Autumnal Earnestness Bonanza, Part 1

It's time for Earnestness Bonanza, our bi-annual call-in show where we DROP THE ACT and answer listener questions HONESTLY. This time with real voice calls! You can call to leave more messages before we record Part 2 at 385-GAY-GUYS!

See us LIVE in Chicago on October 6th and New York on October 12th! Tickets at linktree.com/straightiolab.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Who do you who? This is your final reminder to
buy tickets to our Chicago show this Sunday. There are
like I want to say, fifteen tickets left. It's not
a lot at the Den Theater. We have such a
great line up that I actually won't spoil here, but
I promise it is some of the best of the
best of what Chicago has to offer. And then of
course our Bellhouse show the following week, which is also

(00:24):
I believe there are limited tickets left. All of that
is available at linktree dot com slash Stradio lab and
the link is in our Instagram bio. And then of
course I have my Joe's Pub show coming up in November,
and Sam has his Dynasty show in la and those
are in each of our bios. You guys know where
to look, all right, don't make me spell it out

(00:44):
for you. So that is what I have to say.
And please enjoy our first ever call in Earnestness Bonanza,
which by the way, is one of two, so we'll
see you next week. Goodbye, and also enjoy.

Speaker 2 (01:16):
Podcast starts now. Welcome all to our Earnestness Bonanza. That's
special time of year when we answer your questions as
earnestly as possible.

Speaker 1 (01:27):
We drop the act. We're we're in our net era
in the sense that we are going from comedy to
drama for this one special episode that's sure to win
many awards and top the Netflix charts.

Speaker 2 (01:41):
And needless to say, and why are we doing it? Well,
because it's autumn, and autumn is a time of reflection.

Speaker 1 (01:46):
That's right, aum is autom is a time for reflection.

Speaker 2 (01:49):
Well, t harvest.

Speaker 1 (01:50):
It's actually the only time of reflection we kind of
have left if you think about it, Well.

Speaker 2 (01:53):
Summer is a time to completely look outward, don't look
inward for even a moment.

Speaker 1 (01:58):
Summer is literally about put the song Harley's in Hawaii
by Katie Perry on constant repeat from the beginning of
June to the first week of September, and then when
that ends you have to pick up the pieces. And
I think there's no reflection in winter. I think winter
you're too depressed reflect. I think spring you're too amped
up for what's to come. And then summer, of course,

(02:19):
I mean just cock in every orifice you can barely speak.

Speaker 2 (02:23):
Yeah, it's really Fall is the only time I actually
do feel this way, even with like working, and like
the only time I'm really focused is fall.

Speaker 1 (02:31):
And let's just say specifically the month of October, because
then you get into the Thanksgiving, you get it to
the holidays. Maybe it's like first month of October through
second first week of October through second week of November.

Speaker 2 (02:45):
That is the academic Ye, I mean when you hit
November fifteenth, I wipe my hands clean and I say,
let's wrap it up. He said, you know what, we
did what we could, but we actually cannot resuscitate the patient.
I say, you know, yeah, it's what's more important now
is accepting. Yes, where we're at, and you know.

Speaker 1 (03:06):
An acceptance is different than reflection.

Speaker 2 (03:08):
Oh, of course acceptances. That happens not November fifteenth.

Speaker 1 (03:13):
Right, right, acceptances. This is interesting. People think the holidays
are a time for reflection because you're a feeling gratitude. No,
the holidays are a time of acceptance because what you're
doing is you're deciding based on wherever you are. Let's
say you are unhappy with your career. Let's say you're
in an unhappy relationship. Let's say you are single and

(03:34):
don't want to be single. You have to convince yourself
that those are okay, because if you don't, it's fucking
over for you. So from mid November through January. Second,
you have to basically you're saying, this is what I'm
working with. Yeah, and it's time to make an intellectual
argument that this is good.

Speaker 2 (03:53):
Yeah. Yeah, spin it however you can. You're your OWR.

Speaker 1 (03:57):
You have to be the queen of man. You have
to be like a woman in a documentary about Vogue
that's like get me five scarves yesterday, but about your
own life.

Speaker 2 (04:07):
Yeah, and that's that can be empowering. That's the beauty
of the holidays. But we're here to reflect. So this
is a groundbreaking episode because you know, normally we've done
emails and we've had to sort of read them out loud,
and it's sort of been you know, had a DIY flair.
This time, that's right, George set up a damn voicemail.

(04:29):
We're doing a call in episode, so we're gonna hear
your stunning, beautiful voices for once something suddenly see how
the other half lives. You're going to hear yourself and I, yeah.

Speaker 1 (04:41):
I want to say these were very emotional to listen to.
I just listened to all of them in a row
on a Friday, So of course I'm already feeling emotionally
vulnerable slash cautiously optimistic about the weekend. Kind of the
perfect place to be is I would say, Friday at
eleven am. And I was a little worried. You know,

(05:05):
people have to give us feedback, okay, and we welcome it.
And there was a part of me that was like,
what if I don't know, I hear something that makes
me feel sad, like if someone's like the podcast is
not as good as it used to be, or if
someone's like, hey, like I stopped listening, or and if
that is your experience. I celebrated and I but please
don't tell us. But I have to say not a

(05:25):
single one of these calls was negative in any way.
All of them made me feel great. All of them
were also not like blindly differential to us, Like all
of them were treating us with respect and also with openness.

Speaker 2 (05:42):
That's great. I can't wait so because I have not
heard a one and so they're all coming surprised to me, and.

Speaker 1 (05:49):
So in that spirit, I do want to play. Just
a first call from a good friend of ours.

Speaker 3 (05:54):
Hi, guys, a Salas and Romans I am so irritated
you've got a phone number that makes any sense for
your callers. I resent you. I'm sure that she'll be great. Anyways,
have a good time.

Speaker 1 (06:09):
Bye, Okay, thank you, Alison. As you know, I'll say
this about Alison, she is really great about checking it.

Speaker 2 (06:21):
I agree, this girl shows up.

Speaker 1 (06:23):
She I love that she she always she she is
like she is actually in the truest sense of the word,
like a social extroverted person. And it's always such a
joy to hear from her.

Speaker 2 (06:35):
No, it's a real treat. And it's also like you know,
it always still feels special. I always get that little
h I know.

Speaker 1 (06:42):
Can you believe it? How far are we find? Know,
we're just gab gab Gavin with Allison, and you know,
as a branding expert that she is, you know, she
has many properties to her name. I think it's she
is recognizing that we made a conscious choice to have
three eight five gay guys.

Speaker 2 (06:58):
I was so I mean, George, I just want to
say thank you for all the work that you have
done to put this together. You have done literally all
of the work, and it's been sort of a good
chunk of work. And I have not lifted a damn
finger and I'm grateful that you have done all.

Speaker 1 (07:15):
It's my it's my passion project and I and I'm
so excited and I can't wait to see what we
do with it. But before that, I do want to
play one more important call.

Speaker 2 (07:24):
Wait before this call, can I one riff on Alison Roman?
Of course?

Speaker 1 (07:29):
Please?

Speaker 2 (07:30):
You know that Nicki minaj lyric where she's like sitting
with Anna, I'm really sitting with Anna because she's like
talking and sitting with Anna Wintour. That's us that Alison
Roman chatting with Roman. I'm really chatting with Roman.

Speaker 1 (07:45):
Okay, Wait, let me find the one that I oh, okay,
I kind of reading.

Speaker 4 (07:47):
Yes, Hi, George and Sam John here for its time,
long time, and I haven't earnest and a question. Uh,
the bit is about this crady a lot of Discord.

Speaker 5 (08:01):
Patreon dot com, slash for your Lads, which has really.

Speaker 4 (08:05):
Come into its own in the past years. So you know,
we've had several meetups.

Speaker 5 (08:09):
Across the nation, across the globe over the summer.

Speaker 4 (08:14):
We even had a brunch around the Glass Culture Races Awards,
and I just wanted to thank you both on behalf
of the disc producers out there.

Speaker 5 (08:23):
You know what a special little play doll really let's bursh.

Speaker 6 (08:28):
I do have a question.

Speaker 4 (08:30):
Can you give a little turning update for us at Toronto.

Speaker 5 (08:34):
Durlies in particular are waiting with Fated Brett twenty four
twenty five let us know, love ya xx, John.

Speaker 1 (08:45):
And I just wanted to play that call because we
have a very special announcement, which is that we officially
have a Toronto date and a venue and we will
start promoting it like in the next three days. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (08:58):
Can I just say when you have it in front
of you, it's I know it. It's the Sunday before
Thanksgiving American Thanksgiving.

Speaker 1 (09:05):
Yes, it is Saturday, November Saturday, November twenty third at
the Paradise Theater. I'm pretty sure. Okay, is that wrong?

Speaker 2 (09:15):
No? For some reason I thought it was on Sunday,
but you're probably right. Yeah, So there you go, see
you then, bitch, see you them, bitch and shout out
to all the Discordistas. That's actually so sweet. We love
to see the meetups and we loved that there's a
friendship's blossoming that is.

Speaker 1 (09:36):
Yes, it's true. We love the Discordistas. We love friendships. Blossoming.
We love all the meetups in different cities, and we
are really excited for Toronto, a place where we have
promised we are about to go to for exactly four years.
And I in our defense, each time it did seem
like it was about to happen. But you know we

(09:57):
first of all, I have self undiagnosed ADHD and Sam
had to move, so I don't know what exactly people
wanted from us, but we are coming on November twenty third.
You know, my dear friend from Toronto told me that
that is the absolute worst time to visit the city.
And wait, why cannot wait the winter? Why I think
just be goes of winter?

Speaker 2 (10:17):
Well, I for one can't wait. I know some Toronto
chicas that I'm gonna hit up.

Speaker 1 (10:24):
It's gonna be great. It's gonna be my dear.

Speaker 2 (10:26):
My dear internet friend Donnie Crosswell lives there, and you
better believe we're going out.

Speaker 1 (10:32):
Okay, let's get into calls because we have, by the way,
we have so many it's insane. We got more calls
than we ever do emails and we're not going to
get to all of them. But I am like, let's
prioritize ones that we can answer quickly. All right, ready, okay,
I'm ready, Okay, let's go.

Speaker 7 (10:46):
Who who a longtime listener, first home buyer? They stand
it upon? And I had a topic I wanted you
to discuss between Paul Meskeal and All of the Strangers,
Mike Seist and Josh O'Connor and Challengers and Nicholas Cage
and Long Legs. Twenty twenty four has been a banner
year for straight actors playing gay guys in film, and

(11:07):
there's seemingly no end in sight. So I wanted to
raise the topic of these gay for pay actors. But
that's the question of whether or not it's allowed, because
you know it is. What are your favorite and least
favorite performances in the genre. Who are straight actors you
look forward to playing gay one day? Is it only
okay if they're hot? And what about lesbians?

Speaker 1 (11:27):
Let me know? And what about lesbians?

Speaker 2 (11:31):
Genius? That could be a good dendem on sort of
every question.

Speaker 1 (11:35):
Well, okay, maybe we can start with lesbians. Since you
just recently watched The Kids are all.

Speaker 2 (11:40):
Right, Oh my god, I mean I felt like they
really nailed it.

Speaker 1 (11:45):
They definitely nailed it, and they well, you know, of
course that is directed by a queer women, so she
of course directed them in a way only LGBTQ plus
woman could. Oh wow, I think they also did. Like
the Annette Benning is such a classic butch doctor lesbian
h and then Julianne Moore is such a classic bisexual leaning,

(12:10):
long hair lesbian.

Speaker 2 (12:13):
No. I really felt that was like I watched that
movie and I said, these women are lesbians. I said,
this is not this is not playing they believe it
right now?

Speaker 1 (12:24):
Yeah, and I know that it's people say that. I
mean the politics of that movie. You know, if you
read it the wrong way, are bad. But also if
you read it with an open heart and not as
a little bitch, they are fine. And so I actually
think julian En Moore does a great job of portraying
the emotional complexity of both loving her wife and also
being tracked to Mark Ruffalo, which I think is an
experience most lesbians have had.

Speaker 2 (12:46):
It's a very complex to me that movie. It's not
even about the relationships, it's about drinking wine in California.
And I really felt like they portrayed that.

Speaker 1 (12:55):
Yes, I want to I'll start with worst and then
we can go to best.

Speaker 2 (13:01):
Okay, I have a worst.

Speaker 1 (13:02):
This is a this is not a this is not
a gay guy performance, this is a a trans woman performance.
But Jared Leto and Dallas Virus Club, I know that
is a very cliche answer to this is I would say,
like world historically offensive, and I have not Like, there
are scenes in that movie that haunt me and I
cannot believe it was allowed to happen, and I cannot

(13:24):
believe that he won an Oscar for it.

Speaker 2 (13:26):
I never saw that movie, and now I'm glad I
never did.

Speaker 1 (13:28):
Well, Honey, you're not missing my.

Speaker 2 (13:30):
Worst is and it's kind of a charming bad sure,
But Macaulay Culkin in Party Monster, ooh yeah, it is
just like there's something about it. It almost feels homophobic. It
kind of ruins me of like, God, why am I
Figurnna name Hermione's performance in Blingering? Watch the performance in

(13:52):
Blingering where you're like, what is going on here? Like
You're like, is this genius? Or is this like completely
off the mark? And so I think that's a top
bad for me? Who's your top good?

Speaker 1 (14:05):
Wait? I do want to say a recent bad for
me was James Gordon in the prom I found I don't.
I know, that's exactly the kind of thing you are
not prone to watching. No, it's based on a musical.
It came out during the pandemic.

Speaker 2 (14:19):
Couldn't couldn't find me there like legitimately, just like literally
straight man doing.

Speaker 1 (14:26):
Like gay hand gestures and being faggy.

Speaker 2 (14:29):
Wow. Well, I honestly that makes me curious to watch.

Speaker 1 (14:32):
And by the way, Ronny Malick in Bohemian Rhapsody.

Speaker 2 (14:35):
Oh yeah, that's rough. Yeah, that's rough.

Speaker 1 (14:40):
And I also want to add, there was this trend
for a while to do a twist on the gay
guy performance and have them be super masculine.

Speaker 2 (14:47):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (14:47):
So Pete Davidson did that in some Netflix movie. It
was the one with the one we talked about with
Taylor Tomlinson with that actress that she likes who is unmemorable.

Speaker 2 (15:00):
Right, I thought, Yeah, another version of that is Adam
Pally and Happy Endings.

Speaker 5 (15:07):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (15:07):
Well but so yes, but that's actually a good game.

Speaker 2 (15:11):
No, it is good, and it actually was so hot
and I thought he was gay forever and it was
such a cur Yeah.

Speaker 1 (15:15):
No, that's actually one of the hottest performers performances anyone
has ever given. And I also want to say, Woody
Harrelson did that in Friends with Benefits, which is a
movie people forget about. But he was like a broie
gay guy. Okay, sorry, we're going along. My favorite one
I was gonna say is Robin Williams and The Bird King.

Speaker 2 (15:30):
Oh duh, that's so genius. That's really good. I agree
with that one hundred percent.

Speaker 1 (15:35):
Just like absolute genius, beautiful, stunning.

Speaker 2 (15:39):
Yeah, that's it's also not and yeah, well I want
to say you they are the color already brought it up.
But I thought Paul Mezcow was so good at being gay.

Speaker 1 (15:48):
I agree in.

Speaker 2 (15:49):
All of Us Strangers, is that what it's called. I
was like, yeah, this is like I know this man
like and it's a subtle because it wasn't broie, nor
was it like faggy. It was like that like in
between sort of bushwick gay. It's kind of hard to
pull up.

Speaker 1 (16:01):
Yes, he was literally doing Bushwig. Yeah, and you could
actually tell that he has met Bushwick gaze and has
internalized how they behave.

Speaker 2 (16:10):
Yeah, and it's a subtle performance.

Speaker 1 (16:12):
I agree. No, I think guess what Paul mess called
a great actor?

Speaker 2 (16:15):
Who knew?

Speaker 1 (16:17):
I will be the first to say.

Speaker 2 (16:18):
It, well, I can't wait for Gladiator too.

Speaker 1 (16:22):
Oh yes, I guess I will watch that. And just
to finish, I do want to say, if I, if
I may, I have a conflicted one, okay, one that
I can decide if it's good or bad. And it is.
When I watched Andrew Garfield and Angels in America on Broadway.
I came out of that actually sort of respecting what
he was doing. But then I've talked to many gay

(16:43):
men who said it was offensive and actually like really bad,
and then they they sort of convinced me, and then
I was like, no, why are you listening to them?
Trust your instinct, biach. But then I like and so
I sort of came out somewhere in the middle. So
that is my conflicted gay performance. I don't know if
you have one of those.

Speaker 2 (16:59):
Conflicted gay per formance that's too nuanced. I don't think
I have one, to be honest.

Speaker 1 (17:05):
Okay, we have to ring the nuanced alarm and move
on to the next question. Okay, this is actually one
of my favorite questions. Are you ready?

Speaker 8 (17:11):
I'm ready, Hey, gay guys, I mean George and Sam.
My question for you guys is pretty simple. If you
were to have psychotic delusions. Do you think you would
have delusions of grandeur or prosecutory delusions?

Speaker 9 (17:31):
And why am I not love you?

Speaker 10 (17:33):
Guys?

Speaker 7 (17:33):
Bye?

Speaker 1 (17:34):
Okay, So would we have delusions of grander or persecutory delusions?
So it's like, is your delusion that you are the
best or that you are being persecuted? And I actually
think this is like one of the most I almost
think this is like the new are you a topper?
Are you about?

Speaker 10 (17:52):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (17:53):
This is the new I'm actually obsessed with this question.

Speaker 2 (17:55):
Yeah what? This is tough because at times I'm both
I can I really oscillate between like, oh, you you're
the greatest person on earth, everyone worships you, to like
oh you're complete garbage. No one has ever thought about
you in your life yep, And so I'm not quite
I kind of want to mean grandeur, like because I

(18:15):
do think even when I'm feeling like, oh, people don't
people don't see you, people don't understand you, I can
sort of twist that in my mind to be like,
which is perfect because you're underestimated and you're coming from behind.

Speaker 1 (18:27):
And that's exactly how I feel, and that like I've
I really I've I'm past my phase of thinking I'm
eternally that life is especially unfair to me. Yeah, like
I'm I've now gone past that. I have enough perspective
to know that that's not true. If anything, I end
up like blaming myself three times over if something doesn't

(18:50):
happen for him, like, well, you should have tried harder.
But I that. But then I almost get like on
a meadow level, I'm like, wow, look at me. I'm
so hard on myself. And that's another reason why I'm
so amazing, because I have such high standards for myself
and for others.

Speaker 2 (19:06):
The idea of high standards for oneself is such an
interesting one. I really feel. It's such a thing that
people say where they're like, well, of course I'm depressed.
I have high standards, and it's like and it's like,
I know what you mean, but like, so does everyone.
It's not like I was like, well I don't. I mean,
I guess some there it's possible that some people don't,
but like almost everyone is like dreams of like has

(19:29):
big dreams and then sort of gets them cut down
over time.

Speaker 1 (19:32):
It's not no, it's true.

Speaker 2 (19:33):
It's not like oh, I just started out thinking, you know,
nothing could happen for me.

Speaker 1 (19:38):
But then you meet people who are just like sort
of satisfied, yeah, and you're like, what the hell, what
trauma happened to you that you're happy with a middling
existence of just being happy and having three kids?

Speaker 2 (19:50):
Well, you know, I have really high standards. I think
it's one of the more topic gatings.

Speaker 10 (19:56):
All right, next question, Romori will get you every you
wear darling, I want to hear you.

Speaker 1 (20:04):
Okay, thoughts on Gaga? All right? I will say I
think some songs are out from Joker.

Speaker 2 (20:13):
Well, the whole Harlequin album came out last to day, Yeah,
I think.

Speaker 1 (20:18):
Okay, Okay, So I will say just off the bat.
I have not listened to it, but I have watched
the random clip that Lady Gaga collabed with the official
account of the louver On.

Speaker 2 (20:29):
I haven't watched this clip.

Speaker 1 (20:31):
She's just in front of the Mona Lisa and then
paints a smile on the glass in front of the
Mona Lisa Joker style. So what are your thoughts on this?

Speaker 2 (20:41):
I am curious about her new era. I I kind
of love when she so the album, the Harlequin album
is like, you know, people are sort of being like
it's bad, which respect, I'm sure they're right, but I
kind of like when she gives someone she like, when
she's like releasing bad, I almost think of it as
like she's cleansing so that.

Speaker 1 (21:01):
She can Yeah, okay, I love that theory. I have
a slightly different theory about Gaga right now, which is
I actually think since her Heyday a split has happened
where she actually can She actually is often good at

(21:22):
music and at her work and at acting, but she's
actually terrible at promo and at all the ancillary things
that come along with it. So and I actually think
that's a very useful lens through which to view Gaga,
because you can be like, yes, this Mona Lisa video
is stupid, House Labs Cosmetics is stupid. All your like
dumb interviews are stupid, But that will not affect my

(21:45):
opinion on potentially a new album will be good. Like
I actually felt like that, even about like Chromatica, where
I was like, I like these songs, but like, don't
try to go on Jimmy Kimmel and talk to me
about the mythology of kindness punks. Do you know what
I mean?

Speaker 11 (22:01):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (22:01):
Of course, of course.

Speaker 1 (22:02):
I actually sort of think fame has affected her ability
to gab, Like Gaga could never today do her like
funny little sketch with Andy Samberg on SNL.

Speaker 2 (22:12):
But I love, like, even in the Comatica era, I
remember her going on like Zaye Low and doing like
the whole track by track thing, and but I was like,
I'm addicted to this because I'd like never seen, like
to see her talk for an extended period of time
and just be like, what is going on in that
head of her?

Speaker 1 (22:28):
Yeah? Yeah, she is one of those people whereas longer
she talks, the more confused you are about what she's
trying to say.

Speaker 2 (22:34):
I'm literally can you imagine being like like her music producer,
Like you're like in the studio and she like just
starts going and talking and you're like like she's giving
you notes and you're like, yeah, You're like totally, I'll
have that by Monday, and like you're just sort of
guessing I'm addicted.

Speaker 1 (22:53):
Yeah. I do want to say, just while we're on
the topic, we need to deal with Zaye Low, and
we need a group effort to unseat him because the
damage that is being done across industries is monumental and
will be felt for generations. And also I want to say,
there needs to be a word, like a long German

(23:14):
word for that type of guy. Yeah, what is the
word for like sort of streetwear guy, sort of fuck
boy guy. But that's also like really in a saccharin way,
so like performatively nice, and is also like clearly somehow
successful without having any talent, charm or charisma. And also

(23:34):
people somehow watch his stuff and people want to collaborate
with him, even though the open secret is that everyone
thinks he's annoying, Like what is the deal.

Speaker 2 (23:43):
It's so deeply confusing. I'm also having I'm struggling right
now because I'm trying to imagine what zay Loo looks
like and I'm only seeing the Hot Ones guy. I
like cannot picture Zaye low I'm oh, my brain is
just picturing Hot Ones guy.

Speaker 1 (23:57):
He's literally like I Hot Ones' guy's a little more
like there's something more authentic and nerdy about him, and
it was very like he really sort of made his
way on his own, Like I do think that was
a surprise hit that show. Yeah, whereas Zane Lowe, it
was so top down.

Speaker 2 (24:16):
Yeah, but I'm Also, I just want to say I'm
curious about I'm scared for Joker too, because I hear
that she's not even in it that much, and I'm
worried that really. Yeah, and I'm worried that it's gonna
be the worst thing it can be, which is boring. Huh,
because if Gaga's boring, I might have to jump off
a cliff. Yeah, but I hope the new music's exciting.

Speaker 1 (24:37):
I gotta say, it's like, I do think Gaga as
Joker is one of those things that's like criticism proof,
Like what are you going to say about it? That's insightful?
Like if you just have to like bang your head
against the wall until you are at approximately sixty five
percent brain capacity and go enjoy it at regal Essex.

Speaker 2 (24:55):
I mean the way that I'm so excited to see
that movie.

Speaker 1 (24:58):
Ugh, yeah, no, it'll be the monument.

Speaker 9 (25:03):
I sam Hi George loved the pod. I am calling
just because I have been recently doing a lot of ruminating,
specifically on a photo from Jemima Kirk, who plays Jessa
on HBO's Girls. There's a photo on her Instagram story

(25:25):
from like I don't know how long ago, in which
She's asked to give advice to unconfident women, and her
response is, I think you guys are thinking too much
about yourself to yourselves and that this has like unlocked
a whole situation for me specifically, and I've been thinking
about it. Like the question that I have, I guess

(25:49):
is like that may be like the secret, Like is
these straight men love through the world so easily because
they are just like not thinking critically about themselves. Yeah,
so I guess I have that question. And then also like,
do you agree that is the secret for unconfident women?

(26:11):
I also wanted to post the question like do you
have any advice for unconfident gay guys? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (26:19):
I love that.

Speaker 2 (26:20):
I mean, what an amazing question theory, and yeah, that
was that was really genius.

Speaker 5 (26:27):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (26:27):
I have one critique of that call, which is, do
not condescend to us by explaining who Jamia mckirkis. We
know who Jami.

Speaker 2 (26:35):
I did find that. I was like, hello, Hello.

Speaker 1 (26:38):
Do you know who you're dealing with here? Okay, I
want to hear your answer, and then I'm developing a theory.

Speaker 2 (26:44):
I think that is kind of the key. Sometimes this
is something sometimes when I'm feeling like particularly magnetic when
people are like paying attention to me, I'm sort of like,
what am I doing differently than normal? And I think
what I'm doing differently is like actually like just like
not like just sort of moving forward and being like
like being on self conscious and like, yes, when like

(27:08):
I feel like when I'm like like I feel like
it happens at work. If I'm like in a bad
mood and just sort of like I'm just gonna go
do this thing. That's when people are like, what's Sam
up to? Like it like really draws people because you're like, oh,
I'm just doing my own thing. Yeah. And it's not
because I'm like what am I doing? What should I do?
It's like because I'm like I just need to Yeah,
I'm being un self aware.

Speaker 1 (27:29):
Okay. So along those lines, this is my theory, which
is that at any given time, we are thinking of
ourselves as the subject and the object, and there's a
ratio like at any given point, you're like I am
seventy percent subject, Like seventy percent of my energy is
going into being the one who does, being the one
who is, and then the other thirty percent of my

(27:51):
energy is going to how am I perceived what is
being done to me? How am I reacting to what
is being done to me? And I almost am like,
there should be like an IQ test or like a
personality test type thing that measures what percentage subject and
what percent to object you are at any given time.

(28:13):
And I think we need to find the golden ratio
because I think that's what this is about.

Speaker 2 (28:16):
Wow, that's amazing.

Speaker 1 (28:19):
Isn't that? Wait?

Speaker 2 (28:19):
I literally just thought, Oh, I think that's really that's
really good.

Speaker 1 (28:23):
But I do think to this caller's point, straight men
do think of themselves more as subject, and anyone who
is in any kind of slightly less privileged position is
made to think of themselves as an object more. And
then even when they are quote unquote empowered, they are
like being empowered in response to the ways that they

(28:44):
have been objectified.

Speaker 2 (28:45):
Yeah, to me, the essential confidence straight man is like,
isn't someone that's like isn't like the jock necessarily, No,
It's like the person who like, you're at their house
and they just like get on the computer, and you're like.

Speaker 1 (28:58):
Yes, Sam, yes, because they are literally like I am
the subject. What I want to do now is get
on the computer. Or it's like the classic like, you know,
straight guy playing video games while other people watch, like
there is no they are not thinking of themselves as
something someone else's experience.

Speaker 2 (29:15):
Yeah. Yeah, it's very weird, and unfortunately that's also what
makes them addicting because you're like, oh my god, if
only you get them to pay attention to me, right,
that would be amazing.

Speaker 1 (29:27):
And so much of like reclamation for like queer people
or women or whatever is like here are the ways
they have been seen, they have been an object, and
now we are reclaiming those things. Yeah, and suddenly selfies
are empowerful.

Speaker 2 (29:42):
Damn. That's why do you have any advice for unconfident
gay guys?

Speaker 1 (29:47):
Oh, advice for unconfident gay guys. You know what, if
you're an unconfident gig guy, invite someone over to your
apartment and go on the computer because there is because
I get to you. The person will find it hot.
They'll be like what the hell, No, that's sky fucking.

Speaker 2 (30:04):
Rot's great advice that they will be addicted to you
for life.

Speaker 1 (30:10):
Yeah, but then also randomly be nice, like like, I
think what you have to do as a gig guy
is be really rude, but then randomly be nice to
one person and then everyone will see that and be like, oh, oh,
so it is possible, like if I act, if I
act in the right way, then he can be nice
to me too.

Speaker 2 (30:27):
Wow, it's like prison.

Speaker 1 (30:29):
Yeah, it's exactly like. So, okay, let's go to our
next question. Oh you know, I gotta support this one
because it is my old New Jersey area code.

Speaker 11 (30:43):
Whoa Hi, it's Shannon, a longtime listener for some caller.

Speaker 10 (30:49):
So I've been taking this comedy class.

Speaker 11 (30:52):
And I've gotten really curious about how some most nice
favorite comedians kind.

Speaker 5 (30:57):
Of learn their craft.

Speaker 8 (30:59):
So I was wondering if you guys could talk about
how you learned to.

Speaker 12 (31:03):
Write jokes, like did you.

Speaker 13 (31:04):
Take classes or did you have.

Speaker 12 (31:06):
Mentors or did you just like invent jokes for the
first time?

Speaker 10 (31:11):
And then kind.

Speaker 11 (31:12):
Of how did you like find your own voices within
whatever structure you learned. Maybe this was really boring it
inside baseball, but I was peer pressured by multiple.

Speaker 9 (31:25):
Discoordy stays do ask this questions?

Speaker 5 (31:27):
So here I am.

Speaker 13 (31:29):
Okay, that's all.

Speaker 2 (31:30):
I wow. First of all, thanks Shannon. A shout out
than Shannon. We've seen you, we hear you this. I
love I did my passics podcast this morning that was
entirely about like process. So I'm in such a self
indulgent state of mind, so I'm actually thrilled to talk

(31:52):
about this, Okay, go. I learned by going to open mics,
mostly I because I was an improv girlina I loved improv.
I thought I would never do stand up. I didn't
like stand up. I thought people that did stand up
were bad people. And I was like, but then improv
sucked in and I was like, okay, let's try it.

(32:14):
Let's try it. So I went I like committed. I
was like, I'm just gonna be bad at this for
a while, and that's okay. And so I went to
like just regularly like an eleven PM open mic at
the Creek in the Cave and would bomb and about
maybe like a month in, I started like having like
three jokes that worked, and then it's like okay, and

(32:36):
then I and then you can kind of see how
they work. I kind of I always say I'm self taught.
I always say I'm so I'm self taught, but I
feel like that's I just learned by going to MIC's
and trying. And then also you see how other people
do it. And you're like, oh, that's how that works. Yeah, definitely,
but that's how how about you?

Speaker 1 (32:58):
I took a class when I was in Boston. It
was taught by Maron Kagani, who is now has been,
in fact for many years, a comedian in New York.
He I signed up for this class not knowing anything
about him, and I was very lucky because he is gay.
He is gay and Iranian and has immigrant parents, so

(33:23):
I like there was enough. There was so much there
for me to relate to, which is so rare because
I think, you know, usually a stand up like a
comedy teacher, let's say, it used to be what I
imagine is either like sort of an improv bro like
a comedy bro, or sort of like an asymmetrical haircut
blue hair woman, both of which I can celebrate at

(33:44):
various times in my life. But I think I was
especially like that it was someone that I felt was
had similar life experiences as I did, and he was
really really helpful and really championed me during that and
later on I think initially introduced me to the people
at the comedy Studio, which was like the place that

(34:06):
I liked that ended up really performing a lot at
in Boston, and I will say after the class was over,
I was very much like okay, like time to hit
the ground rinning. And then you sort of like have
this come down of realizing taking a two week class
is not enough, Like you actually do have to bomb repeatedly.
You have to do extremely poorly, and you have to

(34:27):
go to open mics every night in order to like
understand how a joke works. And just because you're funny
in person or online, it does not mean that it's
going to work on the stage. Yeah, but I do
really credit him with like I would say, because I
took that class, I think it sort of covered what
I would have learned organically and let's say three months,

(34:47):
you know what I mean, Like just like the things
you would naturally internalize by seeing other people do it.
I was just like taught because he was a good
because he was a good teacher.

Speaker 2 (34:56):
Yeah, And how did you find your voice in the
frame work?

Speaker 1 (35:00):
Oh? How do I find my voice in the framework?
You can't just ask a girl how she found her
voice in the asked.

Speaker 2 (35:06):
I'm just saying, let's.

Speaker 1 (35:07):
See, Yeah, I don't know. I think being in Boston
really helped because I was very new to the city,
so I felt different and that helped me be like
I actually think if I had started in Brooklyn, I
would be like stressed about differentiating myself and I'd be like,
oh god, I'm like one out of I'm like a

(35:27):
small fish in a big pond, and there's all these
gay guys that are like very similar to me, and
how do I stand, you know, sort of stand up,
stand out? And I actually just because it was very
common that I was like the only gay person of
any kind on a lineup or at the time, because
I was like twenty four, like I was often young

(35:48):
compared to other people, so that set me apart. Like
I just I didn't feel like I needed to try
super hard to be different, and I think that helped
a lot. And then by the time I moved to
New York, I like knew a little more who I was.

Speaker 2 (36:02):
Well, I'd like to dispel some rumors. Not there weren't
that many gay comedians when I was starting. It was
me and Joel and Julio at the Damn Pine Box
mic on Wednesdays, and so it was very easy to differentiate.

Speaker 1 (36:18):
No sure, sure, sure, sure, But.

Speaker 2 (36:21):
I feel like for me, it was about I think
it was helpful to have to like find a the
squad in Brooklyn where it was like very like I
always credit like like River Ramirez had this show called
Do Something and it was like every Sunday and they

(36:42):
would do an open mic afterwards that was like very loose,
very character like it could be literally whatever you wanted
and there was a DJ there that would like riff
alongside you, and it was truly like the most experimental
time in my life in a fun way. And I
like feeling I really found myself there because like you
could do normal jokes, but then you can also just

(37:02):
like fully riff, Like I would like riff riff and
the DJ would like make little sound effects and I
would riff with the DJ, and I was like, this
is like it's still what my favorite thing to do is.
And I'm like and I really got like good at
it there of just like sort of being loose and
totally and having fun. And I feel like that like
we all had like a similar goal but a different

(37:23):
approach to it of like experimental I don't know, but
still with like traditional jokes and stuff.

Speaker 1 (37:30):
Yeah. Also, I think that's a good point because a
lot of people will tell you like you have to
leave your comfort zone and always like go to all
these different mics and it'll be like in the middle
of nowhere and you won't know anyone, but you still
have to make them laugh, which is true to some extent.
But finding that one space that you feel like safe
and comfortable to experiment is to me the most important thing.

(37:51):
Like whether that's like a weekly like a weekly mic
that you know you will know people at and people
will be like giving you the benefit with a doubt,
Like obviously that can't be your entire life because you
do have to leave your comfort zone. But that's like
where you work on stuff. It's almost like you should
work on stuff there and then test it out in harder.

Speaker 2 (38:10):
Yeah, totally, there's a little, a little balance. It's good
to have a little not your people, but it's also
great to have your people.

Speaker 1 (38:17):
Yeah, it sure, all right.

Speaker 8 (38:20):
Next call Hello, I'm wondering your thoughts on what the
gates or straightst board game?

Speaker 9 (38:28):
Thank you?

Speaker 10 (38:29):
Fine?

Speaker 1 (38:30):
Oh my god, look at that laugh.

Speaker 2 (38:31):
I love that laugh.

Speaker 1 (38:33):
Everyone's having such a good time. I I mean, I'm
trying to not be hyper obvious.

Speaker 2 (38:39):
Of course.

Speaker 1 (38:40):
My instinct is Monopoly is the straightest. It's literally like
capitalism the world.

Speaker 2 (38:45):
And I was gonna say Settlers the Katan is the straightest.
It's like you're literally like settling the land.

Speaker 1 (38:49):
Yeah, no, you're right, you're right. No, that's very true. Okay,
so Settlers of Katan and Monopoly are tied for straightest. Yeah,
we're not board game. Uh, sort of efficionados here, So
I'm really only thinking about the most popular ones.

Speaker 2 (39:08):
I do think maybe like Pictionary is kind of gay.
You're like one hundred arts. There's performance, there's stress.

Speaker 1 (39:18):
Yeah, no, I think Pictionary is a great example. It's
also playing with the forum because you're like, oh, a
board game, everyone's sitting down and doing the board. But
with Pictionary, it's like, well what if we were performing?

Speaker 2 (39:29):
Yeah, totally. Scrabble has something LGBTQ plus about it.

Speaker 1 (39:34):
Well, it's literally performing intellectualism. It's like how it's literally
how many words? Do you know? It's like it's a
competition for who is the most oscar wild.

Speaker 2 (39:43):
Yeah no, that's that's I've always hated scrabble and people
out scrabble. I'm like, just I believe you. I believe
that you're smart.

Speaker 1 (39:49):
Yeah totally, Okay, great, next question.

Speaker 14 (39:56):
Hi, gay guys.

Speaker 12 (39:58):
We we we went to our bur loved Brooklyn bar
singers the other day and stumbled upon many of our
mutuals who were there for a straight couples going away party,
all of whom were straight and there for the first time.

Speaker 14 (40:16):
So there was lots of back and forth going on
among our table as to whether or not this is
okay because we have brought a straight friend or two
there many times. But I was just wondering, what do
you think of these singers first timers like oggling at
the porn on the screens and the poppers and the
venue machine, and what is the straight etiquette for singers

(40:39):
in particular?

Speaker 2 (40:41):
In I okay, the party element is what is sticking
to me where I'm like, obviously straight people can come
to singers. I do think if you're a straight couple
and you're having a going away party, that's going to
be primarily straight people, like just go to a different
bar from bar, but not in like it's not like

(41:01):
a moral thing. It's more just like it just it's
like annoying.

Speaker 1 (41:06):
It's like, yeah, and guess what it is?

Speaker 2 (41:07):
A more ha ha.

Speaker 1 (41:12):
I will say I completely agree that hosting a party
there as a straight person. Well, I'll say this, Singers
technically is not a gay bar. Singers is not like
Marie's Crisis. What do you mean by that it has
been I don't think Singers is like listed as a
gay bar on Google Match? Are you not that Google

(41:34):
is that? I'm not the Google is the arbiter of
what'sca and what's not, obviously, But I don't think it
was founded as that explicitly. And I actually almost think
because of that, it's more that's like why it's weirdly
more inclusive.

Speaker 2 (41:49):
But there's toppers in the vending machine, but.

Speaker 1 (41:52):
That's cause it's like owned by gay people.

Speaker 2 (41:56):
This is hard for me to agree with. I'm like
what I say, Yeah, I'm like it's.

Speaker 1 (42:01):
I mean, I'm willing to by default it essentially is,
and so we can we can like start from there.
But I just mean, like, do you know what I mean? Like,
there is a certain kind of thing that's like rainbow
flag gay bar. Sure, Sure, it's a very particular type
of thing. There's also more specific ones, like a lesbian bar.

Speaker 2 (42:18):
Sure, this is more like fluid a leather bar.

Speaker 1 (42:21):
Like Singers is basically just like all the like it's
literally Emma Watson in Perks of being a wallflower going
Welcome to the Island of Misfit Toys. That's suckers.

Speaker 2 (42:33):
Oh my god, you're one hundred percent right. Okay, I
know what you mean. I know what you're saying. Though
I hear what you're saying.

Speaker 1 (42:39):
I do find it interesting the experience of seeing otherwise
very progressive straight people with so many gay friends actually
be shocked at something that is especially gay, like this
person describing like straight people going to a going away
party and then suddenly seeing penetrative gay porn on the screens.

(42:59):
That is heaven to That is so funny And it's
actually like really heartwarming to me that like we can
still have differences.

Speaker 2 (43:06):
No, it is really nice. I mean I was even
thinking that while I was at the Eagle last night,
of course with my chosen family, and I was like,
this is I actually couldn't bring someone like I couldn't
bring like a random straight guy here, Like he would
be like this is weird, and I'm like, that's kind
of fun, like we still have it.

Speaker 1 (43:26):
I No, I agree, and I really I just I
you have to hold those moments in your heart and
say thank you. Yeah, and you have to say thank.

Speaker 2 (43:36):
You New York, Thank you New York.

Speaker 10 (43:38):
All right, next call Hi Davis. I just have one
question in two parts. It's what are you reading this fall?
And who would you like to read this fall?

Speaker 2 (43:50):
Okay, love y'all, fye, okay, okay. I'm I started this
in the summer and I've been going slow. But I
picked up another Ursula.

Speaker 1 (44:03):
You love Ursula, KYLEA.

Speaker 2 (44:05):
I give myself an Ursula every summer. I'm reading the
word for world is forest and I'm almost at the end.

Speaker 1 (44:14):
Damn is it good?

Speaker 2 (44:16):
It is good? Sort of classic ursula. You better believe
this sci fi has uh some commentary on our society.

Speaker 1 (44:28):
You better believe that, sweetheart.

Speaker 2 (44:32):
But no, it's very it's good. I'm excited for the
end to see what the vibe is.

Speaker 1 (44:37):
You'll never believe this what. I also read a book
by a woman named Ursula m h. I read this
book called ex Wife, which was a book in like
the twenties, I believe, and it was reissued last year,
a couple of years ago, and it is about a
woman going through a divorce in the twenties. But when

(44:58):
I tell you that, it might as well have been
re and last week I was having the time of
my life. I said, this Chika is ready to be empowered.
She is ready to become, to turn herself from an
object into a subject, and she is writing about it
for an audience of primarily gay men and very troubled
women who read the New York Review of Books. So

(45:18):
I highly recommended. Her name is Ursula. You know, I'm
gonna say parrot, even though there is a slight chance
it is French. I'm going to go ahead and pronounce
it in the English language parrot.

Speaker 2 (45:29):
Wow I.

Speaker 1 (45:31):
And so I read that. I also, I have to say,
read our friend Dan de Dario's book that has not
come out yet, but you know, we were some coffee,
let's be honest, and I have to say I loved it.
I was like so invested. It is about five actresses
nominated for Best Actress at the Oscars, and you follow

(45:53):
each of their trajectory and it goes it sort of
cycles through them, so each chapter is about a different one,
and then you know, you start the cycle again. And
there was something so fun about having fictional fictional celebrities
to stand and to make like little narratives about and
then since then whenever like I saw Meryl Streep wearing

(46:15):
a certain outfit and then my mind I was like,
she was being so adre Benedict right now, like that
she's so desperate when she's wearing that pink pantsuit, and
so you know, shout out to that when it comes out.
And I want to say, as I already mentioned on
the podcast, I am, for whatever reason, deciding to read
in twenty twenty four on Beauty by Zadi Smith. I

(46:38):
am in the process of reading it. And my answer
to what I want to read this fall is that
I finally want to sit down and read Middle March,
which I've never read. So I will keep everyone posted. Sam,
what do you want to read?

Speaker 2 (46:50):
Well, I did get another another Joan Diddy and to
continue my California journey, which one White album.

Speaker 1 (46:58):
Oh that's great. That's the one I read. I mean,
I think I had read it when I was younger,
but that's the one I read right after she died,
when I was like, I need to pay tribute.

Speaker 2 (47:06):
Yeah, So I'm excited. I'm excited to feel feel feel Cali,
and I want to read Dan's book too. I'm excited
to read Great.

Speaker 1 (47:15):
It's really good. Okay, Sam, this one's for you. Are ready?

Speaker 13 (47:19):
Oh hi George? H Sam, Love you guys. My question
is for Sam. Sam. I was wondering if after watching
George so shekly tie the knot if you think you
and shall ever do the damn thing? Love you guys.

Speaker 15 (47:36):
Bye.

Speaker 2 (47:39):
Yeah, I think no, we are, we are, we are.
We're going to try to figure it out, but we
are being weird about it. And now that, especially now
that all the hulla balloo the move is settled, I

(48:01):
think we're going to try to make a plan now,
which is cool, but I don't even honey, I don't
know where to start, and I don't you know, as
we all know, this our descent into going from cool

(48:22):
gay guys to really uncool gay guys is like it's
happening so rapidly, and it's like actually very difficult.

Speaker 1 (48:32):
You know that like metaphor of like, you know, you
boil a fraud, you know, Yeah, it doesn't realize it's
being boiled until it's dead. That is how I feel
about becoming uncool and identifying as gen X.

Speaker 2 (48:43):
Yeah, it's because I'm still being like, can we get
married without getting engaged? Like is there a way to
do it.

Speaker 1 (48:52):
Wait, are you still so you still don't consider yourself engaged? Interesting,
you have decided, Just to be clear, you have decided
you're getting married, but you are not engaged. Correct, Okay,
that's fair. Why didn't I think of that? I guess
I didn't know that was an option. I just thought
I had to part of the hazing process is that

(49:12):
I had to go through this nine month period of
having to say the word fiance or having to say
the word engage. But I guess you could just not
do that.

Speaker 2 (49:20):
I'm trying to skip that part. I'm trying to see.

Speaker 1 (49:22):
Yeah, okay, Well, first of all, I love watching squirm
when you're when you're describing how you want to get
married but you don't know how.

Speaker 2 (49:31):
Yeah, it's tough.

Speaker 1 (49:32):
I mean, I do think for you, in your defense,
it is tough to even pick like a location right
now because you are It would be sort of random
to do it in Los Angeles, but that's also where
you live, and it would be easier. I think doing
it in Michigan would be a pretty big destination for people. Yeah,

(49:53):
that's hard to get a lot to ask. Yeah, and
then coming back to New York would of course be hard.

Speaker 2 (50:00):
Yeah, so I kind of will win.

Speaker 1 (50:02):
Yeah, best of the next question.

Speaker 6 (50:05):
Hello, George and Sam, I'm calling in. My name is
Ryan Sickles at Ryan Sickle's major celeb on Instagram.

Speaker 5 (50:13):
Go follow me.

Speaker 1 (50:13):
I'm incredible, shout out.

Speaker 6 (50:15):
I'm wondering what you think of the epidemic that's going
on right now of beautiful women dating the ugliest both
panous men, repulsive personality, just pit vipers.

Speaker 5 (50:29):
What do you think of.

Speaker 6 (50:31):
That epidemic going on of them getting together? So it's
really become a troublesome point in mind life where every
beautiful woman I know I'm dating the worst person in
the worst made in America. It's truly psychotic.

Speaker 16 (50:43):
Let me know, I would die for you, right wowweet sweet, Okay,
I'm like, okay, the bad personality is a is a
line in the sand that I don't condone and I don't.

Speaker 2 (50:56):
Celebrate, but they're part of the man can be a little.

Speaker 1 (51:01):
Ugly, That's like exactly, that's what it is.

Speaker 2 (51:03):
Men are supposed to be a little ugly. That's what's
hot about them. Ugly is hot for men, yes, because
it's like, are they pulling off ugly? And if you
can pull off ugly, you're so hot.

Speaker 1 (51:13):
It's really tragic because it just adds to the further
objectification of women, like in our society, women have to
be hot and men have to be ugly.

Speaker 2 (51:22):
It's it's actually crazy.

Speaker 1 (51:24):
It is like that is the foundation that we start
on and it is a losing battle from there, and
I don't really know what way out of it we have.

Speaker 2 (51:37):
There's no way out. The only way is.

Speaker 1 (51:39):
Because guess what if yours. If you start, sorry, if
you start forcing beauty standards on men, they're gonna look worse.
Imagine a man that's like super botoxed out and is
wearing makeup and is like has like chiseled a twelve pack.
It's completely unsexual to me.

Speaker 2 (51:56):
Very very unsexual. I mean, welcome to la literally.

Speaker 1 (52:01):
I well, that's why no one has sex there.

Speaker 2 (52:03):
Quite frankly. The bad personality is tough when someone when
like a friend, is dating someone that does have a
bad personality. I really don't know how to deal with that.
It's one of life's greatest questions because it happens so
often and there's genuinely nothing you can do because if
you're like, break up with him, he sucks, they'll just
like stop talking to you. Yeah, and you just kind

(52:24):
of have to let it run its course. And yeah,
but at least let them be physically ugly.

Speaker 1 (52:31):
I know they have to be physically ugly. You just
have to hope that they're the kind of physically ugly
that has had to develop a personality in response to that,
and not the kind of physically ugly that has had
to develop a career only in response to that.

Speaker 2 (52:45):
Yeah, damn, that's smart, that's good intel.

Speaker 1 (52:48):
But you know, I have to say that epidemic of
that happening is not going to end anytime soon. So
I say, put that smile on your face when you
get lunch with your girls, and just be prepared to
say I love that ring, it's so beautiful.

Speaker 2 (53:03):
And think about the amazing speech you can give at
the wedding. When I first met Ryan, I said, this
guy is ugly and so is his personality. But after
we went to Mexico together, I realized there's more to
him than.

Speaker 1 (53:17):
Shitty opinions exactly. But now that they're married, there's no
way around They're getting married.

Speaker 2 (53:23):
And I love love perfect.

Speaker 1 (53:25):
Wow, write that down, Okay. Oh this is from one
of our favorite Discordistas.

Speaker 17 (53:33):
Hi, George and Sam, Sam and George.

Speaker 3 (53:35):
This is a umble cat.

Speaker 17 (53:38):
I am calling because although it is really fucked up
when childless people give unsolicited parenting advice, here I am
the listing someum, so please go wild. Know that I
speak for the entire parenting community and say that no

(54:00):
one will be offended when you give your hot tips,
tricks and best ideas for raising children in New York
or LA.

Speaker 2 (54:16):
Thank you, damn. Shout out to bumblecat, shout out to
discreditive umblecat George parenting advice. You know we have permission.

Speaker 1 (54:28):
I know it's hard. First of all, no screens until
age sixteen.

Speaker 2 (54:36):
You can have a screen at the moment you can
drive a car.

Speaker 1 (54:39):
At the moment you can drive a car, You're gonna
have a.

Speaker 2 (54:40):
Screen, because how are you gonna drive if you can't
text and drive?

Speaker 1 (54:42):
No social media a huge ernest piece of parenting advice.
No homeschooling. I mean say that, no homeschooling.

Speaker 2 (54:52):
Get them into a school.

Speaker 1 (54:54):
Get them into a school. I think, teach them about
acts of generosity and community. I don't want to the
community organizing, but like acts of community early on, whether
that's find some alternative to church like have a thing
where they see, even if it's taking them to the

(55:15):
farmer's market, they have to see people acting in community.

Speaker 2 (55:18):
Yeah, okay, no, I like that.

Speaker 1 (55:19):
Well, if you're in New York and LA. A huge
piece of advice that I have is have so much money.
Just have endless amounts of money, Have secret kinds of
money that no one knows where they come from.

Speaker 2 (55:30):
Have like a normal job, but like have nicer things
than everyone else.

Speaker 1 (55:33):
Yeah, and no one knows how potentially various bank accounts
in shadowy places like Switzerland or the Maldives. Just a
lot of money, and wear really expensive clothes and just
always look fabulous even though it's sort of unclear what

(55:54):
you do. And so that's a big one, I think.
More to the point, you know, don't try to make
it work with bringing kids to places they don't belong,
Like you have to just sacrifice it and be like
one parent stays home with the kids. One not that
everyone always has two parents, but assuming you have two parents,
parents three with the kids. Some people have three and

(56:16):
the other person goes out. Also like be in community
with other parents and have like sort of way, you know,
a schedule where certain like this couple baby sits the
kid when you go out, and you babysit their kid
when they go out. Basically find ways to cosplay not
having kids for hours at a time every week.

Speaker 2 (56:37):
Yeah, I have a question about parenting. Okay, do you
think it's more like I remember I hated swim team.
I was on swim team my whole life, and I
hated it the entire time, maybe until I was about
like sixteen that I was good at swimming, and I
was like, Okay, now I like it, but what's what's
your stance on making kids do stuff they don't want

(56:58):
to do?

Speaker 1 (56:59):
Because this is one of the hardest things.

Speaker 2 (57:01):
Because now I'm actually extremely grateful that I'm really good
at swimming, and swimming is like like being in the
water is one of the most important things to me,
but I hate it the whole time.

Speaker 1 (57:09):
This is one of the hardest things. I almost think
once again, just like there needs to be a golden
ratio between being a subject and an object. There needs
to be a golden ratio between being forced to do
things you don't want to do and having your voice heard. Yeah,
and I'm literally like the golden the people who know
the golden ratio. Are people exactly like me who have
parents that were immigrants, but they themselves are not immigrants.

(57:32):
It's like you have to basically combine the mentality of
a stricter parent with the mentality of just like one
of those like New York parents that lets their kids
just like paint in crayon on a work of art
at the Guggenheim and is like, she's creative. Like you
have to just combine those two and find the right
fifty to fifty. I think I almost maybe fifty to

(57:53):
fifty is the right ratio. Maybe it's like every second
time that a kid doesn't want to do something, you
force them to do it.

Speaker 2 (57:58):
Yeah, that's nice. I think that's good.

Speaker 1 (58:01):
Okay, all right, oh this is fun.

Speaker 5 (58:04):
Hi Sam and George?

Speaker 2 (58:06):
Did you two?

Speaker 15 (58:07):
We're in a Preaky Friday type situation where you swapped
bodies for twenty four hours?

Speaker 5 (58:12):
What would you do?

Speaker 10 (58:14):
Thanks?

Speaker 1 (58:16):
Okay, what would we do? Huh?

Speaker 2 (58:23):
I have an answer?

Speaker 1 (58:24):
Okay, what is it?

Speaker 2 (58:25):
I'd uh, I'd take that hole for a spin. You
are crazy and say, let's see this hole. Let's go,
let's go for a spin. See how the other half?

Speaker 1 (58:43):
Oh my god, well, well I'm going to take yours
for a spin.

Speaker 2 (58:47):
Well, you're not gonna like it. You're gonna say, damn,
this is much harder.

Speaker 7 (58:51):
Damn.

Speaker 1 (58:52):
Yeah, I mean it is true that I'm better at
it than you are. Let me take this damn hole
for a s Then what would I do? I mean,
I'm trying to think. Okay, so we found something my
body does better than yours. What would I do if
I were in your shoes?

Speaker 11 (59:13):
Oh?

Speaker 1 (59:14):
I know what I would do. I would like, very
lightly fuck with all your coworkers, Like I would go
to work, but then do really weird, like very small
weird things, like I would bring fish and try and
microwave it for lunch. Or I would like I would like,
you'd sulely my reputation, yeah. Or I would like randomly
just constantly name drop like I would. I would be

(59:37):
like I was with Olivia Wilde last night and she
is trying to get this deal closed, and when I
tell you that Sony is absolutely useless, like it's always
something and she's a really really smart writer, like people
don't really understand that, And I would just do that,
like one after the other. I would start name dropping
random celebrities to like people you like at work.

Speaker 2 (59:57):
I mean, to be honest, that's like one degree away
from what I really I am. Like whenever I see
a celebrity, I'm like, ah, like, I'm like, you wouldn't
believe it? Is that a party? In choice of bombs there,
Like I can't not.

Speaker 1 (01:00:07):
I mean literally a man Jessica Biel, Hey, Trendie does
know what I'm talking about.

Speaker 2 (01:00:11):
Yeah, it's hard not to.

Speaker 1 (01:00:12):
Okay, great, perfect answers, I think for both. All Right,
this one, this one is funny.

Speaker 15 (01:00:18):
Okay, Hi, George and Sam, this is a time sensitive question.
Next week in my partner and I are going to
a previous Thirds wedding.

Speaker 5 (01:00:28):
So he and his new.

Speaker 15 (01:00:29):
Partner are very homonormative, which I find is basically gay straight.
So for example, their house theme is beijed Alagonza. Anyways,
I'm asking this question anonymously because the new partner doesn't
know that they use to fuck slash date and I'm

(01:00:50):
really struggling to figure out what do I get a
previous third in a now homonormative relationship as a wedding gift? Anyways,
thank you so much.

Speaker 1 (01:01:01):
By Okay, this person is going to a former Thirds
wedding and the question, which is iconic, is what gift
to get for the former third's wedding? Do you have
any idea?

Speaker 2 (01:01:14):
Yeah, get them like a fancy coffee maker.

Speaker 1 (01:01:17):
I feel like, oh, that's a really good idea.

Speaker 2 (01:01:19):
I mean, if you're going for like an espresso machine,
I mean it's they're basic. You can get them that.
It's it. Also, Yeah, I'm sort of like, why go
not to.

Speaker 1 (01:01:32):
Be totally I mean, I think all we know about
this person is that they are a former third, but
you know, it might be that they're also close friend,
true true, true, Like they're there, they also have a
good relationship. I would say my advice would be get
something really normal, but then write a little quip in

(01:01:53):
the card. Hmm, like get an espresso machine and be like,
think of me every third espresso you make.

Speaker 2 (01:02:04):
Damn, you're like the joker. I love that.

Speaker 1 (01:02:07):
Yeah, I think west with them a little bit. Don't
get a gag gift. I think that is rude, Like,
don't get like a giant vibrating dildo. Yeah, get an
expresso machine. Okay, all right, next question.

Speaker 5 (01:02:21):
Hi Sam and George. I was just wondering, but Halloween
fast approaching? What scares you?

Speaker 10 (01:02:27):
Thanks?

Speaker 1 (01:02:28):
Guys, I do want to say, this is the same
person that sent the Freaky Friday message. I just checked
and it's the same number two. So apologies to other
people whose calls are not being played because we had
to play two calls from the same person. What scares you, hypocrisy?

Speaker 2 (01:02:45):
The Trump.

Speaker 1 (01:02:48):
Hello waves around manically, gestures wildures wildly.

Speaker 2 (01:02:55):
Hello, wake up people trying to vote.

Speaker 1 (01:02:58):
I don't know, rising fascism, the end of democracy.

Speaker 2 (01:03:02):
Maybe gestures around to all of this.

Speaker 1 (01:03:07):
So I guess all of this is normal.

Speaker 2 (01:03:12):
I you know, I've got some classics. I heights. I'm
not a big on.

Speaker 1 (01:03:21):
Birds.

Speaker 2 (01:03:22):
I'm not I don't love fish. I think I fish
can really ruin my experience in the water. If I
see too many of them, it makes me want to leave.
And that's all you can really think of, How about you?

Speaker 1 (01:03:40):
I would say, the vastness of the ocean really yeah,
Like there is a poster for the Disney film Atlantis
The Last Empire that is just the letter A but
in a really really violent ocean, and that used to
really scare me when I saw it at the movie
theaters when I was a kid. And I really love

(01:04:01):
the beach. I traveled on by boat pretty often when
I am home for the summers, and I hate when
there's too much you know, turbulence on a boat.

Speaker 2 (01:04:15):
Yeah, boats are.

Speaker 1 (01:04:15):
And it's also like there's something scary to me about
something as like I would say so calming as the water.
I mean, to be by a beach when the water
is calm is literally meditation. The fact that it can
turn in one second and kill you. I mean, if
that's not a metaphor for life, then I don't know whether.

Speaker 2 (01:04:37):
I have this thing about the ocean, like I do
like watching sort of stories about people who get you know,
their boat crashes and they're stuck floating for days or
like whatever, like sort of perilous moments in the ocean,
and I'm there's something in me where I'm like i'd live,
Like there's something where I'm not afraid of the ocean
because I'm like, I know I could live. And it's

(01:05:00):
and I'm like, okay, so it's fifty miles a shore,
I can swim that. And it's like, no, you can't,
But like in my mind, I'm like, I'd make it.
I'd make it.

Speaker 1 (01:05:06):
Well, that's sort of how I feel about jumping from
like jumping off a bridge. I'm like, well, let's watch
like I would just like die totally.

Speaker 2 (01:05:15):
I'm like, just like hold tight.

Speaker 1 (01:05:18):
Okay, ooh, there are some good ones coming up.

Speaker 5 (01:05:20):
All right, Hi, my name is Connor.

Speaker 18 (01:05:22):
I'm calling in from Washington, DC. Love the show, come
back soon, okay. And here's my question, what does it
mean to you to be a man? When you hear
that question, do you immediately really rise and dismiss it
because of the premise of the question, or just being

(01:05:43):
a man mean something to you? And how would you
answer it?

Speaker 7 (01:05:48):
Okay, that's it.

Speaker 2 (01:05:50):
Wow, this is an interesting one. I will say both
in a sort of before the comment about like do
you roll your eyes? We both sort of hopped up,
not roll our eyes, but sort of in shock.

Speaker 1 (01:06:00):
Well, it's one of those things you don't want to
grapple with.

Speaker 2 (01:06:03):
You don't want to grapple with. And it's almost like
when people are like, what's the meaning of life and
you're like, what do you mean? Like it's life? Isn't
a question? Like there's no meaning, there's not there's no translation.

Speaker 1 (01:06:14):
It's also difficult to answer it in a non cliche
way in these times. I don't want to be self
flagellating and be like you know, of course it comes
with privileges that I'm aware of, and I try to
make space.

Speaker 2 (01:06:25):
In this house we believe yea.

Speaker 1 (01:06:27):
In this house, we believe that being a man means
staying silent and letting the women do the talking unless
they don't want to, in which case we step up
as men.

Speaker 2 (01:06:37):
Yeah, what does it mean to be a man? I
have no idea. What does that even mean? You know?

Speaker 1 (01:06:42):
What's right? Well, here's the thing. It's almost like I
very much relate to the idea of being a gay man,
and that is like, well, there's history, there's cultural yes,
So I'm like, is there a way to separate the two, Like,
do I relate to the identity of man separate from
the identity of game a man? I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:07:03):
I can't tell. I mean, I like sometimes with like
my clothes and the whole Americana thing.

Speaker 1 (01:07:16):
Hmmm, that's true.

Speaker 2 (01:07:18):
I feel like a certain like it feels foreign, but
in a way that feels fun Like it's almost like
when like like it's like putting on a dress, but
a man dress, but a man dress, and it's like
because it doesn't it's not like, oh, this is every day.

(01:07:39):
It's like I'm feeling special in a way that I
don't know what that is.

Speaker 1 (01:07:46):
Yeah, I feel like I had a little bit of
that when I was planning the wedding, where I was like,
at every given point we basically had to do the
groom rather than the bride thing. Like it's like, we're
not gonna wear a veil, Like we're going shopping for
groom suits. We are having little boutonneires with like flowers

(01:08:08):
on them.

Speaker 9 (01:08:09):
We are.

Speaker 1 (01:08:11):
I don't know, making like we're very aware of things
not looking too frilly, even like the party favors and
all that stuff. And it was an interesting experience to
always ultimately gravitate towards the more masculine thing than the
more feminine thing. Like there was not a single thing
at the wedding that I mean, other than like the

(01:08:33):
music and the guests, There's not a single thing that
was like that played with gender in anyway. Yeah, And
I don't know, I wonder what that means. In my mind.
I'm like, oh, we're keeping a classic and that is
the most like chic thing you can do. But then
are we upholding the very institutions.

Speaker 2 (01:08:58):
That are a rise of fascism.

Speaker 1 (01:09:01):
Rise of fascism a microcosm of the rest of the world.
But the best I think my version of your Americana
thing is that I genuinely love wearing a suit, like
to wear a suit tailor to your body, with a
beautiful tie that you or like I love. I love

(01:09:23):
tying my own tie because it's something that you like
grow up seeing your dad do or something, and every
time you do it, you're like, look at me, I'm
a man.

Speaker 2 (01:09:31):
That's kind of how I feel about shaving. Yeah, exactly,
Like there's nothing I don't even I have like an
electric razor, and I'm actually robbing myself of like I've
always wanted to be the guy with like shaving cream
on his face, like in the shower in morning, and
I'm like, well, I ever, that to me is like
the peak of masculinity, and I'm like, I'm not ready yet.

Speaker 1 (01:09:50):
I actually think when I grew out my beard. I
grew out my beard after my big breakup in like
twenty eighteen, and I thought it was going to be
sort of a post breakup thing, and then now many
years later, I still have it, and that was almost
like after rejecting so much of masculinity that was like

(01:10:11):
a way, a little baby step back in where I
was like, oh, look at me, I can have a
beer and be gay.

Speaker 2 (01:10:21):
So I don't know, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:10:23):
I think we have a complicated and ambivalent and at
times ambivalent relationship with being men. But I certainly don't
think we can say we don't think about it at all.

Speaker 2 (01:10:33):
No, I think we're we're almost like there's like a
removal where we're like, yeah, like trying to look at
it from a zoomed out place, but then we but
are not entirely I don't know what that means.

Speaker 1 (01:10:47):
And listen. I sometimes I think I'm past, you know,
doing straight voice on the phone when someone calls your family,
you know what I mean, Like when someone calls the
home phone and you're answering, you're like, uh, hello, no,
my mom's not here in all your thirteen Like, I
think I'm past that, And then sometimes guess what, I
find myself still doing it. Sometimes you'll suddenly meet a man,

(01:11:10):
like a boyfriend of a friend of yours, or something
that is so oppressively manly that you're like, well I
have to keep up.

Speaker 2 (01:11:19):
Yeah. Yeah, Sometimes I'm like I don't even know what
my real voice is anymore, but because my voice definitely
changes also when I'm around you know, the Chicas. When
it's like when we're all at singers, I sound different.

Speaker 1 (01:11:33):
Yeah, but knowing whatever, whatever, Guess what gender is a performance?
And I made that up so you can write that down.
That's smart, right, Next question, Hi, George.

Speaker 13 (01:11:44):
And Sam, I just want to ask do you think
that chaplorone has Reached's past?

Speaker 2 (01:11:50):
Thanks so much, Sam, and this is all you Well,
the thing is she was always at Lizzo's Pass. It's
just which direction did she go?

Speaker 9 (01:11:58):
Like?

Speaker 1 (01:11:58):
But but do you think chosen the direction? Because I
sort of think no. And that's what's so stressful about
this moment is that there's this extended period of time
where she's at the pass and she's like not doing it,
not picking.

Speaker 2 (01:12:12):
Yeah, No, I think I think you're right. I think
there's an internal internal struggle because I think both both
ways don't look good to her. It's a very lotr
you know.

Speaker 1 (01:12:24):
And for anyone who does know Lizo's Pass, Sam, would
you like to explain O.

Speaker 2 (01:12:27):
Lizzo's Pass is that place where when you get really famous,
like quickly and you're like sort of indie famous, but
then you're at a point where you could be even bigger,
and you're like, but right now, do you like, if
you're at Lizo's Pass, It's like, which direction do you go?
Do you go like the Lizo route and sort of
become like target songs, or do you go like f

(01:12:50):
kaka Twigs and stay true.

Speaker 1 (01:12:52):
And recommit to your alternates. And you're like, Okay, I'll
just make money doing fashion ab and like randomly an
ad for Google Glass. But that's not going to affect
my indie cred because my music is going to stay
indie and it's going to be listened to by approximately
thirteen gay guys who all have borderline personality disorder.

Speaker 2 (01:13:12):
And I'm one of them. Yeah, I really. And because
there was a point that people forget that Lizzo was like.

Speaker 1 (01:13:20):
Cool cool, Lizo was cool, and she was at Lizzo's.

Speaker 2 (01:13:25):
Past, she was at Lisso's Pass, and she took she
chose herd, she chose target. And now Chapel has, you know,
climbed the mountain and she's at Lisso's Pass as well.

Speaker 1 (01:13:34):
What do you think Phoebe Bridges chose this?

Speaker 2 (01:13:37):
I think it's going to depend on the next album.

Speaker 1 (01:13:39):
Okay, I agree, because I think there's a way she
could go full poppy on the next album and it
would be kind of shocking.

Speaker 2 (01:13:45):
Yeah. I mean, I'm grateful that she's like been silent
for like the last nine months. Is she same, because
just because it's I think it's a good it shows
a good like understand of the past. And she's like, yeah,
I don't want to take the wrong path. I need
to be quiet.

Speaker 7 (01:14:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:14:07):
Well, good for her, Yeah, good for Phoebe Bridgers. And
I just want to say to Chapel, you know, take
some time to journal.

Speaker 2 (01:14:18):
I want to say, don't fall for it, Like exactly this,
all of this is fake. Everyone being mad at you
is fake. Everyone defending you as fake. Like the whole
thing is just whole thing is invented to have people
have something to tweet about.

Speaker 1 (01:14:32):
You are better than this. You are a great songwriter.
You are talented beyond your years. And in the words
of Fiona Apple, this world is bullshit.

Speaker 2 (01:14:42):
This world is bullshit, and like the more you can
ignore it, Like the way that I've been watching all
this unfold and just been like, wait, none of this matters.

Speaker 1 (01:14:50):
I feel none of this matter.

Speaker 2 (01:14:51):
Absolutely nothing towards any of this, and I wish, I
hope that she is able to see it and sort
of ignore it. Ye, but it's hard, I would imagine.

Speaker 1 (01:15:02):
Of course.

Speaker 5 (01:15:04):
Well.

Speaker 1 (01:15:05):
Uh, that was the first part of our earnest of
our autumnal earnestness bonanza. We will be back next week
for more. We are actually like approximately exactly halfway through
the questions we chose, so see again, and thank you
for listening, and we love you so many final words.

Speaker 2 (01:15:27):
We love you, Thanks for listening, and special shout out
to the discordistas. It's fun to hear your voices.

Speaker 1 (01:15:35):
Yeah, it is really fun. And Toronto, we'll see you
in November.

Speaker 2 (01:15:39):
Yeah, and Chicago and New York see you very soon.

Speaker 1 (01:15:43):
Oh yeah, and Chicago.

Speaker 2 (01:15:44):
There's literally like two tickets left, so get those fast
please boch okay, all right, love love ya, bye podcast
and now want more, Subscribe to our Patreon for two
extra episodes a month, discord access and more by heading
to patri treon dot com, slash stradio lab, and for
all our visual learners, free full length video episodes are

(01:16:05):
available on our YouTube.

Speaker 1 (01:16:07):
Now get back to work,