October 23, 2023 • 38 mins
Got room for more tea? Because it's piping hot and overflowing!
Tom Bergeron is back and not holding back. He gets into the firing . . . really gets into it! Cheryl gets the who, what, when, where, and why! Including what really ticked him off, the lies he was told, the betrayal, the BS reason given for his firing, and whether he would ever return if asked.
Plus, Tom answers rapid-fire questions from the fans, including the most difficult celebrity, favorite co-host, and what he would have liked to change on the show! You really don't want to miss this episode!
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
This is Sex Lies and Spray Tands with Me Cheryl
Burke and iHeartRadio podcast. Hey guys, welcome back to Sex
Lies and Spray Tands. We have no intro needed dance
Dad Double D's Thomas on Hell Love. How you doing,
Welcome to the BBC. You just kidding? Okay, let's just
(00:24):
you know what, Just tell me how you really feel.
Let's just get down and dirty. Are you ready?
Speaker 2 (00:29):
You're saying the last episode we did was merely just
warming up to this magnipulating you.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
Okay, Do I do a good job though.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
You like it? You're like a conversational chiropractor.
Speaker 1 (00:40):
Oh goodness, I learned from the best of the best.
Assume you meant me why did you get fired?
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Well, I'm sure they'll give you a different reason.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
But I want to know your reason. I don't care
about their reason.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
It's a story I think people have heard.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
But I'll go back and because I don't think you're
telling everything.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Okay, all right, well here's I'll start and you can interrupt.
I'm being honest. So at the end of twenty eighteen,
we knew there'd be no spring season in twenty nineteen
for the first time because ABC had acquired American Idol
and they tried a four week athlete season that just
(01:21):
didn't really work. It was overbooked and all that. I
think that was the first indication of that. I think
that other showrunner had the responsibility of that one, and
I thought, okay, we're in trouble. Okay. And so during
the summer of twenty eighteen, no summer twenty nineteen, sorry,
(01:42):
I had two lunches, one with that showrunner person and
another one with his boss at the BBC, separate lunches.
Each of them asked me, and they came to where
I live in Calabasas. They came to one of my
favorite places there. Yeah, up to that point and each
of the masked you know, we've been off the air,
(02:02):
will have been off the air for the better part
of a year. By the way, we did a lot
of research. You tested really well. I'd signed a new
contract for three seasons. What do you think we should
be focusing on? I said, well, look, twenty nineteen is
the threshold to an election year in America. We are
a very divided country. And I said, just nobody of
(02:27):
any party, don't go there. Just make us the wonderful
escape from all that divisiveness for two hours a week,
and they both at their respective lunch, Oh you're so right, Oh, yes,
you're right. Let's play to our strengths. And then a
few weeks later, I get a phone call from the
(02:47):
showrunner and another producer and they run down the list
of who's going to be on the show, and this
former showrunner says to me, you might want to sit
down for the last one. I said why, And then
they told me who it was, the former press guy
(03:07):
for for Trump, And I said, guys, this is exactly
what we we said we wouldn't do. And I would
have responded the same way if they had booked Hillary Clinton,
whom I voted for. Don't go there. This is, you know,
not the right time. Play to our strengths, be the
show that gives people a break from all this bullshit.
(03:29):
So I was furious. At one point, I even said,
you know, what, do you how about if I take
the season off just and and and they said, well
you do that, you're you know, we'll let you out
of your contract if you want. That's how strongly they.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Felt about the show runner.
Speaker 2 (03:47):
Yes, and the other person on the phone with him,
and I said, and that really pissed me sure off.
So I said, all right, let me go to be
Switzerland here. But I was furious. And again this goes
back to the Ryan Locktey thing. If I had known
(04:10):
what was happening and my temper kicked in, it wasn't
going to be pretty got it. This time, I knew
it was happening, and my temper kicked in, and I
was at least going to let people know that they
fucking lied to me. So I wrote the statement that
(04:31):
I wrote that did not name anybody, that did not
name a political party. It merely said I was told
certain things. When I was asked my opinion, they agreed,
and now they've thrown a curveball. I even went so
far as to say, it's their right to do that.
They're the producers of the show. If that's what they
(04:52):
want to do, they are entitled to do that. We
will have to agree to disagree. But I because when
the moment that Spicer was mentioned on Good Morning America,
my phone started blowing up. People were outraged.
Speaker 1 (05:07):
How long did you know prior to his announcement?
Speaker 2 (05:10):
A couple of weeks? A couple of weeks, So at
that moment I knew this is probably my last.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
Season because of that one decision.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
That because of because of that one betrayal got it
because of that one that that that I had been
lied to by people who were in charge.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
Right, So I was you've never been treated like that
prior obviously, well.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
Up until that point, there were people of character there. Yes, yes,
you know, and the moment that sails out of the
wind the building, you're screwed. So I released that statement.
My lawyer even said to me at the time, he said,
you know, it's it's really well written. It doesn't target anybody,
it's it's a well thought out perspective. But you're putting
a bullseye in your back. Why because he knew that
(06:00):
it would be controversial that suddenly the host of a
network show is saying, I don't agree with how they're
booking it. I've been misled.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
And they weren't aware you were going to be posting
this obviously.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
No, no, not, they didn't. They didn't deserve to know.
You know, they had screwed me. I'm gonna screw them,
but I wanted the viewers to know this. This was
a step too far to me. Yeah, this was a
step too far on the cusp of an election year.
And again, had it been a Democrat, same statement.
Speaker 1 (06:34):
You would have done that, really honestly, If honestly Obama
was about to do this, you would have said the
same thing and the same way.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
Yep. Because it wasn't about my political beliefs. It was
about my feeling about the show. What is this show
at its best? And what was happening was we were
suddenly becoming this show at its worst for ratings, for ratings, ratings,
just for controversy.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
I remember seeing the show always done this, Tom It's
always every single season has had controversy.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Up to a point, yes, up to a point, yes,
But I didn't feel that from a societal standpoint, where
we were as a country, we were in a divided
country to the extent that I had never experienced before.
And I was in high school during Watergate. I mean,
come on, you know, during Vietnam War protests and race
(07:31):
riots and all that. This to me felt like a
darker period of our history, and we were fueling that
fire and I just felt it was wrong. I felt
it was a disservice to the show. And yeah, it
had been Obama, who I would have voted for a
third time. If he was, you know, constitutionally able to run,
(07:54):
I would have released the same statement.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
Obviously, you didn't want to be a part of the
cast that point, right, Like when Shawn Spicer was well, I.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
I look, I was going to I would Aaron, and
I said, and I think it's true that if you
didn't know about all the controversy going on behind the scenes,
if you only watched the show, you never would have
known if there was anything. I think that we were
very professional. Yes, of course when it was Sean's birthday,
(08:25):
I wished him a happy birthday on the air, all
that stuff. I didn't put him in that green outfit
somebody else did, you know. I'm not guilty for that one.
But you know, I knew what was going to happen.
I knew that Trump would be tweeting about it and
all that. You're just playing into this, so why do it?
But you know I don't. I don't. I can't speak
(08:45):
to the mindset of the people who booked the show
because frankly, I can't explain it myself.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
So obviously you felt betrayed, yes, and you felt betrayed
by the people that you thought would never betray.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
You the necessarily. I mean I wasn't a fan of
the showrunner obviously, and there were some other people there. Yeah, yeah,
more people who I thought I knew who turned out
I didn't really know that.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
So was that the most disappointing hit?
Speaker 2 (09:12):
Kind of yeah, yeah, kind of yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:14):
And did Aaron just have your back?
Speaker 2 (09:17):
You did? We would basically because at that point they
had a set that with this big wall would open
and we'd walk out to start the show, and we
would always just kind of look at each other and okay,
all right, two hours, this is our reality. Here we go.
Speaker 1 (09:30):
So was that that whole season was like that?
Speaker 2 (09:32):
Yeah, the whole season. It was. I was miserable the
whole season. So anyway to your original question, whatever they
will say, you know, the bullshit thing. Somebody said, oh
it's because he did the masked singer, Come on, get it,
get a life. Really, you know, I was a fucking
taco singing Sinatra. I'm sure that's not a reason firesome.
(09:54):
But I had called them on the carpet and they
don't like that, and so there you go.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
But I knew what don't they like about? What don't
they like?
Speaker 2 (10:05):
They don't like being called a liar in public.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
They as a company or they as.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
You know, those individuals who were specific running running the
show and you know, running that part of the network
at the time.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
Does you find this happening in general though with a
lot of talent versus executives.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
Maybe you know, it was the first time that had
come to that level with me, But I could see
we were getting on a bit of a slippery slope,
you know, up to uh, you know, when Ashley was
kind of elbowed out right because Ashley, who I thought
that did a brilliant job. She was a showrunner, Yeah,
as a showrunner. When this other person came on supposedly
(10:49):
as a co executive producer, That's how it was told
to me. This was the first lie. And then I
find out that Ashley has to report to this person
and has to teach this person how to do the show.
You know, It's almost like it a supermarket, you know,
when they institute the self checkout lines and they have
the cashiers teach you how to use it so they
(11:10):
can be obsolete soon. It's kind of like that.
Speaker 1 (11:14):
And so it was actually even aware of this that
she was basically training her replacement.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Yeah, Well, when she told me that she had to
teach this guy the show and she was reporting to him,
I went to both the network and the BBC to say,
flag on the play here. This is what I was
told was going to happen. How can you how can
you make this person over her when she's doing the
job and he doesn't know how to do it. So
(11:42):
that was the first indication that that, okay, we're playing it.
We're playing a different game of roles here.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
Do you think that they were thinking tom Ney sustained
his lane?
Speaker 2 (11:51):
Like, oh, I'm sure, I'm sure you.
Speaker 1 (11:54):
Are starting to cross boundaries as far as employee or
on camera talent versus executive lately. But they did ring
this in front of your like they were waiving this
piece of meat in front of your face when they
first asked you your opinion on the cast from when
they went through the basses right nor whole thing. Did
they do this every season?
Speaker 2 (12:14):
Nope, that was the first time that we actually had
those kind of lunches. No, it wasn't odd because it
was the first time we would have been off for
the better part of a year, so and it was
you know, after the whole Bobby bones thing, and the
ratings had taken a little bit of a hit, and
so you know, they were doing a lot of sort
of deep diving as to what makes the show work
(12:36):
and what works to its disadvantage, so that they in
that spirit, I thought, they came to me for my
perspective and I gave it to them. And there you go.
Speaker 1 (12:48):
Do you think they were indirectly wanting you to step
down and they pissed you off?
Speaker 2 (12:53):
Well, you know, I again, it felt that way the moment,
the moment they said, will let you out of here,
I thought, Okay, I think I know what's going on here.
So when I said I'll try to be Switzerland, I
knew i'd be writing a statement. I didn't know how
that would blow up the way it did, But I
also knew it was probably my last season.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
You say in other interviews that you felt out of
love with the show. When when was that even prior
to this moment?
Speaker 2 (13:21):
Or it was it was a gradual process with the
hiring of this person who I thought was in over
his head and the ousting.
Speaker 1 (13:30):
Of Ashland right, because you saw the treatment that she
was being.
Speaker 2 (13:35):
Right and I saw the subterfuge that was occurring, and
that made me, you know, love it less. And I
was also, as I think I said in one interview,
at the time, I'd been doing it long enough. I
was at a point in my career comfortable enough that
I don't need this shit, right, if you're going to
lie to me, if you're gonna you know, if this
(13:59):
kind of other nonsense going on behind the scenes, you know, effort, do.
Speaker 1 (14:03):
You believe in, like separating business versus pleasure and more
like business versus emotional Like this is where it's hard
for me to separate. I'm only asking because I'm in
a similar situation where it's like, you know, when the
heart is gone, it's just a job, right. But then
within that you have to also have boundaries. You have
to also have self respect, I mean, if you do
(14:24):
or not.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
As Yeah, And I think I think that that had
a big part to play in what I saw as
a like watching a sand castle succumb to the tide,
you know, with this beautiful sand castle of the show
is being slowly eaten away by people who for whatever reason,
just acted the way they acted. And you know, and
(14:49):
so I left, and they made another choice, and that
person left after her contract was done, and now finally
they got good people back in the show. I think
has righted itself to some degree.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Look overall, the show, as you said earlier, it's been
great to us right in so many different ways.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
Again, I look at the math of it, and ninety
five percent of my experience was really quite wonderful. And
you know, there were a number of times, even prior
to that final season that I would hear about a
booking and swallow a little hard and go, okay, I
can kind of maybe see the rationale here. But at
(15:29):
that last juncture, again I go back to your previous question,
I felt very protective of the show, but also cognizant
of the fact of where we were as a country
and what we didn't want to feed into at that time.
And you know, that's sort of where I decided to
(15:52):
plant my flag. And you know, a really good friend
of mine in Boston I had dinner with and he
said to me, you're not into it as much anymore,
are you? And I said, what do you mean?
Speaker 1 (16:05):
He goes, I can tell remember that conversation we had
on stage right before blocking or right before the live show,
during right before dress rehearsal, and we were both saying like,
this is just a different vibe.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
Yeah, yeah, And it really wasn't true for me until
when this new hire came in. I wasn't aware of
the whole way it would play out with Ashley because
Ashley was still there and she was still in charge
of the show. But as that year progressed and I
could see what was in my estimation really going on,
then yeah, then I felt like, Okay, this is not
(16:39):
I think I said in one interview, the show that
I left was not the show that I loved. And
that's it in a nutshell.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
But again the asterisk in the caveat is where they
are now, with Alfonso and Julianne and with Conrad back
as the showrunner and Derek and there as a judge.
I couldn't be happier for them.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
Would you come back?
Speaker 2 (17:03):
No? Never? Why because it's not the same show, It's
not the same world, you know, the same Yeah, but
but I've done that. I did it for a lot
of years. You know, there's no there's no point. What
what would I prove? You know, there was a game
show host this you won't know the reference named Richard
Dawson who was an actor who hosted the original version
(17:24):
of Family Feud for years, right, and he would have
you had this weird, kinky thing. You would always kiss
all the female contestants just for me. Yeah. Yeah. So anyway,
he leaves the show, other hosts come in, and then
about five years later they bring him back because the
ratings are are dipping and he's a very different person
(17:45):
at that point, and they tell me, Richard, you can't
kiss those galls anymore and all this, and plus he
just didn't. It wasn't you know, he wasn't as into it.
It wasn't fresh. I mean, it's just why would I
do that? It's just you know that let let the
show either exist with the fresh blood that it has
now or die a natural death right.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
You know, what do you think you want to do
next in your career that you haven't had a chance
to do? That's on your bucket list, but I haven't
been able to cross it off yet.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
Do you know? There's nothing really to.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
Be honest on your I P A E p A.
What's it called?
Speaker 2 (18:37):
It's an I P A Yeah, even they even spell
it on the can, so you know how to spell
it IPA. Like last week I shot a couple of
commercials for an insurance company.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
Right, yeah, are the new Geico? H?
Speaker 2 (18:52):
No, the lizard's got like a lifelong contract, and you know,
lizards can live a very long time.
Speaker 1 (18:59):
No. Yes, I know, remember I was married to one.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
But bom.
Speaker 1 (19:06):
So.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
But there's nothing really that that that I have a
burning desire to do in the business anymore. I've done
talk shows, game shows. Hwould be no, because well that's
what they need, another white guy hosting a late night
talk show. Yeah, Oh my god, there's such a scarcity
of white guys hosting late night talk shows, white guys
(19:30):
in their late sixties. Yeah, there's a real target audience
for that.
Speaker 1 (19:34):
Oh well, I mean no, there isn't. You're right, okay, yeah,
You're just you just need to be happy in your retirement.
Speaker 2 (19:41):
I'm having a ball. I'm really, yeah, I'm I really
I'm loving life and enjoying where we are now. And
you know, I'm like, I'm here this week at the
Film Festival, and I'll be back in California, you know
for six weeks. I'll be co hosting with they that
Nicole Brown the second telethon for the Motion Picture Television
(20:04):
Fund on k t L, A you know, to be
able to do things like that during the strike. I
brought my cameo account back up and yeah, I heard
that sending money to UH to the actors. What used
to be the Actors Fund is now Entertainment Community dot
org and they help you know, people who are in
need during this strike.
Speaker 1 (20:25):
I know you were, Thomas. Yeah, are you ready for this?
This is a good one.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
What's this?
Speaker 1 (20:30):
This is going to be called name that host, dun
dun dum. And then the last one is rapid fire
from your fans. Okay, you have to do it all right?
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Okay, sure, we.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
Had thousands of people literally stop it. No, I swear
to God, I'm not kidding. Really it was insanity. Describe
all four of your Dancing with the Stars co hosts
and one word. Lisa Canning.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Nervous because energetic, broke Brooke a sweetheart.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
Aaron Andrews my buddy. Describe the hosts after you got
the boot in one word.
Speaker 3 (21:10):
Tyra Banks a curiosity, all funds of Ribero, thrilled for him,
Juliana Perfect.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
Out of all four of your co hosts you worked
with on Dancing at the Stars, who became a good
friend off camera? Lisa Samantha Brook, Aaron Brook.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
But definitely Aerin. I think Erin I'm closest to.
Speaker 1 (21:33):
Biggest diva Lisa Samantha Brook Aaron. Oh wow, diva can
also be a good thing.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
Yeah, well no, but I really don't think any of
them were divas, really, I really don't.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
I think that would be nice. I think Brooke.
Speaker 2 (21:49):
Does she really? Because I'll tell you, we'd always have
the Monday morning production meetings in my dressing room, and
it was always very laid back. Look. I know that
the female co hosts obviously had to take longer to
get ready because they had different outfits every week, and
I was wearing the same.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
Damn dark seria makeup.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
Yeah. I mean, there's not much that happens with this hair.
Speaker 1 (22:12):
It's just what it is, naturally gorgeous.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
Oh thank you so much. Just slap some powder around
me and send me to the stage.
Speaker 1 (22:21):
And a tie. Who was the funniest off Aaron?
Speaker 2 (22:27):
Yeaharon?
Speaker 1 (22:27):
Who was the most fun to work with?
Speaker 2 (22:31):
I would say Aaron and Brook. It's sort of a tie.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
Who did you bicker with the most? None of them boring.
I guess you weren't there long enough.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
You just came in but also they had a different job.
I had a lot of respect for what they had
to do. They had the harder hosting job, really, you know, yeah,
because they had to kind of keep the show going
while the contestants were waiting to either get their scores
or they just got bad scores or whatever. And they're
not one.
Speaker 1 (23:00):
That's very emotional right now, yeah at that point.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
Yeah, So I always thought that the co host job
was harder.
Speaker 1 (23:06):
Who did you spend the most time with off camera? Lisa,
Samantha Brook, Aaron.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
I would say, Brook and Aaron?
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Who did you learn from the most? Lisa, Samantha Brook, Aaron.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
Who did I learn from the most?
Speaker 1 (23:18):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 2 (23:19):
Learn I think in terms of dealing with curveballs that
life can throw at you, it would be a tie
between Aaron and Brook. Why because they each had health
issues they and I think in both cases it made
us closer friends because I was able to offer some
(23:45):
referrals to surcums in Boston who are just brilliant. And
Brooke told me that even though she didn't get surgery
with that person, that person gave her more information than
the one she actually was dealing with. So I, you know,
I just watch both of them deal with life challenges
(24:06):
and do it with great Grayson points.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
Yeah, wow, there's strong women. I mean, especially when Aaron
was going through that whole thing.
Speaker 2 (24:14):
Yeah, and you know, I'm married to a strong woman.
I have two strong real daughters, so I'm good in
the company a strong woman.
Speaker 1 (24:21):
I kind of like, Yeah, Torris Bool, you if you
were to let's say you were to host Dancing with
the Stars again, We're not saying that you are. Who
would you do it again with? Eric one? Name one?
A rapid fire from the fans. Ready, let's go at
the James Bennett Best Dancing with the Star's host other
than yourself alfonsin at Hannah Scarnett, Chia. Favorite part of
(24:45):
the Dancing with the Stars process midseason parties at Misty
Roe six four seven. Least favorite star on the show.
Uh yeah, mama yo, at mama. Listen to this Instagram
handle at mama yo do fifty five. Favorite co host
from Dancing with the Stars name one.
Speaker 2 (25:05):
Oh it's I. Yeah, Well look because I really time
and you know, I.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
Mean, iba, you can just put their names together. Yeah,
they're right at the side, Dolly, I like that at
the side Dolly Hassen. Wow, this is fascinating favorite pro dancer.
Uh huh you.
Speaker 2 (25:28):
I've said that before.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
Yeah, you when I wasn't here.
Speaker 2 (25:32):
Yeah. No, I've told people you're you're my favorite. I mean,
I love a lot of them, but you're my favorite.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
Yeah, thank you at Jennifer fun Wing. Ye, your favorite
Dancing with the Stars couple of all time?
Speaker 2 (25:46):
Ah you Andrew?
Speaker 1 (25:48):
Oh at quite even it's not spelled like that, but
that's what it is. Why didn't his old co worker
Bob from Breakfast Time do Dancing with the Stars? He
will laugh and understand.
Speaker 2 (25:59):
Oh, that's Bob before we started doing this. Al Rosenberg,
who was the brilliant uh comic mind behind Bob, who
was like the Greek chorus of our show. He passed
away recently and I spoke at his uh at his
his funeral, and I just loved him. I just loved him.
(26:21):
And this is one of the Bob the puppets that
I managed to save. And that's our I used to
call him our little wart Leyton sock.
Speaker 1 (26:34):
What those bumps are?
Speaker 3 (26:36):
Yea?
Speaker 2 (26:37):
And yeah? But but Al Rosenberg.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
What would he look like as a contestant?
Speaker 2 (26:43):
You don't have legs? Okay, Bobby, you rest down.
Speaker 1 (26:46):
Here, you rest down there. Okay.
Speaker 2 (26:50):
I want to thank that particular person for that question,
because I will say this. I will say this, Cheryl,
with all respect to you and everybody else on dancing.
My favorite experience on television ever was hosting Breakfast Time
on FX.
Speaker 1 (27:04):
Was it jumping into the orange juice or was it
the puppet?
Speaker 2 (27:07):
No, the jumping into the orange juice happened on the
on the Unfortunate Network adaptation of Breakfast Time, and it
was my way of saying f you to the network.
Speaker 1 (27:20):
So if you could jump into a pile of whatever,
would it be in budge of mirror balls?
Speaker 2 (27:24):
Or I think all they only have to read some of.
Speaker 1 (27:27):
My interviews to listen to this podcast.
Speaker 2 (27:31):
Here's the thing. I think at the point where I
say the show that I left was out the show
that I loved, What else do you have to say?
Speaker 1 (27:37):
At ju La La chiu. It was the most difficult
celebrity to interview on the show.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
Oh that's a really good question. I'm I'm a bit
at a loss.
Speaker 1 (27:47):
Because a loss for celebrities.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
Yeah, well just for difficult ones, because I think they
they all attempted, even if they're dancing. Wasn't up this enough?
They attempted to, you know, be personable and master p
master p, well, master p was he didn't want to
be there were dance shoes forgot Miller's shoes, wasn't it
wasn't he just filling in at the last minute for
(28:12):
his son, who ultimately did do the show later. But
so he didn't really want to be there.
Speaker 1 (28:17):
So he was something, uh, little Romeo, there you go.
Speaker 2 (28:22):
Little Romeo. Yeah. Yeah, Well I used to tease he always.
I don't think he uses a little anymore, but I
would always tease him about you are you promote this week?
He always promoted something.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
Yeah, I mean right in your face.
Speaker 2 (28:34):
Yeah, I used. I used to say that it was
like watching her four weeks, which was three weeks too long.
It was like moving furniture around. It was like she
had an omoir or something and she's trying to move
it around around the ball room.
Speaker 1 (28:47):
Okay at m j U Beck Okay, did you leave
my did you leave my choice or were you forced out?
Speaker 2 (28:54):
Yeah? It was forced out.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
What was Lewis's and your daughter's reaction when you told
him that you got fired?
Speaker 2 (29:00):
Well, Lois knew how I felt that season. You know,
I think she was. I think she was relieved. And
she was with me after the final show when I
was clearing out my dressing room, saying everything that I
want to keep on.
Speaker 1 (29:14):
Yeah, oh yeah, you went there.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
Well it was the I didn't go to the wrap
party at the end of my last season because.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
There's noies anyways.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
Well, I tend not to, but that season, I definitely
didn't want to because I didn't want to deal with
these people anymore. So I just you know, if there
were pictures I wanted or whatever I wanted, I said,
let's clear out now because I'm probably not ever coming back.
Speaker 1 (29:38):
I mean, at least you weren't painting your room, you know.
Speaker 2 (29:41):
Oh yeah, yeah, no, I that was clumsily handled for Brooke,
but but yeah, no, I kind of knew. And Lois
was relieved.
Speaker 1 (29:48):
Is this just the name of the game, you think
in this business or in any.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
Business some degree, you know, Look, it's it's show business,
and and the business part should be in capital letters,
in the show part should be in a lower case.
And if you if I look back at the at
the run of my career, why would I bitch really?
Apart from talking about a personal difficulty with one person
(30:15):
or two or three people. Yeah, beyond that, I I've
you know, I've been so so, so fortunate. So you
know that I don't want to blow that that little
end difficulty out of proportion because the great majority of
it was.
Speaker 1 (30:32):
Wonderful, totally. Do you think that you grieved, did you grieve,
did you even have a grieving process? Or was this
something that a part of this network like you said?
Speaker 2 (30:42):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, And you know what, you know what
really hurt the most because I knew that it was
probably my last season, but they did a for their
thirtieth season. They did a whole special and they didn't
have one clip of me in it. Really, yeah, there
was not even a clip at all. And because somebody,
(31:03):
I didn't watch it, but I got all these tweets
and texts.
Speaker 1 (31:06):
For me, you know what, You're right, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:08):
And I thought, you know what, that's bullshit. That kind
of stuff is really petty, I think. And so when
I was again, I didn't watch it, but when I
was told that there wasn't even so much as a
clip of you in it, I thought, okay, all right,
because then they had that, you know, when they.
Speaker 1 (31:22):
Started to find by the way, no clips of you.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
Yeah, when they said they were moving the show in
a new direction after firing me, and how I'll always
be part of the family. I mean, you could just
you could smell the bullshit coming right off the page.
Speaker 1 (31:35):
Did you get a text from any of the execs after,
like as soon as you got as soon as you
made that decision?
Speaker 2 (31:40):
Nothing, not one, as soon as I as soon as
they fire.
Speaker 1 (31:43):
As soon as like you were fired. Did you hear
from any other executives?
Speaker 2 (31:47):
Yeah? Whoever, there was a woman who was the head
of entertainment there. I didn't return her phone call.
Speaker 1 (31:53):
Wow, well what I'm.
Speaker 2 (31:55):
Going to call her back and she ah, you know,
we love everything you've done.
Speaker 1 (31:59):
At least they tried.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
I'm just kidding.
Speaker 1 (32:00):
I'm kidding, They're kidding. Okay. At j nine two seventy nine,
lots of mine. What is something you would have liked
to see changed on the show?
Speaker 2 (32:18):
Some of the personnel? Okay?
Speaker 1 (32:22):
At Child of the Universe fifteen, I feel like I'm
like saying, I feel like I'm being America's pageant or whatever.
What was going through your head when Juan, Pablo and
Cheryl were eliminated and when Bobby and Sharona won Dancing
With the start of season twenty seven.
Speaker 2 (32:37):
Uh, I shock both times. Bobby winning didn't surprise me
as much.
Speaker 1 (32:44):
Bobby was supposed to take over your job? Is that
what I hear.
Speaker 2 (32:47):
At one point that before they what I've heard is
before they went to Tyr, they went to him. Really, yeah,
that's what I've heard. Now. I don't know if it's
true or not, but I heard it from several reliable sources.
Speaker 1 (32:57):
Wouldn't you have taken the job?
Speaker 2 (33:00):
I would if I was him.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
I would have if it was Ryan Seacrest, Baby kidding?
Speaker 2 (33:04):
I love I love Ryan. I think when Ryan Uh
when when pat say Jack said he was leaving wheel
and people were, oh yeah, putting me on, putting on
a short list. I remember I texted or or put
on Instagram. I said, I know I'm enjoying life and
and you know, give it to Ryan. The kid needs
(33:25):
the work.
Speaker 1 (33:25):
Oh my god, that guy works so much. But would
you have done it?
Speaker 2 (33:29):
No? Why how about I don't watch it? Number One?
I know what hosting a game show is, like I
did probably on the best show that I ever could.
Speaker 1 (33:38):
I never want to host again. Is that what you're saying, I.
Speaker 2 (33:40):
Kind of don't. I really don't know what.
Speaker 1 (33:43):
If they brought you another live variety show type thing.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
No, well, look, I'm always open to being surprised surprise,
but so I, to echo Sean Connery in his last
James Bond movie, never say ever?
Speaker 1 (34:00):
But r Justin Bieber?
Speaker 2 (34:03):
Oh okay? Did he do that too? That? A song?
Speaker 1 (34:05):
A song about it?
Speaker 2 (34:06):
I guess okay, But but I can't envision a format
or an approach that would be an inducement to me.
Speaker 1 (34:15):
Fair enough at Lauren vic truly five more most lazy
contestant master p Yeah, Nikki l Xia don't you? Isn't
that the best part of this whole thing?
Speaker 2 (34:29):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (34:30):
Anyway, best past or present male pro dancer on Dancing
with the Stars.
Speaker 2 (34:35):
Derek, Who is the most creative?
Speaker 1 (34:38):
Mark ballast was pretty.
Speaker 2 (34:39):
Well, well, no, Mark, I've gone watched Mark on Broadway,
you know, yes, But in terms of consistency and just creativity,
I have to give Derek the edge every.
Speaker 1 (34:52):
Year two six mirror balls in. He deserves all six.
Speaker 2 (34:56):
Of them, exactly right.
Speaker 1 (34:58):
At Big val Virgo, No, it's not Bellshorski. Who is
your favorite celeb dancer?
Speaker 2 (35:06):
You know there are so many that were really good.
I think in.
Speaker 1 (35:08):
Terms of who like a good person.
Speaker 2 (35:12):
Yeah, I think if if like Drew got in touch
and wanted to have lunch, I'd love it, you know,
because I just I think he's a kick.
Speaker 1 (35:20):
At Bainville eighty seven Best theme night.
Speaker 2 (35:26):
I kind of loved the Disney nights. I really did.
I mean, I think we overdid it, but I really
enjoyed that. I enjoyed. I also loved it when the
Muppets would come, you know, stuff like that circus let
showing up. And the best was.
Speaker 1 (35:41):
When Mickey and Minnie finally got so hot that they
Oh god, what I saw under those things. I'm not
going to ruin it for all the kids.
Speaker 2 (35:48):
Yeah yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (35:49):
But man, oh man, did it make me so happy? Anyway?
At Gen Loves Mermaid. What is the most memorable mishap
that happened live on Dancing with the Stars. We already
talked about that, Yeah, Marie Fame, Ci Dolly Hassen, God, Okay,
favorite pro We're already talked about it. If you look
it at her Where can people find you? Under your desk?
Speaker 2 (36:12):
I'm really under my desk with Bob the puppett here
and you know I'm I'm on Instagram at tom Bergern.
I think that's my only social I mean, I have
a Facebook page, but I don't really do much with it.
Speaker 1 (36:23):
Well a lot of our fans do, Okay, so what
is it?
Speaker 2 (36:26):
Yes, I think it's just me. I think it's just
my name, and it's got that little blue ass risk
that means something. It means something. They're not on Twitter
or x whatever they're calling it. Now you have to
buy one now, I think, and anybody.
Speaker 1 (36:41):
Can, and then you can definitely buy one.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
The moment Elon Musk got Twitter, I left right, I said, hello,
I must be going.
Speaker 1 (36:53):
Oh one more question, Taylor Swift? Did you really fall
during the re remember that having Swift coming up here it.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
Was a bit because they were doing a package that
included it ended with Marie Osmond fainting and everything. So
I turned to Taylor. I said, I'm going to do something.
Are you okay? Reading prompter? And she said yeah, she
was fine, And so it came I didn't even tell
I think con was still doing it. Then I forget
(37:22):
who was. I didn't tell anybody that was going to
do it, and uh so it came back to me.
And I just pretended to faint and Taylor, Taylor took
us to break brilliantly. Now and the picture you see
I think I posted as me giving her thumbs up
and her laughing because she did it so well. Because
I just sprung it on her like seconds before we
(37:44):
were coming back to here. It just occurred to me
it'd be funny if I faint too.
Speaker 1 (37:47):
So that's so were people like running out to make
sure you're okay.
Speaker 2 (37:52):
Actually you could see you could see everybody laughing almost.
Speaker 1 (37:55):
This great picture though it looked like it was real.
Taylor Swift is really nice though I remember her think
so nice.
Speaker 2 (38:00):
She was really game and did a great job just
you know, taking a curveball like that.
Speaker 1 (38:08):
Good times, Thomas, I love you, I love you more,
Thank you for doing this, thank you for your time.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
Was this everything you hoped it would be in? More
worn and more okay? And everybody the network listen it.
You know that that show has been complimented more than criticized.
Certainly it really happy both of us. Yeah, tell Lois,
I say hi, I will huh.
Speaker 1 (38:31):
Make sure you guys follow us at sex Lies and
spray Tands on our Instagram handle and make sure your comment.
Let me know who you want me to interview. What
do you all think, Let me know
This is Sex Lies and Spray Tands with Me Cheryl
Burke and iHeartRadio podcast. Hey guys, welcome back to Sex
Lies and Spray Tands. We have no intro needed dance
Dad Double D's Thomas on Hell Love. How you doing,
Welcome to the BBC. You just kidding? Okay, let's just
(00:24):
you know what, Just tell me how you really feel.
Let's just get down and dirty. Are you ready?
Speaker 2 (00:29):
You're saying the last episode we did was merely just
warming up to this magnipulating you.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
Okay, Do I do a good job though.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
You like it? You're like a conversational chiropractor.
Speaker 1 (00:40):
Oh goodness, I learned from the best of the best.
Assume you meant me why did you get fired?
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Well, I'm sure they'll give you a different reason.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
But I want to know your reason. I don't care
about their reason.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
It's a story I think people have heard.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
But I'll go back and because I don't think you're
telling everything.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Okay, all right, well here's I'll start and you can interrupt.
I'm being honest. So at the end of twenty eighteen,
we knew there'd be no spring season in twenty nineteen
for the first time because ABC had acquired American Idol
and they tried a four week athlete season that just
(01:21):
didn't really work. It was overbooked and all that. I
think that was the first indication of that. I think
that other showrunner had the responsibility of that one, and
I thought, okay, we're in trouble. Okay. And so during
the summer of twenty eighteen, no summer twenty nineteen, sorry,
(01:42):
I had two lunches, one with that showrunner person and
another one with his boss at the BBC, separate lunches.
Each of them asked me, and they came to where
I live in Calabasas. They came to one of my
favorite places there. Yeah, up to that point and each
of the masked you know, we've been off the air,
(02:02):
will have been off the air for the better part
of a year. By the way, we did a lot
of research. You tested really well. I'd signed a new
contract for three seasons. What do you think we should
be focusing on? I said, well, look, twenty nineteen is
the threshold to an election year in America. We are
a very divided country. And I said, just nobody of
(02:27):
any party, don't go there. Just make us the wonderful
escape from all that divisiveness for two hours a week,
and they both at their respective lunch, Oh you're so right, Oh, yes,
you're right. Let's play to our strengths. And then a
few weeks later, I get a phone call from the
(02:47):
showrunner and another producer and they run down the list
of who's going to be on the show, and this
former showrunner says to me, you might want to sit
down for the last one. I said why, And then
they told me who it was, the former press guy
(03:07):
for for Trump, And I said, guys, this is exactly
what we we said we wouldn't do. And I would
have responded the same way if they had booked Hillary Clinton,
whom I voted for. Don't go there. This is, you know,
not the right time. Play to our strengths, be the
show that gives people a break from all this bullshit.
(03:29):
So I was furious. At one point, I even said,
you know, what, do you how about if I take
the season off just and and and they said, well
you do that, you're you know, we'll let you out
of your contract if you want. That's how strongly they.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Felt about the show runner.
Speaker 2 (03:47):
Yes, and the other person on the phone with him,
and I said, and that really pissed me sure off.
So I said, all right, let me go to be
Switzerland here. But I was furious. And again this goes
back to the Ryan Locktey thing. If I had known
(04:10):
what was happening and my temper kicked in, it wasn't
going to be pretty got it. This time, I knew
it was happening, and my temper kicked in, and I
was at least going to let people know that they
fucking lied to me. So I wrote the statement that
(04:31):
I wrote that did not name anybody, that did not
name a political party. It merely said I was told
certain things. When I was asked my opinion, they agreed,
and now they've thrown a curveball. I even went so
far as to say, it's their right to do that.
They're the producers of the show. If that's what they
(04:52):
want to do, they are entitled to do that. We
will have to agree to disagree. But I because when
the moment that Spicer was mentioned on Good Morning America,
my phone started blowing up. People were outraged.
Speaker 1 (05:07):
How long did you know prior to his announcement?
Speaker 2 (05:10):
A couple of weeks? A couple of weeks, So at
that moment I knew this is probably my last.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
Season because of that one decision.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
That because of because of that one betrayal got it
because of that one that that that I had been
lied to by people who were in charge.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
Right, So I was you've never been treated like that
prior obviously, well.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
Up until that point, there were people of character there. Yes, yes,
you know, and the moment that sails out of the
wind the building, you're screwed. So I released that statement.
My lawyer even said to me at the time, he said,
you know, it's it's really well written. It doesn't target anybody,
it's it's a well thought out perspective. But you're putting
a bullseye in your back. Why because he knew that
(06:00):
it would be controversial that suddenly the host of a
network show is saying, I don't agree with how they're
booking it. I've been misled.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
And they weren't aware you were going to be posting
this obviously.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
No, no, not, they didn't. They didn't deserve to know.
You know, they had screwed me. I'm gonna screw them,
but I wanted the viewers to know this. This was
a step too far to me. Yeah, this was a
step too far on the cusp of an election year.
And again, had it been a Democrat, same statement.
Speaker 1 (06:34):
You would have done that, really honestly, If honestly Obama
was about to do this, you would have said the
same thing and the same way.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
Yep. Because it wasn't about my political beliefs. It was
about my feeling about the show. What is this show
at its best? And what was happening was we were
suddenly becoming this show at its worst for ratings, for ratings, ratings,
just for controversy.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
I remember seeing the show always done this, Tom It's
always every single season has had controversy.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Up to a point, yes, up to a point, yes,
But I didn't feel that from a societal standpoint, where
we were as a country, we were in a divided
country to the extent that I had never experienced before.
And I was in high school during Watergate. I mean,
come on, you know, during Vietnam War protests and race
(07:31):
riots and all that. This to me felt like a
darker period of our history, and we were fueling that
fire and I just felt it was wrong. I felt
it was a disservice to the show. And yeah, it
had been Obama, who I would have voted for a
third time. If he was, you know, constitutionally able to run,
(07:54):
I would have released the same statement.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
Obviously, you didn't want to be a part of the
cast that point, right, Like when Shawn Spicer was well, I.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
I look, I was going to I would Aaron, and
I said, and I think it's true that if you
didn't know about all the controversy going on behind the scenes,
if you only watched the show, you never would have
known if there was anything. I think that we were
very professional. Yes, of course when it was Sean's birthday,
(08:25):
I wished him a happy birthday on the air, all
that stuff. I didn't put him in that green outfit
somebody else did, you know. I'm not guilty for that one.
But you know, I knew what was going to happen.
I knew that Trump would be tweeting about it and
all that. You're just playing into this, so why do it?
But you know I don't. I don't. I can't speak
(08:45):
to the mindset of the people who booked the show
because frankly, I can't explain it myself.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
So obviously you felt betrayed, yes, and you felt betrayed
by the people that you thought would never betray.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
You the necessarily. I mean I wasn't a fan of
the showrunner obviously, and there were some other people there. Yeah, yeah,
more people who I thought I knew who turned out
I didn't really know that.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
So was that the most disappointing hit?
Speaker 2 (09:12):
Kind of yeah, yeah, kind of yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:14):
And did Aaron just have your back?
Speaker 2 (09:17):
You did? We would basically because at that point they
had a set that with this big wall would open
and we'd walk out to start the show, and we
would always just kind of look at each other and okay,
all right, two hours, this is our reality. Here we go.
Speaker 1 (09:30):
So was that that whole season was like that?
Speaker 2 (09:32):
Yeah, the whole season. It was. I was miserable the
whole season. So anyway to your original question, whatever they
will say, you know, the bullshit thing. Somebody said, oh
it's because he did the masked singer, Come on, get it,
get a life. Really, you know, I was a fucking
taco singing Sinatra. I'm sure that's not a reason firesome.
(09:54):
But I had called them on the carpet and they
don't like that, and so there you go.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
But I knew what don't they like about? What don't
they like?
Speaker 2 (10:05):
They don't like being called a liar in public.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
They as a company or they as.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
You know, those individuals who were specific running running the
show and you know, running that part of the network
at the time.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
Does you find this happening in general though with a
lot of talent versus executives.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
Maybe you know, it was the first time that had
come to that level with me, But I could see
we were getting on a bit of a slippery slope,
you know, up to uh, you know, when Ashley was
kind of elbowed out right because Ashley, who I thought
that did a brilliant job. She was a showrunner, Yeah,
as a showrunner. When this other person came on supposedly
(10:49):
as a co executive producer, That's how it was told
to me. This was the first lie. And then I
find out that Ashley has to report to this person
and has to teach this person how to do the show.
You know, It's almost like it a supermarket, you know,
when they institute the self checkout lines and they have
the cashiers teach you how to use it so they
(11:10):
can be obsolete soon. It's kind of like that.
Speaker 1 (11:14):
And so it was actually even aware of this that
she was basically training her replacement.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Yeah, Well, when she told me that she had to
teach this guy the show and she was reporting to him,
I went to both the network and the BBC to say,
flag on the play here. This is what I was
told was going to happen. How can you how can
you make this person over her when she's doing the
job and he doesn't know how to do it. So
(11:42):
that was the first indication that that, okay, we're playing it.
We're playing a different game of roles here.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
Do you think that they were thinking tom Ney sustained
his lane?
Speaker 2 (11:51):
Like, oh, I'm sure, I'm sure you.
Speaker 1 (11:54):
Are starting to cross boundaries as far as employee or
on camera talent versus executive lately. But they did ring
this in front of your like they were waiving this
piece of meat in front of your face when they
first asked you your opinion on the cast from when
they went through the basses right nor whole thing. Did
they do this every season?
Speaker 2 (12:14):
Nope, that was the first time that we actually had
those kind of lunches. No, it wasn't odd because it
was the first time we would have been off for
the better part of a year, so and it was
you know, after the whole Bobby bones thing, and the
ratings had taken a little bit of a hit, and
so you know, they were doing a lot of sort
of deep diving as to what makes the show work
(12:36):
and what works to its disadvantage, so that they in
that spirit, I thought, they came to me for my
perspective and I gave it to them. And there you go.
Speaker 1 (12:48):
Do you think they were indirectly wanting you to step
down and they pissed you off?
Speaker 2 (12:53):
Well, you know, I again, it felt that way the moment,
the moment they said, will let you out of here,
I thought, Okay, I think I know what's going on here.
So when I said I'll try to be Switzerland, I
knew i'd be writing a statement. I didn't know how
that would blow up the way it did, But I
also knew it was probably my last season.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
You say in other interviews that you felt out of
love with the show. When when was that even prior
to this moment?
Speaker 2 (13:21):
Or it was it was a gradual process with the
hiring of this person who I thought was in over
his head and the ousting.
Speaker 1 (13:30):
Of Ashland right, because you saw the treatment that she
was being.
Speaker 2 (13:35):
Right and I saw the subterfuge that was occurring, and
that made me, you know, love it less. And I
was also, as I think I said in one interview,
at the time, I'd been doing it long enough. I
was at a point in my career comfortable enough that
I don't need this shit, right, if you're going to
lie to me, if you're gonna you know, if this
(13:59):
kind of other nonsense going on behind the scenes, you know, effort, do.
Speaker 1 (14:03):
You believe in, like separating business versus pleasure and more
like business versus emotional Like this is where it's hard
for me to separate. I'm only asking because I'm in
a similar situation where it's like, you know, when the
heart is gone, it's just a job, right. But then
within that you have to also have boundaries. You have
to also have self respect, I mean, if you do
(14:24):
or not.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
As Yeah, And I think I think that that had
a big part to play in what I saw as
a like watching a sand castle succumb to the tide,
you know, with this beautiful sand castle of the show
is being slowly eaten away by people who for whatever reason,
just acted the way they acted. And you know, and
(14:49):
so I left, and they made another choice, and that
person left after her contract was done, and now finally
they got good people back in the show. I think
has righted itself to some degree.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Look overall, the show, as you said earlier, it's been
great to us right in so many different ways.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
Again, I look at the math of it, and ninety
five percent of my experience was really quite wonderful. And
you know, there were a number of times, even prior
to that final season that I would hear about a
booking and swallow a little hard and go, okay, I
can kind of maybe see the rationale here. But at
(15:29):
that last juncture, again I go back to your previous question,
I felt very protective of the show, but also cognizant
of the fact of where we were as a country
and what we didn't want to feed into at that time.
And you know, that's sort of where I decided to
(15:52):
plant my flag. And you know, a really good friend
of mine in Boston I had dinner with and he
said to me, you're not into it as much anymore,
are you? And I said, what do you mean?
Speaker 1 (16:05):
He goes, I can tell remember that conversation we had
on stage right before blocking or right before the live show,
during right before dress rehearsal, and we were both saying like,
this is just a different vibe.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
Yeah, yeah, And it really wasn't true for me until
when this new hire came in. I wasn't aware of
the whole way it would play out with Ashley because
Ashley was still there and she was still in charge
of the show. But as that year progressed and I
could see what was in my estimation really going on,
then yeah, then I felt like, Okay, this is not
(16:39):
I think I said in one interview, the show that
I left was not the show that I loved. And
that's it in a nutshell.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
But again the asterisk in the caveat is where they
are now, with Alfonso and Julianne and with Conrad back
as the showrunner and Derek and there as a judge.
I couldn't be happier for them.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
Would you come back?
Speaker 2 (17:03):
No? Never? Why because it's not the same show, It's
not the same world, you know, the same Yeah, but
but I've done that. I did it for a lot
of years. You know, there's no there's no point. What
what would I prove? You know, there was a game
show host this you won't know the reference named Richard
Dawson who was an actor who hosted the original version
(17:24):
of Family Feud for years, right, and he would have
you had this weird, kinky thing. You would always kiss
all the female contestants just for me. Yeah. Yeah. So anyway,
he leaves the show, other hosts come in, and then
about five years later they bring him back because the
ratings are are dipping and he's a very different person
(17:45):
at that point, and they tell me, Richard, you can't
kiss those galls anymore and all this, and plus he
just didn't. It wasn't you know, he wasn't as into it.
It wasn't fresh. I mean, it's just why would I
do that? It's just you know that let let the
show either exist with the fresh blood that it has
now or die a natural death right.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
You know, what do you think you want to do
next in your career that you haven't had a chance
to do? That's on your bucket list, but I haven't
been able to cross it off yet.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
Do you know? There's nothing really to.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
Be honest on your I P A E p A.
What's it called?
Speaker 2 (18:37):
It's an I P A Yeah, even they even spell
it on the can, so you know how to spell
it IPA. Like last week I shot a couple of
commercials for an insurance company.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
Right, yeah, are the new Geico? H?
Speaker 2 (18:52):
No, the lizard's got like a lifelong contract, and you know,
lizards can live a very long time.
Speaker 1 (18:59):
No. Yes, I know, remember I was married to one.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
But bom.
Speaker 1 (19:06):
So.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
But there's nothing really that that that I have a
burning desire to do in the business anymore. I've done
talk shows, game shows. Hwould be no, because well that's
what they need, another white guy hosting a late night
talk show. Yeah, Oh my god, there's such a scarcity
of white guys hosting late night talk shows, white guys
(19:30):
in their late sixties. Yeah, there's a real target audience
for that.
Speaker 1 (19:34):
Oh well, I mean no, there isn't. You're right, okay, yeah,
You're just you just need to be happy in your retirement.
Speaker 2 (19:41):
I'm having a ball. I'm really, yeah, I'm I really
I'm loving life and enjoying where we are now. And
you know, I'm like, I'm here this week at the
Film Festival, and I'll be back in California, you know
for six weeks. I'll be co hosting with they that
Nicole Brown the second telethon for the Motion Picture Television
(20:04):
Fund on k t L, A you know, to be
able to do things like that during the strike. I
brought my cameo account back up and yeah, I heard
that sending money to UH to the actors. What used
to be the Actors Fund is now Entertainment Community dot
org and they help you know, people who are in
need during this strike.
Speaker 1 (20:25):
I know you were, Thomas. Yeah, are you ready for this?
This is a good one.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
What's this?
Speaker 1 (20:30):
This is going to be called name that host, dun
dun dum. And then the last one is rapid fire
from your fans. Okay, you have to do it all right?
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Okay, sure, we.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
Had thousands of people literally stop it. No, I swear
to God, I'm not kidding. Really it was insanity. Describe
all four of your Dancing with the Stars co hosts
and one word. Lisa Canning.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Nervous because energetic, broke Brooke a sweetheart.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
Aaron Andrews my buddy. Describe the hosts after you got
the boot in one word.
Speaker 3 (21:10):
Tyra Banks a curiosity, all funds of Ribero, thrilled for him,
Juliana Perfect.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
Out of all four of your co hosts you worked
with on Dancing at the Stars, who became a good
friend off camera? Lisa Samantha Brook, Aaron Brook.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
But definitely Aerin. I think Erin I'm closest to.
Speaker 1 (21:33):
Biggest diva Lisa Samantha Brook Aaron. Oh wow, diva can
also be a good thing.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
Yeah, well no, but I really don't think any of
them were divas, really, I really don't.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
I think that would be nice. I think Brooke.
Speaker 2 (21:49):
Does she really? Because I'll tell you, we'd always have
the Monday morning production meetings in my dressing room, and
it was always very laid back. Look. I know that
the female co hosts obviously had to take longer to
get ready because they had different outfits every week, and
I was wearing the same.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
Damn dark seria makeup.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
Yeah. I mean, there's not much that happens with this hair.
Speaker 1 (22:12):
It's just what it is, naturally gorgeous.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
Oh thank you so much. Just slap some powder around
me and send me to the stage.
Speaker 1 (22:21):
And a tie. Who was the funniest off Aaron?
Speaker 2 (22:27):
Yeaharon?
Speaker 1 (22:27):
Who was the most fun to work with?
Speaker 2 (22:31):
I would say Aaron and Brook. It's sort of a tie.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
Who did you bicker with the most? None of them boring.
I guess you weren't there long enough.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
You just came in but also they had a different job.
I had a lot of respect for what they had
to do. They had the harder hosting job, really, you know, yeah,
because they had to kind of keep the show going
while the contestants were waiting to either get their scores
or they just got bad scores or whatever. And they're
not one.
Speaker 1 (23:00):
That's very emotional right now, yeah at that point.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
Yeah, So I always thought that the co host job
was harder.
Speaker 1 (23:06):
Who did you spend the most time with off camera? Lisa,
Samantha Brook, Aaron.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
I would say, Brook and Aaron?
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Who did you learn from the most? Lisa, Samantha Brook, Aaron.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
Who did I learn from the most?
Speaker 1 (23:18):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 2 (23:19):
Learn I think in terms of dealing with curveballs that
life can throw at you, it would be a tie
between Aaron and Brook. Why because they each had health
issues they and I think in both cases it made
us closer friends because I was able to offer some
(23:45):
referrals to surcums in Boston who are just brilliant. And
Brooke told me that even though she didn't get surgery
with that person, that person gave her more information than
the one she actually was dealing with. So I, you know,
I just watch both of them deal with life challenges
(24:06):
and do it with great Grayson points.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
Yeah, wow, there's strong women. I mean, especially when Aaron
was going through that whole thing.
Speaker 2 (24:14):
Yeah, and you know, I'm married to a strong woman.
I have two strong real daughters, so I'm good in
the company a strong woman.
Speaker 1 (24:21):
I kind of like, Yeah, Torris Bool, you if you
were to let's say you were to host Dancing with
the Stars again, We're not saying that you are. Who
would you do it again with? Eric one? Name one?
A rapid fire from the fans. Ready, let's go at
the James Bennett Best Dancing with the Star's host other
than yourself alfonsin at Hannah Scarnett, Chia. Favorite part of
(24:45):
the Dancing with the Stars process midseason parties at Misty
Roe six four seven. Least favorite star on the show.
Uh yeah, mama yo, at mama. Listen to this Instagram
handle at mama yo do fifty five. Favorite co host
from Dancing with the Stars name one.
Speaker 2 (25:05):
Oh it's I. Yeah, Well look because I really time
and you know, I.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
Mean, iba, you can just put their names together. Yeah,
they're right at the side, Dolly, I like that at
the side Dolly Hassen. Wow, this is fascinating favorite pro dancer.
Uh huh you.
Speaker 2 (25:28):
I've said that before.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
Yeah, you when I wasn't here.
Speaker 2 (25:32):
Yeah. No, I've told people you're you're my favorite. I mean,
I love a lot of them, but you're my favorite.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
Yeah, thank you at Jennifer fun Wing. Ye, your favorite
Dancing with the Stars couple of all time?
Speaker 2 (25:46):
Ah you Andrew?
Speaker 1 (25:48):
Oh at quite even it's not spelled like that, but
that's what it is. Why didn't his old co worker
Bob from Breakfast Time do Dancing with the Stars? He
will laugh and understand.
Speaker 2 (25:59):
Oh, that's Bob before we started doing this. Al Rosenberg,
who was the brilliant uh comic mind behind Bob, who
was like the Greek chorus of our show. He passed
away recently and I spoke at his uh at his
his funeral, and I just loved him. I just loved him.
(26:21):
And this is one of the Bob the puppets that
I managed to save. And that's our I used to
call him our little wart Leyton sock.
Speaker 1 (26:34):
What those bumps are?
Speaker 3 (26:36):
Yea?
Speaker 2 (26:37):
And yeah? But but Al Rosenberg.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
What would he look like as a contestant?
Speaker 2 (26:43):
You don't have legs? Okay, Bobby, you rest down.
Speaker 1 (26:46):
Here, you rest down there. Okay.
Speaker 2 (26:50):
I want to thank that particular person for that question,
because I will say this. I will say this, Cheryl,
with all respect to you and everybody else on dancing.
My favorite experience on television ever was hosting Breakfast Time
on FX.
Speaker 1 (27:04):
Was it jumping into the orange juice or was it
the puppet?
Speaker 2 (27:07):
No, the jumping into the orange juice happened on the
on the Unfortunate Network adaptation of Breakfast Time, and it
was my way of saying f you to the network.
Speaker 1 (27:20):
So if you could jump into a pile of whatever,
would it be in budge of mirror balls?
Speaker 2 (27:24):
Or I think all they only have to read some of.
Speaker 1 (27:27):
My interviews to listen to this podcast.
Speaker 2 (27:31):
Here's the thing. I think at the point where I
say the show that I left was out the show
that I loved, What else do you have to say?
Speaker 1 (27:37):
At ju La La chiu. It was the most difficult
celebrity to interview on the show.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
Oh that's a really good question. I'm I'm a bit
at a loss.
Speaker 1 (27:47):
Because a loss for celebrities.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
Yeah, well just for difficult ones, because I think they
they all attempted, even if they're dancing. Wasn't up this enough?
They attempted to, you know, be personable and master p
master p, well, master p was he didn't want to
be there were dance shoes forgot Miller's shoes, wasn't it
wasn't he just filling in at the last minute for
(28:12):
his son, who ultimately did do the show later. But
so he didn't really want to be there.
Speaker 1 (28:17):
So he was something, uh, little Romeo, there you go.
Speaker 2 (28:22):
Little Romeo. Yeah. Yeah, Well I used to tease he always.
I don't think he uses a little anymore, but I
would always tease him about you are you promote this week?
He always promoted something.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
Yeah, I mean right in your face.
Speaker 2 (28:34):
Yeah, I used. I used to say that it was
like watching her four weeks, which was three weeks too long.
It was like moving furniture around. It was like she
had an omoir or something and she's trying to move
it around around the ball room.
Speaker 1 (28:47):
Okay at m j U Beck Okay, did you leave
my did you leave my choice or were you forced out?
Speaker 2 (28:54):
Yeah? It was forced out.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
What was Lewis's and your daughter's reaction when you told
him that you got fired?
Speaker 2 (29:00):
Well, Lois knew how I felt that season. You know,
I think she was. I think she was relieved. And
she was with me after the final show when I
was clearing out my dressing room, saying everything that I
want to keep on.
Speaker 1 (29:14):
Yeah, oh yeah, you went there.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
Well it was the I didn't go to the wrap
party at the end of my last season because.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
There's noies anyways.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
Well, I tend not to, but that season, I definitely
didn't want to because I didn't want to deal with
these people anymore. So I just you know, if there
were pictures I wanted or whatever I wanted, I said,
let's clear out now because I'm probably not ever coming back.
Speaker 1 (29:38):
I mean, at least you weren't painting your room, you know.
Speaker 2 (29:41):
Oh yeah, yeah, no, I that was clumsily handled for Brooke,
but but yeah, no, I kind of knew. And Lois
was relieved.
Speaker 1 (29:48):
Is this just the name of the game, you think
in this business or in any.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
Business some degree, you know, Look, it's it's show business,
and and the business part should be in capital letters,
in the show part should be in a lower case.
And if you if I look back at the at
the run of my career, why would I bitch really?
Apart from talking about a personal difficulty with one person
(30:15):
or two or three people. Yeah, beyond that, I I've
you know, I've been so so, so fortunate. So you
know that I don't want to blow that that little
end difficulty out of proportion because the great majority of
it was.
Speaker 1 (30:32):
Wonderful, totally. Do you think that you grieved, did you grieve,
did you even have a grieving process? Or was this
something that a part of this network like you said?
Speaker 2 (30:42):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, And you know what, you know what
really hurt the most because I knew that it was
probably my last season, but they did a for their
thirtieth season. They did a whole special and they didn't
have one clip of me in it. Really, yeah, there
was not even a clip at all. And because somebody,
(31:03):
I didn't watch it, but I got all these tweets
and texts.
Speaker 1 (31:06):
For me, you know what, You're right, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:08):
And I thought, you know what, that's bullshit. That kind
of stuff is really petty, I think. And so when
I was again, I didn't watch it, but when I
was told that there wasn't even so much as a
clip of you in it, I thought, okay, all right,
because then they had that, you know, when they.
Speaker 1 (31:22):
Started to find by the way, no clips of you.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
Yeah, when they said they were moving the show in
a new direction after firing me, and how I'll always
be part of the family. I mean, you could just
you could smell the bullshit coming right off the page.
Speaker 1 (31:35):
Did you get a text from any of the execs after,
like as soon as you got as soon as you
made that decision?
Speaker 2 (31:40):
Nothing, not one, as soon as I as soon as
they fire.
Speaker 1 (31:43):
As soon as like you were fired. Did you hear
from any other executives?
Speaker 2 (31:47):
Yeah? Whoever, there was a woman who was the head
of entertainment there. I didn't return her phone call.
Speaker 1 (31:53):
Wow, well what I'm.
Speaker 2 (31:55):
Going to call her back and she ah, you know,
we love everything you've done.
Speaker 1 (31:59):
At least they tried.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
I'm just kidding.
Speaker 1 (32:00):
I'm kidding, They're kidding. Okay. At j nine two seventy nine,
lots of mine. What is something you would have liked
to see changed on the show?
Speaker 2 (32:18):
Some of the personnel? Okay?
Speaker 1 (32:22):
At Child of the Universe fifteen, I feel like I'm
like saying, I feel like I'm being America's pageant or whatever.
What was going through your head when Juan, Pablo and
Cheryl were eliminated and when Bobby and Sharona won Dancing
With the start of season twenty seven.
Speaker 2 (32:37):
Uh, I shock both times. Bobby winning didn't surprise me
as much.
Speaker 1 (32:44):
Bobby was supposed to take over your job? Is that
what I hear.
Speaker 2 (32:47):
At one point that before they what I've heard is
before they went to Tyr, they went to him. Really, yeah,
that's what I've heard. Now. I don't know if it's
true or not, but I heard it from several reliable sources.
Speaker 1 (32:57):
Wouldn't you have taken the job?
Speaker 2 (33:00):
I would if I was him.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
I would have if it was Ryan Seacrest, Baby kidding?
Speaker 2 (33:04):
I love I love Ryan. I think when Ryan Uh
when when pat say Jack said he was leaving wheel
and people were, oh yeah, putting me on, putting on
a short list. I remember I texted or or put
on Instagram. I said, I know I'm enjoying life and
and you know, give it to Ryan. The kid needs
(33:25):
the work.
Speaker 1 (33:25):
Oh my god, that guy works so much. But would
you have done it?
Speaker 2 (33:29):
No? Why how about I don't watch it? Number One?
I know what hosting a game show is, like I
did probably on the best show that I ever could.
Speaker 1 (33:38):
I never want to host again. Is that what you're saying, I.
Speaker 2 (33:40):
Kind of don't. I really don't know what.
Speaker 1 (33:43):
If they brought you another live variety show type thing.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
No, well, look, I'm always open to being surprised surprise,
but so I, to echo Sean Connery in his last
James Bond movie, never say ever?
Speaker 1 (34:00):
But r Justin Bieber?
Speaker 2 (34:03):
Oh okay? Did he do that too? That? A song?
Speaker 1 (34:05):
A song about it?
Speaker 2 (34:06):
I guess okay, But but I can't envision a format
or an approach that would be an inducement to me.
Speaker 1 (34:15):
Fair enough at Lauren vic truly five more most lazy
contestant master p Yeah, Nikki l Xia don't you? Isn't
that the best part of this whole thing?
Speaker 2 (34:29):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (34:30):
Anyway, best past or present male pro dancer on Dancing
with the Stars.
Speaker 2 (34:35):
Derek, Who is the most creative?
Speaker 1 (34:38):
Mark ballast was pretty.
Speaker 2 (34:39):
Well, well, no, Mark, I've gone watched Mark on Broadway,
you know, yes, But in terms of consistency and just creativity,
I have to give Derek the edge every.
Speaker 1 (34:52):
Year two six mirror balls in. He deserves all six.
Speaker 2 (34:56):
Of them, exactly right.
Speaker 1 (34:58):
At Big val Virgo, No, it's not Bellshorski. Who is
your favorite celeb dancer?
Speaker 2 (35:06):
You know there are so many that were really good.
I think in.
Speaker 1 (35:08):
Terms of who like a good person.
Speaker 2 (35:12):
Yeah, I think if if like Drew got in touch
and wanted to have lunch, I'd love it, you know,
because I just I think he's a kick.
Speaker 1 (35:20):
At Bainville eighty seven Best theme night.
Speaker 2 (35:26):
I kind of loved the Disney nights. I really did.
I mean, I think we overdid it, but I really
enjoyed that. I enjoyed. I also loved it when the
Muppets would come, you know, stuff like that circus let
showing up. And the best was.
Speaker 1 (35:41):
When Mickey and Minnie finally got so hot that they
Oh god, what I saw under those things. I'm not
going to ruin it for all the kids.
Speaker 2 (35:48):
Yeah yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (35:49):
But man, oh man, did it make me so happy? Anyway?
At Gen Loves Mermaid. What is the most memorable mishap
that happened live on Dancing with the Stars. We already
talked about that, Yeah, Marie Fame, Ci Dolly Hassen, God, Okay,
favorite pro We're already talked about it. If you look
it at her Where can people find you? Under your desk?
Speaker 2 (36:12):
I'm really under my desk with Bob the puppett here
and you know I'm I'm on Instagram at tom Bergern.
I think that's my only social I mean, I have
a Facebook page, but I don't really do much with it.
Speaker 1 (36:23):
Well a lot of our fans do, Okay, so what
is it?
Speaker 2 (36:26):
Yes, I think it's just me. I think it's just
my name, and it's got that little blue ass risk
that means something. It means something. They're not on Twitter
or x whatever they're calling it. Now you have to
buy one now, I think, and anybody.
Speaker 1 (36:41):
Can, and then you can definitely buy one.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
The moment Elon Musk got Twitter, I left right, I said, hello,
I must be going.
Speaker 1 (36:53):
Oh one more question, Taylor Swift? Did you really fall
during the re remember that having Swift coming up here it.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
Was a bit because they were doing a package that
included it ended with Marie Osmond fainting and everything. So
I turned to Taylor. I said, I'm going to do something.
Are you okay? Reading prompter? And she said yeah, she
was fine, And so it came I didn't even tell
I think con was still doing it. Then I forget
(37:22):
who was. I didn't tell anybody that was going to
do it, and uh so it came back to me.
And I just pretended to faint and Taylor, Taylor took
us to break brilliantly. Now and the picture you see
I think I posted as me giving her thumbs up
and her laughing because she did it so well. Because
I just sprung it on her like seconds before we
(37:44):
were coming back to here. It just occurred to me
it'd be funny if I faint too.
Speaker 1 (37:47):
So that's so were people like running out to make
sure you're okay.
Speaker 2 (37:52):
Actually you could see you could see everybody laughing almost.
Speaker 1 (37:55):
This great picture though it looked like it was real.
Taylor Swift is really nice though I remember her think
so nice.
Speaker 2 (38:00):
She was really game and did a great job just
you know, taking a curveball like that.
Speaker 1 (38:08):
Good times, Thomas, I love you, I love you more,
Thank you for doing this, thank you for your time.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
Was this everything you hoped it would be in? More
worn and more okay? And everybody the network listen it.
You know that that show has been complimented more than criticized.
Certainly it really happy both of us. Yeah, tell Lois,
I say hi, I will huh.
Speaker 1 (38:31):
Make sure you guys follow us at sex Lies and
spray Tands on our Instagram handle and make sure your comment.
Let me know who you want me to interview. What
do you all think, Let me know
Host
Cheryl Burke
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Cold Case Files: Miami
Joyce Sapp, 76; Bryan Herrera, 16; and Laurance Webb, 32—three Miami residents whose lives were stolen in brutal, unsolved homicides. Cold Case Files: Miami follows award‑winning radio host and City of Miami Police reserve officer Enrique Santos as he partners with the department’s Cold Case Homicide Unit, determined family members, and the advocates who spend their lives fighting for justice for the victims who can no longer fight for themselves.