In a rare roundtable interview, six senior leaders at CAA discuss the evolution of the agency and its leadership following the ICM Partners acquisition. The group discusses how the rise of social media has changed the game for clients and how the work of agenting has expanded along with the scale of the entertainment industry.
The participants are:
** Tiffany Ward (Managing Director and Scripted Television Agent)
** Jennifer Joel (Literary Agent and Co-Head of CAA Books)
** Lisa Joseph Metelus (CAA Board member and Head of Athlete Brand Strategy & Entertainment for CAA Sports)
** Maha Dakhil (Managing Director and Motion Picture Agent)
** Arleta Fowler (Digital Media Agent and Head of Digital Media Lifestyle Talent)
** Lara Sacket (Co-Head of Production Department)
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Welcome to Strictly Business, Variety's weekly podcasts featuring conversations with
industry leaders about the business of media and entertainment. I'm
Cynthia Lyttleton, co editor in chief of Variety. Today's episode
offers a rare opportunity to bring microphones into the marble
covered halls of CIA. My Variety colleague Katsey Stephan and
(00:29):
I talked to not one, not two, but six senior
CIA agents about the state of the industry and the
state of their agency. These half dozen ten percenters to
use varieties language for talent, agents represent disciplines across the agency.
They are stars in their fields, and they all happen
(00:49):
to be women. The idea for this conversation started months
ago with my interest in looking at how the purchase
of ICM Partners has changed CIA. That's seven hundre earned
fifty million dollar deal was completed three years ago. Next month.
It's CIA's largest ever acquisition. In twenty twenty three, CIA
(01:09):
itself saw majority ownership change hands from private equity giant
TPG to French business mogul Francois Henri Finnelt and his
Artemis Holding Company. In the last few years, CIA has
taken steps to show that it is nurturing a next
generation of agency leaders. It has assembled internal boards and
(01:32):
leadership structures designed to expand the scope of its decision makers.
This comes as CIA has faced some outside criticism and
some notable defections amid the perception that there's a ceiling
for high achievers at the agency. Like other large agencies
and studios, CIA has also historically had a big gender
(01:54):
gap at the top that is changing and that is
illustrated by the composition of our roundtable. We recorded this
on April fifteenth, sitting across from one another on couches
in a COZYCIA meeting room. Our panelists are familiar names
to industry insiders. I'll let them quickly introduce themselves.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Tiffany Ward, Jennifer.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Joel, Lisa Joseph Mattelis.
Speaker 4 (02:19):
Maha Dakiel, Urlita Fowler, Lara Sackett.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
Tiffany Ward is CIA Managing Director and scripted television agent.
Jennifer Joel is a literary agent and co head of
CIA Books. Lisa Joseph Mettelis is a member of the
CIA Board and Head of Athlete Brand Strategy and Entertainment
at CIA Sports. Maha Dakiel is CIA Managing director and
(02:47):
motion picture agent. Ourlita Fowler is a digital media agent
and head of Digital Media Lifestyle Talent, and Lara Sackett
is co head of the Production Department. Women have a
lot to say about agenty, the entertainment economy, the rise
of social media creators, and the privilege of working with artists.
(03:09):
Our free wheeling conversation is coming up after this break
and we're back. Here comes our lively conversation with six
top CAIA agents.
Speaker 5 (03:27):
Tiffany Ward, Jennifer.
Speaker 3 (03:29):
Joel, Lisa, Joseph Mattulis.
Speaker 4 (03:31):
Maha Dakiel, Aurlita Fowler, Lara Sackett.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
Thank you all so much for joining me and my
coworker Katsi Stepan, who covers the talent agency business for us.
We are really appreciative. This is a rare opportunity to
speak with six senior leaders. We all know the beats
that the business has really gone through in the last
couple of years. The pandemic that strikes been a lot
(03:55):
of change, a lot of contraction, a lot of consolidation
in the business. See itself had quite a transformative event
a couple of years ago in purchasing ICM, and so
it's a great opportunity for us to talk about where
the agency is, where you see the marketplace going.
Speaker 4 (04:13):
What is great about this place in particular is it
was never perfect. Nothing ever is. But what it always
was from the day I got here and continues to
be is it's fertile ground for change, and the people
here can be the drivers of the change.
Speaker 6 (04:30):
You don't hit walls here, you know, and when we
do come together. And that's what was so great about
that first early board that spawned this newer board, that
there was a recognition at a certain point that three
or four people could not run this company alone. An
operations committee, as you guys have noticed, has been put
(04:51):
in place in the last several years. When I came here,
you know, expenses were run by one guy. You would go,
it is super nice to him, And that's not how
it's run anymore.
Speaker 7 (05:04):
I came to CIA as part of the ICM acquisition,
and so that was in the middle of the pandemic.
So my initial introduction to the motion picture meeting was
on zoom. So it was just all of these little
squares of everybody's face. And it wasn't just when you
were talking about having a voice. Everybody had a voice,
(05:26):
you know, I was seeing a screen of everybody's sort
of equal part in the process, as opposed to sort
of sitting in a room where somebody's at the front
there speaking, everybody else is listening. And then so that
was my introduction to the way that that meeting was
run and the way that people communicated with one another.
And then when Zoom came to an end and we
(05:48):
were in person, to then see the translation of that
Zoom meeting to an in person experience where it's very
much the same. You know, we're sitting around a table
and as many people as can fit in a room,
but it's never just one person speaking.
Speaker 8 (06:03):
I think we really benefited from the integration with ICM
because I think that even though as has been referenced
many times, we have a great value system of taking
care of each other, we have a great value system
of working in teams which usually include people from different experiences,
which makes the work better and I think a better
experience for the clients. We are as well as said,
we're perfect, and we're curious about always evolving and getting better,
(06:26):
and sometimes the best way to do that is to
be confronted with a different way of working.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
Here, Katsay steers the conversation to talking about social media
and the opportunities it creates for artists and how that
impacts agenting.
Speaker 9 (06:40):
Well, I'm so curious how the current state of the
creator economy and how that's factoring into your everyday at TAA,
and also how you view in the scope of the
entire entertainment industry, the creator economy.
Speaker 10 (06:56):
The digital industry as a whole is something that it
has been an industry that's been evolving, like literally, it
feels like every two years sort of the rules change.
But I've found that it's always been incredibly exciting. I
think the world between creators who have their digital ecosystem,
(07:19):
their online community, and the world of traditional Hollywood has
been coming closer and closer together. Our point of view
has always been like, we're signing and working with the
best creators, artists, taste makers, and our position has always
(07:39):
been to like connect them to the broader agency. So
for CIA works a bit different than other places because
as a client of the agency, you have a team,
and you have a team from different disciplines, and so
when I think about someone like Eliza Koshi who and
(08:00):
we signed her. We signed her off of Vine because
we saw how incredibly talented, funny sharp she was, right
and she's doing the short form content, and then we
really helped her expand and grow within the entertainment industry.
So she just wrapped a film with Arnold Schwarzenegger. I
think her agent team now has like fourteen people on
(08:24):
it across the agency, and she's doing everything from films, television, endorsements,
all while also monetizing her platform. Right now, what we're
seeing is that a lot of incredible IP is being
generated from the YouTube community. So when you think about
(08:48):
late night television right now, if you want to launch
a film, a TV show, an album, you're going to
go on Chicken Shop Date, right Amelia de Moldenburg as
a client of ours, or you're going to go on
to Hot Ones, right. And so that's been incredible. We've
also been seeing clients who've been focused on actually creating studios.
(09:12):
So we represent someone by the name of Darman and
he creates scripted content on his YouTube.
Speaker 2 (09:17):
I'm a big d okay, So.
Speaker 10 (09:23):
Dar you know, he has his own studio now, right,
and we've been helping him to expand his businesses both
like online right but also in other areas, and so
I've really been excited for what's happening right now.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
Social media has been a game changer for athletes in
terms of building businesses, building brands. Can you talk about
how much or how little you have integrated social media
and what they can do in that channel where they
can talk directly to fans.
Speaker 3 (09:58):
It's been an interesting ride because athletes are now viewed
as content creators as well. I think when social first
came out, no one knew what it was or where
it could lead. But what it did was create non
traditional media platforms and really put the narrative in athletes hands,
(10:20):
where before you would have to get that through traditional
media outlet and so or understanding a player's mindset after
a game, after a big loss or after a big win,
or what are they like you always what happens next?
Well you see what happens next in real time because
they're posting about it. And so I think there was
a little bit of fear at the beginning when it
came to social media because it's like, okay, it's like
(10:42):
kind of like the wild, wild West, And I think
there were like important lessons to be learned about what
should be shared and how should be shared, some hard
lessons for athletes.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
And maybe not every waking thought, not everything.
Speaker 3 (10:55):
We don't need to know everything that you're thinking. So
there was some hard lessons to be learned, and I
think as an agency, you know, we had to. It
wasn't a question or thought of being involved, because part
of us is protecting the athlete and educating them in
the process. And so I think over the last few
(11:15):
years you've seen a big shift in that where athletes
are starting to understand that they have a direct connection
to their fans. How can they tell their stories best,
how they can capture the headlines. Athletes aren't going to
traditional outlets anymore. They're breaking the news on their own.
We don't need a press release.
Speaker 2 (11:35):
I can just show this, you know.
Speaker 3 (11:37):
So it's kind of like it's been really really disruptive,
and even through that, athletes now want to be the
content creators they want. You know, we signed Jesser, who
is a huge YouTube so I don't even want to
like put him in that box of just like a YouTuber,
but like he's built an incredible platform around his love
(11:58):
of the game and his love of basketball, and to
see our star athletes wanting to go hang out with
Jesser it's like you all are. He wants to be you,
you want to be him. So how do we like
pair the two up and make it a win win?
So it's been really interesting and I think for us,
we're going to see a lot more. I think athletes
(12:20):
have realized and recognized their power and recognized that they
have incredible stories to tell. So whether it's on social
or whether it's through building their own production companies and
media empires, it's no longer just an athlete and what
they do on the court. But I think in every
scenario here, whether they're writing a New York Times bestseller
(12:41):
or being part being part of a production team or
eping a film, they're touching so many different lanes and
so many verticals. So they are a true multi hyphen
it of talent in all areas and they I think
they've awakened to their power and they own that now.
Speaker 11 (12:58):
And also I think to the social point, you know,
we've heard some you know, some artists today have said, Oh,
when I'm auditioning for something, they ask me how many
followers I have on social media? I'm curious for those
of you.
Speaker 12 (13:10):
Who are you know more on the TV and film side,
how much is that something that you're paying attention to
when you're going into a deal making process a client's
social following who isn't necessarily in the creator economy.
Speaker 10 (13:23):
Early on, it was a little more prevalent because studios
thinking about casting creators almost as it's done as a
and have it be a part of their marketing plan.
But in recent years that's not the biggest factor anymore,
(13:44):
right I also because a big part of what we're
seeing is that if you are on a hitshel if
you're on a hit show on Netflix, you can literally
go from having two thousand followers to two million.
Speaker 5 (13:58):
All of our clients are ultimately trying to reach, whether
you call them fans or audiences or readers, they're trying
to make a connection with people who will consume what
they're creating. Social media is definitely one measure that the
buyers of their intellectual property or services use to try
and figure out how much audience or viewers or readers
(14:21):
or listeners they're already bringing to the table. And we
think of it more generally as platform, and the platform
can be your socials, it can be your extent readers
or your extent listeners, but a measure of your ability
to connect with the people who you are ultimately trying
to reach as you create and new art, I think
is certainly one factor that all of our buyers and
(14:43):
all of our businesses have to be responsible in considering.
But I hope that because we are all in creative
businesses to our latest point, ultimately sort of the talent
and the power of the product is the most important
and factor for them to consider. And certainly history is
(15:04):
a guide to a creator and their ability to connect
with with the larger audience. But I think most of
us are in this business because we know that there's
something that is more than measurable or something that is immeasurable,
which is the feeling that we all get when we
watch performance that moves us, or you read something that
changes the way you know you understand the way the
(15:25):
world works, or that you watch a game and you
realize that your heart is fluttering and you have no
stake in the outcome of that particular conversation, but you're moved.
Speaker 8 (15:36):
I couldn't agree with Jen Moore, and the only thing
I'll add is that for those of us who are
working in storytelling, and I think there's stories in some ways,
and what all of us do. We came out here
because we were captured somehow by the magic of a
really resonant human story, right. And data is something that
we pride ourselves on having sort of best in class
(15:57):
service around, whether it be social or ratings, you know,
the whole the whole spectrum. And that's important. It's valuable
for us. It's valuable and deal making. It's valuable in
terms of giving our clients some kind of transparent feedback
about performance. But the other part of it is that
there's no algorithm on earth that would have told you
to make adolescens right. It's just magical resonance storytelling. The
(16:26):
more that we can keep, you know, to what to
what Jenna is talking about, which is the common denominator
of just a really resonant, specific, magical point of view
from an artist or artist that comes together in a
serendipitous confluence of events that we all benefit from because
it's human like, that's that's why we're here, you know.
(16:48):
So you have to balance both of those things, I
think to do our job with a level of optimism
and hope and excitement.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
How does that spirit of being innovative and creative put
pressure on you as agents? When your clients are being
more entrepreneurial than ever before, how does that translate to
your work.
Speaker 4 (17:06):
I don't really consider it pressure. It's not this pressure
of trying to stay ahead of the clients. It's this
joy and real acceptance of also hopefully being thought leaders ourselves,
pushing the boundaries, challenging systems, looking for different ways of
doing things, leaning on one another in the different divisions.
(17:27):
What are you learning, what are you finding? What patterns
are you seeing? And really helping to business build and
maybe even empire build. Not every single artist wants to
empire build. Sometimes they just want to tell a story,
and we're certainly equipped to do that, but we are overqualified.
Now our job description has expanded so much to being
(17:50):
entrepreneurs ourselves, in house producers and cultural advocates that it's
actually exciting time to be in the agency business because
you see how we're expanding and morphing and understanding that
we have to be all things to all people. Because
artists are so expansive in their thinking, there's an impression
(18:14):
that we represent only stars. We represent people who are
going to be stars, and yes, sometimes we represent people
who are already stars. But the fun and the discovery
of noting somebody's potential and then being a driver of it,
there's really no joy like that. It's maybe akin to parenting,
(18:36):
but just to see somebody grow and go through phases
and the deep history of knowing somebody and being with
somebody for a very long time and being able to
advise them through the highs and lows because obviously nobody
stays on top every single second, and being there when
they fall, and being the one that has you know,
those of us in this room and all our colleagues
(18:57):
outside this room. Having to have the plan, the optimism
and the creativity to be able to navigate next steps is.
Speaker 1 (19:06):
Exciting.
Speaker 4 (19:07):
It's not a pressure, not saying the job it's not
high pressure, but that part of the job is really
actually quite fun.
Speaker 11 (19:13):
Some of you have collaborated between production, motion picture and
television that there have been some recent projects that you
guys have really had to come together on. So can
you tell me a little more about how your teams
work together.
Speaker 8 (19:25):
Just to draft off of what Maha just said, One
of the things that allows us to feel that joy
and to sort of foster that entrepreneurialism is that we
lean on each other all the time. So just an example,
when Laura came in, you know, along with Ryan, Tracy
and many folks in a division that we hadn't had
right production production, Yes, production, that was something that you know,
(19:48):
for those of us who work in content, we maha
and I hadn't benefited from that for I don't know
the first ten fifteen years of our time here, and
it's been a game changer. Anytime that there's a new
show that is on the precipice of production, we are
able to collaborate with a best in class group of
advocates to say not just well who's writing this and
who will be the stars, but also who's making this right,
(20:10):
and who's great at making it domestically internationally, and who's
collaborated before. It's an incredible advantage, amazing.
Speaker 7 (20:18):
Well, I feel the same, and I think when you
see people in physical production, I hear this best in
class a lot, and I think you see a lot
of repeat collaborations because they work well. So people are
working together again and again and they're growing their careers
they see where people have different avenues of creativity and strength,
they pull in other people that they want to keep
working with again and again. And I think so we
(20:40):
have a lot of these artists that have been building
their careers forever building relationships, but then to have the
strength of the best in class relationships that go on
here to sort of see when these productions are just
an idea, So to know when somebody is talking about
a great book that's about to you know, it may
not even be a book yet, you know, it's somebody's
(21:02):
thought idea. It's an article, it's a book, it's a screenplay.
It's a filmmaker who really wants to collaborate with a
particular actor. It's two actors that want to make a comedy.
Just hearing that the kernels of ideas before they're I
mean long before they become physical production is I think
(21:23):
both inspiring. When you're talking about you know, how are
we motivated on a daily basis? It does require a
sort of entrepreneurial spirit because now we're seeing all these
different avenues. We're not waiting for a go job, like
here's a go opportunity. It's sort of like all of
these things that are possible, and I think building relationships
earlier on being aware of, you know, particular interests and collaborations,
(21:47):
it's been game changing for us.
Speaker 1 (21:49):
Here, Katsy presses Jennifer Joel about the ever expanding world
of sourcing literary content for adaptation in other mediums.
Speaker 13 (21:59):
Jen adaptation game is so so broad, and I'm so
curious how you even begin to identify what the right
projects are that make themselves right for these adaptations, whether
it's something whether you're sourcing from a book, a stage
show obviously very wide that you're casting.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
So how do you sort through all the content that's
out there.
Speaker 5 (22:22):
I'm not sure that we're doing a sorting job as
much as we are kind of building the library. And
I think one of the great privileges of the combination
of these agencies is the fact that the library is passive.
We've got decades worth of phenomenal content, whether their books
or their plays, or their podcasts or their kind of
(22:45):
new online content. The fact that we have created so
much excellent content is like a cant It's like a
candy shore for people to go play. In Great Thing
in particular about a long gest dating project, which a
book is often, but all of these things can be
(23:05):
is that somebody has already put years of thought and
effort into imagining one version of a story or a
world or a series. And to Lara's point, in a way,
it gives sort of a new creator who wants to reimagine,
you know, it's looking for a world to reimagine or
play around, and they're starting kind of way down the
(23:28):
playing field because somebody else has already done that work.
One of the great pleasures of the adaptations game and
an agency like this is that that process can go
both ways. So you are, in fact can go in
every way. You have an author who might imagine that
a piece of content that they've made would be phenomenally
(23:49):
reimagined in the hands of a certain director or a
certain actor, a certain writer, and we have the ability
to make those introductions. The reason that we've had so
much success is that is that we have had the
ability to let the people who make things find new
ways to kind of work together and work off of
each other.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
The core film and television business has been through very
you know, the headlines have been cuts and layoffs, and
I do feel like the page turned in January and
after California's horror Show. I do feel like the page
did turn, but I would love your candid thoughts on
(24:29):
whether you're you know you and your clients are feeling
some contraction in the business or is the sense of
contraction do you think overstated?
Speaker 3 (24:37):
I think it comes in waves, and so I think
during I mean, at least for sports right now, it's
been great. I mean, our clients are probably making the
most amount of money that they've ever made. It's been
quite insane. Contracts that are going up, media rights that
are going up. But it does come in waves, and
I think for us as agents, as executives, as an agency,
(25:00):
is really about staying consistent with our clients. And Maha
mentioned something earlier. It is just like being there for
them in the highs and the lows of it, making
them feel confident, making them feel that they're supported through
the process, and really kind of like holding their hand
through it. And I think there's no better feeling than
(25:23):
knowing that, Okay, I might hit a low or something's
not you know, hitting right, as we've all experienced in
the last few years, but knowing that you're part of
a greater system agency representation that's not going to drop
you because you know we're taking hits across the board,
but is really going to be there to support Because
(25:43):
life is all about ways. What comes up will go
down and vice versa, and so for us, it's also
an opportunity to figure out how to be more creative.
Speaker 4 (25:52):
The Hollywood community is a very resilient community because all
the insanely thinkable things that we have faced should maybe
signal that we should just all go home and give up.
And I don't know anybody who wants to go home
and give up. There's something about storytellers, the optimism of
(26:17):
having to create to idate. There's something so beautiful about
that desire to reach other human beings and tell them
that you see them, you feel them, or you want
to show them something new, or you want them to
escape something that they are feeling.
Speaker 2 (26:34):
Our Lada. With general economic instability, are you seeing any
contraction among brands? Is there a hesitancy right now?
Speaker 10 (26:41):
There is a little contraction with brands we have seen
because of the terroriffts. Some brands have pulled back some
of their campaigns or paused it. But on the other hand,
we have others that just got offers.
Speaker 8 (26:55):
Today.
Speaker 10 (26:56):
I think disruption creates opportunity, and so being in digital,
we've always been sort of on this leading edge of
what's next. We're always thinking about how do we help
our clients monetize and expand. And you know, we just
closed a deal for one of our just legendary Balk
(27:17):
Show hosts who has an incredible library that's now going
to become a fast channel. And so it's things like
that that I think, you know, a couple of years ago,
we wouldn't have thought about for our clients, and we're
thinking about that now, and so I see it. I'm
an optimist.
Speaker 7 (27:33):
What I found so encouraging is it's not sort of
an either or proposition. I feel like when we were kids,
there were three television networks, and you know, it wasn't
really like are you going to watch this channel or that,
or are you going to watch TV or go to
the movies on the weekend or I love the way
that this whole entertainment business has evolved and that yeah,
(27:54):
it might be a digital proposition, it might be something
in a movie theater, it might be a musician films
a concert, and then you go to the movies to
watch it. Just so many different avenues and I think,
again going back to just being in this building so
many different inspired experts who have these deep relationships. When
(28:14):
you talk about taking care of your clients and really
being forward thinking on their behalf, knowing what their strengths are,
what their interests are, what their talents are, and then
looking around at all the different avenues that they can pursue,
and them coming to us with the different avenues that
they're thinking about. I just like the fact that nothing
seems contracting to me. It just feels like different opportunities.
(28:36):
It's going to change. We hope that it will evolve,
but it doesn't feel like it's an either or. It
just feels like more opportunities. So I will take ideas
from all of you.
Speaker 8 (28:52):
So kind of went last. I think what Maha said
about kindness is first and foremost. You know, it's our
value system, But I think the more we're kind to
each other internally and externally, it really matters. Right now,
the last five years have been really hard for everybody,
no matter what business you're in, and I think the
kindness and the reciprocy of spirit allows people to feel
safe and then they can do their best work. I
(29:13):
think the curiosity of doing new things, like our leader
was talking about. You know that we may not all
be as well burst or immersed in as she might be,
or whatever the area is. Being curious about what's possible
even in dark times is actually the genesis of doing
great things and then believing. I think you said that
it's all worth it right, like it was, like I
(29:34):
think William James correct me said that believe that your
life is worth living, and that belief will create the fact.
And I like to think that believe that entertainment isn't
vital to all of our lives, and our collectible belief
will create that fact and will survive whatever obstacles, whatever
head ones we're facing, will tell magical stories. I am
(29:55):
not a Pollyanna, but I'm a believer. I think we're
all optimist in this room, and I think we're probably
all optimists in the building.
Speaker 5 (30:02):
I'll speak of somebody who works in what is probably
the oldest business in entertainment, publishing. Rumors of publishing's demise
have persisted since the invention of the newspaper, when people
wondered why you would ever read a book again when
the information you know was going to be outdated, and
that there was this new form of consuming information that
would be by definition more current. But of course books
(30:25):
are still here. All of the businesses that we that
we work in have survived these sort of eras of change.
When the world is challenged as it is today, I
think there is an even greater imperative for people who
can explain it, who can contextualize what we're living through,
(30:45):
who can provide hope and distraction. It is an incredible
privilege to spend your professional life thinking about how to
do those things. And I think we are all optimists.
I think we have to be optimists. I think this
place sort of exists to help make the ground as
(31:06):
fertile as possible for people who embrace the privilege of
living a creative life.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
Anything else that anybody wants to say. I feel like
we've covered a lot of ground.
Speaker 6 (31:15):
I wish listeners could see Lisa's nails.
Speaker 2 (31:19):
I have been staring at that.
Speaker 6 (31:25):
You can't see them. Thanks, I know, the company of Women,
thank you.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Thank you, thanks for putting up with us here.
Speaker 1 (31:34):
We want to end this episode on an uplifting note.
Here's a lightning round of clips of our guests talking
about their mentors and formative career experiences. Katsy and I
want to give our deep thanks to Ourlita, Jennifer, Laura,
Lisa Maha and Tiffany for the privilege of their time
and their thoughts.
Speaker 4 (31:53):
When I got here, I saw Best Swafford, queen of
the director's agents. Shortly after I got here. He'll whee
Lee came with this Irish accent. She had started in
a phone booth in Ireland, one of the best origin
stories ever, and had the coolest haircut and would just
tell everybody off all the time in the best, coolest,
sexiest way.
Speaker 7 (32:14):
I really had the opportunity to kind of learn by
osmosis and again just having people who are very willing
to mentor who I could ask questions. They would let
me be a part of things I would do, like
is it Monday Yet.
Speaker 5 (32:25):
It took me about five minutes of learning the business
and looking around at the landscape to realize that the
two best agents in the publishing business were Biggie Urban
and Uster Newburgh, and that the way that I would
be able to become what I hoped would be the
best version of somebody in this industry was to go
(32:45):
and learn from them.
Speaker 10 (32:46):
There have been so many incredible people that have helped
mentor and shape me, people like Christy Habigger and Terry Hanks,
but then also Kevin Vank.
Speaker 3 (32:59):
Part of the reason why I even moved here was
Michelle Kid who has always been also a mentor to me.
Anytime I had any issues, that would call Michelle, and
Michelle was the one who really encourage me and say, Lisa,
this is the time. We need more women in our building.
We need more women leaders in our building.
Speaker 8 (33:16):
I always felt that my capacity here was my limitation,
which is to say that I always felt with women
like Resa Gertner and Sonya Rosenfeld and Hilda Quilli and
Beus Wolferd who came before me, that I was really
being judged on my ability to be an advocate with
integrity and creativity who fought hard for her clients. And
(33:38):
in turn, I feel like I've been given the space
to try to do that for other women.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
Thanks for listening. Be sure to leave us a review
at the podcast platform of your choice. We love to
hear from listeners. Please go to Variety dot com and
sign up for the free weekly Strictly Business newsletter, and
don't forget to tune in next week for another episode
of Strictly Business.
Welcome to Strictly Business, Variety's weekly podcasts featuring conversations with
industry leaders about the business of media and entertainment. I'm
Cynthia Lyttleton, co editor in chief of Variety. Today's episode
offers a rare opportunity to bring microphones into the marble
covered halls of CIA. My Variety colleague Katsey Stephan and
(00:29):
I talked to not one, not two, but six senior
CIA agents about the state of the industry and the
state of their agency. These half dozen ten percenters to
use varieties language for talent, agents represent disciplines across the agency.
They are stars in their fields, and they all happen
(00:49):
to be women. The idea for this conversation started months
ago with my interest in looking at how the purchase
of ICM Partners has changed CIA. That's seven hundre earned
fifty million dollar deal was completed three years ago. Next month.
It's CIA's largest ever acquisition. In twenty twenty three, CIA
(01:09):
itself saw majority ownership change hands from private equity giant
TPG to French business mogul Francois Henri Finnelt and his
Artemis Holding Company. In the last few years, CIA has
taken steps to show that it is nurturing a next
generation of agency leaders. It has assembled internal boards and
(01:32):
leadership structures designed to expand the scope of its decision makers.
This comes as CIA has faced some outside criticism and
some notable defections amid the perception that there's a ceiling
for high achievers at the agency. Like other large agencies
and studios, CIA has also historically had a big gender
(01:54):
gap at the top that is changing and that is
illustrated by the composition of our roundtable. We recorded this
on April fifteenth, sitting across from one another on couches
in a COZYCIA meeting room. Our panelists are familiar names
to industry insiders. I'll let them quickly introduce themselves.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Tiffany Ward, Jennifer.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Joel, Lisa Joseph Mattelis.
Speaker 4 (02:19):
Maha Dakiel, Urlita Fowler, Lara Sackett.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
Tiffany Ward is CIA Managing Director and scripted television agent.
Jennifer Joel is a literary agent and co head of
CIA Books. Lisa Joseph Mettelis is a member of the
CIA Board and Head of Athlete Brand Strategy and Entertainment
at CIA Sports. Maha Dakiel is CIA Managing director and
(02:47):
motion picture agent. Ourlita Fowler is a digital media agent
and head of Digital Media Lifestyle Talent, and Lara Sackett
is co head of the Production Department. Women have a
lot to say about agenty, the entertainment economy, the rise
of social media creators, and the privilege of working with artists.
(03:09):
Our free wheeling conversation is coming up after this break
and we're back. Here comes our lively conversation with six
top CAIA agents.
Speaker 5 (03:27):
Tiffany Ward, Jennifer.
Speaker 3 (03:29):
Joel, Lisa, Joseph Mattulis.
Speaker 4 (03:31):
Maha Dakiel, Aurlita Fowler, Lara Sackett.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
Thank you all so much for joining me and my
coworker Katsi Stepan, who covers the talent agency business for us.
We are really appreciative. This is a rare opportunity to
speak with six senior leaders. We all know the beats
that the business has really gone through in the last
couple of years. The pandemic that strikes been a lot
(03:55):
of change, a lot of contraction, a lot of consolidation
in the business. See itself had quite a transformative event
a couple of years ago in purchasing ICM, and so
it's a great opportunity for us to talk about where
the agency is, where you see the marketplace going.
Speaker 4 (04:13):
What is great about this place in particular is it
was never perfect. Nothing ever is. But what it always
was from the day I got here and continues to
be is it's fertile ground for change, and the people
here can be the drivers of the change.
Speaker 6 (04:30):
You don't hit walls here, you know, and when we
do come together. And that's what was so great about
that first early board that spawned this newer board, that
there was a recognition at a certain point that three
or four people could not run this company alone. An
operations committee, as you guys have noticed, has been put
(04:51):
in place in the last several years. When I came here,
you know, expenses were run by one guy. You would go,
it is super nice to him, And that's not how
it's run anymore.
Speaker 7 (05:04):
I came to CIA as part of the ICM acquisition,
and so that was in the middle of the pandemic.
So my initial introduction to the motion picture meeting was
on zoom. So it was just all of these little
squares of everybody's face. And it wasn't just when you
were talking about having a voice. Everybody had a voice,
(05:26):
you know, I was seeing a screen of everybody's sort
of equal part in the process, as opposed to sort
of sitting in a room where somebody's at the front
there speaking, everybody else is listening. And then so that
was my introduction to the way that that meeting was
run and the way that people communicated with one another.
And then when Zoom came to an end and we
(05:48):
were in person, to then see the translation of that
Zoom meeting to an in person experience where it's very
much the same. You know, we're sitting around a table
and as many people as can fit in a room,
but it's never just one person speaking.
Speaker 8 (06:03):
I think we really benefited from the integration with ICM
because I think that even though as has been referenced
many times, we have a great value system of taking
care of each other, we have a great value system
of working in teams which usually include people from different experiences,
which makes the work better and I think a better
experience for the clients. We are as well as said,
we're perfect, and we're curious about always evolving and getting better,
(06:26):
and sometimes the best way to do that is to
be confronted with a different way of working.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
Here, Katsay steers the conversation to talking about social media
and the opportunities it creates for artists and how that
impacts agenting.
Speaker 9 (06:40):
Well, I'm so curious how the current state of the
creator economy and how that's factoring into your everyday at TAA,
and also how you view in the scope of the
entire entertainment industry, the creator economy.
Speaker 10 (06:56):
The digital industry as a whole is something that it
has been an industry that's been evolving, like literally, it
feels like every two years sort of the rules change.
But I've found that it's always been incredibly exciting. I
think the world between creators who have their digital ecosystem,
(07:19):
their online community, and the world of traditional Hollywood has
been coming closer and closer together. Our point of view
has always been like, we're signing and working with the
best creators, artists, taste makers, and our position has always
(07:39):
been to like connect them to the broader agency. So
for CIA works a bit different than other places because
as a client of the agency, you have a team,
and you have a team from different disciplines, and so
when I think about someone like Eliza Koshi who and
(08:00):
we signed her. We signed her off of Vine because
we saw how incredibly talented, funny sharp she was, right
and she's doing the short form content, and then we
really helped her expand and grow within the entertainment industry.
So she just wrapped a film with Arnold Schwarzenegger. I
think her agent team now has like fourteen people on
(08:24):
it across the agency, and she's doing everything from films, television, endorsements,
all while also monetizing her platform. Right now, what we're
seeing is that a lot of incredible IP is being
generated from the YouTube community. So when you think about
(08:48):
late night television right now, if you want to launch
a film, a TV show, an album, you're going to
go on Chicken Shop Date, right Amelia de Moldenburg as
a client of ours, or you're going to go on
to Hot Ones, right. And so that's been incredible. We've
also been seeing clients who've been focused on actually creating studios.
(09:12):
So we represent someone by the name of Darman and
he creates scripted content on his YouTube.
Speaker 2 (09:17):
I'm a big d okay, So.
Speaker 10 (09:23):
Dar you know, he has his own studio now, right,
and we've been helping him to expand his businesses both
like online right but also in other areas, and so
I've really been excited for what's happening right now.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
Social media has been a game changer for athletes in
terms of building businesses, building brands. Can you talk about
how much or how little you have integrated social media
and what they can do in that channel where they
can talk directly to fans.
Speaker 3 (09:58):
It's been an interesting ride because athletes are now viewed
as content creators as well. I think when social first
came out, no one knew what it was or where
it could lead. But what it did was create non
traditional media platforms and really put the narrative in athletes hands,
(10:20):
where before you would have to get that through traditional
media outlet and so or understanding a player's mindset after
a game, after a big loss or after a big win,
or what are they like you always what happens next?
Well you see what happens next in real time because
they're posting about it. And so I think there was
a little bit of fear at the beginning when it
came to social media because it's like, okay, it's like
(10:42):
kind of like the wild, wild West, And I think
there were like important lessons to be learned about what
should be shared and how should be shared, some hard
lessons for athletes.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
And maybe not every waking thought, not everything.
Speaker 3 (10:55):
We don't need to know everything that you're thinking. So
there was some hard lessons to be learned, and I
think as an agency, you know, we had to. It
wasn't a question or thought of being involved, because part
of us is protecting the athlete and educating them in
the process. And so I think over the last few
(11:15):
years you've seen a big shift in that where athletes
are starting to understand that they have a direct connection
to their fans. How can they tell their stories best,
how they can capture the headlines. Athletes aren't going to
traditional outlets anymore. They're breaking the news on their own.
We don't need a press release.
Speaker 2 (11:35):
I can just show this, you know.
Speaker 3 (11:37):
So it's kind of like it's been really really disruptive,
and even through that, athletes now want to be the
content creators they want. You know, we signed Jesser, who
is a huge YouTube so I don't even want to
like put him in that box of just like a YouTuber,
but like he's built an incredible platform around his love
(11:58):
of the game and his love of basketball, and to
see our star athletes wanting to go hang out with
Jesser it's like you all are. He wants to be you,
you want to be him. So how do we like
pair the two up and make it a win win?
So it's been really interesting and I think for us,
we're going to see a lot more. I think athletes
(12:20):
have realized and recognized their power and recognized that they
have incredible stories to tell. So whether it's on social
or whether it's through building their own production companies and
media empires, it's no longer just an athlete and what
they do on the court. But I think in every
scenario here, whether they're writing a New York Times bestseller
(12:41):
or being part being part of a production team or
eping a film, they're touching so many different lanes and
so many verticals. So they are a true multi hyphen
it of talent in all areas and they I think
they've awakened to their power and they own that now.
Speaker 11 (12:58):
And also I think to the social point, you know,
we've heard some you know, some artists today have said, Oh,
when I'm auditioning for something, they ask me how many
followers I have on social media? I'm curious for those
of you.
Speaker 12 (13:10):
Who are you know more on the TV and film side,
how much is that something that you're paying attention to
when you're going into a deal making process a client's
social following who isn't necessarily in the creator economy.
Speaker 10 (13:23):
Early on, it was a little more prevalent because studios
thinking about casting creators almost as it's done as a
and have it be a part of their marketing plan.
But in recent years that's not the biggest factor anymore,
(13:44):
right I also because a big part of what we're
seeing is that if you are on a hitshel if
you're on a hit show on Netflix, you can literally
go from having two thousand followers to two million.
Speaker 5 (13:58):
All of our clients are ultimately trying to reach, whether
you call them fans or audiences or readers, they're trying
to make a connection with people who will consume what
they're creating. Social media is definitely one measure that the
buyers of their intellectual property or services use to try
and figure out how much audience or viewers or readers
(14:21):
or listeners they're already bringing to the table. And we
think of it more generally as platform, and the platform
can be your socials, it can be your extent readers
or your extent listeners, but a measure of your ability
to connect with the people who you are ultimately trying
to reach as you create and new art, I think
is certainly one factor that all of our buyers and
(14:43):
all of our businesses have to be responsible in considering.
But I hope that because we are all in creative
businesses to our latest point, ultimately sort of the talent
and the power of the product is the most important
and factor for them to consider. And certainly history is
(15:04):
a guide to a creator and their ability to connect
with with the larger audience. But I think most of
us are in this business because we know that there's
something that is more than measurable or something that is immeasurable,
which is the feeling that we all get when we
watch performance that moves us, or you read something that
changes the way you know you understand the way the
(15:25):
world works, or that you watch a game and you
realize that your heart is fluttering and you have no
stake in the outcome of that particular conversation, but you're moved.
Speaker 8 (15:36):
I couldn't agree with Jen Moore, and the only thing
I'll add is that for those of us who are
working in storytelling, and I think there's stories in some ways,
and what all of us do. We came out here
because we were captured somehow by the magic of a
really resonant human story, right. And data is something that
we pride ourselves on having sort of best in class
(15:57):
service around, whether it be social or ratings, you know,
the whole the whole spectrum. And that's important. It's valuable
for us. It's valuable and deal making. It's valuable in
terms of giving our clients some kind of transparent feedback
about performance. But the other part of it is that
there's no algorithm on earth that would have told you
to make adolescens right. It's just magical resonance storytelling. The
(16:26):
more that we can keep, you know, to what to
what Jenna is talking about, which is the common denominator
of just a really resonant, specific, magical point of view
from an artist or artist that comes together in a
serendipitous confluence of events that we all benefit from because
it's human like, that's that's why we're here, you know.
(16:48):
So you have to balance both of those things, I
think to do our job with a level of optimism
and hope and excitement.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
How does that spirit of being innovative and creative put
pressure on you as agents? When your clients are being
more entrepreneurial than ever before, how does that translate to
your work.
Speaker 4 (17:06):
I don't really consider it pressure. It's not this pressure
of trying to stay ahead of the clients. It's this
joy and real acceptance of also hopefully being thought leaders ourselves,
pushing the boundaries, challenging systems, looking for different ways of
doing things, leaning on one another in the different divisions.
(17:27):
What are you learning, what are you finding? What patterns
are you seeing? And really helping to business build and
maybe even empire build. Not every single artist wants to
empire build. Sometimes they just want to tell a story,
and we're certainly equipped to do that, but we are overqualified.
Now our job description has expanded so much to being
(17:50):
entrepreneurs ourselves, in house producers and cultural advocates that it's
actually exciting time to be in the agency business because
you see how we're expanding and morphing and understanding that
we have to be all things to all people. Because
artists are so expansive in their thinking, there's an impression
(18:14):
that we represent only stars. We represent people who are
going to be stars, and yes, sometimes we represent people
who are already stars. But the fun and the discovery
of noting somebody's potential and then being a driver of it,
there's really no joy like that. It's maybe akin to parenting,
(18:36):
but just to see somebody grow and go through phases
and the deep history of knowing somebody and being with
somebody for a very long time and being able to
advise them through the highs and lows because obviously nobody
stays on top every single second, and being there when
they fall, and being the one that has you know,
those of us in this room and all our colleagues
(18:57):
outside this room. Having to have the plan, the optimism
and the creativity to be able to navigate next steps is.
Speaker 1 (19:06):
Exciting.
Speaker 4 (19:07):
It's not a pressure, not saying the job it's not
high pressure, but that part of the job is really
actually quite fun.
Speaker 11 (19:13):
Some of you have collaborated between production, motion picture and
television that there have been some recent projects that you
guys have really had to come together on. So can
you tell me a little more about how your teams
work together.
Speaker 8 (19:25):
Just to draft off of what Maha just said, One
of the things that allows us to feel that joy
and to sort of foster that entrepreneurialism is that we
lean on each other all the time. So just an example,
when Laura came in, you know, along with Ryan, Tracy
and many folks in a division that we hadn't had
right production production, Yes, production, that was something that you know,
(19:48):
for those of us who work in content, we maha
and I hadn't benefited from that for I don't know
the first ten fifteen years of our time here, and
it's been a game changer. Anytime that there's a new
show that is on the precipice of production, we are
able to collaborate with a best in class group of
advocates to say not just well who's writing this and
who will be the stars, but also who's making this right,
(20:10):
and who's great at making it domestically internationally, and who's
collaborated before. It's an incredible advantage, amazing.
Speaker 7 (20:18):
Well, I feel the same, and I think when you
see people in physical production, I hear this best in
class a lot, and I think you see a lot
of repeat collaborations because they work well. So people are
working together again and again and they're growing their careers
they see where people have different avenues of creativity and strength,
they pull in other people that they want to keep
working with again and again. And I think so we
(20:40):
have a lot of these artists that have been building
their careers forever building relationships, but then to have the
strength of the best in class relationships that go on
here to sort of see when these productions are just
an idea, So to know when somebody is talking about
a great book that's about to you know, it may
not even be a book yet, you know, it's somebody's
(21:02):
thought idea. It's an article, it's a book, it's a screenplay.
It's a filmmaker who really wants to collaborate with a
particular actor. It's two actors that want to make a comedy.
Just hearing that the kernels of ideas before they're I
mean long before they become physical production is I think
(21:23):
both inspiring. When you're talking about you know, how are
we motivated on a daily basis? It does require a
sort of entrepreneurial spirit because now we're seeing all these
different avenues. We're not waiting for a go job, like
here's a go opportunity. It's sort of like all of
these things that are possible, and I think building relationships
earlier on being aware of, you know, particular interests and collaborations,
(21:47):
it's been game changing for us.
Speaker 1 (21:49):
Here, Katsy presses Jennifer Joel about the ever expanding world
of sourcing literary content for adaptation in other mediums.
Speaker 13 (21:59):
Jen adaptation game is so so broad, and I'm so
curious how you even begin to identify what the right
projects are that make themselves right for these adaptations, whether
it's something whether you're sourcing from a book, a stage
show obviously very wide that you're casting.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
So how do you sort through all the content that's
out there.
Speaker 5 (22:22):
I'm not sure that we're doing a sorting job as
much as we are kind of building the library. And
I think one of the great privileges of the combination
of these agencies is the fact that the library is passive.
We've got decades worth of phenomenal content, whether their books
or their plays, or their podcasts or their kind of
(22:45):
new online content. The fact that we have created so
much excellent content is like a cant It's like a
candy shore for people to go play. In Great Thing
in particular about a long gest dating project, which a
book is often, but all of these things can be
(23:05):
is that somebody has already put years of thought and
effort into imagining one version of a story or a
world or a series. And to Lara's point, in a way,
it gives sort of a new creator who wants to reimagine,
you know, it's looking for a world to reimagine or
play around, and they're starting kind of way down the
(23:28):
playing field because somebody else has already done that work.
One of the great pleasures of the adaptations game and
an agency like this is that that process can go
both ways. So you are, in fact can go in
every way. You have an author who might imagine that
a piece of content that they've made would be phenomenally
(23:49):
reimagined in the hands of a certain director or a
certain actor, a certain writer, and we have the ability
to make those introductions. The reason that we've had so
much success is that is that we have had the
ability to let the people who make things find new
ways to kind of work together and work off of
each other.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
The core film and television business has been through very
you know, the headlines have been cuts and layoffs, and
I do feel like the page turned in January and
after California's horror Show. I do feel like the page
did turn, but I would love your candid thoughts on
(24:29):
whether you're you know you and your clients are feeling
some contraction in the business or is the sense of
contraction do you think overstated?
Speaker 3 (24:37):
I think it comes in waves, and so I think
during I mean, at least for sports right now, it's
been great. I mean, our clients are probably making the
most amount of money that they've ever made. It's been
quite insane. Contracts that are going up, media rights that
are going up. But it does come in waves, and
I think for us as agents, as executives, as an agency,
(25:00):
is really about staying consistent with our clients. And Maha
mentioned something earlier. It is just like being there for
them in the highs and the lows of it, making
them feel confident, making them feel that they're supported through
the process, and really kind of like holding their hand
through it. And I think there's no better feeling than
(25:23):
knowing that, Okay, I might hit a low or something's
not you know, hitting right, as we've all experienced in
the last few years, but knowing that you're part of
a greater system agency representation that's not going to drop
you because you know we're taking hits across the board,
but is really going to be there to support Because
(25:43):
life is all about ways. What comes up will go
down and vice versa, and so for us, it's also
an opportunity to figure out how to be more creative.
Speaker 4 (25:52):
The Hollywood community is a very resilient community because all
the insanely thinkable things that we have faced should maybe
signal that we should just all go home and give up.
And I don't know anybody who wants to go home
and give up. There's something about storytellers, the optimism of
(26:17):
having to create to idate. There's something so beautiful about
that desire to reach other human beings and tell them
that you see them, you feel them, or you want
to show them something new, or you want them to
escape something that they are feeling.
Speaker 2 (26:34):
Our Lada. With general economic instability, are you seeing any
contraction among brands? Is there a hesitancy right now?
Speaker 10 (26:41):
There is a little contraction with brands we have seen
because of the terroriffts. Some brands have pulled back some
of their campaigns or paused it. But on the other hand,
we have others that just got offers.
Speaker 8 (26:55):
Today.
Speaker 10 (26:56):
I think disruption creates opportunity, and so being in digital,
we've always been sort of on this leading edge of
what's next. We're always thinking about how do we help
our clients monetize and expand. And you know, we just
closed a deal for one of our just legendary Balk
(27:17):
Show hosts who has an incredible library that's now going
to become a fast channel. And so it's things like
that that I think, you know, a couple of years ago,
we wouldn't have thought about for our clients, and we're
thinking about that now, and so I see it. I'm
an optimist.
Speaker 7 (27:33):
What I found so encouraging is it's not sort of
an either or proposition. I feel like when we were kids,
there were three television networks, and you know, it wasn't
really like are you going to watch this channel or that,
or are you going to watch TV or go to
the movies on the weekend or I love the way
that this whole entertainment business has evolved and that yeah,
(27:54):
it might be a digital proposition, it might be something
in a movie theater, it might be a musician films
a concert, and then you go to the movies to
watch it. Just so many different avenues and I think,
again going back to just being in this building so
many different inspired experts who have these deep relationships. When
(28:14):
you talk about taking care of your clients and really
being forward thinking on their behalf, knowing what their strengths are,
what their interests are, what their talents are, and then
looking around at all the different avenues that they can pursue,
and them coming to us with the different avenues that
they're thinking about. I just like the fact that nothing
seems contracting to me. It just feels like different opportunities.
(28:36):
It's going to change. We hope that it will evolve,
but it doesn't feel like it's an either or. It
just feels like more opportunities. So I will take ideas
from all of you.
Speaker 8 (28:52):
So kind of went last. I think what Maha said
about kindness is first and foremost. You know, it's our
value system, But I think the more we're kind to
each other internally and externally, it really matters. Right now,
the last five years have been really hard for everybody,
no matter what business you're in, and I think the
kindness and the reciprocy of spirit allows people to feel
safe and then they can do their best work. I
(29:13):
think the curiosity of doing new things, like our leader
was talking about. You know that we may not all
be as well burst or immersed in as she might be,
or whatever the area is. Being curious about what's possible
even in dark times is actually the genesis of doing
great things and then believing. I think you said that
it's all worth it right, like it was, like I
(29:34):
think William James correct me said that believe that your
life is worth living, and that belief will create the fact.
And I like to think that believe that entertainment isn't
vital to all of our lives, and our collectible belief
will create that fact and will survive whatever obstacles, whatever
head ones we're facing, will tell magical stories. I am
(29:55):
not a Pollyanna, but I'm a believer. I think we're
all optimist in this room, and I think we're probably
all optimists in the building.
Speaker 5 (30:02):
I'll speak of somebody who works in what is probably
the oldest business in entertainment, publishing. Rumors of publishing's demise
have persisted since the invention of the newspaper, when people
wondered why you would ever read a book again when
the information you know was going to be outdated, and
that there was this new form of consuming information that
would be by definition more current. But of course books
(30:25):
are still here. All of the businesses that we that
we work in have survived these sort of eras of change.
When the world is challenged as it is today, I
think there is an even greater imperative for people who
can explain it, who can contextualize what we're living through,
(30:45):
who can provide hope and distraction. It is an incredible
privilege to spend your professional life thinking about how to
do those things. And I think we are all optimists.
I think we have to be optimists. I think this
place sort of exists to help make the ground as
(31:06):
fertile as possible for people who embrace the privilege of
living a creative life.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
Anything else that anybody wants to say. I feel like
we've covered a lot of ground.
Speaker 6 (31:15):
I wish listeners could see Lisa's nails.
Speaker 2 (31:19):
I have been staring at that.
Speaker 6 (31:25):
You can't see them. Thanks, I know, the company of Women,
thank you.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Thank you, thanks for putting up with us here.
Speaker 1 (31:34):
We want to end this episode on an uplifting note.
Here's a lightning round of clips of our guests talking
about their mentors and formative career experiences. Katsy and I
want to give our deep thanks to Ourlita, Jennifer, Laura,
Lisa Maha and Tiffany for the privilege of their time
and their thoughts.
Speaker 4 (31:53):
When I got here, I saw Best Swafford, queen of
the director's agents. Shortly after I got here. He'll whee
Lee came with this Irish accent. She had started in
a phone booth in Ireland, one of the best origin
stories ever, and had the coolest haircut and would just
tell everybody off all the time in the best, coolest,
sexiest way.
Speaker 7 (32:14):
I really had the opportunity to kind of learn by
osmosis and again just having people who are very willing
to mentor who I could ask questions. They would let
me be a part of things I would do, like
is it Monday Yet.
Speaker 5 (32:25):
It took me about five minutes of learning the business
and looking around at the landscape to realize that the
two best agents in the publishing business were Biggie Urban
and Uster Newburgh, and that the way that I would
be able to become what I hoped would be the
best version of somebody in this industry was to go
(32:45):
and learn from them.
Speaker 10 (32:46):
There have been so many incredible people that have helped
mentor and shape me, people like Christy Habigger and Terry Hanks,
but then also Kevin Vank.
Speaker 3 (32:59):
Part of the reason why I even moved here was
Michelle Kid who has always been also a mentor to me.
Anytime I had any issues, that would call Michelle, and
Michelle was the one who really encourage me and say, Lisa,
this is the time. We need more women in our building.
We need more women leaders in our building.
Speaker 8 (33:16):
I always felt that my capacity here was my limitation,
which is to say that I always felt with women
like Resa Gertner and Sonya Rosenfeld and Hilda Quilli and
Beus Wolferd who came before me, that I was really
being judged on my ability to be an advocate with
integrity and creativity who fought hard for her clients. And
(33:38):
in turn, I feel like I've been given the space
to try to do that for other women.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
Thanks for listening. Be sure to leave us a review
at the podcast platform of your choice. We love to
hear from listeners. Please go to Variety dot com and
sign up for the free weekly Strictly Business newsletter, and
don't forget to tune in next week for another episode
of Strictly Business.
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