April 16, 2025 • 33 mins
Seems not everyone watched with wonder and excitement as that star-studded group of women blasted off on Blue Origin. Some watched with "disgust."
Amy & T. J. discuss why some of the loudest and harshest critics of Gayle, Lauren, and Katy have been other prominent women.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Hey, the folks in this episode strong successful inspiring women
criticizing other strong, successful inspiring women. And with that, welcome
to this episode of Amy and TJ. And we have
to admit, Robes, this is an episode we did not
necessarily plan or expect to record. But there's been so
much buzz around Blue Origin and that historic all female
(00:25):
crew that went up and came back down. But I
have been surprised, Robes at how much criticism they've gotten.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
I have been surprised as well. We need to fully disclose.
We'll be transparent here. We were excited. We watched the launch,
We felt the excitement, and I certainly as a woman,
felt proud to see six women go up in space.
Some of them, of course, were NASA scientists, but others were,
(00:51):
you know, just people who we know and love and
recognize either through television or know what we listened to
on the radio.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
Katie Perry, Gail King, we.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
Should stay different levels of accomplishment. Yes, you had scientists
on there, and astrophysicist, all these kinds of things. But
Katie Perry's wildly successful, Gail King wildly successful. Lauren Santez
had a successful career and doing her thing So this
is a crew that's not just celebrity. These are accomplished women.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Correct, and women who we look up to, women who
we turn to when we want to either be entertained
or informed or to learn something from.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
So yes, I was excited.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
I was completely surprised when I saw the remarkable and
biting criticism. We expect it on Twitter. And we'll get
into that because of course everyone always has a comment,
and everyone loves to throw barbs thinking they're in an
enclosed basement where no one can know who they are
(01:49):
because they're anonymous. But the people, the women who have
come forward, who are also celebrities in their own right,
who have a pulpit, who have people who listen and
follow them, it's fine to disagree. It's fine to be
I even think constructively critical.
Speaker 3 (02:05):
That's okay.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
Those conversations ken and should happen, and we should welcome them.
But when you start getting mean and sarcastic, and start
just saying words and using words like disgusting and gluttonous.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
I then I feel sad.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
It's like I felt uplifted as a woman, and then
I just felt so frustrated as a woman, because why
do we tear each other down so much. Again, we
can disagree, we can have different opinions, but we don't
have to be mean spirited.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
So I want to take it with you from I
guess a few different angles, one being just legit criticism
and conversation we can have about the use of this
time and money to send these celebrities essentially most of
them up in the space. Two who the criticism is
coming from. Should that make a difference? And then three
(02:56):
the words used during the criticism, And so these are
three different answer. So let's take it from I guess
the top with I guess the criticism, talk about the
criticism itself of this being wasteful, this being a waste
of time, a publicity stump, this is unnecessary, all that's
going on in the world. I hate to just say, yeah,
egg prices are going, Yes, everybody has all kinds of issues.
(03:16):
That's never a perfect time in the world to just
do something for fun, it seems on this level, and
with all this money involved, is never a right time.
But still, is there any issue you take or certainly
understand with somebody else taking with Hey, guys, do we
really need to be putting on this big show right now?
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Look, everyone has an agenda I think in the world,
and I would love for that money to be all
put into cancer research so we can find a cure
to cancer. Sure, that would be amazing. But at the
end of the day, I understand how business and industry works.
And also, this is a private business. Blue Origin is
a private company. We're not talking about NASA, We're not
(03:56):
talking about a government funded agency. We're talking about a
private business. And truthfully, I do believe having space exploration
and pushing that and making that more accessible and making
that more available could lend to all sorts of other innovations.
I don't know what they are. I'm not a scientist.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
We should say that's always been the argument with NASA.
Everybody says, why are we wasting all this money going
to spay? Anybody can always make that argument, that's always
there to So this is private.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
Business, correct, So I think when it's private business, that's
that private business owner's decision to do what he wants
to do with his money and with his team.
Speaker 3 (04:33):
But I also just want to say I don't know enough.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
About what they are learning about space travel, what they
are learning about science in these adventures and in these
space missions, but I think they're possibly leading us in
a direction we may need to eventually go in the
world where they're baby steps building blocks.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
But do we need that? Do we have to have
a justification for it to be okay? Can we not
just say they inspired a bunch of people by going up.
It made a bunch of kids think about the stars?
Is not Can it not just be that? Do I
need to know how them going up led to some
medical or scientific breakthrough? Can it not just be enough
(05:16):
that they inspired others and did something cool period?
Speaker 2 (05:19):
To your point, Yes, I think so. I think that's
something that Gail pointed out to Gail King. I think
Lauren Sanchez says something about all the young girls that
they have heard from who now think and dream that
they could become astronauts and that they could get into
science and those stem types of careers that have not
been traditionally female forward.
Speaker 3 (05:40):
So I do think there is value just in and
of that.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
And I just think people can point to you should
have spent your money this way, or you should have
used those resources to do this. Anybody can always say that,
and that's fine, And those are conversations that can and
should potentially happen.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
So the legit conversation for me, at least in terms
of debating critism that we could have was it a
little too showy? Look, this was a lot and baby
that's okay. But it's been a month plus from the
announcement and they were okay. Look, Gail, you said, I
didn't see this until you pointed out to me a
second ago. But she actually meant that she thinks there
(06:15):
is a sexist element to some of the criticism that's
come out because a lot was made of and it's
just a part of it. Lit they're women. They're fabulous women.
They and they stepped out fabbed up.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Yes, they looked like they were on the set of
a movie or they were on the cover of an album,
and it.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
Looked But you know, I don't mind that.
Speaker 2 (06:34):
I think as a woman, you can celebrate your greatness
or your accomplishments or what you've achieved in your life,
your intellect, and also be hot and fine and you know,
do your hair the way you want to do it,
and put your makeup on and be all the things
that make being female fabulous to a lot of us.
So I don't mind having those two things come together.
But you also have to prepare yourself for some of
(06:55):
I mean, like I mentioned this in Morning Run yesterday.
I believe I got a kick out of and was
laughing watching the video of those women Waitless because they
all had so much hair going on. It was all
floating in the in the in the capsule and it
was funny to see. But I think that's okay. Like
you can also laugh at yourself. You can say, yeah, wow,
that's look at my extensions flying.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Like you know, But is that the thing that's a
part of a criticism that they it looked too much
like you're focused on the glam and the fun, but
you're trying to make an argument that hey, this was
a part of science and inspiration. But what it looks
like is just a bunch of privileged folks getting a
(07:35):
free ride, a joy ride up that's promotional for a
guy who's already one of the richest on the planet.
I think that is that legitimate.
Speaker 3 (07:45):
It's legit.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
I think, you know, people are entitled to their opinions,
and they certainly put themselves out there in a way
that provided that fodder for folks who wanted to take
advantage of it. One hundred percent. But I also just
think we shouldn't be afraid to be who we are,
to celebrate what we do and to enjoy it. I
enjoyed the coverage. I enjoyed the build up to it.
(08:05):
I thought it made it more fun to watch and
witness because we were anticipating it, we were excited about it.
This is what television producers do. We understand that very well,
and I think a big part of this world is
getting people to care. I think we're in such a
frenetic time in this world where we're also distracted. We
all have our phones all no one's paying attention to
(08:26):
anything and very rarely any kind of live event. So
I think it's pretty cool when you can collectively get
people to sit down, put their phones down, and watch
something happen.
Speaker 3 (08:35):
And they were able to do that.
Speaker 2 (08:36):
You can criticize how they did it, why they did it,
but they did accomplish that.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
So there is what So that first part I was
talking about with you, there is a legitimate conversation to
be had about it, all this and what went into it,
and then what do we get out of it? And
an inspiration. Let's just all have a conversation about this
and that's fine. You can disagree with it and just
respectfully have that conversation. Now, the next leg of this
(09:08):
goes into the actual criticism that's come from some notable names,
in particular Emily Raki. I'm saying, right, model activist author.
I think everybody, if you don't know her name, you
certainly know her face. Now, she had a criticism her
body if you want, but she had a criticism. First
of all, she is the one that's being quoted most
(09:29):
out there. Tell folks initially, I guess we should start
with that, because she has some very strong works.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
Okay, So, and this is why she is because she
didn't just say one thing. She said a lot. And
it started with that space mission thing morning. It's that
space miss sorry, that space mission this morning, that end
time shit like this is beyond parody, saying that you
care about mother Earth and it's about mother Earth, that
(09:54):
it's going up in a spaceship that is built and
paid for by a company that's single handedly destroying the planet.
Get the state of the world and think about how
many resources went into putting these women into space and
for what for what what was the marketing there? And
then to try and make it like I'm disgusted, literally,
I'm disgusting.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
Okay, if she would have stopped before the I'm disgusted,
would it have come off the same way, because she
did seem like she was kind of going out to
Jeff Bezos.
Speaker 3 (10:22):
It was, but then she called it a parody.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
And then yes, when she said disgusting or that she
was disgusted, that was obviously taking it to a whole
other level and it got mean, and it it just
it it to me, took away any point she was
making because now it just feels it just feels like
her egos involved. Her ego got triggered because she didn't
(10:45):
like what she saw, and so then she feels the
need or at least the ability to lash out and
to whom andto what. And I would ask her, what's
your point? Like, you can still make your point without
having to attack. You can still make your point. And
I always feel like this, if you have an issue
with something or someone, ask questions instead of pointing the finger,
and then you can come up with a reasonable deduction
(11:08):
of what you think. And you have a right to
your opinion, But ask questions first, perhaps before you start
pointing the finger and blaming and shaming, and.
Speaker 1 (11:15):
Honestly, she has she's been outspoken on several issues, and
she has absolutely the right to her opinion. But this
is what really got And I'm sure Gail and crew.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
Are very much awaretic, so they have responded.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
To specifically to her again not specific okay, I'm but
they're surely aware of someone who has this kind of
platform and following talking about them in such a way,
she used words like this line. Privilege is not an accomplishment,
Exploitation is not an accomplishment. She said. We need to
be able to discern what real progress looks like, and
what happened yesterday was nothing like that. Again, a right
(11:51):
to an opinion, but it it doesn't seem like we're
having a conversation. A conversation was started with the trip, perhaps,
but now it's just the headlines and these things happen
all the time, and we've been in the midst of this.
Why where you see the headlines soone's on claps back,
or someone's on respond someone's going backlash and hits back,
instead of us having a conversation about what actually took place,
(12:14):
where talking about women attacking each other.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
I know, and that's really tough because it isn't as
you mentioned just Emily Radakowski, I mean she had probably
would not probably definitely these strongest language and went after
the mission Jeff Bezos himself and the women just basically
eviscerating them all. But Amy Schumer also went on and
put a video up and mocked getting a call about
(12:38):
getting an opportunity to go up to space, and was
just really sarcastic and dead pan, and just.
Speaker 1 (12:43):
Her point was that the trip was pointless.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
Her point was that the trip was pointless. That you know,
we saw the women bring things up that were meaningful.
She made it seem like it was all meaningless. So
she was in the same vein. We also heard Olivia
Wilde not heard she put up a post saying, basically,
this is just a billion dollars spent for a meme
and took the took the image of Katie Perry kissing
(13:05):
the ground and just made fun of her on that.
And then even Olivia Munn a few weeks before the
mission began, actually was quoted or she was speaking to
Hoda and Friends on the Today Show and she was questioning, oh, sorry, Hoda,
I met Jenna and Friends Hoda's gone. It's Jenna and friends.
Miss Oh my gosh, Jenna and friends. But she said,
(13:27):
I know this is probably not the cool thing to say,
but there are so many more important things to be
doing in this world, basically than going up to space.
She was I think she was maybe the first one
to say something critical, but then you know, she was
actually pretty soft and not that mean spirited about it.
She was just questioning the importance of it or the
reason why.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
What she did call it glutness.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
She did call it gltness.
Speaker 1 (13:51):
Talk about being on the cover of L magazine, Like,
what's the point? Why are you doing all this? That's
a legitimate Let's have a conversation about it again. It
was a very very strong words. Does it matter at all?
This is the other part of the conversation or other thing
I want to ask you about. Does it matter or
should it matter who the criticism is coming from. I
hate to look at the critic now and say, well, oh,
(14:13):
you just do this, or you just do that, or
you don't have any place to say. It's not that.
I mean, these folks have a platform and they are
legit and accomplished and impressive in their own way. But
some are wanting to look at the criticizer and say, well,
actually you don't. You don't have any leg to stand
on it.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
You shouldn't be the one pointing the finger, right. So
the problem is then we all pileon. So if you
start criticizing the people who are criticizing them, we're all
we're all dragged down into the mud. So that isn't
what we're trying to do here. It's just to make
the point that it's I'm disappointed as a woman to
see other women reacting to each other this way. Again,
(14:53):
we can all disagree, we can all question whether or
not this was a good use of resources, but a
good use.
Speaker 3 (14:59):
Of someone's private money.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
I don't know if I have a right to tell
anyone else how to spend their money or not, So
I just I would just ask that we all remember
to be kind, that we can have comments, that we
can have opinions, that we can further a conversation. I
think it's an opportunity to have some of these conversations.
But once you start making someone feel like they've done
something wrong, or that you've shamed them for wasting resources
(15:25):
or for wasting money, suddenly, then all of those people
now feel defensive and then they lash back and it.
Speaker 3 (15:31):
Just gets ugly. And that's not the point.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
The point is I hope that everybody wants a better
way forward, a better way to communicate. It's just sad
when you see it all unravel this way so publicly,
and it just reinforces that cat fighting. Women can't get along,
women can't be happy for one another. Women can't And
I will say, you saw those six women who come
(15:53):
from very different walks of life, represented from all different
colors and backgrounds together excite? Did? You can say what
you want. But I thought the squealing was. I thought
it was joyful. I thought it was It made me smile.
I was excited that they were excited, and I imagined
how scary and crazy that must have felt to go
up and do something like that, and to test your
(16:15):
own fears and to push past them. I thought there
were a lot of lessons that could be learned, that
could be good and sweet takeaways. And yes, we can.
I just I just feel like sometimes I gets lost
and I hate seeing women just not support one another.
You can still question, you can still ask, you can
(16:36):
still disagree, But do we have to tear each other down.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
No, we're not suggesting at all that should be just
blanket support or there should be no criticism. And look,
we play a role, and we have been many years
and been questioned in coverage of things we do, or
or why are you all going there and doing this
fun thing? When this, you know what, very sweetheart, is
a very good point. When Stray went to you and
(17:02):
I do the special report and that same day overnight
you remember what there was a tragedy with tornadoes in Kentucky,
was it not? Yes, And there was a huge debate
within the ABC GMA at the time about what we
should do and how we should cover a tragedy. I mean,
I believe like a hundred people might have been killed
on the same day that we are seeing straighthand go
(17:23):
to space. And this was like back to back special
reports almost we were doing.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
I remember I was there in West Texas and I
was in my vehicle on the phone on a conference
call with you and a couple of our executives discussing
the top of the special report because yes, we're breaking
in a special report, Michael Strahan goes to space, and
yet we have a massive national tragedy where dozens if not.
Speaker 3 (17:48):
I think you're right.
Speaker 2 (17:49):
It was a very high death toll, and these tornadoes
had ravaged the area overnight, and we had to balance
the special report with the breaking news, which you handled
off the top and then pivoted to space.
Speaker 3 (18:01):
We had to try to do both. It is a.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
Sometimes these types of stories are a fine needle to
thread because you're trying to make sure we are of
service but also highlighting one of our colleagues and friends what.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
We did there. And I know you've gone through this
plenty of times your career as well, where a network
will make an attempt to justify what it's doing by saying, well,
this is for science, Well this is for where we're
doing this really because we're going to give this environmental
impact or we're trying to highlight climate change, but really
it's kind of just a fun exercise. I remember what
(18:36):
we did that day was embrace it. We embraced folks.
We understand there's a tragedy going on right now and
we're going to be covering it, but also there's something
else going on today that is going to be inspirational.
It's scary, but we kind of put in context. We
understand this isn't the most important thing going on in
the world, but we're also going to acknowledge that it
(18:59):
is still something that's significant that's happening. We embrace. I
remember us just acknowledging, Yeah, this isn't the biggest deal
right now in the world, but we're going to show
it to you. For this reason, I think maybe some
of the criticism is now coming from there's the content,
it's not putting in proper context. You're going up and
it's glamorous thing and celebrity driven, and you're trying to
(19:21):
tell me this is for stem like it's almost some
of the criticisms like don't treat me like I'm stupid.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
Right, Maybe there needed to be better acknowledgment, better perspective
as you just put it, and that way people wouldn't
feel so like, don't serve me, you know, dessert and
tell me it's vegetables. And I think that maybe rubbed
people the wrong way. And then some folks just got
so upset about it that they ranted, literally ranted on
(19:47):
social media. And we talked about the prominent women who
put their faces in their names to their displeasure, But
you were looking on Twitter on X, I guess is
what it's called now.
Speaker 3 (19:58):
And it was brutal, even worse.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
It's awful.
Speaker 2 (20:01):
You want to talk about some of it, because Gail
King did say she was very upset. She said this
was a very sexist I mean, look she saw, of course,
she saw some of the criticism, and.
Speaker 3 (20:11):
She labeled it sexist.
Speaker 2 (20:12):
She took issue with the fact that they called it
a girl's trip. We called it a trip here on
the podcast on Morning Run, and a lot of folks
referred to it as a trip. She said, you would
never refer to male astronauts as taking a trip to space. However, TJ,
you did, you did find that that did happen.
Speaker 1 (20:27):
Of course, has happened with straight had everybody when Schattner went,
everybody called it taking a ride, taking a trip, a
joy ride, a thrill ride.
Speaker 3 (20:34):
It's a ride.
Speaker 2 (20:35):
It's a trip. It's eleven minutes in space. It's not
a mission to Mars or a mission to the moon.
You know, it's it is a trip to space. It
is a ride, right, she said, ride. She was upset
with that word.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
Yes, what did we did? And again and I understand,
but is do you feel a sexist tinge of the criticism.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Well, when you started reading what was on X, then yes,
and and look, and I get it. Like you, you know,
you do your you do your hair, you do your ma.
If you're all glammed up, you got to expect a
little bit of that. I mean, I think as women,
we kind of brace ourselves for that. We understand. I
don't think any woman should apologize for wanting to look
her best to be.
Speaker 3 (21:09):
On a very highly televised and publicized event.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
I would want to have my hair and makeup done too,
so I would never criticize a woman for that.
Speaker 1 (21:18):
You know, how would your hair have been for this trip?
Speaker 3 (21:21):
Yeah, I'm a ponytail girl, but but they but they're not.
And that's fine.
Speaker 2 (21:25):
And it looked hilarious and glamorous and fun and I
enjoyed it.
Speaker 3 (21:29):
I enjoyed it.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
It looked great. It did in the video of them
waitless and the hair is everywhere. Some of these are
tough to watch.
Speaker 2 (21:45):
You.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
I am literally have X up right now. The search
I did was blue Origin and just click latest and
I'm just going from the top here. Imagine getting the
chance to be in space for six minutes and spending
the whole time looking into a camera. That was criticism
of them, not yep, having the enjoying I guess the
experience being more than a publicity stunt. Correct. Another one.
(22:08):
This is a female astronaut which they showed a picture
of Sally Ride, physics degree from Stanford, several years of training.
These women going up in Blue Origin are celebrities going
for a ten minute ride in low orbit. They are
not astronauts or a crew. Calling them that is an
insult to all that kind of stuff is out there.
Speaker 3 (22:30):
You aren't reading the bad stuff.
Speaker 2 (22:32):
There was some talk about you botox and Barren Wombs.
I mean, people really went and took some low blows.
Speaker 3 (22:39):
If you feel more comfortable if I read some of them.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
But like that, I think people need to understand how
mean it's gotten to.
Speaker 1 (22:47):
Your The one you were talking about it says, and
I'm quoting folks, behold the gauntlet of Baron Wombs and Botox.
And that post is up with a picture or the
video of the women walking onto the capsule. That's tough.
Speaker 3 (23:02):
Was there something with the about the ringing of the bell.
Speaker 1 (23:04):
Ring of the bell the unsung hero of the Blue
Origin female crew and somebody has a like a body
suit a you call spendex kind of thing.
Speaker 2 (23:13):
Was it called, yeah, just to suck everybody, to suck
everything in?
Speaker 1 (23:16):
Yeah, that kind of a yeah.
Speaker 3 (23:18):
So and those are the low.
Speaker 2 (23:19):
Blows that I think a lot of these women are
responding to. And you know, I I I don't know
if I would feel like I needed to clap back.
You know. It's one of those things where sometimes it's
better to say nothing.
Speaker 3 (23:31):
Your silence speaks volumes. It can be deafening.
Speaker 2 (23:34):
But I do, I actually do really like what Lauren
Sanchez says. She said, I would love to have the
critics come to Blue Origin and see the thousands of
employees that don't just work here, but they put their
heart and soul into this vehicle. They love their work
and they love the mission, and this is a big
deal for them. And I just thought that was a
good point to make that there are scientists and employees
(23:58):
and teams working feverishly around the clock to make these
missions successful and to build an industry in a business
for private space travel, and that is a legitimate I mean,
I just I understand people who would like those resources
diverted elsewhere, but it's not their money.
Speaker 1 (24:16):
To your point, take take the women out of this equation.
It is remarkable what they're able to do with Blue Origin.
They are able to send people up into space who
have no training, no experience, and get them back safely
without a pilot. That's what the science here is remarkable.
Speaker 3 (24:31):
And what could that lead to we don't know.
Speaker 2 (24:33):
And so that's the thing I think, anytime you're innovating
and you're doing something new, we don't know where that
could lead. We don't know, And I'm not justifying it,
but I understand. I mean, I just would never want
to be someone to be against innovation. And obviously we
have to do it in understanding of how it works
with our the balance of the Earth and all of
those things. But I just feel like we're so quick
(24:56):
to point the finger and to shame people.
Speaker 1 (24:58):
Here's another one for you, But they're passengers, not crew.
It's a flight, not a mission. They have zero controls
over the ship. Just sit there, then float for a
few minutes, then return. It's publicity at best, that kind
of idea. Look, bottom line, can't both sides be right
yep and be a little wrong? Yes, right right? You're
(25:19):
legit in your criticism. Did you have to use that
language to talk about them. Yes, you're legit in going
up and taking this trip, but maybe it did go
a step too far in some of the promotion and
some of the glamour and some of the there's legit.
Everybody could be right and everybody can be wrong at
the same time. The only thing wrong is just how
we engage and talk to each other sometimes about these things.
(25:42):
And I had no criticism of anybody to see women,
To sit back and see women this accomplish going after
each other that strongly, I didn't. That was tough.
Speaker 2 (25:53):
Yeah, it took away all the excitement and pride I
felt in watching those women do what they did, because
look that I don't know that I have it in
me to go up to space. I don't think I
have that kind of courage to risk.
Speaker 3 (26:08):
That to do that.
Speaker 2 (26:09):
So I was absolutely in awe of that. And that
teaches you a lot about who you are and what
you're made of. And I'm sure those women will take
their experience and I hope they will do good with it.
Speaker 1 (26:19):
And the Wendy's thing, what was that about? Why did
Wendy's criticize Katy Perry. There were some posts that, oh, yeah,
I'm looking at your face now, weren't up on this.
There was a tweet that someone put out, let's say
Katy Perry has returned. Wendy's from their official Twitter handle responded,
(26:41):
can we send her back? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (26:45):
What?
Speaker 1 (26:45):
And I don't know what the beef is. Apparently Wendy's
does a bit of trolling in their social media, but
I don't know what their beef is with her. Necessarily,
I didn't get.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
It, okay, so it looks like so okay from what
I understand Kesha, Oh, it actually is Kesha with the
Wendy's cup she piled on after.
Speaker 1 (27:07):
After the fact. Yes, but Kesha's at beef with Katy
Perry for years. That goes back to a producer they
worked with that Kesha accused of sexual assaut blah blah.
Speaker 3 (27:14):
That's right, So you're right.
Speaker 2 (27:16):
Wendy's replied to a post suggesting to center back to space,
and then later in the day, Kesha supported the recommendation
by posting a photo of herself smirking while sipping from
a Wendy's cup. So you can add Kesha to the
list of women who went after some of the astronauts,
but hers was personal.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
But I don't understand why Wendy's got involved and chimed
in and tell him send Katy Perry about. I didn't
get that.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
That's wild.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
So again this has gone now and turned into something
else for whatever reason. Is it worth talking about? Sure,
always have a conversation about something that was that prominent
with women. This this prominent. Sure, let's talk about space travel.
Let's talk about the safety, let's talk about stem let's
talk about these scientists. Let's talk about the criticism. Let's
(27:59):
talk about it. Oh but good lord, gluttonous.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
Disgusting, send her back to space.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
That's just and it's not just fun. It's not good natured.
Some of it seems a little much like the only joke,
you know what in our morning run, the only joke
I was going to crack, And I never ended up
cracking it because I didn't want to. That was gonna
be a problem. But I'll go ahead and let it
out here. I'll say, Wow, the length women will go
to to get away from men on Earth. That was
(28:26):
the only joke I had.
Speaker 3 (28:27):
That's a sweet one. That's a funny one. That's a
self deprecating.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
One, lighthearted stuff. This stuff is mean, man. Some of
this is just you know what.
Speaker 2 (28:36):
We had twelve year olds to being with us watching
and it was fun to see her watching. I would
hate for her to see the aftermath and how women
are treating one another. And I just I hope, God,
I don't know, because once you put it out there,
that's the thing. I tell my daughters this all the time.
Once you put it out there on social media, it
(28:57):
never goes away. This isn't something that you thought, this
isn't something you whispered to your friend, and any type
of that sort of mean spirited gossiper is toxic. But
when you put it in writing or you have a
platform and you put it out there for the world, man,
I just I wish everybody could listen to their own
words and remember that what you put out there comes back,
(29:20):
and just to please try to remember. You can question,
you can disagree, but try to put more kindness and
try to put less hate out in the world.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
Again, not again, not taking it by Oh wait, anybody's
right to criticize. It's not at all what we're suggesting.
It's just something that again, yes, we as well got
caught up in like a lot of people did, and
we were inspired. We were excited, we were on edge,
we were even nervous for we know.
Speaker 3 (29:47):
Gail, and we went through it with straight hand. So
it kind of felt personal to us.
Speaker 2 (29:51):
I was there on the launch site, you were there
manning the special report from mab S News.
Speaker 3 (29:56):
We were immersed in it.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
Oh yeah, we talked to him this week. I mean
talked him that day. We were going back and forth
because we couldn't help. But in watching that, think about
him and think about how we felt, and think about
what that moment was and it straight And I'm not
betraying our confidence on our trust here, but well, the
first the first thing he said when we reached out
when launch was happening that morning was remembering all the
(30:19):
reaction he got to our reaction on air and being
scared and being nervous, like it came through just how
much we love that guy. It was the first thing
he said to us this week. So it is it.
Remember this is space travel. These women had something on
the line.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
They had their lives on the line. This wasn't without
a doubt.
Speaker 2 (30:42):
They had their lives on their line and they knew
that and they and they went back and they thought
about their training. That's what Gail said at least, but yeah,
I give them a little bit of a break. That's
what I would say. Give people a break. Sometimes we
all want to give ourselves a break. You give your
neighbor a break.
Speaker 1 (31:02):
That's something one of my favorite things. We always judge
other people by their worst actions, but judge ourselves by
our best intentions. If you just give somebody just a
little grace that these are maybe good people who did
this thing that was exciting and inspirational and important to them.
(31:22):
It's just a little grace. You can criticize it, just
a little grace in a moment like this. So congratulations
certainly to them for getting up there. Glad they're back.
What's going to happen next, don't know, but man, but yes,
we had no intention of recording this. We actually as folks.
If you've been following us this week on Morning Run,
(31:42):
you know we're on spring break, Sabine her spring break.
So we got out of town. We are sitting pool
side and ocean side as we talk here. But we
our work has continued. We've been doing the Morning Run
and we've had to do it even earlier. And when
we get done, we usually t lad out and take
a nap. You were so fired up about this story
that you were on the couch looking for a movie
(32:05):
and we were just going to go to sleep again
as it Babe, Let's go, yeah, go record one. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
And I think it's an important conversation to have about
the conversation that is taking place. And hopefully, man, we
can all just be the gentler, kinder versions of ourselves
if we just sit and think about how ugly this
is and how I know that we can individually each
say we're not going to participate.
Speaker 3 (32:28):
So with that, thank you.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
All for listening to this edition of Amy and TJ.
You can listen to us every morning Monday through Friday
by six thirty am Eastern Time for all the day's
headlines to get you started, and while you're getting where
you need to go, we'll give you all the information
you need to know.
Speaker 3 (32:46):
Thanks for listening. I'm Ami Robock and I'm TJ.
Speaker 1 (32:49):
Holmes. What is that little animal over there?
Speaker 3 (32:51):
That it's the large rodent?
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Yes, it is, actually I just saw it going through
the bushes and now crossing over by the pool. It's
it's got a weird name that I can't remember, like
in a goody or something.
Speaker 1 (33:02):
Okay, we're sorry, folks, we're gonna get inside. We're dealing
with some local wildlife doctor Elson
Hey, the folks in this episode strong successful inspiring women
criticizing other strong, successful inspiring women. And with that, welcome
to this episode of Amy and TJ. And we have
to admit, Robes, this is an episode we did not
necessarily plan or expect to record. But there's been so
much buzz around Blue Origin and that historic all female
(00:25):
crew that went up and came back down. But I
have been surprised, Robes at how much criticism they've gotten.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
I have been surprised as well. We need to fully disclose.
We'll be transparent here. We were excited. We watched the launch,
We felt the excitement, and I certainly as a woman,
felt proud to see six women go up in space.
Some of them, of course, were NASA scientists, but others were,
(00:51):
you know, just people who we know and love and
recognize either through television or know what we listened to
on the radio.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
Katie Perry, Gail King, we.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
Should stay different levels of accomplishment. Yes, you had scientists
on there, and astrophysicist, all these kinds of things. But
Katie Perry's wildly successful, Gail King wildly successful. Lauren Santez
had a successful career and doing her thing So this
is a crew that's not just celebrity. These are accomplished women.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Correct, and women who we look up to, women who
we turn to when we want to either be entertained
or informed or to learn something from.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
So yes, I was excited.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
I was completely surprised when I saw the remarkable and
biting criticism. We expect it on Twitter. And we'll get
into that because of course everyone always has a comment,
and everyone loves to throw barbs thinking they're in an
enclosed basement where no one can know who they are
(01:49):
because they're anonymous. But the people, the women who have
come forward, who are also celebrities in their own right,
who have a pulpit, who have people who listen and
follow them, it's fine to disagree. It's fine to be
I even think constructively critical.
Speaker 3 (02:05):
That's okay.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
Those conversations ken and should happen, and we should welcome them.
But when you start getting mean and sarcastic, and start
just saying words and using words like disgusting and gluttonous.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
I then I feel sad.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
It's like I felt uplifted as a woman, and then
I just felt so frustrated as a woman, because why
do we tear each other down so much. Again, we
can disagree, we can have different opinions, but we don't
have to be mean spirited.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
So I want to take it with you from I
guess a few different angles, one being just legit criticism
and conversation we can have about the use of this
time and money to send these celebrities essentially most of
them up in the space. Two who the criticism is
coming from. Should that make a difference? And then three
(02:56):
the words used during the criticism, And so these are
three different answer. So let's take it from I guess
the top with I guess the criticism, talk about the
criticism itself of this being wasteful, this being a waste
of time, a publicity stump, this is unnecessary, all that's
going on in the world. I hate to just say, yeah,
egg prices are going, Yes, everybody has all kinds of issues.
(03:16):
That's never a perfect time in the world to just
do something for fun, it seems on this level, and
with all this money involved, is never a right time.
But still, is there any issue you take or certainly
understand with somebody else taking with Hey, guys, do we
really need to be putting on this big show right now?
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Look, everyone has an agenda I think in the world,
and I would love for that money to be all
put into cancer research so we can find a cure
to cancer. Sure, that would be amazing. But at the
end of the day, I understand how business and industry works.
And also, this is a private business. Blue Origin is
a private company. We're not talking about NASA, We're not
(03:56):
talking about a government funded agency. We're talking about a
private business. And truthfully, I do believe having space exploration
and pushing that and making that more accessible and making
that more available could lend to all sorts of other innovations.
I don't know what they are. I'm not a scientist.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
We should say that's always been the argument with NASA.
Everybody says, why are we wasting all this money going
to spay? Anybody can always make that argument, that's always
there to So this is private.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
Business, correct, So I think when it's private business, that's
that private business owner's decision to do what he wants
to do with his money and with his team.
Speaker 3 (04:33):
But I also just want to say I don't know enough.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
About what they are learning about space travel, what they
are learning about science in these adventures and in these
space missions, but I think they're possibly leading us in
a direction we may need to eventually go in the
world where they're baby steps building blocks.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
But do we need that? Do we have to have
a justification for it to be okay? Can we not
just say they inspired a bunch of people by going up.
It made a bunch of kids think about the stars?
Is not Can it not just be that? Do I
need to know how them going up led to some
medical or scientific breakthrough? Can it not just be enough
(05:16):
that they inspired others and did something cool period?
Speaker 2 (05:19):
To your point, Yes, I think so. I think that's
something that Gail pointed out to Gail King. I think
Lauren Sanchez says something about all the young girls that
they have heard from who now think and dream that
they could become astronauts and that they could get into
science and those stem types of careers that have not
been traditionally female forward.
Speaker 3 (05:40):
So I do think there is value just in and
of that.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
And I just think people can point to you should
have spent your money this way, or you should have
used those resources to do this. Anybody can always say that,
and that's fine, And those are conversations that can and
should potentially happen.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
So the legit conversation for me, at least in terms
of debating critism that we could have was it a
little too showy? Look, this was a lot and baby
that's okay. But it's been a month plus from the
announcement and they were okay. Look, Gail, you said, I
didn't see this until you pointed out to me a
second ago. But she actually meant that she thinks there
(06:15):
is a sexist element to some of the criticism that's
come out because a lot was made of and it's
just a part of it. Lit they're women. They're fabulous women.
They and they stepped out fabbed up.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Yes, they looked like they were on the set of
a movie or they were on the cover of an album,
and it.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
Looked But you know, I don't mind that.
Speaker 2 (06:34):
I think as a woman, you can celebrate your greatness
or your accomplishments or what you've achieved in your life,
your intellect, and also be hot and fine and you know,
do your hair the way you want to do it,
and put your makeup on and be all the things
that make being female fabulous to a lot of us.
So I don't mind having those two things come together.
But you also have to prepare yourself for some of
(06:55):
I mean, like I mentioned this in Morning Run yesterday.
I believe I got a kick out of and was
laughing watching the video of those women Waitless because they
all had so much hair going on. It was all
floating in the in the in the capsule and it
was funny to see. But I think that's okay. Like
you can also laugh at yourself. You can say, yeah, wow,
that's look at my extensions flying.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Like you know, But is that the thing that's a
part of a criticism that they it looked too much
like you're focused on the glam and the fun, but
you're trying to make an argument that hey, this was
a part of science and inspiration. But what it looks
like is just a bunch of privileged folks getting a
(07:35):
free ride, a joy ride up that's promotional for a
guy who's already one of the richest on the planet.
I think that is that legitimate.
Speaker 3 (07:45):
It's legit.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
I think, you know, people are entitled to their opinions,
and they certainly put themselves out there in a way
that provided that fodder for folks who wanted to take
advantage of it. One hundred percent. But I also just
think we shouldn't be afraid to be who we are,
to celebrate what we do and to enjoy it. I
enjoyed the coverage. I enjoyed the build up to it.
(08:05):
I thought it made it more fun to watch and
witness because we were anticipating it, we were excited about it.
This is what television producers do. We understand that very well,
and I think a big part of this world is
getting people to care. I think we're in such a
frenetic time in this world where we're also distracted. We
all have our phones all no one's paying attention to
(08:26):
anything and very rarely any kind of live event. So
I think it's pretty cool when you can collectively get
people to sit down, put their phones down, and watch
something happen.
Speaker 3 (08:35):
And they were able to do that.
Speaker 2 (08:36):
You can criticize how they did it, why they did it,
but they did accomplish that.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
So there is what So that first part I was
talking about with you, there is a legitimate conversation to
be had about it, all this and what went into it,
and then what do we get out of it? And
an inspiration. Let's just all have a conversation about this
and that's fine. You can disagree with it and just
respectfully have that conversation. Now, the next leg of this
(09:08):
goes into the actual criticism that's come from some notable names,
in particular Emily Raki. I'm saying, right, model activist author.
I think everybody, if you don't know her name, you
certainly know her face. Now, she had a criticism her
body if you want, but she had a criticism. First
of all, she is the one that's being quoted most
(09:29):
out there. Tell folks initially, I guess we should start
with that, because she has some very strong works.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
Okay, So, and this is why she is because she
didn't just say one thing. She said a lot. And
it started with that space mission thing morning. It's that
space miss sorry, that space mission this morning, that end
time shit like this is beyond parody, saying that you
care about mother Earth and it's about mother Earth, that
(09:54):
it's going up in a spaceship that is built and
paid for by a company that's single handedly destroying the planet.
Get the state of the world and think about how
many resources went into putting these women into space and
for what for what what was the marketing there? And
then to try and make it like I'm disgusted, literally,
I'm disgusting.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
Okay, if she would have stopped before the I'm disgusted,
would it have come off the same way, because she
did seem like she was kind of going out to
Jeff Bezos.
Speaker 3 (10:22):
It was, but then she called it a parody.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
And then yes, when she said disgusting or that she
was disgusted, that was obviously taking it to a whole
other level and it got mean, and it it just
it it to me, took away any point she was
making because now it just feels it just feels like
her egos involved. Her ego got triggered because she didn't
(10:45):
like what she saw, and so then she feels the
need or at least the ability to lash out and
to whom andto what. And I would ask her, what's
your point? Like, you can still make your point without
having to attack. You can still make your point. And
I always feel like this, if you have an issue
with something or someone, ask questions instead of pointing the finger,
and then you can come up with a reasonable deduction
(11:08):
of what you think. And you have a right to
your opinion, But ask questions first, perhaps before you start
pointing the finger and blaming and shaming, and.
Speaker 1 (11:15):
Honestly, she has she's been outspoken on several issues, and
she has absolutely the right to her opinion. But this
is what really got And I'm sure Gail and crew.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
Are very much awaretic, so they have responded.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
To specifically to her again not specific okay, I'm but
they're surely aware of someone who has this kind of
platform and following talking about them in such a way,
she used words like this line. Privilege is not an accomplishment,
Exploitation is not an accomplishment. She said. We need to
be able to discern what real progress looks like, and
what happened yesterday was nothing like that. Again, a right
(11:51):
to an opinion, but it it doesn't seem like we're
having a conversation. A conversation was started with the trip, perhaps,
but now it's just the headlines and these things happen
all the time, and we've been in the midst of this.
Why where you see the headlines soone's on claps back,
or someone's on respond someone's going backlash and hits back,
instead of us having a conversation about what actually took place,
(12:14):
where talking about women attacking each other.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
I know, and that's really tough because it isn't as
you mentioned just Emily Radakowski, I mean she had probably
would not probably definitely these strongest language and went after
the mission Jeff Bezos himself and the women just basically
eviscerating them all. But Amy Schumer also went on and
put a video up and mocked getting a call about
(12:38):
getting an opportunity to go up to space, and was
just really sarcastic and dead pan, and just.
Speaker 1 (12:43):
Her point was that the trip was pointless.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
Her point was that the trip was pointless. That you know,
we saw the women bring things up that were meaningful.
She made it seem like it was all meaningless. So
she was in the same vein. We also heard Olivia
Wilde not heard she put up a post saying, basically,
this is just a billion dollars spent for a meme
and took the took the image of Katie Perry kissing
(13:05):
the ground and just made fun of her on that.
And then even Olivia Munn a few weeks before the
mission began, actually was quoted or she was speaking to
Hoda and Friends on the Today Show and she was questioning, oh, sorry, Hoda,
I met Jenna and Friends Hoda's gone. It's Jenna and friends.
Miss Oh my gosh, Jenna and friends. But she said,
(13:27):
I know this is probably not the cool thing to say,
but there are so many more important things to be
doing in this world, basically than going up to space.
She was I think she was maybe the first one
to say something critical, but then you know, she was
actually pretty soft and not that mean spirited about it.
She was just questioning the importance of it or the
reason why.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
What she did call it glutness.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
She did call it gltness.
Speaker 1 (13:51):
Talk about being on the cover of L magazine, Like,
what's the point? Why are you doing all this? That's
a legitimate Let's have a conversation about it again. It
was a very very strong words. Does it matter at all?
This is the other part of the conversation or other thing
I want to ask you about. Does it matter or
should it matter who the criticism is coming from. I
hate to look at the critic now and say, well, oh,
(14:13):
you just do this, or you just do that, or
you don't have any place to say. It's not that.
I mean, these folks have a platform and they are
legit and accomplished and impressive in their own way. But
some are wanting to look at the criticizer and say, well,
actually you don't. You don't have any leg to stand
on it.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
You shouldn't be the one pointing the finger, right. So
the problem is then we all pileon. So if you
start criticizing the people who are criticizing them, we're all
we're all dragged down into the mud. So that isn't
what we're trying to do here. It's just to make
the point that it's I'm disappointed as a woman to
see other women reacting to each other this way. Again,
(14:53):
we can all disagree, we can all question whether or
not this was a good use of resources, but a
good use.
Speaker 3 (14:59):
Of someone's private money.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
I don't know if I have a right to tell
anyone else how to spend their money or not, So
I just I would just ask that we all remember
to be kind, that we can have comments, that we
can have opinions, that we can further a conversation. I
think it's an opportunity to have some of these conversations.
But once you start making someone feel like they've done
something wrong, or that you've shamed them for wasting resources
(15:25):
or for wasting money, suddenly, then all of those people
now feel defensive and then they lash back and it.
Speaker 3 (15:31):
Just gets ugly. And that's not the point.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
The point is I hope that everybody wants a better
way forward, a better way to communicate. It's just sad
when you see it all unravel this way so publicly,
and it just reinforces that cat fighting. Women can't get along,
women can't be happy for one another. Women can't And
I will say, you saw those six women who come
(15:53):
from very different walks of life, represented from all different
colors and backgrounds together excite? Did? You can say what
you want. But I thought the squealing was. I thought
it was joyful. I thought it was It made me smile.
I was excited that they were excited, and I imagined
how scary and crazy that must have felt to go
up and do something like that, and to test your
(16:15):
own fears and to push past them. I thought there
were a lot of lessons that could be learned, that
could be good and sweet takeaways. And yes, we can.
I just I just feel like sometimes I gets lost
and I hate seeing women just not support one another.
You can still question, you can still ask, you can
(16:36):
still disagree, But do we have to tear each other down.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
No, we're not suggesting at all that should be just
blanket support or there should be no criticism. And look,
we play a role, and we have been many years
and been questioned in coverage of things we do, or
or why are you all going there and doing this
fun thing? When this, you know what, very sweetheart, is
a very good point. When Stray went to you and
(17:02):
I do the special report and that same day overnight
you remember what there was a tragedy with tornadoes in Kentucky,
was it not? Yes, And there was a huge debate
within the ABC GMA at the time about what we
should do and how we should cover a tragedy. I mean,
I believe like a hundred people might have been killed
on the same day that we are seeing straighthand go
(17:23):
to space. And this was like back to back special
reports almost we were doing.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
I remember I was there in West Texas and I
was in my vehicle on the phone on a conference
call with you and a couple of our executives discussing
the top of the special report because yes, we're breaking
in a special report, Michael Strahan goes to space, and
yet we have a massive national tragedy where dozens if not.
Speaker 3 (17:48):
I think you're right.
Speaker 2 (17:49):
It was a very high death toll, and these tornadoes
had ravaged the area overnight, and we had to balance
the special report with the breaking news, which you handled
off the top and then pivoted to space.
Speaker 3 (18:01):
We had to try to do both. It is a.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
Sometimes these types of stories are a fine needle to
thread because you're trying to make sure we are of
service but also highlighting one of our colleagues and friends what.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
We did there. And I know you've gone through this
plenty of times your career as well, where a network
will make an attempt to justify what it's doing by saying, well,
this is for science, Well this is for where we're
doing this really because we're going to give this environmental
impact or we're trying to highlight climate change, but really
it's kind of just a fun exercise. I remember what
(18:36):
we did that day was embrace it. We embraced folks.
We understand there's a tragedy going on right now and
we're going to be covering it, but also there's something
else going on today that is going to be inspirational.
It's scary, but we kind of put in context. We
understand this isn't the most important thing going on in
the world, but we're also going to acknowledge that it
(18:59):
is still something that's significant that's happening. We embrace. I
remember us just acknowledging, Yeah, this isn't the biggest deal
right now in the world, but we're going to show
it to you. For this reason, I think maybe some
of the criticism is now coming from there's the content,
it's not putting in proper context. You're going up and
it's glamorous thing and celebrity driven, and you're trying to
(19:21):
tell me this is for stem like it's almost some
of the criticisms like don't treat me like I'm stupid.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
Right, Maybe there needed to be better acknowledgment, better perspective
as you just put it, and that way people wouldn't
feel so like, don't serve me, you know, dessert and
tell me it's vegetables. And I think that maybe rubbed
people the wrong way. And then some folks just got
so upset about it that they ranted, literally ranted on
(19:47):
social media. And we talked about the prominent women who
put their faces in their names to their displeasure, But
you were looking on Twitter on X, I guess is
what it's called now.
Speaker 3 (19:58):
And it was brutal, even worse.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
It's awful.
Speaker 2 (20:01):
You want to talk about some of it, because Gail
King did say she was very upset. She said this
was a very sexist I mean, look she saw, of course,
she saw some of the criticism, and.
Speaker 3 (20:11):
She labeled it sexist.
Speaker 2 (20:12):
She took issue with the fact that they called it
a girl's trip. We called it a trip here on
the podcast on Morning Run, and a lot of folks
referred to it as a trip. She said, you would
never refer to male astronauts as taking a trip to space. However, TJ,
you did, you did find that that did happen.
Speaker 1 (20:27):
Of course, has happened with straight had everybody when Schattner went,
everybody called it taking a ride, taking a trip, a
joy ride, a thrill ride.
Speaker 3 (20:34):
It's a ride.
Speaker 2 (20:35):
It's a trip. It's eleven minutes in space. It's not
a mission to Mars or a mission to the moon.
You know, it's it is a trip to space. It
is a ride, right, she said, ride. She was upset
with that word.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
Yes, what did we did? And again and I understand,
but is do you feel a sexist tinge of the criticism.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Well, when you started reading what was on X, then yes,
and and look, and I get it. Like you, you know,
you do your you do your hair, you do your ma.
If you're all glammed up, you got to expect a
little bit of that. I mean, I think as women,
we kind of brace ourselves for that. We understand. I
don't think any woman should apologize for wanting to look
her best to be.
Speaker 3 (21:09):
On a very highly televised and publicized event.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
I would want to have my hair and makeup done too,
so I would never criticize a woman for that.
Speaker 1 (21:18):
You know, how would your hair have been for this trip?
Speaker 3 (21:21):
Yeah, I'm a ponytail girl, but but they but they're not.
And that's fine.
Speaker 2 (21:25):
And it looked hilarious and glamorous and fun and I
enjoyed it.
Speaker 3 (21:29):
I enjoyed it.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
It looked great. It did in the video of them
waitless and the hair is everywhere. Some of these are
tough to watch.
Speaker 2 (21:45):
You.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
I am literally have X up right now. The search
I did was blue Origin and just click latest and
I'm just going from the top here. Imagine getting the
chance to be in space for six minutes and spending
the whole time looking into a camera. That was criticism
of them, not yep, having the enjoying I guess the
experience being more than a publicity stunt. Correct. Another one.
(22:08):
This is a female astronaut which they showed a picture
of Sally Ride, physics degree from Stanford, several years of training.
These women going up in Blue Origin are celebrities going
for a ten minute ride in low orbit. They are
not astronauts or a crew. Calling them that is an
insult to all that kind of stuff is out there.
Speaker 3 (22:30):
You aren't reading the bad stuff.
Speaker 2 (22:32):
There was some talk about you botox and Barren Wombs.
I mean, people really went and took some low blows.
Speaker 3 (22:39):
If you feel more comfortable if I read some of them.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
But like that, I think people need to understand how
mean it's gotten to.
Speaker 1 (22:47):
Your The one you were talking about it says, and
I'm quoting folks, behold the gauntlet of Baron Wombs and Botox.
And that post is up with a picture or the
video of the women walking onto the capsule. That's tough.
Speaker 3 (23:02):
Was there something with the about the ringing of the bell.
Speaker 1 (23:04):
Ring of the bell the unsung hero of the Blue
Origin female crew and somebody has a like a body
suit a you call spendex kind of thing.
Speaker 2 (23:13):
Was it called, yeah, just to suck everybody, to suck
everything in?
Speaker 1 (23:16):
Yeah, that kind of a yeah.
Speaker 3 (23:18):
So and those are the low.
Speaker 2 (23:19):
Blows that I think a lot of these women are
responding to. And you know, I I I don't know
if I would feel like I needed to clap back.
You know. It's one of those things where sometimes it's
better to say nothing.
Speaker 3 (23:31):
Your silence speaks volumes. It can be deafening.
Speaker 2 (23:34):
But I do, I actually do really like what Lauren
Sanchez says. She said, I would love to have the
critics come to Blue Origin and see the thousands of
employees that don't just work here, but they put their
heart and soul into this vehicle. They love their work
and they love the mission, and this is a big
deal for them. And I just thought that was a
good point to make that there are scientists and employees
(23:58):
and teams working feverishly around the clock to make these
missions successful and to build an industry in a business
for private space travel, and that is a legitimate I mean,
I just I understand people who would like those resources
diverted elsewhere, but it's not their money.
Speaker 1 (24:16):
To your point, take take the women out of this equation.
It is remarkable what they're able to do with Blue Origin.
They are able to send people up into space who
have no training, no experience, and get them back safely
without a pilot. That's what the science here is remarkable.
Speaker 3 (24:31):
And what could that lead to we don't know.
Speaker 2 (24:33):
And so that's the thing I think, anytime you're innovating
and you're doing something new, we don't know where that
could lead. We don't know, And I'm not justifying it,
but I understand. I mean, I just would never want
to be someone to be against innovation. And obviously we
have to do it in understanding of how it works
with our the balance of the Earth and all of
those things. But I just feel like we're so quick
(24:56):
to point the finger and to shame people.
Speaker 1 (24:58):
Here's another one for you, But they're passengers, not crew.
It's a flight, not a mission. They have zero controls
over the ship. Just sit there, then float for a
few minutes, then return. It's publicity at best, that kind
of idea. Look, bottom line, can't both sides be right
yep and be a little wrong? Yes, right right? You're
(25:19):
legit in your criticism. Did you have to use that
language to talk about them. Yes, you're legit in going
up and taking this trip, but maybe it did go
a step too far in some of the promotion and
some of the glamour and some of the there's legit.
Everybody could be right and everybody can be wrong at
the same time. The only thing wrong is just how
we engage and talk to each other sometimes about these things.
(25:42):
And I had no criticism of anybody to see women,
To sit back and see women this accomplish going after
each other that strongly, I didn't. That was tough.
Speaker 2 (25:53):
Yeah, it took away all the excitement and pride I
felt in watching those women do what they did, because
look that I don't know that I have it in
me to go up to space. I don't think I
have that kind of courage to risk.
Speaker 3 (26:08):
That to do that.
Speaker 2 (26:09):
So I was absolutely in awe of that. And that
teaches you a lot about who you are and what
you're made of. And I'm sure those women will take
their experience and I hope they will do good with it.
Speaker 1 (26:19):
And the Wendy's thing, what was that about? Why did
Wendy's criticize Katy Perry. There were some posts that, oh, yeah,
I'm looking at your face now, weren't up on this.
There was a tweet that someone put out, let's say
Katy Perry has returned. Wendy's from their official Twitter handle responded,
(26:41):
can we send her back? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (26:45):
What?
Speaker 1 (26:45):
And I don't know what the beef is. Apparently Wendy's
does a bit of trolling in their social media, but
I don't know what their beef is with her. Necessarily,
I didn't get.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
It, okay, so it looks like so okay from what
I understand Kesha, Oh, it actually is Kesha with the
Wendy's cup she piled on after.
Speaker 1 (27:07):
After the fact. Yes, but Kesha's at beef with Katy
Perry for years. That goes back to a producer they
worked with that Kesha accused of sexual assaut blah blah.
Speaker 3 (27:14):
That's right, So you're right.
Speaker 2 (27:16):
Wendy's replied to a post suggesting to center back to space,
and then later in the day, Kesha supported the recommendation
by posting a photo of herself smirking while sipping from
a Wendy's cup. So you can add Kesha to the
list of women who went after some of the astronauts,
but hers was personal.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
But I don't understand why Wendy's got involved and chimed
in and tell him send Katy Perry about. I didn't
get that.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
That's wild.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
So again this has gone now and turned into something
else for whatever reason. Is it worth talking about? Sure,
always have a conversation about something that was that prominent
with women. This this prominent. Sure, let's talk about space travel.
Let's talk about the safety, let's talk about stem let's
talk about these scientists. Let's talk about the criticism. Let's
(27:59):
talk about it. Oh but good lord, gluttonous.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
Disgusting, send her back to space.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
That's just and it's not just fun. It's not good natured.
Some of it seems a little much like the only joke,
you know what in our morning run, the only joke
I was going to crack, And I never ended up
cracking it because I didn't want to. That was gonna
be a problem. But I'll go ahead and let it
out here. I'll say, Wow, the length women will go
to to get away from men on Earth. That was
(28:26):
the only joke I had.
Speaker 3 (28:27):
That's a sweet one. That's a funny one. That's a
self deprecating.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
One, lighthearted stuff. This stuff is mean, man. Some of
this is just you know what.
Speaker 2 (28:36):
We had twelve year olds to being with us watching
and it was fun to see her watching. I would
hate for her to see the aftermath and how women
are treating one another. And I just I hope, God,
I don't know, because once you put it out there,
that's the thing. I tell my daughters this all the time.
Once you put it out there on social media, it
(28:57):
never goes away. This isn't something that you thought, this
isn't something you whispered to your friend, and any type
of that sort of mean spirited gossiper is toxic. But
when you put it in writing or you have a
platform and you put it out there for the world, man,
I just I wish everybody could listen to their own
words and remember that what you put out there comes back,
(29:20):
and just to please try to remember. You can question,
you can disagree, but try to put more kindness and
try to put less hate out in the world.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
Again, not again, not taking it by Oh wait, anybody's
right to criticize. It's not at all what we're suggesting.
It's just something that again, yes, we as well got
caught up in like a lot of people did, and
we were inspired. We were excited, we were on edge,
we were even nervous for we know.
Speaker 3 (29:47):
Gail, and we went through it with straight hand. So
it kind of felt personal to us.
Speaker 2 (29:51):
I was there on the launch site, you were there
manning the special report from mab S News.
Speaker 3 (29:56):
We were immersed in it.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
Oh yeah, we talked to him this week. I mean
talked him that day. We were going back and forth
because we couldn't help. But in watching that, think about
him and think about how we felt, and think about
what that moment was and it straight And I'm not
betraying our confidence on our trust here, but well, the
first the first thing he said when we reached out
when launch was happening that morning was remembering all the
(30:19):
reaction he got to our reaction on air and being
scared and being nervous, like it came through just how
much we love that guy. It was the first thing
he said to us this week. So it is it.
Remember this is space travel. These women had something on
the line.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
They had their lives on the line. This wasn't without
a doubt.
Speaker 2 (30:42):
They had their lives on their line and they knew
that and they and they went back and they thought
about their training. That's what Gail said at least, but yeah,
I give them a little bit of a break. That's
what I would say. Give people a break. Sometimes we
all want to give ourselves a break. You give your
neighbor a break.
Speaker 1 (31:02):
That's something one of my favorite things. We always judge
other people by their worst actions, but judge ourselves by
our best intentions. If you just give somebody just a
little grace that these are maybe good people who did
this thing that was exciting and inspirational and important to them.
(31:22):
It's just a little grace. You can criticize it, just
a little grace in a moment like this. So congratulations
certainly to them for getting up there. Glad they're back.
What's going to happen next, don't know, but man, but yes,
we had no intention of recording this. We actually as folks.
If you've been following us this week on Morning Run,
(31:42):
you know we're on spring break, Sabine her spring break.
So we got out of town. We are sitting pool
side and ocean side as we talk here. But we
our work has continued. We've been doing the Morning Run
and we've had to do it even earlier. And when
we get done, we usually t lad out and take
a nap. You were so fired up about this story
that you were on the couch looking for a movie
(32:05):
and we were just going to go to sleep again
as it Babe, Let's go, yeah, go record one. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
And I think it's an important conversation to have about
the conversation that is taking place. And hopefully, man, we
can all just be the gentler, kinder versions of ourselves
if we just sit and think about how ugly this
is and how I know that we can individually each
say we're not going to participate.
Speaker 3 (32:28):
So with that, thank you.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
All for listening to this edition of Amy and TJ.
You can listen to us every morning Monday through Friday
by six thirty am Eastern Time for all the day's
headlines to get you started, and while you're getting where
you need to go, we'll give you all the information
you need to know.
Speaker 3 (32:46):
Thanks for listening. I'm Ami Robock and I'm TJ.
Speaker 1 (32:49):
Holmes. What is that little animal over there?
Speaker 3 (32:51):
That it's the large rodent?
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Yes, it is, actually I just saw it going through
the bushes and now crossing over by the pool. It's
it's got a weird name that I can't remember, like
in a goody or something.
Speaker 1 (33:02):
Okay, we're sorry, folks, we're gonna get inside. We're dealing
with some local wildlife doctor Elson
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