QLS Classic: Joi

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Of course, Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. This
classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora.

Speaker 2 (00:08):
What Up, QLs fam, It's like yam and This QLs
classic takes us back to a time when the whole
crew went to Los Angeles did a few interviews.

Speaker 3 (00:18):
Oh, but this one right here is special. I'm talking
about Joy.

Speaker 2 (00:22):
Yes, I'm taking you back to February fourteenth, twenty eighteen,
where we sat down with Joy, singer, songwriter, producer. She
talks about her debut album, how a Change, the direction
of Madonna's Bedtime Stories, working with Fishbone and her spart
in the Dungeon Family Treat, and so much more.

Speaker 3 (00:41):
Check this out.

Speaker 4 (00:52):
Supreme Suck Suck Supremo role called Suprema su su Supremo role,
Supremack Supremo role called.

Speaker 1 (01:04):
Suprema Suck Supreme. I just got me feeling pressure. Yeah,
I'm going insane. Yeah, No Joy, Frankie Beverly reference, Yeah, Sunshine.

Speaker 4 (01:16):
Supreme, Supremo road called Suprema Son Son, Suprema Road.

Speaker 5 (01:23):
Quants in the building. Yeah, y'all know what I'm about. Yeah,
I made a record with Joy.

Speaker 6 (01:29):
Yeah, in my house, Suprema roll Call Supremack Supreme road call.

Speaker 1 (01:39):
My name is Sugar Boy. I'm your boy boy. I
bring you joy boy, I bring you a joy.

Speaker 7 (01:47):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:50):
Supreme dumb so Supreme Role still is here. Yeah, I'm
trying to find a rhyme. Yeah, but I'm acid too,
like yah, yeah, because I ran out of time.

Speaker 4 (02:04):
Supremo Something Supremo, roll call Supreme something Supreme roll.

Speaker 2 (02:13):
Yeah, and I'm a little nervous. Yeah, motherfucking joy my
first rod girl.

Speaker 8 (02:18):
Crush Supremo, roll call, Supremo something Supremo roll.

Speaker 3 (02:27):
Sometimes they call me kitty yeah. Sometimes they call me
pussy yeah. Sometimes they call me sugar Yeah. But today
I'm gonna be.

Speaker 8 (02:34):
Joy Supremo, roll call, Supremo, Suppremeo, Role, Suprema something something Suppreme.

Speaker 3 (02:50):
My roll call.

Speaker 1 (02:55):
Wo Thank God that's.

Speaker 3 (02:58):
Free Styllar.

Speaker 1 (02:59):
I'm a little rusty on that.

Speaker 3 (03:01):
I'm awful.

Speaker 1 (03:02):
Yeah. You can tell it's been a minute.

Speaker 3 (03:04):
Black Dog. Everybody looking bad?

Speaker 1 (03:05):
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to another episode
of Quest Love Supreme. Uh, Quest Love and the House
We got Teams Supreme. Hello, people going, man, I was
about say have a New York I was like, no,
that's totally wrong. I don't know, you know it's gonna air,

(03:26):
but no, I'm good Man happy in La.

Speaker 5 (03:29):
Yeah, history monk, we have to say black history mon
something I think maybe I don't know what might be
Black history, might be March, who knows.

Speaker 1 (03:35):
And yeah, we we have to mention that we are
broadcasting line from the illustrious uh Westlake Audio Recording Studios.
Uh house. That the house that Michael Jaxon thriller money
built this house. Yeah, we're actually if you if you've
seen the Michael Jackson UH Bad twenty five documentary, we
are literally in the spot where like him and.

Speaker 2 (04:01):
Stevie and Gary, they said that's where he wrote the
piano was where Yeah.

Speaker 1 (04:06):
The piano, the girl's mind pianos behind us. I believe
that Bruce would Dean built this. This uh kind of
looks like a pyramid esque looking.

Speaker 8 (04:15):
Uh uh.

Speaker 1 (04:19):
You call what we're just you're engineers. It's a stage. Yeah, okay, well,
I mean you gotta come up more colorful. It's a
nice stage. That's it's sort of like a booth, but
sort of. It's very unusual. Anyway, watch the Bad twenty
five Incredible stage one of the best stages of h

(04:41):
but it's kind of cool to be here because even
well bad was recorded here. Young other things in the
uh the Atlantis, Moore said, helm jagged little pill. Wow,
what's done here? I'm I'm sure millions of a million
of things. We have a special guest with us today.
I will say that I could probably name three people
in history that kind of face the the the burden

(05:10):
of being way before their time from you know, Shuggio
is just one of those people. Betty Davis is definitely
one of those people. And I feel as though our
guest today is definitely so ahead of her time because
everything that she's ever done, other people have graciously walked

(05:34):
through joint well I mean, you know, I mean unfortunately
in life, some people have to pave the red carpet
or part to see for other people to walk through
effortlessly and sometimes never get the credit for it. Exactly.

Speaker 5 (05:49):
Somebody got inspired those bedtime stories exactly, so the greatest
machete carry of all time.

Speaker 1 (05:54):
Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome to the show. Jorge Gilly.

Speaker 3 (06:02):
Good to be here with you.

Speaker 1 (06:03):
I'm really glad you're here. You know, we we've been
for a long time, crossing paths and touring with each other.
But this, this is the conversation I've been dying to
have with you forever, because you know, I have so
many questions about your the path and the trail that

(06:24):
you blazed and and the after effects of it.

Speaker 3 (06:30):
Yeah, let's talk about it.

Speaker 1 (06:32):
Let's talk about I feel there's a.

Speaker 9 (06:37):
Police right, that's one of my favorite So where where?

Speaker 1 (06:51):
For our listeners that don't know where? Where are you?
Where were you born? Where are you from?

Speaker 3 (06:55):
I was born in Nashville, Tennessee.

Speaker 1 (06:58):
Hey, Nashville, that is where it? Because I thought you
were born. And I'm the king of assuming that our
guests are born in certain places. But you're not born
in Atlanta.

Speaker 3 (07:13):
Where did you think I was born?

Speaker 1 (07:14):
I thought you were born in Atlanta?

Speaker 3 (07:15):
Did you That's not a hard That's not bad though,
a lot of people think because I spent so much
time there.

Speaker 1 (07:21):
I guess Tennessee kitty, every Tennessee.

Speaker 3 (07:25):
You know. I was always Tennessee slim, all right? So
you you wrapped yourself, wrapped myself, but I wrapped you
know a time down also were born and raised that tense.

Speaker 1 (07:35):
You're born there? Okay? So what was what was your
childhood music environment?

Speaker 3 (07:40):
Like well, I uh, I had a pretty intensive love
affair with music early on. My mama had album she
had a friend and worked at a as a DJ

(08:00):
or something. My mom had a bunch of hustles when
I was growing up to uh that made me feel
like we were rich, even though we weren't. Hindsight looking back,
we were absolutely not rich. But my mom worked hard,
and I UH felt I had you know, things at
my at my access. And so my mom uh had
a DJ friend and had a bunch of albums and stuff,

(08:21):
and I would go through those albums and listen to 'em.
And when I was really really little and my parents
were still together, Daddy listened to a lot of Johnny
guitar watching and yes, and my daddy played UH pro
a while when I was little. So we had a
little w W you know, young your father was on
the stillness right, he was, oh he's quarterbackfather too. W

(08:46):
And my granddaddy was a very uh well respected uh
college football coach. He was he's in there in the
Hall of fame.

Speaker 1 (08:56):
Actually, when you were young, did you know that your
dad was, did you know who he was?

Speaker 3 (09:01):
Like?

Speaker 1 (09:01):
Did you know y'all kind of had it good.

Speaker 3 (09:04):
Well, we had it good as you know, that's relative relative.
I recognize. I knew that he was talented. I knew
that people uh respected him a lot. I knew that
he had done some great things.

Speaker 1 (09:18):
So he grew up in a football environment.

Speaker 3 (09:20):
I grew up in a football a heavy football environment, so.

Speaker 1 (09:23):
Like weekends were like holidays.

Speaker 3 (09:26):
And but my family is very woman heavy also. But
the men in my family, a lot of them played football,
worked in football, so it was just, you know, the
women embraced it as well. But I didn't have to
be all up in it if I didn't want to be.
But it was deeply entrenched in the culture of me

(09:48):
growing up, particularly HBCU football, because my grandfather was coach
at Tennessee State, Okay, and my dad was you know,
a star player at Tennessee State as well. So the
Gilliam Yeah, the weight of the Gilliam name in Tennessee
State was like a you know, it's a lot of weight.

Speaker 1 (10:07):
That meant something.

Speaker 3 (10:08):
Yeah, it meant something. Did after them, I went there
for a hot second, for a high second, I went
to Tennessee State a whole semester.

Speaker 1 (10:17):
Wow, you have a playing.

Speaker 3 (10:25):
And all of that is such a blur like I
barely even remember, but I don't want to neglect quest
asking me about the music, though, I don't want to
neglect that part. It was a lot of P funk
and a lot of LaBelle, and it was a M radio,
which back then kind of mixed blue eyes so and
uh and you know, uh root soul as well, and

(10:52):
so that was constantly you know, playing it was it was.
It was a constant diet of that. And my parents
were young, and so my mom would take me to
concerts with her. I saw The Mothership Land when I
was six, and because Solid Bell performed at War Memorial Auditorium.

Speaker 1 (11:10):
When just because of your your musical openness and all
the risks that you've taken and stuff, I was like, well,
certainly in your your formative years you had to have
adapted to this early. I mean there's some people that
like either you know, for beat makers, you know, they'll
start collecting records and then discover like their uncle's records

(11:32):
or something like that. But you know, I always felt
as though you might have gotten miss education super early.
Are you where do you fall in the sibling line?
Are you?

Speaker 3 (11:44):
I'm the oldest?

Speaker 1 (11:45):
Okay, then that's something weird because normally the youngest of
the brood gets the trickle down, and I'm.

Speaker 3 (11:52):
The oldest on some like, I was mostly an only child.

Speaker 1 (11:58):
It's weird no cousins to lots of big cousins.

Speaker 3 (12:02):
But I just I was always a little bit you're
just adventures, yeah, and a little bit different from my
other the things that interest me, which is different than
everybody else. Was kind of thinking about I don't know,
future and getting married and things like that, and I
was just thinking, how to, you know, just go deeper

(12:23):
into the funk and expand my mind.

Speaker 1 (12:30):
Querious, I knew it. Okay, that's what she's five days
from us. Yeah, but she was born like nineteen ninety.
She was one where I came out.

Speaker 3 (12:54):
Yeah, okay, but.

Speaker 1 (12:57):
Yeah, we'll just know, we'll go with it.

Speaker 3 (13:01):
But yeah, I just was a little bit different from
my cousins. But still not a not a not a
not a secluded or introverted or weird old kid per se.
But absolutely Yeah, but that developed a little more I
think later. I was a little more risk taking. Like
I remember smoking some cigarettes and ship at the house

(13:22):
when I was little, like six years old. Like my
cousin made me love some cigarettes there, like maybe I
smoked them and I don't know how I ended up
being able to even light it and do it, but
I remember them like finding me and being like, let
me tell your brother, smoke cloud coming out of my
mouth when I'm like six and I was in trouble
and even like with you know, just all of my

(13:42):
interactions were a little different growing up. I had two
boyfriends in kindergarten the same time. Yes, I mean, you
know what I mean, and fine with it. Yeah, he was,
you know what I mean. So there's that I just
I don't know, I was just but I got in
trouble for because we were you know kind of uh,

(14:04):
I was just ahead of the curve. There was certain
things that are like natural explorations for little people that
all little people do, but I think my understanding of
them as a little person was much keener. And I
think because it was much keener I had, I recognized
that it wasn't as keen for everybody else, and I
think that kind of made me realize you might be

(14:24):
a little different. So, you know, in any interaction, no
matter what it was, you know, it was just a
little bit here with it and everybody else might have
been kind of like right there, so then I would
try to kind of backpale and kind of be back
there everybody else. But that didn't you know that only way?

Speaker 1 (14:39):
How did you express it? Like work? Did you have
bands in high school or that sort of thing.

Speaker 3 (14:45):
I didn't do that, but I did sing in high school.
So I was, you know, doing some challenge shows and
won some challenge shows and was a dancer for like
thirteen years to when your family know you could sing.
When I was little little, probably like maybe four or five,
my grandmother used to belong to a lady social group

(15:06):
called the Beautiful Lily.

Speaker 1 (15:09):
That is so black and something.

Speaker 3 (15:15):
I just lovely ladies. They bring you know, it's popla.
They bring a dish. They played Pikino and Vinga and
uh and I remember singing you Light of My Life
for them.

Speaker 1 (15:30):
Something. That song was number one for like one hundred weeks.
Wait speaking which you Okay, if you ever get the chance,
Jimmy cast A Bunch has Yeah, if you want to
see if you can see Fante's eyebrows like just the gun,
Jimmy cases that Jimmy cast Bunch has a one of

(15:53):
the most jaw dropping versions of you light Up My Life.
That's hilarious, like in a bad way, like it's it's,
it's it's in a very good and terrible Brandy Watson
with the saxophone too, because saxophone, saxophone. You gotta pet

(16:13):
You Light on My Life by the Jimmy Cast a
Bunch produced by Billy Davis Jr. I'm thinking that was
That's what I was thinking.

Speaker 5 (16:28):
Dimension I sang you light Up My Life in third
grade to to win this girl's heart, like I stood
up and find everybody and sang that and and stole
her away from the souther.

Speaker 1 (16:38):
It works, It really worked. Yet sound wait second or
third grade something? Oh my god, forgive me okay, see you.
That's the piano from I don't believe it. Just make no,
that's true. That's the.

Speaker 3 (16:58):
Line.

Speaker 1 (16:58):
I don't believe it is from now And that's the
never mind. That's the piano there is that damn quick
quest love Supreme. Yeah you're a nerd? Yeah hell now
get ready. Maybe I didn't warn you.

Speaker 3 (17:13):
About this before, no warning, but I figured it would
have to be if it was y'all two together, because
I'm familiar with your nerd and I'm familiar with quest nerds,
and I figured this, Yeah, I think it was gonna be.

Speaker 1 (17:25):
We used the exelon you know, I sang in my
life in third grade nerd know there's nerd geek and
I love it. So you So you didn't have any bands.

Speaker 3 (17:43):
Or anything, so not bands.

Speaker 7 (17:44):
No.

Speaker 3 (17:44):
I worked with after winning the Talent show and because
I was in tenth grade and I sung everything must change,
oh of course, and then I also now here's a.

Speaker 1 (17:55):
Fun Apollo classic everything.

Speaker 3 (17:59):
With my The pianists that accompanied me was Gary Jenkins,
who was a little g from Silk Yeah.

Speaker 1 (18:08):
Wow, and.

Speaker 3 (18:11):
He went to Tennessee set. He's an amazing piano player,
like ridiculous, and he used to do all the funerals
and wits and saying people's churches and you know, all
of that stuff around Nashville because he's from Nashville too,
and uh, and so he was my accompanyment and he
and I do edit. Uh. We started off with Nobody

(18:33):
Loves Me Like you Do, and then we segued into
everything wow and I want to tell the show. But
after that I started working with some producers in Nashville
and got in the studio. So that was when first
when I first went to the studio, I guess I
was about sixteen.

Speaker 1 (18:48):
You know, I know that Nashville is in music city
but also primarily known as a kind of a country
country music. Yeah, but I know that songwriters down there
is Is there any sort of at least when I
say urban, I mean like to the to the sort
of cosmic funk level that you're on and that you

(19:08):
brought to the Atlantic community. Was there any of that
sort of culture in Tennessee at all?

Speaker 3 (19:13):
Not really, But I also feel like Nashville was a
place that was sort of ripe for getting whatever you
wanted to get. There were things lots and lots of
lots and lots of cultural diversity that came artistic cultural
diversity that came through Nashville back then. So my mom,
because I was, you know, a dancer and I enjoyed

(19:34):
theater and I sang and stuff, my mom always had
me very plugged into all the stuff that was happening
in the city. So it's really more so a blend
of all of what I was, you know, being exposed
to at the time. Lots of theater, lots of dance,
and lots of you know, music by my choosing by
my own hand and whatever was on AM radio at

(19:56):
the time. But in terms of a scene like you're
talking about, no, that wasn't happening.

Speaker 1 (20:02):
What was it that got you into dance? How did
you I just was.

Speaker 3 (20:06):
Always dancing and shit when I was little, and my
mom put me in in la that's what mama's doing.

Speaker 1 (20:12):
Yeah, okay.

Speaker 3 (20:12):
And she also felt like I was a little clumsy
when I was little, and when I was very small,
she thought I was clumsy, and so she wanted me
to be graceful, and so she put me in That's
what she said.

Speaker 2 (20:24):
She didn't do the combo, the ballet, jazz tap, I
did that.

Speaker 3 (20:27):
That came later, but the root of it, it started
with ballet. The jazz and all that came once she
really saw that I had taken to the dance, okay.
And so probably in about maybe third grade, I started
taking like modern and jazz and tap and all that.
But from like little girl, like three years old to
like sixteen, I was like ballet with some jazz and

(20:47):
tap and stuff, you know, mixed in.

Speaker 1 (20:50):
So when did you leave Tennessee?

Speaker 3 (20:52):
I left Nashville, I guess technically I left when I
went to Memphis State in eighty nine, but still kind
of coming back and forth because I also went to
Tennessee State, like I said, for a semester. I guess
I was officially left Nashville probably in let's say ninety three.
Officially ninety two, ninety three.

Speaker 1 (21:12):
Oh man, but wait that was the year year, now, Pendlum,
I was ninety ninety four.

Speaker 3 (21:18):
Pen Bob came out. I think it dropped in ninety four,
but in ninety three. I think that's how that worked.
I was working on it in ninety three, Okay, So
I moved to Atlanta like top of ninety three, and
like by that summer I was working on Penmambot.

Speaker 1 (21:34):
Wow, So why, well, I want to go. Why what
drew you to Atlanta? Why would you?

Speaker 10 (21:40):
Now?

Speaker 3 (21:41):
In ninety two, Dallas Austin came to Nashville, Okay, and
he was working on at that time, Holland Placed Monsters. Yeah. Yeah,
And so TLC was just like bubbling, like just going kaboom.
ABC was doing their thing and stuff. And so I
ended up meeting him at a studio there and we
hit it off instantly. I told him I was a songwriter.

(22:04):
I didn't say singer, cause I thought songwriter was just
more I'm serious about my shit, right, and uh, and
I played on some of my little songs on a
little demo tape and shit, one of which was Narcisse
Acuity Pie at the time, and some other stuff that
was on there, and we just hit it off, and

(22:24):
I knew that he was from Atlanta, and we stayed
in touch, and he was like, I'm really gonna be
hitting you up so we can do some stuff, and
I was kind of like whatever, And and then I
just knew that it was time for me to do
something different and leave Nashville, cause I was just down there,
kind of pilled a post, kind of hustling, feeling real
out of place, having like all these you know, grandiose

(22:46):
ideas and dreams for myself, but knew that they weren't
gonna be realized and in Nashville. So I left and
then my girlfriend went to Atlanta, and uh, I kind
of went down there with nothing and just never came
Where was.

Speaker 2 (23:01):
Your first place in Atlanta, I'm just curious.

Speaker 3 (23:03):
I lived in a place called Peachtree Hills. Well, that
was the first place by myself. That was after I
got a record deal. But me and the girlfriend that
I moved down there with, and Martin Luther. I don't
know if I lived there, of course. And that's the
brother Trey rab And, who's my boyfriend at the time,

(23:25):
and then two other sisters, seven of us, and we
lived in this apartment on Beuvah Highway. Yeah, Highway club.

Speaker 1 (23:35):
You know what, wait, Highway strip club.

Speaker 3 (23:43):
They call it.

Speaker 1 (23:45):
It's a street that's called the truck stop, the street from.

Speaker 3 (23:53):
The stop though in l right the hell yeah.

Speaker 1 (23:56):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (23:56):
Flame is definitely still open go club, of course, not
it's a regular club, just regular at this point.

Speaker 2 (24:06):
It's Atlanta, honey, just step off the plane.

Speaker 3 (24:10):
But we all lived together, yeah, in Temple Hallmark.

Speaker 1 (24:12):
So wow, that's great.

Speaker 10 (24:14):
Seven.

Speaker 3 (24:15):
Yeah. That was at the top of ninety three. And
so then I remember breaking up with the guy that
I was loving so at that time and feeling so heartbroken,
and I was just like, this is the worst thing
could ever happen. I must be about to get a
record deal, because if this is the worst, the best

(24:38):
thing that could happen would be there. I would get
a record deal. And probably about a month, probably about
a month later, I got a call from Dallas and
he asked me comes to the studio and he was like,
come right with me whenever they played a few songs,
one of which will be fine me and one of
which would be Sunshine right. And I just wrote to

(25:02):
him and of course I'm still there as a writer,
not as a as an artist per se a singer.
You know, I'm still just kind of wanting to do that.
But then after we heard how the tune sounded, he
was just like, don't you want to do this? And
it's just kind of like, yeah, I guess I do.

(25:25):
You know, we listened to Sunshine and Rain probably and
I'm not exaggerating, we probably listened to that probably fifty
times right to just over and over and over and
over and over after it was done. And that's what
kind of both let us know, like, yeah, we need
to move forward on this. This is something kind of else.

Speaker 1 (25:50):
So was there was there any direct planning, because I
mean there's really I mean, it's kind of up in
the air on who who planted the flag first. But
I mean, you definitely weren't under the current status quo
of what music from Atlanta was supposed to be. I mean,

(26:16):
you weren't in a tlc umbrella, nor were you under
Brownstone or so. Yeah, And I felt like and I
could tell when someone's like trying hard to be contrary,
like you know, just you know, where everything is well
thought out and well plotted to. But it didn't feel

(26:37):
like that to me when I heard it. It was
like I knew it was different, but I couldn't I
couldn't quite call it. So, I mean, what was it
just a planning?

Speaker 3 (26:48):
Like there wasn't any planning none. We just did it
and we did it in about two months.

Speaker 1 (26:57):
Yeah. Yeah, so at the time Dallas called you the work,
you hadn't signed the deal to.

Speaker 3 (27:06):
I signed the deal with through him, Okay, that came
with him, Yeah, because I was signed to him as
an artist under under actually under Limp, which was.

Speaker 1 (27:19):
Rowdy was through I mean he had Rowdy.

Speaker 3 (27:23):
Was on Arista though, and then Limp was on am I.
It was me and Shades of Lingo, maybe one other somebody,
maybe one other person, but one of the act. But yeah,
we were the only ones that were at am I.
But there was no plan like, there was no The
only prerequisite that I had was I wanted live instruments.

(27:48):
That was the only thing I came And I was
like every you know, you're well known for you know,
your beat, these R and B beats and stuff, But
that's not what I do. That doesn't really resonate with me.
It's cool, but for what I want to do, I
need the ship to be live, and if it's not live,
it needs to be freaked in some sort of way
that it's something.

Speaker 5 (28:06):
He was like, Hell, yeah, well, I was gonna ask
just the question I always had, how do y'all sell
that record?

Speaker 3 (28:15):
Like?

Speaker 1 (28:15):
What was it like taking it to am I? Because
even now, I mean twenty plus years.

Speaker 5 (28:20):
After this release, it sounds like nothing else, like it
still is in the league of his own, So like,
how do you sell that in ninety four?

Speaker 3 (28:28):
In ninety four impossibly? You know, you could go at
the meetings that I had at the labels, everybody was like, Wow,
shit is fucking great. How do we sell it?

Speaker 1 (28:41):
Gary Gary, Gary Harris.

Speaker 3 (28:46):
Gary Harris was I don't even remember. Damn, I don't
even remember what department Gary worked then back then. Gary,
But Gary wasn't Dave. Gossip was my an.

Speaker 5 (28:59):
I got got gossip demos? Yeah, because they've s mister
mister Dave right, that's no, no, no, no, no, no, No,
that's something that somebody different.

Speaker 3 (29:12):
Dave Gossip was my Dave. And at that time Dave
had maybe maybe he done and from maybe like Zanella
Ice or somebody at the time, and like a few
other people, and he had and on some big projects
Black Sheep, Black Sheep, he did.

Speaker 1 (29:26):
He signed Gossip signed the Roots to Mercury.

Speaker 3 (29:32):
I never knew.

Speaker 5 (29:33):
Oh wow, when I didn't know that, Yeah, and the
contract had they misspelled all our names on the contract
so made it nol and void in that seventy two
hour period. That's I guess that they were making a
new contract for us. Geffen came in the last minute,
like and so we went to Geffen instead, And Dave
Gossip never talked to me.

Speaker 3 (29:56):
Well, Dave was good to me while I was there,
but Dave was so I just remember. What I remember
about Dave most is that the fact that Pendulum Vibe
did not get his proper shot and its fair shape
for how much he put into it, it really broke

(30:19):
his motherfucking heart. It broke his heart to the point
where he did step away music.

Speaker 1 (30:24):
Yeah wow, i'n't heard from after that.

Speaker 3 (30:27):
He was just like, I can't even like fuck all
this shit you know, now, Gods has just been chilling living,
you know, a cool civilian life as I call it,
civilian life. You stepp away from this shit. And I
love him to this day because he wrote really hard
for him. We were just kind of all we didn't
realize that there would be a machine to contend with.

(30:49):
I know, I didn't. I just thought that I'm doing
some shit. I recognized that ain't nobody doing what I'm doing?
What could be so hard about selling it? Like, isn't it?
What's what's the hard sale? If you put something in
front of someone, if it's great and if they've not
seen it before, won't they instantly be enamored with it

(31:10):
and curious about it? And won't it Like ain't that
how to fuck it go? And then I remember saying,
you know, will put me on the road, Just put
me on the road. I want to perform. Put me
on the road. If you put me on the road,
the people will come.

Speaker 1 (31:24):
They wouldn't do that, Ah, they wouldn't give you to
a support.

Speaker 3 (31:26):
They wouldn't get me to support. They were like, no,
we're going to really try to push it right, And
here we are in nineteen ninety four, they're trying to
push Sunshine in the fucking run up against Brownstone and
come on, And I remember very clearly them saying to
me too, if this was just a little bit more
like what's the four one one?

Speaker 2 (31:44):
That's not about to ask you who were the contemporaries
at the time marriage, So what's the fore woman was
like super huge and everybody fucking love included let.

Speaker 1 (31:52):
That out, me, let me ask who. Because they always
do this. It's usually like we're coming on a Monday
and they'll be like, all right, sit on the couch, guys,
I'm gonna play some remixes, just some ideas and see
if you guys like it, and then it'll be like twelve.
There's so many distortion and static remixes, like twelve of
them that never made it to the light of day.

(32:12):
So like, who were they trying to match you with? Like, oh,
let Eric Satin remix your thing.

Speaker 3 (32:17):
Or well, because Dallas was there, they weren't really doing
a lot of that. They were just kind of because
he had the magic touch at that time, so they
weren't really doing that. They were he was really trying
to push it. From a standpoint of y'all gotta trust
me on this like we got it, like I'm telling
you this is you know, and they just weren't. They
couldn't understand how to do it. And you know, it

(32:40):
wasn't really about like cause it was several you know,
rock bands that I was on the label with, all
of them had to support, all of them was out
on the road. They was just fucking getting started. I
didn't understand why I couldn't hand on to a support
and why I could go on the road. Why it
wasn't important for me to build my fan base like that,
And it just wasn't looked at for it wasn't looked

(33:01):
at like that. By then, the death of the black
Band had really kind of already you know, occurred, except
for just these few concrete roses like your Condition and
men Conditioned and Tony Tony Tony, Like the black Band
had been reduced. It had been it was done. So
the idea of that even at that time, and they
were like, if you go out and you do shows

(33:23):
with dad, and I was like, a dad, you ain't
performing on no fucking dad. I mean a band, you know,
my band that I have. But at that time too,
I was rolling with a larger band and Dallas was
on keys and Colin was on but that was later,
that was after, but that was later. Like when Pendulum Vibe,

(33:44):
it was like Dallas and Colin Wolf and it.

Speaker 1 (33:47):
Was that's crazy, like the job machine, but I got it.

Speaker 3 (34:00):
That's what Yeah, this is what I want to do,
you know. And that's kind of been also that's been
a lovely bright spot over the course of my career
is that people do like to come and work with
me when they want to make a departure from kind
of what they're used to doing. Or they'll bring me
in and be like I want you on what I
do and I'm like, fine, you know I can do

(34:21):
that too. But a lot of people will come and
be like, I want to do some different shit, don't
want to work with you.

Speaker 10 (34:25):
And I like that.

Speaker 3 (34:26):
I like to be I like to be that haven
for people. I'm cool with that. But anyways, Doubts and
them were in the band. It was about probably about
eight of us at the time, and that just won't
on work at three backgrounds things, they won't gonna pay
all that shit. Yeah, at the time of us, because
it just it had to be the fullness of the
sound at that time, I hadn't tapped into my I

(34:49):
hadn't tapped into being able to feel comfortable enough with
something more stripped down. I figured that out by the
second album. Once I started working on Me but Cleansing
Syndrome with Fishbone, and even though it was a lot
of them in the band, I had more. I was
able to zero in more on rhythm section and what

(35:11):
that meant. So I was able to zero in on
that drum that bassed that guitar, and and and and
get from that what I needed. And so for a
number of years I saw all I toured with was
just drums, bass, guitar, and it was just super fucking rocking,
you know. And then that became more of a home
place for me to the point where I really didn't

(35:33):
want to too tough with nothing out side of that,
you know, particular setup.

Speaker 1 (35:37):
What was ahead? Oh h, what was the transition? So
after penzum Vi Drop and then you started working on
Me but Clean, there's a stop in between again we
got to ask about freedom. We didn't got to talk
about the impact that pendulum vipad on a certain to
get going to get the match, but I'm wanted to

(35:58):
get freedom first and then get the match. Okay, So
could you talk about the the Freedom project.

Speaker 3 (36:04):
Sure, Freedom came about from apparently uh uh the people
from from Panther the film at the time. Uh, I
guess maybe Polydor it was.

Speaker 1 (36:22):
It was probably back with.

Speaker 3 (36:29):
Polly Ground heard Freedom on the Whole Music when they
were calling up to the studio to talk to Dallas.
And when they heard it on the on the Whole music,
this is what I was told she could be at.
Sounds really great. It's a story. They heard it on

(36:50):
the Whole Music and decided that they want that's what
they wanted to use for the soundtrack. And then they
had this idea that they would, you know, bring in
every black female artist that was working in R and

(37:11):
B at the time. It was the will It was
like the female you will know, right and jeez, everybody
was there. But when I got that call that's what
they wanted to do, and that all those women were
going to be on there, artists remember being like, oh,
like this is incredible, you know, and then it was

(37:32):
like breathing some more life into Pendulum vibe. It was
like a good consolation for how heartbreaking it was, you know,
for to have not done what I thought it was
gonna do and for it to not have been accepted
the way I really thought that it would be accepted
and stuff, And so it it shed another light for

(37:56):
me on kind of what it means to have like
critical acclaim because I didn't really understand that concept at
the time either. But doing that let me know. Because
then people, the ladies, that was a really powerful experience
because all those ladies you know that I met that day,

(38:16):
I still have, you know, a tremendous amount of respect
for you know, and they still have a tremendous amount
of respect for me. And some of them have gone on,
you know to as sind to you know, crazy commercial
successful heights.

Speaker 2 (38:30):
But it's never been another moment like that since with
a group of black female singers, I don't female.

Speaker 1 (38:34):
Do they have a title for it? Like like Black
Men United? Was that?

Speaker 3 (38:38):
You won't know, right?

Speaker 1 (38:40):
What was the female version of it?

Speaker 3 (38:42):
You know what?

Speaker 1 (38:42):
It was?

Speaker 3 (38:43):
Various various artists.

Speaker 1 (38:49):
You'd be looking for Africa?

Speaker 3 (38:53):
Should that say various?

Speaker 5 (38:55):
And then so I remember you tell me so the
sweet Honey in the Rock thing you got? Oh I didn't,
I didn't even know. I thought it was your song.

Speaker 1 (39:02):
I didn't know.

Speaker 3 (39:03):
It was oh another heartbreak. So yeah, that was that.
Blessed my little heart sister, just baby, just out there
trying to sing something she ain't knowing nothing about, no
logistics going on, and she just get right. So my
album So Pendulum Vibe opened up with I'm Gonna Stand.
I saw Sweet Honey. My mom took me to see

(39:24):
Sweet Honey in the Rock at Fish Chapel when I
was in seventh grade, and it changed my life. And
I decided from that point professionally, when I would do music, whatever,
whatever project I came out with, first Sweet Honey in
the Rock, something by Sweet Honey in the Rock would
be the first thing that I would have on my records.

(39:45):
I would cover it in some way. So once I
got once I you know, got the deal and started
making a I was like, I'm gonna put I'm gonna
stand on this record, and I had it cleared m
I cleared it for Pendle. But again, hearing PolyGram, hearing

(40:06):
the ship on the whole music, they're thinking they had
no They're just thinking it's mine, right, so they weren't
even using it initially. There ended up being so many
women on the song that they didn't have enough room
to do features for all the artists, and so that's

(40:26):
how they decided, well, we're just gonna add that beginning
part to the song. God, And how the fuck am
I supposed to know if the people at PolyGram like
got their paperwork shit together and got clearance from Sweet
Honey in the Rock? What turns out they never got clearance.
Nobody fucking got Clarence and Bernie's Johnson Riggans suit. But
what does it have to do with you personally?

Speaker 1 (40:46):
Though?

Speaker 3 (40:47):
I was just because I was a writer, I'm named
in the suit.

Speaker 1 (40:51):
So basically they took the interloew that was before freedom
Right and.

Speaker 3 (40:58):
So so for the for the optic, for the video
and for the other Because who ended up being on
the beginning of that Vanessa Williams in Vogue maybe you know,
it was like all these profiles you know at the
time like super duper, but I ended up guesso, And

(41:20):
man it hurt my fucking feelings and it was just
so unfair. It's just like, how does that happen? How
do I have to take the fucking hit for this ship?

Speaker 2 (41:29):
Like I had to do with that?

Speaker 1 (41:31):
I didn't, I didn't, you know, did you get a
chance to talk to.

Speaker 3 (41:35):
Her, Miss Bernie. I did not, And she's a fantastic,
awesome daughter to uh Toshi who's badass musician and uh
huh Reagan that's doctor that's doctor Reagan's and I don't know,

(41:56):
and I have a lot of mutual mutual sister friends,
but even she I've never met in person. But I
remember kind of trying to do a read to doctor
Rigan back in the day and she was like, Oh.

Speaker 2 (42:11):
That's a family. Maybe he could bring y'all together.

Speaker 1 (42:18):
For twenty eighteen. Can you not throw me under the
bus or my own show, please? She is the one
that's the cousin. There's a cousin of mine in the group.
I don't even know. I haven't met her either. Don't
put that gun away, please, But.

Speaker 3 (42:42):
I just always figured that it would. You know, she
got to know by now that the child didn't hand
nothing to do with that ship. I know she knows,
and I just, you know, I kind of charged it
to the game. I was like, I know, I'll be
able to meet doctor Riggan one day and it'll be
all good.

Speaker 1 (42:55):
Wow, I'm sorry that happened. Yea up, since this is
gonna be a lot of those stories. So let's just
go for it. Get the clean next, all right?

Speaker 5 (43:12):
Oh yeah, I was just gonna how did Madonna find
out about the Pendulum Vibe?

Speaker 3 (43:21):
Probably because.

Speaker 1 (43:26):
She was working with my guess this guy.

Speaker 3 (43:29):
I'm sorry, oh Siri that it could be.

Speaker 1 (43:31):
That guy is always her hearge of the street.

Speaker 3 (43:34):
It could be. And I'll say this too, I think
any people of that particular ILK at that time knew
who I was because the first person that reached out
to me, that was fucking with me was Lenny Grab
It makes sense, which is how Han Dallas ended up.
Ah okay, But but Lenny reached out like, you know,

(43:55):
who is this? What is the sunshine in the rain?
Who is this girl? I want to meet her? I
want to meet her, you know, And he called the
record label, found me, invited me like out with he
and his friends, and I just remember being like, well, fuck,
what's y'all?

Speaker 1 (44:14):
Kind of label meets you're up?

Speaker 3 (44:17):
Virgin virgin big old umbrella back then is kind of Yeah,
it wasn't too hard, not too much of a stretch,
but you know, it's just a little old meat and
then a gravitz, you know. And that was fun and
it was great to be like acknowledged and great to
be you know, uh you know acknowledged, you know, scene

(44:45):
for my craft, and I think through him, I think
he kind of let a lot of people know, yeah,
about what was what was happening at that time, and
then Madonna would end up reaching out for Dallas to
produce bad time stories.

Speaker 10 (45:03):
Oh damn, I want to know.

Speaker 1 (45:13):
Damn No, I'm just saying now it makes sense because
even with I'm Not Sorry Human Nature, I was like, yo,
that's I feel.

Speaker 3 (45:24):
Like she definitely, you know, heard the album and definitely
loved it, and they definitely had to go back into
a little restructuring.

Speaker 1 (45:37):
But she ended up helping you out. Though it wasn't
like beef an.

Speaker 3 (45:43):
Now that motherfucker that made a phone called Steven Mozil
and I've got the Calvin Klein campaign. I'm not she
was cold. I never had any issues. She was actually fair,
very cool, Like you know the times that she.

Speaker 2 (46:03):
Actually mentioned one day, like doing a show together, because
the thing is interesting because it's like, yes, that's great,
you're modeling, not singing.

Speaker 1 (46:16):
We're also a Maverick associate. I just remember that myself, So.

Speaker 9 (46:22):
Okay, cool, We're not.

Speaker 1 (46:25):
Trying to throw salt on the game.

Speaker 3 (46:27):
I just know that was real. That was Madonna. I
see your game. I picked it just.

Speaker 1 (46:31):
They often retweet our shows out appreciate it.

Speaker 3 (46:36):
Singing out there, so if you love them. But no,
she didn't reach out on any tip like that. I
don't know that anybody ever reached out, you.

Speaker 1 (46:44):
Know what, not that we could afford to do anything
with you at the time, but definitely Gary was saying that, uh,
you were someone that we should work with. I mean
just at the time, I'll say, before we realized what
had to happen. And also you two found your own
family tree with the Dungeon family, like when you're alone,

(47:08):
I realized that you need a group of people. You
basically need five to seven people that do what you
do and be in a community. So well, I mean
I guess that's what you were basically going with Fishbone
with the problem. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (47:23):
I did more so with them, I think than than Yeah,
like did I definitely did that with them. And I
would collaborate with DF you know, and I would go
on the road with them, not as joy though not
as an untry. I would go you know, as music
director or go as singing backs or go as you know,

(47:46):
doing things of that nature. When Goodie first went out
a little bit later on, I would do that music
direction and stuff for them because Lo and I just
had kind of a we knew it each other, like right,
and I could, you know, get the shit together and
make sure everything was good for them. But not as
a joy entity. No, always in a in a more

(48:07):
of a supporting kind of grow you know, which is fine,
you know which is whatever, because I would still do
my own shit, you know, whenever I would do my
own shit.

Speaker 1 (48:24):
So I gotta ask in the most diplomatic way possible. Yes,
because we have a lot of mutual people in common.
Yes we do, but you but you and I also
have a lot of experiences in common. And I'll say
that even with whatever my weird journey is in music,
I always still felt like the bride's maid and never

(48:45):
the bride. And there is no feeling like the feeling
of you thinking, Okay, this is gonna be the moment,
that's gonna be the always in January like this is
gonna be okay, this is the year we're gonna get together.

Speaker 3 (48:58):
And then.

Speaker 1 (49:01):
Yeah, you You're like all right, cool, cool, next year,
just keep working, but how I would like to know.
And again I'm not I've never on this used the
show as a gotcha journalism or that sort of thing.
But you are literally one of the people of my

(49:23):
contemporaries that I could possibly think has had the same
sort of tortoise in the hair journey. Sure, So what
is that feeling with once the year start to develop
and suddenly people are open to alternative ways of seeing

(49:44):
R and B and I'll say your name with Erica
and everything and you not getting your turn, like, how
do you well? I've sad tears over many of Rolling
Stone cover. I've had panic attacks. Sure, I've thrown many
a coffee mug at you know, I get it, So Steve,

(50:09):
damn that mix. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (50:12):
So here's the thing. One thing I've been pretty blessed
with is the ability, like I like when we in
the beginning of this interview, when I told you from
very little i've known, my shit ain't like everybody else's shit.
So the journey is not like everybody else's so if

(50:33):
and I mean, and I really really realized that early on.
So I and another thing that I don't do, and
which is probably why I've been able to keep a
lout of my zen and my sanity and check is
that I don't do a lot of I'm not a
I'm not a comparer. I don't compare myself to other people.

(50:55):
I don't compare what I have going on in my
life or what they have going on in their life.
Just don't do it. And this is from the jump
of your life. This is from my life. This is
not me as an artist, This is me as a
human being.

Speaker 2 (51:06):
Because when we started this conversation, you said something to
me that was very ill for somebody that was your age.
You said that when old boy broke up with you,
it was one of the saddest parts of your life.
But you knew that you were about to get a
record deal.

Speaker 3 (51:15):
It was already clear on what balance what checks a
lot of people.

Speaker 2 (51:18):
It takes some books, some spiritual learning, some things, you know,
to really realize that moment.

Speaker 3 (51:23):
No no, no book has taught me my Nothing has
taught me better than my experience and my living and
my making it through. For what keeps you saying and balanced,
Because what keeps me saying in balance is that I'm
still hearing. I know I got shit to do. That's
what keeps me saying ballence, that's I believe you know
what it is, quess here it is in a nutshell genuinely.

(51:46):
I believe my best work is in front of me, genuinely.
So if I didn't believe that, then I could be
mad and I could be like, well, fuck so and
so and so and so got dawn had my goddamn
shoes on at one time, and so goddamn had this,
and so and so sound like me on that and
that bitch, No, she got damn sample that doesn't even
know he got down there. No, my contemporary my peers

(52:09):
get mad like that about certain shit, and I have
to calm them there, like why y'all, I mean, but
why are y'all so hell being on comparing me to
the next motherfucker? Why are you so hell bent on that?

Speaker 1 (52:19):
It's not because they're projecting the projecting and it's not
what it is.

Speaker 3 (52:23):
I'm with it. If I did not believe that my
best work and my my finest, finest self was not
in front of me. If I didn't believe that, then
I wouldn't be fucking doing it. And it's literally that simple.
It don't mean the shit don't hurt or don't you know,

(52:46):
it doesn't mean that I'm not affected by those things.
It just means that I'm rooted in something that anchors
me outside of all the external noise.

Speaker 1 (52:56):
How fast did it take you to realize that?

Speaker 6 (52:58):
For me?

Speaker 1 (52:59):
Like, I'll be honest with you last year, I'm really
truly not lying to you. I'm not lying to you,
and I'm not I'm not even saying to the point
where it's like, oh, I had to watch all my
contemporaries fall or break breakup or that sort of thing.
But you know, even though like I still don't know

(53:23):
where this place is where, it's like, Okay, I get
to write books and teach class and do a radio show.
But I definitely feel like I knew that my biggest
fear starting in nineteen ninety two was whether or not
I'd still be here in nineteen ninety nine. That was
like some super future shit. And I'm not even talking
about like two thousand and five or twenty fifteen or

(53:45):
even twenty twenty five.

Speaker 5 (53:47):
But you know, I know four years is a rap career,
Like I mean, that's it's is like high school, like
literally you got four years to get your money and
then after that it's kind of like.

Speaker 1 (53:59):
You know, I think I came to the conclusion that
if Tarika and I really got what we wish for,
you know along the way, you know whatever, like the
Bentley or whatever, right, we would have been assholes and dead.

Speaker 3 (54:13):
I would have been dead.

Speaker 1 (54:14):
Yeah, we would have been assholes.

Speaker 3 (54:17):
Like inside with way way too free, way too well.
I would do because I'm a creature of desire, I
do what the funk I want to do, so and
because I'm that way, I would have just ain't what
the rigie he says that I couldn't have Yeah, I
couldn't have had it like that it had.

Speaker 1 (54:34):
Like one hundred million units. But you know he was
saying like he was saying like the question is like,
you know, can you survive your success? That's the thing,
Like you can whatever because whatever it is you're into,
if it's girls, if it's dope, if it's whatever, you're
gonna get all of that that's dope, all the dope,
all the holes, all the cars, whatever it is into.

Speaker 5 (54:51):
So with success, the question becomes can you survive it?
And if you get it too early? You know, that's
why allow of people.

Speaker 3 (54:58):
Don't nothin I I agree, I would have. I definitely did.
The road had to be temper I just I really
look at it because now where I am in my
life now, you know, shit, some people be looking at
me like a damn shaman at this point, you know

(55:21):
what I'm saying. And my friends who uh you know,
do have to be under the lights, you know all
the time, you know, can find you know, some comfort
and being able to come and sit with me or
talk to me and to to to get grounded, you know,

(55:42):
and where they are, and and to have and to
to to gain some clarity about where they are. So
kind of what ended up happening as a result of
all these experiences and me having to process and digest
all these different things that have happened to me in career,
things I've seen, whatever's really turned me into an a
one fucking therapist without the doctorate, but a one like

(56:08):
a fucking one like really really, I was about to say,
please you did not want to share that info? Please
do And and that's the kind of book where I could,
But you can't touch everybody.

Speaker 1 (56:23):
It's a different audio.

Speaker 3 (56:26):
I need something.

Speaker 2 (56:27):
I need something for the everyday man, because that which
you that's some Yeah, it's major.

Speaker 3 (56:31):
It's like metal, human and ship. You're talking. Yeah, it's
just and that's and those are things that I'm you know,
those are journeys I have to to to get suited
up for with being able to put things into books
and do things like that. Because my mom, I'm so like,
just come see me. Yeah, come see me and sit

(56:53):
on my like you know what I'm saying, like a book,
a seminar.

Speaker 2 (56:58):
Okay, I was thinking about everybody else, but I'll come
over your house everybody else.

Speaker 1 (57:03):
I'm just like we're sending to your house.

Speaker 3 (57:09):
About the Tears was about a month.

Speaker 1 (57:11):
Yeah, because we're about to finish album for this week.
You got the off you're about to.

Speaker 3 (57:16):
Go, will take it camp quite you know, I'm you know,
cos bring my medicine with me to bring will have
my own medicine. You may bring your medicine, share medicine.

Speaker 1 (57:31):
I supposed to share prescriptions that I just want to
do some drugs. I want to be joy. Yes, Okay,
So the tenure for the Turies sweet badass song the
fish moone period? Did I pronounced that right?

Speaker 5 (57:51):
The tenure is that what you're saying, said Jim Cheery,
Sorry to Tree like, no, not not Mary Poppins. That
you think the mythic man, the flow man was quote
Mary Poppins, Jim Jim three, Mary Poppins.

Speaker 3 (58:16):
You never seen Mary?

Speaker 1 (58:17):
You were never but I knew that.

Speaker 3 (58:19):
But you're really gonna love.

Speaker 1 (58:21):
It, planning on watching in the next Nigga, who watched
all the Friends?

Speaker 3 (58:27):
You better watched Mary Popps.

Speaker 1 (58:29):
I had nothing to do. I was in Malloy alone.

Speaker 7 (58:31):
You could have watched Mary Poppins to watch Friends, and
the randomness it would have been over sooner, the randomness
of it. You're gonna check it out one time late night.
You totally are, like, I watched.

Speaker 1 (58:42):
I will watch Mary Poppins. Thank you anyway, pronounce this
fishbone al.

Speaker 2 (58:48):
As.

Speaker 1 (58:49):
Y'all just looked at me like you don't know what
this is?

Speaker 5 (58:52):
No, No, I was just I thought you were saying
Jimmy cheery, because Jimmy Cheery sauce is like the sau steak.

Speaker 1 (59:00):
About. I was like, so we we actually not many
people well not many people know. I think one third
of our third album, Philadelph Half Life, we recorded at

(59:20):
dark Yeah, and I was gonna say, how did how
did you guys? Pull?

Speaker 10 (59:30):
Uh? Uh?

Speaker 1 (59:34):
I'm about to say Norwood Angelo Angelo away from that
goddamn Thurman miss Sherman. Well, he practiced that ship like
seven hours a day, he did, and that.

Speaker 3 (59:47):
It was newly discovered for him at the time. And
it's still a part like once it came and never left.
Now that's still a part of the Fishbone show. But he's,
you know, masterful with that now.

Speaker 1 (59:58):
Back in ninety seven, he wouldn't answer questions.

Speaker 3 (01:00:02):
Like he.

Speaker 10 (01:00:08):
Loved it.

Speaker 3 (01:00:08):
He loved it so deep and hard.

Speaker 1 (01:00:11):
So just being in that chaotic environment, what was that like?

Speaker 3 (01:00:18):
Wonderful?

Speaker 1 (01:00:19):
Oh okay, you embraced that.

Speaker 3 (01:00:20):
I embraced it.

Speaker 1 (01:00:22):
I'm not good at.

Speaker 3 (01:00:23):
Chaos my kind of freedom. And see I am. I
don't do well with order.

Speaker 1 (01:00:28):
Broke up after three weeks. I'm disciplined follow the rules.
You with me.

Speaker 3 (01:00:41):
So much that I'm not following the rules. I just
recognized that the rules. You know what I'm I'm not
going to yield so easily to someone else's control. And
I'm not going to be rambunctious or fucked up about it,
but I will if I want to get found, I'm
gonna have to make some ulse. I can't be here.
It's like that.

Speaker 1 (01:01:06):
Come a second, talk to me.

Speaker 3 (01:01:10):
But I'm also super respectful and super nurturing of other
people's ways and how other people are. So I have
a lot My mama is. You know, she got a
little animal thing, a little bit with her. You know,
my auntie, you got a little aiming where they real neat,
real orderly. And I appreciate that deeply. It's just not me.
So I can do it for a time, I just

(01:01:32):
can't exist in it. How many beatings you get before
they were just like about to say, all I heard
was yeah, a lot growing up, and just after a
point they were just like, y'all, this is just how
she gonna be. But that time period with them was

(01:01:54):
really wonderful. I had met Angelo. He was doing a
Doctor Mad Vibe thing in Atlanta, and I went to it,
and I was so excited because of course I'm a
fan from uh, you know, from.

Speaker 1 (01:02:09):
From from their southern California.

Speaker 3 (01:02:11):
Then yes, and and I remember seeing them on soul training.
I remember them performing Freddy's Dead and every day Sunshine training.
It was fucking killer. And so I met Angelo there
and he was super funny and insane and awesome and wonderful,
and he was like, man, we just lost our deal

(01:02:31):
with who they was at Sony or c Sony at
the time, because the last time and they didn't think
maybe give a monkey a brain, which is a great thing.
And he was like, so Fisherman doesn't have a deal.
And I was like, what, how does fish have a deal?

Speaker 1 (01:02:49):
And I said, you were the bridge to Dallas.

Speaker 3 (01:02:55):
Yes. Wow, So I said, y'all gonna have a fucking
record deal. Y'all gonna do that ship here in Atlanta.
He was like, I was like, we're going to we
want to study it. So I took Angeloa to meet Dallas,
and of course Dallas was like, fucking fishbone dude, like

(01:03:17):
you're going you being cool because he's a quiet, kind
of reserved cat back then, still kind of his but
he was real kind of quiet a shot back then,
but he was freaking out on the inside and uh.
And they started a dialogue about it, and he made
that he pushed that ship through pretty quick because once
he found out he could really do it, he was

(01:03:37):
just like, you know, so exetraally pushed that forward and
the guys ended up spending a tremendous amount of time
in Atlanta over the next year. So here's Fishbone said
in Atlanta like during like ninety yeah, at the dungeon,
and you know they meet U GK. Because I mean
PIMC shouts him out on on Roden dirty at the end,

(01:04:00):
he shouts out Fishbone because he spent I mean, because
you know they were we were very good friends, you
know at the time, blending pimple like our family getting
out we're married, and and they ended up just spending
a lot of time with them too, because they were
just a ron. So here it's like UGK, it's Fishbone,
it's cass Is Goodie, it's you know me. It's like

(01:04:22):
it was just.

Speaker 1 (01:04:22):
This, you know, back down, describe what working with Dallas
is like, because i mean, again, you know, what was
his first joint, mister dj would.

Speaker 3 (01:04:34):
Yeah, so I mean he was a child, you know,
he was in high school age.

Speaker 1 (01:04:39):
Yeah. But to have that range of being a new
Jack proprietory TLC and just going to the new soul
like sort of swimming to that and then to go
all over the place, how was he able to because
he's churning out the hits for everybody at this point,
how is he able to devote time to you to

(01:04:59):
them to TLC to Madonna to like just keep all
of this.

Speaker 5 (01:05:04):
It was a lot.

Speaker 3 (01:05:05):
I can't remember it being a lot for him.

Speaker 1 (01:05:09):
Was it a lot for you?

Speaker 3 (01:05:10):
Though?

Speaker 1 (01:05:10):
I mean in terms of like, hello, are you picking up?

Speaker 3 (01:05:12):
No, it wasn't that way for me only because like
that's not like the same age, same exact age, and
how things were structured with us back then. It was
a little more family dynamicish, so it was a little
more like that's my part, and if his mama's cooking
on Sunday, I'm going over to the house, like which
he would have everybody come over with his mama's house
on Sunday. But like they would do these regular occurrences.

(01:05:34):
If he said a student he's working, I'm going by
the studio, he gonna hit me, I'm at the studio.
I didn't. Necessarily, I didn't have problems with accessibility with him.
No one did. He wasn't an inaccessible person at the time.
If you were working with him, he could get ghosts
like you know, the best of whoever. But but I
didn't have that problem, and I didn't see him thinking

(01:05:57):
back that shit, han't you just call out all that shit?
I was like, damn, he was young as fuck back then,
and he was doing all that shit like I hadn't
even thought about it like that, and so I guess
he handled it, you know, as best he could and
did a pretty decent, like a job of it because
he was working on I mean, but cleansing Syndrome. We
were working on that at the same time. They were
doing Chim Jim was at the same time, and then

(01:06:21):
whatever else he was doing. Because at that point too,
you know, everybody's calling you for these individual tracks and
you know, you got to work on remixes and you're
doing all kind of shit everybody. I didn't have any
accessibility problems with him. He was great to work with.
He was adventurous, he was rooted and soul and funk.

(01:06:43):
He was, you know, a James Brown student, you know,
an old soul student, a pfunk student. So we had
a lot in common. He was just doing this R
and B. You know, he had gone heavy into this
new urban R and B sound, but his roots were
in the shit that I fucked with. So it it
was always, you know, a pleasure, very easy you know

(01:07:05):
to work with. It was that was that or yes,
it was supposed to be a me, but cleansing is
like my black albums never commercially released.

Speaker 1 (01:07:21):
What happened?

Speaker 3 (01:07:23):
So em I fault bout two weeks before Amimba was
supposed to come out.

Speaker 1 (01:07:29):
Em I folded, and the label prior to that, they
were with it. They were like, we're gonna put it out.
We're gonna put it out, okay.

Speaker 3 (01:07:36):
Cool, And then the label folded.

Speaker 1 (01:07:37):
So then it was like, did they have the video
out for Ghetto Superstar and.

Speaker 3 (01:07:41):
The video for Ghetto Superstar had just dropped. Oh no,
it hadn't come out yet. Because here's what ended up happening.
Once em I folded, Dallas hurried up and got another
situation together with this other cat. I can't even remember.
Maybe V not V two. I don't want to get
that wrong.

Speaker 1 (01:07:59):
Was it?

Speaker 5 (01:08:00):
No, I know you're talking about because he put out
was that the young Sad and Blue Wow put that.

Speaker 1 (01:08:07):
Free World? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (01:08:09):
Free World?

Speaker 1 (01:08:10):
Was I had that single in college?

Speaker 3 (01:08:19):
Oh wow, when I'm so tired on there? Does it happen?

Speaker 1 (01:08:24):
I don't think that's on there, but it's the one
with the pink cover. Yeah, yeah, maybe it.

Speaker 3 (01:08:28):
Doesn't because I'm so tired. Was a lot of people
that have that because that wasn't on like the big,
the more widely distributed sam when people have the one
when I'm so tired.

Speaker 1 (01:08:40):
It was like the college sampler.

Speaker 3 (01:08:44):
Free World. So he ended up cooking up a little
deal real quick, put that together, got some money behind ship,
and then we shot the video for Ghetto Superstar, and
then Ghetto Superstar was really take off. It was doing well.
It had been like kind of pulled into that whole
MTV regular play list when they would do little R
and B Ship back then and whatever. And then Free

(01:09:08):
World folded. Yeah, Jesus, and then I was just like,
there's a roote on my life. There's a fucking curse
on me. There has to be. This is some bullshit. No, no, no,
you were my journey, because that's not the way you said.

(01:09:28):
Again I said you were like, this is my journey though,
because but you know, even on our journey we got
to take me sometimes.

Speaker 1 (01:09:34):
Okay, one thing, Yeah, where did you have your daughter?

Speaker 3 (01:09:41):
And that's what I was leading up to. I had
just had keep Sire that keeps I was born in
ninety six. Okay, so the first iteration of amba cleansing
syndrome began before Keeping was born. And second iteration because
I went back and added you.

Speaker 1 (01:09:58):
Turn me on. Wait a minute, you just said that
she's always going to be you to me.

Speaker 3 (01:10:08):
Twenty one, Yeah, grown marbling, she's going to be two forever.
I know.

Speaker 2 (01:10:13):
I remember working at Clark Atlanta Radio and you're walking
in with a baby.

Speaker 3 (01:10:17):
That is I feel. I mean, I was going in
the nineties, so it was weird.

Speaker 1 (01:10:23):
You're only.

Speaker 2 (01:10:25):
A couple of years old.

Speaker 3 (01:10:27):
Edit. Oh but yeah, keeps twenty one should be twenty
two in June.

Speaker 1 (01:10:35):
But so yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:10:37):
Then I went back in and I added you turned
me on La Bell cover time the Smile, went back
in and did something with Colin Wolf, and then I
added Ghettle Superstar. Gettle Superstar came letter of something I
added to me but cleansing for them to be just on.
We don't have that one radio one, so wh're making
it added that one and there's one I'm missing. I'm

(01:11:00):
sorry I forget, but yeah, so it was too It
was before keep Beat, before and after keeping Uh thank
you Danne Line does by that. Yeah, yeah, I'm sorry.

(01:11:21):
So the two you know, it was before keeping after
Keeping Me, But Cleinsington drums took a while to come out.
I started working on it in ninety five and then
it actually came out in uh ninety seven, well, didn't
actually come out. Was finished with it in ninety seven.
As it was about to be released, everything all the
plugs got pulled. So I just after that, That's really

(01:11:42):
what made me kind of go deeper into being more
of the wind beneath other people's wings because it was
a little too I didn't know how much I had
left in me to get kicked in my kicked in
my chest like that, A shotgun blasted in my chest like.

Speaker 1 (01:11:56):
That, another Ghetto Super started coming out.

Speaker 2 (01:12:02):
I was I'm trying to get it out of my
head because every time I hear the title, the other
one comes in my head, and I'm trying to get
it out.

Speaker 3 (01:12:08):
What I tell you, I don't like this motherfucking ask
to this day.

Speaker 1 (01:12:13):
I'm sorry, oh problem. I'm hugging you right now. Okay,
I'm hugging I remember thinking like, is this how y'all
gonna do it?

Speaker 3 (01:12:22):
It's just gonna be the black Like it's just gonna
it's gonna be like this.

Speaker 1 (01:12:26):
Hide it.

Speaker 3 (01:12:29):
Were just gone. And I remember, and it was always
these situations, whether it was just enough, what you're doing
is legal for it to be okay, and you can't
soon nobody here. It's only the moral like you just
doubt what you're gonna do. You only have that, but
you don't have like a legal leg to stand on

(01:12:49):
and ship, so you just gotta be like shrug. Wait,
but we talked about keeping.

Speaker 2 (01:12:58):
We didn't talk about her debut you before she was
even born, and how that I felt like that was
the whole history making moment on screen Indiangelo's video.

Speaker 3 (01:13:06):
Yes, well that was that was she was in She
was in there, okay, because I was about to say
I thought that was face in China, but China was
a little thing. But I was pregnant.

Speaker 11 (01:13:17):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:13:20):
With the bikini sheer moment, it was a moment.

Speaker 2 (01:13:23):
Were you did you have questions like was the bikini?
Did you say I'm going to do it, but I
must be in my bikini?

Speaker 3 (01:13:30):
No, I came. I just came dressed to the video.
That was just her regular It was a summer day. No,
it was you're gonna be they want you video.

Speaker 1 (01:13:38):
And I was, and I'm gonna shut ship down.

Speaker 3 (01:13:40):
And I'm on bikini with this ship dressing him and
this and.

Speaker 1 (01:13:44):
What video was and I bet you nobody can plain.

Speaker 3 (01:13:50):
And that was and that was the day I met Erica.

Speaker 1 (01:13:53):
Really wow because she was in the video in the.

Speaker 3 (01:13:56):
Video the first drop, that was her first little Wow.
That's crazy, first seeing you know, first seeing her on
the screen. And that was my first time meeting her,
and my first time meeting Faith that day too. And
Faith was pregnant with little little c J at the time.

Speaker 2 (01:14:13):
That's crazy because then the dim in between what was
the video? It was it Erica's video where you were
in the car.

Speaker 3 (01:14:18):
I just have a visual of I haven't been in
any easy no, you know what, who are you thinking?

Speaker 1 (01:14:25):
No, you're thinking of Lucy Lucy bro I wasn't think
couldn't be because you're in don mess with my man, right, I.

Speaker 3 (01:14:32):
Am not in the mess with because I'm in without
you and you those because you know my I came
in at the telling very just to finish up awar
season and the tour.

Speaker 1 (01:14:46):
That was it. What was transition. I feel like you're
just then fix it.

Speaker 3 (01:14:56):
I'm fix it. Yeah, it's like a fix It's like
some fixer ship. It really is fix it with no
drama like deliver and low key you don't end up
in flow. Seriously, Yeah, we.

Speaker 1 (01:15:11):
Have heard about that wisdom. Where's her jingle? I'm sorry? Yeah,
I'm sorry, I'm sorry. That was your first brilliant moment
of comedy on the show.

Speaker 3 (01:15:27):
Only took almost two years. That was pretty phone call
at the eleventh hour, you know that was I would
have you had to say no, I've had to say
to a to a lot of things.

Speaker 1 (01:15:43):
Who did you say no, I can't do the project
right now? Or I'm good?

Speaker 10 (01:15:48):
You know what?

Speaker 1 (01:15:48):
Like your weirdest offer, my weirdest offer, girls, that would
have been hilarious.

Speaker 3 (01:15:56):
That's my weirdest offer. Child, I don't even know. I
can't even.

Speaker 1 (01:16:04):
So much.

Speaker 3 (01:16:04):
Damn shit my brain, I don't know. I don't know.
You could ask me this probably in two hours, and
I'd be like child, it was that one. But right,
I can't think of what my weirdest one would be.

Speaker 1 (01:16:19):
But I have to say.

Speaker 3 (01:16:23):
The stuff that the universe will shoot at me, the
universe that it'll be tough, fucked up, kind of hard
kind of lessons and stuff. But it's not it ain't
nothing that I can't you know, stand by, And it
ain't nothing that I can't be like well, you know,
I'm always proud of the work. So anything that I've done,

(01:16:46):
I'm still proud of the work, you know, my involvement in.
But I can't really I can't think right now of
what the what I've turned down where I was like,
probably because once I turned something down, I'm through with
that and I don't think about that no more. I don't.
I don't store that no. Well, but working with you know,
getting a call from Ray it was cool because I

(01:17:06):
was just like, you know, I'll be on the lips
of my name, will be on the lips of some
you know, some folks in the demographic that otherwise absolutely
wouldn't know who I was. So and he's the homie.

Speaker 1 (01:17:17):
And were you shot that like oh okay or is
it like whatever? Like I mean, are you I don't
mean in a jaded centema, I mean, but is it
just like yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:17:30):
Okay, it's a job. It was a job like I
looked at it like a job that I can do
for now, Like that's what it looked like, like this
is a good temporary gig and I'm gonna do it.

Speaker 1 (01:17:42):
We'd playing them back because I also forgot that we
toured uh uh during the goodie my period. Yeah. And
also so it's like.

Speaker 3 (01:17:52):
I was pregnant then too, where you have to sort
of not or you kind of have to.

Speaker 1 (01:17:57):
Is it weird laying in the cut and being a
team member.

Speaker 3 (01:17:59):
I've been doing it for so long now, like you
have to remember after me, but cleansing syndrome that really
started me to being to scale back. I wasn't so
in pursuit of the spotlight and I just wanted to work,
you know what I'm saying. So once I just got
to that point, I was just like, I just want

(01:18:20):
to work and I'm not so you know whatever. And
I think for other people it's far more weird than
it is because people have these these notions of me
and what they think I am and how they think
I am and all this type of ship and so
then when they meet.

Speaker 1 (01:18:35):
Me they like that. Yeah. I think people of like
what fame being a successful musician.

Speaker 3 (01:18:44):
Musician is like you.

Speaker 1 (01:18:46):
Can be a success and nobody know.

Speaker 3 (01:18:49):
Yeah, Like, and that's why I'm you know, I don't
give a fuck about that. Other part of fame is
not even controllable enough for me to want it, you know,
like it doesn't offer freedom. I'm too. I I I
live and die by my freedom, and fame doesn't offer
a tremendous amount of freedom. It has perks, but it

(01:19:12):
doesn't it's enslaving.

Speaker 1 (01:19:14):
Yeah, it's the exact opposite. Yeah, freedom, it is.

Speaker 3 (01:19:16):
And so I don't. I ain't never been tillated by
that particular part. I've only felt the I know that
when you do good art, the fame tends to come
with it. So if I had to endure the fame
to produce the good art, then I would do it.
But that part of it so so me kind of
stepping back and being like, well, I just do work
with other people. That was a that wasn't a hard

(01:19:38):
decision to make. That was like, A I want to work.
B I just say, mean, I'm tired of all that
other part of ship anyway, and I'm just who the
fuck I am, and I'm just gonna fucking be that
and do that and raise my child.

Speaker 5 (01:19:50):
And yeah, if you were famous, I think me and
you couldn't have been sitting outside the Dennis or whatever chilling.

Speaker 1 (01:19:58):
That moment.

Speaker 3 (01:19:58):
It would have been something totally different exactly. And see,
I I I have to be able to sit outside
of Dennis with my folks sometimes, you know what I'm saying,
like I have to be able to do that in
this life? You miss who you miss Denny's. No, No,
not at all. It just happened.

Speaker 2 (01:20:16):
No, I was just saying in those moments because he's
so it's opposite in that way, like what you're talking about, like.

Speaker 1 (01:20:22):
That outside of my illustrious apartment about twelve Ace is up.

Speaker 5 (01:20:27):
You got that fancy Denny's, the only, the only Denny's
in Manhattan. So I'm very familiar.

Speaker 3 (01:20:33):
It was a metaphor for life.

Speaker 1 (01:20:35):
I know. But then I love radio on Perade sometimes anyway,
So yeah, maybe like twice a week I'm at that
Denny's connected. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:20:45):
And the other thing too, I have to say, is
that famous my kind of fame or how I'm famous?
You know my way I'm famous. It's it's different because
people I don't. I don't deal with a lot of
foolishness and ridiculousness to other people, Like people fuck with
me because.

Speaker 1 (01:21:04):
They fucked with me, not because other people fuck with you.

Speaker 3 (01:21:08):
People to fuck with me, robbing you exactly, you know,
And so I don't have like a fickle anybody that
was my you know that came along as a supporter
of what I do from Pendulum. By they still here.
You know, I ain't lost. No, ain't nobody like I
don't fuck with Joyan no moo she wet or she
don't do whatever. I didn't like that other album and shit,

(01:21:29):
But no, everybody still supports me, stays down, goes though
with me, and believes in my ability to continue to
produce good work.

Speaker 1 (01:21:41):
Yeah. I remember.

Speaker 5 (01:21:42):
I mean when we did the record together for those
albums in twenty fifteen, I was just still getting in
my head.

Speaker 1 (01:21:48):
I was telling my well, now wife, you know what
I'm saying. I was like, Joy is on the way
to the house, Like you understand, Joy about to be
in my house. She's like, what what you mean?

Speaker 5 (01:21:59):
I'm like, Yo, you understand I met her when I
was fucking fourteen and now in my house, Like so
just to see that come full circle, like to meet
you when we were at Yeah, you were doing an
in store. I think I like skipped school to come
see you promote Pendulum Vibe.

Speaker 1 (01:22:13):
It was her and Jay Row Damn it was coming
to Weird come. It was both.

Speaker 5 (01:22:21):
It was both and uh and gangster. Yeah yeah, and
yeah they came to the store and I was there
and we saw we were there. We were there to
see Jay Row and we didn't even know that she
was coming.

Speaker 1 (01:22:34):
It was just you know, Jay was like I would
go see j Row. So then she showed up tall
with like the orange hair.

Speaker 3 (01:22:40):
It was like, who is that?

Speaker 5 (01:22:41):
And so they gave us the Sunshine and the Rain tape.
It was just the single that was the It was
like the yellow like orange.

Speaker 3 (01:22:51):
It was yellow.

Speaker 1 (01:22:52):
Yeah, it was the yellow tape. Were just like, all right,
what is this? Like all right, well I check it.

Speaker 5 (01:22:56):
Out and we took it home and it had the
same It had the song on one side of it
and the instrument on the other and we used to
freestyle issue.

Speaker 1 (01:23:04):
Yeah, Yo, that was it. I was like, we used
to yeah that instrumental man.

Speaker 3 (01:23:10):
That's what the guys from you said when I met them.
We were sitting in the dungeon freestyling this y. When
I came into the studio, they were like.

Speaker 7 (01:23:17):
That's the Shining Girl went ship wow.

Speaker 1 (01:23:23):
Yeah yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:23:24):
So yeah, that was to go from there to actually
be able to sit and co write and produce a
record with Joy and that was a great experience.

Speaker 1 (01:23:31):
I thank you. She enjoy sat on like in my crib,
Like we was just in my crib and bang. That
so dope.

Speaker 2 (01:23:40):
Since we're talking about experiences and recording, I just because
in my mind you were part of the Equimini like
recording era, right, were you a part.

Speaker 1 (01:23:48):
Of the No you came in Aliens.

Speaker 2 (01:23:50):
No, you came in at Aliens. I was like, yeah,
because I feel like at some point we would hear
you in the background.

Speaker 3 (01:23:59):
Yeah, I am on the album before, I guess I'm
saying before that. I guess that is what I was saying.
You asked me specifically about a cuemina.

Speaker 1 (01:24:07):
Is that what you have?

Speaker 2 (01:24:08):
I'm asking about that just that time period in Atlanta
and that feeling. Yeah, I was there, Yeah, and its
like from an outsider, it just looked like another world
of heaven, I guess based on the players in that
whole situation. And I was just curious from your perspective, again,
that's that's perception.

Speaker 3 (01:24:26):
But what was it really like? Like during that time
in Atlanta? Amongst from there was a renaissance happening. That's
what I'm saying. You know, at that time we.

Speaker 1 (01:24:39):
Lived for the romantic perception of it. It was delicious,
like was it like magical time and I went on deep.

Speaker 3 (01:24:53):
I mean, at times it could be there was some
magical moment.

Speaker 1 (01:24:57):
Okay, you have to tell the story.

Speaker 5 (01:24:59):
The reason why you said you have to tell the
story and do the impression of Rico singing you may
die please.

Speaker 1 (01:25:07):
You don't remember telling you this, but dude, oh god,
she was.

Speaker 5 (01:25:11):
She was very, very elevated. But it was the story
of how Rico had an idea for you may die.

Speaker 3 (01:25:20):
Organized Away can have amazing ideas about melodies, but ric
Away cannot see at all, like not at all, and
so he was trying to.

Speaker 1 (01:25:37):
Yeah, it was so perfect.

Speaker 3 (01:25:39):
He was trying to, you know, convey how he wanted
the melody to go. And I feel like he was
this guy because you know, you can't be sure that's
how you say. And that was actually Peaches that particular part.

(01:26:02):
But as we're you know, Peace's not kind of coming
up with how we you know go and floated it
and went.

Speaker 11 (01:26:06):
And so y'all should do a life you can be
sure a lot to get Hi, you may learn to.

Speaker 3 (01:26:19):
You God, you may die or some ship like that,
and he did, but just completely out of tune. But
you know what, he kind of means because you can
and you know what the music is doing, and so
you like actual week won't he kind of wants it

(01:26:41):
like that. So then we end up, you know, pulling,
get a couple of more lyrics out, and then Peaches
puts a thing on it and I put the you
know the backs and can you tell the babies the significance.

Speaker 2 (01:26:55):
I mean, I was in college when I used to
see you girls performing and I'm just amazing. But tell
people the significance of Peaches to the movement the music.

Speaker 3 (01:27:05):
Well. Wild Peach is a funk rock band from Dallas, Texas,
comprised of Myrna Screechy, Peach Brown, and David wild Brown.
Peaches passed in two thousand and seven. Yeah, it's been

(01:27:29):
overtemed almost eleven uh Peaches in Atlanta And it was
interesting because I met Peaches around the same time that
I met Fishbone.

Speaker 1 (01:27:42):
Through the.

Speaker 3 (01:27:44):
Rock lockdown scene, because it was a people don't know
that Atlanta had a cool ass black rock scene happening
in the early nineties. There were lots of different bands,
Naked Truth and Wild Peach and w Liinsteine and follow
for Now and uh Moby's Trip and Love Joy and

(01:28:06):
it was a lot of bands. And because what I
did live, even though I was classified as R and B,
what I did live translated as something more like funk rock.
So I ended up meeting Peaches and becoming really good
friends with her, and she was just like this.

Speaker 1 (01:28:25):
She is.

Speaker 3 (01:28:26):
She was just this incredible performer, incredible writer, incredible vocalist.
And it happened to be that we bought out really
good shitting each other and and we worked really well together.
So we started just lacing you know, people's backs land

(01:28:48):
in particular with the guys and the DF because I
ended up introducing them to introducing Dave and and and
Peaches to Toda.

Speaker 1 (01:28:56):
Really yeah, wow, I don't know, yeah, m hm.

Speaker 3 (01:29:02):
I am the bridge, but yeah, you know, And so
that's how they ended up linking up. And from the
initial you know, like it started off with Peacha singing
backgrounds was with me and with a couple other sisters

(01:29:26):
that were kind of interchange out.

Speaker 1 (01:29:28):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (01:29:29):
Later on Kesa Jackson will come in and she would
end up being a staple there as well. Later, but
it was Peach not in the beginning, and that blend
and that was vocal just all that ship was killed
but Peaches was you know, on the ground level from

(01:29:50):
the building of things, and I bought her with me,
and once she was you know, got in there, and
then they were able to check out, you know, the
band for the themselves and stuff. Then everybody just you know,
they started loving them too. But they had already been
doing their Wild Peach thing on the scene in Atlanta,
and they had had like a major record deal with

(01:30:10):
something that didn't you know, one of those things where
they damn sure didn't know.

Speaker 1 (01:30:14):
What to do. Damn show didn't anything locally.

Speaker 3 (01:30:20):
They didn't, but they would do shows and they have
these incredible ass songs that people still and I think
Wild is gonna do a full release of a I
think he's working on something pretty special, I think for
her and for them, because the the what they brought
to the table freed all of us up. Because they

(01:30:42):
were also a little bit older than us, so they
had just mold you know, the most seasoning on the
thing too. But Peachers was a fantastic writer, a fantastic vocalist,
killer fucking vocal stylist, and unlike you know, anything before

(01:31:08):
or since. Yeah, absolutely, she's my sister and I fucking
miss her. Every day.

Speaker 1 (01:31:16):
You mentioned something earlier, and I know that a really
big influence on your life. Uh as far as your
your your music was Betty Davis, could you talk about
her influence on you? And have you ever gotten to
meet her and have it one on one? And you

(01:31:38):
never got to meet her? No, she's still Yeah, they're there.
I mean there's still talks of her life, her bio
in the movie whatever. But but she's very yeah, extremely reclusive.

(01:32:00):
She's sort of like giving notes to the producers of
the movie, like not in front of them and that
sort of thing. I think she just wants to remain
a mystery. But have you made attempts to try to
or is that one of the heroes that you don't
I don't ever want to meet my heroes, you know what.

Speaker 3 (01:32:17):
I don't give a shit about that about the meeting
of heroes and things like that.

Speaker 1 (01:32:21):
So you would never like to have to sit down
with her, and just I would.

Speaker 3 (01:32:24):
And that's what I'm saying. I don't care. I don't
have any like, oh my god, that's my hero and
then you meet them in the point now, because I
know people with life is fucking crazy. It takes people
down through that any goddamn thing could happen. Like for
what I've created about you in my mind, that doesn't
necessarily mean that that's how you're gonna be in. That's fine.
I ain't gonna hold it against you. I ain't got
shit to do with how bad ass that shit was
that you created and influence it out of me. So

(01:32:47):
but yeah, I haven't talked to her. I would love
to one day when the time is right, but I
would never want to push that. I wouldn't want none
of that. I would only wants be able to do
that if that's something she wanted to do, because I
know people have tried to get and I like, don't, don't,
don't do that. Just need to know I'm out here
and at our rifle.

Speaker 1 (01:33:03):
Quick quick backdrop for our listeners that don't know Betty
Davis uh ex wife of Miles Davis. Pretty much. I
guess you could say it was basically yeah, and and
sort of what you've been describing as you building the
Atlanta scene.

Speaker 3 (01:33:21):
I mean, she she was a connector.

Speaker 1 (01:33:23):
She was a connector. Yeah, she was extremely important. And
the funk direction that slide took with theirs a ride
going on. Actually there's a tattoo on her ass that
literally says that this ass invented fusion. So yeah, she was.
She was very key to Miles's bitches brew development and

(01:33:47):
on the corner and also with Herbie doing his funk
stuff with the head Hunters and Chameleons.

Speaker 3 (01:33:55):
So how many wives did Miles have? I'm just I'm
trying to place her for She's not one that you
probably would have seen because people really only talk. It's
mostly Cicily Tyson that people talk about that he was
married to, and then maybe the one other who was Yeah, yeah,
but people don't really talk about because.

Speaker 1 (01:34:13):
It was so quick, but she had she had a
singing career. Kind of weird speaking of the sly thing
Slide would be so notoriously late to these studio sessions
that yeah, that basically the Family Stone be chilling like
this during like the ride going on seventy one period
that she just come around the studio and sli be

(01:34:36):
going for days and missing. And that's basically how the
Family Stone became her because Greg Erica produced the first album, right, yeah,
exactly what I mean. But it's Jerry and Cynthia and
and Freddie Stone. Yeah, yeah, pretty much.

Speaker 3 (01:34:53):
Yeah, yeah, but but you but I didn't know that
particular piece. So it's because Slo would be so late
and shit out to and the baby coming out, and
she just ended up getting tight with everybody and they
just stopped playing for her too.

Speaker 1 (01:35:04):
He'd be going for three four weeks, Mayde be sitting,
so they was like, all right, let's work on her
own shit. So that's how that initial album came to be.
But yeah, like, why did you gravitate towards Did you
feel the need to like maybe take the time that
she had?

Speaker 3 (01:35:21):
And I didn't feel that until I found out about her,
and I found out about her later in my life.
I was already grown once I found out about her.
I found out about her when I was working on
Amba cleansing syndrome.

Speaker 1 (01:35:38):
Oh man, that makes sense.

Speaker 3 (01:35:40):
And Fishbone introduced me to her up but specifically Norwood
Fish and jb Okay, and they were just like, cause,
you know, we had been jamming together and doing shit together,
on the road together and doing all that stuff, and
it was just like, have you are you familiar with
Betty Davis? Have you heard that? I was like the actress,

(01:36:02):
you know, right, like Kim Curs. They're like no, Miles
Davis's sex wife, and I was just like no, and
they were like, hold up. And then they had because
at that time everybody still had like, you know, cosette
rare cassettes and ship that they would like keep put on.
They went back there and pulled out focus sets of

(01:36:24):
her ship and the first ship they played for me
was if I Met Look Good God. And the first
time I heard I member, I.

Speaker 1 (01:36:31):
Was just like.

Speaker 3 (01:36:33):
Mother a Like seriously, it was like a right, like
some missing link type shit because the only person I
had really felt connected to like that from when I
was really little was like Mannie Riperton's voice used to
do me like that, it resonated, it had a thing
with me. And then I had a very in depth
relationship with Sad as a teenager musically, and so there

(01:36:55):
were just these things that you know, like there were
certain but there was always something missing. There was nothing
outside of like LaBelle and Funkadelic that spoke to like
the go to all parts of me, but I didn't
really And I love Tina Turner as well in a
hardcore way for sure, but I didn't have I didn't

(01:37:18):
There was still something missing in terms I hadn't seen
that other part of myself in anybody else. And when
I heard that part of myself and anybody else, and
so when they let me hear that, I was just like, okay,
So for all the new Beatty Davis people, because now
I'm in it. I'm in her. You got me. I
wasn't familiar. Give us a cheesy what's the album that

(01:37:39):
you think?

Speaker 2 (01:37:40):
Like?

Speaker 3 (01:37:40):
Can you start with the first one. I'll just start
the title Dave crank it up.

Speaker 1 (01:37:43):
I start from just three, yeah, four, So.

Speaker 3 (01:37:48):
I see Nasty Gown. I just want to go to
it because it's just that's okay. But as start with
the first, start with the first one, start with that one,
and then go to the last.

Speaker 1 (01:37:58):
Albe was she started dating Addicted to Love Robert Palmer?
Robert Farmer?

Speaker 3 (01:38:04):
Really that makes sense?

Speaker 1 (01:38:05):
Yeah, like yeah, oh, she was dating Robert Palmer?

Speaker 3 (01:38:08):
Like what a minute, But you said addicted to love?

Speaker 1 (01:38:10):
Well, that's why I was thinking of Robert Palmer. But yes,
she started dating him, uh seventy eight, seventy nine, and
he got her a deal on island and they made
a record and then never released it. A sucker like
me like went to Bleaker Bob's put a few Benjamins

(01:38:31):
on it on the acid Tate. Oh wow, re released
like two years later.

Speaker 3 (01:38:35):
I like, originally yeah, but that expanded me and opened
me up in another kind of way, and I just
felt instantly like and I saw so much of my
self in her and in her journey, and I just

(01:38:58):
you know, it changed me. It's one of those, you know,
one of those moments in your life.

Speaker 1 (01:39:03):
Do you have any aspirations or hopes to at least
be a part of her biopic or the telling of
her story or Oh I would love to.

Speaker 3 (01:39:12):
I would absolutely love to. I would absolutely I would
like somebody to do the ship before I get to
go down.

Speaker 1 (01:39:28):
I have one more question, because I know we got
a wraps in, but what it seems so obvious to me,
Why have you not made a complete full album with
organized noise or would that have been too obvious? Well
not obvious, like you know, I mean, were you comfort

(01:39:48):
with Dallas? You know, like you work well with Dallas?
And has there ever been a thing like why don't
you produce your work well.

Speaker 3 (01:39:56):
With whoever I'm working with, whoever want to work Has
the conversation ever come up I'm working about them doing
a whole album.

Speaker 1 (01:40:04):
They did.

Speaker 3 (01:40:05):
They did quite a few, you know, they did, but
not an entire album. But not an entire album. No,
I've not done an entire album with anybody since Pendlam Black.

Speaker 1 (01:40:19):
But I do feel that.

Speaker 3 (01:40:23):
I've worked with different producers on different ships.

Speaker 1 (01:40:26):
I would have loved to heard their production, and I
just feel as though, because they did it so well
with Cast and they did it so well with Goodie
Mob and stuff.

Speaker 3 (01:40:37):
It was talk of doing it several times. It just
didn't happen. It just didn't happen. But that was always talk.

Speaker 1 (01:40:48):
It was.

Speaker 3 (01:40:48):
It was talk of a full Joy album. It was
talk of pil Trick Gangster Click album. It was talk of,
you know, a full Heroin album, which was me, Peaches
and Stephanie at the time. It was talks of a well, uh,
you know, it's been lots of talks. It's just it
just wasn't something that came to where do.

Speaker 1 (01:41:06):
Things stand now, just as far as where things are
with the family, like it's just completely separate. This person's here,
this person there, this person's up there, this person's down there.

Speaker 3 (01:41:18):
I mean, then you know, I'm in any situation, I'm
in it. I'm always the lone wolf. Even if I'm
family affiliated, I'm still the lone wolf. You know wherever
I am so, Uh, everybody's good. I don't see everybody.
I'm out here, you know, everybody else is in Atlanta.

(01:41:42):
But everything is fine with the you know, like, people
are still cool, people still work together, people still talk
people each other.

Speaker 1 (01:41:51):
You played me some Sleepy stuff.

Speaker 11 (01:41:54):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:41:54):
I don't know when sleep is gonna put his uh
stuff out, but I think he is gonna do it
fucking soon. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:42:03):
Oh man, you have to tell us about being a
bang bang girl.

Speaker 3 (01:42:07):
Oh what a bang bang girl? Uh? So the cool
thing that has happened, as like I said, the behind
the scenes shit is cool. I'm fine with it. Since
I've been living in LA, one of my cool hustles
has been, you know, doing vocals for some for a

(01:42:31):
lot of pop music, and in particular working with Max Martin.
I received a call from uh name, who's the homie
that I grew up with in Nashville who asked me
to put together three ladies, uh some LaBelle esque type

(01:42:52):
vocals h And I said okay, And I made a
couple of phone calls to some ladies who I knew
I could sing well with and they were available at
the time, and we went to a session. We were
only supposed to do one song for Max Martin and
it was for something we were working on for Ariana
Grande when we got there and it turned out to

(01:43:14):
be Bang Bang, and so we did that one and
we ended up doing like four more Jesse j and
Ariana Grana. So wait a minute, she's singing vocal, so
we did vocal. I did back back in vocals. So

(01:43:36):
I've just been for the last few years. I've had
some some pretty consistent work doing backs with Max Martin
with other producers. Are you are you cool with Saya Garrett?
Y'all have some similar parallel situations. I know Sayda's husband Eric,
because I know Erica because she was married used to

(01:43:59):
be married to my friend KP years ago. Uh huh.
But I've never met Miss Saida and she's the ship,
but I've never met her and she's the fucking bond. Yeah,
and I respect all of her ship and just she's
just the ship that's like Jesus ship. And maybe I

(01:44:21):
have met her once but it was just very in passing.
It wasn't anything too in depth. But yeah, the bang
Bang grew Me and tar Stans and and uh uh
in donbiight ye. So the three of us have been
doing for the past few years and it's been it's

(01:44:42):
been really cool. We haven't done anything in a bit,
but so happy that y'all are like working and killing it. Yes,
but we did. We've done a lot and it led
to other work. So it's like with us doing that
for him and with that going so well, then it
was like other people that were reaching out with ship
those girls and we just end them calling ourselves a
bang girls because that was the first thing that we
sung on together, and because Max was calling us statute

(01:45:04):
and bragging that he didn't want nobody but the Bank
Bank girls.

Speaker 1 (01:45:09):
Thought you were talking.

Speaker 2 (01:45:12):
Wait though, that's like a whole supergroup, joy hold one.

Speaker 3 (01:45:16):
Well it is, But you know, girl, we're just gonna
work checks, dude, I mean check us out individually.

Speaker 1 (01:45:25):
That's the check you're talking about, joy A. Sorry, final questions.

Speaker 5 (01:45:38):
The Ray Ray intro, Yeah, that's that's what you have
been a part of, like two of the greatest intro
albums intro to albums ever and Ray Ray Thank.

Speaker 3 (01:45:50):
You, Ray left Me Alone. He was working on that project.
He just left me in the studio.

Speaker 1 (01:45:55):
Whatever, dude, can.

Speaker 3 (01:45:56):
You write me something?

Speaker 1 (01:45:57):
I was like, and what I said was, I love that.

Speaker 3 (01:46:01):
I was like, I'm gonna write you. I'm gonna write
your intro song. I'm gonna write your intro some theme music.
That's what I said. Like I got me. I was like,
I'm gonna give you something. It'll be your version. It's like, okay.
So he left me in then and I wrote to
making Mighty in l A.

Speaker 1 (01:46:20):
Yeah, but that's right right.

Speaker 3 (01:46:30):
We almost had a Joynte duet. Everybody else.

Speaker 1 (01:46:39):
You can kiss my entire black he is.

Speaker 3 (01:46:53):
But yeah, that was one I love. That's one of
my favorite things I've done. It was very funny making it.

Speaker 9 (01:46:58):
It was and he loved it.

Speaker 3 (01:46:59):
So I was glad that, you know, glad I was
able to Was that given?

Speaker 1 (01:47:04):
Was that after before y'all did I'm So Famous? After
that was after okay all right? Yeah, that was after
I thank you that. But I want to infess it
to the world. Thank you, thank you, I love I'm
so famous.

Speaker 3 (01:47:14):
Thank you, Slam the Bombers.

Speaker 1 (01:47:17):
Yeah, dance Yesterday's dance Yesterday. That's my favorite one.

Speaker 3 (01:47:20):
Thank you, Thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:47:22):
Is there a new albumm Yes when when when we sing?

Speaker 3 (01:47:26):
It was January twenty first, Jerry twenty field. I'm sorry
my birthday birthday.

Speaker 1 (01:47:31):
So it's already out now, all right, Yes.

Speaker 2 (01:47:34):
That's what I'm here.

Speaker 3 (01:47:35):
It's already yeahend to you. What the album is called, sir,
Rebecca Holy Love?

Speaker 1 (01:47:42):
Yeah? Why you changed your Twitter name? I was like,
must be a new album?

Speaker 3 (01:47:47):
Is that?

Speaker 1 (01:47:48):
Is that like a fierce type thing or is there
a story behind that?

Speaker 3 (01:47:50):
Well, you know, I'm Tennessee slim. It's just another alias
Rebecca Savage, Immortal and Righteous Rebecca Holy Love. Us about
Rebecca Rebecca is the you know, a woman fully realized
stepping into her Christ's heads face and fully realizing the

(01:48:16):
wrong you know, the the not too much difference, uh
what really almost well, the duality of things. That's what
she She's a woman who realizes the duality of things.
And she's forgiving and uh accepting, and she's peaceful and
she uh resists the confinements of constructs and she'll get

(01:48:42):
I mean she could also you know, help you bury
the body. But she can also she can also you know,
be your ball and sooth you. She can do that too.
Thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:49:00):
Ship Okay, I was hoping to get in there. I
was like, damn independent, absolutely fantastic.

Speaker 3 (01:49:06):
M hm mm hmm. We and the fan and got
a cool little team. We're just gonna keep We're gonna
take it one step at the time and just keep
pushing that joker. You're going tour with Forward. I am
going to to it. I need a booking agent. That's
what I'm looking for now. I need somebody to book
these shows.

Speaker 1 (01:49:22):
All right, from your now to the ears of the
hardest work. Listening to a podcast that should be Questo Supreme,
God's favorite podcast. Yes, that's it.

Speaker 3 (01:49:39):
But I'm excited, and uh, I'm excited about the work
I produced. H hands on, I produced, I say four
and I work with brook the Low. Yeah, I mean god, damn,

(01:50:02):
y'all didn't respond like that.

Speaker 1 (01:50:07):
We didn't expect to hear Brooks and Christmas.

Speaker 3 (01:50:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:50:12):
We were literally just talking about this before you got here,
about how like you know, artists, I mean not to
say they got drafted, well yeah, gotted, and also just
how like artists that are you know, of the older generation,
how they need to work with like the new Jacks
that grew up listening to them, you know, what I'm saying,
like they need that and you don't.

Speaker 1 (01:50:33):
You don't really see too much of that now, you
know what I mean.

Speaker 3 (01:50:35):
I mean just like half and half. He's one of them,
and then he's not. You were not that young. He's
not forty either, But they're the they're the ogs of
the younger badasses that now exactly they were around to
see it. They weren't the younger and they're trailblazers and
kick ass fucking originals, you know. But I'm excited. Brooke

(01:50:58):
did an amazing James fantastic.

Speaker 1 (01:51:01):
Observation on note, this is the first time in all
these episodes that I've seen Bill get genuinely excited about
music coming out, Like you awakened something in him that
has been dead for so long.

Speaker 3 (01:51:18):
Excited.

Speaker 1 (01:51:19):
Wow, because he hates everything.

Speaker 3 (01:51:22):
I mean, I'm and I'm I'm pleased with the album
is you know, it's fucking bumped. I can't wait for
the show. It's bumping. It's bass heavy, it's mostly up Temple,
Ship Jam, mid Temple and up Temple, and it's a
couple of you know, slow ones. On book is a
drum smith and a and a and a hardcore techner
yes he is.

Speaker 5 (01:51:42):
And for those of those listening that don't know who
Brook is, he produced Miguel's a Door, right, Yes he did, and.

Speaker 1 (01:51:49):
I think well he was. It was part of the
Grammy performance at least.

Speaker 3 (01:51:52):
But he did.

Speaker 1 (01:51:53):
Yeah, he produced a gouble of the US.

Speaker 3 (01:51:59):
Yeah, but but yeah, he's just a ridiculous tunes smith.
And and it really helped me get my drums together.
I'm fine with my beats be five, but I needed
help getting them like chunky, like the sonics of them,
getting them wide and full.

Speaker 1 (01:52:16):
He really helped me, saying you take long tedious trump
sells on stage, just joking anyway, just playing anyway, Joey,
we thank you. This is this is like our first
world cover. I feel like I know you now it
is our first.

Speaker 3 (01:52:38):
Well, no, this is, I said. Remember we had a
really great conversation at Dark when I let you listen
to Star.

Speaker 1 (01:52:45):
Yes, yes, you can talk about that record at all.
We didn't need to start kitting that was that was
record you and rafter he know he did. Tennessee, he
was exactly producer. That's one of my favorite one.

Speaker 3 (01:52:59):
He said. Well, Tennessee, sim is the bond, he says,
and this is out of his mouth. He says, I
didn't produce that record. I just played bass on a
couple of songs, That's.

Speaker 9 (01:53:09):
What he said.

Speaker 10 (01:53:09):
That's nice.

Speaker 3 (01:53:10):
And he says, you produced that record, and I did.
And I am like that with all of my projects.
But I choose wisely on who I choose to work
with because they bring out the best in me and
I them. So I appreciate Ray for that. But yeah,
Tennse simm was one of my favorite. Now that was half.
Some of it was Dallas, some of it was Organized Noise,

(01:53:30):
some of it was Raphael and this other cat. I
can't even remember that brother's name right now, Andre something fuck,
I don't remember. But those were the people that worked
on Star Kitty. So I was already out from under
Dallas at that.

Speaker 1 (01:53:47):
Time, and.

Speaker 3 (01:53:50):
I'm glad to be here. I'm glad I was here.
It was fun.

Speaker 1 (01:53:53):
Thank you. Well, you're awesome too.

Speaker 3 (01:53:57):
Thank you, and I appreciate it. We think the look amazing.
I can't see you here, so I just want everybody.

Speaker 1 (01:54:02):
To know we'll get all the looks.

Speaker 3 (01:54:04):
Andre Betts, Andre Betts, thank you, and brother and b
T T T and human Nature. I'm like, wait and
Bets he did get.

Speaker 1 (01:54:15):
On okay on the album Yeah we got him Andre
Betts all right well, or be half of the team
Supreme fan take a little uh boss Billy and our
guests Joy, Thank you very much. Thank you for the
confooks at west Lake Audio. This is an awesome experience.
Shout out the bubbles. Shout out the bubbles. Yeah, bubbles,

(01:54:38):
room up there, bubble looking down over us.

Speaker 2 (01:54:41):
Thank you Coco, because we are bringing out the year
with a female engineer.

Speaker 3 (01:54:44):
Bam.

Speaker 1 (01:54:52):
All right, y'all, or when we have a Team Supreme.
This is Quest Love Man. We'll see you on the
next go round. Thank you very much. Quest Love Supreme

(01:55:12):
is a production of iHeartRadio. This classic episode was produced
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