Questlove Supreme: Eric Roberson Part 1

Team Supreme’s Phonte interviews his Tigallero collaborator Eric Roberson in the latest QLS solo session. In the first of a two-part episode, the Grammy-nominated singer-songwriter discusses trading major labels for independence and lessons he learned from his father and El Debarge.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio, Ladies and gentlemen.

Speaker 2 (00:10):
What's Up?

Speaker 1 (00:10):
What's Up?

Speaker 3 (00:11):
This is your host, Quest Love of Quest Love Supreme.
How y'all been doing? I hope y'all been doing fine.
So we're doing it a little bit different this year.
We're recording some special QLs episodes this season, and in
order for you guys to get more familiar with anyone
on this show who's not me, which is always a

(00:34):
good thing in my opinion, I decided that I wanted
each member of the Supreme team to get their own
rogue episode and interview and do sort of a one
on oneish. And we kicked it off, of course with
Sugar Steve with his dream interview, his epic two part
conversation with Elvis Costello, and they recorded at Electric Lady Studios.

(00:56):
One of the first in person QLs episodes, it's the
Pandemic back in March of twenty twenty. So this particular
go round, we are passing the microphone, if you will,
to our brother Fontigelo.

Speaker 2 (01:12):
Fontigolo, what's up man? Yes, indeed, what's up man? Congratulations.
It's the first one since.

Speaker 4 (01:17):
Right, it's the big whim everything that's right changed.

Speaker 2 (01:21):
Yes, everything, the price is going up. Yesterday's price is
not today's price. I love it.

Speaker 4 (01:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:31):
So similar to sugar, Steve Fonte's guest is a gentleman
that he has worked closely with, actually that I've actually
collaborated with as well. And this particular Quest Love Supreme
guest is none other than mister Eric Roberson. And he's
Grammy nominated singer, songwriter, producer and music industry og. And

(01:54):
I just want to welcome him. Please welcome him to
Quest Love Supreme.

Speaker 5 (01:57):
What's up, Eric, honor to be on here, man, congratulations
as well, first chance to get to tell you that
I appreciate you'all having me on here.

Speaker 3 (02:05):
I'm kind of hello jealous of your background right now.

Speaker 2 (02:09):
His zoom, I think it's only second to Will Smith's zoom.
Yes you will Will zoom was like that ship looked
like hggd.

Speaker 3 (02:17):
Yeah, you look like you're in the Garden of Eden
right now. Like what does this represent? This particular background.

Speaker 5 (02:23):
This, this background is part of just my basement and
what I've learned during the pandemic. Man, I wass doing
virtual shows. I teach class sitting here as well. I
got I got sound effects and all kind of you know,
all kind of stuff here.

Speaker 4 (02:39):
Uh you know, I love it, you know, whatever we do.

Speaker 2 (02:42):
Yeah, yeah, before so before you got on, before you
came home with me, he was talking to us, and
he's gonna be the one to kind of help us
get roll called back because he got some tools, you know,
how to deal with it.

Speaker 5 (02:54):
No latency, yes, yes, yeah, so there's several different things
that we can get fixed. But yeah, I told Laya,
let's let's talk and tim because when the first pandemic started,
the first thing I started doing, I made the album.
But the second thing I did was like how do
we do shows? And then I probably spent shouts with
my boy DJ Molski in La, probably about a month

(03:15):
or two months, standing up all night just trying to
all those things figure out. Latency, figure out like looping
things back, like playing things from a computer, hearing it
and then sending it back into the web. All that stuff. Man,
we crashed and burned on it. So yeah, let's let's talk. Afterwards,
I got.

Speaker 3 (03:31):
Forget the interview. Let's talk now. Now I'm gonna leave
y'all to it again. Thank you very much for doing this,
And I hit it fante Yo.

Speaker 2 (03:42):
All right, man, so listen though, Like I'm sitting here,
and as much as we work together, there are just
very I think crucial things in your life that me
and you have never talked about. That's creat Like when
we was on the phone the other day after the
Fred Hemmert interview and you were telling me about like
what commission it meant to you, and like how something
as simple as just seeing gospel singers on an album

(04:06):
cover with jeans on. Yeah, you know, for you know,
for even like me, that was nothing, you know what
I mean? But nah, man, yeah, talk about you know
how you got started, Like what was your first kind
of introduction into music.

Speaker 5 (04:21):
My dad plays guitar and sings. My sister. I have
an older sister, my sister Alisha, lovely, and and you know,
I think all my introduction really started from that just
being a little brother. Had to follow her around and
she was the one who actually had a band in
high school and then she did theater and was making
clothes and all kinds. So whatever she was doing. As

(04:42):
the little brother, I went to the piano lessons, I
went to dance recitals, I went into the theater classes,
went to her band rehearsals, and I think a lot
of it just rubbed off on me. Of course, were
singing at church on Sunday, we got choir two days
out the week or whatever you choir, mergency choir, whatever
we was, whatever were in and of course then of
course you know we we boomed backing on the on

(05:04):
the cafeteria table with our friends, freestyle rhyming, dreaming of
being utfo or whoever. So I mean, you know, I mean,
I'm from Jersey. It's just like a I was born
in New York, but I was raised in Rawway. Yeah,
And and I think just when it came time to
do music, like what do you do? Like you know,
it's like do you do guys with music? Do you
do house music? Do you do rap? Do you do

(05:25):
R and B? Do you know?

Speaker 4 (05:26):
I was really struggling with that.

Speaker 5 (05:28):
But I will tell you that, you know several moments
that was really impactful for me. I remember when like
going through my dad's vinyl and realized that this was
somebody's job, like somebody they do this for a living.
Like I remember taking Stevie Wonder record like so he
wrote this stuff and like he call he put this
together like okay, this is a job. I couldn't tell
how old I was, but I remember that being really impactful. Like,

(05:49):
I know, my dad goes to work. This person goes
to work and they do this right, you know. And
my dad would come home and pick the guitar. But
we had a guitar like in every room.

Speaker 4 (05:58):
You know.

Speaker 2 (05:59):
But your dad did he have personal did he have
like aspiration of being a professional musician or was it
just like a hobby, just something he did, just.

Speaker 4 (06:07):
A hob just a relief.

Speaker 5 (06:08):
Just really I think when my dad and my dad
was kind of late in joining the church. When he joined,
he joined, you know, he became a powerhouse in that
in that church as a vocalist. My whole family was
in the church before, mind you, my grandfather as a pastor.
My dad's brothers were pastors, my mom's brothers were all deacon.
So everyone had found church before my dad. My dad

(06:31):
was very reluctant when he found it. Boy, he founded,
you know.

Speaker 4 (06:35):
And I remember telling me.

Speaker 2 (06:36):
I think it isn't like some of your people. I
think it is your grandfathers. Like don't you have some
times in North Carolina? I think either your mom and
dad to.

Speaker 4 (06:44):
My mom and dad.

Speaker 5 (06:44):
My mom and dad are both from uh from North Carolina. Yeah,
so a town called Greenville and a little town called
Stokes is where my family my family.

Speaker 4 (06:55):
Greenville, North Carolina, and Stokes, North Carolina. You know.

Speaker 5 (06:58):
So yeah, and everybody's still there for the most part.
I had, you know, some family on my mom's side
moved up north when when my parents relocated, came up
north and some of that, but for.

Speaker 4 (07:09):
The most part, most of my family's in North Carolina.

Speaker 2 (07:11):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (07:12):
So when I first heard a commission we won, I
think my parents got a tape, a commission tape from
the family reunion, and I was ironing my clothes and
I put the tape and I was like, oh, I'll
just put this tape and listened to some music. I
didn't know what it was, right, I didn't even catch
the album cover yet, but I remember I was ironing

(07:35):
my clothes and I just looked down and my clothes
are wet, like there was drops of wetness on my
on my clothes, and I didn't realize that I had
started crying on my clothes. I'm probably like twelve eleven, twelve,
thirteen years old, and the music was like punching me
in the chest, like you literally punched me in the chest.
I remember this day like it was, Yes, said, I

(07:55):
remember I saying whatever that is, like point at the
point at the radio, like whatever that is. Want to
do that, Like I want to do whatever that is.
Because it was the most impactful moment. And from that
moment on, I was like, all right, learn everything I
can about commission, learned everything I can about who's this
for him? Guy, I'll learned everything I can about him.
And uh and then like I said, you know, up
to that point, just keeping really one hundred. You know,

(08:17):
a young kid growing up at church. You had an
excuse when you see I'm not even about the name church.
People that might not have came off so cool. They
sounded great, but they didn't come.

Speaker 2 (08:27):
Off so who. They were always like three four years
behind what was going on.

Speaker 5 (08:32):
Hey, you have to be in the church because you
kind of corny. You know, you can't, you can't be
in the clubs. Maybe that's why you that's why you
singing this, because clearly if you wasn't in his corn
he maybe you be singing with guy and singing the
comminisip came out, they had gumbies and jeans on they
look like they looked fly And I was like, why
they singing this? There must be something impactful to and

(08:54):
plus it already kind of blew me away and stuff
like that, and it was, it was, It was a
really monument thing. But it really more strengthened my pen
game and made me say, like, really write something true
that could be penetrating to somebody. And I think that
was the first, like first time I got on that
course of doing that.

Speaker 2 (09:10):
Man, I want to talk to you, or wanted you
to talk about your parents. You know what I'm saying.
I mean, you know me and you we been you know,
we go back. God let me shit, it's almost twenty
years at this point. You know what I'm saying. But
you know, man, your parents. You know, I just in
the time that we work together, and I will always

(09:31):
see your parents always there like supporting you, helping you,
you know what I mean, pulling up its shows your
dad and I don't even know if we ever talked
about this. I know I've never talked about this public.
But the day that we shot the picture Perfect video,
when we shot the Picture Perfect video and in Brooklyn,
I don't even know, if me and you ever talked

(09:51):
about this, this is one of the worst days of
my life.

Speaker 4 (09:58):
We have not talked about this.

Speaker 2 (10:00):
Wow, Okay, okay, bro listen. So that morning I flew
into Philly and then because we were shooting in Brooklyn,
so I flew into Philly and your dad came and
picked me up from the airport. So this is like,
oh God, maybe we shot it on like a They
say we shot on like a Friday or something. I
don't know, but anyway, we shot it on a Friday.

(10:21):
And literally I think that Tuesday that was when my
divorce started. That was when, like me and my you
know period, we separated. So the day of that picture
perfect video shoot, I am a fucking wreck.

Speaker 1 (10:38):
I do.

Speaker 2 (10:40):
As as much as I had, as much as I
wanted to do it, and as you know, as much
as I love everybody involved. Man, that shit was a wreck.
But I was riding in the car with your dad.
Your dad came and picked me up from the airport
and then he took us to Brooklyn where the shoot was,
and so we were sitting in the car, bro and
you know, and your dad is me Pops is Pops.
He was a going on young man, what's happening. Let's

(11:01):
talk about you know, he's just on and I just
broke down crying and he was just like yo, He's like, man,
you hight And I never forget this. I asked him myself.
I said, I said, look, I just got to ask you.
I said, you know, have you ever you know, thought
of a time where can you ever remember ever thought

(11:21):
you know, in all your years of you know, being married,
he ever thought that like marriage maybe wasn't for you.
And he was like, he said, oh that's strong. He said,
that's tough right there.

Speaker 4 (11:34):
Why do you go to a science bro?

Speaker 2 (11:38):
I never forget the ship loongs I lived. So I
was like, damn, He's like, oh that's tough right there.
And I never get He gave me some of the
most like timeless, just most perfect advice that has been
just like a guiding like you know for everything, you
know what I mean, just in my career and just
you know, whenever I have to make tough decisions. And
he just said, he said, well listen, man, he said, look,
no matter what you choose, no matter what decision you make,

(12:01):
it's going to be the right decision because it's your decision.

Speaker 4 (12:07):
God Lee.

Speaker 5 (12:09):
No matter what decision you make, it's gonna be the
right decision because it's your decision, because it's your decision,
so much like that man bro.

Speaker 2 (12:17):
So yeah, so that was so that was My life
was changed in like an hour and a half ride
with this guy. What impact did your parents have on
your You'll speak to the impact on you as.

Speaker 4 (12:28):
A First of all, why why did you fly to Philly?
Why did you fly in Philly? We shot in New York.

Speaker 2 (12:34):
I think I can't remember what it was. I think
we were because I think you're if I'm not mistaken,
I think your parents were bringing your clothes or something.
They had to drive up to Brooklyn anyway, so I
think it just made sense. It was like, all right,
just flying to Philly and not just ride up with pops.
I think that was the logic.

Speaker 5 (12:53):
But you know, even before I even answer your question,
the interesting thing is, maybe the reason why you flew
into Philly is because you needed that time, had that conversation.

Speaker 4 (13:03):
Reasons amazing how things work out.

Speaker 5 (13:04):
But you know, it's, first of all, I've been very
fortunate to have the most amazing parents in the entire world,
just the most supportive, supportive, parents from day one to
just even today, you know what I mean, Like just
really And that answer is so funny. I always joke

(13:24):
to say that my dad has never given me a
straight answer ever in life, right.

Speaker 4 (13:28):
My dad.

Speaker 5 (13:29):
So when I walk to my dad, I'm like, you know,
heartbroken out of what say, Dad? But did you ever
go through whatever his answers are, usually that answer is
so him, whatever decision you make is going to be
the right decision because your decision right. So so, for example,
my dad's a junior and he was hell being on
making sure I wasn't the third reason why. He's like, yo,
I need you to go your own path. And and

(13:51):
so Fiver said, like, Dad, you like this outfit? He'd
be like do you like that outfit? He's like he
never just goes yeah, it's dope. Not It was my
entire time of knowing my dad, not one time. Dad,
you like this hat? I love the hat? Keep rocking.

Speaker 4 (14:06):
He'd be like, Dad, you like this hat? Are you
wearing it? How does it fig you feel? You know?
Going the way that hat?

Speaker 5 (14:14):
Right? It's like, what the But what I did notice
is that throughout my life when I go back and
like reflect back on the life. He would never give
me an answer, he'd never give me a direction, but
he was always like little nudge, Okay, he's a little
off clothes. No answer, but nudging back again. Like it
was just putting up, putting up guard rails, putting up

(14:36):
guardrails throughout my entire life, through all the failed record deals,
throughout you know, the tough times, trying to struggle going
back to college and whatever. And my mom was more
like the I remember when I had left school, you know,
I did the Warner Brother's thing and I went to
the Island Records and I was out of school for

(14:56):
like a year and a half. My mom was like, so,
what's up with the record deal? And I was like,
I think it kind of dried up. She like, you know,
you got your scholarship still, right, You need to go
to a building like listen.

Speaker 4 (15:07):
So I went.

Speaker 5 (15:07):
I went there the next time and they didn't like
offer the scholarship. They were like, I was like, my
I went back and it was like they were like
nobody was like bringing it back up.

Speaker 4 (15:15):
She said, you need to go in there.

Speaker 5 (15:17):
You need to sing, you need to sign sign autographs,
you need to hug every single person and you need
to do whatever you need to do. But when you
walk out of a building, that scholarship needs to be back.
And I was like, okay, cool, I walk back.

Speaker 4 (15:29):
I love you. You know you give me a singature
bar miss for whatever. It's like.

Speaker 2 (15:35):
Meet.

Speaker 4 (15:36):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (15:36):
So she was she would be the one who was like,
you know, I'm gonna give you some direction, this is
what you need to do, you know whatever, whatever, And it.

Speaker 4 (15:43):
Was the perfect. They're the perfect. I tell you that.

Speaker 5 (15:46):
The two most impactful moments in my childhood my mom
when I was I think a freshman of high school.
I remember her coming home and she had quit her
corporate America jobs she worked for AT and T and
she was like, I can't do it no more or
I'm done so on, I'm just unfulfilled. I'm done with it.
I remember he wasn't talking to she were talking to
my dad and he was like, okay, all right cool.

(16:09):
And she equit her job to start a business in fashion. Wow,
And that was really important, like I own my own business.
My sister owns her own business now. And I think
it comes from that day to my mom exactly. But
then the other part was I think like the next
day my dad had this Lincoln mox seven white with
a blue rag top, sweet gorgeous car, and the next

(16:33):
day he put a full sale sign on it and
it's sold within hours, like somebody drove by and bought it,
like boom, And he went and bought this big, old,
old gray vand to drive my mom's clothes around. So
it was like the moment was an entrepreneurship and then
like support your partners.

Speaker 2 (16:47):
Yeah, true sacrifice and support. Yeah, that's right.

Speaker 5 (16:50):
And I think, you know, I think I'm an example
of entrepreneurship. But at the same time, you know, I
if you anybody knows me, and my wife is like,
that's how we I'm driving, she holding the map, she
dropping holding the map, like all right.

Speaker 4 (17:03):
This the turn, you know what I mean.

Speaker 5 (17:04):
So I'm constantly trying to figure out what's the gray
van in my marriage, you know what I mean?

Speaker 4 (17:10):
And doing that, and it's it's completely.

Speaker 5 (17:13):
Watching watching my parents, you know, give everything to them,
you know what I mean.

Speaker 4 (17:17):
It's enormalcy, supportive.

Speaker 5 (17:19):
What I'll tell you, my dad, you know, you know,
he know by pop everybody calls him pop, and most
of my friends unfortunately did brow up with dads. You know,
for whatever reason whatever, And my dad was not just
my dad. My dad was the dad to my community,
to all my up So it's like he earned it up.

(17:41):
He earned that term pop, like to not just in
high school, not even just college, but then all the
bands that played from all the musicians that played for me,
all the times, all the cats he picked up from
the airport or dude might have been going through a
hard time, you know, he's he's like, for real, if
anyone's ever earned that term pop, there's one thing to
be a dad, you know, and he's been a great
dad to me, but he's been a pop.

Speaker 4 (18:02):
To like the music community.

Speaker 5 (18:04):
Like these stories I hear all the time because he's
taking time to invest in everybody. And what's crazy is
they live ten minutes down the street from me. People
will go see them. They called they come to see
Pop and Mama come to see Pop, you know what
I mean. And I think that that speaks vious, you know,

(18:27):
for how amazing they are.

Speaker 2 (18:32):
I wanted to go back to one of the things
that we that I noticed when we first started working together,
particularly when we would do videos together like we did
Picture Perfect and then we did we are on the
move and you know stuff, you have a very much
uh kind of like a a theater presence, you know
what I'm saying. Like you the thing I noticed when

(18:55):
we were work is in videos like you use your
whole body, like you use your hands, you use your
leg like you do Like I was like, Okay, he's
like really a performer. And one of the first times
we went, we did a show together and I remember
at the end of the show, I was just sitting
on the side watch him. And at the end of
the show, you was like, you know, you're like, yo,
my name is Eric Roberson and it has been my

(19:17):
great honor to perform for you tonight. And that is
just something that that really resonated with me and and
I you know, I never forgot that because it's something
that I think a lot of artists don't really take
and understand the importance of giving a performance, you know
what I'm saying, of using the stage as you know,

(19:38):
as your place to really perform and express yourself and
give the audience an experience. And I have to think
that a lot of that came from your experience in
Howard in the musical theater department, and I just wanted
to you know, touch on that.

Speaker 5 (19:52):
Yeah, I mean because my sister I grew up doing theater,
really got heavy into it in like junior high in
high school, and then I got a scholarship to Howard
and going to my parents saying, hey, I want to
I want to if I could have majored in R
and B out of major in R and B.

Speaker 4 (20:07):
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 5 (20:09):
If I could have majored in commission, I would have major,
but obviously that didn't exist, so there was a musical
theater major. I went and saw a performance of dream
Girls before five went to Howard. I was blown away
by like just the talent day. I was like, oh,
I gotta get it together. And I'll tell you it
was a blessing going. You know, first of all, I
was around just killers. The teachers were great, the students

(20:33):
were great. Just you saw the future of theater, the
future of acting, the future of everything in that in
that department. The third floor is the music department, the
first floor is the theater department. And I probably learned
more about music on the first floor in theater because
theater was talking about like character development and like you know,
if you say, but it's true.

Speaker 4 (20:53):
Well, what is true?

Speaker 2 (20:54):
Mean?

Speaker 5 (20:54):
What's true to you? And we might talk ten minutes
about just the word true. So let's back it up.
What's the first time you ever heard true? Where were
you at the first time you ever heard that word?
I heard it when I was in kindergarten? Okay, was
it true then? And then you know it's like the
teachers would dissect it. Now say it again. Now you're like,
so is it true? If I can even say it
tears falling out. I mean, it was like dissecting it.
Now you talk about like trying to write songs and

(21:17):
things like that, What if I bring this into that area?
What if I bring feed or into these It's all.

Speaker 4 (21:23):
Us as singers and rappers, we're just characters. The songs
are just scripts. You know. The music is just the
scene and read the stage is the scene. It's like,
you know what.

Speaker 5 (21:31):
So it's like, how can we bring this to another
another level? And for me, whether it's in the studio,
whether it's on stage, whatever, Yeah, it's like, how can
we bring this this character? Not not just that if
I'm sad, the bass player needs to be sad.

Speaker 2 (21:47):
I can't. I can't he just pouring my life to
be telling the same story.

Speaker 5 (21:50):
Yeah, we all gotta be telling the same story, so
the drummer can't be happy, like and I'm sitting here
like how could you let me Dad?

Speaker 4 (21:57):
Or vice versa. You know.

Speaker 5 (21:58):
So I think I think a lot of my friends
from Howard are surprised I didn't follow a career theater,
but when I also feel like I fulfill my my
theater needs in my music, in my writing and my performance.

Speaker 2 (22:13):
As Welle, you know.

Speaker 5 (22:16):
And I think the choice a lot of it came
for my desire to write, like sure in out of
auditioning and then rehearsing and probably not doing my own material,
I'll be taking on other characters. With this one, I
was like I could write about you know, I could
really dive into it, and it worked. I think when
people listen even to my music, if not every most song,

(22:36):
you're gonna find a song on every album where it's
like it's musical theater, you know what I mean?

Speaker 2 (22:42):
Now You Had You was a record I forgot which
album was on. It was called The Magician. I think
where you like when speaking from the aspect magic and
I was just like, man, I would never do a
song like that. I would be so scared to do
a record like that. I don't know, it's just I was.
I just thought it was just a really bread choice.
But you always took those kind of choices where you

(23:02):
would really like embody a character. I mean, it's one
thing to rap as that character, right, It's one thing
to be Secrick and like you know, you know the
cops shot to kid, you know, like to do all
the voices, but you don't really see that in in
R and B as singers. And I always thought that
was really admirable and just always admired you for taking
those kind of choice, those kind of chances and your stuff.

Speaker 5 (23:23):
I appreciate it. I appreciate it. But you know I
learned I learned a lot from your pen. You know,
if I and even say this, you know, the first
time I ever witnessed it a person writing a song
without writing it down was watching you when we did
be in love. And remember it, yes we did have
been in love. You were having a conversation with my dad.
I was setting the music up and my dad was talking,

(23:45):
and you took my dad's conversation. Remember this day was yesterday,
the exact conversation, and you made it rhyme and you
you were like the beat was ready and he was like, yeah,
I'm ready, and then you just walked in and took
everything that y'all I were talking about and just rhymed
it down. It blew me away that somehow you processed
all that in your head without putting on paper.

Speaker 4 (24:07):
And it took me some time.

Speaker 5 (24:08):
But you know, probably I haven't written a song down
probably for the last ten years, probably.

Speaker 4 (24:13):
Like you know. So a lot of it is like
seeing what you did.

Speaker 5 (24:17):
Of course hearing what Biggie's doing and hearing jay Z,
but then seeing what you did, and then for me
applying like theater background. For me, my first thing is like,
all right, who do I want to be in the song?
What's the character? The more the more developed the character is,
then I just hit record because now I just gotta
make a rhyme. The objective is all there, the character's
all there, and then and it just make a rhyme.

(24:38):
But a lot of it was sparked from like watching
you do it. I was like that's I was like, yo,
did this cat just literally first of all, not just
like did you wrote a song in your head? But
you wrote a song in your head while talking to somebody.

Speaker 2 (24:53):
That's I mean, yeah, I mean that was just that
was again just your pop man, like that was Pops.
He just you know, would just come in and just
drop these jewels and he just start talking and all right,
yong man, well tell me about let me talk to
you about this, and he just be talking and I'm
just soaking this shit in. I'm like, man, And so
I just went in and did it. And the crazy
stuff now is like kind of the roads are reverse
because you don't write down and I'm constantly like writing

(25:16):
prompts like in my phone. Like I think. I think
for me what change was the process because at that
time we did been in love. Man, that was shit.
That was damn old five six some of that. And
so at that time, that's when we were recording at
the studio, and so that was just kind of my process.
I would just turn a beat on, just crank it up,
and I would just walk around pace just kind of

(25:38):
just you know, run it in my head, just kind
of write the verse in my head with the music up.
But then around like oh nine, that was when and
it's in the studio, it's in we're in some we're
in the studio. So you know, time is money. We
just want to be efficient. So that was how we learned.
Just in those early Little Brother records, it's like, all right,
get in, get out, you know what I'm saying. It
just had to be you had to be on it.

(25:59):
So around like oh nine, once we moved back to
when I built my studio at the crib, you know,
I mean, my kids are here. I can't be just
cranking to three in the morning, you know what I mean.
So my process changed, and so that was when I
kind of had to go back to just like actually
writing either on paper or you know, sometime my phone
or whatever, but just going there. And so from the

(26:19):
time when we were working at first, it just my
whole thing was just like one take. I gotta get
it down. It's just one take, one take, Jake, just
is what it's got to be. But once I got
home and uh talking to another co collaborative, our was
fall Manch talking to him, and he had a completely
different approach, and he would say, he said, Man, when

(26:39):
I go to the booth, I treat it like I'm
a director, you know what I'm saying. He said, So
I look at my verse like Okay, I'll do a take,
but it's like, hmm, the and in that verse, I
may want to stick that better cause that'll lend and
I'll just go in and get just the and you
know what I mean, Like he is surgical with this ship.

(27:01):
You know what I'm saying. And hearing that approach, I
was like, oh my god, you know what I mean.
And so that was kind of where I'm at with it.
Now it's much more a lot more kind of methodical.

Speaker 5 (27:13):
First of all, you know, listen this can you already know?
You know what I'm sayings know, I think ahead, I
put my money on anybody.

Speaker 2 (27:27):
Come on, just god, come on, what were talking?

Speaker 4 (27:29):
You know, just such a you.

Speaker 5 (27:31):
You always had such a unique approach and it's so interesting.

Speaker 4 (27:35):
But like I said, the process changes.

Speaker 5 (27:37):
I'm a I'm a fan of people's process is one
of my favorite words in the time. You don't hear
me saying several times even in this interview, but I
and people always ask me, like, who would you love
to collaborate?

Speaker 4 (27:47):
I said, I love. I just love to watch.

Speaker 5 (27:49):
I love just be in a room when Pharah Manch
is working or when Eric ab i Do is work.
You know, when Fante's working, like just so I can
see the process of how somebody's putting something together.

Speaker 4 (27:59):
It's amazing. And guess what, it always works differently for different.

Speaker 2 (28:03):
And it's always different. That's the thing. Everybody's thing is different, man,
And it's just yeah, I remember, like you know, when
we were working and you know, and I would see
just kind of you know, because you would I would
tune into the process like your your you know, your
your platform, and I was just again, it was just
one of those things, you know, for for for people listening,
you know, ero, he has a thing. Is it still

(28:25):
on Patreon? Is it still still Patreon? Yeah? I called
the process where you know, he pretty much just netflixed himself,
you know what I mean. But he was ahead of
Curve you I mean, you did this ship then ten
years ago. But you know, but he has a thing
called the Process where you can just tune in and
watch him create songs. And that is just again just

(28:48):
one of those things where I'm just like, dude, I
would never like, never, like, oh my god, like having
cameras in the studio while I'm like, bro, that is yo.
I would rather you have a camera in the dressing
room while I'm like trying on sweatmans or some ship
like camera in the studio while I'm creative, Are you
fucking kidding me? Like, I just, I just I can't

(29:10):
do it, bro, I just it freaks me out.

Speaker 5 (29:13):
I learned this quickly with you. Me and you have
done a million songs. But when we decided to take
Ale album right when we did the Man album, it
was very obvious to me, Okay, I am one who
wants to go through it to figure it out. You're
one who wants to figure it out before you go
through it. It was to me exact we were so

(29:34):
exact opposite that we actually were the same in some
form of fashion, right, And it worked out, it complimented.

Speaker 4 (29:40):
But it was like, you know, I'm definitely one who's like.

Speaker 5 (29:43):
Put cameras on me, like I'll do it, like I'm
down to like just go against the wall.

Speaker 4 (29:47):
Like whatever you like.

Speaker 5 (29:48):
Nah, bro, we ain't throwing nothing against the wall, you know,
shot to the head, And I think, degree, you know how,
maybe I was there to pull you a bit off center.

Speaker 4 (30:03):
That's absolutely.

Speaker 5 (30:06):
I had a beautiful thing about the conversation about collaboration,
How amazing the collaboration it is. But it's like you
were able to pull me off center and I was
able to pull you off center, and that's where the
magic of all that, you know, laid that right there.
But yet we had we definitely had two different type
of theories when we came in to do that album.

Speaker 4 (30:27):
You know what I mean of just stopped.

Speaker 5 (30:28):
Throwing stuff against the wall because this is not that's
not gonna work. He's not gonna understand like this, he's
not only we ain't just throw it some against the
wall like No, we planted out our shots and we're
going with ten for ten.

Speaker 4 (30:40):
It's gonna be ten for ten.

Speaker 2 (30:41):
Listen, man, listen.

Speaker 4 (30:43):
Nah.

Speaker 2 (30:43):
It was so informal because I just had never because
I had I was never that person that you know,
and I always admired you know that, and that was
something working with you in a lot of ways, it
kind of reminded me of working with Pooh, you know
what I'm saying, NLB, because Pooh was like that coming up,
like Poo who was the guy that who would just
record non stop. He would just go in and just

(31:04):
bang bang rap gang and he was way more prolific
than I was. And you know, that was something that
I always admired, you know what I mean, because I
just was never like that. It just always felt like
I was wasting people time. I'm like, yo, if I
ain't really coming with no heat, like I'm gonna just
shut the fuck up because I ain't you know what
I mean, I ain't. I ain't trying to be. I
had just experiment and like when I show up, I
wanted to be for real. And so we were working

(31:25):
on that album. First off, you know, for everybody listening
at home to this day, I have no idea how
we finished that record. Idea that was at the time
because I think you were were you about to have
your third son at that time or had he just
been born?

Speaker 5 (31:40):
He had just been born, so so so me and
I decided we're gonna make an album. And we had
been talking for about two years about planning to straight up,
you wait till you went on.

Speaker 4 (31:51):
Tour and you call. I remember a phone call.

Speaker 5 (31:55):
You said, E I'm ready, let's start. Let's start it.
At that point, we weren't called to.

Speaker 2 (32:03):
Have a title.

Speaker 5 (32:03):
Let start the album. And I said, oh, that's that's great.
I'm in the hospital. My wife had a baby, and
you was kind of like that's dope, but this is
the window, Like this is the window, like this.

Speaker 4 (32:17):
Is I was like literally holding the child, like.

Speaker 5 (32:22):
Okay, if this is the window, then let's go now,
mind you you know, to help out one thing. This
is my third child in you know, in probably six years.
So we we were having a child like ten at
little break sae like a three year break, and then
we had another child.

Speaker 4 (32:41):
Right, so.

Speaker 5 (32:43):
I've been recording with kids in my hand, you know,
like for the last seven years pretty much last five
years whatever.

Speaker 4 (32:50):
So I was, you know, okay, all right, cool.

Speaker 5 (32:52):
But literally the next like two days later, we were
we were cutting and I mean ninety percent of that
record was cut literally with that kid like I hold him.
I said it in one of the songs.

Speaker 2 (33:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (33:06):
So we were like but then you were like, like
I said, you were in a different state. I feel
like it was in a different state every time you
sent me something. We at no point we would ever,
we didn't see each other. What's crazy style, bro? Like
it was straight up justly album cover.

Speaker 4 (33:24):
Everything was just hilarious how it all came together.

Speaker 5 (33:27):
But yet as locked in, we could not have been
anymore locked in. And I think that's the that's the
magic of it. You know, I think, which is which
is really really special. When I go back and listen
to songs, you know, they were they were amazing. I
mean it was a blur because it was really crazy
little blur.

Speaker 2 (33:44):
Yeah, but that record, man, listen, I mean that record
made me just a better musician all the way around,
just you know, better singer songwriter, because it was just
it was very much for me. It was just to
thing of just kind of iron sharpening iron. And you know,
I've just always just been a believer in you know,
when you're collaborating with people that you respect, you know,

(34:06):
you just always want to you want to be on
your best behavior, so to speak. You know, you always
want to make sure you show up as the best
because you know, I knew like you just had a kid.
Twenty sixteen, that was when yeah, I lost my dad
and my man. Yeah, the night we did I think
the night we did Atlanta. It was like shortly after that.

(34:26):
I can't remember it was. This was twenty it's twenty sixteen,
but yeah, I lost like my my granddad died on
like Tuesday, and then my dad died on like Sunday,
and all of this shit was happening while We're in
the middle of the record, you know what I'm saying.
And so I knew that you were showing up. I'm like,
he just had a kid, Like I got through what
I'm going through, but man, fuck this, like I you know,

(34:49):
I'm staying in this. We're gonna finish this, you know.
And uh And I always admire just you know, your efficiency,
just because I knew working with you, I'm like, I
know this will get done. I know to get done.
And I just always, you know, wanted to just maintain
that trust. It's like, yo, if Erro sent me something
he knows is I'm knocking it out and it's over with.

Speaker 4 (35:09):
Yeah, we we have. I mean, we've had a great
relationship over music.

Speaker 5 (35:12):
It was it was it was time and we of
course we showed up with We showed at the right time,
but it was it was the craziest.

Speaker 4 (35:20):
Time that it was crazy to do an album.

Speaker 5 (35:23):
But you know what, it was even funny though, like
the whole how we take Alero, we said that as
a joke, as a joke, like that was the way
we send it to each other.

Speaker 4 (35:36):
I could have Lero and you said the verse and eventually.

Speaker 2 (35:42):
Like said, it's the album, like why you bullshit?

Speaker 5 (35:47):
And this might be she might be to that, you know,
so listen, man. But once again, that was the happy
medium of like going through it to see if it works.
We see it works before we go through, kind of
like you know, because at no point we was committed,
were just having fun, but eventually was like.

Speaker 4 (36:07):
That took a lot of card job.

Speaker 2 (36:09):
Actually, yeah, a little bit. I'm not tired of it,
Like I keep saying it, you know what I mean,
like this might be it so fun time I want
to I want to ask you, man, so back to
your your days at Howard and your first deal on
Warner Brothers. First off, you have no idea how excited

(36:30):
I was to find out that you wrote the Moon,
that the Moon was your song. I mean the Moon was.
I mean, man, the Moon was one of those songs
that I literally remember hearing it one time on the
radio when I was probably like I don't know, twelve
or thirteen or something, and I was like, oh my god,
like who the fuck is this? This shit is amazing,

(36:51):
and never heard it again, and so then you know,
I mean, you know, fifteen, have many years later, I'm like, oh, shit,
you know what I mean? How did you get that
that Warner Brothers deal? What was that process like of
signing with them?

Speaker 5 (37:05):
So my sophomore year, the group Shi who also was Howered.
They had a big song. So they met adj right
and they sung the song for him two weeks A
week later, they were on the radio with him.

Speaker 4 (37:18):
Two weeks later Senior Hall.

Speaker 5 (37:20):
Two weeks after that, they were millions of copies later.
You know, it just went, it just exploded, and it
was crazy because all of us were singing and doing
stuff on campus, but we were at that point, I
was just trying to be the dopest on campus. I
didn't even think this could be something outside of this,
And that was big. But the bigger part of it
was also like, what, here's my demo, Like just when
you get to LA just passed it to somebody.

Speaker 2 (37:42):
And these were songs that you were recorded previously before.

Speaker 5 (37:45):
They just like my demo at that time, my demo
at that time, which was just I want to say,
the moon was probably on it. No, no, that's not true.
Let me think for a second. No, So all right,
So Derek, who was a member of uh of Shah Carl,
I'm sorry, remember of Shot introduced me to his brother.

(38:07):
His brother was in the group and he had some
producers that were under Teddy Riley, and they sent me
the track and that's what I wrote, wrote the Moon,
and then of course the phones at that point. At
that point, now I'm doing class and every weekend I'm
pretty much like flying out to uh take meetings and stuff.
Medina met with Little Salas before he passed and uh,

(38:29):
just running past label at the label at the label
and what was a.

Speaker 2 (38:32):
Little Solace like? Man, he's this very time. You know,
we don't really we get few people out here that
I have worked with him. But what was he like?
He was the guy for everyone listening. Little Solace Junior
was the he was guy over at m c A Records.
You know, he played the you know, big role you
know new edition. Uh he formed Solace Records like Shante
Moore more like he was he was kind of one

(38:54):
of the one of the old Jesus. What was he like?

Speaker 5 (38:56):
I just had one meeting with him, but I remember
he was shooting straight from the hip. But I her
from him was he said, uh, and this was interesting
because when I look back, so he's like, uh, listen,
I just want to take a meeting with you. I
think you already decided. You know, you're going through the
Warner Brothers thing. But I just wanted to meet with you.

Speaker 2 (39:11):
Man.

Speaker 4 (39:11):
I like your music this and that and whatever whatever,
and I was like I appreciate it, you know.

Speaker 5 (39:15):
And I was kind of like why you like, why
do you think? I like, why am I here if
you think I'm already going to Warner Brothers. At that point,
I really was going to Warner Brothers. I was deciding.
He's like, I wanted to meet what you kind of
talk with you? And before I left the room, he
was like, so good man, hey man, the music's dope. Man, listen,
if you want this you know something over here and
just let you know, man, I don't know why you're
going to Warner Brothers because Benn ain't gonna be here
for long.

Speaker 4 (39:36):
That's the last thing he said. As I walked out
the door, like I was like, okay, all right now.

Speaker 5 (39:41):
I walked out the door like whatever, And sure enough
I signed the deal and Benny was out the door.
Benn and Denny was like focus on Fresh Prince of
bel Air like after and I was like, well, he
leave I'm leaving. But but I never thought of like
I didn't even think. I just didn't even put and
two together, you know.

Speaker 2 (39:58):
And yeah, that's something that a lot of artists I
even talked to like now just about how like you know,
it's signing to a label. That's just one of kind
of the pitfalls you can have where it's like you
can have your guy or your girl, your person that's
really riding for you that you might sign to or
whatever they'll get you signed, but if they leave, you

(40:19):
kind of lose your advocate, like you ain't got nobody
fighting for you, and you just are back and square one.

Speaker 5 (40:23):
What I will tell you was almost almost immediately I
got signed to Island Records. And the interesting was when
I went when I signed with Warner Brothers, I signed
in LA and it was like stop.

Speaker 4 (40:34):
Today, everybody is that robertson day? Hey? Right?

Speaker 5 (40:37):
And then when I went to when I showed up
to Island, I took the train in New York. When
I got there, it was like just a lawyer in
the n or my boy Leois Clibborn shot out to Liotis.

Speaker 2 (40:47):
It was just the two of them. It's like a
lawyer Liotis.

Speaker 5 (40:49):
I was like, where's the cake, and like where's the
you know, it's a five straight business. They were like,
it's just it's quiet day. I was like, oh, okay,
all right, signing ever, took pictures, whatever, and then I
think I got back on the train. I might I
stay to day in New York and then like the
next day I got home. But when I got back,
I remember my manager called me and going, yo, Hire

(41:11):
Micks just got signed as President Ireland.

Speaker 4 (41:15):
And I knew immediately what that meant.

Speaker 5 (41:16):
It was like, so, why the hell do we just
signed there, because he's gonna come and wipe every wipe
everybody out, and sure enough he did.

Speaker 4 (41:23):
He came in.

Speaker 5 (41:24):
Was like Leota's lost his job. Then it was like
contracts just and she just wiped the whole thing out.
And it's crazy because you know, initially you heard your ego,
you know, because at first it was like yo, listen
to the music.

Speaker 4 (41:33):
First he's like, I don't even care. No, I got
my home, I got my whole team.

Speaker 5 (41:36):
I'm bringing he didn't jail and yeah, he's like, I'm
bringing my whole thing in and and then later I
ended working with Hiring. It was it was fine because
when I worked, when I was at this point years later,
I'm like, let's get this money. Like I'm not even tripping,
like you not even up, you knowing worried about that,
Let's get this money. But but you understand that, Like
that's how it was. President come in, They're like, I

(41:57):
don't care what was here before. I'm bringing my guys.
I do that, I'm bringing my people in and this
and that and that, and I had to learn that
was the biggest lesson for me, that like my music
can't save me, Like you got to be on point.
You gotta be on point because like you can't sing
your way out of this. This cat didn't care what
the music sounded like. He was like, let's get out,
like you out of here. So that's when I really
started learning. And another thing was really important too, So

(42:21):
Beni Madina's office had this wall of like CDs and
tapes and that's from ceiling to floor, the entire wall,
like it's missions of just music period.

Speaker 2 (42:35):
Was just music period.

Speaker 5 (42:36):
And I've been in this office probably like ten times
right just over the last two months or whatever it was,
and there's like a whole row of prints. There's all
the other names I don't know, I mean just music, music, music.
And then when I got signed, I think they said, well,
what do you want to do next? You have had
enough time to catch some food or whatever. I said,
I want you to change my flight and give me

(42:58):
some headphones. I want to listen to this wall. It
was the first time I felt like I had the
right to say that. And I stayed there that night
just going through, like just pulling every CD, every tape,
every day out and just listening that whole wall. And
it was the most amazing musical night in my life,
hearing Prince songs I never heard for and then like, well,
who's this cat? Oh that's the new day we signed?
Is ALM supposed to come out whatever?

Speaker 4 (43:17):
Whatever?

Speaker 5 (43:17):
And then you never hear that and his people are here,
who could clearly be the next Prince, But it never
saw the light of day. It was just like this
wall was crazy wow. But it never left me that
like what happened to all those people, Like what happened
all that music? Like you know, And I think one
of the reasons why I kind of went like the

(43:38):
whole independent route was like I never wanted to be
one of the people on that wall, like it just
that that scared the hell out of me, Like, yo,
this this is life changing music up here that's never
going to be released.

Speaker 4 (43:49):
It's never going to see a lot of day.

Speaker 2 (43:51):
And the only reason I'm hearing it is because I'm
actually signed to these.

Speaker 5 (43:56):
Right right, the only reason I ever heard it. And
then you know, we we were writing songs and producer
songs for people. We've we've done whole albums on people
and the albums never come out.

Speaker 4 (44:05):
So you're like, you're.

Speaker 5 (44:06):
Like, you know, I remember like wanting to be an
artist but yet having a career as a songwriter and
seeing an artist get signed, see them flying in, getting
put into some glorious hotel and recording for a month,
and you think, Okay, it could really pop for this person.
And then whether it's the president, label, the A and
R department, marketing team, whatever, they're like nah, And then

(44:29):
that person is back and it's just over doing hair
or structured with It's over. It's like, how wait a minute,
how is it that never set right with me? You know,
like how is it just over? So the Island Warner
Brothers thing was really really tough after that, Like so
I went back to school, and I was tough because
you got to think out during the moontime. I was
in school, So I was in class while that song

(44:51):
was playing on the radio and the video was playing.
And then I was like, well, I'm leaving to go
focus on the album and blow up show off the
next one, you know, And and then the deal started
falling apart, Like as soon as I left school, it
was like pooooo, Like life really hit and and I
had to like really, But so when I went back
on campus, it was like what you're doing back?

Speaker 4 (45:11):
What is that? You know? And it was humbling. It
was really really humbling.

Speaker 5 (45:15):
But my pen wouldn't be what it is today if
it wasn't for that time going back. I became a
better student every like the person you know now it's
that person who show back up at that school like learning,
like oh I need more, I need to know more.

Speaker 2 (45:34):
When you when you were with Warner that was was
that an album deal or was it just a single
deal for the moon? Like?

Speaker 4 (45:40):
So it was it was.

Speaker 5 (45:41):
A single deal. Uh, it was a single deal. And
before we could even go into the song was thirty
three on the charts. And then Benny left, so it
was like wow, and I think we were moving towards.
It was moving towards like we're gonna do a whole
album deal. And then I did an album deal with
with Ireland and then like I said that one, that
one wiped out as fast as you possibly imagine. But

(46:02):
I remember, like the song the Moon was doing great.
It was doing great for me. It was growing, it
was climbing, and then it was like, blessed move because
it was it was a great song. Yeah, clearly was
about to have it here as bad, like you know,
and and it was just a whole little president hop
for for a nice man. It seemed like a year,
you know what I mean, just trying to go from

(46:23):
one of one label to another.

Speaker 2 (46:25):
Man. Please tell the story as much as you want
to tell. Please tell the story of doing your promotional
tour with l de Barge all Varner Brothers. This is
one of the greatest hour you told me this story.
I never get. We was at the Guy, We was
at the damn Bob Evans somewhere in the middle of Jersey.

Speaker 4 (46:49):
I don't know where.

Speaker 2 (46:50):
I remember we was at the Bob Evans like one
morning show.

Speaker 5 (46:53):
So there's so many levels of it. There's so many
levels of the story. But what I would tell you
and just respectfully, I remember I remember one thing. I
remember one thing the rep, the Warner Brother's rep said,
if if Elle ever calls you even five o'clock in
the morning once to play pool, go play pool with him.
You know, He's like, go play pool. If he ever

(47:14):
needs to talk, he needs to hang out, Like this
is one of your main reasons for being on this tour,
is like if he ever needs you, like follow through
answer the call. And you know, we all know that
El the bar just had some some substance issues whatever,
and this was doing his clean period, so I think
that what he was talking about, it's like, you know,
if you ever want to play pool, he needs to
go out and play pool.

Speaker 4 (47:33):
Let me whatever.

Speaker 5 (47:34):
So you know, we became fast friends that in that time.
And he was just so amazing man. Like every hotel
we showed up, he went and set at a piano.
He almost do a whole concert in that lobby, like
just waiting for our rooms or just just he was
sitting at a piano.

Speaker 4 (47:53):
Every time. He was just so musical. We would do
a show.

Speaker 5 (47:56):
I mean we did a show I think in Connecticut
and the sound system was just horrible. He's still on
the stage and he waited and the sound was just trash,
and he waited let everybody crash and burn, and right
before the open doors, he said, hey, brother, can I
just come over there? He talked exactly what he said.
He's saying, come over there and just just look at
the mixing board if that's all right, And God was like, yeah, sure.

(48:18):
In like probably ten minutes, he took the mic back
there and he started turning knobs and he cleared all drama,
like all clouds just clear. And the sound sounded enormously
incredible that night. And that's just how he was. He
was like he knew how to work everything. He was
a concert professional. He had been through everything. We were
driving one time and I told him said, Yo, man,

(48:41):
I really like your album.

Speaker 4 (48:42):
The album is great.

Speaker 5 (48:44):
We were going they were taking a limit from Connecticut
to Boston. I think it was something like that, driving it,
and he says, man, I was this Alams a money album.

Speaker 2 (48:56):
I would never forget this out, the money out because
you had told him, because you had told him it
was a good He's like, Yo, this is a good album.

Speaker 5 (49:02):
He was like oh no, this a money This ain't
a good album. This is a money album. He said,
I'm doing my money album so I can get a
chance to do a good album. And he was like,
he's like Marvin Gay did money albums till he was
able to do a good album. By Marley did money albums,
He's able to do it. He just ran down the
line and then he just said, so this right here,

(49:22):
that's just a money album because I'm getting ready to
do a good album. And he just went just wandered off,
and I just love me figuring like I need to
do my good album, a good album, right.

Speaker 4 (49:33):
You know. It's like every I mean, he just had.

Speaker 5 (49:35):
I could have made a T shirt off of everything,
he said, you know what I mean. You know I
remember we were at his birthday party and uh and.

Speaker 2 (49:45):
Was this the don't don't fall in love man?

Speaker 4 (49:48):
He saw he saw my eyes were glistening that night.
He was like, he said, hey, man, don't fall in love.
Just don't fall in love. I was like to like.

Speaker 2 (50:02):
The wisdom of LSD I make a whole album, or
the wisdom of l But it was just it was
to learn like a constant professional man.

Speaker 5 (50:10):
His showmanship on and off stage was just you know,
he was just tough and it you know.

Speaker 4 (50:17):
And also I was a person.

Speaker 5 (50:18):
It was probably the start of I was a person
who always had vocal issues. I mean I got horse,
I mean, mind you, I was like two songs in
the show and then got the Way and those two songs,
I was struggling to maintain up. I was getting horse
and stuff like that. So to see somebody who sang
all day on stage off stage, it really it really

(50:40):
blew me away. And it was probably on the steps
of like how do I get to that point? How
do I get to a point where I can get
more health like really healthier.

Speaker 4 (50:49):
Yeah, And that was the start of it. Like and
I was. I was nineteen really so I was. It was.

Speaker 5 (50:54):
It was crazy, but it was a good learning lesson
for me, Like, yo, this is this if you're gonna
learn from a pro.

Speaker 4 (51:00):
The third from bag Other Bars was esoteric.

Speaker 2 (51:03):
Was that your first independently released well not inventy? Was
that your first album period? Like that?

Speaker 5 (51:10):
Actually, yes, first album period. So uh, what's crazy is
that I moved to Atlanta and I eventually eventually ran
into ran into touch of jazz. So that was like
life changing moment was like working at a Touch of Jazz,
and then I moved back. I went back to Atlanta
to just get my stuff because I for the moment

(51:30):
I met Touch of Jazz, like the moment I went
to Jazzy Y Studio.

Speaker 4 (51:33):
It's like I just never left around.

Speaker 2 (51:36):
Still one of my favorite like records, just I.

Speaker 4 (51:38):
Love Yeah, yeah, I mean you know, like I said,
meet and Jeff.

Speaker 5 (51:43):
Meeting all those brothers at a Touch of Jazz was
like that was graduate school for me. That was like
the life changing moment for me. But when I went
back to get my truck and like move out of
my apartment, I had a session with Joe and Uncle Sam.

Speaker 2 (51:59):
I was working at noon one Teddy Bishop.

Speaker 5 (52:03):
Teddy, Bishop Teddy, Bishop, Jazzy Faye, Brian Michael Uh, Brian Cox,
I mean just killers and it's down there, and I
think Joe had a concert. So when he went, He's like,
I'm gonna go to my concert and I'm gonna come
back and finish the song. So I went to take
a nap at a friend's house and left just but

(52:23):
mind I'm leaving the next time, dropping back up to
Jersey and someone broke into my truck and took just
took the bag out the front seat, and that bag
was every song I recorded up to that point. So
it's like everything in high school, everything in college, everything
at Warner Brothers, everything.

Speaker 4 (52:39):
In Island all gone.

Speaker 5 (52:41):
And in just a snap, like I come out to
the car and it's just glass everywhere the truck or whatever.
And uh and that was like that was really like,
oh snap. So I mean it was like really starting
over starting.

Speaker 2 (52:54):
I say, it's a full reset.

Speaker 4 (52:55):
Completely full reset.

Speaker 5 (52:58):
And then I went I was still working out of course,
working on Touch of Jazz, and then I just started
I started just working on Esoteric.

Speaker 4 (53:05):
And then it was like.

Speaker 5 (53:07):
I didn't have a deal, you know, And it was
like at that point, I'm Eric Roberson, a songwriter. Like
I'm proud of myself. Every room I walking out, I'm
Eric Roberson, a songwriter.

Speaker 2 (53:16):
And did you had you signed your deal your songwriting
deal with ian My at that time or was this
prior today?

Speaker 4 (53:21):
I had my publishing deal.

Speaker 5 (53:23):
I had a publishing deal with ian My at the time,
and things were working for me. I mean, as a songwriter,
I couldn't have been happier, you know what I mean,
because at this point I talk about the music, Soul
Child stuff, the VV and Green stuff, everything's working, but.

Speaker 4 (53:37):
I just wasn't satisfied. And I had it. I got it.

Speaker 5 (53:39):
I actually had a bad like a bad breakup, and
that's what really sparked it. Like I was like, let
me just start, just close the studio door and just
start working. That was the only way I knew how
to get back to neutral.

Speaker 4 (53:50):
Was like just right. So I was either writing in
the journal, I was writing a song.

Speaker 5 (53:53):
It was like back and forth, and then the album
was done, and it was I really was like I
was just unwilling to sell these songs because they were
like they were way too personal, way too much.

Speaker 4 (54:04):
And it was like I'm just gonna I'm just gonna
put it out.

Speaker 5 (54:07):
And I remember, like really the homies like all laughing,
like what you mean you're gonna put it out?

Speaker 4 (54:11):
You're gonna put it out. I was like, I think
I'm just gonna put it out.

Speaker 5 (54:13):
Like you got a record now now, like we'll just
figured it out, just put it out. And that was
it just started. This is two thousand two or two thousand,
two thousand and one, and and mind you by no
means was out a first. But I know means I
remember Dwelly had Rise, I knew of I knew of
a lot of artists who were independent and in different

(54:35):
states and everywhere.

Speaker 4 (54:38):
Shout out to fertile ground. Who was the first.

Speaker 5 (54:40):
Queso putting out music like independently putting out music and
selling records?

Speaker 4 (54:46):
So I know means the first.

Speaker 5 (54:48):
If anything that was different from me and anyone else,
I remember, like I remember Carl Thomas being an independent artist.

Speaker 4 (54:55):
I remember Kim.

Speaker 5 (54:57):
I remember Kim before before Motown signing John Legend before
uh before he was John Stevens.

Speaker 2 (55:05):
Stevens had we had Kobe, he had had the Kobe haircut.

Speaker 4 (55:08):
Yes, yes, So I remember.

Speaker 5 (55:11):
The difference was like, you know, once you sold a
certain amount of records independently, the labels come scoop you up.
That's how that was a normal thing. And I was like, well,
what happens if you if you don't sign with them?
What happens if you started sell a certain amount and
then just keep going.

Speaker 4 (55:24):
What will happen then?

Speaker 5 (55:26):
And I think that if anything is different, that's that's
the part where we got to the We got to
the point where we could have went to a deal
and and and worked.

Speaker 4 (55:35):
Their stuff out.

Speaker 5 (55:35):
We had sold enough records, we had got enough attention,
and then guess what, most of the labels, because of
my songwriter stuff, knew who I was and for whatever reasons.
If there was situations, which we did have, some they
didn't work out. But for the most proble like, let's
just push through, man, Let's push through and see what happens.

Speaker 4 (55:51):
And it worked out, man.

Speaker 5 (55:51):
I mean be honest with you.

Speaker 4 (55:54):
You sit here and there I had a master plan.

Speaker 2 (55:56):
I didn't.

Speaker 4 (55:56):
It just worked out.

Speaker 2 (55:58):
Really, And when you with your label Blue Soul, was
that like how did you assemble? I guess the team?
You know? Was it? You know you go to your
parents and say, hey, I need some help. Is it
just homies you worked with? Like? How did you work
those steps of figuring out what you needed as an
independent artist?

Speaker 4 (56:16):
The first part was the fans challenged me to take
it more serious.

Speaker 5 (56:19):
They wanted more music, and it was like, okay, if
we're gonna because I thought I was gonna put album
out and then just go back to songwriting and producing
for people, but they were like, we want more, we
want more. It was like, okay, how do we work
that out? The biggest difference. The first step was my
dad retired, and I remember it. He came into the
studio one time, and at that point I would do
like I would record all night, and then I might

(56:41):
go to the gym for like a couple of hours,
and then I would from like twelve to four, we
was just like packing CDs up and like just making
printing packages. And I would spend that time at the
post office. And then when I finished the post office,
say five o'clock, it was back recording from five to
four o'clock till I just couldn't stay up anymore.

Speaker 4 (57:01):
And I repeated.

Speaker 5 (57:01):
And my dad walked in one day when I was
like preparing stuff, he says, what you're doing here? I
was like, I got to ship all the stuff off,
like ship the CDs off, and he's like, you need help.

Speaker 4 (57:12):
That's how I was like, like you need to help
with that.

Speaker 5 (57:14):
And I was like, if you could take this as
a post office that that would be a lot of help,
and he was like, yeah, cool. So then I was
at that point I was like, okay, I can just
focus on music. And to be honest with you, you know
Jarell who has been one of my best friends.

Speaker 4 (57:27):
He has managed me off.

Speaker 5 (57:29):
You know, he's been around, and I think Jarell kind
of watched for a while and he was like, eventually
stepped in, was like, how you need help, let's whatever.
And then the rest of the truth he told. The
rest of it was like fans. I think sweet Locks
was around and she was around and was like, what
do you do? I like, hey, join me, let's you know.

(57:52):
It's like Select eventually joined on, Demo eventually joined on,
and she eventually joined on. It was really, I mean
and that mind you. I don't want to not evenly
think that they were.

Speaker 4 (58:02):
Just like fancyeah.

Speaker 5 (58:03):
It was more like these are people who also had
desires in the industry. They were around, and the more
we talked, it was like, well, I'm trying to do this,
what do you do?

Speaker 4 (58:12):
You know there's a mutual win here, there's a mutual win.
There's a mutual win.

Speaker 5 (58:17):
Like even uh, Demo, I think he was he sung
background for me on a show, like somebody linked me
up and he sung background. At that point, it was
a house band, show up whatever whatever, and then we
started picking up a band and I think he camera said,
if I show up to a show up to a show.
Can I do the gig? I was like yeah, sure, okay.

(58:37):
I was like, the next show in Toronto, candidate. He's like,
all right, cool, he was in Toronto. The next show
was in La. He was in La And the next
show is in Atlanta. He was in Atlanta. So now
I was like, how are you getting here? Like he's
a well you guy then figured this out. So now
I remember like, so can you get my band tickets
like that? He's like, yeah, yeah, do that. And that's
how he started booking. That's how he started. He started

(58:58):
like he's been like the row manager, the background saior
road manager ever since, you know. And I remember like
Aunt shea who now is a powerhouse in the booking
she's booking everybody shows. But I remember we were there's
probably six seven years ago. She was already in the staff.
She was rocking in the staff, But I need more
help in the booking area. Can someone move over? She

(59:19):
was like, I moved to booking. She probably already had
some insight on it, but then she she moved over
there and like just started rocking.

Speaker 4 (59:27):
So it was really just a community of people that were.

Speaker 5 (59:31):
Trying to grow, trying to be better, and I was
fortunate they joined up with me to join it with
my company. And it's great because now they have their
own businesses and their families and their own successes, but
yet can invest in Mind as well.

Speaker 4 (59:48):
So it's been great.

Speaker 5 (59:49):
The history, I mean, the history of just who's worked
for me, who's played for me, is probably one of
my proudest, proudest things.

Speaker 2 (59:57):
Like just Man Man, Yeah, Killers, Killers.

Speaker 4 (01:00:02):
I'm honored.

Speaker 2 (01:00:03):
I'm honored to see ye demo Man, Demo, I got
a shout out. I mean, just first off, I mean
your whole team. I mean, every time we've always traveled,
you know, it's always been love. It's always just been
you know you you just have amazing people around you.
And that was just a big lesson I think I
learned just from kind of touring with you and just
kind of seeing the way you built out your infrastructure

(01:00:24):
of just okay, like these are just like people that
he really fucked with and they just fuck with him,
you know what I mean, and they trust each other
and you know, Demo, I got a shout Demo out.
Demo saved my life one night. I was. It was
after we did bro, it was after we did Chicago,
we did Chicago, and I feel like this is around

(01:00:47):
the same time that, like my dad was done, like
all this shit is going on. But so it's after
the show and uh, and it's late and I'm just
in the lobby. I don't even I can't remember what
it was. I was even I was outside talking to something,
but I was just in the lobby. Demo shows up
with a bucket. Goddamn heralds. Let me tell you something, bro,

(01:01:10):
Demo show. He's just in a line with a bucket
of heralds. And I think he had his kids with
him that night. Yeah, And I was like, I said, yo,
I say yo, I say yo, Man, I said, you know,
I ain't try. I said, bro, Man, let me get
one of the wings.

Speaker 4 (01:01:22):
He said, oh no, Bro, I got you.

Speaker 2 (01:01:24):
Man. Come on, I got you man. He gave me
something to win. Bro, Listen, I said, you are the realist, dude,
like to part with heralds in Chicago. That is the sacrifice. Like, so,
say man, listened. I needed that wing right then. I
really needed it.

Speaker 5 (01:01:42):
But that's you know what a good guy like. I said, Man,
you know, and it's funny, you know. Now I'm a parent,
but I watched this guy's being a solid dad to
his kids, you know.

Speaker 4 (01:01:52):
What I mean?

Speaker 5 (01:01:52):
And you know, and I think he's a perfect example
of everybody has had to wear multiple hats on my
team and I love watching, like a venue manager or
promoter watch finish up negotiations with him and then watch
him go on stage shady jacket and get on stage
and then like sing. They're like, yo, it a minute.
Wasn't the same dude. It's like, but guess what we

(01:02:14):
all had to We all had to do. We all
had to wear different hats to make all this word,
you know what I mean. So so shout out to him,
mauch Yo, find Demo's music.

Speaker 4 (01:02:23):
You know you got a new album coming out in.

Speaker 5 (01:02:24):
The whole nine once again, like everybody, everybody is in
the team is working on something. And I'm honest, like
I said, I'm honored did they take time to bill
with me and that they're building their own stuff as well?

Speaker 2 (01:02:36):
Yo, yo yo, what up? This is Sponte fakelo. Listen,
stay tuned because Part two of my one on one
conversation with my big brother Eric Robson is coming next week.
We get even further into life things, some family stuff
to get into the recording process. I'm making them Ticulario.
We're getting all that good stuff, so check for us.

(01:02:57):
Next week is going down on Quest Lots springs, all right, Pasty.

Speaker 1 (01:03:10):
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