In today’s episode, Tatiana Siegel, Variety’s executive editor of film and media, details her interview with actor Dean Cain, who bucks the trends in Hollywood in more ways the one. And Brian Steinberg, senior TV editor, gives detail on upfront ad sales as Disney, NBCUniversal and Fox call it a wrap on advance advertising commitments for the coming season.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:08):
Welcome to Daily Variety, your daily dose of news and
analysis for entertainment industry insiders. It's Thursday, July thirty, first,
twenty twenty five. I'm your host, Cynthia Littleton. I am
co editor in chief of Variety alongside Ramin Setuda. I'm
in LA He's in New York, and Variety has reporters
around the world covering the business of entertainment. In today's episode,
(00:30):
we'll talk with Tatiana Siegel about her profile of the
actor who has spent more time in Superman's blue tights
than any other. Dean Kine and Brian Steinberg gives us
an update on where upfront advertising sales stand for the
major conglomerates. The biggest draw for blurb buyers, according to Brian,
is sports, sports, and more sports. But before we get
(00:52):
to that, here are a few headlines just in this
morning that you need to know. Comcast's second quarter results
reflected the sun in advertising and the drip drip drip
of cord cutting.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
Profit.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
However, got a boost from the four hundred and forty
million dollar check that Disney wrote to Comcast earlier this
year to complete the buy out of Hulu. Wednesday had
to be a rough day at Warner Brothers. The studio
laid off fifty two people in the motion picture group.
Most of the cuts came in marketing, production, strategy, operations,
and the Theater Ventures division. Netflix renewed animated comedy Long
(01:29):
Story Short for season two. They must be high on
the show, given that season one doesn't premiere until August
twenty second. It's from BoJack Horseman creator Rafael Bob Waksburg.
Now we turn to conversations with Variety journalists about news
and trends in show business. Next up, Tatiana Siegeal, Variety's
(01:50):
executive editor of Film and Media, details her profile of
Dean Kine and why she wanted to talk with the
Trump loving star of Lois and Clark. Tatiana Siegel, thank
you so much for joining me today on a hot
day in New York City.
Speaker 3 (02:05):
Pleasure to be here.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
Tatiana, you have a really compelling profile in this week's
issue on actor Dean kan What sparked your interest in
checking in with him?
Speaker 2 (02:14):
Now?
Speaker 3 (02:15):
Basically, Superman is in the zeitgeist right now this summer.
It's the summer of Superman, and only eight actors have
appeared as the Man of Steel over the years in
live action films and TV series. So I did a
little research and I said, well, Dean Kane actually has
(02:37):
probably been in the suit more than anyone else, with
the exception of Tom Welling, who starred in Smallville and
that ran for ten seasons. The original Superman George Reeves,
he was in slightly more episodes than Dean Kin. I
think it was one hundred and four to eighty seven,
(02:59):
but Dean Kane means Lois and Clark ran for forty
six minutes versus thirty minutes for the George Reeds Superman.
So I thought to myself, this is somebody who is
clearly vocal about his politics as a Trump supporter, and
also has this deep knowledge of the character. He might
(03:22):
make a really good interview.
Speaker 4 (03:25):
Okay, Los, Okay, I've been rehearsing this for months.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
Let's see if I can get it right.
Speaker 4 (03:31):
I know this is a shock, and I wanted to
be the one to tell you so that you could
understand how hard this has been for me, how I've
carried this secret by myself, and how long I have
wanted to tell you. But when I decided to become Superman,
(03:52):
I became a target.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
And so anybody close to you became a target.
Speaker 5 (03:58):
And it just got more complicated when you realized.
Speaker 4 (04:00):
You, which was about two minutes after I met you.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
I love that you brought data to it. You crunch
the numbers on time in the suit. I also appreciate
that you went into that interview with a very specific question,
not to grill him on his personal politics, but to
talk to him about how him being vocal about his
support of MAGA and President Trump, which is definitely not
the norm, not the conventional wisdom in Hollywood or New York,
(04:27):
in the kind of the hotbeds of the business, how
just that stance has affected his career as an actor,
as a personality in our business. Did you find him
to be earnestly engaging with you in talking about exactly that.
Speaker 3 (04:42):
Absolutely, he was very earnest and candid. He also has
a lot of confidence and doesn't really seem to worry
about will I be a pariah in Hollywood for being
a Trump supporter. The people that I called for secondary voices,
like Greg Burlante, they got right on the phone. Dean
(05:06):
was very eager to talk about playing gay in the
two thousand romantic comedy The Broken Hearts Club, which was
Greg Burlanti's first movie. He said he loved playing gay
and he did it again in another movie. And what
Greg mentioned that I found really interesting is like the
context of the times is like nobody wanted to play
(05:27):
gay back then.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
Especially a rising star leading man. That was not the
move that your agent would have suggested. First.
Speaker 3 (05:35):
Dean was kind of like, I didn't understand the fuss
then or now. As somebody on his team said, well,
people might think you're gay in real life, and he said, well,
then I've done my job.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
Another thing that he is very direct about is that
he experienced in his time on Lois and Clark, in
his time in The Tights, that he experienced some significant
sexual harassment.
Speaker 3 (05:58):
That is true, and he talked about it, but only
very briefly and would not identify the person and said
he didn't want to comment any further on the matter.
But there had always been rumblings. Dean seemed like somebody
who was pretty straightforward, straight shooter and did not really
(06:22):
indulge in a lot of oh woe is me kind
of talk. It was just like, yeah, this happened, and
I'm going to move on. And I think he moved
on at the time, and he moved on in the
interview with me.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
Another interesting thing that I didn't fully appreciate is that
he has tapped into this very vibrant strain of independent
production that has done far outside of La New York
and Chicago, independently produced and financed faith based movies that
run on certain channels, that sometimes even do smaller circuits
in sort of Bible belt markets. And it sounds like
(06:56):
he's really invested as a producer, director, star of some
of these films.
Speaker 3 (07:01):
Yes, and it's sort of a parallel universe that operates
right near Hollywood, but not quite in Hollywood. It's becoming
more and more of an economic force if you look
at the chosen these things. So it's not to be dismissed.
He said that he loves making these movies and he's
made sixteen of them now because he feels like they
(07:24):
showcase strong family cohesion, something that is really pushing strong
positive messages and we are in a dark time.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
From your story, you get the sense that he really
means this isn't it isn't stick for him. The other
big takeaway is that he is somebody who also has
a good sense of humor about himself and his place
in the pantheon, and there is no getting around it.
Once you play Superman, there is always some part of
you that is going to be identified with Superman. Well,
this whole process must have also been good research for you,
(07:58):
cause know you are working away away on a book
about the history of DC Studios in Hollywood. We will
definitely check in with you at the time that that
book is ready, because very interested to get your perspective
on the long arc of DC in Hollywood.
Speaker 3 (08:13):
And it's a long arc, yes, and a book coming
soon in twenty twenty seven.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
Thank you, Tatiana, appreciate it. Now Brian Steinberg brings us
up to speed on the big picture of TV advertising sales. Disney, NBC,
Universal and other heavyweights have wrapped up the advanced advertising
sales process conducted every year under the broad heading of
upfront sales. Brian Steinberg, thanks for joining me.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
Nobody covers the upfront sales process like you. You've been
busy the last couple of days. Tell me what's the
temperature of the market this year.
Speaker 5 (08:50):
It's surprisingly upbeat because I think people were afraid the
tariffs and the trunk transition. We're going to pass a pall.
But what we're seeing is actually I think we're seeing
upturns of dollars, most of them for sports, the NFL,
Super Bowl, Winter Olympics, and World Cup.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
That tax back to the oldest principle of TV advertising, right,
get me a big group at the same time, which
is counter to the trends in the business over the
last couple of years.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
That's right. It's in the streaming era.
Speaker 5 (09:18):
It's much harder to find big audiences all watching the
same thing at the same time. That's what your big
average hiders like Pizza Hutt and McDonald's and Nikeness they want.
It's harder to make a dollar after advertising as you're
trying to find your consumer streaming this year and streaming
that there. So sports and other live events that award
(09:38):
shows and other kids of specials are what really drive
currency now and drive interest.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
We know that the linear advertising market has been weak
within the world of sports. Are dollars growing, Dollars are going.
Speaker 5 (09:51):
We're seeing more dollars come in a quite of We've
had Fox, NBC, and Disney all announced their results. Others
are so were so waiting for in every report, they
say that the money can then to sports is going up.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
What's really happening here?
Speaker 5 (10:04):
A lot of companies that they wouldn't spend on sports
proper and gamble and other something that were more towards
female and family consumers are saying, gee, I need to
reach audiences. Where can I do it for a good
price and your reasonable amount of money?
Speaker 2 (10:18):
Sports is it. That's where you get the big audiences.
Speaker 5 (10:20):
So even companies that weren't putting money into baseball and
football are doing so now and then because they know
they need to reach large numbers all at once.
Speaker 1 (10:28):
Twenty twenty six is going to be a big year.
We're going to have the Winter Olympics across NBC universal platforms.
We're going to have the World Cup on Fox and Telemundo.
Outside of the sports realm, in the more entertainment side,
live events, big, flashy spectacles are I would imagine are
also pretty attractive in this climate.
Speaker 5 (10:47):
MBC is doing the tenniversary of the network this year.
They've got last year they did NBC's SNL fifty anniversary.
They create, you know, landmark milestones and events that you
can take it into You saw can do a Jaws
anniversary a few weekends ago. Further sum, they're trying to
create things that people can gravitate to celebrate, and some
of the stouts, well, I think you're going seeing more
of that. I do think it's getting harder and harder
(11:08):
to generate the same ad without sports. You saw Disney
this week announced they were flat. In other words, they
had the same amountline of this is into last year
sports went off, but the overall number was concurring, which
means they didn't increase their dollars over last year.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
Flat is hard when Disney, after so much investment in streaming,
Disney needs to see growth. I think there's such intense
business reporting on the upfront that the big public companies
have been forced to put out the flag and say, okay,
we've drawn the curtain and give some guidance on their
upfront haul because it is so material to their results.
Disney has done that. Who else has kind of has
(11:43):
reached that point where they're saying, yep, we're done with
the upfront.
Speaker 5 (11:46):
We've had NBC, Fox, and Disney all put out releases,
which is unusual time years ago. You had to kind
of figured out for yourself they would give some guidance
for someone, but they wouldn't actually confirm it watch the
Blue Moon. They would put an SEC filing out or
something like that. Universion talk about on their earnings call,
they're still negotiating. We've heard Netflix say things are robus
or up on the up stint on their earnings call,
(12:07):
but nothing more formal.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
So we're shilling in paramount.
Speaker 5 (12:10):
And for Warner, I think Warner, we ca all agree,
faces more headwinds.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
They've lost their NBA right.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
No question that this is the ripple effects of those
NBA changes are now are now being felt. Amazon and Netflix,
How are both of these companies impacting the ad market
this time around? They certainly have a lot of heft
and a lot of inventory, a.
Speaker 5 (12:30):
Lot inventory if they put dumped a whole bunch of
new inventory on the mart, which has caused rates for
streaming to go down, especially last year, big rollbacks in
streaming rates because of the new supply. I think Netflix
and Amazon have had to learn some lessons. They came
in very hot, devanding very aggressive upticks and rates. They
had to learn that who says the market here is
not the media seller but the person who's buying the
(12:52):
ad time Apple, Procter and Gamble, Unilever. It's their money,
not Netflix at Amazon until they agree to spend it,
So if their rates aren't great, they won't be spending.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
It would seem Brian that every upfront conversation has to
end with a question about the upfront process itself. Let
me ask you specifically, do you see real signs that
AI and automation in maybe constant auction of ad time
every nanosecond. Do you see any indication that that is
going to change the work of the media buyers that
are schooling the new entrants on how the business is done.
Speaker 5 (13:24):
There's no question that more ad time is being bought
by algorithms. And it's not just the upfront there's the
twenty four seven year round market for ad time. Because
streaming there's more stuff to come, worry about and figure out.
But I think this process still goes on people clearly
so like I believe that by ad time cheaper and
you mon't get it later on, and that's why this
process is still around, especially with Super Bowl and big
(13:47):
sporting events still in the office. I think when McDonald's
and prompters say they don't want to do it anymore,
it will stop very quickly.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
Here we are at the end of July, talking about
where things stand in You and I both remember the
go go nineties when they says for the big networks
would be wrapped up in forty eight seventy two hours.
Then let me ask you, was it really done in
that seventy two hour in a crazy rush or was
that just for show because there was so much money
slashing around that everybody figured out, we'll figure it out.
Speaker 5 (14:14):
I remember in those times, really they're buying primetime TV.
That was the biggest thing you could buy, and only
so much of it. There wasn't like primetime now as anytime.
Speaker 1 (14:23):
At the risk of sounding like Archie Bunker, those were
the days. Thank you, Brian, Thank you. As we close
out today's episode, here are a few things we're watching for.
Paramount Global reports it's second quarter earnings after market closed today.
We may get some updates on the sky Dance Media
merger process. Stay close to Variety dot com for all
(14:45):
the news. Michael Gracie, the director of the Greatest Showman,
is planning a stage musical about the life of the
late great tenor Luciano Pavarotti. Our Nick Vivarellian Rome reports
that the Australian director is working with Pavarotti's widow on
the project. On Friday, I'm heading to the LA Convention
Center to check out k kon the K Pop and
(15:07):
Korean Culture fan Convention. I'll get some on the ground
reporting to give listeners a sense of just how intense
this fandom is. So come back Monday before we go.
Congrats to actors Jason Isaacs, Natasha Rothwell, and John Grease.
They will be faded with the Creative Coalition's Humanitarian Awards.
(15:28):
They'll be presented September thirteenth, the day before the Emmy Awards,
at a ceremony in Beverly Hills. Thanks for listening. This
episode was written and reported by me Cynthia Littleton, with
contributions from Tatiana Siegel and Brian Steinberg. It was edited
by Aaron Greenwald. Stick's Next hick Picks. Please leave us
a review at the podcast platform of your choice, and
(15:50):
don't forget to tune in Monday for another episode of
Daily Variety.
Welcome to Daily Variety, your daily dose of news and
analysis for entertainment industry insiders. It's Thursday, July thirty, first,
twenty twenty five. I'm your host, Cynthia Littleton. I am
co editor in chief of Variety alongside Ramin Setuda. I'm
in LA He's in New York, and Variety has reporters
around the world covering the business of entertainment. In today's episode,
(00:30):
we'll talk with Tatiana Siegel about her profile of the
actor who has spent more time in Superman's blue tights
than any other. Dean Kine and Brian Steinberg gives us
an update on where upfront advertising sales stand for the
major conglomerates. The biggest draw for blurb buyers, according to Brian,
is sports, sports, and more sports. But before we get
(00:52):
to that, here are a few headlines just in this
morning that you need to know. Comcast's second quarter results
reflected the sun in advertising and the drip drip drip
of cord cutting.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
Profit.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
However, got a boost from the four hundred and forty
million dollar check that Disney wrote to Comcast earlier this
year to complete the buy out of Hulu. Wednesday had
to be a rough day at Warner Brothers. The studio
laid off fifty two people in the motion picture group.
Most of the cuts came in marketing, production, strategy, operations,
and the Theater Ventures division. Netflix renewed animated comedy Long
(01:29):
Story Short for season two. They must be high on
the show, given that season one doesn't premiere until August
twenty second. It's from BoJack Horseman creator Rafael Bob Waksburg.
Now we turn to conversations with Variety journalists about news
and trends in show business. Next up, Tatiana Siegeal, Variety's
(01:50):
executive editor of Film and Media, details her profile of
Dean Kine and why she wanted to talk with the
Trump loving star of Lois and Clark. Tatiana Siegel, thank
you so much for joining me today on a hot
day in New York City.
Speaker 3 (02:05):
Pleasure to be here.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
Tatiana, you have a really compelling profile in this week's
issue on actor Dean kan What sparked your interest in
checking in with him?
Speaker 2 (02:14):
Now?
Speaker 3 (02:15):
Basically, Superman is in the zeitgeist right now this summer.
It's the summer of Superman, and only eight actors have
appeared as the Man of Steel over the years in
live action films and TV series. So I did a
little research and I said, well, Dean Kane actually has
(02:37):
probably been in the suit more than anyone else, with
the exception of Tom Welling, who starred in Smallville and
that ran for ten seasons. The original Superman George Reeves,
he was in slightly more episodes than Dean Kin. I
think it was one hundred and four to eighty seven,
(02:59):
but Dean Kane means Lois and Clark ran for forty
six minutes versus thirty minutes for the George Reeds Superman.
So I thought to myself, this is somebody who is
clearly vocal about his politics as a Trump supporter, and
also has this deep knowledge of the character. He might
(03:22):
make a really good interview.
Speaker 4 (03:25):
Okay, Los, Okay, I've been rehearsing this for months.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
Let's see if I can get it right.
Speaker 4 (03:31):
I know this is a shock, and I wanted to
be the one to tell you so that you could
understand how hard this has been for me, how I've
carried this secret by myself, and how long I have
wanted to tell you. But when I decided to become Superman,
(03:52):
I became a target.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
And so anybody close to you became a target.
Speaker 5 (03:58):
And it just got more complicated when you realized.
Speaker 4 (04:00):
You, which was about two minutes after I met you.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
I love that you brought data to it. You crunch
the numbers on time in the suit. I also appreciate
that you went into that interview with a very specific question,
not to grill him on his personal politics, but to
talk to him about how him being vocal about his
support of MAGA and President Trump, which is definitely not
the norm, not the conventional wisdom in Hollywood or New York,
(04:27):
in the kind of the hotbeds of the business, how
just that stance has affected his career as an actor,
as a personality in our business. Did you find him
to be earnestly engaging with you in talking about exactly that.
Speaker 3 (04:42):
Absolutely, he was very earnest and candid. He also has
a lot of confidence and doesn't really seem to worry
about will I be a pariah in Hollywood for being
a Trump supporter. The people that I called for secondary voices,
like Greg Burlante, they got right on the phone. Dean
(05:06):
was very eager to talk about playing gay in the
two thousand romantic comedy The Broken Hearts Club, which was
Greg Burlanti's first movie. He said he loved playing gay
and he did it again in another movie. And what
Greg mentioned that I found really interesting is like the
context of the times is like nobody wanted to play
(05:27):
gay back then.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
Especially a rising star leading man. That was not the
move that your agent would have suggested. First.
Speaker 3 (05:35):
Dean was kind of like, I didn't understand the fuss
then or now. As somebody on his team said, well,
people might think you're gay in real life, and he said, well,
then I've done my job.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
Another thing that he is very direct about is that
he experienced in his time on Lois and Clark, in
his time in The Tights, that he experienced some significant
sexual harassment.
Speaker 3 (05:58):
That is true, and he talked about it, but only
very briefly and would not identify the person and said
he didn't want to comment any further on the matter.
But there had always been rumblings. Dean seemed like somebody
who was pretty straightforward, straight shooter and did not really
(06:22):
indulge in a lot of oh woe is me kind
of talk. It was just like, yeah, this happened, and
I'm going to move on. And I think he moved
on at the time, and he moved on in the
interview with me.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
Another interesting thing that I didn't fully appreciate is that
he has tapped into this very vibrant strain of independent
production that has done far outside of La New York
and Chicago, independently produced and financed faith based movies that
run on certain channels, that sometimes even do smaller circuits
in sort of Bible belt markets. And it sounds like
(06:56):
he's really invested as a producer, director, star of some
of these films.
Speaker 3 (07:01):
Yes, and it's sort of a parallel universe that operates
right near Hollywood, but not quite in Hollywood. It's becoming
more and more of an economic force if you look
at the chosen these things. So it's not to be dismissed.
He said that he loves making these movies and he's
made sixteen of them now because he feels like they
(07:24):
showcase strong family cohesion, something that is really pushing strong
positive messages and we are in a dark time.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
From your story, you get the sense that he really
means this isn't it isn't stick for him. The other
big takeaway is that he is somebody who also has
a good sense of humor about himself and his place
in the pantheon, and there is no getting around it.
Once you play Superman, there is always some part of
you that is going to be identified with Superman. Well,
this whole process must have also been good research for you,
(07:58):
cause know you are working away away on a book
about the history of DC Studios in Hollywood. We will
definitely check in with you at the time that that
book is ready, because very interested to get your perspective
on the long arc of DC in Hollywood.
Speaker 3 (08:13):
And it's a long arc, yes, and a book coming
soon in twenty twenty seven.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
Thank you, Tatiana, appreciate it. Now Brian Steinberg brings us
up to speed on the big picture of TV advertising sales. Disney, NBC,
Universal and other heavyweights have wrapped up the advanced advertising
sales process conducted every year under the broad heading of
upfront sales. Brian Steinberg, thanks for joining me.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
Nobody covers the upfront sales process like you. You've been
busy the last couple of days. Tell me what's the
temperature of the market this year.
Speaker 5 (08:50):
It's surprisingly upbeat because I think people were afraid the
tariffs and the trunk transition. We're going to pass a pall.
But what we're seeing is actually I think we're seeing
upturns of dollars, most of them for sports, the NFL,
Super Bowl, Winter Olympics, and World Cup.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
That tax back to the oldest principle of TV advertising, right,
get me a big group at the same time, which
is counter to the trends in the business over the
last couple of years.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
That's right. It's in the streaming era.
Speaker 5 (09:18):
It's much harder to find big audiences all watching the
same thing at the same time. That's what your big
average hiders like Pizza Hutt and McDonald's and Nikeness they want.
It's harder to make a dollar after advertising as you're
trying to find your consumer streaming this year and streaming
that there. So sports and other live events that award
(09:38):
shows and other kids of specials are what really drive
currency now and drive interest.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
We know that the linear advertising market has been weak
within the world of sports. Are dollars growing, Dollars are going.
Speaker 5 (09:51):
We're seeing more dollars come in a quite of We've
had Fox, NBC, and Disney all announced their results. Others
are so were so waiting for in every report, they
say that the money can then to sports is going up.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
What's really happening here?
Speaker 5 (10:04):
A lot of companies that they wouldn't spend on sports
proper and gamble and other something that were more towards
female and family consumers are saying, gee, I need to
reach audiences. Where can I do it for a good
price and your reasonable amount of money?
Speaker 2 (10:18):
Sports is it. That's where you get the big audiences.
Speaker 5 (10:20):
So even companies that weren't putting money into baseball and
football are doing so now and then because they know
they need to reach large numbers all at once.
Speaker 1 (10:28):
Twenty twenty six is going to be a big year.
We're going to have the Winter Olympics across NBC universal platforms.
We're going to have the World Cup on Fox and Telemundo.
Outside of the sports realm, in the more entertainment side,
live events, big, flashy spectacles are I would imagine are
also pretty attractive in this climate.
Speaker 5 (10:47):
MBC is doing the tenniversary of the network this year.
They've got last year they did NBC's SNL fifty anniversary.
They create, you know, landmark milestones and events that you
can take it into You saw can do a Jaws
anniversary a few weekends ago. Further sum, they're trying to
create things that people can gravitate to celebrate, and some
of the stouts, well, I think you're going seeing more
of that. I do think it's getting harder and harder
(11:08):
to generate the same ad without sports. You saw Disney
this week announced they were flat. In other words, they
had the same amountline of this is into last year
sports went off, but the overall number was concurring, which
means they didn't increase their dollars over last year.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
Flat is hard when Disney, after so much investment in streaming,
Disney needs to see growth. I think there's such intense
business reporting on the upfront that the big public companies
have been forced to put out the flag and say, okay,
we've drawn the curtain and give some guidance on their
upfront haul because it is so material to their results.
Disney has done that. Who else has kind of has
(11:43):
reached that point where they're saying, yep, we're done with
the upfront.
Speaker 5 (11:46):
We've had NBC, Fox, and Disney all put out releases,
which is unusual time years ago. You had to kind
of figured out for yourself they would give some guidance
for someone, but they wouldn't actually confirm it watch the
Blue Moon. They would put an SEC filing out or
something like that. Universion talk about on their earnings call,
they're still negotiating. We've heard Netflix say things are robus
or up on the up stint on their earnings call,
(12:07):
but nothing more formal.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
So we're shilling in paramount.
Speaker 5 (12:10):
And for Warner, I think Warner, we ca all agree,
faces more headwinds.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
They've lost their NBA right.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
No question that this is the ripple effects of those
NBA changes are now are now being felt. Amazon and Netflix,
How are both of these companies impacting the ad market
this time around? They certainly have a lot of heft
and a lot of inventory, a.
Speaker 5 (12:30):
Lot inventory if they put dumped a whole bunch of
new inventory on the mart, which has caused rates for
streaming to go down, especially last year, big rollbacks in
streaming rates because of the new supply. I think Netflix
and Amazon have had to learn some lessons. They came
in very hot, devanding very aggressive upticks and rates. They
had to learn that who says the market here is
not the media seller but the person who's buying the
(12:52):
ad time Apple, Procter and Gamble, Unilever. It's their money,
not Netflix at Amazon until they agree to spend it,
So if their rates aren't great, they won't be spending.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
It would seem Brian that every upfront conversation has to
end with a question about the upfront process itself. Let
me ask you specifically, do you see real signs that
AI and automation in maybe constant auction of ad time
every nanosecond. Do you see any indication that that is
going to change the work of the media buyers that
are schooling the new entrants on how the business is done.
Speaker 5 (13:24):
There's no question that more ad time is being bought
by algorithms. And it's not just the upfront there's the
twenty four seven year round market for ad time. Because
streaming there's more stuff to come, worry about and figure out.
But I think this process still goes on people clearly
so like I believe that by ad time cheaper and
you mon't get it later on, and that's why this
process is still around, especially with Super Bowl and big
(13:47):
sporting events still in the office. I think when McDonald's
and prompters say they don't want to do it anymore,
it will stop very quickly.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
Here we are at the end of July, talking about
where things stand in You and I both remember the
go go nineties when they says for the big networks
would be wrapped up in forty eight seventy two hours.
Then let me ask you, was it really done in
that seventy two hour in a crazy rush or was
that just for show because there was so much money
slashing around that everybody figured out, we'll figure it out.
Speaker 5 (14:14):
I remember in those times, really they're buying primetime TV.
That was the biggest thing you could buy, and only
so much of it. There wasn't like primetime now as anytime.
Speaker 1 (14:23):
At the risk of sounding like Archie Bunker, those were
the days. Thank you, Brian, Thank you. As we close
out today's episode, here are a few things we're watching for.
Paramount Global reports it's second quarter earnings after market closed today.
We may get some updates on the sky Dance Media
merger process. Stay close to Variety dot com for all
(14:45):
the news. Michael Gracie, the director of the Greatest Showman,
is planning a stage musical about the life of the
late great tenor Luciano Pavarotti. Our Nick Vivarellian Rome reports
that the Australian director is working with Pavarotti's widow on
the project. On Friday, I'm heading to the LA Convention
Center to check out k kon the K Pop and
(15:07):
Korean Culture fan Convention. I'll get some on the ground
reporting to give listeners a sense of just how intense
this fandom is. So come back Monday before we go.
Congrats to actors Jason Isaacs, Natasha Rothwell, and John Grease.
They will be faded with the Creative Coalition's Humanitarian Awards.
(15:28):
They'll be presented September thirteenth, the day before the Emmy Awards,
at a ceremony in Beverly Hills. Thanks for listening. This
episode was written and reported by me Cynthia Littleton, with
contributions from Tatiana Siegel and Brian Steinberg. It was edited
by Aaron Greenwald. Stick's Next hick Picks. Please leave us
a review at the podcast platform of your choice, and
(15:50):
don't forget to tune in Monday for another episode of
Daily Variety.
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