#508 - Andrew Callaghan

Interview with Andrew Callaghan on The Bootleg Kev Podcast.

Full video version of the episode is available on YouTube!

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Yo, what's up, guys.

Speaker 2 (00:00):
This is Andrew Callahan from Channel five News. Check me
out on the Bootleg keV podcast.

Speaker 3 (00:05):
Bootleg cav Podcast. Man, we got a special guest in here.
This guy just dropped a new movie, an amazing documentary.
He's got one of my favorite YouTube channels. He's one
of my favorite journalists in the world. My guy Andrew
from Channel five has officially touchdown.

Speaker 1 (00:18):
Man, thank you for having me on bro. I really
appreciate it. I'm a big fans the coolest seeing you
grow your platform in the past couple of years. So
shout out to Bootleg keV. Shot out to Phoenix too.

Speaker 3 (00:26):
Yes, sir, it's crazy because I think I want to
say I first kind of found you. It was probably
like twenty nineteen. It was when you were you interviewed
the Joker Guy in Florida.

Speaker 2 (00:39):
Yeah, it made my first videos, like in the winter
of twenty eighteen and twenty nineteen was like the beginning
of all gas no breaks. I think my first Joker
Gang interview was in the September of twenty nineteen and.

Speaker 1 (00:48):
Golden in Florida.

Speaker 3 (00:49):
Yeah, because I used to live in Tampa, right, So
I actually lived in Saint Pete. So I remember seeing
that guy go viral when I was living there, and
like it was funny to kind of like see the
Florida man. Yeah, we'll talk, no crazy.

Speaker 2 (01:00):
So I went to Miami to find him, Like, I
went to Miami first, and I was like, yo, I
happened to be in Miami because I didn't want to
freak him out and be like I'm coming to find it, right,
So I went to Miami. I was like, Yo, what up,
Joker three zero five ross Chico alive, I'm in this
bitch And he was like, bro, I'm in Saint Pete.

Speaker 1 (01:13):
And I was like, what, How'd that happen? So I
drove through the Everglades in like the middle of the night.
For sure.

Speaker 3 (01:18):
People don't know that's a wild.

Speaker 1 (01:19):
Drive alligator alley.

Speaker 3 (01:21):
Yes.

Speaker 2 (01:21):
So I get to say, Pete, I go to the
south side of town. I'm like, yo, I'm actually here too,
you know, it just happened to be here, And he
was like for real, met him at the liquor store,
busted the interview at.

Speaker 3 (01:29):
The South side of Saint Pete's serious yeah, serious area
for sure. Yeah no, So I mean, obviously you've been
leveling up for a long time. Man. I want to
talk about the movie real quick, because it was an
emotional watch. It was kind of crazy because we like,
you know, I think you did such a good job,
and you do such a good job of like whatever
side of politics you might be on, like humanizing everybody. Yeah,

(01:53):
you know, whether it's protesters, whether it's people who are
coming over. I mean, you know, I'm i'd subscribe to
your Is it a Patreon, Yeah, yeah, because I know
there's Patreon and locals. Yeah, I subscribe to the pedophile
beaters on the locals, the guys who beat up those
guys don't play. They don't play. But no, So I like,
you know, I watched your entire episodes at the Border.

(02:17):
But you're so good at like just providing context and
nuance to all these divisive issues. Yeah, which if you
just consume like surface level media, that doesn't happen. Yeah,
you know. And so with this Kelly guy, for people
who don't know you were filming this guy for over
four years. Without giving away too much of the movie,

(02:38):
you kind of dive into this guy named Kelly who
was a successful lawyer. Yeah, had a family, ended up
losing his house. Blames it on a guy.

Speaker 1 (02:49):
Yeah, he blames it on a lender named Bill Joyner.

Speaker 3 (02:53):
Yeah, and uh Bill and his whole entire like life
just spirals into this like weird like like Maga sphere. Yeah,
like the craziest of the crazy, like hanging out outside
of abortion clinics. That's how the movie's going hard, you know,
and then you know it kind of fo you end
up getting close with his kids, very close. Yeah, it's
pretty crazy, like for you, man, like, at what point

(03:15):
in time when you were filmed, because you also put
out the HBO documentary, but at what point in time
when you were kind of following Kelly, did you decide like, Okay,
there we gotta we actually got to put all this
together and do like a real movie and tell his story.

Speaker 2 (03:27):
I mean, I think it's just like there was over
three hundred and fifty hours of footage. So the first
time that I met him was at the White Lives
Matter rally in Huntington Beach in twenty twenty one, and
the last shoot was with Uncle Pill at a skate
park in Oceanside, California, three and a half weeks ago. Right,
So we had a cumulative like three hundred and fifty
hours of total footage, and I just looked at it
all in total, and I was like, bro, we gotta
do something with this.

Speaker 3 (03:48):
And so when when Kelly was at that like that
that was the America Festival that just happened in Phoenix.

Speaker 1 (03:55):
It happens every like Christmas in Phoenix.

Speaker 3 (03:57):
But that was the one that just happened. No, no, no, no,
that was.

Speaker 1 (03:59):
Filmed at the America Fest one year before.

Speaker 3 (04:01):
Okay, okay, yeah was it? Because I wasn't sure how
soon how close it was, because I was like, I
thought that thing just happened.

Speaker 1 (04:06):
No, no, no, it was twenty twenty three, I think.

Speaker 3 (04:08):
Yeah, So that all those years, you end up wrapping
it up three three and a half weeks ago, and
you know, I know you had kind of articulated like
you wanted to kind of dive into the why. Yeah,
because we have seen so many people who we deem
to be like normal, be radicalized on both sides of
the aisle, definitely, and there's a why, yeah, you know,
and for you, like, what were some of the correlations

(04:30):
that you kind of realized were consistent.

Speaker 2 (04:32):
With well, like I noticed that even back in the day,
like the first I guess conspiracy adjacent rallies I go to,
like the flat Earth conference in Dallas, Like I would
post somebody like a flat Earth are talking about, you know,
Hitler having a secret city in an Antarctica and hiding
the flat Earth truth that type of thing, and the
comments will be like, Yo, this was my science teacher
he got fired for like you know, flashing students or.

Speaker 1 (04:53):
Some shit like that.

Speaker 2 (04:54):
Yeah, or like this is my cousin, Like he got
laid off after he got hurt at work and he's
never been the same. And so I noticed this like
com in thread of people having a full blown collapse
of their core needs like security, significant unection, all collapsing,
and then they developed this like super negative worldview that's
very binary as far as like I'm good, I'm a
good person, and there's this like nebulous evil force that's

(05:15):
out there, like this dark cloud that's above every hard working,
red blooded American patriot. It is just trying to sap
all the life force out of us. And a political
movement comes around kind of picks up on that angst
and gives them a way to channel their personal situation
into a greater spiritual war in the country.

Speaker 3 (05:30):
Yeah, it's pretty crazy too, because it really makes sense
if you because it gives you you know, it's so
easy to not have accountability. Yeah, And I think what
was dope about the movie is by you know, by
the end of the movie, it seems like this guy
ended up taking some accountability.

Speaker 2 (05:43):
A little bit, Yeah, a little bit at a little
bit without spoiling the whole shit. Like a lot of
people watch the movie and they see the ending and
they're disappointed. But I'm like, dude, if you look at
the very beginning to the end of the movie, that's
a different guy for sure. He's probably not doing like
the TLC intervention ninety days later thing where they're like,
oh my god, I'm healed, but he's significantly less angry.
He's let aside some personal resentments. But yeah, you're right, bro,

(06:04):
Like it's way easier to live in your own self
mythology and have a heroic narrative about your own life
as opposed to acknowledging like different shortcomings and saying, you
know what, I'm gonna do this better in the future
and keep pushing.

Speaker 3 (06:16):
And like the other thing too, is like, you know,
if there is like a thread of like validity to
an issue, and not even necessarily a threat because I
think with the immigration issue, obviously the border was out
of control. Yeah, you know, this is a question, This
is a fact. But it also gives a lot of

(06:37):
people who are in situations in their lives to point
the finger at somebody like I have the villain in
my story as to why I might not be doing better.
Is it because of immigrants? It is because of you
know xyz And this is on both sides, you know,
but it's like very very you know. To me, what
I've realized is a lot of these folks who are

(06:57):
like radicalize there, they're really radicalized because they need a villain, yeah,
and they need a purpose. Like look, it's kind of
like being a crip for a blood.

Speaker 2 (07:07):
And what's crazy about it is like when you look
at these conservative events, especially like in the magosphere, you
can have like a bitcoin libertarian who drinks ayahuasca and
smokes weed five times a day sitting next to somebody
who is a non psycho or a pro life evangelical
Christian who like actually believes that marijuana was created by
the devil to make white women have interracial children.

Speaker 3 (07:27):
Yeah, it's the then diagram with people that go is insane.

Speaker 2 (07:30):
And they're like, all we both fuck with Trump, it's
all good, Whereas on the other side, the liberal side,
you can't even have a group of five without them
tearing each other down for dumb shit.

Speaker 3 (07:38):
Yeah, and like, you know, I'm an old school liberal,
like I voted for Bernie. I'm I'm you know, I
guess I would be. As you know, I'm pretty aligned
with Bernie Sanders on mostly everything.

Speaker 1 (07:47):
I same here.

Speaker 3 (07:48):
I think he got fucked over. I mean I don't
think I know, and.

Speaker 1 (07:51):
We're paying for that now.

Speaker 3 (07:52):
It's crazy. But but like you said, you know, it's
it's frustrating because I think over the last I would
say some COVID right, like you're really not allowed to
step out of line as a liberal on any issue whatsoever.
Like I'm super pro trans rights, super pro trans rights.
I think it's fucked up that Trump just spanned them
from the military. I also think it's like a serious

(08:14):
conversation to say, like, hey, when it comes to sports,
like that's a conversation like combat sports, Yeah, we should
have Like it doesn't make sense not to say that.
It's like like maybe there's a trans fighting league.

Speaker 1 (08:25):
I don't know, that'd be the best league.

Speaker 3 (08:27):
I'll be like, it's like if you just step out
a little bit, it's like you get fucking thrown. Like
I mean, dude, I remember during the pandemic. I mean
I was spooked, man. I was masked up the whole time.
Uh for like the first four or five months. Okay,
maybe even the first three months, but I was wearing
gloves and ship at the gas. But I remember, like

(08:51):
I remember Joe Rogan had this doctor name not not
not not the guy who looks like Kenny Rogers Andrew something,
but he was like one of the guys who he
was like like the most published cardiac cardiovascular doctor in
agg of all time. And they were just talking about
like you know, the vaccine and like all these alternative things,

(09:14):
and I remember just bringing up like not even like
knowing for sure, I just remember bringing some shit up
in front of my cousin and he was like, are
you fucking Magan now?

Speaker 1 (09:21):
Bro? Oh shit?

Speaker 3 (09:22):
And I was like what, of course not, what are
we talking about? And it was like this thing where
like you couldn't even like question what was going on
with like some of the like alternative like treatments that
were available for COVID or even just like the lab
leak theory, and it just I feel like COVID, like
we were already super divided from like twenty sixteen oneh

(09:46):
Q none was cracking, like all this crazy shit was happening.
But I feel like between like COVID and you know,
the BLM, you know, George Floyd riots like it just
I feel like we all just got thrown into a blender.

Speaker 1 (09:59):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (10:00):
I feel like also the social policing that COVID created,
especially in more liberal spaces, made it so conservatives became
the new counterculture. Like I remember before George Floyd popped
off in May, there was those two months where the
only thing that I was covering was freedom rallies. So
like I remember watching you go to Sturgis. Yeah, Sturgis
was sick. I went to a Sacramento capital they had.

(10:20):
This is before the vaccine, so it was just called
a freedom rally. It was like an anti lockdown protest.
And dude, like conservative reuniting is like we're going against
the government, like we're not gonna take it. And before
then the conservatives were like all about the government narrative.

Speaker 3 (10:32):
And it's funny because when you I mean, obviously I
don't hold you are, but it's like I feel like,
prior to COVID, like liberals were supposed to be like yeah, anti.

Speaker 1 (10:40):
Government, yeah, and now they're an anti war and they
were supporting the censorship of like everybody on social media.

Speaker 2 (10:46):
And now you see what that did. It just pushed
everybody into tighter echo chambers. And now looks at Trump's
in office, and.

Speaker 3 (10:51):
Then it pushed everybody because, like you said, if the
counterculture to something that makes no sense is just the right. Yeah.
And because I've noticed so many people who I know
who supported Bernie Sanders, I mean people who donate money
to Bernie Sanders vote for Trump. Yeah, Like there's like
this weird like who would have thought like that would
ever be a thing. But it's like, well if the

(11:13):
other if the option is you know, people kind of
pick their poison. Yeah, have you noticed that?

Speaker 2 (11:18):
Like definitely, I mean, especially if you think about it now.
It's crazy to me that Trump ran on this platform
of like eliminating the deep state bureaucracy, so like the
DNC and CNN and the media, but now he has
like a private army of tech oligarchs as his advisor.

Speaker 1 (11:31):
So it's so crazy.

Speaker 2 (11:32):
But going back to a point that I wanted to
make too, A lot of people watch Dear Kelly and
they say, Yo, why don't you make a movie.

Speaker 1 (11:37):
About the liberal equivalent of Kelly? And I just want
to say that does exist.

Speaker 2 (11:42):
But I don't think that, like radical hardcore liberalism is
created by need collapse. I think it's actually created by
an oversaturation of court needs. Like people who have everything
that they need and they're doing so well, they feel bad,
especially if they participate in gentrification and they're pushing people
out of neighborhoods like Brooklyn.

Speaker 3 (11:59):
Like I go back, white guilt is.

Speaker 1 (12:02):
It's just it's just paralyzing for them.

Speaker 2 (12:04):
And so I think most like extreme libs that I've seen,
they come from more conservative families. They come from the suburbs,
they moved to this city. I grew up in this city,
so I didn't grow up around any like hard core liberals.

Speaker 1 (12:14):
But there's a correlation.

Speaker 2 (12:15):
The most gentrified neighborhoods in America is where you see
the most hardcore liberals.

Speaker 3 (12:20):
Yeah, that's true. It's funny too, because you know, I
do a radio show. My co host is James Jefferson,
who's a big TikTok personality, black guy. But he always
says he's like yo man. Like most of the time
there's like a someone like super pissed off or like
triggered by something in the news that isn't that big
of a deal. It's always like a white one.

Speaker 1 (12:40):
Always, it's always a white lady.

Speaker 2 (12:42):
During during COVID, during the protest movement, I came into group.
I came into contact with a group in Portland, Oregon
called the White Body Shields. And what they would do
is they would go and all in bulletproof armor to
black neighborhoods and they would approach older black women usually
and say, hey, do you need me to walk you
to the bus stop? Do you need me to walk
you to the girl store? Just in case a policeman

(13:02):
tries to kill you, I want to make sure that
I can be a physical barrier and take those bullets
for you. And people will be like, no, what the fuck,
get away from me. But they'd be like, you don't understand.
This is a divisive time and you're being hunted down
in the streets.

Speaker 3 (13:14):
You know. It's funny too because I saw this video
and obviously it was on Twitter, but it was a
it was like, uh, you know, there's this this this
overall discussion about like voter ID, and it seems like
most of the people who are against voter ID are
like liberal white people and they go through the hood
and they ask people like, hey, do you got an ID?
And they're like yeah, what the fuck? Like they're like

(13:38):
are you sure? Are you sure? And it's because it's
like the argument is like, well, you know, there's certain
minority communities where it's almost impossible for them to have
an ID. And it's like it's like it's almost like
that Democratic lady who said something about the kids in
the Bronx like they've never seen a computer BeO.

Speaker 1 (13:54):
Oh yeah, they don't even know what computers are.

Speaker 3 (13:56):
It's like, lady, these kids could there they have an iPhone. Yeah,
they're better at computers than we're seventeen. Yeah, like they
know how to fucking make They know cap cut better
than all of us.

Speaker 1 (14:06):
The kids of today are crazy. Bro.

Speaker 2 (14:07):
I had a cousin, My little cousin. He wakes up
on Christmas morning before opening his own presence to watch
his favorite streamer unbox their gifts, and he's more stoked
about like what they're gonna get He's like in the
chat being like L gift, W gift.

Speaker 1 (14:19):
So by the time his parents.

Speaker 2 (14:20):
Are like Santa came, He's like, I don't give a
I got fuck your socks, mom.

Speaker 3 (14:26):
Yeah, that sh it's funny.

Speaker 2 (14:27):
So the point is the kids from the Bronx to
the Hamptons, they know about the phone and the computer.

Speaker 3 (14:31):
They know computers. Yeah. No, it's interesting too, man, because
I think with the movie, like, you know, for me,
it was just like showing like how his daughter because
he has a lesbian daughter, right, Kelly has a lesbian daughter,
and just showing how like, by the way, his kid's badass.

Speaker 1 (14:46):
His son is outside, Kyle's outside, Yeah, he's fucking fucking
you're talking about his party? Yeah, Like it was a
tight party.

Speaker 3 (14:54):
But it was just dope to kind of see the
perspective of like how how you know kids are affected
and the fact like his he showed up to a
protest with his dad, I thought was like the nicest thing. Yeah,
you know, like, hey dude, this is what he's into.
So I'm just gonna show up like I'm I don't know,
you know, like, yeah.

Speaker 2 (15:12):
That scene definitely was emotionally impactful for me because I'm like, Wow,
the links that he'll go to connect with his pops.
I think a lot of people can relate to that
for sure.

Speaker 3 (15:20):
For sure, man Bill Joyner is suing you. Yeah, for
people like he's the boogeyman of this film allegedly, allegedly,
allegedly he's the And I'm like, to be fair, you
did not paint him as the boogeyman.

Speaker 2 (15:33):
That's what I think. And I try and tell him that,
I try to tell him.

Speaker 3 (15:36):
You you kind of showed the world that hey, this
guy's this guy didn't really any doing wrong.

Speaker 1 (15:42):
Yeah. Well, the lawsuit was filed before the film even
came out.

Speaker 3 (15:45):
You're kind of hoping he's seen the movie maybe eases
up a little.

Speaker 1 (15:49):
Well.

Speaker 2 (15:49):
I think that him and his lawyer, from what I
can see by the court filings, they think that we
are like, you know, big, that we're on Kelly's exact team,
and then we're corroborating his narrative about the home foreclosure,
right but in reality, which is not the case.

Speaker 1 (16:01):
No.

Speaker 2 (16:01):
So the actual lawsuit says violation of the Federal Wiretap Act,
like he thought we were tapping his phone lines. It
says stalking, emotional distress, like we weren't stalking him or anything, right,
or I mean emotional distress.

Speaker 1 (16:13):
I don't know, I don't think.

Speaker 3 (16:14):
So yeah, no, no, no. So are you worried about
the lawsuit at all?

Speaker 1 (16:17):
Of course?

Speaker 3 (16:18):
Yeah, but I.

Speaker 2 (16:20):
Mean thankfully, like we filed an anti slap motion. It's
like something basically where if someone sues you for defamation
or whatever, you can do a slap An anti slap motion,
which is like slapp basically means like it's within my
rights as a documentary filmmaker to share someone's perspective even
if you disagree with it.

Speaker 3 (16:35):
And you knew that this lawsuit was already kind of
in motion and still decided to release the movie.

Speaker 2 (16:40):
Yeah, because the judge dismissed what's called oral argument. So
that's like when they expect both attorneys to show up
and make their case and is deliberating for like one
hundred and eighty day period or something, right, So what
that tells me is that the judge has kind of
made up her mind to the point that she didn't
even want to hear from my.

Speaker 1 (16:53):
Lawyer or Bill's lawyer. It makes sense, So.

Speaker 2 (16:55):
I won't know if she's team Bill or Team Channel
five for like at least ninety day.

Speaker 3 (17:00):
Damn, dude, that's crazy. Yeah, well, good luck. Thanks.

Speaker 1 (17:04):
I mean it's gonna be fine.

Speaker 3 (17:05):
Like I think, I think too, like I think this
movie like because I know you had opened the movie
kind of explaineding like hey, you know, because I thought
the HBO documentary was amazing, thank you, But it was
crazy to see like like even like then, like you
had to kind of like you know, you're playing by
the rules a bit when you're doing something with a
big partner like that, and so this was like straight

(17:26):
to straight to the.

Speaker 2 (17:28):
Yeah, I mean I finished the movie, Dear Kelly, one
day before it came out, Like I did a final
color and sound pass and put the right songs on
like literally the day before it came out.

Speaker 3 (17:37):
So crazy.

Speaker 2 (17:38):
In comparison, the HBO film was picture locked, so finished
without color and audio nine months before the release date.

Speaker 3 (17:44):
Damn, do you feel like this is kind of the
new way? Because I mean you're doing well, right. It
sold a lot, you know, I saw some I think,
you know, it broke some records.

Speaker 1 (17:54):
I think we got one hundred thousand in sales in
the first weekend.

Speaker 3 (17:57):
Which is amazing.

Speaker 2 (17:58):
Which is like a record since Connie twenty twelve for
a direct to streamer direct to consumer streaming video.

Speaker 3 (18:03):
Do you feel like that because because at the end
of the day, you put so much work into like
some of some of these videos you do, which is
why I think it's important to support the Patreon. Yeah, thanks,
because you put a ton of work. Bro, Like this
is like real journalism, Like we like people will see
shit on the news, you're actually like going to wherever
it's happening and yeah and finding out what is going on.

Speaker 1 (18:24):
In the field. And we really have no bosses.

Speaker 2 (18:26):
A lot of people they masquerade is being independent, you
know what I mean because you see him on the
street with the you know, but they did I'm with
Vice I journey right, but you know what I mean,
Like we're actually like not beholden to anybody, which is
why they don't like us.

Speaker 3 (18:38):
Think, by the way, thank you for not like doing
like cringey weird shit like Vice used to do, Like
I did Heroin for thirty days straight. This is what happened.

Speaker 1 (18:45):
You know what's crazy though, bro, is that Vice.

Speaker 2 (18:46):
When I was a youngster, I'm twenty, well back in
the day, it was amazing so sick. So I always
say when people talk shit about Vice, I'm like, yes,
WECE makes some pretty ass shit nowadays.

Speaker 1 (18:55):
However, it used to be the ship back when they
would go to the Congo.

Speaker 2 (18:58):
Dude General Button, remember that, or even the David Show
series Thumbs Up America. Like, without that series, I probably
wouldn't hitchhiked across the US, I probably wouldn't have made
a videos.

Speaker 1 (19:07):
I probably wouldn't have been here.

Speaker 3 (19:08):
That shit's crazy.

Speaker 2 (19:09):
They made journalism cool again before Advice, I don't think
there was anybody actually pushing the envelope except for like
Louis Thorreau in the UK with BBC. But like, journalism
wasn't like badass until Vice. Do you care about like
being accepted? Like, you know, there's so many people who
a quote unquote journalists that are mainstream. Do you care
about their acceptance or like being seen as like a

(19:31):
peer of them?

Speaker 1 (19:31):
No, No, I don't like journalists like that. Yeah, I
just don't think I don't want to be accepted by
journalism or you know, they already don't fuck with me, right,
they never fucked with me, right, They're never going to.
So even if I wanted to say.

Speaker 2 (19:43):
Yeah, I would love to, you know, have a bunch
of friends at the Associated Press and sit down with
some MSNBC fund It's like, you.

Speaker 1 (19:48):
Think they would fuck with me. No, but that's because
we're outsiders.

Speaker 3 (19:52):
Trump's press secretary this morning, we just saw it before
you walked in, actually said that the White House press
credentials are o been to anyone who has a YouTube channel,
TikTok account, a Twitter account that has a following and
it does news based content.

Speaker 1 (20:08):
Wow, I should apply.

Speaker 3 (20:10):
No, they just posted the website today.

Speaker 1 (20:11):
Oh shit, Yeah, we should apply.

Speaker 3 (20:12):
So I think you should apply because I think you
could ask some questions in there.

Speaker 2 (20:15):
Yeah, it's actually good questions. And I also feel like,
at the same time, though, that could be bad if
they reject people based upon like the pressure, if they
packed the room with just right wing influencers, right, if
it's just like fucking Charlie Kirk and you know, yeah, whoever,
they're just glazers, just glazers.

Speaker 3 (20:30):
Jesus. It is crazy too, though, because it's almost like
the extreme left getting soaked wild has kind of like
commercialized so many of these guys on the right. Yeah,
to the point where it's like, you know, if you
think about like Charlie Kirk or or you know, like
my kids, Like my son's a mixed kid. He's fucking

(20:52):
eleven years old and he's seen the kids that dos tiktoks.
Yeah you know what I mean, Like it's it's it's
almost like do you feel like because of because you know,
I had this conversation with a friend of mine and
I was like, there's always like a pendulum like swinging right.
It was like, yo, there wasn't anything Trump could have

(21:14):
done in twenty twenty to win, Like they could have
ran a fucking they could have ran anybody against him
and he would have lost.

Speaker 1 (21:19):
Oh totally.

Speaker 3 (21:19):
And I feel the same way about like I don't
think there was probably now again there's the Bernie card,
but they would never play that Bernie card because it
isn't you know, but or like someone in that same
vein that speaks to working class Americans Like honestly, but
I feel like this Trump thing, it was just like
a very predictable, like you could feel the pendulum swinging yeah,

(21:42):
like in real I was like, yo, like I just
don't see.

Speaker 1 (21:44):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (21:45):
I think it's because so many young dudes like shifted
right because of these like progressive new standards, especially on
college campuses, with like this hardcore identity politics banging where
like that's more important than class, like those issues, like
it doesn't matter what your idea is if as long
as you are like a certain position on the privilege hierarchy,
you shouldn't be.

Speaker 1 (22:02):
Able to say anything. And I get the point.

Speaker 2 (22:04):
What they're trying to do is like give people who
are marginalized like a chance to speak. But what that
does to somebody who might feel like a young white
dude with a good idea is he's like, you know what,
I'm well intentioned, and I'm being basically exiled for speaking
my mind because of how I look. I'm going to
go to Turning Point, USA, where they're gonna give me
exactly exactly what I want, you know. And so unfortunately
a lot of the progressive new standards have alienated a

(22:26):
ton of young people, especially dudes.

Speaker 3 (22:28):
Yeah, I've noticed that. It's like a lot of like
young dudes, man are just like, you know, they they
fucking they and Trump went to all their platforms.

Speaker 1 (22:36):
Yeah, definitely, you know.

Speaker 3 (22:37):
And like to me, like if Kamala would have just
like that. The one thing about Kamala that I just
could not I just could not wrap my head around
is whoever was running her campaign they just refused to
put her in uncomfortable situations where she had to talk
off the script. Yeah, and it would be like, man,
if I could have just seen like this was a
human being for like an hour, like a human. Hey.

Speaker 1 (22:56):
The one thing that she did that did have some
good impact is you know the front Horachi's and Phoenix. Yeah,
so Mahomie Renee is the chef there. She went three
days before election day to Phoenix and had like a
Sonora and Sarne. I remember some type of food like that.

Speaker 3 (23:09):
Yeah. I just I just like I was just waiting
for her to, like, you know, when she did like
club Shaysha, I was like, oh, like even if she
would have did like you know, even the breakfast club thing,
like I wish you would did it a one on
one with Charlemagne and not like a you know.

Speaker 1 (23:22):
Yeah, I don't know why they didn't do that. They're
just so tapped out.

Speaker 2 (23:25):
But I'm like, I'm saying it's karmaic retribution for them,
kind of like kicking Bernie Sanders out the picture, because
Bernie would have talked to the youth. Bernie would have
gone on every he actually did. He went on Theovon,
he went on like Joe Rogan back in the day,
all these platforms where Trump was able to speak directly
to the youth and stuff, or not even just the youth,
but just like ages, you know, eighteen to forty.

Speaker 3 (23:43):
And the other thing too, is like I think if
you're a Democrat and you're watching the last week of
Trump in office, however you feel about whatever he's doing,
it like shows you how ineffective our politicians are so bad, dude, Like, yo,
if this guy can come in and make a fucking
spectacle out of signing these executive orders, whether or not

(24:06):
they stick or not, like you know, the birthright ship,
like that's a Supreme Court issue. Yeah, but it's like
performative for his base. Yeah. Like, dude, if you're fucking
Joe Biden, on day one, you signed the executive order
for for you know, the George Foyd Police Act. You
sign an executive order to try to like you just
you just do some shit to make us feel a
little better.

Speaker 1 (24:25):
Yeah, for sure.

Speaker 3 (24:26):
It's like it's like everything is so hard with a Democrat.
But it's like this motherfucker's up here turning ship up
and bro.

Speaker 2 (24:34):
Honestly, like, if you think about it, I see why
people view Trump as like an underdog counterculture icon. For sure,
deployed every single thing they could in the media to
take him down for years, and the law and the
and the law system, dude, the law system. Every late
night TV show became like a Trump mockery platform. Jimmy Cammel,
Stephen Colbert, they literally threw their entire integrity out the

(24:54):
window and became DNC mouthpieces.

Speaker 3 (24:56):
I can't even for fucking years, I can't even watch it, dude.
I I fully because I grew up a Democrat. My
parents are Democrat, my grandma's Democrat, and fucking I am
a fucking When I registered in California because I moved
from Azy to Cali, Yeah, registered as an independent. I
don't want no side by both sides.

Speaker 2 (25:14):
Bro, Like the crazy gas lighting is like if you
don't vote for Kammell or you're voting for Trump, It's like,
oh whatever, Bro.

Speaker 3 (25:19):
This is what I told everybody because I was an
RFK guy during because I liked a lot of his
ideas about UH food and censorship, and you know, I
hated his stance with the Israel stance, but I was like, yo,
when I'm talking, while I was talking to my friends,
I'm like, you know, they're like no, but it's a
it's a wasted vote, And I'm like, dude, this is

(25:40):
the brainwashing over hundreds of years that has been programmed
into us that will never allow us to have another alternative. Yeah,
because you know that there's a third party candidate that
is much better than either being offered. But because you're
you think you're throwing it's your vote.

Speaker 1 (25:59):
You owe your vote definitely, Like vote with your conscious.

Speaker 3 (26:02):
That's like to me, like I knew, Like like I'm like, yo,
like if you feel any type of way about Palestine,
like vote for Jill Stein and know you voted with
your heart and your conscious and neither side deserved your vote.

Speaker 1 (26:16):
Dude.

Speaker 2 (26:17):
Honestly, if Kamala Harris would have said, like I'm pro
Palestine or at least I supported two state solutions, she
would have won the election.

Speaker 3 (26:23):
Fucking rolled Bill Clinton out in Michigan to chastise fucking
Muslim Americans to their fucking face. Yeah, it was the.

Speaker 2 (26:31):
Craziest shit, and a campaigned with Liz Cheney I'm like,
it's exactly.

Speaker 1 (26:37):
Can you imagine being on the.

Speaker 2 (26:38):
Fence and being like, oh shit, well Dick Cheney's wife
fucks with Kamala Harris.

Speaker 3 (26:42):
And to me, that's where they just lost me due
the last couple of years. And I'm just like, so
we're like, legit the War Party now. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (26:49):
But honestly, dude, if you think about it, this in
the long run, twenty twenty eight is going to be
a great year because we're gonna have fresh primaries on
both sides. The Democratic Party is totally done.

Speaker 1 (26:59):
They're never going to rematerialize.

Speaker 2 (27:01):
You're gonna have new progression maybe new Conservative candidate, right, oh,
they're done.

Speaker 3 (27:05):
I don't know. I don't. I think that they're so
ignorant on the left. I mean, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (27:10):
At least we're going to get new people.

Speaker 3 (27:12):
I hope.

Speaker 1 (27:12):
So we are gonna get new people.

Speaker 3 (27:13):
I hope that they find whoever that is.

Speaker 2 (27:16):
We're gonna get new Conservatives and new progressives, Like twenty
twenty eight is going to be that year.

Speaker 3 (27:20):
I think it's gonna up being Jade Vance and Vivic.

Speaker 2 (27:24):
I think that'll be the Yeah, we need new dynasties
like Bro Biden was Obama's vice president. Does nobody think
that's fucking weird? That's insane? Hillary Clinton is Bill Clinton's wife.

Speaker 3 (27:36):
It's just Donald Trump.

Speaker 2 (27:37):
It was on the Apprentice, like all these fools are
already entrench, Like when can we get a Bernie Sanders
Vermont will rise again?

Speaker 3 (27:43):
Oh? Man, Yeah, no, I don't even know who the
new Bernie is. Honestly, that has like actual power, you know,
Like I mean, I guess AOC, but she kind of
sold out a lot of her you know, a lot
of her free will. For I would say AOC was
the most disappointing the last couple of years because she
kind of like chowse up with a couple of times
and I was like, who, anyway, you have done so

(28:05):
many crazy like you've literally been in the shits whatever.
Uh you know issue that's arisen in pop culture, in
the news, your front lines on is there a situation
in which you were the most scared for your safety?

Speaker 2 (28:24):
That's the thing, bro, I don't think so it's weird,
Like I get scared when I watched the footage after
Like when I was at the stash house in Philadelphia
with the dudes who are manufacturing fucking insane.

Speaker 3 (28:36):
That was also when I insane.

Speaker 1 (28:38):
In the moment. I'm not scared because I'm so like
focused on getting the video.

Speaker 3 (28:42):
And like those guys were manufacturing trank.

Speaker 2 (28:43):
Trank which is a combination of xylazine which is horse tranquilizer,
and fentanyl. So basically it makes it so like trank
is really cheap and also makes a it's a tranquilizer,
so you can have a bag of fentanyl that's like
one quarter fent one quarter three quarters trank, and it's
gonna hit basically the same, just have a little bit
more of like tranquilizing effect so that you can make
a bunch of money. And xylazine is maybe one hundred

(29:04):
times cheaper than fentanyl, and you can buy it legally
from Chinese manufacturers, like in powder form on WhatsApp. Anyway,
I don't want to give too much game. Don't manufacture
a trank if you're watching this. But anyways, I watched
the footage back and I was like, bro, what the
fuck was I doing? You're hopping the border. I'm not
scared in the moment, but then I'm looking back at
the footage and I think, damn, like I should have

(29:24):
been scared, you know. But it's moments like that where
I need to realize that I am relatively fearless. But
that doesn't mean that I shouldn't do dumb shit, right.

Speaker 3 (29:33):
Ye know, that was a wild episode. It's funny because actually,
you know that hit close to home recently, my son's
mom passed away in Philadelphia from an overdose.

Speaker 1 (29:41):
Damn rest in peace man.

Speaker 3 (29:42):
Yeah yeah, yeah, but I mean it was fentanyl for sure.
But that trank shit, it hasn't hit LA yet.

Speaker 2 (29:49):
No, No, it's pretty crazy that it hasn't because it's
hit Baltimore, has a HITD Atlanta, it's Baltimore, DC.

Speaker 1 (29:55):
In Boston.

Speaker 2 (29:55):
Yeah, it's like a people's like limbs get swollen up
and yeah, so if you miss a van with the
trank like this condition can happen called necrotizing fasciitis, which
is a flesh eating bacterial disease or something like that.
So it literally consumes your limbs and if you don't
treat it within the first four to five days, amputation
is the only option, or it can spread to your
heart and you get sepsis and you really can't survive that.

(30:15):
So there's this this this problem that many groups in
Philadelphia have the harm reduction communities where they're like, yo,
how do we get these people off the streets into
the hospital immediately?

Speaker 1 (30:25):
And they're withdrawing from dope.

Speaker 2 (30:27):
So like it's just really difficult because you don't have
to you can't kidnap people. You have to ask them
to go to treatment.

Speaker 3 (30:32):
Yeah, that Kensington area is so.

Speaker 2 (30:34):
But it's tough because if you go to somebody whose
arm is falling off and you say, like, bro, you
have to go to the hospital, and they say no,
they're they're adult.

Speaker 1 (30:40):
Free human beings. Can't make somebody do something, right, Yeah.

Speaker 3 (30:43):
It's crazy you h You went into the Chaz area too, right, Yeah,
so I'm from Capitol Hill, Seattle. I would say that
that's where you're from.

Speaker 1 (30:53):
Okay, So I grew up in Philly in Fair Mountain,
North Philly. So I was ten.

Speaker 2 (30:57):
My dad was a big grunge fan and he worked
in the tech end streets. So we moved out to Yeah,
we moved to Capitol Hill and that's like where Chaz was.
So that that like that corner Tenth and Pike call
Anderson Park.

Speaker 1 (31:09):
I grew up like in that neighborhood.

Speaker 3 (31:11):
That's your area.

Speaker 2 (31:11):
So I'm in I'm in Minneapolis right where the actual
riots popped off, like by Lake Street on the south side.
And I get a call and someone says, Yo, the
cops just ran out of the precinct. They abandoned the
precinct in Capitol Hill. You know, the cops just gave
it to the protesters.

Speaker 1 (31:24):
I was like what. And so there was a four block.

Speaker 2 (31:27):
Radius initially called the Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone and then
became Capitol Hill Organized Protest. And I was actually there
basically the entire time, living in a tent. However, the
footage was never released. M why not, because bro, he's
embarrassing on some home, on some hometown ship.

Speaker 3 (31:43):
It was.

Speaker 1 (31:44):
It was bad, okay. So there was three phases. Phase
one was like spirit of the Revolution, like Fidel Castro,
like the people will rise up. Phase two was like
burning man.

Speaker 2 (31:53):
You have fools coming in on Greyhound buses from northern California,
Eugene I called the Republic of Islam. That's southern Oregon,
northern California. Are still slapping Max Dre like they just
found out about it. And so people are pulling up
like ooh, so folds are pulling up like you have
drum circles. People are setting up stages, they're doing dubstep sets,

(32:13):
you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (32:13):
And then the initials Viva a Revolution. Young crowd is like,
what the fuck fuck these books.

Speaker 2 (32:19):
They start beefing it, and then so they start kind
of canceling each other for different shit.

Speaker 3 (32:23):
Meanwhile, people are living there like they have their apartment
right there.

Speaker 2 (32:26):
And then week three, the you know, the trappers, the
hoods in Seattle, like in the South End and Tacoma,
start figuring out that the cops aren't coming there, so
they have all their their their fiends go from downtown
in different areas to Capitol Hill. And then different gangs
start taking control of different parts of the park.

Speaker 1 (32:42):
So it was Revolution week, what week? And then Gang week.

Speaker 2 (32:45):
I'm there the whole time, my tank keeps getting stolen,
and then so that so literally you had, bro, I've
never seen something like this in Seattle by the basketball courts.
Kids fifteen year old kids with shisties and guns fucking
bigger than their entire bodies. And this is a safe
urban park in a gateighborhood. So I'm like, bro, this
is insane, and so what happened?

Speaker 1 (33:03):
I really.

Speaker 2 (33:03):
Remember there was a fatal shooting on the fourth of July.
I was like, right next to it. I thought it
was fireworks because it was fourth July. Someone got killed
right there. And this antiphametic chic, you know, like in
full costume, comes running up and she goes, there's a
gang war happening at the park and I'm like, I
literally look at I go, what gangs are fighting?

Speaker 1 (33:20):
Just say the name of one of the gangs. Since
you're from Seattle, what are the gangs called?

Speaker 3 (33:23):
And she's like, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (33:25):
And so the moment after the fatal shooting happened. The
next morning, all of the medics and all of the
organizers and all the wooks and all the revolutionaries they
leave and the park just becomes like Hamsterdam and the
wire and then the cops at that point come in
and shut it down.

Speaker 3 (33:38):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (33:39):
So I filmed the whole thing. I still have the footage.
I'm thinking about putting it out.

Speaker 3 (33:42):
Dude. Honestly, that's that's pretty sick.

Speaker 2 (33:45):
Yeah, it was crazy, but I was like, you know,
it was just real, Like God, Seattle took the l
on that one.

Speaker 1 (33:50):
You know.

Speaker 3 (33:51):
What's so crazy is I feel like on like like
when we think about like I think people who are
extreme left and Antifa and and all these people and
on the other side, the QA non folks. I feel
like everyone has pretty they feel like they're doing the

(34:11):
right thing, like they have everybody there, they have like
good intention in their heart right, and I feel like
there just has to be like, you know, I don't
know what it is. I think, you know, there just
has to be like there's if everyone feels like they're
doing the right thing right, Like you know, the the
White Lives Matter rally that opens up your film. It

(34:34):
didn't feel like much of a rally, but you know,
your boy was out there with his flags and then
they're not playing. They ended up fucking them up. Yeah,
he ends up getting the rest. Do you feel like
there's like just the option for like uh, I guess
like positive discourse where people can just agree to disagree.
Do you just think that shit's out the window? Man?

(34:56):
You know.

Speaker 2 (34:56):
The thing is though, is like these groups, these vocal minorities,
get a lot of his ability because they make noise.
But I think that a good like seventy percent of
the country is on the same page as you and I.
You know, they see the shit from Afar. They might
react to a certain thing a certain way or slant,
but most people are not Antifa or QAnon. The difference is,
I feel like QAnon ideology has bled its way into

(35:17):
the mainstream conservative right, whereas Antifa and these groups are
still like a very marginalized left, and liberals reject their.

Speaker 1 (35:25):
Ideas for sure. So I just think that like the
actual left.

Speaker 2 (35:27):
That Trump always talks about has no actual power over
the liberals.

Speaker 1 (35:31):
Liberals don't give a fuck about unions, you.

Speaker 2 (35:33):
Know, They're more concerned with like calling Trump supporters Nazis
and white supremacists and throwing labels on people. So there
is going to be a point where we can have discourse.
But like I said, twenty twenty eight's that year.

Speaker 3 (35:44):
You know, there's just this, Like you said, it's on
the left, dude, Because on the I feel like I
have conversations with like my cousin, like this is another
thing I stopped talking about. I was a part of this,
like the left that stopped talking to people over Trump
in twenty sixteen.

Speaker 1 (36:00):
That was a real thing.

Speaker 3 (36:01):
My cousin James, who's like my closest cousin in my life,
voted for Trump was vocal about it on Facebook, and
I just stopped talking to him for like two years.

Speaker 1 (36:09):
You guys are good now, yeah, see America is healing.

Speaker 3 (36:11):
No. But I felt terrible about it, and I realized, like, dude,
I was fucking tripping, bro. Yeah yeah, bro like I
was bro. I was one of the guys shaming people
for not getting I shamed this motherfucker for not getting vaccinated.
Every fucking time we'd go, I'd be like, you're a
fucking b That was me. And I just realized, like dog, like,
I'm I'm a part of the side that's the most judgmental, Yeah,

(36:34):
which is crazy because the other side's supposed to be Nazis.

Speaker 1 (36:37):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (36:37):
I remember back in the day when COVID first popped
off in Seattle. You could be getting a you could
be having a picnic in a park.

Speaker 1 (36:44):
Just you and two people.

Speaker 2 (36:45):
If you spread a blanket out and somebody took their
mask off for a second, you'd have somebody in the
cut with an N ninety five on like this. They'd
take a picture of you, They'll put it online. Find
you're at that, Like, what's this person's at? Super spreader,
super spreader, complicit in the genocide of those who were
disabled and complicit in the genocide of the immune compromise,
and they would they would lose their job, they would
lose everything.

Speaker 1 (37:05):
I saw this shit happening in real time. Uh so sad, dude,
bro I was. I remember when COVID popped off.

Speaker 2 (37:11):
So I was in Seattle and I was like, I
gotta go somewhere more, you know, more hippied out because
I'm like, I gotta see somebody. So I went down
to Eureka, California, and I stayed with my homegirl and
she told me, she was like, listen, I don't care
about this COVID shit, or I do care about if
if if I see you in public with somebody and
they take a picture of you or they see you
with somebody else, I'm gonna get in trouble.

Speaker 1 (37:31):
Okay, what do you mean trouble? She was like, I
could lose my job.

Speaker 3 (37:33):
It was the same thing that was I mean in Australia,
it was crazy. Yeah, like people were like going to jail.
And that's my thing is like, you know, uh, I
just feel like we get so I just feel like
we stopped questioning shit for a while there where it
was like, hey, like, isn't a little weird that there's
a ticker on the screen on CNN with the death
total going up like it's a fucking basketball game.

Speaker 1 (37:55):
Yeah, like what is like?

Speaker 3 (37:57):
And everybody like the fuck? And I'm over here buying
gloves and shit and fucking I got so much sanitizer
left over from COVID.

Speaker 1 (38:04):
It's crazy abouteah garage. Yeah, I was. I mean I
I was sort of tweaked out too.

Speaker 3 (38:09):
You know.

Speaker 2 (38:10):
It was just a crazy time and I feel like
we're still kind of living in the shadow of twenty twenty.

Speaker 3 (38:14):
For sure, And then now you look back and you're like, Okay, well,
you know, I know I dealt with this because I
had two sons, who you know, my kid was fourteen
and was like dealing with depression because he was just
stuck at home. And the people who lost their businesses,
especially here in California. You know, there's like restaurants that
were losing their businesses while there was like catering on

(38:36):
movie sets. Yeah shit, And it was like like make
it make sense, you know, like.

Speaker 2 (38:41):
Yeah, and Walmart was open though you know what I
mean exactly, dispensaries were open.

Speaker 1 (38:45):
Yeah, I didn't know that.

Speaker 3 (38:46):
Yeah, no dispensaries were open. They never closed down dispensaries here,
which was interesting. But yeah, I don't know, man, I
just feel like, you know, like you said, man, like
this is what we get. We get Trump again. Yeah, definitely,
like all that crazy shit, this is this.

Speaker 1 (39:01):
Is what you get. We earned this shit, We earned it.

Speaker 3 (39:04):
We fucking earned it. Man. Do you feel like there
was a point in time for you where you know,
you as a as a young journalist, like, was it
always kind of the idea to kind of tell both
sides because obviously, like you said, you're more of a
burnie guy, so you yeah, but you know you have
like your your set of values. But to be able

(39:25):
to kind of cover like people who you harshly disagree with, yeah,
and show them give them like a fair shake. Was
that difficult for you?

Speaker 2 (39:32):
No, I've always been like that because you know, I
grew up, like I said, in the city, always run
different kinds of people, exposed to different personalities. I also
went to school in the Deep South in New Orleans,
so it was like I got I got.

Speaker 1 (39:40):
Exposed to a ton of Southern stuff.

Speaker 2 (39:42):
So by the time I started my career, I was like,
I want to show people on the West Coast what
it's like in the South. I want to show people
in the South what it's like where I'm from in Seattle.
So I already felt like I had two different upbringings,
but as far as like the unbiased thing, like I'm
not unbiased.

Speaker 1 (39:55):
No human being is unbiased.

Speaker 3 (39:57):
No, for sure, but you, I feel like you do
a really good job of of trying to like tell
both I tell tell the story as much down the
middle as you can, And definitely, I just feel like
that's something that that is very like, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (40:08):
I definitely appreciate it.

Speaker 2 (40:09):
I just wanted to make that point because there's so
many journalists claiming to be unbiased, but I'm like everybody
has biases based upon how they.

Speaker 3 (40:16):
Grew on the planet, has a personal bias exactly.

Speaker 2 (40:18):
Like shit, I use the example the other day, like
whenever the George Floyd thing happened, like I had lost
a couple friends growing up to police brutality, So as
soon as that happened, I was sort of on board
with like whatever had whatever had to happen. I saw
buildings going up in flames, and I was like, hell, yeah,
me too. But if I grew up in you know, Iowa,
and my dad was the police chief and a town
of five hundred people, and he was rescuing cats from
trees and helping people. You know, I might be like,

(40:39):
come on, man, that's just one bad egg, but I
didn't see it that way because of how I grew up.

Speaker 3 (40:43):
You know, how are you? How's your what is your
perspective on those protesting riots? You know, what would it
be five years later? Now, like almost five years four
and a half years later. I feel like, you know,
black Lives Matter as a statement is obviously a factual statement.
I feel like that the and the intent of that
movement was was pure and had great intentions, but somehow

(41:06):
it got twisted and used against well.

Speaker 2 (41:09):
I mean, if you look at every social movement that
begins organically, there is people out there, grifters and profiteers
who will figure out a way to make an industry
out of it. And the same thing happens with every
social movement in America. It takes about two years, maybe
three years, for you know, Black Lives Matter LLC to
become a donation farm to where people were just like
embezzling in mansions.

Speaker 1 (41:30):
That's what happens yeah, you know what I mean.

Speaker 2 (41:31):
And so it's more like I feel like shame on
somebody for not realizing that, like why are you giving
money to the Black Lives Matter? Two and a half
years later, I thought the protests were great. I think
that they began very straightforward and organic, like this is
about police brutalizing black people in the streets, period, and
then it took only about a month later it kind
of became about everybody.

Speaker 1 (41:51):
You know, they added the black stripe to the Pride
flag and you're seeing people out there and I'm like,
wait a second, you know, shout out to all the
LGBT people out there. But I thought this was about
police brutality against Black Americans, and so you just sort
of see this forced intersectionality obscure the message, and before
you know it, it's not what it was supposed to be.
It's not.

Speaker 2 (42:09):
And that's just what happens because white guilt is so
powerful that you have white people who have any type
of disadvantage, whether it be gender, income level, but mostly
it's gender and orientation, and they say, you know what,
I don't want to be the scarecrow that people were
throwing eggs at right now.

Speaker 1 (42:24):
I don't want to be the.

Speaker 2 (42:24):
Bad part of the bad white out group during this
protest movement. Let me figure out how it can join
the side of the oppressor by giving myself something to
stand on. So they're almost chasing down oppression to almost
put on their back, as opposed to the actual purpose
of liberation, which is to get away from it. So
it's very sad you saw that, especially in Portland, where
you know, you had groups actually obviously taking advantage.

Speaker 3 (42:45):
Of the neighborhood. They ruined Portland downtown.

Speaker 2 (42:48):
For Yeah, okay, that's one argument, But then if you
look at why did downtown Portland, Downtown SF, and downtown
Seattle grow the way they did before COVID, it's because
all these tech companies were getting taxed, so they moved
their offices there.

Speaker 3 (43:01):
And then they left it. They they once COVID happened,
everyone left and they figured out they start out resources out,
They figured out.

Speaker 2 (43:07):
They can make more money having people work on Zoom
from home, and they didn't have to pay HR, they
didn't have to maintain these office buildings. So you have
office buildings like in San Francisco there are thirty six
stories where only two of the floors are being used,
the rest are vacant, and landlords don't want to go
down on price for these tech apartments they built for
the workers that are now living in Idaho or wherever
they came where they came. So now you got homeless people,

(43:28):
homeless people on the streets everywhere in Portland and everywhere else.
And then you have these fucking assholes coming out and
being like, wow, look at the Democrat policy and it's like.

Speaker 1 (43:36):
This is corporate elite fucking bullshit.

Speaker 3 (43:40):
Yeah, I think it's I think I think this. I
think that's like a perfect example of both though it's
like it's a it's two things can be true at
the same time. It's like, yes, these tech cities where
all of this massive income and all these people just
decided to just be like deuces. Yeah, that's that's one thing.
And then the other side, like in the Bay you know,
it's like the Bay's crazy. I go to the Bay lot,

(44:03):
you know, it's like, yeah, the basis great chances of
you're getting bipped out there and or like just like
you can't like I mean we were we started going
a lot in like twenty twenty one. Yeah, because I
was shooting a lot of content out there, and even
like all the way up until maybe like late last year,
it's like damn, like the Walgreens are gone.

Speaker 1 (44:20):
Yeah, it's the bipping is out of control. Bro.

Speaker 2 (44:22):
I was by Lake Merritt in the RV like a
year and a half ago. I'm chilling by Lake Marriott.

Speaker 1 (44:26):
Bro.

Speaker 2 (44:27):
It's a beautiful day, probably two pm, you know, Lake
Marrion downtown Oaklyan. So I'm chilling right there in the
RV and this valet guy comes up to me and
he goes, don't don't park your car here.

Speaker 3 (44:35):
I go. Why.

Speaker 2 (44:35):
He goes, it's gonna get bipped. I go no, Like,
I'm gonna stay in the car. It's gonna be fine.
He's like, nah, don't even stay in the car. So
I'm chilling in the car. I swear to God, I
opened the door to like, you know, just get some air.
Walk out for a second. A mini van pulls up
like a soccer mom van. Three kids in full shisties
jump out of the car with bip tools and hands
like it like a ninja army and start throwing like

(44:57):
bit like spark plugs on fucking wire and ring into
the car like it was seriously like a like a.

Speaker 3 (45:02):
Ninja wild Like my boy Samson, he was pumping gas
about to return his rental outside of the Oakland Airport.
So he's at the car, he's on the phone, pumping gas,
and before he knows it, his backpack in his back
seat is gone. Yeah, and he's running after a car
that within seconds they got him. Like the bay is

(45:23):
fucking crazy.

Speaker 2 (45:24):
Yeah, And so there's certain shit like that where you
that's not just income inequality.

Speaker 1 (45:28):
That is the cops and well that's not doing their
job right.

Speaker 3 (45:31):
And that's just like at the end of the day,
if there are loopholes that allow you to hit licks, yeah,
you're gonna take advantage of those loopholes. Yeah, Like it
is what it is.

Speaker 2 (45:40):
And one thing that liberals don't understand is this, some
fools just like hitting licks.

Speaker 3 (45:44):
You know what I mean, Like, no matter what happens.

Speaker 1 (45:46):
It's not like everyone hitting a lick is like I
can't afford food.

Speaker 2 (45:50):
Some fools love hitting licks. I grew up with people
who are rich, middle class, impoor. They listen to Chief
Keep all day they're trying to hit a lick. It's
not like they woke up with not being able to
put cornflakes in the bowl.

Speaker 3 (46:01):
Facts.

Speaker 2 (46:02):
And I'm just saying that's something that you can't explain
to people because you're like, what do you mean they
like it? You think there's something about them genetically that
made them Like, No, I didn't fucking say that. I
just said fools be hitting licks, yes and I and
they don't get it, you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (46:14):
But we're not going to explain it to them. But
if they live in this city for long enough and
somebody hits it, hits a lick on your ship, You're
not gonna be like, wow, you know what, even though
they stole my car, I hope they can feed their family. Like,
where do you think we're in? Fucking Darfur? The this
is you know.

Speaker 4 (46:28):
I'm just saying, would you would you say based on
your your you know, obviously your experience being up up
in the northwest and covering Portland and covering the Bay
and I go back to your reference of Hamsterdam from
the wire, based on like just your experience and your perspective,
because perspective matters.

Speaker 3 (46:47):
Uh, would you say the Hamsterdam model is one that
is sustainable? No?

Speaker 2 (46:53):
And here's why specifically it might be sustainable if it
was like a nationwide policy. But you got to think
in all the ordering states to Washington and Oregon, Idaho, Montana,
even Utah and states like that.

Speaker 3 (47:06):
Yeah, I lived in Boise.

Speaker 2 (47:07):
It's illegal to be homeless in a lot of these states.
They will put you in jail for your third vagrancy
ticket for ninety days. They'll prosecute, they'll they'll burn your shit.

Speaker 1 (47:16):
You know what I mean.

Speaker 2 (47:16):
A lot of people get harassed and they get and
not only that, but I was in Austin, Texas one time,
one time, and I watched the city book two hundred
and fifty greyhound bus tickets and sending homeless people from
Seventh Street in downtown to Portland.

Speaker 3 (47:30):
So what year was that?

Speaker 1 (47:31):
That was before all this chaos? Twenty fourteen?

Speaker 3 (47:34):
Oh, you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (47:34):
So this has been happening.

Speaker 2 (47:35):
So what happens is if Seattle says, you know what,
We're gonna enact harm reduction policies and open up a
needle exchange or something like that for people to not
get HIV and have se right here, all of a sudden,
these other counties, not even just different states, are like, okay, perfect,
Now I know where to send one hundred thousand drug addicts,
and so it's impossible to maintain the Hamsterdam model when
these different states have such different policies.

Speaker 3 (47:57):
I wonder what is your perspective on and you know,
because I think what happened in the last twelve months
or so was you noticed a lot of minority communities
feeling a certain way about like the same places like Chicago,
New York City, Like immigration hitting I mean obviously Governor

(48:22):
Abbott putting people on buses setting it into New York City,
send it into Chicago. But then kind of seeing like
the preferential treatment that someone who came in here illegally
might get, whether it's a visa card loaded with fourteen
hundred dollars at an hotel room and all this stuff, did
you kind of like there's it felt like there was
like kind of a divide. Well, it's between two communities

(48:43):
that usually would be I guess aligned, if that would
make sense for me.

Speaker 2 (48:47):
It's hard to see what's real and true about that,
because that particular narrative is perfect for the conservative established right,
like Wese see these poor people, working class people don't
like migrantcsy either. I don't know how real that actually is,
Like if you look at New York City right most
of the migrants are being held in shelters in Long
Island or by the Roosevelt Hotel in Midtown. It's not

(49:08):
like they are going to, you know, minority communities in
the Bronx and in Queens or in the Lower East
Side and just opening up these gorgeous migrant skyscrapers where
they're giving people for dope ass phones.

Speaker 3 (49:20):
They're like, yo, you got you gotta fucking you gotta
fucking loft in New York.

Speaker 2 (49:23):
So I feel like a lot of a lot of
it is like Jesse Waters going to the hood in
the Bronx and being like, I don't know if you saw,
young man, but they just got a free phone down there.

Speaker 3 (49:31):
And then I was as like, what the fuck a
fuck that? I don't know if if it's actually accurate.

Speaker 1 (49:36):
It is Also it's possible for poor and working class
people to also be syopped by hypnototic media. Hypnotic media,
you know what I mean, without.

Speaker 2 (49:45):
Knowing, because they're if you're poor and you see somebody
getting free shit, that's how they turn the white working
class against the black communities. In the eighties, during a
primitive extre so it's it's a little mini version of that.
If you go to a poor, poor person anywhere and
you show them a video of someone getting free shit,
they are probably gonna be BacT.

Speaker 3 (50:01):
There and then you're able to take that footage put
it on TikTok and then it spreads like a while.

Speaker 2 (50:06):
It's like showing a rich person a video of somebody
breaking into a mansion.

Speaker 3 (50:10):
Yeah, I think to the thing I just saw recently
that was going viral on TikTok was like this like
idea that like you could get a reward for turning in,
and I think they came out and said it's not real.
But it was like, like you mentioned the word sip.
It felt like it was like this fake thing that
got thrown out there. And then you would see like
these tiktoks like like like there was when I saw
this black girl being like the thousand dollars a person,

(50:32):
they're seven who live next door to me, Like that's
my address type shit, and it's like it's like the again,
it's like at the end of the day, man, It's
like I think with the immigration issue, it's there's a
lot of things that can be true at the same
time yeah, I think, like obviously, man, like there was
a lot of people coming over. I was area which
was like not sustainable, you know, it's not sustainable for

(50:54):
anybody to take.

Speaker 2 (50:55):
Any and most importantly it's not good for them. Like
I have a friend from Senegal or a friend now,
and I met him at the border. He had just hopped, right,
So he gets he goes to border in Arizona.

Speaker 1 (51:04):
Too, in Arizona right by Lukeville crossing Gringo Pass. Yeah,
so he's telling.

Speaker 3 (51:08):
A Rockey point. I go by there.

Speaker 2 (51:09):
Yeah, I'm talking to him, and he's excited. He's like,
I can't wait to get to America and work, you know.
Abbot bustes him to New York and he just got
his asylum appointment date and it's for twenty twenty nine,
so he can't get and he.

Speaker 1 (51:19):
Can't get his work papers, and he can't get anything.
He can't even receive a green card. He can't even
be heard by a judge.

Speaker 2 (51:25):
Because now you're just in limbo for on limbo for
years for him, and the shelter says, we can't have
space for you. We have more migrants coming in. So
he's living on the streets right now trying to see
who will hire him for under the table work and
paying him in cash. He's getting paid four bucks an
hour because you got you know, deli owners and shit
trying to save money asking him to mop the floor.
That's not a life he wanted in the US either.

Speaker 3 (51:46):
And how man and that times, however many hundred thousand
is happening.

Speaker 2 (51:50):
Yeah, there should be there should be a clear path
to citizenship, which makes his whole situation avoidable for sure.

Speaker 3 (51:55):
And then and then that's the thing is like, if
there is like an I think that it just kind
of all got mixed up to where it's like, okay, well,
if it's a free for all at the border, then
whatever bullshit systems in place for people, Like you said,
the asylum system, I know, the asylum courts is a
fucking jokey. It's just not sustainable, dude. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (52:15):
Also, asylum policies were a conservative thing. I think the
first asylum policy was during Reagan. It was called wet foot, dryfoot,
and that was to inspire Cubans to flee the island
during communism. And they said, if you can get in
a boat to Miami, the moment you touch sand or soil.
You're an American citizen. So it was supposed to incentivize
people to defect from communist regimes or enemies of the US.
So Venezuela, that's exactly who we want. Because that's good

(52:38):
for Trump.

Speaker 1 (52:38):
They're leaving communism, they're coming here for a better capitalist life.
I think that's good for old school Republicans exactly. I
feel like the new shit is different.

Speaker 2 (52:47):
And people are exploiting the asylum system. Wherever you stand
left to right, that system is being exploited. Being poor
is not an asylum.

Speaker 1 (52:54):
Claim, so if you get here. When I was interviewing
Mexicans at the border, these are poor people saying I'm
being targeted by the cartel. They're gonna kill me. Every
single one of them said that.

Speaker 3 (53:04):
I also heard like, if you are if you say
you're lgbt Q, if you're coming from like an area
that frowns upon it, they grant you asylum too.

Speaker 1 (53:14):
I'm sure I mean that.

Speaker 3 (53:15):
Homy and TJ was telling me that. He's like, yeah,
he's like, if you just say you, if you just
say you're gay at the border, like me, try it.
I don't know. No. He comes back and forth like
he lives in TJ and works in the U.

Speaker 1 (53:26):
Tell him hop the border act as gay as possible,
like yo.

Speaker 3 (53:29):
Come with a boyfriend. You know.

Speaker 2 (53:31):
No, by the way, speaking to the border, we were
just to know Paso ware is a couple a couple
of days ago, wild place wars is crazy.

Speaker 1 (53:36):
We're just there.

Speaker 2 (53:37):
And so you know that video of like Trump's first
wave of deportations where you see like a bunch of
young dudes walking across the border back in New Mexico.
So speaking to sy Offs, those people had been held
there for like three months and we're just being processed,
and Trump said, don't process him, send him back right
now so we can get the good optics.

Speaker 1 (53:54):
So they had a camera crew.

Speaker 2 (53:55):
Set up in Warez from Breitbart, from these conservative outlets,
being like, the deportations are happening, but those people got apprehended,
apprehended under Biden criminal right.

Speaker 3 (54:05):
It's just content manipulation, man, It's what it is. Everyone's
fucking playing the TikTok game the fund It's that's fucking wild.

Speaker 1 (54:11):
Yeah yeah, Jesus.

Speaker 3 (54:13):
You you you based on like your interactions with everybody
who were coming over the border, because do you know
there's this narrative that there's all there's this massive spike
and single Chinese men coming over of military age and.

Speaker 2 (54:28):
You know, single Chinese men of military age. Imagine being
described that way. No, exactly what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 (54:35):
And then you know, we're kind of like in this
like cold war with China, and they're sending, they're sending,
they're sending, uh, you know, all these cells.

Speaker 1 (54:43):
Over every Chinese person works for the Chinese.

Speaker 3 (54:46):
Government apparently, right right, yeah, exactly. There's no poor people
in China exactly. Yeah, because for people who don't know
the extreme poverty in Chinese. Yeah, yeah, but it was
just funny. It's just funny because, like you said, like
you could kind of like, you know, whatever, whatever side
of the road you want to be on politically, like
you can kind of find like an echo chamber within
that one immigration issue to be like yeah, I mean,

(55:07):
but at the same time, you know, it's obviously like
there is an issue, you know, with with with that
influx of people. Would you say there was like a
concerted because the other thing is is people say by
people I mean the right, yeah, that that the border
was opened up on purpose to try to import more
democratic votes. That's my favorite, which is fucking an insane Well,

(55:30):
if that's.

Speaker 2 (55:31):
The case, it didn't work right. Also, dude, migrants can't vote.
They're not citizens, right, They literally can't vote. They can't
even But I don't even need to get into that.
The point is the reason you see somebody single men
at the border hopping the borders because their entire families
are back home.

Speaker 3 (55:46):
So it's like they come and work and they send
money back. I mean, this is a very normal thing.

Speaker 1 (55:49):
How would they take their family?

Speaker 3 (55:50):
Their family?

Speaker 1 (55:51):
You want your little kids and your wife to work,
she has to take care of the kids.

Speaker 3 (55:53):
Yeah, you want your fucking kids walking across the desert
in Arizona in the summertime.

Speaker 1 (55:56):
Yeah, you can die shot. That's a human borders giving
water to those people.

Speaker 3 (55:59):
Yeah, that's it's fucking crazy.

Speaker 2 (56:01):
But yeah, bro, like, of course it's going to be
single man, but like it's it's a it's been it's
been strange.

Speaker 1 (56:05):
But yeah, the border being wide open was a huge problem.

Speaker 3 (56:08):
What do you went to Colorado right during the yeah
gang for trendy Aragua.

Speaker 1 (56:12):
Yes, td t d A just taken over the apartments,
taxing everybody.

Speaker 3 (56:17):
I mean again, there was a crazy video that went
viral now I know. It was like it was like
red meat.

Speaker 2 (56:24):
Yeah, like I have some really bad news. There's a
gang at an apartment building in the hood, and one's like,
what the fuck is happening?

Speaker 1 (56:31):
There's a gang in every apartment building.

Speaker 3 (56:33):
Right, so what did you say? Like going there? What
did you did you? What did you?

Speaker 2 (56:37):
Okay, here's the verdict on on Colorado. There was a
gang in the apartment building period, which caused the landlord
to be like, you know what, bro, there's a gang here.

Speaker 1 (56:45):
He was a slumlord name that from Florida.

Speaker 2 (56:47):
He owned like six different super badly maintained properties, right,
so he was like, you.

Speaker 1 (56:51):
Know what, bro, there's gangs over running the ship.

Speaker 2 (56:53):
I don't even want to take care of it. I'm
abandoning the property. So there was no more, no more
landlord services happening, no more plumbing, no more electricity, just
the services were being under maintained. He was getting sued
by the city of Aurora, Colorado, so he hired a
crisis PR firm called Red Bandon Communications to basically plant
that story about the gang takeover, to be like, they

(57:13):
beat me up and forced me out of the property.

Speaker 1 (57:15):
So two things were true. At one time. It was
a gang of illegally of undocumented viagrants from Venezuela who
were gang banging, and you had a shitty landlord. I
don't understand how people can't see those two things seem
to go hand in hand. I actually think.

Speaker 2 (57:31):
There's that That's almost always the case. Everywhere you see
gangs in the projects, the property is poorly maintained. Have
you ever seen a nice apartment building with a gang
in it?

Speaker 1 (57:40):
It's possible.

Speaker 3 (57:41):
No, that's funny. Yeah, Like you said, two things can
be true at the same time.

Speaker 2 (57:43):
And also gang see a shitty maintained spot and they're like,
I'm gonna go gang.

Speaker 3 (57:47):
Did you see the story that came out a couple
of nights ago. They were like, Yo, in Colorado there
was a Venezuelan gang house party and we rated it
got forty gang members off. I'm like, first of all,
shout out to those guys were being like brave enough
to throw a house party. Yeah, in the same week
Trump gets elected for sure, obviously not the smartest place.

Speaker 1 (58:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (58:06):
Also, dude, what about the one hundred thousand gang members
here in Los Angeles?

Speaker 3 (58:10):
Right?

Speaker 1 (58:11):
What what are we talking about? Right, it's so crazy.

Speaker 2 (58:13):
But conservatives have never met a gang member, so they're like,
oh my god, the gang members have arrived. It's like
the gang members are here, started here, Yes, all the
MS thirteens started in Koreatown.

Speaker 3 (58:24):
People don't realize that MS thirteen is a California gang
that obviously exported Del Salvador.

Speaker 2 (58:29):
Yeah, and our prison system, Harvest is an incubator for
the most powerful gangs in the world.

Speaker 1 (58:34):
So it's really crazy.

Speaker 2 (58:35):
When you get people being like, bro, the border's open
and now people are gang bang. But if you show
that clip on Fox News and you're in Little Rock, Arkansas,
actually lit Rocks pretty good. Let me use a different example.
If you're in Omaha, it's actually pretty good too.

Speaker 3 (58:47):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (58:47):
If you're in Boise, Idaho and the rural outskirts and
you see a video of the border and then people
gang banging right after, you're like, here we go.

Speaker 3 (58:55):
Yeah crazy. Have you ever covered Mormons at all? And
you're no, I haven't.

Speaker 2 (58:59):
But you know, when I first got to Salt Lake City,
I went to Temple Square and they were in plain
clothes and they're like, hey, what's up man? I thought
they were fans.

Speaker 3 (59:06):
Like, oh, yeah, good to meet you. Bro.

Speaker 1 (59:07):
I was like, you want a picture, and they were
like a picture.

Speaker 3 (59:10):
Have you read the word? Like ah?

Speaker 1 (59:12):
Man.

Speaker 3 (59:13):
So I grew up in Mesa, which is outside of Phoenix,
like yeah, twenty minutes and it's a big Mormon population.
So I'm very very intrigued. And then I moved to Boise.
I did radio and bois for a year, which is
the third largest Mormon population. It's just such a very
very interesting culture of people.

Speaker 1 (59:32):
They're really nice.

Speaker 3 (59:33):
There's the nicest people ever. Their religion is pretty wild. Yeah,
it is pretty crazy. Like there's I would love to
see you. Is there some more if some more in
the Mormon shiit pops up? Yeah, I would love to
see you.

Speaker 1 (59:43):
I mean I love Salt Lake City.

Speaker 2 (59:44):
Like there's this bar that they're called Twilight Lounge that
I like a lot, you know what I mean. So,
and most of the kids who get drunk there every
day are from Mormon families and they just drink and
they just like sit there and be.

Speaker 3 (59:53):
Like oh yeah. Like when I was a kid, like
the kids in high school who were like doing like
real drugs or all Mormons because they were like revolting.

Speaker 1 (59:59):
Yeah, that's people don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:00:00):
But Salt Lake City is like a many New Orleans
when it comes to alcohol consumption because these kids who
defect or they kind of break off from the church,
they drink like amish people on Rum's from Man.

Speaker 3 (01:00:09):
You know, I went to Salt Lake once. We went
for the day. We went to interview a young boy
at his house.

Speaker 1 (01:00:15):
Such a good video, bro, Yeah, shout out to him, man,
that's one of my favorite interviews.

Speaker 3 (01:00:19):
Shout out to young boy. Free that man, Free him.
I know.

Speaker 1 (01:00:22):
All he had to do was not do that.

Speaker 3 (01:00:24):
All he had to do was just just not like
fake prescriptions. So you have everything like like like what
that young boy story came out? I was like, really, bro, wait, is.

Speaker 1 (01:00:35):
It correct that he went to the Walgreens and said
I'm a doctor?

Speaker 3 (01:00:37):
He called I think it was over the phone. I
think he called in over the phone as a fake. Again,
this is all.

Speaker 2 (01:00:44):
Can you imagine young boy trying to sound like not
young boy because somebody's.

Speaker 3 (01:00:48):
Just hanging out with him like super nice guy. You know.
But yeah, you spent some time here in LA with
crit Mac, who obviously is incarcerated. Shout out to krypt Mac.
Do you keep in any contact with him at all.

Speaker 1 (01:01:01):
Yeah, a little bit.

Speaker 3 (01:01:02):
Do you know what's going on with his case?

Speaker 1 (01:01:03):
Is there any I mean, he's just gonna do his time.
He'll be out next Christmas.

Speaker 3 (01:01:06):
So he'll be out next Christmas.

Speaker 1 (01:01:07):
Nice Christmas.

Speaker 3 (01:01:08):
Yeah, shot. What is your thoughts on like that? I
guess because I feel like krit Mac was kind of
like the beginning of the commercial commercialization in the podcast
space of like gang banging it's bad. It's like it's
becoming like a you know, whether it's cam capone you know,

(01:01:29):
obviously no jumper at him, you know, you go on.
I mean there's it's kind of crazy, like like gang
politics have now become like real just YouTube content, like it's.

Speaker 2 (01:01:40):
A serious content farm. What I've noticed though, is like
once the lore is kind of oversaturated and figured out,
people kind of move on. For example, like the Hyracology
way of like all the gdbd O block cutard ship
that had like four years of people figuring out everything,
and now you hear you've heard every story like every
FBG BUTTA interview.

Speaker 1 (01:01:59):
I'm like, I know that already.

Speaker 2 (01:02:00):
I'm not sure how I know that, But like you
got dudes like traploor Ross who are breaking down the
scientific moment by moment progression of these beefs and then
they figure it out and it's kind of just like,
all right, we understand Chicago.

Speaker 3 (01:02:11):
Because he did like a four hour King von like
documentary that was fucking I couldn't get through it.

Speaker 1 (01:02:16):
He might be the greatest drill documentarian.

Speaker 3 (01:02:18):
I was gonna ask you, what are your thoughts on
a guy like because he obviously fancies himself a journalist.

Speaker 1 (01:02:22):
Yeah, he's definitely a journalist.

Speaker 3 (01:02:23):
What are your thoughts on Trapel?

Speaker 1 (01:02:25):
I think he's dope. I mean I think that.

Speaker 2 (01:02:27):
You know, last time I went on to Jumper, I
was pretty critical about like just the gangbang in space
being commercialized and.

Speaker 1 (01:02:33):
The way that has been.

Speaker 2 (01:02:34):
But at the same time, now that I look back,
I think the real person to blame is the record labels.
I mean, the people pushing this shit in the first place.
You can't blame journalists and podcasters for responding to that demand.
It wasn't like they pulled these people out of a hat.
I'm curious about King von No, Atlantic and all these
record labels they decide, Okay, we're going to commercialize gang music.

Speaker 3 (01:02:55):
Yeah, I think too, Like you know, it's interesting because
a lot of these guys always say this because I'm
not a big Drill fan, Like it's just never was
like my shit, you know. But I feel like nowadays
the kids aren't into like you'll see it all the
time with like let's say like pull a name out
of Kwanda Rondo. Yeah, like he's known, but like he

(01:03:16):
doesn't really have much big music. No, his interviews are
still good there, like most of these guys are known
more like people care about the It's almost like they're
like like the audience is just watching this real life
like crime series play out and they have like only
invested in like the Julio Fulio, Young and Ace is
the perfect example. Yeah right, it was like people really

(01:03:37):
I mean, like not to say they didn't have some
dope like like Fulio had some dope records, you know,
but people were more invested in like how's this going
to end? As opposed to like, yo, let me go
support this guy's album that came out.

Speaker 1 (01:03:51):
I know when Fulio died, like the next day that
Young and A song right five in the morning, got
a call who is this? One hundred thousand comments? I'm like,
just even the comment like just so some.

Speaker 3 (01:04:01):
Of the comments are just so like people like don't
have a heart.

Speaker 2 (01:04:04):
Well, it's it's even beyond that, they don't see them
as human beings like superheroes and the drill. They don't
exactly lives as valuable. I mean, it's it's depressing, but
like it's not gonna end.

Speaker 3 (01:04:15):
It's not gonna end.

Speaker 2 (01:04:16):
So it's like I'm a big proponent and like, don't
critique things too heavily that you can't stop for sure,
you know, And like the youth is hypnotized by violent
and violent violence and violent music.

Speaker 3 (01:04:26):
Yeah, I think you know. You know you mentioned going
on to a jumper, Like I think you know. I
think Adam is to me, Like I always tell people
when they you know, because I'm tight with Adam. He's
the home and I always say, like, hey man, Adam's
reinvented that fucking platform over and over and over. He's
also responsible for some of like the greatest hip hop
interviews of all time, if you go back to X
and the first Juice World interview and and all that

(01:04:47):
shit for better or worse, from like twenty sixteen to
seventeen to now, Like there was this shift in the
SoundCloud era and like that that platform was very, very
instrumentaleh in the that wave and like you said, there's
a demand for that content. So if it's not, and
I think Adam does a pretty decent job of like

(01:05:08):
if you watch the more long form shit, like yeah,
having some nuance in context to a lot of those
beefs and stuff. But no matter who, like there's gonna
be a cam capone, there's gonna be what's the homies name?
Who does the hood documentaries? That never shows his face.
I've DMed with him before, fu.

Speaker 1 (01:05:23):
DJ small eyes.

Speaker 3 (01:05:25):
Nah, he does like a glugs No does. He does
a lot of like Northern Cali shit.

Speaker 1 (01:05:32):
I haven't seen it before, but Northern California is way
more active than here.

Speaker 3 (01:05:34):
Oh like Stockin's crazy, Yeah yeah, Stockings fucking.

Speaker 2 (01:05:38):
The cool thing about how Adam has been able to
develop his platform is like the SoundCloud era was huge, right,
and it took place in La obviously like Melrose and Fairfax.

Speaker 1 (01:05:46):
But it wasn't an LA scene.

Speaker 3 (01:05:48):
It was like a Florida thing.

Speaker 1 (01:05:49):
But but I mean, like this was this the hub
of like media for it for sure, and a lot
of like the rappers lived here and like once it
fizzled out, like you still he figured it out because
he was like, all right, we gotta make something out
of just like l a Native rap and there's some
sick rappers from La X four RS three. I still
listen to Draco every days.

Speaker 3 (01:06:08):
Amazing the truth. Yeah, long live Draco for you man?
What is what is like when you put a movie
out like Dear Kelly and and you know you're getting
a lot of love for it. It's an amazing documentary.
I thought, I don't know what is your team? Like?
Is it how many of you are there?

Speaker 2 (01:06:23):
So there's me, Susan who's like the senior producer, uh,
Timmy and Liam who work in the office. And now
I have four editors Gabe, Wiggy, Ethan, Charlie and then
my homie Drew edit from Texas. So I don't know
how many people that is in total, but it's a
it's a nine person team. And then I got correspondence
like Hosue in Mexico City.

Speaker 3 (01:06:44):
I watched, Yeah, I watched his TJ episode.

Speaker 1 (01:06:46):
Yeah, the oh that's that's the Homi.

Speaker 2 (01:06:47):
Beanie from La Okaysuay did the Mexico City gentrification.

Speaker 3 (01:06:51):
He just did. I just saw that one I saw.
I saw the Mexico City one.

Speaker 2 (01:06:54):
I saw it, and he's doing a cock fighting episode
right now, which is gonna be sick, which is like
a deep in the country of Mexico. And then we
have like correspondent in Israel won in New Zealand, and
then yeah, but in general, I would say, like, oh,
then JP, the homey from New York is the social
media clips.

Speaker 1 (01:07:06):
So I don't know how big your team is. Is
it more or less than ten?

Speaker 3 (01:07:09):
Two?

Speaker 1 (01:07:10):
Oh shit, there's got to be a third. There's that
my boy Erica Rock helps Okay, so my team is
probably like around your size, like under twenty more than three.

Speaker 3 (01:07:19):
Damn yeah, it's it's crazy. Uh. And the other thing
you started to do was dub over your videos in
different languages, which I think mister Beast was Like, was
it mister Beast who started doing that? Ship?

Speaker 2 (01:07:30):
I mean, he's the one who made me want to
do it, now that I watched mister Beasts religiously, but
I've seen mister Beat, so I just know, like he
has a town in North Carolina. It's like a YouTube town,
right where he has a whole studio there with like
different overdubbed team for Different.

Speaker 3 (01:07:45):
Prime show is really good. Oh really Beast Games. It's
like real life squid games. You have kids, right, yeah,
that's why you're watching of course, okay, of course. Yeah. Yeah.
It's like there's no way you get off work and
you're like here we go. No, there was like it's
good though, it's yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:07:58):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:07:59):
So I was gonna ask you because you did you
you talked about your correspondence. You did a really dope
video about it was it took place, and there was
you kind of showed both perspectives in terms of what
was going on in Lebanon. Yeah, and I think you
said the video would did get demonetized.

Speaker 2 (01:08:16):
I mean that video has been like a nightmare. Like
every correspondent who is in that video is now mad
at me for some reason. Wow, you know, because I
had someone in Israel and someone eleven.

Speaker 3 (01:08:25):
Because you had someone on the Israeli side talk and
someone on the Lebed East side talk, and.

Speaker 2 (01:08:29):
Some British guys interviewed this hes blow dude, and they're
mad because I didn't put him in the credits because
I forgot to, And like it's just that that that
piece was a trilateral nightmare. Damn.

Speaker 3 (01:08:38):
But it was good man. Thank you. I'm glad you
liked it, bro, because I feel like it's important because
I feel like, again, there's just these there's there's especially
with that situation. It's like, you know, it just sucks
because I'm sure we probably aligned pretty closely in terms
of how we feel about that. The war that's been
happening for over a year. Definitely this bullshit ceasefire that

(01:09:00):
is probably going to result in. I mean, Trump just
said they want he wants to fucking displace the entire country.

Speaker 1 (01:09:06):
Yeah, which is crazy.

Speaker 3 (01:09:07):
Yeah, but you know, for you, like interviewing a Hesbela
member on camera, that's a risk for you. Yeah. I
didn't do it though, no I know, but just it's
your platform. So like telling the side of the Hesbela.

Speaker 2 (01:09:21):
Dude, I thought, soldier, I thought that covering MAGA and
Antifa shit opened me up to criticism.

Speaker 1 (01:09:26):
Brother. You should have seen when I dropped the Hesbela interview.

Speaker 3 (01:09:29):
Dude.

Speaker 2 (01:09:29):
People were calling me like a pro terrorism platform, like
you know what I mean. I had comments in Hebrew
like wishing death upon me and shit.

Speaker 1 (01:09:36):
I was like, this is they don't play about them at.

Speaker 3 (01:09:38):
Least would you, because I think the other story that
I really would like to see somebody really trying to
tackle in like as is like what's going on in
the West Bank. Yeah, yeah when the settlers and like
there's like a it's pretty fucked.

Speaker 1 (01:09:51):
Yeah, those settlers are on some shit. You seen videos
of them? Oh my god, what's wrong with them?

Speaker 3 (01:09:56):
What is wrong?

Speaker 1 (01:09:57):
Seriously?

Speaker 3 (01:09:57):
They're like maniac like yeah, like what nightmares are made of.
Like there's this lady who's just so mean and evil.

Speaker 1 (01:10:05):
Yeah, they're like homeless people with ars.

Speaker 3 (01:10:07):
They're like homeless people with ars. Bingo. But like you said, dude,
like this shit, it's like almost like there's like this
like you just can't talk about it.

Speaker 1 (01:10:17):
No, well, I mean you can, but it's just like
you're opening yourself up so much, like dude.

Speaker 3 (01:10:21):
Because again with the labels you're anti Semitic or it's
the same thing with like if you disagree with anything
on the left, Yeah, you're a trumper, you're a Nazi.

Speaker 2 (01:10:29):
It's yeah, it's even worse when you're talking about Israel
Palestine though, because you get your channel really taken down.

Speaker 3 (01:10:35):
Yeah, it's interesting too because it's like to see kind
of like the MAGA correlation with like Israel. Yeah, and
then you know, but then there's like the outliers on
the right who are like so far like anti Israel, like, uh,
what's the guy's name with the beer, the fucking Dan Basaria, And.

Speaker 1 (01:10:55):
Yeah, that shit's so funny.

Speaker 2 (01:10:56):
It's also just been so funny to see like MAGA
aligned with is because like for two years they.

Speaker 1 (01:11:01):
Were like the Jewish Cabal of deep state apac elites or.

Speaker 3 (01:11:05):
The Q fuck.

Speaker 2 (01:11:06):
Yeah, these Q fucks yeah yeah, and then and then
now they're lying, they're like funk terrorism.

Speaker 3 (01:11:12):
Yeah, it's crazy.

Speaker 2 (01:11:13):
You know, it's hell of funny. But yeah, man, I'm
definitely not done covering the Middle East, but I'm taking
a little breather and trying to figure it out. Next
time I'm gonna go out there, be careful, Yeah, I'll
be Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:11:24):
Belly has a line he did in a freestyle where
he said hero villain, it's all perspective, and it's like, yeah, yeah,
it's crazy, it's crazy. What are your thoughts on, because
you know, it's been an interesting first week and a
half of President Trump's What are your thoughts on the
first week and a half?

Speaker 2 (01:11:43):
Well, I'll say this man, if Trump does some good
things for the country and the quality of life improves
for average American, I'm not gonna go above and beyond
to try and make him look bad. I'm not this
like weird guy who's just like operating on some anti
Trump spighte. If things get good, I'll cover that too.
So I look at it as like we have no
choice but to just hope for the best. So, I mean,
I try to look past the sort of like anti

(01:12:05):
trans shit, and I just just really think, like, Okay,
is he going to eliminate the extreme poverty and inequality
that we have.

Speaker 3 (01:12:11):
Which is always like I mean, that's what the craziest
thing is is the you know, the extreme poverty is growing,
and then just the wealth gap is just getting It's
almost like, you know, the shit that's happening with trying.

Speaker 2 (01:12:25):
To buy homes in America and American dream is over,
and the gap of regional understanding is crazy. Like, for example,
California is being overtaken by tech transplants and rich people
from other places, causing working class Californians to flee to
Arizona and Texas. And then they say, don't California, my
Texas and they look at them as the problem when
their problem is low key.

Speaker 3 (01:12:45):
Them fucking with Black California.

Speaker 2 (01:12:47):
It's just like this cycle and black Rock owns everything
and everything's all bad. But like I said Brad twenty
twenty eighth that year.

Speaker 3 (01:12:52):
Yeah I hope, so man, I sure hope. So yeah, yeah,
I think it's it's just it's just it's disheartening because
it's like, damn, dude, like I can I don't imagine,
Like if I was like twenty two to twenty three
right now, I wouldn't even even like the thought of
like buying an entry level condo couldn't even cross my mind.

Speaker 1 (01:13:08):
Yeah, I don't. I don't own anything.

Speaker 3 (01:13:09):
Yeah you know what I mean.

Speaker 2 (01:13:11):
Yeah, that's yeah, except by in my two thousand and
seven Tacoma the car. But I mean, aside from that,
I don't even want to buy a house. If I
do buy a house, it's gonna be in the cut
in the country. Like young boy, So you were in
Phoenix for a while, I lived in Phoenix.

Speaker 1 (01:13:23):
For an entire year.

Speaker 2 (01:13:24):
I'm gonna blow the lid off that no one knows
that I was on forty fourth and camel Back, living
behind the village it's an athletic club. Great area, holding
it down, Indian School, Chopper John's.

Speaker 1 (01:13:35):
Siparadia, Yeah, Arcadia, Arcadia, Scottsdale, CUSP.

Speaker 3 (01:13:40):
Yeah, great area. Yeah, so you enjoyed it? Did you
enjoy your year?

Speaker 1 (01:13:43):
I love Phoenix, bro, I'm not gonna lie.

Speaker 2 (01:13:45):
I was a major Tucson flag staff guy and I
moved to Phoenix and I said, you know what, I'm
a figure out. Had to make this place as fun
as possible, and I figured out my spots.

Speaker 1 (01:13:53):
And I got a lot of love for Phoenix.

Speaker 3 (01:13:55):
Now.

Speaker 1 (01:13:55):
Yeah, and Phoenix, I always thought it was like the
Dallas of the West. It's like a gross, infinite sprawl
of nothingness and identical suburban cul de sacs. But Phoenix
is tight.

Speaker 3 (01:14:04):
No, it is tight for sure. Yeah. I mean you
were in a good area too. Great food around there.

Speaker 1 (01:14:07):
Good food, good vegan food, you know. I mean.

Speaker 2 (01:14:10):
The only part I don't like Phoenix really, and I
hate to be negative, is like the downtown Scottsdale area.

Speaker 3 (01:14:17):
Oh yeah, old town.

Speaker 1 (01:14:18):
Yeah, it's just not my thing.

Speaker 3 (01:14:20):
Yeah, I mean I could see why not. It's very
I mean, I know you own a club, a club
in old Town Scott's.

Speaker 1 (01:14:25):
Which is a good business play.

Speaker 3 (01:14:26):
Yeah, I mean, and it's also the only black club
in Scottsdale, so you know it's a hip hop club.
We're booking like fucking whoever you could think of it.
We just had Boston Richie Friday.

Speaker 1 (01:14:35):
Oh really sick. That's tight. I like Tempi though.

Speaker 3 (01:14:37):
Yeah. The Tempe's a vibe. Downtown Phoenix is a vibe.

Speaker 1 (01:14:41):
You see. They had a candlelight vigil last night in
Tempe for the goon for naughticham alone, Oh my god,
goon in Heaven. Goon too soon?

Speaker 3 (01:14:49):
Dude, that this whole fucking guy becoming like the mascot
for gooning on Twitter.

Speaker 1 (01:14:56):
It's horrible, bro.

Speaker 3 (01:14:57):
It's so funny. My kids were like, my my son
is like, yo, dad, you see they had a they
had a they had a fucking they had a gooner role.
I'm like, man, what.

Speaker 1 (01:15:09):
The full text to me? The dude organize. He's like,
you gotta pull up and I was already here and
I was like, oh man, oh that would have been
fired all right.

Speaker 3 (01:15:15):
So yeah, no, there was like for people who don't know,
there's like this guy's fucking forever on internet. Brain what
brought Hall of fame. This guy who caught my friend
owns that.

Speaker 1 (01:15:24):
Place, Bikini Breast Bikini Beans.

Speaker 3 (01:15:26):
Yeah, my friend Ben owns that place. Oh shit, so
he posts. It's funny because he posted the video. He
was the first guy that posted, and I just reposted
it on my story within seconds. I was like, yo,
track this creeped out.

Speaker 1 (01:15:37):
Yeah for sure, and then like, I don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:15:40):
Two days later it was like the guy killed himself
and I felt kind of bad, yeah, because I was like, fuck,
I shared that video.

Speaker 1 (01:15:45):
Fuck was it two full days?

Speaker 3 (01:15:47):
I don't even know.

Speaker 1 (01:15:48):
I thought he went straight to a parking lot in
Goodyear and just did the deed that.

Speaker 3 (01:15:52):
I don't know. I don't know all the deats. I
just know this guy is now, you know, fucking I
didn't even know what dooning he was before two weeks ago.

Speaker 1 (01:15:59):
You know about the Gilbert Goons, though, right, of course
have you them?

Speaker 3 (01:16:03):
Have you? Have you done anything? No Gilbert Good? No,
I didn't.

Speaker 2 (01:16:07):
I was focused on the border and I was like,
I don't want to hear about this ship. But now,
looking back, I wish I had an exclusive.

Speaker 3 (01:16:11):
Yeah, the Gilbert Goons. For people who don't know, it's
like this Gilbert is like the nicest area you could
possibly live in. It's like one of them is pretty
big Mormon area too. But just these fucking they get it.

Speaker 1 (01:16:21):
They killed somebody, right, Rich kid gangs, rich kid Gary's
you know, but like, dude, real ones, No, rich high
school kid gangs are terrifying.

Speaker 2 (01:16:29):
They catch bodies. There was one in Laurel Canyon, the
Wonderland Gang. Yeah, the three eleven Boys in Las Vegas
and Seattle. You had a gang called Spruce Mob that
would hit licks at every house party. They never caught
a body. But these kids got none to lose, no money.

Speaker 3 (01:16:41):
Their parents are by.

Speaker 1 (01:16:42):
Lawyers charged as juveniles.

Speaker 3 (01:16:44):
Their daddy didn't love them enough, wasn't around enough. And
what are they listening to? Fucking Chief Keef and fucking
NBA young boy.

Speaker 1 (01:16:50):
And so we're not gonna blame no Jumper for that, yo.

Speaker 3 (01:16:55):
It's so oh my god, that's funny. Dude. You're obviously
a big hip hop fan. Who were your like like like, like,
who would you say he is like your favorite hip
hop artists of all time?

Speaker 2 (01:17:04):
I mean I grew up in like the litl Be
Chief Key Cooks and Space Ghost Purp generation, you know,
in between odd Future and trippy red if that makes.

Speaker 3 (01:17:13):
Sense, that makes sense. Yeah, I mean this is good
hip hop in there.

Speaker 2 (01:17:15):
Yeah, yeah, that was kind of my era. I mean now,
like I listened to a lot of Lah. I listened
to a lot of sped up Florida music. Like I
listened to a lot of jack Boy obviously Kodak, but
you ever heard a nine to five to four fast
pitch before DJ Frisco, DJ Fetti Fee.

Speaker 1 (01:17:29):
I listened to a lot of.

Speaker 3 (01:17:30):
Shit like that. The crazy shit is I had, you know,
me and Denzel career homies and where I was like, yo, man,
like first of all, Space Ghost Perp. He don't get
enough fucking love for the influence he had. But like
if Raider Clan and Asap Mob never beefed, yeah, Like,
there was just so many possibilities that could have played out, dude.

Speaker 2 (01:17:51):
And you know, we remember a public school breakfast when
you going to give you the apple wrapped in plastic
and a couple of eggs. So when I was in
sixth grade, I used to go to public school breakfas
and there was this dude that would sit at the
table across from me. His name was Keishawn. He ended
up joining Raider Clan and he was the only Seattle member.
He's a rapper named key Niata. So we got to

(01:18:11):
meet some of like the og Raider Clan people at
one of his first concerts in Capitol Hills. So I
had met like space Cohos, Purp and Denzel Curry and
young Sammy when I was like fourteen, And I thought
about that too, like if the asap Purp thing never happened,
which was all about the vocabulary and the Vale replacement
with the excess and V's being taken, if that didn't happen,
I don't know what would have happened. But Purp is legend,

(01:18:33):
little Bee also legend.

Speaker 1 (01:18:35):
I'm trying to think. I wish I had more for you,
but just the whole.

Speaker 3 (01:18:37):
When you're a kid in Seattle, do you just like
fucking Maclamore.

Speaker 2 (01:18:41):
Let's go, well, the thing about Malcilmore and this is
why Seattle guy, by the way, I fucked with Macklimore.
This is why Seattle is such a hater city. Bro
is because Malcilmore was the most respected underground legend.

Speaker 3 (01:18:52):
For yeah No for a few years, Like he was
like an underground rapper bro.

Speaker 2 (01:18:56):
He went to Garfield High School. He's not a suburban cat.
Malcolm was a certified, respected battle rapper, freestyle rapper from
the inner city of Seattle who had the most respect.
The moment Thrift Shop comes out, it hits a billion views,
all of a sudden, he's the people in Seattle are like, haha, Mackelmore,
this and that instantaneously hometown hate and jealousy.

Speaker 3 (01:19:16):
Which is crazy because it's like, dude, this guy's such.

Speaker 1 (01:19:18):
A good guy, such a good that's a band man.
He's from the same neighborhood as me.

Speaker 3 (01:19:23):
Oh wow, Yeah, he's such a good guy, dude, and
he's like, you know, I think it's been just dope
to see him like unapologetically take a stand for a
fucking what's going on in Palestine.

Speaker 1 (01:19:34):
He goes MLK on him, he does, he said some
I forget what he said. No, he talks like MLK
on him. You ever hear him fucking Malcolm wore being
like I'm taking a stand, you know, it's of Yeah,
he does it once every five years, and when he
does it, he's not fucking playing.

Speaker 3 (01:19:48):
I remember when he jumped on the fuck Donald Trump remix.

Speaker 1 (01:19:52):
Oh shit, damn that song.

Speaker 3 (01:19:53):
I forgot about He's on the Fuck Donald Trump remix?
It was I think it was him and G Easy.
I think it was why Yeah, it was y G.
G Easy in Maclamore.

Speaker 2 (01:20:04):
G Easy went to the small Catholic Catholic college that
I went to in New Orleans. But check it out
when that when I hear that instrumental from Fuck Donald Trump,
it gives me goosebumps because that was it was being
played during all the riots in Minneapolis. I can smell,
I can feel the flames from the precinct burning on
my face when I hear that instrumental.

Speaker 3 (01:20:21):
Holy shit, you know what I mean?

Speaker 2 (01:20:22):
That one and the beginning of the Fuck the Police
instrumental before Boosey starts rapping with those two songs.

Speaker 1 (01:20:27):
You'll never experience life until you're around a burning cop
car with the song's playing.

Speaker 3 (01:20:32):
What's what's next?

Speaker 1 (01:20:33):
Man?

Speaker 3 (01:20:33):
I'm this obviously. I know you you're gonna keep the
channel growing and doing big ship, but like, you know,
are you going to continue to do documentaries?

Speaker 2 (01:20:41):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (01:20:41):
Do you think that with the success of this is
the goal that I get to deal with Netflix, maybe
be able to sell the next one to one of
these bigger platforms.

Speaker 1 (01:20:48):
No, I don't want to work with them really.

Speaker 2 (01:20:49):
I mean, actually, you know what, I just don't want
to be put in a position again to where my
future is in the hands of somebody and some people
I don't know. So I would definitely work with NETFLI
in a licensing capacity, but I want every movie that
I drop, I want to drop by myself first on
my own websites, and I'm gonna go to them with
the numbers and say, hey, if you like this, would

(01:21:12):
you like to license it for a year. I won't
post it on my platform. You guys can make as
much money off you want off of it as you want,
like masterp that style. Because whenever you're a documentary filmmaker
and you go to a streaming platform HBO and Netflix,
Prime to be whatever, they're going to calculate how much
money that they're going to give you based upon a
minimum guarantee, which is calculated by your engagement. So if

(01:21:33):
you're in obscurity, if you're in nobody with a dope documentary,
they're going to be incentivized to give you a small number.
But if you're somebody who can say, hey, dear Kelly
did fifty thousand streams in the first month.

Speaker 1 (01:21:43):
Here's how much money we made. Here's the reaction.

Speaker 2 (01:21:46):
How would you like to go into business together? You
license it, do as much as you want with it,
then give it back one day so I can die
with the ip.

Speaker 1 (01:21:53):
That is the best situation. They tell you you can't
do that.

Speaker 3 (01:21:57):
Has anyone done it before? No?

Speaker 2 (01:21:59):
No, because because what the platform say is, I know
it's not that much money, and I know that we're
going to own it. It's not going to be years,
but you're going to be famous, and then that exposure
is going to be your gateway into owning your content
in the future one day. This is a model that
I thought of, and once I explained it to my agent,
he said, yeah, that's possible, and I was like, oh shit, really.

Speaker 1 (01:22:18):
He's like yeah yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:22:20):
I mean if you show why wouldn't they want Because
at the end of the day, you have such a
niche audience, and if it's something that you've already shown
the proof of concept for like hey, no, it worked,
we have this is then this is what we did.
This is the buzz behind the movie. I mean, why
wouldn't they license it?

Speaker 1 (01:22:38):
Not a few reasons, but I mean, you know, in general.

Speaker 2 (01:22:42):
Obviously I've had some controversy in the past that makes
it difficult for them, and secondly marketing budget.

Speaker 3 (01:22:47):
The controversy that you had, I thought it was. I mean,
you don't have to speak on it, but I think
just from a perspective of somebody who follows you and
I think I gather what transpired. Yeah, I just thought
it was It was very very uh Aziz an Zari
type situation. In my opinion, it was like, yeah, are

(01:23:09):
we really trying to cancel this guy?

Speaker 1 (01:23:11):
And what happened behind the scenes is more unbelievable.

Speaker 3 (01:23:13):
Yet to speak on it, but the point is is
that I just felt like, you know, I felt like
your situation and DISEASA situation was like the personification of
cancel culture getting a little fucking out of hand. Yeah,
like what are we doing here? But that's just me,
I know, you know, like you said, you haven't spoke
about behind the scenes, I'm sure.

Speaker 2 (01:23:30):
I mean, it was basically, without giving too much information
out because it's going to all come at at one time. Yeah,
it was a lawyer and a group of people who
most of whom I didn't know, trying to bait me
into a civil settlement to give them a portion of
the HBO movie payout. But I didn't play ball with
these people. They sent out press releases to the media
outlets who basically ran these pieces as a pressure tactic.

(01:23:52):
So I had to the only way out of that
situation really was to kind of like just bite the
bullet and move on.

Speaker 3 (01:23:58):
Wow. So they really try to, yeah, bully you into
a payday.

Speaker 1 (01:24:01):
Yeah, but I didn't do it. But I had to
deal with you know, I had to really make a choice.

Speaker 3 (01:24:06):
You had to face it.

Speaker 2 (01:24:07):
Yeah, because if I were to pay the money to
these people, then there'd be an NDA and nobody would
learn about it. That's what most of the celebrities in
the industry do. I was actually advised to do that
by some of the people I was working with. They said,
you know what, this is a part of becoming famous.
You're going to have people who try to get money
out of you. The best thing to do is take
the L financially and hold on to your career. And

(01:24:28):
I said, you know what, I'm actually not going to
take the L financially because if I pay somebody out
for something I didn't do, then what's going to happen?
Five years down the line, if I continue to have
success and they have that on me, it's going to.

Speaker 1 (01:24:38):
Go up and up and up. I just I didn't
want to be on that hook.

Speaker 2 (01:24:43):
But the point is because I haven't really spoke too
much about that situation with receipts, yet I still have
this issue to where like even today, People Magazine was
supposed to run a feature on me. They had the
whole thing written, and then ten minutes before it's supposed
to come out, up the editor in chief, because of
the controversy, decided to nix the story.

Speaker 3 (01:25:02):
These guys are pussies, but.

Speaker 2 (01:25:04):
That's the world they live in. It's so crazy, So
I'd be crazy to pretend like that's not a road
block to getting my shit on Netflix, you know what
I mean?

Speaker 3 (01:25:12):
Yeah, I mean I think if there's anything that hopefully,
you know, we think about the positives that could happen
with fucking old fucking orange face being president again, is
like a lot of that shit gets eased up and
and and you know it sucks too because you also
see like a lot of these fools just bend in
the kneed to trump and like getting rid of, like,
you know, shit just to bend the need of Trump. Yeah,
but it's like, yo, man, like we got to stop
fucking like just getting people out of here for no reason.

(01:25:36):
And it's become like, you know, there's a real economy
behind it, Like there's an economy behind, there's commerce behind
making us hate each other. Yeah, and there isn't it.
There's this there's a whole black market, you know, economy
behind trying to cancel people or blackmail im legally and
cold legally blackmail people.

Speaker 1 (01:25:56):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:25:57):
And you asked about, you know, the BLM movement too,
and I think it's the same thing with the me
too movement. A lot of things start off with a
genuine purpose, but then the tail end becomes an industry.
It's based upon generating capital.

Speaker 3 (01:26:07):
Yeah, I think the me too thing got pretty out
of hand quick. It was like, yeah, fucking Harvey Weinstein's
a fucking steaming pile of dog shit. And this is
something that obviously happens and it should be addressed. But
if someone hits on you, that doesn't mean that they
sexually like, it's just like it shit, Like I think
I think I don't remember all the details of his

(01:26:27):
ease thing, but I think he flirted with someone and
it didn't go well, and like he I think he
lost his show on Netflix definitely. I mean he's yet
to return, you know, which is crazy because he's like
one of the guys.

Speaker 2 (01:26:38):
Yeah, I mean to if you really want to have
a mind fuck, the person who leads the Creating Evidence Lab,
which is an online workshop that teaches you how to
basically extract a confession from somebody, is Harvey Weinstein's defense attorney.

Speaker 3 (01:26:52):
What.

Speaker 2 (01:26:53):
Yeah, So it's like it's it's like a black Mirror episode,
Like this shit is really this shit's really full circle.

Speaker 3 (01:27:00):
What is your opinion on a guy like Joe Rogan?

Speaker 2 (01:27:05):
I like him, Yeah, I mean, obviously I disagree with
some of the things he said, but I think that
as a podcaster, what he's been able to achieve in
some of the conversations that I've I've seen him have before,
I think he does a great job. I mean, especially
if you think about, like the fact that when he
came onto the scene, you know, podcasting wasn't what it
was today, and so I almost feel like he kind

(01:27:28):
of paved the way for podcasts to be taken more seriously. Yeah,
you know, I know, he's like an easy person to target,
and you know, I did meet him one time and
he wasn't the nicest to me.

Speaker 3 (01:27:38):
You know what I mean. But you know, I feel
like you're gonna end up on that show.

Speaker 1 (01:27:42):
I hope so, bro.

Speaker 3 (01:27:43):
But at the same time, like, but then when you
go on there, when you go on there, they're gonna
be like because now you know, obviously Joe Rogan's a Nazi,
you know, so.

Speaker 1 (01:27:52):
Yeah, they're gonna be you know.

Speaker 3 (01:27:54):
And I think with Rogan is like I always just
appreciate the fact that like he just I've learned about
like archaeology on his podcast and I never would have
or fucking self sustained farming or just like the most
random shit, it's tight. And when it comes to like
political shit, like he'll have like I remember there was
like two a couple of years ago. He had like

(01:28:15):
one guy who was uh, pro climate change and then
another guy who was anti climate change, and he interviewed
them and back to back days and then got them
together to have like a discussion, and I'm like, well
that and it was like four hours long. Yeah, I mean,
you're not getting that.

Speaker 1 (01:28:29):
You're not going to see shit like that elsewhere.

Speaker 2 (01:28:31):
And I think it also speaks to like people's attention
attention span, even though the social media algorithm would tell
you that people have like a short attention span. People
are still watching three and a half hour podcast for sure.
Foples are still going to watch this whole podcast and
they're gonna like it.

Speaker 3 (01:28:44):
You know, what are your thoughts on? Uh, you were
on the ground for January sixth. I was nearby nearby.
Oh you weren't there, Okay, okay, okay, yeah, okay, so
you weren't there, that's right.

Speaker 2 (01:28:56):
I was there for like three different pump fakes where
they said like we're gonna take the Capitol and they
would get close and be like not today.

Speaker 3 (01:29:04):
So I want to know your thoughts because I thought
it was I thought that with the j sixers, I
guess I think that there was probably some people who
probably should have been pardoned who walked into a building,
and then I think there were people who deservingly attacked
Capitol police officers. Yeah, there was like this blanket party
where I was like, I don't know if you should
have partnered all of them, like maybe half like, because

(01:29:25):
I do think that there was genuinely people. I mean,
there was a dude who got arrested who shot his
mixtape cover in the Capitol that day, whoa like some
rapper just because he was there, and like they that's hard. Yeah, yeah,
but I feel like there were people there who just
like genuinely like walked in with their phones, like, oh,
this is crazy, we're in the Capitol.

Speaker 1 (01:29:45):
I hate to be that guy, but like, dude, the
people who should be in jail for January sixth is
like Trump, if you really want to start locking people
up for that, it's the people who told these these
masses that the election was stolen and that they had
to take their country back. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:29:59):
I think too, is they. I think that that Trump
knew it wasn't stolen. That's the problem. If Trump truly
believed the election was stolen, then okay, But I don't
think he truly believed the election was stolen. I think
it's just like Rudy Giuliotti, by the way, he's a
piece of shit, God Jesus, the most cringiest. I feel like, yeah,
out of everybody from the last eight years, I should

(01:30:19):
just love to see him fucking just eat shit.

Speaker 1 (01:30:22):
Fuck Rudy Giuliani. Yeah, especially because he was like a
nine to eleven hero and he had.

Speaker 3 (01:30:26):
To fucked around and do this such a piece of shit, dude.

Speaker 1 (01:30:29):
Yeah, but honestly, like if you look at some of
their prison sentences, some of them were just.

Speaker 3 (01:30:33):
Outrageous, outrageous and like some people like I think we're
just being held without a court date all this time,
and it's like, well, if this teacher like stumbled into
the as long there were people who showed up with
zip ties like attacked officers, that guy should be in
jail for sure. He should never you know, one hundred percent.
What are your thoughts on because you you have covered

(01:30:55):
the Proud Boys. I know, the Proud Boys leader in
Rique what's his last Enrique Tarrio, he just got pardoned.

Speaker 2 (01:31:01):
Yeah, I mean I'm close with a lot of people
who got pardoned. Yeah, I mean they probably don't like
me now because of the HBO documentary. Unfortunately, the way
I was made to posture in that film burned a
lot of bridges with the conservatives.

Speaker 3 (01:31:13):
Really yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:31:15):
They basically made me.

Speaker 2 (01:31:16):
They tried to like posture me into this like misinformation Watchdog,
who was like super blue pillar that just existed to like,
you know, just a Trump and exposed expose white nationalism.
I'm obviously like, I will do that if that's what's
happening with the They made me editorialize it so much
to where like I'm saying shit at the end on
this director's chair monologue that I didn't have a choice

(01:31:38):
a choice in where I'm saying like Enrique Tario couldn't even.

Speaker 1 (01:31:41):
Stomach the fire that he'd fueled, just like pussy as
shit like that.

Speaker 3 (01:31:46):
I wonder because from when I get I one time
we were in Vegas, me and my boys, and we
just happened to be there the night Trump had a
he had a fucking rally, And I think we're staying
at Treasure Island or some Sure, we're staying some and
we happen to be staying where the Proud Boys are staying. Yeah,
So I'm playing Roulette and these and I'm like, real,

(01:32:07):
like my boy he's like hey, He's like, I think
we're surrounded by Proud boys.

Speaker 1 (01:32:12):
Where they were in Fred Perry's, they were wearing like.

Speaker 3 (01:32:15):
Polo shirts yeah, golden yellow gold yeah right yeah, And
I was like, oh shit, but like what, like I
want to say, only one of the dudes at the
roulette table with us was actually white.

Speaker 1 (01:32:27):
Yeah, and if.

Speaker 3 (01:32:30):
Would you consider the Proud Boys. I'm not saying that
I agree with anything they do because I think they're
like more of like a pro masculinity group. But would
you consider them a white supremacist group, because that is
the Yeah, No, not at all.

Speaker 2 (01:32:42):
They're like a nationalist group, like a nationalist drinking club.
They're kind of like soccer hooligans, you know what I mean,
they just get fucked up together and like they yell
about sports and also politics.

Speaker 3 (01:32:53):
Right, Yeah, because I remember because one of the guys
who started the Proud Boys is one of the founders
of Vice.

Speaker 2 (01:32:58):
Yeah, Gavin mckinnis. I think that he has some white
supremacist tendencies.

Speaker 3 (01:33:02):
Yeah, he because he would dress like fucking you just
see that motherfucker. Oh, he definitely he's leaning into that shit.

Speaker 2 (01:33:08):
He definitely fucks with Hitler. But I mean a lot
of them, I feel like they support nationalist governments. But
there's also been nationalist governments like Pinochette Pinochet and Chile.
He wasn't white, right, you know, but he was still
a dictator. There's been plenty of brown fascists.

Speaker 3 (01:33:23):
Yeah, I think what people you know, there's this like
when we talked a little bit earlier about like kind
of like the intersection of like Biden or not Biden,
of Bernie and Trump. Yeah, and like I guess the
quote unquote like America first approach. Yeah, and it's like
it's it's it's not necessary. It's just it's not uh,

(01:33:44):
it's not if it's if Bernie says it is not
white supremacy. Yeah, but they align even if it's on
like twenty percent of that.

Speaker 2 (01:33:52):
I mean, some of the Proud Boys are like urbanized,
like trendy people. I remember in twenty seventeen, I was
at a bar in New York City called Mehnada, which
was like this gay bar, and all the gay Proud
Boys had their annual meeting there.

Speaker 1 (01:34:04):
So I walk up in there.

Speaker 2 (01:34:05):
It'saw all these like trendy gay dudes with like earrings
and shit, and they're wearing the Fred Perry yellow and
black polos and Maga hats, talking about you know, these
gay dudes talking about how you know Trump's gonna help
the gaze out because they're like gay people who don't
like trans people, so they're just like raging about trans people.
So I'm in there right, I'm kicking it. Was an accident, right,
I'm just getting to drink. Like, they don't recognize me.
So I'm just chilling and I go outside and there's

(01:34:27):
like this black dude chilling out there.

Speaker 1 (01:34:28):
I look at him. I'm like, are you a gay
proud boy? And he was like, what the fuck? I'm
not one of those motherfuckers. And I was like, oh,
my bad dog. Yeah, I was joking around. He's like,
you think I'm part of that.

Speaker 2 (01:34:37):
White supremacist shit. You think I'm gay too. I was like, no,
I'm just joking. He was like, fuck you hoe me
my back inside, and that she was. So I still
think about that all the time.

Speaker 3 (01:34:46):
Is there anything you're are you? Are you plotting on
trying to maybe cover like any of these part and
folks to just see what you know. I'm so over
I know you've said that in the documentary.

Speaker 1 (01:34:54):
You're over this shit, dude. It's not that interesting.

Speaker 2 (01:34:56):
That's the thing is, Like I'm on this platform talking
about or Kelly because I worked on it for so
long and I think it has some level of like relevance,
and so does January sixth. But I've been like in
the January sixth media realm for like four years. I
want to move on to like actually cool shit, Like
I got this project coming out soon about like different
sovereignty movements in the US and also like endangered languages

(01:35:17):
in the US, like Cajun, French, Golageechee, Navajo language, some
like Alaskan dude, all types.

Speaker 3 (01:35:22):
I don't know if you've done it yet because you've
done so much, but I think the I think there
has to be the story of like the reservations across
the country.

Speaker 1 (01:35:31):
Yeah, yeah, I've done a little bit.

Speaker 2 (01:35:33):
But like when I was that was the best thing
about living in Arizona Navajo. I got super tapped in
with the natives. Yeah, shout out talking about Homie Kenneth.

Speaker 3 (01:35:41):
Yeah, shouts of the natives. Man, And like it's kind
of crazy, Like, you know, there's like a real fucking
like if you drive through the res houses are they're
fucking living on, Like it's kind of crazy how a
lot of these houses are constructed. Yeah, trailer parks. There's
a lot of drug use, there's a lot of alcoholism,
and it's like I just feel like, you know, that's

(01:36:02):
a very interesting story that needs to be told.

Speaker 2 (01:36:05):
Also, the difference is between the different reservations in Arizona.
Like if you go to Cells, which is in the
Tahona Odom Nation west of Tucson, that place looks like
it's in the Third World country. I mean, it is
broken down. You go somewhere like window Rock, which is
in the Four Corners area in the Navajo Reservation, and
you're like, damn, they got their shit together right for sure.
And it shows how the Bureau of Indian Affairs kind
of picks and shoeses where where it gets investment. And

(01:36:26):
so that was the coolest shit about Arizona living there
is learning about the different reservations, the cultural differences. And
I'm actually producing my first ever like fictional TV show
with an all native cast from Arizona.

Speaker 3 (01:36:37):
Most Oh.

Speaker 2 (01:36:38):
It's called Borders. We're still like getting the pilot done,
but I play a journalist in it.

Speaker 1 (01:36:42):
And it's sick.

Speaker 2 (01:36:43):
It's about it's sort of about the tahonah Odem Reservation
on the border. So it has to do with the
idea of like multiple borders in one state. There's cartel characters.
We got Danny Trejo's son Gilbert on that bitch. We
got hell of different shit. I'm excited and so you're
producing that to pitch it essentially, Yeah, yeah, I think
for a TV show, I'd rather pitch it as opposed
to drop it or independently. Of course, if nobody wants

(01:37:03):
to take it, I'll post it on Channel five and
the whole cast will be there at the end in
a dark room being like.

Speaker 1 (01:37:09):
Please pick this up.

Speaker 3 (01:37:11):
It's not a bad idea. Man. Is there anything that
you have besides the Chatz thing that, because of safety
or because you just think it wasn't in good taste,
ended up being something you decided not to release. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:37:24):
After the George Floyd riots, I went back to the
Target and the kmart that got looted the next morning
and did like a consumer research study about all the
items that didn't get looted, you know. So it was like,
this is a message to Target corporate, like there are
certain items that you have that are so undesirable that
even when it's open season, that's going to be left
on the racks. And it was like Honica sweaters, and

(01:37:44):
like certain game systems that like fools just would not steal.

Speaker 3 (01:37:48):
What game systems would they stay?

Speaker 2 (01:37:49):
I don't know that well, they wanted the PlayStations in
the Xbox, but it was like some of the off
brand VR headsets were just left right, We're just gonna
leave those. Yeah, and even like beats by Dre they
had some left right there, and I was like, damn.
So I feel like it was important market research. And
so it was called what they Didn't Loot and it
was just like a you know, an item by item analysis.
But then I sent it to my boss and he's like,
this is a trespassing charge and I was.

Speaker 3 (01:38:10):
Like, you still keep in contact with with Kelly?

Speaker 1 (01:38:15):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (01:38:15):
Yeah, I mean because you you got pretty emotional. Well,
I would say you got emotional in the movie at
a certain point. I don't want to spoil the movie,
but obviously, being you know, around somebody for so long,
you guys become friends, you know, yeah, how often you
guys talk? And what does he think about the movie?

Speaker 1 (01:38:32):
He loves the movie, Yeah, which is relatively surprising.

Speaker 3 (01:38:36):
Yeah, because he's not. I mean, I think you end
up kind of I watched that movie and I ended
up like like feeling for the guy.

Speaker 2 (01:38:44):
The movie is not anti Kelly, it's not. It's also
not about converting someone to becoming a liberal. No, it's
just a study of family and the intersection of politics
between generations with an American family that's sort of splintered
by it.

Speaker 3 (01:38:58):
Yeah, he likes it.

Speaker 2 (01:39:00):
Only like I was hoping and I'm still hoping that
there's kind of a breakthrough that happens after he sees it.

Speaker 3 (01:39:06):
You know.

Speaker 2 (01:39:06):
I like to think that the movie maybe is the
missing piece and all of this. But he's seen it
several times. He came to two different tour dates on
the Channel five tour last summer, and then he also
came to the premiere in Huntington Beach two and a
half weeks ago, and each.

Speaker 1 (01:39:19):
Time he was kind of like hell yeah, like sick.
So it's a bit confusing.

Speaker 3 (01:39:24):
I thought what I actually loved about was that he
left you a voicemail when you were going through your shit. Yeah,
and you play that voicemail and it was like, damn,
Like this dude, he's a good dude. Yeah, Like he's
not a bad guy.

Speaker 1 (01:39:35):
Like, and he's capable of giving really good advice when
it matters.

Speaker 3 (01:39:38):
Yeah, And like he's obviously he's obviously a smart guy,
because you don't become a lawyer and not be it.
And I mean, I would say they aren't fucking idiots
or lawyers. But it's like this guy had like a
like when you were showing some of his like family
footage with like all the animals they owned, and shit,
I was like, damn, this dude really had the American dream,
like fucking figure it out for real.

Speaker 2 (01:39:56):
And that's kind of one of the subtexts of the
film too, is like he did achieve the American dream,
and what the American dream is on paper is literally
shifting classes, being able to go from a working class.

Speaker 3 (01:40:06):
Because he grew up in like I said, trailer trailer park.

Speaker 2 (01:40:09):
And boom, dude, imagine that twenty years later, after hard
work and dedication, you go to Pepperdine for law and
you're in Laguna Hills living like Zoe one oh one,
and then boom, all of a sudden, it goes away
and the American Dream breaks in front of your eyes.
And especially if you're conditioned by the Reagan era with
that like hyper positivity Bootstrafts mentality, that is like it
might as well be the fabric of space time warping

(01:40:29):
when that happens.

Speaker 3 (01:40:30):
Yeah, no, it's crazy, man. It's such a good movie, dude, people,
and you know you can ran.

Speaker 1 (01:40:34):
It for five bucks, five dollars and fifty five cents.

Speaker 3 (01:40:38):
Uh yeah, I think I think everyone should check it out.
I feel like, especially if you're like a fucking hardcore lefty.

Speaker 2 (01:40:45):
Yeah, because the thing is like a lot of a
lot of hardcore a lot of hardcore lefties.

Speaker 1 (01:40:50):
They want to pretend like these people don't exist.

Speaker 3 (01:40:52):
Or they're not like people, like they're not like hey,
like just be like, yes, they're crazy. They're holding the
signs and they're on the they're screaming at you outside.
But what is like that's a person at the end
of the day in a backstory.

Speaker 2 (01:41:03):
A huge backstory, And in a way, this movie is
kind of for them to say, Hey, if you do
want a revolution, if you want a progressive future, you
have to figure out how to incorporate the millions and
millions of people like Kelly who have valid economic grievances,
who were hypnotized by political media and are now working
for the enemy as they see it. Right, you can't
just have a utopian future without figuring out a path

(01:41:23):
to stability and mental mental strength and solitude for these people.
Not solitude mental like whatever the word is, like a
you know what I mean, Like for sure, mental health services,
but you know, not every Trump supporters.

Speaker 1 (01:41:35):
It's like a head case. I'm just saying no for sure.

Speaker 3 (01:41:37):
No, no, I think And then I think that's the
other thing too, man is I just think like what
you do is you have context and nuanced to just
so many divisive issues. And I feel like, you know,
if somebody watched, like you know, any of your coverage
that you've had over the years, Bro, it's like it's like, Yo,
there's not it's not. We're all in the gray area
and we act like it's black or white.

Speaker 1 (01:41:56):
Yeah, I think there's more people in that zone than
you like to think.

Speaker 3 (01:42:00):
So would you do a podcast?

Speaker 1 (01:42:02):
I'm thinking about it, bro, I'm thinking about it. But
the thing that scares me about.

Speaker 2 (01:42:05):
A podcast is like you look at dudes like Stevo
who have had crazy lives, but they've done a million podcasts.
At some point you've told every story and the lore
kind of goes away, at least for somebody like me
that has a sort of like in field mystique to myself.

Speaker 3 (01:42:21):
Now that's fair, Yeah, no, that's fair. I think I
think you're not overexposed personally, right.

Speaker 2 (01:42:24):
I don't want to tell people and I'm also like,
I'm kind of smart, but I'm more of a listener
than a talker, Like you've been in the radio, like
you know what you're doing. Not saying I'm a bad podcaster,
but I don't know if I have a take for everything.

Speaker 3 (01:42:36):
Yeah, and I do feel like what you do is
like a version of I mean, it's all content, right, podcasts,
the content of v logs, content, a mini documentaries, content Like,
So I think what you do, man, is I think
unless you think you're doing a podcast will add to
like the overall like mission of journalism. Yeah, then you know,

(01:42:58):
just double down on the ship you're doing.

Speaker 1 (01:43:00):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:43:00):
One thing that I would do is like a hybrid
between I guess Channel five and software Underbelly. I want
to get an ambulance, buy an ambulance and kind of
gut the back and turn it into a mobile studio
where I can talk to just like random people, not
just like.

Speaker 3 (01:43:14):
I'm gonna pull up the Yeah, I'm gonna pull up
wherever sweet yeah right, kid row. It could be fucking yeah,
the White Lives Matter in Huntington Beach. It could be anything.

Speaker 2 (01:43:21):
So I would do a podcast with like random people
and sometimes famous people. But not just famous people, right,
you know because famous.

Speaker 3 (01:43:28):
Well, you're the only person I think that's interviewed to Yeat.

Speaker 2 (01:43:31):
Actually Complex got him, which was very unfortunate, but they
didn't do it.

Speaker 3 (01:43:35):
Like yeah, but I felt like, did you have like
the first interview with Yeat?

Speaker 1 (01:43:38):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (01:43:39):
Well actually our Generation Music got him before, but I
had early. They were pretty early.

Speaker 1 (01:43:44):
Yeah, I had the first post blow up interview.

Speaker 3 (01:43:47):
Yeah. Year, He's I I can't wait for hip because
I feel like he EA's a pretty interesting guy. Heard
he owns a ton of guns. He's from Portland.

Speaker 1 (01:43:54):
Yeah, Heat's awesome, Like he's like, uh yeah, I just
I want to know more about him.

Speaker 3 (01:43:59):
But he's so fucking was there.

Speaker 2 (01:44:00):
Like yeah right, and so like I want to be
somewhere in between that and Steve O and Steve O'shit's cool.

Speaker 1 (01:44:06):
It's I'm not hating on Steve.

Speaker 3 (01:44:07):
Yeah, it's cool.

Speaker 1 (01:44:08):
Just saying everyone knows every story now almost for she's
done a thousand podcasts.

Speaker 3 (01:44:14):
Is there anything man for you that you just want
to kind of like like, Okay, let's say you had
to kind of you know, twenty years from now, man,
what do you do you what would you say you
would want your legacy to be man, hey, man, just
never fold.

Speaker 1 (01:44:30):
Yeah, just yeah, it's basically it never fold. Just hope
the war. I hope we're still fighting.

Speaker 3 (01:44:36):
Yeah yeah, not the war in God's obviously no no no,
but just the.

Speaker 2 (01:44:40):
War message to myself in twenty years. I hope that
we're still on top, we're still doing our shit. I
hope we never compromise. I hope we never sell out.
I hope we never let somebody control us. I hope
we never let a bureaucratic, corporate media establishment own a
single percent in Channel five.

Speaker 1 (01:44:56):
And I hope that the media establishment is dead and gone.

Speaker 3 (01:45:00):
I think it's happening.

Speaker 1 (01:45:01):
Yeah, I think it.

Speaker 3 (01:45:02):
I think slowly but surely, and you know, I think
it has to. Man. I just feel like, you know,
CNN and all these fucks, they're all full of shit.

Speaker 1 (01:45:13):
Bro, they're full of shit.

Speaker 2 (01:45:14):
But the problem is, you know's maybe more full of
shit clickbait reactionary podcasters.

Speaker 3 (01:45:19):
Oh you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (01:45:20):
So that's the thing is you're taking one swamp and
you're kind of starting a new.

Speaker 3 (01:45:25):
And it's a bigger swamp that the entry level was zero,
and you can let anybody can turn a camera on. No,
for sure, it's it's fucking crazy. It's crazy.

Speaker 1 (01:45:33):
CNN has to get caught in a lie, you know
what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 (01:45:36):
I think they've been caught in a few. I don't
understand why Rogan never sued them for the They made
his skin yellow, and that whole ivermectin thing was just crazy.

Speaker 1 (01:45:46):
They made his skin yellow when they put him on TV.

Speaker 3 (01:45:49):
Yes, they live in Mexico. They made him look like
he was sick when he did his It was fucking crazy.

Speaker 1 (01:45:54):
Damn bro, that's whack.

Speaker 3 (01:45:56):
Yeah, no, I just they did that for real.

Speaker 1 (01:45:58):
Yes, that's unbelievable.

Speaker 3 (01:45:59):
But it's in saying and I'm like he always said,
he was like, you know, I could sue him, but
I just this is not worth it. I'm like, yeah,
you could sue, sue somebody for putting a tent on
you because they were trying to make it that. I
think the whole angle of the.

Speaker 2 (01:46:11):
Story was he was sick. He's getting jaundice from ivermactin. Yeah,
like that's the vibe, right, Like his skin is turning yellow,
like he's going in septic shop.

Speaker 3 (01:46:18):
I guess so, man, But yeah, I think I think, man,
you're doing good work, bro keep it up, and you know,
I look forward to seeing you guys expand with the
different correspondence you have all over the world. Any any
areas you're looking, I would love to see, like somebody
maybe in Africa like.

Speaker 1 (01:46:33):
There, I had a homegirl in the UH in the
Democratic Republic of Congo that I.

Speaker 3 (01:46:37):
Would say Congo specifically.

Speaker 1 (01:46:38):
But our policy is if you're going to cover something,
you have to be from that area.

Speaker 3 (01:46:42):
At least you know what I'm saying. I mean, that's
the thing. Though it's also dangerous, like covering those fucking
minds in Congo are crazy. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:46:48):
Well, if you're an African person who wants to work
for Channel five, tap it and you're not scared by
emails Andrew at Channel five dot news.

Speaker 3 (01:46:56):
There it is, my guy. I appreciate you coming through.
Go get the movie.

Speaker 2 (01:46:59):
Dear Kelly to www dot Dear kellyfilm dot com five
dollars fifty five cents rental.

Speaker 3 (01:47:03):
It is amazing. Buy it for fifteen dollars if you
want to. Yeah, support you gotta support this guy's got
lawyer fees.

Speaker 1 (01:47:08):
Support me. I need new ties.

Speaker 2 (01:47:10):
Shout to pop Eye, Shout out to pop Eye Man
you know, you know loves this tie Kelly Lefty gunplay
interview coming soon.

Speaker 3 (01:47:16):
Oh you interviewed Lefty? Yeah? How how off the shits
was he at the time he was doing He's a
good friend of mine.

Speaker 1 (01:47:22):
He was doing good.

Speaker 3 (01:47:23):
Yeah, I know he's doing Oh he's the best. Yeah,
he might be the most. I mean since listen. I
don't want to compare him to krypt Mac because he
would hate that, But since Krip Mac, I'm not sure
we've had a more entertaining personality hit. These internets agreed.

Speaker 2 (01:47:36):
Shout out to Lefty, shout out to Bootleg keV, shout
out to Phoenix, shout out to Kelly, shout out to
Bill Joyner.

Speaker 3 (01:47:42):
I hope you dropped Bill Joying to drop the fuck
it soap bro boom my guy appreciate you rather Yeah,