DOJ ends raw sewage settlement, Crockett rips GOP's dangerous health agenda, El Salvador Deportation

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
In the.

Speaker 2 (00:04):
In the in the in the in the.

Speaker 3 (00:22):
Public, in the.

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In the.

Speaker 2 (00:33):
In the in the Bach, in the Bach, in the Bach, in.

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The public, in the.

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Bank.

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H.

Speaker 1 (04:29):
Today's Monday, April fourteen, twenty twenty five, coming up a
rolling mon unfiltred streaming live on the Black Star Network.
Donald Trump, they are ignoring a Supreme Court ruling. In fact,
this thug is actually trying to suggest the Supreme Court
rule in their favor. That is a lie. He met
with the president of El Salvador. He was caught on
Mike saying they should build more prisons because he plans

(04:52):
to send Americans to l Salvadoran prisons. Also, Congresoman Jasmine
Crockett calls out MAGA for turning public help into a
partisan battle. And speaking of the thugs in Donald Trump's administration,
I told you they do not give a damn about
black people. They have out they have overruled a decision

(05:13):
made by the Body has administration regarding a tap with
the area in Alabama black people dealt with sewage backup
in their neighborhood. Trump calls it any legal DEI decision.
And guess what all of these MAGA negroes are real
quiet plus thousands turned out for UH the homegoing service

(05:37):
of boxing Great George Forman, Folks. Is time to bring
the funk. I want Little Mark unfiltered, all the Black
Sure Network. Let's go.

Speaker 3 (05:50):
What Helena Plas, He's right on top.

Speaker 10 (05:57):
Best believe he's knowing now, Thanks Loston Housta politics with entertainment,
just bookcase.

Speaker 1 (06:13):
It's mart.

Speaker 3 (06:22):
He's Punky Stress, she's real the bestion. No, he's Rolan Martin.

Speaker 1 (06:35):
Martin Folks. I've told you on numerous occasions Donald Trump
and MAGA does not give a damn about black people.
Here is the one thousand and seventy second example of that. UH,
the used Department of Justice. They've ended a landmark agreement

(06:56):
that was meant to fix long standing sewage problems in
Lownes County, known as the Black Belt in Alabama. The
decision follows a directive from the administration, an executive order
that bans federal agencies from supporting diversity, equity and inclusion efforts.
Now these idiots are declaring that that this agreement is

(07:19):
DEI now, folks. This takes place thirty miles from Montgomery,
the state capital of Alabama, the heart of the Black Belt,
where more than five hundred five thousand homes in the county,
or sixty percent, have failing or inefficient sewer systems. That
thousands of families, many of them black, living with sewage
in their yards are backing up into their homes. Dows

(07:42):
County ninety eight hundred people, folks, and the county is
seventy two point five percent black, twenty five point nine
percent White. Generations have beendu it raw sewage in their
yards not because of poor choices, but because of poor
infrastructure and government neglect. That's why the Body Administration launched
an environmental justice investigation in twenty twenty one, which found

(08:05):
that Alabama's public health officials failed to protect residents from
wastewater hazards. Captain Coleman and Flowers, the CEO of the
Center for Rural Enterprise and Environmental Justice. She's going to
join us tomorrow to discuss this, but discussing right now.
My pound, doctor Omicongo to being a senior parpasorial lecture
school in your National service. The Micro University, author of

(08:26):
Lives About Black People, How to Combat racist stereotypes in
White Matters DC, Tommy Christopher, editor Media I at Attucker
to New Jersey. Eugene Craig, CEO X Factor Media out
of Baltimore. Eugene, I will start with you. All of
these maga people. Where are they, these black maga people.
It's amazing how quiet they are. So this decision impacts

(08:47):
black people in Lowndes County. The Cancer Alley decision to
stop that lawsuit against petro chemical company affects black people
in Louisiana. They stopped a lawsuit dealing with black people
and voting in Texas. Donald Trump is not giving them
about black people. And all of these black people, all
of those negroes who were so happy, smiling and shucking

(09:10):
and jiving at the White House Black History Months party.
It's amazing how quiet all of them they are. Where's MICHAELA. Montgomery,
Where's C. J. Pearson? Where is David Harris? Where is
what's his name? A? Pinto? You know, where all these folks?

(09:32):
Where's that little girl from FAMU who running around? It's
amazing how quiet they are when these things are impacting
Black people and you don't hear peep.

Speaker 11 (09:43):
Look the thing about these new this new wave of
black mag is that, look, they don't It's actually sad
and disappointing, right because they don't care about Black people.
They just care about feeling slightly better about themselves for
the poor decisions that they make. So, yeah, all they
do care about is with things like you know, showing
up to the White House for a ute unquote Black
History Month event right after the White House, you know,

(10:06):
assaults black history. You know, they shouldn't We shouldn't expect
them to ever speak out against things, you know, like
the like the you know, the government, the White House
and this d I loss. But they're calling a the
I lawsuit when in reality it's actually the federal government
cleaning up a state and local government mess. You know,
we shouldn't expect them to reasonably, you know, speak out,

(10:28):
you know when you know they want to shut down
the Blacksonian right. We shouldn't reasonably expect them to speak
out when they want to raise Harriet Tubman and the
true essence of the Underground where I wrote from the
National Park Service. We shouldn't expect them to speak out,
you know, when you know the Pentagon says, oh yeah,
Jackie Robinson was the I higher. We shouldn't expect them
to speak out when none of this because first and foremost,

(10:51):
you know, they have to appeal to white conservatives for
the grift to work. Because of that, that appeal, the
grift just wouldn't work. And so you know, when you're
looking at a doctor Julio out of Atlanta, when you're
looking at you know, in any of these folk that
decided to pop up and run around and prop up
Donald Trump, just suspect them to not show up when

(11:13):
it comes to actual black issues affecting black people. When
it comes to this Trump White House.

Speaker 1 (11:20):
I'm a conggoll and bombla is this here? Uh? When
you look at all of this, these folks are silent.
They are complicit again Byron Donald's nothing, Burgess Owens nothing uh,
Wesley Hunt nothing, Tim uh, Tim Scott nothing. They're just
all quiet they're saying nothing, and these are real issues

(11:43):
impacting black people, impacting the lives of black people.

Speaker 12 (11:48):
Yeah, and these guys got more smoke for Pastor Jamal
Bryant than they have for anything this administration is doing.
And it's shameful and gracego disgraceful when you mentioned Tim
Scarada and Byron Donalds and they're like, this is this
is who they are. And they're still trying to find
a way to angle, for some way to get in
good graces with this administration, to build their profile while
our people are dying, while our people are struggling, and

(12:10):
these situations. Trump and his people all they see with
these areas, all they see is land, and they see
possibilities of people having to move into other areas that
they can go in and take over that land. And
for these poor white folks in these rural communities and
these other spaces, they're going to do the same thing
with you as well, if they're not doing it already.
I don't know if there's other networks that are speaking out,
you know, for poor marginalized white people. We do on

(12:33):
this network, but I'm saying we're paying real attention to it,
like we're doing right now. They're coming for everybody, and
they have no respect for people who are poor, people
who are struggling, and for people who are dealing with
as brother Craig was saying, man made disasters.

Speaker 13 (12:47):
And this is the other thing.

Speaker 12 (12:48):
Did you see the interview last week where Kennedy, you know,
they're like, hey man, you cut this program for teen
diabetes and he was like, oh, we didn't do that,
We just cut all the DEI stuff. They use DEI
as a trigger word for everything. And as long as
they use that term DEI for everything, the Byron Donald's
of the world, the Tim Scotts of the world, none

(13:08):
of them are going to speak up because they don't
want to be associated with anything that might actually be
looked at DEI.

Speaker 1 (13:13):
This is not DEI.

Speaker 12 (13:14):
This is public health. This is people dying. This is
communities being torn apart, and it's been happening for decades.
And I don't know what's going to happen with these
Black Republicans because, to be quite honest, as long as
they can continue to be a mouth trump for Donald Trump,
a mouthpiece for Donald Trump, we're not going to hear
pete for them about anything happy to do with the
empowerment of black people in these situations.

Speaker 1 (13:35):
We are on our own from them, absolutely, and so
I think it is safe to say that black people
can forget having any protection at all from this administration.
I mean, you can forget them standing up for black people.
They are going to stand up for big business at
every turn, one hundred percent.

Speaker 11 (13:58):
I mean, look, John James announced has run for governor Michigan, right,
I think every single black Michigan Michigan needs to be
asking them from here on out, what should why haven't
you done anything to support the situation of Flint, and
what can we reasonably expect you to lie about you're
going to do if you get elected governor?

Speaker 3 (14:21):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 1 (14:23):
Hell yall uh? And so sure, John James, where you're at,
where you're at, and this is this is where, this
is where every single one of these black Republicans need
to be questioned specifically about these decisions that impact black
people on the congo, as simple as that. And we
shouldn't let them off the hook.

Speaker 12 (14:45):
Oh absolutely, and giving them incredible work that was done
in Louisiana to destroy you know, those those four initiatives
that that the government had on the ballot. There these
Black Republicans need to wake up because, as you always
talk about Roland, when we get to turn out and
get our numbers out in a place where where the
places we populate.

Speaker 13 (15:02):
We are unstoppable.

Speaker 12 (15:03):
And I think that more and more Black people slowly
but surely are waking up to that fact. When you
look at the world work of Black Votes Matter and
so many these other organizations, I think every Black Republican
should be unnoticed right now. You're not gonna be able
to bring in fifty cent, You're not gonna be able
to bring up so many these other guys who are
gonna speak for you and just say, oh, we'll just
get some black votes. We'll just throw in a black
celebrity here and there. It's not gonna work this time around.

(15:25):
And these guys are continually and daily making themselves irrelevant
because the Trump administration has shown that they have nothing
for them. I'm not even convinced Baron Donalds will even
get that Trump endorsement when he runs for governor in Florida.

Speaker 13 (15:38):
But where are these guys are gonna go. They're gonna
think they can always come back.

Speaker 12 (15:41):
Kind of canvae Owens like try to rehabilitate themselves, go
on a couple of podcasts here and there, maybe get
a you know, an interview.

Speaker 13 (15:48):
On somebody's field. There's always room with Steven A.

Speaker 12 (15:50):
Smith for some of these other guys who does not
speak for black people in the Democratic Party. But they
will see that as a way to kind of move
themselves up. But we have to be unforgiving in how
we challenge to people who have abandoned us. They cannot
be able to be allowed back in, especially after this
administration continues to reject them. And again going back to
that Lituisiana example, we are showing that when we flex

(16:11):
our muscle, we are unstoppable, and all of those black
Republicans out there need to be unnotice with that.

Speaker 1 (16:19):
All right, folks, Hotel, one second we come back, we'll
talk about the thug Trump aligning himself and telling the
El Savado and President I'm going to send Americans to
your prison, So build lots more folks. You're watching roland
Mark unfiltered right here on the blackstud Network.

Speaker 7 (16:41):
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Speaker 14 (16:46):
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guaranteed is death, and taxes. The truth is that the
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Speaker 7 (16:59):
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Speaker 14 (17:01):
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Speaker 14 (17:20):
That's right here on Get Wealthy, only on Blackstar Network.

Speaker 15 (17:26):
This week, on the Other Side of Change, we're going
to examine how foreign policy impacts domestic policy, and how
domestic policy impacts foreign policy. We are all intertwined, and
we're going to have Hannah Read help.

Speaker 3 (17:36):
Us break down that topic.

Speaker 16 (17:38):
We should not want our country to be the big
bad wolf of the globe because that puts us in
a really vulnerable position safety wise as well.

Speaker 3 (17:47):
Only on the Other Side of Change on the Blackstar Network.

Speaker 1 (17:57):
I'm Russell Oyle, Honoree Lieutenant Gerald, United States were retired.

Speaker 7 (18:00):
And you're watching Rollad Martin.

Speaker 3 (18:02):
I felt.

Speaker 1 (18:12):
M m m m.

Speaker 3 (18:33):
M m m m.

Speaker 17 (18:45):
M m.

Speaker 2 (18:55):
Mmmbach insta into instant, Club, Instant, instant, last, instant, instant

(19:39):
last instant instant instead instant instant Smith insta instant in,

(20:23):
instant insta Instama insta inst in instant in.

Speaker 1 (21:10):
A thug A thug. A thug is in the Oval Office.
Donald Trump is defying a United States Supreme Court order
that the administration returned a man who's an American citizen
who was mistakenly sent to L Salvador e span does
not have a criminal record, but as far as Trump concerned,

(21:32):
you know what, they don't care. In fact, in the
Oval Office today during the while the President of L.
Savador was there, while the media was asking questions, Trump
actually lied and claimed that the US Supreme Court ruled
nine to zero in his favor, as opposed to against him.
Listen to this stupidity.

Speaker 18 (21:55):
Promise you if he was your neighbor, you would move
right away, so you don't plan.

Speaker 3 (22:02):
In the Supreme Court saved was at nine to nothing.

Speaker 7 (22:04):
Yeah, there's a nine zero.

Speaker 1 (22:07):
In our favor.

Speaker 18 (22:08):
Against the district court ruling saying that no district court
has the power to compel the foreign policy function of
the United States. As Pam said, the ruling solely stated
that if this individual at El Salvador, sole discretion was
set back to our country that we could deport him
a second time. Well, no version of this legally ends
up with him ever living here because he is a

(22:28):
citizen of El Salvador, that is the president of El Salvador.
Your questions about it, per the court, can only be
directed to him.

Speaker 1 (22:38):
Folks. That's a lie, that's an absolute lie. That is
not what the Supreme Court say it. And in that meaning,
the President l Sabador said that he would not return
to kill mar Garcia claiming that he's a terrorist. There's
no there's nothing that states at this man as a terrorist.
He's never been charged as a member of MS thirteen. Nothing.

(23:02):
He made it up. But then again, I guess his
mentor is Donald Trump. The two of them were talking
and not realizing the live stream was still going, but
Trump said, Hey, you're gonna need to build more prisons
because I'm going to send American citizens to your prisons.
The manager the people wanted to change your differences and

(23:25):
didn't want to. Man tim there, I'm.

Speaker 3 (23:30):
Gonna feel supporter.

Speaker 1 (23:31):
I want you know who criminalists?

Speaker 7 (23:36):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (23:36):
They said, who grewing is the next the bruns?

Speaker 8 (23:40):
You get it?

Speaker 3 (23:41):
About five more places? Yeah, that's fair, all.

Speaker 1 (23:43):
Right, it's not big enough.

Speaker 3 (23:48):
Oh yeah, come on, So this is a much different
office in here.

Speaker 1 (23:56):
So on my congo, Donald Trump says, I am going
to sin American prisoners to the prisons in El Salvador.
I'm sorry. You don't have the right to export American
citizens to a foreign country.

Speaker 12 (24:19):
So glad you used the word export, because you can't
use deport, because you can't deport an American citizen.

Speaker 13 (24:25):
This is what dictatorship looks like.

Speaker 12 (24:26):
And so many people who wanted to you know, you
seen Roland how many I think probably on like day
two or even before the election, and you're like, yeah,
we're already in a constitutional crisis, but all these other
places were arguing for days.

Speaker 13 (24:38):
Well, if we get to this point, is a crisis.

Speaker 12 (24:40):
To get to this point, there's no more discussion for
any of these guys anymore. When a president can outright
just live and then talk about getting rid of you know,
ignoring the constitution, calling this man a terrorist.

Speaker 13 (24:52):
And on top of that, he needs all.

Speaker 12 (24:54):
Of his staff there because he has no real basis
understanding of whats of each individual.

Speaker 13 (25:00):
Cases out there. So he'll go to a miller.

Speaker 12 (25:02):
What was the case Pambondi, which one was that and
let them do all of the talking. You all need
to understand is justice. So Tomorra said it last week.
What he wants to do is to be able to
round everybody up who disagrees with him. So everybody who
is out there talking about we don't care about folks
getting deported or you know, y'all have these find out
moments and all.

Speaker 13 (25:22):
Of the other type of stuff. We are all in
this together now.

Speaker 12 (25:25):
If you were not clear, nine are ruling under the
Supreme Court, and he decided to ignore them wholeheartedly. Welcome
to the dictatorship. And the dictatorship doesn't have to be
everybody's under rule. It's just that the people that they
want to be ruled over are the ones being ruled over.
And so if y'all are not going to get this now,
if you're not going to challenge this now, what are
you going to do? People are talking about resting, What

(25:47):
are you what are you waiting for? Because really, at
the end of the day, nobody is safe. And when
they were in a court a couple of weeks ago,
one of the judges asked, does that mean that they
can just come up and round me up, and and
the and the attorney didn't answer. So if they're there
any question about whether this man is going to respect
the rule of law, we all knew that this was
the case. We all knew this was coming. It was
emphatically made clear today. This man is not a terrorist.

(26:11):
He's a resident of my state, and he was under
the temporary protective status under Trump's first administration. But now
all of a sudden they want to call him this
in snatching Mark the streets and take him from his
three children, one of them who's artistic.

Speaker 13 (26:24):
And do this to him. They can do this to him,
They could do it to anybody America. Better watch out, Eugene.

Speaker 1 (26:33):
I remember a whole bunch of these loud mouth FBA
negroes saying, oh yeah, they can't to port us. They
can deport them. They can't deport us because we foundational
black Americans with a sound to me like, oh we
gonna export you. We ain't gonna call a deport but

(26:53):
were gonna ship some black people to l Salvadorian prisons.

Speaker 11 (27:00):
And look, look you to say you need five more
of these things. And I believe that president hosts one
hundred thousand people the issue issue is here, Right, We're
already in the constitutional crisis. When you have a president
that openly just disrespects the rule of law. You have
a Supreme Court that included Alito and and Clarence Thomas
ruling with the nine old majority that the United States

(27:23):
government needs to facilitate bringing this gentleman back. When you
have a president that is now saying that district courts
have no saver, what happens over the executive branch, Yeah,
folks should probably be more than a little waried, right,
because you know, first it started with the the personnels
here legally, then it went to the protected status person

(27:45):
then it went to the Green card holder. And now
he's already laid out and straight up said, look, we're
gonna menu send homegrown US citizens here. And the thing
is this, right, the Constitution only protects you as long
as as everybody respected. And we're at a point where
Donald Trumps openly saying after Supreme Court, after district courts,
after Constitution, after your actual rights, what he says is law.

(28:09):
And he has a full staff and no guard else
there to stop them this time around. So yeah, these
FBA folks, that is the shout out election, or you
know they're standing on some other type of business. They
might want to get their shit together pretty quickly, we
can say you.

Speaker 1 (28:22):
Could be next, folks, and Republicans are allowing him to
do so. Last week they paid paid past the Save Act,
which is one of the most ownerous voter suppression bills
that is going to have a negative impact on millions
of Americans. To help us explain this, Alex Aleupol Policy

(28:43):
Council at the Bars Community for Civil Rights under Law.
Let Alex glad to have you here. Uh, there are
a lot of people who are very concerned that if
the United States Senate passes this bill, this is going
to disenfranchise millions of people. I've seen some estimates ranging
from four to seventy million Americans.

Speaker 6 (29:05):
Yeah, it's a real concern.

Speaker 1 (29:07):
Roland.

Speaker 19 (29:07):
We're basically at the point where we're hoping the Senate
saves us from the saving.

Speaker 6 (29:12):
This is something that asks voters register.

Speaker 19 (29:16):
With passports or what they call enhanced driver's license, which
are only available in five states, a US passport or
a birth certificate.

Speaker 6 (29:25):
Truly, how many people do you know that have one
of those documents available? It's ridiculous.

Speaker 19 (29:30):
So the other thing they're doing here is they're banning
online voter registration, which forty two states currently have, and
they're saying every time you want to register to vote,
or every time you want to move, you have to
show up in person with those documents.

Speaker 6 (29:45):
It's outrageous.

Speaker 7 (29:46):
Now, the good news is this just.

Speaker 13 (29:48):
Passed the House.

Speaker 19 (29:49):
It hasn't passed the Senate yet, and Leader Schumer has
said it's getting no Democratic votes in the Senate, so
it's safe for now.

Speaker 6 (29:57):
But we have seen that Democrats frankly play dead.

Speaker 19 (30:02):
When it comes to constitutional rights before, so it's on
us to make sure that nobody is thinking that this
is an acceptable piece of legislation to move.

Speaker 1 (30:15):
So here's a question, then, how we fight back.

Speaker 19 (30:21):
Yeah, I think what you need to what you need
to do is you need to register to vote right now,
right because the reason they're attacking the way we register
to vote is because they know that this is one
of the last tools in the toolbox to get them
out of office or to hold people accountable.

Speaker 6 (30:38):
So register to vote right now.

Speaker 19 (30:40):
The second thing to do is let your lawmakers know,
under no circumstance is this acceptable. And that goes for
Democrats and Republicans across the line at the Lawyer's Committee.
We're not non partisan, right, We're yelling at everybody equally
at this point.

Speaker 7 (30:54):
So we're going to do that now.

Speaker 19 (30:56):
Second point is we're ready to sue if this goes through,
and we're going to examine all of our legal options.
But we've just heard in the previous segment. We're not
waiting for the courts to save us. So the important
thing to do is let people know right now how
unpopular this is.

Speaker 1 (31:15):
Absolutely, and I just think people need to understand what's
going on here, and this is an administration that does
not care about the law. They believe they have supreme power.
And when you have that sort of state of mind,
yet you're not necessarily going to have a free and
fair election in twenty twenty six.

Speaker 6 (31:38):
Absolutely, And you know what, they already tried to do this.

Speaker 19 (31:41):
They tried to pass an EO that has a lot
of the same elements of the Save Act. So they're
trying to take two bites of the apples here. They've
got an executive order saying, oh, only you know, voters
when they register can only have these certain type of documents.

Speaker 6 (31:55):
And then they've got this bill over here trying to
do the same thing.

Speaker 19 (31:59):
They know the Executive Order is unconstitutional, and they likely
know that the Save Act has no chance of passage
through the Senate, but they're taking every single opportunity they
can to undermine the rule of law and attack voting rights.
And that's why it's important that people stay in this
fight and register to vote.

Speaker 1 (32:21):
To be a lot to contend with. I think people
need to understand that these are people, not people to
be trusted. You do not have the Attorney General a
Department of Justice that is going to be about justice.
It is not equal justice under law. For them, it
is about appeasing Donald Trump. And so this will be

(32:43):
for the first time the DOJ that we cannot look
to to be impartial and to give and to hold
people under the rule of law because these thugs running
the administration are going to do whatever they want.

Speaker 6 (32:58):
I think that's right, and I think it's really ironic.

Speaker 19 (33:01):
You know, for years we've heard actors who want to
suppress votes and discriminate say, oh, elections are up to
the states. Elections are up to the states. That's why
Alabama or Georgia can do this horrible thing to black voters. Right,
and now that they control the presidency in Congress, suddenly

(33:22):
it's hey, we want to set one national, uniform, federal standard.
It's hypocritical, but we expect that. We know it's about power.

Speaker 6 (33:30):
So what we're looking at is, Okay, if you're going to,
you know, pass this, what's your baseline here, what's your
rationale for doing so?

Speaker 19 (33:39):
And what we're seeing is the same act is just
the same zombie ideas of a solution in search of
a problem. They're claiming all of the stuff about non
citizens voting that's never been proven true, and.

Speaker 6 (33:53):
The prescription for it would block the voter registration of.

Speaker 7 (33:58):
Millions of people.

Speaker 19 (34:00):
We've also seen this at play already. Kansas in twenty
eleven passed a similar law. They ended up blocking thirty
one thousand US citizens from registering to vote. Now that's Kansas,
that's twelve percent of their entire population, and ultimately federal
court said that's unconstitutional. They haven't done it since twenty eighteen,

(34:23):
and their election administrators in deep red Kansas are.

Speaker 7 (34:27):
Saying this is a disaster.

Speaker 1 (34:28):
Do not do this.

Speaker 6 (34:30):
It doesn't work if you want fair and free elections.

Speaker 1 (34:36):
All right, Alex Misholi appreciated, gatigued to battle in the course.

Speaker 13 (34:39):
Thanks a lot, Thank you Roland, thanks for having me.

Speaker 1 (34:44):
Folks, gotta go to break. We come back to the
Rod of chronicles as she talks about MAGA turning public
health issue at partisan battles. Folks, if you want to
support the work that we do, join not bring the
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dot Com. We'll be right back.

Speaker 20 (35:43):
This week on a Balanced Life with doctor Jackie. Here
on Blackstar Network, we are talking about all things. You
got it stress related, Yes, the big s. Whether it's spiritual, physical, emotional,
or sometimes it could be just in your head. Stress
has a way of manifest itself in our lives in
such a way that it disrupts who we are and

(36:05):
who we're.

Speaker 7 (36:05):
In the process of becoming.

Speaker 21 (36:07):
Stress is just as bad as a lot of the
physical elements that we think of. That's all next on
a Balanced Light on the Black Stun Network.

Speaker 7 (36:19):
Hi, I'm Vivia and Green.

Speaker 1 (36:20):
Hi I'm Wendell Pierce, actor and author of The Wind
in the Reads Al Peace World.

Speaker 22 (36:25):
What's going on in select King of Arn and b
yle Heath Divine and you're watching Roland Martin Unfiltered.

Speaker 1 (36:51):
Cos of Majasman. Crockett did not hold back when she
went off on Republicans turning a public health issue into
a partisan issue. Check it out.

Speaker 3 (37:03):
Third of Winning.

Speaker 21 (37:04):
Yet we are hugely winning. We have the best of
the best.

Speaker 1 (37:10):
Right.

Speaker 3 (37:12):
Wrong.

Speaker 21 (37:12):
That was sarcasm if you didn't catch it. The fact
is we should never have partisan politics playing a role
when we're talking about something such as science. But unfortunately,
in today's times, Democrats believe in scientists and experts and data,
and Republicans instead believe in conspiracy theorists. And right now

(37:37):
that is who we have leading one of the most
important agencies in this country is a conspiracy theorist, not
someone who has an actual resume to get the job done.
So why would anyone trust the Republicans on anything, let
alone matters of public health and safety. It has taken

(37:57):
Texas largest measles out break in thirty years, with more
than five hundred confirmed cases and the death of two children,
for the Secretary of the Department of Health and Human
Services to say what we already knew, the most effective
way to prevent the spread of measles is the MMR vaccine.
This is the same guy who chaired the anti VAXX

(38:19):
nonprofit Children's Health Defense. Just last month, during an interview
with Fox News, he suggested that somehow being infected with
measles could provide protection against cancer and heart disease. The
Republicans are implementing the most dangerous public health agenda and
modern American history, and people are literally dying as a result.

(38:41):
This administration doesn't believe in science. They're firing thousands of
scientists and public health officials who keep our food and
medicine safe, slashing funding for scientific agencies that help cities
and states respond to public health emergencies, limiting public access
to research and data that contradicts their misas information. They're

(39:01):
using financial threats to manipulate which studies the government will sponsor,
in blocking researchers from diversifying clinical trials. This reckless and
chaotic approach will make it more difficult for the FDA
to achieve its mission of protecting the public health of Americans.
But there are two issues that I want to address
before my time expires. Staffing at FDA has long been

(39:24):
a challenge. The Government Accountability Office has identified several challenges
at FDA as high risk issues. One of the bigger
issues that GAO has identified as FDA's extensive workload. Last Congress,
the Senate held a hearing on the sale of unauthorized
and illegal vaping products and e cigarettes. During the hearing,

(39:44):
doctor Brian King, director of FDA's Center for Tobacco Products,
testified that the volume of pre market tobacco product applications
is overwhelming, so FDA is instead prioritizing its enforcement responsibilities
when it comes to e cigarettes products. But just last week,
Trump not only fired the director of FDA's Tobacco Center,

(40:06):
he closed two entire offices responsible for drafting new tobacco regulations.
In setting policies, doctor Kessler, and it's twenty twenty five
high Risk report, GAO stated that quote stable senior FDA
and Center leadership remains of vital importance to the agency.
How will this vacuum of leadership impact the public health

(40:28):
and safety of Americans?

Speaker 1 (40:30):
It will.

Speaker 17 (40:32):
Put Americans at risk. But Congressman, you raised a very
very important point. I'm the only pediatrician on this panel today,
and your constituents, please the most important thing is what
you said. If you want to prevent measles, please have

(40:56):
your children vaccinated against that very dangerous disease.

Speaker 21 (41:03):
Thank you so much for that, Doc, And I only
got fifty six seconds, and I don't know if I'm
gonna go through my last question because you just I'm
looking at Grid to see if youre gonna make me
do it. Listen, I'm gonna go off instead.

Speaker 3 (41:17):
Sorry.

Speaker 21 (41:19):
I appreciate the fact that you are an expert in this.
And here's the reality. The Republicans and definitely MAGA loves
to troll me in so many ways. And the reality
is that I trust and believe experts. I don't believe
that I know everything. I believe that I was elected

(41:40):
by my constituents to make sure that I could keep
them safe and always making sure that they are not
going to be victimized if they have, say, family members
that are serving abroad because of Signal Gate, because of
that incompetence, making sure that they have access to vaccines
if they need it, making sure that they can actually
provide for their faith, because we have real economists.

Speaker 4 (42:02):
That are general ladys, whether we are at times here
for general ladies.

Speaker 1 (42:11):
Me and Janie. The reality is we are dealing with idiots.
We are dealing with people who want to penalize others,
and these people are about retribution. There's no doubt in
my mind, and we're seeing it. We had nineteen attorneys
general state that they their states have not gotten FEMA
money that has already been authorized. It's about online they want,

(42:35):
and so when it comes to public health, they don't
mind killing people. RFK Well, he was asked about massive
cuts in his department. He had no idea, he didn't
know who the hell he made the cuts. And so
these people and I'm telling you we're on our own.
We're gonna have to depend upon state health departments and
county health departments and the city. We cannot depend on

(42:58):
the federal government because we have incompetent thugs who are
in control.

Speaker 11 (43:04):
Look, it's funny because the part of that binds itself
on being pro life is now essentially pro death. And
I agree with you at this point. We do have
to rely on states. We do have to rely on cities,
We do have to rely on strong organizations, right. You know,
I think some of the states should be making compacts
now where you know, their data sharing with each other

(43:26):
so they can make emphasis on what's going on, being
that there won't be any national outlook or data sharing
when it comes to a lot of you know, diseases
that kill people every day. You know, they're looking at
this measles outbreak and you know, AHHD and what you know,
Secretary Kennedy is refusing to do. You're looking at North

(43:47):
Carolina right where you know, Donald Trump is literally penalizing
North Carolinians that just went through two major hurricanes, and
so you know, and a lot of this is being
backed by those right That's the real issue here is
that they're trying to figure out every dollar they possibly
can cut. So you come back and say, oh, we
cut all this money for the federal budget. Think are

(44:09):
what we say the taxpayer, when in reality you know
they're just going to find another way to spend it.

Speaker 1 (44:16):
I'm a gone go again. I keep telling people, you
can forget how we have looked to the federal government
to lead in the past that has gone. That is
not what these people are about. These people are absolutely
positively about them doing whatever they want and to advance

(44:40):
their hardcore right wing MAGA agenda, which is all about
big business and profit profit profit.

Speaker 13 (44:50):
Oh absolutely.

Speaker 12 (44:51):
And I will say in addition to us being on
our own, it's like we are on our own in
terms of having to protect ourselves from them. It's not
even just that we're no help with coming. We have
to do the work to protect ourselves from what they're
bringing into our communities. When you talk about that MESOS
outbreak in Texas, I saw the story where there was
a doctor you know, who actually had measos. In this

(45:11):
meeting with other parents and kids talking about oh yeah,
I'm on like day two, I'm doing a little bit
better now.

Speaker 13 (45:16):
No mask or anything, just sitting there, just spreading it.

Speaker 12 (45:19):
And mesos is one of the most contagious diseases out there,
and parents in there like, oh, God has blessed you
and all of that. These are the things out lead
to the outbreak. And when they're putting out these types
of issues, whose health is more in state, people in
these black and brown communities, we are going to suffer
the most. And this connects to our first story about
the sewage. The black folks in that community didn't make

(45:40):
the sewage problem. The government did. And so in addition
to us being on our own, we have to go
to extra step to protect ourselves from them. Because just
as as a Genie was saying, these guys are pro like.

Speaker 13 (45:51):
They don't care if people die.

Speaker 12 (45:54):
They don't care Kennedy, they do not care his sister
or whatever relative said he was a predator, right like,
this is who they are. You surround themselves with predators,
people who are similar a pedophiles or anti semites, who
are racist. Who are you know, billionaires with no connection
to the people. They don't care and so the sooner
we realize that, the sooner we can organize all. I

(46:17):
was watching you for Tiffany Cross and Angel Variety the
other day on y'all's Incredible or interview, and one of
the things that Tiffany Cross said, like, all y'all people
who said, oh, I feels back in the day doing
slavery or whatever, but this is what I'd be doing.

Speaker 13 (46:30):
She's like, you're doing now what you would be doing then.

Speaker 12 (46:32):
And so if the people who aren't getting organized now,
who aren't rallying their communities now, we're not doing what
they need to do to protect themselves now where they's
talking about physically, psychologically, mentally. If you don't do it now,
it is going to be too late, because we don't
got time to wait till the midterms of action and
the organizing and the fighting needs to happen now because
all of their anti everything agenda is going to hit

(46:54):
us first and it already is.

Speaker 1 (46:58):
Oh absolutely, and folks just need to be aware of
what is happening here. Are y'all going to a quick break,
We'll be right back. Roland Martin unfiltered on the Blackstar Network.

Speaker 7 (47:14):
On the next Get Wealthy with me Deborah Owens, America's
wealth coach.

Speaker 14 (47:20):
I'm sure you've heard that saying that the only thing
guaranteed is depth and taxes. The truth is that the
wealthy get wealthier by understanding tax strategy.

Speaker 7 (47:32):
And that's exactly the conversation.

Speaker 14 (47:34):
That we're going to have on the next Get Wealthy,
where you're going to learn wealth tax That.

Speaker 7 (47:41):
Hope you turn your wages into wealth.

Speaker 3 (47:44):
Taxes is one of the largest extents that you've ever have.

Speaker 10 (47:47):
You really got to know how to manage that thing
and get that under control so that you can do wealth.

Speaker 14 (47:53):
That's right here on Get Wealthy only on Blackstar Network.

Speaker 1 (47:59):
Hey, this is Motown recording artist Kim. You are watching
Roland Martin unfiltered?

Speaker 3 (48:05):
Boy?

Speaker 1 (48:05):
He always unfiltered though I ain't never known him to
be filtered? Is there nothing? Is there another way to
experience Roland Martin than to be un filtered? Course he's unfiltered.
Would you expect anything less? Why watch watch? Watch what
happens next? H m hm.

Speaker 2 (48:37):
Hm h m.

Speaker 1 (48:41):
M h m.

Speaker 9 (48:46):
Hm hm hm.

Speaker 2 (48:50):
Hm hm hm h m hm hm.

Speaker 1 (48:59):
Hm In.

Speaker 2 (49:01):
Club instbic inst In Insta insta into Instant, Instant, laic

(49:45):
inst in insta.

Speaker 1 (50:16):
All right, folks, we started the show talking about MAGA,
talking about how MAGA rolls, how they operate, and what
they're doing. And so guess what a black museum is
getting screwed by Donald Trump. That's right, Boston, the museum
of the Museum of African American History, oldest in New England,

(50:38):
says their future is now in the question because the
federal government pulled a five hundred thousand dollars three year
grant from the Institute of Museum and Library Services. The
money was meant to support staffing, school field trips, and
educational programming. Again this, the museum's leadership was notified as
the grant was being terminated, effective immediately. Why. According to

(51:00):
the letter, the museum no longer aligns with the priorities
of the White House under the Trump administration. Of course,
this comes weeks after Donald Trump targeted the Smithsonian. Here's
the whole deal here, and I'm gonna say this again.
We said it when it comes to Lowndes County, when
it came to all these other different places. These people

(51:24):
don't give a damn about black people. Donald Trump is
a white nationalist. Stephen Miller is a white nationalist maga's
agenda is white people, white conservatives. They do not care. Now.
We tried to warn folk, We tried to tell folk

(51:46):
why voting must matter, that this is going to be
an all out assault on black people.

Speaker 22 (51:53):
But no, some people didn't believe us. Some people are like, Oh,
you're a Schierley for the demo crats. Oh, you're just
you're just saying these things. You're trying to scare us
to come out. Well, they're going after all this black stuff.

Speaker 1 (52:17):
And again all these little FBA people. Oh yeah, that's right,
we're gonna stay at home. Y'all.

Speaker 22 (52:28):
Look at what's going on right before our very eyes.
What do we say at the beginning of the year,
What do we say of the ethic inauguration.

Speaker 1 (52:37):
They want to completely decimate the entire black economic, civil
rights infrastructure. They want to erase black people. They want
to erase black history. They want to erase history books.
They want to erase black museums. They want to return
Confederate monuments and plaques and other symbols. Wrote an entire

(53:00):
book called White Fear, How the browning of Americans making
white folks lose their minds. What we are witnessing is
an all out assault on black people. This is not
hard to see on the Congo and guess what, we're

(53:20):
just three in month three. People had better brace for
impact because they want to wipe out everything black.

Speaker 12 (53:33):
Every single thing, and that that museum, you know, for me,
that that's home for me. I've been there, you know,
over the years. It's been an institution for us. And
people need to really understand all of that. When you
say everything, you actually mean everything. Whether we're talking about
corporate spaces, whether we're talking about university spaces, whether we're
talking about the museums, every single aspect, whether it's talking

(53:55):
about the Kennedy Center, every single aspect.

Speaker 1 (53:58):
He is coming for.

Speaker 12 (53:59):
And when you talk talk in many of your interviews
about the idea of people Generation X and younger not
making you know, taking withdrawals out of the bank account
of black civil rights and activism, but not making enough deposits.

Speaker 13 (54:11):
This is that moment that we are in right now.

Speaker 12 (54:14):
We are already not getting enough history in our schools,
We're already not getting enough representation in corporate spaces, We're
already not getting enough of government contracts. And so whatever
literally was, it's all going to be less, if not
completely diminished. And so at what point do black people
wake up? We know that we are one of, if
not you know, the largest consumer base in this country.

(54:35):
What conversations are we talking about as it relates to
reevaluating our dollars and the money that we could be
possibly needing to send in fundraise for some of these
organizations and churches and associations that are being taken out.

Speaker 13 (54:47):
This is on us to do.

Speaker 12 (54:48):
That's why the word is on us because it literally
owners literally means on us. And so when will people
get the wake up call? As I said earlier, not
time to rest, because before you know, it's something that
you value, they're coming for next and they may have
already come for it, and you're gonna go and try
to get those funds or get that information, or get
that research, or get that internship, and.

Speaker 13 (55:07):
It's going to be gone.

Speaker 12 (55:09):
And lastly, we have to remember, like you talked about
in your book, white Fear, they're not even just doing
this out of disdain for us. They're doing it out
of fear of what young white people will learn about
our history and they will be inspired to get out
there and never want to repeat the mistakes of the past,
and they're going to want to unite with us just
like we saw during the Black Lives Matter movement, and

(55:31):
they are terrified of that.

Speaker 1 (55:35):
Oh I'm just telling you right now, Eugene, these folk
better brace for impact. They want to destroy everything black listen.

Speaker 11 (55:48):
Folk better brace for impact in a major way. They
said they were gonna do away with DEI and then
declare everything DEI. So you're justified doing away with it.
You know, I'll send back here thinking like literally less
than a month ago, it was oh joki joki ha ha.

Speaker 1 (56:05):
Yeah, we would never send you know.

Speaker 11 (56:06):
Export you know people really just black and brown people
to a prison at Salvador.

Speaker 1 (56:12):
And what do we see today?

Speaker 11 (56:12):
Hey, you need to go buy you know bill five
more of them career about in a lot of people
your way, you know, whether it's you know, the head
of Black History Museum at the Smithsonian, whether it's a
joint chief for staff, whether it's you know, an insert
black person here. Black America's under attack by the Trump administration,
and people better get very better, get more pard than

(56:33):
they are now. Because if you think the last three
months have been crazy, you got another twenty one months
to go at least before your opportunity to put a
hard stop and break sit this thing.

Speaker 1 (56:46):
Yeah, and again, if people want to just sort of
just keep playing games and keep acting like this is
no big deal, We're going to see more and more
stories like this repeatedly, hard folks. So today in Houston,
George Foreman was laid to rest. A huge turnout at
the Wortham Center to recognize the Houston native, of course,

(57:07):
two time heavyweight boxing champion of the world who later
went on to be a major, major pitchman of products
in the country. Here is some one of the tributes
at a Stay's funeral.

Speaker 5 (57:21):
Good morning. First, I'd like to thank John in the family,
so allowed me to say a few words about George.
George was boxing when I met him, But I never

(57:43):
knew George the boxing. I only knew George as the man.
People always ask me, how did you meet George. We
grew up in the same neighborhood, so Mocht said, oh,
you grew up with no. George five years younger than me.
He was a little boy when I was growing up.

Speaker 1 (58:06):
But when I met.

Speaker 5 (58:07):
George, I can't understand that George was pure. A lot
of people, and even he says, when he was young,
he was a bad boy. But I realized George was
never a bad boy when he was young. He was

(58:28):
a good boy who did bad things. He says he
was converted. He was never converted. George was always good.
He just learned who he really was. He learned his foundation.
How did I meet George? George started giving me money

(58:51):
when I was dean O law school. Didn't know him,
never met him, get checks in the mail. When I
became president, George gave me a large contribution to the university.
I called Nancy, the person that I'd been communicating with
all these years, and I said, Nancy, I have to

(59:13):
meet George. I have to talk to George. I have
to personally thank him for all the contributions he's made
to Texas Southern University. And she said, the only way
George will meet you if you come to church. If
you come to church, he would talk to you afterwards.

(59:34):
At that time, Nancy didn't know.

Speaker 3 (59:39):
That I made a.

Speaker 5 (59:43):
Contract with myself. At nineteen years old, I walked out
of the church. So for the rest of my life
I had to explain to people I didn't need God.
I left the church because I couldn't deal with all
the hypocrisy in the church.

Speaker 1 (01:00:02):
But I went to.

Speaker 5 (01:00:05):
George sermon, went to church, heard him preach, We talked afterwards.
I really liked what he said, and so I went
back to next Sunday, another very very moving sermon for me.

(01:00:26):
So that Wednesday, my secretary was mean. She said, George
Foreman is here to see you? I said, George Foeman.
She said yes. So George came in and I said, George,
you know I'm not always.

Speaker 1 (01:00:42):
In my office.

Speaker 5 (01:00:44):
I have meetings, I'm out of town. I said, in
order to make sure that I'm here, it might be
a good idea if you make an appointment. He said,
you didn't make an appointment when you came to church.
So that's how a friendship started. I want to do

(01:01:06):
two things. First, I want to read something scriptured from
the Bible. I know it's not church, but this is
what brought George and I together. Now, this encounter that
Jesus had with the Pharisees, it said Matthew, Luke and John.

Speaker 1 (01:01:31):
All right.

Speaker 5 (01:01:33):
I always tell people my name is James Matthew Dugley.
So I like to count at Matthew. And so that's
what I'm going to read. In twenty second chapter Matthew
thirty six through the four year Verse, and one of
the Pharisees said to Joe, I meet to Jesus, Master,
which is the greatest commandment in the law. Jesus said

(01:01:57):
unto him that I shall love the Lord thy God
with all thy heart.

Speaker 1 (01:02:04):
And with.

Speaker 5 (01:02:06):
Thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the
first of the great commandments, and the second is li
likened to it, that I should love thy neighbor as thyself.
On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

(01:02:31):
That's how George lived his life. And I realized that's
what I was looking for.

Speaker 1 (01:02:40):
You know.

Speaker 5 (01:02:40):
I know a lot of people in the church said,
why did the president of the university started just coming
to our church. I started coming to the church because
I finally found somebody who believed like me. Religion in
Christianity shouldn't be complex. It's just two simple things. Love

(01:03:05):
God and loved our fella man. I know Michael Harris
always talking about George being the love Man because he
preached love all the time. That's what this life is
all about. It's all about love. And George was pure
because George lived and believed what he preached. So that's

(01:03:31):
how George and I became friends. George was always volunteering
me to do things. I had to explain to a
natote because I kept bugging her. I said, Natalie, I'm
bugging you because your father somehow told everybody if you

(01:03:54):
want to talk to me, you got to go through
Douglas's first. Everybody blows me up every time they wanted
something from George. But those of you are old enough
to remember when A's was really big. When A's first started,
it was really ravishing the African American community. But because

(01:04:20):
A's was first identified as a gay disease, most African
Americans stayed away from it. So George came to me
and he said, look, he said, I want to do
something for the NAACP. He said, I'm making a lot
of money and I want to make sure I don't

(01:04:44):
want to be like other athletes. I know that I'm
making a lot of money because of people like Martin
Luther King the NAACP, and so I want to contribute
something to the NAACP. So George ended up contributing to
one hundred thousand dollars, and at the meeting, he asked
me to read this, and I'm going to read you.

(01:05:07):
What he asked me to read is very short, but
it shows what George was all about. And it says,
my brothers and sisters in the struggle with the urgering
end of a new millennium and centurion. So this is
two thousand. The easiest thing for successful man to say

(01:05:30):
is look what I've done, as if we accomplish everything
by ourselves, and for the most part history is like that.
I too have accomplished a lot, but with the help
of God, my fellow man, and most importantly, with the
aid of the NAACP. Naacpers are among the bravest of

(01:05:53):
them all, those who put their lives on hold, the
family's in danger and the love of a Marriora and
freedom first. So that I and so many other younger
black Americans and say, look what I have done to
the NAACP, I say thank you. That was George.

Speaker 7 (01:06:15):
That was George.

Speaker 5 (01:06:16):
George gave money to I had a lot of different organizations.
You wouldn't believe it. But the thing that brought me
to George was his love for God and his love
for everybody else on the face of this earth. He's
a wonderful man, folks.

Speaker 1 (01:06:43):
That was James Douglas, former president of Texas Heather University
and former head of the Thurgod Marshall School of Law
there at TSU. And so we livestream that holds service.
If you want to see that, go to the Blackstudent
Network YouTube feed or our Black Student Network APT to
actually check all of that out on the Congo and Eugene,

(01:07:07):
I appreciate you. I've been on today's show. I appreciate it.
Thank you so very much, folks. We gonna go to
a break, we come back. We got an fascinating interview
with a book author, folks, and we really talk about
some really critical information. And again, first of all, let's
be real clear. We're now living in the age where

(01:07:29):
you can't even read books about black people. But Sandy
Hudson and I talked about her book which is called
Defund Black Lives, Policing and Safety for All, and she
talks about defund the police and why that is a
phrase that we should not be afraid of and should
not run away from. That conversation is next right here.

(01:07:49):
I'm roland markin Unfiltered on the Black Star Network.

Speaker 15 (01:07:56):
This week on the other side of Change, We're going
to examine how far policy impacts domestic policy and how
domestic policy impacts foreign policy. We are all intertwined, and
we're gonna have Hannah Read help us break down that topic.

Speaker 16 (01:08:08):
We should not want our country to be the big
bad wolf of the globe because that puts us in
a really vulnerable position safety wise as well.

Speaker 3 (01:08:18):
Only on the other side of change.

Speaker 7 (01:08:19):
On the Blackstar Network, Hey, I'm Anthony Smith.

Speaker 10 (01:08:27):
Hey Jane, Hi, this is shriy Lee Ralph and you
are watching Roland Martin Unfiltered.

Speaker 1 (01:08:33):
I mean, could it be any other way? Really, it's
Roland Martin saying, if there's one thing that has been volatile,

(01:08:57):
that has been outrage, just wild, crazy, you name it,
over the last five years, it is being this phrase
defund the police. The right as used it to demonize Democrats.
Democrats have run from it left and right, and a

(01:09:18):
lot of people literally have no idea what the true
intent was and what the meaning was. And it's one
of those things that when the right took hold of it,
it is still a potent, potent phrase today that they've
used to weaponize and brate the left, progressives African Americans with.

Speaker 9 (01:09:43):
You couldnt be more right. I but you know, I
want to push back on them not really knowing what
it means. I think they do know what it means.

Speaker 3 (01:09:52):
I think they just don't like it the phrase to
defund the police.

Speaker 9 (01:09:57):
What we're talking about is really removing reasons ruses from
the police and putting them into services that would actually
make our communities.

Speaker 3 (01:10:06):
Safer and more secure.

Speaker 9 (01:10:08):
And when I say that they're being disingenuous, I mean, like,
look at the way that some folks on the right,
We'll talk about defunding NPR, and we don't see the
same sort.

Speaker 3 (01:10:20):
Of what do they mean?

Speaker 9 (01:10:21):
What are they talking about with that kind of phrasing,
because they know exactly what it means. I just think
that there is a disrespect for black organizers and also
that they just don't like the policy demand that the
phrase points to.

Speaker 1 (01:10:40):
But but you even have African Americans who have reacted
in a vowelatile way to the phrase. And I remember
covering this from the beginning, and what you laid out
was exactly what we talked about. What we talked about
was when when people and folks said defund the police,

(01:11:01):
they were talking about how do you redirect resources in
San Francisco. One of the things that they did was
when they get their analysis of people who were impacted
by police actions, that you know, when there's a mental
health issue, you're sending police. We examined on my show

(01:11:22):
the shooting death of Kajima Powell, the young brother. This
is after Michael Michael Brown's death, and I think we
played on the show and I timed it, and I
believe it was sixteen seconds from the moment the police
door opened to when the first shot rang out. It
was literally sixteen seconds. The case in Dallas, I can't

(01:11:45):
remember the young man's name, but the mother calls and
he's having a mental health episode and he's playing with
the screwdriver and she opens the door and she walks
out and the police are there, and then they put
the we put it down, put it down, and he's
literally playing with it. He's not lunging at them. Next
thing we know, shots bar He's dead. And what people

(01:12:09):
who arke about deep on the police, they say we
should be sending mental health experts on those calls, and
not cops who are trained or some who are trained
to shoot first ask questions later on.

Speaker 9 (01:12:25):
I couldn't agree with you more I tell a number
of additional stories in the book about incidents like this
where people are going through some sort of crisis and
require support, require help. But right now in most jurisdictions,
in some places have started to change this, have started
to take some resources that were previously going to the
police and using it to create a different sort of

(01:12:49):
mental health emergency service.

Speaker 3 (01:12:51):
And that's what people need in those moments.

Speaker 9 (01:12:54):
But for most places, all they have access to in
a crisis is the police showing up, and they are
not equipped to deal with mental health crises. One of
the stories I tell in the book is when I
was in Toronto doing some activist work after a vigil
we held for ab Derkman of DII, who was killed

(01:13:17):
by Ottawa police in twenty sixteen.

Speaker 3 (01:13:21):
You know, we were exiting the vigil that we held.

Speaker 9 (01:13:23):
We were exiting the venue and the venue was surrounded
by police officers because at that time, the police were
following us all around the city even though it was
a really somber.

Speaker 3 (01:13:34):
Event.

Speaker 9 (01:13:35):
And you know, we exit the venue into the night
and a black man came running down the street and
he was screaming or wailing, just inconsolable.

Speaker 3 (01:13:46):
It looked like and the police who had been there
to really surveil us.

Speaker 9 (01:13:51):
They hopped on their bikes, they took out their batons,
they took out their tasers, and they started running after
this guy, and myself and my colleagues we also started
running after him to try to make sure.

Speaker 3 (01:14:03):
That the police wouldn't harm him. He collapses on the ground.

Speaker 9 (01:14:07):
Two of the organizers kind of hold him, collapse on
top of him to hold him, and myself and another
organizer we kind of step in between the police and
this man and say what are you doing? And they've
got their batons out and their tasers, and they are
threatening us with arrest for obstructing justice, and we were like,
what did this man do? We don't understand. And just

(01:14:30):
then a friend of his comes running down the street,
a woman. She's very confused to see all of these
police officers, and she says to us, you know, his
mother just died in his arms down the street and
he couldn't console himself and he ran out of the
building just crying.

Speaker 3 (01:14:48):
Now did this man need police officers to respond?

Speaker 9 (01:14:51):
I don't think so, And I often wonder what would
have happened to him that night had we not been there.

Speaker 3 (01:14:57):
To intervene. And I think that these types of stories
are are really all too frequent and can.

Speaker 9 (01:15:05):
Sometimes result and as you've as you've just mentioned farmer's consequences.

Speaker 1 (01:15:11):
So let's just be real clear. The horse has left
the barn. The bottom line is they have effectively weaponized
this phrase of political politicians who are supportive of the
call have been running left and right. You had you
had something like, you know, the woman who's running for

(01:15:33):
governor of Virginia on the Democratic side. I'm still shocked
nobody actually even even opposed her to the primary. Spanberger
was the one loudly complaining that, oh, this is one
of the reasons why we lost some house seats out
in twenty twenty two. And I'm sitting there going and

(01:15:53):
actually AOC made it comings like, no, some of these
people lost because they actually ran horrible races, and so
and so with what we know has taken place over
the last five years, how what is it now? I mean,
at the end of the day, you know, they've they've
they've destroyed what the intent of the phrase is? So, Okay,

(01:16:16):
what do we say now? What is the rallying cry?
How do we now reframe this restart this whatever you
want to call it.

Speaker 9 (01:16:25):
Honestly, I think what we are in right now is
a backlash period, right and we see these backlash periods
happen after monumentally successful moments in black movement.

Speaker 3 (01:16:38):
Organizing, and that's what we're in right now. And I
think that the.

Speaker 9 (01:16:41):
Most important thing that we can do is make sure
that we are well educated on what we are talking
about and what we need for our communities, and that
we continue to speak truth to power. And that's why
I thought it was really important to put out this
book and apologetically call it defund because what we are calling.

Speaker 3 (01:17:02):
For is actually it just makes sense. It is logical.

Speaker 9 (01:17:05):
If we have tons and tons of resources going to
policing and that leaves our governments unable to properly resources
to properly resourced the services that we need in order
to create safe communities, then you know we have a problem.
I mean, you think about the safest places you can

(01:17:29):
go to in any of our communities. Are they teeming
with cops?

Speaker 3 (01:17:34):
No, they're not.

Speaker 9 (01:17:35):
And by and large police officers, you know, they're wielding
violence and they're making our communities less safe. And so
I think we need to be clear eyed when we say,
you know, this is a massive problem that is most
urgent for our community, and we need to be unapologetic

(01:17:56):
about saying it does not make sense to give more
money to the police. We need to take those resources
away from the police and put it into services that
will actually help keep us safe.

Speaker 1 (01:18:07):
Where are you from.

Speaker 3 (01:18:09):
I am from Toronto, Canada, and I am based in
Los Angeles, California.

Speaker 1 (01:18:13):
The O reason I asked that because again you say
starting early schools. You said, I attended public schools in
Toronto during the nineteen nineties and early two thousands, So
I didn't want assume that you that you were born
there or born here, just but went there for other reasons.
You said, I never had cops in my schools. There
was the odd fight between kids, but by and large,

(01:18:34):
my elementary and junior high schools felt very safe, perhaps
exceptionally so. The reality is, and I think anytime, anytime
there's any conversation, I'm all about you know, how do
you how do you look? How do you look backwards?
There's a phrase in television, we call it back timing,

(01:18:56):
that when you do a television show, you don't start
at you don't build a show at zero to sixty,
you actually build it sixty to zero. Backtiming. And to me,
when we talk about this very issue, we have to backtime.
We have to literally say, okay, you have to literally
go back. How did police start in this country? And

(01:19:19):
they started slave patrols. And the reality is this America
is a violent country. America was created through violence. It
was created through war. The idea of how do you
grow America violence and the reaction in this country, the

(01:19:40):
reaction to anything crime goes up more cops, more cops,
more cops. When the reality is police actually don't prevent crime.
That's right, they don't. That's not what their job is.
Their job is to curtail to then after something happens,
apprehend whoever into the crowd. But it's actually not death

(01:20:02):
puilalty does not stop people from committing murder. It doesn't.
So so that's so that that that is the reality.
So if we're talking about having to reimagine, that's what
you're going to restart, whatever you want to call it.
Give who is doing this this this concept, who is

(01:20:23):
doing it? Well, who can we say look at and
and and and no disrespect. And it has to be
in the United States, it can't be at some other country.
Who in this country, what city, what county, what town
are effectively doing this and we can then say, here
is an example if they are doing this and it

(01:20:44):
has resulted in positive results. M h.

Speaker 3 (01:20:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 9 (01:20:49):
The the the origins of policing are as you say,
and I write about this in the book, are very violent,
and it all has it's enslaved and certainly in the
United States, in the Caribbean, in Canada, and the United Kingdom.

Speaker 3 (01:21:05):
It was actually all really related and it still is.
And I think that that history.

Speaker 9 (01:21:11):
I hope that when people read the book that that
really gives them a lot of context. For one, how
young policing is. It's a really kind of a young idea,
which I think means that it can certainly be transformed,
and also just how violent it was always meant to
be in that it's coupling with the idea of safety

(01:21:34):
and security is even more recent and it's like a
magnificent term that policing was able to do.

Speaker 3 (01:21:44):
In the nineteen forties around and so where are they
doing it?

Speaker 9 (01:21:49):
Well, Well, here's the thing, right, Like, I actually don't
think that policing itself is the solution for safety and security.

Speaker 3 (01:21:57):
So where are they doing policing. Well, there's.

Speaker 9 (01:22:00):
There's no answer to that, but I do know that
in Arizona, in Oregon, there are these programs where they
started to again resource different sorts of services that are
working quite well. So services for homeless folks, for example,
that have nothing to do with police response, nothing to

(01:22:22):
do with corraling people up and arresting them and responding
to them in a car sertal way, but actually giving
them resources that they need to respond to the needs
of homeless people.

Speaker 3 (01:22:34):
That is better for the entire community.

Speaker 9 (01:22:37):
And also there are a number of resources for people
who might have addiction problems that lead that can lead
to issues with criminality or with homelessness and so on.
Treating that like a public health issue and responding to

(01:22:58):
folks needs uh from a from a public health perspective.

Speaker 3 (01:23:03):
Seeing it as a health issue rather than as a criminal.

Speaker 9 (01:23:06):
Issue also is much safer for everybody in the community,
rather than forcing people to engage in in underground economies
that can become really unsafe. And so I think, just
like you've said, you know, we need to focus on
prevention of of of violence, prevention of harms in our

(01:23:30):
communities rather than these kind of gotcha moments that really
don't do anything, have nothing to do with crime rates.
Another example would be how we how we engage with
traffic stops like we it is it's a choice to
have the police engage in high speed chases or stopping

(01:23:50):
people on the highway to to try to investigate them,
and we have very little rights when it comes to that.

Speaker 3 (01:23:58):
But there are safer ways to make sure that we
are safe.

Speaker 9 (01:24:02):
On the roads, whether it's the way that we do
infrastructure or having civilian responses to to issues with how
vehicles organize themselves on the streets in residential communities.

Speaker 3 (01:24:18):
All of these things have been tried.

Speaker 9 (01:24:20):
In multiple places all over the United States with success
and outside the United States as well, And so you know,
these are are proven strategies, and I name a number
of others in the book as well that can be implemented,
but they require resourcing. And if we are serious about
trying to prevent crime, rather than you know, always just

(01:24:42):
throwing more money at the police, whether crime is going
up or down, the solution always seems to be to
throw more money at the police. If we're serious about
preventing harm, preventing violence, you know, that's what we'll do.

Speaker 1 (01:25:01):
And.

Speaker 14 (01:25:12):
We begin tonight with the people who are really running
the country right now.

Speaker 1 (01:25:15):
Trump is often wrong.

Speaker 22 (01:25:16):
And misleading about a lot of things, but especially about
hisster l Trump falling in line with President Elon Musk
in the way.

Speaker 1 (01:25:22):
Of the unsettling news that MSNBC has canceled Joy and
Reads primetime show, The Readout, Roland Martin and the Blackstar
Network would like to extend an invitation to all of
the fans of Joy and Red's MSNBC show to join
us every night to watch Roland Martin Unfiltered streaming on
the Blackstar Network for news discussion of the issue that

(01:25:44):
matter to you and the latest updates on the twice impeached,
criminally convicted felon in chief Donald Trump as unprecedented assault
on democracy, as well as co President Elon musk takeover
of the federal government. The Blackstar Network stands with Joy
and Read and all folks who understand the power of
black voices in media. We must come together and never

(01:26:07):
forget that information is power. Be sure to watch Roland
Martin Unfiltered weeknights, six pm Eastern at YouTube dot com.
Forward Slash Rowland s Martin or download the Black Star
Network happened.

Speaker 3 (01:26:33):
Fact.

Speaker 1 (01:26:33):
I think we have to the issue that we have
to put on the table, and it's real, and that
is even if you factor in race. I mean, look
at the last election, seventy one percent of the electric
was white. And the reality is, when it comes to campaigns,
a potent political weapon crime crime, crime absolutely scare white voters.

(01:27:00):
But here's what happens though, but it also is equally
effective for Black voters because black votes is about typically,
if you have African American high crime in the neighborhood,
you want to feel safe and so but our view
and reaction to police is actually different because it comes

(01:27:22):
down to trust. The reality is white people in America
really really really trust the police. Black people want to
be safe. Well, we ain't necessarily trust in the police.
But what ends up happening, though is our reaction, though
is the same. We want protection. So now you're up

(01:27:43):
against a battle and the valu're up against is what
you're trying to do in terms of the safety with
this book, is how do you get over that hurdle
that this thing is so locked into the mind of
white people, black people and others that hey, we need

(01:28:07):
more cops, spend more money. When you look at these
city budgets, fifty sixty seventy percent is going to police
and fire the total budget. So okay, how then do
we start to begin that change, because it actually has

(01:28:27):
to start here, and that is I mean, look, look
what happened in San Francisco, what we talked about. They
actually try to shift these resources. The attack, the attack
on the city council, the mayor London breed no longer
the mayor. You saw what happened where they recall the
district attorney in San Francisco, they recall the sister in

(01:28:52):
Alameda County in Oakland, tried to recall the DA in La.
Now you have the attack on the George Soros Fund. Prosecutors.
They've been attacking Krashner in Philadelphia because they're like, let's
stop locking people up all. They're attacking cash, bail and
so everything that has come out of the defund the
police movement, they are attacking as this is why crime

(01:29:15):
is going up, and this is why businesses are leaving.
And that is a hope and force to contend with.
So how do we restart, re engage this.

Speaker 3 (01:29:27):
Discussion, really, really important question.

Speaker 9 (01:29:30):
It is so clear to me that we have to
decouple the idea of safety and policing. And of course
people want to be safe in their communities, and that's
what they're responding to, you know, when they even when
we hear these reactions to defund the police that may
not be as malicious as some of the reactions I
was describing before, people are a little bit confused, you.

Speaker 1 (01:29:51):
Know, like, what is this?

Speaker 9 (01:29:52):
How how can you say that the confusion is coming
from this idea that police equals safety.

Speaker 1 (01:29:57):
We have to.

Speaker 9 (01:29:58):
Decouple that idea. You know, I talk about some of
the hard facts, the numbers in the book. You know,
how often our police solving these cases or I mean
we don't even really have those numbers. How often our
police laying a charge in a case of like a
robbery or an arson or a fire very often less
than fifteen percent.

Speaker 3 (01:30:16):
What sort of.

Speaker 9 (01:30:19):
Service is able to fail so consistently like that and
continue to get funding. You know, it's outrageous, and so
we really have to see policing as a service that
we have tried to use to respond.

Speaker 3 (01:30:36):
To safety that isn't working.

Speaker 9 (01:30:38):
But I do think you know, as you say, it's
such a powerful tool for politicians, you know, if they
are able to say we'll be tough on crime, which
every politician does every single election cycle.

Speaker 3 (01:30:50):
But nobody seems to be able to solve the issue
of safety, right.

Speaker 9 (01:30:56):
No one seems to be able to say, well, I've
done that, I've been successful on that front. I mean,
it benefits them to be able to say every year,
I'm going to be tough on crime.

Speaker 3 (01:31:09):
I'm going to be tough on crime.

Speaker 9 (01:31:11):
It's so easy to say something like that and to
be able to say it again and again and again.

Speaker 3 (01:31:18):
And these.

Speaker 9 (01:31:22):
Specific issues that you've pointed to where we're seeing again
this backlash period, all of these programs that have been
started and even trying to be pulled away.

Speaker 3 (01:31:33):
The program that I mentioned in Oregon, who's one of them.

Speaker 9 (01:31:37):
It is just miraculous to me that policing has had
about one hundred and fifty years to fail consistently in
providing safety to our communities. Over and over and over again,
we end up in these cycles of dealing with the
police corruption or violence. I mean, the earliest police report

(01:31:58):
that I read talking about how they needed to fix
issues with policing was from the late seventeen hundreds, and
I mean, this cycle of issues continues unovated. It's had
over a century to fail again and again, and we
try something new for you know, how long does it take.

Speaker 3 (01:32:21):
To set up a service. It takes some time to
set it up.

Speaker 9 (01:32:24):
We try something new for what the last three ish
years in response to to twenty twenty, and people are
already trying to tear them down.

Speaker 1 (01:32:33):
You need to give these for not even already. I mean, look,
I have been laying out to people like this period
that we're in. Well, first of all, you know, George
Floyd's murdered on May twenty fifth, twenty twenty, and I
was literally saying, after that, with the protests, we saw

(01:32:55):
the response from corporate America, We saw all these different things,
and I did my best to try to frame this
so people could understand I was. I was calling it,
and I still call it the third reconstruction, and I
called the first reconstruction obviously followed Slavery. Second reconstruction followed, Yeah,

(01:33:20):
you had Brown versus Board of Education in fifty four,
but it really was the lynching of mid til nineteen
fifty five that I called the second reconstruction, which went
from fifty five to sixty eight. So I called this
the third reconstruction. And what I said then was, I said,
the failures of the first reconstruction and the second reconstruction

(01:33:41):
they did not contend with the money issue. And I
said the third one. I said, secondly, of the failures,
that neither one lasted twenty a minimum of twenty years.
I argue that even though Duba's book put the reconstruction
period at twenty, it really was ten. I call it
ten to twelve years, because you go from sixty five
to the Great Compromise of eighteen seventy seven, which Usher's

(01:34:04):
in Jim Crow. The issue for me was and I
kept warning people. I say, guys, we got to keep
our foots on their net, because if you look at
the history of white America, they are going to all right,
we've done enough very quickly. And it was happening in
of course, twenty twenty one, the implosion of Black Lives Matter,
the attacks on Black Lives Matter. Twenty twenty two we

(01:34:26):
saw with the election it was all about critical race theory.
Then twenty twenty three it was woke. In twenty twenty
four it was DEI I remember being on a panel
at the NAACP Image Awards, and I was like just
just going hard. I'm like, guys, I'm like, I said,

(01:34:47):
this thing is about to be over. And they were
sort of like, damn, bru, calm down. I was like, no,
you don't understand. I'm telling you. This thing is happening
before our very eyes. He playing around. I said, I'm
telling y'all. And literally the chair of the naacpeople was
sitting not even fifteen feet in front of me, and
I said, I'm telling y'all, this thing is about to end.

(01:35:11):
I said. These people and folks were just sort of like, yeah, okay,
And I'm like, because so, I think what happened was
too many of us got so comfortable with some of
these donations. And look, BLM got ninety million, Urban League
got more than one hundred million, NACP got more than
one hundred million as well. I said, but that was

(01:35:31):
a drop in the bucket. I said, I'm telling you,
the backlash is coming and the reality is here. We
are here. We are in the fifth year, five years
after George Floyd was murdered, and it is mayhem because
this is now the reaction to the third Reconstruction and
white America saw young white people latinos age. They saw

(01:35:56):
this was the first black movement an American history, or
a majority of Americans agreed with and white forces said, oh,
hell no, we cannot have this. And I just think
a lot of us, including a lot of activists, did
not fully comprehend how vicious the backlash was going to be.

Speaker 3 (01:36:19):
I think you're right. I think that we were not
prepared for the the extent of this backlash.

Speaker 1 (01:36:28):
History. But it was said right there, what he.

Speaker 3 (01:36:31):
Know, I think you're right, History, I you know what.

Speaker 9 (01:36:35):
I knew there was going to be a backlash myself,
and in part that's why I started writing this book.
So I was like, we're going to need to have
some of this stuff written down before you know, they
start to really attack it. But I, you know, I
think that this is again like a redemption period as well.
It seems like a period that followed reconstruction was really

(01:36:56):
trying to not just destroy the movement that.

Speaker 3 (01:36:59):
Was created, but to destroy all of the institutions.

Speaker 1 (01:37:03):
Yes, where did that move Yes? I did a segment
this was after Trump's Trump's Trump's after that plan fest
on January twentieth, and I said, they want to completely
eradicate the entire black civil rights, economic rights, social justice infrastructure.

(01:37:26):
They want to eradicate all of it because they saw
what happened all that work, all that work, I'll dare say,
civil rights movement. Then you go seventies, eighties, nineties, Jena six,
Trayvon Martin, Eric Garner, Michael Brown, all of that, they said, oh,

(01:37:49):
hell no, we got to kill all of this.

Speaker 3 (01:37:53):
Yeah, And they're starting like.

Speaker 9 (01:37:54):
Right from education, right, They're going after institutions.

Speaker 3 (01:37:57):
They're going after the thing that they think.

Speaker 9 (01:38:01):
You know, started when when folks were young. Think that
they are going after knowledge.

Speaker 1 (01:38:07):
They're going they all want young white reading this.

Speaker 3 (01:38:11):
That's exactly right. And I think, you know, it is
important in this time.

Speaker 9 (01:38:16):
You know, people are afraid, people are nervous, and I
understand that there are there's a lot at stake, you know,
potentially deporting citizens at this point, let alone folks who
are migrants. And that's a huge, huge risk that people

(01:38:37):
can be taking when they're speaking out, and that makes
people feel isolated. And I think history also tells us
that one of the best things that we can do
in moments where we are feeling isolated is to connect
with our community, and to make sure that we are
working together because they're coming for us whether we respond
or not, so we might as well speak truth to power.

Speaker 3 (01:38:59):
And I'm so grateful for your show, because I really
do think that you do that consistently.

Speaker 1 (01:39:04):
I was, I were mentioning activists earlier, and I hate
first of all, I don't like to other people say it,
but I don't. But I do understand spiritual gifts and things,
those things and being able to see things before they happen.
And I remember there were some activists and if I

(01:39:26):
named them, they are very well known. And during this,
during the period after Michael Brown, this was Fergus and
all of this, several of them had posted some funding
efforts contributing, and I remember hitting them and I said, hey,
do not do this individually. You need to be doing

(01:39:47):
this through institutions, so you don't so you're not targeted
tax wise. And then with some who were like like,
who the hell is you? Who to hell are you?
And I'm like, I'm trying to tell y'all, I said,
this is always been the way they went after black
black activists, I said, through taxes. So then we begin
to have other conversations. I begin to talk to other people,

(01:40:11):
and I kept talking about infrastructure, infrastructure, infrastructure, infrastructure, and
I remember I was in this really intense conversation with
some young brothers and sisters, and I said, listen, I said,
I'm not trying to be an older person and tell
you what to do. I said, but I do understand history.
And I said, you can criticize. There are rightful critiques

(01:40:34):
of the NAACP, of the National Urban League of other institutions.
I said, but guess what, they're still here. I said,
Snick is not here. We could talk. I said, we
could talk about co and tail pro, we could talk
about all those things. I said, but the reality is
there's something to be said about black institutions that are

(01:40:57):
still here. I said, please focus on infrastructure. I said,
because you might burn out. The organization is still there.
I remember I was. I was having interviews and I
was talking to DLM leaders and I was like, I
don't understand y'all infrastructure, I said, I don't understand your hierarchy.

(01:41:17):
And folks were talking about, oh, no, we like to
have consensus. I was like, guys, I mean no disrespect.
Let's say, ladies and gents, that shit don't work. I said,
you have to have hierarchy. I said, Occupy Wall Street.
I was like, y'all all that, you know, I said,
I get the collaborative process, but you still got to
have hierarchy. And so I and I believe, I fundably

(01:41:40):
believe that one of the reasons why that that movement,
not just the organization, but the movement just fractured is
because folks were not thinking, if we're going to build something,
it needs to last more than five years, or more
than ten years, or needs to last beyond this really

(01:42:03):
inspirational individual And I think the struggle we're in right now,
it's five years after George Floyd's death, multiple years after
Michael Brown, Eric Garner, whatever, that that that movement is
so fractured and now you go, okay, well where are folks. Well,
people are doing individual things, But the power of that

(01:42:26):
movement was that it operated eventually as a collective. And
I just think that this is where this still is.
It is a problem. And then you had people who
were like, well, man, that that voting shit don't matter.
And I'm sitting there going, you cannot do this. It
was a young brother, and never forget he goes man

(01:42:49):
at politics don't mean shit, you know. So I'm going march,
And I said, marching without voting is going for a walk,
go hand in hand. You can't change policy if you
don't change the politicians and as voting, and that's where
that infrastructure comes in. And I just think that is

(01:43:10):
the that that still is what just ooh it irks
me because a lot of folks just didn't understand the
infrastructure was needed to sustain the movement.

Speaker 9 (01:43:23):
Look, I take your critique, I really do. I agree
with you on a lot of what you've just said.

Speaker 3 (01:43:31):
I think that there is a way that we sometimes
can can fall into a.

Speaker 9 (01:43:38):
Trap of like this is the only way of doing
something when we should be using all the resources.

Speaker 3 (01:43:44):
Available to us.

Speaker 9 (01:43:45):
And I you know, and I look at the right
and how much they focused on jerrymanderin voting districts and
trying to make sure that.

Speaker 3 (01:43:53):
Votes don't count. It tells me that there's there is
there's something strategic about engaging in that.

Speaker 9 (01:44:02):
But I also, you know the other thing that I
want to say about that period, because you know, I
was around in all of that organizing as well. Since
twenty thirteen twenty fourteen, I do think that there were
folks who knew that we needed to have an infrastructure.
But I am curious about what we're going to learn
about infiltration and attempts at agitating the movement in the

(01:44:27):
decades to come, because the other thing we know from
history is that when we do have these moments, the
people who are most threatened by those moments will often
send folks in to try to destroy our movements.

Speaker 3 (01:44:42):
Surreptitiously hatred on the streets.

Speaker 15 (01:45:02):
A horrific scene white nationalists rally that descended into deadly violence.

Speaker 1 (01:45:09):
We white people are moving.

Speaker 9 (01:45:11):
Their their.

Speaker 4 (01:45:13):
As anagrad proach from mob storm to the US Capital show.

Speaker 1 (01:45:18):
We're about to see the lies where I call white
minority resistance. We have seen white folks in this country
who simply cannot tolerate black folks voting.

Speaker 9 (01:45:27):
I think what we're seeing is the inevitable result of
violent denial.

Speaker 13 (01:45:32):
This is part of American history.

Speaker 1 (01:45:34):
Every time that people of color have in progress, whether
real or.

Speaker 6 (01:45:38):
Symbolic, there has been.

Speaker 1 (01:45:39):
But Carold Anderson at every university calls white rage as
a backlash. This is the wife of the Proud Boys
and the Boogaaloo Boys. America. There's going to be more
of this proud.

Speaker 3 (01:45:50):
This country is getting increasingly racist in its behaviors and
its attitudes because of the fear of white people.

Speaker 5 (01:45:58):
The food that they're taking, our job, they're taking out
with resources, they're.

Speaker 1 (01:46:02):
Taking out women. This is white fields. I keep going

(01:46:33):
back to April third, nineteen sixty eight doctor King's final
sermon at Mason Temple when he says in the sermon
black people, individually we are poor, but collectively we are wealthy.
We represent one of the largest economies in the world.
And he says we have to move as a collective.

(01:46:54):
And then as a result of that, you take that
concept and then say, Okay, in order to have a movement,
it can't be a singular person, it can't be a
singular organization. It has to be it has to be
a collected And so when I look at when we
talk about still how do we change policing, everything everything

(01:47:15):
was so I remember having a conversation with somebody and
they were talking about it was like an Aha moment
when for years it was massive incarceration, mass incarceration, and
everything was about going to DC and then finally somebody
was like, the person who changes it is really is
the district attorney, not Congress, not the Supreme Court, not

(01:47:36):
the President, not judges, not governors. That legislat towards the
person who is at the beginning stages of mass incarceration
is the district attorney. And that person determines whether what
kind of crowns you prosecute. And people then begin to realize,
and then you begin to see these progressive das elected
because folks are like, yo, that's it right there. But

(01:48:00):
that also again was collective. That was the organization and mobilization.
And when you talk about again black lives, policing and
safety for all, I just fundamentally believe that the only
way this can be achieved is if folk begin to say,
we have to mobilize and organize our power. Elect the people.

(01:48:22):
Even if they don't use the phrase defund the police,
but their policies are how do we now shift resources?
But that cannot be done if we keep our asses
on the couch. It just it's not going to happen.

Speaker 9 (01:48:38):
No, you are so right, Like I think you know
that that piece that you just identify with the das
and the Progressive.

Speaker 3 (01:48:46):
Das, it's like, yes, like that is that is a
piece of the pie that needed to be focused on peace.

Speaker 9 (01:48:53):
And also a piece of the pie is like what
we call a crime, Like there are some behaviors that
are that shouldn't be and where do we focus there?
You know, that's who's making who's making the decisions about
what's a crime. And sometimes that's at a federal level,
and sometimes that's at a state level. You know, like
we need to focus there as well, and we need

(01:49:13):
to get our communities informed and mobilized on that stuff.
So that's the Okay, let's try to see if we
can get people marching in the streets, or let's try
to see if we can, you know, get books like
this out into the community so people can read and
find out more information about it. You know, we have
to be engaged on so many different levels, and sometimes

(01:49:36):
I do you know, I take your critique. There's there's
a way that we can get too focused on one
way of.

Speaker 3 (01:49:42):
Doing things when we really just got to be everywhere.
That's where successes.

Speaker 1 (01:49:46):
See, I don't see, I don't I don't mind collective,
I don't mind collective conversations. I don't mind being collaborative.
But at the end of the day, and this is
where again this is this was the beauty of the key.
The thing was, you still have to have somebody who
I mean. One of the things that he would do
is he would sit there and he would the NAACP

(01:50:08):
was to have their say, and Core would have their say,
and Snick would have their say, and the National Congress
and Council Negro women have their say. And the beauty
of him was listening to all different people, affirming all
different people, and then say this is how we got
to go. And I think what happens in a lot
of times we get stuck on the conversation piece, but

(01:50:30):
it's still like, okay, when were about to go? And
so I think that when I when I look at this,
I still go back to, okay, how do we do it?
How do where do we start? How do we do it?
And when I hear the people go, oh man, you
a shield for the Democrats, I'm very simple, I'm like, no,
I'm focused on black people. The reality is this will

(01:50:52):
never happen through a Republican party. Fact it is not.
I don't give a damn, but anybody you can see
it in time, it's not gonna happen. Somebody could say
it's too many soft Democrats. There's too many Democrats who
buckle when they get when they get criticized with pressure.
But the reality is through a political prism, there's only

(01:51:16):
one party where this is going to be done through,
which now means that what has to happen is again
we have to be electing people who we believe can
actually make this happen. And I just think that from
an activist standpoint, there were a lot of people who
were boohooing voting and say it doesn't matter and we

(01:51:37):
just have to organize our people. I'm like, yeah, but
if you leave out the voting aspect, you can't change policy.
I just I just don't understand how some people think
it's gonna happen without that that happening, Like, I just don't.
I just I just like it has to happen. And

(01:51:57):
so that's that to me, is just just where we
are from an activist standpoint, Where are we today in
terms of because you talk about people being scared, where
are we Where is that energy? Where's that? Where is
it happening? I know things happen locally, but are you

(01:52:19):
seeing folks saying, you know, we've got to now rise
back up, are you seeing that actually happening?

Speaker 9 (01:52:27):
I mean, look at this weekend right like this, this
last weekend that just passed by, where there.

Speaker 1 (01:52:32):
Were actions indivisible, indivisible.

Speaker 3 (01:52:36):
Yes, that's right.

Speaker 9 (01:52:37):
You know, so I think that people are again, people
are are terrified and they're kind of on their back foot,
but the.

Speaker 3 (01:52:46):
Actions are I think inevitable.

Speaker 9 (01:52:49):
Now how organized those actions are going to be is
up to us activists to make that happen.

Speaker 3 (01:52:54):
Now, I think when it comes to to.

Speaker 1 (01:52:58):
Hold on, hold on, I don't want to run past that.
So what you just said was the inde visible marches
on that Saturday. That's called mobilization, that's right. What happens
Monday after the mobilization is organization, that's right. So people
who don't language, people who don't understand that, just explain that.

Speaker 9 (01:53:23):
So you know, when we get into the streets and
we are making fervor righteously about an issue that is
mobilizing people, getting people out into the street and demonstrating
that people are angry and people want to do something
about it, what we need to take do with all
of that energy is move it into organizing, and that

(01:53:45):
is setting ourselves up appropriately to respond and to organize
and out organize the right on all of the things
that they're doing, and that would be things like placing
people to focus on on the law, Placing people to
focus on electoral placing people to focus on creating programs

(01:54:07):
within communities where they don't exist and where the government
is failing us, Placing.

Speaker 3 (01:54:11):
People in.

Speaker 9 (01:54:14):
Education in all of the different in religious institutions and
all the different institutions that can have an impact on
what these services, what we're calling for, how we can
shift and change them.

Speaker 3 (01:54:29):
And again, we need to be everywhere.

Speaker 9 (01:54:32):
And I think, you know, you mentioned that period in
twenty twenty one twenty twenty two when Black Lives Matter
activists were really being focused on and targeted.

Speaker 3 (01:54:44):
I think that that really terrified people.

Speaker 19 (01:54:47):
I do.

Speaker 9 (01:54:48):
I think that, you know, especially because there was very
little support for the individuals who were being targeted in particular.

Speaker 3 (01:54:54):
You know, it's very hard. I think part of the
strategy from right wing media in that regard was to
try to.

Speaker 9 (01:55:02):
Make it so that it's difficult for people to take
up that mantle because they don't want to be targeted.
And I think we're going through a period right now
where people are gonna have to look at themselves and ask,
you know, am I going to make that right wing
campaign successful that fearfulness or am.

Speaker 3 (01:55:23):
I going to say no?

Speaker 9 (01:55:24):
It's worth it for us to figure out to organize
the support that we need for people to be able
to take those steps.

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Speaker 1 (01:57:21):
I'm gonna say this here, and it was it was
very interesting. I remember so. I'm not gonna name the organization,
but I remember there was a group. They released this
plan and they gave it to the New York Times first.

Speaker 9 (01:57:37):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (01:57:38):
And at the time, I had my show on TV one,
and then I was on the Times on the morning show,
and I called and I cussed them out and they
were like, damn and bro. While you going off, I said,
because here's my problem. You have a plan of action.

Speaker 3 (01:57:55):
I remember this.

Speaker 1 (01:57:57):
I was hot, I was pissed. I said, you have
a plan of action that you gave to the New
York Times first, and you ain't come talk to black
people first. I said, don't give it to the New
York Times and then you don't then you don't come
to us, and then when you don't get the reaction

(01:58:17):
that you want, then you call us. I said, no,
you need black people first. I said, bring that to us.
The late George Curry used to he was highly critical
of the National Urban League for a very long time
because whenever they were released their State of Black America report,
they would give the embargoed copy to the Associated Press,
and they wanted Associated Press to run it, and then

(01:58:39):
it goes all across the across the country and Georgia's like,
why the hell you're not giving it to the black newspapers.
And that's also I think. So when you're talking about
how do you have that protection of organization and leaders,
what I keep saying is you you have to lock
down your base for you have to have your relationships

(01:59:01):
with black owned media, black radio, newspapers, digital operations. So
when the attack comes there, and it's going to come
in mainstream, you already have your relationships over here to
respond to the attack. There were a lot of folks
who ignored us in black owned media, and then when

(01:59:22):
they start getting a tech then.

Speaker 9 (01:59:23):
They call We were like, but what y'all being see
that's the lesson of organization and strategy, truly, truly, and
it's you know, I do think that some people do
confuse them mobilization in an organization and think it's the
same thing, and it's not. And you really have to
do both in order to have success when you are
pushing against a system that is it is, it is

(01:59:47):
designed to be difficult to change.

Speaker 3 (01:59:50):
You have to have all your ducks in a row.
It's not easy.

Speaker 9 (01:59:53):
It requires a lot of talent and skill and people.
And you know, again these critiques are well taken.

Speaker 1 (02:00:02):
Two questions, two questions left? Do you believe when you
when you okay, we were just talking about organized and mobilizing,
So in order to do this, do you believe that
One of the problems, one of the problems with the
new organizations that were created is that they were leader

(02:00:25):
driven organizations that had no membership. And what I mean
by that is, like I'm right now thinking of several
that they are organizations, but they have four or five
or six leaders, but there's no way to become a member,
which means your generals don't have truths. So you're there.

(02:00:50):
So there. So if you're a person who says I
want to get involved, where do I join? So you're
in that space. There's somebody who's watching and listening and
they say, you know what, I love what Sandy has
to say. I want to join one of these organizations.
Who has meant? Who? Who can you join?

Speaker 9 (02:01:13):
I think it depends. I think it depends on the
type of organization and what if they're giving me a couple.

Speaker 1 (02:01:19):
Like who can like who can somebody right now and say,
you know what, I can act actually join the organization?
Not sure if anything, but joined the organization. Just give
me a couple so people know who I can who
can hit up?

Speaker 9 (02:01:31):
Well, there's a lot of local organizations, and I don't
want to speak for for the different organizations like but
I but what I mean by it depends is again
this this thing that I was talking about before with
respect to infiltration and agitation. Right, So, if you were
doing something that may be on the more radical UH
and direct action type of mobilization, which I think is

(02:01:54):
really important, UH, it might not be the best idea
to have it open to membership at where anyone can join,
because that can be manipulated. But if what you were
doing is trying to shift you know, how a DA
is acting in a particular jurisdiction, I think it makes

(02:02:16):
sense to have members because you need to pull in
as many people as possible into that strategy. So again,
it depends on the mandate what the strategy is. Uh,
and so often people think that there's only one way
to do things, you know, and I think it is
just so critical for us to remember that there.

Speaker 3 (02:02:38):
Our strategy has to fit the goal. Our strategy has
to fit the mandate, and so do so to do
our institutions and how we're designing them.

Speaker 1 (02:02:48):
So absolutely, because I do believe micro macro. So we
have the EUM local organizations.

Speaker 3 (02:02:55):
That's right?

Speaker 1 (02:02:57):
Is there is there a national entity? And I'm thinking
of how SNICK was operated that sort of serves as
an umbrella that is able to bring these folks together
to be able to meet to understand, well, if y'all
are in Charlotte and you're l Paso, and you're in
Los Angeles and you're in Miami and you're in Mobile,

(02:03:21):
to be able to learn from each other, collaborate. Listen,
John fart, So, is do you believe that that's a
missing piece because what you're laying out here is a
local strategy, but it's also a national plan.

Speaker 3 (02:03:35):
Yes, that's right.

Speaker 1 (02:03:37):
How then do those how do those collection of local
people gather and talk. Is there an entity that's focused
on that pulling those disparate local groups together?

Speaker 9 (02:03:49):
And Okay, I think that this is also very very
important because I think engaging with each other in person too,
not just over the internet, is like a big missing
piece as well.

Speaker 3 (02:04:00):
I think that different organizations have tried that.

Speaker 9 (02:04:03):
Certainly the Black Lives Matter, the Movement for Black Lives
or two that have had gatherings bringing people together from
all over America and beyond. In some cases, I don't
think that there's a group that's doing that consistently right now,
and I do think that that is a challenge for

(02:04:23):
us to try to engage in this moment, and I
think that that would be something that could only benefit
the organizing that we need to do to shift the
conditions that exist right now that make it really difficult
for us to organize effectively.

Speaker 1 (02:04:44):
The last question I asked this of all book authors,
that is, when writing the book, when researching the book,
when doing interviews for the book, what was your wow moment?
Was there something that you came across where even you went,
oh shit, this is crazy.

Speaker 3 (02:05:06):
I had a few moments with this book. But I'll
say the thing that I thought was the wildest was
all of these like reports that tend to happen after.

Speaker 9 (02:05:20):
An awful, heinous example of police violence. You know, the
governments will say, well, we need to study that. You know,
we got the NAF commission for example. Those go back
to like seventeen ninety five, and those reports read almost

(02:05:40):
exactly the same every time. Like the first one that
I think I recalled that was like maybe we need
more black police officers is like from eighteen ninety five,
and it's the same thing from seventeen ninety five to
today that it's being repeated, like we need to try
to change this, this and this.

Speaker 3 (02:05:56):
Like the first time I saw we need to have.

Speaker 9 (02:05:59):
Some sort of review board to review the police, it's
from the late seventeen hundreds. I mean, I was like, wow,
so this is even even the sort of response of
wow has been going on?

Speaker 1 (02:06:14):
Wow that that that is a wow. I didn't even
realize that that's crazy from the outsaid from that, from
the outset that were problems, there were problems.

Speaker 9 (02:06:27):
They're like these people are too violent and they're also corrupt.
You need to have somebody to review them.

Speaker 3 (02:06:34):
And it's been that way literally from the very beginning.

Speaker 1 (02:06:37):
Wow yeah, that is a yep. I think that would
be a wow yeah very well for a while. Well,
I am hopeful. I am hopeful that that not just
regular ordinary people, but activists really really look at this
because the issue is still there. It's still a typt

(02:06:58):
of front and and I am I'm constantly repeating myself
on the show when I talk about organizing, immobilizing, uh,
but also data collection, because you got to be able
to reach people like I can't stand people like I
don't know. I know when I looked at their website,
I know Indivisible they had email in zip code. But

(02:07:21):
I think one of the greatest mistakes that we often
make is that we have events, we have protests, we
have marches, we don't do data collection.

Speaker 3 (02:07:31):
You need to know who those people are.

Speaker 1 (02:07:33):
So boom because see what I keep and and it's
so funny. I had this big, big argument because this
person was like, rolling, You're you're not an organizer, you
you know, you're a journalist. And I'm like, I said,
my parents were co founders of a civic club. I
said so at the age of nine and ten, I said,

(02:07:55):
I said, I was there when they had the meetings.
I said. I was like, hell, he was sitting right there, said,
so I was listing. I remember traveling with my mom
to rallies in the state capitol and I'm sitting here
watching this, and what I saw was exactly that I'm
sitting there. Because you can have a march or a protest,
but then when you need people to show up to

(02:08:15):
the city council, police committee, and I covered city council.
I covered those events, and you know what happened. There's
no one there the committee and then we go to
the city council and what I covered city council, county
government and what I did, but I discovered it all
my entire career. We typically will come out after an

(02:08:38):
event that's happened. And my deal is you need to
you need to be able to press the button and say, hey,
city council having this discussion, I need fifty people to
show up. You already have a list to work from,
so you never recorded who the hell showed up. You
ain't got nobody to call when you need them to
show up tonight. So you're trying to mobilize again. Yeah,

(02:09:01):
here's a list. So That's one thing just dropped me crazy.
So so I'm hopeful that Yeah, I just I can't
even tell you. You cannot imagine how it irks me,
Like you literally have no idea because I've been on
calls and I'll be at an event and I'm going,

(02:09:21):
ain't nobody collecting data. I'm like, it's four hundred people
here and y'all ain't even know who the hell here.
Y'all ain't got no names, phone numbers, social media, you
ain't got sales. And then it get mad at me
and I'm like, Okay, nice event, but what you're gonna
do on Monday and go again? I'm like, okay, fine,
all right, I'm sorry. So I'm gonna keep saying it.

(02:09:43):
And that was the one thing I will I will
always give them credit to me Ka Mallory, bob Land,
Carmen Perez, uh, Janey Ingram, and Linda Saussword when they
when they were the leaders of the Women's March, how
they collected data millions around the world, they collected data,

(02:10:07):
and now people came after them. The largest the white
women scootered all up. And that's why Women's marchin shit.
And they ain't gonna be shipped because they ran the black,
Latino Muslim white organizers away who understood it. But how
they did that was brilliant, Reverend bish William Barber. Same
way they collect data at every event so they can

(02:10:32):
organize them later.

Speaker 3 (02:10:34):
Yeah, this is this is like a school for your
for your audience.

Speaker 18 (02:10:38):
This is how you do it.

Speaker 3 (02:10:39):
If you're considering doing it in your local area, you
know the things you need to do to.

Speaker 9 (02:10:44):
Keep it, to keep it up for the next time
that you need to mobilize people. You need to organize,
and part of that organizing is collection of contact information
and data.

Speaker 1 (02:10:55):
Absolutely. The book is Defund Black Lives, Policing and Safety
for All by Sandy Hudson. Sandy appreciate it. A great
conversation and hopefully people will read it and we'll understand
that a lot happened after May twenty fifth, twenty twenty
and before uh and but there's more that can still

(02:11:17):
be done and all hope is not lost.

Speaker 3 (02:11:20):
Thank you so much. It's great. Thank you for having me.

Speaker 1 (02:11:23):
Thank you Black Start Networks a real revolution there right now.

Speaker 3 (02:11:39):
I thank you for being the voice of black apparance
nomalment that we have. Now we have to keep this going.

Speaker 8 (02:11:45):
The video of phenomenal is between Black Star Network and
Black owned media and something like seeing.

Speaker 1 (02:11:52):
In you can't be black owned media and be scaped.
It's time to be smart, bring your eyeballs. It did

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