December 14, 2023 • 39 mins
Ted Leo is an iconic indie rock songsmith and ambassador of soul. In this season 2 wrap up of Sound of Our Town, Will and Ted have a heartfelt talk about first shows, touring, venue vibe and connection.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
What was your first concert that I attended?
Speaker 2 (00:07):
Yeah, that I went to, Uh it was it was
Adam and the Ants and at the Capitol Theater in Passaic,
New Jersey in nineteen eighty.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
I was ten, and I I, you know, I was
a fan.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
I think probably more from like early MTV at that point,
Like I wasn't you know, going to other punk shows
or anything. But I was aware of it, like Ben's
like the jam and stuff I knew, you know, just
because I don't know, like I paid attention to the
radio and there was a lot of good like independent
(00:47):
radio around here. And I remember asking my dad if
I could go to this show, and for so many
years it seemed crazy that he took me.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
And then I realized, like, oh.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
He was like thirty two, like thirty one or something like,
you know, he was still a young guy essentially himself,
like you know, when I was a teenage like, yeah,
do you believe my dad took me to go see it?
I mean, so I was like, oh, you know, by
the time I was forty, I was like, oh, he
was like ten years younger than I am now, you
know right right?
Speaker 1 (01:20):
Was he was? He into it? Yeah? He enjoyed it. Yeah, yeah,
what did he listen to?
Speaker 2 (01:26):
Uh? You know, uh the Beatles, who Bob Dylan, that
kind of stuff, some like you know, weirdly like you know,
I got kind of turned onto reggae by him, but
mostly mostly you know your basic Beatles, who axis you know?
Speaker 1 (01:48):
Yeah? Did were you playing music at that time?
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Uh?
Speaker 1 (01:52):
Not really, I I was. I was taking some piano lessons.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
And mostly I was just walking, probably annoying everybody with
how much I was. I would sing, but I didn't
really pick up a guitar until I was like a
senior in high school.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
So sing singing was like the natural thing coming out
of you first almost Yeah, yeah, that tracks, that tracks.
Speaker 1 (02:17):
I appreciated that.
Speaker 3 (02:18):
Do you do you remember having a feeling that that
ten year old kid being like that that right there?
Speaker 1 (02:24):
I do. But here's the crazy thing.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
So and this, you know, this kind of loops around
to the internet era because I remember the opening band
so well. They were this power pop group that I
later learned was from Richmond, Virginia called Single B A Theory.
And they were, I mean they were you know, they
(02:48):
were kind of like cheap, tricky, like they were just
like the super tight tons of Hooks powerpop band. It
had this one song called which I'll tell you it
was called keep It Tight, and I never forgot it.
It's like one of those rare things where from nineteen
eighty until, you know, when I finally I wasn't in
front of a computer and you know, remembered to look
(03:10):
it up. Like thirty years later, I had the chorus
of this song you Gotta key bit like, you know,
just like rolling around in my head and I was
finally able to look them up and you know, find
out where they were from, and there's like a video
for the song and et cetera. And that was the
(03:31):
thing that stuck with me. I mean, I remain a
big I actually remain kind of a big Adam and
the Nants fan, but it was that opening band song
that stuck with me, and I think gave me more
of the sense of what you're talking about, because, you know,
with all the.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
With all the makeup and the.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
The the you know, pirate costumes and stuff like Adam
and the Answer were a little more theatrical, but this
was just like this is just like a band. You know,
this is like cheap trick, bad Finger, you know, just
like getting out there hooks la guitars, and I think
that that was what that gave me a little bit
(04:10):
more of a sense of like, oh, there's you know,
a whole this this stuff that I that I am
attracted to, like you know, it's ongoing, and there's a
whole world of people who are just doing it, you know,
and they're not superstars and et cetera.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
And I wonder too because what you just described I
feel like I still look for on a night out
or or I'm on a bill or anything, and that
it accesses this primal response to music that doesn't need
the preconceived media hype, which is a construct of you
(04:47):
know that that that is modern essentially like a three
hundred year construct, right that you would know who Mozart
is and you had enough money to get to a performance,
or you would you know who the Beatles are. You
have expectations on adam ant, you have a built up
narrative when you're there. You have no narrative on this
thing in front of you, and they happen to be
(05:08):
badass and have a hook and be authentic in front
of you, and it access that thing that we all
deserve that we lose sight of in.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
Media arts.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
Absolutely, Yeah, I think you're right about that. It's a
very it's a very what's the word. It's primal, not
in like a maybe a little bit in like an
amygdalo like lizard brain response sense, but also just in
the sense that it's it's it's it's at that early
forming stage, you.
Speaker 1 (05:40):
Know, before.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
Before media exists much for you, before those narratives start
to develop, you know, to cohere around what you're doing,
whether driven by you or not.
Speaker 3 (05:53):
Right, right, And it's maybe with the ubiquity of just
we're all connected. You know, five six billion of us
are all connected now through some degree of separation. I
just worry about that atrophy all the time. Yeah, And
when I pass a lizard in a cage, I'm just like,
(06:14):
you're so lucky you have that whole lizard brain.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
Just that's all that you have to deal with, the
other half. Right, Son's over here, That's where I'm moving
my head.
Speaker 3 (06:23):
Yeah. Do you do you have a favorite town to play?
Not like where you you have the best audience or
anything like that, but just like you know, you're going
to this town in the United States and you're gonna
have a spiritual ted Leo time like a U time.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
That's a little tough, having having been to most places
a lot of times. You know, uh, I kind of center,
you know, I have I have done. I have gone
through stretches where the breaking from the tour herd walk,
you know, solo walk becomes really important. Most of the time,
(07:10):
I do kind of especially these days, I do kind
of stick with the herd. I like to stay in
the milieu of the you know, of the show. But
I used to explore a lot more. And so the
return to these places, you know, where I had discovered
(07:32):
this cool little art museum or this great little vegan restaurant.
You know, they become a little bit mythologized in your
in your own head, you know. And sometimes that return
is great, and sometimes that return is a bummer because
it's not it doesn't have the magic of that you know,
you're hoping to reconnect with it the first time you
went there, or.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
It's gone, you know. But yeah, yeah, good, oh, go ahead.
Speaker 3 (07:55):
No, I mean I never thought of what you just
said about the being with the herd and everything that
I've never really I don't think I've had a conversation
about that importance both important, right, Yeah, that the feeling
of rolling into a new town to play, or a
new region or a new place and just going for
a walk where you're not thinking, but that's two miles away.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
You just walk because you have no.
Speaker 3 (08:16):
Idea, yep, and you're just gone and they're like Or
you finish a sound check and like, hey, where can
I go to a byte? And I go to this place,
I'm just gonna walk and I don't end up at
that place. I just end up somewhere else, and I
don't care anymore. Especially the more foreign places to me,
the less I'm judging my experience, and then I have
a better experience I haven't made in itinerary or not
looking for that place that was awesome last time.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
Right right?
Speaker 2 (08:41):
You know these are I mean, I'm I'm assuming that
this might be of interest to the listeners of your
particular podcast and might not. It might be a little
inside baseball for for some people. But like the different
you know ways, like logistically of touring affect this as well,
because if you're on a bus and you arrive in
it in a new town in the morning, you have
(09:02):
some time, you know, you have some time to explore.
If you're on a on a van tour in a
kind of punker scene where shows are later and there's
not this like regimented sound check scenario. Drives are maybe
a little shorter most of the time. You have more
time to explore if you're kind of in that in
that like we're selling a few records, like we're drawing
(09:24):
a few hundred people. We're in a van, but everything's
a little tighter. Yeah, the shows are the shows are
earlier because we're older and because that's what the venues
do at this you know size, Like you get there,
you load in, you sound check, there's maybe two hours
before the first band, if you know. If that and
if you want to be around for that, there's not
a lot of time, you know, not a lot of
(09:45):
time to explore anymore. And then the show's over and
you got to go to bed. So it's a it
changes your relationship to traveling.
Speaker 3 (09:52):
When I got approached to do this podcast, like, yeah,
you just talk about all the experiences, like I just
want to explain the experience of somebody working traveling around
into the place. Yeah, And I spent the summer following
a bus in a car with me and one other
person which is driving setting yourself up, merching, yourself, checking, playing, talking,
(10:13):
selling back in the car, hotel, wake up, drive, follow
a bus.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
Yeah, yeah, exactly, yeah, yeah, you know it's it's these
days for many many reasons, like I don't do I
don't really do the like six seven week tours four
times a year, five times a year that I that
I did twenty years ago. But but building in a
day off every every now and then in a in
(10:37):
a place where you're maybe going to get some of
that fun. Mystery again is it's kind of like I
do think about that ahead of time, you know, I'll
say recently, like in an answer to your original question about this,
I don't remember what two towns we were driving between, but.
Speaker 1 (10:59):
Back in twenty eighteen.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
Twenty seventeen, late twenty seventeen, I was doing one of
the two the only two bus tours that I've ever
done under my own name, and uh, you know, we
we needed a day to get from wherever it was,
like Atlanta to New Orleans or something, and we stopped
(11:24):
in Jackson, Mississippi, and had a day off. And that
was exactly one of those situations where you're like, I
guess I'm just gonna walk because I'm just gonna walk around,
you know, and then eventually, like you find, you find someone,
You listen to some things, you look at some flyers
on the wall. You know, somebody tipped somebody in our
band off to this like speakeasy that opens up in
(11:46):
the back of a pharmacy at ten pm, you know,
and yeah, it goes through the through the nights, so
like you stumble upon this actually cool thing and and
and that create you know that that will forever be
the you know, one of those magical days off or
when I used to when I was touring with Amy
a lot anyman for the listeners like both as when
(12:07):
we did our band the both and also times when
I would when I would travel opening for her, we
made it a real point to find an art museum
like wherever wherever we were that was those were bus tours,
so you had many many hours in the day because
it's it's a way to like sort of stay in
a in a creative space talk, you know, have conversations
(12:30):
about art, but not be in the black box of
the rock club with.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
That, you know, all day and all night, and.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
That that's like that's something that presents really fun magical
things because maybe you're in a small town, maybe it's
a it's a tiny museum, but you find one corner
where there's something really cool that you've never seen before,
you know, and uh it it really like it just
gives you. It gives you life that can just drain
(12:58):
out of you if you if you're just on the
grind the whole time.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
You know, Yeah, I got that habit from Chemo and
Kirk who play Case with Amy a lot.
Speaker 1 (13:07):
Doing the museums. Oh that's cool, that's great. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
And uh and also you're just you're in the legacy
of art and you're like that thing on that wall
is someone's effort, Like I'm putting effort in now, and
you just.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
Have a little bit more.
Speaker 3 (13:25):
Continuation and continuity of feeling okay about it. Because also
on the road, you there's it's just this bipolar thing
of down not only the downtime and work of one
hour to two hours a night or something like that,
but bad night to good night, all this stuff being
away from from not only just loved ones, but the
(13:48):
source sometimes if your love is the source, right, uh,
and uh so sometimes feeling that connection, Uh, it's just
a little bit moremental health.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
Yeah, it will. I mean I know that you you
who who tours solo solo a lot like I do,
must also know like I've always you just said bipolar,
and I have always called it like it's it's touring
alone alone is super manic.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
You know.
Speaker 2 (14:16):
It's like when things are when things are up, it's
really up.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
You know, it can be.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
Like the greatest thing, like you're meeting new people, you
have this great show. You know, when things are low,
there's you got nowhere to go other than the driver's
seat of your car, you know, and think that.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
Can get pretty.
Speaker 2 (14:35):
Low if you don't have an appreciation for the driver's
seat of your car.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
Yeah, and and for doing those check ins or having
something like that. And when you when you are solo touring,
it's like, well, I don't.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
Deserve you have so much more work to do. There's
no one to lean on.
Speaker 3 (14:50):
Or even if it's like I just did, like I said,
I was following a big band with a bus and
I want a tour manager with me, but still was
it was a lot of work just that two of us.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
And uh, it.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
Is those little things of within a town or you know,
be it the museum or the food place, or the
bookstore or a record store, something something like.
Speaker 1 (15:17):
That, just to have some sanity of it all. Is
there are there? What are some rooms? You know what?
Speaker 3 (15:25):
I just on this on this tour that I played
the Uptown Theater in Kansas City.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
I think it's Uptown Theater could be Yeah, that sounds right.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
And and had a night off when you speak of
night offs, And I went to the Green Lady. Have
you ever been the Green Lady in Kansas City? The
jazz well, it's it's one of those things. Was like,
all right, I want to tell everyone, and I don't
want to tell everyone, and you feel like we are
all going to be all right if we could all
just spend some time in the Green lad It's two
(15:57):
floors of jazz, all original, not like jazz covers, but
like these outfits from I think four in the afternoon
until two am. Different bands, right, yeah, two different bands
upstairs and downstairs. Another place called the Black Dolphin, I
believe next door, which is a little bit more modern design,
but the Green Lady's been around forever. It's red and orange. Inside.
(16:19):
Every lamp is different, you know, the puffy couches. Everyone
in America is in there. And I was there at
seven o'clock on my off night because I'm like, I
heard I have to go here. Yeah yeah, and everywhere
all of America is in there, and I mean every
kind of person, every demographic. An eighty year old couple
(16:41):
on a date nice and a twenty year old looking
twenty two year old looking to hook up and like
meet some somebody, and they're all there, And I thought,
I don't I.
Speaker 1 (16:51):
Don't know a lot of places like this, especially in America.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
Yeah yeah, yeah yeah, And it didn't, and it didn't
and it wasn't like, uh, you know, Disnified or Bozeman.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
Not at all. Yeah, not at all.
Speaker 3 (17:05):
And and it's one of those things is often like
a night off, I will have that whole the up
and down bipolarists will will creep in. It's like I
should be working, I'm not doing anything, or I'm away
from my loved ones, and I don't want to be like, hey,
I'm just gonna go kick it around town. But then
I just had this great positive jazz America experience that's
(17:27):
almost one little room that's really great. Next time I go.
Next time I go there, it'll be closed.
Speaker 1 (17:33):
So I don't say that.
Speaker 3 (17:35):
No, it's been around forever. It's a thriving, thriving place.
But what is are there rooms as far as performing?
Like performing, Like I've never played Value Hall? You just
played there with Did the Chisel tour go through time?
Speaker 1 (17:50):
No?
Speaker 2 (17:51):
But I played there with the with my band the
Pharmacists back back in on that twenty seventeen tour that
I was just talking about, Yeah, or maybe later, that.
Speaker 3 (18:01):
Just seems like to like, that's one of my rooms,
Like I haven't played that. I was like, that just
got seems like a magical room. I always love playing
the Metro. Yeah, I always love playing the Paradise or
the Sinclair and Bosson. You know, plenty of places. But
do you have do you what's your magic list in America?
Speaker 1 (18:20):
Yeah? I do.
Speaker 2 (18:21):
I mean, you know, Chisel did play the Sinclair and
it's interesting that was my first time there, and uh
it was.
Speaker 1 (18:30):
It was a really nice show. It was fun.
Speaker 2 (18:31):
But one of the one of the amazing things was
more than one person remarked And you don't get told
this very often from even your friends, you know, like
they might say you sound good, but it's very rare
that they say it sounded so good, you know, and
I had a couple of people tell me like it
sounded like it was already pressed on vinyl, like how
(18:52):
it was.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
Coming out of the of the PA.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
I was like, wow, that's amazing, all right, you know,
thumbs up to the to the Sinclair for that. We
just did the Summerville h Ballroom, the Crystal Ballroom.
Speaker 1 (19:06):
I just played the other night. That was great. It
was beautiful sounding race.
Speaker 3 (19:09):
Yeah, it sounds great in that room and that here
I'm sorry to something like also for people who follow
the show, and I think people who we are speaking
to a little bit of the converted in sound of
our town for the most part, but I feel like
they need it's also good to speak to the converted
so they know that it's important to be converted and
(19:32):
know how important a lifestyle of engaging with live music is,
especially when everyone's complaining about Spotify and all these things,
Like we have the power to invest in the arts
when you participate in live music and not let anybody think.
I always want to instill in any listener this show
that not only a sense of gratitude, but uh, it's
(19:57):
a really powerful thing to participate in live music and
you're can you're continuing something ancient, But that's way off
track about what I was going to say about music rooms.
But I want to share some of these little details
that a room, like the Crystal Ballroom, something about its design.
I always like when a room when you're sound checking
and you're hearing reflections back as well as your monitor,
(20:18):
and it's a really nice and you have this great
sound check and then it fills with people and all
you have is monitor. Yeah, and the ballroom stays a
little bit live and comes back at you. A good
theater which will always do absolutely, But some rock clubs
and some smaller rooms like die once you walk out
and there's people.
Speaker 1 (20:36):
Yea. The ballroom can fill with people in it and
it cycles back at you.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
And I love that, Yeah, yes, absolutely that that's you know,
I mean, for better or for worse, probably for worse.
Like I don't I don't use in your monitors, And
it's precisely for that reason, because like I really do
kind of feed off the the bing around of the
of the stage and in the room a little bit.
And and I really appreciate exactly what you're saying when
(21:01):
you can feel that. I think other rooms for me,
you know, just like a little bit of context when
I started playing under my own name in I guess
late late nineties, like I had just been in a
couple of other bands in the nineties, including Chisel, who
we mentioned, and me starting to play under my own
name was like.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
It was.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
It was in a way, it was like degrading, uh
not degrading the sense of devaluing, but just like dropping
it down a few notches to hobbyist in a way.
Like I was just like, you know, I want to
keep playing music, Like I'm kind of done. I'm done
with being in bands. I'm done with like playing the game.
I'm done with trying trying to do much with this
other than to just do it. So I started playing
(21:48):
solo gradually, you know, wanted to have want to be
playing with people again, and gathered this band around me
that has has had a core for a long time
but has had more fuzzy edges where people come and
go call the pharmacists, and and then you know, as
it goes with these things, like something happened, like once
I sort of gave all, gave all that striving up,
(22:12):
things started happening. And in the early two thousands, I'm
gonna like take New York, Boston in DC as as examples,
because this is where it really happened. You know, we
could see we're on tour. We toured a lot back then,
and you could see, you know, every six months, you
could see the progress of of like the growing audience
(22:34):
for what we were doing, and so and you would
map out venue by venue, so it would be like,
you know, upstairs at the Middle East or Brownies in
New York, or the backstage at the Black Cat in
DC for like a year and then it's just like
we can't we literally can't play there anymore, Like we
have to go downstairs in the Middle East or you
know where what a Bowery ballroom in New York and
(22:57):
the main stage of the Black At in DC. And
and it was it was perhaps one of the only
times in my life. And I feel very like, you know,
you mentioned gratitude and the last thing, and that's that's
what jogged this in my head, because you know, one
of the only times in your life were my life
where I could see this happening and it felt it
(23:23):
felt amazing because you know, we had gone we had
started putting out records with Lookout records like the Venerable
West you know East Bay Punk label who had some resources,
so we were we were like on a decent sized label.
But other than that, like we still really weren't doing
anything other than just you know, trying to make music.
And it was connecting and it was the first you know,
(23:48):
we like I said, like we started having you know,
we could you could map like venue size by every
six months, like what we were we were doing back then.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
And then there was a.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
Time when we were we were going to play the
Valery Ballroom and we needed to add a second night
and both nights sold out, and that to me was
like this kind of amazing mountain top because it really really,
it really really felt like, you know, we were still
pretty out of the spotlights such as it was. You know,
(24:20):
this was like the era of the Strokes and everything,
and uh, you know, we weren't get we weren't getting
that kind of press, We weren't getting that kind of play.
You know, ninety percent of the people you talk to,
if not ninety nine percent.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
Of the people you talk to. This is the era
where you.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
Get on a plane with the guitar and the flight
at ten is like, oh, should I know you and
you're like probably not know, like maybe you should, but
I mean my life exactly. Yeah, yeah, I mean you
should maybe, but like I don't expect you to.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
You know, if you're leading a healthy lifestyle, you would,
but no.
Speaker 2 (24:57):
You don't know, right exactly, but that.
Speaker 1 (25:01):
Kind of thing. It was also you know, it was
also the.
Speaker 2 (25:05):
The beginning of the of the Iraq War years and
you know, we we were known for I think, you know,
for for singing songs within that time. That that that
connected with people who were struggling to like live through
(25:27):
that time. And you could just feel this energy on
those two nights at the Bowery Ballroom that that.
Speaker 1 (25:37):
Very much, uh was that kind of.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
Positive community Catharsis where it like just creates this great
feedback loop of of good you know, of like sorrow
and love and you know, like we're in this together
and and we're actually all here and and to be
able to do you know, the Barry Barb is not
the biggest venue in the world, but it's.
Speaker 1 (26:06):
It to do.
Speaker 2 (26:07):
To be able to do two nights there, having like
come from like scuzzy basement punk world, you know.
Speaker 1 (26:18):
It really.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
It had less to do with me feeling like, hey,
we've made it than it did with like that, that
that absolute like reminder that there's power in music and
there's like community in music. That's what makes me do
it in the first place. Like, you know, I love
(26:44):
playing songs, I love hearing playing hearing the songs that
I love playing them, you know, like I could sit
here and play songs and it would it would lift
my mood and make me happy. But there's something very
special about connecting with an with an audience, with that
stuff that that that moment crystallized for me, and for
(27:06):
that reason, that venue will.
Speaker 1 (27:08):
Forever be a very special place for me.
Speaker 2 (27:12):
We were able to go back there this this past
September and do a show and it really really felt like,
you know, after many many years, I don't even remember
the last time we played there before that was, but
it really felt like a like a cool.
Speaker 1 (27:27):
Homecoming, and it should be. It is like a.
Speaker 3 (27:33):
If you're someone and I have friends who you know,
don't play music at all, but they go to more
shows probably than I've a paid right, you know, and
our ballroom should be one of those places. Like you
have to know it if you've yeah, you know, gone
to more than twenty shows a year in your life
in a way, and are you saying that you recognize
(27:53):
it even then? Are you saying yeah, or is it
it's also just grown more in power that you did
accomplished that, because it is an accomplishment. There's something about
the rooms where you can access the whites of everybody's
eyes when the lights like pop up a little bit,
and you know that that's the most that's the most
(28:16):
ancient part of the job. Recorded music is one hundred
year old phenomenon, which is nothing we were at the
and I'm of the opinion and this is another podcast
we could do another time, but we are now waving
goodbye to a renaissance of recorded music that you know,
there was a renaissance of water colors, and there's amazing
(28:36):
watercolor paintings being sold right now and the watercolor artists existing,
but the renaissance of it had passed that interesting and
and the technology of humans being able to record themselves
from from the basic acetate to the beatles to then
pro tools and now it's a now democratized across humanity.
(28:59):
Everyone's going to have it and it's important to I
think also recognize so you cannot wave goodbye. And it's
also maybe exciting because it should lead power, especially with
all these things that we're concerning ourselves with AI and Spotify,
payments and this, and that we have to remember the
real power and the real ancient job that we have
(29:20):
is what you described.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
Yeah, yeah, and I think and I think, and I
think an answer to your question, I think I did
recognize it in the in the moment. I think that's
why it imprinted so strongly on me, you know, because
it's it's not something that is like rose colored glasses,
(29:42):
like in the moment of those two nights, the lengthy
moment of those two nights, I absolutely did feel it.
And you know, it's truly one of those things where
I can this ly say, like if I went to
my grave never having experienced exactly that again, I couldn't
(30:06):
I count myself.
Speaker 1 (30:07):
I'm like among a very.
Speaker 2 (30:09):
Lucky group of people who got who maybe have gotten
to experience.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
That that's wise and healthy and so true and important
to remember.
Speaker 3 (30:33):
A band has a hard time being serious and I
kind of have like a Rolodex band, you know, like
in a drummer in La and drummer in Chicago and.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
Stuff like that. Just to do this.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
But I was joking around the other night. I was go, Okay, guys,
let's go out and honor every bloodline that is running
through our bloods. Aren't every amoeba, every humanoid, not just
the bipeds. They all existed, and you know how excited
they be to be able to walk out into a
room of people and play music right now. And and
(31:03):
I was a joking. We all like, we're just making
silly jokes about it.
Speaker 1 (31:07):
Yeah, but there is something very.
Speaker 3 (31:10):
Rare about doing it, and especially you just said, you know, two, three,
four and five, and right now it's just like this
this century in general, it's a really important job because
the Renaissance was thriving.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
Back then.
Speaker 3 (31:30):
We felt connected over the radio and people felt, you know,
the way people talk about Starch and Pepper's coming out,
or the way I felt when I remember when Okay,
computer came.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
Out, and I was like, people are in line waiting
for this record, you know.
Speaker 3 (31:42):
And we were having communical experiences within the renaissance, and
now we're not having communal experiences with recorded music. That
might have to be okay, not lamented and enjoy the
renaissance and and return to that fire pit, you know,
(32:05):
where you know, your other humanoid just killed an animal
and like you're using the bones to drop a sick
beat and your friend's carving up the wood, and Mammothon.
Speaker 1 (32:13):
Says, that's a really great beat. Are you going to
do anything with that?
Speaker 2 (32:17):
Maybe I can, Yeah, I could you book some holes
in this one and get a little like ok arena
kind of thing going on exactly.
Speaker 1 (32:25):
Yeah, we've been doing it forever.
Speaker 3 (32:27):
Yeah, you felt, And that's that's what I hear too
when you when you describe.
Speaker 2 (32:31):
It, that's yeah, that's that even like that even heightens
it for me to like.
Speaker 1 (32:35):
It was already really high.
Speaker 2 (32:36):
But now now I'm thinking of the the you know,
the the genetic material of Amieba's that you know that
you know, made made their way through to that moment somehow,
it's pretty heavy.
Speaker 3 (32:48):
And when everyone should know what this is, like, this
is the morning for us. We're not imbibing on anything
right now. And I but I'll and I'll also say,
just to bring this full circle, what you just described
that probably time period, what year would you say that
show was?
Speaker 2 (33:06):
I think that was as we've been talking, I realized
that that was probably five or oh six.
Speaker 1 (33:12):
And I was, you know, sure, listening to the Strokes
and listening to a ton of things.
Speaker 3 (33:19):
It was probably a site called e music, Oh yeah,
where I downloaded Shake the Sheets.
Speaker 1 (33:25):
Oh nice, because I was looking.
Speaker 3 (33:28):
For that thing that you also described with the band
that opened up for a man, right right, I'm looking
for show me something real that isn't being sent to
me right now, to tell me it's real. And that's
how I heard you for.
Speaker 1 (33:43):
The first time. Made me cry. That's actually really nice.
Speaker 2 (33:46):
That's I mean, that's that's like that is right in
line with what's become the theme of this you know,
which is that that kind of ongoing thing you know
that I mean, take take it back to the Amiba
and stop along the way at a single bullet theory
from Richmond, Virginia, you know, which led in some ways
(34:07):
to me making that album, led to you finding that album,
you know, et cetera.
Speaker 3 (34:11):
Yeah, And there's people who are really good at being
in that one percent of successful artists, right there is
something in that world that makes you feel I would
just never be good at it, right, And we need
to know that there's an authentic way to art without
it being approved by the marketplace, I'll say for now,
(34:34):
in that process is everything for the artist. It is
the process of writing the song, process of playing the show,
process of recording it. Those processes where we are at
those highs of the bipolar wave of the experience, and the.
Speaker 1 (34:50):
Results are the lie. Yeah, yeah, the results are not real.
Speaker 3 (34:57):
I mean, and we're constantly robbed of the by a process,
by results.
Speaker 2 (35:03):
I I can't go all the way there with you
only because as a as an also a fan of music,
I feel like I have to. I have to honor
the fans response in some way, you know, like is
that is that re encounter to what you're saying or not.
Speaker 1 (35:22):
No, I don't think so, no, no, no, I don't think.
Speaker 3 (35:24):
I think I think that's a process of connectivity, like
you're saying, Okay, I would call that process as well.
Speaker 1 (35:29):
Yeah, right, we're back on We're back on the We're
back totally totally. That would be that would be the
fourth uh fourth tier in this in this series.
Speaker 3 (35:41):
But uh, but but you know case because you're just
alluding to like, oh, yeah, the strokes are happening at
that time and the stuff, and we were doing this.
But what you did, what you do and have done,
and all that to me is uh is uh extremely
pivotal like for not only the audience, but me as
the audience, and or people like me as the audience
(36:01):
who are artists like I need to see I need
to see ted Leo doing it.
Speaker 1 (36:04):
I need to see you in the when it happens
to me and I saw you in the both and
all these other things. I don't know. I'm just I
I well, you know how I feel. I feel like
you felt at that adam antic concerts.
Speaker 2 (36:16):
Well you should know that I feel the same way
about you. And I'm not just saying that our things
are going to run out of time.
Speaker 1 (36:21):
Yeah it is. Yeah, damn it.
Speaker 3 (36:23):
I'm gonna call you, okay, just but we're done, like
we we we fixed everything.
Speaker 1 (36:27):
I think we. I think we said a lot here.
Yeah yeah, I mean yeah.
Speaker 3 (36:31):
It's a half hour show because live music is more
important than two dudes talking.
Speaker 1 (36:35):
There you go, Yeah, listen to this on your way
to the show.
Speaker 3 (36:38):
Y, yeah, on your way to the show. And one
more thing, to everyone who's listened this season in the
prior season, thank you. And to anyone who has wandered
(36:59):
in the night, maybe in a strange town, saw a
marquee or a chalkboard or a flyer, just thought why
not pulled out a five ten or twenty thirty forty
bucks and went inside and just listened. You're pretty magical
(37:21):
if you've done that.
Speaker 1 (37:33):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (37:34):
Season two complete.
Speaker 1 (37:38):
Where do we go from here?
Speaker 3 (37:40):
Only you can decide share your favorite episodes follow this podcast.
I do have some extra surprises coming into the new year.
Leave a review wherever you get your podcasts, and just
send me a direct message of what you think I
should do. Where should we go, what happens next? What
(38:00):
cities do we cover? This is Sound of Our Town.
It's a production of iHeartRadio and Double Elvis, executively produced
by Brady Sadler and Jake Brennan. Production assistants by Matt Bowden.
I gotta thanks so many writers Freda Love Smith, Samantha Ferrell,
Patrick Coleman, Caitlin White, Gerald Dowd. We had fun this year,
(38:23):
and thanks to Jamie Demas for keeping us all in order.
Speaker 1 (38:26):
I'm your host, Will Daly.
Speaker 3 (38:28):
By the way, I've created, wrote, and scored and produced
this in case you didn't know, and you can find
me just by spelling Will Daly d A.
Speaker 1 (38:41):
I L.
Speaker 3 (38:42):
E Y into any kind of electronic device, and I
hope to see you soon. Until then, thank you for
your ears.
What was your first concert that I attended?
Speaker 2 (00:07):
Yeah, that I went to, Uh it was it was
Adam and the Ants and at the Capitol Theater in Passaic,
New Jersey in nineteen eighty.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
I was ten, and I I, you know, I was
a fan.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
I think probably more from like early MTV at that point,
Like I wasn't you know, going to other punk shows
or anything. But I was aware of it, like Ben's
like the jam and stuff I knew, you know, just
because I don't know, like I paid attention to the
radio and there was a lot of good like independent
(00:47):
radio around here. And I remember asking my dad if
I could go to this show, and for so many
years it seemed crazy that he took me.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
And then I realized, like, oh.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
He was like thirty two, like thirty one or something like,
you know, he was still a young guy essentially himself,
like you know, when I was a teenage like, yeah,
do you believe my dad took me to go see it?
I mean, so I was like, oh, you know, by
the time I was forty, I was like, oh, he
was like ten years younger than I am now, you
know right right?
Speaker 1 (01:20):
Was he was? He into it? Yeah? He enjoyed it. Yeah, yeah,
what did he listen to?
Speaker 2 (01:26):
Uh? You know, uh the Beatles, who Bob Dylan, that
kind of stuff, some like you know, weirdly like you know,
I got kind of turned onto reggae by him, but
mostly mostly you know your basic Beatles, who axis you know?
Speaker 1 (01:48):
Yeah? Did were you playing music at that time?
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Uh?
Speaker 1 (01:52):
Not really, I I was. I was taking some piano lessons.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
And mostly I was just walking, probably annoying everybody with
how much I was. I would sing, but I didn't
really pick up a guitar until I was like a
senior in high school.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
So sing singing was like the natural thing coming out
of you first almost Yeah, yeah, that tracks, that tracks.
Speaker 1 (02:17):
I appreciated that.
Speaker 3 (02:18):
Do you do you remember having a feeling that that
ten year old kid being like that that right there?
Speaker 1 (02:24):
I do. But here's the crazy thing.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
So and this, you know, this kind of loops around
to the internet era because I remember the opening band
so well. They were this power pop group that I
later learned was from Richmond, Virginia called Single B A Theory.
And they were, I mean they were you know, they
(02:48):
were kind of like cheap, tricky, like they were just
like the super tight tons of Hooks powerpop band. It
had this one song called which I'll tell you it
was called keep It Tight, and I never forgot it.
It's like one of those rare things where from nineteen
eighty until, you know, when I finally I wasn't in
front of a computer and you know, remembered to look
(03:10):
it up. Like thirty years later, I had the chorus
of this song you Gotta key bit like, you know,
just like rolling around in my head and I was
finally able to look them up and you know, find
out where they were from, and there's like a video
for the song and et cetera. And that was the
(03:31):
thing that stuck with me. I mean, I remain a
big I actually remain kind of a big Adam and
the Nants fan, but it was that opening band song
that stuck with me, and I think gave me more
of the sense of what you're talking about, because, you know,
with all the.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
With all the makeup and the.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
The the you know, pirate costumes and stuff like Adam
and the Answer were a little more theatrical, but this
was just like this is just like a band. You know,
this is like cheap trick, bad Finger, you know, just
like getting out there hooks la guitars, and I think
that that was what that gave me a little bit
(04:10):
more of a sense of like, oh, there's you know,
a whole this this stuff that I that I am
attracted to, like you know, it's ongoing, and there's a
whole world of people who are just doing it, you know,
and they're not superstars and et cetera.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
And I wonder too because what you just described I
feel like I still look for on a night out
or or I'm on a bill or anything, and that
it accesses this primal response to music that doesn't need
the preconceived media hype, which is a construct of you
(04:47):
know that that that is modern essentially like a three
hundred year construct, right that you would know who Mozart
is and you had enough money to get to a performance,
or you would you know who the Beatles are. You
have expectations on adam ant, you have a built up
narrative when you're there. You have no narrative on this
thing in front of you, and they happen to be
(05:08):
badass and have a hook and be authentic in front
of you, and it access that thing that we all
deserve that we lose sight of in.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
Media arts.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
Absolutely, Yeah, I think you're right about that. It's a
very it's a very what's the word. It's primal, not
in like a maybe a little bit in like an
amygdalo like lizard brain response sense, but also just in
the sense that it's it's it's it's at that early
forming stage, you.
Speaker 1 (05:40):
Know, before.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
Before media exists much for you, before those narratives start
to develop, you know, to cohere around what you're doing,
whether driven by you or not.
Speaker 3 (05:53):
Right, right, And it's maybe with the ubiquity of just
we're all connected. You know, five six billion of us
are all connected now through some degree of separation. I
just worry about that atrophy all the time. Yeah, And
when I pass a lizard in a cage, I'm just like,
(06:14):
you're so lucky you have that whole lizard brain.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
Just that's all that you have to deal with, the
other half. Right, Son's over here, That's where I'm moving
my head.
Speaker 3 (06:23):
Yeah. Do you do you have a favorite town to play?
Not like where you you have the best audience or
anything like that, but just like you know, you're going
to this town in the United States and you're gonna
have a spiritual ted Leo time like a U time.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
That's a little tough, having having been to most places
a lot of times. You know, uh, I kind of center,
you know, I have I have done. I have gone
through stretches where the breaking from the tour herd walk,
you know, solo walk becomes really important. Most of the time,
(07:10):
I do kind of especially these days, I do kind
of stick with the herd. I like to stay in
the milieu of the you know, of the show. But
I used to explore a lot more. And so the
return to these places, you know, where I had discovered
(07:32):
this cool little art museum or this great little vegan restaurant.
You know, they become a little bit mythologized in your
in your own head, you know. And sometimes that return
is great, and sometimes that return is a bummer because
it's not it doesn't have the magic of that you know,
you're hoping to reconnect with it the first time you
went there, or.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
It's gone, you know. But yeah, yeah, good, oh, go ahead.
Speaker 3 (07:55):
No, I mean I never thought of what you just
said about the being with the herd and everything that
I've never really I don't think I've had a conversation
about that importance both important, right, Yeah, that the feeling
of rolling into a new town to play, or a
new region or a new place and just going for
a walk where you're not thinking, but that's two miles away.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
You just walk because you have no.
Speaker 3 (08:16):
Idea, yep, and you're just gone and they're like Or
you finish a sound check and like, hey, where can
I go to a byte? And I go to this place,
I'm just gonna walk and I don't end up at
that place. I just end up somewhere else, and I
don't care anymore. Especially the more foreign places to me,
the less I'm judging my experience, and then I have
a better experience I haven't made in itinerary or not
looking for that place that was awesome last time.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
Right right?
Speaker 2 (08:41):
You know these are I mean, I'm I'm assuming that
this might be of interest to the listeners of your
particular podcast and might not. It might be a little
inside baseball for for some people. But like the different
you know ways, like logistically of touring affect this as well,
because if you're on a bus and you arrive in
it in a new town in the morning, you have
(09:02):
some time, you know, you have some time to explore.
If you're on a on a van tour in a
kind of punker scene where shows are later and there's
not this like regimented sound check scenario. Drives are maybe
a little shorter most of the time. You have more
time to explore if you're kind of in that in
that like we're selling a few records, like we're drawing
(09:24):
a few hundred people. We're in a van, but everything's
a little tighter. Yeah, the shows are the shows are
earlier because we're older and because that's what the venues
do at this you know size, Like you get there,
you load in, you sound check, there's maybe two hours
before the first band, if you know. If that and
if you want to be around for that, there's not
a lot of time, you know, not a lot of
(09:45):
time to explore anymore. And then the show's over and
you got to go to bed. So it's a it
changes your relationship to traveling.
Speaker 3 (09:52):
When I got approached to do this podcast, like, yeah,
you just talk about all the experiences, like I just
want to explain the experience of somebody working traveling around
into the place. Yeah, And I spent the summer following
a bus in a car with me and one other
person which is driving setting yourself up, merching, yourself, checking, playing, talking,
(10:13):
selling back in the car, hotel, wake up, drive, follow
a bus.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
Yeah, yeah, exactly, yeah, yeah, you know it's it's these
days for many many reasons, like I don't do I
don't really do the like six seven week tours four
times a year, five times a year that I that
I did twenty years ago. But but building in a
day off every every now and then in a in
(10:37):
a place where you're maybe going to get some of
that fun. Mystery again is it's kind of like I
do think about that ahead of time, you know, I'll
say recently, like in an answer to your original question about this,
I don't remember what two towns we were driving between, but.
Speaker 1 (10:59):
Back in twenty eighteen.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
Twenty seventeen, late twenty seventeen, I was doing one of
the two the only two bus tours that I've ever
done under my own name, and uh, you know, we
we needed a day to get from wherever it was,
like Atlanta to New Orleans or something, and we stopped
(11:24):
in Jackson, Mississippi, and had a day off. And that
was exactly one of those situations where you're like, I
guess I'm just gonna walk because I'm just gonna walk around,
you know, and then eventually, like you find, you find someone,
You listen to some things, you look at some flyers
on the wall. You know, somebody tipped somebody in our
band off to this like speakeasy that opens up in
(11:46):
the back of a pharmacy at ten pm, you know,
and yeah, it goes through the through the nights, so
like you stumble upon this actually cool thing and and
and that create you know that that will forever be
the you know, one of those magical days off or
when I used to when I was touring with Amy
a lot anyman for the listeners like both as when
(12:07):
we did our band the both and also times when
I would when I would travel opening for her, we
made it a real point to find an art museum
like wherever wherever we were that was those were bus tours,
so you had many many hours in the day because
it's it's a way to like sort of stay in
a in a creative space talk, you know, have conversations
(12:30):
about art, but not be in the black box of
the rock club with.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
That, you know, all day and all night, and.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
That that's like that's something that presents really fun magical
things because maybe you're in a small town, maybe it's
a it's a tiny museum, but you find one corner
where there's something really cool that you've never seen before,
you know, and uh it it really like it just
gives you. It gives you life that can just drain
(12:58):
out of you if you if you're just on the
grind the whole time.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
You know, Yeah, I got that habit from Chemo and
Kirk who play Case with Amy a lot.
Speaker 1 (13:07):
Doing the museums. Oh that's cool, that's great. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
And uh and also you're just you're in the legacy
of art and you're like that thing on that wall
is someone's effort, Like I'm putting effort in now, and
you just.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
Have a little bit more.
Speaker 3 (13:25):
Continuation and continuity of feeling okay about it. Because also
on the road, you there's it's just this bipolar thing
of down not only the downtime and work of one
hour to two hours a night or something like that,
but bad night to good night, all this stuff being
away from from not only just loved ones, but the
(13:48):
source sometimes if your love is the source, right, uh,
and uh so sometimes feeling that connection, Uh, it's just
a little bit moremental health.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
Yeah, it will. I mean I know that you you
who who tours solo solo a lot like I do,
must also know like I've always you just said bipolar,
and I have always called it like it's it's touring
alone alone is super manic.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
You know.
Speaker 2 (14:16):
It's like when things are when things are up, it's
really up.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
You know, it can be.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
Like the greatest thing, like you're meeting new people, you
have this great show. You know, when things are low,
there's you got nowhere to go other than the driver's
seat of your car, you know, and think that.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
Can get pretty.
Speaker 2 (14:35):
Low if you don't have an appreciation for the driver's
seat of your car.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
Yeah, and and for doing those check ins or having
something like that. And when you when you are solo touring,
it's like, well, I don't.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
Deserve you have so much more work to do. There's
no one to lean on.
Speaker 3 (14:50):
Or even if it's like I just did, like I said,
I was following a big band with a bus and
I want a tour manager with me, but still was
it was a lot of work just that two of us.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
And uh, it.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
Is those little things of within a town or you know,
be it the museum or the food place, or the
bookstore or a record store, something something like.
Speaker 1 (15:17):
That, just to have some sanity of it all. Is
there are there? What are some rooms? You know what?
Speaker 3 (15:25):
I just on this on this tour that I played
the Uptown Theater in Kansas City.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
I think it's Uptown Theater could be Yeah, that sounds right.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
And and had a night off when you speak of
night offs, And I went to the Green Lady. Have
you ever been the Green Lady in Kansas City? The
jazz well, it's it's one of those things. Was like,
all right, I want to tell everyone, and I don't
want to tell everyone, and you feel like we are
all going to be all right if we could all
just spend some time in the Green lad It's two
(15:57):
floors of jazz, all original, not like jazz covers, but
like these outfits from I think four in the afternoon
until two am. Different bands, right, yeah, two different bands
upstairs and downstairs. Another place called the Black Dolphin, I
believe next door, which is a little bit more modern design,
but the Green Lady's been around forever. It's red and orange. Inside.
(16:19):
Every lamp is different, you know, the puffy couches. Everyone
in America is in there. And I was there at
seven o'clock on my off night because I'm like, I
heard I have to go here. Yeah yeah, and everywhere
all of America is in there, and I mean every
kind of person, every demographic. An eighty year old couple
(16:41):
on a date nice and a twenty year old looking
twenty two year old looking to hook up and like
meet some somebody, and they're all there, And I thought,
I don't I.
Speaker 1 (16:51):
Don't know a lot of places like this, especially in America.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
Yeah yeah, yeah yeah, And it didn't, and it didn't
and it wasn't like, uh, you know, Disnified or Bozeman.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
Not at all. Yeah, not at all.
Speaker 3 (17:05):
And and it's one of those things is often like
a night off, I will have that whole the up
and down bipolarists will will creep in. It's like I
should be working, I'm not doing anything, or I'm away
from my loved ones, and I don't want to be like, hey,
I'm just gonna go kick it around town. But then
I just had this great positive jazz America experience that's
(17:27):
almost one little room that's really great. Next time I go.
Next time I go there, it'll be closed.
Speaker 1 (17:33):
So I don't say that.
Speaker 3 (17:35):
No, it's been around forever. It's a thriving, thriving place.
But what is are there rooms as far as performing?
Like performing, Like I've never played Value Hall? You just
played there with Did the Chisel tour go through time?
Speaker 1 (17:50):
No?
Speaker 2 (17:51):
But I played there with the with my band the
Pharmacists back back in on that twenty seventeen tour that
I was just talking about, Yeah, or maybe later, that.
Speaker 3 (18:01):
Just seems like to like, that's one of my rooms,
Like I haven't played that. I was like, that just
got seems like a magical room. I always love playing
the Metro. Yeah, I always love playing the Paradise or
the Sinclair and Bosson. You know, plenty of places. But
do you have do you what's your magic list in America?
Speaker 1 (18:20):
Yeah? I do.
Speaker 2 (18:21):
I mean, you know, Chisel did play the Sinclair and
it's interesting that was my first time there, and uh
it was.
Speaker 1 (18:30):
It was a really nice show. It was fun.
Speaker 2 (18:31):
But one of the one of the amazing things was
more than one person remarked And you don't get told
this very often from even your friends, you know, like
they might say you sound good, but it's very rare
that they say it sounded so good, you know, and
I had a couple of people tell me like it
sounded like it was already pressed on vinyl, like how
(18:52):
it was.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
Coming out of the of the PA.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
I was like, wow, that's amazing, all right, you know,
thumbs up to the to the Sinclair for that. We
just did the Summerville h Ballroom, the Crystal Ballroom.
Speaker 1 (19:06):
I just played the other night. That was great. It
was beautiful sounding race.
Speaker 3 (19:09):
Yeah, it sounds great in that room and that here
I'm sorry to something like also for people who follow
the show, and I think people who we are speaking
to a little bit of the converted in sound of
our town for the most part, but I feel like
they need it's also good to speak to the converted
so they know that it's important to be converted and
(19:32):
know how important a lifestyle of engaging with live music is,
especially when everyone's complaining about Spotify and all these things,
Like we have the power to invest in the arts
when you participate in live music and not let anybody think.
I always want to instill in any listener this show
that not only a sense of gratitude, but uh, it's
(19:57):
a really powerful thing to participate in live music and
you're can you're continuing something ancient, But that's way off
track about what I was going to say about music rooms.
But I want to share some of these little details
that a room, like the Crystal Ballroom, something about its design.
I always like when a room when you're sound checking
and you're hearing reflections back as well as your monitor,
(20:18):
and it's a really nice and you have this great
sound check and then it fills with people and all
you have is monitor. Yeah, and the ballroom stays a
little bit live and comes back at you. A good
theater which will always do absolutely, But some rock clubs
and some smaller rooms like die once you walk out
and there's people.
Speaker 1 (20:36):
Yea. The ballroom can fill with people in it and
it cycles back at you.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
And I love that, Yeah, yes, absolutely that that's you know,
I mean, for better or for worse, probably for worse.
Like I don't I don't use in your monitors, And
it's precisely for that reason, because like I really do
kind of feed off the the bing around of the
of the stage and in the room a little bit.
And and I really appreciate exactly what you're saying when
(21:01):
you can feel that. I think other rooms for me,
you know, just like a little bit of context when
I started playing under my own name in I guess
late late nineties, like I had just been in a
couple of other bands in the nineties, including Chisel, who
we mentioned, and me starting to play under my own
name was like.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
It was.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
It was in a way, it was like degrading, uh
not degrading the sense of devaluing, but just like dropping
it down a few notches to hobbyist in a way.
Like I was just like, you know, I want to
keep playing music, Like I'm kind of done. I'm done
with being in bands. I'm done with like playing the game.
I'm done with trying trying to do much with this
other than to just do it. So I started playing
(21:48):
solo gradually, you know, wanted to have want to be
playing with people again, and gathered this band around me
that has has had a core for a long time
but has had more fuzzy edges where people come and
go call the pharmacists, and and then you know, as
it goes with these things, like something happened, like once
I sort of gave all, gave all that striving up,
(22:12):
things started happening. And in the early two thousands, I'm
gonna like take New York, Boston in DC as as examples,
because this is where it really happened. You know, we
could see we're on tour. We toured a lot back then,
and you could see, you know, every six months, you
could see the progress of of like the growing audience
(22:34):
for what we were doing, and so and you would
map out venue by venue, so it would be like,
you know, upstairs at the Middle East or Brownies in
New York, or the backstage at the Black Cat in
DC for like a year and then it's just like
we can't we literally can't play there anymore, Like we
have to go downstairs in the Middle East or you
know where what a Bowery ballroom in New York and
(22:57):
the main stage of the Black At in DC. And
and it was it was perhaps one of the only
times in my life. And I feel very like, you know,
you mentioned gratitude and the last thing, and that's that's
what jogged this in my head, because you know, one
of the only times in your life were my life
where I could see this happening and it felt it
(23:23):
felt amazing because you know, we had gone we had
started putting out records with Lookout records like the Venerable
West you know East Bay Punk label who had some resources,
so we were we were like on a decent sized label.
But other than that, like we still really weren't doing
anything other than just you know, trying to make music.
And it was connecting and it was the first you know,
(23:48):
we like I said, like we started having you know,
we could you could map like venue size by every
six months, like what we were we were doing back then.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
And then there was a.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
Time when we were we were going to play the
Valery Ballroom and we needed to add a second night
and both nights sold out, and that to me was
like this kind of amazing mountain top because it really really,
it really really felt like, you know, we were still
pretty out of the spotlights such as it was. You know,
(24:20):
this was like the era of the Strokes and everything,
and uh, you know, we weren't get we weren't getting
that kind of press, We weren't getting that kind of play.
You know, ninety percent of the people you talk to,
if not ninety nine percent.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
Of the people you talk to. This is the era
where you.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
Get on a plane with the guitar and the flight
at ten is like, oh, should I know you and
you're like probably not know, like maybe you should, but
I mean my life exactly. Yeah, yeah, I mean you
should maybe, but like I don't expect you to.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
You know, if you're leading a healthy lifestyle, you would,
but no.
Speaker 2 (24:57):
You don't know, right exactly, but that.
Speaker 1 (25:01):
Kind of thing. It was also you know, it was
also the.
Speaker 2 (25:05):
The beginning of the of the Iraq War years and
you know, we we were known for I think, you know,
for for singing songs within that time. That that that
connected with people who were struggling to like live through
(25:27):
that time. And you could just feel this energy on
those two nights at the Bowery Ballroom that that.
Speaker 1 (25:37):
Very much, uh was that kind of.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
Positive community Catharsis where it like just creates this great
feedback loop of of good you know, of like sorrow
and love and you know, like we're in this together
and and we're actually all here and and to be
able to do you know, the Barry Barb is not
the biggest venue in the world, but it's.
Speaker 1 (26:06):
It to do.
Speaker 2 (26:07):
To be able to do two nights there, having like
come from like scuzzy basement punk world, you know.
Speaker 1 (26:18):
It really.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
It had less to do with me feeling like, hey,
we've made it than it did with like that, that
that absolute like reminder that there's power in music and
there's like community in music. That's what makes me do
it in the first place. Like, you know, I love
(26:44):
playing songs, I love hearing playing hearing the songs that
I love playing them, you know, like I could sit
here and play songs and it would it would lift
my mood and make me happy. But there's something very
special about connecting with an with an audience, with that
stuff that that that moment crystallized for me, and for
(27:06):
that reason, that venue will.
Speaker 1 (27:08):
Forever be a very special place for me.
Speaker 2 (27:12):
We were able to go back there this this past
September and do a show and it really really felt like,
you know, after many many years, I don't even remember
the last time we played there before that was, but
it really felt like a like a cool.
Speaker 1 (27:27):
Homecoming, and it should be. It is like a.
Speaker 3 (27:33):
If you're someone and I have friends who you know,
don't play music at all, but they go to more
shows probably than I've a paid right, you know, and
our ballroom should be one of those places. Like you
have to know it if you've yeah, you know, gone
to more than twenty shows a year in your life
in a way, and are you saying that you recognize
(27:53):
it even then? Are you saying yeah, or is it
it's also just grown more in power that you did
accomplished that, because it is an accomplishment. There's something about
the rooms where you can access the whites of everybody's
eyes when the lights like pop up a little bit,
and you know that that's the most that's the most
(28:16):
ancient part of the job. Recorded music is one hundred
year old phenomenon, which is nothing we were at the
and I'm of the opinion and this is another podcast
we could do another time, but we are now waving
goodbye to a renaissance of recorded music that you know,
there was a renaissance of water colors, and there's amazing
(28:36):
watercolor paintings being sold right now and the watercolor artists existing,
but the renaissance of it had passed that interesting and
and the technology of humans being able to record themselves
from from the basic acetate to the beatles to then
pro tools and now it's a now democratized across humanity.
(28:59):
Everyone's going to have it and it's important to I
think also recognize so you cannot wave goodbye. And it's
also maybe exciting because it should lead power, especially with
all these things that we're concerning ourselves with AI and Spotify,
payments and this, and that we have to remember the
real power and the real ancient job that we have
(29:20):
is what you described.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
Yeah, yeah, and I think and I think, and I
think an answer to your question, I think I did
recognize it in the in the moment. I think that's
why it imprinted so strongly on me, you know, because
it's it's not something that is like rose colored glasses,
(29:42):
like in the moment of those two nights, the lengthy
moment of those two nights, I absolutely did feel it.
And you know, it's truly one of those things where
I can this ly say, like if I went to
my grave never having experienced exactly that again, I couldn't
(30:06):
I count myself.
Speaker 1 (30:07):
I'm like among a very.
Speaker 2 (30:09):
Lucky group of people who got who maybe have gotten
to experience.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
That that's wise and healthy and so true and important
to remember.
Speaker 3 (30:33):
A band has a hard time being serious and I
kind of have like a Rolodex band, you know, like
in a drummer in La and drummer in Chicago and.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
Stuff like that. Just to do this.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
But I was joking around the other night. I was go, Okay, guys,
let's go out and honor every bloodline that is running
through our bloods. Aren't every amoeba, every humanoid, not just
the bipeds. They all existed, and you know how excited
they be to be able to walk out into a
room of people and play music right now. And and
(31:03):
I was a joking. We all like, we're just making
silly jokes about it.
Speaker 1 (31:07):
Yeah, but there is something very.
Speaker 3 (31:10):
Rare about doing it, and especially you just said, you know, two, three,
four and five, and right now it's just like this
this century in general, it's a really important job because
the Renaissance was thriving.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
Back then.
Speaker 3 (31:30):
We felt connected over the radio and people felt, you know,
the way people talk about Starch and Pepper's coming out,
or the way I felt when I remember when Okay,
computer came.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
Out, and I was like, people are in line waiting
for this record, you know.
Speaker 3 (31:42):
And we were having communical experiences within the renaissance, and
now we're not having communal experiences with recorded music. That
might have to be okay, not lamented and enjoy the
renaissance and and return to that fire pit, you know,
(32:05):
where you know, your other humanoid just killed an animal
and like you're using the bones to drop a sick
beat and your friend's carving up the wood, and Mammothon.
Speaker 1 (32:13):
Says, that's a really great beat. Are you going to
do anything with that?
Speaker 2 (32:17):
Maybe I can, Yeah, I could you book some holes
in this one and get a little like ok arena
kind of thing going on exactly.
Speaker 1 (32:25):
Yeah, we've been doing it forever.
Speaker 3 (32:27):
Yeah, you felt, And that's that's what I hear too
when you when you describe.
Speaker 2 (32:31):
It, that's yeah, that's that even like that even heightens
it for me to like.
Speaker 1 (32:35):
It was already really high.
Speaker 2 (32:36):
But now now I'm thinking of the the you know,
the the genetic material of Amieba's that you know that
you know, made made their way through to that moment somehow,
it's pretty heavy.
Speaker 3 (32:48):
And when everyone should know what this is, like, this
is the morning for us. We're not imbibing on anything
right now. And I but I'll and I'll also say,
just to bring this full circle, what you just described
that probably time period, what year would you say that
show was?
Speaker 2 (33:06):
I think that was as we've been talking, I realized
that that was probably five or oh six.
Speaker 1 (33:12):
And I was, you know, sure, listening to the Strokes
and listening to a ton of things.
Speaker 3 (33:19):
It was probably a site called e music, Oh yeah,
where I downloaded Shake the Sheets.
Speaker 1 (33:25):
Oh nice, because I was looking.
Speaker 3 (33:28):
For that thing that you also described with the band
that opened up for a man, right right, I'm looking
for show me something real that isn't being sent to
me right now, to tell me it's real. And that's
how I heard you for.
Speaker 1 (33:43):
The first time. Made me cry. That's actually really nice.
Speaker 2 (33:46):
That's I mean, that's that's like that is right in
line with what's become the theme of this you know,
which is that that kind of ongoing thing you know
that I mean, take take it back to the Amiba
and stop along the way at a single bullet theory
from Richmond, Virginia, you know, which led in some ways
(34:07):
to me making that album, led to you finding that album,
you know, et cetera.
Speaker 3 (34:11):
Yeah, And there's people who are really good at being
in that one percent of successful artists, right there is
something in that world that makes you feel I would
just never be good at it, right, And we need
to know that there's an authentic way to art without
it being approved by the marketplace, I'll say for now,
(34:34):
in that process is everything for the artist. It is
the process of writing the song, process of playing the show,
process of recording it. Those processes where we are at
those highs of the bipolar wave of the experience, and the.
Speaker 1 (34:50):
Results are the lie. Yeah, yeah, the results are not real.
Speaker 3 (34:57):
I mean, and we're constantly robbed of the by a process,
by results.
Speaker 2 (35:03):
I I can't go all the way there with you
only because as a as an also a fan of music,
I feel like I have to. I have to honor
the fans response in some way, you know, like is
that is that re encounter to what you're saying or not.
Speaker 1 (35:22):
No, I don't think so, no, no, no, I don't think.
Speaker 3 (35:24):
I think I think that's a process of connectivity, like
you're saying, Okay, I would call that process as well.
Speaker 1 (35:29):
Yeah, right, we're back on We're back on the We're
back totally totally. That would be that would be the
fourth uh fourth tier in this in this series.
Speaker 3 (35:41):
But uh, but but you know case because you're just
alluding to like, oh, yeah, the strokes are happening at
that time and the stuff, and we were doing this.
But what you did, what you do and have done,
and all that to me is uh is uh extremely
pivotal like for not only the audience, but me as
the audience, and or people like me as the audience
(36:01):
who are artists like I need to see I need
to see ted Leo doing it.
Speaker 1 (36:04):
I need to see you in the when it happens
to me and I saw you in the both and
all these other things. I don't know. I'm just I
I well, you know how I feel. I feel like
you felt at that adam antic concerts.
Speaker 2 (36:16):
Well you should know that I feel the same way
about you. And I'm not just saying that our things
are going to run out of time.
Speaker 1 (36:21):
Yeah it is. Yeah, damn it.
Speaker 3 (36:23):
I'm gonna call you, okay, just but we're done, like
we we we fixed everything.
Speaker 1 (36:27):
I think we. I think we said a lot here.
Yeah yeah, I mean yeah.
Speaker 3 (36:31):
It's a half hour show because live music is more
important than two dudes talking.
Speaker 1 (36:35):
There you go, Yeah, listen to this on your way
to the show.
Speaker 3 (36:38):
Y, yeah, on your way to the show. And one
more thing, to everyone who's listened this season in the
prior season, thank you. And to anyone who has wandered
(36:59):
in the night, maybe in a strange town, saw a
marquee or a chalkboard or a flyer, just thought why
not pulled out a five ten or twenty thirty forty
bucks and went inside and just listened. You're pretty magical
(37:21):
if you've done that.
Speaker 1 (37:33):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (37:34):
Season two complete.
Speaker 1 (37:38):
Where do we go from here?
Speaker 3 (37:40):
Only you can decide share your favorite episodes follow this podcast.
I do have some extra surprises coming into the new year.
Leave a review wherever you get your podcasts, and just
send me a direct message of what you think I
should do. Where should we go, what happens next? What
(38:00):
cities do we cover? This is Sound of Our Town.
It's a production of iHeartRadio and Double Elvis, executively produced
by Brady Sadler and Jake Brennan. Production assistants by Matt Bowden.
I gotta thanks so many writers Freda Love Smith, Samantha Ferrell,
Patrick Coleman, Caitlin White, Gerald Dowd. We had fun this year,
(38:23):
and thanks to Jamie Demas for keeping us all in order.
Speaker 1 (38:26):
I'm your host, Will Daly.
Speaker 3 (38:28):
By the way, I've created, wrote, and scored and produced
this in case you didn't know, and you can find
me just by spelling Will Daly d A.
Speaker 1 (38:41):
I L.
Speaker 3 (38:42):
E Y into any kind of electronic device, and I
hope to see you soon. Until then, thank you for
your ears.
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