THE WAR ROOM WITH STEPHEN K. BANNON (EP. 4459)

THE WAR ROOM WITH STEPHEN K. BANNON - MAY 3RD, 2025

GUESTS:

BEN HARNWELL

KANE

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Of priorities this year as a skinny budget. It will
be fleshed out in full. But when you're talking about
cuts to the National Park Service, cuts to climate science research,
cuts to UN peacekeepers, to the NIH rental assistance at
a time when the rent is too damn high, what
does it tell you about the priorities john of this administration?

Speaker 2 (00:19):
And we're not just talking Listen, it should be clear here,
we're not just talking about cuts. We're not talking about
what you usually hear and watching about, which is a
reduction in the expected increase or even a one or
two point haircut on these programs.

Speaker 3 (00:32):
We're talking about tens of.

Speaker 2 (00:33):
Billions of dollars from the National Institutes of Health and
the Housing Urban Development Agency, So you've had a big
list there. I think we're talking about basically a twenty
percent cut, maybe a little bit more than that discretionary spending.
This is unheard of. No one's ever seen anything like this.
It is responsive to Donald Trump's base, It is responsive

(00:55):
to Russ Vote, the director of the Office of Management
and Budget, basically the kind of budgets that he used
to write when he was the budget guy for the
Republican Study Committee, which at the time was the extreme
right wing group in the House, and its budgets never
got more than a handful of votes. So we're seeing
the dream of Donald Trump to slash the federal government,

(01:17):
to cut taxis for the wealthy, and you know, we
will see what Congress says about it, but for the
time being, I think that there is a clear direction
of President Donald Trump to destroy as much as he
can of the federal government as fast as.

Speaker 4 (01:30):
He can well live right of course, right, I mean,
at this point, they keep taking these actions that are
plating in this case explicitly illegal, and that's you know,
that's sort of a throwaway at this point that could
have become so much of a reflux of this administration
and what.

Speaker 5 (01:43):
They're out of as part of this larger plant right.

Speaker 4 (01:45):
Which is to target anything that they feel is oppositional.

Speaker 5 (01:48):
And that's where we as we get closed.

Speaker 4 (01:50):
With the midterms, that there's a resistible tentation, which I
know is true to think about this in the standard political.

Speaker 5 (01:56):
Terms, but I just want to caution everyone that this
is different. This is not just another election.

Speaker 6 (02:02):
They are on an authoritarian run here.

Speaker 4 (02:04):
They are trying to reshape our country using government in.

Speaker 5 (02:08):
A way that reshapes our culture and what our government represents.

Speaker 7 (02:11):
They're not.

Speaker 4 (02:11):
They're trying to take away so much of the basic
protections and freedoms that we took. So what's an issue
with CBS and PBIA at MPR one revenge? They've always
hated them. The right wing media is always targeted as
one of the villains that they're a truth teller. Another
part of that is, I remember, most of the stations
will be affected are in are in are not the
big cities, but actually in the smaller community, the smaller stations,

(02:34):
the royal areas are the ones that are going to
get hit the hardest in that taking away alternative voice
just against Trump and the rest of the right wing
media more power, enhancing their narrative dominance, and that to
me is a big part of it. They're getting rid
of the checks, not just legally, but also in the
court of public opinion.

Speaker 1 (02:49):
Well, Asley, you have political calling these cuts on precedents,
but I mean, all four of us know these are
not surprising. A lot of this is straight out of
Project twenty twenty five. Russell Vote had been telegraphing that
this is what they wanted to do if they came
back into power. There was a playbook, and now they
are running the playbook.

Speaker 7 (03:08):
Angelo.

Speaker 5 (03:09):
Yeah, I mean they listened all the things they're going
to do.

Speaker 4 (03:12):
Nothing in here even remotely, you know, sort of out
of left field. I mean, they are getting basically everything
they wanted in terms of their first wave of cuts
and reduction and gutting. And that is an intentional part
of the plan. The other thing, too, is that they're
bullied not just by the sort of whatever sort of confidence.

Speaker 7 (03:30):
They have now and this is whatever.

Speaker 4 (03:31):
Authoritary event, they're also bullied by history and a track record.

Speaker 5 (03:35):
This is not the first time.

Speaker 4 (03:37):
In twenty seventeen, his buddy, a similar thing happened when
his first term the budget was had all these tax
cuts in there.

Speaker 5 (03:43):
It was it was a deeply unpopular budget.

Speaker 4 (03:45):
Everyone like, everyone's going to be mad at Trump over
this because they promised that the tax coug we're going
to pay for themselves.

Speaker 5 (03:51):
None of that came true. The only thing that came
true was that rich people.

Speaker 4 (03:54):
Got a massive tax cut out of Trump's skill that
wasn't funded. And yet people still walked away with the
water not feeling an impression that somehow Trump is better
on the economy than an alternative Democrat would be. And
that to me is the scary part about this, that
they not only think that they can jam this through.

(04:15):
History says that they probably have a pretty good traper,
not just jamming it through, but getting.

Speaker 7 (04:19):
Away with it.

Speaker 8 (04:20):
Trump one and Trump two, there's really an attempt to
sideline the courts.

Speaker 7 (04:24):
And there's always been this attempt to.

Speaker 8 (04:26):
Sideline Congress, but now to sideline the courts as well.
I mean, they're doing a few things. One is they're
moving people around all the time to try to keep
us from getting into the right court. So we go
to one court and get injunction and they move people
to another counture. I mean, even with this Alien Enemies
like that piece you just played, he signs it on
March fourteenth, doesn't tell anybody, but do we find out.

Speaker 7 (04:50):
They're starting to get people ready.

Speaker 8 (04:51):
Then they finally publish it on the fifteenth, But the
statute says very clearly you're supposed to publish the Alien
Enemies that proclamation.

Speaker 7 (04:59):
If you you want to use it, make it public.

Speaker 8 (05:02):
But they're already trying to move it before it becomes public.
We find out that people are being moved, we go
into Court, and then they say, well, you're too early.

Speaker 7 (05:12):
It hasn't even published it, but the people would have
been gone. And as you said, they were already some
people gone.

Speaker 9 (05:17):
DOJ no longer enforcing justice, like the whole dismantling of DEI.
Everything the DOJ has done thus far has been in
support of this administration. They've attacked the courts to undermine
the court's trust with the public for when the courts
actually do speak, they are attacking the whole prospect of.

Speaker 5 (05:34):
The nationwide injunction.

Speaker 9 (05:35):
So it's going to make it harder for people to
challenge the administration's actions. They'll have to do it in
every different jurisdiction. That'll be entirely unwieldy. They are subjugating
law firms, and they are trying to attack public interest
firms too. All of that is about reducing the amount
of legal resources available for this fight. It is not
a coincidence. This is a strategy to make the law

(05:57):
no longer work for the.

Speaker 3 (05:58):
People haven't really faced.

Speaker 10 (06:00):
I think what will be the defining crisis, which will
be the President either accepting a contrary decision, likely from
the Supreme Court on an issue of great significance, or
trying to reject it and trying to defy it.

Speaker 3 (06:15):
And that moment is coming.

Speaker 10 (06:18):
You know, the word crisis comes from the Greek vernacular
about healthcare. Crisis is the moment in a disease where
a patient lives or dies.

Speaker 3 (06:28):
And don't want to be.

Speaker 10 (06:30):
Overly hyperbolic on a Friday evening, but we will have
a crisis for the rule of law, I think before
this year is out. And here's hoping that the institutions,
the judges, the lawmakers, and the citizens hold on to
that rule of law, no matter what their impulses of

(06:50):
the moment might be.

Speaker 11 (06:54):
This is the crimal stream of a dining lergy. Pray
for enemies because we're going to medieval on these people.
You've not got a free shot. All these networks lying
about the people, the people have had a belly full
of it. I know you don't like hearing that. I
know you've tried to do everything in the world to
stop that, but you're not going to stop it. It's

(07:15):
going to happen.

Speaker 5 (07:16):
And where do people like that go to share the
big line?

Speaker 12 (07:19):
Mega media?

Speaker 4 (07:20):
I wish in my soul, I wish that any of
these people had a conscience.

Speaker 11 (07:26):
Ask yourself, what is my task and what is my purpose?

Speaker 13 (07:30):
If that answer is to save my country, this country
will be saved.

Speaker 7 (07:36):
War Room.

Speaker 12 (07:37):
Here's your host, Stephen kna.

Speaker 11 (07:44):
It's Saturday, three May, in the year of Alert twenty
twenty five. We're here. We're going to get into all
this Caneac Citizen Kane's going to join us here shortly
to go through this firestorm that's come up about the
budget that the RUSS Vote and the team put out
yesterday from the White House. We'll get into all that.
I actually had a great honor to speak this morning

(08:06):
already as a keynote speaker to the last day of
the Center for Renewing America conference where RUSS Vote, Mark Paoletta,
that entire team, Jeff Clark, all the great heroes of
the interregnum in President Trump's four years did all this
and made sure the days of thunder and flood the
zone were you could actually effectuate her now in for

(08:28):
the second hundred days, one of the most dangerous and
controversial part times of the American Republic's history, which we're
now rolling out in the first couple of days. And
MSNBC is actually right, there are conversions of crises here
and whoever kind of wins the next hundred days is
going to be really driving the agenda, so it's quite important.

(08:49):
I want to go to Rome, Ben Harnwell, yesterday I
did this interview or republished interview I did with Archbishop Vigno.
I want to get to that in a moment, Ben,
Where are you? The reporting out of Europe is so important.
About what you've accomplished and what we've put together at
our monastery is kind of the counter to the radicalness

(09:11):
of Brigoglio in trying to keep the hopefully keep the
church on track by being a rally point for conservatives
and more importantly for traditionalists. Where are you today and
where do we stand with this upcoming conclave, Sir.

Speaker 14 (09:27):
Beef, Good morning.

Speaker 15 (09:28):
Well, I'm here live from Saint Peter's Piazza.

Speaker 14 (09:32):
You can get a sense of the fact that the piazza.

Speaker 15 (09:35):
Is already now starting to fill up with pilgrims in
expectation of the conclave by the fact that this mobile
signal is slower than usual. That's because they're like a
couple of thousand people behind me. This always happens in
Rome when lots of people gather together there's a dimination
of the of mobile signals, so that as an indication,
there's an excitement in the air, a buzz in the air.

(09:57):
People are starting to discuss now in real terms, who
the potential names might be. I mentioned one name because
I know this is something that you've been hammering on.

Speaker 14 (10:07):
On the war, and this is the danger to do.

Speaker 15 (10:09):
With American born Cardinal Crevost. Already the world's mainstream media
seems to have picked him as their flag bearer.

Speaker 14 (10:18):
You have articles by.

Speaker 15 (10:18):
The New York Times by Crux, which is basically the
Catholic version of the New York Times, and they're pushing articles.

Speaker 14 (10:26):
Against him in his favor, one after another.

Speaker 15 (10:28):
If I might just quickly highlight this, this is the guide
to avoid Steve. This is one of the principal people
we do not want to see come out onto that
loder behind me with a new papal regnal name. But already,
to give an example of the things that people are saying,
the National Catholic Reporter, known as the National Catholic Disdaughter

(10:49):
for its accuracy, has highlighted Cardinal Prevost and his interest
in dialogue. Crux argues that Prevost would maintain pain pope
frantas is substance, but with more pragmatic, cautious.

Speaker 14 (11:05):
And discreet leadership. Steve, God save us from that.

Speaker 11 (11:11):
No, this is uh, we got this. We obviously we're
fairly dialed in there. And from the very early really
even before the funeral, but from the early days, there
was this push behind the scenes to say, hey, let's
keep the Americans on board, because they're eighty percent of
the cash flow. But we actually have somebody here that's

(11:31):
more that's more organized, but even more progressive than Brigolio.
And so they feel that they got they got every
win in the world they get. They basically have the
you know this this myth of no American pope. They
go through that they lock in the American Church, particularly
the donors are now feel obligated to back an American pope,
so they lock in the cash they so desperately need

(11:54):
from the American Church, and they'll have somebody that thinks
even more organized in Burgolio, and they will have somebody
that's actually farther to the left than he is. Your
thoughts is that basically what the people driving this agenda
behind the scenes are looking at.

Speaker 15 (12:11):
Yeah, but I have to say I think they're slightly
on the wrong foot this time around.

Speaker 14 (12:17):
The difference from being when.

Speaker 15 (12:21):
Francis was elected in the twenty thirteen and the difference
is that they no longer have a friendly force guiding
the international pressure, like for example, what.

Speaker 14 (12:33):
Macron is doing in France on his cardinals.

Speaker 15 (12:36):
Because in the sense that they no longer that the
deep state, the global deep state, what Archbishop Vigano calls
the deep Church, it no longer has control of the
White House. And this is crucially important because it's a
missing element now and this is the power of the
war audience.

Speaker 14 (12:55):
Obviously, this is the power of Maga.

Speaker 15 (12:57):
What it does mean in this time round is that
you cannot be the Claus Spob, the Vond the Lion,
the people who set the agenda behind the scenes and
then have it repeated via the Catholic Church.

Speaker 14 (13:11):
They can no longer use the White House to push
the guy in this timeout.

Speaker 15 (13:17):
So they are doing exactly what you said, but we
have a far stronger hand this time out.

Speaker 11 (13:25):
Hangar for a second, Ben, We're going to take a
short commercial break. When I come back, there's a lot
to go through, including that interview Archbishop Vigeno. I mean
he throws down hard and says there was actually a
plot that was executed to make sure Bogolio became pope.
And he's very specific about it about the deep State,
the World Economic Forum, and what he calls the deep Church.

(13:46):
Will break it all down for you. Ben Harnwell's live
in Rome at the Vatican today. Kaneyak Citizen Kane is
going to join us also within this hour short commercial break.
One of the things we've been working on for years
is to make sure that you under stand capital markets,
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money and power, because that's what this is all about. Obviously,

(14:09):
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(14:29):
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(14:51):
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Speaker 12 (15:00):
Use your host Stephen k.

Speaker 11 (15:06):
Okay. Let's go back to the Vatican in Saint Peter's Square,
our own Ben Harnwell tell us about Vigano really connected
the dots of the Obama administration, the deep state in
the United States, the World Economic Forum, the deep state internationally,
these intelligence services, these political operatives, these the money and

(15:27):
also talked about how it manifests itself in the deep Church.
Walk us through the highlights of the interview.

Speaker 7 (15:32):
Sir.

Speaker 15 (15:41):
Steve Well, I'll tell you this that the quote that
court yeah, I can hear you Smith.

Speaker 11 (15:47):
Yeah, We're good. Go ahead, No, no, we got you,
go ahead, yes, go ahead.

Speaker 15 (15:52):
The quote that really caught my attention here is when
Archbishop Vigano says, hatred for the traditional Mass is one
of the hallmarks of the.

Speaker 14 (16:02):
Enemies of Christ.

Speaker 15 (16:03):
And this being archibision know he's also clearly talking about
Satsan because he's his whole ecclesiology of the present moment
is definitely the reign of Satan.

Speaker 14 (16:15):
Over the world and over Christ's Church as well.

Speaker 15 (16:19):
Our flag up for our Protestant brethren this fact, whether
you buy into a lot of what the Catholic churches
teaches in terms of its piety and its traditions or not,
even Protestants will recognize that in Satan, in demonic possessions,
has an absolute, supernatural or pret and natural hatred of

(16:41):
the crucifix, of the Cross of Christ crucified. So although
mentioned to our Protestant friends, is to carry that thought
process along because it is exactly the same and arguably
even more demonstrable Satan's hatred of the traditional Latin Mass.

Speaker 14 (16:58):
I'll mentioned and then pass on.

Speaker 15 (16:59):
It will come to that developed that point a little furthestive.
The point is, and this is why Archbishop Vigino is
absolutely heroic. It is because he is speaking up for
the ordinary Kilgrims and Catholics who go to Mass every Sunday.

Speaker 14 (17:17):
Because all of the rest of the bishops, all the.

Speaker 15 (17:19):
Rest of the cardinals are not doing They are hiring
shepherds at great personal cost. Archbishop Viginner has been a
tireless voice, and I.

Speaker 14 (17:30):
Think you know I strongly recommend. Look, Liza has pushed
this out. It's on the Warring website. I'm going to
push out this interview as well.

Speaker 15 (17:36):
Everybody must read it because of what Archbishop Vigino is saying.

Speaker 14 (17:40):
And I'll say this, that guy has been in hiding I.

Speaker 15 (17:44):
Think for the last seven or eight years since he
produced his expose, his dossier on the child sex abuse
scandal in the church and Pope Francis's lack of action,
the fact that he was promoting cardinals constantly like McCay.
It only Viganotes spoke up, and there is now within

(18:04):
the war room and within.

Speaker 14 (18:05):
The wider if we ever we take trisulty with the rather.

Speaker 15 (18:09):
Within the wider Maga family. Here there is now a
direct line. This is the point I'm trying. This is
the direct line between Archbishop Vigino's solitary witness in defense
of ordinary Catholics and.

Speaker 14 (18:22):
This radio show, this television show, this transmission. There is
that line.

Speaker 15 (18:26):
This is the show that speaks out and says the
message that all the Catholic media are too afraid to touch.
This is where people need to come to find out
what is the horrific stories that are taking place over
my shoulder in the Vatican steam.

Speaker 11 (18:43):
How's this going to play out? Now? How's this going
to play out in this conclave? Because we saw what
Viginos said before, Hey, you had the political muscle of
the progressive left globalist back in twenty twelve and twenty
thirteen that manifests itself by getting Burgolio in. Now now
their alternative is to come with an American to try

(19:06):
to get the Americans to buy off to keep the
cash flow from the American Church, which the Vatican desperately
needs because they have an insolvency crisis. They have plenty
of assets assets all over the world in real assets,
real estate, but they have limited cash flow because somebody
of the Church of somebody of the folks in the
in the old regular Church don't go anymore because it's

(19:27):
it's gotten too radical and the traditional Church, as you know,
we've tried to cut these guys off from getting access
to the money. But in prevost they've got they've got
somebody actually more lethal than Burgolio, because he's more organized,
he's more radically left.

Speaker 15 (19:41):
Sir Steve, Look, that's exactly the point here. You've got
two questions, two issues. You've got the role.

Speaker 14 (19:50):
Of the laity.

Speaker 15 (19:53):
In the ability, the talent, the resources that the laity
have which is not being used. And I'd like to
close it up when I come back to the lady,
and I think that the lady should have a role
in what's taking place over my shoulder in just a
few days time, in the treason of the pope.

Speaker 14 (20:08):
But you also have the Vigano points as well.

Speaker 15 (20:13):
So did these two things to do with the fact
that the church is bankrupt? One of the reasons that
the Church, the Vatican has no money is because you
had a lot of serious, pious, pious sincere American businessman
giving money every year to the Pope and his initiatives

(20:37):
via the Paper Foundation and what have you, and they
had a difficulty in getting the money comed in why
because Pope Francis was constantly doing two things. He was
criticizing capitalism and he was playing.

Speaker 14 (20:54):
Up his hatred of America.

Speaker 15 (20:56):
But how are you going to get American capitalists to
give money before you're doing is showing a contempts and
hatred for them, and in fact indicating that American capitalist
are the very antithesis of Christ's Gospel. So that is
one of the reasons that the Vatican is heading towards bankruptcy.
And I'm only I can only regret the fact that

(21:17):
not my Pope died before the incoming hit the fan
on that one, because he should have been around to
see this particular disaster that he had created for the
church and for the faithful. Staying on the point of
the faithful, this church has a medieval organization, right. It's

(21:37):
structure the faith goes back two thousand years, but its
essential governing system goes back a thousand years, Pope undred
and thirteen years, and it hasn't really changed.

Speaker 14 (21:48):
One of the things. And I close with this point, Steve.

Speaker 15 (21:50):
One of the things, as a practice in classic that
really offends me is that I have no real say
in the winning of the church. And that wouldn't be
a bad thing if the bishops and the cardinals who
are charged with running the church, We're doing a good job,
but they're doing an appalling job.

Speaker 14 (22:07):
They're doing an appalling job on what is really.

Speaker 15 (22:09):
Belonged to their office, like Christ has entrusted to them,
which is feeding the sheep, preserving the faith. Well, if
we judge them on the metric of preserving the faith, we.

Speaker 14 (22:17):
Can see how badly they failed.

Speaker 15 (22:19):
But even on the worldly things like the governing governance
of the church, the discipline of priests and bishops, it's
doing an even worse job. And those guys over my shoulder,
their approach to us has never changed since the Dark Ages.
The lady's job is to pay, to pray and obey.

(22:39):
They come up with happy talk about involving the laity,
but fundamentally we're closed out of that room. In four
days time when they start choosing a paper, we're locked
at and we're supposed to applaud whoever they put out
there on that baralcony. And that's really that's just great
and effecive because they're failing, and because it's patronizing, and
it was always.

Speaker 14 (23:00):
That way in the church. Steve, let's go to that.
Six hundred years.

Speaker 15 (23:06):
Ago the laity of the Rome picked the pope.

Speaker 11 (23:10):
Well, let's go to that, because one of the criticisms
they throw at us is that, oh, you guys are
just nothing more than than your traditional Latin Mass. But
the structure, the power structure you want is close to Protestantism.
That one of the big things that Luther and the
Reformation are about. That that you're trying to We're trying
to impose a more Protestant hierarchy or more Protestant organization

(23:33):
on the church.

Speaker 15 (23:34):
Your response, well, firstly, from the official Catholic position, what
is the problem with that? They love the Protestants, They
have breakfast meetings with them, they have prayer gatherings with them.
The people that they don't like us, the traditionalist Catholics,
the people that don't think the faith should change as
it moves down the generations. But if that is their

(23:55):
criticism of us, oh that's Protestant, Well, isn't there a
certain dis Let's say it? Because all they do is
praise Protestantism from the fact when not my Pope pulled
up in the St. Paul the sick, excuse me, the
audience or the bust of Luther.

Speaker 14 (24:13):
They love Protestantism, what's the problem?

Speaker 15 (24:15):
Second point, sid and I close with it, which is
more fundamental. CCP generals have the ability to pick Catholic
bishops under this secret toxic Vatican China agreement. That dream
that's so toxic we're not even allowed to see it.
Don't tell me Vatican that the CCP generals when they're

(24:36):
persecuting the faith in China can pick general can pick bishops,
but we can't.

Speaker 14 (24:42):
That's just disgusting.

Speaker 11 (24:45):
Ben, Where do people go to keep up with this?
By the way, I also want to announce that Jack
Pasopic is going to go is going to go over
to work with Ben for the coverage. We're going to
have a wall of water or the conclave, and I
think we're going to try to get Jack over there
as soon as possible. Who'll go with a special correspondent
for the war room because we're gonna take a ton
of his time and also be doing a show from

(25:06):
over there. We'll take a ton of his time. So
and we'll make a formal announcement of that, I think
tomorrow or Monday.

Speaker 7 (25:12):
Uh.

Speaker 11 (25:13):
Where do people go to get all your all your content? Sir?
Particularly over the weekend, because things are going to run
pretty hot on this.

Speaker 14 (25:20):
Well, Steve, I can't wait for Puss to come out here.

Speaker 15 (25:22):
We'll finally see who's able to drink more polls or
the Brits.

Speaker 14 (25:26):
I'm on getta see Harnwell hard Well. It's the Brits.
We know the answer before we even ask the question.
I'll bring that guy under the table. Well, thanks Steve, God.

Speaker 11 (25:39):
Bless he doesn't want to hear about the about the
intelligence officer. People should understand Ben Harnwell is one of
the most competitive people I've ever met my life. That's
one of the reasons I love him. Ben Harnwell, thank
you so much, brother, look forward to get you back
to on Monday and reading all your content over the weekend.
Thank you. Sir Grays and Moe have pushed out the
up on our site. Is the is the interview? I

(26:02):
think complicit clergy, one of the great groups of a
young priests in the country have pushed it out. We're
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gave amazing answers, stunning answers. You want to understand the
deep state in the deep Church. He's the guy and

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Speaker 7 (26:57):
On the other.

Speaker 2 (26:57):
Side, place the power of the purse. Congress no longer
defends its institutional prerogatives, or not very much. That said,
I think you'll see some pushback in some areas, For example,
the Low Income Home Energy Assistance Program lie HEAP. This
is a program where you've got hundreds of thousands of

(27:18):
people getting heating and cooling assistants in a variety of states,
among them the biggest swing states Pennsylvania and Michigan all
throughout the South, where you get air conditioning assistance from
the lie HEAP program. That's one that's popular that I
think there will be some pushback on. I think you'll
see some pushback on the national Endowment for the Arts,
the National Endowment for the Humanities. But overall, I think

(27:39):
Republicans are going to do their darnest to support Trump.
And I think what has changed since twenty seventeen is
that you've got a Republican party in Congress that is
not only much more aligned with Trump, but very very
afraid of his base in primaries, which is the most
likely way than any of them will lose. And so
I think they're going to do what they can to
pass what he wants and maybe make a few adjustments

(28:00):
here and there.

Speaker 5 (28:01):
They were so very clear what the tradeoff actually was.

Speaker 4 (28:03):
Usually they leave that part out of the budget, they
don't make it clear what they're going to take away
from you.

Speaker 5 (28:07):
In this case, they were very clear. I think the
first question I asked it was really important in.

Speaker 4 (28:13):
Response to the current landscape, because that strange confusion and
tension about the defense spending is critical because Trump one
of the things within the larger sort of right wing
ecosystem that obviously helps sort of have that swirling cauldron
of support for Trump's snaris and false snarg and support
for him that is is weird. There are obviously competitions

(28:33):
and tensions everywhere. But one of the tensions is in
defense spending. There's a traditional sort of a hawkish, you know,
very they want to work very as much defense.

Speaker 5 (28:41):
Spending as you can possibly get.

Speaker 4 (28:43):
And then there's another part of their coalition that is
much more nationalistic, wants to look inward, much more populist,
wants to butt and cut defense spending first and really
take it away. And so in a strange way, this
confusion actually helps them because if you're a part of it,
you're sitting in the right wing media right now, depending
on where you tune in, that's the one place where
they're saying different things. So I'm saying, yeah, you know,

(29:04):
this is really bad for defense spending because they're spending
too much. Right Some are saying the opposite when it
comes to other things. They're all saying that there's not
going to be any consort sacrifice. It's only waste for
aged abuse that they're getting rid of in Medicare and
medicaid to the extent they ever acknowledged that. But that's
the part where I think it's an advantage, that's being
something to really have our home. So that fracture becomes
a full blown crack.

Speaker 16 (29:23):
The salvation here has to be the populace, and the
salvation is clearly not Congress, which is not in doing anything.
The courts can only do so much. Remember, a lot
of what we're talking about is something that may be illegal,
but there's a whole lot that's going on that is
legal and just improvident. And so that's where you really

(29:47):
need those pulse. I mean, that is why that is
ultimately the key issue. But what we're seeing in terms
of the attack on the judiciary, I mean, nobody should
be surprised. This is you know, a man who is
an did felon in sitting now in the Oval office.
We saw him attack prosecutors and the courts. You know,

(30:09):
for the entire time that he was under indictment. This
so now you will start seeing the exact same thing.
It's the reason he has attacked the media. Anybody who
stands up and part of it, even when.

Speaker 7 (30:21):
He loses, is fear.

Speaker 16 (30:24):
So the idea of attacking the law firms is that
they have the fear they will obey in advance. The
attacking of universities is you have fear and obeying in advance,
even if he loses. The International Students International scholars thinking
about thinking twice about coming here, Scientists thinking you know,

(30:45):
what better to be doing this in Canada, in England,
in France. I mean the repercussions because of the nature
of what he is doing, even if the courts ultimately
say you can't do this enormous.

Speaker 10 (31:00):
Well, he sees his next hundred days the way he's
seen his last x number of days in life, which
is that it is about him. It's not about us.
It's not about we the people. It's not about a
world in which we try to fulfill the implications of
the declaration of independence. And this is not some reflexibly

(31:24):
partisan anti Trump point.

Speaker 3 (31:26):
It's simply the case.

Speaker 10 (31:28):
And we're not We don't do ourselves any favors. We are,
I think, doing our jobs as citizens if we don't
call them as we see them. And what we've seen
for the last decade and it's now been a decade,
is that we are living in an age of Trump.

Speaker 3 (31:46):
There's no question about that.

Speaker 10 (31:49):
He has set the terms of the debate, and many
people are defined now by their reaction to the terms
he has set. And I think what, without any fear
really of serious contradiction, I think we can say that
he is taking a cult of personality. He has used

(32:12):
that to take over a major political party, and he
is now in his second term of trying to make
the world in his image as opposed to an image
where we can all figure out a way to live
lives of prosperity and purpose.

Speaker 3 (32:32):
And it's a remarkable thing.

Speaker 10 (32:33):
No American president has ever held this kind of grip.
It's ever had this kind of grip on the American imagination.

Speaker 3 (32:42):
And I don't like saying things are unprecedented.

Speaker 10 (32:44):
It's against my business model, but in this case, in
this case, it is unprecedented.

Speaker 11 (32:52):
Oh my god, what a Saturday Morning d John meadium
The haters actually said, I'm going to replay that one
in the second hour that this is the age of Trump.
What we said on the show for years and years
and years. John Meacham says, you can't dispute it. It's
the age of Trump and no American president. Meetcham's the

(33:17):
historian of the presidents, one of them. But the Morning
Joe crowd, the Washington consensus just said, no American president
has ever had a grip on powerlay President Trump. Wow
from Meecham, not from warroom, not from Bannon from John Meacham,

(33:37):
stunning the I want to bring a kne now the
president of Media matters, who's a really smart guy. Hates MAGA,
hates Trump, hates war Room, hates all of us, but
a smart guy. I'll play that clip in the middle
of that again. By the way, the team did a
magnificent job of bringing all the different elements of of

(34:00):
these clips together for the last couple of days. He
got it, So kineac Cain. One things I love about
assisteens free press, and I was the Drudge of the right.
It's ten times better than Drudge. You are at where
Drudge was with peak. Drudge back with Andrew. Breitbart was

(34:22):
one of his. It was Andrew twelve. It was twelve
on twelve, Off Andrew do twelve. Drudger Drew twelve back
in the two thousand and four or five six, all
the way up to ten eleven until Andrew went separate
ways to do the Breitbart. We financed the Brakebart site,
and then Drudge lost it after a Trump went at sixteen.
Whether he got bought off or invested, who knows. But

(34:42):
it radically shifted but also got lazy. It's now where
it doesn't have the impact. It's also not brillantly thought through,
as you in your stack tell people why because you're
sitting the budget came out and you and Iron and
sink on this and this is remember Rush votes the
architect here. This is Project twenty five. This is Sierra.
I just gave the keynote address over this morning, the

(35:03):
third one I've done for the three years they've been
kind of up and running, or since they've had these conferences.
You know, it's twenty two percent on the discretionary side,
don't The defense budget's a major increase, although the defense
guys are yelling us, but you immediately when this thing
goes up. Cain has got the way to look at

(35:24):
I think, the sophisticated way in the stack, red and green.
He's letting you know this is important. You need to
pay attention here. And you're all over this like, hey,
this is not nearly enough. This is a nice first cut,
but we're not going to get there here. So walk
me through one. What is your obsession with federal spending?
What is your obsession? How's that driven you as a

(35:47):
newsperson Because you weren't a newsperson for decades, You're a trader,
you know, Wall Street guy in the You know, you're
trading securities daily and playing golf, working on that handicap,
and then all of a sudden you're the one of
the most significant people in the world on news. But
it was driven by your obsession with federal spending. Sir, Yeah,

(36:08):
that's correct.

Speaker 17 (36:09):
First of all, I gotta say Meecham got it completely wrong.
I just got to put this in there. It is
not a cult of personality. It's the will of the people.
This is what MSNBC doesn't understand. They don't understand the
working class coalition and that Trump. We aren't driven by Trump.
We're driven by the ideas behind America.

Speaker 6 (36:27):
First. Now I'll get to your question. You're exactly right, Benn.

Speaker 17 (36:30):
And you remember our conversation as well that we've had
in different texts, in different text threats. I was interning
for CNN in Washington, DC in the summer of nineteen
eighty seven.

Speaker 6 (36:40):
I was a young kid of twenty years old.

Speaker 17 (36:42):
I was doing my resume tape on the overnight shift
in the last two weeks of the internshift. Now this
is early CNN, and this is Bernie Shaw, Bernard Shaw.

Speaker 6 (36:52):
This is eighty seven.

Speaker 17 (36:53):
I think it existed for just a couple of years,
so it wasn't a left wing you know, sort of
a hateful left weeen bragg and so I'm over there
in the overnight. One of the overnight producers is like,
the national debt just crossed two trillion, two trillion. I'd
never really even heard about the national debt, didn't understand
the difference between debt and deficits, and that sort of

(37:14):
struck my interest to that point. And you can go
back and talk to my friends. Starting back in eighty
seven is when I started to get extremely upset about
this stuff because I was looking at you know, future
you know, unfunded mandates, the future money that was going
to have to be laid out. So it's been a draw.
You know, this has been a thing that's been going
on now for forty years for me. So, yeah, you

(37:37):
talked about Drudge, you and I in our various discussions,
and I know how tight you sort of obviously you
were with Andrew but as well with Drudge himself, and
you talked about the heyd heyday, you know, two to
sort of twenty ten, when when Drudge was really pushing
it out, and you know, and I was a reader
of that site, and I just always thought that there

(37:57):
needed to be an alternative. Not that Drudge was doing
it wrong, but just that he didn't do enough stories
in a day. You know, he would do fifty sixty.
Maybe back then he was doing closer to one hundred,
but you're correct in pointing out that he's not really
even trying anymore if he's still running the site, because
they're really just doing fifty fifty five sixty stories. So
I always thought there should be an alternative. I knew

(38:19):
it would, it would change my life. I mean, look,
this is four hundred and fifteen straight weekends that I'm
working this. It's the as you know, it was the
eighth anniversary of Citizen Free Price's launch just two days
ago on May first. It was May first, twenty seventeen,
So this is three thousand straight days. So I knew
that that once I started, that if the site became popular,

(38:42):
that I would never be able to stop, right, So
I put it off. I put it off a long time,
and I didn't actually to wrap this up. I didn't
actually wait for Trump, excuse me for Drudge to turn
on Trump as he started to in that March April
May period of twenty seventeen, when the Komi stuff was
first breaking, that was just when I happened to launch.

(39:06):
So I did not launch because Drudge turned against Trump
or turned against America.

Speaker 6 (39:10):
First. I launched just because.

Speaker 17 (39:12):
I think there needed I thought there needed to be
another side up with more links every day.

Speaker 6 (39:17):
So that was the That is what led to May first.
I've got a lot more, but I'll let you interject.

Speaker 11 (39:24):
Yeah, no, no, no, no, no, no, hang on, We're
gonna go to a commercial break. I'm gonna keep you
around for a while because I want to get to
for people to understand the site to stack and particularly
you do the best. You do the best pulling together
of different whether it's Financial Times, Wall Street Journal, New
York Times, all the great blogs out there, to talk
about really the underlying economic and financial crisis we have

(39:48):
this summer, the second hundred days. This is the speech
I just gave it. Cra We're gonna have the convergence
of multiple crises, both the kinetic part of the Third
World War coupled with this, the issue about Trump being
a commander in chief, the constitutional crisis on the deportations
coupled with this financial and economic crisis hangover a second game.

(40:10):
We're gonna take a short commercial break the situation down
in Texas. We're gonna start covering in details. Well we're
covered in detail, but I mean we're gonna have the
players on starting next week. There's something deeply wrong in
the state of Texas right now. It's a maga state.
The House has been taken over, a given by the
Rhinos to the Democrats, and they're passing some incredibly just

(40:30):
bizarro laws. Also, this question of what's going on with
these mosque and these Islamic centers. We're gonna get to
all of it. Got to break it down. Nine to
seven to two. Patriot Patriot Mobile, Glenn Sturry and the
team out of Tarrent County have helped turned around the state.
President Trump wanted a boy fourteen points. They've got the
best phone service in the country, full stop. Today's the

(40:52):
day you do the shift. Do the switch at nine
to seven to two Patriot Patriot Mobile.

Speaker 12 (40:59):
Here's your host, Stephen K.

Speaker 17 (41:01):
Bath.

Speaker 11 (41:02):
Like I said, Glencring the team, make sure you check
out Patriot Mobile. You don't need to be convinced about
the company as one of the great alternative Patriot companies
in this alternative economy, because folks, I said this morning,
the breakfast in twenty eight if the radical Democrats steal it,
we allow them to steal it. And the deep state
has not been shattered. And I'm not crazy about the

(41:25):
trajectory on that where I love so much other stuff
it's going on. Let's be honest. MTG put that tweet
out and people should listen to MTG in this. I
think she spoke from the heart and she spoke for
a lot of people in the base about things. They're
coming hard. They're coming hard. That's why nine to seven
to two Patriot do this switch today to Patriot Mobile.

(41:49):
So I'm just doing some math here. Kine eighty seven
would make this. It was thirty years then, roughly from
that day as an intern when you found you heard
about this thing called the name debt to the day
really when you launched Citizens Free Press. About thirty years okay,
of you doing other things for eight years. Every day

(42:09):
you've worked this relentless. You're back to the old drudge
even pre Andrew right, So you're doing it. You're doing it.
Twenty four to seven. I want to make sure something
because the convergence abous this budget. But I would actually
argue in the reality of CNN at that time, and
the reason it resonated was not Bernie shar who's a
hardcore lefty, was Lou Dobbs, President Trump, the formation of

(42:33):
this movement. Lou Dobbs is the railhead of the guy
that was saying back then trade trade deficits, and the
focus was Japan because very quickly after the crash, you know,
Japan crashed right in the early nineties and never really

(42:53):
to recover although they've got massive trade deficits with US.
China took it over because the Bush Hunter in the
early nineties and the Clintons gave a most favored nation
in wto and really you know, pardoned with the Chinese
Commist Party. So as we're here today, we have for
a young man as an Intern, we had only two

(43:14):
train a debt, We had a very small trade deficit.
We had some but not not huge. We had a
pristine balance sheet. Basically we were a manufacturing hedgemond. Still
we were starting to lose it the eighties. You started
see losing it right seventies and eighties. But the catastrophe
before us as you went about did your wall steat trading?
Did it ever dawn on you as you were a

(43:35):
trader that the country was being gutted both by trade
and by the spending, because those are the double whammies
that have us in the frickin jammer in today, Sir.

Speaker 17 (43:47):
Yeah, absolutely a dawn on me, dude, Ross Parole. I
mean I was one hundred percent on the Ross Perot train,
and not because I thought, you know, yeah, he was
talking about the national debt when Clinton and Bush weren't,
but he was also talking about was what was going
to happen to the jobs and the giants sucking sound obviously,
So I saw that coming and I didn't buy it

(44:08):
even at the time.

Speaker 6 (44:09):
I didn't really.

Speaker 17 (44:10):
Buy the drink the kool aid that the cheap textile
jobs would go overseas and go to Mexico and you know,
the higher wage jobs would come back so quickly and
so easily, and they obviously hasn't in proros proved to
be correct.

Speaker 6 (44:23):
So yeah, I saw it.

Speaker 17 (44:24):
But yeah, Ben, I want to really get into this
budget stuff because you talked about it.

Speaker 6 (44:29):
Look, you played MSNBC.

Speaker 17 (44:30):
These guys are freaking out about one hundred and sixty
three billion in cuts to non discretionary, non defense discretionary. Right,
that was like seven hundred and fifty million in the
previous budget and last year's fiscal year budget, and we're
cutting it down to the five hundred and eighty million range.
And they're freaking out because these are all the programs
they don't they'd love. They don't want a twenty three
percent cut in any they don't want a two percent

(44:53):
cut in any of it. But you know, getting into
why I was upset yesterday and why every time there's
something about the budget, why I break it down, is
this all I'm looking for, a Bannon, is a path
to a balance budget. And I understand that Trump didn't
talk a huge amount in this campaign season about the
national debt, but it's an understood thing you and I

(45:14):
both realize and others as well, the importance of it.

Speaker 6 (45:18):
So I was sort of hoping that in four.

Speaker 17 (45:19):
Years we could knock this thing down six hundred billion
a year and get the deficit back, you know, by
twenty twenty eight, approaching that zero mark, right, because the
whole point what people need to understand about the deficit,
and obviously, in the accumulation of the annual deficits being
the national debt.

Speaker 6 (45:37):
What they don't understand is interest on the national debt.
I gave some.

Speaker 13 (45:41):
Charge to your producer before the show today to show
how interest has really gone from the sort of three
hundred billion a year range to this year, this fiscal year,
we're only halfway through it and we're at.

Speaker 6 (45:52):
Five hundred and eighty two billion. You see it right there.

Speaker 17 (45:55):
So on thirty seven trillion in national debt, if you're
if you're having to find answered at three point two
eighty four percent, it's gonna cost one point one trillion.
So that's gonna make it the single largest non discretionary
item in the budget.

Speaker 6 (46:09):
It's gonna be larger than defense. We heard yesterday.

Speaker 17 (46:12):
Defense is likely to be one point zero one trillion,
and interest on the debt at one point one.

Speaker 6 (46:17):
So why does this matter?

Speaker 17 (46:18):
Think about it, people, We only bring in five trillion,
about five point one trillion in total federal revenues, right
we're spending seven point five We're bringing in five point
one and one point one of it is interest on
the debt. That's twenty percent of our total federal revenues
that we're having to spend on.

Speaker 6 (46:36):
The monthly visa bill just to keep it from going up.

Speaker 17 (46:39):
And I'll quickly say, you know, when I put links
in the stack, like, look at the national debt four
years from now, right this day, in twenty twenty nine,
at forty seven trillion. First of all, we're gonna be
lucky if it's at forty seven trillion. It's very possible
that it's going to be closer to fifty trillion. And
the point is the financing cost on fifty trillion at
three point two four percent, that's one point six trillion

(47:03):
dollars in interest payments.

Speaker 6 (47:06):
You know, I've always I've been I've been.

Speaker 17 (47:07):
Worried about this for thirty years, right, wondering what's the
breaking point. Well, the breaking point is the bond market.
You and I both realized. We saw what happened three
weeks ago when the bond market kind of did a
few wiggles and waggles when it wasn't when it was
a little bit worried about this Republican budget.

Speaker 6 (47:23):
That's the point.

Speaker 17 (47:23):
When the bond market goes, when it decides that it
needs one percent more or two percent more on every
you know, every length of treasury, then we can no
longer finance our debt.

Speaker 6 (47:34):
As people have said, how do countries go bankrupt? Very
very slowly and then all.

Speaker 17 (47:39):
Of a sudden, all it really takes is for the
bond market to give up on US treasuries. And my
you know, the reason I'm screaming right now, and the
reason I'm screaming all over the website is we're finally
getting close to that choking point ban it. We're getting
close to the point where interest on the debt is
so large it takes such a percentage of our federal

(47:59):
revenues rate that we can no longer spend on anything.
And so that's why I'm sounding the alarm now because
I would look rather than Trump, you know, putting on
ten or eleven trillion, just like Biden did. And I'm
not just blaming Trump, and Trump's numbers were much lower,
by the way, before COVID. Before COVID, Trump had gotten
the the Obama annual deficits down from like the one

(48:21):
point eight trillion range down closer to a trillion, So
he was making progress.

Speaker 6 (48:25):
So I'm not putting this on Trump.

Speaker 17 (48:27):
And I understand how this is all politically difficult to do.
These are actual cuts, but the point is if we
let it get to fifty trillion or forty seven trillion,
the interest on that is going to be almost insurmountable.

Speaker 6 (48:40):
So that's why I'm raising the alarm out and I.

Speaker 11 (48:42):
Feel like, hang on one second, Hang on one second,
hang one second. We'll take you through a break. The
great Kine, citizen Kane, is with us, and I got
one more bombshell to drop coming out of Japan. All
next in the word