.

Speaker 8 (16:04):
Minutes, Free Shout out to set Free, and I truly
can't remember, but when he came through, I was so
happy because I love the movies he'd been in, and
he was down.

Speaker 5 (16:17):
You know. It was not a lot of money involved
in it or anything like that. He just came through
and represented. And you know, I still think that video
I should create a movie. I love Frank Frankie and Johnny.
I think it would be so dope to to, you know,
do that. And we shot it pan Pan in Harlem,

(16:37):
and Pan Pan's not there anymore, right, so that brother
made the best sans yeah, Pam Pan was do.

Speaker 6 (16:46):
You mentioned that? Chris?

Speaker 7 (16:47):
What's another video you feel that way about that? You
could have just continued on and it could have been
a whole like Christy, break You off to so many videos.

Speaker 4 (16:58):
Chris did so many videos. I forgot he did my video.

Speaker 3 (17:02):
I'm sitting here like, wait a minute, I think Chris
directed the Roots video and I just oh, ship because
when you said the wire I was like, wait a minute,
A couple of wire cats are in my video for
break You And then that's right.

Speaker 5 (17:14):
But I produced that video and we did the thing
under the bed and the whole joy. But it was
that was no. I love that video.

Speaker 9 (17:25):
You know, the era of kind of the big budget
videos just kind of pretty much evaporated. How did you
and the other directors how did y'all transition during that period?

Speaker 4 (17:35):
Went to movies?

Speaker 5 (17:37):
Listen? Listen?

Speaker 4 (17:39):
And what was that?

Speaker 7 (17:39):
Like?

Speaker 5 (17:39):
Man?

Speaker 9 (17:40):
Kind of seeing that that ecosystem just kind of dwindle.

Speaker 5 (17:44):
You are, man, it's such a great question.

Speaker 4 (17:46):
And it's YouTube your Napster.

Speaker 5 (17:50):
Oh yeah, Napster is my Napster because Napster is the
reason the video budgets disappeared too. And I'll tell you man,
I once again, I wish I could say I saw
it coming, but we did not. And I remember literally
there was there was like a week where the bottom

(18:15):
dropped out. I think fortunately I had already like maybe
started working with Kevin on Real Husbands or whatever it was.
But you know, my bread and butter, it was chopped
at the knees. And it was very much like almost
thinking it was a joke at first, Like you know,

(18:35):
labels would call and go, yeah we got X, and
I'd be like, really, now we're okay, so what is
it really? Because you know who you know this artist
and what they you know, the budget, you're telling me
is what they need for their you know writer, you know,
like what this artist is. So I think, you know,
for me, it was just a it was just a

(18:58):
very difficult switch. But I started to understand it, and
I actually would call people. I'd call all the people
I met over the years and go like, Yo, what's
going on, Like what's happening? Like I didn't understand the
ramifications of napster and digital and all that time, I

(19:19):
was still going to the record store getting CDs.

Speaker 3 (19:22):
Yeah, you see, I think or you know, in the
music business, many people look at Usher's Confessions as the
last album of that era. I mean, it was the
last album. It's the last brick and mortar album where
it sold ten million units.

Speaker 4 (19:40):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (19:41):
And then you know, like it came on two thousand
and three and then the age of ripping and all
that stuff really came into play. But I also feel
like I have a theory that maybe for the video world,
even though it wasn't financially responsible, I kind of feel

(20:02):
like the Rock the Boat video really marked an end,
even though other opulent videos were made kind of after.
But I feel like the effect of the Rock the
Boat video and kind of what it represented like just
the whole thing with the Leah's death flying to other locations,

(20:25):
private planes.

Speaker 4 (20:25):
Da da da, Big Boxers, Dad on a boat on
a yacht, Da da Da.

Speaker 3 (20:29):
I definitely remember a moment where that just kind of
paused the whole entire industry for a second. So even
though it wasn't like a direct thing where it's like,
you know, like a nine to eleven thing that changes
the world, or a January sixth thing like where you
can literally see a tangible thing, but I kind of
always wanted to know, like in the video world, was

(20:54):
was that a moment that gave you personal pause.

Speaker 5 (20:56):
Like like your your soul, like your soul was like
put on pause. And I think we all had been
moving at one hundred miles an hour for so many
years and have had all these relationships and were so
deeply entrenched and you know, going for excellence that we
didn't realize the you know, how precious life is right

(21:21):
because we were so indexed on working. An example is
when the pandemic happened and I was home for three
weeks and I was bugging out a little bit. I
realized that I hadn't been anywhere for more than two
weeks for twenty years, right, so I had to stop

(21:46):
moving around. And I'm sure you guys went through that
same thing. And to your point, you know, when that
video happened and all those things happened, there was a
real the party will almost stopped, right, There was a
there was a halt, and because we all felt like
a Leo was our low sister, a little cousin, and

(22:10):
we loved it. It was a different kind of a
feeling when that happened. And and you know, we're all
jumping on planes and jumping on private planes and we're moving.
You know, we've been to I've been to Brazil to shoot.
We never really took We never thought about it about
safety and what could happen. And I think, look, that's

(22:31):
just something that happens in life. And I think it
just was business as usual for us to achieve a
great art form. I think we're hype. I think that
video is beautiful, and I think, of course, like you know,
you know, Hype himself as an artist wasn't only a
music video director. He was like our north star, and

(22:52):
he was tight with these artists and had relationships with
these artists in a way where you know, hi Williams
video could change in life as a musical artist, right,
And it just felt like all of our business, all
of our craft, had took a moment to breathe in
when that happened. So I agree with you, man, it

(23:14):
was It was tragic and beautiful at the same time.

Speaker 3 (23:24):
I always wanted to know, if you can name a name,
what artist always makes you go back to the drawing
board and re does Like for me, I will say
that I was in a situation where I know never
to give the song that I want to give Jill
Scott or ericabad As the first song, like I actually

(23:46):
create and sometimes trek like it's always it's almost like
I had to do a horse and pony show, like
all right, here's the song, and it's not the song,
and then I'll do a second song. All right, I
tried hard, here's the song, and then I'll do the
song really want to give you.

Speaker 4 (24:00):
All right, here's a song that like, yeah, this is
the one.

Speaker 3 (24:04):
So is there an artist that always makes you go
back to the drawing board to read I don't like
this treatment. I don't like this treatment or where you
have to explain to them like in other word, okay, well,
I guess with the Honey video and you said Erica.

Speaker 4 (24:18):
You didn't say she's Michaeromanergy.

Speaker 5 (24:20):
But you know, I know, no, I am not saying
she's Micaro. She is of an amazing artist.

Speaker 3 (24:29):
Yeah, we're going to recreate these classic album covers, which
looks good on paper, but absolutely what artist like makes
you always go back to the drawing board because they
just don't see it in the paragraph that you're.

Speaker 6 (24:45):
Challenge. It's a good challenge.

Speaker 4 (24:47):
Yeah, no, no, an annoying challenge.

Speaker 5 (24:49):
I immediately know too. Artist one is busted.

Speaker 6 (24:53):
By that's a good challenge, that's a good chanter.

Speaker 5 (24:57):
Hymes is a visual he you want to talk about
somebody who's paying attention to the visual I mean, and
wants to call you at two a m. Because he's
on that time as a musician in the studio, exactly exactly.
I don't understand why you didn't pick the phone up
at two am like he is, you know, to his credit.

(25:20):
I mean, look at I just on his tribute. I
was looking at the Janet Jackson video that he did,
and that thing is is crazy just booha. Everything he
does has a visual component to it. So what happens
is he likes the first treatment too, But then you

(25:42):
get there and he's in the details. He's going classic, classic,
busted rhymes and bust I love you, my man, and
we already know what it is, classics. But when we
did past the cavassier that was each set up was
a conversation like he classically, he didn't. He Diddy's fight

(26:08):
scene he felt was better than his fight scene, and
he wanted to rechoreograph the fight scene to make sure
that it's his video. So I get that we re
choreographed that that fight scene in that room. Now at
the time when the clock is ticking and you're gonna

(26:30):
go into overtime, and you've written the treatment, and you've
done the costume design, and you've got all the martial
artists who are going to be in it, and you
have the moment that seems like a request that is
gonna be tough to create, but it doesn't matter because

(26:51):
we still did it. And when you when you look
at that video, when I look at that video, I go, wow,
we probably had sixty five percent of that on paper,
sixty five percent of that plan. And what Buster will
will do is he's not just making arbitrary request. He's

(27:14):
so deep in it that he's pushing you. He's pushing
for greater, he's pushing for better. So he's not the
guy who just disappears and goes and smokes. He's on
the set setting in the director's chair, looking at playback.
And as you're moving through your data as a director,
you you know there's certain time things you have to hit.

(27:37):
But interestingly enough, I think we did shoot like an
extra eight hours on that video.

Speaker 3 (27:45):
So do you already have overages written in the budget?
Do you already have overages written in the budget?

Speaker 5 (27:50):
When you know that is what you try to do,
right and like once again my executive producer Roseanne Cunning,
that's what you try to do. But the reality is
you cannot predict some things. Now. The tough conversation that
I've seen many times is when the producer goes over
to the you know, music video reping goes, okay, we're

(28:14):
having this is this much time? Or Chris wants a crane,
the crane broke and we have to bring in another
whatever that is. The record label has to sign off
to say, okay, you know cost plus if the crane
costs you another ten thousand dollars, we'll pay for it.
And usually that's where the power shifts, right, because the

(28:37):
power because we already have a contract. So no matter
what happens, I need to do what's on this treatment
to fulfill the contract to get paid. Like that's just
a reality of the business that it's really the only
way that you can do it right. You have to

(28:57):
make sure that it's done. But there's extenuating circumstances that
I've seen over the years. But if the artists in
the label are like down with you, right, you can
you can change things a little bit to accomplish the
same goal. But you know, I think I think Buster

(29:21):
is is you know, he understands it early. He understands like, Okay,
this even if this treatment is a we've got to
move quickly. So this treatment is a blueprint. We're going
to get it where it needs to be once we
get there, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 (29:38):
Okay, I vowed to never do this on this podcast,
but since you're here, I gotta know the politics.

Speaker 4 (29:48):
Of video jawns.

Speaker 6 (29:53):
Come on now.

Speaker 3 (29:55):
Now, there's entire careers and Instagram accounts that have made
legends out of the right seven seconds in a video?

Speaker 6 (30:06):
Is that still a thing? No, y'all think that.

Speaker 4 (30:09):
I don't think videos are.

Speaker 6 (30:11):
As the Baxter, you know, like I'm thinking of like so.

Speaker 3 (30:16):
But the thing is that by this by this era,
you know, even video uh models have just as much
leverage as the artists themselves. And so is there how
do you wrangle like and I'm not trying to objectify,

(30:39):
like their product placement, but is it written ahead of time?
Like Okay, I'll make sure that you know when you're
wrangling with her manager whoever it is Gloria, like dude,
that when when Grace was a jib, like Grace was
responsible for like half from from Kreem.

Speaker 4 (31:02):
All the way down, like all those videos.

Speaker 3 (31:05):
So but but she told me that she was there
to ring, not only wrangle, but also to protect them,
you know what I mean.

Speaker 4 (31:11):
And so, but I.

Speaker 3 (31:13):
Didn't realize that there's like negotiations where this particular artist
has a certain cache and she wants to be featured
and da da da da da. Is that just is
that just decided or is it random or is it
already pre planned at the gate, Like Okay, we'll make
sure that you're the you're the featured and We're not

(31:35):
going to feature your rival that you might have beef
with and said video or is it just like up
to the artist who gets in or not.

Speaker 5 (31:44):
Now Listen, in my experience, it's always been this is
gonna be a boring answer. It's always been like casting
on a feature film. Yeah, you would think like, oh,
that's kind of random, you know, or you look kidding,
you go, that must be random where they get all
old girls from a club. No, the answer is there's

(32:05):
a casting director, Ulysses Torero. Jesse's brother is one of
the best of every wow. And you know at that
in that point, there was an era where those young
ladies that were you know, video vixens or whatever you
want to call him. It was a portal. Right, so
now you decide, you know, like there's very memorable moments

(32:28):
of different video vixens in videos, right, So, but then
it was it's literally a portal. Like think about every
actress who does shot shout out to Melissa for it.
I mean, you want to talk about the hype Williams
of video vixens like he was she was do you

(32:49):
know that Datakis video knocked yourself out? Like she's amazing?
But but let's let's talk about her the portal. Now
she is in another part of the business. Now she
does podcasts. Now she's she she was, you know, part
of that era with the magazine with Daytwine Thomas and
you know what I mean. And then let's talk about

(33:11):
Lauren London. The first thing she did was she was
Paul Hunter's assistant number one. He was in Drop It
Like It's Hot, which is a new video. She was
in Parell's video. Right, and my assistant at the time
brother named Carl Reid. They were friends and he goes, Chris,

(33:32):
you should you should audition Lauren for atl and I
said absolutely, no, No, I'm not. I'm not I'm going
I'm not having a video girl. I'm trying to be
a serious filmmaker. But he was like, look, man, you
got to just be a good brother, man. You got
to get her a shot. She wants to be an actress.
And she came in and it's a great story because

(33:54):
she came in and she was late. We had packed
the film equipment up right. She she came and she goes,
I got a pee, I got a pine Can I
go to the bathroom? So she delayed us further in
the bathroom. Okay. So I'm just sitting there looking a
car like see okay, and we said action and I

(34:15):
had been looking for new, new for probably eight to
ten weeks. Wow, and it was her. Wow.

Speaker 9 (34:25):
Was it true in the atl that a lot of
big boys lines that heat improv a lot of that?

Speaker 4 (34:30):
Or how did how did that? Because we got it?

Speaker 3 (34:33):
I wanted to ask about it.

Speaker 5 (34:37):
Let me tell you something. What he said, you do
that money in my face, like try not to let
Big Boy is genius with his his ad libs. And
the way big Boy was moving was, you know, he's
big boys from outcast. He didn't really understand you know,

(34:58):
oh it's a six am call, Yeah, to be there
all these things. And he would come directly from the
studio to set, not having slept or whatever it was.
And every day I'd be worried. Every day he delivered
every scene. Uh you know he always added that extra

(35:19):
that was beyond the script. Yeah, he had lived a
lot of that stuff.

Speaker 4 (35:21):
And how was it with I? Was that was him?
I don't think that was his first Was that his
first feature?

Speaker 5 (35:29):
It was? It was? It was It was similar in
the fact that he wasn't he didn't. He never worked
on a set before, so you know, me and him,
I had done his very first video I'm serious before

(35:51):
before exactly, so so I was always like, man, this
kid is dope and Dallas awesome. Was like, I think
t I could really play the scroll, So Tim would
I think. He came in the first day in a
Rose Royce and he came to said he pulled up
for the set was a Rose roy and then he

(36:11):
had a big like you know, when it's a movie,
it's favorite nation, So every actor has the same kind
of a trailer, and he had he had his own
winner bagel and all the other actors were in like
a two banger. So you know, I talked to him
and I said, brother, you know you're leading this like
this is everybody's looking to you. You are number one

(36:34):
on the call shoot, so I mean in our other world,
in your music world, because he's in the studio every
night too. He's super popular. He's becoming the king of
the South. I just had a conversation with him and
we just got on the same page about work ethic,
coming in being the leader because we're all looking to you,

(36:59):
and is the lead in this picture and you know.
He I think the hardest part for any artist is
not being ti or being tipped to your audience. Being
with Shad, who is the high school a guy who
just got out of high school, who has got to

(37:20):
show vulnerability. But I think what we both learned for
each other because both of our you know, you can
never do your first movie again, right, so everything was
bet on Tip for me. Everything for Tip was bet
on me, Like, so we both had to. You know,
we're gonna win the super Bowl. The quarterback and the

(37:41):
receiver better be connected. All references, so, you know, we
I think we did a good job. I think it's
you know, people still reference it and still love it.
And I watched him turn into a superstar. That's the
one human being our watch turned from a really hot

(38:02):
commodity into a superstar through that process. That was up.

Speaker 4 (38:08):
How did you know that Evan Ross was right for
that role?

Speaker 6 (38:10):
Hm hmm.

Speaker 5 (38:11):
He you know what he came, he came into the audition.
I didn't know who he was. I met him in
the Los Angeles and and I didn't know he was
Diana Ross's son until we were shooting. Okay, really good, good,
but yeah, I just was Evan as a restaurant out here. Now,
Evan's look, good man, Evans, what the restaurant leons?

Speaker 6 (38:36):
Leons? Okay, thank you?

Speaker 5 (38:38):
It's on Venture and he has a club called Warwick
on Sunset.

Speaker 7 (38:43):
Then there didn't didn't know that was his People will
look at Evan Ross and like, what is he doing
besides being married to Ashley Simpson.

Speaker 5 (38:49):
That's dope counting.

Speaker 3 (38:53):
I have one more question about videos mhm, and be
honest about the mind state of directors.

Speaker 4 (39:00):
I know you're saying I can only speak for myself, but.

Speaker 3 (39:05):
Half the time, do you guys already have treatments in
your head or stock footage pre shot already that you're
just waiting for the right artist to sell that one?

Speaker 7 (39:22):
Like?

Speaker 3 (39:22):
In other words, is every video a bespoke kind of
customized video. I'm only asking this because you know, I
had a situation with I don't know, I don't know
if you know who Sanji is. He did far size
passed me by yep, and dude always wanted to work

(39:46):
with Sanji and we finally got a chance to work
with them on our Tipping Point record, and my manager
was always like summing right here, like what I we were.

Speaker 4 (40:00):
Like, hold up, wait a minute, we did the Star video.

Speaker 7 (40:04):
Oh, I was wondering which one okay?

Speaker 3 (40:06):
And Rich is like, why do I feel like he
shot this video already and just basically sold us a
bit because the thing was we weren't there for it.
When you talked about shooting your b shots without the
artist first, I was like, wait a minute, that might
be a Sandy trick from which it's my manager, Rich

(40:28):
Nichols rest in peace. It's this assessment that we got
got and basically like he had already shot the video
already and sold it to us, and we just shot
our shots like at the end for a day or whatever.
But like, do you do stock shooting of stuff, you know,
like neighborhood shots or just random things that doesn't have

(40:52):
a home yet.

Speaker 4 (40:53):
Is that a thing?

Speaker 5 (40:55):
No? I listened in my experience. I'm just kidding.

Speaker 6 (41:02):
I don't go watch this video again.

Speaker 5 (41:03):
Chris.

Speaker 6 (41:03):
I think they might've got got a look.

Speaker 5 (41:07):
I think they're all Everything is bespoke for every director.
One reason is, you know, the label owns everything. So
we would finish a video, you would see two thousand
feet of it, but we'd send the whole twenty thousand
feet of film to the label. So I don't know
if they that's when we were shooting film. But the

(41:28):
label owns everything, period, point blank.

Speaker 4 (41:32):
But yeah, but I mean, like right, okay, back in
the day, like all.

Speaker 3 (41:36):
My reels go to the label. But now by turning
a record, I'm just turning that record. They're not getting
the demos and the stuff that didn't make the record, right,
they're opposed to you.

Speaker 5 (41:48):
I always here's what's funny. I always talk to my
producer and I say, you know, we should do and
it's exactly what you said. I said, when we shoot
a video, why don't we have this conset? Because let's
say this, for every video you shoot, you wrote five

(42:09):
treat There's five videos I didn't get right. I'm battling
hype Benny. We're all battling each other. So for every
video I did, there were five concepts that are setting
on my shelf. I always thought it would be a
genius idea to shoot all the components of the video

(42:31):
and then put the artist in it. But you never
really could do it because everything has a certain vibe.
Every song had a certain vibe. Like I said, I
thought that would be a great, great idea, and maybe
artists would like it where you could go, hey, here's
a video, and here's how we would insert you in it.

(42:51):
I always wondered that never had the opportunity to do it,
but it got watched because I hate roots.

Speaker 10 (43:00):
Videos, just rewatched it. I was like, wait, anyway, let's
talk New Edition wrap up.

Speaker 7 (43:15):
I just wanted to know about New Audition as a
director from your vision. First of all, what were the
You have to have these things in place for you
to direct this project. You have to have power over this,
Like did you have any of those those moments?

Speaker 4 (43:29):
Can I answer them to your question?

Speaker 6 (43:31):
Yeah? Before please?

Speaker 4 (43:33):
All right?

Speaker 3 (43:33):
You remember the guy who did the bel Air thing
like actually pitched, hey, why don't we do it you Matt?

Speaker 4 (43:41):
And he did like a real or a fake trailer?

Speaker 3 (43:45):
Yes, there was once a fake trailer for the New
Edition biopic that was like roaming on you in the
early days of YouTube, like back in two thousand and six.

Speaker 4 (43:55):
Did you have anything to do with that?

Speaker 5 (43:57):
I did not?

Speaker 4 (43:58):
Did you?

Speaker 7 (43:58):
Do?

Speaker 4 (43:59):
You know what I'm talking about?

Speaker 5 (44:00):
Absolutely? And I met the brother? All right, I met
the brother and let me tell you what else. He
showed up on set with Maurice Starr.

Speaker 4 (44:11):
Oh wow, so look he uh look.

Speaker 5 (44:17):
God bless him. That's a Hollywood lesson man. Like we are.
I've been the same way early in my career, Like yo,
I'm just gonna shoot the sizzle and then they'll know that.

Speaker 4 (44:28):
I'm a guy.

Speaker 5 (44:29):
I did it seven eight years ago. I shot at
at L two trailer. I got everybody together, paid for
me and Titchell. Okay, we're trying to get We're trying to,
you know, create momentum. So you know studio would say, hey, man, yeah,
we'll make it. You know, it just was it was

(44:50):
an effort to you know, show all those people together again.
So nothing has come of it as of yet. We
hope that we can make ATL two. But I do
remember that quest and I met that brother, and he
was a young director and he was really dedicated to
wanting to make that happen. And you know, I didn't

(45:13):
have anything to do with it, but I do know
that he he got so far as he showed up with.

Speaker 6 (45:21):
And what did they want?

Speaker 5 (45:23):
Well Westar of course we invited him and said, okay,
you know, to see to watch, but he was there
with him and I actually had a conversation with him.

Speaker 6 (45:31):
His heart must have been broken.

Speaker 5 (45:33):
Oh lord, it's tough. It's it's tough. But that is
a that is a Hollywood one oh one lesson. That's
hard to get. But I think he's still like, he's
still pursuing the art, he's still pursuing directing, and and uh,
I think he's I think, look, it was dope for
him to do that, right, he had to love and

(45:55):
he just kind of came up with it and he goes,
I'm going to do this. The fact that he made
that happen and I got to go back and look
at it, but I remember thinking this is pretty good,
you know what I mean, before I was over involved
in any any New Edition project.

Speaker 3 (46:09):
I kind of thought that was the impetus that allowed
this to happen, because that thing was so viral that
about a year or two later then it was like, Yo,
we're really going to make this happen. I thought he
was a part of that.

Speaker 5 (46:24):
So no, you know what I knew about this project,
Jesse Collins produced it. So Jesse, Jesse told me about
this maybe seven years before we shot it, but he
had the project obviously, you know, he does BT awards
and everything, and so he got with them, so you

(46:46):
can imagine in order to develop it with all those
human beings, to do the life rights and to come together.
It took that long. So about seven eight years later,
I mean no, I remember the New Edition was my
first concert fifteen Spectrum Philadelphia. I went to see New

(47:06):
Edition Lisa Lisa coult jam and they was a fresh
fst and you know, stole the car from my parents.
Did the whole thing so.

Speaker 3 (47:16):
Well, you can't just casually say that what what?

Speaker 11 (47:23):
Yeah?

Speaker 5 (47:23):
That that was my first concert as a kid, like
I love the New Edition.

Speaker 4 (47:27):
At that point, did you get away with it?

Speaker 5 (47:29):
I did not?

Speaker 4 (47:30):
We Uh what was the bunishment?

Speaker 5 (47:33):
I didn't steal the car. I took the car when
they told me no, and I drove all my cousins
up there. Worst it's man, we got the car told
one of my uncles had to drive from Maryland to
Philadelphia to get us some silence on the way back.
It was worse than Vanessa on The Cosby Show.

Speaker 7 (47:51):
I'm thinking about that episode. Literally, think about that episode.

Speaker 4 (47:56):
It was explained Bill and Steve good. I watched the
Cosby Show.

Speaker 6 (48:04):
It was ship. What was your question about?

Speaker 4 (48:06):
Oh oh, did you get away with it?

Speaker 5 (48:09):
Oh no, did not, did not. But when I finally
did it, I made sure my uncle and my dad
got to see it, and they were like, okay, it
was worth it, you know what I mean?

Speaker 3 (48:23):
How long was your initial treatment, because I'm almost certain
it was the three parter.

Speaker 5 (48:28):
Right, three nights.

Speaker 3 (48:30):
I'm almost certain that you had enough content for almost
an entire week, like your original vision.

Speaker 4 (48:38):
How long would it have been?

Speaker 5 (48:40):
Well, the script, it was. The original script was one
big script, right, it was like one hundred and sixty pages.
And then Stephen Hill and Bet said, look, we want
this to be like an event. We want this to
be three nights. So the writer Abdul, who's amazing, we

(49:01):
started that process. So Jesse told me about it seven
years prior all those seven years, I was like, man,
I wish he would I wish I could do that
new edition movie. And then he asked me, would you
be interested in doing this? I was like yes. So
it's interesting because I was just I this was two

(49:22):
thousand and fifteen, sixteen. I just decided to move back
to the East coast. So at a house, I hear
the whole thing. We shut the house down, you know,
gave up the lease and I was headed to the
airport when he called me to say, would you want
to do this movie? It's a green light with BT

(49:42):
We start next week. So I had to change everything
that I was doing, stay out of there, and but
so then it happened, and then we worked for maybe
six months before we started shooting. So I think the
one of the questions was how did we pull all
those actors and what not together? And that was a

(50:06):
real casting thing with Robbie Reid. We'd have Robbie Reid,
Spike Lee's casting agent for years and years the show. Yeah,
she's amazing. She's amazing, And it's just so for each
person like wood Woody McLean, who's now you know, doing

(50:27):
the thing, he's killing him. He used to be he
used to be a dancer for Chris Brown.

Speaker 6 (50:32):
What wait wait wait wait wait wait.

Speaker 5 (50:35):
He was a dancer for Chris Brown before he had
ever acted in anything. So I had called for Tima
Robinson to go, hey, do you know anybody who I'm
looking for Bobby Brown? And she gave the reco for Woodie.
Then we saw Woody and wood was really like he
was a dancer, so he wasn't used to acting. He

(50:57):
was rather shy, but he could dance his asshle, you
could do all the Bobby Brown stuff. And we had
the conversation and I just was like, listen, I'm going
to bring you back for like the third audition, be
bold brother.

Speaker 6 (51:10):
Like he's not an actor, believe it.

Speaker 5 (51:13):
And then he's but but look what he's done. That's
what I always say, Like, you know, that's something that
me and Jesse Terrell always said, like a lot of
times we weren't able to work with the big actors
in our career, like they weren't checking for us as directors,
that they always looked at us as video directors. So
we said, let's make our own star, right. And I'm

(51:34):
glad that we, you know, had that that kind of
blockade because it spawned.

Speaker 7 (51:40):
Of the thing because he was Bobby for a long
time to the point where when he got to Power,
I was like, I don't know, but now he's Kane.

Speaker 5 (51:48):
He did a new addition and then he did the
Bobby Brown. Yeah, he killed it.

Speaker 6 (51:54):
You feel I feel the same.

Speaker 7 (51:55):
I guess you must have felt very strongly about Algae
in that way, the actor that played Ralph Transvant. Because
you've circumvented him back into a couple of projects.

Speaker 6 (52:03):
Right, at least I know he was in Shooting Stars.

Speaker 5 (52:06):
Yeah. No, listen, it's always a curveball, right. I was like,
I didn't see it. I didn't see Algie as Ralph
tress Man because there were people that looked exactly, looked
a lot more like Ralph Treasvan.

Speaker 6 (52:19):
I could see that, and I didn't see it.

Speaker 5 (52:21):
But then Jesse really believed in it, and I was like, okay.
And then when he came to the park to the
audition where they would sing else you can sing, and
I was like, I mean, listen, I was torn all
the way up until we were shooting, and then he
just did it like he killed it.

Speaker 3 (52:42):
So even free shooting, you weren't you still weren't sure.

Speaker 5 (52:47):
I wasn't sure. I wasn't sure because we had let
this guy go that I'm talking about if there was
a Ralph Treasvan twin. But obviously Algae embodied the character.
He had. He had a sensitivity, no pun uh, he had.
He could dance, he could sing, and even the tone

(53:08):
of his voice was just perfect.

Speaker 6 (53:12):
I need something specific from you, Chris. I'm so sorry.
And as you're telling these stories about this casting.

Speaker 7 (53:16):
I need you to please tell the story why you
casted Dustin Felder for Jimmy jam May he rest in
paradise for fucking ever, like please, please, please please.

Speaker 5 (53:27):
Listen Dustin Felder is it was just he's He was
our acting coach for the Right, and his energy was
it was just grounded and real, like the exact kind
of person that I the way I wanted to communicate

(53:47):
to the boys, and I would we would have sessions
where I would just be in the corner quiet, and
the way he spoke to them and the way he
talked to them about performance and being real if you
watch them more, because these were all guys who were
kind of afraid, right because not only is this material
material tough, the real guys are visiting rehearsal like they did,

(54:13):
like they you know what I'm saying. And then what
Dustin would do would be amazing. And we were looking
for like Jimmy James, Terry Lewis, and I would look
at him every day ago, man, you could be Jimmy Jail.
You know what I'm saying, You could do it and
we'd laugh about it. And then one day he wore
for Dora and I go.

Speaker 12 (54:35):
It's and all the boys were like campaigning for him too,
like all the all the all the guys who were
you know, played New addition, they were campaigning for him too,
and it was a natural fit.

Speaker 7 (54:48):
He's really coached some amazing black actors out of l
A Like there's a very a generation of black actors
that have a lot to give to him.

Speaker 5 (54:55):
So I didn't even know that that's what's up, good brother.

Speaker 3 (55:01):
I heard a rumor that you were Were you one
of the initial actors that I guess for a long time,
both Will Smith and Kevin Hart. We're going to do
Uptown Saturday Night. You do not hear your name tossed
in there as a director.

Speaker 5 (55:18):
I'm glad you're telling me because I heard about that
project too. I think Will Packer was involved in it.
And that's one of my favorite movies of all time. Wow,
favorite movies of all time. And a couple of years
a few years ago, it was going around Hollywood that
that was happening. I haven't seen the script yet, but.

Speaker 4 (55:36):
Yeah, yeah, I could have worn I heard your name
mentioned in it.

Speaker 5 (55:40):
Thank you good because you might be in some rooms
I'm not in.

Speaker 4 (55:43):
That's a good that I love Lord.

Speaker 9 (55:46):
Speaking of script Chris, with the writer strike that's going
on now, how with you as a director, how does
that affect you?

Speaker 5 (55:55):
One?

Speaker 4 (55:55):
And two?

Speaker 9 (55:56):
How do you think it affects the future of filmmaking
as a whole. Where do you think the game is
right now? And where do you think is eded?

Speaker 5 (56:04):
I think we're having a napster moment, and I think
it's it's completely People can't imagine what that the that
the industry would change, right, But you know writer strike
for instance, right, I still get atl was eighteen years ago.

(56:26):
I still receive residuals from it from that, right, because
the business model was Okay, we saw it in the movies.
Now we see it on TV. Now, we see it
in the airplane, Now we see it in Africa. That's
the way TV has always worked. Now it's streaming, so
streaming for US two for Director's Guild, where everybody is well,

(56:49):
no streamer wants it to ever go anywhere else. It's
a subscription model. We want this is only available here.
So I think what we're looking at is going wow,
like the business change, what is it? How do you
figure it out? It's the wild wild West to a degree.

(57:10):
And I think there are some streamers who've got it
figured out at least the best that it can be,
but it will never be what it was what it was,
And I think, just like with videos, we it took
a long time to go. Maybe I should stop making
horseshoes because they're driving cars around and there needs to

(57:32):
be tired. Right, It's a long way to look at
how you the way content is valued. So what is that?
That's just what I'm telling you is just a realization
I had recently. Maybe you know, I've been so involved
in so in the marketing and everything with the shooting

(57:54):
stars and the edit right up until it came out
that I wasn't even really on the page. But when
I've been having some conversations, it's like I don't quite
understand the answer yet or what it means, you know.
So to answer quest question, the world is not my oyster,

(58:17):
you know what I mean? I don't think the world
is an oyster for anybody right now, because we don't know.
The opportunities are shrinking. Right. There's a statistic in the
in the DGA that of every member that makes a
feature film, eighty five percent only make one. Yeah, this

(58:41):
is before any of this, right, So that tells you
how difficult it is to make a feature and how
slimny opportunities are. Eighty five percent of the union makes
one feature film and not another one.

Speaker 9 (58:54):
It's almost the same on the sack side as well.
On our side you have your your Tom Cruiss whatever.
But then the other is, you know, people struggling to
get commercials or whatever.

Speaker 7 (59:05):
You know, that's why you got to keep your ear
to the street street because if you keep it in
the bubble, you're gonna think it's sweet. But nah, it's
it's people are out in la ship is changing and
it's you feel it.

Speaker 5 (59:16):
Yeah, it's tough, you know, but it's interesting, right because
that's the thing. The thing about the business, even if
once you're in it for a long time, for me,
is that every day there's the opportunity for possibility, right,
and that can that can that can keep your motivation flowing,

(59:38):
It can keep your you wake up every morning there's
a possibility of writing that script or moving forward. But
I think that what we have to look at are
great examples of the business aspect of it. You know,
when we look at Amir and how he does things,
how we look at Tyler Perry and he does things
Lee Daniels, these guys who have Kenya Barras, these guys

(01:00:02):
who have taken their talent understood how it works in
business and how to play the game. And me personally,
I've always been leaning more towards the artist's side, right
and having reps and agents and things, and just happy
to be able to be created because at some point,

(01:00:24):
as a creative, you go, man, I couldn't live any
other way, Like I couldn't have another job, you know
what I mean, and that satisfaction of when something that
you create connects to your audience. Right. But I think
that because of the way that the world and the
technology is moving, it's more of a there needs to

(01:00:45):
be more of a focus on understanding the business, not
even just from a Hollywood perspective, but from a Wall
Street perspective. You know, how content is being valued, how
the business battle of subscriptions are different.

Speaker 9 (01:01:07):
Yeah, all the streaming companies are kind of collapsing into
one another, like with Max becoming HBO overcoming Max and
Time going collapsing into Paramount, And it just reminds me
a lot of what happened with major labels, like when
you said, naps the moment if it does the same
thing to happen with label.

Speaker 3 (01:01:26):
Well, sir, thank you. This is long overdue. The next
time we're in the Landa together, I'll treat you to.

Speaker 4 (01:01:34):
Follies or he's in l A. He's in l A,
I said, the next time.

Speaker 5 (01:01:41):
We're in l A, hop on a plane.

Speaker 11 (01:01:45):
LA don't count, you know, man, I just wanted to say, Chris,
I really just appreciate your work, man, and I love
the way just to watch how you is you a
lot of the the directors I follow my guy set Man,
who I'm sure you know see uh.

Speaker 9 (01:02:01):
Yeah, the y C Anthony Heman Way. Just y'all brothers. Man,
I'm just really proud to see y'all like you know,
transition and just keep working, man.

Speaker 4 (01:02:11):
And I just love what y'all do.

Speaker 5 (01:02:12):
So thank you, brother, thank you.

Speaker 4 (01:02:16):
That's what's up on.

Speaker 3 (01:02:17):
Behalf of Sick Steve and Pete Bill and find Tickeolow
and like you and the great Chris Robinson.

Speaker 4 (01:02:24):
I love your work.

Speaker 3 (01:02:25):
I love your songs that you do with your brother
Rich and all the vics formula all right.

Speaker 6 (01:02:31):
That was for Dustin. I just wanted to show it
on the YouTube.

Speaker 4 (01:02:34):
That's right, we are on YouTube now. Damn congratulates.

Speaker 3 (01:02:40):
Yes, I still don't know how that works for us.
We're still on our soft launch anyway. Uh this great
Chris Robinson and then we'll see you on the next
go around.

Speaker 5 (01:02:49):
Y'all, Peace, my brother, Thank y'all.

Speaker 1 (01:02:56):
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