September 15, 2021 • 34 mins
In April, 20-year-old Army Specialist Vanessa Guillén was found dead outside a Texas Army Base. Now, her devastated family has come to the Red Table demanding justice and seeking answers. Vanessa’s heartbroken mother sits down for an emotional one-on-one conversation with Gloria and reveals why she feels there is more to the story surrounding her beloved daughter’s death. Vanessa’s impassioned sisters share their gut-wrenching journey and the important work they’re doing to ensure this never happens again.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Bivens, Gloria Stefan. Here, you are listening to Red Table
Talk via Stephens Podcast, all your favorite episodes from our
Facebook watch show in audio. I'm asking everyone to watch
this Red Table Talk. Here's a family that needs us,
and we are not going to let them down. The
(00:20):
story you're about to hear will shake you to your core.
Vanessa Gillen was a beautiful daughter, sister, and a devoted
member of the United States Army. At age twenty, she
was sexually harassed and killed by a fellow soldier. News
(00:49):
of Vanessa's sudden disappearance and brutal murder exposed shocking secrets
at Ford Hood Army Base in Texas. You signed up
to take a bullet for our country. You didn't sign
up to get harrass assaulted, nor look with shattered hearts.
Her family has come to the Red Table for answers.
(01:12):
Why what they do is sendingly some person she's killed,
just do water stuff? Why why? Why her? And to
keep Vanessa's voice alive. The law has to change. Any
woman out there that is watching this, there's no reason
to put up with this kind of abuse from anyone.
(01:44):
She decided I have a mission. I'm gonna do this.
We have to help her, doesn't matter what. We need
to close that base and we need to find out
what happened, and we need to take it to the top, Gloria,
some of PoCA Glorias no i moods are raised thee
(02:33):
I see Primi lucky say, claramente ucas and Santa persona
quest and her sacrificada poesis also mena coming on supposed
(02:57):
to being carmosa I saw simple imperative you knows case.
At birth, Vanessa was diagnosed with a life threatening breathing disorder.
Doctors told Gloria her baby girl would not survive. But
(03:19):
even from the beginning of life, Vanessa shows signs of
a higher sense of purpose as the alta rmosa pomann
(03:40):
you can Patria, you know me house, no mommy, you
any familiar or family to Mexico normally no mommy protium
(04:11):
with Claren Suma accomplished on the true moreios notice intuition
the mommy or more dios you put off in Marto
(04:32):
con sentiment, Camino, Camino price boot camp, sat entrance in
(04:53):
this emble for hootemp On Cambo and then the Raka
(05:17):
have this case Speranaki, La. Located in the heart of Texas,
(05:41):
ford Hood is an army base larger than New York City.
It's the most densely populated military post in the United
States and one of the deadliest. Sadly, Veneza wasn't the
first soldier to suffer from the violence. This year alone,
twenty eight service members staytion there have died, and only
(06:02):
one death has been combat related. Ford Hood has more
reported murders, suicides, and violent crimes than any other military
base in the United States, and on average, over two
hundred sexual assault complaints or filed a year at ford
Hood alone. Vanessa was keeping a devastating secret from her
(06:23):
mother than everyone else, not the police, Rompeller, Contrato and
Dante noll Is. You could have meant, you know, complete
(06:44):
no lady who ka style and yeah my man, yeah
you know is nomo? He said, wantwise single video? Hey,
(07:13):
let's you say create to your I mean yourself, your
your savi, yourself, no no bab feelers and Indians, I
feel as the Ninias, Yes who who? Then your way
(07:51):
up the you know the knows different your mommy not
to put Mexica first. And then you think this is
(08:15):
your queen Rosa and look look grand No no comedy
perse here on the koreas Atletica atletical A Persia and
(08:36):
the Korea is Lapa. The qualities so na single ala
Era Ultimate conversation Coste converessa physical domingoecially Elta. Three days
(09:10):
after returning to base, Vanessa's daily text to her mother
suddenly stopped. When the army had no answer about Vanessa's whereabouts.
The family went public as they searched for their beloved daughter.
Bata you're no want. Gloria continued to reach out to
(09:47):
her missing daughter with no response, the search became international headlines.
Seventy days later, she received the news that no mother
should ever hear. Her daughter's remains had been found. Her
little girl was never coming back home. Her body had
been brutally dismembered and burned. Kelly, who he's in cos
(10:17):
you've been to me? No? No, no, mommy, no big
you see mos any you know? You look at your biber?
You look at your biber? Is it? No, mommy? You know.
(10:50):
The day after Vanessa's remains are found, all eyes turned
to ranking officer Army specialist Aaron Robinson. He was one
of the last to see Vanessa her shift, as he
submitted a gun for repair, so the investigation team places
him under watch. Can manages to escape ford Hood, but
as police close in, he shoots and kills himself. That
(11:14):
same day, his girlfriend, Cecilia Guila, is arrested and confesses
to helping hide Vanessa's remains. Just over twenty five miles
away from ford Hood, Pero fieroldquaa Pakia sposa miche ce
(12:22):
porquer non complore i coosa secretos. Moved by Vanessa's tragic death,
an anonymous source from within ford Hood reached out to
the Gien family with secret information. They claim it included
(12:42):
security cameras allegedly being turned off the day of Vanessa's
disappearance and the cover up inside the base. Camaras soa
quest or Pablo Lucid Smell Commando left with nothing but
(13:31):
pain and unanswered questions. Vanessa's mother climbed the military chain
of command until her plea was heard by the President
of the United States. So we're gonna look into it
very powerfully and we'll get to the bottom of it.
Maybe things can come out that will help other people
(13:52):
in a situation like Vanessa. A week later, the Secretary
of the U. S. Army, Ryan McCarthy addressed the Gaien
family on behalf of four hood. That is our teammates,
and we let her down. We will do everything we
can to protect her legacy by making enduring changes. You know, Looknomen,
(14:23):
since venice is death. Other victims claiming sexual harassment in
the military are speaking up. My heart is racing so much.
It was by someone I knew. Neget still remember the
exact corner where he took me. We've been battling this
for decades. What's the time for your story to be heard? Vanessa?
(14:45):
Ka had woke us up, masts who were going to
see your president. You could, okay, a kid, all right.
(15:30):
I've had to do a lot of difficult things in
my life, but that because you felt her pain. Yes,
it's every mother's nightmare, every father's nightmare. My father was
in the military. I grew up as an army brat,
and I know to a degree the culture of discipline
and control. There were inspections in our house. My father
(15:51):
was an officer, and they would come in with a
white glove and literally clean wipe under the oven or
behind the cabinets. It's been a very closed culture. When
you go to war, you need to follow orders. That
means trusting that the people that you are following those
orders from are protecting you. If you don't have a
(16:14):
place to have a voice, somebody that you trust, a
safe place where you feel you're gonna be guided through
the process, that reads a lot of dangerous, dangerous things.
It's a responsibility to be loud. We need to talk
about this, which is why I'm so proud of what
we're bringing here today. We do and since Vanessa Agayen's murder,
her sisters have not stopped fighting for justice. My sister
(16:37):
would not respected. My sister was not heard, and they
failed her. This could have been prevented. With no one
to turn to for help. Vanessa's sisters, Mida and Lupe,
took to social media and started the hashtag find Vanessa Gain.
Celebrities like Becky g and Samahayak used their spotlight to
(16:57):
find Vanessa, and the search one viral as thousands joined
the online effort to locate the missing soldier. When Vanessa's
remains were discovered, the sister's call for help became a
powerful movement, inspiring millions of others to join the fight
to end a sexual harassment about your daughter, your best friend,
(17:18):
your sister, My sister deserves justice. Sisters are a powerful force.
We are incredibly proud of you, and you are completing
the mission that your sister had on this earth. How
did you feel when she joined the army? When she
(17:40):
signed up when she was eighteen, I mean I felt
really part of her because like, wow, you're giving your
life for the army. I was actually excited for her
because that's something that she wanted to do. Absolutely. And
by the way, so many immigrant families give their children
two the detection of this country in the military, and
(18:03):
I want to thank all of those families that give
the ultimate sacrifice. You've noticed right away that she was changing.
What was different about Vanissa ever since she just stationed
at for her. I mean, I noticed a lot of
things going on with her. She didn't eat, and her mood,
her attitude, always miling at pictures and always miling at us, laughing,
(18:27):
making jokes, and I don't know where it just went down,
and everything went down, and I noticed her becoming very sad.
One time she came home, she left her backs on
the floor by the door and I saw her crying.
Something was going on and she didn't like it. Did
she ever tell you anything about the sexual harassment? She
(18:51):
never told me. I asked her, are you sure you
don't want to tell me anything, and she just told me,
you're too little to understand. How about you and Myra?
She wasn't that outgoing or fun person anymore because there
was another person. I thought it was more work stress related,
but I would have never imagined that it was regarding
(19:11):
sexual harassment, and she would have. She probably was trying
to protect you. You guys would text each other, cool
was it every day? We wouldn't go more than a
day without talking to each other. Vanessa was missing for
just twenty four hours when Myra got nervous and started
calling Fort Hood. No one had seen Vanessa since lunch
(19:32):
that day, and she missed her mandatory check in. Scared
for her sister, Mara decided to drive two hundred miles
at night in bad weather to find her. Eventually, I
got the staff sergeant's phone number and he was like, Okay,
we'll stay up and wait for you. I didn't get
there till about three in the morning, and I was
(19:52):
turned back because nobody was up um hat to book
a hotel. Of course, I wasn't able to sleep, thinking
like where is she? The following morning, I did go
up to her room and I tried to see if
anything in a specific was missing, stuff that I know
she she wouldn't leave behind, and everything was there, which
probably scared you even more. Right, They didn't want to
(20:15):
tell me who was in the room. They didn't want
to tell me who was scheduled to work that day.
And that's when I was like, something's going on here.
So while you were at the base, you actually put
eyes on and met Aaron Robinson. I became the prime suspect.
What was that like? He was one of the males
I was a waiting on my arrival. For some odd reason,
(20:37):
his presence just stood out to me because he didn't
see a single word. He was just standing there. I
was like, this guy knows something. This guy did something
like I feel it in my heart. I I just
know it, but there's no way of me proving it.
He just started laughing. He was I was like, there's
nothing funny about the situation. So I got really upset
(20:58):
and I just stood up and left. When he laughed,
what was the reaction of the other Nobody would't say
anything and where were you during all of this? I
was at home over whether at Houston with my mom
because I couldn't leave her alone. I was just there
to try to come and with prayers. I did not sleep.
I was actually waiting for my dad to come through
the door and be like, I'm already here with when
(21:20):
is she goes missing? Do you guys feel that the
army was helpful looking for her now? I tried my
best to try to do everything and comply and get
them everything that they needed as soon as possible. You
have the passwords for every type of social media. You know,
nothing was complicated for them. We made everything so easy
(21:42):
that I just couldn't believe that there was no way
to find her. I started searching through her stuff to
see what type of clothes she had over there, or
what type of shoes she had over there, and we
saw that she pumped gas. I went into the map,
I found the gas station. The fact that it takes
the idea like days later to find out the gas station,
I'm like, I'm over here in Houston and I'm over
(22:03):
here finding it. It's it's it's it's a shame of that.
So you became an investigator, you notice things that an
investigator or a policeman should have noticed your scene, Yeah,
because you feel like they were not doing anything at
that point. What do you guys think happened to her?
I believe someone adopted her because she would have never left.
(22:26):
She's not the type of person, and me knowing her
as a sister, she wouldn't do anything to harm anyone.
So the only choice we had someone took her or
someone did something to her. I was trying my recipe hopeful,
but I felt that there was going to be a
bad outcome. The military culture is I don't know if
it's always like that, but they just don't give you
(22:48):
any information because they are protecting. There's also a chain
of command. When something like this is happening, you literally
have to go and say, what's happening to your superior.
So your superior happens to be the one that is
creating the situation, then who do you go to? It's
gonna stop right there. Also, guys, women are minorities in
(23:10):
the army, but even men are getting sexually about. It
has been both men and women, but mostly women. The
ones be aggressing, you harassing, You are your superior, so
you helpless. There's no help nowhere because you have to goior.
As the family pleaded for the military to get police
(23:30):
involved in the search for Vanessa, the sisters tried to
piece together any clues about her last location. It was
ten weeks before they would find her remains en cased
in cement in an area where authorities had already searched.
How did you find out that Vanessa was killed? Everywhere?
(23:53):
Actually driving down to Washington, it was on the thirtieth
of June, which happens to me my birthday. I start
hearing my aunt say there's news going around, and I'm like,
what news. Apparently they found other remains, and I'm like, well,
I don't think it's true. It's probably people making stuff up.
I started getting all these calls that they did find
(24:15):
actual human remains by the river where they've been searching
all along, and did appear to be Vanessa. Apparently there
was a civilian um that was working on the fence
on the land there and he got this sent and
he decided to call it in. But it's a shame
because they were looking there for so long and for
(24:36):
them not to notice that something was off. What did
you feel at that moment? I know it was her.
Why do you guys think her life was taken? I mean,
we still don't even know the truth and why. What
they do is an innocent person killed her. After she's killed,
(24:59):
just do walk that stuff that I can't even say,
like why? And that's my question every single day? Why why? Why? Her?
Like and I asked to God like bus. But the
(25:25):
answer that you are going to get is that she
is going to change something she already has. And I
know that your mom almost lost her when she was
a baby, and she would tell your mom that she
had a mission. You need to get to the bottom
as much as you can, but you also have to
be ready that there may not be those answers. All
(25:45):
we can try to do is bring some meaning to it,
which is what you're doing. I'd like to take this
moment to tell any woman out there that is watching this,
it doesn't matter whatever the circumstances. Maybe there's no reason
to put up with this kind of abuse from anyone
because it could have repercussions as terrible as the ones
(26:07):
that your sister experienced, and that kind of mental pressure
is one of the reasons that people get away with
this kind of thing. What you're doing is very important
because you're trying to break down something that has been
decades in the creation of it, the protection behind an
organization which I am very proud of our armed forces.
(26:32):
Not everyone is guilty, but sometimes the people in those
situations take advantage of the power that they wield. We
have to take a deeper look at how these institutions
were created and built. So I do have to say
that I agree with what you're saying, but I think
we need to put things in place to make us
feel safe. Just imagine how many cases that haven't been reported,
(26:53):
They don't have a voice, and once you report it,
they call you a loyal they bullieve you like you're
supposed to be brothers sisterhood. If it's brother and sister heard,
why are y'all harassing woman and man? That's not how
it should work. And that's what we're trying to change
now because this shouldn't be happening. The change has to
happen now. When I saw you on television, my sister's
(27:15):
a human being and I want justice and I want
to answers because my sister do not do this to herself.
Someone didn't and it's not want someone, it's very with people.
I thought to myself, what an amazingly strong woman, because
(27:38):
you're no longer a kid. These types of things really
make us mature and grow. And God knows what this
is going to do in your lives because it won't
be just Vanessa. She has left an indelible mark in
each of your hearts. She will always be your sister
and you will have your own purpose which she has shaped.
(28:02):
And I thank you so much because despite your heartache,
you're turning that pain into something that is going to
help other women, other men from a tragedy story. You
can do a positive change. Absolutely, you guys are incredibly strong.
Thank you guys. Natalie Cowama is a true fighter for justice.
(28:25):
She's a renowned attorney representing the Guillen family who has
taken cases all the way to the Supreme Court. She
never backs down from a battle, even against the military. Natalie,
thank you. Welcome to the Red Table. I want to
thank you all for hosting us today, um and thank
you for bringing awareness to this fish sue. Unfortunately, Vanessa's
(28:48):
situation is not an isolated incident, as I say, it's
so deep in the military community, all those ladies and
men that were victims of sexual sexual harassment and mail terry.
You read their stories and you just think your hair's
in your neck go up. How does this happen and
why is it happening. You signed up to take a
(29:08):
bullet for our country. You didn't sign up to get
harass or assaulted. What do you think really happening to Ennessa.
I think that she told him get off, leave me alone,
to stop, and they had a duel there. You know,
I think he went at her. She's a strong girl,
you know, she's fit for duty, and I'm sure it
was just very aggressive. They said there was blood all
(29:29):
over the room, but there was blood. There was blood.
They did a blue star because he cleaned it up.
Don't ask me how he did it in record timing.
I think that there's help, maybe cover up going on here,
which means it must have been pretty violent. Well, if
he caught her by surprise, any bloodgender like is the thought,
then she might not have had a chance, especially if
(29:50):
he did it from behind or when she was surprised.
I imagine that maybe she told him she was going
to report him that's what we were told. When you're
in a military the farest doctor says, you're not allowed
to follow any lawsuits against anyone. It could be a tour,
it could be malpractice, it could be sexual assault. You
don't have any rights. They're serving our country. We can't
(30:11):
abandon them. You're stuck for four years there. You can't
quit just because you were sexually assaulted. What do we do?
When I saw the family grieving, I said, this is
the only thing that I could do for this family
to bring Vanessa back. Her spirit will live with us,
her fight will be with us forever. And this drafted
the iron Vanessa Geene Bill. I literally drafted it like
(30:33):
a glove to the hand with Vanessa. What happened on
the military world. If Vanessa was harrassed, she would have
to call somebody in her unit and tell them about it.
That's not confidential. What it would allow us a third
party to take the phone call, investigate it, and she
would have the confidentiality, the non conflict. This would allow
(30:53):
our men and women to have the confidence that they
could report it. And then that third party would say
a do to move or do you want him to
be removed? Because right now they removed the victim, you
would have them reviewing it and investigating it and given
them right to follow claim. We're not going to fix
it by crying. We're gonna fix it through legislation because
(31:15):
the law has to change. The military needs reform right now,
there's no accountability, so people do as they want. The
victims have to live with it. It's going to the
White House. We met with President Trump and who was
very gracious about putting us in office and hearing the story.
And then the reason that was so important was because
it's just not a democratic or Republican issue. It cannot
(31:38):
be politicized. We will lose that battle. This is a
human rights issue, and out of pain is how you
make advances. What can we do. We can call our
congressman and senators say vote yes for I am Vanessa
Game Bill. Every person that calls your senator, congressman, or
sent an email, so you document an email. I want
you to pass a Vanessa Game Bill. We will not
(31:59):
allow you to say no of this. We need at
least two thirds thought, which is not a lot, but
it's enough to either make it or break it. The
Guyen families fight for justice has ignited a demand for
change in the military. Major General Scott A. Flatt has
been removed from his position in charge of Fort Hood,
but the struggle continues. The US Army, believe it or not,
(32:21):
tolerate sexual harassment as though abuse and rape. They have
come to Capitol Hill where Speaker of the House Nancy
Pelosi committed to bringing the I Am Vanessa Gayen bill
to the floor. For many more must software and go
through a nightmare of sexual violence, for Congress, the Senate,
and the President to realize we need the I is
(32:41):
the gay and built to pass. How many more must
I for for her to be investigated and hold accountable.
We all have a voice, so let's use it for
a positive change. Listen, everybody watching. We need to support
our troops. Let's be proactive. People write an email which
(33:02):
has proof that you asked your congressman and your senators
that you want this past. We want to help this family.
They made the ultimate sacrifice, as have other families, and
I want to thank you so much for standing up
for them. I know how difficult it is to get
any law passed. Thank you so much. Thank you for
(33:24):
coming to the Red Table, Thanks for listening to join
(33:50):
the red Table Talk family and become a part of
the conversation. Follow us at Facebook, dot com, forward slash,
red table Talk, Stephens. Red Table Talk via Stepans is
a production of Westbrook Studios in partnership with I Heart
Radio's Michael Tura podcast Network. For more podcasts from my Heart,
visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever
(34:14):
you listen to your favorite shows.
Bivens, Gloria Stefan. Here, you are listening to Red Table
Talk via Stephens Podcast, all your favorite episodes from our
Facebook watch show in audio. I'm asking everyone to watch
this Red Table Talk. Here's a family that needs us,
and we are not going to let them down. The
(00:20):
story you're about to hear will shake you to your core.
Vanessa Gillen was a beautiful daughter, sister, and a devoted
member of the United States Army. At age twenty, she
was sexually harassed and killed by a fellow soldier. News
(00:49):
of Vanessa's sudden disappearance and brutal murder exposed shocking secrets
at Ford Hood Army Base in Texas. You signed up
to take a bullet for our country. You didn't sign
up to get harrass assaulted, nor look with shattered hearts.
Her family has come to the Red Table for answers.
(01:12):
Why what they do is sendingly some person she's killed,
just do water stuff? Why why? Why her? And to
keep Vanessa's voice alive. The law has to change. Any
woman out there that is watching this, there's no reason
to put up with this kind of abuse from anyone.
(01:44):
She decided I have a mission. I'm gonna do this.
We have to help her, doesn't matter what. We need
to close that base and we need to find out
what happened, and we need to take it to the top, Gloria,
some of PoCA Glorias no i moods are raised thee
(02:33):
I see Primi lucky say, claramente ucas and Santa persona
quest and her sacrificada poesis also mena coming on supposed
(02:57):
to being carmosa I saw simple imperative you knows case.
At birth, Vanessa was diagnosed with a life threatening breathing disorder.
Doctors told Gloria her baby girl would not survive. But
(03:19):
even from the beginning of life, Vanessa shows signs of
a higher sense of purpose as the alta rmosa pomann
(03:40):
you can Patria, you know me house, no mommy, you
any familiar or family to Mexico normally no mommy protium
(04:11):
with Claren Suma accomplished on the true moreios notice intuition
the mommy or more dios you put off in Marto
(04:32):
con sentiment, Camino, Camino price boot camp, sat entrance in
(04:53):
this emble for hootemp On Cambo and then the Raka
(05:17):
have this case Speranaki, La. Located in the heart of Texas,
(05:41):
ford Hood is an army base larger than New York City.
It's the most densely populated military post in the United
States and one of the deadliest. Sadly, Veneza wasn't the
first soldier to suffer from the violence. This year alone,
twenty eight service members staytion there have died, and only
(06:02):
one death has been combat related. Ford Hood has more
reported murders, suicides, and violent crimes than any other military
base in the United States, and on average, over two
hundred sexual assault complaints or filed a year at ford
Hood alone. Vanessa was keeping a devastating secret from her
(06:23):
mother than everyone else, not the police, Rompeller, Contrato and
Dante noll Is. You could have meant, you know, complete
(06:44):
no lady who ka style and yeah my man, yeah
you know is nomo? He said, wantwise single video? Hey,
(07:13):
let's you say create to your I mean yourself, your
your savi, yourself, no no bab feelers and Indians, I
feel as the Ninias, Yes who who? Then your way
(07:51):
up the you know the knows different your mommy not
to put Mexica first. And then you think this is
(08:15):
your queen Rosa and look look grand No no comedy
perse here on the koreas Atletica atletical A Persia and
(08:36):
the Korea is Lapa. The qualities so na single ala
Era Ultimate conversation Coste converessa physical domingoecially Elta. Three days
(09:10):
after returning to base, Vanessa's daily text to her mother
suddenly stopped. When the army had no answer about Vanessa's whereabouts.
The family went public as they searched for their beloved daughter.
Bata you're no want. Gloria continued to reach out to
(09:47):
her missing daughter with no response, the search became international headlines.
Seventy days later, she received the news that no mother
should ever hear. Her daughter's remains had been found. Her
little girl was never coming back home. Her body had
been brutally dismembered and burned. Kelly, who he's in cos
(10:17):
you've been to me? No? No, no, mommy, no big
you see mos any you know? You look at your biber?
You look at your biber? Is it? No, mommy? You know.
(10:50):
The day after Vanessa's remains are found, all eyes turned
to ranking officer Army specialist Aaron Robinson. He was one
of the last to see Vanessa her shift, as he
submitted a gun for repair, so the investigation team places
him under watch. Can manages to escape ford Hood, but
as police close in, he shoots and kills himself. That
(11:14):
same day, his girlfriend, Cecilia Guila, is arrested and confesses
to helping hide Vanessa's remains. Just over twenty five miles
away from ford Hood, Pero fieroldquaa Pakia sposa miche ce
(12:22):
porquer non complore i coosa secretos. Moved by Vanessa's tragic death,
an anonymous source from within ford Hood reached out to
the Gien family with secret information. They claim it included
(12:42):
security cameras allegedly being turned off the day of Vanessa's
disappearance and the cover up inside the base. Camaras soa
quest or Pablo Lucid Smell Commando left with nothing but
(13:31):
pain and unanswered questions. Vanessa's mother climbed the military chain
of command until her plea was heard by the President
of the United States. So we're gonna look into it
very powerfully and we'll get to the bottom of it.
Maybe things can come out that will help other people
(13:52):
in a situation like Vanessa. A week later, the Secretary
of the U. S. Army, Ryan McCarthy addressed the Gaien
family on behalf of four hood. That is our teammates,
and we let her down. We will do everything we
can to protect her legacy by making enduring changes. You know, Looknomen,
(14:23):
since venice is death. Other victims claiming sexual harassment in
the military are speaking up. My heart is racing so much.
It was by someone I knew. Neget still remember the
exact corner where he took me. We've been battling this
for decades. What's the time for your story to be heard? Vanessa?
(14:45):
Ka had woke us up, masts who were going to
see your president. You could, okay, a kid, all right.
(15:30):
I've had to do a lot of difficult things in
my life, but that because you felt her pain. Yes,
it's every mother's nightmare, every father's nightmare. My father was
in the military. I grew up as an army brat,
and I know to a degree the culture of discipline
and control. There were inspections in our house. My father
(15:51):
was an officer, and they would come in with a
white glove and literally clean wipe under the oven or
behind the cabinets. It's been a very closed culture. When
you go to war, you need to follow orders. That
means trusting that the people that you are following those
orders from are protecting you. If you don't have a
(16:14):
place to have a voice, somebody that you trust, a
safe place where you feel you're gonna be guided through
the process, that reads a lot of dangerous, dangerous things.
It's a responsibility to be loud. We need to talk
about this, which is why I'm so proud of what
we're bringing here today. We do and since Vanessa Agayen's murder,
her sisters have not stopped fighting for justice. My sister
(16:37):
would not respected. My sister was not heard, and they
failed her. This could have been prevented. With no one
to turn to for help. Vanessa's sisters, Mida and Lupe,
took to social media and started the hashtag find Vanessa Gain.
Celebrities like Becky g and Samahayak used their spotlight to
(16:57):
find Vanessa, and the search one viral as thousands joined
the online effort to locate the missing soldier. When Vanessa's
remains were discovered, the sister's call for help became a
powerful movement, inspiring millions of others to join the fight
to end a sexual harassment about your daughter, your best friend,
(17:18):
your sister, My sister deserves justice. Sisters are a powerful force.
We are incredibly proud of you, and you are completing
the mission that your sister had on this earth. How
did you feel when she joined the army? When she
(17:40):
signed up when she was eighteen, I mean I felt
really part of her because like, wow, you're giving your
life for the army. I was actually excited for her
because that's something that she wanted to do. Absolutely. And
by the way, so many immigrant families give their children
two the detection of this country in the military, and
(18:03):
I want to thank all of those families that give
the ultimate sacrifice. You've noticed right away that she was changing.
What was different about Vanissa ever since she just stationed
at for her. I mean, I noticed a lot of
things going on with her. She didn't eat, and her mood,
her attitude, always miling at pictures and always miling at us, laughing,
(18:27):
making jokes, and I don't know where it just went down,
and everything went down, and I noticed her becoming very sad.
One time she came home, she left her backs on
the floor by the door and I saw her crying.
Something was going on and she didn't like it. Did
she ever tell you anything about the sexual harassment? She
(18:51):
never told me. I asked her, are you sure you
don't want to tell me anything, and she just told me,
you're too little to understand. How about you and Myra?
She wasn't that outgoing or fun person anymore because there
was another person. I thought it was more work stress related,
but I would have never imagined that it was regarding
(19:11):
sexual harassment, and she would have. She probably was trying
to protect you. You guys would text each other, cool
was it every day? We wouldn't go more than a
day without talking to each other. Vanessa was missing for
just twenty four hours when Myra got nervous and started
calling Fort Hood. No one had seen Vanessa since lunch
(19:32):
that day, and she missed her mandatory check in. Scared
for her sister, Mara decided to drive two hundred miles
at night in bad weather to find her. Eventually, I
got the staff sergeant's phone number and he was like, Okay,
we'll stay up and wait for you. I didn't get
there till about three in the morning, and I was
(19:52):
turned back because nobody was up um hat to book
a hotel. Of course, I wasn't able to sleep, thinking
like where is she? The following morning, I did go
up to her room and I tried to see if
anything in a specific was missing, stuff that I know
she she wouldn't leave behind, and everything was there, which
probably scared you even more. Right, They didn't want to
(20:15):
tell me who was in the room. They didn't want
to tell me who was scheduled to work that day.
And that's when I was like, something's going on here.
So while you were at the base, you actually put
eyes on and met Aaron Robinson. I became the prime suspect.
What was that like? He was one of the males
I was a waiting on my arrival. For some odd reason,
(20:37):
his presence just stood out to me because he didn't
see a single word. He was just standing there. I
was like, this guy knows something. This guy did something
like I feel it in my heart. I I just
know it, but there's no way of me proving it.
He just started laughing. He was I was like, there's
nothing funny about the situation. So I got really upset
(20:58):
and I just stood up and left. When he laughed,
what was the reaction of the other Nobody would't say
anything and where were you during all of this? I
was at home over whether at Houston with my mom
because I couldn't leave her alone. I was just there
to try to come and with prayers. I did not sleep.
I was actually waiting for my dad to come through
the door and be like, I'm already here with when
(21:20):
is she goes missing? Do you guys feel that the
army was helpful looking for her now? I tried my
best to try to do everything and comply and get
them everything that they needed as soon as possible. You
have the passwords for every type of social media. You know,
nothing was complicated for them. We made everything so easy
(21:42):
that I just couldn't believe that there was no way
to find her. I started searching through her stuff to
see what type of clothes she had over there, or
what type of shoes she had over there, and we
saw that she pumped gas. I went into the map,
I found the gas station. The fact that it takes
the idea like days later to find out the gas station,
I'm like, I'm over here in Houston and I'm over
(22:03):
here finding it. It's it's it's it's a shame of that.
So you became an investigator, you notice things that an
investigator or a policeman should have noticed your scene, Yeah,
because you feel like they were not doing anything at
that point. What do you guys think happened to her?
I believe someone adopted her because she would have never left.
(22:26):
She's not the type of person, and me knowing her
as a sister, she wouldn't do anything to harm anyone.
So the only choice we had someone took her or
someone did something to her. I was trying my recipe hopeful,
but I felt that there was going to be a
bad outcome. The military culture is I don't know if
it's always like that, but they just don't give you
(22:48):
any information because they are protecting. There's also a chain
of command. When something like this is happening, you literally
have to go and say, what's happening to your superior.
So your superior happens to be the one that is
creating the situation, then who do you go to? It's
gonna stop right there. Also, guys, women are minorities in
(23:10):
the army, but even men are getting sexually about. It
has been both men and women, but mostly women. The
ones be aggressing, you harassing, You are your superior, so
you helpless. There's no help nowhere because you have to goior.
As the family pleaded for the military to get police
(23:30):
involved in the search for Vanessa, the sisters tried to
piece together any clues about her last location. It was
ten weeks before they would find her remains en cased
in cement in an area where authorities had already searched.
How did you find out that Vanessa was killed? Everywhere?
(23:53):
Actually driving down to Washington, it was on the thirtieth
of June, which happens to me my birthday. I start
hearing my aunt say there's news going around, and I'm like,
what news. Apparently they found other remains, and I'm like, well,
I don't think it's true. It's probably people making stuff up.
I started getting all these calls that they did find
(24:15):
actual human remains by the river where they've been searching
all along, and did appear to be Vanessa. Apparently there
was a civilian um that was working on the fence
on the land there and he got this sent and
he decided to call it in. But it's a shame
because they were looking there for so long and for
(24:36):
them not to notice that something was off. What did
you feel at that moment? I know it was her.
Why do you guys think her life was taken? I mean,
we still don't even know the truth and why. What
they do is an innocent person killed her. After she's killed,
(24:59):
just do walk that stuff that I can't even say,
like why? And that's my question every single day? Why why? Why? Her?
Like and I asked to God like bus. But the
(25:25):
answer that you are going to get is that she
is going to change something she already has. And I
know that your mom almost lost her when she was
a baby, and she would tell your mom that she
had a mission. You need to get to the bottom
as much as you can, but you also have to
be ready that there may not be those answers. All
(25:45):
we can try to do is bring some meaning to it,
which is what you're doing. I'd like to take this
moment to tell any woman out there that is watching this,
it doesn't matter whatever the circumstances. Maybe there's no reason
to put up with this kind of abuse from anyone
because it could have repercussions as terrible as the ones
(26:07):
that your sister experienced, and that kind of mental pressure
is one of the reasons that people get away with
this kind of thing. What you're doing is very important
because you're trying to break down something that has been
decades in the creation of it, the protection behind an
organization which I am very proud of our armed forces.
(26:32):
Not everyone is guilty, but sometimes the people in those
situations take advantage of the power that they wield. We
have to take a deeper look at how these institutions
were created and built. So I do have to say
that I agree with what you're saying, but I think
we need to put things in place to make us
feel safe. Just imagine how many cases that haven't been reported,
(26:53):
They don't have a voice, and once you report it,
they call you a loyal they bullieve you like you're
supposed to be brothers sisterhood. If it's brother and sister heard,
why are y'all harassing woman and man? That's not how
it should work. And that's what we're trying to change
now because this shouldn't be happening. The change has to
happen now. When I saw you on television, my sister's
(27:15):
a human being and I want justice and I want
to answers because my sister do not do this to herself.
Someone didn't and it's not want someone, it's very with people.
I thought to myself, what an amazingly strong woman, because
(27:38):
you're no longer a kid. These types of things really
make us mature and grow. And God knows what this
is going to do in your lives because it won't
be just Vanessa. She has left an indelible mark in
each of your hearts. She will always be your sister
and you will have your own purpose which she has shaped.
(28:02):
And I thank you so much because despite your heartache,
you're turning that pain into something that is going to
help other women, other men from a tragedy story. You
can do a positive change. Absolutely, you guys are incredibly strong.
Thank you guys. Natalie Cowama is a true fighter for justice.
(28:25):
She's a renowned attorney representing the Guillen family who has
taken cases all the way to the Supreme Court. She
never backs down from a battle, even against the military. Natalie,
thank you. Welcome to the Red Table. I want to
thank you all for hosting us today, um and thank
you for bringing awareness to this fish sue. Unfortunately, Vanessa's
(28:48):
situation is not an isolated incident, as I say, it's
so deep in the military community, all those ladies and
men that were victims of sexual sexual harassment and mail terry.
You read their stories and you just think your hair's
in your neck go up. How does this happen and
why is it happening. You signed up to take a
(29:08):
bullet for our country. You didn't sign up to get
harass or assaulted. What do you think really happening to Ennessa.
I think that she told him get off, leave me alone,
to stop, and they had a duel there. You know,
I think he went at her. She's a strong girl,
you know, she's fit for duty, and I'm sure it
was just very aggressive. They said there was blood all
(29:29):
over the room, but there was blood. There was blood.
They did a blue star because he cleaned it up.
Don't ask me how he did it in record timing.
I think that there's help, maybe cover up going on here,
which means it must have been pretty violent. Well, if
he caught her by surprise, any bloodgender like is the thought,
then she might not have had a chance, especially if
(29:50):
he did it from behind or when she was surprised.
I imagine that maybe she told him she was going
to report him that's what we were told. When you're
in a military the farest doctor says, you're not allowed
to follow any lawsuits against anyone. It could be a tour,
it could be malpractice, it could be sexual assault. You
don't have any rights. They're serving our country. We can't
(30:11):
abandon them. You're stuck for four years there. You can't
quit just because you were sexually assaulted. What do we do?
When I saw the family grieving, I said, this is
the only thing that I could do for this family
to bring Vanessa back. Her spirit will live with us,
her fight will be with us forever. And this drafted
the iron Vanessa Geene Bill. I literally drafted it like
(30:33):
a glove to the hand with Vanessa. What happened on
the military world. If Vanessa was harrassed, she would have
to call somebody in her unit and tell them about it.
That's not confidential. What it would allow us a third
party to take the phone call, investigate it, and she
would have the confidentiality, the non conflict. This would allow
(30:53):
our men and women to have the confidence that they
could report it. And then that third party would say
a do to move or do you want him to
be removed? Because right now they removed the victim, you
would have them reviewing it and investigating it and given
them right to follow claim. We're not going to fix
it by crying. We're gonna fix it through legislation because
(31:15):
the law has to change. The military needs reform right now,
there's no accountability, so people do as they want. The
victims have to live with it. It's going to the
White House. We met with President Trump and who was
very gracious about putting us in office and hearing the story.
And then the reason that was so important was because
it's just not a democratic or Republican issue. It cannot
(31:38):
be politicized. We will lose that battle. This is a
human rights issue, and out of pain is how you
make advances. What can we do. We can call our
congressman and senators say vote yes for I am Vanessa
Game Bill. Every person that calls your senator, congressman, or
sent an email, so you document an email. I want
you to pass a Vanessa Game Bill. We will not
(31:59):
allow you to say no of this. We need at
least two thirds thought, which is not a lot, but
it's enough to either make it or break it. The
Guyen families fight for justice has ignited a demand for
change in the military. Major General Scott A. Flatt has
been removed from his position in charge of Fort Hood,
but the struggle continues. The US Army, believe it or not,
(32:21):
tolerate sexual harassment as though abuse and rape. They have
come to Capitol Hill where Speaker of the House Nancy
Pelosi committed to bringing the I Am Vanessa Gayen bill
to the floor. For many more must software and go
through a nightmare of sexual violence, for Congress, the Senate,
and the President to realize we need the I is
(32:41):
the gay and built to pass. How many more must
I for for her to be investigated and hold accountable.
We all have a voice, so let's use it for
a positive change. Listen, everybody watching. We need to support
our troops. Let's be proactive. People write an email which
(33:02):
has proof that you asked your congressman and your senators
that you want this past. We want to help this family.
They made the ultimate sacrifice, as have other families, and
I want to thank you so much for standing up
for them. I know how difficult it is to get
any law passed. Thank you so much. Thank you for
(33:24):
coming to the Red Table, Thanks for listening to join
(33:50):
the red Table Talk family and become a part of
the conversation. Follow us at Facebook, dot com, forward slash,
red table Talk, Stephens. Red Table Talk via Stepans is
a production of Westbrook Studios in partnership with I Heart
Radio's Michael Tura podcast Network. For more podcasts from my Heart,
visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever
(34:14):
you listen to your favorite shows.
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