Sean Spicer

Today's guest certainly generated a lot of buzz when he joined Season 28 of Dancing With the Stars!

Trump's Former White House Press Secretary, Sean Spicer, joins Cheryl to share his fascinating journey into politics and his time on the hardwood! Sean reveals that producers reached out to him before he even left the White House, what he requested from executives before agreeing to do the show, and his thoughts and feelings about Tom Bergeron's comments about him. 

Plus, a candid conversation about his costumes, what his partner Lindsay would always say to him, Tucker Carlson's advice about doing the show, and a spicy Rapid Fire Q&A! 

 

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
This is Sex, Lies and spray Tands with Me Cheryl
Burke and iHeartRadio Podcast. Hey guys, welcome to today's episode
where we have the unique opportunity to chat with Sean Spicer,
a name that resonated through the halls of political and
pop culture circles alike, most known for his role as
the White House Press Secretary under President Donald Trump. But
obviously it's not his time in the press room that

(00:23):
brings him to sex, livees and spray tanks. Today, Sean
Spicer took a huge leap from the political stage to
the dance floor in a move that caught so many
by surprise, joining the cast of the twenty eighth season
of Dancing with the Stars. You know, because of his casting,
there's been lots of conversations, debates, and you know, on
celebrity and politics to discuss about the sheer unpredictability of

(00:44):
his actual dance performances. Seawn's time on Dancing with the
Stars was nothing short of memorable, that's for sure, with
each week bringing a new level of anticipation for viewers.
His commitment to the show, despite facing criticism for his
lack of dance experience, showcase the side of Spicer that
many had not before. It was a period that highlighted resilience,
a willingness to step out of one's comfort zone, and

(01:04):
perhaps a search for redemption in the public eye. Today,
we're here to dive into that unique journey to understand
what drove Sean to take on such an unexpected challenge,
the lessons learned and the moment set defined his time
on one of America's most beloved dance competitions. Sean Spicer.
Welcome to the show. Hi, Sean, Hey, how are you?

(01:25):
I'm good? How are you hanging in there? Welcome to
sex Lize and Spray Tans.

Speaker 2 (01:30):
O good to be here, I think.

Speaker 1 (01:35):
Oh you think well. Welcome again to sex Lize and
Spray Tans. It's an interesting title. I know that much.
But thank you for coming on. And I really honestly
want just to get to know you as a person
behind the mirror ball, the glitter and the ruffles. Right,

(01:56):
So welcome, And I guess my first question to you
is you know who is Sean Spicer behind the politics
and the sequence? You know?

Speaker 2 (02:03):
I don't know. I think I'm a pretty fun guy.
I can be. I don't know. I'm curious I'm interested.
I'm passionate about a lot of things. I'm a pretty
loyal guy. I grew up in a pretty working class background,
so you know, I I think I'm a pretty true

(02:25):
to who I am kind of guy. What you see
is what you get. I don't know, that's that's kind of.

Speaker 1 (02:31):
The family man.

Speaker 2 (02:33):
Yeah. I was raised by two parents who are extremely caring,
who instilled a sense of family, and my father was
one of those guys that really believed that your word
was your bond, and you know, there were greater things
in life than money. And I grew up, you know,
I would say I grew up around over the course

(02:54):
of my childhood to my adult years, some people who
definitely had a lot of money, but I think looking
sometimes at their families compared to mine, I would have
I'm glad to have given up the money to have
the support of parents and of course and relationships that
we did versus what I saw a lot of people

(03:14):
who had a lot more material goods than we did,
but sometimes they didn't exactly lack the same sort of support, love, etc.
That I think I was lucky enough to have.

Speaker 1 (03:31):
That's very true. Money doesn't buy happiness. That's for sure,
but it does. But yeah, maybe freedom, but uh, freedom, happiness.
Who knows what are people's you think biggest misconceptions about you?

Speaker 2 (03:49):
It depends on when you knew me, or when you
know me from or what you've read. So that's a
tough one to answer, because I don't spend a lot
of time really caring about what some people think of me.
I mean, like, I mean, the people who know me
know me well know they can count on me. It's
just fine. I mean, it's a great question, but I don't,
to be honest, Cheryl, I don't spend a ton of

(04:10):
time thinking about people perception that I don't care.

Speaker 1 (04:14):
That's hard, I mean for me. I mean with social
media nowadays, like I wish, I wish I could say that,
but then I would be lying to you. But you know,
I mean, here's the truth.

Speaker 2 (04:22):
And I'm not kidding. Every once in a while I'll
do an event, so I wist say I saw in
your Wikipedia pageent and God's honest truth. I haven't looked
at it since probably twenty seventeen. I don't because whether
it's social media or aggregated content, and not to say
that I don't, I'm not perceptive, Like about right you
said about me, I get I still have a Google alert.

Speaker 1 (04:46):
And nothing's dangerous.

Speaker 2 (04:48):
Well, you know, there's a couple episodes of the show
from up Right, and so I will see stuff. But
that's different than caring about Does that true for me?
Do I feel like I need to go out there
and correct the record? I mean, again, I think the
people who know me know me. I don't really care
what a bunch of randoms think.

Speaker 1 (05:07):
Right right right, And random's meaning people you've never necessarily
cross paths with, or randoms like you just don't know me,
random all the above.

Speaker 2 (05:16):
I mean trolls on the Internet.

Speaker 1 (05:18):
There's lots of those.

Speaker 2 (05:19):
I mean I've actually to the extent where I've had
people say, you know, I had one interview early on
where somebody said, you know Sean. I knew Sean in college,
and I was like, I'm looking through an old Who
the heck is this part? I mean, like there's a
lot of people that I find that that want to
claim that they know you city from maybe people who
I went to college with, to to trolls, but I

(05:42):
put them all with in category. I mean, it's one
thing if somebody would have called me that is a
friend of mine or they care about or you know,
over twenty five years in the Navy, there's a bunch
of shipmates that woul call and say, dude, I got
a bone to pick with you. I care. There are
people that I really do care about the exception of
me or whatever. Beyond that, I don't. I don't really care.

Speaker 1 (06:01):
I hear you, And that could be because of your
stability in the family and the way you were raised.
You know, you don't come from a divorce family. It
seems like you've been very grounded within that and you
have values, morals and beliefs that you stick by, which
is beautiful.

Speaker 2 (06:14):
Yeah, there's also I mean, I I'll be honestly, I
think that I appreciate that. Maybe that's true, and maybe
that's why I am where I am now, But I
think I would have cared a lot more, say ten
years ago. But there's a thick skin that has to
develop through a lot of public being in the public eye,
where people are saying things about you, and you're like,

(06:34):
at some point you just have to go Okay. If
you start caring about that or you start responding to it,
that's gonna you don engulf you.

Speaker 1 (06:42):
Right, Can you share before we get to all things DWTS,
Can you share about your journey from your early career
days to becoming the White House Press Secretary. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (06:54):
So I've always told people I felt like a minor
league ballplayer. I my dad, as I said early on,
it was a yeah, he sold boats for a living,
and uh so we would have good years and bad years.
And when I was in college, I went to college
to be a Japanese language major. Really well, just so

(07:16):
everyone understands the context, when it was in the eighties
and Japan was on the ascent, and I had gone
to a school and every the people who knew me
well knew that money had been an issue in our family,
you know. Like I said, there were those particular years
were the lean and mean for us. And one of
my teachers, who I had really taken to said to me, Sean,

(07:38):
I'm going to tell you something. I know. You know everyone,
So I always I was a get rich kid kind
of kid. I sold candy books, greeting cards, I sharpened skis,
oh not, but I mean I honestly, like, at one
point I started I'd sent a letter to every parent
in my school. I was a financial aid day student

(08:00):
at at a boarding school, and so I sent a
letter to every single parent whose kid was boarding there
and said, since you can't be there with your kid
on their birthday, let me buy I mean present them
with a cake on your behalf. And so of course
I cut a deal with the local bakery.

Speaker 1 (08:17):
Oh my gosh, oh yeah, I.

Speaker 2 (08:19):
Mean this was and it was like, you know, my
dad had taught me early in life because he sold boats,
like poor people don't buy boats, I mean. And so
I started to realize, Hey, these kids have parents that
have cash. So you know, i'd send a letter and say,
please don't miss your son's birthday, send me a check,
and I'll make sure that I deliver a cake to them. Wow,
tell them how much you love them.

Speaker 1 (08:41):
I appreciate that.

Speaker 2 (08:43):
Well, so did I. I mean it was actually for
a sixteen year old kid. I did pretty well. Yeah.
But I say that because when I went off to college,
this teacher came to me and said, hey, listen, I'm
going to tell you this right now. If you're smart,
you'll go learn Japanese East there's a real need for

(09:03):
English speakers that can speak, you know, Japanese. There's obviously
a lot of Japanese speakers that can speak English. It'll
go really well on Wall Street and Da da da dah.
So I went to college. I spent you know, an
hour and a half in class and then went to
language lab and doing all this. And what I realized
early on is I didn't like it. There was no passion.
I was doing it purely transactionally. I wanted to you know,

(09:24):
I wanted a better life, and you know, I figured
if my parents were doing everything they could to make
sure that could go to college, I should come out
of there and have a career. And I got bitten
after taking a government class one day, and I was like, wow,
this is really sort of an intellectual awakening. And I
was like, wow, I'm fascinated by the role of government,

(09:45):
what it should be doing, and then furthermore, the role
of politics. How do you you know you only get
to govern if you win. What does it take to win?
How do you run a campaign? So I started volunteering
on campaigns. And I say all this because after college,
I like to tell it was like a minor league ballplayer.
I would go from city to city working on the
next campaign. You know, the first one I made one

(10:06):
thousand dollars a week. I lived in the attic of
somebody's house. A couple of years later, I lived on
in the in the backyard of another people in their
RV with no plumbing, no running, no key, no nothing.
It was but I would go from place to place,
and the idea was the next campaign, you try to
grow in stature and maybe make a little bit more money.
And so I did all that. I'll save you the

(10:27):
you know, the long version, and part of it is
after I got off, I did an asked in on
active duty from two thousand and eight to twenty eleven.
After I got off active duty, my wife and I
were trying to We're thinking about starting our family, and
so we wanted more of a stable job. And I
had gotten an opportunity to go to the Republican National Committee, which,

(10:47):
to use my ballplayer analogy, is the big League. So
my wife is like, you gotta take job. So I
did that. I ended up staying for we call three cycles,
which is six years. And in the six year Trump
with the nominee, they didn't have have much at all
of a campaign in terms of staff and experienced people.
I had obviously done already a presidential cycle. Been in
the game now for at that point twenty something years.

(11:10):
So when Trump won, there weren't a lot of people.
I mean, I love to think that I went through
this great you know, to use your world, the some
kind of audition process. It was like, hey, who's.

Speaker 1 (11:19):
Still here right right?

Speaker 2 (11:21):
One of the people. Early on, I believe in the party.
I believe that whoever the voters chose was the nominee
and that was our job is to support them. And
so I just started developed a relationship with him, started
traveling back and forth to New York to the campaign.
And then, as we all know, he won, and as
I you know mentioned, you know, we're looking around at

(11:43):
how many people had been with him were qualified to
do the job. I had actually served from the Bush
administration as the assistant US Trade Representative as part of
the Executive Officer of the President. So I had sort
of you know, White House experience, and you know, like
I said, I wish I could tell you I beat
up fifty people for the job, but I was pretty
much the only person that fit all those checked all
those boxes, and kaboom, there we are.

Speaker 1 (12:06):
So your passion was with politics, obviously, do you can
you speak fluent Japanese.

Speaker 2 (12:11):
Oh no, no, no, no, I'm sorry I forgot that part.
Not only was I not passionate about it, but I sucked.
I literally, I mean, I get this letter, I'll never
forget it. Came to it. You know, I love getting mail.

Speaker 1 (12:23):
And it's like actual mail.

Speaker 2 (12:24):
Oh yeah, I love going to the mail or.

Speaker 1 (12:26):
Like you love a mail.

Speaker 2 (12:27):
Yeah. Well no, no, no, not that, I mean old school letter,
like I still really like I. So anyway, I remember
going to my mailbox in college and the academic dean
had sent a letter. I opened it up and it
said please come see me. Uh, Professor Watsonabi says that
we're having some issues or I forgot the exact I
still have the letter just because.

Speaker 1 (12:48):
I'm like, oh wow, you really love mail.

Speaker 2 (12:51):
Not only I'm just I love mail and I'm a
packrack combined car. So anyway, I went and saw and
he was like, listen, uh, I mean the none of
it is that no matter how you translate it in
F is an f and you're failing.

Speaker 1 (13:03):
And I was like, okay, yeah.

Speaker 2 (13:06):
I not only did I not enjoy it and I
wasn't passionate about it, but I was horrible at it.

Speaker 1 (13:11):
Did you he tried? Obviously?

Speaker 2 (13:12):
Oh my god, I worked my sale off. But interesting,
I think part of it is that if you're not
into it, like my fellow classmates, you know, and I
would go to the language lab. We have these study groups.
I just they thought it was fun. They're like, hey,
Saturday night, why don't we do it? And I'm like, uh, nope,
Saturday night, I'm going out right right right, and they
you have to really have a passion. It's it's a

(13:36):
very tough language, not only speak, but the caddagun on
the hero god.

Speaker 1 (13:39):
I mean, it's beautiful there. Though I love Japan, oh
I no, no, I love Japan. No, I know, I
don't even imagine. Oh I don't.

Speaker 2 (13:48):
Love it whatever you're doing. And that's why I tell
people all the time, like I love politics. I mean
I I love reading the rules about politics. I have
a podcast every day at Sean Spicer Show, and I
tell people, I mean I I I'm sort of like
everybody you know, you with dancing you with a bunch
of further passions. And for me, I love the nuances.

(14:10):
I can tell you when some and so got elected,
what the delegate count was, and to me the nuances
and machinations of how the political system works to me,
so I love it. I eat it up. There's not
a book or a movie or a group of statistics.
I'll dive into, uh, you know, the delegate math and
figure out how it's going. And super Tuesday is a
big issue, and the conventions and the day. And so

(14:31):
for me, when that bug got when, I got bitten
by that bug and I was like, I love this.
I'm fascinated by you know, how many votes do you
need to win this? Where are we in this race?
How short is it? How much money do we need
to raise? So when that all happened, that that changed
you know, my my course U professional trajectory forever?

Speaker 1 (14:51):
Did that give you that? Like adrenaline rush? I'm sure too, right,
like the constant or competitiveness? Where do you think that
came from?

Speaker 2 (14:58):
Well? Both? I mean at its politics is marketing. You're
trying to get to vote for you, to donate, to volunteer,
to activate in some way. I mean it's a marketing exercise.
You want them to vote for you, to side with you,
to do something, to commit an action. And so I
think it's the sales background that my father instilled in me,
and that I I love. I mean, I love taking

(15:19):
an item and figuring it out how to sell it.
I Mean we talk about this when we talk about
Dance with the Stars because that.

Speaker 1 (15:22):
Was part of motivation costumes.

Speaker 2 (15:25):
Yeah, that too. But I so for me, this idea
of of how do you win? Uh, if you don't like,
I love the winning part of it. I'm a very
competitive person and I love the idea of trying to
figure out, you know, can you win this race, because
there's some races that just are unwinnable for demographic purposes.

(15:46):
But then what does it take to do it? What
is the vote count that's needed, How are you going
to do it? What's the money that needs to get raised?
So to me, that's the thrill of that. And the
thing that I love about politics is it's it's you know,
it's like a it's like a sporting event, the game.
There's a finite amount of time in the game. Election
day occurs and that's it. And so it's like when
the clock runs when ye both comes out on you

(16:08):
know baseball, I mean.

Speaker 1 (16:09):
On baseball, on game day ball or soccer, that's it over. Yeah, yeah, no,
I hear you, how do you navigate though the challenges
of like still being able to maintain your personal integrity
through it all, right, and just just in politics in general.

Speaker 2 (16:25):
Well, I would. I think there's a lot that in
every profession there's an element of do I support people
sometimes that I'm not one hundred percent with. Yeah. I
mean I've worked for probably ten plus members of Congress.
I've agreed with a single one of them. There's never
any candidate that I've agreed with. Probably that's look. I mean,
I don't think that there's a profession that you go

(16:46):
into or or a job where you go God, I
love everything about this and I think that everything they
do is one hundred percent upstanding and ethical and commit
I mean, like, maybe there's someone out there that's watching
this that can say that there is.

Speaker 1 (16:59):
But no, I hear you.

Speaker 2 (17:00):
Every time I talk to someone about their job or
their work or their employment or their industry, it's oh
my god, you're not going to believe this, or here's
what happened. You know. In politics it's just a little
bit more raw because you might see a politician say
something or switch their position on something or whatever it is.
It's just I think it's a more raw experience than

(17:22):
what you see in the rest of the workplace.

Speaker 1 (17:24):
Right, it's not covered with anything. It's like what you
see is what you get type thing.

Speaker 2 (17:28):
Yeah, I mean, I like, I know people who work
in academics and all the time they're talking about it.
Someone so got screwed on ten years right because of
this and this was it's politics. Is just what's happening
in every other workplace without.

Speaker 1 (17:41):
Well there's politics in every workplace.

Speaker 2 (17:43):
Like, it's just it's more out in the open in
the actual industry.

Speaker 1 (17:48):
More importantly, what motivated you to do Danty with the Stars?

Speaker 2 (17:54):
So a couple of things. I just to take people
back in the story. When I left the White House,
I had actually before even left, I had been approached
by them.

Speaker 1 (18:01):
You have prior to the season twenty eight?

Speaker 2 (18:04):
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, so the twenty it would have
been twenty seventeen.

Speaker 1 (18:09):
Wow, that was a while. It was that a while? Yeah,
that was a while ago.

Speaker 2 (18:13):
Well, twenty nineteen is when I did it.

Speaker 1 (18:15):
Got it? Okay? Oh my god?

Speaker 2 (18:17):
Or so yeah, so I'm trying to think, okay, twenty
six yeah, so twenty seventeen I left the White House,
I was approached at that point and said, you know,
we'd love to talk to you about this. I had
been presented with a ton of options, writing a book,
doing a speaking tour, and there was no way that

(18:38):
that would have worked with it. And Frankly and I
also at the time, I was like, of all the
opportunities I was given, I'm like, okay, I have no rhythm.
I I you know, I joked with people on the show.
I my wife and I literally didn't really dance at
our wedding. I mean like we took a dance lesson.
We turned for like four times like okay, everybody come out.

Speaker 1 (18:58):
So those are things that is this.

Speaker 2 (19:01):
The first thing that I want to do? And the
answer was no. I know you've talked about the show before.
Dina Katz, who's the one of the co executive producers
there and heads casting, and I had really hit it off,
kept the conversation going and then whatever it's twenty nineteen

(19:21):
was the year and prior to that we had had,
like I said, we'd continued talking off and on for
a year, so I kind of recognize if I was
ever going to do it again, that was it. Like
there's always so many times you get asked right, and
I started. I had a couple of conversations with people
that I know and trust and that are mentors and
friends and then obviously my family, and said, you know

(19:41):
what what why not Number one? I thought it'd last
a week. So I was like, this could be fun.
I get to La, get to see what it's.

Speaker 1 (19:47):
Like about you, Sean Spicer with your competitiveness.

Speaker 2 (19:50):
Right well, and and I thought this could be just
you know, it'll be fun, it'll be over quick. It's
something I've never done before, and there was this so anyway,
I just thought it would be kind of a cool
one off thing. I love. You know, if you call
me tomorrow and say, hey, you know we're gonna go

(20:12):
two tomorrow rafting whatever, I'm like, hey, I'll come like
I love do it. So I finally was like I
had enough people They're like, what do you have to lose?
And it well, you know that I literally have no rhythm.
I can't keep a beat. So I was like, this
will be fun. I'll fly out, I'll get to do
all the cool stuff and I'll be back in like
ten days.

Speaker 1 (20:30):
Oh my gosh, come on, you knew the deep down
inside that that wasn't going to be the case.

Speaker 2 (20:34):
No, I listen, I had no idea. It was. Lindsay
Arnold was my partner, and she says, I'm going to
tell you this, like you will go a lot farther
than you think, and I will. And I kept saying
to her, I'm like, I'm like, that's what you have
to say. But it was genuine, and I think, getting
back to my competitive and campaign spirit, you know, Dina
had said to me, just remember half the votes are

(20:56):
the judges and the other half are from people. And
I thought, okay, and I'm gonna do everything I can
to folks. I know I won't do well with the judges.
I didn't know who any of them were if you had.

Speaker 1 (21:05):
Named So you weren't a fan of the show prior.

Speaker 2 (21:07):
I wasn't. I wasn't not, I wasn't really aware of it.

Speaker 1 (21:11):
Got it? So you didn't watch like season three or
like you weren't like a closet dancer. Put it that way, not.

Speaker 2 (21:18):
Only like actually not a closet dancer. But then I
had only watched a couple of clips on YouTube.

Speaker 1 (21:25):
Got it? So you really did your extensive research before
Siby got for this.

Speaker 2 (21:29):
I talked to some folks, gotcha.

Speaker 1 (21:32):
Like my ex partner, ex partner, my old partner, Tom Delay,
did you talk to him?

Speaker 2 (21:36):
I didn't talk to Tom. I talked to some people
who dealt with with Perry, Sarah Palin Ye who I'm not,
Sarah Bristol, Crystal. I talked to Tucker Carlson, okay, and
I just did ask them.

Speaker 1 (21:47):
I'm like, listen Carlson say.

Speaker 2 (21:50):
It was funny. Tucker was sort of like, I don't know,
and then his wife Susie was like, come on, Sean,
you got to do It'll be fun. And that's where
I was just like, so I was like, exact same thing.
I was just like, you know what, it'll be fun.
Tucker literally lasted one show.

Speaker 1 (22:04):
Absolutely he did a chair dance where he did absolutely nothing.

Speaker 2 (22:09):
But I hadn't even known that. Well.

Speaker 1 (22:11):
Tom Delay would have lasted probably a lot longer if
he didn't fracture both his feet. I'm not taking responsibility
over that, but like, seriously, he just continued like the
energizer Bunny. It was, it really is. It's interesting this
whole voting process. So you know, the voting has changed
since you've been on. It's no longer so there's no
judge's pick at the end.

Speaker 2 (22:29):
There was, but it also changed the season that I
was on, so right, right, And that was explained to
me as well that prior to that it was just
last person, right, you get booted off. Yes, the season
that I got on, remember it became the bottom two
and then they get to choose.

Speaker 1 (22:44):
Yes, you can thank Bobby Bones for that one.

Speaker 2 (22:46):
Yeah. Well, I and to be honest, because I once
I realized that that voter piece of it mattered. You know.
I was literally on Sundays and Mondays, not so much Sunday,
but there's a little bit Sunday afternoon and Sunday Mondays.
I was just calling talk radio and saying, hey, guys,
tonight watch Dance with the Stars, please vote for me.

(23:08):
Here's the thing. We were doing social media posts. I
ran it like a campaign. I mean wow, I literally
was doing everything I can. I had an email list
that I would send to you, Hey, thank you. I
met with a bunch of TikTok influencers. Stop it. Oh
no kidding. On Sunday nights we would have a little
I'd say to these guys, can you please on Tomorrow
night put out a thing vote you know type sean

(23:31):
to two, one, five, two, three and boom.

Speaker 1 (23:34):
Because you wanted to stay in the competition. You didn't
feel like did you ever feel discouraged during? Because I
watched every all of your dances again and including the
judges comments and the packages before. I mean, I've been
researching obviously a lot, and I would have thought maybe
you would feel discouraged, like kind of like, you know
what I throw on the towel. This is never I'm

(23:55):
not gonna ever, you know, win the judges votes. So
I guess that's part of your name, though you don't
throw in the towel, right.

Speaker 2 (24:02):
I woke up one morning in nineteen ninety eight or
seven somewhere in there and ran a marathon.

Speaker 1 (24:09):
Just because you decided to that morning.

Speaker 2 (24:11):
Yeah, someone said, hey, I'm gonna run when you run
the first few miles and I started, and once I started,
he was like, can you just run the first five miles?
And I was like, well, I'm not going to finish,
you know, drop out of something that I start. Once
I was in, I was.

Speaker 1 (24:23):
In, right, And so that's your mentality. I think, Oh life,
I don't I love it.

Speaker 2 (24:29):
I mean, the worst thing I can do is be
dared if you say, I bet you can't. Now I'm
scared of heights. So that is one that I will
not do. But anything else, I mean, once I get going,
I'm not going to stop.

Speaker 1 (24:41):
I dare you to do mass singer or have you?

Speaker 2 (24:47):
Are you no? No, I can say it. I don't,
I don't. I don't know that I would have a
problem with that. Is there there's anhing?

Speaker 1 (24:54):
Are you a singer? Can you sing?

Speaker 2 (24:55):
No? No? No. When I say I have no rhythm,
that extends to the entire architic I mean I can't draw,
I can't sing. Whatever else is in art world music? Right? Nothing?
No bueno.

Speaker 1 (25:17):
Let's rewind a little bit. Just before the premiere, obviously,
there was a lot of controversy with.

Speaker 2 (25:25):
Let me, I'll google that.

Speaker 1 (25:27):
No, don't, you don't need to. I'm here, I'm here
for you. Yeah, live in person kind of. But what
was your feeling like that? Okay? I just want to
know behind this hard you know I'm gonna I'm a
go getter and I'm gonna, you know, get it and
I'm gonna do whatever. There's got to be a very
emotional being. I would say, like we all are we

(25:51):
all have it. I also had come across like this
person with a wall. But I'm not saying you do.
I think there is this vulnerable side to you. Did
you did it affect you at all with the controversy,
especially coming into a world where you weren't familiar with
and then with all of the backlash surrounding your you know,

(26:11):
casting basically, yeah, so two fronts.

Speaker 2 (26:15):
One, You're right, I didn't know these people, right, So
the first thing they're hearing about me, and you would think,
I mean, just to be clear, a lot of the folks,
like everybody comes, as you know, from from their world acting, singing,
modeling in the case of you know, so to be
as much as I might have been known in the
world of politics, and a lot of people didn't know me,

(26:35):
and all of a sudden, the first thing they know
is like, hey, this guy's a total jerk and half
of America doesn't like him, and here he is, And
so I was like, oh, this is not going to
go well. Like you know, you're sitting there and it's
a very the dancing world, there's a lot of intimacy.
And what I mean by that is like suddenly some

(26:56):
dude or a woman or both that sometimes are grabbing
and be like I got measure you and I gotta.

Speaker 1 (27:00):
Garbe okay, oh yeah, very touchy, and.

Speaker 2 (27:03):
I'm like, okay, all these people are now like, is
this the guy that we're not supposed to like?

Speaker 1 (27:07):
Uh?

Speaker 2 (27:08):
And that, Yeah, there's no question that. That was in
the back of my head because I'm thinking to myself,
I don't even know your name yet, and you probably
don't like me. That's number one. Number two. I had
had a discussion prior to doing the show and said,
this is not gonna I've done pr my whole life camp.
I mean, right, this is when it comes to campaigns.

(27:30):
I create strategies for candidates, firms, I mean people, companies, whatever.
And I was like, I did my own sort of
campaign on myself. And I'm like, So, I had sat
down with the folks and I said, this is this
announcement is not going to go well. I want you
to understand how the rollout is going to go. There's
going to be a backlash. People are going to say,
I can't believe you guys have So we had had

(27:50):
a lot of discussions ahead of time. The biggest fear
I had initially was I said, you know, uh, most
of Hollywood and most of the entertainment street are not
particularly right leaning.

Speaker 1 (28:03):
To be fair correct, yes, And so I'd.

Speaker 2 (28:06):
Said to them, when the controversy comes, I don't I
need a commitment that ABC, Disney, etc. Are not going
to cut bait and say we made a mistake in
casting and we're letting them go.

Speaker 1 (28:18):
Right.

Speaker 2 (28:18):
I don't need that. If you guys aren't going to
stand by me, then let's just not do this, Okay,
Like it's not worth it. I'm doing this because I
think it would be fun, it'd be something cool to try.
If you're not going to stand by me, then let's
just call it. Let's call it a day. We go
to our separate corners and no harm, no foul. I'm
good with that.

Speaker 1 (28:37):
You had this conversation with Dina and with the executives,
and a.

Speaker 2 (28:40):
Lot of the executives. In fact, I had asked at
one point, like just think about this. Don't don't say yes,
just understand that I know. And they said to me,
we've had controversy in the past. Ryan lockedin and I said,
this is going to be different. The world is very
political right now, the country is very and you're going
to get blowback, and they came back and said, Okay,
we know we got it. We've heard you, we've discussed it,

(29:03):
we have your back.

Speaker 1 (29:05):
This was before Tom bergeron and all of that stuff.

Speaker 2 (29:08):
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, this is before I signed
on the dotted line.

Speaker 1 (29:10):
It got it, got it, guys, I.

Speaker 2 (29:12):
Said, you know, Dina check Okay, so are you how
serious are you? And I said, okay, I really think
that I'd like to do this, but I need to
know that if I do move forward, before we get
into like exchanging paper, that there's a commitment that you
guys really will stand by me. And then, of course,
you know that morning happened and that changed everything real quick.

Speaker 1 (29:36):
And when what was the turnaround between that conversation versus
the announcement? I guess.

Speaker 2 (29:41):
Well, as you so that season, I think we signed
sometime in late July August. I can't remember that, somewhere
in there, right in the premiere September till September maybe
the second. Yeah, So as you recall that season, they
had they had done something. I think that was different

(30:02):
in the sense that I knew we met our partners,
you knew you were dancing with Lindsay. I I yes,
and then we practiced, and then we went to New
York for the reveal on Good Morning America. And and
so I had signed whatever let's call it, four or five,
six weeks prior, and then we had done the practices

(30:26):
and the rehearsals, et cetera, and then went to New
York to do the launch.

Speaker 1 (30:32):
Right were you were there with everyone for that though? Correct?

Speaker 2 (30:35):
So we went up, uh let's call it a week
a week.

Speaker 1 (30:39):
Prior to the premiere always something like that, Uh.

Speaker 2 (30:42):
Yeah, yeah, maybe that, but but we go to so
but that was the first time that anyone knew.

Speaker 1 (30:49):
So the partnerships, the partnership.

Speaker 2 (30:51):
So I met Lindsay, we practiced, we all went to
New York whatever that was the call it the first
week of September. It was a week or two later.
And when we were in New York, they had a
reception for us to night before GMA, and we all
got to meet the other people on the show. But
prior to that, up until that night, except for a
couple hints that the network or the PR people had

(31:14):
put out, there was really no confirmation that anyone else
anyone was on the show.

Speaker 1 (31:18):
And then when that happened, as far as like the
host of the show obviously having an issue with you
being a part of Dancing with the Stars that season.
How is that, because that must have been I don't know,
you tell me, but like it's like it's almost like
going into a new school, right, like and you want
you almost don't want to First of all, you want

(31:40):
to be accepted, I would assume.

Speaker 2 (31:43):
Yeah, but not only that, but imagine going to the
school and having the principal crap on you. Yeah, I mean,
we're as you. I mean, you've done this a million times.
You go to GMA, you meet everybody, it's going really well.
I mean, you know, I'm I'm I'm a political kid
from working I'm meeting I'm like, oh my gosh, it's
lamar owed from the office. It's like, this is cool.

(32:04):
Look at these folks. And we get through all the
GMA stuff, we get put in these vans and we're
going to like a fitting. Oh yeah, we did the
press and then we go and all of a sudden,
it was like you talk about school. It was sort
of like like you know, it was like someone knocked

(32:24):
on the door and said, can we pull mister Spicer
out of the classroom? Please, because we're all sitting around
this area and they were like put this outfit on,
take this picture, and we're all kind of hanging out.
There's a little food around, and I remember getting like, hey,
we need to talk to you. And that's suddenly and
at the same time, one of the people that worked
with me looked at me and held the phone up
and it's like, Sean, you need to see this. And

(32:45):
so they were all gathered in a conference from the
executive types and the woman who works with me like,
before you walk into that room, you need to read this.
And I'm looking at it like Okay, now I know
why they want to talk to me. And so yeah,
that was like I was like, oh my god, this
is exactly what I knew. You know. It was sort
of like I expected the backlash from the Hollywood types,

(33:09):
the TV critics or whatever it was. To your point,
like to suddenly have someone in the school do it,
I was like, I didn't see this one coming, So you.

Speaker 1 (33:19):
Didn't, so meaning see this meaning that what Tom said.

Speaker 2 (33:22):
I'm gonna put this statement out because.

Speaker 1 (33:24):
He was there during the cast announcement. Correct, yeah, he was.

Speaker 2 (33:28):
So they're like where we interacted on the so we yes,
we show up at gm A, right, they brought us
over from the Millennium Hotel, I think, and we all
go on stage. I think it was like two or
three segments, and and there's interaction between Tom and I.

Speaker 1 (33:44):
Oh yeah, no, I know.

Speaker 2 (33:46):
He literally was joking about some you know, Sean, you'll
this will be the biggest season. I mean whatever it was.
It was some ki and I'm like, okay, like I'll
play along, like I get it. I'm a funny guy,
like I'll I get it. I'll take my shots. And
that's why I thought, Okay, good, we just got through this.
Now let's go do press. And we do press, and
they I kept thinking myself, Oh, I mean, I've been

(34:08):
in this world doing media for decades. This press line,
I'm like, oh god, this is gonna and we cruised
through that. How is it? You know? Why'd you do it?
Blah blah blah, And I'm.

Speaker 1 (34:17):
Like, whoa, what did you think was gonna happen?

Speaker 2 (34:20):
I don't know, but my point was I was walking
in I can tell you. I mean, I know the
political press corps pretty much like I backed my ind
I've never dealt with the Hollywood press corps and all
of a sudden, I so on so from access Hollywood
and people, and I'm like, what are they going to
ask me? And so we get through with that boom done.
Then we get put on these vans headed over to
these studios for a bunch of you know, photos and

(34:42):
shoots and promos, and then like I said, we're sitting
around like having you know, cute little croissants and having
a kiki Well what's the key? Meaning?

Speaker 1 (34:52):
Like we're all just chatting and getting to know each other.

Speaker 2 (34:54):
Right you know? Yeah, I mean there's really nice food.
And I was like, wow, this is great. I this
and then like I said, all of a sudden, it
was like you better look at this.

Speaker 1 (35:04):
And then when that happened? When did you see cross paths?
Afterwords with Tom?

Speaker 2 (35:11):
Well, so just to back up, so I'm in this
room and they're like what do you want to do?

Speaker 1 (35:16):
Right, and I'm like, I don't.

Speaker 2 (35:17):
This isn't my I don't. He doesn't work for me, guys.

Speaker 1 (35:20):
So with the executives in the room, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (35:22):
So they put me into this conference room and they're
like this happened. We were obviously unaware. I mean cause
again I had conversations with this is not going to
go well, right, so they had don't worry. And so
the first thing I'm like, Okay, this is exactly what
I said was going to happen, and this is your test.
Are you actually going to have my back? And and

(35:45):
so I'm like, I mean this was like I kept
thinking to myself, you know, nothing wasn't writing. It was
a phone call. And I said, Okay, I'm gonna I'm ready.
I want to do this, but this to go back
a few weeks. But you know you're gonna have my back? Right?
And I wanted to know ABC Execs, Disney's execs. You
guys need to tell all of them that people are

(36:06):
gonna have boycotts and they're gonna get pissed. Are we cool? Yep.
Now I'm like, okay, this is where the test really
comes comes out. Are you going to have my back?
And I'm sitting in this room and I'm thinking to myself,
oh boy, I don't know any of these people. They
don't know me. The only one I know that I
interacted with was Dina. These other people, the BBC people
who actually oates rights or whatever. I don't know these people.

(36:31):
And so I'm like, oh god, And there's a pr
rep from every entity, like this is the Disney Guide,
this is the ABC person, this she represents so and
so and the studio and this person, you know. And
I'm like, okay, they don't know me. There's probably a
good chance what they do know they don't like. And
I'm like, okay, so this is where the hammer's gonna
come down. There say you know, Sean, appreciate you trying,
but we're just gonna have to part ways.

Speaker 1 (36:52):
But they've already announced you.

Speaker 2 (36:54):
Yeah. Well I don't know. I mean, this is not
my work.

Speaker 1 (36:56):
Right, right, right, right, We so be honestly.

Speaker 2 (37:00):
Like I said, I don't give myself credit for a
ton of stuff. But in this instance, I kicked in
the high gear and I said, okay, look we got
to kill this real quick. Andrew Litters was the EP,
and I said, I just need a statement from you
one line. We're pleased with the casting, not about me,
don't this is not about me. This is we are
something the effect of we are pleased with the cast

(37:21):
we have put together for this season. Were like, that's good,
We're good with that. And I said, and I'll just
put out a statement saying, hey, I'm excited to do
this and I hope that I prove everybody wrong. And
and they were like, what do you want us to do?
And I said nothing, because I don't want this. The
sooner that you and this is just free pr advice
for anybody, The sooner that you get beyond the controversy,

(37:42):
the better. It's like a fire stop. If you give
it oxygen, it will continue. And so my point was
nip this in the bud. Make it clear that they
were standing by me in the simplest terms, and it
wasn't going to be about me. It was about the whole.
I wanted this to be we're happy with the cast,
not about Sean. Right the second, the quote for me
had to be I'm excited to be here. I hope

(38:04):
I show everybody why this show is so great and
let's go forward.

Speaker 1 (38:07):
And it was not. It was directed not at Tom necessarily,
but it was it was a reaction from that.

Speaker 2 (38:13):
Well that was all anyone wanted to have. I mean,
it wasn't there was nothing else to react to. It
was right, you know, and everyone wanted to know because
to your point, how are you going to interact? What's
this going to mean, are you guys separated? And so?

Speaker 1 (38:27):
But also it wasn't just Tom obviously there's other outlets,
but meaning within the show.

Speaker 2 (38:31):
But I knew that I can handle all a bunch
of I mean, here, what's your point about like being
in a school like you know, it's like if I
didn't care about what people outside of course, you know
the schoolyard. Thought I cared about people in the school yard.
Are they you know? And and so? Yeah, of course,
I mean i'd seen things on Twitter when we did press, uh,

(38:53):
you know, I could see tweets from other people. There
was some showrunner from Gray's Anatomy that was like, I
hate ABC for doing the I knew that was going
to come. I didn't really care again that because back
when we talked about at the beginning here, I don't
really care. But I care about the fact that how
am I going to do a show?

Speaker 1 (39:08):
Of course I was hostings.

Speaker 2 (39:09):
I don't want you on it.

Speaker 1 (39:11):
Did you hear his interview here on the show?

Speaker 2 (39:13):
I did, well, I I know I heard, like I
I've I heard piece enough of it in pieces?

Speaker 1 (39:18):
Yes, So did you hear though, the fact that they
told him that they were thinking about you prior, way
before the premiere.

Speaker 2 (39:26):
I I know, I know I did not, Okay, but
again it's not my point in all of this was
I don't like if they want to have if those
are internal discussions. As I said when I was having this, right,
of course, you guys don't want to have me on,
don't have me on. You know, you're the you're the team, right,
I get the outside noise, it's going to happen, the critics.

Speaker 1 (39:49):
The other You also can't control what people say if
they're you know, obviously at the end of the day,
whether you're a part of the cast or not, there's
nothing that you can You can't stop Tom, that's for sure.
You can't stop anyone, right.

Speaker 2 (39:59):
I can't stop no, of course not.

Speaker 1 (40:01):
We have many executives though too. You know, it's like
there's a there's almost like, of course, I think you know,
I think they did a great job in protecting you,
for sure, but like, also, like, what do you do
with a situation that's so in a way uncomfortable.

Speaker 2 (40:15):
Well again, I mean, I'm not gonna I'm not gonna
rehash this all I will say. I mean part of
the statement that I put out after the fact was like,
look from the you know, I I've known Tom, well,
not known him, but from a humor state when I've
watched him do other shows, and he always look, I
think Tom's a great host. Actually very publicly said this.
You know, I think he should have stayed on the show.

(40:36):
I think he did a good job. I thought Aaron
and Tom were a great combination. He was funny, he
knows the material he made. He helped make the show
move well, which, as you know when you got it
was a live show. So I said, look, I think
Tom does a great job as the host, and you know,
I hope he can watch how this Actually, I thought

(40:56):
by being on the show, it was a good thing
for the country to sort of allow people to see
venues where we do. Everything has become political. And I've
said this to people all the time, Like there are
certain things where I get asked all the time. I'll
go to, you know, a dinner or party in the mackay,
can we talk to you about it? And I'm like no,
can we just talk about sports? Like you know, like

(41:21):
I there's a time and a place. And my whole
point was I love the show because one unlike a
lot of reality shows, you're not kicking somebody off, You're
not beating somebody. I I only advance if I do well,
if people vote for me. I'm not trying to push
somebody else off the island. And I thought that's cool.

(41:43):
Number two, it's family oriented. I had my kids at
that time where I think, uh, well, I'm doing the
math now like eight nine, and I can have them
watch it. I could tell if there's no swear words,
there's no proof. I mean it's it's it's good family viewership.
And as somebody who thinks there's too much crap on tellion,
this was something that I felt like, Wow, this is cool.

(42:03):
It's a family oriented show. It's about learning. It's not
meant to be there's parently a show's about being a
good dancer or being a good singer. This is about
having somebody go through a journey. And I thought, hey,
this is pretty cool. So anyway, it just but to
your point, you want to talk about like awkward. Right,
So this all happened in New York and we got

(42:24):
to get a flight a flight and go to LA
and I'm walking in and to your point, it's like
the first day at school when you show up, you know,
junior high, high school, college, and you're walking through and
you're kind of and I'm thinking to myself, everyone's looking
at me. You're the guy that we don't want here.

Speaker 1 (42:40):
What was your first reaction or what was your first
interaction with Tom?

Speaker 2 (42:44):
Then?

Speaker 1 (42:44):
Was it the premiere?

Speaker 2 (42:46):
No, I was the game blocking premiere. So I think
your listeners and viewers know that. Like the So the
show at that time aired on Monday nights. Sunday is
your rehearsal day camera blocking, right?

Speaker 1 (42:59):
And yeah?

Speaker 2 (43:00):
Yeah, So the trailers are right outside the door. Everyone
everyone that, every dancer and every every pros a trailer.
You get ready in the day, Okay, it's your turn.
And when you walk you literally it's like five yards
or whatever. Right, you walk into the to the studios,
and the hallway is where Tom and her and had

(43:21):
their little office dressing room. Yeah, addressing right, sorry, And
and then on the way to the actual dance floor,
and I bumped into Tom on the way there. This
is the first time we see each other, and he
he just looked at me and he said, you know,
I would have said the same thing if it was
anyone else.

Speaker 1 (43:36):
And I looked at him.

Speaker 2 (43:37):
I'm like, okay, and just kept walking.

Speaker 1 (43:40):
That is true.

Speaker 2 (43:43):
I just anyway, no, go ahead, no, yeah, I mean, look,
I I'm I believe in the first I mean, he
has a right to his opinion. I believe it.

Speaker 1 (43:52):
So I asked him on the podcast, I said, if
if let's say President Obama at the time decided to
do the show, would you all so disagree? And he
said absolutely.

Speaker 2 (44:02):
I think his donations in his previous comments and tweets
might not give a ton of credence to that. It's
easy to say that now his his political and again
I'm not critical. This is a show. He is a
good host. I think he I have no qualms, and
in fact, you know, with with the job that my

(44:23):
view is if you're good at what you do, do it,
and he's very good at what he does. I had
no problem with that. But you know, getting back to
a question you asked earlier, it's like, at some point,
this is the world that we live in, you don't
I don't get to love every candidate that I work for.
There are candidates that I work for that I like
better than others, that I align more with others. There
are shows that I'm sure you know, I I've heard

(44:46):
you you talk about this before. There are people that
have been on the show that you know. I mean,
let's face it, if you're gonna have controversy, there are
people that have let's just say, committed crimes or been
charged with things that that are absolutely and I'm like,
so now your your concern is me, let's get your

(45:07):
priority straight. You know, I have been accused of doing
things to other human beings, to women, and and like
now you have outrage, like I'm sorry, And again, he
has one hundred percent right to his opinion. I don't.
He has every right to do that, to express himself,

(45:27):
and so I don't. But and like I said, I
made it very clear that despite that, I think he's
good at what he does and he should have remained.

Speaker 1 (45:38):
And when that so you don't think he should have
been let go, Well, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (45:43):
I don't know the what else was going on in
that world, Like in other words, was there more contractual issues?
Had he done anything wrong in the past, did they
want to talk about future and whatever? We all know
we live in a world of contracts, and so I
don't know if he had said, you know, going forward,

(46:04):
I want this controller, you can't do this. That's not
not for me to decide. As I said, I think
he was in a good host I when I was
asked my opinion by the executives about what I thought,
I said, hey, let's move on and move forward. And
so you know, I didn't weigh in then, and I'm
not going to weigh.

Speaker 1 (46:23):
In now opinion of the exact meaning.

Speaker 2 (46:26):
Meaning they said to me when I got brought into
that room, it was what do you want us? You know,
what what do we what do we need to do?

Speaker 1 (46:32):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (46:33):
Like they were looking for and that's why I said.
My answer was one, I need a statement from you. Two.
I'm going to put out the following. Here's how we're
going to handle this. I ran, I mean, I literally
went into pr mode in crisis coming out and said,
I'm going to send this to the Here are the
three reporters that I know that will run this. Here's
here's the statement that we that you guys need to
be comfortable with coming from you. And we put that

(46:56):
plan together and then executed it.

Speaker 1 (46:58):
But I was executed it. They did, like per what
was supposed to be done, and it was done well.

Speaker 2 (47:03):
They were fantastic. They kept their word.

Speaker 1 (47:07):
And I think so you basically went in there and
did damage control, I mean ahead of time, before the
damage was done.

Speaker 2 (47:13):
It was like, you know, I was like my own
little client. Wow.

Speaker 1 (47:19):
Wow, I feel like it was a movie almost. Okay,
the wardrobe situation, Yeah, how are you so game to where? Well?
I mean, I first of all, I love and I
appreciate how you were in it. Like you were in it.

(47:42):
You weren't, from what I heard, difficult to handle. Like
it was like you just went. You went, as we say,
balls to the walls, you know, and it was like,
good on you. Because there's a lot of people I
would say that I went twenty six seasons, right, I've
had all different types from people who just did not
want to wear ruffles, fused to even shimmy their shoulders,

(48:02):
shake their shoulders. It was a fight, right. But with you,
you would think that maybe you would lean more towards
that way because you do have like a repute. I
don't know, I don't know, just I was that was
a judgment.

Speaker 2 (48:15):
What I want to finish.

Speaker 1 (48:16):
No, I would I would assume that maybe you were
more on the conservative side, meaning like not no pun intendon,
but you know what I mean, Like ruffles, like I
couldn't even get Tom delayed to wear a freaking leopard vest.

Speaker 2 (48:28):
You don't think I look good?

Speaker 1 (48:29):
And I sold that. I thought you sold it.

Speaker 2 (48:32):
I'll tell you that story in a minute.

Speaker 1 (48:33):
Oh no, charity. It was charity. Okay, So what were
did you ever have any pushback on any of it? So?

Speaker 2 (48:41):
Yeah, so let's let's take this back. So the first week,
first of all, the answer I'll start off with is
I didn't know better. Right, I had an amazing partner.
I think the world of Lindsay Arnolds. G Yes for
a better partner and Jenna and Jenna, but but in fairness,
like when I started, and not that she when she
stepped in, honest to god, seemed was amazing. But when

(49:05):
I first started, and I didn't know better, Like I'm like,
they're asking here's the music, and I'm like okay, and
then and.

Speaker 1 (49:12):
Then maybe you should have done more research with no.

Speaker 2 (49:16):
So so I had. Then all of a sudden, Lindsay's like,
so here's the first outfits, gonna be like these pants
and then we've got like a green shirt, and I'm like,
She's like, don't worry, don't worry. This is it's gonna
be great. You're all in and so this will be
awesome and life song. Yeah. So we're practicing here in
Virginia right and I won't be precise on the timeline,

(49:36):
but let's just call it like that first show, uh
you know is on Monday. The the camera blocking Sunday.
I think we flew out Thursday. Okay, so land in
La Friday morning, they're like, can you go to this
to the to this shop that you're familiar with downtown LA.
We're gonna show you know, to to do your fitting
and I will. Yeah, mister Garl he is amazing and

(49:59):
Steve amazing. We'll talk about him. I love that guy,
but give him say more, no, get it, go ahead,
don't know. He is amazing and talent and they all are.
So I get there and I walk in and I'm
like what is that and they're like that's your shirt
and I'm like for what And then Lindsay, I'm like

(50:23):
I think I don't know if I call her whatever,
and She's just like, come on, Sean, you're all in
on this, like just embrace us, and like, I'm not
the skinniest dude in the world. And I'm like, this
is not gonna look good, and so I'm like, oh god,
it adds movement and makes it.

Speaker 1 (50:39):
It's the illusion, don't you get it? With the ruffles,
Like when girls wear skirts when we spin, we're not
really that fast to be quite honest, but the rebound
of the skirt is what gets us, I'm telling you,
And the rebound of your freaking ruffles really did you
a number there?

Speaker 2 (50:53):
It was pretty Yeah, that's good spin.

Speaker 1 (50:55):
It makes you look like you had more movement. I'm
not even kidding.

Speaker 2 (50:58):
Okay, well then that's positive then anyway, So I was
just like and again that's where I was just like,
ripped the band aid off, have some fun.

Speaker 1 (51:05):
Okay, but you did have an initial holt like you
did not want to wear that at first. It wasn't
your idea. Just make it clear. Let's put this on
the record the world.

Speaker 2 (51:17):
Anyone that says you know what I was thinking tonight, Yes,
green satin ruffled shirt, like, there's no there's a few
would wants to wear that.

Speaker 1 (51:25):
That's not true. That's not true. Ah yeah, I can
name a few of my partners On Pablo de Pace,
Joe murried they.

Speaker 2 (51:34):
Probably looked a lot better in it than I did.

Speaker 1 (51:37):
I don't know who knows this shows realized after.

Speaker 2 (51:39):
The fact, like they're like, oh, you know that you can.
I mean like I wouldn't say pushback, but you could
have some input.

Speaker 1 (51:45):
And I was like, oh, who said that to you?

Speaker 2 (51:49):
A couple of people when I got asked, they're like,
why'd you put it on? I'm like, because they told me.
This is my own.

Speaker 1 (51:53):
A couple of people like not your partner, though, did she?

Speaker 2 (51:56):
Oh no, no, this was like I think Lindsay thought
this is the star. I mean she was just like no,
but I bet you.

Speaker 1 (52:00):
Lindsay was being told this from the executives that you
had to wear this. I'm not kidding.

Speaker 2 (52:06):
Well I don't know. I mean I don't know. But
she was like, come on, this is fun and we're
going to have a blast. And she was like by
the way her outfit, she said to me, if you
think what you're wearing, wait, you see I've got these
ruffled things all over my body. Yeah, but I mean so,
but I will tell you, like a couple other people,
like even cast members, like so, why do you agree
to this? I'm like, what do you mean? I'm like,

(52:27):
did I have to? And like, no, you could have
said something like.

Speaker 1 (52:29):
Is that from the other crows or the other celebrities,
the other celebrities. Yeah, don't listen to them. Don't listen
to those people.

Speaker 2 (52:35):
Yeah, well it was over I mean by yeah exactly.

Speaker 1 (52:39):
But let me tell you though, that's why I believe.
Of course, there's a lot of factors that come into
you lasting so long. But I think that that is
what was so endearing, really was to see you just
not in a way be so in your head. Because
that's the problem. The people that don't succeed on Dancing
with the Stars are the people that are overthinking it,
that don't feel like they look cool. Don't sign up

(53:02):
for a dance to go with the stars if you're
trying to be cool. I'll tell you that much, because
the more it's just it doesn't come across as cool.
Let me tell you, it's like you have to let
it go when you when.

Speaker 2 (53:11):
You, I mean, you're you asked us in the beginning,
like I love to I love to play practical jokes,
I love to have fun. I mean, I've I've been
the White House Easter Bunny, I dressed up national like,
so I don't I mean, I mean, if you think
I just if you take yourself too seriously in life,
just that you only have one time I have some fun.
And that's kind of how I approached the show. It's like,
you know what, have fun? Yeah, and you know, going back,

(53:34):
like part of the problem was is that the only
introduction people had had to me, who had seen me
at the White House podium, thought I was an angry leprechaun,
and so it to'd be like, hey, here's a guy
that can actually have fun and joke with him a joke,
you know, take a joke that was important the other
thing that was interesting, and this goes to your point.
I remember it was like, I don't know, week five,
weeks six, something like this. We're doing camera blocking and

(53:56):
I can remember exactly where I was on the dance floor.
I I probably could pick out the individual and this
I don't know what their title was, so I'm not
even gonna try to fake it. This guy pulls me
aside after my my rehearsal the first run, and I think,
what do you get? Three right? Three passes or something?
Three pulled me by the first one. He said, can

(54:16):
I just tell you something? And I was like, yeah, sure.
He goes you didn't look happy at all, And I'm like,
what do you mean? He goes, you looked mad doing
that thing, or frustrated, whatever the word. And he goes,
you know, what is this for your salsa? I don't
remember it was it for week four five? And he says,
people love your journey and that you're happy, you're enjoying this.

(54:37):
If you don't look like you're enjoying it anymore, they're
not going to vote for you. And I was just like, okay,
like have like I I had forgotten to have fun
part because I was so into the you hit this step,
do this, do the affectionism and and his point was,
if you don't look happy anymore, people aren't good. Like

(54:57):
the journey that people enjoy watching you is that you're
doing something that you're completely not good at, that you're
having you're trying to get better, and you're enjoying it.
If you're not happy and enjoying it anymore, they're not
going to stay with you.

Speaker 1 (55:09):
And I was like, good point, that's wise words, seriously,
and that is that is definitely the case. It doesn't
matter how great of a dancer you are. First of all,
there's no such thing as perfectionism, especially with ballroom dancing
in general. Like, but most of the time, the camera
is a close up of your face, you know, so
like whenever I always say, whenever anyone messes up, I'm like,
don't even fuss about it, Like, don't show it on

(55:29):
your face because most likely no one in the world
saw this. It was a close up of your right
eyeball or whatever it was. You know, you don't need
to like put so much stress on yourself. Did how
much did this show consume your life? Did you expect that?

Speaker 2 (55:45):
Uh? No, I didn't. But again, remember I didn't know
what to expect, right. Two things. One it was every
I mean I would do I had some you know,
some pr clients at the time, and I was I
was doing stuff on the side here and there, some
speeches that I had given I you know, did that
on the side then, so we would, we would We

(56:05):
went to different places to practice. I did part of
a tour with Florida, Georgia, lying part of a veterans
organization that I'm with, and so there were a couple
of times when I was on tour at the different
tour stops.

Speaker 1 (56:17):
While you were doing Dancing with the Stars.

Speaker 2 (56:19):
Yeah, so we practiced in West PONMD Beach. We did
want it. I think it was we did one and uh,
I'd have to look at the tour, but yeah, so
but it we came, and then, like I said, I
was doing interviews. I was you know, I was trying
to do. I mean, I I got it and I

(56:40):
had fun with it, and I would call in a
radio stations, Hey, we're having fun doing this. Please call
you know, uh, text tonight, hit this, go to ABC
dot com and vote for me. Ten time, I knew
that that was the only way I was staying. But
you know, when it starts, they always say Dan at
the Stars is like a family, and you don't know
what that means. It's easy to say it. It's like

(57:01):
a nice tagline just because I was at I don't
know that she wants me to say this, but I
was at Laura Lane's wedding last week.

Speaker 1 (57:09):
Like I've congratulations well for her, Yeah that's what I meant.

Speaker 2 (57:15):
But like, there are some I stay in touch with.
Definitely a handful of the cast members, a bunch of
you know, the pros. I went and took my kids
to the tour, the live tour, I mean if you
told ten years ago Sean that he was going to
spend a Friday night at the Gaylord here and just
over the bridge in Maryland to go to a Dancing
with the stars, they would they would have been like,

(57:39):
you nuts? Are they serving beer? Like what's going up?

Speaker 1 (57:41):
And free beer?

Speaker 2 (57:43):
The free cocktails. So but I took my kids. They've
they've loved the show. We've watched it every season since
we vote. You know, Riley Arnold is on now, and
so we got to passing the torch to hey, we're
going to support We're all on the Arnold family that
but and not just you know, uh, but I was
huge Daniella had a great season last year and I

(58:05):
was texting her awesome and it's like, it's a great,
great group of people that I'm proud you have gotten
to know and to stay in touch with, all the
way down to some of the makeup folks who congratulations
again to them for another amazing season and their Emmys. Uh,
to craft services that are people that put out the food.

Speaker 1 (58:26):
No, it's a machine, the show it is.

Speaker 2 (58:28):
But there's I can't say enough. I've always joked like
if they do anything again, I wish there was like
a Dancing with the Stars comic con version thing, because.

Speaker 1 (58:40):
I don't wish I'm telling you right now, there might
be an All Stars. It might be you against Tom Delay.
You never know. Hey, I'm so you would do the
show again.

Speaker 2 (58:52):
I love the people. The experience was awesome the way
you're taking I mean, like, you.

Speaker 1 (58:59):
Know, yeah, better than the White House, I'm assuming.

Speaker 2 (59:02):
Right, But I just I really enjoyed the experience, and
there's a great group of people that are part of it.
I'm honored that Dina stuck with me. And you know,
like I said, I I still text with a lot
of folks from the show. You know, Stephen Lee, who

(59:23):
I mentioned, is the costume designer, an amazingly great human
being and definitely talent. So I I just I can't
say enough good things about the show, and I was
really excited to be part of it. I actually I
just saw Sarah Evans right when I hosted Sara when
I hosted my show on Newsmax, before I started this

(59:47):
podcast that I have now, it was amazing how many
times we'd have guests on John Schneider, Sarah.

Speaker 1 (59:52):
Evans, I've done alumni.

Speaker 2 (59:56):
Yeah, Oh my gosh, I can't even I'm trying to
remember a couple of the other ones. A gentleman from
I think he's Wisconsin. Uh, the bullet train guy Joe, No, no, anyway,
But it's when you look through the number of people. Uh,
I was at this charity event. My wife is on
the board of the National Council for Adoption. We're at
this event and there's a guy. I walk in and

(01:00:18):
we're staring at each other, and this person walks up
to me and goes, hey, dummy, that's the Marcus Square.
I'm like, I know. So he's looking at me. I'm
looking at him and everyone's trying to like break the ice,
like you know that show on Spicer. And he's like,
I can tell that he's you know, it's like a
high school dance.

Speaker 1 (01:00:33):
Yeah, I know who he is.

Speaker 2 (01:00:36):
I mean, I'm football fan. And finally we walk over
to you and I look at him and go Lindsay
Arnold and he's like, that's it. I knew he because
he had been Lindsay's partner.

Speaker 1 (01:00:45):
I think it was Peter. Was it Peter Lindsay? It
was Lindsay Lindsay Lindsay events.

Speaker 2 (01:00:53):
FaceTime from the event, But that's okay. Connection. Once you're
on the show, it's like you have this bond even
with previous season cast members.

Speaker 1 (01:01:02):
Yes, you've been through. It's called trauma bonding. Okay, No,
I'm kidding. I'm kidding, Bobby Bones. That's the quote from
Bobby Bones's mouth. But you're right. And this is why
I love the podcast, because like, I haven't caught up
with some of these people in over close to twenty years,
you know, and a lot of the pro dancers, So
it's beautiful. Are you ready for rapid fire?

Speaker 2 (01:01:32):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:01:33):
Thanks Sean. If Trump were to do Dancing with the Stars,
who do you think his pro partner should be? I'm retired,
don't even say it.

Speaker 2 (01:01:40):
Oh, I've heard a couple of these before. I didn't
think this is where you're going to start. I'm just
trying to.

Speaker 1 (01:01:51):
Think, Hey, well there's Daniella, there's I'm trying to think too,
oh right, Riley, No, I'm kidding.

Speaker 2 (01:01:58):
No, I think you'd want someone a little I know
that the pro player, Peter Trump's tall. I don't know
that that always matters.

Speaker 1 (01:02:03):
I don't know, maybe petera yeah, Peter, I don't know.
I'm just thinking, like I have to say, Trump is
a fan.

Speaker 2 (01:02:08):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:02:09):
I ran into him at the Meredith Via show decades ago.
I'm not even kidding, and he literally barged into my
dressing room and shook my hand and he goes, Cheryl,
I'm a huge fan of dance sars. I was like, oh,
this before he was president obviously.

Speaker 2 (01:02:23):
Anyway, well, yeah, I the night that I got off,
the night that that I didn't move forward, however you
phrase it, didn't.

Speaker 1 (01:02:30):
I went back to go to the semi finals. I
guess right by the way, it's like my bio and
a quarter finals quarter Biola is yes and proud.

Speaker 2 (01:02:39):
So I but I looked at one of the people
who works with me and I said, oh, I wonder
if I should call the president. And she looks at
me and she goes, he's tweeting. So I called. I
called the White House operator and she said, Jean for you.
Well he had so she was like, it was twenty
minutes ago, so he knows you're up. He's obviously that
I called the White House operator, She's in, mister spice
of the President's waiting for you.

Speaker 1 (01:03:00):
Oh my gosh, I love that. See he's a closet dancer.

Speaker 2 (01:03:04):
You just know. I think the key, the key to
me that I've learned is that your partner has to
understand your strength and their weaknesses. And that was great
about Lindsay is that she was just like, Okay, you're
I need to be patient, and she she just there
was never ever a moment where she got frustrated. She'd
be like, Okay, why don't we do that again? It

(01:03:25):
was like talking to a four year old.

Speaker 1 (01:03:28):
Thank god you didn't thank god I wasn't your partner.

Speaker 2 (01:03:30):
Well, there were a couple of times when I saw
some of the other couples and I'm like, I couldn't
do that because.

Speaker 1 (01:03:34):
Right right, I think it depends on the partner.

Speaker 2 (01:03:37):
That's why she's such a great mom. I see these
videos of hers, I'm like, because she has the patience
of a like to deal with the two year old
who I was like, the two year old equivalent to dancer.
And she'd be like, Okay, why don't we try that
again with your left foot?

Speaker 1 (01:03:50):
And then your left foot. She has the like slash
one is an L your other left, your other left right.
That's great. Okay, So have you and Trump competed on
the show against against one another? Who do you think
would win the coveted Mirror Ball Trophy. I mean, my
money's on you.

Speaker 2 (01:04:08):
I think I could do better with the judges, but
he would do better with the votes.

Speaker 1 (01:04:11):
Do you think you could do better with the judges?
That's mean, yeah, he does this.

Speaker 2 (01:04:16):
I like, he'll kill at me on the on the votes.
But I think this right where I finally could get
Bruno to say something nice.

Speaker 1 (01:04:25):
A leg up, no pun intended. What politician do you
think should do dancing next? And why? Before you answer that, though,
do you believe that politicians should like do you believe
they should continue to cast politicians? Why are I not?

Speaker 2 (01:04:41):
I look, I'll say what you have to have the
right mentality. You shouldn't cast someone because they're a politicians.
You should think that they bring something to the show. Right,
So I look, I've loved the casting now that I've
gotten into this, and I think Dina has a great head.
And to understand that balance what makes it's not one casting,

(01:05:02):
it's that whole what I've started Maroauderie. It's the season
who's on you know, so you have a player obviously
you know someone who's on the Bachelor or whatever, And
there's a balance of different types, So I would leave
it to the to the to the smart people to
decide what what works well as opposed to who works well?

Speaker 1 (01:05:20):
Right right, right? Okay, So who do you think should
do it? If she does cast a politician next season.

Speaker 2 (01:05:27):
I think Kevin McCarthy, the former speaker, actually would do
well and he'd be good. He's you know, but yeah,
I'm just off the top of my head. He's had
he's probably has some more time on his hands these
days too, so he could do that, right.

Speaker 1 (01:05:40):
How has participating in Dancing with the Stars impacted your
life in career post show?

Speaker 2 (01:05:48):
I think positively. I mean there's a plat of I mean,
the show has a huge, huge, loyal fan base, and
the number of people who, as I said, got to
see me beyond yelling at people as an angry leprechaun
suddenly grew and it was like, hey, I love that
package that you did, or you know, I saw that
dance that you did with Lindsay and it was really
cool that we could tell. So I've, in case you

(01:06:10):
can't tell, a huge fan love what it. So I
was really excited to be part of it and it's
been a huge bonus.

Speaker 1 (01:06:17):
To my life I'm actually really sad he didn't wear
your ruffled shirt for this interview. How dare you?

Speaker 2 (01:06:21):
It's chilly.

Speaker 1 (01:06:23):
That's what pasties are for. Favorite Judge Derek Huff second
favorite judge.

Speaker 2 (01:06:36):
I kind of I will give it to Len And
I say that because he I don't know. I think
he just he It was sort of like I always
felt like I was having a conversation with my grandfather
where he'd be.

Speaker 1 (01:06:50):
Like, yeah, you know, I know you're trying, but you
still aren't good.

Speaker 2 (01:06:56):
Right.

Speaker 1 (01:06:57):
Last one, If Tom Bergeron was listening to this episode,
would you like any words for him? What would you
like to say to him?

Speaker 2 (01:07:03):
I think I've said it all before. I think he's
a great host. I hope that I said at the
outset that I hoped my participation in that show would
be a way for the country to realize that there
are venues when we can all come together, put aside
politics for at least a couple hours, and enjoy ourselves
and show that there are things that we can all
come together on. I think that I succeeded in that

(01:07:27):
during that season, that the bonds that I made at
the show with my fellow cast members, with the pros
with the things, and then the reaction to the audience
shows that if we don't lead by example and do
things where it's not all political and we're not mad
at each other, then we're part of the problem. I
think that that season showed that the more that we

(01:07:51):
do things that put people together where they might be
opposed and show that despite our differences, we can actually
enjoy each other's company, that's what we need more of,
not less of. Thank you, Sean, Thank you, Cheryl.

Speaker 1 (01:08:05):
I really appreciate your time.

Speaker 2 (01:08:06):
You're prom Thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:08:08):
Make sure you guys follow us at sex Lies and
spray tands on our Instagram handle and make sure your comment.
Let me know who you want me to interview. What
do you all think?

Speaker 2 (01:08:17):
Let me know