November 25, 2025 • 44 mins
The Texas Rangers non-tendered former postseason star Adolis Garcia last week rather than go to arbitration. Now a free agent, there are few places better where Garcia could re-establish his market than Great American Ball Park. Would Garcia fit with the Reds? C. Trent Rosecrans and Danny Graves discuss Garcia and other players who were non-tendered last week and look for bargains this Black Friday.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
With that little Johnty toone. I am C. Trent rosecrans Uh,
senior writer at the Athletic and he once slotted in
somebody's game between Randy Johnson and Kevin Brown. Remember pitching
between those two guys?
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Yes, I do. The two thousand All Star Game in Atlanta.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
I was in the left field in the aux box.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Were you really m m oh my gosh. But you
have probably have no idea that I was pitching between
those two.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
I did. I did. I did not remember it off
the top of my head. So probably less vivid memories
of Danny Graves in the two thousand All Star Game
at Turner Field for me than for mister Danny Graves,
two time All Star Danny Graves.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
The reason I worded it that way is you don't
rememb me doing it, or you didn't know that I
was pitching in between them, because prior to the game
I didn't know I was pitching in between those two either.
So actually it does.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
I probably did pay attention because I was working for
Oh right, No, that was before he was Here's what
the Royals. I wrote this story about how the Royals
had like because it was a Royals fan even though
I was writing for a newspaper in Georgia about how
the Royals had maybe the one of the best outfields
(01:32):
in baseball that nobody thought about, because yeah, Jermaine Dye
was there and you what did you do there? I
just had that up. He flied, he flew out to
short left fields towards me, and I was writing about him,
and so I was probably paying attention and he was
because it was it was him, Johnny Damon and Carlos Beltran.
(01:55):
I mean that's yes. I remember, like I had an
argument with the guy I worked with. I was like,
the Yankees would trade the Royals their outfield straight up
right now. And he's like, no, no, no, And I
was like, and I don't know who was in two
thousand was in the Yankees outfield then, I mean probably
pretty good. It was like Bernie Williams and some other
guys because that was the run. They were still the
(02:18):
world serious champs. But Damon die and Beltran was the
heck of an outfield.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
Yes, Paul O'Neil was still playing in two thousand, right, so.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
He yeah, maybe yeah, I mean.
Speaker 2 (02:33):
So, yeah, Jermaine died. There's I got other stories about
Jermain Die. He had a ball off me in Omaha
and triple A one year that I still hasn't landed,
and that was in nineteen ninety six. He hit it
so far, he hit it over the back drop in
center field and it was ridiculous. Okay, So anyways about
this All Star Game. Prior to the game, I wasn't
(02:54):
scheduled to pitch in the second inning. I was scheduled
to pitch in the eighth. Leo Mazzoni came until all
the pitchers what inning that they planned on us throwing.
So I was just taking my time getting ready to
go down to the bullpen. So get in a cart
and go under the tunnel with Tom Glavin and we're
riding down there. And as soon as I get to
(03:15):
the bullpen, the phone starts ringing and they're like the
bullpen coach at the time was I think it's Bobby Dues.
So he says, they just called and wanted to know
if you can get ready to pitch, and I'm like
when now, and they're like, yeah, now, I said, I'm ready,
I'll pitch. Go okay, let's get in there. I didn't
want to wait till the eighth inning. Well, it turns
(03:36):
out Kevin Brown was supposed to pitch in the second inning,
but Randy Johnson had a quick one two three inning
to start the game and there was no way Kevin
Brown could get loose. So I threw like maybe five
pitches in the bullpen, and I was so pumped my adrenaline.
I went out in the game and pitched like with
barely warming up in the bullpen.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
But that makes sense, But like that's like, looking back
on it, it couldn't be better because you didn't get
those butterflies. You got up just as you're used to
and really like the and this was your first All
Star game, so probably a little different for you. But
the thing that I don't know that people know about
All Star games, like once you're done playing, there's a
(04:16):
good chance you're just gone. You leave right right, like
you go home.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
Yeah I didn't. I went after the second inning, I
took my spikes off and put tennis shoes back on,
and I sat there the rest of the game and
just and got to enjoy it. Like if I was
sitting there waiting to pitch until the eighth inning, I
probably would have had to go to the bathroom at
least ten times, like I would have been so nervous
and butterflies and anxious. Oh it had been awful, So
(04:44):
thankfully it worked out great for the second inning.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
Yeah, I mean, like if you're I don't know, Ken
Griffy Junior or Danny or not Danny Graf sorry, or
Barry Lark, and I was seeing your two teammates there,
like the is like if Junior had a plan and
ready to go and you're he was like, hey, you
want to go back to where we're going, and You're
like hooky, because that's what happens, right, Yeah, Yeah, that
(05:10):
that definitely happens.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
And I don't even remember if because Junior was in
the home run Derby that year, but I don't think
he played in the game. Yeah, I think you're right,
Barry did Barry Barry started the game, Barry off. Yeah,
And I don't know if Junior even stayed for the
beginning of the game. I don't remember. But my plan
(05:34):
was once I pitched, I was just gonna relax and
watch because these are these are all guys that I
grew up watching. You know, I was still just a
kid playing with a bunch of guys. I used to
see on TV, and it was. It was very surreal,
just the whole, the whole, the whole evening was awesome.
Speaker 1 (05:57):
That was your first All Star game, my second, what
was your first? Boston tough to beat. So Junior won
the home run derby con that year, but all everybody
remembers Maguire hitting it over the Monster. And then that
year was the one hundred Greatest Players saying and Ted
(06:18):
Williams comes out from right field and that's where the
oxbox was, and that's where I was sitting, like at
a twenty I guess I was twenty three. It was
a twenty three year old who was there for no
good reason, but I was there.
Speaker 3 (06:31):
So it was awesome.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Yeah, that was that had to have been a great one.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
It's tough to beat. So today we're going to talk
well Black Friday but also non tenders kind of goes.
We're talking about bargains. On the other side of our break,
we will start talking about some of the we went
through the ads, you know, like the old days when
you'd get the newspaper on Thanksgiving and it would be
(06:56):
so thick and it would be all like Black Friday
in between for the kids in newspaper. You're gonna look
it up. But yeah, so like that's kind of what
we've done, is we've looked through the non tender candidates
and looking for maybe some bargains, maybe some things that
we shall see. But on that I will note that
(07:18):
the Reds non tendered Will Banfield, Roddery Munos, and Carson Spires. Banfield,
they you know, they got another catcher with split contracts,
so that's you know there, Munos is a guy they
had just claimed off waivers earlier this month. A lot
of times you'll see those and and and Danny, you
know this better than I do, where they'll pick somebody
(07:39):
up on November ninth and like, hey, we're gonna non
tender you. It's almost like an agreement you get in
some A lot of times you get an agreement that
they're going to sign a minor league deal. I wouldn't
be shocked to see Rodery Munos sign a minor league deal.
That's just, you know, I don't think anybody's gonna give
them a big league deal. So this is a team
(08:00):
that at least wants you for a little bit. And
Carson Spyers, who had Tommy John surgery and is gonna
be rehabbing. So those were the reds three non tenders.
None of those are you? Yeah, I mean they all
like I Honestly, it's like who is this guy? But
(08:21):
I remember? So anyway, we will talk more some more
interesting names and roderie munos after this, uh message from
our friends that me undis krats.
Speaker 4 (08:35):
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Speaker 2 (09:34):
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Speaker 1 (09:37):
No, you know you can't beat the matching me Undies
that Danny Graves and I are gonna get. And that
will be our Christmas card, uh form her front Territory
Christmas card. It's gonna be uh me and Danny and
are me undies matching me Undies, not you and these
me and these right uses. Yeah, so well, Danny, like,
(10:02):
actually this is sorry, Danny. Like when we were shooting,
like we were texting back and forth about ideas for
this week's shows, this was your idea and it's actually
a good one because, like the main thing is last year,
you have a lot of guys who have track records,
big leaguers, and like we are non tendered like this.
(10:24):
A lot of times, it's not saying hey, we don't
think you can play. It's us saying, hey, you have
reached to part of your career where you're gonna go
in to arbitration, and quite honestly, we know what arbitration's
gonna give you, because it doesn't give you a pay cut. Yeah,
so we're just gonna say, hey, we're not gonna send
(10:46):
you an arbitration. We wouldn't pay even the low number.
You're a free agent. A lot of times those guys
will resign. We've seen it here a lot of times
with where they are, the people that know them, and
a lot of times they'll go elsewhere and find a
find a fit, and uh, it's it is. It is
kind of like the bargain basement of shopping. But you know,
(11:09):
like like that, uh, you know, they might put a
cheap TV on sale at a bust buy and you
got to run to get it. So you kind of
started this And who is your guy that you're like
running to get.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
I'm running to see if Adules Garcia is going to
be that cheap TV at best Buy that I can
steal away.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
You need to pay for it, Danny.
Speaker 2 (11:32):
Yeah, I'm gonna pay for it.
Speaker 1 (11:34):
Oh oh like a relative steal, Like you pay so little.
It is a steal, not like I just hey, you
know this is an issue we've had with reds Pitchers before.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
Yeah, yeah, I'm not I'm not gonna I know I'm
gonna have to pay. I know, I know I'm gonna
have to pay, probably more than I expected. But he's
out there and it's a guy that has proven that
he can hit the ball out of the ballpark and
that's it. This is what the Reds need. They need
a power back and somebody in the outfield. And he
(12:06):
did win a Gold Glove. I'm not saying he's going
to be a goal Glove winner again. He won a
Gold Glove a few years ago. I know his numbers
have been trending down as far as like OPS and
he had. He didn't strike out as much last year
as he has in the previous years, but his batting
average OPS is down. But this is a guy that
you put him in Great American Ballpark, a whole new setting.
(12:27):
I mean, this guy might just rejuvenate his career. And
we've seen this before. Some players that are on the
downside get an opportunity somewhere else and next thing you know,
they're back to what they were before, even if it's
just for a year. I'm not sure how much he's
gonna cost. Maybe probably in the twelve to fifteen million range,
i'd imagine somewhere around there.
Speaker 1 (12:49):
I think it's gonna be less. It might be about
eight to ten. Maybe I'm not sure, but because I
think you would get it. He was I think he
was scheduled. Get about like was it twelve and urb
is what MLB trade rumors kind of guessed, But yeah, no,
like it's it'll be interesting. He's a guy that like,
(13:12):
here's Danny. Here's a question I have for you. How
do you feel about like when you think of this
offense as a whole and this team and their approach.
And again, like I am not a like person who
puts a lot on the hitting coaches. I feel like
hitting coaches in this day and age are almost like assistants,
(13:34):
like not bosses, right right, And so they're there are
players assistants they don't have there there's still his coaching staff,
but you know, like and and I also always go
back to something I think I've mentioned this before, but
Brooke Jacobi said when John Fay, the late great John Fay,
asked him about like, well, you know, you have a
guy like Vao and his approach, how do you teach
(13:58):
that to other guys? And Brooke said, you don't teach approach,
you draft it.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
Or acquire it.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
You know, It's like you could do as much, but
like in the end, and this is something speaking of
other people, like I remember talking to Eric Davis. He
was talking to somebody, I think it was Will Benson,
and Eric Davis just said, be who you are. You know,
you can't be something you're not. You can't be a
(14:31):
doulas Garcia and then turn into you know, Joey Vado,
or you can't be Vladimir Guerrero senior and turn into
Vladimir Guerrero junior other than a long process with you know,
a partner and raising them, but it's still not you.
Speaker 2 (14:48):
But yeah, so yes, yeah, the Joey Vodo thing is
is brilliant. I love that that quote from Brook Jacoby.
Nobody you're not going to try to teach somebody how
to have the same approach and patience as Joey Vado.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
And you can trust and be like, hey, this is
what he does. Good. But you you're not going to
turn somebody into that, just as like you're not going
to turn well, this guy hits the ball.
Speaker 2 (15:14):
Is about the ball?
Speaker 1 (15:15):
Well, we want you to get more power, be a
power hitter. You know, like that doesn't work. You have
to be who you are that can evolve. But changing
it abruptly or trying to change abruptly, I think is
the fool's erin.
Speaker 2 (15:29):
Yeah. You know, when Adam Done came to Cincinnati way
back in early two thousands, people were complaining that he
was not swinging at pitches, like he was taking too
many pitches and taking too many walks. And you know,
he's either a home run, strikeout, or walk. Well, isn't
that what baseball loves these days? I mean, Adam Dunn
was like he was the.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
First yeah, three true outcome guy.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
Yeah, and he had a great eye at the plate,
and he wasn't gonna chase. I mean, he did strike
out a lot, but he was very seldomly going out
of the strike zone to chase pitches. You know. Well,
he didn't mind taking a walk.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
And that's kind of my my worry with the Dolas
Garcia is no, no, no, it's not the walking, it's the chasing.
You know, a thirty five point chase percentage last year
on pitches out of the zone, So one of three
pitches out of the zone he's swinging.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
Yeah, but that that also could be somebody in his
ear telling him you need to be more aggressive and
you need to you know, try to jump on somebody
early into count or whatever it is. Because when a hitter,
even a pitcher for that matter, when when a player
is struggling, you have so many voices telling you this
is how you got to get out of your slump,
(16:49):
and this is what you gotta do. You got to
be more aggressive, you got to be less aggressive. Next thing,
you know, you're turning into who you're not. You know,
basically kind of what we just said starting this comment
station Adulas Garcia is if he could go back to
just being the guy seeing the ball, hit the ball
hard somewhere, maybe that's as simple as that, instead of
(17:10):
trying to change his approach at the plate.
Speaker 1 (17:12):
And he still hit the ball hard last year, you know,
he had like it was pretty good. I looked at
exo velocity and hard hit rate and all that and
they were all in like eightieth percent island better. So
the question is just swinging and hitting, and you know,
I would love like it's a guy I've thought about
for a little bit. I even thought, like, you know,
(17:32):
because you heard rumors at the trade deadline that the
Rangers were looking at maybe moving him, and it made
sense because he was a guy who could be non
tendered and wasn't performing, and I was like, oh man,
that's an interesting bounce back. I also liked that he's
a right handed hitter, you know, because it seems like
they've got a lot of platoon guys. He's not a
(17:53):
platoon guy, or at least he hasn't been. He might
be now, we don't know. It could be one of
those things. But I can't see him just hitting against lefties.
But but he's also a good base runner. He's not
exactly fast, but he's a good base runner. That's where
like he had a two to seven b war last
year and it was mostly defense and base running.
Speaker 2 (18:16):
You know.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
He did that with a ninety three oh ps plus
and so like, you know, seven percent worse as a
hitter than the average player, but still gave you nearly
three wins because of his defense and his and his
and his running ability and and and maybe it's a
guy that like, okay, you have him here and he
(18:39):
goes to left field. You can do that in DH
some but a guy who's a former Gold Glover who
can play out field, you have him out there with
Noelvi Marte, you know, and then you have him batting
right handed, right behind Ellie de la Cruz. You know,
even if he gets off to a slow start, people
(19:01):
are still not wanting to test them because he has
a resume.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
Exactly, That's exactly it. I mean, you bring somebody proven.
I mean, I know everybody in baseball saw what he
did in that World Series when he's a couple of
years ago. You couldn't get the guy out. Every ball
he hit was one thousand miles per hour off the bat.
It was ridiculous. So and when you tell me the
sale price at best Buy, like that's even better than
(19:30):
what I imagine. So, like, he'll be thirty three when
the season starts, which still is I mean, you're not
going to try to sign him to like a five
year deal, right, you just want to see no let
him Yeah, A lot of times you see these guys
maybe sign a one year deal or two year deal
with an opt out to see if they can get
(19:50):
back on track. Let the Reds be that team to
get back get him back on track.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
It will be interesting though, for me to see exactly
how this market does and if guys are willing to
sign one year deals or more likely to be aggressive
for two years deals with an opt out. Because of
the CBA expiring after this season, you know, there are
gonna be a lot of guys who want the the
(20:17):
security of being on a roster or at least on
a team's radar as opposed to just in the wild
during that lockout time, just because you know, we saw
it in twenty twenty two, like the lockout ends and
it's just like frenzy, you know, you just open the
gates and everybody's running to claim their their land like
(20:40):
the old land rush days, you know. And so I
think that is part of why I think that there's
gonna be some hesitancy in the free agent market. To me,
and I could be wrong, but I think there might
be some hesitancy from both sides. You know. If you're player,
(21:00):
you're like, I don't know, Like I don't know what's
coming up. I don't know that I want a one
year deal, and maybe we're gonna have like these new restrictions,
and I don't think there's gonna be a salary cap.
I also don't think a salary cap is the answer.
That's a different topic for a different day. But I
(21:22):
think they're gonna be people, both players and front offices
hedging their bets because you don't want to get caught
like all of a sudden, we're playing under old rules
and we're paying this guy way too much. So we
shall see. But I think a Dolars Garcia and yeah, yeah,
Baseball you know, MLB Trade Rumors does a great job
(21:43):
with their projections for arbitration and they had them at
twelve one and so that's right on that.
Speaker 2 (21:50):
So but yeah, okay, here's here's my thing. Okay, if
I think.
Speaker 1 (21:59):
There's gonna be no shortage of teams, probably even including
the Texas Rangers offering Dolas Garcia a contract, what is
your sales pitch? If you are Nick Krawl and Brad Matter.
Speaker 2 (22:15):
You can play in a ballpark that you can hit
thirty to forty home runs, and you can play hit
behind Ellie Dela Cruz, or we hit you in front
of Ellie Dela Cruz. Or you can have Lerosa's pizza
every Friday night. Whatever. Sorry, I love the Ross. I'm
just saying.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
They should sponsor us then. But yeah, I don't know.
Like I've been to Cuba, I don't know that it
quays the Cubans are craving Lorosa's. But you know, Hey,
you didn't before you were born in Vietnam. Hell, there
you go, there you go.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
But I think Ellie Dela Cruz is a you use
him as your sales pitch. I think any free agent
that you go after, you can throw that in there,
and then you can also say, well, guess who the
manager is. Tito Francona, who everybody, every retired player would
have loved to have played for Tito Francona when they
(23:17):
were players. And now I'm sure that a lot of
current players they might not say it, would love to
play for Tito Francona.
Speaker 1 (23:26):
I think. I mean, we've seen some players say that.
I'm trying to remember who. I saw it the other day,
but it was like, oh, it's Justin Turner, right, Justin
Turner said he always wanted to play for Terry Francona.
Just Turner's free agent. He's also forty one forty two.
But you know, I think what it does show is
like not just necessarily him, but that type of player
(23:49):
and those veterans who who are like looking for fits
and quality of life. You know, a guy like like
like Justin Turner, who's got you know, this contract is
not going to change his retirement one bit. But so
those guys there are looking at what's going to make
(24:10):
me happy for a year, and your manager is pretty big, uh,
pretty big part of that, right, Danny.
Speaker 2 (24:18):
Yes, you I mean no offense to a lot of
the other managers out there. But if I had an
opportunity to play for Tito and I could only get
a one year deal somewhere, I know this guy is
going to back me. He's going to be right behind
me and try to help me succeed every way possible.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
All Right, So I've got a guy that I thinks interesting.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
I'm not sure I would go there.
Speaker 1 (24:45):
But what do you think about Christopher Morell non tendered
by the Rays. I had actually forgotten that he went there.
It's the trade deadline two years in twenty four. I
just remember this guy like every time he came to
the playf Great America. And you're like, uh oh, because
because the ball can jump off that bat.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
Yeah, and he can play multiple positions.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
He plays so like he played second base, shortstop, and
third base with cups you know those middle those infield spots,
including shortstop, and last year he only played outfield in
DH And you're talking a guy.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
Which affected his hitting. Obviously it did well.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
I don't, I don't know, you know, Like the thing is,
it's it's weird. He's a free swinger with a good eye,
like he makes good decisions. It's just like in the zone.
He does not hit the ball great, but when he does,
you know, he had twenty six home runs in twenty three,
(25:51):
twenty one in twenty four. A guy that kind of
plays all over the place. That's that's the interesting one
for me. And again all of these every name we
bring up, it's gonna be like, well, it depends on
what it costs, and we know that and maybe should
do it. Who's who's another guy you kind of thought about?
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Well, I saw that you highlighted Joey Lukesey. Yeah, left Reliever.
Didn't even cross my mind until you put that on there,
and I'm looking up stuff on this guy. I don't
understand why he wasn't tendered. He wasn't supposed to be
he wasn't supposed to make a ton of money.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
Like two million, Yeah was the projection. And these projections
are usually pretty good because they're based on all these
other ones and so like, yeah, it surprised me too.
Because here's a guy and maybe it is that transition
from starter to reliever, but it seemed like he did
(26:53):
a pretty good job. He like was durable last year.
Once you know, he went over the Giants, they used
him again and again and again. He was there, lefty,
this team needs a lefty. There's a lot for me there.
That was the guy that jumped out at me.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
Yes, and looking up what he did against lefties. He
gave up one home run against a left handed batter
all year last year and eighty three plate appearances. I
mean that's pretty good, I'd say. Yeah. And there's not
just a lefty specialist anymore, because obviously you got to
throw it at least three batters. But still he's going
(27:31):
to come in to face more lefties than right he's
that's what you would use him for. And to keep
the ball in the ballpark, right, I'll take it.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
You know, last like when you were playing back in
the old days, when you guys would leave your gloves
behind your position and the other guy would pick it up.
So that's the guy you know, younger than you or
older than he by the way, Oh yeah, thank you,
I appreciate that. So so like you know, like there,
(28:04):
you would use those left handed guys and they would
literally be used for one batter. Now when you're using them,
you're going to use them for at least three, but
you're really using them for one batter. Like you're like saying, hey,
this this lefty, he's not going to beat me. I
need you know, those other guys. Maybe they'll beat me
against this guy, but I can't. I can't afford to
(28:27):
pitch to the.
Speaker 2 (28:28):
Lefty exactly exactly, and you need that guy and he
can still get right handed hitters out or you look
at it at his splits from last year, right, he's
hit two fifty off of them, ops seven sixty five.
But like you're not having him in there mainly right right,
(28:51):
you have.
Speaker 1 (28:51):
To be able to like basically what that says is
like he can get him out and will, but yeah,
not as great and that's probably exactly why he wasn't there.
But he is a former starter, you know, and so
like it's not foreign to him, Like I think I
think there was probably some adjustment to I don't know,
(29:13):
you'd probably be better than like this, Like is there
an adjustment to how you face guys from the bullpen
versus starting and use your stuff and almost have to
figure out a little differently.
Speaker 2 (29:28):
Well, I think as a reliever, you come in and
you know you're only going to face this guy once
that particular day, unless you're in there for mop up
and you throw multiple nings. But that's not what Luke
Casey would do. So you go in and you know
that you can try to get nasty with every single pitch.
You don't have to pitch around, you don't have to
(29:51):
try to get them to chase try. You know you
can go right after them and be aggressive. And if
you look at like his his strikeouts to innings last
year as a reliever, so he had thirty one strikeouts
in thirty eight and third innings. Well, two years ago
he had nine starts, thirty two strikeouts and forty six
(30:11):
and two thirds innings, so a lot less per inning
as a starter. So I guess what I'm saying is
you can get nasty as a reliever. There's only certain
times of the game. I think as a starter where
you have that ability to I need to get nasty now,
like run around third less than two outs or you know,
trying to shut down a big inning reliever. It's like
(30:34):
I know, I'm in here for these three batters or
these four batters. Here's my stuff, right.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
And you're coming in a lot of those times were
like that's all you're doing is your fire extinguisher, and
so it's like, Nope, not going to mess around. I
don't like because that's right. Like, you know, I think about,
like I was telling somebody this yesterday, like how veteran
pitchers and they were rehabbing, they never want to go
(31:03):
to the lowest leagues because I just remember Aaron Harangu.
Speaker 2 (31:07):
One day being like dangerous.
Speaker 1 (31:10):
Well, his thing was it was like those idiots didn't
know I was setting them up. They were just teeing off.
Speaker 2 (31:16):
Yeah, he was like I was.
Speaker 1 (31:17):
Trying to set them up, but they don't know they
were being set up because they don't know where and
how to set up right. And so it's like it's
so unpredictable, and it's just funny for me to think that,
like you can be a big league pitcher, all star,
you know, I think you know, Harange got cy young votes.
He was a great picture, Like you can be like that,
(31:41):
and it's much easier to pitch against big leaders than
it is single egg guys. And I guess it's just
because you know what to expect.
Speaker 2 (31:50):
Yes, because spring training back in the day when we
used to leave the gloves on the field for the
other guys when they come out, there's opportunities to go
pitching B games, you know, on the backfields, because there
just wasn't enough innings to throw in the the spring
training game. I would as much as I could avoid
(32:14):
the B games on the backfields because of that, Like
there was no you didn't really get much out of
it except a pitch count, because the best thing that
could come out of that is that you didn't get hurt.
Your feelings are going to get hurt because they're going
to crush you because they swing at everything. They see
a big leaguer coming down. They're like, I'm gonna go
(32:36):
up there and swing at a first pitch close and
I'm gonna I'm not gonna let him try to strike
me out.
Speaker 1 (32:41):
So right, you're expected to strike out, Yes, Yes, Like
I remember a couple of years ago, it was Mark Colesferry,
former Reds catcher, when he was in the minor league camp.
It was this one of his He had been in
camps before, but it was since they see a lot
of those big games or against the UH against the
(33:03):
the the Guardians, he hit a home run off Shane
Bieber and it was like everybody was talking about it.
Speaker 2 (33:12):
Oh it gets out, yeah, oh yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:16):
B games are fun though, Like I kind of like
it just because like I watched Joey Vado one year
and like it's different for hitters. Well pictures, pictures, you
can stop at anytime, Like Danny Graves goes out and
he's like, all right, I'm gonna throw this. You could
even be like, oh, that guy hit a home run,
(33:36):
this guy hit a triple. They're swinging at nothing. I
got my fifteen pitches in skip, We're done and you'll
roll the inning, Whereas like Joey Vado could go and
he would like fly out and he could be like, no,
I'm staying in. I'm gonna hit again, you know, like
you can do those things and like I.
Speaker 2 (33:54):
Still can get like ten didn't he get like eight
at bats one?
Speaker 1 (33:58):
Oh yeah easy? Like And it was a game that
I saw against the Guardians and I actually wrote way
too much about it where he hit a pop up
to the infield in a big game, and this is
Joey Vado in a nutshell. That's why I wrote about it,
because I was just back there pop up in the
B game and he was just busting an ass and
it was to the third basement and felt fair territory
(34:20):
and the third baseman lost it in the sun and
it dropped and he got a double because he was
busting his ass. But can you imagine being B guy,
like triple A guy. You're watching any big leaguer yet
future Hall of Famer, and when you see that, Yeah, Like,
that's why I wrote about it, and probably wrote too much.
Speaker 2 (34:41):
But now that's a teaching moment. Of course. Man, you
can't write too much on something like that because there's
so many kids down there, even older players that need
to I've.
Speaker 1 (34:52):
Got editors who might disagree with you, but I did
talk to I talked to I think like thirty two
people for that story, basically anybody who was on the field.
And I of course didn't use that all right, but
I was looking for it and you know, and wanting
to track down everybody.
Speaker 2 (35:11):
So yeah, of course I'm not an editor and I
never will be. But that's intriguing because of the situation.
It's Joey Vado running hard on a pop up on
the infield in a B game, You're not going to
see that very often. And these eighteen, nineteen and twenty
year olds that are playing in these games need to
(35:33):
see that often.
Speaker 1 (35:36):
All right, Yeah, so let's go to how about this
name for you? Alec Manoa.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
I like this kid, Okay, I have a follow up question.
Speaker 1 (35:49):
Okay, and maybe you'll know this because you looked at
my notes, but I still didn't remember, so I had
to go back looking up which team non tendered a Manoa.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
So I didn't know it until I saw it in
your notes. I would say I would have said the
Blue Jays, but I.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
Would have said the same thing, but yeah, it was
the Braves, and I didn't like I had even forgot
that from the time I typed it too.
Speaker 2 (36:19):
Now, yeah, did he even play in any minor league
games with them? He did?
Speaker 1 (36:25):
He did, and or I know he was with them
last year and he pitched in the miners and it
was not what we in the business called good. Oh,
I got it.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
Yeah, But with Toronto he was decent. But before he
went I looked up his numbers in Buffalo last year.
I think he had seven starts as was a sub three.
Speaker 1 (36:51):
I think I think it's like a guy like that,
it's you know, he's if he's pitching ninety one, well
he was never a fireball. It was ninety four, which
I mean again, in today's game, that's nothing. And I
just kind of like the thought that I bet and
he's gonna get I think a minor league contract somewhere,
(37:14):
and for him, it's gonna be the best spot. And
that's probably not Cincinnati with a lot of what they have,
although you can say I have Derek Johnson, yeah, and.
Speaker 2 (37:26):
Yes that's huge, but you know what else is huge.
And I don't know if he would consider it this,
but I think maybe he should at this time to
try to get back in the big leagues go to
the bullpen. He has the perfect mentality to pitch in
the bullpen. You see the excitement, the fiery attitude that
he has when he's pitching, Well he needs that in
(37:49):
the bullpen. Go out there for an inning or two
at a time until like, okay, maybe he starts getting
comfortable and gets his stuff back. Then maybe become a
starter again. But I think this I would flourish as
a late ending reliever, not saying a closer. I'm saying,
you know, big situations late in the game where you
need somebody to come out there that has no fear,
(38:10):
and this dude has no fear pitching.
Speaker 1 (38:13):
Yep. All right, we're gonna finish this up, and I'm
gonna give you three names, three three UH out fielders
and what you any of these? Uh? Tickle your fancy?
Michael Toglia, whose first baseman outfielder was the U the
UH Rockies opening day first baseman last year, Mike Talkman
(38:38):
and JJ Plade, Any of those do anything for you?
Speaker 2 (38:48):
Do any? Oh?
Speaker 1 (38:50):
You just kind of froze up.
Speaker 2 (38:52):
Sorry, tickle my fancy? Six years old? Oh yeah, talk
to me. He's intriguing, but he's thirty five, thirty six
years old? Like how much? But he could be cheap
because of that, But I don't I don't really think
the other two guys are trending in the right direction.
Speaker 1 (39:11):
But those other two guys are much younger. Toddleia is
a switch hitter two years ago and was at twenty
four He at twenty five homers. Seventeen of those were
on the road. I did, I you know, and like
he was a better Like he's a switch hitter, he's
been pretty even as ops's ops plus's home road splits
(39:37):
but and from each side. So I think that's kind
of interesting just because it maybe is a bad year.
Maybe it's a bad spot, you know, leak. Just just
as Great American isn't great for every power hitter, you know,
course is different and yeah, you know, because there's the
(39:58):
difference in cores. For me is not the home runs
but everything else. Like that's why it's always huge. I
was like Billy Hamilton in his prime should have been
a Rocky. He was built for a year, right because
because like he was playing in the worst possible ballpark,
(40:19):
because you know, Great American gives you home runs, but
it takes everything else away. Yeah, because it is that
outfield's small. I mean, the outfield is so small that
we've seen Jesse Winker in center field. I like, Jesse
defense was not his calling card. We saw Shint su
Chow in center field in his thirties because it was
(40:42):
Great American ballpark and you could do that. So you know,
like again it's all comes down to it. That's what
I just find intriguing because it is a switch hitter,
he can you know, you worry about that the the defense. Like,
maybe he's just a left fielder, and but you have
(41:03):
just as a right handed hitter or as a switch hitter.
I just like that versatility. Bla Day is Bla Day
and Taglia we're both first round picks in twenty nineteen
Bigger Prospects. Blade was number four overall pick. Yeah, plays
all three outfield spots, but he's left handed and right now,
(41:25):
like you know, Jake Fraley is available, but like that's
the same thing they have Will Benson, who is probably
a platoon guy, and most of your platoon guys in
the outfield are looking a little left handed.
Speaker 2 (41:36):
So yeah, yeah, you're right switch hitting, a switch hitting
outfielder that can play first base at the H two
and has some pop. I mean it's not a bad
idea either. I'm sure he's not going to be very
expensive at best Buy.
Speaker 1 (41:53):
Yeah, but like rel is still interesting to me just
because right handed, serious pop and the defensive flexibility.
Speaker 2 (42:02):
Yes, yes, I like him more than any of those three.
I know those He wasn't a choice with those three,
but yeah, I would take him all right.
Speaker 1 (42:12):
Well, we got longer than they wanted us to yet again,
because that's what Danny and I do but we will
be back again. We have another one this week before
the holiday. I think we are going to talk closers,
and so our guest is going to be Red's all
time Saves leader, Danny Graves. Will inform me and my
(42:35):
co host just what it takes to be a closer,
because Danny is closing different than any other pitching in
any other inning. Or do we have to stay tuned
for your detailed answer, turn tune into the next one
because this is a long discussion, and it's a discussion
I'm fascinated by, honestly.
Speaker 2 (42:56):
Yeah, and I think they're telling us we've gone too long,
so I have to wait till next episode.
Speaker 1 (43:01):
All right, Well, with that, I guess we You know,
I try to follow instructions. Yeah, you know what you will.
You know what you can do for us for our holidays.
You can rate and review us wherever you listen to
your podcasts or here on YouTube or well, I guess
YouTube's commenting. You really subscribe and YouTube and then go
(43:23):
to Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts, and
you know, share it with your buddies, your friends who
who just want to look at Danny. You can do
it with a sound off. Maybe I should do a
like single camera or it's just Danny and not me,
that might be better. I also do like maybe a
feed where you don't hear me talk. Also very very
(43:47):
highly encouraged. So you know, but but review say nice
things my therapy today and you know we're sensitive today.
Give us five stars. If you're not going to give
us five stars and say nice things, well I don't
want to cry again. So you know that's just one
(44:10):
little please my birthday. Yes, so yeah, you know. Riverfront
Territory is part of the Foul Territory Network, and we'll
check out any of our other shows because we got
great shows on this network and you can find a
whole lot of interesting talk and maybe some of these
same guys and get a better idea. So until next time,
(44:33):
I am see Trent Rosecrants and he is two time
All Star Danny Graves
With that little Johnty toone. I am C. Trent rosecrans Uh,
senior writer at the Athletic and he once slotted in
somebody's game between Randy Johnson and Kevin Brown. Remember pitching
between those two guys?
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Yes, I do. The two thousand All Star Game in Atlanta.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
I was in the left field in the aux box.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Were you really m m oh my gosh. But you
have probably have no idea that I was pitching between
those two.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
I did. I did. I did not remember it off
the top of my head. So probably less vivid memories
of Danny Graves in the two thousand All Star Game
at Turner Field for me than for mister Danny Graves,
two time All Star Danny Graves.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
The reason I worded it that way is you don't
rememb me doing it, or you didn't know that I
was pitching in between them, because prior to the game
I didn't know I was pitching in between those two either.
So actually it does.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
I probably did pay attention because I was working for
Oh right, No, that was before he was Here's what
the Royals. I wrote this story about how the Royals
had like because it was a Royals fan even though
I was writing for a newspaper in Georgia about how
the Royals had maybe the one of the best outfields
(01:32):
in baseball that nobody thought about, because yeah, Jermaine Dye
was there and you what did you do there? I
just had that up. He flied, he flew out to
short left fields towards me, and I was writing about him,
and so I was probably paying attention and he was
because it was it was him, Johnny Damon and Carlos Beltran.
(01:55):
I mean that's yes. I remember, like I had an
argument with the guy I worked with. I was like,
the Yankees would trade the Royals their outfield straight up
right now. And he's like, no, no, no, And I
was like, and I don't know who was in two
thousand was in the Yankees outfield then, I mean probably
pretty good. It was like Bernie Williams and some other
guys because that was the run. They were still the
(02:18):
world serious champs. But Damon die and Beltran was the
heck of an outfield.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
Yes, Paul O'Neil was still playing in two thousand, right, so.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
He yeah, maybe yeah, I mean.
Speaker 2 (02:33):
So, yeah, Jermaine died. There's I got other stories about
Jermain Die. He had a ball off me in Omaha
and triple A one year that I still hasn't landed,
and that was in nineteen ninety six. He hit it
so far, he hit it over the back drop in
center field and it was ridiculous. Okay, So anyways about
this All Star Game. Prior to the game, I wasn't
(02:54):
scheduled to pitch in the second inning. I was scheduled
to pitch in the eighth. Leo Mazzoni came until all
the pitchers what inning that they planned on us throwing.
So I was just taking my time getting ready to
go down to the bullpen. So get in a cart
and go under the tunnel with Tom Glavin and we're
riding down there. And as soon as I get to
(03:15):
the bullpen, the phone starts ringing and they're like the
bullpen coach at the time was I think it's Bobby Dues.
So he says, they just called and wanted to know
if you can get ready to pitch, and I'm like
when now, and they're like, yeah, now, I said, I'm ready,
I'll pitch. Go okay, let's get in there. I didn't
want to wait till the eighth inning. Well, it turns
(03:36):
out Kevin Brown was supposed to pitch in the second inning,
but Randy Johnson had a quick one two three inning
to start the game and there was no way Kevin
Brown could get loose. So I threw like maybe five
pitches in the bullpen, and I was so pumped my adrenaline.
I went out in the game and pitched like with
barely warming up in the bullpen.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
But that makes sense, But like that's like, looking back
on it, it couldn't be better because you didn't get
those butterflies. You got up just as you're used to
and really like the and this was your first All
Star game, so probably a little different for you. But
the thing that I don't know that people know about
All Star games, like once you're done playing, there's a
(04:16):
good chance you're just gone. You leave right right, like
you go home.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
Yeah I didn't. I went after the second inning, I
took my spikes off and put tennis shoes back on,
and I sat there the rest of the game and
just and got to enjoy it. Like if I was
sitting there waiting to pitch until the eighth inning, I
probably would have had to go to the bathroom at
least ten times, like I would have been so nervous
and butterflies and anxious. Oh it had been awful, So
(04:44):
thankfully it worked out great for the second inning.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
Yeah, I mean, like if you're I don't know, Ken
Griffy Junior or Danny or not Danny Graf sorry, or
Barry Lark, and I was seeing your two teammates there,
like the is like if Junior had a plan and
ready to go and you're he was like, hey, you
want to go back to where we're going, and You're
like hooky, because that's what happens, right, Yeah, Yeah, that
(05:10):
that definitely happens.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
And I don't even remember if because Junior was in
the home run Derby that year, but I don't think
he played in the game. Yeah, I think you're right,
Barry did Barry Barry started the game, Barry off. Yeah,
And I don't know if Junior even stayed for the
beginning of the game. I don't remember. But my plan
(05:34):
was once I pitched, I was just gonna relax and
watch because these are these are all guys that I
grew up watching. You know, I was still just a
kid playing with a bunch of guys. I used to
see on TV, and it was. It was very surreal,
just the whole, the whole, the whole evening was awesome.
Speaker 1 (05:57):
That was your first All Star game, my second, what
was your first? Boston tough to beat. So Junior won
the home run derby con that year, but all everybody
remembers Maguire hitting it over the Monster. And then that
year was the one hundred Greatest Players saying and Ted
(06:18):
Williams comes out from right field and that's where the
oxbox was, and that's where I was sitting, like at
a twenty I guess I was twenty three. It was
a twenty three year old who was there for no
good reason, but I was there.
Speaker 3 (06:31):
So it was awesome.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Yeah, that was that had to have been a great one.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
It's tough to beat. So today we're going to talk
well Black Friday but also non tenders kind of goes.
We're talking about bargains. On the other side of our break,
we will start talking about some of the we went
through the ads, you know, like the old days when
you'd get the newspaper on Thanksgiving and it would be
(06:56):
so thick and it would be all like Black Friday
in between for the kids in newspaper. You're gonna look
it up. But yeah, so like that's kind of what
we've done, is we've looked through the non tender candidates
and looking for maybe some bargains, maybe some things that
we shall see. But on that I will note that
(07:18):
the Reds non tendered Will Banfield, Roddery Munos, and Carson Spires. Banfield,
they you know, they got another catcher with split contracts,
so that's you know there, Munos is a guy they
had just claimed off waivers earlier this month. A lot
of times you'll see those and and and Danny, you
know this better than I do, where they'll pick somebody
(07:39):
up on November ninth and like, hey, we're gonna non
tender you. It's almost like an agreement you get in
some A lot of times you get an agreement that
they're going to sign a minor league deal. I wouldn't
be shocked to see Rodery Munos sign a minor league deal.
That's just, you know, I don't think anybody's gonna give
them a big league deal. So this is a team
(08:00):
that at least wants you for a little bit. And
Carson Spyers, who had Tommy John surgery and is gonna
be rehabbing. So those were the reds three non tenders.
None of those are you? Yeah, I mean they all
like I Honestly, it's like who is this guy? But
(08:21):
I remember? So anyway, we will talk more some more
interesting names and roderie munos after this, uh message from
our friends that me undis krats.
Speaker 4 (08:35):
We picked you to talk about me Undies not just
because they're ridiculously comfortable, but also because they are very festive.
When the holiday season hits, you go on the website
and there are just so many more designs to check out,
and they just scream Eric Kratz getting a little matching
sets with everybody that he knows.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
You know what. They're called me Undies, not you Undies.
So you go and you say, this one's for me,
this set is for me. This is what is good
for me, not you undies. Me Undies a lot of
different ones that choose from.
Speaker 4 (09:10):
I'm so confused, but what I do know is that
you can knock out all of your holiday gifting needs
today with me Undies. And to get the exclusive holiday
deals up to fifty percent off meundies dot com, slash
foul enter promo code foul that's me Undies dot com
slash foul promo code is f o u L for
up to fifty percent off matching holiday prints with your person.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
You can't beat that.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
No, you know you can't beat the matching me Undies
that Danny Graves and I are gonna get. And that
will be our Christmas card, uh form her front Territory
Christmas card. It's gonna be uh me and Danny and
are me undies matching me Undies, not you and these
me and these right uses. Yeah, so well, Danny, like,
(10:02):
actually this is sorry, Danny. Like when we were shooting,
like we were texting back and forth about ideas for
this week's shows, this was your idea and it's actually
a good one because, like the main thing is last year,
you have a lot of guys who have track records,
big leaguers, and like we are non tendered like this.
(10:24):
A lot of times, it's not saying hey, we don't
think you can play. It's us saying, hey, you have
reached to part of your career where you're gonna go
in to arbitration, and quite honestly, we know what arbitration's
gonna give you, because it doesn't give you a pay cut. Yeah,
so we're just gonna say, hey, we're not gonna send
(10:46):
you an arbitration. We wouldn't pay even the low number.
You're a free agent. A lot of times those guys
will resign. We've seen it here a lot of times
with where they are, the people that know them, and
a lot of times they'll go elsewhere and find a
find a fit, and uh, it's it is. It is
kind of like the bargain basement of shopping. But you know,
(11:09):
like like that, uh, you know, they might put a
cheap TV on sale at a bust buy and you
got to run to get it. So you kind of
started this And who is your guy that you're like
running to get.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
I'm running to see if Adules Garcia is going to
be that cheap TV at best Buy that I can
steal away.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
You need to pay for it, Danny.
Speaker 2 (11:32):
Yeah, I'm gonna pay for it.
Speaker 1 (11:34):
Oh oh like a relative steal, Like you pay so little.
It is a steal, not like I just hey, you
know this is an issue we've had with reds Pitchers before.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
Yeah, yeah, I'm not I'm not gonna I know I'm
gonna have to pay. I know, I know I'm gonna
have to pay, probably more than I expected. But he's
out there and it's a guy that has proven that
he can hit the ball out of the ballpark and
that's it. This is what the Reds need. They need
a power back and somebody in the outfield. And he
(12:06):
did win a Gold Glove. I'm not saying he's going
to be a goal Glove winner again. He won a
Gold Glove a few years ago. I know his numbers
have been trending down as far as like OPS and
he had. He didn't strike out as much last year
as he has in the previous years, but his batting
average OPS is down. But this is a guy that
you put him in Great American Ballpark, a whole new setting.
(12:27):
I mean, this guy might just rejuvenate his career. And
we've seen this before. Some players that are on the
downside get an opportunity somewhere else and next thing you know,
they're back to what they were before, even if it's
just for a year. I'm not sure how much he's
gonna cost. Maybe probably in the twelve to fifteen million range,
i'd imagine somewhere around there.
Speaker 1 (12:49):
I think it's gonna be less. It might be about
eight to ten. Maybe I'm not sure, but because I
think you would get it. He was I think he
was scheduled. Get about like was it twelve and urb
is what MLB trade rumors kind of guessed, But yeah, no,
like it's it'll be interesting. He's a guy that like,
(13:12):
here's Danny. Here's a question I have for you. How
do you feel about like when you think of this
offense as a whole and this team and their approach.
And again, like I am not a like person who
puts a lot on the hitting coaches. I feel like
hitting coaches in this day and age are almost like assistants,
(13:34):
like not bosses, right right, And so they're there are
players assistants they don't have there there's still his coaching staff,
but you know, like and and I also always go
back to something I think I've mentioned this before, but
Brooke Jacobi said when John Fay, the late great John Fay,
asked him about like, well, you know, you have a
guy like Vao and his approach, how do you teach
(13:58):
that to other guys? And Brooke said, you don't teach approach,
you draft it.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
Or acquire it.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
You know, It's like you could do as much, but
like in the end, and this is something speaking of
other people, like I remember talking to Eric Davis. He
was talking to somebody, I think it was Will Benson,
and Eric Davis just said, be who you are. You know,
you can't be something you're not. You can't be a
(14:31):
doulas Garcia and then turn into you know, Joey Vado,
or you can't be Vladimir Guerrero senior and turn into
Vladimir Guerrero junior other than a long process with you know,
a partner and raising them, but it's still not you.
Speaker 2 (14:48):
But yeah, so yes, yeah, the Joey Vodo thing is
is brilliant. I love that that quote from Brook Jacoby.
Nobody you're not going to try to teach somebody how
to have the same approach and patience as Joey Vado.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
And you can trust and be like, hey, this is
what he does. Good. But you you're not going to
turn somebody into that, just as like you're not going
to turn well, this guy hits the ball.
Speaker 2 (15:14):
Is about the ball?
Speaker 1 (15:15):
Well, we want you to get more power, be a
power hitter. You know, like that doesn't work. You have
to be who you are that can evolve. But changing
it abruptly or trying to change abruptly, I think is
the fool's erin.
Speaker 2 (15:29):
Yeah. You know, when Adam Done came to Cincinnati way
back in early two thousands, people were complaining that he
was not swinging at pitches, like he was taking too
many pitches and taking too many walks. And you know,
he's either a home run, strikeout, or walk. Well, isn't
that what baseball loves these days? I mean, Adam Dunn
was like he was the.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
First yeah, three true outcome guy.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
Yeah, and he had a great eye at the plate,
and he wasn't gonna chase. I mean, he did strike
out a lot, but he was very seldomly going out
of the strike zone to chase pitches. You know. Well,
he didn't mind taking a walk.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
And that's kind of my my worry with the Dolas
Garcia is no, no, no, it's not the walking, it's the chasing.
You know, a thirty five point chase percentage last year
on pitches out of the zone, So one of three
pitches out of the zone he's swinging.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
Yeah, but that that also could be somebody in his
ear telling him you need to be more aggressive and
you need to you know, try to jump on somebody
early into count or whatever it is. Because when a hitter,
even a pitcher for that matter, when when a player
is struggling, you have so many voices telling you this
is how you got to get out of your slump,
(16:49):
and this is what you gotta do. You got to
be more aggressive, you got to be less aggressive. Next thing,
you know, you're turning into who you're not. You know,
basically kind of what we just said starting this comment
station Adulas Garcia is if he could go back to
just being the guy seeing the ball, hit the ball
hard somewhere, maybe that's as simple as that, instead of
(17:10):
trying to change his approach at the plate.
Speaker 1 (17:12):
And he still hit the ball hard last year, you know,
he had like it was pretty good. I looked at
exo velocity and hard hit rate and all that and
they were all in like eightieth percent island better. So
the question is just swinging and hitting, and you know,
I would love like it's a guy I've thought about
for a little bit. I even thought, like, you know,
(17:32):
because you heard rumors at the trade deadline that the
Rangers were looking at maybe moving him, and it made
sense because he was a guy who could be non
tendered and wasn't performing, and I was like, oh man,
that's an interesting bounce back. I also liked that he's
a right handed hitter, you know, because it seems like
they've got a lot of platoon guys. He's not a
(17:53):
platoon guy, or at least he hasn't been. He might
be now, we don't know. It could be one of
those things. But I can't see him just hitting against lefties.
But but he's also a good base runner. He's not
exactly fast, but he's a good base runner. That's where
like he had a two to seven b war last
year and it was mostly defense and base running.
Speaker 2 (18:16):
You know.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
He did that with a ninety three oh ps plus
and so like, you know, seven percent worse as a
hitter than the average player, but still gave you nearly
three wins because of his defense and his and his
and his running ability and and and maybe it's a
guy that like, okay, you have him here and he
(18:39):
goes to left field. You can do that in DH
some but a guy who's a former Gold Glover who
can play out field, you have him out there with
Noelvi Marte, you know, and then you have him batting
right handed, right behind Ellie de la Cruz. You know,
even if he gets off to a slow start, people
(19:01):
are still not wanting to test them because he has
a resume.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
Exactly, That's exactly it. I mean, you bring somebody proven.
I mean, I know everybody in baseball saw what he
did in that World Series when he's a couple of
years ago. You couldn't get the guy out. Every ball
he hit was one thousand miles per hour off the bat.
It was ridiculous. So and when you tell me the
sale price at best Buy, like that's even better than
(19:30):
what I imagine. So, like, he'll be thirty three when
the season starts, which still is I mean, you're not
going to try to sign him to like a five
year deal, right, you just want to see no let
him Yeah, A lot of times you see these guys
maybe sign a one year deal or two year deal
with an opt out to see if they can get
(19:50):
back on track. Let the Reds be that team to
get back get him back on track.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
It will be interesting though, for me to see exactly
how this market does and if guys are willing to
sign one year deals or more likely to be aggressive
for two years deals with an opt out. Because of
the CBA expiring after this season, you know, there are
gonna be a lot of guys who want the the
(20:17):
security of being on a roster or at least on
a team's radar as opposed to just in the wild
during that lockout time, just because you know, we saw
it in twenty twenty two, like the lockout ends and
it's just like frenzy, you know, you just open the
gates and everybody's running to claim their their land like
(20:40):
the old land rush days, you know. And so I
think that is part of why I think that there's
gonna be some hesitancy in the free agent market. To me,
and I could be wrong, but I think there might
be some hesitancy from both sides. You know. If you're player,
(21:00):
you're like, I don't know, Like I don't know what's
coming up. I don't know that I want a one
year deal, and maybe we're gonna have like these new restrictions,
and I don't think there's gonna be a salary cap.
I also don't think a salary cap is the answer.
That's a different topic for a different day. But I
(21:22):
think they're gonna be people, both players and front offices
hedging their bets because you don't want to get caught
like all of a sudden, we're playing under old rules
and we're paying this guy way too much. So we
shall see. But I think a Dolars Garcia and yeah, yeah,
Baseball you know, MLB Trade Rumors does a great job
(21:43):
with their projections for arbitration and they had them at
twelve one and so that's right on that.
Speaker 2 (21:50):
So but yeah, okay, here's here's my thing. Okay, if
I think.
Speaker 1 (21:59):
There's gonna be no shortage of teams, probably even including
the Texas Rangers offering Dolas Garcia a contract, what is
your sales pitch? If you are Nick Krawl and Brad Matter.
Speaker 2 (22:15):
You can play in a ballpark that you can hit
thirty to forty home runs, and you can play hit
behind Ellie Dela Cruz, or we hit you in front
of Ellie Dela Cruz. Or you can have Lerosa's pizza
every Friday night. Whatever. Sorry, I love the Ross. I'm
just saying.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
They should sponsor us then. But yeah, I don't know.
Like I've been to Cuba, I don't know that it
quays the Cubans are craving Lorosa's. But you know, Hey,
you didn't before you were born in Vietnam. Hell, there
you go, there you go.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
But I think Ellie Dela Cruz is a you use
him as your sales pitch. I think any free agent
that you go after, you can throw that in there,
and then you can also say, well, guess who the
manager is. Tito Francona, who everybody, every retired player would
have loved to have played for Tito Francona when they
(23:17):
were players. And now I'm sure that a lot of
current players they might not say it, would love to
play for Tito Francona.
Speaker 1 (23:26):
I think. I mean, we've seen some players say that.
I'm trying to remember who. I saw it the other day,
but it was like, oh, it's Justin Turner, right, Justin
Turner said he always wanted to play for Terry Francona.
Just Turner's free agent. He's also forty one forty two.
But you know, I think what it does show is
like not just necessarily him, but that type of player
(23:49):
and those veterans who who are like looking for fits
and quality of life. You know, a guy like like
like Justin Turner, who's got you know, this contract is
not going to change his retirement one bit. But so
those guys there are looking at what's going to make
(24:10):
me happy for a year, and your manager is pretty big, uh,
pretty big part of that, right, Danny.
Speaker 2 (24:18):
Yes, you I mean no offense to a lot of
the other managers out there. But if I had an
opportunity to play for Tito and I could only get
a one year deal somewhere, I know this guy is
going to back me. He's going to be right behind
me and try to help me succeed every way possible.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
All Right, So I've got a guy that I thinks interesting.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
I'm not sure I would go there.
Speaker 1 (24:45):
But what do you think about Christopher Morell non tendered
by the Rays. I had actually forgotten that he went there.
It's the trade deadline two years in twenty four. I
just remember this guy like every time he came to
the playf Great America. And you're like, uh oh, because
because the ball can jump off that bat.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
Yeah, and he can play multiple positions.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
He plays so like he played second base, shortstop, and
third base with cups you know those middle those infield spots,
including shortstop, and last year he only played outfield in
DH And you're talking a guy.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
Which affected his hitting. Obviously it did well.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
I don't, I don't know, you know, Like the thing is,
it's it's weird. He's a free swinger with a good eye,
like he makes good decisions. It's just like in the zone.
He does not hit the ball great, but when he does,
you know, he had twenty six home runs in twenty three,
(25:51):
twenty one in twenty four. A guy that kind of
plays all over the place. That's that's the interesting one
for me. And again all of these every name we
bring up, it's gonna be like, well, it depends on
what it costs, and we know that and maybe should
do it. Who's who's another guy you kind of thought about?
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Well, I saw that you highlighted Joey Lukesey. Yeah, left Reliever.
Didn't even cross my mind until you put that on there,
and I'm looking up stuff on this guy. I don't
understand why he wasn't tendered. He wasn't supposed to be
he wasn't supposed to make a ton of money.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
Like two million, Yeah was the projection. And these projections
are usually pretty good because they're based on all these
other ones and so like, yeah, it surprised me too.
Because here's a guy and maybe it is that transition
from starter to reliever, but it seemed like he did
(26:53):
a pretty good job. He like was durable last year.
Once you know, he went over the Giants, they used
him again and again and again. He was there, lefty,
this team needs a lefty. There's a lot for me there.
That was the guy that jumped out at me.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
Yes, and looking up what he did against lefties. He
gave up one home run against a left handed batter
all year last year and eighty three plate appearances. I
mean that's pretty good, I'd say. Yeah. And there's not
just a lefty specialist anymore, because obviously you got to
throw it at least three batters. But still he's going
(27:31):
to come in to face more lefties than right he's
that's what you would use him for. And to keep
the ball in the ballpark, right, I'll take it.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
You know, last like when you were playing back in
the old days, when you guys would leave your gloves
behind your position and the other guy would pick it up.
So that's the guy you know, younger than you or
older than he by the way, Oh yeah, thank you,
I appreciate that. So so like you know, like there,
(28:04):
you would use those left handed guys and they would
literally be used for one batter. Now when you're using them,
you're going to use them for at least three, but
you're really using them for one batter. Like you're like saying, hey,
this this lefty, he's not going to beat me. I
need you know, those other guys. Maybe they'll beat me
against this guy, but I can't. I can't afford to
(28:27):
pitch to the.
Speaker 2 (28:28):
Lefty exactly exactly, and you need that guy and he
can still get right handed hitters out or you look
at it at his splits from last year, right, he's
hit two fifty off of them, ops seven sixty five.
But like you're not having him in there mainly right right,
(28:51):
you have.
Speaker 1 (28:51):
To be able to like basically what that says is
like he can get him out and will, but yeah,
not as great and that's probably exactly why he wasn't there.
But he is a former starter, you know, and so
like it's not foreign to him, Like I think I
think there was probably some adjustment to I don't know,
(29:13):
you'd probably be better than like this, Like is there
an adjustment to how you face guys from the bullpen
versus starting and use your stuff and almost have to
figure out a little differently.
Speaker 2 (29:28):
Well, I think as a reliever, you come in and
you know you're only going to face this guy once
that particular day, unless you're in there for mop up
and you throw multiple nings. But that's not what Luke
Casey would do. So you go in and you know
that you can try to get nasty with every single pitch.
You don't have to pitch around, you don't have to
(29:51):
try to get them to chase try. You know you
can go right after them and be aggressive. And if
you look at like his his strikeouts to innings last
year as a reliever, so he had thirty one strikeouts
in thirty eight and third innings. Well, two years ago
he had nine starts, thirty two strikeouts and forty six
(30:11):
and two thirds innings, so a lot less per inning
as a starter. So I guess what I'm saying is
you can get nasty as a reliever. There's only certain
times of the game. I think as a starter where
you have that ability to I need to get nasty now,
like run around third less than two outs or you know,
trying to shut down a big inning reliever. It's like
(30:34):
I know, I'm in here for these three batters or
these four batters. Here's my stuff, right.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
And you're coming in a lot of those times were
like that's all you're doing is your fire extinguisher, and
so it's like, Nope, not going to mess around. I
don't like because that's right. Like, you know, I think about,
like I was telling somebody this yesterday, like how veteran
pitchers and they were rehabbing, they never want to go
(31:03):
to the lowest leagues because I just remember Aaron Harangu.
Speaker 2 (31:07):
One day being like dangerous.
Speaker 1 (31:10):
Well, his thing was it was like those idiots didn't
know I was setting them up. They were just teeing off.
Speaker 2 (31:16):
Yeah, he was like I was.
Speaker 1 (31:17):
Trying to set them up, but they don't know they
were being set up because they don't know where and
how to set up right. And so it's like it's
so unpredictable, and it's just funny for me to think that,
like you can be a big league pitcher, all star,
you know, I think you know, Harange got cy young votes.
He was a great picture, Like you can be like that,
(31:41):
and it's much easier to pitch against big leaders than
it is single egg guys. And I guess it's just
because you know what to expect.
Speaker 2 (31:50):
Yes, because spring training back in the day when we
used to leave the gloves on the field for the
other guys when they come out, there's opportunities to go
pitching B games, you know, on the backfields, because there
just wasn't enough innings to throw in the the spring
training game. I would as much as I could avoid
(32:14):
the B games on the backfields because of that, Like
there was no you didn't really get much out of
it except a pitch count, because the best thing that
could come out of that is that you didn't get hurt.
Your feelings are going to get hurt because they're going
to crush you because they swing at everything. They see
a big leaguer coming down. They're like, I'm gonna go
(32:36):
up there and swing at a first pitch close and
I'm gonna I'm not gonna let him try to strike
me out.
Speaker 1 (32:41):
So right, you're expected to strike out, Yes, Yes, Like
I remember a couple of years ago, it was Mark Colesferry,
former Reds catcher, when he was in the minor league camp.
It was this one of his He had been in
camps before, but it was since they see a lot
of those big games or against the UH against the
(33:03):
the the Guardians, he hit a home run off Shane
Bieber and it was like everybody was talking about it.
Speaker 2 (33:12):
Oh it gets out, yeah, oh yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:16):
B games are fun though, Like I kind of like
it just because like I watched Joey Vado one year
and like it's different for hitters. Well pictures, pictures, you
can stop at anytime, Like Danny Graves goes out and
he's like, all right, I'm gonna throw this. You could
even be like, oh, that guy hit a home run,
(33:36):
this guy hit a triple. They're swinging at nothing. I
got my fifteen pitches in skip, We're done and you'll
roll the inning, Whereas like Joey Vado could go and
he would like fly out and he could be like, no,
I'm staying in. I'm gonna hit again, you know, like
you can do those things and like I.
Speaker 2 (33:54):
Still can get like ten didn't he get like eight
at bats one?
Speaker 1 (33:58):
Oh yeah easy? Like And it was a game that
I saw against the Guardians and I actually wrote way
too much about it where he hit a pop up
to the infield in a big game, and this is
Joey Vado in a nutshell. That's why I wrote about it,
because I was just back there pop up in the
B game and he was just busting an ass and
it was to the third basement and felt fair territory
(34:20):
and the third baseman lost it in the sun and
it dropped and he got a double because he was
busting his ass. But can you imagine being B guy,
like triple A guy. You're watching any big leaguer yet
future Hall of Famer, and when you see that, Yeah, Like,
that's why I wrote about it, and probably wrote too much.
Speaker 2 (34:41):
But now that's a teaching moment. Of course. Man, you
can't write too much on something like that because there's
so many kids down there, even older players that need
to I've.
Speaker 1 (34:52):
Got editors who might disagree with you, but I did
talk to I talked to I think like thirty two
people for that story, basically anybody who was on the field.
And I of course didn't use that all right, but
I was looking for it and you know, and wanting
to track down everybody.
Speaker 2 (35:11):
So yeah, of course I'm not an editor and I
never will be. But that's intriguing because of the situation.
It's Joey Vado running hard on a pop up on
the infield in a B game, You're not going to
see that very often. And these eighteen, nineteen and twenty
year olds that are playing in these games need to
(35:33):
see that often.
Speaker 1 (35:36):
All right, Yeah, so let's go to how about this
name for you? Alec Manoa.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
I like this kid, Okay, I have a follow up question.
Speaker 1 (35:49):
Okay, and maybe you'll know this because you looked at
my notes, but I still didn't remember, so I had
to go back looking up which team non tendered a Manoa.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
So I didn't know it until I saw it in
your notes. I would say I would have said the
Blue Jays, but I.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
Would have said the same thing, but yeah, it was
the Braves, and I didn't like I had even forgot
that from the time I typed it too.
Speaker 2 (36:19):
Now, yeah, did he even play in any minor league
games with them? He did?
Speaker 1 (36:25):
He did, and or I know he was with them
last year and he pitched in the miners and it
was not what we in the business called good. Oh,
I got it.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
Yeah, But with Toronto he was decent. But before he
went I looked up his numbers in Buffalo last year.
I think he had seven starts as was a sub three.
Speaker 1 (36:51):
I think I think it's like a guy like that,
it's you know, he's if he's pitching ninety one, well
he was never a fireball. It was ninety four, which
I mean again, in today's game, that's nothing. And I
just kind of like the thought that I bet and
he's gonna get I think a minor league contract somewhere,
(37:14):
and for him, it's gonna be the best spot. And
that's probably not Cincinnati with a lot of what they have,
although you can say I have Derek Johnson, yeah, and.
Speaker 2 (37:26):
Yes that's huge, but you know what else is huge.
And I don't know if he would consider it this,
but I think maybe he should at this time to
try to get back in the big leagues go to
the bullpen. He has the perfect mentality to pitch in
the bullpen. You see the excitement, the fiery attitude that
he has when he's pitching, Well he needs that in
(37:49):
the bullpen. Go out there for an inning or two
at a time until like, okay, maybe he starts getting
comfortable and gets his stuff back. Then maybe become a
starter again. But I think this I would flourish as
a late ending reliever, not saying a closer. I'm saying,
you know, big situations late in the game where you
need somebody to come out there that has no fear,
(38:10):
and this dude has no fear pitching.
Speaker 1 (38:13):
Yep. All right, we're gonna finish this up, and I'm
gonna give you three names, three three UH out fielders
and what you any of these? Uh? Tickle your fancy?
Michael Toglia, whose first baseman outfielder was the U the
UH Rockies opening day first baseman last year, Mike Talkman
(38:38):
and JJ Plade, Any of those do anything for you?
Speaker 2 (38:48):
Do any? Oh?
Speaker 1 (38:50):
You just kind of froze up.
Speaker 2 (38:52):
Sorry, tickle my fancy? Six years old? Oh yeah, talk
to me. He's intriguing, but he's thirty five, thirty six
years old? Like how much? But he could be cheap
because of that, But I don't I don't really think
the other two guys are trending in the right direction.
Speaker 1 (39:11):
But those other two guys are much younger. Toddleia is
a switch hitter two years ago and was at twenty
four He at twenty five homers. Seventeen of those were
on the road. I did, I you know, and like
he was a better Like he's a switch hitter, he's
been pretty even as ops's ops plus's home road splits
(39:37):
but and from each side. So I think that's kind
of interesting just because it maybe is a bad year.
Maybe it's a bad spot, you know, leak. Just just
as Great American isn't great for every power hitter, you know,
course is different and yeah, you know, because there's the
(39:58):
difference in cores. For me is not the home runs
but everything else. Like that's why it's always huge. I
was like Billy Hamilton in his prime should have been
a Rocky. He was built for a year, right because
because like he was playing in the worst possible ballpark,
(40:19):
because you know, Great American gives you home runs, but
it takes everything else away. Yeah, because it is that
outfield's small. I mean, the outfield is so small that
we've seen Jesse Winker in center field. I like, Jesse
defense was not his calling card. We saw Shint su
Chow in center field in his thirties because it was
(40:42):
Great American ballpark and you could do that. So you know,
like again it's all comes down to it. That's what
I just find intriguing because it is a switch hitter,
he can you know, you worry about that the the defense. Like,
maybe he's just a left fielder, and but you have
(41:03):
just as a right handed hitter or as a switch hitter.
I just like that versatility. Bla Day is Bla Day
and Taglia we're both first round picks in twenty nineteen
Bigger Prospects. Blade was number four overall pick. Yeah, plays
all three outfield spots, but he's left handed and right now,
(41:25):
like you know, Jake Fraley is available, but like that's
the same thing they have Will Benson, who is probably
a platoon guy, and most of your platoon guys in
the outfield are looking a little left handed.
Speaker 2 (41:36):
So yeah, yeah, you're right switch hitting, a switch hitting
outfielder that can play first base at the H two
and has some pop. I mean it's not a bad
idea either. I'm sure he's not going to be very
expensive at best Buy.
Speaker 1 (41:53):
Yeah, but like rel is still interesting to me just
because right handed, serious pop and the defensive flexibility.
Speaker 2 (42:02):
Yes, yes, I like him more than any of those three.
I know those He wasn't a choice with those three,
but yeah, I would take him all right.
Speaker 1 (42:12):
Well, we got longer than they wanted us to yet again,
because that's what Danny and I do but we will
be back again. We have another one this week before
the holiday. I think we are going to talk closers,
and so our guest is going to be Red's all
time Saves leader, Danny Graves. Will inform me and my
(42:35):
co host just what it takes to be a closer,
because Danny is closing different than any other pitching in
any other inning. Or do we have to stay tuned
for your detailed answer, turn tune into the next one
because this is a long discussion, and it's a discussion
I'm fascinated by, honestly.
Speaker 2 (42:56):
Yeah, and I think they're telling us we've gone too long,
so I have to wait till next episode.
Speaker 1 (43:01):
All right, Well, with that, I guess we You know,
I try to follow instructions. Yeah, you know what you will.
You know what you can do for us for our holidays.
You can rate and review us wherever you listen to
your podcasts or here on YouTube or well, I guess
YouTube's commenting. You really subscribe and YouTube and then go
(43:23):
to Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts, and
you know, share it with your buddies, your friends who
who just want to look at Danny. You can do
it with a sound off. Maybe I should do a
like single camera or it's just Danny and not me,
that might be better. I also do like maybe a
feed where you don't hear me talk. Also very very
(43:47):
highly encouraged. So you know, but but review say nice
things my therapy today and you know we're sensitive today.
Give us five stars. If you're not going to give
us five stars and say nice things, well I don't
want to cry again. So you know that's just one
(44:10):
little please my birthday. Yes, so yeah, you know. Riverfront
Territory is part of the Foul Territory Network, and we'll
check out any of our other shows because we got
great shows on this network and you can find a
whole lot of interesting talk and maybe some of these
same guys and get a better idea. So until next time,
(44:33):
I am see Trent Rosecrants and he is two time
All Star Danny Graves
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