QLS Classic: Spike Lee (Part 2)

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Of Course Love Supreme is a production of I Heart Radio.
This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora.
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to part two of QLs classic
with the great Spike Lee. We have so many questions
about his illustrious cinematic history. You know, we've just nerved
here of course Love Supreme. We hope you enjoyed part

(00:21):
two of our journey. Spike lead, Let's go again another stilt.
The last time my father scored were my films was
able and he was ready and willing to be actually

(00:41):
in the film because that was like his first lie
part part of the part of the score. Did I
not hear some of those score motifs in later films?
The I felt there's one particular score pieces. There's one

(01:03):
piece that Terence Blanchet wrote that that we used later. Ye,
it's the thing. It's called song for Cueto. I love it. Yeah,
and that's the one he's playing on on the Brooklyn Bridge.
Terence blanche wrote that. So here's the thing though, with

(01:23):
those scores for the school days score do the right
thing and Branford with school Days do the right thing.
Mobile blues in the Orchestra of my father's score. You
had Terrence Blanchard. I mean you had Terrence. So for
mo Better Blues. When you hear Wesley, that's Branford. Denzel

(01:48):
is Terrence blanches So they were both given the actors,
you know, my favorite musician how to play the instruments.
This is what I want to ask you, because there's
a scenement you do that not many musicians noticed. But
because I was coming up and starting about the inter
college and stuff and like move, I'll say that it's weird.

(02:09):
Even though I don't pick mo Betta Blues as like, okay,
that might be my spike leave film of choice. It's
just like maybe it chose me. But so there's the
scene where Denzel interrupts, uh, well no, So there's a

(02:30):
point you watch if you watch Wesley, and it's it's done,
and it's even on the soundtrack. It's like, how did
you Is it written in the script that okay, uh,
Denzel's character is going to interrupt Wesley's sack solo. Yeah,
because that's that's all the done the playback, So we
had to had to be in the script. So when

(02:51):
we recorded it. So at one point, did you say
exactly five minutes and thirty four seconds. I want you
to interrupt. It wasn't exactly, but but the script says
he has I mean structurally and phillo dramatic. Denzel, his character,
the Gilman Gilim has been humiliated, and so these two

(03:13):
brothers who were at odds one show shadow Henderson's his humanity,
his love for his brother, so he's like picking him up,
saving him. I'm not even talking about the end. I'm
talking at the beginning, the very not even the battle
just and that's this thing it was I'm talking about.

(03:34):
It was so miniscule at the very beginning, when you're
you're egging on Denzel like yeo, man, he's so in
for thirty six burs I can't get him, get him.
And then we worked out in the recordings too, because
all this stuff is done, done, done done, and you
know the playback, I realized, you want some next ship
because any unlesser hands I felt like that scene would

(03:56):
have been an interrupted scene. I don't know, just as
a musician, I hate watching music miss the same way
I hate watching basketball films. Yes, even though the dog
somebody shoots, there's a cut to the basket and the

(04:17):
ball goes in so why were you not allowed to
call it a Love Supreme? Oh, Alice cold Trump Uh
did not like the profani and sex in the film
and the script, so I said you to read it first. Yeah,
I mean that that's she she requested that. But well,

(04:38):
I didn't care about the title. I just wanted love
Supreme because when during that period, because it's funny because
the every film we have, like we make Jackets, the
crew Jackets, the Crew jack I said Love Supreme. I
was gonna say, why do you because like we're rappers,

(04:58):
we will send the queen version of that song for
the sample to get cleared. I cannot do that. The
John Coltran's wife could not. Could not. But in the
name of art, you know older people don't. I cannot
do that. But I think more. In fact, a friend
of mine who I went to school with, Patty Hales,
she's when it came up with the title more Better

(05:24):
by this time. I'm not that I'm adding, but I
will say I'm i too. I'm a fan of the
spike love scenes. So by more better blues, the numbers
come up, you know what I'm saying. Like from school
days from Jouncle Fevers numbers like as many scenes it's been.
It was more. It was like sex, Yeah, more sex,
more sex. It was Denzel and Sinda, and then it
was Sinda and Wesley, and then it was what's the question.

(05:51):
The question is what is your love scene philosophy? I
guess I would ask because they are so a party
of movies. People think those things are sexy, but they
are hard to shoot. It's hard, people uncomfortable, and you
shot your sister, So what is that like? Yeah, what

(06:17):
she read the script? Den don't read the script? And
they were cool. I was cool. And so the scene, uh,
where she delivers the baby Jesus, we had We went

(06:38):
up to Harlem hospital and we knew about that. We
went to the docks and say when did somebody can
be born this day? M hmmm, so they could predict,
you know. So we had several people who signed up,
and uh, we got the call. We rushed to the

(07:02):
hospital and filmed the birth. I was gonna say, by
this point you had leverage because you were Spike Lee
and it was a Harlem hospital. I'm just I'm just
saying that by that point I doubt like you got that.
I mean, I'm sure you've gotten your share of knows
from the Hollywood system. But like, but they the whole,

(07:24):
the hospitals found there as long as you get permission
from the moms and the family. People film births all
the time. So if the people that you know, if
they approve it, then they reprove of it being used
in the film, then what's the problem. But I'm certain
that I would get well not I'm sure that you're
Joe Schmo filmmaker, would get funk out of here. I'm not,

(07:44):
you know, as opposed to it's an honor met her too,
okay one day said, you know, I was in More
Better Blues, So yeah, what role you feel it? Being born?
She was like a teenagers. That's where I wanted to see,

(08:09):
like it has the this is my first mortalized However, man,
nothing that film. I didn't expect it to take the
turn that it took at the end. And every musician, man,
but here's the thing, though, that doesn't come from music.

(08:34):
That comes from sports. So you just what I did,
because you know, any athlete, now let's say, let's let's
say most athletes, whatever sport is, they started playing it.
They started playing it when they're a little kid, and
so at a certain point you say, I'm gonna try us,
I'm gonna this one. I want to do. So just

(08:56):
like musicians, athletes, whatever sport, they spend all their time
developing the skill. So what happens I thought about these
athletes who are very young blow out their knee or
the arm. I want you to save my life, you know,
and then they're like they're and like retiring. So I

(09:22):
just that premise of a career and an injury. I
just moved that to music to a trumpet player. That's
still one of the hardest things to watch. Ye that. Yeah,
that was another movie that I saw it as a kid,
but seeing it older, that was when it really got
was like musicians they turned. They turned. No musicians like

(09:46):
I actually played because they know what you know what
this time out what I've been trumpet in. Uh like
through middle school, I was like first chair, all state man,
all that. Can you be a guest on your own relation?
I don't know. I thought, yeah, yeah, you grahammy nominated
freaking acting. You do everything. He missed The Humble Tea

(10:15):
got a feed? How did you discover Cindy Williams audition?
Robbie Reid still Robbie, So we gotta get her here
into the street. Or it's a combination of both. You
have to go find new talent. Does she have interns
that like? No, it used you go to you go

(10:37):
you find your talent. Also, people sending her agents are
sending her people too, so it's a combination of both.
M hmm. Are you her first films? I mean fast
forward years years later? But were you proud when you
when you watched the New Addition story because that was
really great cast into that she she did Yeah, you
didn't do that right, She's I mean she's a top

(11:00):
executive at a BT. No, I mean she's done great.
I mean Ruth Carter one of the top costume designers
again her class of Hampton to Kimic nominations for Malcolm
X and Amistad. So Ruth's doing the thing. You know,
speaking of Academy, how did you feel about that? That

(11:22):
was a very awkward thing, like did Kent Passengers? I
know you're talking about Why don't you explain it because
I remember, yeah, I remember watching the Academy. It's basically
like kim Passengers just went off script and said that
you know, it was like the very first Oscar so
White moment where the the glaring omission of do the

(11:44):
Right Thing um getting nominated for Best Picture, Best Picture,
and it made literally everyone. We had two nominates. Danny
got one for supporting supporting the Denzel with Denzel cried
with right and screens and screenplay. Yeah, so you know,

(12:07):
she just made mention that, you know, you know, it's
the glaring omission of And I almost feel like even,
I mean back then she said she said, yeah, she
said it like she really went off script and went rogue.
But I was just like, she didn't get black balled.
Let me find out. They just not like, yeah, let's

(12:29):
script it and just you know, keep them at bay
and to keep them satisfied and not protesting us and whatever.
But were you in the art? Was there? How did
you feel? Were you shocked? I was shocked because you
you lost the driving His Days? Was that the year
driving his motherfucking Days? I like that movie Best Picture

(12:55):
of the Year, That's what's up? Ding? Were you was
do the Right Thing up for the palmd or that year?
Or was that no we lost it to? Uh? Was
that jungle fever? Or no, do the Right Thing? We
lost to uh sex lives of deal tape? So was
that the wee movie I haven't thought about exactly? Was

(13:15):
that the we was robbed? Here? Dan, you damn near
the Kanye of your pre Kanye has a spike of
his No wonder you ain't show up to get that
jo on that. So with with with Jungle Fever, I
know that con Film Festival was so moved by Samuel
Jackson's performance. Did they invented best supporting? I never had?

(13:40):
Just made it up right? So they decided to have
supporting categories so that sam could win. Did he win
or no he won? They made up he better win
if they made up it was so stand I mean Sam,
I mean that that for me. You know people might
talk about that Tarrant, Yeah, but it was really jungle

(14:01):
for you and the Sam has even said that himself.
Was he actually still going through fighting his addiction at
the time? He was clean, but he just I was
the last one to find out. You didn't know. I
didn't know? Wow? So how much of that role is scripted?
Like I really I kind of want to even go
like scene by scene. It's weird. I'm like, how much

(14:22):
did he improve? You know? How to do it. Here's
the thing though, so again this is how it Burry's
first film. So while we're rehearsed and rehearsal process, he's
taken how all his former spots. She said, he taught

(14:48):
her how to be a crackhead. Damn she was. He
was taking like so that I mean, that's I mean
due to the right. Here's the thing I'd like to
say real quick because I know we gotta want to
move move ahead. But people, we all know what a
misdirection play is in football, right. The misdirection and Jungle

(15:08):
Fever was the interracial relationship between and Wesley Annabella Shore
and Wealthley character. The real story, which a lot of
people miss, is the effect of crack on black families.

(15:28):
That's what Jungle is about. See, I've always about religion
and black family because to me, maybe that that thinks
but that that comes with Ozzy and Ruby. But also
we also get the whole thing with Marvin Gay Sr.
That comes directly. I felt that the that's that's where

(15:50):
it came from. You're killing the Sun, Marvin Gay because
I felt like that was the father. Maybe the Sun
was the crack story and the Holy Ghost is the
interracial relationship as far as like subplot lines whatever. But dude,
no scene has ever scared the ship out me more
than Charlie Murphy. He was how yes, No, that was

(16:16):
That was an old ballroom, I think at Abstinian ball Room,
which which is in it was just in Decay. But
what I do is they're great songs. Why just make
a mental checklist? And I said, one day I'm going
to use I just got the right scene, but motherfucker,

(16:42):
I'm gonna use that. And the touch of I don't
know if it was me by television at the time,
but when I seen it as he got closer to
the crack house, it was more like a green tint
of I don't don't know if you guys used to
filter or not, or what kind of TV do you

(17:03):
have that, sony? What the TV? How many extra? How
many extra? We wanted We wanted that to be like

(17:24):
that famous scene from Gone with the Wind where they
just all the Confederate soldiers are like under ground and injured.
Did you have to pay them all ars? I was
at the point the SACK rules at a certain point
that to be SAG members. After that you reached that number,

(17:47):
then you just don't have to be sack non unions
like me. Take but that that, that that and then
the thing. It was a great scene. But then at
the Wesley leagues where the whole when when David Crack
code goes in his pocket and in season here he's

(18:10):
been holding on Crack like I've been out here sucking
thicks for you, I mean like and she was she was, yes,
she was smacking the ship out of Then she came
around and then she was like, no, smoke this because
she's seen that he was in. Yeah, I mean, that's
that's what I mean. How how many hours was it?
That was one day? That whole scene an entire day

(18:33):
in there? Damn? When did you know that? Like Ruby
d and Ozzy Davis just believed in what you were
going to do. That's an amazing accomplished. My father had
done this thing called I Forgot to Play, but he
did the music for and they were in it. So
I've always known them and loved their work. And uh,
just I've been blessed to work with Ruby D. I

(18:55):
mean with with first, as you mentioned before school Days,
co Oldem didn't do the right thing. The mayor Ruby
mother's sister then you got them playing together husband and
wife and Jungle Fever. Then uh uh Ozzy getting and
get on the bus. But then we brought his people

(19:18):
and remember, don't forget this, we bought Ozzy back to
we do Malcolm came back and steal it and we
do that. So giants, giants. Um. By that point, uh,

(19:39):
Spike Lee the media star, I mean you were constantly
on Nightline, seeing you on Phil Dona Hue seeing you
on I mean you were like, you know, with the
point where you're like the the black spokesperson or the
angry militant black spokesperson. Um. And I remember doing your

(20:01):
Donna Hue appearances that you were, you know, a little
myth that you were being asked like where the drugs?
Like how come you having dealt with the crack epidemic
yet and where you know, how come there was no cracking?
And do the right Wall Street, I mean we that
was a big criticism of do the right thing, that
the streets were clean, that that that there was no

(20:22):
crack and stuff like that. But because that was that
was a conscious decision. That was another film which was
was Jungle Fever. But I made the comment because Wall Street,
you know, those marvels. Right, there was no any I mean,
any of that stuff in there. But did you feel

(20:44):
the pressure at that point, like Okay, I gotta I
gotta do a crack movie now or you know, No,
it wasn't a pressure. It was just seeing the devastation
of crack. I mean, we're still dealing with crack because
we had a generation are people who are beautiful Black
people grew up without parents in the homes. Yeah, and

(21:07):
the mothers. They killed the moms. Like every other drug
was kind of like social whatever, but took mamas, took
people's soul. Yeah. I mean we've always had drugs, gonna
be a hair or stuff like that, but crack, this
thing was was devilish. The infamous Uh Sister Girls seen.
I forgot what you called it? Yeah, I forgot what

(21:29):
you call there. One day, I'm going back to the vaults.
I want to see the full what do you call
it in the film? Don't go in there, there because
that's the you had a special title for it. Told
him don't go in there because they're having a Yeah,
I forget the title. But was that No, No, that

(21:49):
was not You just let the cameras run talk about
all your all the backs when you ever had in
your life for a black mama. So basically it was
a it was a day on Twitter. So then that
was there each their individual real experiences. Wow, so Teresa,

(22:11):
when Teresa was like, how date them all? And you know,
oh my god, a movie alone that was at least
that for two hours. I do have to, Okay, I
have to play Devil's advocate because I know that there's
been criticism of your representation of women and how they scripted,

(22:35):
which I was asking like, well, damn, that seemed pretty realistic.
But they were so how especially with philis von Stickney,
who are always felt was so underutilized. At no point
did you think like, Okay, I have to give her
a piece of that she can No. I saw Phillis

(22:56):
her one man shows. I mean one woman shows. She's
a her. She's a great talent, so that's why I
put her down right, But I felt like, especially she
stole that scene like she's going to have a movie
by herself and you know it's but it never happened.
Is it hard to really right for for Is it

(23:19):
hard for you to write for women? And I think
it really depends on that. Are you concerned with their
development as much as your your male character. Oh yes,
I think I think I got a lot much better
once I got married. When when she hated me? Was
that post marriage? That was pre marriage? Okay, Okay, you're right,

(23:41):
you're right, you're right, you're right. You you can definitely
look where I got married and as before and after,
and so I would definitely say that my woman, my betrayals,
are women more fuller and more layered after I got married. Damn,
how long was Malcolm X in your pocket before you

(24:04):
finally felt the need to unleash it as far as
the script was concerned, and you wanted to because I
can imagine that you had Malcolm X in your pocket. No,
it wasn't that. That wasn't the case at all. The
late producer Marvel work with what the rights to the
book from the late great Alex Haley and the late

(24:27):
great doctor Deny Schabas. Was it instantly yours or he
been trying to know? He's been trying to make that
fil for twenty years? Ship And so finally it was
announced that Norman Jewison was going to direct the film
with Denzel and I started saying, press hell no, And
then the Marvel world got to touch with me, and

(24:48):
this Spike stopped, stopped speaking to the press, and I'm
going to arrange a meeting between you and Norman Jewison,
very fine directed and the heat a night with Potier
and Uh. I explained to normal to Jewish and wife
think that I was the right director for the film.
And to his credit, he gracefuly bowed out because he

(25:10):
had the gig. He had the gig. He had the
gig Denzel or Denzel was going to play Malcolm X,
so that that thing was together before me. Denzel will
play Malcolm X and Norman Jewison direct. The film was
the final product your vision. Yes, that's why last three hours.

(25:33):
Was there any scene that you're like, damn, if we
could only it was? There was three hours convening longer.
Though we I always saw this film as an epic film.
I mean Ernest Dickinson and I. He was very We
were very lucky that somehow there was a restoration of

(25:56):
Lawrence Arabia right when we're pre production of the zig Field,
and he said, that's the ship we gotta do. So
we wanted to tell the autobiography his life and not
just pick us a certain dist and that now we
want to show the evolution of man Malcolm Little Detroit
read Malcolm x LA, you know, to show the whole

(26:19):
evolution and many and you can't show his transformations from
this person for that person in a two hour film.
And so trouble began from the very beginning because we
never had the correct budget, enough budget for the shoot.
That film was the initial budget. It wasn't enough. I forgot, Okay,

(26:40):
were you giving rap budgets? In other words, uh cypress
Hill's first album SI. Meanwhile, Metallica's Black Album was four
million standards. No, it wasn't a double standard, just wasn't
enough the due to epic film we wanted to do.

(27:03):
And also Warner Brothers did not want the film to
be that length because three hours, that's one less screening
in the theater. Funny story, not funny, but the first
time we screened the film for the two heads, the
Warner Brothers co chairman, it was uh Bob Dailey and

(27:26):
I keep getting the other guy's name anyway, The first
time they saw the film was the day of the
l A Riots ship and to their credit, they both
stayed and that was a four hour cut. But the
secretaries were coming in and thout the whole thing, will

(27:49):
notes and stuff like that. So it's ironic that the
that the first time we showed the film, the Warner
Brothers l A l A was up in flames. Do
you remember any of the celebrity these that didn't help?
It is a thing. Let me get the story. So

(28:11):
I would not cut the So Warner Brothers wants the
film to be two hours. I said, look, it can't
be two hours. And so I know that All the
Stone is getting ready to finish JFK pre production, and
the war brought us film. So I say, how long
is jeff K? They say it's two hours? They're no.

(28:34):
I knew All the Stone, Yo, how long is the okay,
the spike, it's three hours. Won't tell us mother E
didn't curse, he said, don't tell my said so, so
wait a minute, JFKs me three hours, and we can't

(28:56):
be three hours. I wouldn't. I wouldn't cut the film.
So one of budds let the Bond Company take over
the film. And so then all the people post production
gotta uh letter saying you're no longer you're fired. Yeah,

(29:19):
so we had no money. I got paid one million
dollars from Malcolm X. I put that money into the
budget right towards the film. And so in the eight
nine months in pre production from Malcolm X this these
I kept thinking about what Malcolm talked about self reliance,

(29:39):
self determination, self reliance, self determination, and I kept thinking
about that didn't hit me like a motherfucker' tongue of bricks.
I got people I could call, I got the number.
And here's the tricky thing it it could It was

(30:01):
not gonna be an investment in the film. It cannot
be a tax break. Who's had to be a gift?
Mm hm. The first like cold it was Bill Cosby,
so called. Bill was up and he said, what do
you want to spike? So I told him so he said,

(30:22):
I'll put the check in the mount said no, no,
I'm coming on now. So I jumped on the subway.
M hmmp east Side. You went to him, Yeah, so
I got a subway. He's like, I don't believe you.
I'm gonna get He opened the door, had the check.

(30:45):
I snatched the check and even come in the house
and it ran to the bank before ran them back
for he could cancel that ship made a list. So
we had Janet Jackson, did you have a relationship with

(31:07):
her like that you could ask her? I had a number,
You're not strangers for a million, So Janet, Prince, Tracy Chapman,
it's open, winfree. There's a woman, uh, African American woman
whose entrepreneur name is Peggy Cooper Cape Fritz from d C.

(31:28):
So there's two more people on my list, Magic Johnson.
Now one more person my list, Michael m hm. So
the only thing that people said, please do not discount,
please do not, you know, disclosed how much? So I said,
my mother's grave. No one's ever gonna know. So I

(31:51):
called my last call my main man money. So Michael
Jordan is very very competitive. You want to know how
much everybody? You know, I just mentioned the range of
what magic game he want to make that you're getting this.

(32:24):
So that money enabled me to rehire oh yeah, my people.
And we kept it quiet so there was no interaction
between myself and still it for months and of Malcolm
X's birthday made nineteen, we had a press conference at
the Schaumberg Library, Hue Street, Lennox, where we had a

(32:45):
press conference announced the names these prominent African Americans who
came through out the goodness their heart. So the vision,
so the world can see our vision of Malcolm X.
And the next day you don't happened. Warner Brothers started
to put us back on the payroll man. True story.

(33:06):
So how long? Okay? Can I ask you who's who
was the hardest pitch? Because it's weird because like, I
have a hard time getting people to come to my
DJ gigs. It's like as a a virtual stranger. I mean,
I have a hard time getting people to do this.

(33:29):
So it's like, how's your pitch? Is it lengthy? Or
is it just like black people education? It's like it's
Nation time. Wow, It's Nation time and nobody was scared.
Was this your first conversation with Prince? Like? Who was
your first? Like? Did you have That's what I'm saying.
Every I was like friends, but I knew enough that

(33:51):
I had that number, and it wasn't like, look, here's
the story. How did you even get to Prince to
be like, yo, I gotta ask him because he's kind
of elusive. I don't remember, but I got a check,
I talked, I taught everybody people because it had been
in the press though I mean, it was in the press. This,

(34:14):
I mean, the whole thing of Malcolm X was huge
about the whole banking, all this stuff, and were already
out at that point by that point to right, you know,
so it was known. And then the fact that it
was known that that that that they pulled the plug
on the money. And so people not people understood what
was at steak and they would just say how much

(34:36):
you need? And so here's the thing though, so I
have a list, everybody asking the list came through, but
every time no one said no, one said no, how
can you? E didn't go to the other Michaels. That's
about that's a matter of fact, with two other Michaels
Muslim who both were Mustlim at some point too. Because

(34:59):
at a point I had my money. Okay, so you
didn't want to go over just no, no, I just
I didn't want to be greedy. And you knew that
you needed a nine million more. That wasn't a million,
There wasn't nine million. But I just knew what I needed.
So every time I would go up and get more confidence,
get the pepper my step. So it's like a scale.

(35:19):
Every next call I'm asking for more like self determination,
self reliance, and these problem black people came together and
gave us the money to make the filing way he
wanted to make it so Tracy Chapman wasn't like, Okay,
well maybe I'll need to videos like no one, No,
it was all love, It's all up. It had nothing

(35:41):
to do with me. It's about Malcolm X. It was
about Malcolm How even more importantly, how do you get
them all in the room at the same time to
shoot that last the credit scene where they are all
they were the same room. You just made it seem no,
we we just where we could find them. We put
it on had on the wait is that a X men?
And I swear I didn't know past that. It just

(36:03):
looks like when Revolution is played by the arrested development,
who's wearing to have Michael and Magic together? Right? Okay,
the way you cut it, though, I just thought everybody
was in the room at the same time. I was
more impressed with that. I'm like, that was different. Prince
got Malcolm X or something? Did you get a baseball

(36:24):
gap just in case he wanted? Prince that's where But
that was that was I mean, because I don't know
what's gonna do. How did you pull off the mega sine?
We were the first, yes, we were the first people

(36:45):
ever allowed to bring a thirty five millimet the camera
and the Holy City of Mecca during Hajj, and so
we just had to hire a Muslim crew. Why why
why would they say they let you do it? Why
they respect alcome X as a Muslim? And again, who's
pitching them? I don't know, it's just the the amount

(37:08):
of miracles. One of the social producers from Nando Sin
somehow he talked the High Islamic Court into grant this
permission issue. Was there resistance or is there a sex
in the film? Is there they had in this look?
I'm not gonna mess aground with the High Islamic Court.
So thank thank Allah they gave us permission to shoot it,

(37:32):
because you cannot recreate what we did. When when that stuff?
I mean, come on, well on the other side of
the coin, how did you avoid the ire or anger
of the nation? Easy? In pre production, I flew to
Chicago and had a meeting with the minister, Minister Farcom

(37:55):
I had I don't want no problems. So I got
on a plane, flew Chicago and sat down with the minister,
and the minister was really not concerned how he portrayed
Malcolm X. I was gonna say, only concerned about Mohammed.
That's what Annie says, Spike, I wish you well, but

(38:18):
there hopefully you will do. Hedn't say that, but you
let me do those terms like possibly what was he
cool because you gave U a couple of gems in
the movie. But I mean, but it's deeper. There was

(38:41):
two he liked the film. He did say, Spike like
I saw him eventually after said he did like the film.
Did not Was he nominated for Best Supporting Actor? Was any?
Was any? Only? The nominators were Denzel and Rufe Carter
and Dancel lost Alpaccino for Center Ones. Wait that's the

(39:07):
NBA makeup call because Puccino is a great actor. Did
not win for god By the one to Cerprocal the Afternoon, right,
and so denzels young you'll be back boom, don't want
anyway center A woman was stupid though that It's amazing
to support me, Steve. I thought you had a good punch.

(39:29):
You're such a classic films. But look, Pacino did not
win for Godfather one Godfather Serprocal do the right thing afternoon, right,
at least one of those you should have won right
to at least Malcolm X was so crazy. I remembers

(39:53):
it's just a crazy sitting here with you. It came
out when I was in seventh grade. Cut School. No,
it's even better. I tried to get my class to
go to go see it, and I almost got it done,
but something happened and the principle was like nah, and
it ended up in the end the school I went to,

(40:20):
get ready, he can take the we gotta go see
Cut School, play hooky, go see school. I went to
Minny Hall Middle. It was like it was like a
school that was in the middle of a very affluent
neighborhood in that city. And uh, I mean yeah, but
Nimes got money that I was just saying, you know,

(40:42):
but yeah, but it was you know so but yeah.
But I was like, Yo, we should go see it.
We could make it a class trip and all this
ship and it was happening and then all of a
sudden it just got shut down. And I remember reading
it in the paper, so apparently something went down with
the principle or some ship. But they were like nah.
But I ended up going to see it myself, of course,
but it so were you fine with the parting of

(41:03):
you and Ernest at that period? I don't know why
stopped working with each other after, because Ernest I want
to do the day he came to film school told
me I'm gonna be a director. So I always knew
that day was coming when he would, you know, direct
the film and continue on that path. So we're just like,
give me five years. And no, we never talked about it,

(41:27):
but it was at Malcolm X. I knew that was
going to be the end that he was looking to direct.
But did you That's not we wanted to do. And
so look, I mean, I want people do what they
want to do, but aren't you afraid that the formula
will be different? Like damn, Like you have such a
good marriage and such an identity. I've worked with great

(41:50):
deep piece, Malis said, Ellen Curis, Uh, a whole bunch
of people, you know. So we had we had great
time together. You know, We've always had those films and
he's doing what he wants to do, which is direct.
What did you think of Juice? Loved it? This was
that Damn just just hit me that you never worked

(42:13):
with Tupac, and now I wonder what would have come
of it had Tupac acted in one of your films. Well,
I mean he had, he had conversations at all. I
don't think I ever met him. I don't. I don't
evenly remember meeting him. Wow, because when I came to
the set, he wasn't there. Juice, No, have you ever

(42:36):
met Tupac? I don't think I remember. Remember was this
inspit in the interview like this was a while. I
mean he was saying because I just support didn't come
to the premiere or Juice or something like that. No,
it's I wasn't around the set. I mean me and
Earst were like we grew up together. I have to
be on this. First of all, I don't when I'm

(42:57):
when I'm when I'm on when I'm I'm a direct
in the film, I don't go to I just I
just feel awkward on all the people's set, so I
don't go. And also, you visited Graffiti Bridge anywhere, Prince.
You couldn't have stop that. When Prince calls for you,

(43:22):
I'm coming right? Is that? How y'all got girls sick?
And how you got him to do? Oh? Yeah, I
had this script and I said, look, I said the
script when use all your songs, it's okay. And he said,
can I choose a song? And said, yeah, go ahead. Wow,
so you wrote the theme song title. Yeah, so I

(43:43):
guess we're crooking. Well, even though it's the story of
your mother, that could have been more of those the
Lee family story, the Lee family growing up and and
for like, was it anything that was I mean, the
dog didn't pop about, the castle convertible, the character did
you play with the quick and the dude, the neighbor

(44:06):
down what I'm just saying that even though you're talking
about your family, that is really something autobiographical. But to
me it was like a lighthearted okay, it wasn't a daze.
That could have been your romantic comedy or you're just
you're lighthearted. We want to do something after Malcolm X different.
That was the first time I said, my daddy cried

(44:27):
after he saw Crookland because people want to raise in
New York the scene in Crookland where where she goes
south down south, and the thought behind that, well, it's
Alice in Wonderland's in a strange place, and you know
it's crazy because people were I was confused at first,

(44:50):
but now it took me a minute to figure out
what you were going for again. Yeah, I love that.
That's one of my favorite. You know what people if

(45:13):
I if I took score, people come up. They of
all the things I've done, people say, Crooklyn. Want any
other film, more to do the right thing, more to
Malcolm X. Just on the street, just stranges, They say, Crooklyn. Yeah,
because it's at one point, yeah, and it's like a

(45:34):
not a working man's film. But you know, I feel
like your your initial arsenal the first five or six
we're so larger than life and epic and you know, again,
you have the pressure of being arsbooks person and you
have to cross every team, dot every eye that I
was gonna ask like, is there I mean, do you

(45:57):
have writers block? And I'm I'm parallel in this the songwriting? Like, okay,
so obviously Malcolm X is your thrower, your purple rain
or whatever. Like when you're trying to follow up a film,
are you just like I'm out of ideas or I
just like, where where do you go to? Well, I've
been to your career before. But here's the thing, though,

(46:18):
is that is that I've done films. I didn't direct.
I mean, I'm excusing, I didn't write. So the original
script a Krook was called hot Piece and Butdles written
my brother Sanky and my my sister Joa. So they
brought it to me. I said, I want to, you know,
rewrite it. And so that's where that that was the
origin of that. So I I always have I have

(46:42):
a bunch of stuff to make. So it's not a
thing about Rio's blocks about getting the money to make
those films. My question for you one thing I've always
amired about you, and I don't know how you do it.
You always seem to be like right on time, like timely,
so like particularly thinking of twenty hour, I mean that
came like right you know, on the hills and not living.

(47:04):
How did that come together? Was a novel by David
Bennioff of Games of Throne, and the novel takes place
before not eleven. Uh So, Edward Norton I got the
ideal to make it take place post not eleven. So

(47:26):
that's that's how that happened. Yeah, that's one of my
I think, in my opinion, that's one of your underrated joints.
Like I mean, people. They talk about do the right
thing and all the early but that one really spoke
to me. I thought, you really did a great guy
just capturing the city post like it just felt so
empty and like it was fucked up. I loved it.
Thank you know, they look at the Barry Pepper, Edward Norton,

(47:48):
the Lake Philist Mahapan Rosario, Brian Cox. Yeah, I mean
the Castle was killing it. But don't you think every person,
because that's Fante says that's his favorite. But I feel
like every person who's a Spike fan has their list
of classics and then the ones that I think people
slept on, like I think people slept on Miracle and Santana,
you know what I mean. But it seems like you

(48:10):
have those two lists of you slept. Well. Here's the thing, though,
you know, you really it's like music. You know, we
sleep on albums, you know, you just sleep on plays,
and and you just gotta hope that soon or later
people get it, you know, and that's that's all you

(48:30):
can do as an artist, you know, you just put
it out there, and once it's out in the public,
you know, really, what can you do? You know, you
can't really, especially you have millions million dollars behind you
to push it. You know, I just got it. You
just got leave it out there, you know, see what happens. Yes,
I'm slightly and I'm jumping ahead of a lot of

(48:51):
films because I felt that one of the films that
has proved itself very very accurate in time. Uh. Actually,
in this very room that we're in, you came to me,
uh m hmmm, sixteen seventeen years ago with all of

(49:17):
these minstrel toys in a bag and you pitched us
bamboozle and ask your question, Yes, did you guys take
a lot of heat for plane Alabama porch? Once? NAS
tried to use that against us because okay, well because

(49:41):
we had backed up jay z It's it was like
we chose sides during that Nas jay Z war, and
we chose when we did jay Z's Unplugged, But you didn't.
You were choosing size though we were supposed to be Switzerland.
But the thing when we did take over, like we
started music, we started doing like NAS music, so like

(50:06):
really like you know, put the put the dagger in
the heart and so you know, he he had words
for us on Hot nineties seven, but we didn't. We
didn't catch words. However, when um, uh, what's who played? Uh,
I'm about to say not not the deader man Malcolm Moo.

(50:28):
Yeah yeah, uh. He had visited the FALON set and
on like day one he happened to be like in
the NBC building and he he had Ah, he's a man.

(50:53):
Matter fact, we did Barefoot Pregnant for Spike's walkout Jimmy Fallon.
Is that an original song? That? Yeah, we just made
it up on the spot. I've been waiting for that,
the show up on the Roots album for the last
sixteen years. Did you think porch monkeys or here's the

(51:18):
thing was? It was like, I wast it? No, hell,
no good, here's the thing. I was like at first,
I thought, come on, man, like when all right, here's
the deal you. I didn't know if you were doing
the school days on us. But for some reason, the

(51:42):
trailer for the Roots and we had to put on
black face and all that ship the trailer for the
Roots and we're in those jail suits. The trailer, no, no,
the our dressing room trailer was three blocks away from
where we have to shoot that school in face, no

(52:06):
context whatsoever. I didn't know that, and you know, this
was our breakout year, so you know, pre things fall apart,
you know, I was like the guy with the weird
head or you know, you have the Snoop Dogg haircutter.
But I was definitely quest love at that point, and

(52:28):
there was a thank god social media wasn't out at
that point. It was it was like people's hearts when
they saw Welcome, they was okay, No, they were just confused,
like what the hell was this? And m because I
had the red lipstick. So it wasn't even like y'all
could do the dead presidents with the white doing it

(52:53):
for a week, just doing it without context of people
just think there were no cell phones back then, none
us up and by the last day I was like,
let me find out Spikes trying to school days us
And so when I saw the film, I was like, damn,
this is this is a hard peel to swallow, Like

(53:13):
what's the likelihood? Because I knew by that point the
only menstrel we really truly had to worry about was like,
you know, up N had that out of space and yeah,
a secret that's stuff. And it was a funny slave show.
I was like a slave rom com I mean, we

(53:33):
were excited because it's like our first feature thing. But
and the fact I was like, maybe Spike went over
the top with this one. But then maybe five years
later I was like, oh, just like they said in Bamboozel.
Next year, Oh yeah, that's right there, just just like Bamboozel.
But then by year ten, I remember hitting up like,
I was like, Yo, do you find it strange that

(53:55):
all the things that Spike was talking about back in
two thousand's happening now? It's like bamboos and an idiocracy
or like too prophetic films? Yeah, their documentaries. Yeah, So
I mean you, I mean, if you have the dart

(54:16):
in your hand, I would say that you know, you
weren't exactly maybe you were kind of like sixty one
back in two thousands. Now I'm thinking that you, well,
did you really foresee that we wound up in the

(54:39):
post menstrul entertainment hell that we are in right now?
Where I saw it coming and uh what I wanted
coming though, I mean, Tyler, it was just this album

(55:04):
I totally forgot you're talking about. I just think that
I've always felt that you could tell who we are
as the people bar music that really tells you know
who we are, boy, damn music, and I just did
and I just saw it going south and uh literally
or no Southland, no South Islander. I'm not doing that.

(55:29):
No South Islander. Come you lived down south? But come on,
you know you from Queens. We adopted you, bro, I'm
Carolina going and raised man, I ain't going nowhere claimed

(55:52):
you man, We claimed you. Okay, that's cool. I where's
your heart? My heart it's still line. Yeah, you have
a Northeast liberal, you are I'm a Northeast liberal. Hath
a Northeast liberal. Okay. I just think that was going
you know, down, not south, but down, and that we
were losing. We're forgetting who we are where great people

(56:18):
come from, great ancestors, and we were losing that for
the fame of money and fame praying at the on
our knees, praying at the altar, the almighty dollar. And
this was examination of this character. They lea Choi who

(56:43):
lost his soul trying to be successful and then uh,
once he got woke, it was too late. And it
was also when that thing was made, it was a
hundred anniversary of film, and it was anniversary of television.

(57:08):
So I why the show how these two mediums have
the based our answers are people who we are. But
that same film can be made about the debasement of
Native Americans women. So it's how I mean, if you

(57:30):
look a look at the films to John Ford and
John Wayne, look what they Native Americans a savages and
this whole the humanization of people through the powerful means
of television and sentiment. That's why we have that that
very very hard, hard hard montage at the end, which

(57:54):
is really painful to see by felt that you know,
we need to Why is it that that your people,
Jewish people talk every day about the Holocaust and that's great,
you know, we should deal with our own Holocaust too,
And that's what that films about. I was just what

(58:16):
was yeah you said, because that means I got the floor, right,
I just coincidentally maybe or I don't know, um my
favorite one of your films, bimbos. Yeah, with the just
the most direct message, most in your favorite message, alright,
Malcolm X. And then that's the truth. I believe you.

(58:40):
I believe you. So it was a very very I mean,
just like this stuff that you talked about, those those
the memorabilia, the jolly Nigga bank and all that stuff.
That is it was a real thing thing and I
invite everybody to go to the National Museum of African

(59:00):
American History and Culture where they have a crazy display
of the history of the minstrel. Well did you okay?
So even even more than just the minstreul angle Reality TV,
just with Reality TV and the viral natil that we
are in now, snuff film, the live streaming snuff film.

(59:23):
Oh my god. Yeah, the girl killing her sister in
the car. I mean like you and Eric the murder
Eric Gardner's the snuff film and we go on. I
I mean every there's just snuff films we're seeing because
after a certain amount of views it is yeah h wow.

(59:43):
Kind of did that interrupt you? Oh well? The only
question had a black What was the decision to shoot?
Because you shot that on digitally many TV, so my
questions what was it budget? Was it a budget? It was?
It was two things. It was artistic and budget cheer.

(01:00:06):
But we wanted to shoot the performance on on digital
tape and everything and everything else on film because most
TV shows are filmed on tape. So that was that
was Ellen. Curious again, was it the DP did a
great job. So that was the decision to do it
like that. Oh I love the the end for the

(01:00:35):
entitle song Misrepresented People No shadow Lands by Bruce Hornton. Great, yeah, great,
great song. It's the soundtrack to Ye Stevie Mr. Speaking
of the soundtracks, how did you and Stevie get together
for Jungle Fever? Did you had you already chosen to

(01:00:59):
do the The scene was living for the City and
then but that was the only song that was not
written for the I was asking, did you ask Stevie
after you had made this wrote the script? I since
see script and he said, please do do the songs
for us. He said okay, And everybody told me that

(01:01:20):
he would not do it in time. But ye, I
was gonna say, how did you because when he had
no no records ready between eight and the script was
transcribed in to Brail and we would send them scenes
and you know, he goes Stevie goes the movies all

(01:01:41):
the time, and uh, he came through. One of my
favorite songs on the album is a Chemical Love. Remember that. Yeah,
some people don't dry drunk. Being my band for exchange,

(01:02:01):
we covered that's from from Jungle all right. So we're
getting on the bus. Did you knowing that the event?
How much in advance did you have before? You were like, okay, yeah,
that's what I'm saying, Like it was so on time.
We had like really probably two months to shoot it.

(01:02:24):
I mean, they came to me, so let's do this film.
They came to you, who say, oh, I forget I uh,
I'm bad with names now, but they said, we got
this film, I want to shoot it. Road movie. And
you didn't write it. No, Reggie Rock wrote it. Okay, Reggie,

(01:02:48):
Yeah he wrote it. Oh, Gina, And okay, oh I
didn't do it. Okay, okay, okay. So it's a road movie.
I'm trying to get everything out there. We didn't touched
when where is Girl six? In the We kind of did,
but I just had a Teresa I always say, Randall, Randall,
Teresa random question because she had such in Malcolm X

(01:03:09):
and in Jungle Fever, like especially young if People was
a smaller role, and of course Malcolm X more still small,
but like what why her? Like, I mean, it's it's
very hard for black women too say that in the mics.
I couldn't hear everybody. It's very hard for black women
to sustain long careers and very talented, very attractive. And

(01:03:39):
I don't know what happened, but I mean, I mean
bad boys, but I mean she father what history he is?
Jesus the story of Sorry, Mcca Feiffer. Is it the
story true about him taking pictures at the walmart and

(01:04:00):
bring them to you? For? Uh? For she got I
don't know, cousin, what's that story? McKay accompanied his cousin
to the audition and we asked him, do you want audition?
You're here? So he came in and he got the role. Wow,

(01:04:27):
seeing you were seeing Robbie, does she do all those
in the room? Okay, okay, Robbie like pre screen stuff.
But you know, like I was in the room when
I saw, McKay said, because he was in comfortable. This
just came because because I said, come with me. Wow,
you look at him now? So for he got game?

(01:04:49):
First of all, what urkes you about basketball films that
I don't fake what I'm using. I'm not saying fake
news just don't look real. And here's the thing though,
where I sit in Masquare Garden, I did not want
players on the NIXT or posing teams say, Spike, that
movie is bullshit. So the last uh scene of Denzel

(01:05:13):
and ray playing that was a real game. Oh yeah,
it's scripted. His famous famous story is scripted that Rays
posted when he live in Zip. Denzel No, Denzel was
on forums JV team. His coach was Peter Chrismo, and

(01:05:36):
Denzel says an athlete. So his thing was like, funk
what the script says. I'm scoring at least one basket.
It would be a moral victory. And so Denzel started
throwing up some humble ship it was going in and
Rayon was shocked because this race first films where you

(01:06:00):
gotta do what descriptions. Spike was up. He stopped all
the way. He's not to get any basket like this
all you want me to do? So after that race
that then doesn't score another basket. But it was a
moral victory, and it was better for the film too,
that that the Denzel that that that Jake shuttles Worth

(01:06:25):
got those baskets. But the scripted raised g supposed when
he lives Zip and and and Ray did not know
best that the desert could play. I didn't know that
made a Fordams JV team on the So how did you.

(01:06:50):
I mean, just what is it as a non sports
junkie asking you guys, No, I'm not I'm not sports
So what am I missing in sports films that you
see or you look at sports film the way that
looked like music films, like, Okay, his fingering is not
right and it's not real. Earl Monroll from Philadelphia was it?

(01:07:15):
It was a basketball consultant on the film, and we
just wanted that's where we cast real players. We've cast
real players, so we get the you know, how much
patience did you have to have with your actors who
didn't have that much experience acting real? Yea, yeah. One

(01:07:40):
of the world's greatest acting coach is Susan Batson, who
was there every day with him. So I mean, I
think Ray did a great job, you know, and and
just that whole again. For me, it's more than a
basketball film for me, that that's a father and son's story.
I'm gonna get to the end. I swearted my I

(01:08:04):
don't know, I've seen I've seen Summer Sam maybe at
the right time, but I don't know that's it's it's
not like it, you know, it wouldn't be in my
my Spike type top three. But for some reason, you know,
I'm picking that in my I love that film. She uh,

(01:08:26):
I like thrillers. I wish you would do more thrillers.
You know, it's just it. Yeah. And in fact, you
got Jimmy Breslin to like do it. That was crazy. Yeah,
the beginning and the end like the book because thea
Burg was on Sam. He was writing, let us to

(01:08:47):
Jimmy Breslin. I mean, that's what I want him to
it to be the book in and you know he
just recently passed that blessed us all. Great guy, great guy.
So my question for insight man, is was there a
not Again, I don't know if there's ever a pressure,
but I mean, inside man, you made your you're you

(01:09:12):
know you're opening. The opening was marvelous knowledge stuff. So
for you, was it just like, Okay, I want to
show Hollywood that I know how to make I'm gonna
play their game. And you know, not, not really, because
it was a great script and there was a chance
to work again with my man, Denzel Washington, and and

(01:09:37):
I like that genre, and we we we screened all
day afternoon like numerous times by a great director, Sydney.
So it was a fun It was a fun film
Russell Russell Gorvitt's first I'm screenwriter and the twist at

(01:10:02):
the end, we know we would get people. The funny
thing about that film is that that the it was critical,
the fine actor would stand up to Denzel because most actors,
you know, Denzel could run over you. How how easy

(01:10:30):
The way he does it is a quiet attext. We
use it to direct Denzel is Denzel. You can't tell
me nothing, no, no, you let Denzel do his thing.
And then there's certain things that you know, who listen,
but you know he doesn't need you to say do this,
do this this. You know that's that's disrespectful. You know
you never do that, is it? Yes? But even though

(01:10:52):
you get the final word, well, I mean, and we
never We've never had had an instant. I mean it's
like sometimes you said, Spike, I think I got us okay,
and sometimes I said I need one more and he said, cool,
let's do it. But you know we we've it's always
been me and him been been mad mad cool. But
want to get back to the other point is that

(01:11:13):
Denzel is so powerful that he makes all actors shrink.
And he's a timid dating, so I knew I had
to get an actor. It was like, it's not going
to be afraid of Denzel, Like Clyde was like, fun this,
I'm a man too, and you needed that that happens. Yes, well,

(01:11:35):
I was just the script a little bit. But I mean,
like if you have a script and say, like there's
a scene where I have conflict with Denzel's character and
I had to argue, you're saying that he's so powerful
of an actor that I might aimidation. It's like if
you're playing on stage with somebody this, Yeah, but I've

(01:11:57):
figured that, and I'm not judging didn't. I'm just saying
that I figured that a wise veteran actor. Would I
want you to shine with them? Or is it just
because it might be that your character's roll that you
gotta do your thing and so if if the somebody
to stand up against you, it's gonna be like a slaughter.

(01:12:18):
And that's why, because you had to have this conflict
where they were like head the head and if someone
was weak assoft you' you won't believe it. And that's
why it was Thank god we've got Clive Owen. So
can I ask you were you did you know that

(01:12:40):
Denzel had him to do training day because when I
watched that ship, I was like, oh God, who knew?
I never knew? How come you weren't tempted to show
that because because the films I did didn't that wasn't
a role. I mean, you get someone, you see someone,
and he got game. No yeah, yeah, but he he

(01:13:04):
was also at the mercy of you know, like he
was on his knees, not on his but or he
was on his knees and humbled because he was in
prison and trying to broker deal. But when he came
out though, he was smack punch. I'm not going to
see how I know that, but are Here's the thing

(01:13:33):
I'm going to repeat this though, is that I knew
Denzel had in a train date. But what what fling
with that? What that was not worked in mo Beta?
H Yeah? I mean did you come up with a
vehicle that would maybe even he'd like the Detroit red out? Yeah? Yeah,

(01:13:56):
he was pure gangster. Yeah hit hit the upside in
the Great Bar to just close the Harlem. Yeah, lets lous.
They even took the sign down. It's crazy side the
guys here with the bottle. Oh he's definitely American. That's
just that's that's that's the American gangster and train dated

(01:14:18):
you read would you ever have? Do you think it's
in you to come up with a fifth vehicle? Fourth
vehicle for you and him to work. I'm sorry, but
all the time, you know, I just gotta to be
the right right First of all, you gotta get him
because he's it's just act like at JFK, I mean

(01:14:40):
like moves the next two years and ship. Were you
really proud of the defenses? I mean that was his
to Mike robbed again, but him director just the product itself.
But I know that he also did The Great Debaters.
But is a director, Yeah, he was more. That was

(01:15:02):
like his passion project. Did he direct Antoine Fisher too? Yeah,
that's we've called Derek Luke. Yeah, I forgot is a
total package. All right, We we can go on forever.
I'm trying. I'm a rapid fire of this. Okay. So

(01:15:24):
as as a musician, there are songs that I wish
I had written. As a director, I really got really
under my skin when I first heard outcast of Spodioti
Dope Policious. It's not a hit, but I just wish

(01:15:44):
I came up with that. Well, yeah, it's in the
hearts of But I really wish I had my hand
in that because I got something to say. That's all
I gotta say. Shut up, Um, but are there movies
or projects that you, well, besides Jackie Robinson and James Brown,

(01:16:08):
films that I didn't direct. Specifically, one film that you
wish you directed, be it success or failure, that you
wish you had your version of it. I wish he
directed Ali for the record, but I wanted to director,
had interviewed for it, I didn't get the job. Wow,

(01:16:29):
who did you have to talk to for Colored Girls
at Ali? Yeah? Was it was? Who was the executive?
Will and James Lasser? Yikes? You know that's interesting. Never mind,
am I getting anybody? And that's yeah, because they're both.

(01:16:52):
I was just thinking, that's interesting. They're both brothers. It's Overbrooke.
They had to you know, and they chose Michael Man exactly.
So I was just thinking, that's interesting. I mean, it wasn't.
I mean, it was just six. I mean, does the
studio have to say too? So you wish that Ali
was your I would like to director. I would like
to direct that Jackie Robison, James Brown too. I wish

(01:17:15):
it doesn't James probably. I still think there's others to do.
We didn't talk about your documentary work at all. That
could be we won't get into it now. Um, if
you could do a director cut of any of your movies,

(01:17:36):
which one would you do? Wait? Is there a four
hour Malcolm X? We knew that it was never gonna
be four hours, but that was the first cut that
we showed. Is there a version of it unscathed? Is
there a four hour cut? Thinking? Is Warner Brothers. You

(01:17:57):
don't have a copy for yourself, you don't keep a demo,
keep the man we were. That was the last thing
we wo think about then. Damn. But the for the documentaries,
I mean, I'm very proud of them, the two Katrina

(01:18:20):
and then Little Girls story about full Little Girls. So
while we're in pre production, uh, we found the postal
more than pictures of the full Little Girls, and I

(01:18:43):
kept praying and praying should I include these photographs? And
find just made a decision. We have the show how
hate looks like, How the Clan looks like? How does
myrtles look like? How these reading that racists look like?

(01:19:05):
And so included the photographs. And I did not tell
the parents that we included. You know, they were shook,
or some of them, Dana Dan's parents were and then

(01:19:26):
they were shook them but they understood why why I
did it? And this who we are as a people.
I mean, you know, it's amazing that we as black
people don't go off. Man. I mean, we're talking about

(01:19:50):
ps what's it called. We had that from slavery. That's
still with us, that is still with us. And we're
not a lot of us aren't mentally, you know, we're
not right because we're still dealing with the investiges of
slavery and and and and washing television and seen as

(01:20:10):
being shot down like dogs and then cops walking away
like nothing, no, not nothing, they even happened. And I
mean it's crazy now today, I know this is not
gonna be this will be seeing dated. But today that
they passed, you know, getting rid of Obamacare, I mean,

(01:20:32):
and and those are these guys. They have no heart,
no love. They're just cold blood and murderous because people
are gonna die if they can't get the stuff they
got through Obamacare. They don't want to give a fuck.

(01:20:55):
It's it's it's, it's it's and that's why I to
give a shout to man jay Z. That album. I
gotta give it up. You know, I've always been a fan,
but this new album, I mean, it's it's amazing. Have
you ever worked with anything? I did one thing for him,
there was a short film called to be jay Z

(01:21:17):
for one day. It was for his for his rocket wear.
But other than that, that's it. Did you just send
us into the album? I wonder because I know, okay,
oh yeah, my son he's on it. You'll be hitting
me ship because folks, you know, sometimes they say that's
a little bit of an older person's album in that way.
But there's certain things that the certain things that my
wife and I town, you know, they asked questions, so

(01:21:39):
we have to break it down. But you know there's
something they don't know. My daughter too, who just graduated
n y U. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah she do. Yeah.
He's working at MTV the new RTL showy. One question
I had for you is about remakes. How do you

(01:22:02):
detern what the remake? Because what you did the Sweet
Blood of Jesus, which was the Gods that was a
very odd. Yeah. I've never seen that very early on
when I was in film school. It was written by
a really underrated black filmmaker, play right Bill Gunn and

(01:22:26):
uh so one the film school, and always I love
that film and thought about, you know what, how would
how would we do that today with this whole religious
you know impact, you know, and then going back to
Africa and stuff like that. And it's not a horror film,

(01:22:48):
m and I never saw Dr Hess as a vampire,
but these are people who knee blood and you really
use blood as as a for a lot of other things.
So that that film was great about that. Then was

(01:23:10):
shooting Mars Video because I've always wanted to shoot a
film mans. Idn't even heard of Mars Veni in one
of my classmates, and there's always been a large black
community manas Veneon up and down East Coast, you know,
professional black folks. And my friend was from Philly, John Wilson.
One we were in school. He said, you should come
to Mars have a house, my grandma's house, Mars Vide, said,

(01:23:31):
Mars Video. I went there, I loved and I said,
one day, Lord, if you ever get any money, I
want to buy a brownsed On Brooklyn season ticket. The
Knicks and in the house. What you consider doing the
Kickstarter round again for that was that that was I

(01:23:53):
can't do that again. But what people might not know
we were you using the strategy a Kickstarter its marketing
to make them no, no, to make She's gonna have
it right, you know. So we just had the technology
and so it's always been my thing, like, you gotta,

(01:24:15):
you gotta whatever you gotta do, you know, short of
killing somebody and going to jail and still be honest,
you gotta do. We gotta do to get the films
made because this is an industry art phone. We need money.
And now with the technology people making films, but there
there iPhones. Yeah, you and Tyler Perry or maybe Tyler

(01:24:39):
Perry had beef with you. He had words for you,
and he was very vocal at one time saying, well,
if you think my movies are bad, you know, why
don't you try to help me? Or whatever? What would
you say as a director and director speak, what could
make his movies better? Me and Tyler Perry are cool.
All that stuff that's been squashed like four or five

(01:25:00):
years ago. So I mean it's it's it's really, you know,
nothing to dig up. You know, we're cool. He's doing
a thing. You know, we gotta love each other. And
you know, we flew down Atlanta. I said, yo, we
gotta speak. Got got on the plane, Delta, went to

(01:25:21):
his house. Who sat down. We talked. You know, we said, well,
whatever we discuss, will just keep between us and say,
well cool, and and that was that's that's what happened.
I had that conversation before Color for Color Girls. You know,
I I wish I can't wait for the day where

(01:25:43):
he's just a producer and not star. Well, I like
him as an actor and a baby girl was a lawyer.
But I had to sit through the trailer for Boom too,
so Boom Boom the second the second one. Yeah, what

(01:26:08):
Hallen Halloween, Lord Halloween. I'm just doing trails for Halloween
films already. Yeah. I saw when I went to a
lot of Black Panthers next year Black History Month, So well, yeah,

(01:26:28):
I'm just saying that I can't wait for the where
he's just producer and that he finds and he's just
the you know, our tour and the curator of other
talent to come in and in precious studio. Speaking of which, okay, yes,

(01:26:48):
basically the Red Stone the Ship. Um, did you and
Eddie Murphy ever have a Kumbaya conversation moment? Just since
never found the project? Wait what you no? He just
never we just never found together. I know he was excited.

(01:27:09):
I know Chris rock told when he was on the show.
He spoke of Eddie Murphy and all of them coming
to see she's gonna have She's got to have it
and you know, having a screener of it. But just
during that period, like, did you guys ever, did he
ever try to invite you to be in the Black Pack?

(01:27:30):
And that sort of thing and a funny story during
do the Right Thing? Halfway through a spike, I want
to get you guys a party. That's when he lived
in that was it called Bubble Hill we tourist house up.

(01:27:53):
Time was broken. I left when people started jumping in
the pool naked. That's out of him. Do the do
the younger guys? The young cats come up like av
she you know Ava doing a and like Ryan Coogler,
did they chop it up with you today? Come to
you for advice or game or whatever? Uh my man

(01:28:16):
did when he was doing uh Rocky, he came to
mind office and office n y U. But here's the
thing though, you know, like look people, people have my numbers,
so it's you know, I'm people want to speak, I'm available,
So it's not like I'm trying to you know. Like,

(01:28:39):
what about with your cousin Malcolm? Yeah, yeah, girls and girls, Yeah,
big shout out to my first cousin, Malcolm Lee, my father,
his father, brothers, and uh, he's doing this thing, doing
that thing. What's the what's the age gap between you two? Like?
Were you when I wasn't? In fact, when I was

(01:29:02):
at n y U, I was living in his basement
and Crown Heights, So Malcolm was in high school when
I was in uh grad film? Were you the reason
why he got in the film? That's what he says.
That's what he says. I mean, I mean his cousin
was a big movie director, so it wasn't it was

(01:29:23):
an influence. But but you know he's done it on
his own, you know, so power to him, you know,
happy for him. Whose images are you feeling? Like who's
what's the last couple of projects that you saw? And
he was like, I'm appreciating this voice. Well, my two
films I saw last year I'm not your Negro, ro

(01:29:48):
Peck and o J in America. Those are my joints.
I mean those those were monumental. Did you get out?
You loved it too, but but I loved it. But
for me, I just those two films I mentioned before,
I'm not your Negro and Old J in America. Did

(01:30:11):
you see Moonlight? Yeah? What what was your take on?
Like the too? But my two favorite, I mean just
my preferl Yeah, you know, I'm not your need to view,
so yes, yeah, I saw that, actually saw that one
time I was up here we were taking Yeah, I'm
just always curious to hear just what you know, the
movies that we like as consumers, but you as a director,

(01:30:33):
like what you see? You know the new joint though
is dunk Kirk. Yeah, but you gotta go Christopher Noan's
no joke. So that wasn't big on Stellar, but I
heard because like that, do we need to do the
seventy MILLI yeah, you got to see the Imax six
eight and Andy okay seven million? I mean I heard

(01:30:58):
they earned their nine round tomatoes, so that ship. Look,
Christopher Nolan's a serious director. He's dope, and it's hardly
any dialogue in it too, and no and no and
no blue screams. All that's just real. No green screams. Wow, Okay,
I'm gonna take yeah, because I'm getting the last question

(01:31:20):
on this. How can I see the entire last hustle
in Brooklyn aside from just the clip in the Off
the Wall documentary One Day when I'm gonna come go
back to go back, do color correction, sick up the sound.
But the thing about lot that music was never cleared.
You know, there's all disco music. She's got to have it.

(01:31:40):
Netflix series. Yes, when is that dropping? Thanksgiving Day? Can
tell Black Excellence Bench Day the Wanda Miller. I recently,
I'm sorry, I recently fell in love with her Underground
shots fired Bush with don't even know the sequence of

(01:32:01):
the cast and if you were third or whatever, but
we were after that, okay, okay, So what made you
decide she was no dope? Yeah, she's like dope. You
know who's gonna be gonna who know who's gonna surprise
people in this who? Fat Joe, fat joke. I'm telling you.

(01:32:25):
This character is called whin he Win and he plays
h the MC owner of Burluss club called the HoTT
and trop Wow, how many episodes? Ten? I directed them all?
Is it our half hour? Half half o? What's this
giving day? What's the can you give us like the
premise or like what's the kind of Well it's really

(01:32:47):
updating of the original film, but now it takes in
a gentrified Ford Green gentrified for cream. So is there
a Mars Blackman and the noble darling marsh Blackness now
Black and Puerto Rican. It's played by the Great Triple
for Anthony Ramos from used to Have from Hamilton's Hamilton's.

(01:33:14):
I know the dude from Hamilton is on Black Boy.
That's that's one day I'll take it. I'm not I'm
never going to see Hamilton's, sir, I'm not that rich.
I'm so sorry. You know, the producer of it, I
was told nothing Hamilton's Hamilton's for twenty years. Black is

(01:33:35):
now after Black and Puerto ricant Um, Oh well this
last one red Hood Summer Nolah Darlings. Uh. I was
like sad to see. I was like, damn, Like she
really just is the church lady just like life. It
was so that was based on a real character or

(01:33:58):
she that's strange. Camilla John's real life. Now, yes, she's
a Pentecoster preacher. Wow. Wow picture. So she changed her life.
So she left music, left movies and found the lord. Wow.

(01:34:22):
The only reason I have considered to do this is
because I wish to clear money. Wow, that's in it.
That's it. We brought that back. So Tracy, she's in
the in the she has a cameo. Okay, that's dope, Bill.
Anything you got left, I think I'm you got any questions,

(01:34:42):
but okay, I want to go back to with the
nightclub scene with Bra. Did you choose the song? I
choose all the music, and did you choose it before
you shot it or did it come afterwards? No, bras
one of them one of those songs where I knew
you know it? Okay, because somewhere like that is just so,

(01:35:04):
it was so worthing. It was on the cipher, right
was the Yeah, just mixed that like that's comedian extraordinary,
that's yeah, he's career in the comedy. Aio was dancing that.
She was mad at me, Yes she was. You know,
we weren't having Spike. Okay, I'm done. I have But

(01:35:33):
the first first time I saw Zara was en that
film kids. Yeah, yeah, yes, so she hate me. I'm
going to start by saying, before Carrie Washington and Diana Ramirez,
I too enjoyed those that situation, Anthony, Yes, any regrets.

(01:35:58):
I always thought it was interesting that so many means
wanted to have sex with one man. It was esbians.
She feels like it was your midlife crisis film and
that was your portion is like that's when I was like,

(01:36:24):
oh damn, Carrie, what's what's it here for? Like that
was not Carrie Washington from saying the last Dance, not
at all, so that it was a film we want
to do at a time what people think. What I
really liked about that film was well we had the
cheuytail character. Yes, that was the Yeah, it's yeah. Here's

(01:36:52):
the thing though, if you watch CNN with this whole
stuff happened with the White House, all these guys are
half dead. They're talking about Watergate, John Dinos motherfucker's They
never talk about Frank Wells. It was this guy, this brother,
if he didn't cast those crooks the whole war, the

(01:37:12):
thing would never happen. And he's dead. He died pendless.
And every time they talk about warter Gate, they never
mentioned his brother Frank Wells, but it looks I'm not ashamed.
Only Here's the thing, though, I'd say this all the time,

(01:37:33):
all the films I've done, the only thing I haven't
regret because the only thing I regret was the rape scene,
and because that was immature and made light of such

(01:37:53):
a horrible act the one could do another human being.
That is the only thing everything that's interesting because I
remember we watched that in a class in college, and
I remember we watched it and it was it was
mixed crowd, it was men and women. And the teacher,
professor came up and she was like she was in

(01:38:14):
the after we were discussing, and she's like, so what
do you think about the rape scene? And like half
the class was like huh, like that was a yeah,
Like it's just odd. Just I mean you say that
you regreted, like because I didn't read it that way.
When I first I was trying to think, I was like,
I can't even remember it to be. When I first
saw the eight teen, I just thought it was in
passion love scene. And then when I started reading more

(01:38:37):
and stuff than I realized like, oh, that's supposed to
be a rape scene. Yeah, I read the screenplay first
before I saw the movie and so you So then
no regrets about she taking them? None? Okay, so none?
What's what about like specific shots of the specific shots

(01:38:58):
to you which she could shoot over? You guys are
kind of stuf? Can I just ask my questions to
ask Steve? Do you have anything? Yes? Mr Lee? What
what can I as a white person if you make

(01:39:24):
your films? Nothing? But that was one of Malcolm's regrets
that he told that, yes, the white coch student, that
I watched your extras. He regrett he told her nothing
that is on your extras? What did he I didn't

(01:39:44):
see the extras? What do he wish? He would have said,
go back and talk to your people, don't you go? Steve? Yeah?
I told her white girlfriend who's starting to day black dudes,
you can't do that if you ain't seen those Bike
Lee movies. That's the way I'm because tributing. You can
see the collective? All right? So Spike Spike thriller? Yes

(01:40:13):
or no? Are you going to It's not up to me,
it's up to the state. Was the estate happy with
bad They loved it very much. Was the state happy
with off the Wall. Yes, so you gotta wait for

(01:40:33):
Have you had a conversation yet or it hasn't come
up yet. Well, we had conversations, but they're not I
don't think they got other stuff they're doing before. I'm sorry,
what's what's what else? What else is it? Michael Jackson's
arsenal that was coming out or in film? If you

(01:40:53):
listen to me, I got some TV shows stuff like that. Okay, nice?
I mean asking Spike Lee if he's going to direct
the Thriller documentary. I want to because I would if
I was able to, if I was blessed to get
to do trilogy. I'm done because I mean to do

(01:41:15):
to do Thrill that'd be a trillogy for me. Trilogy.
I'm done. Let someone else Dangerous pass. I'll be happy
to pass the baton on. But Dangerous is a new
jack classic in my eyes. No, I mean, I'm I'm
just saying that would be the only one to do
it because he did the video for Remember the Time. Okay,

(01:41:36):
actually yeah, it's actually a three part um. Okay, this
is kind of my rapid fire. Okay, No, I'm just running.
Can you name me three directors? Uh that came under

(01:41:57):
the leaves of your tree or or your family tree,
that you've enjoyed their work. Three African American directors that
you've Malcolm Lee, Ernest Dickinson, uh, d Rees, Yeah, she was,
she was my student. Well and why you those three

(01:42:20):
now three acting students or three first timers that didn't
have any history and films that have now blossomed to
actors like who's your you're, you're, you're, you're, you're starting
three squad, like the three students that you're proud of
in the acting world, Like I didn't teach an actor,
were not acting, but you know that you've the first

(01:42:44):
film that are now like hey, like a halle Berry
I was first that wasn't I mean halle Berry Rosie
Uh but that Thieve was Queen Lativa's first film. So

(01:43:07):
it's just the black and captis. Remember that. So those three,
you're the proudest of it that they Okay, Now the
same question for four crew because I know that besides
Ernest Dickerson bleek, I can't imagine all the cinematographers and

(01:43:30):
editors leak start as electric. I'm Malcolm X not one
of the best dps. Ellen curist who shot Summer sam Full,
Little Girls Bamboozled. Uh, my newest dp UH genteral named
Dan Daniel Patterson morehouse man. Also what was my student
and yu who shot up all the episodes for She's

(01:43:52):
Got to Have It? Who? Who? Side question? Yes? I
even answeride questions to my final questions. You've been your
longest uh ally employee that's been with you since it?
Has there been someone that's been there since the beginning,
like your editor or your costume designer or your craft services, right,

(01:44:16):
they are people that work with but there has been
like every single film, so you know a lot of
times when I'm shooting something, they have another film. So
what what three actors have you yet to work with
that you were like, I want Sean Penn is one. Wow,
damn I would see I could have seen Sean pen

(01:44:39):
In Sean Penn mm hmm dead air, dead hair. Uh,

(01:44:59):
you've never worked with no never you know? You know,
will you ever work with the hopefully you know who's
potential be a great actress Solange. I think I see
that he wants to act and not that's another thing,
but I think that great potential. Uh Morgan Freeman ain't

(01:45:24):
getting no is it just funny guys like who has
he not just been around? Would you ever worked with
Morgan Freeman? We that did not happen, But you worked
with I'm to be a black actor. That was just

(01:45:45):
just a random legendary black actor. That's I was like, oh,
that's the one that he works a lot. But you
said that, I mean I would like to. I was
too young, but I wish I could have worked with
Paul Newman. Ah that film, Uh cool hand lucas a moment. Yeah,
that's so yeah, yes, yes, I'm sorry. Did you ask

(01:46:14):
that because it was a white film? My head? Is
that right? Okay? So I don't know if directors can
divide their scenes like their songs from an album whatever,
But in your arsenal, what do you feel are your

(01:46:37):
three most important scenes? Okay, your three most important scenes? Like,
I'm after more than three? Uh, you gotta give me
three guns of your head three? I'm burning all your
other worlds. His house is burning? Uh? I would say,

(01:46:58):
Mooky thrown at Garls and do the window absolutely assassination
Malcolm X and uh that scene in Edwin Norton's talking
into the mirror, m M okay, tricky. I thought the

(01:47:18):
I could swear in your number one would have been
the Tis Mahon scene. Oh oh, yet you said only
three though, okay, but the fact that that wasn't even
your got it? I mean, okay, no, I'll think those
three um again, the expanded version that that was your songs.

(01:47:39):
You're you're the three albums and three albums, the three
films that when you're going and of mind, if we
look at your cannon, what are the three films that
you weren't representing your work? For me, that's that's It's
like picking kids. Pick your three favorite kids. You you

(01:48:02):
have twenties choice. Here's the thing, though, you you say
you love all your children the same. We might like
them tell about darkness, but I would just say I've
done so many films that I leave it up to
I'm telling you, I can't pick three gun to your head, man.

(01:48:24):
I can't pick three guns of your head, house on fire.
I can't pick three universal house burning all the reels.
You can't pick three, Okay, the opposite, the opposite. You
gotta kill three. You gotta kill three with three films?

(01:48:46):
With three films? Do you kind of wish I'm cool?
Nobody sees that as I said before, the only thing
I wish I could do over the rape scene, and
she's gonna have it. Because everything I've done, for good

(01:49:07):
or bad, is the experience that helps me what the
next film is. So that's that's the way it is.
Is learned how to hone your skills. You know, good, bad,
and different. Every time you'll learn something new, different circumstances,
and if you're smart, the lessons that you learn, you'll

(01:49:28):
apply that to the next film. He's not gonna answer
your question, what is the most overlooked Spike Lee film
in your opinion? I got a lot of those, like
the one you think that most people really should see
or see again. Well, I don't think people saw miracles
sat An. I don't think people saw Bamboozo when here's

(01:49:54):
the thing. No, there's two there's two categories. How many
people to see when it came out versus people discovered
you know later on, So Bambooze goals in that character
where people discovered it discovered it. Miracle is saint? Now?
What was there? Was a novel? It was based on
the novel by James McBride, almost wrote The Color of Water,

(01:50:16):
almost entered the casting call for extras for that movie
for real. I had a homie that was in that.
He was he was one of the ex did he
go overseas? Yeah? Three than he ain't gonna remember the name,
but not Than something. I don't want to embarrassing you
called him. We had we had the cassise these guys

(01:50:40):
to play the uh, the Buffalo Soldiers, but none of
them had passports. We had to go to Italy like scrambling,
you know, to get to get past That's why I
did single all about it is at the top of
our list now for requirements, he must have a passport. Yeah,
he was telling was real. He was like, yo, he's like, man,

(01:51:00):
we had the cannons was going off and he was
like it was real, Like there was really like income
back and he said, for like when he came back,
it took like he kind of had PTSD after the shoot.
Like it was like he would be going to sleep
and he couldn't you know, He's still be hearing the
ship going off. It was crazy. Okay, this is my final,
My final final Final Questions two parts. Spike the episode

(01:51:27):
absolutely no. First of all, I appreciate you for doing this, Spike.
Thank you just been amazing man. Yeah, my macarons for you.
So that's a good well. I brought it for everybody,
but appreciate the ship because we were too busy talking.
People don't eat macarons. We don't you want that on there?

(01:51:47):
Five million people don't offer no black personal okay. Anyway, Spike, Uh,
there's a game that we played on the show. Yes,
which one? This is your final question of Spike from

(01:52:08):
his four million dollars? Can you please tell me what's
the original sample of this song? Ladies and gentlemen, Thank you,
Spike Lee. We're coming on Quest Love, Supreme Sugar Steve

(01:52:30):
Boss Bill unpaid Bill and yeah, this is Quest Love
signing off Spike Lee. Thank you so much for answering on.
Thank you very much. A doctor now sorry that was
my last I'm sorry, teacher, he's a teacher. Okay, thank
you sorry. Yes, anyway, until next week if we're still here. Um, Yes,

(01:52:55):
and macaroons for everybody. Don't listen to you. This is
Question Love signing off only on Pandora. This is Supreme
see you all next round. Thank you, yo yo yo.
I'm gone with the wind because it is Sabapa love.
The bittis when the ship hits the fan. I got
my shape in my hand, black man with the permanent tan.
I come from the building that brand. Damn, I'm feeling

(01:53:16):
the love the part of reality to hit me when
I represent the f AP straight from the build till
then played the building. I mean that they're legal or
not said, y'all make a killing. I'm fitting the bus,
the pipe original head strapped, check the Brookman or night
to what I'm saying. The shoot with not bring your
clicks so we can get old like family slide. We

(01:53:36):
need to see you in the bush, Mighty mcs in
the rock giving the bush. Of course. Love Supreme is
a production I Heart Radio. This classic episode was produced
by the team at Pandora. For more podcasts from my
heart Radio, this is the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

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Laiya St. Clair

Questlove

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