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March 29, 2024 48 mins

Behind every reality tv star, there's someone picking up the pieces. For Rachel, that is her manager, Juliette.

Rachel has turned over the podcast to let Juliette tell all as she talks with entertainment journalist, Lanae Brody, and reveals the role the media plays in the whole situation.

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Episode Transcript

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Speaker 1 (00:05):
This is Rachel Go's Rogue. This is Rachel Savannah Lovis,
and you're listening to Rachel Goes Rogue. Today, we're doing
something a little bit different. I am handing the reins
over to my manager, Juliette. There's been a lot of
questions and I've asked my manager to step in and

take the reins on this one because she is able
to articulate all of the things that happened when I
was away at the Meadows and she had to step
in and deal with all of this chaos. Just giving
more of an insight on what that was like, because

this scandal kind of took over the media for months
and months and months and months, and it was very stressful,
and Juliette was there for all of it, thank goodness,
because I had, you know, I had to deal with
my own stuff. In order to be healthier, I had

to take that time away. Juliet was my representative that
really stepped up for me and really took over, which
I really needed at that time because the press was insane.
People were asking for comments, there were rumors and mistruths

being talked about. You know, there was full blown fan fiction.
There were allegations that I was pregnant, that I was
seen at an airport, that I was not at mental
health facility, I was actually at a spa. Just all
this stuff that was not accurate at all, and I
couldn't even have predicted that was going to happen. I

just knew it was all too much that first month
leading into the reunion, and then I had to take
some time away to figure my stuff out. So Juliette
was my first hand woman, and I think that she's
more well equipped to answer the questions that Lenae Brody

is asking. Lenae Brody has almost sixteen years of experience
working in entertainment journalism with a heavy emphasis covering all
things Bravo. She has also been a moderator at Bravo Con,
so I know that she's very emotionally invested in the

situation and has all the tough questions. And this isn't
a cop out for me to like not take accountability
or people say that I just physically and mentally was
not there for the heart and the meat of the chaos.
I was taking care of my mental well being. But

Juliette was and she earned every dime of her rate
during that time, so I'm going to hand it over
to Juliette and Linee Brody.

Speaker 2 (03:14):
Juliet I'm so excited to chat with you today. First
and foremost, I think you're going to answer so many journalists, fans,
even like fellow colleagues of ours in the industry. I
think You're going to answer a lot of questions, and
this should be a really insightful chat. So thank you
for taking the time today to do this. Well, thank you.
You know. I think my first question when I was

asked a chat with you is I really want to
know how she met Rachel and how their relationship started,
Like did you find her? Did she find you? Had
you guys met at you know, an event ten years ago?
Like why don't you talk to me about that first? Fortunately,
I've been doing this for twenty four years and I've
been very lucky that because of word of mouth, that's
how I get all my clients. And actually we had

a mutual friend that when it happened, Just to kind
of remind you that timeline of that when it broke,
I think and look, I am not great at all
my dates and times, so bravo, fans, give me a break.
If I'm a day or two off. I believe it
happened on the Wednesday that they were in New York
and then the video and then it broke, and then
Friday broke news wise, and she found out that she

had been taped without her knowledge and thought, you know,
oh goodness is at a whole different level. And she
told her family and friends and they connected us, and
by the Sunday, I was on the phone with the
lawyers and helping her get sort of organized and figure
out what we needed to do. So it happened very quickly,
and it was from a neutual referral and they hit

it off, and I spoke with her parents, and you know,
I'm funny because I know there were people that were
afraid to work in a situation right And for me,
I think we did it very strategically as far as
not speaking too much and speaking quietly and calmly and
when we needed to, trying to always be honest with
the media. But I tried to not be just reactive.

You know, at the end of the day, I had
a person that I was trying to help, not just
a narrative or story. And had you known about Bravo,
I mean, obviously you knew like what Bravo was, but like,
did you know the depth of this, like for the fans,
like we spoke about, you know, before we started, guys,
we had to talk about like the fandom that is

the Bravo universe, aka the Bravoaholics, and they call them. Yeah,
they come full force, like if you if you need anything,
like if you're wondering what episode a certain line was in,
Like there's a Brava Holic that's got it, Like, yeah, sure,
So you know, like were you familiar with the neverk
had you seen the show? Did you have to google
who Rachel was? Like talk to me about that. I

was very familiar with Bravo. I've worked with different housewives
in the past. However I've never seen or heard of
inproperles and and now they're gonna come from each but
but I am now well versed. But you know what,
at the end of the day, for me, public relations
and a situation are the same things, no matter what

the actual item itself is. The principles are the same,
the tactics are the same. You know. I believe in
being very honest with the media outlets because I wouldn't
have a career if I was misleading the outlets. And
so fortunately I have very good, lengthy, strong relationships with
the outlets, with the journalists themselves, so therefore I could
maneuver the situation. And then I had to learn as

I went. And obviously the situation itself was horrible, right,
so you know, but I'll tell you what is just
to me is how many affairs have we seen in Hollywood? Right?
How many cheating scandals or whatever? And not very many,
if any. And maybe the one that was closest to
it was baby Sheen has right with her first one

with Eddie, they don't hit the fervor, and the with
the this one did, so that in itself is fascinating.
But when I took Rachel on for me, it was wow.
I mean, I helped this young woman with this you know,
horrible narrative and try to help her through it, and
then it ended up being a whole lot more right. Well,

and you know, people who don't do what we do right,
like don't really know, so like just to walk through
through it very quickly for like the cliff note version
for people like yes, when this all goes down and
you know, the story broke on TMZ, and you know,
it's like there's shirts like I know where I was
I survived scandal, Where I was when scandal, Like I

think it was March third, right, Yeah, I think that's right. Yes,
that's sad that I know the day off topic. Anyways,
you know, like we as journalists like knew where we were.
And I just I remember I was a reporter at
at People at the time, and it was like, oh
my god, like jaw hit the floor when we read
the TMZ headline, and you know, right away as a journalist,

well doing our due diligence, which is reaching out to
the fellow publicist involved, and in that moment, it was
not you, and I just remember by it must have been.
If I remember correctly, I think Rachel had somebody else
for like a two day stint in between you guys
write for like that first weekend, because I just remember

we're all like, okay, you know, I won't name names,
but like this person who does work with Rachel is
now claiming they don't work with Rachel. And now I'm
told this person's working with Rachel, And oh my god,
I thought I reached out to Rachel's rep. But now
I'm hearing that this is not Rachel's rep. It's this person.
And then I believe by Monday your name was given
to me start reaching out to. And I was literally

sitting there like, Okay, I just want to do the
right work. But like that's what we do, and like
you know, we use websites that are updated constantly or
supposed to be to tell us who the right representative
is to reach out. Yes, I have to imagine when
you got thrown in by that Monday, because like I said,
she did have somebody else for that like forty eight
hour when there was actually two people, Oh there were okay,

because I'm like a usual who works with other vander Pump. Yes,
and that was a problem, right, because which we'll get into,
i'm sure. But so first of all, the person was
working with her who is not actually hired, was advising
her through Tom. I'm just gonna say it. And and

she and then that situation when she found out Tom
had recorded her, it was it became a conflict and
she was concerned. She went to somebody else first, I think,
and they were too afraid of the magnitude. They basically said,
and these are good people. I'm not naming them. They're
good people. They just said we're small, we're startup, we
can't wait hold hat and yeah yeah, so that's on it. Okay,

So like by Monday again for those who like don't works,
like I started reaching out to Juliet being like, hey,
I hear you're you're now here and you know, and
I I'm a very honest person. I was like this
in my head, is now the third person I have
reached out to in forty eight hours. You're probably not
gonna be around much longer either, because this just seems

and I mean that with like love, like in the
sense that like it's so like I said, it is
a beast, and this story was blowing up and more
was coming out and like to your point, right, like
it was an affair, and so I think people didn't
really think it was going to like have this kind
of magnitude that that ended up having. So when I
say that, I just mean like it's like, Okay, this

is a headache, Like this is more than I can
deal with. I have so many other clients, I'm so successful,
Like this isn't like a break that I need. So
like then it's going to be somebody else. But I
just remember, like I was, like I hadn't thoughts many times,
and like I mean this with so much respect, like Julia,
it's like really hanging on here, because because this is
a this is a job, right, Like you guys have

people on your roster that maybe you'll get one email
a month for because the person's just having a slow
month or their on hiatus. But this was constant, like
stipid night, like did you get sweep? Well, I think
right there at the beginning, there wasn't a lot of
sleep and it was you know, and you have to remember,
besides the fact that this is the television show and

a scandal at the base of it, our people, right,
and her parents who were watched this happen to their daughter,
and look, think of Pam and Tommy, right, like what
could have happened? And so that's why I say on
Sunday we were on the phone all afternoon with the
lawyers and that's when they sent out the season desists
and to destroy the video and not send it out
a bublah, which they needed to do that quickly because

and also in perspective of everything from that timeline where
the argument happened, the assault happened, getting on a plane
back to la and finding out that it's bad enough
that this affair just came public, but then finding out
the person that you trusted had recorded you without your permission,
and now that's out there, right and that's our only

So now there, you know, her television friend group has
blown up her like it all blew up in one minute.
So for her family, you know, it was horrible. So yeah,
they were on the phone with me all the time.
What should we do? How do we fix this? Because
they certainly didn't want to see their daughter on orn,
you know, so everybody was trying to jump up and
do what they could do. And then let's not forget

Rachel was already from this previous season quite fragile, and
you saw her have her breakdowns. I mean, and if
you talk with like she had the anxiety attack in
the car, I think it was from the Girl's trip.
She was crying on Peter's shoulder as a friend because
she just I think for Rachel, she wasn't sure which
parts were reality and which parts were reality TV. So
when it came to me, there was already these issues

of her breaking down and getting counseling and figuring out
if she was going to go into this facility. So
all that happened like in a week, and then the
reunion was coming right. So yeah, it wasn't a lot
of sleep. It wasn't a lot of rest. It was
a lot of and the media, with all the respect
all of them, I have very religious, we're relentless, but
they're all trying to get the story. They're all trying

to get the bottom line and why so I respect that,
But yes, I it was. It was a wild time.
I think like it got to a point for me
because you know, as a senior reporter, I just remember
that I got to a point where like I was
like copy and pasting, like, Hi, Juliette, I hope this
email finds you quite well. Reaching out because like it
got repetitive, but we had to reach out any single time,

you know, another outlet was bringing something or like, you know,
my phone was like I am very intertwined in this community.
I am a fan and I've covered the beat, and
so like my phone, like even if I wasn't out
there sniffing, was blowing up, like hey, you know, she
had dinner at this establishment. We saw like her and
Tom We're still meeting up and hanging out. So everyone's like,

oh my god, what actually is going on here? So
you know, your guys's job, right is to work with
us either have us get the story straight or again,
like if it's a journalist you really trust, like you
might come to and be like, hey, I really want
to put this out there. Can we work together, you
know on getting the story straight? How are you deciding
what to comment on and like when to make those

calls to like, you know, get the story out there,
get the story straight, things like that. Well, I think so,
in full disclosure, one of the things that I did
do is I didn't publicly put my name out right
most of the time. You don't as a polosist, right, like,
it's not my job to be out there. But you
know a lot of times I have to thank my

journalists and my relationships for keeping me hidden, if you will,
for a while, because I with the viitual and the
hate and the intensity of it all. I've got three
little kids, right, and I just didn't want that. But
I was also because I had the relationships with the
journalists I had, and they knew and I'm very proud
of this because I worked at it for twenty four years.
I don't lie to the journalists. I don't need to lie.

I can say, look, I can't tell you that right now.
I'll tell you when I can. I'll clarify when I can.
So a lot of it is is thinking like a
chess game, right, So what I do is thinking what's
going to happen three steps out right and trying to
because I don't everyone to lie. I also don't want

to rush to answer something so that it's wrong later.
This very well could have gone that way. A lot
of the theories were kind of right, right. We find
that out as it all kind of goes. But I
didn't want to misspeak. I also wanted to give Rachel
space to make decisions because if I said we were
going to do something and something went in a different direction,
then they would come and say we lie. So if
you really look back at everything we did from a

pr perspective, it was less, not more. It was and
that was very purposeful. And we can dig into some
of those because some of them were very challenging. Like
you know, the initial part it was fasteful, right, there
was an affair, but I think the part that was frustrating.
And I know you're a huge job of fans, but
the pr that came from this was driven. This wasn't

not accidental. This was not just a swirl of interest,
because that would have lasted a week, right, Like how
many no offense to Kyle and Maurice, who love them,
but they keep trying to get that scandal to stick
and it just doesn't really stick. This one went above
and beyond, And then you have to look at all
the tentacles because you've got all of the Ginas and

Laalas that have their own podcasts too, So you know,
the PR is working overtime, and the Bravo blogs are
working over time, and the fans are working over time,
and the fans are searching for truths and whys. But
then the narratives were pushed out pretty hard, and I
believe to my core, for many reasons which we can
get into, that this was very much driven for ratings.

I was I want to ask you about that a
little bit more, because you know, I don't think that's
something Rachel's like really come out and said. And you know,
I guess, like the I wondered, like, why how did
this come out? Now and you know, we know that,
like they were at the show together at Tom's Tom's concert,
and like the phone came out of the pocket and
like that's when Ariana found it, and like you know,

as if you were, like I've kind of thought too,
and like that, Like I've known these players for over
a decade now, eleven seasons. I have literally covered the
show since season one at my first job. Right, what
took so long? I wonder, Like it happened on this
stage just as October of twenty twenty two, this picture
right behind me. Okay, it came out March of twenty

twenty three, and I have to, like my job is
to like sniff what's going on. And I am still
mad at myself to the day that I did not
pick up on anything going on when it was literally
happening right in front of my face, under my nose
next to me. So like how this was kept quiet
was is one thing, but like two, like, how do
you think it came out when it didn't? Why if

that is your theory, why do you think it came
out when it did? So my theory is not going
to be a popular one, but I stand by it
and I will go to my grave believing it is that.
So the Bramo salutes are super salute. But women as
a whole pretty good at smoothing. If I think my
husband is cheating, and I can walk right over to
the side of the bed when he's asleep and check

his phone, because clearly she has password. Right when you
drop your phone, it doesn't unlock, so she had to
unlock it. She unlocked it. If the story is true
to check it at that moment. Why why would you
if you suspect anything at any time and we already
know because Sheena and on her podcast they came out
and said something about oh. Arianna said, oh, this is

suss behavior right and and in the lawsuit that Rachel filed,
she also said that she believes, you know, this was
known beforehand. So I don't believe that. I don't believe
that's how it's happened. I believe that was propped and
sent and I don't know. Maybe she saw the day
before and she told production and off they went. But

if you want to if you think that some of
your partner is cheating, you have access to their phone
twenty four hours a day, wait till they're asleep. Wait
till they go the bathroom. But look at the phone
the password, So I don't buy that it fell out
of his pocket and I looked at it and blah
blah blah blah. I think that was set up for
the whole thing. Why do we think it came out?
You know? You can also tell in the in the

final five minutes of the reunion when they pulled Rachel in,
So just so everybody knows, that was like four or
five hours condensed into five minutes. So they were pushing
and pushing for her to express things. So they were fishing.
They knew, they knew, they knew. There's no way they
didn't know my opinion, and why the show was bludgling

And look at the ratings it got. It got readings
it beat Original Bachelor ratings.

Speaker 1 (19:42):

Speaker 2 (19:42):
So that's my opinion. I know people aren't going to
love that, and but I stick to it, and I
feel that something else that you'll look at and people forget.
Is that all? If all? Except maybe I don't know
if James is or not. I mean, he's a DJ,
but all of them are actors. They are all trying
to be actors. They're all actors. Rachel wasn't. And I

think we find Joe in the same position that Rachel
was in. And you know, people want to say she
was the super fan. She wasn't. She had never seen
the show before until she started dating James. Then she's
watched the show because you know she's dating James. And
people like to say, oh, they all know what they're
getting into. They don't. They think they do. They think
they can control it. They think they are smarter than

the network. They're not. It's like, I compare the network
to Las Vegas. The house always wins. So when you
did this all imploded, This all came out Rachel and

you were having to navigate it very quickly, and like
obviously then she you know, checks into the facility. And
from the media perspective when said celebrity, you know, let's
I don't want to like compare, it's not the same.
But like if a celebrity gets in, you know, get

to DUI like a high profile at least like well
back in the day, maybe not as much as work.
Their wrath is gonna be like, hey, maybe she's got
to rehab for two weeks, right, clean up your image,
show people you're sorry. Whatever, So again, like from my perspective,
this happened, and I was like, Okay, she's doing that,
you know, like clean up the image, like I get

the pr behind it. Little did I ever think it
would turn into ninety days? Right? It was, And that's
that's when I was like, oh my gosh, she's not
going to come back to fander pumpa roles like this
is this is you know, And that's like I believe
she was in the facility when the reunion aired. Is
that correct? No, right after she filled it, she went in, Yeah,

we had been watching it on TV, so we're watching
it knowing that she's now in this facility. You know,
people really came for her and like La La, I'm
sure she's not watching it or probably not watching, but
like La La love La La. She actually took it
upon herself to apologize and send Rachel a message while
she was in the facility, and I remember on the episode,
La La said she read Rachel read the message, and

she never heard from her, Like do you think that
Rachel felt the apology just like wasn't genuine? Are there
certain people that you think that you know, she wishes
she would hear from or like talk to me a
little bit about that. Yeah, so let's let's talk about that.
Rachel was in the facility, and Okay, first of all,

the minute you step in there, you hand up your phone.
She has nothing. I took over her phone so that
I could be aware for anything that was interesting, exciting
or whatever. I saw that come in across my phone.
And because I didn't have her phone, I had her
social media's on my phone, and so I saw that
message come across and so I clicked on it. So

that was my TV debut, I'm kidding. So what a debut. Yeah,
let's first put it in perspective. Lala did that because
she was told to do that on the television show.
She was scripted to call Rachel because that was it,
and there wasn't an apology. Maybe she showed a second
of oh, you know, she's in a facility, right, So
then she calls I or you left the message. I

saw it and I'm not going to answer it, right,
it's not my place. I just making sure whatever anything is.
And then you see and then she comes out afterwards
and said that she wish she hadn't done it. So Lala,
I like Lala's personality, don't get me wrong. I think
she's dynamic. I think she's super strong for what she's doing.
But you know what, those girls were very very ladies,
are very very mean to Rachel, their mean girls, and

they used her for the storyline. They used her for
that moment of empathy, only to retract that. But yeah,
I was the one that saw that she had no
knowledge that had happened until she came out and to
that point that you made. First of all, Rachel was
also already going through counseling, and it was quite funny
when we did into the Tom of it all. Tom

was trying so heavily to influence everything she did, including me,
you know, try to get me fired so that she
would work with his rep, trying to get her to
come out of this facility. She needed to get away
from that, so, you know, the thirty days, it was
a big commitment. And I don't think there's a celebrity
out there that you can say that had that level

of impatient three months assistance. I mean, it's unheard of,
and she's so great for it. I will say too, Yeah, well,
obviously she took it seriously. And you know, I will say,
like when she came out and said I'm walking away
from the show. I think that was her in my opinion,
It was herd a way of like really saying like, no,

I don't want this, I don't need this, I don't
need to be famous. Like she gave up a job,
you know, and a lot of money and a lot
of money, and it was really out there that they
wanted her to come back. And I've watched several times
this year, and I'm sure a lot of fans and
people the same thing, like of, well, what if Rachel
were here, Like what would be happening? Like, you know,

things like that will never We'll never know. And you know,
I kind of like had the vibes to I'm like,
maybe it'll be like the Housewive moment where they take
a season off and then they you know, come back
and like, hey guys, I'm here. Obviously that seems to
not be the case in this situation, but you know,
I really do want to get into the tum of
it all. Actually, one question that I really have for
you is Brock, on a recent episode acute Sandival's team

of planting a room or that Brock and Rachel hooked
up right. He thinks that Sandival's team or former team
planted that. What do you have to say about that?
Have you heard anything? Do you agree with Brock? I
don't have the fact, but I would It wouldn't surprise
me in a hot second. There's another thing that was
out there when Rachel was coming out of the nail

salon and she she answered some questions. I've always set
things up directly with the outlets. I tell you and say, hey,
so and so, it is going to be here, be there.
Somebody had to give that that, and it wasn't us,
and somebody got paid for that, and it wasn't her
for me, So I am of the belief that he
one hundred percent set things up in whatever way to

make him look good. And then there's another example I'll
just mention it. You know, there was when she was
in the facility, and there was then the video where
he was at the spot and then you hear the
girl laugh. That was done intentionally to cast doubt that
she was in a facility. Yeah, I mean, I've got
to wonder, like I had this thought too of Like

you know, usually when you have two celebrities, two public
figures that are having this affair together, you know, again,
for people who don't know both public maybe they're not
telling their whole roleodex, but like they're gonna tell their publicist,
I'm sleeping with so and so, right, I'm having an
affair with I'm having an affair. I'm having an affair
with like, because you guys are gonna have to feel

the call, and if it comes in at three in
the morning, hey, I'm going to press if I don't
hear from you, like, That's why they tell you, and
that's why you always tell your like tell me everything.
I've always got to have your back. I'm on your team,
and that's why having a publicist you trust and a
journalist in your pocket that you trust is so important.
So you know, I do wonder, like, especially because you
were brought into this and you know Tom's former publicist

or former team member you know, was helping Rachel as
well before all this happened with like certain things. So
you know this person knew Rachel a little bit and
probably how to you know, work around her, work with her,
work alongside her whatnot. So you know, how did you
feel when this was all coming to a head, and

like stories are coming to you about both of you
and like, again, you would usually call this person and
be like, hey, how should we handle this together? What
are you going to talk address? It sounds like you
couldn't really do that in this situation. So were you
guys talking constantly? Were you not on the same being?
Like what was going on behind the scenes? So I
think from the very beginning. So, because when something is

such a a huge experience, you'd come close quite quickly.
So in this situation, I had to get to know
her very quickly, and we had to make some moves
very quickly. We spoke a lot. Her parents were concerned,
and let me make this very clear, Rachel hired me.
Rachel paid me, not her parents. Her parents or typical

parents that are like, oh my gosh, my daughter's business
is now everywhere right, and they're worried and they're scared
because of the death threats. So when she went into
the facility, I thought, the thing that was the most
important is that she really needed to heal, She needed
to get away because as an outsider, to me, the
whole thing looked like a cult. The whole thing looked
like she was so sucked in that she couldn't see

the difference between what was real, and she was torn up.
She was torn up when she found out that this
tape happened. She was torn up that it got it,
you know, that it came out the way that it did,
and she lost the one person that she thought she
had and then everybody was going to be so upset
with her. And she was remorse from from day one.
And she was confused because he was telling her they

were broken up and they were this, that and the
other thing right, So, you know, all of that was
very hard on her at that time. So I had
to give her the respect of letting her be in
there and heal because she needed to not talk about
this show. She needed to not think about business. So
a lot of why there wasn't I mean not still
probably would have been my strategy to is that we

didn't just jump to answer things. We didn't just respond
to things. We didn't you know, if things I thought
were unfair, I could call somebody like you and say, well,
you know, that's not really quite accurate, or and or
remind people that at the end of the story is
a person in pain and problematic mental health and in
a facility doing it. So you know, maybe it would

be to kind of keep it great. But in twenty
four years, I've never had a situation where I couldn't
talk to my client. Somewhere around the middle is when
we started to talk maybe once a week, because you know,
the other thing you don't want to do is I
want to go, oh, my gosh, this headline happened, Gosh,
this night thing. Right, she's in there getting treatment. So
then I would only try to tell her the things
that I needed to tell her or thought I needed

to respond to or get an answer to. Oh.

Speaker 1 (30:11):
You know.

Speaker 2 (30:11):
The worst part about it was when everyone started saying
she was at a spa and Mirvall posted something to
imply that she was there, and I immediately they did
it on a Friday night, So me trying to get
a hold of corporate at that time not easy but right.
But then the cast members their podcasts, everybody started jumping

on it, saying, oh, she use to me, but she said, oh,
I heard she's at the spa. Then there was a
video that Tom posted where he was at a spa,
and then you hear this girl laugh in the background
that is meant to be implied that that's possibly Rachel.
So then I get bombarded by the media saying there's
sightings of her, she's out, she's not in, and there's

and there are people that like you that I have
a relationship with, a trusted relationship, right, And I'm like,
they all know, Juliet. The sources are legit, sources are great,
she's out, she's out, and companee, oh my gosh. So
I at one point called the facility, spoke to the
nurse and I'm like, you know, can you see Rachel.
Oh yeah, she's her Aaron front of great. And I
went back to my friends and said, no, this is

for my colleagues and said, no, this is she's You
can post whatever you want, but it's not accurate, right,
And and now I do remember that, and I remember
us all being like, well, there's no way because like again,
there's it's all happening so fast. And I'm not saying
this at you directly, but like, you really know, there
are publicists in this industry who lie on a daily

basis to protect our clients. Totally. We are used to it. Yes,
I usually can sniff them out, like I get it,
you don't want me breaking this big news, And then
I don't want to get scooped like I lose sleep over.
So of course it's like we have this video, we
hear a girl, there's a mirror ball, which is a
legit plate. Right, things were moving like a million miles Again,

were you talking and were there ever times that you
talked to Tom directly? Did you ever oh, yeah, you know,
and correct me if I'm wrong, But it sounds like
you were having issues communicating or getting on the same
page with his side of the ball and his team.
Did you ever try to go around that and go
to him directly? And then was there a point that
you just kind of said, you know what, we're going
to do it our way. I can't work with you guys,

you're not in her corner. Because I really did think,
at least in that moment when we were all living it,
while like Tom and Rachel may end up together again
outside looking in at that moment, so for me, I
would consider myself a good juke of character and pretty
good intuition. And the very first conversation that I had

was with myself and Rachel and Tom and his then representative,
and even the way it came to me at that point,
I could hear she was broken. She was a broken person.
You could hear it in her voice. You know, she
was shaky, was I don't even know how to describe it.
She was sort of not all in her in herself
at that moment. And she when she said to me,

Tom wants to get on the phone. Tom's representative and
me and you, and I'm like, okay, what do you want?
You know, I pick up on those things. I'm a
mom of daughters too, and I'm very much about empowering them.
And when I hear that, I think, okay. So we
get on the phone and immediately listening to him. Now
remember I haven't seen an episode of the show at
this time, listening to Tom, right, yes, this is Tom.

Immediately talking to him and listening to him, and all
he kept saying is my brand, our brand. And I
was like, excuse me, you're thinking about a brand. I'm
thinking about a human that is about to go into
a mental health facility. But you do you And Rachel
actually had said to me previously, I need to have

some time alone. But he won't give me the time
alone and he won't give me a minute's rest. I
told her, let me be the bad guy. I'm the
back guy. Then let me be the voice. And so
I said to him, I said, look, you know what
I mean, get the flu. You still love your family,
but you don't feel well, and all you want to
do is lay in the bed with the covers over
your head and just drown it out. I said, can
you give her twenty four hours where you don't call her,
leave her alone for twenty four hours, Let her have

the flu, Let her pull the covers over her head
and just relax. He could not do it. The minute
we hung up, he was on the phone for again,
and he's in her ear. And at the point she
was not strong enough to hang up. She was not
strong enough to walk away. People can blame that all
they want. They can say, oh, she's an adult, Oh
she knew, Oh blah blah blah whatever. When you are manipulated,
when you are down, you don't have the strength. And

if that wasn't a thing, we wouldn't have the domestic
violence and abuse situations we have, because how many people say,
why does she stay with him? Because we don't understand
the power dynamics, We don't understand the threats, We don't
understand where that person is mentally, and we don't understand
what the other person is doing to them. So it's
very easy to be the couch coach and say why

didn't she just hang up? She couldn't. She wasn't strong enough,
and so part of her going to the facilla to
improve herself and learn about why she was codependent, why
she couldn't break away, and why she didn't have the strength.
He gave her the space and hence the clarity to
walk away, But in the moment she didn't have it.
She was Okay, I'm coming, Okay, I'm leaving, Okay, this

is great. He loves me, he doesn't love me. It
was a tornado in her head. So from that moment on,
as he told me, he was worried about his brand
with Arianna he had built, They had built a brand together,
they had appearances. Then he was like, but Rachel and
I we're going to be the new brand. And I

was like, ew, this is this is dick, this is
a person. This isn't about a brand. And then it
takes me back to one of the earlier points I
made with you. There's people that are on reality television
that get it, and they're great at it, and they
work it and they manipulate it and they benefit from it.
Rachel was one of those people. She just wasn't So
did it get to a point then, like after that

phone call that you guys started to herself from soy, yeah,
pretty much from that moment, I knew what I was
dealing with, and I was like, I'm not doing this
one thing in particular, or actually two things. Rachel was
still torn with the Tom issue, right. She was starting
to see he was manipulating her, but she wasn't strong
enough to just break it off at that point or
walk away from it. And so we had this call

about how we were going to break was I think
it was the apology to public apology. So she had
apologized to Ariana twice on via email and tried to
call her, and Ariana had blocked her. Understandy, So just
because you want to apologize, says it me, and somebody
is there to receive it. So she apologized to her twice,
and then she told her that she was going to
make a public apology because she didn't want it to

be fake or whatever. So she let her know. She
didn't answer, that's fine, we put out the public apology.
I was very transparent I hit the journalist at People
magazine first set it up, and then we were on
the phone with Tom and his wrap and I read
it to him, and the minute he said he was
good with it, I hit sent to the journalist. Well

did I get from his rep? Oh, you lied to us?
You went around and says no, I just beat you.
I went faster, so I got it out there because
I did. I'm not playing the games that they're playing.
I needed to take care of a human. I needed
to get that apology out for hers, she wrote, and
then we needed to be able to take care of
her health. And then there was another time, and this

was again where I start questioning the motive. In the reunion,
Tom says how he was on the speaker phone right
and heard it all, and then Ariana says, all you
have to do is keep your mouth shut. Right. They
told me that that happened beforehand. And I said to Tom,
if you love her and you support her and you
want what's best for her, why would you not say
that now because this is on the early side, right.

He said, yes, I will, and then he backtracked. That
to me was a real sign of his selfishness, because
that would have changed the narrative along the way because
we didn't have Rachel speaking, and because I wasn't willing
to just feed into headlines for just no purpose. There
wasn't a lot on our side, so all those headlines

that were going out were very one sided. And that
one article at the beginning, because this was before she
went into the facility, would have changed the trajectory of
the conversation, but he wouldn't do it. Yeah, and remember
they were in the trailer at the reunion together filming,
and like, like I said, I really thought like these
two were going to go the distance. But it sounds

like all of these issues that were happening behind the scenes.
It sounds like to me like there were all these
issues your mom, so you also have that you know,
maternal piece of view. It sounds like you really were
able to like come in see what was going on,
see that you know, your word broken girl who just

needed guidance. Maybe you were probably thinking, if she goes
into this facility, clears her head, comes out and says,
I'm so in love with this man. We're going to
go to therapy together when we're through this. Like everybody,
we've probably had to support her on her side, right,
but you you saw what was going on, you got
her out of it with her parents, you got her
into this place. But it sounds like all these things
that were happening behind the scenes that we didn't hear
or see about, because I was wondering too, I'm like, okay,

so wait, what's going on? Because when she went in,
they seemed to be a unit happy given the situation
and love. You know they're going to come out of
this together, and like she's just going in for a
pr again outside looking at of course, of course, and
then she came out and you know, we're watching on
the show now he's like, oh, she won't talk to me.

And I remember thinking, well, how did we get here?
Because there's a lot of things that we're not hearing,
like how did we get here? And this is where
I was like watching, being like I wish we had
Rachel's like commentary, like her side of it as well. Right, Yes,
but it sounds like you were having all of these
you know, butting heads conflicts, like you're seeing that like

they wanted to to take the story in a direction
that you did not agree with and want and you
were able to get Rachel to see. Oh wait a minute,
this is not someone who has somebody best and trusted heart,
I feel right. So it really sounds like it was
all these behind the scenes working that led to their
you know, blocking him and their one thing actually in

particular is so now remember she goes in this facility
and he's calling me right, and the whole first part
of it, he's just like bashing her going in there.
Oh you know they're going to brainwash her. Oh, she
needs to come out. And I said, if you support
her and you care about her, let her have this journey.

Is she feels that this is helping her, why are
you bucking it? Let her be Let her get the
help she needs. Well, it's because he didn't want to help,
you know, like he's told her and hence the name
of the podcast. He didn't want her to go road.
Thankfully it clicked for her and she said no more.
And then he was frustrated and then he would call
me out of frustration. And then the last phone call

I had with him that was very funny, he said,
she needs to get on the phone. You need to
get her on the phone, even if she doesn't want
to talk to me. She just needs to be on
the phone. I've got critical information for her. I've got
critical information for her. I'm like, okay, you know, I said,
I'm sorry, she doesn't want to talk to you. She
has instructed she's not gonna call you. And he got

so frustrated and he blew a gasket and was like,
I'm not going to protect her anymore. I'm out here
by myself. It's them against me. I'm not going to
do this anymore. I'm going to do what I have
to do. And then hung up the phone. And I
don't know if it was the same day or the
next day. I called her Rachel and I said, oh,
I think Tom just broke up with us. You guys
never heard him again, and now he's dating somebody. I mean,

what do you guys, what do you guys think of you?
Never stop dating? He's never stopped dating. He's dating. I
don't know. There was some influencer, then there was the
music girl, and then he's never stopped dating. So you know, booh,
I haven't been single in fifteen years. You don't need
to be single to date. You're still dating, never stopped.
Does Rachel seem bothered like at all? Or did she

is she able to like tune that stuff out because
you know what, this is the thing that I don't
care what anybody says and all the haters that hate
that girl has put in so much work and she
is continuing to do the work. You know. I look
at her and in the way that where she started
to where she is now, she's like a different person
the confidence and happy space. Like the broken girl that

I met that was so sad and confused and hurt.
You know, she's she's on the other side of that.
She's still got a ways to go. She's a work
in progress, and she will be the first one to
say that she is still learning on a daily basis,
but at the end of the day, she is she's
living her life again. She also when Rachel got out,

I was like, Okay, in my head again, I was like,
it's probably now time for her. Andy Cohen Sindo. Andy
gets Teresa and Joe Judace before they went to jail,
you know, like he gets a big Bravo celebrity sit
downs obviously before he gets first before any other journals.
So I'd love to know when she came out, Like,
did Andy approach you guys I'm assuming he did. Did

other journalists, you know, because she still hasn't done like
one big journalist sit down right yet when she went in,
I didn't want to tell people where she went to
begin with, right, like again, I wanted to give her
privacy and whatever. But it was leaked. Somebody from the
Meadows leaked They I think they were leaving when she
came in, and they leaked it and put it out
there and then everybody sort of picked up on it.

So that was the next statement that I put out right.
I was like, well, I better do this because I
want to control I don't want people making stuff up.
So I asked the network to post what I wrote
on their platforms because I feel that would have also
changed the trajectory of the narrative. They wouldn't do it,

and I thought that was pretty suspect, because if you
have an employee that's going in for mental health care help,
don't you want to support them? So then I did say,
you know what I think, don't you guys want to
be on the right side of this, Like this is
somebody that's committed to her mental health. Nobody knows what
it's like to go to an in house facility, what
if when she comes out, if it works for her

and she's healthy. And at that time, I didn't know
she was going for one month, two month, three months either, right,
We just knew she was going in for We knew
it was a thirty day stay to begin with. And
so I said, well, if we did do something to
highlight what her journey was like, right, and what it
was like in that facility, you guys, meaning the network
will come off looking great too, because you're supporting somebody

that just, you know, the stigmas along not only mental
health but treatment are big and real. Wouldn't it be
great to be the people that talk about this and
bring it out, you know, and they kind of yeah, yeah,
I mean, we'll consider reperd it. And it didn't. One
of the things she pointed out to me, and I
wouldn't have known this if she didn't say it is
the scene that we see where they go back to
filming in her apartment and they're talking on the couch.

She asked, Tom, why did you fiel me without my consent?
And he answered her and they cut that out. And
so then I spoke to the powers of being the
producers and said why would you do that. You're trying
to tell her that she can trust you, But who
benefited from that? So only one person that benefited from
that put out And at that point, it was right

around the same moment, it was still the first half
of the stay that negotiations were taking place, and they
wanted to know what she was going to do, and
she said, no, this is a toxic environment. I'm past this,
I'm beyond this. I'm not doing this anymore. It's not
good from a mental health I'm not coming, and she
decided to go. Hence why the Bethany interview happened. And

it happened, And I don't care what anybody says about Bethany.
Bethany didn't watch the show. But Bethany was fair and
Bethany gave her unlimited time, uninterrupted time to talk about
what happened. And I think it was still today. It
was the best movie we had because even a network
that would have been supportive couldn't have given her the
time right And so this way she got to tell

her story freely. Whether she did it perfectly or not,
you know what, it was her first time. Maybe she
made some mistakes or whatever, But I thought it was good.
I'm so good we got to chat. Like I said,
I could ask you so many more questions, but you know,
maybe we'll have another part two at some point. And
I feel like, like I said, I think this conversation
was so insightful for journalists, publicists, fans who have had

a lot of questions. So thank you so much. And
from our conversation you can tell like you are invested
in your client. You are invested in Rachel. You do
have her best interests at heart, and she's very lucky
to have you in her corner. Well, thank you. I
appreciate your time. And one thing that I asked of
all the haters, if you will just be objective. No
one's going to change your mind, nobody's going to condone

what happened, but just try to give her the grace
that everybody's trying to give Tom on the news storyline,
extend that to Rachel. We have had so many supporters,
I will say that really seeing her growth. So I
just hope that continues. And I think the podcast is
helping to shine a lot of light there, so people
should tune in and just give it a chance totally,

and just to piggyback off of that. If anybody is
still on the fence a good journalist and a good
person who is like a fanatic, you're going to be
Smith Thurlin. I always try to keep an open mind
because there's your side, there's their side, and then there's
the truth. And I think, you know, especially in this situation,
so much has changed in the last year since his

story broke. We have learned so much. I've now learned
even more things that I didn't know. Like I'm still like,
oh my god, that's how the method about rand. So
I do hope that people will maybe, especially now that
we're like a year into this, that people will just
kind of start to chill a little bit about yeah,
handle of it all and let these people live their lives.

So thank you for time, and you know, I wish
Rachel the best on her mental health journey. I appreciate
that and it was great to talk to you. Thanks
a lot. Thank you so much for listening to Rachel
Goes Grogue.

Speaker 1 (48:14):
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