June 4, 2025 • 21 mins
Join Host Lynn Hoffman for the episode of Music Saved Me with the former frontman from the band Hinder, Austin John Winkler. He has a new project called "the Founder" and he discusses how music played such a vital role in his recovery and opened his eyes to getting healthy to spurn on his creative juices. Austin was down and out for a long period of time due to his challenges and music truly played a vital role in saving him.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Music Saved Me.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
I think that being vulnerable is a very important part
of an artist's job. If you're sending, if you're writing
songs about your life, even you know, like be honest,
Be as honest as you can, because deep down you
know you're human. Everybody's human on this on this earth,
and somebody's gonna feel the exact same way if you're
(00:21):
just honest with yourself.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
I'm Lynn Hoffman, the host of the Music Saved Me podcast,
the podcast that goes behind the scenes with musicians and
entertainers and explores the healing power of music.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Now.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
If you like this podcast, thank you, and please follow
our companion podcast hosted by the incredible buzz Night, called
Taken a Walk, which is available wherever you get your
podcasts now. Like most celebrities from the days of MTV,
my next guest is a multi platinum selling rock star
and former frontman who is no stranger to the temptations
(00:55):
of addiction. After a decade of fighting for his own survival,
Austin Winkler, formerly of the band Hinder, has done the
hard work of finding his footing and rekindling his lost
love of music. Can you believe lost Love? I can't
even believe I'm saying that. With a brand new musical
entity he created called The Founder, which symbolizes his artistic rebirth.
(01:17):
He also has a brand new six track EP called
Walking Dead, which we'll talk about, and eagerness to use
his new found freedom to help others who are working
through those same demons by letting them all know that
they are not alone in their fight. Just the perfect
guest for Music Saved Me, Austin John Winkler. Welcome to
the show. It is so good to see you and
(01:37):
have you here.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
Thank you so much, Lean and it's good to be it.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
Well, first, let's just talk a little bit about this
new entity, the Founder. It's a sanctuary for where you're
creating all of your new musical creations. Can you tell
me a little bit about that.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
And when that started, Yeah, I wanted to just get
in and I just have this one song, it's actually
the title track Walking Dead, and I was just like,
all right, I'm just gonna do one song and just
do a single, and it kind of it really turned
out like know to me, really raw, a lot more
(02:16):
raw than than kind of my polished stuff that I've
done in the past. And and the lyrics are a
little more raw, and I was like, Okay, well I'm
gonna do another one. I'm gonna do another one. And
so I just I kept on recording him, and it
just I saw this body of work, and I saw
this whole kind of new approach to to recording, and
you know, I didn't want to ever put out anything
(02:39):
again that I wasn't going to be in full control of.
And so that's kind of how the Founder Was was born,
is that I I was able to put my whole
heart into something again, you know, for the first time
in a while. And I told myself, if I ever
(03:02):
do that again, I'm going to make sure that I'm
only putting in all the creative into it. So can
can you.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
Share that moment? Was that? Was there a moment like
that epiphany that you realize that music was going to
be this this lifeline during your darkest times considering your
past with music.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
Absolutely. Yeah. Well, to be honest, that means we have
to go back even further to like to twenty twenty.
And I had just I was I was on dialysis
because my liver and kidney had failed due to a
excess of years of partying. I was. I was what
(03:41):
you'd call a disposal. I would whatever I can get
my hands done. I was going to do. And I
was like nine months on dialysis, and I was strumming
the guitar and I was just I hadn't I hadn't
been in love with music for a while, just just
because I've been through so much in this industry. And
(04:03):
I started writing a song called super Jaded, and I
like hit a C chord on a chorus, And that
was the moment, at least for me, that I fell
back in love with music. I after I had written
that song and heard it back, like I cried in
(04:24):
my hotel room at like two am, just like I
could feel myself just like my body releasing and from
this music healing vibration, like me hearing myself going, you
know what, I think I still got this thing in
me And yeah, that's that. That just like started like
a complete new love for music and for me, going,
(04:48):
you know what, I'm I'm I may give this thing
another go.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
Well, I mean, you have spoken very openly as you
are now about your battle with the addiction and the
dialysis was you know, so young. It just it blew
me way that you were able to. I mean that
truly is a low moment. Yeah, for someone sitting there
thinking about their life. I mean it's right in the
palm of your hands. Yeah, to do with it's pretty incredible.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
What thank you?
Speaker 1 (05:12):
How did those experiences change your perspective on life and music?
Speaker 2 (05:17):
Man, I'll tell you, like, I'm still processing it. It's
still something that was just so crazy. It's like somebody
picked me up and shook me and then set me
back down. And I still I'm still processing it, Like
even this is this is me processing it. Because as
soon as I found out that what happens, I was
(05:41):
I was alloted. The doctor said, okay, you know what,
We're going to take you off the Alisis for two weeks,
and my brain didn't even think about it. I'm like,
I gotta go record this song. So he took me
off the Alisis for two weeks. I flew to Nashville.
We recorded Super Jaded in this like tiny shed of
my guitar players now is crazy as that sounds. And
(06:02):
then I go back. I fly back. It's affecting him
to get back on dialysis. And he was like, you
know what, We're good. We're gonna we're gonna keep you
off of it for two months or three months or
whatever it was. And I was like, okay, crazy, So
I haven't even still had time to process all of
that crazy stuff. But I mean, I will tell you
what it's like to walk in to dialysis, like a
(06:26):
dialysis center at five am, four days a week, five
hours at a time, and I'm you're thirty seven years
old at the time, thirty eight years or sold the time,
and I'm everybody else is seventy and the only way
I'm the youngest guy in there, and everybody's just in there,
just kind of sitting like this, you know. And I
(06:47):
was like, is this I had accepted it. I'd accepted
this is my life now, I guess. But I was
diligent and what the doctors told me to do. And
whenever he said two weeks off, I my book, my
flight the next day and I was out and hit
the ground. Role.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
Yeah, that is just so powerful what you just said.
I mean, literally, you're cleaning your blood, which is what
we need to live the rest of our lives. And
you got that one moment of clarity where maybe you
could turn this around. So do you think music had
an impact as well in your healing. When you got
(07:24):
to performing that after you left for a couple of weeks.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Oh, absolutely, absolutely. I mean it's it's more therapy now
than it's ever been, even when I first started. I
feel much more connected to what I'm putting out now,
And not that I wasn't connected to it. I was
just I was literally a different person than I mean
coming out at twenty four years old. I was that
(07:49):
party guy. I was everything on those records, like that's
who I was at the time, and I've always been
attached to it.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
It was like a machine, it was.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
Absolutely, I'm curious about Music Cares and in other support
systems that sort of played a role in your recovery.
How did they work and how important do you think
it is for artists, especially artists to have access to
these types of resources.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
And Music Cares has done so much for me whenever
I was really in need of a lot of help
and they took me in, they took care of like
my entire give me a scholarship for my rehab ninety days.
I mean, they really take care of their own and
(08:36):
I'd love to do anything if they ever have anything
to do, I'd love to volunteer my time to help
them out. I mean they truly help, really help people out.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
How did you find out about them?
Speaker 2 (08:49):
My therapists at the time was connected to them in
Malibu and she hooked me up with them.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
Wow, there has to be I mean, being in this
industry as long as you have and I have on
on my role, it's amazing how little there is put
out for artists, you know, when they're the ones entertaining
the masses who need it so badly. They're providing this therapy,
but they don't have any access to it or understanding
(09:23):
that it's even out there for them.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
You know, I'll tell you this, Like my therapist now,
who does amazing work, she's, uh, she's started to have
to go to like Coachella and these big festivals and
she'll have a tent and she's like, well, these artists,
these artists are too big, they're they're they're they're not
going to have any time. And she is booked solid.
Like she'll go in and she'll be booked from the
(09:47):
time she gets there. Because these because people nowadays, I
mean they're actually they are starting to wake up and
realize that, hey, this business is designed to isolate you,
like no matter the bigger you get, the smaller your
world kits. And she's providing safe space for big artists
(10:07):
to go in and be like, you know what, this
is what I'm dealing with on the road, and this
is what I can't deal with and stuff like that,
and it's really quite remarkable to see that. I love
seeing that.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
Yeah, me too. Was there a specific song or like
a moment that you felt that music truly saved you?
Speaker 2 (10:25):
You know, like I said, I think it was that
super jaded song. I mean when I say save, I
mean like music saves me in general. Right when I
say save, I mean that made me fall in love
with music again, meaning that I needed that to fall
back in line with something that saved my whole life.
Like I mean, before I even started hinder at nineteen,
(10:48):
I was getting arrested and I was like I was,
I was a train wreck of a nineteen year old kid.
And a couple of weeks later I started Hindering, I
got on line. You know, I felt like I found
my calling of stick to in music. Yeah you're or
you're going to get off track. And that's what happened,
(11:10):
you know, whenever I let whenever I ended up leaving
the band in twenty thirteen is that I didn't have
that main thing is my support anymore, I felt and
I got off the rails man, like seven years of
some pretty dark stuff that I ended up getting into.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
So yeah, yeah, I mean, and it's true you don't
even realize you know, how vulnerable you are and how
much you give that you don't check yourself like it
brings meaning to the word, you know, oxygen mask on
you first and then you can help others. But right
sometimes you.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
So much to me.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
Yeah, how does vulnerability play into your songwriting and help
you with your process with healing or with pain?
Speaker 2 (11:57):
Man, It's it's something that that I feel like I'm getting,
I mean even more, I'm getting even more personal, I
feel like with especially with this founder stuff, because I
think that being vulnerable is a very important part of
an artist's job. If you're sending, if you're writing songs
about your life, even you know, like be honest, be
(12:17):
as honest as you can, because deep down you know
you're human. Everybody's human on this on this earth, and
somebody's going to feel the exact same way. If you're
just honest with yourself. I mean, look at lips of
an Angel. To be honest, like that that happened to me,
and I wrote it the next day, like and it
was just fifteen twenty minutes, but it was something so
(12:40):
true and very vulnerable. I mean it ended up actually
causing me a lot of files with my personal life.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
But how crazy is that? You know something, So.
Speaker 2 (12:49):
I've been vulnerable since day one, you know.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Just trying to figure out how to work it so
that you're protected. You know. It's funny. I was reading
after stepping away from Hinder that you had mentioned this.
I couldn't believe this. I said it in the open
that you you sort of fell out of love with music,
which is incredible. So you must have really been really
in a tough spot. What helped you rekindle that passion?
(13:14):
I think the quote was something like I learned how
to be from MTV but then it almost that almost
ruined you.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
Really, Yeah, that was that was something that I mean,
it's I'm kind of half kidding but kind of not.
Like I loved watching MTV as a kid, and I
wanted to be a part of that world. And you know,
I read the dirt right before I went out on
tour like it was. It was all kind of playing
(13:41):
out exactly there, I think, you know what I mean.
And I went down all the steps so you know,
I married the girl in the music video, like I
did every thing you shouldn't do. I mean, as wrong,
as as crazy as that sounds like, that's kind of
how I feel like that in TV raised me kind
of thing, you know.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
Yeah, but how like it's amazing to me that you
even went back well to begin with. But but in
twenty three though, you released Lips of an Angel again
as a duet and there was like three million downloads
and you had been off the scene for quite a while.
That must have been an incredible feeling to know that
your fans are still out there craving for more.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
No, that's that was. That was a surreal experience. I mean,
I couldn't believe that I was back in the booth
with the producer Brian House, who did the first one,
and it was you know, Shalns did an amazing job,
and it was it was surreal. It's it's it's amazing
to know that there's still people out there that are
digging the music.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
Has your approach changed it all? In terms of how
you write songs since you're entered recovery.
Speaker 2 (14:48):
No, like I said, it's like with this founder stuff,
it's just a little more raw and you know it's
it's very personal. It's it hasn't changed, like I said.
I mean, I've been since day one, like I've I've
laid it out there as as clear as day, as
long as I as long as I've been writing songs.
Speaker 1 (15:08):
How important is it for you to help others who
are challenged?
Speaker 2 (15:14):
Man? I read every single comment uh that that people
write on songs that I'm a part of, and it's
very important to me because I know I've been on
the other side of that, and I still I'm always
on the other side of that. Like music, music helps
me all the time daily. And to be able to
(15:35):
write something that connects with somebody who is going through
the same thing as you, and to be able to
go on stage and sing that and then sing it
back to you is an indescribable feeling. Like that is
more rewarding than any amount of numbers in a bank
account or any anything I can own. Like that is
(15:56):
something I share with the fans, and that is something
that is sacred to me.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
It's so special that you do that and also that
you care enough that you want to do that through
your music to help others, and is it's a therapy
for everyone involved. Really it lifts everybody up.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
Yeah. Absolutely, Like you go to the show and it's like, Okay,
it's like a little church or whatever for people who
are going through heavy shit. Like that's what that's what
it is.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
It's pretty amazing. How do you think that the music industry?
I know we talked about this earlier in terms of
charitable organizations that are out there, but what do you
think that the music industry as a whole could do
to better support its artists. I mean, we're in a
whole new world. It's a lot different than before where
we were just apples and oranges represented by agencies, and
(16:46):
now it's really you know, you can pick and choose
who you want to represent you, what message you want
to put out there.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
That's it for sure. I Mean my advice that I
would even tell my younger self would be like, dude,
it's it's okay to say no, you know what I mean, Like,
you don't have to do every single thing that gets
thrown into your lap. I mean that that drains you.
It doesn't matter what kind of line of work you're
in if you're just saying yes to everything, especially if
(17:13):
you're doing something you love and it starts to get
tarnished with with so much that they pile on your plate.
I mean, the bigger you get, the busier you get.
And I mean I would, I would tell my younger
I tell my younger self to be like dude, say
no to once in a while, like get some rest,
like like it's important for you to take care of
you before you can take care of you know, the
(17:34):
person on stage. So I mean, I think, like I said,
them having you know, therapy tints instead of you know,
schwag tints. I think we'll play, will go a long
way and keep keep big artists you know or small waters,
it doesn't matter who it is, keep them in line
and keep them grounded from the small success you know
(17:57):
that we have had. It was sking crazy out there.
It was crazy.
Speaker 1 (18:05):
I remember. I mean I was working actually at a
radio station not long before your first real big hit
song came on about twenty years ago up in Boston,
and I just remember you were on heavy rotation. Lips
of an Angel was just a smash, but you had
a lot of other songs as well. You were, you know,
rising up, and just as I was leaving town heading
(18:26):
to New York, and it was exciting to see that
you've been able to really turn this whole thing around,
because it really is inspiring, and that you're willing to
put yourself out there for your fans, as vulnerable as
you are, to show them that even people like yourself
has issues that you have to work through. And it's
(18:47):
you know, the biggest thing for me is when people
who rise to the big levels have such a responsibility,
and I always felt like you should never squander that
responsibility to help others when you have forged your own
path like that, because there's so many who don't know how.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
Right right, No, it's it's definitely you know, and you
don't I mean, you don't realize the responsibility you have obviously,
I I you know, it was hard for me to
see that until I was out of.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
How can you honestly, when you've got the machine behind
you like that, You're like, what stage am I? What
town am I at?
Speaker 2 (19:25):
You're definitely somewhat of a robot in some sense. Is
the arrows pointing you. You're just you're following a path
and you don't even know you're just following the person
to the stage, or you're following the person to the
radio station or the hotel or whatever. Like you're just
you're you're an autopilot sometimes and it's really really good
(19:45):
to not do that. And if you can do some
things to break that up, that would be great.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
What would you like your legacy to be, not just
as a musician, but as someone who's overcome significant personal challenges.
Speaker 2 (19:58):
Just to be honest, be just somebody that that fights
for what he loves, Like I love music again, and
you know, I have days where I'm like, am I
still so good? Or is this is this worthy of
of of going out and touring and stuff like that?
And it's you know, I think it's just it's going
(20:21):
to be this legacy or whatever, just somebody that obviously
you loved music and wanted to share his music with
the world and wanted to connect with people. Because this
this rock or whatever that we're spinning on there or
is insanely malicious. I mean, it can it can be
(20:43):
a beautiful, beautiful place, and it can be so malicious.
And I just want to be known from maybe taking
time whatever. I come to this city and it just
kind of pushes everything. Everything's on pause for a minute
and you can sit and scream your head up off
to rock and roll songs.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
I love it, and I love your videos especially, they're
really great. Austin John Winkler. Congratulations on getting to where
you are in life and your successes. Thank you for
sharing them with us on music. Save me and good
luck and everything that you do in the future, and
please come back and see us again when you have
(21:24):
your next EP or I dare I say album, but
everything's coming back so you never know.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Absolutely, thank you so much then,
Music Saved Me.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
I think that being vulnerable is a very important part
of an artist's job. If you're sending, if you're writing
songs about your life, even you know, like be honest,
Be as honest as you can, because deep down you
know you're human. Everybody's human on this on this earth,
and somebody's gonna feel the exact same way if you're
(00:21):
just honest with yourself.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
I'm Lynn Hoffman, the host of the Music Saved Me podcast,
the podcast that goes behind the scenes with musicians and
entertainers and explores the healing power of music.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Now.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
If you like this podcast, thank you, and please follow
our companion podcast hosted by the incredible buzz Night, called
Taken a Walk, which is available wherever you get your
podcasts now. Like most celebrities from the days of MTV,
my next guest is a multi platinum selling rock star
and former frontman who is no stranger to the temptations
(00:55):
of addiction. After a decade of fighting for his own survival,
Austin Winkler, formerly of the band Hinder, has done the
hard work of finding his footing and rekindling his lost
love of music. Can you believe lost Love? I can't
even believe I'm saying that. With a brand new musical
entity he created called The Founder, which symbolizes his artistic rebirth.
(01:17):
He also has a brand new six track EP called
Walking Dead, which we'll talk about, and eagerness to use
his new found freedom to help others who are working
through those same demons by letting them all know that
they are not alone in their fight. Just the perfect
guest for Music Saved Me, Austin John Winkler. Welcome to
the show. It is so good to see you and
(01:37):
have you here.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
Thank you so much, Lean and it's good to be it.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
Well, first, let's just talk a little bit about this
new entity, the Founder. It's a sanctuary for where you're
creating all of your new musical creations. Can you tell
me a little bit about that.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
And when that started, Yeah, I wanted to just get
in and I just have this one song, it's actually
the title track Walking Dead, and I was just like,
all right, I'm just gonna do one song and just
do a single, and it kind of it really turned
out like know to me, really raw, a lot more
(02:16):
raw than than kind of my polished stuff that I've
done in the past. And and the lyrics are a
little more raw, and I was like, Okay, well I'm
gonna do another one. I'm gonna do another one. And
so I just I kept on recording him, and it
just I saw this body of work, and I saw
this whole kind of new approach to to recording, and
you know, I didn't want to ever put out anything
(02:39):
again that I wasn't going to be in full control of.
And so that's kind of how the Founder Was was born,
is that I I was able to put my whole
heart into something again, you know, for the first time
in a while. And I told myself, if I ever
(03:02):
do that again, I'm going to make sure that I'm
only putting in all the creative into it. So can
can you.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
Share that moment? Was that? Was there a moment like
that epiphany that you realize that music was going to
be this this lifeline during your darkest times considering your
past with music.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
Absolutely. Yeah. Well, to be honest, that means we have
to go back even further to like to twenty twenty.
And I had just I was I was on dialysis
because my liver and kidney had failed due to a
excess of years of partying. I was. I was what
(03:41):
you'd call a disposal. I would whatever I can get
my hands done. I was going to do. And I
was like nine months on dialysis, and I was strumming
the guitar and I was just I hadn't I hadn't
been in love with music for a while, just just
because I've been through so much in this industry. And
(04:03):
I started writing a song called super Jaded, and I
like hit a C chord on a chorus, And that
was the moment, at least for me, that I fell
back in love with music. I after I had written
that song and heard it back, like I cried in
(04:24):
my hotel room at like two am, just like I
could feel myself just like my body releasing and from
this music healing vibration, like me hearing myself going, you
know what, I think I still got this thing in
me And yeah, that's that. That just like started like
a complete new love for music and for me, going,
(04:48):
you know what, I'm I'm I may give this thing
another go.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
Well, I mean, you have spoken very openly as you
are now about your battle with the addiction and the
dialysis was you know, so young. It just it blew
me way that you were able to. I mean that
truly is a low moment. Yeah, for someone sitting there
thinking about their life. I mean it's right in the
palm of your hands. Yeah, to do with it's pretty incredible.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
What thank you?
Speaker 1 (05:12):
How did those experiences change your perspective on life and music?
Speaker 2 (05:17):
Man, I'll tell you, like, I'm still processing it. It's
still something that was just so crazy. It's like somebody
picked me up and shook me and then set me
back down. And I still I'm still processing it, Like
even this is this is me processing it. Because as
soon as I found out that what happens, I was
(05:41):
I was alloted. The doctor said, okay, you know what,
We're going to take you off the Alisis for two weeks,
and my brain didn't even think about it. I'm like,
I gotta go record this song. So he took me
off the Alisis for two weeks. I flew to Nashville.
We recorded Super Jaded in this like tiny shed of
my guitar players now is crazy as that sounds. And
(06:02):
then I go back. I fly back. It's affecting him
to get back on dialysis. And he was like, you
know what, We're good. We're gonna we're gonna keep you
off of it for two months or three months or
whatever it was. And I was like, okay, crazy, So
I haven't even still had time to process all of
that crazy stuff. But I mean, I will tell you
what it's like to walk in to dialysis, like a
(06:26):
dialysis center at five am, four days a week, five
hours at a time, and I'm you're thirty seven years
old at the time, thirty eight years or sold the time,
and I'm everybody else is seventy and the only way
I'm the youngest guy in there, and everybody's just in there,
just kind of sitting like this, you know. And I
(06:47):
was like, is this I had accepted it. I'd accepted
this is my life now, I guess. But I was
diligent and what the doctors told me to do. And
whenever he said two weeks off, I my book, my
flight the next day and I was out and hit
the ground. Role.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
Yeah, that is just so powerful what you just said.
I mean, literally, you're cleaning your blood, which is what
we need to live the rest of our lives. And
you got that one moment of clarity where maybe you
could turn this around. So do you think music had
an impact as well in your healing. When you got
(07:24):
to performing that after you left for a couple of weeks.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Oh, absolutely, absolutely. I mean it's it's more therapy now
than it's ever been, even when I first started. I
feel much more connected to what I'm putting out now,
And not that I wasn't connected to it. I was
just I was literally a different person than I mean
coming out at twenty four years old. I was that
(07:49):
party guy. I was everything on those records, like that's
who I was at the time, and I've always been
attached to it.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
It was like a machine, it was.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
Absolutely, I'm curious about Music Cares and in other support
systems that sort of played a role in your recovery.
How did they work and how important do you think
it is for artists, especially artists to have access to
these types of resources.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
And Music Cares has done so much for me whenever
I was really in need of a lot of help
and they took me in, they took care of like
my entire give me a scholarship for my rehab ninety days.
I mean, they really take care of their own and
(08:36):
I'd love to do anything if they ever have anything
to do, I'd love to volunteer my time to help
them out. I mean they truly help, really help people out.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
How did you find out about them?
Speaker 2 (08:49):
My therapists at the time was connected to them in
Malibu and she hooked me up with them.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
Wow, there has to be I mean, being in this
industry as long as you have and I have on
on my role, it's amazing how little there is put
out for artists, you know, when they're the ones entertaining
the masses who need it so badly. They're providing this therapy,
but they don't have any access to it or understanding
(09:23):
that it's even out there for them.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
You know, I'll tell you this, Like my therapist now,
who does amazing work, she's, uh, she's started to have
to go to like Coachella and these big festivals and
she'll have a tent and she's like, well, these artists,
these artists are too big, they're they're they're they're not
going to have any time. And she is booked solid.
Like she'll go in and she'll be booked from the
(09:47):
time she gets there. Because these because people nowadays, I
mean they're actually they are starting to wake up and
realize that, hey, this business is designed to isolate you,
like no matter the bigger you get, the smaller your
world kits. And she's providing safe space for big artists
(10:07):
to go in and be like, you know what, this
is what I'm dealing with on the road, and this
is what I can't deal with and stuff like that,
and it's really quite remarkable to see that. I love
seeing that.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
Yeah, me too. Was there a specific song or like
a moment that you felt that music truly saved you?
Speaker 2 (10:25):
You know, like I said, I think it was that
super jaded song. I mean when I say save, I
mean like music saves me in general. Right when I
say save, I mean that made me fall in love
with music again, meaning that I needed that to fall
back in line with something that saved my whole life.
Like I mean, before I even started hinder at nineteen,
(10:48):
I was getting arrested and I was like I was,
I was a train wreck of a nineteen year old kid.
And a couple of weeks later I started Hindering, I
got on line. You know, I felt like I found
my calling of stick to in music. Yeah you're or
you're going to get off track. And that's what happened,
(11:10):
you know, whenever I let whenever I ended up leaving
the band in twenty thirteen is that I didn't have
that main thing is my support anymore, I felt and
I got off the rails man, like seven years of
some pretty dark stuff that I ended up getting into.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
So yeah, yeah, I mean, and it's true you don't
even realize you know, how vulnerable you are and how
much you give that you don't check yourself like it
brings meaning to the word, you know, oxygen mask on
you first and then you can help others. But right
sometimes you.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
So much to me.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
Yeah, how does vulnerability play into your songwriting and help
you with your process with healing or with pain?
Speaker 2 (11:57):
Man, It's it's something that that I feel like I'm getting,
I mean even more, I'm getting even more personal, I
feel like with especially with this founder stuff, because I
think that being vulnerable is a very important part of
an artist's job. If you're sending, if you're writing songs
about your life, even you know, like be honest, be
(12:17):
as honest as you can, because deep down you know
you're human. Everybody's human on this on this earth, and
somebody's going to feel the exact same way. If you're
just honest with yourself. I mean, look at lips of
an Angel. To be honest, like that that happened to me,
and I wrote it the next day, like and it
was just fifteen twenty minutes, but it was something so
(12:40):
true and very vulnerable. I mean it ended up actually
causing me a lot of files with my personal life.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
But how crazy is that? You know something, So.
Speaker 2 (12:49):
I've been vulnerable since day one, you know.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Just trying to figure out how to work it so
that you're protected. You know. It's funny. I was reading
after stepping away from Hinder that you had mentioned this.
I couldn't believe this. I said it in the open
that you you sort of fell out of love with music,
which is incredible. So you must have really been really
in a tough spot. What helped you rekindle that passion?
(13:14):
I think the quote was something like I learned how
to be from MTV but then it almost that almost
ruined you.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
Really, Yeah, that was that was something that I mean,
it's I'm kind of half kidding but kind of not.
Like I loved watching MTV as a kid, and I
wanted to be a part of that world. And you know,
I read the dirt right before I went out on
tour like it was. It was all kind of playing
(13:41):
out exactly there, I think, you know what I mean.
And I went down all the steps so you know,
I married the girl in the music video, like I
did every thing you shouldn't do. I mean, as wrong,
as as crazy as that sounds like, that's kind of
how I feel like that in TV raised me kind
of thing, you know.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
Yeah, but how like it's amazing to me that you
even went back well to begin with. But but in
twenty three though, you released Lips of an Angel again
as a duet and there was like three million downloads
and you had been off the scene for quite a while.
That must have been an incredible feeling to know that
your fans are still out there craving for more.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
No, that's that was. That was a surreal experience. I mean,
I couldn't believe that I was back in the booth
with the producer Brian House, who did the first one,
and it was you know, Shalns did an amazing job,
and it was it was surreal. It's it's it's amazing
to know that there's still people out there that are
digging the music.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
Has your approach changed it all? In terms of how
you write songs since you're entered recovery.
Speaker 2 (14:48):
No, like I said, it's like with this founder stuff,
it's just a little more raw and you know it's
it's very personal. It's it hasn't changed, like I said.
I mean, I've been since day one, like I've I've
laid it out there as as clear as day, as
long as I as long as I've been writing songs.
Speaker 1 (15:08):
How important is it for you to help others who
are challenged?
Speaker 2 (15:14):
Man? I read every single comment uh that that people
write on songs that I'm a part of, and it's
very important to me because I know I've been on
the other side of that, and I still I'm always
on the other side of that. Like music, music helps
me all the time daily. And to be able to
(15:35):
write something that connects with somebody who is going through
the same thing as you, and to be able to
go on stage and sing that and then sing it
back to you is an indescribable feeling. Like that is
more rewarding than any amount of numbers in a bank
account or any anything I can own. Like that is
(15:56):
something I share with the fans, and that is something
that is sacred to me.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
It's so special that you do that and also that
you care enough that you want to do that through
your music to help others, and is it's a therapy
for everyone involved. Really it lifts everybody up.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
Yeah. Absolutely, Like you go to the show and it's like, Okay,
it's like a little church or whatever for people who
are going through heavy shit. Like that's what that's what
it is.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
It's pretty amazing. How do you think that the music industry?
I know we talked about this earlier in terms of
charitable organizations that are out there, but what do you
think that the music industry as a whole could do
to better support its artists. I mean, we're in a
whole new world. It's a lot different than before where
we were just apples and oranges represented by agencies, and
(16:46):
now it's really you know, you can pick and choose
who you want to represent you, what message you want
to put out there.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
That's it for sure. I Mean my advice that I
would even tell my younger self would be like, dude,
it's it's okay to say no, you know what I mean, Like,
you don't have to do every single thing that gets
thrown into your lap. I mean that that drains you.
It doesn't matter what kind of line of work you're
in if you're just saying yes to everything, especially if
(17:13):
you're doing something you love and it starts to get
tarnished with with so much that they pile on your plate.
I mean, the bigger you get, the busier you get.
And I mean I would, I would tell my younger
I tell my younger self to be like dude, say
no to once in a while, like get some rest,
like like it's important for you to take care of
you before you can take care of you know, the
(17:34):
person on stage. So I mean, I think, like I said,
them having you know, therapy tints instead of you know,
schwag tints. I think we'll play, will go a long
way and keep keep big artists you know or small waters,
it doesn't matter who it is, keep them in line
and keep them grounded from the small success you know
(17:57):
that we have had. It was sking crazy out there.
It was crazy.
Speaker 1 (18:05):
I remember. I mean I was working actually at a
radio station not long before your first real big hit
song came on about twenty years ago up in Boston,
and I just remember you were on heavy rotation. Lips
of an Angel was just a smash, but you had
a lot of other songs as well. You were, you know,
rising up, and just as I was leaving town heading
(18:26):
to New York, and it was exciting to see that
you've been able to really turn this whole thing around,
because it really is inspiring, and that you're willing to
put yourself out there for your fans, as vulnerable as
you are, to show them that even people like yourself
has issues that you have to work through. And it's
(18:47):
you know, the biggest thing for me is when people
who rise to the big levels have such a responsibility,
and I always felt like you should never squander that
responsibility to help others when you have forged your own
path like that, because there's so many who don't know how.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
Right right, No, it's it's definitely you know, and you
don't I mean, you don't realize the responsibility you have obviously,
I I you know, it was hard for me to
see that until I was out of.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
How can you honestly, when you've got the machine behind
you like that, You're like, what stage am I? What
town am I at?
Speaker 2 (19:25):
You're definitely somewhat of a robot in some sense. Is
the arrows pointing you. You're just you're following a path
and you don't even know you're just following the person
to the stage, or you're following the person to the
radio station or the hotel or whatever. Like you're just
you're you're an autopilot sometimes and it's really really good
(19:45):
to not do that. And if you can do some
things to break that up, that would be great.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
What would you like your legacy to be, not just
as a musician, but as someone who's overcome significant personal challenges.
Speaker 2 (19:58):
Just to be honest, be just somebody that that fights
for what he loves, Like I love music again, and
you know, I have days where I'm like, am I
still so good? Or is this is this worthy of
of of going out and touring and stuff like that?
And it's you know, I think it's just it's going
(20:21):
to be this legacy or whatever, just somebody that obviously
you loved music and wanted to share his music with
the world and wanted to connect with people. Because this
this rock or whatever that we're spinning on there or
is insanely malicious. I mean, it can it can be
(20:43):
a beautiful, beautiful place, and it can be so malicious.
And I just want to be known from maybe taking
time whatever. I come to this city and it just
kind of pushes everything. Everything's on pause for a minute
and you can sit and scream your head up off
to rock and roll songs.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
I love it, and I love your videos especially, they're
really great. Austin John Winkler. Congratulations on getting to where
you are in life and your successes. Thank you for
sharing them with us on music. Save me and good
luck and everything that you do in the future, and
please come back and see us again when you have
(21:24):
your next EP or I dare I say album, but
everything's coming back so you never know.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Absolutely, thank you so much then,
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