Ep 17: The Politics of Healthy Arrogance - Featuring Will Packer

On this week’s opening filibuster, Jemele shares the story of Bill Nunn, the longtime Pittsburgh Steelers scout who was the architect of the Steelers infamous “Steel Curtain” defense, which led to Pittsburgh’s four Super Bowls. Jemele also has a conversation with mega producer Will Packer, who talks about his new book, “Who Better Than You: The Art of Healthy Arrogance & Dreaming Big,” and how he became a minority owner in the Atlanta Falcons. Will discusses his relationship with star actor and comedian Kevin Hart, and the secret behind them making blockbuster films together.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey, what's up everybody.

Speaker 2 (00:01):
I'm Jamelle Hill and welcome to his politics and I
heard podcasts and unbothered production.

Speaker 1 (00:07):
Time to get spolitical.

Speaker 2 (00:17):
As I mentioned last week, I'm going to use Black
History mouff to highlight black stories and sports that don't
get the attention they deserve. And this week's story starts
and ends in Pittsburgh, specifically with the Pittsburgh Steelers. Now,
the Steelers are one of the most revered and successful
franchises in NFL history. They are currently tied with the
New England Patriots for most Super Bowl wins, with both
franchises having won six Super Bowls. Now, for the Steelers,

(00:40):
six super bowls came in the nineteen seventies, when they
were considered a premier dynasty. Now, I'm sure you've heard
of the legendary coach Chuck Nole, who coached those teams
and was with the Steelers for twenty three years, and
of course the Rooney family, who is considered to be
the gold standard of pro football ownership. There was another
man who played a critical role in the Steelers becoming
an dynasty. The man who was primarily behind the Steelers

(01:03):
building their infamous Steel Curtain defense. That man would be
Bill Nunn, a former scout and assistant director of player
personnel for the Steelers. Now here's what it happened was
Bill Nunn was a newspaper guy, and as someone who
started their career in newspapers, I have a special place
in my heart for Bill Nunn's enormous legacy. Now, None
was a sportswriter and editor of the Pittsburgh Courier, a

(01:25):
distinguished national black newspaper. Starting in nineteen fifty, None selected
the paper's annual Black College All American football team, and
he hosted an annual banquet for the coaches and players. Now,
through his work and study of HBCUs, None developed an
extensive knowledge of the players from historically black colleges and universities. Now,
back in those days, all the premier black college football

(01:46):
talent they went to HBCUs because of segregation. So HBCUs
were the only place where they could really showcase what
they could do. The Black college football product was a
superior product, even though players, coaches, and the HBCU brand
of football were largely ignored by the NFL and disrespected
by the mainstream and by mainstream you know who I mean.

(02:07):
According to USA Today senior NFL writer Jared Bell, None
has such deep relationships with HBCU coaches and players than
when they went to visit Pittsburgh. They often stayed with None,
since a lot of the hotels were segregated.

Speaker 1 (02:19):
As for how None wound up with the.

Speaker 2 (02:20):
Steelers, well, it was a relationship that began rooted in criticism.
None ragged on the Steelers for their lack of talent
and success. Before the Steelers became a dominant team in
the nineteen seventies, Pittsburgh had only seven winning seasons since
the franchise began in nineteen thirty three. Aubrey Bruce, the
sports columnists for the New Pittsburgh Career, explains how None

(02:40):
and the Steelers became connected for life.

Speaker 3 (02:42):
Initially, Bill and Nunn's relationship with the Steelers was a critic.
It was criticizing the team for not having black players,
and we cannot forget Dan Rooney ms ruinship. Was you
so much an expert? Come on over, let scout we
can get some plays now.

Speaker 2 (02:58):
Bill Nunn's response was less or whatever. The nineteen sixties
version of that was. The Steelers hired None as a
part time scout in nineteen sixty seven, two years before
they hired Chuck no who coached the Steelers to their
first four Super Bowl victories. But it was None who
had the secret sauce.

Speaker 4 (03:13):
From the stories that Bill told me, some of the
scouts weren't very comfortable of going into those schools of
the historically black colleges scouting players. They didn't always think
that they would have access to them.

Speaker 2 (03:29):
That was me and Joe Green, one of the key
defensive forces that was part of the Steelers infamous Steel
Curtain defense. Much to the dismay of the Pittsburgh fans
at the time, the Steelers drafted Green fourth overall in
nineteen sixty nine. That same draft, None told the Steelers
to take el C. Greenwood, another major figure in the
Steel Curtain, in the tenth round out of Arkansas. But

(03:49):
that was just the beginning of a new era in
Steelers football.

Speaker 5 (03:53):
From nineteen sixty nine to nineteen seventy five, the Steelers
drafted twenty four players from HBC years, the most in
the NFL. Five players from those schools, Mel Blunt, Elsie Greenwood,
Ernie Holmes, John Stalwart, and the undrafted Donnie Schell became

(04:14):
Pillars of four Super Bowl teams in the seventies.

Speaker 2 (04:17):
In nineteen seventy four, the Steelers added five Hall of
famers to their roster, four of which were drafted. It's
considered to be one of the greatest NFL draft classes
in history. The Steelers drafted lyn Swan, Jack Lambert, John Stalworth,
and Mike Webster, and then they signed the undrafted rookie
Donnie Shale. None is credited for the entire reason the
Steelers took Stalworth and Shell with None in their ear

(04:39):
Three fourths of that famed steel Curtain defensive line came
from HBCUs. While None was known for his strong connection
to HBCU's that wasn't the only thing that None brought
to the table, said Kevin Colbert, who was the Steelers
general manager for over twenty years. Of course, he was
known for his work in the HBCUs and what he
did in breaking down barriers and so on and so forth.

Speaker 1 (05:00):
But Bill scouted.

Speaker 2 (05:01):
The first time I was with him on the road,
we spent a day at Boston College.

Speaker 1 (05:05):
Even though his expertise was the hbcused, he was so
much more than that.

Speaker 2 (05:10):
None retired from the Steelers in nineteen eighty seven as
assistant personnel director, he never got to be a general manager,
a position he was clearly qualified for. Even after he
officially retired, None still continued to work part time for
the Steelers. In twenty fourteen, he had a stroke in
the team's scouting room and died a few days later.

Speaker 1 (05:29):
At eighty nine.

Speaker 2 (05:30):
Years old and twenty twenty one, None was inducted into
the Pro Football Hall of Fame. He is the first
black person in the Hall's history to be enshrined as
a contributor. The same year of his induction, the Pro
Football Writers of America renamed their award that honors distinguished
reporting in Pro Football after None. Unfortunately, these honors came
for None after his son, a famous actor I'm sure

(05:52):
you'll recognize, had already passed away. You might remember his
son from this role.

Speaker 6 (06:00):
Turn out him off right, turn it up radio out here.
I can't him myself. Three you want you want to.

Speaker 1 (06:17):
Now?

Speaker 2 (06:17):
I don't know why that wouldn't ring a bell, But
just in case it didn't, here's another famous character played
by Bill Nunn's son.

Speaker 6 (06:24):
Who wasn't making no money then?

Speaker 2 (06:25):
Was we?

Speaker 6 (06:26):
Now that we are?

Speaker 7 (06:27):
You out here living your fucking Michael Jordan, fantasy shooting,
jumpers and whatnot.

Speaker 6 (06:30):
Business must be pretty good. We will be brother beat.
This a man freebase. So what yo, man? You know
the rules us brothers don't be getting out. Shut the
fuck up.

Speaker 7 (06:49):
Man, it just try to call you a non talking basket.

Speaker 2 (06:52):
The actor Bill Nunn died in twenty sixteen, five years
before his father officially became a Hall of Famer, but
his father's legacy lives on as it is one that
was clearly built to last.

Speaker 1 (07:03):
I'm Jamel Hill and I approved this message.

Speaker 2 (07:06):
I am so excited about today's episode because my guest
is a billion dollar producer.

Speaker 1 (07:10):
That's right, I said billion with a B.

Speaker 2 (07:13):
He had ten films that have opened at number one
at the box office, and in twenty seventeen and twenty eighteen,
his two comedies that he produced for the highest grossing.

Speaker 1 (07:21):
Comedies in those years.

Speaker 2 (07:23):
His success is not limited to movies, as he has
produced quality, award winning content in the television space, including
and unscripted. He's a proud HBC you graduate, and most recently,
he became a minority owner with the Atlanta Falcons. He's
got one of the best success stories in Hollywood history.
Which you can read about in his new book Who
Better Than You The Art of Healthy Arrogance and Dreaming.

(07:46):
Coming up next on Politics, mega producer Will Packer.

Speaker 6 (07:57):
So Will, I'm going.

Speaker 2 (07:58):
To start the podcast by question I asked every guest
on politics and that is named a athlete or a
moment that made you love sports.

Speaker 7 (08:08):
Ooh and okay, all right, I have to ask you
answer your question?

Speaker 6 (08:15):
What a question? Sorry, but I'm an analytical type.

Speaker 7 (08:18):
So does it have to be something that I experienced
myself or can it just be oh, Hank Aaron, Hank
Aaron and the home run record seven fifty five.

Speaker 6 (08:29):
Yeah, that would be because because because.

Speaker 7 (08:31):
Of what's possible, because of you know, I just remember
I played baseball as a young man growing up, and
to have somebody that looked like that in a sport
that you know, was not is not has not ever
been dominated by people of color, of black people, specifically.
You know, Hank Aaron's a home run king that always

(08:52):
said to me, like you could do it, you know
what I mean, Like the ceiling of what someone that
looks like me can accomplish is right. So anyway, I
learned a little bit about as a young person what
he went through. As I got older, I did, you know,
some of my own research and study it. But I
would say him, I think that the barriers that he

(09:13):
broke and achieving the ultimate, the highest heights of success
within that sport and not doing it on a curve,
not doing it with any caveats needed or necessary like
that would be that moment seven.

Speaker 6 (09:29):
Moments Because I love sports as you do.

Speaker 1 (09:31):
But yeah, do you're a big sports fan and you
know you not. You got to me.

Speaker 2 (09:38):
You're experiencing something that every sports fan s dreams about,
and that is ownership. I mean you you have an
ownership stake in the Atlanta Falcons, and you know, just
from my viewpoint, that's the next frontier NFL ownership that
black folks, you know, really need to We need to
get one. We need to get one majority owner in

(10:00):
the NFL, and that has not yet happened. But you
having this ownership stake in the Falcons, Like, take me
through the process because this is a very exclusive club.

Speaker 1 (10:09):
So what was the process like for you?

Speaker 6 (10:11):
Yeah, it's it's huge. I mean it really is. It
is as cool as it sounds.

Speaker 7 (10:15):
I'm not gonna lie to you, Jay, Like just being
a sports fan, being somebody with very deep ties to
Atlanta and to that market. Number One, it doesn't happen
without me having an advocate and somebody that has power.
That's something that I want to You can't kind of

(10:36):
overstate we talk about and understand the power dynamics and
a culture in a community. You talked about how exclusive
the club is, especially in the NFL. Right, NFL is
the biggest of all the sports leagues, and it is
a very very exclusive club of you know, billionaires, super
rich billionaires. You can't just have one billion right to

(11:00):
team and be a majority owner, and so you need
somebody that's going to advocate for you. And I am
somebody that's of the belief and it's been my experience
that the person that advocates for you doesn't have to
look like you, doesn't have to identify with you, but
they do have to see value in you. And I
think it's a two way street in terms of you

(11:23):
being somebody that presents yourself as someone of value and
someone that can add value to a relationship, and they
have to see the importance of having someone like you
in their world. For me, that person was Arthur Blain,
and he did not have to do this at all.
And he brought in last year four for African American
New African American owners as limited partners of the Atlanta Falcons,

(11:47):
and I was very, very proud to be one of them.
I got a call Jay, my right hand for a
very long time as Sheyla Cowan and Sala runs a
management division of my company.

Speaker 6 (11:59):
She was my chief staff and she knew somebody.

Speaker 7 (12:02):
This is how these things happen, right, She knew somebody
that worked in the Obama White House, and she knew
that person introduced me this person, like you know, years
ago when Obama's in office, and it was just kind
of a social relationship.

Speaker 6 (12:14):
And so she.

Speaker 7 (12:15):
Called me and was like you remember blah blah blah.
I was like, oh, yeah, yeah, what's see up to?

Speaker 6 (12:18):
How's he do it?

Speaker 7 (12:19):
He's like, well, he knows somebody that's got an investment opportunity. Now,
when you are in the position that I'm in, everybody's
got an investment opportunity.

Speaker 6 (12:28):
Right.

Speaker 7 (12:28):
If I had a dollar for every investment opportunity that
was brought to me, I would be running the doge
of the United States, you know what I'm.

Speaker 6 (12:38):
Saying, Right, So.

Speaker 7 (12:41):
I got this call, and it sounded crazy.

Speaker 6 (12:45):
My eyes rolled first.

Speaker 7 (12:46):
Because she said investment opportunity and then she said, listen,
I wouldn't bring it to you if it wasn't real.
But it's the NFL. And I was like, you're talking
about the National Foodsball League, like prick Fried Legion, Like
I know, you're not talking about the NFL, right, And
she was like, yeah, there is somebody who is putting
together a group to be considered by one of the owners.

Speaker 6 (13:08):
It was all very very top secret.

Speaker 7 (13:10):
I didn't know the team, I didn't know the owner,
but the question was would you want to be considered?
And the person putting it together and that name, I
will say, it's a brother named Derek Hagenes. And Derek
had worked with the NFL for years behind the scenes.
He's an attorney and he had consulted with the league
and he had been trying to advocate for NFL owners

(13:30):
to diversify their ownership ranks. This is not something they
have to do, This is not something that they get
any benefit for doing. This is something that they have
to see the value in doing and want to do
on their own. And he had been, you know, honestly
banging his head against the wall for a very long
time trying to put a group together. But he had
one owner that was open to the possibility who had
considered it before on his own and that owner happened

(13:53):
to be author black and so I once it was
explained to me, and I had to sign like seven
NDA's right even to just get on the list. And
I did that found out it was a falconus. I
was like, wow, how apropos is that right? Because I
got deep Atlanta ties, and you know I was. I
was one of the one of the brothers down in

(14:14):
the in the in the Patriots section of the twenty
eighty three Super Bowl. I was right there with my wife,
you know what I'm saying, cheering us home. And from
quarters one through three and a half, it was an
amazing I mean an amazing time. Boy, that last the
last half of that fourth quarter and overtime was rough
on a brother uh and her sister because my wife

(14:35):
was right there with me, and we couldn't hide because
it was the only black people with our section. We was
on the Patriots side. We had been giving it to
them fans all game twenty eight to three, and when
old Tom Terrific started doing what Tom Terrific does. We
tried to shrink inside our little Falcons gear and them
Boston folks was like, nah, I don't try to hide now,

(14:55):
you've been talking trash all game. So anyway, so it
was it's crazy that it was Atlanta foul because it
was off the blank. And so there was, as you
could imagine, a larger list, a larger group that was
vying to be considered.

Speaker 6 (15:10):
And it was a process with all these various steps.

Speaker 7 (15:13):
And here's one thing that I will tell you is
that the NFL, as we know, is very protective of
their brand. They don't play about that shield. And so
the process to be considered because ultimately you have to
be voted on. The individual owner has to decide to
accept you and then put you forth for consideration, and
then all the owners have to vote when you add
even a limited partner minority on.

Speaker 6 (15:34):
So they go.

Speaker 7 (15:36):
You have to go to a very rigorous vetting process,
like rigorous, like I was asked during this process about
you know, social media that I had engaged with ten
years ago, you know what I mean, and just you know,
not necessarily like I couldn't have freedom of speech, but
just asking about some of the things that had, you know,
been out there. I was asked about like a parking ticket,

(15:58):
like from fifteen years ago.

Speaker 6 (15:59):
Was like, what who?

Speaker 7 (16:01):
Like the NFL has got some x FBI agents on
the paywell, you know what I mean, and law enforcement
types and so they don't mess around. So anyway, each
stepping away, it got smaller and smaller and smaller in
terms of the group that was being considered. And ultimately
there were four of us, and you know I made
the cut. And it's not charity. I will tell you that, right,

(16:21):
like you gotta you know, you gotta step up the dollars.
Not we didn't have to invest black dollars. We had
to invest US American dollars, you know what I'm saying.
So it's funny because I grew up in Florida and
Saint Pete and you know, people was like, man, you're
a Bucks fan. You grew up a Bucks fan. I
was like, I did grow up a Bucks fan.

Speaker 6 (16:39):
But when you.

Speaker 7 (16:40):
Make a serious investment into a team, guess what ownership
hits different?

Speaker 6 (16:44):
You know what I mean?

Speaker 7 (16:45):
You start talking about like real resources, like significant portions
of your net worth.

Speaker 6 (16:51):
I'm a falcons fan. So anyway, it was it was cool.

Speaker 7 (16:56):
It's a blessing and I give I got a lot
of props Arthur Blank, because it especially in an environment
where you have people going, you know, why is diversity important.

Speaker 6 (17:04):
It's not, you know, let's ignore it.

Speaker 7 (17:07):
Let's not lift people up based on you know, you know,
the color their skin or their ethnicity or the fact
that they bring you know, something different, different perspectives to
the table.

Speaker 6 (17:17):
I'm somebody in my career.

Speaker 7 (17:19):
Has always benefited from the fact that I have people
that do have diverse skill sets, abilities, and backgrounds and
ethnicities and orientations. That is what has made me successful
throughout my career is that I'm not just hiring people
from the same club and the same pipeline. But if

(17:40):
you don't understand that value, then you may be somebody
that ignores that. But you do it at your own peril.
And so I give a lot of propers author Blank
for giving me that opportunity. And so, man, it's been
it's been cool. Jay, I'm not gonna lie to you,
Like the season didn't go to where we wanted for
the Falcons, but but my first year as an NFL
owner being able to see it behind the scenes. You

(18:01):
know what's interesting is that I got to see kind
of the humanity of.

Speaker 6 (18:06):
Sport.

Speaker 7 (18:07):
Right Like, as a fan, you sit on the outside.
You get mad when your team, you know, doesn't do
what you want, when the coach doesn't answer a question,
right when the you know, key player drops the ball.
When you get to be behind the scenes a little bit,
you realize that these are people, right Like I would
go to the press conferences and I would watch Raheem Morris,
coach of the Falcons, and I would see him like

(18:29):
after a very very tough loss, I mean like ten
minutes later, right, you're still sweating from being on the sideline,
and you got to stay in front of a room
of people who oftentimes are looking for a SoundBite, and
you get asked the same question five different ways because
they just want you to say something provocative that they
can go run with. And you got to sit there
and compose yourself and you're dealing with the emotions yourself,

(18:51):
but you got to be you know, professional and try
to get the right answer. Just seeing him in a
way navigated it. Just it opened my eyes to the
humanity behind this scenes. It ain't just you know, X's
and olds and fancy football and things people bet on.

Speaker 6 (19:04):
It's human, it's lives, careers as families, all that stuff.

Speaker 2 (19:06):
In fact, so so far, what has been the coolest
part about being an NFL owner?

Speaker 7 (19:14):
Man, I mean, it's just being an owner, Like that's
you know, I'm I'm I'm the coolest cat at the
dinner party, Jamiel. I ain't gonna lie to you, you know
what I'm saying, Like I can walking everybody who doesn't
own a team sit over there, you know what I mean.

Speaker 6 (19:32):
Like, it's just it's not a bad flex, right, you
know I think that it is. Yeah, football fan, you
know what I mean?

Speaker 7 (19:44):
Being being able to go in the locker room and
especially after victory and see the energy and and you
know how everybody you know celebrates and and uh and
see this this this.

Speaker 6 (19:54):
Bandon brothers all coming together.

Speaker 7 (19:56):
That's cool, you know, being there and being able to
interact with the fans in a different way, you know
what I mean. You know, I've always been somebody that
has aspired to be.

Speaker 6 (20:08):
A shining example of what's possible.

Speaker 7 (20:13):
And so when I spoke to some kids at a
conference and they were introducing me, and they were talking
about and he produced this, he producing that, and you know,
and these were younger kids, and a lot of them
hadn't necessarily seen all the movies that I've made. But
then when they mentioned my ownership of the Atlanta Falcons,

(20:35):
like everybody knew that.

Speaker 6 (20:36):
You know what I mean. And these were a group of.

Speaker 7 (20:39):
Black and brown kids, and they looked up and like,
you know, you could tell it was the first time
that they saw somebody that looked like them that was
able to be in that position. That's the coolest thing
to show that, you know, we can excel on the grid.
Is we know that we can excel on the court,
on the hardwood, we know that we can do anything
out the athletic but also there are levels to success,

(21:03):
and so to be somebody that represents a different level
of success for that next generation.

Speaker 6 (21:08):
Honestly, that's really was the driving.

Speaker 7 (21:11):
Motivation for me to do it, because I wanted to
be a part of showing folks that look like me
that we can also excel in the boardroom, in ownership
groups and at ownership levels like that was important.

Speaker 2 (21:26):
Before I move on and we talk about this wonderful
new book of yours that that's out, So do you
think you could have been a partner in a team
that you don't particularly like, Like if the picture is
like come.

Speaker 1 (21:38):
On, will like we don't you?

Speaker 6 (21:39):
Yeah? Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 7 (21:42):
It's funny because when it came up and we didn't
know which team it was, my wife and I would
talk and we were like like, yo, like what if
it's like some random you know, and listen, it ain't
but thirty two teams and to get in any of
them is you know, you're part of points here zero
one percent. Most people will never had that opportunity. But

(22:04):
like I wasn't necessarily trying to be like part of
the Seattle Seahawks, you know what I'm saying, Like I
live in the Southeast. I don't know a lot of
people up there, cold and rainey, you know what I mean. Like,
you know, I ain't nothing against the Buffalo Bills. They're
great franchise, but like it's cold man, it's a long way.
So we talked about that, and I remember thinking because

(22:28):
the Denver Broncos recently got sold that I remember, you know,
looking at that group and you had you know, Melody
Hopson and kind of he's a Rice Lewis Hamilton, right,
and so I.

Speaker 6 (22:38):
Remember thinking like, man, if we had a chance.

Speaker 7 (22:40):
To be a part of Denver Broncos, we'll be flying
to the mile High every other week, you know.

Speaker 6 (22:47):
So the answer to the question is, I don't know.
It is one of those things that.

Speaker 7 (22:53):
It's kind of too awesome an opportunity to pass up
to be real witch, especially somebody like me who's very
bitious and thinks about legacy. So I'm just glad it
was a Falcons put it that way. I'm just glad
that it was. It was the home team, baby, you
know what I'm saying. I'm glad that it was who
it was.

Speaker 2 (23:13):
All Right, let's talk about your new book, Who Better
Than You The Art of Healthy Arrogance and Dreaming Big?

Speaker 1 (23:19):
Yes, what is healthy arrogance?

Speaker 6 (23:24):
People told me not to put that on the tile
of my book.

Speaker 7 (23:26):
They say, you gonna put that on the cover because
it is something that you know, scares people. You think
about arrogance, You just think about people that have like
unsubstantiated hubris. Right, And I'm a Hollywood producer. I have
worked you know, for the last three decades. I've worked
around some of the most famous, some of the most important,

(23:48):
powerful passionate also some of the most ego driven and
toxic people in the world. I have and what I
have learned, and this was really my motive invasion of
writing a book, is that those folks that have been very,
very successful in that industry have a skill set and
a mindset that's transferable no matter what.

Speaker 6 (24:09):
Industry you want to get into.

Speaker 7 (24:11):
And so when I talk about healthy arrogance, it is
this confidence.

Speaker 6 (24:15):
And it does not have to be externally loud.

Speaker 7 (24:18):
It's not about walking in the rooms and kicking over
tables and telling everybody I'm here, look at me right.
Typically people that are doing that ain't backing it up.
It is about a belief that I have seen the
most successful people that I have been around, that they
have not that they could be successful or that they
want to be successful.

Speaker 6 (24:36):
It is that they are destined for success.

Speaker 7 (24:40):
That is a mindset that if you're able to adopt,
it will manifest itself in ways that you don't even realize.
It changes the way that you walk into those rooms.
It makes you not think am I supposed to be here?
Not even think that I might be able to hang
in this room, But it makes you realize that the

(25:01):
room is better because you're in it now. To do that,
you got to have a foundation of a work ethic,
you gotta have a skill set, you got to be
bringing something to the table. But the most successful people
have this confidence, this supreme confidence that they are predestined
to achieve not just good success, but outside great success.

Speaker 6 (25:25):
You gotta be a little I.

Speaker 7 (25:26):
Was talking to I saw them Will Smith actually, and
he was talking about something that Quincy Jones said to him.
And Quincy Jones said, to really succeed in the game,
you gotta be a little mad, is what he said, right, And.

Speaker 6 (25:38):
So is that wrong?

Speaker 7 (25:39):
You do gotta be a little Craig Craig, but in
a good way. You got to be crazy about your
ability and your desire to reach the highest levels of success.
And even if you don't have it, if you're not
somebody that innately has that drive, you can get there.
There are things that you can do to train yourself
in your mindset to think a certain way, and success
then begets success.

Speaker 2 (26:00):
What I love about your book is just as we're
talking right now, that's how I feel when I read
your book. It's like it's so powerfully written in your voice.
It's funny, it's smart, it's thoughtful all of those things,
and you tell great stories. You are a storyteller.

Speaker 1 (26:14):
It's very true.

Speaker 2 (26:14):
I mean, if people don't know from seeing your movies,
but that you know, all of that translates to your
book for you.

Speaker 1 (26:22):
Why now? Why did you feel like it was important
for you to put this out now?

Speaker 6 (26:26):
Yeah?

Speaker 7 (26:27):
I think the why now is because we live in
a time where it is the divide in the gap
between the haves have not, the doers and the do nothings,
the folks that are achieving their dreams and goals and
the people that aren't. That gap and that divide is

(26:50):
bigger than ever. And part of the reason is the
environment that we live in. I have a lot of
conversations with our younger you know, brothers and sisters, gen
z and and you know, they grew up in a
time of immediate gratification. Right, you push a button, you
post something, you get a million likes, you get a
million dollars, you're an influencer, you're rich.

Speaker 6 (27:08):
You can move on. But that's not real.

Speaker 7 (27:11):
And so I realized because I had more people than
ever coming to me and asking me about mentorship, asking
me about doing a masterclass, And I said.

Speaker 6 (27:19):
You know what, I have a story to tell.

Speaker 7 (27:21):
I am a storyteller, and the book is a collection
of stories the things that I've learned from the front
lines of Hollywood. But it also is something that is
for people that are just starting out, people who've been
in the game but ready to pivot, people who have
been doing something a certain way and are not satisfied
with the level of success that they've had. And I

(27:43):
realized that people need to hear that now more than
ever because the world is more unpredictable than ever, because
we live in a time and in an environment where
you have to be able to make sure that your
network and your foundation is more solid than ever before
in order for you to achieve success, because you will
get swept up in a wave of folks that care

(28:08):
nothing about you, and so you got to make sure
that you are on the path to success, that you
were doing what's necessary to achieve everything.

Speaker 6 (28:15):
I mean, the wildest dreams that you want to achieve.

Speaker 2 (28:18):
You know, one of the things that you write a
lot about in this book, or one of the people
I should say, is your relationship with Kevin Hart. I
love that you speak of great affection but also call
him this Fawn of Satan, which is pretty sad.

Speaker 6 (28:30):
Yes, he is. Both can be true, both.

Speaker 1 (28:33):
Can be true, two things can be true.

Speaker 2 (28:35):
It was and if that is the case, when you
and Kevin Hart and I just laughed all the way
through that story of when you all were shooting right along.
But yet he had this, you know, he had his
comedy specialist. That's his corn garden. I don't know how
you kept your cool in.

Speaker 6 (28:51):
The middle of the shoot, Jamel in the middle. It
was the biggest.

Speaker 7 (28:54):
Movie of both careers. He came up to me, He's like, hey,
next Friday, I need to get off a little early.
You know, I'm busy almost Settim.

Speaker 6 (29:04):
In his trailer.

Speaker 7 (29:05):
Okay, all right, well let me check and see what
we shoot next Friday. I look, oh, Kevin, we shoot
Friday and Saturday. Remember Saturday? Is that really important day?
So no, we can't, Like, why what do you need
with you know what? I didn't realize we shot next Saturday.
Something told me that he did, but I fell for.

Speaker 6 (29:20):
It at the time.

Speaker 7 (29:20):
I said, well, yeah, we shoot next Saturday. Let me
see if I get you off early. What what do
you gotta do?

Speaker 6 (29:24):
You gotta do?

Speaker 7 (29:25):
Host a party or something, He's like, I got a
comedy show I gotta do. I'm like, listen, brother, you
gonna have to cancel the comedy show because we got
a big shoot.

Speaker 6 (29:30):
The next day.

Speaker 7 (29:31):
It's like, yeah, but to send Madison Square Guard Madison
Square Garden. So you planned a huge comedy show, literally
your next comedy special, in the middle of our shoot.
And at that time, Kevin was coming off a Thing
Like a Man, which I produced right. This was right
along him ice Cube, the biggest budget and the biggest

(29:52):
opportunity in his movie career and the biggest budget and
biggest opportunity in my movie career. So I'm like, brother,
you couldn't have done this. After we wrapped production, he
convinced me Jamel to fly with him. He told me, listen,
I'm gonna go up, I'm gonna do the show. I'm
gonna come right back right he said, In fact, I

(30:14):
should have known.

Speaker 1 (30:15):
What black people say.

Speaker 6 (30:16):
Listen.

Speaker 2 (30:17):
It's like when black people say, come rus some errors
with me real quick. Nine hours later we know yes.

Speaker 7 (30:25):
First first, he hit me with the old black expression.
You know, I don't ask you for much. You know
when somebody say they don't ask you for much, they
asked you for shit all the time, you know that
they do. He hit me with you know, I don't
ask you for much. Then he hit me with the yeah,
come run this errand with me, come with me. That's
what he said. It was until we got there and
I found myself in the middle of a New York
nightclub at an after party that he also didn't tell

(30:47):
me about, and I'm in there trying to knock bottles
out of people's hands with Carmelo Anthony running up in
the section with a bunch of waitresses behind him with
thirty bottles, like literally everybody in our section had two bottles.
I'm I'm like this too many bottles. No, thank you,
mister Anthony. No, we don't need this.

Speaker 6 (31:03):
It's cool. I think that's too many bottles.

Speaker 7 (31:05):
Put that down, Kevin, stop drinking, like I'm trying to
get out of there, to get back to the private
jets so we can get back to the shoot on time.

Speaker 6 (31:12):
When I realized in that moment when.

Speaker 7 (31:14):
Carmelo Anthony came in with all these bottles and the
music turned up, and I looked at Kevin and he goes,
well we tried.

Speaker 6 (31:22):
When he said well, we tried, you know the scene in.

Speaker 7 (31:26):
Usual Suspects where the detective realizes who kayz Sosee is.

Speaker 6 (31:31):
It was in that moment that I realized this was
all his plan.

Speaker 7 (31:34):
Because if he leaves set and flies to New York
do a comedy show and then doesn't get back in time,
the studio is gonna be pissed off at him, and
he's gonna have to pay for that. He's gonna be
in major trouble because he's put the whole shoot in Jeffards.
But if the producer is with him, and the producer
and the director, he flew.

Speaker 6 (31:55):
Both of us up.

Speaker 7 (31:56):
If we are there with it, we are completely complicit.

Speaker 6 (32:00):
It's on us.

Speaker 7 (32:01):
I realized in that moment, I said, you evil, evil man.

Speaker 6 (32:05):
You set this whole damn thing up.

Speaker 7 (32:08):
It was all I could do to stop from choking
my star actor and my short little friend.

Speaker 6 (32:12):
In that moment, it taught me Carmelo Anthony let us
off the hook.

Speaker 7 (32:16):
I'll still owe Carmelo to this day, because it was
set up where we wasn't getting out of that club.

Speaker 6 (32:21):
If Mellow didn't say something, you were about to fail.
We were gonna fail.

Speaker 7 (32:25):
Listen, Mellow was pouring shots, he was like, he was like,
we turn it up. We gonna die tonight. He literally
said those words. I was like, Oh God, we can't die,
not tonight. Let's not die, like, let's die after the movie. Shoot,
let's die during the playoffs when the kicks ain't gonna
be there.

Speaker 2 (32:40):
You know.

Speaker 7 (32:41):
He I realized that that moment two things. One, you
gotta expect the unexpected, right, you really do. You have
to whatever it is that you're doing. You can't always
think things are going to go according to plan. And
as a young producer, I have learned over and over
again that things will always go wrong. You can't control

(33:02):
what's going to go wrong, but you can control being
able to mitigate how much it affects you. The second thing,
and this is something that we talk about when it
comes to personal relationships. When somebody shows you who they are,
you gotta believe right. You've heard that statement before. It
applies in business as well. When you're in business with
somebody and you know somebody has a certain predilection, a
certain personality or perspective, you gotta you're able to kind

(33:25):
of predict their behavior. I knew Kevin Hart was that
type of cat. I knew he was a type of
cat that would wait to the last minute to spring
on me that he had a big ass comedy show
with massive square guard. I didn't think about it. I
let him catch me off guard. He'll never do it again.
So those are two things that I learned from that
and I use that to this day. And I'm telling
people all the time, I don't care what your business,

(33:46):
you can have to donut shop, expect you unexpected, and
believe who people are when they show you.

Speaker 2 (33:52):
Well, where I'm also going with this is that when
you look at a lot of the great directors and producers,
it's just an actor. They are able to develop a
certain chemistry with you know, Spike Leans and Sale.

Speaker 1 (34:03):
You have Michael B.

Speaker 2 (34:04):
Jordan and right Ryan Coopler. You and Kevin Hart seem
to have found that. I mean, Fight Night was exceptional
such a series.

Speaker 6 (34:12):
Appreciate that great.

Speaker 1 (34:13):
Story, like I really loved it.

Speaker 2 (34:15):
So what is it about your dynamic with Kevin that
allows you all to produce this high quality work that
you do.

Speaker 7 (34:21):
Yeah, our work ethics, we have a lot of symmetry.
We have a symbiotic relationship because I know you know,
even in that story, the fault of Kevin was that
he was working too hard and trying to do too
much right, and so you want that. You don't want
the person who is lazy and is going to try
to get away with doing the least, doing the minimum,

(34:43):
no matter what the environment is. You want to put
people around you that are aligned with your goals. Kevin
and I are certainly aligned. He's super talented, right, I
would never take that away from him, but it is
his work ethic that sets him apart. A lot of
people are funny, a lot of people have been able
to have success in movies. But you're not gonna outwork,

(35:04):
cav You're just not. That's that's and you're not gonna outwork.
We'll packer right. And so for me, that is why
our relationship works the way that it does because I
know I can depend on him.

Speaker 6 (35:14):
I know he's gonna deliver, and I know whatever I need.

Speaker 7 (35:17):
If I need to go to extra mile, I need
to work, you know, shoot for eighteen hours straight for
whatever reason. Like I know he's down, He's gonna give
me that he is going to work, and so you know,
I just I always think that you have to make
sure that the people around you, your team if you're
giving more energy to your team than they're giving to you,
you need a new team.

Speaker 6 (35:36):
Right. If you're the most successful, most ambitious, hardest working
person in your circle, you need a new circle because
they're not pushing you, you're not getting any better. And
so we make each other better, Iron Shoppers.

Speaker 7 (35:46):
Iron And with Fight Night, we became each other's most
frequent collaborators.

Speaker 6 (35:51):
We've done more movies and TV with each other than
we have with anybody else.

Speaker 2 (35:56):
Yeah, as I said, it's a dynamic that definitely shows
up that we see on screar now.

Speaker 1 (36:00):
As anybody knows from your work wheel, like.

Speaker 2 (36:03):
You are terrific at doing universal stories that are black lid.
They're not necessarily black stories, or they're universal stories that
are black lid. And this time where there seems to
be an assault on all things black, all things black lid.
On top of that, how has that impacted at all
with how you navigate the types of stories that you

(36:25):
want to tell? And for more, I guess more importantly,
the type of stories that you could get done now
in this kind of tumultuous time.

Speaker 7 (36:33):
Yeah, listen, here's what I think those types of stories
DEI efforts to be more inclusionary. Have always been under attack.
They've always been things that the power structure has fought
against because power seeds nothing without demand. And so it

(36:57):
doesn't change what I'm doing. The bar has always been
the bar for me. If my movies, I don't care
who's in front of the camera, I don't care how
important the stories are. If they don't make money, I'm
not making another That's the reality. And so at the
end of the day, my job and our job as
a community is to make sure that we are delivering

(37:19):
on whatever the quantitative metric is for success in your industry,
you got to make sure that you're hitting it and
that you're doing and so in my industry, it is
box office revenue that you can return how much more
can you make versus what you spend, And so I
have to make sure that my projects are hitting those metrics,

(37:40):
and so I don't change.

Speaker 6 (37:42):
What I'm doing.

Speaker 7 (37:43):
Of course, Hollywood is a reactive industry, and as the
pendulum of politics and public perception swings back and forth,
Hollywood reacts to that. Of course, but at the end
of the day, if I'm somebody that can deliver or
a bottom line is the economic imperative more than any

(38:04):
other social or political one that most industries operate under.
And so what we have to do is make sure
that we realize.

Speaker 6 (38:12):
This is not new. There's nothing new.

Speaker 7 (38:14):
It's got a different name, right, It's got different figures
that are touting why diversity is not a good thing.
But at the end of the day, these are the
same people that have never genuinely heralded diversity. So if
you're somebody that believes in diversity, you got to make
sure that there's a value to it that is undenial.

(38:35):
You got to make sure that the diversity that you
are bringing to the table, if it needs to make money,
is making money because it needs to win awards, is
winning awards, whatever it is. You cannot rely on somebody
doing it because it's the right thing to do. So
you have to position it in a way that it
is valuable to people so that they can't just easily
turn it off or turn away. That's what I've been

(38:56):
able to do in my career.

Speaker 2 (38:57):
Yeah, I mean, aside from the political part of it,
and I know this just being in la is sort
of having some you know, connections within the industry with
even projects that I'm trying to do is the politics aside?

Speaker 3 (39:10):
Though?

Speaker 2 (39:10):
I mean, I think a common play that I hear
among creators is that now that's sort of the hedge
fund mentality has moved into movies. It's always been one
to some degree, but it feels like even now that
Hollywood is so much more risk averse than they used
to be. That's why you're getting the nostalgia plays and like,
you know, this is not to pick on this movie.

Speaker 1 (39:35):
It's got to be I p like all of that.

Speaker 6 (39:37):
So does that what movie where you going to say?

Speaker 2 (39:39):
You say, you don't want to pick on like for example, right,
this is to sell some merch you could, like you
know what I'm saying. And I think I saw that
Margot Robbie is doing another board game type of show,
a type of movie as well. So the whole point
is that I'm wondering, as a creative, though, are you
feeling more constrain or is your formula enough.

Speaker 1 (40:02):
To kind of weather this kind of time now in Hollywood?
Because people assumed it was going to be back.

Speaker 2 (40:09):
After the strike, and I've told people it is not back,
not in the way that people were thinking it would be.

Speaker 4 (40:14):
No.

Speaker 7 (40:15):
I mean, you work very closely in the media industry
and so you understand your content creator.

Speaker 6 (40:21):
It's we are definitely.

Speaker 7 (40:23):
In an EBB in Hollywood right now. It's not a flow, right,
there is a constriction of content. The major media companies
are making less, right, I don't care what you look like,
who you are, there's less content being made. So coming
off of multiple strikes, which were coming off of the

(40:44):
global pandemic, our industry has been hammered, and that means
it's been very, very tough for everybody, myself included. I
don't care how successful you are, everybody's having to deal
with the challenges of the industry right now. You're absolutely right,
and so Hollywood's always been risk averse, even more so
now right the bar is even higher for a project

(41:08):
to get over the finish line to get a green light.
As we say, it is very very tough right now.
So what that means is that you got to have
a pondrance of elements. You got to have the stars
and the IP and the built in audience and the
marketing for consumer product goods, like all those things have

(41:28):
to line up. Now every project doesn't have that. But
to be successful and get a project made in this environment,
you got to have as many of those elements as possible.
That is true across the board, not just with diverse
projects or creators of color. Everybody is fighting against that
right now. It's a cycle, it's an ebb. It will

(41:49):
flow again, but right now, make no mistake, it's it's
a tough time in Hollywood. I have a lot of
peers that are challenged right now because it's so hard
to get things made. What that means is that if
you have a connection with an audience and this is
something else that's transferable beyond just Hollywood. If you have
a connection with an audience and you can build that,

(42:09):
that's something that Hollywood and traditional gatekeepers can't control. And
if you have a way to reach and talk directly
to your audience. I encourage that next generation of folks
coming up trying to be content creators. Build your brand,
build your audience, Build the folks within your network that
will say, oh, that's a Jamail Hill project. I'm in
Like whatever she's doing, I want to know about I

(42:31):
want to be a part of. Focus on that and
spend as much, if not more energy on building that
as you are chasing and trying to knock on doors
of folks that are not letting many people in, letting
less in than they ever have before.

Speaker 6 (42:46):
So it's tough. It's tough, but you can navigate well.

Speaker 2 (42:50):
I say, maybe as a Hollywood that you can explain
this to me is that there's more streaming that it
just doesn't seem like they have enough content, So why
the restriction is what I want to know is like
y'all don't have enough, you know, So I guess I
just don't get like the thought processes that we have
streamers on streaming, on streaming, like platforms being created, fast channels.

(43:12):
It's like we're inundated, and yet at the same time,
it just seems like they don't want to get anything made.

Speaker 1 (43:18):
Like I don't I don't get it.

Speaker 6 (43:20):
You just said it, though, Jay, you just hit on it. Okay.

Speaker 7 (43:23):
You have all these various platforms that the studios invested in, right,
and they thought.

Speaker 6 (43:31):
That streaming was going to be a profit center.

Speaker 7 (43:34):
So they went out and spent billions with a B
on Netflix, Disney Plus.

Speaker 6 (43:40):
Max, Peacock, Paramount plus you name it. Right.

Speaker 7 (43:43):
Everybody need to have their own streaming service, and thus
you needed to feed those streaming services. So you go
back five years ago, there were a lot of deals
getting done, a lot of content getting made, and actually
it oversaturated the market. So when we had those strikes,

(44:03):
people outside the industry.

Speaker 6 (44:06):
Didn't feel it. They didn't even really care.

Speaker 7 (44:09):
You had two major strikes, the actors and the writers
not working, pins down, cameras off right, But people didn't
necessarily feel like, oh man, there's not a new episode
of Abbot Elementary. What am I gonna do on you know,
on this primetime weeknight. You know what they did, They

(44:30):
went to their streaming service and said, you know what,
I'm about to catch up on the old episodes.

Speaker 6 (44:34):
Of House of Cards, whatever it was.

Speaker 7 (44:38):
Regular people had so much opportunity to consume content, so
it's not really that they need more now. There actually
is a little bit of a thinning out process that
is happening because so much was made and consumers, who
ultimately consumers are the one that control what Hollywood and

(44:59):
every the other industry does. If consumers want it and
they want more, they will make more. But right now,
because there are so many options and so many streaming
service can whatever you're into, you can find it.

Speaker 6 (45:10):
You can find I don't care how.

Speaker 7 (45:13):
Niche or outside the normal or traditional stream it is,
you can find it somebody's making. Right, until we get
to a point where people are genuinely looking for new content,
and I don't mean just new episodes of your favorite show,
but I mean new original content. Until that appetite picks
back up, you're going to see the media companies pulling back.

(45:36):
Because here's the dirty secret that not a lot of
people like to talk about. During those strikes, while actors
were hurting and writers were hurting, and producers were hurting,
and directors were hurting, and grips and electrics and all
the craft services people who feel this industry were hurting,
the media companies actually had some of them some of
their best years ever because they weren't spending money on

(46:00):
new content, but their old content was still making money
because people didn't stop subscribing to their favorite streaming services.

Speaker 6 (46:09):
Right.

Speaker 7 (46:10):
And so that's the dynamic that you have to really
kind of drill into, is the economics of the business
right now are such that the media companies don't have
to go out and spend more. They're not making what
they thought they were going to make on streaming, and
so folks like you and I it's much tougher for
us to get our content. Mate, that's a little more
inside baseball maybe than we wanted to go.

Speaker 1 (46:31):
But that makes a lot.

Speaker 2 (46:32):
Of sense because when you have because during the pandemic,
me and Van Lathan we did rewatch podcasts of The Wire, right.

Speaker 1 (46:41):
The Wire was one of the most watched series during.

Speaker 2 (46:44):
The pandemic Because to your point, people are catching up
a whole stuff.

Speaker 1 (46:48):
They're like, oh, I've never watched this.

Speaker 2 (46:49):
It's why Suits just suddenly exploded all over again, like
it just came out.

Speaker 1 (46:54):
And when that happens.

Speaker 2 (46:55):
While I'm certainly happy that it does for those involved
with the projects, but that's not new material. So like,
that's right, what's the incentive the right new material if
I'm just gonna go back and watch something that they
did ten or fifteen years ago.

Speaker 7 (47:07):
So you guys, the rights holder of suits is making
money and they don't have to go out and make
the new suits right because audiences are satiated, and so
that's that's that's the dynamic that folks like us have
to balance, all right.

Speaker 2 (47:21):
So I know your time is short, and before I
get you out of here, I like that in the
podcast by asking every guest, what I call a messy question.

Speaker 1 (47:28):
Let's get into some trouble that create.

Speaker 6 (47:32):
We were doing good. I know, we were doing so good.
Here this is where it's gonna go bad.

Speaker 7 (47:37):
We had an amazing conversation and this is the one
right here where I'm an mess up.

Speaker 6 (47:40):
Let me tell you that this is where it goes bad.
All right.

Speaker 2 (47:43):
So the messy question is this, What if you had
to pick one, You could only pick one of these,
all right? Would you rather have an Oscars win or
a Falcon's Super Bowl victory.

Speaker 7 (47:57):
You gotta pick the super Bowl, Falcon super Bowl. I'm
like Lincoln, I'm taking super Bowl. Baby, I'm taking these
super Bowl, I'm taking super Bowl.

Speaker 6 (48:05):
I'm taking it.

Speaker 1 (48:05):
Listen, honey, how change the situation?

Speaker 6 (48:11):
Listen, I'm an investor.

Speaker 7 (48:13):
You know you know what that super Bowl win gonna
do to the value of the balcony. You know what
it is to see a city like Atlanta city that
I love, a super Bowl being brought to that city.
You see what it does, how it lifts the whole
community up in a way. A oscar is so much
more of an individual thing, and I would love it,

(48:35):
and I would, you know, love.

Speaker 6 (48:36):
It for my own legacy.

Speaker 7 (48:37):
But I've done okay at Hollywood, right, I still got
a little PTSD from them.

Speaker 6 (48:42):
Damn Oscars if you want to know the truth.

Speaker 7 (48:43):
Right, we didn't go there, But I would say that
super Bowl because that's something that everybody could enjoy. It's
a totally new area for me, and I just can't
a made the city of it like you think. Y'all
don't like them, damn cheeks. You think you kind of
Kansas City at old swag surface tailor swift. Let me
tell you, so you let these Falcons win a Super Bowl,

(49:04):
y'all are going hate I mean hate the eight Yeah,
because you know we show it all the way out.

Speaker 2 (49:10):
I wouldn't expect anything less. Well, will thank you so
much for joining me. I really appreciate it. And everybody
out there, make sure that you buy Wheel's You book.
It's really fun, thoughtful read. As I said, quick read
to which you know that you definitely wrote to today's
attention span generation right or lack of say. Book is
called who Better Than You? The art a healthy arrogance

(49:32):
and dreaming big. So make sure that you cop that
and good luck will. Maybe one of these days we
might see that Girl's Trip.

Speaker 6 (49:40):
I'm working on it. I'm working on it.

Speaker 7 (49:45):
I just said it's a tough content environment.

Speaker 6 (49:47):
Did you hear me say that it's hard. It's hard
out here?

Speaker 1 (49:51):
Over one hundred million dollars.

Speaker 6 (49:54):
This is yes? Ever, Okay, you're right, You're right. I'm
on it. That it is not on the studios. That
one is on my team. We work, If we work,
we try to make it happen. It's hard.

Speaker 1 (50:05):
You get them together.

Speaker 6 (50:06):
Man, Yes, I've wrought it. I wrote it. I got you.

Speaker 7 (50:09):
I appreciate you, Laddy, thanks for giving me some time.
I appreciate Okay, all right, Sis, one.

Speaker 1 (50:15):
More segment to go, and you guys know what that means.

Speaker 2 (50:17):
I got questions to answer up next, your viewer slash
listener questions, and I have plenty of answers coming up
next on the final segment of Spola Dips. All right, everybody,

(50:38):
before I wrap up another episode of Politics, time for
me to answer a question from you.

Speaker 1 (50:43):
And this question comes from Instagram.

Speaker 2 (50:45):
Baraka Ali sixty sixty one asked given analysis of title nain. Okay,
I'm going to assume this question is related to the
Trump administration's recent announcement that it was reversing guidance from
former President Joe Biden, who in the final days of
his presidency, instructed schools to quote proportionally distribute name, image,
and likeness payments between male and female athletes to comply

(51:06):
with Title nine, the federal legislation adopted in nineteen seventy
two that prohibits discrimination on the basis of sex educational
institutions that receive federal funds. Now, if you're wondering what
has nil money got to do with Title nine, it's
this This bring a federal judge is expected to finally
approve a multi billion dollar class action settlement that will
completely transform college sports. The House versus NCAA settlement will

(51:28):
give college athletes who competed from twenty sixteen to twenty
twenty one back pay since they were unable to financially
capitalize on nil at the time. Colleges are deciding whether
to opt into the settlement to directly share revenue with players,
which is expected to amount to about twenty million per
Power four or five schools. But some schools are choosing
to opt out because they don't want to take part

(51:49):
of a revenue sharing system with players.

Speaker 1 (51:52):
So what does this mean? For female athletes.

Speaker 2 (51:53):
Well a means schools can just funnel the majority of
the money from the settlement to men's basketball and college football. Now,
some of your proper thinking, well it should be that
way anyways, it's those two make a lot of money.

Speaker 1 (52:03):
Well, here's some food for thought.

Speaker 2 (52:05):
Maybe the reason these two sports have become worth a
billion dollars or more is because the NCAA has frankly
spent decades pouring money and.

Speaker 1 (52:13):
Resources into these sports.

Speaker 2 (52:15):
Now, the Government Accountability Office did a Title nine study
last year and found that the NCAA made a conscious,
concerted effort to place their full support behind men's basketball
and the men's basketball tournament.

Speaker 1 (52:26):
And this was long before.

Speaker 2 (52:27):
Men's basketball became a billion dollar business. Now, these new
directives from the Trump administration could have a damning effect
on women's sports. Now that schools have been told they
don't have to worry about providing equal support women's basketball, softball, volleyball,
those are exploding in popularity. But let's not also forget
the Olympics, where if the American women who competed in
the Olympics last summer in pairs were their own country,

(52:50):
they would have finished third among all nations. When sports
like swimming, gymnastics, soccer, and track and field start suffering at.

Speaker 1 (52:56):
The college level, that will show up in the Olympics.

Speaker 6 (53:00):
Take note.

Speaker 2 (53:01):
Thank you Baraka Ali six to six to one for
your question. Now, if you have a question for me,
you can hit me up on social media or email.
I'm at Jamail Hill across all social media platforms Twitter, Instagram,
blues Guide and Threads, also fan Base, which I recently joined.
Please use the hashtags politics. You also have the option
of emailing me as Politics twenty twenty four at gmail

(53:21):
dot com. You can also send me a video of
your question, but please make sure it's thirty seconds or less.
Don't forget to follow and subscribe to Politics on iHeart
and follow spolitics pod on Instagram and TikTok. Politics is
spelled s PO L I t I c S. A
new episode of Politics drops every Thursday on iHeart Podcasts

(53:42):
or wherever you get your podcasts. This is politics where
sports and politics don't just mix, they matter. Politics is
the production of iHeart Podcasts and the Unbothered Network. I'm
your host, Jamail Hill. Executive producer is Taylor Chakoin. Lucas
Hyman is head of audio and executive producer. Original music

(54:04):
First Politics provided by Kyle VISs from wiz FX