May 30, 2025 • 50 mins
It’s one thing to deal with your own anxiety, but when your kids are struggling with stress, that can be next-level nerve wracking!
So, Oliver is turning to two pros, therapists Ashley Graber and Maria Evans for some advice.
Hear how he’s not the only one dealing with anxiety in the Hudson household, and what he’s going to do about it.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hi.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
I am Kate Hudson and my name is Oliver Hudson.
Speaker 3 (00:08):
We wanted to do something that highlighted our.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Relationships and what it's like to be siblings. We are
a sibling railvalry.
Speaker 4 (00:21):
No, no, sibling rival.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Don't do that with your mouth, Vely, that's.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Good, Ah, Oliver Hudson, It's Oliver Hudson, Oliver Roules Hudson.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
I just went on a run and I'm a little sweaty,
and I'm taking a million supplements and I'm injecting myself
with peptides and I'm getting to this place it's strange
where I don't even know who I am anymore. I'm
(01:08):
transitioning from like an old Oliver to a kind of
a new Oliver, shedding a bit of skin, so to speak,
like a fucking snake where all of a sudden, I'm
not drinking, I'm not smoking cigarettes, I'm not doing anything.
I'm eating healthy, I'm taking supplements and I feel incredible.
But at the same time, I'm like, who am I?
(01:29):
I have to like adjust to this new me and
I'm not sure how it's going anyway. Maybe I can
talk to our guests about these issues, even though they are.
I think they're child therapists, but I think they're family
and child so their parents too. Maybe they can help
(01:50):
me out. This is a pretty good segue. It was unintentional,
but Ashley Graver and Maria Evans, let's bring them on
and let's talk about my my problems.
Speaker 4 (02:01):
Shall we?
Speaker 5 (02:02):
Hi?
Speaker 2 (02:03):
There? Hi, Oliver, Hey, guys, how are you good?
Speaker 5 (02:07):
Nice to meet you?
Speaker 2 (02:09):
So in my intro because I do weird intros and
you know whatever, But I was talking about myself. We're
going to get into kids. I've been in therapy for
a thousand years. I went to the Hoffmann Institute. I'm
always trying to work on my shit. It's never ending,
and I think that is a comforting thing to sort
(02:32):
of think about because we're looking for an end and
there is no end. We are all going to suffer
throughout our lives, but it's just about mitigating it and
understanding why we suffer, which helps, right. I mean, this
is my own interpretation. Suffering may be a large word,
but you know, it's a never ending process. Because there
is no end. We can always sort of be better,
(02:54):
we can always be introspective and want to understand who
we are. Sometimes though I wish I didn't, because I
know people who don't give a shit, you know, and
it's almost like their lives are better because they just
don't care. They just accept who they are, all flaws
and everything, and have no desire to sort of change
(03:15):
or shift, so there's no anxiety attached to it. You know,
I'm anxiety prone, you know, since my twenties. I'm on
legs of bro and you know I'm a very sensitive
sort of being, I guess. But anyway, I was just
talking in my intro about how I'm starting this new
sort of chapter in my life where I am on
(03:40):
a healthcake. I was drinking too much, I was smoking cigarettes.
I was just in a foggy, shitty place. I decided
to do a battery of tests, taking supplements, taking peptides,
not drinking, and I feel incredible. Okay, but here's the psychology.
It almost feels like I don't know who I am.
More strangely, I'm so used to that other person that
(04:06):
there is some anxiety around even feeling like my best
self because of transitioning into sort of someone who I'm
not too familiar with. Does this make sense in any way?
Speaker 5 (04:19):
It does? It absolutely makes sense. It you know, when
we are used to doing things a certain way, getting
to know doing it a different way is uncomfortable because
it's unknown. We sometimes talk about if there's a dirty
pond and a clear pond, and you're used to swimming
(04:40):
in the dirty pond, but somebody says, hey, there's a
clear pond next door, why don't you go swim in.
It makes a lot of sense you'd want to go
get in that clear pond. But most people get in
that clear pond and say, wait a minute, I don't
know this pond at all. I'm going to go back
to the one that I know. And it's not that
we're going to make changes overnight or be used things.
(05:00):
We kind of have to get used to this idea
of we're going to take one. It's that idea of
when one step forward a couple of steps back, we're
gon we're going to try to get used to something
and maybe default back to what we already know as
we're moving towards something different.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally. I mean I have friends who
are like that in sort of the dating world. You know,
older guys like my age or fifty, who are so
used to living and so comfortable in the chaos that
in order to step into something healthy they can't, you
know what I mean. It's easier to live in the
pain of the chaos and the uncertainty in the back
(05:39):
and the forth, even though it's so destroying for them,
and they don't understand why why can't I find love?
Why can't I do this? I'm like, well, because you're
just comfortable in the why you're comfortable in all of that?
You know, and when you make an effort to step
outside and to find some purity or to try to
work on yourself, I fucked out. Let me just go
(06:01):
back to this. So interesting.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
Yeah, And as someone who's done a lot of therapy,
you probably know that our unconscious minds are drawn to
recreating the patterns that we're used to, even if they're
not good for us. So we'll find ourselves drawn again
and again in the same dynamics, the same situations, not
wanting to be but just drawn there. And part of
therapy is becoming more aware so that you can make
(06:24):
a different choice.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
Do you think that's a learned behavior or do you
think there's it's a primal thing. You know, I'm wanting
from an evolutionary standpoint and going back and getting a
little deeper on it. But you know, I totally agree
with that our subconscious sort of takes us back to
those things. I wonder if that was some sort of
a defense mechanism, you know, for back in the day,
or if this is something that is sort of environmental,
(06:47):
so to speak.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
That's a very good question. I guess I would wonder
when did the unconscious mind develop? Did Caveman have an
unconscious or were they just operating out of pure impulse?
Speaker 4 (07:00):
You know?
Speaker 1 (07:00):
And and where did those behavioral patterns get set. We
know that once you're used to even you know, opening
your milk a certain way or opening the door a
certain way, that you're going to do it every single
time the same way. Right, So we know some things
are totally wired.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
That's a great question, early man, Caveman, I mean, did
they have I think of course they must have had
an unconscious mind. How why wouldn't they?
Speaker 4 (07:23):
Yeah, I mean we know that animals dream.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
Yeah, yeah, Oh we've tapped into something. Maybe that's our
that's our next book, the three of Us. This is
Caveman the unconscious mind.
Speaker 4 (07:36):
That's right. Let's go back to those times. How did
cavemen date.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
Yeah, I mean, honestly, it would be a pretty evil
So I had a dating book for the caveman. Well,
I love that you guys are in the child world,
you know, and doing what you're doing. I have three kids.
As I told you, I have experienced anxiety in my life,
(08:04):
and my oldest, when he was in eighth grade, went
through it. And it started with him sort of disassociating
and telling me that he doesn't feel real, which I
could completely relate to him. I was like, ah, fuck,
you know, I was like, good news, bad news. Bad
news is I know where this is going. Good news
is is that I've been through this, so I can
(08:25):
help you, you know, and I'm not fearful, you know.
And I had to keep him home for like a month.
We did, my wife and I because he was just
in this space, and we didn't put him on medication,
and you know, I didn't want to do that. He
was young and he was just journaling, and I taught
him some meditations and you know, he would sit outside
(08:46):
and write his journal. Sort of things that I did
to help myself get out of it in my twenties,
and it seemed to have worked, you know, I guess
the question is children anxiety. You know, how much of
an uptick are you seeing? And what are some of
the best sort of ways to speak to your child
(09:07):
if you haven't experienced yourself, to try to help the
little one.
Speaker 5 (09:11):
It's kind of the most one of the most common
questions we get is if we see anxiety rising in kids,
and we really have seen a lot more anxiety. Kids
are exposed to a lot more, they're experiencing things at
earlier ages, and the world is more worrisome. I mean,
(09:34):
it's kind of why we named the book, gave the
book the title that we did, of raising Calm kids
in a world of worry, because there is so much
and the thing that we would start by saying is
really listen if you don't know what it is that's
going on, to listen to what a child is saying
(09:57):
and believe them. Like what you said, just believe what
they're saying and try not to dismiss it or fix it,
which is what we often want to do when a
problem is brought to us and we feel uncomfortable with
it because maybe we don't know about it. We just
don't want the person to be suffering. That is bringing
(10:17):
us something.
Speaker 1 (10:20):
Yeah, it's such a hard time to parent right now
because there's so much coming at parents. It's a totally
different time. There's technology, there's AI, there's all these different things.
There's the news, there's social media, everything that none of
us had to deal with as kids. Really, and so
parents are really you met with this great challenge, which
(10:44):
is how do I raise a kid that's not completely
terrified of the world that I don't even know how
to walk them through?
Speaker 5 (10:50):
Right.
Speaker 1 (10:51):
So our book is all about and our philosophy is
about the idea that you can raise kids who generally
have a greater sense of safety through the way that
you parent, so that even when they do feel anxious,
they have those tools, they know what it is, they
can come to you.
Speaker 4 (11:08):
They've got a.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
Sense of belonging in the family. And so we've got
all kinds of tips and you know, whatever you'd like
to chat about. We can kind of go in that direction.
But so many ways to parent to create that environment
so that they're not shaking in their boots every day,
you know, and so you're not either.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
There's not one right way to do it right. All
kids are different, all parents are different, But as far
as the freedoms that our kids don't have anymore because
of the fears that we have as parents, Like how
do you navigate that so they're not afraid of everything
and sheltered.
Speaker 5 (11:43):
Such a good question, and building a strong connection to
your kids is going to be such an important piece
of it, because, as you said, there are things going
on that we have to deal with, and if a
child feels like they can come and talk to you
about it, whatever it is, then then you can let
(12:05):
them roam a little bit more free if they feel
like they can come back. I remember growing up, we
had this contract that if there somebody was drinking and driving,
we signed a contract with our parents and if somebody
was drinking and driving, you could call them. You call
your parents and they would come and pick you up
and there would be no conversation that night, you wouldn't
get in trouble. You would talk about it the next day,
(12:28):
and you know whatever the family sort of decided in
that moment, but that there was this understanding that you
could fall back on your parents. And that's so much
of what we try to teach is that if you
have this bond and you and your children know that
(12:48):
you can come to you. Then whatever is happening, that's
that's changing in the world is okay for them. And
if you're if you're talking about things like we asked
a lot about social media, to teach good practices to
talk to your children about the things that are going
on versus kind of ignoring it or not speaking about it,
(13:14):
because in that way, then a child knows okay. I
know I can come to my parents, you know, or
I know that they're going to be there to talk
to me about something if there's something scary that comes up.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
Playing Devil's Advocate with that, you know. I think inherently
kids are mischievous. That's just part of the growing up process.
And I've created an open space for my kids to
talk about whatever the hell they want. We're very liberal
parents when it comes to that, you know what I mean.
I haven't forgotten what I was like at sixteen seventy
(14:00):
years old, and I don't want to be a hypocrite.
And that's my biggest pet peeve is hypocrisy. That's why
I can't stand politics. But that's a whole other discussion.
So if I'm thinking about what I was doing at
fifteen sixteen, seventeen and then getting on my kids for
doing similar things. It doesn't feel good to me. Now,
it doesn't mean I can't teach some sort of a
lesson anyway. The door is always open for them, but
(14:22):
they don't always tell the truth. They're always they sneak,
they do their shit. And my kid was very simple
and he said, they're all great, they're all great kids.
But I was on him about something and why didn't
you tell me this? It's always open door. You know
that you can do that? And he goes, Dad, what
am I supposed to just tell my dad everything I do?
(14:43):
And I was like, wow, you know what. You're right,
of course you're not. This is a rite of passage.
You try, you will get caught because I used to
do it myself, so I know what's up. And now
we have ring cameras in life three sixties that you're
completely fucked? What about that though? You know? Because we
(15:03):
can't expect our kids to just be all open and
honest and vulnerable all the time. Do we give them
some leadway, I mean, I do for when they might lie,
or they might sneak out, or they might do something mischievous,
or do we have to get on their asses.
Speaker 1 (15:16):
No, you've got it, You've got it right. It's really
important to be understanding of that process. They need privacy.
You know. As they become teenagers, they start to really
develop that sense of self that's totally separate from you,
and that can be hard for a lot of parents,
but you know, they become really pure focused. But the
thing to really think about in those preteen teen years
(15:38):
is kids. As much as you want to be the
totally cool parent that's like, I know you're going to lie,
I know you're going to smoke, I know you're going
to drink. Kids need a boundary to push up against.
So you don't want to be so like you were describing,
just so tight that you don't let them explore the
world at all. But you also don't want to be
all the way wide open because then they have absolutely
(15:58):
nothing to push up against. So you want them to
know something like, oh, my dad's totally going to kill
me if I don't check in at midnight and tell
them where I am. You want them to have that
feeling so that they do check in, or so that
maybe they don't come home at twelve, but they come
home at twelve fifteen versus I know you're a teenager
and you're just going to waltz in anytime, so whatever, right,
(16:19):
because then they might come in at four am, so
that makes sense. You want to keep in mind that
your job is still to hold boundaries so that they
get to experience going against them. The trick is finding
where does that boundary lie so that they get to explore.
But also they don't just go completely haywire.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
That's so important. I couldn't agree more. I mean, and
I wrestle with that. We wrestle with that a little bit,
but well we have boundaries. But again it's about figuring
out sort of you know, it's like a dog pen
for a puppy, like how small you're going to make it,
you know, or how big are you going to make that?
And I think that that is to each their own.
(16:58):
There is something there's personal. It's personal, you know. For me,
it's big moments, you know, like like the other day,
my kids have these surrongs. You know, they're like basically motorcycles.
I mean it's you know, they have helmets. My wife
is cannot believe that I'm letting me do this, but
you know, they ride around, they'd ride into Westwood and
my kid rode to school today, you know, on his suran,
(17:20):
and I come home and the bikes are gone and
the helmets are in the garage and I'm lenient, but
that's a big fucking no no. And they came back
and I just ripped them, you know. I was like, dude,
part of it is like I give you so much,
you know what I mean? Like this is these there
(17:41):
are certain things where you sort of pick your battles,
you know, so where they can sort of hear that
and understand that. But you're right, the boundary thing is important.
But then again, there are parents who like are too restricted,
I think. And that's actually my next question because you
work with parents, well right obviously, so have you found
(18:03):
a pattern? I know everyone's different, but is there something
if you were to pull all the parents or pull
your experiences with these parents, is there a through line
with like the new parent that you see a lot of.
Is it fear? Is it worry? I mean, is there
something that is a through line? Or is everyone completely
(18:27):
unique and different?
Speaker 5 (18:28):
I would say one of the things we see so
often is really not wanting to talk about the things
that they should talk about. But maybe they didn't. They
didn't have a model for that growing up. They didn't
(18:48):
have Your children will likely have a similar relationship with
their children where and perhaps you do with your parents,
or you did it completely differently. But we see that
often a parent will say like, I don't want to
expose my child to such and such, and because there
(19:09):
is so much more now, it's too early, I don't
want to talk about it. And we see it a
little bit differently. We want to talk about things age appropriately,
but we do want to talk about things, and there's
just as Maria said earlier, there's just so much now
that parents are balancing that they didn't have to before
(19:31):
that that seems to be a really common thing that
comes up. It's like, oh, I don't really want to
I don't want to talk about that thing. I don't
want to scare my children. I don't want them to
be thinking about something earlier than they should be. When
what we know from the work that we do and
also from working with kids directly, is that they just
(19:52):
generally do.
Speaker 2 (19:53):
Know what's going on.
Speaker 5 (19:54):
They're hearing about it in some way or another, whether
it's their older sibling, their friends, will their sibling at
school on the news and the house. They see a
phone that somebody's holding, they overhear a conversation.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
Oh my god, I know. I think these kids soak
it up their ears or to their ears are to
the ground. They they they we don't think they're listening,
but they are listening. Oh my gosh. It's scary sometimes
you know everything, oh here everything. Were talking in the
room as my oldest like, what were we saying? I'm nothing,
(20:32):
nothing like.
Speaker 4 (20:33):
What bionic ears they have them?
Speaker 2 (20:36):
Like you were talking about so and so? Well, what
was that like? You sort of raise your voice a
little bit. I'm like Wilder, says Wilder. Wilder, it's this
is not doesn't concern you, I know, but Dad like,
what was it? I mean, he will not let it
go persistent. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:52):
The other thing is with social media, they can access everything.
They know so much they don't need to come to
you and ask you about something they and oftentimes they'd
rather look it up because then they don't have to
have the awkward conversation.
Speaker 4 (21:03):
You know. So I think so much sooner than anybody thinks.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
Oh my god, especially now that they're on all the trends.
You know, my kids, you know, it's disturbing when I
give them what I think is some wisdom on a
subject and like, well, AI said that, I'm like, hey,
I said, now AI is a human. I mean, I
know that we're getting there, but like, can we just
(21:27):
put the brakes on for a second, AI said, I
don't like that totally. I've been resistant to it, just
from a conscious but still an unconscious level. I you know,
I love the outdoors. I'm pretty analogue. You know, I
have a boat, and I love the mountains and I
fish and all that. But some reason, for some reason,
(21:50):
I resistant, you know, even though I should probably get on.
Speaker 1 (21:53):
Well, it's super threatening, right, especially with how fast it develops.
It's really scary to imagine where it's going to go.
Oh and at the same time, as parents, there is
a tremendous responsibility to learn AI because the kids already
know it, and you know, most parents don't even necessarily
know yet just what AI is capable of. Even now
(22:16):
you know that you can open up an email draft
and an AI letter is just written for you as
a response, or you know, obviously writing essays with AI,
which a lot of schools have banned, and things like that.
But even more than that, you know, it's it's it's
really amazing and and scary at the same time. But
it's kind of like if you remember when the iPhone
(22:37):
came out. If if all the parents were like, oh no,
we're not getting iPhones, they would they would just be
in a different world than the kids.
Speaker 2 (22:45):
It's another great point and one I should probably advice
that I should take, which is you're right, we as
parents and adults have to learn it because the kids
know it, so we have to know it. I mean,
they're so versed in it. It's crazy. Part of me
as well, that's disturbing and scary, and then the other
part is, well, at least your brain is working and
(23:06):
you're figuring it out, you know what I mean. I
said to my kids, and this was controversial amongst my friends,
but I said, I would rather you cheat honestly in school,
because the alternative is not giving a shit. So if
you're cheating, you're caring to some extent, You're worrying about
(23:27):
a grade, you're worrying about getting your assignment in on time,
whereas if you just don't give a shit, then you
let it pass without a care in the world. I
know that sounds insane.
Speaker 1 (23:39):
Yeah, look, maybe you could amend that a little bit
and go. If you're going to cheat, here's what our
family values say about what makes sense there and what doesn't.
So we want you to have critical thinking skills. I
don't want you to cheat by having AI write your
whole essay. But if you want to use it to
find all of the sources, or if you want to
(24:00):
use it to write up your reference page or things
like that, that totally makes sense.
Speaker 4 (24:04):
Save time.
Speaker 1 (24:05):
Fine, right, don't tell your teacher, Okay, But here's where
I don't want you to cheat. And here's why it matters,
because we do want them to develop those critical thinking skills.
You know, there was I read something where this I
think it was like a student at Stanford was having
coffee with a journalist and I read this article where
(24:26):
the student admitted to the journalist or something like that
that I use AI so much that I'm having trouble
formulating sentences right now at this coffee with you.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
Wow, that's scary. Oh gosh, just where we're headed.
Speaker 4 (24:42):
Please go, oh, we got to prepare.
Speaker 5 (24:46):
Yeah, And something to think about too, is that if
it's an interest of your child, that a way to
bond with them. And I think you mentioned this, and
the way to bond with them is to ask them
to show you about it, to ask come to teach
you about it, and if it is interesting to him
(25:06):
or he's using it in some way, then that is something.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (25:10):
That and then in that way you'll learn and you'll
probably learn a lot, yeah, from asking him then going
and trying to figure it out yourself.
Speaker 6 (25:19):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:29):
Here's the other issue I have, and I can only
speak from experience. You know, I got expelled from high school,
okay for cheating on a test. And that's just the
one I got caught for. I cheated, right. I was
not mature enough yet to want to learn. I mean,
I'm in high school. I love being in school. My
(25:50):
education was sort of learning how to get by and
learning how to sort of, you know, use the system essentially.
I went to Boulder for two years. I knew I
wanted to be in the movie business, and I left
school because I wasn't academically inclined in any way, nor
was I wanting to educate myself philosophically or read books
(26:12):
or just understand the meaning of life, so to speak.
So I'm not very educated as far as the standard
education goes. I consider myself an intellectual person. I'm a
big thinker. It just took me a longer period of time.
Maturity is such a big component in education. We're expecting
(26:34):
these kids to just be bang bang bang and their
brains developed enough to be like, Oh, you're going to
college and you're going to learn right now, and you're
going to soak it all in. But everyone is so
different and it's almost like we have to cater to
that in a way, you know, because I only in
my twenties is when I thought, oh, you know what, like,
I want to start reading books. I'm interested in this,
(26:55):
I'm interested in that. I want to start to sort
of learn about myself a little bit more and humanity.
And then I got inspired. But prior to twenty two
years old, I was like, I don't give a shit,
you know, so how do you how do we calculate
for that? I think we're doing better now in today's world,
(27:18):
but it's just a fact, you know.
Speaker 5 (27:22):
Yeah, we're not experts on the educational system per se,
but it is a kind of blanket system that's out there.
And as you said, I think people are so different
and do things in different ways. I remember after my
(27:42):
senior year of high school, I went and I had
this whole speech prepared. I was going to tell my dad,
my mom and dad, who were very much wanted me
to go to college, and I was going to tell
them I was going to take a year off of work,
and I, you know, plan this whole speech. And I
got myself right and sat down in my dad's office
to talk to him, and he turned it to a
(28:04):
credenza behind him to pick up something, and I blurted
out what I wanted to say, and he turned back
and said, absolutely not. And the fact is is I
would have done better to take a year off because
I was similar to you. I just wasn't that mature
and ready. So I screwed off in the first couple
of years of my undergraduate And I think, if parents
(28:28):
can nurture what is happening for their own children then
and not this sort of idea. And it's heart because
there is a pressure for parents to have their children
go to college or go to a specific college, or
become a certain thing, and that could be familial, that
(28:50):
could be societal pressure, or whatever it is. But to
step back and just to look at and this is
easier said than done. Look at who it is you're
dealing with, and maybe it's not even you know your
two children, that one is just very different from the other.
I mean we think, we often will say that's kind
of the joke in parenting, that you get one child
(29:11):
and then once you figure it out, you're like, Okay,
I got this work, you know, sort of figured out
how to do this. You get a different child.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
Oh my god, I know, Oh my god, so much
so actually really real quickly, it's almost like what you're
saying is, you know, you are not your kid. You
are You don't impose what you feel on someone who
is a completely different human being than you, you know
what I mean, Like I think we fall victim to
(29:38):
that a little bit, Like this is what I believe,
So you need to believe this as well. You need
to go to college because that's what I did. That's
the right thing to do. But that's just bullshit, you
know what I mean, Like you have to recognize your
children for who they are, not stand so rigid and
and just what you believe, you know. And the other thing, too,
is that's such a good it's so true. And I
(30:00):
had a moment with Wilder, my oldest, where he did
some shit or whatever, and you know, I maybe reacted incorrectly,
and I walked into his room and I said, hey,
look dude, I said, I've had to switch away a
parent because you're going from sort of toddler and to
(30:22):
preteen and now you're a teenager and there's a big shift,
so you no longer want to cuddle with me, like
it's a whole different world. And I am getting used
to this. So I said, I don't know what the
fuck I'm doing. Okay, because you're number one body and
rio are going to benefit from you. And just as
you are sort of figuring out this new sort of
(30:44):
teenage chapter which you were sort of trying to navigate,
I'm the same thing. So I said, I'm gonna make mistakes,
You're gonna make mistakes, and this is it is what
it is, you know, And it was. It was a healthy,
good conversation to have, even though he just kind of
nods and grunts. I think they hear it.
Speaker 4 (31:04):
Yeah, that's beautiful.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
That's that's exactly what we want parents to do, is
have conversations own when things don't go great, start again,
start fresh, show that you can apologize for your side
of the street, demonstrate that you're not perfect. All of
these things are some of the most tremendous things you
can teach kids. And it's very different than you know,
(31:26):
the olden days and how parenting is yea.
Speaker 2 (31:28):
And I also think we need to temper our frustrations
when the kids don't respond the way that we want
them to, you know, because it's like I'm being vulnerable
and I'm expressing myself to you, like give it back, bastard,
But that is just not the way that they that
that's not the way they take it in. I think
we need to understand they are taking it in in
(31:48):
their own way.
Speaker 4 (31:49):
So that's that's brilliant.
Speaker 2 (31:51):
That's what you need to say. And then okay, all right, peace,
I love you, I'm out, you know.
Speaker 1 (31:56):
Yeah, And that's part of letting them be who they are.
And kids really appreciate that. They like those parents who
can just let them be or know that they're listening,
even if they're not responding or if they're not making
eye contact, if they're not you know, immediately smiling about something.
They love to be known in that way and just
given that space.
Speaker 2 (32:15):
Yeah, And it's not easy because you're like, what do
you come on, man?
Speaker 5 (32:19):
You know, give me some vulnerability about yeah, yeah, about sorry.
We talk about having difficult conversations with kids, or having
conversations at all, and noticing when does your child respond.
Is it that you're walking to school together and you
all aren't side by side, that are side by side
and not looking at one another. Is it that you
(32:40):
know you said you're outdoorsy. Is it that you all
are on the beach together, that it's that you're hiking together.
Is it that a child likes to do art and
they're sitting there but they're not looking at you and
knowing that about your child, that those are the times
that you can talk to them more freely and they
will hear you and maybe they will connect or they
(33:02):
may not, And that's okay to what we were just
talking about, but that they paying attention to when does
your child talk to you and when do they open up?
And if you can figure that out, then you can
actually maybe have a little bit more if if that's
(33:24):
what you're going after, because it's such an important point
too to say it's okay if they don't give back
what you are looking for in that way.
Speaker 2 (33:34):
Yeah, usually at ten pm, like it wanders in my
room and all of a sudden he's just attached to
the foot of the bed, just sort of talking and
saying weird shit. And this is his moment, Like he
always comes in late and just sort of want like
sort of paces around the room and talks about weird things.
It's funny.
Speaker 4 (33:54):
Yeah, that's so classic.
Speaker 1 (33:56):
And you know the other thing that can be challenging
on the subject of letting kids be who they are
is knowing what do they want to talk about? You know,
I remember early on one of my first ever teene clients,
all they wanted to do, all you wanted to do
was talk about video games every session for several weeks,
and I remember just thinking, what is he getting out
(34:19):
of this?
Speaker 4 (34:19):
What is he getting out of this?
Speaker 1 (34:20):
And then at some point I asked him, I said,
you know, you talk about video games a lot.
Speaker 4 (34:24):
What are you getting out of this? And he said,
you know, you're.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
The only person who will listen, and it's my whole world, right,
It really mattered to him. And so really being the
parent that lets the kid talk about whatever it is
they're actually interested. You may not care at all about
the topic whatsoever. You might not like the band or
the artist or whatever it is, but you know, when
(34:47):
you turn off that music and you say it sounds
like crap, they feel insulted and they feel like it's
a blow to their system.
Speaker 4 (34:53):
You know.
Speaker 1 (34:54):
So true, you know, and they're not going to like
it forever. So if you can just hold out until
the next days comes and they can.
Speaker 4 (35:01):
Feel like, all right, my dad gets it.
Speaker 2 (35:03):
Yeah, it's so true because you and you have to
force yourself sometimes to be like to get up and
like whatever it is they're liking, or you immerse yourself
in whatever it is that they're into at that time,
you know, and you're like, oh cool, Yeah, those airsoft
guns are rad. I'm like, oh god, more aerosoft. I
(35:24):
want to get to the mindfulness thing real quick. But
you know, just to go back, just to tell a
story sort of about how the expectations are not mad.
I did a movie in Toronto in January and Wilder,
my son got to Got Apart and it's a big part.
I mean, he's in the whole movie. I was there.
It was with him for six weeks in Toronto, living together,
and I had this like montage fantasy. I overspent and
(35:48):
got an amazing house and I was like, Oh, we're
going to cook and we're gonna like watch movies and
it's just gonna be fucking rat When we have like
a beer and we get to the place and I'm like,
all right, cool, this is awesome. And literally I'm like
it's like up the stairs in the room, the door closes.
I'm like yeah. First day, I'm like, what happened to
(36:10):
my montage? Like I had the music playing in my
head and everything, and I'm like Wilder, like, do you
want to, like get let's watch a movie? Dude, Like
let's when He's like, no, I'm cool. Oh no, this
is supposed to be an incredible experience.
Speaker 1 (36:25):
Such a funny scene, a relatable scene.
Speaker 2 (36:32):
Anyway. I want to talk about sort of meditation and
mindfulness and how you guys sort of implement that into
your practice with parents and children. I don't know if
you know my mom has done has a foundage gone
mind up? Do you guys know of it? Okay? So
(36:55):
it's nuts. It's very similar to potentially what you guys
are are doing. You know, she gets into the science
of it, you know, so these kids can sort of
learn about why they're feeling the way that they're feeling
from a science place as well.
Speaker 4 (37:08):
Did you grow up with any mindfulness skills?
Speaker 2 (37:10):
Yeah, I mean my mom was going to India forever
and she was always sort of meditating, and it was
sort of always surrounding us as children, know, which we
could have benefited from because we were products of divorce
and it was tumultuous and it was crazy. And that's
why I've been in therapy, you know, for a million years.
But it probably would have helped in my teens. Late
(37:36):
teens is when meditation sort of came into play for
me and helped me in my early twenties get through
gnarly bouts of anxiety, you know. And it's strangely, it's
the hardest thing to do. I'll work out for an
hour and a half, I'll get on my boat and fish,
I'll do this, I'll read, i'll clean, I'll do it.
And it's like, oh, just sit down for ten minutes
and meditate. I'm like I can't, all right the time.
(38:00):
It's so strange how it's just resisted, you know, I
don't know what that is, just being quiet, being in
being alone with your inner thoughts. I don't know, but yeah,
but talk about how I talk about that in mindfulness meditation,
how you guys sort of use it.
Speaker 5 (38:17):
Yeah, Well, for one, I just want to uh, I
just want to say, I think sitting with the nature
of our own mind. You know, being still is heard
because we're there's a lot coming at us all the time.
And what we will often teach parents is to bring
mindfulness into the things that you're doing already and to
help your children do that. You just named a lot
(38:38):
of ways in which you are possibly getting present, you know,
if it's fishing on your boat, if it's hiking, whatever
it might be. But finding those ways to help a
child do that too, and meditation is wonderful. We will
often say, like it's so hard to get people to
(39:00):
sit down and do that, but weaving mindfulness into your
everyday life is a little bit different. And one of
the things that we'll always talk about is that you
can't you can't help but be present if you're using
your senses, and that gives kids a lot of choices.
So to help them, we also learned that in school,
what are your senses? And so to help a child
(39:24):
to tap into that, find which sense do they like
to use the most. Is it their ears, their eyes,
their touch, and to practice with a child. And that
doesn't mean that you're all sitting down and meditating. It
could mean that you're finding five circles in a room.
It could mean that you're finding four things that are
(39:46):
blue in a room. It could be that you're cooking
and you all take a second to run through your
senses just quickly. But to do that, and I imagine
you know this from having anxiety, that if you do
it consistently, that is going to help and it is
going to make a difference. And if a child knows
(40:08):
how to do that, or and a parent knows how
to do that, you can slow things down. And really
by slowing things down is where anxiety lowers, whether it's
you know, in our nervous system, or it's running in
the home in a moment. And really the idea that
(40:31):
we're going to get people to sit down and meditate,
we often will say this like we don't really even
try that much to get people to sit down and
meditate that much anymore. It's great if you will, but
if you can practice those things, if you can practice
when you walk through a doorway, try to take a breath.
Speaker 2 (40:50):
Yeah. Well it's funny because I did meditation with the
kids when they were younger. We'd sit down and form
like a you know, a guided thing, and they were little,
and you know, Wilder, I'm always about Wilder, but Body's
my middle one. He's more down. Rio's my girl, and
she's just like, I don't know, from another planet. She's
incredible human being. But he was always restless. He's like,
(41:13):
I don't want to, you know, but we tried, and
it was fun because we got into it, but then
it was you know, laughy, and you know, it was
an experience that just didn't last very long. And this
is leading up to sort of my final question because
we've got to get out of here soon. But you know,
I went to the Hoffmann Institute and I came back
like I was on cloud nine. I mean that honeymoon
(41:35):
period we were just like I literally felt psychic. I
mean I could see things that I mean, it was incredible.
You realize the potential that we have as a human being,
not that you will ever stay in that state of
bliss because it's not really possible. You build the toolbox.
You got some tools, but in that first couple of weeks,
you're just like, oh my god, like I see the
(41:56):
world differently. I am clean and pure and I I'm
a home and you know the first thing I'd do
is like, okay, kids, I got canvases and paints. I'm like,
we're going to paint are the way we feel? And
they're like, what is wrong with you? Like what is
this Hoffman place? You went to? This whole was like
just paint your feelings and they're like, what the fuck
(42:17):
are you doing? When we did and I still have
them and it was fine. This is leading up to
my question, how do you hide the broccoli so to speak?
You know what I mean? Like, how do you hide
the greens? The sustenance where you can put it in
a turkey paddy, you can put it in a burger
or put it in you know, to where they're getting it,
but they don't know it because a lot of kids
(42:38):
right now, they're savvy. They don't like that feeling of
woo woo, that that sort of vulnerability that Okay, now
we're going to do this or talk about your feelings.
How do you feel? You know, at least in my world,
you know, there's got to be a way to hide
the broccoli.
Speaker 1 (42:56):
Totally, totally, and you know, part of it is helping
teens and kids understand that they're already doing it. It's
not like it's something you're forcing them to do. They're
already doing it. So you can have a casual conversation
and go, hey, when you're on those bikes, what's that like?
What does that feel like? I mean, are you like
thinking about TikTok when you're on the bike or what's
(43:18):
going on in there?
Speaker 4 (43:19):
Oh?
Speaker 1 (43:19):
No, I'm just I'm just kind of riding. It feels good. Oh,
it feels good. Nice, And you just leave it right
there because that is a mindful activity, right anything where
they're using their senses, So helping them see that what
they're doing, and then just really helping to develop those things.
So if somebody really likes to draw, get them some markers,
leave them there, you know, get them some new stuff,
and maybe don't even say anything. That can be like
(43:43):
we talk about playing it cool, so you know, you
don't want to jump up it down and go, hey
you're being mindful.
Speaker 4 (43:48):
You're being mindful right now.
Speaker 2 (43:51):
Look at you.
Speaker 4 (43:53):
Later that night you can be like, hey, that was
pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (43:55):
How you just like got into it, like you didn't
even check your phone for like twenty minutes. That was awesome,
you know, like just small things like that really plant
those seeds. And then modeling, just being the parent that
does those things, because if they feel close to you
and you have a strong bond and you are the
parent that is modeling that vulnerability and going to workshops
(44:16):
and Hoffman and caring about emotions, you are going to
raise kids who do too. You even have to jam
it down their throats, they will become that way. So
you're already doing it really.
Speaker 2 (44:27):
Yeah, And then you know, I know that tech is
good and bad. I think it's expression as I do
wish it was, you know, more in person. But words
are strong as well, and that's how I express myself
(44:48):
because I love to write, and I'm actually a pretty
good writer one of my sort of gifts, I guess,
and I love to express myself through the word, and
it's easier for me to do that than it is
in person. And oftmen changed that because I was able
to feel more vulnerable and be able to look at
my wife or my mom, and especially with women, strangely
to say, or my sister and being like, I just
(45:10):
want you to know I fucking love you so much
and I don't tell you enough. And it was hard
for me to do because I'd be like and sort
of shy it away from that feeling. But I could
use words to express myself and it was completely accepted.
I just wanted to sort of change that for myself.
All that being said, sometimes text is amazing, you know
(45:30):
what I mean, And they're able to express their feelings
towards you, towards me through text. Two nights ago, I
was thinking about Wilder and I said, just thinking about you, man,
Like he's in his room. I was like, I just
he's just a great fucking kid. I love you so much.
You're seventeen and just doing well. And he's like, man,
He's like thanks Dad, Like, I love you too so much.
(45:52):
Nothing he would ever say to me in person, honestly,
but I was able to You know, you're able to
do it through through text. So communication, there's a lot
of ways to sort of communicate these things, you know. Amen, Yeah,
all right, book plug the book what are we reading?
Speaker 5 (46:13):
It's called Raising com Kids in a World of Worry
and Maria Shriver it's her imprint called the Open Field
at Penguin Random House, and you can buy it anywhere
books are sold. It's written for parents to really help
learn just what we've been talking about, just different ways
(46:33):
of being and dealing with all of the worry that's
out there today. We wrote it so that you can
read it in a school pickup line, so that you
can pick up a little bit, take in some tools.
Marie and I feel really strongly.
Speaker 7 (46:50):
That having a big book that is impossible to get
through is just unrealistic for parents today, so they can
really pick it up and just learn a little something
they can listen to it.
Speaker 2 (47:04):
Is it safe to say that it's not just a
book based on your profession and your education, but also
from learned experience as well.
Speaker 4 (47:17):
Certainly, Yeah, I mean the book every day.
Speaker 2 (47:20):
That's cool. It's like not just like we're psychologists and
this is what we do. It's like, yes, we know
a lot, but here's who we are as well.
Speaker 4 (47:28):
Experientially totally.
Speaker 1 (47:30):
And what you'll find is, you know, it's hard to
pay attention to books these days, and what we did
is in almost every other paragraph or so, there's an example.
So right away you're just in somebody's room or you're
in a parent's head where you're hearing about a conversation
you know, similar to what we had in session or
something like that, so that you can just apply it
immediately and see yourself in it and just get some
(47:51):
of those tools going at home.
Speaker 5 (47:53):
Yeah, and we're both children who had anxiety. And there
were many, many times throughout this process that we said,
this is like doing you know, a learning about ourselves
and our families as so much as well because we
have the lived experience as well as the professional experience
(48:14):
to bring to this, and we really wanted parents to
have something to do it differently because we both have
wonderful parents. They just didn't have these tools.
Speaker 2 (48:23):
Yeah, no, totally, I mean totally. And then and then
we actually had this add Adhd, like expert who has
been studying it for twenty five years, thirty years on
the podcast. It was great, you know, because he's like
people it's they're calling it an illness, but it's he's like,
it's a fucking superpower, is what he was saying. As
long as you learn how to manage it. But think
(48:44):
about it, it's it can be a real superpower. You know.
I think it's turning some of these negative things around.
Not that anxiety isn't detrimental and it's it was an
urly but like you know, I wouldn't change anything. I've
learned so much about myself, you know. Yeah, it's about lessening,
you know. I just there's there's so much of it now.
(49:06):
You know that the fear around it needs to sort
of dissipate a little bit and learn how to sort
of use it for good. You know. Anyway, thank you
guys for coming on. This was this was great. I
appreciate it.
Speaker 4 (49:18):
Thanks Oliver, it was so great.
Speaker 2 (49:20):
Yeah, really fun. All right, good luck. We'll talk aboutter ay.
Speaker 5 (49:27):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (49:27):
I feel like I feel like I could be a psychologist.
It feel like I could be a psychologist. Well, having
gone going to school, you know, I wonder if I
could life coach. I don't think you have to, I
don't think I don't think you need an education be
a life coach. But acting, you know, it's been great
and love my business. But maybe I will start a
non licensed psychology practice and just be straight up like
(49:51):
I am not licensed, but I'm calling myself a psychologist.
The hardest thing to do is to practice what you preach.
You know, you need to follow my own advice. Sometimes,
I think we all need to follow our own advice.
Sometimes easy to give the advice, harder to follow your own.
(50:13):
You can tattoo that on yourself if you want. Copyright
Olive Hudson. I'm out.
Hi.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
I am Kate Hudson and my name is Oliver Hudson.
Speaker 3 (00:08):
We wanted to do something that highlighted our.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Relationships and what it's like to be siblings. We are
a sibling railvalry.
Speaker 4 (00:21):
No, no, sibling rival.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Don't do that with your mouth, Vely, that's.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Good, Ah, Oliver Hudson, It's Oliver Hudson, Oliver Roules Hudson.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
I just went on a run and I'm a little sweaty,
and I'm taking a million supplements and I'm injecting myself
with peptides and I'm getting to this place it's strange
where I don't even know who I am anymore. I'm
(01:08):
transitioning from like an old Oliver to a kind of
a new Oliver, shedding a bit of skin, so to speak,
like a fucking snake where all of a sudden, I'm
not drinking, I'm not smoking cigarettes, I'm not doing anything.
I'm eating healthy, I'm taking supplements and I feel incredible.
But at the same time, I'm like, who am I?
(01:29):
I have to like adjust to this new me and
I'm not sure how it's going anyway. Maybe I can
talk to our guests about these issues, even though they are.
I think they're child therapists, but I think they're family
and child so their parents too. Maybe they can help
(01:50):
me out. This is a pretty good segue. It was unintentional,
but Ashley Graver and Maria Evans, let's bring them on
and let's talk about my my problems.
Speaker 4 (02:01):
Shall we?
Speaker 5 (02:02):
Hi?
Speaker 2 (02:03):
There? Hi, Oliver, Hey, guys, how are you good?
Speaker 5 (02:07):
Nice to meet you?
Speaker 2 (02:09):
So in my intro because I do weird intros and
you know whatever, But I was talking about myself. We're
going to get into kids. I've been in therapy for
a thousand years. I went to the Hoffmann Institute. I'm
always trying to work on my shit. It's never ending,
and I think that is a comforting thing to sort
(02:32):
of think about because we're looking for an end and
there is no end. We are all going to suffer
throughout our lives, but it's just about mitigating it and
understanding why we suffer, which helps, right. I mean, this
is my own interpretation. Suffering may be a large word,
but you know, it's a never ending process. Because there
is no end. We can always sort of be better,
(02:54):
we can always be introspective and want to understand who
we are. Sometimes though I wish I didn't, because I
know people who don't give a shit, you know, and
it's almost like their lives are better because they just
don't care. They just accept who they are, all flaws
and everything, and have no desire to sort of change
(03:15):
or shift, so there's no anxiety attached to it. You know,
I'm anxiety prone, you know, since my twenties. I'm on
legs of bro and you know I'm a very sensitive
sort of being, I guess. But anyway, I was just
talking in my intro about how I'm starting this new
sort of chapter in my life where I am on
(03:40):
a healthcake. I was drinking too much, I was smoking cigarettes.
I was just in a foggy, shitty place. I decided
to do a battery of tests, taking supplements, taking peptides,
not drinking, and I feel incredible. Okay, but here's the psychology.
It almost feels like I don't know who I am.
More strangely, I'm so used to that other person that
(04:06):
there is some anxiety around even feeling like my best
self because of transitioning into sort of someone who I'm
not too familiar with. Does this make sense in any way?
Speaker 5 (04:19):
It does? It absolutely makes sense. It you know, when
we are used to doing things a certain way, getting
to know doing it a different way is uncomfortable because
it's unknown. We sometimes talk about if there's a dirty
pond and a clear pond, and you're used to swimming
(04:40):
in the dirty pond, but somebody says, hey, there's a
clear pond next door, why don't you go swim in.
It makes a lot of sense you'd want to go
get in that clear pond. But most people get in
that clear pond and say, wait a minute, I don't
know this pond at all. I'm going to go back
to the one that I know. And it's not that
we're going to make changes overnight or be used things.
(05:00):
We kind of have to get used to this idea
of we're going to take one. It's that idea of
when one step forward a couple of steps back, we're
gon we're going to try to get used to something
and maybe default back to what we already know as
we're moving towards something different.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally. I mean I have friends who
are like that in sort of the dating world. You know,
older guys like my age or fifty, who are so
used to living and so comfortable in the chaos that
in order to step into something healthy they can't, you
know what I mean. It's easier to live in the
pain of the chaos and the uncertainty in the back
(05:39):
and the forth, even though it's so destroying for them,
and they don't understand why why can't I find love?
Why can't I do this? I'm like, well, because you're
just comfortable in the why you're comfortable in all of that?
You know, and when you make an effort to step
outside and to find some purity or to try to
work on yourself, I fucked out. Let me just go
(06:01):
back to this. So interesting.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
Yeah, And as someone who's done a lot of therapy,
you probably know that our unconscious minds are drawn to
recreating the patterns that we're used to, even if they're
not good for us. So we'll find ourselves drawn again
and again in the same dynamics, the same situations, not
wanting to be but just drawn there. And part of
therapy is becoming more aware so that you can make
(06:24):
a different choice.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
Do you think that's a learned behavior or do you
think there's it's a primal thing. You know, I'm wanting
from an evolutionary standpoint and going back and getting a
little deeper on it. But you know, I totally agree
with that our subconscious sort of takes us back to
those things. I wonder if that was some sort of
a defense mechanism, you know, for back in the day,
or if this is something that is sort of environmental,
(06:47):
so to speak.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
That's a very good question. I guess I would wonder
when did the unconscious mind develop? Did Caveman have an
unconscious or were they just operating out of pure impulse?
Speaker 4 (07:00):
You know?
Speaker 1 (07:00):
And and where did those behavioral patterns get set. We
know that once you're used to even you know, opening
your milk a certain way or opening the door a
certain way, that you're going to do it every single
time the same way. Right, So we know some things
are totally wired.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
That's a great question, early man, Caveman, I mean, did
they have I think of course they must have had
an unconscious mind. How why wouldn't they?
Speaker 4 (07:23):
Yeah, I mean we know that animals dream.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
Yeah, yeah, Oh we've tapped into something. Maybe that's our
that's our next book, the three of Us. This is
Caveman the unconscious mind.
Speaker 4 (07:36):
That's right. Let's go back to those times. How did
cavemen date.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
Yeah, I mean, honestly, it would be a pretty evil
So I had a dating book for the caveman. Well,
I love that you guys are in the child world,
you know, and doing what you're doing. I have three kids.
As I told you, I have experienced anxiety in my life,
(08:04):
and my oldest, when he was in eighth grade, went
through it. And it started with him sort of disassociating
and telling me that he doesn't feel real, which I
could completely relate to him. I was like, ah, fuck,
you know, I was like, good news, bad news. Bad
news is I know where this is going. Good news
is is that I've been through this, so I can
(08:25):
help you, you know, and I'm not fearful, you know.
And I had to keep him home for like a month.
We did, my wife and I because he was just
in this space, and we didn't put him on medication,
and you know, I didn't want to do that. He
was young and he was just journaling, and I taught
him some meditations and you know, he would sit outside
(08:46):
and write his journal. Sort of things that I did
to help myself get out of it in my twenties,
and it seemed to have worked, you know, I guess
the question is children anxiety. You know, how much of
an uptick are you seeing? And what are some of
the best sort of ways to speak to your child
(09:07):
if you haven't experienced yourself, to try to help the
little one.
Speaker 5 (09:11):
It's kind of the most one of the most common
questions we get is if we see anxiety rising in kids,
and we really have seen a lot more anxiety. Kids
are exposed to a lot more, they're experiencing things at
earlier ages, and the world is more worrisome. I mean,
(09:34):
it's kind of why we named the book, gave the
book the title that we did, of raising Calm kids
in a world of worry, because there is so much
and the thing that we would start by saying is
really listen if you don't know what it is that's
going on, to listen to what a child is saying
(09:57):
and believe them. Like what you said, just believe what
they're saying and try not to dismiss it or fix it,
which is what we often want to do when a
problem is brought to us and we feel uncomfortable with
it because maybe we don't know about it. We just
don't want the person to be suffering. That is bringing
(10:17):
us something.
Speaker 1 (10:20):
Yeah, it's such a hard time to parent right now
because there's so much coming at parents. It's a totally
different time. There's technology, there's AI, there's all these different things.
There's the news, there's social media, everything that none of
us had to deal with as kids. Really, and so
parents are really you met with this great challenge, which
(10:44):
is how do I raise a kid that's not completely
terrified of the world that I don't even know how
to walk them through?
Speaker 5 (10:50):
Right.
Speaker 1 (10:51):
So our book is all about and our philosophy is
about the idea that you can raise kids who generally
have a greater sense of safety through the way that
you parent, so that even when they do feel anxious,
they have those tools, they know what it is, they
can come to you.
Speaker 4 (11:08):
They've got a.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
Sense of belonging in the family. And so we've got
all kinds of tips and you know, whatever you'd like
to chat about. We can kind of go in that direction.
But so many ways to parent to create that environment
so that they're not shaking in their boots every day,
you know, and so you're not either.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
There's not one right way to do it right. All
kids are different, all parents are different, But as far
as the freedoms that our kids don't have anymore because
of the fears that we have as parents, Like how
do you navigate that so they're not afraid of everything
and sheltered.
Speaker 5 (11:43):
Such a good question, and building a strong connection to
your kids is going to be such an important piece
of it, because, as you said, there are things going
on that we have to deal with, and if a
child feels like they can come and talk to you
about it, whatever it is, then then you can let
(12:05):
them roam a little bit more free if they feel
like they can come back. I remember growing up, we
had this contract that if there somebody was drinking and driving,
we signed a contract with our parents and if somebody
was drinking and driving, you could call them. You call
your parents and they would come and pick you up
and there would be no conversation that night, you wouldn't
get in trouble. You would talk about it the next day,
(12:28):
and you know whatever the family sort of decided in
that moment, but that there was this understanding that you
could fall back on your parents. And that's so much
of what we try to teach is that if you
have this bond and you and your children know that
(12:48):
you can come to you. Then whatever is happening, that's
that's changing in the world is okay for them. And
if you're if you're talking about things like we asked
a lot about social media, to teach good practices to
talk to your children about the things that are going
on versus kind of ignoring it or not speaking about it,
(13:14):
because in that way, then a child knows okay. I
know I can come to my parents, you know, or
I know that they're going to be there to talk
to me about something if there's something scary that comes up.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
Playing Devil's Advocate with that, you know. I think inherently
kids are mischievous. That's just part of the growing up process.
And I've created an open space for my kids to
talk about whatever the hell they want. We're very liberal
parents when it comes to that, you know what I mean.
I haven't forgotten what I was like at sixteen seventy
(14:00):
years old, and I don't want to be a hypocrite.
And that's my biggest pet peeve is hypocrisy. That's why
I can't stand politics. But that's a whole other discussion.
So if I'm thinking about what I was doing at
fifteen sixteen, seventeen and then getting on my kids for
doing similar things. It doesn't feel good to me. Now,
it doesn't mean I can't teach some sort of a
lesson anyway. The door is always open for them, but
(14:22):
they don't always tell the truth. They're always they sneak,
they do their shit. And my kid was very simple
and he said, they're all great, they're all great kids.
But I was on him about something and why didn't
you tell me this? It's always open door. You know
that you can do that? And he goes, Dad, what
am I supposed to just tell my dad everything I do?
(14:43):
And I was like, wow, you know what. You're right,
of course you're not. This is a rite of passage.
You try, you will get caught because I used to
do it myself, so I know what's up. And now
we have ring cameras in life three sixties that you're
completely fucked? What about that though? You know? Because we
(15:03):
can't expect our kids to just be all open and
honest and vulnerable all the time. Do we give them
some leadway, I mean, I do for when they might lie,
or they might sneak out, or they might do something mischievous,
or do we have to get on their asses.
Speaker 1 (15:16):
No, you've got it, You've got it right. It's really
important to be understanding of that process. They need privacy.
You know. As they become teenagers, they start to really
develop that sense of self that's totally separate from you,
and that can be hard for a lot of parents,
but you know, they become really pure focused. But the
thing to really think about in those preteen teen years
(15:38):
is kids. As much as you want to be the
totally cool parent that's like, I know you're going to lie,
I know you're going to smoke, I know you're going
to drink. Kids need a boundary to push up against.
So you don't want to be so like you were describing,
just so tight that you don't let them explore the
world at all. But you also don't want to be
all the way wide open because then they have absolutely
(15:58):
nothing to push up against. So you want them to
know something like, oh, my dad's totally going to kill
me if I don't check in at midnight and tell
them where I am. You want them to have that
feeling so that they do check in, or so that
maybe they don't come home at twelve, but they come
home at twelve fifteen versus I know you're a teenager
and you're just going to waltz in anytime, so whatever, right,
(16:19):
because then they might come in at four am, so
that makes sense. You want to keep in mind that
your job is still to hold boundaries so that they
get to experience going against them. The trick is finding
where does that boundary lie so that they get to explore.
But also they don't just go completely haywire.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
That's so important. I couldn't agree more. I mean, and
I wrestle with that. We wrestle with that a little bit,
but well we have boundaries. But again it's about figuring
out sort of you know, it's like a dog pen
for a puppy, like how small you're going to make it,
you know, or how big are you going to make that?
And I think that that is to each their own.
(16:58):
There is something there's personal. It's personal, you know. For me,
it's big moments, you know, like like the other day,
my kids have these surrongs. You know, they're like basically motorcycles.
I mean it's you know, they have helmets. My wife
is cannot believe that I'm letting me do this, but
you know, they ride around, they'd ride into Westwood and
my kid rode to school today, you know, on his suran,
(17:20):
and I come home and the bikes are gone and
the helmets are in the garage and I'm lenient, but
that's a big fucking no no. And they came back
and I just ripped them, you know. I was like, dude,
part of it is like I give you so much,
you know what I mean? Like this is these there
(17:41):
are certain things where you sort of pick your battles,
you know, so where they can sort of hear that
and understand that. But you're right, the boundary thing is important.
But then again, there are parents who like are too restricted,
I think. And that's actually my next question because you
work with parents, well right obviously, so have you found
(18:03):
a pattern? I know everyone's different, but is there something
if you were to pull all the parents or pull
your experiences with these parents, is there a through line
with like the new parent that you see a lot of.
Is it fear? Is it worry? I mean, is there
something that is a through line? Or is everyone completely
(18:27):
unique and different?
Speaker 5 (18:28):
I would say one of the things we see so
often is really not wanting to talk about the things
that they should talk about. But maybe they didn't. They
didn't have a model for that growing up. They didn't
(18:48):
have Your children will likely have a similar relationship with
their children where and perhaps you do with your parents,
or you did it completely differently. But we see that
often a parent will say like, I don't want to
expose my child to such and such, and because there
(19:09):
is so much more now, it's too early, I don't
want to talk about it. And we see it a
little bit differently. We want to talk about things age appropriately,
but we do want to talk about things, and there's
just as Maria said earlier, there's just so much now
that parents are balancing that they didn't have to before
(19:31):
that that seems to be a really common thing that
comes up. It's like, oh, I don't really want to
I don't want to talk about that thing. I don't
want to scare my children. I don't want them to
be thinking about something earlier than they should be. When
what we know from the work that we do and
also from working with kids directly, is that they just
(19:52):
generally do.
Speaker 2 (19:53):
Know what's going on.
Speaker 5 (19:54):
They're hearing about it in some way or another, whether
it's their older sibling, their friends, will their sibling at
school on the news and the house. They see a
phone that somebody's holding, they overhear a conversation.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
Oh my god, I know. I think these kids soak
it up their ears or to their ears are to
the ground. They they they we don't think they're listening,
but they are listening. Oh my gosh. It's scary sometimes
you know everything, oh here everything. Were talking in the
room as my oldest like, what were we saying? I'm nothing,
(20:32):
nothing like.
Speaker 4 (20:33):
What bionic ears they have them?
Speaker 2 (20:36):
Like you were talking about so and so? Well, what
was that like? You sort of raise your voice a
little bit. I'm like Wilder, says Wilder. Wilder, it's this
is not doesn't concern you, I know, but Dad like,
what was it? I mean, he will not let it
go persistent. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:52):
The other thing is with social media, they can access everything.
They know so much they don't need to come to
you and ask you about something they and oftentimes they'd
rather look it up because then they don't have to
have the awkward conversation.
Speaker 4 (21:03):
You know. So I think so much sooner than anybody thinks.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
Oh my god, especially now that they're on all the trends.
You know, my kids, you know, it's disturbing when I
give them what I think is some wisdom on a
subject and like, well, AI said that, I'm like, hey,
I said, now AI is a human. I mean, I
know that we're getting there, but like, can we just
(21:27):
put the brakes on for a second, AI said, I
don't like that totally. I've been resistant to it, just
from a conscious but still an unconscious level. I you know,
I love the outdoors. I'm pretty analogue. You know, I
have a boat, and I love the mountains and I
fish and all that. But some reason, for some reason,
(21:50):
I resistant, you know, even though I should probably get on.
Speaker 1 (21:53):
Well, it's super threatening, right, especially with how fast it develops.
It's really scary to imagine where it's going to go.
Oh and at the same time, as parents, there is
a tremendous responsibility to learn AI because the kids already
know it, and you know, most parents don't even necessarily
know yet just what AI is capable of. Even now
(22:16):
you know that you can open up an email draft
and an AI letter is just written for you as
a response, or you know, obviously writing essays with AI,
which a lot of schools have banned, and things like that.
But even more than that, you know, it's it's it's
really amazing and and scary at the same time. But
it's kind of like if you remember when the iPhone
(22:37):
came out. If if all the parents were like, oh no,
we're not getting iPhones, they would they would just be
in a different world than the kids.
Speaker 2 (22:45):
It's another great point and one I should probably advice
that I should take, which is you're right, we as
parents and adults have to learn it because the kids
know it, so we have to know it. I mean,
they're so versed in it. It's crazy. Part of me
as well, that's disturbing and scary, and then the other
part is, well, at least your brain is working and
(23:06):
you're figuring it out, you know what I mean. I
said to my kids, and this was controversial amongst my friends,
but I said, I would rather you cheat honestly in school,
because the alternative is not giving a shit. So if
you're cheating, you're caring to some extent, You're worrying about
(23:27):
a grade, you're worrying about getting your assignment in on time,
whereas if you just don't give a shit, then you
let it pass without a care in the world. I
know that sounds insane.
Speaker 1 (23:39):
Yeah, look, maybe you could amend that a little bit
and go. If you're going to cheat, here's what our
family values say about what makes sense there and what doesn't.
So we want you to have critical thinking skills. I
don't want you to cheat by having AI write your
whole essay. But if you want to use it to
find all of the sources, or if you want to
(24:00):
use it to write up your reference page or things
like that, that totally makes sense.
Speaker 4 (24:04):
Save time.
Speaker 1 (24:05):
Fine, right, don't tell your teacher, Okay, But here's where
I don't want you to cheat. And here's why it matters,
because we do want them to develop those critical thinking skills.
You know, there was I read something where this I
think it was like a student at Stanford was having
coffee with a journalist and I read this article where
(24:26):
the student admitted to the journalist or something like that
that I use AI so much that I'm having trouble
formulating sentences right now at this coffee with you.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
Wow, that's scary. Oh gosh, just where we're headed.
Speaker 4 (24:42):
Please go, oh, we got to prepare.
Speaker 5 (24:46):
Yeah, And something to think about too, is that if
it's an interest of your child, that a way to
bond with them. And I think you mentioned this, and
the way to bond with them is to ask them
to show you about it, to ask come to teach
you about it, and if it is interesting to him
(25:06):
or he's using it in some way, then that is something.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (25:10):
That and then in that way you'll learn and you'll
probably learn a lot, yeah, from asking him then going
and trying to figure it out yourself.
Speaker 6 (25:19):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:29):
Here's the other issue I have, and I can only
speak from experience. You know, I got expelled from high school,
okay for cheating on a test. And that's just the
one I got caught for. I cheated, right. I was
not mature enough yet to want to learn. I mean,
I'm in high school. I love being in school. My
(25:50):
education was sort of learning how to get by and
learning how to sort of, you know, use the system essentially.
I went to Boulder for two years. I knew I
wanted to be in the movie business, and I left
school because I wasn't academically inclined in any way, nor
was I wanting to educate myself philosophically or read books
(26:12):
or just understand the meaning of life, so to speak.
So I'm not very educated as far as the standard
education goes. I consider myself an intellectual person. I'm a
big thinker. It just took me a longer period of time.
Maturity is such a big component in education. We're expecting
(26:34):
these kids to just be bang bang bang and their
brains developed enough to be like, Oh, you're going to
college and you're going to learn right now, and you're
going to soak it all in. But everyone is so
different and it's almost like we have to cater to
that in a way, you know, because I only in
my twenties is when I thought, oh, you know what, like,
I want to start reading books. I'm interested in this,
(26:55):
I'm interested in that. I want to start to sort
of learn about myself a little bit more and humanity.
And then I got inspired. But prior to twenty two
years old, I was like, I don't give a shit,
you know, so how do you how do we calculate
for that? I think we're doing better now in today's world,
(27:18):
but it's just a fact, you know.
Speaker 5 (27:22):
Yeah, we're not experts on the educational system per se,
but it is a kind of blanket system that's out there.
And as you said, I think people are so different
and do things in different ways. I remember after my
(27:42):
senior year of high school, I went and I had
this whole speech prepared. I was going to tell my dad,
my mom and dad, who were very much wanted me
to go to college, and I was going to tell
them I was going to take a year off of work,
and I, you know, plan this whole speech. And I
got myself right and sat down in my dad's office
to talk to him, and he turned it to a
(28:04):
credenza behind him to pick up something, and I blurted
out what I wanted to say, and he turned back
and said, absolutely not. And the fact is is I
would have done better to take a year off because
I was similar to you. I just wasn't that mature
and ready. So I screwed off in the first couple
of years of my undergraduate And I think, if parents
(28:28):
can nurture what is happening for their own children then
and not this sort of idea. And it's heart because
there is a pressure for parents to have their children
go to college or go to a specific college, or
become a certain thing, and that could be familial, that
(28:50):
could be societal pressure, or whatever it is. But to
step back and just to look at and this is
easier said than done. Look at who it is you're
dealing with, and maybe it's not even you know your
two children, that one is just very different from the other.
I mean we think, we often will say that's kind
of the joke in parenting, that you get one child
(29:11):
and then once you figure it out, you're like, Okay,
I got this work, you know, sort of figured out
how to do this. You get a different child.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
Oh my god, I know, Oh my god, so much
so actually really real quickly, it's almost like what you're
saying is, you know, you are not your kid. You
are You don't impose what you feel on someone who
is a completely different human being than you, you know
what I mean, Like I think we fall victim to
(29:38):
that a little bit, Like this is what I believe,
So you need to believe this as well. You need
to go to college because that's what I did. That's
the right thing to do. But that's just bullshit, you
know what I mean, Like you have to recognize your
children for who they are, not stand so rigid and
and just what you believe, you know. And the other thing, too,
is that's such a good it's so true. And I
(30:00):
had a moment with Wilder, my oldest, where he did
some shit or whatever, and you know, I maybe reacted incorrectly,
and I walked into his room and I said, hey,
look dude, I said, I've had to switch away a
parent because you're going from sort of toddler and to
(30:22):
preteen and now you're a teenager and there's a big shift,
so you no longer want to cuddle with me, like
it's a whole different world. And I am getting used
to this. So I said, I don't know what the
fuck I'm doing. Okay, because you're number one body and
rio are going to benefit from you. And just as
you are sort of figuring out this new sort of
(30:44):
teenage chapter which you were sort of trying to navigate,
I'm the same thing. So I said, I'm gonna make mistakes,
You're gonna make mistakes, and this is it is what
it is, you know, And it was. It was a healthy,
good conversation to have, even though he just kind of
nods and grunts. I think they hear it.
Speaker 4 (31:04):
Yeah, that's beautiful.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
That's that's exactly what we want parents to do, is
have conversations own when things don't go great, start again,
start fresh, show that you can apologize for your side
of the street, demonstrate that you're not perfect. All of
these things are some of the most tremendous things you
can teach kids. And it's very different than you know,
(31:26):
the olden days and how parenting is yea.
Speaker 2 (31:28):
And I also think we need to temper our frustrations
when the kids don't respond the way that we want
them to, you know, because it's like I'm being vulnerable
and I'm expressing myself to you, like give it back, bastard,
But that is just not the way that they that
that's not the way they take it in. I think
we need to understand they are taking it in in
(31:48):
their own way.
Speaker 4 (31:49):
So that's that's brilliant.
Speaker 2 (31:51):
That's what you need to say. And then okay, all right, peace,
I love you, I'm out, you know.
Speaker 1 (31:56):
Yeah, And that's part of letting them be who they are.
And kids really appreciate that. They like those parents who
can just let them be or know that they're listening,
even if they're not responding or if they're not making
eye contact, if they're not you know, immediately smiling about something.
They love to be known in that way and just
given that space.
Speaker 2 (32:15):
Yeah, And it's not easy because you're like, what do
you come on, man?
Speaker 5 (32:19):
You know, give me some vulnerability about yeah, yeah, about sorry.
We talk about having difficult conversations with kids, or having
conversations at all, and noticing when does your child respond.
Is it that you're walking to school together and you
all aren't side by side, that are side by side
and not looking at one another. Is it that you
(32:40):
know you said you're outdoorsy. Is it that you all
are on the beach together, that it's that you're hiking together.
Is it that a child likes to do art and
they're sitting there but they're not looking at you and
knowing that about your child, that those are the times
that you can talk to them more freely and they
will hear you and maybe they will connect or they
(33:02):
may not, And that's okay to what we were just
talking about, but that they paying attention to when does
your child talk to you and when do they open up?
And if you can figure that out, then you can
actually maybe have a little bit more if if that's
(33:24):
what you're going after, because it's such an important point
too to say it's okay if they don't give back
what you are looking for in that way.
Speaker 2 (33:34):
Yeah, usually at ten pm, like it wanders in my
room and all of a sudden he's just attached to
the foot of the bed, just sort of talking and
saying weird shit. And this is his moment, Like he
always comes in late and just sort of want like
sort of paces around the room and talks about weird things.
It's funny.
Speaker 4 (33:54):
Yeah, that's so classic.
Speaker 1 (33:56):
And you know the other thing that can be challenging
on the subject of letting kids be who they are
is knowing what do they want to talk about? You know,
I remember early on one of my first ever teene clients,
all they wanted to do, all you wanted to do
was talk about video games every session for several weeks,
and I remember just thinking, what is he getting out
(34:19):
of this?
Speaker 4 (34:19):
What is he getting out of this?
Speaker 1 (34:20):
And then at some point I asked him, I said,
you know, you talk about video games a lot.
Speaker 4 (34:24):
What are you getting out of this? And he said,
you know, you're.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
The only person who will listen, and it's my whole world, right,
It really mattered to him. And so really being the
parent that lets the kid talk about whatever it is
they're actually interested. You may not care at all about
the topic whatsoever. You might not like the band or
the artist or whatever it is, but you know, when
(34:47):
you turn off that music and you say it sounds
like crap, they feel insulted and they feel like it's
a blow to their system.
Speaker 4 (34:53):
You know.
Speaker 1 (34:54):
So true, you know, and they're not going to like
it forever. So if you can just hold out until
the next days comes and they can.
Speaker 4 (35:01):
Feel like, all right, my dad gets it.
Speaker 2 (35:03):
Yeah, it's so true because you and you have to
force yourself sometimes to be like to get up and
like whatever it is they're liking, or you immerse yourself
in whatever it is that they're into at that time,
you know, and you're like, oh cool, Yeah, those airsoft
guns are rad. I'm like, oh god, more aerosoft. I
(35:24):
want to get to the mindfulness thing real quick. But
you know, just to go back, just to tell a
story sort of about how the expectations are not mad.
I did a movie in Toronto in January and Wilder,
my son got to Got Apart and it's a big part.
I mean, he's in the whole movie. I was there.
It was with him for six weeks in Toronto, living together,
and I had this like montage fantasy. I overspent and
(35:48):
got an amazing house and I was like, Oh, we're
going to cook and we're gonna like watch movies and
it's just gonna be fucking rat When we have like
a beer and we get to the place and I'm like,
all right, cool, this is awesome. And literally I'm like
it's like up the stairs in the room, the door closes.
I'm like yeah. First day, I'm like, what happened to
(36:10):
my montage? Like I had the music playing in my
head and everything, and I'm like Wilder, like, do you
want to, like get let's watch a movie? Dude, Like
let's when He's like, no, I'm cool. Oh no, this
is supposed to be an incredible experience.
Speaker 1 (36:25):
Such a funny scene, a relatable scene.
Speaker 2 (36:32):
Anyway. I want to talk about sort of meditation and
mindfulness and how you guys sort of implement that into
your practice with parents and children. I don't know if
you know my mom has done has a foundage gone
mind up? Do you guys know of it? Okay? So
(36:55):
it's nuts. It's very similar to potentially what you guys
are are doing. You know, she gets into the science
of it, you know, so these kids can sort of
learn about why they're feeling the way that they're feeling
from a science place as well.
Speaker 4 (37:08):
Did you grow up with any mindfulness skills?
Speaker 2 (37:10):
Yeah, I mean my mom was going to India forever
and she was always sort of meditating, and it was
sort of always surrounding us as children, know, which we
could have benefited from because we were products of divorce
and it was tumultuous and it was crazy. And that's
why I've been in therapy, you know, for a million years.
But it probably would have helped in my teens. Late
(37:36):
teens is when meditation sort of came into play for
me and helped me in my early twenties get through
gnarly bouts of anxiety, you know. And it's strangely, it's
the hardest thing to do. I'll work out for an
hour and a half, I'll get on my boat and fish,
I'll do this, I'll read, i'll clean, I'll do it.
And it's like, oh, just sit down for ten minutes
and meditate. I'm like I can't, all right the time.
(38:00):
It's so strange how it's just resisted, you know, I
don't know what that is, just being quiet, being in
being alone with your inner thoughts. I don't know, but yeah,
but talk about how I talk about that in mindfulness meditation,
how you guys sort of use it.
Speaker 5 (38:17):
Yeah, Well, for one, I just want to uh, I
just want to say, I think sitting with the nature
of our own mind. You know, being still is heard
because we're there's a lot coming at us all the time.
And what we will often teach parents is to bring
mindfulness into the things that you're doing already and to
help your children do that. You just named a lot
(38:38):
of ways in which you are possibly getting present, you know,
if it's fishing on your boat, if it's hiking, whatever
it might be. But finding those ways to help a
child do that too, and meditation is wonderful. We will
often say, like it's so hard to get people to
(39:00):
sit down and do that, but weaving mindfulness into your
everyday life is a little bit different. And one of
the things that we'll always talk about is that you
can't you can't help but be present if you're using
your senses, and that gives kids a lot of choices.
So to help them, we also learned that in school,
what are your senses? And so to help a child
(39:24):
to tap into that, find which sense do they like
to use the most. Is it their ears, their eyes,
their touch, and to practice with a child. And that
doesn't mean that you're all sitting down and meditating. It
could mean that you're finding five circles in a room.
It could mean that you're finding four things that are
(39:46):
blue in a room. It could be that you're cooking
and you all take a second to run through your
senses just quickly. But to do that, and I imagine
you know this from having anxiety, that if you do
it consistently, that is going to help and it is
going to make a difference. And if a child knows
(40:08):
how to do that, or and a parent knows how
to do that, you can slow things down. And really
by slowing things down is where anxiety lowers, whether it's
you know, in our nervous system, or it's running in
the home in a moment. And really the idea that
(40:31):
we're going to get people to sit down and meditate,
we often will say this like we don't really even
try that much to get people to sit down and
meditate that much anymore. It's great if you will, but
if you can practice those things, if you can practice
when you walk through a doorway, try to take a breath.
Speaker 2 (40:50):
Yeah. Well it's funny because I did meditation with the
kids when they were younger. We'd sit down and form
like a you know, a guided thing, and they were little,
and you know, Wilder, I'm always about Wilder, but Body's
my middle one. He's more down. Rio's my girl, and
she's just like, I don't know, from another planet. She's
incredible human being. But he was always restless. He's like,
(41:13):
I don't want to, you know, but we tried, and
it was fun because we got into it, but then
it was you know, laughy, and you know, it was
an experience that just didn't last very long. And this
is leading up to sort of my final question because
we've got to get out of here soon. But you know,
I went to the Hoffmann Institute and I came back
like I was on cloud nine. I mean that honeymoon
(41:35):
period we were just like I literally felt psychic. I
mean I could see things that I mean, it was incredible.
You realize the potential that we have as a human being,
not that you will ever stay in that state of
bliss because it's not really possible. You build the toolbox.
You got some tools, but in that first couple of weeks,
you're just like, oh my god, like I see the
(41:56):
world differently. I am clean and pure and I I'm
a home and you know the first thing I'd do
is like, okay, kids, I got canvases and paints. I'm like,
we're going to paint are the way we feel? And
they're like, what is wrong with you? Like what is
this Hoffman place? You went to? This whole was like
just paint your feelings and they're like, what the fuck
(42:17):
are you doing? When we did and I still have
them and it was fine. This is leading up to
my question, how do you hide the broccoli so to speak?
You know what I mean? Like, how do you hide
the greens? The sustenance where you can put it in
a turkey paddy, you can put it in a burger
or put it in you know, to where they're getting it,
but they don't know it because a lot of kids
(42:38):
right now, they're savvy. They don't like that feeling of
woo woo, that that sort of vulnerability that Okay, now
we're going to do this or talk about your feelings.
How do you feel? You know, at least in my world,
you know, there's got to be a way to hide
the broccoli.
Speaker 1 (42:56):
Totally, totally, and you know, part of it is helping
teens and kids understand that they're already doing it. It's
not like it's something you're forcing them to do. They're
already doing it. So you can have a casual conversation
and go, hey, when you're on those bikes, what's that like?
What does that feel like? I mean, are you like
thinking about TikTok when you're on the bike or what's
(43:18):
going on in there?
Speaker 4 (43:19):
Oh?
Speaker 1 (43:19):
No, I'm just I'm just kind of riding. It feels good. Oh,
it feels good. Nice, And you just leave it right
there because that is a mindful activity, right anything where
they're using their senses, So helping them see that what
they're doing, and then just really helping to develop those things.
So if somebody really likes to draw, get them some markers,
leave them there, you know, get them some new stuff,
and maybe don't even say anything. That can be like
(43:43):
we talk about playing it cool, so you know, you
don't want to jump up it down and go, hey
you're being mindful.
Speaker 4 (43:48):
You're being mindful right now.
Speaker 2 (43:51):
Look at you.
Speaker 4 (43:53):
Later that night you can be like, hey, that was
pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (43:55):
How you just like got into it, like you didn't
even check your phone for like twenty minutes. That was awesome,
you know, like just small things like that really plant
those seeds. And then modeling, just being the parent that
does those things, because if they feel close to you
and you have a strong bond and you are the
parent that is modeling that vulnerability and going to workshops
(44:16):
and Hoffman and caring about emotions, you are going to
raise kids who do too. You even have to jam
it down their throats, they will become that way. So
you're already doing it really.
Speaker 2 (44:27):
Yeah, And then you know, I know that tech is
good and bad. I think it's expression as I do
wish it was, you know, more in person. But words
are strong as well, and that's how I express myself
(44:48):
because I love to write, and I'm actually a pretty
good writer one of my sort of gifts, I guess,
and I love to express myself through the word, and
it's easier for me to do that than it is
in person. And oftmen changed that because I was able
to feel more vulnerable and be able to look at
my wife or my mom, and especially with women, strangely
to say, or my sister and being like, I just
(45:10):
want you to know I fucking love you so much
and I don't tell you enough. And it was hard
for me to do because I'd be like and sort
of shy it away from that feeling. But I could
use words to express myself and it was completely accepted.
I just wanted to sort of change that for myself.
All that being said, sometimes text is amazing, you know
(45:30):
what I mean, And they're able to express their feelings
towards you, towards me through text. Two nights ago, I
was thinking about Wilder and I said, just thinking about you, man,
Like he's in his room. I was like, I just
he's just a great fucking kid. I love you so much.
You're seventeen and just doing well. And he's like, man,
He's like thanks Dad, Like, I love you too so much.
(45:52):
Nothing he would ever say to me in person, honestly,
but I was able to You know, you're able to
do it through through text. So communication, there's a lot
of ways to sort of communicate these things, you know. Amen, Yeah,
all right, book plug the book what are we reading?
Speaker 5 (46:13):
It's called Raising com Kids in a World of Worry
and Maria Shriver it's her imprint called the Open Field
at Penguin Random House, and you can buy it anywhere
books are sold. It's written for parents to really help
learn just what we've been talking about, just different ways
(46:33):
of being and dealing with all of the worry that's
out there today. We wrote it so that you can
read it in a school pickup line, so that you
can pick up a little bit, take in some tools.
Marie and I feel really strongly.
Speaker 7 (46:50):
That having a big book that is impossible to get
through is just unrealistic for parents today, so they can
really pick it up and just learn a little something
they can listen to it.
Speaker 2 (47:04):
Is it safe to say that it's not just a
book based on your profession and your education, but also
from learned experience as well.
Speaker 4 (47:17):
Certainly, Yeah, I mean the book every day.
Speaker 2 (47:20):
That's cool. It's like not just like we're psychologists and
this is what we do. It's like, yes, we know
a lot, but here's who we are as well.
Speaker 4 (47:28):
Experientially totally.
Speaker 1 (47:30):
And what you'll find is, you know, it's hard to
pay attention to books these days, and what we did
is in almost every other paragraph or so, there's an example.
So right away you're just in somebody's room or you're
in a parent's head where you're hearing about a conversation
you know, similar to what we had in session or
something like that, so that you can just apply it
immediately and see yourself in it and just get some
(47:51):
of those tools going at home.
Speaker 5 (47:53):
Yeah, and we're both children who had anxiety. And there
were many, many times throughout this process that we said,
this is like doing you know, a learning about ourselves
and our families as so much as well because we
have the lived experience as well as the professional experience
(48:14):
to bring to this, and we really wanted parents to
have something to do it differently because we both have
wonderful parents. They just didn't have these tools.
Speaker 2 (48:23):
Yeah, no, totally, I mean totally. And then and then
we actually had this add Adhd, like expert who has
been studying it for twenty five years, thirty years on
the podcast. It was great, you know, because he's like
people it's they're calling it an illness, but it's he's like,
it's a fucking superpower, is what he was saying. As
long as you learn how to manage it. But think
(48:44):
about it, it's it can be a real superpower. You know.
I think it's turning some of these negative things around.
Not that anxiety isn't detrimental and it's it was an
urly but like you know, I wouldn't change anything. I've
learned so much about myself, you know. Yeah, it's about lessening,
you know. I just there's there's so much of it now.
(49:06):
You know that the fear around it needs to sort
of dissipate a little bit and learn how to sort
of use it for good. You know. Anyway, thank you
guys for coming on. This was this was great. I
appreciate it.
Speaker 4 (49:18):
Thanks Oliver, it was so great.
Speaker 2 (49:20):
Yeah, really fun. All right, good luck. We'll talk aboutter ay.
Speaker 5 (49:27):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (49:27):
I feel like I feel like I could be a psychologist.
It feel like I could be a psychologist. Well, having
gone going to school, you know, I wonder if I
could life coach. I don't think you have to, I
don't think I don't think you need an education be
a life coach. But acting, you know, it's been great
and love my business. But maybe I will start a
non licensed psychology practice and just be straight up like
(49:51):
I am not licensed, but I'm calling myself a psychologist.
The hardest thing to do is to practice what you preach.
You know, you need to follow my own advice. Sometimes,
I think we all need to follow our own advice.
Sometimes easy to give the advice, harder to follow your own.
(50:13):
You can tattoo that on yourself if you want. Copyright
Olive Hudson. I'm out.
Hosts And Creators
Oliver Hudson
Kate Hudson
Popular Podcasts
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
True Crime Tonight
If you eat, sleep, and breathe true crime, TRUE CRIME TONIGHT is serving up your nightly fix. Five nights a week, KT STUDIOS & iHEART RADIO invite listeners to pull up a seat for an unfiltered look at the biggest cases making headlines, celebrity scandals, and the trials everyone is watching. With a mix of expert analysis, hot takes, and listener call-ins, TRUE CRIME TONIGHT goes beyond the headlines to uncover the twists, turns, and unanswered questions that keep us all obsessed—because, at TRUE CRIME TONIGHT, there’s a seat for everyone. Whether breaking down crime scene forensics, scrutinizing serial killers, or debating the most binge-worthy true crime docs, True Crime Tonight is the fresh, fast-paced, and slightly addictive home for true crime lovers.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com