Ms. Evelyn the Matriarch: A Two-Part Braxtons Season Finale Recap with Dustin & Blue

Carlos is back with Dustin and Blue for an explosive recap of The Braxtons’ two-part season finale. Safe to say, we thoroughly enjoyed this season! The trio dives into whether this is truly the end of the road—for the show… and for the sisters themselves.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
Reality with the King is hosted by me, Carlos King.
I'm an executive producer who have produced some of your
favorite shows from the Real Housewives in Atlanta, New Jersey
and my own creation, The Love and Marriage Franchise and
Bell Collective. Every episode we recap reality television from the
Real Housewives Franchise to The Bachelor or Selling Sunset, in

(00:27):
addition to celebrity guests, whether in the unscripted space or
scripted as well. All right, rain Drops, we are back
for another installment of the Braxton's recapin I am joined,
of course by Dustin and we got Blue.

Speaker 2 (00:51):
Yes, we do. Happy to have you Blue.

Speaker 3 (00:53):
Thank you guys for having me.

Speaker 4 (00:54):
This has been so.

Speaker 2 (00:55):
Fun, hasn't it.

Speaker 5 (00:57):
It's been a great time in the way you'd be
breaking this shit all the way down.

Speaker 2 (01:00):
You know what I'm saying. We're gonna start.

Speaker 4 (01:01):
I'm gonna behave this week.

Speaker 3 (01:02):
I'm gonna behave. I promise, I'm gonna be so so
so behaved.

Speaker 5 (01:06):
No Burning Blue this week, I'm gonna start calling you
burning Blue like that Mariah song, like.

Speaker 2 (01:13):
Hell yeah, I actually love me too.

Speaker 5 (01:15):
Is gorgeous. She needs to write for other people to fun.
Fact she writes all of the music by herself.

Speaker 3 (01:23):
Performers.

Speaker 4 (01:24):
Wait, waits, you didn't know that?

Speaker 5 (01:26):
No, And so I have like a tremendous amount of
respect for Mariah the scientists now because the lyrics are
actually what drew me into her music in the place.

Speaker 4 (01:34):
Yeah, yeah, I.

Speaker 1 (01:36):
Just told my age I thought we were talked about
Mariah Carey.

Speaker 4 (01:40):
Oh us, okay, look at you. That's blue.

Speaker 3 (01:47):
You've ever said, are you serious?

Speaker 2 (01:48):
Blue?

Speaker 4 (01:49):
Blue Blue? I know I have the face of a
twenty five year old.

Speaker 2 (01:53):
Right.

Speaker 6 (01:56):
Rich, but blue blue, that's look at it? Doesn't have said,
Oh you did know that? Like I thought, Carre wrote
her song not me and.

Speaker 7 (02:06):
Me another Mariah with with with bad tasting Ben who
gossip on on jail birds.

Speaker 5 (02:11):
That Mariah we knew Mariah Carrey got down with that
p Mariah Carry clicked that big so fast and write
ahead on your ass.

Speaker 2 (02:19):
Expediously all that.

Speaker 5 (02:20):
Ship, big three syllable one marriage. You know what I'm saying.
I love all right Carry. But yeah, I was so surprised.
Shout out to Mariah a scientists and her skills with
the pen. I did not know that she wrote all
that music by herself.

Speaker 3 (02:35):
I was impressed the stronger than the Yeah, oh I
just heard it.

Speaker 4 (02:39):
Oh people I dated back in the day, I gotta
you know what you're strong.

Speaker 3 (02:58):
Okay, I said, I was my line. Okay, so yeah,
the is up. Let's do this.

Speaker 4 (03:02):
Let's do this.

Speaker 7 (03:04):
My mercury is an aries. I communicate like an aries.
Even when I'm being soft, I might knock all this
shit over.

Speaker 2 (03:10):
Yeah. I love that. I feel seen. I know.

Speaker 4 (03:15):
I am constantly around aries.

Speaker 1 (03:17):
And it's funny because back in the day it was
all scorpios. My ax is a scorpio. I my my look,
my ex best friend. Of all these years of scorpio,
I've always been around scorpios. But nowadays, at my big age,
I'm surrounded by aries, and I gotta say one thing
of my areas that I do love.

Speaker 4 (03:34):
You guys are beautifully honest.

Speaker 2 (03:39):
I'm an.

Speaker 3 (03:41):
I don't claim the aries in me. I fight it
every day.

Speaker 2 (03:45):
Come on over to the dark side.

Speaker 4 (03:47):
I'm oh, I know what it is. I don't.

Speaker 1 (03:56):
Dust's in a mood because I forgot dust. It is
gay our day after five, p yo, let's.

Speaker 2 (04:03):
Get it all.

Speaker 5 (04:05):
It's the weekend. You know the motto all you do
is this is the motto for the whole weekend.

Speaker 3 (04:11):
About or whatever this is before you let it out.

Speaker 4 (04:14):
I like mood.

Speaker 2 (04:22):
You want my schedule? You know my schedule. You know
what I'm saying.

Speaker 4 (04:26):
Yeah, you know your schedules.

Speaker 7 (04:28):
But no Dustin you and the other finance black men.
I saw y'all on that stage. I was very related.

Speaker 2 (04:33):
Thank you, ste I got my life. That's my boy.

Speaker 5 (04:39):
Shout out to Obio Jones, Shout out to Deontay Kyle,
and shout out to my boy Steve Sanders. And the
biggest shout out goes to the beautiful and name and
he for giving us her platform to have a great conversation.
Shout out to everybody at Revolt. That was a really
dope experience. Thank you for for knowing that. Blue, I
appreciate that. Thank you for watching.

Speaker 4 (05:01):
And just to tell the range Jos where they can
watch it.

Speaker 2 (05:04):
Yeah, you can go on.

Speaker 5 (05:05):
So if you go to YouTube to the Revolt YouTube
channel and you look up The People's Brief, the name
of the show is The People's Brief by Lene Venie.
And we were so blessed to be able to moderate
a discussion on black masculinity and the many facets and
dynamics of it.

Speaker 2 (05:21):
Yeah, we really just scratched the surface. So hopefully we
get to do it again. But it was really great,
great group of guys, great minds. You know.

Speaker 5 (05:28):
I like being around smart people. I was just soaking
it up. I was a sponge.

Speaker 2 (05:35):
Yeah, we got up in there, didn't we. It was good.

Speaker 5 (05:37):
So, you know, it was a great experience. And I
love working like that in that capacity. I love being
able to share ideas and kind of just just put
a conversation out into the world that's gonna make motherfuckers
be better.

Speaker 2 (05:49):
So I was grateful.

Speaker 5 (05:51):
Thank you, Blue, Thank you to everybody who was a
huge Thank you to Lena, Thank you beautiful.

Speaker 2 (05:58):
Absolutely.

Speaker 1 (06:00):
So you guys been watching that, and apparently a lot
of people are watching our Braxton's recap, including some family
members all the legends.

Speaker 4 (06:07):
So and you see, is anybody happy?

Speaker 7 (06:15):
Did anybody call the lady afterwards and maybe do some introspection?

Speaker 4 (06:20):
People are watching.

Speaker 3 (06:23):
I'm used to it. I don't mind it. Let's do it.

Speaker 6 (06:26):
Check the table, Blue, how has your feed been?

Speaker 1 (06:32):
Because listen, Dustin, uh his name is Dustin. I don't
recomments rass. So it's so Dustin is far removed from it.
He is used to being the topic of conversation, but
Blue being introduced into this wild world of recapping the
Braxtons weekly. I can't wait to get to this to

(06:55):
our finale that aired tonight.

Speaker 4 (06:57):
But how has a feedback ben for you?

Speaker 1 (07:01):
Because doesn't I said this to you earlier? We really
do appreciate your educational ways of dissecting the dynamics of
this sibling robbery that's occurring.

Speaker 4 (07:18):
On this show.

Speaker 2 (07:19):
Yeah, for sure.

Speaker 4 (07:22):
Have you beginning any dms?

Speaker 3 (07:24):
Well, here's the thing. I feel like the people who
are used to me know to expect this.

Speaker 7 (07:31):
You know, I'm very consistent. Those who are new to me,
I will say this. I am compassionate, not nice, like
niceness is performative. Nice by definition, simply means I want
to be agreeable and stroke your ego. I'm a self
mastery coach who specializes in ego death. So just because
you're mad at me, does it mean something good's not

(07:53):
still happening?

Speaker 1 (07:57):
I hire you to just follow me around life and
to talk to me about every move I make.

Speaker 7 (08:03):
Oh what's his name? Jonathan Major tried to hire me.
I was like, sir, I got I got too much
going on. Wait, it's an exclusive we're be had to pay. Well, okay, yes,
there's a long list of people who have pulled me
aside what a dollar and said please help me.

Speaker 2 (08:20):
That's a compliment. Blue means a huge one. Yeah. That
means that.

Speaker 5 (08:24):
People are like, you know what, I'm willing to be
vulnerable to her. That means you the ship and he's huge.

Speaker 3 (08:30):
Here's the thing. Everybody is human.

Speaker 7 (08:31):
So I see all the sisters as human beings, which
is why whenever we try to teat treat them like
purely victims or purely superstars, I clock out because to me,
all I see is human beings going through human ship.

Speaker 2 (08:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (08:44):
Yeah, yeah, no, and that's watching yeah no, listen, listen, listen.

Speaker 1 (08:49):
On aside, I will say this, the one thing I
always pride this podcast or doing is working with people
who are here.

Speaker 4 (08:59):
Just being honest.

Speaker 1 (09:00):
And you didn't have to even say it, but I'm
glad you did because I think now we could frame
it that way. The three of us, including Claudia, Ebony
K Williams, anybody who I've had the chance of working
with on this platform, we look at everyone as humans,
not as just entertainers. We are very honest about no. Look,
I'm friends for this person in real life. So there's

(09:22):
a little bias there or not, you know, like we
were very honest about that too, But there's there's no
hitting agenda, and I think that's the reason why a
lot of people do tune into this. And I do
get a lot of dms from people who we do
talk about and they give me their feedback. And the
beauty of this is this It's been good feedback and

(09:45):
I'll leave it at that.

Speaker 2 (09:46):
That's what's up.

Speaker 3 (09:49):
It is.

Speaker 2 (09:49):
Ain't nobody here trying to hurt nobody.

Speaker 5 (09:51):
There's a lot of other places you can go to
for that type of content. Some people call it mess
it's just got some content or whatever. And if that's
what you're into, cool, But that's is not what we
do on this show in particular. So hate to disappoint
your ass, but you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (10:09):
Over here. Sorry, So no, I'm glad.

Speaker 1 (10:13):
So listen, let's get into this two our season finale
that I think may be called the series finale because look,
as a producer in the business and as somebody that
also had a show that had a two hour season finale.

Speaker 2 (10:31):
That show did not come back.

Speaker 4 (10:32):
So what I it's sort of.

Speaker 1 (10:36):
It sort of feels like and listen, I have no
insider information, because if I did, I would tell you all.
I think a two hour finale on this show indicates
that maybe the show is not going to come back.
I gotta be honest with all of you. We'd love

(10:56):
to hear your thoughts after watching this two hour season finale.

Speaker 4 (11:00):
I don't know what the.

Speaker 1 (11:01):
Next season of the show would feel like the difference
between a show like this from Housewives, Bell Collective Love
and Marriage Love and Hip Hop Batties, you know what
I mean? Like the difference with these shows. Shout out
to Dustin Ross the difference with those shows. Everybody replaced

(11:22):
the Bow Family, isn't You can't do a show about
the Braxtons and not have the core group of the
family film together and based on this two hour season finale,
I honestly, and Blue, I'm looking forward to your dissection

(11:43):
of this from a global educational standpoint. I don't see
a world where these sisters can film again and it'd
be enjoyable to watch and they actually want to be
around each other. So, before I get to you, Blue, Dustin,
what about your thoughts on the to our finale and

(12:05):
where do you think the show goes from here?

Speaker 5 (12:07):
Yeah, well you brought up a very interesting POV on that,
because I didn't even consider that it was indicative of, like,
you know, no more story to tell basically, right, I
was thinking, you know, Thanksgiving its next week. This show
airs on Friday nights, Like you know what I'm saying.
I was like, maybe they're trying to get it out
instead of compete with everybody being distracted next week during

(12:30):
this normal airing time, and we're at the end of
the year.

Speaker 2 (12:34):
You know, everything in the world, well in our.

Speaker 5 (12:36):
Business typically shuts down after the fifteenth of November anyway,
So I was just like, maybe they're trying to expedite
the ish the ending of this season.

Speaker 2 (12:46):
I kind of do see.

Speaker 5 (12:47):
The show being able to come back next season, but
they're going to have to create some sort of contractual
rule that obligates them to film together. It can't be
disjointed filming, it cannot be You're almost going to have
to basically sign their their experience a way to being
in the same space for the for the.

Speaker 2 (13:10):
Entirety of the season.

Speaker 5 (13:12):
That's what I think, because don't nobody want to watch
them arguing, you know, in that way or talking about
how they're not going to don't nobody want to watch
them reach your daddy? And I'll just put it like that.
I think Twanda spoke in some very final ways. She
used some words and phrasing that was very final, right Blue,
And I feel like that was premature because as you

(13:34):
can see, Tamar pulled Trina's hair and kicked her, and
they still came back together to film at the Sister's
retreat their quotes. So I don't know, you know, I
feel like there is a pathway back, but it's going
to have to be structured with a view toward an
enjoyable viewer experience. But you would know far better than
I will, Carlos, because you make this shit.

Speaker 2 (13:55):
So I don't know.

Speaker 1 (13:57):
We'll see, well, yeah, but to your point, will we'll
see because at the end of the day, money does talk.

Speaker 7 (14:03):
Yeah, go ahead, Blue, and the money is loud depending
on how much, but it depends on who the money
is talking to. I will say this, I think this
season confirmed for a lot of people because I went
in the comments of other people's stuff, including us, carlosk.
I did some research, you know, the anthropologist in me,
I said if there's some market research on what the

(14:24):
audience is saying about this finale, regardless of what my
education is telling me, right, Like, I wanted to see
what what everybody was saying emotionally speaking, without over the
overwhelming sentiment that I saw on every platform. The aggregate
sentiment was we came for Tony, we stayed for Tamar.

Speaker 1 (14:44):
Whoa I was studying everywhere I went.

Speaker 3 (14:49):
It was the theme.

Speaker 7 (14:52):
And I think everybody's having to sit with what that
means because it's clear that, you know, I did make
some jokes about the Lilac and Doodoe Brown wedding, but
the wedding was gorgeous, because I'm not a hater.

Speaker 3 (15:04):
The wedding was.

Speaker 7 (15:04):
Beautiful, beautiful wedding, right, And I will never jokes about
that because I love love and I love seeing how
obsessed her man is with her, Like I want all
people to know what it's like to see another black
person love on you that way, right, And So I
think in Twanda's mind, this was going to be her

(15:25):
main character season, and I think when it started to
hit her that that wasn't gonna happen.

Speaker 3 (15:32):
I think that's why she was like, well, there's no
reason for me to come back.

Speaker 7 (15:34):
And that's why the finality that that doesn't picked up
on started to creep into her language. Right, all the
little moments where she thought she would be centered, somehow
she was still off of center.

Speaker 3 (15:44):
And here's the thing.

Speaker 7 (15:45):
There's nothing wrong with one in your main character moments,
especially when it's your wedding. There's nothing wrong with wanting
to be centered when you're about to be celebrating love.
It's just you guys know what I feel about cannibalizing
your sisters to do it, and also Miss.

Speaker 2 (15:58):
Evelyn cannibalizing them.

Speaker 4 (16:04):
I'm trying to keep it straight, saying.

Speaker 2 (16:07):
Do you want to right now? I'm laughing at night.

Speaker 5 (16:13):
I don't get the day I'm laughing, and that.

Speaker 3 (16:18):
You want to keep that girl up.

Speaker 4 (16:22):
Blue Blue.

Speaker 6 (16:24):
I'll be good until Dunfin cracked a smile and laughed,
and I'll be like, fuck, no, look tell statistically know
when when it happens.

Speaker 3 (16:33):
I'm just going over there trying to kill a black
that girl and you was so funny.

Speaker 7 (16:38):
Is the moment that made it clude to me that
you guys were writing previous breakdowns about the lack of
a matriarch and how Tony is the closest thing to
a matriarch, but Tamar is the one who wants so
badly to act like a matriarch. Was the wedding when
Tony went to her mama and said, so, I'm gonna
go tell Twanda right that our sister had a medical

(16:58):
emergency and in her rspand almost died and and that's why
she's not here.

Speaker 3 (17:01):
And the mother was like, Miss Evelin was like, girl,
I don't know about that.

Speaker 7 (17:05):
Let me go talk to mister Rufus real quick and
get a little dancing like Miss Evelyn was saulst to
the girls up and tapped out that poor Tony had
to figure out how to be a latch key mom
at the damn wedding. I got a glimpse to that
job that one scene. Miss Evelyn was not about it.
She was like, oh, girl, okay, y'all do nothing, y'all
do look the check cleared, My wig is straight. I

(17:27):
don't have time for this. And so Tony running around
trying to play mom, and then finally telling Twanda and
to Wanna saying I wish you had told me ninety
minutes ago so I wouldn't have been stuck in ambiguity
for so long. That tells me everything I need to
know about what happens when the latch key babies have
to figure out how to make their own mashed potatoes
because mom's at work. That scene told me everything I

(17:47):
needed to know about why it's babies raising babies and
why the matriarch figure and who's supposed to fix this
has never arisen and the closest we have is a
Libra superstar with a fresh haircut, worried about her next
music video like it's a going on.

Speaker 3 (18:03):
Those are my opening thoughts. Let me choll.

Speaker 4 (18:09):
Okay, well, let's listen.

Speaker 1 (18:11):
Let's let's let's dog into that, because again, I know
that the top of I'm sorry. Towards the end of
last week's recap, we did talk about starting this conversation
with the finale, but also with Evelyn, with miss ev
excuse me because I'm a respectful black man raising Detroit,
So Miss Evelyn, apologize, I will never call you by

(18:32):
your first name. Apologies, Miss ef You obviously found the
perfect way to bring this up, because.

Speaker 4 (18:40):
Listen, that scene is.

Speaker 1 (18:42):
Indicative the dynamic of what's happening, and before we get
into the sit down between Tamar, Trina and Tony.

Speaker 2 (18:51):
Which, by the way, he told me everything I needed
to know.

Speaker 4 (18:58):
You are vindicated and.

Speaker 1 (18:59):
So oh yeah, they call that a lot of stuff.

Speaker 2 (19:07):
I'm just waiting till we get there. That's it. I'm
just waiting till we get there. We can't hear you
those Carlos.

Speaker 7 (19:16):
Your voice went out. See they got one. They got
one of the Braxton lawyers to turn off your mic friend.
You be careful.

Speaker 2 (19:22):
It's some damn airprids.

Speaker 3 (19:26):
Oh he is high tech. Yeah, and that microphone.

Speaker 7 (19:30):
I wonder where he got that microphone from.

Speaker 5 (19:32):
Ye, I don't know, changing colors and ship Okay, this
grady and ass microphone. Where you get this from?

Speaker 3 (19:43):
I like you can hear you, you and your fancy
micro still. Oh he's on mute. Well that's just mute.

Speaker 4 (19:51):
My bad. We're back.

Speaker 2 (19:53):
Yay, we're back.

Speaker 4 (19:55):
All right.

Speaker 1 (19:56):
Technical difficulties Okay, sorry, it's the spirit of a Braxton
all right.

Speaker 4 (19:59):
So we I will say is this what I will say?

Speaker 2 (20:02):
Is this.

Speaker 3 (20:05):
Right?

Speaker 7 (20:08):
Yes?

Speaker 8 (20:09):
No, apologized because you yaked my wing.

Speaker 4 (20:24):
That We'll get to that. That was easy. We'll get
to that, okay, miss eval, Yes, sorry again.

Speaker 1 (20:38):
We talked about how Tony Brackston said publicly, and these
are her words, not mine. I would have sword exact
words was sword if it wasn't for my sisters. She
talked about feeling guilty because every time she achieved something,
her mother would say, don't forget about your sisters. Blue
just clocked it when Trina had to leave the wedding

(21:01):
early due to bond her husband dealing with a heart
issue that he has congest.

Speaker 4 (21:06):
Heart failure, which is a very serious thing, by the way,
So I'm glad they did lead. Tony was running around
figuring out do I tell her?

Speaker 1 (21:15):
The mom was like, nah, don't do it, and she did,
and Tomanta said, you should have told me earlier, which
Tony had an instinct to do.

Speaker 7 (21:22):
So.

Speaker 1 (21:23):
With all of that being said, in addition to the
fact that they have never filmed a scene where the
mama was told about her daughter's fighting verbally and a
little bit of physical, what is the sort of role
that Miss Evelyn has or any when it comes to
the dynamic of her daughters.

Speaker 2 (21:46):
Go ahead, do your thing, boo ladies.

Speaker 5 (21:51):
First, you know what I'm saying, because it's simple for me,
It's a very simple answer.

Speaker 3 (21:56):
I feel like.

Speaker 7 (21:57):
Miss Evelyn is a slave to optics, and that there
are certain conversations that she would need to have that
would not look.

Speaker 3 (22:04):
Good on camera, and that she's kind of created this pact.

Speaker 7 (22:11):
With the girls and as long as it looks good,
we're fine, and you know, being in church, that whole
first lady energy. As long as it looks good, we're fine.
Don't embarrass the family. I think the need not to
embarrass herself for their family often is more pronounced than
her need to safeguard their psychological safety.

Speaker 3 (22:31):
And I think.

Speaker 7 (22:32):
Also to seeing how Miss Evelyn doesn't know how to
frame things for them brings my compassion level way up
for the girls. Why they have to like almost vie
for attention and affirmation in the way that they need
because their mother will be soothing, their mother will look fabulous,
their mother will will you know, be very very lovely
on camera. But unless she's cussing out their daddy, she's

(22:54):
not having those hard conversations. And it makes me sad
for them because when Tamar was saying, hey, it's four
against one, like, I just want somebody to feel like
somebody standing up for me.

Speaker 3 (23:05):
If nobody's just gonna stand up for you, it would
have been your mother, you know what I mean.

Speaker 7 (23:08):
And even when they said, oh, we're crying over Tracy
not being there, because it's always been meet you know, Trina,
Tracy and Twanda, I was like, well, we know why
Toy's not included because she's on the private jet, but
why didn't.

Speaker 3 (23:20):
Y'all include There's just all these things that.

Speaker 1 (23:23):
A very.

Speaker 3 (23:25):
I'll say this, I think miss Evelyn wasn't taught so
she couldn't teach it.

Speaker 7 (23:30):
I think she wasn't taught how to be an individual
within the community, and so she didn't know how to
give that to her girls. And so the things that
she's normalized for herself, she's normalized in them. But unfortunately
for her, we're in a different time where people and
I have the Internet and they're like, wait a minute.
The therapist lady on TikTok said, I'm allowed to have
a voice and be a singular person, and she's kind
of like, you know, chicken, little if I just turned

(23:52):
my head away, it's not there. But avoidance is not healing.
Avoidance is not healing, and I honestly I feel bad
that I feel like these girls don't have a mother.
They might just have a sixth or fifth sibling. It
doesn't feel like their mother is showing up as a matriarch.
And honestly too, I will say this, Can we all
just acknowledge even the people who hate Tamar, because I
know the saarapheop go on here who get mad, we

(24:14):
humanize Tamar? Can we all acknowledge that in that scene
that happened after she missed the wedding, the first thing
she said was how was the wedding? And how there's
something so vulnerable in asking that question as soon as
you see your sisters, because that's the little girl and
you saying, hey, I want to know what I missed
because I wasn't included. I want to know what I
missed because I wasn't included. And when Tony said are

(24:35):
you coming, she said I wasn't invited. And then Tony said,
well pride. I can't believe that's not pride, that's that's her,
that's discernment. Why would I show up in a space
where I'm not wanted even though I want to be there?
And so I I will say this, miss Evelyn disappoints
me deeply. And also, you can't talk about people's momas
without them getting defensive, and I fear that the girls

(24:58):
wanting to defend their mother will stop them from admitting
that their mother is a human being who failed them
in some ways. I think miss Evlin has failed them.

Speaker 5 (25:06):
Yeah, for me, it's pretty black and white, right, So
miss Evelyn is a black mother, black parent of a
certain age. The only two rules that people really had
because there were so many external factors that they had
to prioritize, if for being honest, societal factors, right that
when it came to rearing their children and parenting their
children at that time, don't do what I tell you

(25:30):
to do and don't disrespect me. That's it, right, And
a lot of times any introspective conversations that really built
up your development or kind of challenged that in some
way that wasn't disrespectful, were deemed disrespectful and therefore it
did not happen. And I think that these women have
carried that rationale will call it right into the way

(25:54):
that they engage with their mama as adults. They still
even like Trina when they were having and whatever the
healing moment was that they had at the retreat, and
Trina was associating it was something that would contradict her faith.
There was a posturing of like defiance and I'm not
doing it because I was told no, i ain't and

(26:16):
like a fear based thing. That to me is the
same exact energy that they all have when it comes
to their mama. And I get it because you know,
I'm a black man of a certain age, right, and
so I understand it. But I also can understand how
that sort of allegiance to respect, and allegiance to a
certain model of respect, I say, can betray and be

(26:39):
detrimental to any sort of real progress, any sort of
real evolution, any sort of real development. Miss Evelyn today
is a completely different woman than she was when she
was an in home mother of those four young, five
young four young five five young ladies, you know what
I'm saying. And their brother, you know what I'm saying.

(26:59):
She ended up going through a divorce, She went through
a situation with some infidelity or her husband.

Speaker 2 (27:05):
You know, he moved on.

Speaker 5 (27:07):
Those are things that can cripple you, especially a mom,
someone who had devoted their life to being a wife,
a mother, and a figurehead in the church.

Speaker 2 (27:15):
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 5 (27:16):
That's that completely uproots all of that, then your daughter
gets famous. You know what I'm saying. It's just a
lot of stuff to manage. And I think Miss Evelyn
is tired, y'all. I think she's tired. And I think
that instead of coddling that antiquated, archaic model of respect

(27:36):
and reverence for your parents, now is a better time
than ever to connect with their mama as women.

Speaker 2 (27:42):
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 5 (27:43):
Tiwanda's newly married, Tamar's divorce and embarking on a new,
you know, chapter in her life. Trina has experienced the
loss of a partner and now you know, she's managing
her husband's health in addition to being a mama. We
don't know what's going on with Trina's sons because they're
not a part of this, So there's other shit she's
dealing with too that we don't even see her talk about.

(28:03):
You feel me? So I think Miss Evelyn just had
a lot to manage. And I think that it's time
for all the sisters to, like unlearned some things when
it comes to their level of transparency and the way
that they connect with their mother. And I think if
they dig a little deep, Miss Evelyn will feel comfortable
or maybe they can like break that.

Speaker 2 (28:21):
Whatever their veil is, it's.

Speaker 5 (28:22):
Keeping them from keeping it real, almost in the name
of being respectcause I'm mama taught us that.

Speaker 2 (28:27):
I'm Mama taught us. Now we don't, we wouldn't talk like,
we wouldn't raise everything raised like that. She did say that, Yeah,
everything's framed like that, you know what I mean?

Speaker 5 (28:36):
And nobody gives it damn about about that. I'm trying
to be respect respectful as possible. Nobody cares about how
y'all showed up with regard to the Black American model
of respect for your parents that we all understand and
it here too.

Speaker 2 (28:51):
We get that.

Speaker 5 (28:52):
But who are you you know what I'm saying, what's
really going on? And how are you going to work
towards resolution? That's what I see.

Speaker 1 (28:59):
No, so I agree with the both of you. You know, obviously,
same thing raised by the same mom and dad of
my nine siblings. It's ten total, same household until my
mom passed away five six years ago.

Speaker 4 (29:14):
Same house, three girls, seven boys.

Speaker 1 (29:19):
There is this sort of veil and facade that one
has when you are raising children and you want the world,
the neighborhood to see you as one way when you're
really dealing with some real shit. So we be bossing
that and that is true. The thing about Miss Evelyn
that I don't think has ever truly been dissected. And

(29:42):
I really wanted Miss illanovan Zad when she was a
guest on the show. I really wanted her to focus
more on Evelyn than the daughters, because I do think
children you are sort of a product of your the
way you were raised in some cases not all this
some cases.

Speaker 4 (30:01):
And one thing that I've always felt day.

Speaker 1 (30:04):
One, because I've watched this show since season one and
I watched behavior, Miss Evelyn has never gotten over her
ex husband cheating on her. It is still written all
over her face. And one thing I know about Black
women who are around miss Evelyn age. I'm sure we

(30:29):
know a plethora of Black women who around her age
who husbands may have passed away and they never remarried.
They never you know, women are grandmothers, great grandmothers, husband cheated,
they don't get remarried. If they pass away, they don't
get remarried. There's a pain that they just don't deal with.

(30:50):
Miss Evelyn said on the show once.

Speaker 4 (30:53):
And I want to read it to you and Dustin.
And this is a quote.

Speaker 1 (30:56):
She said that the whole town knew her husband and
was cheating, and nobody told her a thing. I quote
she said, they were sleeping together in my bid for
ten They were sleeping together in my bid for ten
long years.

Speaker 4 (31:16):
Who would ever get over that?

Speaker 1 (31:20):
Is down right, low down and disgusting that you would
bring another woman with her big draws and candles lit
into my bid like it's something special. She made it
clear that forgiveness does not mean forgetting, and that's how
she feels, right, But she said to herself that.

Speaker 4 (31:42):
Who would ever get over that?

Speaker 1 (31:44):
I think Miss Evelyn has dealt with that, and this
is no shade to obviously this woman, because I would
never do that, tons mother, now that you guys would either.
I think what we've learned as adult children of parents,
of course, is the fact that I would never judge
the things my parents did because they only did what

(32:06):
they knew how to. And I think miss Evelyn not
being able to heal from that, I think it does
have a direct reflect on how the daughter's relationship is,
because you can't teach your daughters to really forgive each
other and forget about what happened because she hadn't done

(32:30):
that to her ex husband that she had these kids with,
and that, to me, is is indicative of exactly the
behavior she has.

Speaker 4 (32:41):
And I could not agree with you morralbleuu about the
fact that she.

Speaker 1 (32:45):
Doesn't want to deal with whatever is happening to her
daughters because she has to focus on this, on this facade, right.
And it hit me and I never thought about this
until now. We know for a fact that it was
displayed in this EF so, I mean it has been
displaying all the episodes, but the girls got access to footage.

Speaker 4 (33:07):
Yep. The girls have editing control.

Speaker 3 (33:10):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 1 (33:11):
It hit me today that maybe Miss Evelyn did have
a scene where she learned about.

Speaker 4 (33:17):
It, and maybe it never made the light of day
because they didn't like how it looked. I never I
never thought about that.

Speaker 1 (33:23):
I did until now that that that that they could
have tape a scene that was removed because there's no
it doesn't make any sense that you never had a
combo with your daughters about what happened. But now it
makes sense. You guys, did y'all looked at it? I
think she probably said, I don't.

Speaker 7 (33:41):
Know, no, do you know what I mean, do you
know how I knew that that scene actually happened, because
there's no way in how a producer would pick as
a first choice to watch you bringing candles to Tina's
office talk about faise on Love. I said, well, this
is fluff. What really happened? This feel like feeling, This
is not This is not prime times. These scenes like filler.
When they were sent around on the ikea furniture, smelling

(34:04):
candles and talking about face on Loves Bachelor Pad, I
was like, I feel like something juicy or happened, and
they had to find something wholesome to fill in with
Miss Evelyn because Miss Evelyn's real scene was too much.
And I want to point out the quote that you
just read, Carlos, What did you just read in her
own language? The worst thing that's ever happened in my
life that I am determined not to get over is

(34:24):
being embarrassed. And what did I say that Mark's biggest
sin was in the very first episode when I came
on here. Timark's biggest sin in that family is being embarrassing.
And they have a mother who has taught them it's
okay to never forgive somebody who embarrasses you.

Speaker 2 (34:40):
Okay, I know where to start. I don't even know
where to start.

Speaker 5 (34:52):
Okay, first of all, so let's let's keep it right
here when we saw I'll just say this, I'm totally
down to watch a show where they can break a
fourth wall, pull out a laptop and look at a
four cam shot of the same scene.

Speaker 2 (35:07):
And break it down.

Speaker 5 (35:09):
I'm like, if this choose your own adventure interactive ass
version of the Braxton's is what we're about to watch,
then bring on five more seasons, because this is how
we get down to some answers. And what I saw
at that table, sitting around that table when they were
in California and Malible, if I'm not mistaken, was each
of their production company logos that's displayed at the end

(35:29):
of the credits every week. I saw Tamar's director chair
right there in front of the computer. I saw a
treehouse treating its production company sitting right there. And I
saw Tony Braxton TV. You know what I'm saying, I
seen Tony Braxton sitting right there. Og came out the
way that that sort of check and balance system is
necessary in a group of personalities like this who can

(35:53):
take state in an occurrence right and put value in
an occurrence, and then it has to be proven whether
that happened or not. I think that this is that
when we add in these if those women sit down
with the powers that being said, listen, in order for
us to participate, we got to have a media access
to all the footage, every shot, every scene. We need

(36:16):
to be able to call that, we need to be
able to break the fourth wall and talk to the producers.

Speaker 2 (36:20):
We got to have those kind of layers in place
in order for this scene to work.

Speaker 5 (36:23):
I'm with it because that makes it a totally different
show that I'm watching, which is interesting. And now there
is a there's a device that they're using, right, which
is this system of checks and balances like, uh, let's see,
let's just watch and see. You know what I'm saying,
And so I enjoyed that. So if that's what we're
gonna get, bring that on.

Speaker 2 (36:43):
Renew that. You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 4 (36:44):
If everybody come in with the laptop, listen, did.

Speaker 3 (36:47):
You see Trina's face. It's the quiet moments where Trina
tells them herself. She said, has Tamar seen this before I.

Speaker 2 (36:54):
Even watch it?

Speaker 1 (36:57):
Seen it?

Speaker 7 (36:58):
Yep, that there was these nasty quiet moments with Trina
where I was like, we have to unpack this, because
what you're saying in that moment is I'm not curious
to see if I remembered it correctly and open to
apologist if I got it wrong.

Speaker 3 (37:16):
I want to know if I messed up, and I
have to get ready for another fight.

Speaker 5 (37:19):
Well, let's also be clear that the whole, the whole
disagreement they have is based upon a situation that directly
involves Trina. So even though she did not give the
person that a lot of people are assuming to be
their brother, that they assumed that was the brother's name
that they're remuting out. Even though she did not say, hey, suit,
put you know, put a cease and desist, which we

(37:40):
can have another conversation about that, because I'm so tired
of a ceasing desist being equated to stopping somebody's business.

Speaker 2 (37:46):
But anyway, I don't she did.

Speaker 5 (37:48):
She although she did not say, hey, place a cease
and desist on this conversation, she did provide them with
the attorney's information, and she would held that piece when
they were discussing it at the restaurant in the first
damn place, when tame flipped out and the read you
have to then that then begs the question why would
she want to aid that conversation being stopped or muted,

(38:09):
And it's because it's gonna, like Blue said, I believe
last week or the week before, it's gonna expose some
or she assumes that it's going to expose some sort
of bad behavior or something that she knows was not
the right thing to do that she did in this situation.
And so Trina did. I hate to say it because
I enjoyed Trina on this show, but I don't.

Speaker 2 (38:30):
Hate to say it because it's an observation, right.

Speaker 5 (38:32):
I did peep that Trina was kind of not even
kind of Trina wasn't honest and forthcoming in that conversation.
Because when they were at the restaurant in the first place,
when Tamar turned around and did like this, when they
had that conversation, that was the time for Trina to say,
you know what, Tamar, No, I did not send you that,

(38:55):
but I definitely did pass the lawyer's information to them
because I don't want that conversation to happen either.

Speaker 2 (39:00):
Is bringing up a lot of pain.

Speaker 5 (39:01):
I don't feel good about the part I played in it,
and honestly, Tamar, I did not want that conversation to
come to light. And that's why I was angry with you,
because I felt like you understood that and you did
it anyway.

Speaker 2 (39:13):
That's all she had to say that you go.

Speaker 3 (39:16):
Death dustin that.

Speaker 7 (39:17):
I mean, if a dog can me, I would be
a cat like that's not her nature. And I will say,
this is a word called darvl. Do y'all know what
darvro is? And we talked about dar on this before time.

Speaker 2 (39:29):
R V O, D A, R and D.

Speaker 3 (39:33):
Have you ever gotten into an.

Speaker 7 (39:34):
Argument with somebody because they did something that was blatantly
hurtful to you, something that a complete stranger would admit
was hurtful, and you go to them to tell them
that they've hurt you, and by the end they're mad
at you for being mad at them.

Speaker 2 (39:44):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 3 (39:45):
Now hold on that. I feel agree party get in it.
That's called darvl.

Speaker 7 (39:49):
It means deny attack and then reverse victim and offender.
So what happens with darvo is the person who has
done something wrong will be the that is at the
table because they rather pretend they're mad and have been
harmed than admit how they were complicit, then just.

Speaker 5 (40:06):
Say you don't like me, and don't pretend to want
a solution because that completely blocks all progress being made and.

Speaker 3 (40:14):
Just covering up a cover up allegedly. Right, if I
have some.

Speaker 7 (40:20):
Think about it, let's let's trace it backwards. God like
to reverse engineer these things. Right, Bear with me if
I carry shame around being someone who froze and was
complicit by freezing. When a miner in my family told
me a story that put me in a rough spot, right,

(40:43):
and had I been of sound mind and body, I
would have.

Speaker 3 (40:46):
Advocated for the truth.

Speaker 7 (40:47):
But instead I advocated for the optics, because that's why
I was taught by my mother and my family and
my church and everybody else.

Speaker 3 (40:54):
Right. And then years go by.

Speaker 7 (40:56):
Of my sister, particularly Tauanda, telling me, well, I'm a
victim to it happened to me too, even though it
technically I have actually happened to the minor, and I'm
told that's okay. Then one day the miner grows up,
it comes back from Spain and wants to start singing
like a canary bird about what happened. And in this day,
in an age of TikTok, a decade or so after
how it happened. The audience is now primed to see

(41:19):
her point in the way they probably were, and I.

Speaker 3 (41:21):
Wasn't when it originally happened.

Speaker 7 (41:23):
Then, my sister, the most embarrassing one, is the one
who is carrying this torch for her right and about
to have an ex fos where I am concerned that
my part will be double clicked on in a way
that it never has before. And my brother allegedly says,
y'all know, I don't even want to be on the show.
You think Rob Kardashian's a ghost in the machine. I'm

(41:45):
about to change my name to Larry right. I don't
want no parts of this.

Speaker 4 (41:48):
Stop stop stop stop stops stop stop stop that I
mean because I happen to get it out, but please finish.

Speaker 1 (41:56):
I never realized that with a family full of sins,
there's a one brother that the one brother in the
Kardashians and the one brother in the Bractons want nothing
to do with this reality show.

Speaker 4 (42:07):
Wow, go ahead, looke, because we all know.

Speaker 7 (42:10):
That when you are looking at a gender group from
a distance, you can see their collective mess better than
they can when when men are looking at women, When
women are looking at men, when the gay community is
looking at everybody else, they're like, what is they doing?

Speaker 2 (42:21):
This is weird?

Speaker 7 (42:22):
Right, you're the other It actually gives you a better
vantage point, right. So the brothers like I don't want
to be pulled into this, and this is my daughter, right,
and she has the Braxton face. I, Trina, I want
you to stop this.

Speaker 3 (42:35):
You and I. You think it's a coincidence that who
he went to to get the information?

Speaker 7 (42:39):
Trina, you and I are the two who are gonna
look the worst if this comes out, because I'm her
daddy who didn't do shit, and you the auntie who
didn't do shit.

Speaker 3 (42:46):
Do you know somebody who can help me? And Treta's like,
I don't know who.

Speaker 7 (42:50):
This is a boot, but I don't want to get involved.

Speaker 3 (42:53):
Me out of it, right.

Speaker 7 (42:55):
So she's complacent, but because then it in a way
where she can say, my name is not on the deed, right, right?
And so he does this and here's the thing I
need try to understand about the business part. And I
do want to double click on this. Several of my
friends is not a flex. A lot of my friends
are Grammy Award winning artists, and they're getting paid from
their podcasts, not from singing. They're getting paid from appearance

(43:16):
is not from music, right, the consumption that Tamar's business
is singing and being a star. Respectfully, I get paid
more on YouTube than I did working for iHeartRadio.

Speaker 2 (43:28):
A lot of times, the.

Speaker 7 (43:29):
Hustle that looks the smallest is actually what's keeping you
afloat for the optics of the hustle that.

Speaker 3 (43:33):
Everybody else is clapping for.

Speaker 7 (43:35):
So I do believe that in Tamar's mind, as somebody
who's been in business conversations that might have included her
potentially and the bags were big, I do believe that
in her mind, this media persona, that she's doing this,
this podcast and all her stuff, in her mind, that
is her business. It's the thing that's probably feeding her
a lot more steadily than the music sometimes. Right.

Speaker 5 (43:55):
Yeah, But friend, I'm talking about perception, and I think
that's why the tape scene was so important.

Speaker 7 (44:01):
You're about to talk about reality. I'm talking about Tamar's perception.
And we tend to operate from perception, not objective reality.
So in my mind, I'm thinking I have been signs
for my sisters, and I love them and for some
reason we're good off camera, but like she said, Trina,
why are you so mad at me on camera? And
I now believe in my research it's because they all
can feel in their gut they showed up for Tony

(44:23):
and stay for Tamar Hoole different discussion. So now Tamar
sees her little niece going through something that she can
relate to for reasons that she probably hasn't even clocked herself.
So she's thinking, well, I'm doing something good. She talks
to Tony, and Tony's like, yeah, that Ashley thing was concerning, let.

Speaker 3 (44:37):
Me do the vores. That Ashley thing was concerning. I
didn't know much about it, but that is concerning. Maybe
we should have her on the Braxteds.

Speaker 7 (44:45):
She goes off thinking that she has her sister's co
signed to support Ashley, but then Toni starts talking to
Twanda and Trina, and then she.

Speaker 3 (44:54):
Realizes, oh, snap, this might implicate my.

Speaker 7 (44:56):
Sister, right, So suddenly she has to pull back on
the endorsement she gave Tamar. Tamar stinking she's running off
with the endorsement of Tony D. Braxon, not knowing the
other two in the middle have actually changed the waters
because you know how libras are. Whoever gets them last
and smells the best is gonna get their ears right. Whoever, whoever,
whoever talks to them last and smells the best and

(45:18):
strokes them into some Oh you do you do make sense?

Speaker 3 (45:21):
I know, I just saw her. I agree, But you
make sense now too. So now Tamar stinking she.

Speaker 7 (45:26):
Has an endorsement that she does not have, not recognizing
that Trina has a vested interest in silence in this
and her brother's already in cohoots.

Speaker 3 (45:33):
With her allegedly allegedly allegedly.

Speaker 1 (45:35):
Okay, which is why, which is why Tamar kept saying,
you did not have my back. You were defending me,
and Tony took them as a global I always defend you,
and Tamar said, I'm talking about in this moment.

Speaker 3 (45:47):
And you're the one who put the battery in my pack.
So why are you with them?

Speaker 1 (45:51):
Because you are our second mother, So my second mother
as a baby sister, who is just good my second
mom as my baby says, he gave me the go
ahead to do it, and when I did it, you
didn't put me up.

Speaker 4 (46:05):
On game, saying, look, bitch, they about to do X,
Y and Z.

Speaker 1 (46:09):
And That's why Tony kept saying the finale, I did
not know you were being.

Speaker 4 (46:13):
Served, which I believe her. I believed know she was
being served. But you knew that to blues point, you
knew that your assist and your.

Speaker 1 (46:22):
Brother, who have the most to lose, contacted your best
friend who happens to be a lawyer that you speak
to on a Delhi basis, So you knew that a
conference was happening, although you get your sister the greenlight
to do it, because you know, at the end of
the day, your sister looks up to you.

Speaker 7 (46:40):
And you were relying on the technicality of the name
not You were relying on the technicality of your name's
not being on the document to shield you.

Speaker 2 (46:47):
You were.

Speaker 5 (46:50):
I feel like at the end of the day, Tamar
was relying on the technicality of being able to say
that her sister tried to shut her businesses down. No,
I don't, but I think that you have to be
I think that you have to be specific about that
because I don't believe.

Speaker 2 (47:05):
I don't know, right, but I don't.

Speaker 5 (47:07):
Believe she got a letter saying you have to stop
doing business as Tamar Braxton. I believe she got a
letter saying I believe she got a cease and desist
that you can't have this conversation with Ashley and to me,
to to frame that as you shutting down trying to
shut down my businesses. I'm a producer and a performer

(47:28):
and you're trying to shut down my businesses, that's a reach,
just like to me, it was a reach that she
said Trina put her hands on her and struck her,
and Tamar admitted that it was a reach.

Speaker 2 (47:38):
That was a reach, and I think that.

Speaker 5 (47:47):
So I think that sometimes we of course these things
are Tamar's perception of these occurrences, but it is not
a license, right. Tamar hits her whole wagon of argument
right to the fact that they tried to shut her
businesses down and who was responsible for it. I want
to know who sent my address to that lawyer to

(48:10):
shut my businesses down.

Speaker 2 (48:12):
And she was very clear on that. And I personally don't.

Speaker 5 (48:15):
See her getting a cease and desist not to have
a conversation at a live podcast event as someone trying
to shut her businesses down. And I think that that's
the problem Tamar can definitely if Tamar has shown a
capacity to kind of see something and then take events
and circumstances and build them to that conclusion rights conditioning.

(48:40):
Though I never even said it was paranoia.

Speaker 2 (48:42):
I don't know what it is.

Speaker 5 (48:44):
That's what she's doing, you know what I'm saying, like,
that's why.

Speaker 4 (48:53):
No, No, I.

Speaker 7 (48:55):
Think Tony Broxton, I don't think it was the ceasing assist.
I think it was Tony Broxton. If Tama had gotten
the cease and desist but Tony had her back, she
would not see it as them shutting down her business
like so perfect example, if I get a cease and desist,
but Tony says no. I talked to Tamar and told
her I thought this made sense. Suddenly you're thinking me

(49:17):
and Tony at least have each other's back, and I
can try to explain it to my sisters why this
ceased desistem But one was respectful because of how I
feel about my address and the death threats and my child.

Speaker 3 (49:27):
And number two because.

Speaker 7 (49:29):
My brand that I am building and my heart is
attached to it, and so my money was also got
a hit. But the minute Tony does it about face
and then Tamar's perception and Tony even admitted it that
she lied, didn't have to.

Speaker 1 (49:42):
She did.

Speaker 4 (49:43):
She did the minute Tony.

Speaker 7 (49:44):
Turns my her back on me, Tony, the star power
of Tony means where else am I losing the backing
that I need? And where else are they trying to
trip me up? I don't think it was singularly about
the podcast. The minute Toni Braxton turns on you, As
a co producer with a much bigger star power, you.

Speaker 3 (50:03):
Not have to be thinking what else am I going
to get in the mail?

Speaker 7 (50:06):
And it creates this paranoia around if you can turn
your back on something that's elegant, where else you don't
not have my back as a co producer.

Speaker 3 (50:12):
And my sister.

Speaker 5 (50:16):
That's the spot where we all have a little bit
of personal responsibility to the outcome of the events, right
and to what happens, because Tony Rexton's statement of support
to Tamar shouldn't hold that much weight in her life.

Speaker 3 (50:33):
She's got She's Jesus, you.

Speaker 2 (50:34):
Feel what I'm saying.

Speaker 5 (50:35):
And even though they have, Tamar still is responsible for
her own life, and she's responsible for the way that
all of those decisions that other people may impact.

Speaker 2 (50:46):
What she does as far as her behavior is concerned.

Speaker 5 (50:49):
In this case, even though that explains why she don't
do it right, but it doesn't negate the fact that
she should.

Speaker 2 (50:57):
It's ridiculous that.

Speaker 5 (50:59):
Tony's words held that much power in this situation, to
the point where you losing control and kicking your sisters
and blacking out.

Speaker 2 (51:06):
These are her words. She says, she blacked down, didn't
know what was going on. So my thing is, yeah,
you know, wedding, everybody stopped breathing. Tony D.

Speaker 3 (51:16):
Braxton is about to talk for thirty seconds.

Speaker 2 (51:18):
Then they should have asked her before before to Wanda
put them cowboy boots on.

Speaker 5 (51:22):
If we're gonna give Tony power, then let's give her
the real power, right.

Speaker 2 (51:25):
I thought Towanda was a beautiful bride.

Speaker 5 (51:27):
I was confused by the cowboy boots after because I
wore cowboy boots to Beyonce concert and the motherfucker's hurt.
I couldn't wait to take them goddamn boots off. So
I'm like, if she changed shoes to be comfortable while
was the cowboy boot to choice, but she looks she
was a beautiful bride though.

Speaker 2 (51:42):
Real talk.

Speaker 5 (51:43):
But I just feel like at a certain point we
can explain all this shit away. We all are affected
by so many things, but ultimately it's up to you
to kind of course correct, right, And I think that
especially when you got four people all at the end
for sure, you know. But even that though, let's talk
about that scene because fuck, fuck.

Speaker 2 (52:02):
The other ship. We know what's going on.

Speaker 5 (52:04):
But but that last scene when her and Trina were
like trying to make some.

Speaker 2 (52:08):
Progress, I even felt like that was okay.

Speaker 5 (52:11):
So now that I admitted it, what you're gonna do okay,
So now that I said yes to that, well, what
you're gonna do.

Speaker 2 (52:16):
Well, you're gonna do it. I'm gonna do with it, okay.

Speaker 5 (52:18):
It was very much like a push pull as opposed
to people just saying I don't like what's going on,
let me just enter this space with.

Speaker 2 (52:26):
A view to it like this that was looking for
something from you. You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 7 (52:35):
I think I think you're a very healthy black man,
and I do think you're very mentally healthy. If you
if there was a neurotypical person on this stage, I
think it's you.

Speaker 2 (52:42):
No offense to me and Carlos, thank you, thank you,
because I feel like I'm.

Speaker 7 (52:49):
You're very your brain is very aligned properly, but in
a neuro divergent brain, which trauma actually creates no divergence. Guy,
all those sisters have some form of Nord divergence induced
by trauma. Right in a Nord divergent brain. What happens
is and this is something Tamor has already shown. So
I've clocked it, like, and I don't want to diagnose.
Tamar is sometimes so much trying to make her case

(53:12):
that she doesn't read the room and it's not because
of egos, because of trauma. So when she looks up
and sees, oh, there's a way to fix this, she's like, bad,
let me fix it. Not what?

Speaker 3 (53:21):
Oh, so that's why you're upset. You can't listen to me.
And I've done this before.

Speaker 7 (53:25):
Oh you're mad because I won't admit this one thing.
You mean, all I gotta do is is admit this
one thing, and you actually listen to me.

Speaker 3 (53:31):
Bet, I admit it. I'm wrong, That's what you needed.
I'm wrong? Now what, Like, I really want to work
this out. That's actually not defensiveness.

Speaker 7 (53:39):
That's an autistic nor divergent trauma induced thing that happens a.

Speaker 3 (53:44):
Lot that people misread a lot of times.

Speaker 7 (53:46):
And so what that told me as a Nord divergent
person was she and I've done it before. She wants
so badly to fix it. Tell me what is stopping
you from being my sister? Please just tell me what
you need to be my sister again. I was having
Sunday with so I'll give it to you now. What
I miss my sister? Tell me what I need to
get my sister back. And she kind of voiced that

(54:08):
as best as she could, and so, and I want
to be clear, guys, we are never explaining things away.
We're explaining how people got there because the lack of
intentionality is important. Tamar doing something because her perception was
off doesn't excuse it, but it does take away the
tinge of malice, and that is incredible. So it's not
the way to say she didn't accidentally and it still

(54:30):
had an impact that needs to be accounted for, but
it wasn't the malicious intent that many people I miss
reading it as.

Speaker 3 (54:35):
Does that make sense?

Speaker 2 (54:36):
Perfect sense? Perfect? Yeah?

Speaker 4 (54:39):
Because the thing is this, The thing is this.

Speaker 1 (54:41):
One of the things that I felt that that scene
gave me was Trina's. It's sort of like Trina knew
that her hand was called the cookie jar when Tamar
did ask her point blank, like, look, did you give.

Speaker 4 (54:56):
So and so my information?

Speaker 1 (54:58):
And she hmmm, she h she hung she looked in
the air, and then she finally said yes, which and
then take that long to know you did that, just
like you knew at the at the dinner scene, you
did it when she asks and you and you kept
quiet to me, listen, I am just gonna say this

(55:20):
because I honestly feel that way, and I really do.
I feel like the scene with Tony and Trina, I
feel like Tamar is doing a lot of work internally,
and I for the first time on this show, I
felt that she was really trying. I felt that the
therapy is working. I felt that her advisor task is.

Speaker 4 (55:43):
Doing great work with her.

Speaker 1 (55:45):
I felt that she was just trying to be like,
I'm not crazy, and look, it's the game of semantics
in terms of you put your hands on me whatever
like and I get that to me, that semantics. But
I also feel that when you are in the heat
of the moment. What I found so sad was it
took Tony to say no, we I because Tony stood

(56:11):
up first and gave her the finger. And then one
thing I've learned is you can't you can't be mad
at how somebody responds to you when you started, yeah,
and then and then, And to me, it was it's
not so much the semantics of like, yeah, she didn't
push you, she definitely pushed you aside. But if I

(56:36):
feel like my family, these these people hate me, let's
talk about let's talk about housewives, if if if if,
Memi and Cynthia are about to help about to like
get into it, and Phaedra comes in and all of
a sudden, bad analogy, because yeah, shut up, not not that,

(56:59):
not that, but the person who you don't think liked
you is the one that's pushing you.

Speaker 3 (57:04):
Aside while she's.

Speaker 6 (57:12):
Okay blue with the with the back turn, pushing you,
telling the woman in front of you.

Speaker 4 (57:18):
Who got up out her seat, you're a superstar, don't
do this.

Speaker 2 (57:24):
Yeah, I get it, I get it.

Speaker 1 (57:25):
So I did feel like what I got from that
scene was I feel like the therapy Tamar's doing is working,
and I feel like they.

Speaker 4 (57:33):
All need it. She's not the only one who needs it,
they all need it.

Speaker 1 (57:36):
Because it was it was it was sort of like
she ain't the only one guy that needs it, And
I think you guys have spent your whole life thinking
that she's the one that acts out, which is fine,
but I think as grown women, no one. And she
said it, y'all, don't y'all don't ever hold Tony accountable.

(57:57):
Y'all gonna be check her, and it doesn't because you
never check. And this is true in families.

Speaker 4 (58:03):
You never check. The person who is signing your checks.

Speaker 5 (58:07):
And the person that's gonna need therapy is og ah
wrap their crew, og and crew. That's who's gonna need Yeah,
they need therapy. Gift cards with the punch like after
each visit, because this.

Speaker 2 (58:25):
This is a lot, man, and it feels even more heavy.
You know, what's that stat.

Speaker 7 (58:30):
Around black women that the studies have found that when
a black woman is angry or ridable, she's actually just depressed.
And that's been quantified now, so this is not just
anecdoto anymore.

Speaker 3 (58:41):
And I always think about people.

Speaker 7 (58:44):
Like Miss Evelyn, back to Miss Evelyn, women of that age,
like my mama and them, whenever they were ashamed, they
would hide behind sternness as a cover for shame. The
sternness that Trina had, that entire retreat total her so
loudly to me I am shamed of how I showed up.
So I'm gonna be stern and super pious to hide

(59:07):
my shame, because sternness is a fact similar for the
power I don't have in this situation.

Speaker 3 (59:14):
She was costplaying at her.

Speaker 7 (59:16):
I felt like I was watching a little girl putting
on her mother's wig and costplaying as Miss Evelyn.

Speaker 3 (59:19):
That entire retreat.

Speaker 4 (59:21):
Mmm.

Speaker 7 (59:23):
And the minute Tony said, nah, I actually did get
knuck if your buck, and yeah, that was me, Trina
immediately stood down. The thing that Tamor had been begging
for months. Trina gave within a half a millisecond to Tony,
and you're trying to tell me that that's not gonna
hurt I'm begging for months. But she just blinks and
she gets it. That's gonna hurt anybody. And I dream

(59:44):
of a day where your healthy logic is available to her.
It's not like it's not, to Carlos's point, anything that's
available to her. She soaks it up so badly because
she won't so badly. And I will say this, this
is purely speculation, This is not a fact. I blew
Tulusma in that scene when I watched Tamar Braxton say
I keep showing up for them. I believe that was

(01:00:06):
her subconsciously admitting I only keep doing these shows because
they need the money, and then they keep.

Speaker 5 (01:00:11):
Attacking one hundred. That's what the messages out and clear.
But that would have offended me.

Speaker 3 (01:00:16):
When you were talking to me. But I'm the reason
you can pay your mortgage this month. Make it makes sense.

Speaker 5 (01:00:20):
That felt passive aggressive to Mede.

Speaker 7 (01:00:24):
It was passive aggressive, and it was also an admission
of motivation, like I'm trying to buy your love. I'm
trying to again be cannibalized and put on the pit
like a fresh suckling piece of pork, so that maybe
you seeing me will make you remember that I'm your sister.

Speaker 3 (01:00:40):
Nah, bruh, it's it's And the thing is I heard
for Towanda.

Speaker 7 (01:00:43):
I heard for Towanta because the thing is to Wanda
is being revealed right now, and it could have been
an opportunity for her to go see the lady along
with her sisters, but instead she's choosing to isolate in
a distraction of her new marriage. And again, Tuanda, I'm
rooting for you so hard because I relate to you
so much. The Unheald part of being relates to you
so much more than Tamar funny enough, avoidance is not

(01:01:05):
healing you. Being with that man and kissing on his
beautiful face and thanking him for loving you is wonderful
and he can never replace the love of your sisters.

Speaker 5 (01:01:13):
They look good together too, by the way, just let
the record look good together.

Speaker 4 (01:01:17):
I have them on my podcast.

Speaker 1 (01:01:21):
I did want brought him man, I will say, singing
in person.

Speaker 4 (01:01:25):
They're so mates.

Speaker 3 (01:01:26):
That's a good man.

Speaker 2 (01:01:28):
You can tell.

Speaker 1 (01:01:29):
Johnna is a great man. She loves him. They are
meant to be with each other. I do think this, though,
well does I want to? I want to make sure
you finish your thought when you said you clocked something
and you felt.

Speaker 4 (01:01:42):
You hit it.

Speaker 5 (01:01:42):
I don't even remember mine ship mine now, I don't
remember my CRS is kicking in.

Speaker 2 (01:01:50):
Don't worry about it.

Speaker 1 (01:01:52):
So what I will say is I and and I
hate to say this because I have siblings. I love them,
But I'm also in my forties. So also give people
change as they get older. I just think at this

(01:02:13):
point in their lives, in their lives, I think it's
best that they just go their separate ways. I think
I think when it comes to like because look, I think,
at some point, if you're not willing to fully show
up and do the work. In that scene, when it
took Trina ten seconds to say the obvious truth in

(01:02:36):
her heart that told me everything. When Tony sat there
and was very particular about I did not know you
were being served. When Tamar is saying, you just don't
like me, what is it?

Speaker 4 (01:02:57):
Because you don't like me?

Speaker 1 (01:02:58):
So what happened? You don't like me, you know? And
Tawanda saying my man, my ma, and my man, you
know by my honeymoon. I just think that who they
are in their lives, I think Tony and Tamar will
forever be close.

Speaker 4 (01:03:13):
I think, yeah, I think Tony Tammarbart will be here.

Speaker 1 (01:03:18):
I think I think Twanda and Trina will be here.
And I think Tony will always find ways to play
in the sandbox. And I think tay Marble always be
here alone. And I think at this point, I think
the only.

Speaker 4 (01:03:38):
I don't put that off the universe. I won't say this,
but what I will say.

Speaker 2 (01:03:41):
Is I know exactly what I was about to say too.

Speaker 1 (01:03:44):
You know, yeah something, yeah, go y'all get it. That's
the only way they're going to come back together because
and I did God forbid. But I just I think
at this point in their lives, I think Trina, which
is no shade. I think Trina focuses on Bomb and
his help. I think Towanda is focused on this man.

(01:04:07):
She is happy to be married. They've been you know,
they've been seeing each other off and on since they
were early twenties, right, yeah, And I think.

Speaker 4 (01:04:18):
Yeah, that's something that's so mate. She's with her new man.

Speaker 1 (01:04:21):
And I think Tony Braxton, who is on a who
was about to start her tour new edition and boys
to man.

Speaker 4 (01:04:27):
I think she got Burdman, and I think she got
her her career. And I think and her kids.

Speaker 3 (01:04:34):
We have to finish the sentences Tony Braxton.

Speaker 1 (01:04:36):
Tony Braxton, and I think that's what it is. And
I think Tamar. I think Tamar is realizing that I
just am not capable.

Speaker 4 (01:04:50):
I'm sorry.

Speaker 1 (01:04:52):
My sisters just aren't capable of meeting me where I'm
at today. And I have to accept that, yeah, yeah,
And I have to navigate through life hoping that one
then we'll get back together.

Speaker 4 (01:05:04):
But I don't see that happen in the next couple
of years.

Speaker 3 (01:05:07):
You just broke my heart.

Speaker 7 (01:05:08):
And I feel like we keep on talking about how
this show is so much like our families. I am
both the Tamar and the Toni and my family. I'm
the shiny one that they find embarrassing for being so honest.
And I've had to make peace with that in the
last couple of years, that the people in my family
who were committed to confusion and chaos and I couldn't
be a part of that. And when Tamar looked at Trina,

(01:05:29):
when Trina would not admit a simple point, because Trina
was being defensive the entire time, and she said, Trina,
you are fifty and Trina said fifty and a half.
Said oh girls, wrap this up. Play the credits. Got it,
you got it?

Speaker 4 (01:05:44):
Finally you got it?

Speaker 3 (01:05:46):
Okay, So you okay. So this is just how I
was going.

Speaker 7 (01:05:49):
Got it to the credits because at that point, now
you're being willfully up to. And here's the thing I
hate to say, the thing you were about to say
that might not work the way that we're hoping.

Speaker 3 (01:06:00):
Because when Tracy passed.

Speaker 2 (01:06:03):
I don't even want to talk. I don't even want
to go there.

Speaker 3 (01:06:05):
Yeah, Tracy passed.

Speaker 7 (01:06:07):
I had hoped that Tracy's passing would make put everything
into perspective. Can we all admit that there are some
people in our families who are glue and without them,
there's an erosion that happens.

Speaker 3 (01:06:19):
It's happened in my family.

Speaker 1 (01:06:21):
Yeah, for sure, for sure, yes, yes, yes, and listen,
it's it's in friendship.

Speaker 4 (01:06:26):
Like it's some friendship. There's one person who kind of
keeps the friend group together.

Speaker 3 (01:06:32):
More glod than we thought. Yeah, I think Tracy.

Speaker 4 (01:06:35):
Was so Look, I will say this, it was a
very sad.

Speaker 1 (01:06:40):
It's like groupgeous beautiful gowns, baby, beautiful, beautiful gown. But
I I I'm abdusted. If y'all going to give us
another season, I guess break the f the Wall and
is the it's the Adventures of the for the Wall.

(01:07:00):
But I think this, I think this world, we all
live separate lives and we're we're only filming together because
we're forced to. I just think nobody wants to sign
up to see that. And I think the difference with
our Kardashians. And I'll go on record saying this because

(01:07:21):
I maybe doesn't watch a lot of reality.

Speaker 4 (01:07:24):
Are you watching Kardashian Hulu?

Speaker 2 (01:07:26):
Absolutely?

Speaker 4 (01:07:27):
I thought Okay, so I listen.

Speaker 1 (01:07:32):
It's not what it was in its glory days because
everybody is living individual lives. But the one thing that
family does have besides gazillions is is they're still close
in proximity and they all do love each other.

Speaker 7 (01:07:48):
They have a Carlos, they have an involved Can we
just be honest. Chris Jenner is the antithesis of Miss Evelyn,
where Miss Evelin's like, oh, I was tired, Chris jen
The only thing that works harder than the Devil and
the Gop is Chris Jenner. Right, And Kie and Kendall
got a problem. She's driving both of their houses with
a fruit basket. Let's talk about it like everything. And
I hate that, right. I hate that we're talking about

(01:08:10):
a black family versus a non black family, and so
many black families we go into silos and suffer in silos.
That's the reason why I was so excited about that
that work you did with black men. It actually comes back.

Speaker 3 (01:08:20):
To this episode. Black men suffer in silos.

Speaker 7 (01:08:24):
Yeah, and then by the time they hit their mid fifties,
they passed away because they didn't speak out loud about
the obvious thing and get the support they needed. That's
why even the Vaughn storyline heavily sat on my heart
because how many black men do we know in their fifties?

Speaker 3 (01:08:36):
A lot of black men die in their fifties.

Speaker 7 (01:08:38):
Because that's the age where you avoiding stuff starts to
catch up with you.

Speaker 5 (01:08:41):
Right, we do, and a not a lot of us
have doctors that look like Stephanie Meals either, because I
know I wasn't on Repub's doctor looked like Stephanie putting
a rush on your diagnosis?

Speaker 2 (01:08:52):
Ain't she okay?

Speaker 4 (01:08:55):
Black light bulb moment.

Speaker 3 (01:09:04):
I like the red the.

Speaker 4 (01:09:16):
I am God, I am done, so listen.

Speaker 1 (01:09:19):
We will see where the sisters go from here. There
hasn't been an announcement of another season, so things are
left to be unseaid.

Speaker 4 (01:09:29):
But Blue and dustin final thoughts.

Speaker 2 (01:09:33):
I hope they come back.

Speaker 5 (01:09:34):
I hope all that cast and crew is back to
work for another season. They got a black showrunner. It's
a black family, and I want to see these ladies
continue to work. And I really hope that with the
added protections they need, we get an enjoyable show.

Speaker 2 (01:09:48):
I'm not expecting, you know, a miracle here.

Speaker 5 (01:09:50):
I'm not expecting really anything, but I would love to
see what happens next for them in another season, So
I definitely hope they come back.

Speaker 3 (01:10:02):
That was so spicy and wholesome. I love it.

Speaker 7 (01:10:05):
You know what's so funny sometimes when somebody has a
really big ego or they're higher identifying with their trauma,
which is I think the legacy, unfortunately slash whatever of
miss Evelyn is that she we high p identify her
with her trauma, and her daughters high pridentify themselves with
their trauma, right, And so when people give up their trauma,
in their mind, they're.

Speaker 3 (01:10:26):
Thinking they're giving up their identity because their identity is
their trauma.

Speaker 7 (01:10:29):
And I'm hoping that they might be fighting the obvious now,
but I'm hoping the conversations that we're having here watching
themselves from a distance, friends and loved ones who hopefully
are dming them in group chats and saying the thing
that needs to be said that eventually they're concent Do
you believe these are all good people?

Speaker 2 (01:10:50):
Which is why.

Speaker 3 (01:10:51):
These are all good people?

Speaker 7 (01:10:52):
And I feel like the opposite of love is and
hat it's apathy, right, this is just love that's lost
its way. I hope that one day Twanda is sitting
with her husband and he's kissing on her face, and
she hears a funny joke that she normally would have
shared with Tamar and she realizes, that's my sister. I'm
hoping that Tamor has a woman of saying, damn, even
though I'm their grief little.

Speaker 3 (01:11:13):
Sister, I have caused harm.

Speaker 4 (01:11:15):
Right.

Speaker 7 (01:11:16):
I'm hoping that sometimes people have to hear something several
times before their ego will be quiet enough for their
heart to listen.

Speaker 3 (01:11:23):
And I'm praying that that happens me too.

Speaker 1 (01:11:27):
Yeah, yeah, so we'll say, we'll say, but thank you
guys so.

Speaker 4 (01:11:32):
Much for another dynamic episode.

Speaker 2 (01:11:38):
Somebody's check on.

Speaker 5 (01:11:43):
I see you hear nothing about scratchy.

Speaker 7 (01:11:45):
Somebody gee, somebody to check on the whole crew because
they were brought into it so many times.

Speaker 3 (01:11:55):
Well, he told me that you didn't want me to
come like I need. Somebody's giving that man a big
Christmas bonus?

Speaker 2 (01:12:00):
Can we all just a Christmas bonus?

Speaker 5 (01:12:03):
Some icy hot, some weed, you know what I'm saying,
A bottle of Hannessey, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (01:12:08):
OG need a care package for real. Anyway. We love y'all,
Thank you for this Carlos and Blue. I appreciate y'all
another lovely.

Speaker 1 (01:12:20):
Yes and we will be back doing this again. So
thank you, rain Drops. I love you guys. Have a
safe weekend and listen give your thoughts in person the
Bractons because we want them to figure this out and
up at they do for sure. Reality with the King
is executive produced by me Carlos King, produced by Lizzie Nimitz,

(01:12:44):
and a partnership.

Speaker 2 (01:12:45):
With the Lack of Effect Network.

Speaker 1 (01:12:48):
You can also find us on my YouTube channel at
Being Carlos King Underscore