January 25, 2025 • 26 mins
In this special episode recorded at League One Volleyball’s First Serve celebration in Atlanta, women’s sports advocates Ari Chambers and Jenny Nguyen join Serving Pancakes senior producer Anya Alvarez to discuss the moment that women’s sports is having right now. Both Ari and Jenny have created spaces dedicated to platforming and growing women’s sports – Ari in the digital sphere as a host and analyst on ESPN and founder of HighlightHER, and Jenny physically as the cofounder and CEO of The Sports Bra, the country’s first sports bar dedicated to women’s sports. They’re contributing to the rising tide of women’s sports right now that includes new leagues, new investments and more women’s sports content hitting the mainstream than ever before. Women’s sports are becoming normalized.
Host: Tiffany Oshinsky
Senior Producer: Anya Alvarez
Executive Producers: Carrie Stett, Tamara Deike, and Lindsay Hoffman
Theme Music: Pancakes by Eric W. Mast, Jr.
Sound Designer: Daniel Gonzalez
Serving Pancakes is an iHeart Women's Sports Production, in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment. You can find us on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
I'm Anya Alvarez and welcome to Serving Pancakes. We're here
at Love's First Serve in Atlanta, and I have two
very special guests with me today. Ari Chambers, post and
analysts on ESPN and also the founder of Highlight Her,
one of the first and fastest growing social platforms one
percent dedicated to covering women's sports. And I'm also joined
(00:24):
by Jenny When, co founder and CEO of the Sports Bra,
a bar dedicated to women's sports. Thank you guys for
being with me today and coming to Atlanta.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Oh my gosh, I'm totally stoked to be here.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
When I got the when I got the invite out,
I was just like, yes, and.
Speaker 4 (00:42):
And it's a party. I mean, hey, you know me
and I. You don't know this about us. The Atlanta
is our.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
City, so it is our city. We've had we have
some memories now we do.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
We have lots of movies.
Speaker 1 (00:52):
You two know each other, oh dearly.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
I mean, I feel like women's sports spaces is all
about this.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
It is.
Speaker 4 (00:59):
And I remember when you were founding your when you
when you're in the midst of founding and one thing
I love about you is you're so passionate about what
you do and you have the vision, but you also
have the execution. And just think of how rapidly it
has grown throughout like the past, what four or five years?
Has it been that long?
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Two and a half?
Speaker 4 (01:19):
Two and a half. That's crazy, and that's how like
that that's to say, like, look at it in two
and a half years. I'm thinking it's like five and
it's growing fast. Two and a half is nothing me.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
I know, I hear, I hear you.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
But the thing is is that, yes, great vision and
the execution part is a team effort, like from team
minus day one.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
I've had incredible support.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
From community, community members, other people who have a ton
more experience than me. But the thing is is women's
sports is a space where people want to see it thrive, absolutely,
and so they come and they join and you know,
nobody does it alone.
Speaker 4 (01:55):
It's a community.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
It is one thousand.
Speaker 1 (01:57):
Percent sorry with you. When you founded Highlight Her, I
feel like that was so much about community, was about
what you were building within Highlight Her and showing that
there was a fan base that wanted to support women's sports.
So tell me a little bit about when you first
(02:17):
founded that and what was the inspiration behind that.
Speaker 4 (02:20):
The entire point of highlight Her is to uplift and
empower women and girls in sport and culture, and so
that's the origin of it. I wanted a space where
we can not only be seen, but be safe as
we're being seen, so we can be empowered to be
great no matter.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
What level or sport we play or do.
Speaker 4 (02:41):
And so and I say we because when Highlighter first started,
it would feature everyday people along with the elite athletes.
It would feature youth as well as elderly. It was
a space for everybody. So when Geny made the sports Bra,
it's a space. It's a space for a community to
see each other, and I wanted that to be a
(03:01):
virtual space for people to see each other. It's all
about visibility, representation, and empowerment and even beyond that, being
able to like post embarrassing moments. I don't know if
you all remember the origins of Highlighter, but like it
wasn't just all the glory and the w's, but like
sometimes we got to post the losses, We got to
post the funny moments in between, because it's not all
like go, team Go. Sometimes sometimes like dang, you fail,
(03:24):
that's hilarious and you can just laugh at yourself, just
make it a lighter space.
Speaker 3 (03:28):
And not just that, but that authenticity, yeah, draws people in.
And it's like we're not perfect athletes, you know that
we hold up on pedestals, are not perfect. And when
we create, when you kind of break that barrier between
like the people and the athlete, there is a community
that builds from that, and there's an authenticity that people
buy into and then they follow more because they see
(03:51):
themselves in them versus like just a reflection of great
statistics or just a reflection of elite athleticism. So I
think that what you did with highlight her and the BRA,
like there's so much.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Of the BRA.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
I love that, Like the BRA. Cool kids call it
the BRA.
Speaker 4 (04:08):
I'm going to call it the BRA.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
Yeah, absolutely, cool kid. Yeah, But like that the alignment
is so there. And when you talk about safety, I
mean that's one of the main reasons I opened the
BRA too. It was just like, you know, I grew
up in Portland and those spaces sports bars just never
felt safe for people who look like me. So I
just I'm just thrilled to be here and like to
(04:31):
be a part of you know this inaugural game day, Like,
oh my gosh, so awesome.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
I want to add to it. Sorry really quick. It's
before highlighter. I didn't know how many different sports were
so underserved, and so like, as you're airing the different
sports on the BRA, as we're posting about different sports,
like people didn't know about collegiate bowling. They didn't know
about how you know, exciting volleyball could be. Like they
(04:56):
didn't know about the origin of lacrosse. Like there are
things that were missing with coverage, and there are things
that are missing with airtime and just being able to
consume the sports. So like, let it be a learning
process between consuming the social media or being able to
be at a bar that can show you an array
of games and moments in sports. And so it opens
up a possibility for people out there that didn't know
(05:19):
that it existed.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
For women in particular, well, I think there's also more
overlap in terms of your journeys and your stories because
you've received pushback in terms of wanting to start a
women's sports that is so understood you couldn't find investors
in the beginning, and now we see the immense growth
that women's sports has had over the last couple of years,
(05:42):
even I would just say the last two or three
years has really just seen an exponential growth, and now
people are like, oh, maybe there is something here, maybe
we should invest, Maybe there are fans.
Speaker 2 (05:54):
Oh yeah, so left the state.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
How did you both overcome the doubt that other people
had in what you knew needed to be covered.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
I mean, honestly, for me, I am very risk averse.
So I went into it wondering if it would work.
I wasn't sure, and you know, like when I thought
about the sports BRA, when I first had the idea,
I was like, let's see how it's worked in other places,
because I didn't know it was the first of its kind.
And so I got you know, I went and searched
(06:26):
for it and searched. I put in words in different orders,
and I was like, oh, this has not happened yet.
And then I started to think, why hasn't this happened yet?
And then it made me real nervous. But it got
to the point where I felt like I had to
give it a shot, and if I gave it a shot,
I would try everything that I could to make it successful.
And if it wasn't, I could at least say that
I gave it a shot and that somebody out there tried.
(06:49):
But to be honest, at the beginning, I wasn't sure
if it would work. And I think, you know, sometimes
as an entrepreneur, I feel like you have to kind
of fool yourself a little bit to just take that
next step to just you have to say to yourself, like,
I can do this, this, this is gonna work, just
to like get up in the morning and take that
next step.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
On the first eight months, you guys cleared over a
million dollars in revenue work. Yeah, it was insane.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
It was insane.
Speaker 3 (07:27):
I mean when we opened the doors, we opened to
three thousand people and the bar seats forty so.
Speaker 4 (07:32):
The lines were up a door, honey around the blot.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
It was.
Speaker 3 (07:35):
It was insane, and that was something that I didn't
see coming clearly. My first hire was eight employees because
I was like, we're having a small bar launch. You know,
it's going to take some time to build a clientele.
And our very first day off, I hired eight more
people and so I grossly underestimated all of that. But
I think that we were also coming out of a pandemic,
(07:55):
so there was a lot of factors, and then I
wasn't on social media very much, so I also so
got like a bunch of trolls and haters that came
out of the woodworks like hardcore, and I didn't know
how to deal with it because I've never dealt with
it before, so of course I had very thin skin.
I took it very personally, and there was one comment
I can't remember what it was, and I wrote it
out like three times and I erased it and then.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
I was like, you know what, I'm just going to
go for a walk.
Speaker 3 (08:18):
I went for a walk, came back and about sixteen people,
people I didn't know, strangers, had like come in and
defended the BRA And that's when I kind of realized,
you know what, for every one hater out there, there's
probably ten thousand people who think that this is important
and necessary, and that you know, for the times that
I don't have the words, the community will speak up.
Speaker 4 (08:41):
And you might not have had the words, but you
had the foresight to do it. And I think that's
what it it takes. It takes foresight. And then going
back to what you said with the why, I was like,
why can't these things happen, like, why does it not exist?
Why does it not exist? And in my case, Highlight
is not the first women's sports coverage. I think I
believe espnW was the first one dead to women's sports
shot out Carol Stiff. But so why don't people pour
(09:04):
more into it? And if I have the capacity to
dedicate concerted and intentional energy towards it, I know the
power that it can bring just by empowering people to
be open about their stories, empowering people to get on
a platform and share what hasn't been shared before, and
so just genuine curiosity, genuine intention and honestly genuine rebellion.
(09:29):
I'm the only child nobody's ever told me no, like
that's just not a thing for me, and just be
like honestly, truly and so period only children out here,
we out here. But no, it's just like, why don't
people want to talk about our friends? Why don't people
recognize the greatness that is women's sports in a scalable magnitude?
(09:50):
Why don't people want to have a return on investment
because it is there? And so asking these questions and
not being afraid to push back when people say they
can't do things. Why can't you and challenging that. It's
challenging the people in the room who say, oh, that's
not possible. Why is it not possible? We have all
this money, we have all these resources. Put several people
(10:10):
on this and anytime you are making change or disruptive,
and it takes people who aren't afraid to be disruptive
to really push the envelope. I had nothing to lose, right,
I started with nothing, So if I were to fail,
I would have rested on nothing. But I knew women's
sports was something the athletes knew. It was something Jenny knew,
it was something you knew, it was something on you.
(10:30):
And so that's something we owed it to ask the
powers that be.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Like why not now we're here to watch volleyball period night,
the best sport. I know a lot of people know
you for covering WNBA and women's college basketball, but at heart,
you are a volleyball.
Speaker 4 (10:47):
Let's be very clear, your girl war number seven. I
was a middle blocker. I'm not much of a hitter.
I'm not like a standing hitter, but like I was
a very great defensive front row girly and I coached
varsity volleyball for a while and I did club growing up,
Like I literally, it was volleyball and cheerleading for me.
In college, I decided to cheer. It's the same support
(11:10):
when you go to NC State. So like I am, literally,
volleyball is my core and I try to tell everybody
who will listen, and nobody cares. They're like, get back
in basketball. I'm fine, that's fine too. Whatever, we're both tall.
We're all tall. Not joking, but no, volleyball has my heart,
and I'm glad that the attention it's getting is showing that, Like,
it has a lot of people's hearts, and you can
(11:30):
love both, you can love it all, but I my
heart is with volleyball.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
What about you, I'm kind of opposite.
Speaker 3 (11:36):
My heart is with basketball. But shout out to Athletes Unlimited.
They invited me out to Arizona to watch my very
first pro volleyball matches and it was I lost my voice.
So in basketball, when I cheer, you cheer for like
a great pass, a great three pointer or whatever. In volleyball,
every single thing is amazing. A pass, a safe, a block.
(12:01):
There's not a single thing that happens on the volleyball
court that doesn't deserve like full throated cheering, and so
I had never witnessed that and the athleticism live. I mean,
we watch it all the time at the BRA, but
oh my god.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
Oh we had the NCLA Championship.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
It has been bonkers.
Speaker 3 (12:16):
And to see you know, we've been open, you know,
just almost three years.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
In April, swear it was five. I hear you.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
I mean I got grays like we've been open for
fifteen years, a decade, but like year over year, watching
the volleyball fandom that show up into the bar is magic.
And it is the power of you know, we're talking
about kind of a chicken and egg situation. How can
you create fandom if you don't give people access to
(12:46):
watch it? And so when the BRA opened, we started,
you know, we showed all the major stuff, but we
started to show things like bowling, We showed the national
cheerleading stuff, and when we promoted it, people showed up
in droves to watch it. And same with like random
things like pickleball or we did a CrossFit watch party,
and like just when people see it, they obviously they
(13:11):
feel like they can be it right or that the
possibility is out there. And so I mean, the more
volleyball we can see on TV, and we're an all
ages bar, so we welcome kids to come in and
watch these games because if we can normalize it for
these kids, they can be like, yeah, that could be
me and yeah. Just so access and fandom are just
(13:33):
like this continuous circle. But yeah, so my first foray
into witnessing pro volleyball was like game changer for me.
Speaker 1 (13:40):
I took my mom to the V and L Championships
in Texas this past year, and she had never watched
pro volleyball live and she was just so enamored by
these women and she was like, this is hardcore. Like immediately,
my mom is not sports person. I played golf growing up.
(14:02):
She went to my golf tournaments and that was her
extent exactly that was, and so her seeing how dynamic
it is and how athletic it is. And I remember
at certain points we were watching and you would see
these women jump and their knees were going above the
bottom of the net. Oh yeah, I mean they're jumping
(14:23):
up this high and she was like, I did not
know they could do that.
Speaker 4 (14:28):
I think volleyball is such a sport for somebody who's
new to sports because you get the excitement every single position,
every cycle time they gather, Like I still have ah
Kill Go Kill stuck in my head from like when
I used to play like it ignites a different energy
in you, and then you want to root for people
no matter which team it is. You want to see
how they're going to cover the you know, cover the block.
You want to see them diving on the floor to
(14:49):
save something. It just shows a different level of grit
in heart that you don't get in other sports.
Speaker 3 (14:54):
And there's so much joy in between points, like every
time they come together, Like there's not very many sports
where they every every point there's this like huddle.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
It's a very team oriented sport too. It's it's one
of I think one of the only sports that I
can really think of where you really see every person
on the court playing a role at any point of
the game. I agree, and I have to say that
we at Love have some of the best, if not
(15:25):
the best players in the world. We pretty much have.
I mean, listen, we've got Jordan Poulter, Kelsey Robinson, Jordan Larson,
Justin Wong, we you know, members of the US women's
national team, Olympic gold medalists. We have recently signed Lexi Rodriguez,
who is one of the best Leberos ever to play
(15:48):
the game from Nebraska, and it's just been really exciting
to see even in the last year, the last year alone,
how much fandom there is around the sport, and I'm
just really excited for people to continue to get that exposure.
(16:17):
Why do you think people are starting to pay more
attention outside of just having access. What do you think
is changing about people's attitudes around women's sports and why.
Speaker 4 (16:27):
I think that now that there's pro leagues for women
in the United States, you have a state side, front
row view of what your potential can be. So there
are more girls growing up thinking that they can be athletes,
knowing that they can be athletes, and they can stay
at home or close to home, and so it just
keeps them in sports longer. Also, sports are now cool,
(16:49):
so it's a really big brand boost for you to
stay in it. And so as when we were growing up,
it was kind of like, oh, she's sweaty, Like oh
my gosh, she's not going to be popular this whole thing.
But there's a different level of again visibility. I know
you wanted me to deviate from that, but there's a
different level of visibility that doesn't include the on court play.
It's like a, oh, I can have teammates and we
(17:11):
can be like showcased, and I can turn this into
a brand, and I can play in front of my
family into the pros. I can make money now, And
so all these questions make the next generation like know
that girls and women belong in sports. And I hate
to bring up the WNBA, but there's a generation now
who hasn't had to grow up without seeing women in
(17:32):
a professional space in the United States, and so they
don't know the alternative. They don't know that women weren't
supposed to be pro They're like, oh, this is normal.
So it's normalizing women in sports and normalizing the fact
that it can be a career. It's not just a
side hustle anymore. Or we're still obviously working towards the
sustainability of professional women athletes, but as a whole, the
(17:54):
progress is exponentially going and it's way better than when
we were growing up.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
Ditto.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
I mean echo everything that Ari just said, like one
hundred and I also want to like pay homage to
the business side of it period, Like people are seeing
Rois on the major games from tennis, basketball, soccer. I
mean those are kind of have been like the gateway
to like normalization of female athletes, and so I think
(18:21):
that there's also this explosion of what's the next frontier,
what's the next biggest thing? And I mean it is
just about time for volleyball to get their glory. I mean,
for however long, it's been the most popular sport for
girls in America for like one hundred years or something
crazy like it's massive, and then internationally it's even bigger.
(18:43):
And so why hasn't it gained the attention of these
other sports TBD? Who knows, But the time is now right,
And so I think that on the business side, people
are starting to look for what is the next thing.
We saw the PWHL launch last year and it's just
been lights out. We see unrivaled coming up, and just
(19:04):
marketing has been off the chain, so it's always like, Okay,
who's next, and the wl's coming. People are stoked about lacrosse,
which is also a very old sport. So I think
it's just folks like really propping it up. And what
we needed was kind of that gateway, and once those
floodgates kind of started to open boom and so you know,
(19:26):
the rising tide lifts all ships and that's what's happening.
So I think that there's a part of that too.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
The ships are left it. I mean, we saw Nebraska
Memorial Stadium have over ninety two thousand That was so
crazy go watch a woman's volleyball and that was one
of the coolest things that I had ever seen in
just terms of the atmosphere and the environment. And they
(19:50):
sold out within forty eight hours when tickets went on sale,
And I think that is just another like when those
moments happen, it reinfor forces. Hey, we're doing the right
thing in terms of continuing to invest in this space,
and I think it's very self gratifying. I guess for
me too, because I've been in the space for so
long of shouting from the rooftops invest in women's sports,
(20:14):
to be like, finally people are getting it and seeing
just how valuable this space is across the spectrum. And
I think the other thing too that I really love
about how things are changing in terms of the narrative
of how we're starting to flip things on its head
in the women's sports space. It's not just women's sports,
not just for little girls. To inspire little girls. It's
(20:36):
to inspire men, inspire young boys. It's to help really
change the overall perception. I think of how we view
women in society and the roles of what they're capable
of doing. And I think we're just really seeing the
tides turn in a way that I have been waiting for.
And it's just a really exciting moment for all of us.
Speaker 4 (20:57):
For sure, pushing the boundary in the brows was insane
to witness, and it wasn't like I hear dang moment.
Like they had a drone show to show that the
Nebraska broke the world record, and it was a world record.
People want to be there for history. This is not
only history, it's set the standard.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
Right.
Speaker 4 (21:15):
You see little girls, little boys, everything in between. Like
literally everybody was at that stadium enthused to watch volleyball,
and it just showed like I can be on the
stage too. I can be on the biggest stage playing
a sport I love. And again going back to what
we were saying about the Fairweather fan being enthused about volleyball,
you see that camaraderie and you're like, I want that
for myself.
Speaker 1 (21:36):
And going back a little bit towards the social media
side though, and these young women and athletes having the
opportunity to really take ownership of themselves in terms of
how they brand and market themselves to the public. What
would you like to see change in terms of how
social media is being used to continue to promote women's sports.
Speaker 4 (21:57):
I want to talk directly to the athletes when I
say this, don't be afraid to put yourself out there.
A lot of times I speak to people who aren't
in basketball and they are so afraid of like they
want to overstrategize it.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
Just be yourself.
Speaker 4 (22:11):
People are gonna fall in love with you. Just be yourself.
Don't be afraid to share your story, Don't be afraid
to post what you want to post. Don't be afraid
to show your day. People are interested in it. And
if we can just empower everybody to be present on
social media, you would be shocked how much money there
is to be made for these women athletes, how much
visibility it gives them, how much increased interest it will have.
(22:33):
And so I would say take the strategy away when
you're first starting out and just be present, be present
and know with all the bad that you anticipate, there's
going to be so much more good.
Speaker 1 (22:43):
There's so much more good. Are you getting a little
bit more social savvy now that you have?
Speaker 3 (22:48):
I had to, but kind of like already, like I
started with nothing right, And so when I first opened
the BRA, I started a social media platform, and then
I was super authentic with it. I was like, we
don't know what we're doing, and you know, whatever challenges
we had, we kind of used it as a joke
and also kind of a learning tool and like a
way to connect with the people who are following us
(23:09):
and j D and all the time.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
Yeah, I mean I was just like.
Speaker 3 (23:14):
And And one thing, when I run into people at
in the early stages, they were like, I love who's
doing your social media? I love how authentic and it
tells the story and like I feel like I know you.
And I was just like, that's it. It's because I
didn't have a strategy. It was kind of like I
don't know how to do this, so everyone's going to
come along with me for the ride. But one thing,
you know, I actually overheard one of the volleyball players
(23:34):
one time talking to a media social media strategist and
He was just like, if you think about it, you
have your original content that no one else has exactly
do you, and you'll have the only content of that exactly.
And he was just like, what are you interested? And
she was like, I love puppies and I want to volunteer.
And he was like, bring your phone with you. And
people would be like, oh my god, puppies and you know,
(23:57):
and then work with you know, a nonprofit or something,
and it all times together and that original content is you.
Speaker 4 (24:03):
And then the media, sorry, very quickly the media. If
you want to start your own brand, do it Like
I highlighter. We weren't on the market for two and
a half years, so I was DM and people like, hey,
this is all right behind this. Can you follow this patform?
And it's just the shamelessness of getting your following up
and being consistent and being humble enough to know that
you have to grow. You have to start from somewhere.
(24:25):
And I'm listening to your following what do they want
to see? Not say oh, I can't dedicate this to this,
because I think that this listen to people, listen to
what they want, and go where the.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
People are and stay authentic and stay authentic.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
Now you have to unfortunately wrap this, but I want
to het me.
Speaker 3 (24:42):
I'm we're just gonna talk in you guys have to
clean up around us.
Speaker 1 (24:48):
I want to know what's next for the two of you.
What's on the horizon.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
Oof.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
I mean, I feel like a lot of folks know this,
but the sports Bras franchising, we're going national period. So yeah,
it's a pros us. But we are full steam ahead.
Twenty twenty five is looking big for us, so I'm
really excited. Slash frightened, but that has been my mo
for about the last three years, so we're going to
(25:12):
keep doing that.
Speaker 1 (25:13):
It's great.
Speaker 4 (25:13):
Yeah, I'm gonna speak it into existence. I want analysts
work for volleyball and gymnastics and continue to do special
features in storytelling. I am walking on my purpose. So
there's nothing that I would say I would change outside
of adding volleyball analysis, but I want to continue to
storytell on women's sports.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
Well, I'm excited to continue watching everything that you both do,
and thank you for joining us. And I'll see you
at tonight's game.
Speaker 4 (25:36):
Yeah you will, hear me.
Speaker 1 (25:40):
I hope you are the loudest person I want to
I want to hear it all like I almost want
to ask for a sample now, but for the sake
of our audio person, I'm just gonna spare them.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
You'll see a lot of me. Okay, thank you, thank you,
thank you.
Speaker 5 (25:57):
Serving Pancakes is an iHeart women's sports for and partnership
with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment. You can find us
on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get
your podcasts. Production by League one Volleyball. I'm your host,
tiany O'shinsky. Annya Alvarez is our senior producer. Our executive
producers are Carrie Stett, Tamarondike, and Lindsay Hoffman.
Speaker 2 (26:20):
Our marketing lead.
Speaker 5 (26:21):
Is Jora Partner. Sound editing and mixing by Daniel Gonzalez.
Our theme music is Pancakes by Eric W. Mast Junior
special thanks to Sarah Franklin and Chiako Bago. Stay tuned
for another episode of Serving Pancakes next week.
Speaker 2 (26:36):
Thanks for listening.
I'm Anya Alvarez and welcome to Serving Pancakes. We're here
at Love's First Serve in Atlanta, and I have two
very special guests with me today. Ari Chambers, post and
analysts on ESPN and also the founder of Highlight Her,
one of the first and fastest growing social platforms one
percent dedicated to covering women's sports. And I'm also joined
(00:24):
by Jenny When, co founder and CEO of the Sports Bra,
a bar dedicated to women's sports. Thank you guys for
being with me today and coming to Atlanta.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Oh my gosh, I'm totally stoked to be here.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
When I got the when I got the invite out,
I was just like, yes, and.
Speaker 4 (00:42):
And it's a party. I mean, hey, you know me
and I. You don't know this about us. The Atlanta
is our.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
City, so it is our city. We've had we have
some memories now we do.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
We have lots of movies.
Speaker 1 (00:52):
You two know each other, oh dearly.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
I mean, I feel like women's sports spaces is all
about this.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
It is.
Speaker 4 (00:59):
And I remember when you were founding your when you
when you're in the midst of founding and one thing
I love about you is you're so passionate about what
you do and you have the vision, but you also
have the execution. And just think of how rapidly it
has grown throughout like the past, what four or five years?
Has it been that long?
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Two and a half?
Speaker 4 (01:19):
Two and a half. That's crazy, and that's how like
that that's to say, like, look at it in two
and a half years. I'm thinking it's like five and
it's growing fast. Two and a half is nothing me.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
I know, I hear, I hear you.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
But the thing is is that, yes, great vision and
the execution part is a team effort, like from team
minus day one.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
I've had incredible support.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
From community, community members, other people who have a ton
more experience than me. But the thing is is women's
sports is a space where people want to see it thrive, absolutely,
and so they come and they join and you know,
nobody does it alone.
Speaker 4 (01:55):
It's a community.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
It is one thousand.
Speaker 1 (01:57):
Percent sorry with you. When you founded Highlight Her, I
feel like that was so much about community, was about
what you were building within Highlight Her and showing that
there was a fan base that wanted to support women's sports.
So tell me a little bit about when you first
(02:17):
founded that and what was the inspiration behind that.
Speaker 4 (02:20):
The entire point of highlight Her is to uplift and
empower women and girls in sport and culture, and so
that's the origin of it. I wanted a space where
we can not only be seen, but be safe as
we're being seen, so we can be empowered to be
great no matter.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
What level or sport we play or do.
Speaker 4 (02:41):
And so and I say we because when Highlighter first started,
it would feature everyday people along with the elite athletes.
It would feature youth as well as elderly. It was
a space for everybody. So when Geny made the sports Bra,
it's a space. It's a space for a community to
see each other, and I wanted that to be a
(03:01):
virtual space for people to see each other. It's all
about visibility, representation, and empowerment and even beyond that, being
able to like post embarrassing moments. I don't know if
you all remember the origins of Highlighter, but like it
wasn't just all the glory and the w's, but like
sometimes we got to post the losses, We got to
post the funny moments in between, because it's not all
like go, team Go. Sometimes sometimes like dang, you fail,
(03:24):
that's hilarious and you can just laugh at yourself, just
make it a lighter space.
Speaker 3 (03:28):
And not just that, but that authenticity, yeah, draws people in.
And it's like we're not perfect athletes, you know that
we hold up on pedestals, are not perfect. And when
we create, when you kind of break that barrier between
like the people and the athlete, there is a community
that builds from that, and there's an authenticity that people
buy into and then they follow more because they see
(03:51):
themselves in them versus like just a reflection of great
statistics or just a reflection of elite athleticism. So I
think that what you did with highlight her and the BRA,
like there's so much.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Of the BRA.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
I love that, Like the BRA. Cool kids call it
the BRA.
Speaker 4 (04:08):
I'm going to call it the BRA.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
Yeah, absolutely, cool kid. Yeah, But like that the alignment
is so there. And when you talk about safety, I
mean that's one of the main reasons I opened the
BRA too. It was just like, you know, I grew
up in Portland and those spaces sports bars just never
felt safe for people who look like me. So I
just I'm just thrilled to be here and like to
(04:31):
be a part of you know this inaugural game day, Like,
oh my gosh, so awesome.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
I want to add to it. Sorry really quick. It's
before highlighter. I didn't know how many different sports were
so underserved, and so like, as you're airing the different
sports on the BRA, as we're posting about different sports,
like people didn't know about collegiate bowling. They didn't know
about how you know, exciting volleyball could be. Like they
(04:56):
didn't know about the origin of lacrosse. Like there are
things that were missing with coverage, and there are things
that are missing with airtime and just being able to
consume the sports. So like, let it be a learning
process between consuming the social media or being able to
be at a bar that can show you an array
of games and moments in sports. And so it opens
up a possibility for people out there that didn't know
(05:19):
that it existed.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
For women in particular, well, I think there's also more
overlap in terms of your journeys and your stories because
you've received pushback in terms of wanting to start a
women's sports that is so understood you couldn't find investors
in the beginning, and now we see the immense growth
that women's sports has had over the last couple of years,
(05:42):
even I would just say the last two or three
years has really just seen an exponential growth, and now
people are like, oh, maybe there is something here, maybe
we should invest, Maybe there are fans.
Speaker 2 (05:54):
Oh yeah, so left the state.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
How did you both overcome the doubt that other people
had in what you knew needed to be covered.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
I mean, honestly, for me, I am very risk averse.
So I went into it wondering if it would work.
I wasn't sure, and you know, like when I thought
about the sports BRA, when I first had the idea,
I was like, let's see how it's worked in other places,
because I didn't know it was the first of its kind.
And so I got you know, I went and searched
(06:26):
for it and searched. I put in words in different orders,
and I was like, oh, this has not happened yet.
And then I started to think, why hasn't this happened yet?
And then it made me real nervous. But it got
to the point where I felt like I had to
give it a shot, and if I gave it a shot,
I would try everything that I could to make it successful.
And if it wasn't, I could at least say that
I gave it a shot and that somebody out there tried.
(06:49):
But to be honest, at the beginning, I wasn't sure
if it would work. And I think, you know, sometimes
as an entrepreneur, I feel like you have to kind
of fool yourself a little bit to just take that
next step to just you have to say to yourself, like,
I can do this, this, this is gonna work, just
to like get up in the morning and take that
next step.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
On the first eight months, you guys cleared over a
million dollars in revenue work. Yeah, it was insane.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
It was insane.
Speaker 3 (07:27):
I mean when we opened the doors, we opened to
three thousand people and the bar seats forty so.
Speaker 4 (07:32):
The lines were up a door, honey around the blot.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
It was.
Speaker 3 (07:35):
It was insane, and that was something that I didn't
see coming clearly. My first hire was eight employees because
I was like, we're having a small bar launch. You know,
it's going to take some time to build a clientele.
And our very first day off, I hired eight more
people and so I grossly underestimated all of that. But
I think that we were also coming out of a pandemic,
(07:55):
so there was a lot of factors, and then I
wasn't on social media very much, so I also so
got like a bunch of trolls and haters that came
out of the woodworks like hardcore, and I didn't know
how to deal with it because I've never dealt with
it before, so of course I had very thin skin.
I took it very personally, and there was one comment
I can't remember what it was, and I wrote it
out like three times and I erased it and then.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
I was like, you know what, I'm just going to
go for a walk.
Speaker 3 (08:18):
I went for a walk, came back and about sixteen people,
people I didn't know, strangers, had like come in and
defended the BRA And that's when I kind of realized,
you know what, for every one hater out there, there's
probably ten thousand people who think that this is important
and necessary, and that you know, for the times that
I don't have the words, the community will speak up.
Speaker 4 (08:41):
And you might not have had the words, but you
had the foresight to do it. And I think that's
what it it takes. It takes foresight. And then going
back to what you said with the why, I was like,
why can't these things happen, like, why does it not exist?
Why does it not exist? And in my case, Highlight
is not the first women's sports coverage. I think I
believe espnW was the first one dead to women's sports
shot out Carol Stiff. But so why don't people pour
(09:04):
more into it? And if I have the capacity to
dedicate concerted and intentional energy towards it, I know the
power that it can bring just by empowering people to
be open about their stories, empowering people to get on
a platform and share what hasn't been shared before, and
so just genuine curiosity, genuine intention and honestly genuine rebellion.
(09:29):
I'm the only child nobody's ever told me no, like
that's just not a thing for me, and just be
like honestly, truly and so period only children out here,
we out here. But no, it's just like, why don't
people want to talk about our friends? Why don't people
recognize the greatness that is women's sports in a scalable magnitude?
(09:50):
Why don't people want to have a return on investment
because it is there? And so asking these questions and
not being afraid to push back when people say they
can't do things. Why can't you and challenging that. It's
challenging the people in the room who say, oh, that's
not possible. Why is it not possible? We have all
this money, we have all these resources. Put several people
(10:10):
on this and anytime you are making change or disruptive,
and it takes people who aren't afraid to be disruptive
to really push the envelope. I had nothing to lose, right,
I started with nothing, So if I were to fail,
I would have rested on nothing. But I knew women's
sports was something the athletes knew. It was something Jenny knew,
it was something you knew, it was something on you.
(10:30):
And so that's something we owed it to ask the
powers that be.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Like why not now we're here to watch volleyball period night,
the best sport. I know a lot of people know
you for covering WNBA and women's college basketball, but at heart,
you are a volleyball.
Speaker 4 (10:47):
Let's be very clear, your girl war number seven. I
was a middle blocker. I'm not much of a hitter.
I'm not like a standing hitter, but like I was
a very great defensive front row girly and I coached
varsity volleyball for a while and I did club growing up,
Like I literally, it was volleyball and cheerleading for me.
In college, I decided to cheer. It's the same support
(11:10):
when you go to NC State. So like I am, literally,
volleyball is my core and I try to tell everybody
who will listen, and nobody cares. They're like, get back
in basketball. I'm fine, that's fine too. Whatever, we're both tall.
We're all tall. Not joking, but no, volleyball has my heart,
and I'm glad that the attention it's getting is showing that, Like,
it has a lot of people's hearts, and you can
(11:30):
love both, you can love it all, but I my
heart is with volleyball.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
What about you, I'm kind of opposite.
Speaker 3 (11:36):
My heart is with basketball. But shout out to Athletes Unlimited.
They invited me out to Arizona to watch my very
first pro volleyball matches and it was I lost my voice.
So in basketball, when I cheer, you cheer for like
a great pass, a great three pointer or whatever. In volleyball,
every single thing is amazing. A pass, a safe, a block.
(12:01):
There's not a single thing that happens on the volleyball
court that doesn't deserve like full throated cheering, and so
I had never witnessed that and the athleticism live. I mean,
we watch it all the time at the BRA, but
oh my god.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
Oh we had the NCLA Championship.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
It has been bonkers.
Speaker 3 (12:16):
And to see you know, we've been open, you know,
just almost three years.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
In April, swear it was five. I hear you.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
I mean I got grays like we've been open for
fifteen years, a decade, but like year over year, watching
the volleyball fandom that show up into the bar is magic.
And it is the power of you know, we're talking
about kind of a chicken and egg situation. How can
you create fandom if you don't give people access to
(12:46):
watch it? And so when the BRA opened, we started,
you know, we showed all the major stuff, but we
started to show things like bowling, We showed the national
cheerleading stuff, and when we promoted it, people showed up
in droves to watch it. And same with like random
things like pickleball or we did a CrossFit watch party,
and like just when people see it, they obviously they
(13:11):
feel like they can be it right or that the
possibility is out there. And so I mean, the more
volleyball we can see on TV, and we're an all
ages bar, so we welcome kids to come in and
watch these games because if we can normalize it for
these kids, they can be like, yeah, that could be
me and yeah. Just so access and fandom are just
(13:33):
like this continuous circle. But yeah, so my first foray
into witnessing pro volleyball was like game changer for me.
Speaker 1 (13:40):
I took my mom to the V and L Championships
in Texas this past year, and she had never watched
pro volleyball live and she was just so enamored by
these women and she was like, this is hardcore. Like immediately,
my mom is not sports person. I played golf growing up.
(14:02):
She went to my golf tournaments and that was her
extent exactly that was, and so her seeing how dynamic
it is and how athletic it is. And I remember
at certain points we were watching and you would see
these women jump and their knees were going above the
bottom of the net. Oh yeah, I mean they're jumping
(14:23):
up this high and she was like, I did not
know they could do that.
Speaker 4 (14:28):
I think volleyball is such a sport for somebody who's
new to sports because you get the excitement every single position,
every cycle time they gather, Like I still have ah
Kill Go Kill stuck in my head from like when
I used to play like it ignites a different energy
in you, and then you want to root for people
no matter which team it is. You want to see
how they're going to cover the you know, cover the block.
You want to see them diving on the floor to
(14:49):
save something. It just shows a different level of grit
in heart that you don't get in other sports.
Speaker 3 (14:54):
And there's so much joy in between points, like every
time they come together, Like there's not very many sports
where they every every point there's this like huddle.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
It's a very team oriented sport too. It's it's one
of I think one of the only sports that I
can really think of where you really see every person
on the court playing a role at any point of
the game. I agree, and I have to say that
we at Love have some of the best, if not
(15:25):
the best players in the world. We pretty much have.
I mean, listen, we've got Jordan Poulter, Kelsey Robinson, Jordan Larson,
Justin Wong, we you know, members of the US women's
national team, Olympic gold medalists. We have recently signed Lexi Rodriguez,
who is one of the best Leberos ever to play
(15:48):
the game from Nebraska, and it's just been really exciting
to see even in the last year, the last year alone,
how much fandom there is around the sport, and I'm
just really excited for people to continue to get that exposure.
(16:17):
Why do you think people are starting to pay more
attention outside of just having access. What do you think
is changing about people's attitudes around women's sports and why.
Speaker 4 (16:27):
I think that now that there's pro leagues for women
in the United States, you have a state side, front
row view of what your potential can be. So there
are more girls growing up thinking that they can be athletes,
knowing that they can be athletes, and they can stay
at home or close to home, and so it just
keeps them in sports longer. Also, sports are now cool,
(16:49):
so it's a really big brand boost for you to
stay in it. And so as when we were growing up,
it was kind of like, oh, she's sweaty, Like oh
my gosh, she's not going to be popular this whole thing.
But there's a different level of again visibility. I know
you wanted me to deviate from that, but there's a
different level of visibility that doesn't include the on court play.
It's like a, oh, I can have teammates and we
(17:11):
can be like showcased, and I can turn this into
a brand, and I can play in front of my
family into the pros. I can make money now, And
so all these questions make the next generation like know
that girls and women belong in sports. And I hate
to bring up the WNBA, but there's a generation now
who hasn't had to grow up without seeing women in
(17:32):
a professional space in the United States, and so they
don't know the alternative. They don't know that women weren't
supposed to be pro They're like, oh, this is normal.
So it's normalizing women in sports and normalizing the fact
that it can be a career. It's not just a
side hustle anymore. Or we're still obviously working towards the
sustainability of professional women athletes, but as a whole, the
(17:54):
progress is exponentially going and it's way better than when
we were growing up.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
Ditto.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
I mean echo everything that Ari just said, like one
hundred and I also want to like pay homage to
the business side of it period, Like people are seeing
Rois on the major games from tennis, basketball, soccer. I
mean those are kind of have been like the gateway
to like normalization of female athletes, and so I think
(18:21):
that there's also this explosion of what's the next frontier,
what's the next biggest thing? And I mean it is
just about time for volleyball to get their glory. I mean,
for however long, it's been the most popular sport for
girls in America for like one hundred years or something
crazy like it's massive, and then internationally it's even bigger.
(18:43):
And so why hasn't it gained the attention of these
other sports TBD? Who knows, But the time is now right,
And so I think that on the business side, people
are starting to look for what is the next thing.
We saw the PWHL launch last year and it's just
been lights out. We see unrivaled coming up, and just
(19:04):
marketing has been off the chain, so it's always like, Okay,
who's next, and the wl's coming. People are stoked about lacrosse,
which is also a very old sport. So I think
it's just folks like really propping it up. And what
we needed was kind of that gateway, and once those
floodgates kind of started to open boom and so you know,
(19:26):
the rising tide lifts all ships and that's what's happening.
So I think that there's a part of that too.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
The ships are left it. I mean, we saw Nebraska
Memorial Stadium have over ninety two thousand That was so
crazy go watch a woman's volleyball and that was one
of the coolest things that I had ever seen in
just terms of the atmosphere and the environment. And they
(19:50):
sold out within forty eight hours when tickets went on sale,
And I think that is just another like when those
moments happen, it reinfor forces. Hey, we're doing the right
thing in terms of continuing to invest in this space,
and I think it's very self gratifying. I guess for
me too, because I've been in the space for so
long of shouting from the rooftops invest in women's sports,
(20:14):
to be like, finally people are getting it and seeing
just how valuable this space is across the spectrum. And
I think the other thing too that I really love
about how things are changing in terms of the narrative
of how we're starting to flip things on its head
in the women's sports space. It's not just women's sports,
not just for little girls. To inspire little girls. It's
(20:36):
to inspire men, inspire young boys. It's to help really
change the overall perception. I think of how we view
women in society and the roles of what they're capable
of doing. And I think we're just really seeing the
tides turn in a way that I have been waiting for.
And it's just a really exciting moment for all of us.
Speaker 4 (20:57):
For sure, pushing the boundary in the brows was insane
to witness, and it wasn't like I hear dang moment.
Like they had a drone show to show that the
Nebraska broke the world record, and it was a world record.
People want to be there for history. This is not
only history, it's set the standard.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
Right.
Speaker 4 (21:15):
You see little girls, little boys, everything in between. Like
literally everybody was at that stadium enthused to watch volleyball,
and it just showed like I can be on the
stage too. I can be on the biggest stage playing
a sport I love. And again going back to what
we were saying about the Fairweather fan being enthused about volleyball,
you see that camaraderie and you're like, I want that
for myself.
Speaker 1 (21:36):
And going back a little bit towards the social media
side though, and these young women and athletes having the
opportunity to really take ownership of themselves in terms of
how they brand and market themselves to the public. What
would you like to see change in terms of how
social media is being used to continue to promote women's sports.
Speaker 4 (21:57):
I want to talk directly to the athletes when I
say this, don't be afraid to put yourself out there.
A lot of times I speak to people who aren't
in basketball and they are so afraid of like they
want to overstrategize it.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
Just be yourself.
Speaker 4 (22:11):
People are gonna fall in love with you. Just be yourself.
Don't be afraid to share your story, Don't be afraid
to post what you want to post. Don't be afraid
to show your day. People are interested in it. And
if we can just empower everybody to be present on
social media, you would be shocked how much money there
is to be made for these women athletes, how much
visibility it gives them, how much increased interest it will have.
(22:33):
And so I would say take the strategy away when
you're first starting out and just be present, be present
and know with all the bad that you anticipate, there's
going to be so much more good.
Speaker 1 (22:43):
There's so much more good. Are you getting a little
bit more social savvy now that you have?
Speaker 3 (22:48):
I had to, but kind of like already, like I
started with nothing right, And so when I first opened
the BRA, I started a social media platform, and then
I was super authentic with it. I was like, we
don't know what we're doing, and you know, whatever challenges
we had, we kind of used it as a joke
and also kind of a learning tool and like a
way to connect with the people who are following us
(23:09):
and j D and all the time.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
Yeah, I mean I was just like.
Speaker 3 (23:14):
And And one thing, when I run into people at
in the early stages, they were like, I love who's
doing your social media? I love how authentic and it
tells the story and like I feel like I know you.
And I was just like, that's it. It's because I
didn't have a strategy. It was kind of like I
don't know how to do this, so everyone's going to
come along with me for the ride. But one thing,
you know, I actually overheard one of the volleyball players
(23:34):
one time talking to a media social media strategist and
He was just like, if you think about it, you
have your original content that no one else has exactly
do you, and you'll have the only content of that exactly.
And he was just like, what are you interested? And
she was like, I love puppies and I want to volunteer.
And he was like, bring your phone with you. And
people would be like, oh my god, puppies and you know,
(23:57):
and then work with you know, a nonprofit or something,
and it all times together and that original content is you.
Speaker 4 (24:03):
And then the media, sorry, very quickly the media. If
you want to start your own brand, do it Like
I highlighter. We weren't on the market for two and
a half years, so I was DM and people like, hey,
this is all right behind this. Can you follow this patform?
And it's just the shamelessness of getting your following up
and being consistent and being humble enough to know that
you have to grow. You have to start from somewhere.
(24:25):
And I'm listening to your following what do they want
to see? Not say oh, I can't dedicate this to this,
because I think that this listen to people, listen to
what they want, and go where the.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
People are and stay authentic and stay authentic.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
Now you have to unfortunately wrap this, but I want
to het me.
Speaker 3 (24:42):
I'm we're just gonna talk in you guys have to
clean up around us.
Speaker 1 (24:48):
I want to know what's next for the two of you.
What's on the horizon.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
Oof.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
I mean, I feel like a lot of folks know this,
but the sports Bras franchising, we're going national period. So yeah,
it's a pros us. But we are full steam ahead.
Twenty twenty five is looking big for us, so I'm
really excited. Slash frightened, but that has been my mo
for about the last three years, so we're going to
(25:12):
keep doing that.
Speaker 1 (25:13):
It's great.
Speaker 4 (25:13):
Yeah, I'm gonna speak it into existence. I want analysts
work for volleyball and gymnastics and continue to do special
features in storytelling. I am walking on my purpose. So
there's nothing that I would say I would change outside
of adding volleyball analysis, but I want to continue to
storytell on women's sports.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
Well, I'm excited to continue watching everything that you both do,
and thank you for joining us. And I'll see you
at tonight's game.
Speaker 4 (25:36):
Yeah you will, hear me.
Speaker 1 (25:40):
I hope you are the loudest person I want to
I want to hear it all like I almost want
to ask for a sample now, but for the sake
of our audio person, I'm just gonna spare them.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
You'll see a lot of me. Okay, thank you, thank you,
thank you.
Speaker 5 (25:57):
Serving Pancakes is an iHeart women's sports for and partnership
with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment. You can find us
on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get
your podcasts. Production by League one Volleyball. I'm your host,
tiany O'shinsky. Annya Alvarez is our senior producer. Our executive
producers are Carrie Stett, Tamarondike, and Lindsay Hoffman.
Speaker 2 (26:20):
Our marketing lead.
Speaker 5 (26:21):
Is Jora Partner. Sound editing and mixing by Daniel Gonzalez.
Our theme music is Pancakes by Eric W. Mast Junior
special thanks to Sarah Franklin and Chiako Bago. Stay tuned
for another episode of Serving Pancakes next week.
Speaker 2 (26:36):
Thanks for listening.
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