June 29, 2025 • 31 mins
Former national Bernie Sanders Political Director Michele Watley and Former National Racial Justice Director Tezlyn Figaro discuss the behind-the-scenes challenges while organizing for Bernie Sanders as Black operatives.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Yet ask you a question. Let's just keep it real,
straight shot with no chasing. I'm gonna get a little
bit ruptured. I'm here for it. Those who really believed
in the American process, all of us Street shot, no
(00:20):
chase with your girl, Chessel figure out on the Black
Effect podcasting at work on the Celtant figure Out, straight shot,
no chaser.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
I want to change my name. But then that intro
is so flying. All right, yeah, let's look at that.
You know, I'm thinking Marcellos would appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
No oh, but guys, thank you for tapping in. Got
Marcella's and Michelle with me. It's been a minute. Michelle
got above us. All she was helping us last year
was the last year Michelle was helping us, pretending like
you're gonna be on all the time, and then.
Speaker 3 (00:55):
Yep, I'm gonna let you have all that. Yeah, breaking up,
we know why.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
Yeah Yah, Michelle back, baby sister back, holding it down,
helping me out this week with just making sure we're
just keeping some topics going. And we were talking about
on the last episode what it was like to work
on Bernie Sanders campaign, and not even necessarily about Bernie Sanders,
but what it meant to be a part of the
(01:22):
progressive movement at the beginning of it, which I never
consider myself progressive, by the way, but what that was
like to, you know, to start a movement at the
onset of it in twenty fifteen, when people didn't know
what Bernie Sanders was, people didn't know what progressive was,
what all that traveling was like. Marcelle's found out that
Michelle and I lived together, we were on the campaign trail,
We're all over the country, and so we just kind
(01:43):
of wanted to do this episode for those who are interested.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
In knowing, like what that looks like.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
You know, what is if you did not attend my
training on roles and responsibilities for Cannadi's campaign workers, activists
and organizers campaign workers, which is what's also called operatives.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
And that's what we did.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
And so this episode, Marcella's wanted to ask some questions
and I'm letting Michelle lead on it. I'm going to
do my best to just tap in a little bit,
but just lead on it on you know, the ins
and outs of what it means to be a national
operative on a presidential campaign. Again, it's not taking away
(02:23):
anybody's experience, but it is very different when you just
you know, drop down in the city that you know
nobody and they tell you, hey, go start an office,
kind of like in a military pair of rescue.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
Just drop you down in the middle of nowhere.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
Figure it out, you know, build a tent, set up camp,
you know, go get the enemy. Very similar to obviously
not the same, but you know, you get my point.
So I want to talk about that and kind of
go let Marcella's and Michelle lead the conversation.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
So Marcella's take it away.
Speaker 4 (02:53):
All right, Okay, So I'm curious of of course, I
never worked on a campaign before, so I want to
know when you was on the Bernie Center's campaign, what
was the first day like on the campaign? It's like,
did they give you twol's of you know, how you
(03:15):
know what to expect, what not to you know, expect
things like that.
Speaker 3 (03:21):
What working on a campaign is probably different from any
job you've ever worked in that except for maybe the military,
and that when you's a it's a job where time
and resources are limited, and so you don't having you know,
hr training and handbook about how to do your job
and what's expected of a political director. And all of
(03:42):
these different roles. My experience has been that you are
expected to come in with the insight of knowledge that
you need to get on the ground quickly and moves
a candidates campaign forward. And so day one you get
on the ground, you are told where you need to
be and who needs to be moved or who you
need to talk to or what needs to happen. Then
(04:03):
you just move And Tes talks about this all the time.
When she went to Michigan, there was nobody there to say, hey, this,
here's a list of people you can call and hear
your outcomes and expectations. She had to go in there
with the expertise that she had to move black voters
and fly in Detroit and everywhere she went UH to
(04:26):
support UH the senders you know campaign and I had
to do a lot of the same And so there's
no route, there's no guide for how to do it
your My experience has been you're expected to know it,
and you should come in with a planner's strategy and
be ready to execute with whatever tools they give you,
if they give you any of it.
Speaker 2 (04:44):
Yeah, let's be clear, they don't give you no tools.
So let's just go ahead and be out. You don't
get no I don't know why to do tools? What tools?
Speaker 1 (04:51):
So we didn't get no tools. You better figure it out.
And I think Marsellers don't like that because he's a
union guy. Like handbooks, orientations, you know, they didn't tell
me and whatever.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
I'm learning and all that, none of that. Marcella's hit
the ground. Come on, that's what it is. Articulation. She
gave you the roundabout answer.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
I'm just gonna sum it up bottom, ain't no damn tools,
ain't no nothing.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
End here it out, get it done. Are we sending
your ass home?
Speaker 3 (05:34):
And well, we send you home. We're gonna send out
a press release to all the press first letting folks
know that you didn't see them. They gonna find out
for you before you find out.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
Ain't no tools. Yeah, it's definitely no tools. And this
is why the training is so important. You know, keep
talking to training, but this is why the training is
so important because even when you go to the other
trainings that Michelle and not been to, rest of black
Hawk's White Ass Project, all of this stuff, even.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
The tools they give you, the tools you get in
real life.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
So like it's from presidential thing especially on the campaign
that they have very little resource and nobody knew who
the hell Bernie Sanders was.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
So what tools? We had? Our laptop and that's that.
Speaker 3 (06:14):
Yeah, literally, no dire at all, none, none, And.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
I mean that literally.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
Marcelf's like, I want to make sure the listeners clear.
I'm not talking about just that supervisor. You don't tell
you a little bit. You know, Oh, okay, your jacket,
you know over here is the break room?
Speaker 2 (06:32):
This and that. It wasn't even that, it was literally
nothing is it nothing?
Speaker 3 (06:39):
As it nothing?
Speaker 2 (06:42):
Wow?
Speaker 3 (06:44):
You really gotta you gotta go in and like a
self starter, you gotta know what you need to do
and go get it done because there's as Tess said,
there are no tools, no direction.
Speaker 4 (06:55):
So just to be clear, So Tess was in Flint,
Where were you at?
Speaker 2 (07:03):
Were? We both were multiple states?
Speaker 3 (07:06):
So we started out in Georgia because the Black Irish
team was headquartered in Georgia, but we were sent to
multiple states. I think I was sent to nine different states.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
Yeah, I talk about Flint a lot because that was
the highlight. That's where I was the longest, you know,
and where I made the impact. But that sa it
didn't mean like I didn't go do an invent in
Oklahoma for three days or that. I went and spent
some time with Michelle and New York when she did
New York. That's where we had Charle Mayne come do
the when we did what's the name of it, the Apollo, Yeah,
(07:39):
the Apollo. It didn't mean I didn't go to Colorado.
Didn't mean I didn't do stuff in Georgia.
Speaker 5 (07:44):
You know.
Speaker 1 (07:44):
So you was bouncing around the only place I did
not go and refuse to go.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
Like I told before, it was Florida.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
Y'all not sent me for it because I knew they
was gonna take an l and my my political stomping
ground is Florida, and I wanted nothing to do. I
don't want my name close to that because I know
they was gonna lose. I know they wasn't spending the resources,
the money, you know, none of that. I talk about
Flint because I stayed there the longest, I made the
biggest impact. I was very strategic and why I went.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
I knew that there.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
Was an opportunity that the Hillary Clinton campaign was not doing.
It was a swing state, and that was the one
we won by half a percent. The upset so that's
why you and me talk about Michigan.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
But no, we were all over.
Speaker 5 (08:30):
So when you're how long was was the campaign? By
the way, Oh, I think they started in well when
they started ramping up staff. I think that was November
December of twenty sixteen.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
No, twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
Yeah, so a year. Michelle stayed on the longest. She
was one of the last ones. They sent the rest
of us home to Hill or whatever they call it.
What they say.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
Said when Michelle stayed on the very the longest.
Speaker 4 (09:06):
Mm okay, So what would you say, like, what was
the toughest of the roughest moment on the campaign?
Speaker 2 (09:18):
Georgia?
Speaker 3 (09:22):
Why?
Speaker 1 (09:24):
Yeah, I don't know what tough? I don't know how
Michelle want to answer that with me again? Yeah, let
me change it because I'm a veteran, so I like tough.
What like what do you mean to find tough? What
are the rules of tough?
Speaker 3 (09:38):
I completed JR OTC in high school so that I
ain't got none of that, you know.
Speaker 2 (09:45):
Yeah, that's about all.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
Like, are you meaning what was the greatest challenge?
Speaker 1 (09:50):
What was? Yeah?
Speaker 4 (09:50):
I would say, yeah, the greatest change, like like like
you know when someone be like, I wouldn't expect this,
It's gonna be hard, and I thought it was gonna be.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
Yeah, I don't know how to answer that. As Michelle,
she's more human to me. I don't know how to
answer that because I don't. I mean, by that time,
I had ran my own business, you know, with three
hundred employees. I were you know, worked first, first and
third largest lot of staffing firm in the world. And
the baby at a very season, you know what I mean.
(10:21):
So I had I been in the military, I didn't have.
It wasn't to me some Oh it's harder than our thought. No,
I knew people raggedy. I know, they don't do what
they say they're gonna do. Even when my colleagues tried
to come with me to the Michelle Tey, that's honest, true,
they tried to follow me to come to Detroit. They like, no, y'all,
stay where y'all at, cause I know what I'm just
coming down here, and I don't want none of y'all
(10:43):
getting credit for what I'm doing, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
So I had a lot of right.
Speaker 1 (10:47):
Yeah, I made sure my receipts were in every day
I went above and beyond to make sure I made
an impact even though they weren't asking me to are
expecting me to. So none of that, I would say,
the frustration, if you want to know, like, it wasn't
about hardest. I mean, I could say being in the
weather and flying and you know, cold and all of that,
but even then, I mean I did that in the military,
So it wasn't that. The frustration, I will say, or
(11:09):
the eyeopener would be, uh and even then no big deal,
because I still expect humans to be humans. But I
think the and I probably speak for Michelle with this too,
not really necessarily tougher. But the biggest eye opener was
how raggedy something still is, even at the presidential level.
Speaker 2 (11:26):
Yes, how disorganized it is.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
How you know, like, okay, we got forty thousand people
to come to the stands and y'all don't have no
way to follow, you know, to connect after, you know,
those type of things like the inconsistencies, the lack of leadership,
the lack of structure, the lack of discipline, the just
everybody kind of doing what they want to do, you
know that type of stuff. The amount of money that
(11:51):
was pissed away the amount of money that was not
spent on black voters.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
The churches.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
For me, uh that really I knew what I knew
about because Faith Outreached was one of the ones. Michelle,
I would say that I was kind of like, Wow,
these pastors.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Really be on this type of time.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
And that did shift not necessarily think about hard, you know,
but it did shift my took me a minute after
that to really kind of which is one reason why
today I try to not get too close to pastors
because I've seen too much of how they move in
that political space and that money space and that you know,
(12:29):
mogul space and all of that.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
And I didn't like what I saw.
Speaker 3 (12:33):
You and me both because you can remember, you know,
different things we saw on the campaign together, and that
was very much an eye opening experience for me. Campaigns
are grueling work period. If you're on a campaign, it's
just it's twenty four to seven non stop. So for
people who are not used to working.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
At that level, that's difficult.
Speaker 3 (12:53):
Roommating with an alien who doesn't sleep, who is in
the military, is on her you know, on the piece
of Q's took it to a whole other level and
I'm really grateful for that, to be honest. It just
showed me that there's another level of excellence that I
could work to and aspire to. I think for me,
(13:16):
I would have fashioned myself for progressive at the time,
in alignment with the values. For me, your experienced tads
with faith was my experience with the progressive mood, just
seeing the blind spot, lack of connection to depths for
black people in black issues when the progressive movement came
(13:38):
up for me and that one.
Speaker 2 (13:39):
So you thought they gave a damage what you're saying, No,
that they don't. You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
The eye opener was that they don't give a damn.
But you went into a thinking they did because they
were progressive. Yes, oh my god, because I was. It
wasn't shit, but okay.
Speaker 3 (13:52):
Well, and not that they gave a damn, but that
the platforms that there was true alignment. And I said
this on one one of the panels that I was on,
maybe right after the campaign, but at the time, to me,
the Bernie movement was the other side of the coin
of trump Ism than Trump movement, and that they were
(14:13):
willing to burn everything down and let things go for
what they thought they deserved or were entitled to, and
that was maybe I opened it for me. I wasn't
expecting that.
Speaker 1 (14:24):
You expecting them to what like go over to the
Democrat side.
Speaker 2 (14:28):
I'm just trying to figure out what you mean.
Speaker 3 (14:29):
No, what I mean is is when progressives just different
experiences I had on the campaign, I experienced, you know,
so called Bernie supporters called me the N word just
in public. You know, I just experienced things that I
hadn't expected to experience from progressives when it came to
(14:53):
black folks, even just seeing how they prioritized platform issues,
the fact that the aggressive movement is at this point
connected to Bernie Sanders, and that movement is attached to him.
But Congresswoman Barbara Lee has been a progressive the entire
time she's been in Congress. If you look historically, Shirley
(15:16):
Chisholm would be considered a progressive. But those are nine
names or folks that they herald. I think I went
into this thinking that the progressive movement was better aligned
with black issues and maybe cared a little more than
they actually do. And that shows that shows in.
Speaker 1 (15:33):
The forgetting that white supremacy is still across the board.
It's kind of like and that people's heartget broke with
that pole thing. You know. One of my other girlfriends
like another organization's part She said, well, I thought they
operated in excellence.
Speaker 2 (15:45):
They do, but they also cover up for a lot
of bullshit too. You know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
This is another group and she's a part of. But
the end of the day, they still white supremacist, you
know what I mean. Like, I never had a thought
like and it's not I tell friend of about all
the time, you don't like white people, be like, no,
I'm not talking a white People'm talking about systems, and
I'm talking about the systems that they represent. And I'm
talking about not the cool white person that you go
(16:09):
have a beer with or hang out with or whatever.
I don't have no problem with white people. That's not
not a biggot. What I'm telling you is it. I
recognize the systems. I recognize the privilege, and I know
that anytime that privilege has an opportunity to say hello,
I'm privileged, it's.
Speaker 2 (16:26):
Gonna show up. It's gonna show up and and as expected.
And I don't think because somebody.
Speaker 1 (16:33):
Say, yeah, but we're all the same, Yeah, okay, until
it's time to not be the same until it's time
to really. That's why I'm big with loyalty. Yeah, you
ain't like me, mama, cause I know when it comes
down to it, you ain't gonna like when they tell
me about the rapture. Oh yeah, everybody willing until it's
time get.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
Your head chopped off.
Speaker 5 (16:54):
Then it hit different.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
And so I don't expect white people to put themselves
put me over them?
Speaker 2 (17:08):
Why should they?
Speaker 1 (17:10):
And that's why people find themselves so broken hearted than this,
that their heart is so attached to it. Yeah, but
they thought yeah, until it meant you getting in front
of them.
Speaker 3 (17:21):
That's right. The campaign shifted my political ideology.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
Yeah, that shit, they shit. I'm like, why was y'all confused?
And people still look confused to this day. If I'm
standing in the line and we both starving, why am
I gonna let you eat before Jada?
Speaker 4 (17:40):
Right?
Speaker 2 (17:40):
What kind of mother would I be?
Speaker 5 (17:42):
Right?
Speaker 2 (17:43):
So, why would we expect a white person to do
anything anything different?
Speaker 3 (17:47):
That's it.
Speaker 2 (17:48):
Ain't no poet being mad about it.
Speaker 3 (17:49):
You're being mad about it. Ain't no point being mad
about it.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
You in the line, no way, Yep, that's it. Bottom line. Privilege.
Privilege is absolutely like bording a plane. That's it.
Speaker 1 (18:02):
And just know that they don't want you in first
class period, even if you got the money for first class,
even if you got the points, the seats.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
Available, No, it's not happening.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
My friend was on the plane last night going home.
He said, Man, if she don't let me in that
big seat, you know, with spirit because it was wide open. No,
you did not pay even though nobody's sitting here. Clearly
it's seven people on the plane. It was literally seven
people on the plane. It was a six am flight.
Why not let him get the big seat? No, that's
how life worked. You're not entitled to the big seat
(18:36):
just because it's open.
Speaker 3 (18:37):
That's right.
Speaker 2 (18:39):
I worked with Mi shelldle a lot. But why if
worked hard?
Speaker 1 (18:42):
No, you paid for seats six A. And even though
your ancestors have paid far more than what the person
in seat one has ever done, America has set it
up that they belong in seat one. So the argument
would be, will Michelle ask me always, well, then, tens,
(19:03):
why do we do it? She really sincerely? We want
to know, like scerely sincerely broke, you know, perplexed about it?
But what's the point, because the point is we always
have to be loud and clear that I, even though
I'm in six, seat six, I know you're in one,
and I know how you got to one.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
And we want to make it clear. And you still
might be in one, but you're gonna hear me in
six though, right.
Speaker 1 (19:32):
You get I'm gonna keep on getting up, going to
the bathroom, over and on making your shit uncomfortable, Zelle.
I'm gonna bump into you and every time with your arm.
And but if it's gonna be real uncomfortable, because I may,
I may not make maybe you'll get tired, and maybe
one day you'll let me in seek one. You cannot
be in this thinking you're gonna get it. You understand
the difference because if people say, well, if I'm eventually
(19:56):
gonna get it, that's why people get out of this
so much. Nothing changes, No, the goal ain't for it
to change. The goal is for using the seat analogy.
Just keep getting up and going to the restaurant, keep
bumping their arms, dropping bags on their head, uh, opening
up the bend, getting up fifty thousand times, you know,
turning the air on, taking your hair, your plug, your
(20:17):
air plugs, out playing the music loud as heid.
Speaker 2 (20:20):
No, we're just gonna have just a bumpy ride. You
know what I mean that you're a warm job. If
I'm uncomfortable, you're gonna get a little bit of this
turbulence too.
Speaker 5 (20:27):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (20:27):
No matter the outcome, it's my outpa versus the outcome.
I'm gonna make this uncomfortable.
Speaker 4 (20:32):
That's it.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
And you and I might move you out the seat.
But if I never move, you have to seat.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
I have to know that everything I did in my
seat was still worthy, right if somebody behind me may
actually get that seat, But if they never do, you
cannot train the next generation. Well, if we just keep
doing it, keep doing, keep doing a bitch, they'll get
out the seat. No, that's why y'all get out of it,
because you keep looking for the microwave. What's the point?
Speaker 2 (20:55):
What do you mean? What the point is? The point
is how did did you? How did you ride this ride?
What capacity did you own that seat?
Speaker 5 (21:10):
Mm hmm?
Speaker 2 (21:13):
And that's what politics is, that's it.
Speaker 4 (21:19):
So I want to ask you what did you hear
most from black voters doing the campaign? And how did
you respond to.
Speaker 1 (21:31):
My w was who the hell is Bernie Sanders Clinton,
and they we don't see enough black people and all
of those things are true. Where you Where is the
rest of y'all black staff, especially in Detroit? They we
wasn't trying to hear none of that. Bernie Sanders don't
talk about black people that y'all can keep saying all
over he Marshall King.
Speaker 2 (21:51):
They didn't want to hear that ship Ye not want
to get this ship?
Speaker 5 (21:58):
What have you?
Speaker 2 (21:59):
That's it? Did y'all have?
Speaker 4 (22:02):
So did y'all have to respond or y'all just listen?
Speaker 2 (22:06):
Yeah? I mean you respond. I mean somebody asked you
a question. If I'm trying to God, can how can
you respond to that?
Speaker 5 (22:12):
Though?
Speaker 2 (22:13):
No, she like, I just said, what you mean? Tell
me truth for me? All know how Michelle did it?
Michelle pro did a more diplomatic way.
Speaker 3 (22:22):
More diplomatic way, but I tell them the truth and
tells you may not remember, but very early on in
the campaign, we had that discussion about telling the truth.
Don't tell folks and not that you lie, but don't
tell folks that you can't deliver on or the U
can't personally guarantee. And so that shaped High would answer
those questions and I was diplomatic about it because that's
(22:43):
just who I am and how I present. But I
was very mindful not to overpromise or not promise anything
that I could not personally deliver.
Speaker 5 (22:53):
Mm.
Speaker 1 (22:57):
Yeah, I definitely, like I said, I didn't have That's
a great question, Marselves because actually made me think about
this my way of organizing, because I was not at
there talking about Bernie Sanders is the best and he
got the best policies and all that. Like Michelle truly
is a progressive, you know what I mean. So she was,
you know, like these are positive black people. That that
(23:18):
wasn't my my move. My move was I'm here to
build a relationship with you me you know, build a
relationship with you for visibility, for whatever it is I
can bring to you.
Speaker 2 (23:31):
But this is not the end of our relationship.
Speaker 1 (23:34):
And so that's why I still go to Detroit now
every other week, you know what I mean, Like, I
still have relationships there. I still became great friends with
Eric Mays rest in peace, you know, still great friends
with Danielle Green who eventually who helped me organize to
Bernie Sanders. He highlighted her, did townhalls with her. He
(23:57):
was the one that she hugged when he looked all
Bonne up that they use on advertisements to help us
win that. But Danielle and I still talk to this day.
She eventually became school board he never knew about. It
wouldn't be nice for being to say, damn, one of
the people I originally you know, organize is now the
elected official.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
They leave and move on.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
That still became a relationship to me. She also helped
me when it was time to organize for in Flint,
for Ben Crump for the Flint water crisis. That didn't
have anything to do with the campaign, but those relationships
I still was able to call them relationships and still
and call on today they can call on me.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
So for me, I was a.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
I did outside of what you typically would probably do,
you know, for an operator, to be honest, But that's
because I just sell myself and whatever I do, I'm
building me and you.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
I can't tell you what burn' gonna do, well, here're
gonna do.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
All I know is I'm here to try to set
up whatever resource we can give you now or however
we can. But I'm stamping my shit, you know what
I mean? Me domin the candidate build a relationship with
That's how I did it. That's not how I would
teach people. You know, you have to advocate for your candidate. Again, guys, don't.
(25:12):
There's some things I train, but I'm not telling you
to do, but say, that's how I did it because
I just had to operate in my full integrity. And
I didn't rock with Bernie Sanders like that. I just
didn't and I couldn't act like I didn't know what
I knew. So now that don't mean I don't have
(25:34):
candidates that I rock with, you know like that, because
I do. Like I can say Levin Bracy and you
say what y'all want to say about her. She gave
my voice, she was behind me one hundred percent. She
went against the church, her family, everybody support me. Levin's
always picked up the fall seventeen years, whether I've been
in Orlando or not. Regina, Hi'll except everybody want to say, ay,
(25:54):
Virginia Hill, she if she did it, she didn't do it.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
I can only tell you my experience with Regina that
can go the same thing.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
Even as even with Diddy now people are looking at
a horrible side of him. I'm gonna stand on what
I know about you. Don't mean it's all you and totality,
you know, it's just what I know. So I for me,
that's just how I operate because I got it. Like
I said, I got to operate in true integrity. But
(26:24):
that's also why I don't work on people's campaigns now too.
Speaker 3 (26:27):
Yeah, because to be an operative, you have to, as
Tess's said, you have to move different. It's about the
it's about election day, it's about the voter, it's about
the numbers, and how you move in that space is different. Now,
I will say that I've always been and of course
with Tess's help and shaping that, I've always been intentional
about how I engaged with black voters and black supporters
(26:50):
because it is about the relationships, and I've always wanted
to feel like I can come back to the community
and not come back with a question of if I
sold people out or gave people false hoping. Things like
that are very intentional about being truthful about what they
can expect and where they can contribute and what makes sense.
But when you're an operative, you got to you got
(27:11):
a deadline that's election day, and you got to employ
different strategies and do different work to get to that.
And you may not always be in love with your candidate,
and candidates are oftentimes hard to love.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
So real hard to love. But that's why I'm not
an operative, you know, because it ain't eve about being
in love. Like I, I go so hard for somebody.
You know that I'm a ride. But again, that's why
we all have a role. I'm really good at training operatives,
really good at you know, I work with Michelle, but
(27:45):
I don't necessarily jump outter it. You know, people get upset.
I can work on my campaign. No, I'll consult, I'll advise,
I'll do all of that.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
But like.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
The way people you see ourselves, like, go so hard
for these people, and I just no politicians. I can't
put myself in a situation when I already know I
at some point that politician gonna show up, and I
don't want to be responsible for whatever that is, you
know what I mean, just because of that. But that's
not being an operative, you know, That's what I'm saying.
(28:15):
You gotta know your role. You know, Operatives keeping their
head down, they're working on campaigns. They're not always front
facing people. They're not activists all the time, you know
what I'm saying. So you need people to do that.
You need it's people who work on campaigns that with Michelle.
I signed somebody with Michelle one front facing out posting
(28:36):
about Michelle and Michelle's the best. This that no keeping
Michelle on schedule, keeping her own point, you know, making
sure she get her information, making sure her data is
available to every day, making sure that she got the
graphics she needs, you know, all that type of stuff
that has nothing to do. You know, you want to
care about the candidate and the issues, but I'm just
speaking to those who just want to work on campaigns.
You don't feel like you always had to be caught
(28:58):
pulled by some emotion.
Speaker 2 (28:59):
Because it is. It can be a career, a job.
You know, those who are pulled.
Speaker 1 (29:03):
By emotion is great, But sometimes that's not always a
good thing too, because now you're caught up in Always
say that's probably one of the downfalls of Bernie Sanders
movement and even the Trump world, because they're so caught
up on emotion that they can't see the forest for
the trees. A lot of times, you know, crashing out
the whole campaign because you didn't get this that did
(29:24):
that well, he said he believe in this and that
that ain't how it worked, you know, you know what
I mean. So like they get so emotionally tached, you know,
attached that they can't be a hired manager, you know
what I mean.
Speaker 2 (29:37):
And we need you need that on campaigns.
Speaker 1 (29:39):
You need people that see very clear, very objective that's
not going to be caught up in the petty and
the this and the bullshit. And I want to train
more people like that. That may not necessarily be my role.
I know my role too, which is I'll just consult
with a candidate once a week. You know, hey, give
me all your question Dad, but like working with.
Speaker 2 (29:59):
You every day, day in, day out.
Speaker 1 (30:01):
I didn't even do that with Michelle. I signed somebody
to do it for I tapped in and gave overview Michelle.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Boom boom boom boom boom.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
This is what I'm saying, wrong, Da da da da
da change the strategy of and then my job is
like drill startge, like come in and push push, push
push push. A candidate don't need that every single day.
You'll drain your candidate down. Does that make sense? Yeah?
Cause Anne Marcella is really gonna be talking about how
you calling the union on me.
Speaker 2 (30:28):
I want somebody's staff off. I run somebody's staff off,
and I know that. Enough about me now. I had
to learn that.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
If you like what you heard on Straight Shot No Chaser,
please subscribe and drop a five star review and tell
a friend. Straight Shot No Chaser is a production of
the Black Effect podcast networking iHeart Radio, ANTILM figure Out,
and I like to thank our producer editor mixer Dwayne
Cruffer and our executive producer Charlotta Magne to God. For
more podcasts from iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app,
(30:57):
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts
Yet ask you a question. Let's just keep it real,
straight shot with no chasing. I'm gonna get a little
bit ruptured. I'm here for it. Those who really believed
in the American process, all of us Street shot, no
(00:20):
chase with your girl, Chessel figure out on the Black
Effect podcasting at work on the Celtant figure Out, straight shot,
no chaser.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
I want to change my name. But then that intro
is so flying. All right, yeah, let's look at that.
You know, I'm thinking Marcellos would appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
No oh, but guys, thank you for tapping in. Got
Marcella's and Michelle with me. It's been a minute. Michelle
got above us. All she was helping us last year
was the last year Michelle was helping us, pretending like
you're gonna be on all the time, and then.
Speaker 3 (00:55):
Yep, I'm gonna let you have all that. Yeah, breaking up,
we know why.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
Yeah Yah, Michelle back, baby sister back, holding it down,
helping me out this week with just making sure we're
just keeping some topics going. And we were talking about
on the last episode what it was like to work
on Bernie Sanders campaign, and not even necessarily about Bernie Sanders,
but what it meant to be a part of the
(01:22):
progressive movement at the beginning of it, which I never
consider myself progressive, by the way, but what that was
like to, you know, to start a movement at the
onset of it in twenty fifteen, when people didn't know
what Bernie Sanders was, people didn't know what progressive was,
what all that traveling was like. Marcelle's found out that
Michelle and I lived together, we were on the campaign trail,
We're all over the country, and so we just kind
(01:43):
of wanted to do this episode for those who are interested.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
In knowing, like what that looks like.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
You know, what is if you did not attend my
training on roles and responsibilities for Cannadi's campaign workers, activists
and organizers campaign workers, which is what's also called operatives.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
And that's what we did.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
And so this episode, Marcella's wanted to ask some questions
and I'm letting Michelle lead on it. I'm going to
do my best to just tap in a little bit,
but just lead on it on you know, the ins
and outs of what it means to be a national
operative on a presidential campaign. Again, it's not taking away
(02:23):
anybody's experience, but it is very different when you just
you know, drop down in the city that you know
nobody and they tell you, hey, go start an office,
kind of like in a military pair of rescue.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
Just drop you down in the middle of nowhere.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
Figure it out, you know, build a tent, set up camp,
you know, go get the enemy. Very similar to obviously
not the same, but you know, you get my point.
So I want to talk about that and kind of
go let Marcella's and Michelle lead the conversation.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
So Marcella's take it away.
Speaker 4 (02:53):
All right, Okay, So I'm curious of of course, I
never worked on a campaign before, so I want to
know when you was on the Bernie Center's campaign, what
was the first day like on the campaign? It's like,
did they give you twol's of you know, how you
(03:15):
know what to expect, what not to you know, expect
things like that.
Speaker 3 (03:21):
What working on a campaign is probably different from any
job you've ever worked in that except for maybe the military,
and that when you's a it's a job where time
and resources are limited, and so you don't having you know,
hr training and handbook about how to do your job
and what's expected of a political director. And all of
(03:42):
these different roles. My experience has been that you are
expected to come in with the insight of knowledge that
you need to get on the ground quickly and moves
a candidates campaign forward. And so day one you get
on the ground, you are told where you need to
be and who needs to be moved or who you
need to talk to or what needs to happen. Then
(04:03):
you just move And Tes talks about this all the time.
When she went to Michigan, there was nobody there to say, hey, this,
here's a list of people you can call and hear
your outcomes and expectations. She had to go in there
with the expertise that she had to move black voters
and fly in Detroit and everywhere she went UH to
(04:26):
support UH the senders you know campaign and I had
to do a lot of the same And so there's
no route, there's no guide for how to do it
your My experience has been you're expected to know it,
and you should come in with a planner's strategy and
be ready to execute with whatever tools they give you,
if they give you any of it.
Speaker 2 (04:44):
Yeah, let's be clear, they don't give you no tools.
So let's just go ahead and be out. You don't
get no I don't know why to do tools? What tools?
Speaker 1 (04:51):
So we didn't get no tools. You better figure it out.
And I think Marsellers don't like that because he's a
union guy. Like handbooks, orientations, you know, they didn't tell
me and whatever.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
I'm learning and all that, none of that. Marcella's hit
the ground. Come on, that's what it is. Articulation. She
gave you the roundabout answer.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
I'm just gonna sum it up bottom, ain't no damn tools,
ain't no nothing.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
End here it out, get it done. Are we sending
your ass home?
Speaker 3 (05:34):
And well, we send you home. We're gonna send out
a press release to all the press first letting folks
know that you didn't see them. They gonna find out
for you before you find out.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
Ain't no tools. Yeah, it's definitely no tools. And this
is why the training is so important. You know, keep
talking to training, but this is why the training is
so important because even when you go to the other
trainings that Michelle and not been to, rest of black
Hawk's White Ass Project, all of this stuff, even.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
The tools they give you, the tools you get in
real life.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
So like it's from presidential thing especially on the campaign
that they have very little resource and nobody knew who
the hell Bernie Sanders was.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
So what tools? We had? Our laptop and that's that.
Speaker 3 (06:14):
Yeah, literally, no dire at all, none, none, And.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
I mean that literally.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
Marcelf's like, I want to make sure the listeners clear.
I'm not talking about just that supervisor. You don't tell
you a little bit. You know, Oh, okay, your jacket,
you know over here is the break room?
Speaker 2 (06:32):
This and that. It wasn't even that, it was literally
nothing is it nothing?
Speaker 3 (06:39):
As it nothing?
Speaker 2 (06:42):
Wow?
Speaker 3 (06:44):
You really gotta you gotta go in and like a
self starter, you gotta know what you need to do
and go get it done because there's as Tess said,
there are no tools, no direction.
Speaker 4 (06:55):
So just to be clear, So Tess was in Flint,
Where were you at?
Speaker 2 (07:03):
Were? We both were multiple states?
Speaker 3 (07:06):
So we started out in Georgia because the Black Irish
team was headquartered in Georgia, but we were sent to
multiple states. I think I was sent to nine different states.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
Yeah, I talk about Flint a lot because that was
the highlight. That's where I was the longest, you know,
and where I made the impact. But that sa it
didn't mean like I didn't go do an invent in
Oklahoma for three days or that. I went and spent
some time with Michelle and New York when she did
New York. That's where we had Charle Mayne come do
the when we did what's the name of it, the Apollo, Yeah,
(07:39):
the Apollo. It didn't mean I didn't go to Colorado.
Didn't mean I didn't do stuff in Georgia.
Speaker 5 (07:44):
You know.
Speaker 1 (07:44):
So you was bouncing around the only place I did
not go and refuse to go.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
Like I told before, it was Florida.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
Y'all not sent me for it because I knew they
was gonna take an l and my my political stomping
ground is Florida, and I wanted nothing to do. I
don't want my name close to that because I know
they was gonna lose. I know they wasn't spending the resources,
the money, you know, none of that. I talk about
Flint because I stayed there the longest, I made the
biggest impact. I was very strategic and why I went.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
I knew that there.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
Was an opportunity that the Hillary Clinton campaign was not doing.
It was a swing state, and that was the one
we won by half a percent. The upset so that's
why you and me talk about Michigan.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
But no, we were all over.
Speaker 5 (08:30):
So when you're how long was was the campaign? By
the way, Oh, I think they started in well when
they started ramping up staff. I think that was November
December of twenty sixteen.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
No, twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
Yeah, so a year. Michelle stayed on the longest. She
was one of the last ones. They sent the rest
of us home to Hill or whatever they call it.
What they say.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
Said when Michelle stayed on the very the longest.
Speaker 4 (09:06):
Mm okay, So what would you say, like, what was
the toughest of the roughest moment on the campaign?
Speaker 2 (09:18):
Georgia?
Speaker 3 (09:22):
Why?
Speaker 1 (09:24):
Yeah, I don't know what tough? I don't know how
Michelle want to answer that with me again? Yeah, let
me change it because I'm a veteran, so I like tough.
What like what do you mean to find tough? What
are the rules of tough?
Speaker 3 (09:38):
I completed JR OTC in high school so that I
ain't got none of that, you know.
Speaker 2 (09:45):
Yeah, that's about all.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
Like, are you meaning what was the greatest challenge?
Speaker 1 (09:50):
What was? Yeah?
Speaker 4 (09:50):
I would say, yeah, the greatest change, like like like
you know when someone be like, I wouldn't expect this,
It's gonna be hard, and I thought it was gonna be.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
Yeah, I don't know how to answer that. As Michelle,
she's more human to me. I don't know how to
answer that because I don't. I mean, by that time,
I had ran my own business, you know, with three
hundred employees. I were you know, worked first, first and
third largest lot of staffing firm in the world. And
the baby at a very season, you know what I mean.
(10:21):
So I had I been in the military, I didn't have.
It wasn't to me some Oh it's harder than our thought. No,
I knew people raggedy. I know, they don't do what
they say they're gonna do. Even when my colleagues tried
to come with me to the Michelle Tey, that's honest, true,
they tried to follow me to come to Detroit. They like, no, y'all,
stay where y'all at, cause I know what I'm just
coming down here, and I don't want none of y'all
(10:43):
getting credit for what I'm doing, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
So I had a lot of right.
Speaker 1 (10:47):
Yeah, I made sure my receipts were in every day
I went above and beyond to make sure I made
an impact even though they weren't asking me to are
expecting me to. So none of that, I would say,
the frustration, if you want to know, like, it wasn't
about hardest. I mean, I could say being in the
weather and flying and you know, cold and all of that,
but even then, I mean I did that in the military,
So it wasn't that. The frustration, I will say, or
(11:09):
the eyeopener would be, uh and even then no big deal,
because I still expect humans to be humans. But I
think the and I probably speak for Michelle with this too,
not really necessarily tougher. But the biggest eye opener was
how raggedy something still is, even at the presidential level.
Speaker 2 (11:26):
Yes, how disorganized it is.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
How you know, like, okay, we got forty thousand people
to come to the stands and y'all don't have no
way to follow, you know, to connect after, you know,
those type of things like the inconsistencies, the lack of leadership,
the lack of structure, the lack of discipline, the just
everybody kind of doing what they want to do, you
know that type of stuff. The amount of money that
(11:51):
was pissed away the amount of money that was not
spent on black voters.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
The churches.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
For me, uh that really I knew what I knew
about because Faith Outreached was one of the ones. Michelle,
I would say that I was kind of like, Wow,
these pastors.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Really be on this type of time.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
And that did shift not necessarily think about hard, you know,
but it did shift my took me a minute after
that to really kind of which is one reason why
today I try to not get too close to pastors
because I've seen too much of how they move in
that political space and that money space and that you know,
(12:29):
mogul space and all of that.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
And I didn't like what I saw.
Speaker 3 (12:33):
You and me both because you can remember, you know,
different things we saw on the campaign together, and that
was very much an eye opening experience for me. Campaigns
are grueling work period. If you're on a campaign, it's
just it's twenty four to seven non stop. So for
people who are not used to working.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
At that level, that's difficult.
Speaker 3 (12:53):
Roommating with an alien who doesn't sleep, who is in
the military, is on her you know, on the piece
of Q's took it to a whole other level and
I'm really grateful for that, to be honest. It just
showed me that there's another level of excellence that I
could work to and aspire to. I think for me,
(13:16):
I would have fashioned myself for progressive at the time,
in alignment with the values. For me, your experienced tads
with faith was my experience with the progressive mood, just
seeing the blind spot, lack of connection to depths for
black people in black issues when the progressive movement came
(13:38):
up for me and that one.
Speaker 2 (13:39):
So you thought they gave a damage what you're saying, No,
that they don't. You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
The eye opener was that they don't give a damn.
But you went into a thinking they did because they
were progressive. Yes, oh my god, because I was. It
wasn't shit, but okay.
Speaker 3 (13:52):
Well, and not that they gave a damn, but that
the platforms that there was true alignment. And I said
this on one one of the panels that I was on,
maybe right after the campaign, but at the time, to me,
the Bernie movement was the other side of the coin
of trump Ism than Trump movement, and that they were
(14:13):
willing to burn everything down and let things go for
what they thought they deserved or were entitled to, and
that was maybe I opened it for me. I wasn't
expecting that.
Speaker 1 (14:24):
You expecting them to what like go over to the
Democrat side.
Speaker 2 (14:28):
I'm just trying to figure out what you mean.
Speaker 3 (14:29):
No, what I mean is is when progressives just different
experiences I had on the campaign, I experienced, you know,
so called Bernie supporters called me the N word just
in public. You know, I just experienced things that I
hadn't expected to experience from progressives when it came to
(14:53):
black folks, even just seeing how they prioritized platform issues,
the fact that the aggressive movement is at this point
connected to Bernie Sanders, and that movement is attached to him.
But Congresswoman Barbara Lee has been a progressive the entire
time she's been in Congress. If you look historically, Shirley
(15:16):
Chisholm would be considered a progressive. But those are nine
names or folks that they herald. I think I went
into this thinking that the progressive movement was better aligned
with black issues and maybe cared a little more than
they actually do. And that shows that shows in.
Speaker 1 (15:33):
The forgetting that white supremacy is still across the board.
It's kind of like and that people's heartget broke with
that pole thing. You know. One of my other girlfriends
like another organization's part She said, well, I thought they
operated in excellence.
Speaker 2 (15:45):
They do, but they also cover up for a lot
of bullshit too. You know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
This is another group and she's a part of. But
the end of the day, they still white supremacist, you
know what I mean. Like, I never had a thought
like and it's not I tell friend of about all
the time, you don't like white people, be like, no,
I'm not talking a white People'm talking about systems, and
I'm talking about the systems that they represent. And I'm
talking about not the cool white person that you go
(16:09):
have a beer with or hang out with or whatever.
I don't have no problem with white people. That's not
not a biggot. What I'm telling you is it. I
recognize the systems. I recognize the privilege, and I know
that anytime that privilege has an opportunity to say hello,
I'm privileged, it's.
Speaker 2 (16:26):
Gonna show up. It's gonna show up and and as expected.
And I don't think because somebody.
Speaker 1 (16:33):
Say, yeah, but we're all the same, Yeah, okay, until
it's time to not be the same until it's time
to really. That's why I'm big with loyalty. Yeah, you
ain't like me, mama, cause I know when it comes
down to it, you ain't gonna like when they tell
me about the rapture. Oh yeah, everybody willing until it's
time get.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
Your head chopped off.
Speaker 5 (16:54):
Then it hit different.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
And so I don't expect white people to put themselves
put me over them?
Speaker 2 (17:08):
Why should they?
Speaker 1 (17:10):
And that's why people find themselves so broken hearted than this,
that their heart is so attached to it. Yeah, but
they thought yeah, until it meant you getting in front
of them.
Speaker 3 (17:21):
That's right. The campaign shifted my political ideology.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
Yeah, that shit, they shit. I'm like, why was y'all confused?
And people still look confused to this day. If I'm
standing in the line and we both starving, why am
I gonna let you eat before Jada?
Speaker 4 (17:40):
Right?
Speaker 2 (17:40):
What kind of mother would I be?
Speaker 5 (17:42):
Right?
Speaker 2 (17:43):
So, why would we expect a white person to do
anything anything different?
Speaker 3 (17:47):
That's it.
Speaker 2 (17:48):
Ain't no poet being mad about it.
Speaker 3 (17:49):
You're being mad about it. Ain't no point being mad
about it.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
You in the line, no way, Yep, that's it. Bottom line. Privilege.
Privilege is absolutely like bording a plane. That's it.
Speaker 1 (18:02):
And just know that they don't want you in first
class period, even if you got the money for first class,
even if you got the points, the seats.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
Available, No, it's not happening.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
My friend was on the plane last night going home.
He said, Man, if she don't let me in that
big seat, you know, with spirit because it was wide open. No,
you did not pay even though nobody's sitting here. Clearly
it's seven people on the plane. It was literally seven
people on the plane. It was a six am flight.
Why not let him get the big seat? No, that's
how life worked. You're not entitled to the big seat
(18:36):
just because it's open.
Speaker 3 (18:37):
That's right.
Speaker 2 (18:39):
I worked with Mi shelldle a lot. But why if
worked hard?
Speaker 1 (18:42):
No, you paid for seats six A. And even though
your ancestors have paid far more than what the person
in seat one has ever done, America has set it
up that they belong in seat one. So the argument
would be, will Michelle ask me always, well, then, tens,
(19:03):
why do we do it? She really sincerely? We want
to know, like scerely sincerely broke, you know, perplexed about it?
But what's the point, because the point is we always
have to be loud and clear that I, even though
I'm in six, seat six, I know you're in one,
and I know how you got to one.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
And we want to make it clear. And you still
might be in one, but you're gonna hear me in
six though, right.
Speaker 1 (19:32):
You get I'm gonna keep on getting up, going to
the bathroom, over and on making your shit uncomfortable, Zelle.
I'm gonna bump into you and every time with your arm.
And but if it's gonna be real uncomfortable, because I may,
I may not make maybe you'll get tired, and maybe
one day you'll let me in seek one. You cannot
be in this thinking you're gonna get it. You understand
the difference because if people say, well, if I'm eventually
(19:56):
gonna get it, that's why people get out of this
so much. Nothing changes, No, the goal ain't for it
to change. The goal is for using the seat analogy.
Just keep getting up and going to the restaurant, keep
bumping their arms, dropping bags on their head, uh, opening
up the bend, getting up fifty thousand times, you know,
turning the air on, taking your hair, your plug, your
(20:17):
air plugs, out playing the music loud as heid.
Speaker 2 (20:20):
No, we're just gonna have just a bumpy ride. You
know what I mean that you're a warm job. If
I'm uncomfortable, you're gonna get a little bit of this
turbulence too.
Speaker 5 (20:27):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (20:27):
No matter the outcome, it's my outpa versus the outcome.
I'm gonna make this uncomfortable.
Speaker 4 (20:32):
That's it.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
And you and I might move you out the seat.
But if I never move, you have to seat.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
I have to know that everything I did in my
seat was still worthy, right if somebody behind me may
actually get that seat, But if they never do, you
cannot train the next generation. Well, if we just keep
doing it, keep doing, keep doing a bitch, they'll get
out the seat. No, that's why y'all get out of it,
because you keep looking for the microwave. What's the point?
Speaker 2 (20:55):
What do you mean? What the point is? The point
is how did did you? How did you ride this ride?
What capacity did you own that seat?
Speaker 5 (21:10):
Mm hmm?
Speaker 2 (21:13):
And that's what politics is, that's it.
Speaker 4 (21:19):
So I want to ask you what did you hear
most from black voters doing the campaign? And how did
you respond to.
Speaker 1 (21:31):
My w was who the hell is Bernie Sanders Clinton,
and they we don't see enough black people and all
of those things are true. Where you Where is the
rest of y'all black staff, especially in Detroit? They we
wasn't trying to hear none of that. Bernie Sanders don't
talk about black people that y'all can keep saying all
over he Marshall King.
Speaker 2 (21:51):
They didn't want to hear that ship Ye not want
to get this ship?
Speaker 5 (21:58):
What have you?
Speaker 2 (21:59):
That's it? Did y'all have?
Speaker 4 (22:02):
So did y'all have to respond or y'all just listen?
Speaker 2 (22:06):
Yeah? I mean you respond. I mean somebody asked you
a question. If I'm trying to God, can how can
you respond to that?
Speaker 5 (22:12):
Though?
Speaker 2 (22:13):
No, she like, I just said, what you mean? Tell
me truth for me? All know how Michelle did it?
Michelle pro did a more diplomatic way.
Speaker 3 (22:22):
More diplomatic way, but I tell them the truth and
tells you may not remember, but very early on in
the campaign, we had that discussion about telling the truth.
Don't tell folks and not that you lie, but don't
tell folks that you can't deliver on or the U
can't personally guarantee. And so that shaped High would answer
those questions and I was diplomatic about it because that's
(22:43):
just who I am and how I present. But I
was very mindful not to overpromise or not promise anything
that I could not personally deliver.
Speaker 5 (22:53):
Mm.
Speaker 1 (22:57):
Yeah, I definitely, like I said, I didn't have That's
a great question, Marselves because actually made me think about
this my way of organizing, because I was not at
there talking about Bernie Sanders is the best and he
got the best policies and all that. Like Michelle truly
is a progressive, you know what I mean. So she was,
you know, like these are positive black people. That that
(23:18):
wasn't my my move. My move was I'm here to
build a relationship with you me you know, build a
relationship with you for visibility, for whatever it is I
can bring to you.
Speaker 2 (23:31):
But this is not the end of our relationship.
Speaker 1 (23:34):
And so that's why I still go to Detroit now
every other week, you know what I mean, Like, I
still have relationships there. I still became great friends with
Eric Mays rest in peace, you know, still great friends
with Danielle Green who eventually who helped me organize to
Bernie Sanders. He highlighted her, did townhalls with her. He
(23:57):
was the one that she hugged when he looked all
Bonne up that they use on advertisements to help us
win that. But Danielle and I still talk to this day.
She eventually became school board he never knew about. It
wouldn't be nice for being to say, damn, one of
the people I originally you know, organize is now the
elected official.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
They leave and move on.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
That still became a relationship to me. She also helped
me when it was time to organize for in Flint,
for Ben Crump for the Flint water crisis. That didn't
have anything to do with the campaign, but those relationships
I still was able to call them relationships and still
and call on today they can call on me.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
So for me, I was a.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
I did outside of what you typically would probably do,
you know, for an operator, to be honest, But that's
because I just sell myself and whatever I do, I'm
building me and you.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
I can't tell you what burn' gonna do, well, here're
gonna do.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
All I know is I'm here to try to set
up whatever resource we can give you now or however
we can. But I'm stamping my shit, you know what
I mean? Me domin the candidate build a relationship with
That's how I did it. That's not how I would
teach people. You know, you have to advocate for your candidate. Again, guys, don't.
(25:12):
There's some things I train, but I'm not telling you
to do, but say, that's how I did it because
I just had to operate in my full integrity. And
I didn't rock with Bernie Sanders like that. I just
didn't and I couldn't act like I didn't know what
I knew. So now that don't mean I don't have
(25:34):
candidates that I rock with, you know like that, because
I do. Like I can say Levin Bracy and you
say what y'all want to say about her. She gave
my voice, she was behind me one hundred percent. She
went against the church, her family, everybody support me. Levin's
always picked up the fall seventeen years, whether I've been
in Orlando or not. Regina, Hi'll except everybody want to say, ay,
(25:54):
Virginia Hill, she if she did it, she didn't do it.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
I can only tell you my experience with Regina that
can go the same thing.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
Even as even with Diddy now people are looking at
a horrible side of him. I'm gonna stand on what
I know about you. Don't mean it's all you and totality,
you know, it's just what I know. So I for me,
that's just how I operate because I got it. Like
I said, I got to operate in true integrity. But
(26:24):
that's also why I don't work on people's campaigns now too.
Speaker 3 (26:27):
Yeah, because to be an operative, you have to, as
Tess's said, you have to move different. It's about the
it's about election day, it's about the voter, it's about
the numbers, and how you move in that space is different. Now,
I will say that I've always been and of course
with Tess's help and shaping that, I've always been intentional
about how I engaged with black voters and black supporters
(26:50):
because it is about the relationships, and I've always wanted
to feel like I can come back to the community
and not come back with a question of if I
sold people out or gave people false hoping. Things like
that are very intentional about being truthful about what they
can expect and where they can contribute and what makes sense.
But when you're an operative, you got to you got
(27:11):
a deadline that's election day, and you got to employ
different strategies and do different work to get to that.
And you may not always be in love with your candidate,
and candidates are oftentimes hard to love.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
So real hard to love. But that's why I'm not
an operative, you know, because it ain't eve about being
in love. Like I, I go so hard for somebody.
You know that I'm a ride. But again, that's why
we all have a role. I'm really good at training operatives,
really good at you know, I work with Michelle, but
(27:45):
I don't necessarily jump outter it. You know, people get upset.
I can work on my campaign. No, I'll consult, I'll advise,
I'll do all of that.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
But like.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
The way people you see ourselves, like, go so hard
for these people, and I just no politicians. I can't
put myself in a situation when I already know I
at some point that politician gonna show up, and I
don't want to be responsible for whatever that is, you
know what I mean, just because of that. But that's
not being an operative, you know, That's what I'm saying.
(28:15):
You gotta know your role. You know, Operatives keeping their
head down, they're working on campaigns. They're not always front
facing people. They're not activists all the time, you know
what I'm saying. So you need people to do that.
You need it's people who work on campaigns that with Michelle.
I signed somebody with Michelle one front facing out posting
(28:36):
about Michelle and Michelle's the best. This that no keeping
Michelle on schedule, keeping her own point, you know, making
sure she get her information, making sure her data is
available to every day, making sure that she got the
graphics she needs, you know, all that type of stuff
that has nothing to do. You know, you want to
care about the candidate and the issues, but I'm just
speaking to those who just want to work on campaigns.
You don't feel like you always had to be caught
(28:58):
pulled by some emotion.
Speaker 2 (28:59):
Because it is. It can be a career, a job.
You know, those who are pulled.
Speaker 1 (29:03):
By emotion is great, But sometimes that's not always a
good thing too, because now you're caught up in Always
say that's probably one of the downfalls of Bernie Sanders
movement and even the Trump world, because they're so caught
up on emotion that they can't see the forest for
the trees. A lot of times, you know, crashing out
the whole campaign because you didn't get this that did
(29:24):
that well, he said he believe in this and that
that ain't how it worked, you know, you know what
I mean. So like they get so emotionally tached, you know,
attached that they can't be a hired manager, you know
what I mean.
Speaker 2 (29:37):
And we need you need that on campaigns.
Speaker 1 (29:39):
You need people that see very clear, very objective that's
not going to be caught up in the petty and
the this and the bullshit. And I want to train
more people like that. That may not necessarily be my role.
I know my role too, which is I'll just consult
with a candidate once a week. You know, hey, give
me all your question Dad, but like working with.
Speaker 2 (29:59):
You every day, day in, day out.
Speaker 1 (30:01):
I didn't even do that with Michelle. I signed somebody
to do it for I tapped in and gave overview Michelle.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Boom boom boom boom boom.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
This is what I'm saying, wrong, Da da da da
da change the strategy of and then my job is
like drill startge, like come in and push push, push
push push. A candidate don't need that every single day.
You'll drain your candidate down. Does that make sense? Yeah?
Cause Anne Marcella is really gonna be talking about how
you calling the union on me.
Speaker 2 (30:28):
I want somebody's staff off. I run somebody's staff off,
and I know that. Enough about me now. I had
to learn that.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
If you like what you heard on Straight Shot No Chaser,
please subscribe and drop a five star review and tell
a friend. Straight Shot No Chaser is a production of
the Black Effect podcast networking iHeart Radio, ANTILM figure Out,
and I like to thank our producer editor mixer Dwayne
Cruffer and our executive producer Charlotta Magne to God. For
more podcasts from iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app,
(30:57):
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts
Host
Tezlyn Figaro
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