July 14, 2025 • 38 mins
Behind every budget is a backstory—and for many people, that story is complicated. Today’s episode is a wake-up call to those of us who are tired of shrinking to fit someone else's idea of success. Lauren Simmons—who shattered barriers on Wall Street at just 23—joins us to share how audacity is the real game-changer. It's about embracing our worth, owning our power, and making bold moves that reflect the future we actually want. Get ready to become financially unrecognizable in six months!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
What would it take for you to become financially unrecognizable
in the next six months. No, I'm not talking about
getting rich quick or having more money. I'm talking about
being bolder, clearer, and more in control of your money
and your mindset. Today, financial expert Lauren Simmons is here
to show us what happens when you stop waiting for
permission and start leading with audacity. She made Wall Street
(00:27):
history at twenty three years old, y'all. But she says
that real power comes when we change the stories we've
been telling ourselves about our money are worth and what's possible?
Speaker 2 (00:38):
How can you be so audacious? And people could take
that as a negative or positive. I think it's absolutely
a positive, through and through. And I think that there
should be more women that have the audacity to step
into rooms and spaces and to be their most empowered
badass self because we have done enough of playing small,
(00:59):
and I think we should be as colorful and right
and beautiful and amazing as we identify.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
I'm simone voice, and this is the bright side from
Hello Sunshine. To be honest with you, I had a
little epiphany as I was preparing for today's interview with
our fabulous financial expert Lauren Simmons. As I was doing
some research, I realized that a lot of the financial
advice that we are fed is it's predicated on guilt,
(01:28):
on telling us what we should be doing or what
we're doing wrong, like spend less, don't buy your seven
dollars lattes that bring you so much joy? What Like
I'm going to stop doing that? So I'm interested in
hearing from experts who can offer a different perspective, Like
what if our relationship with money didn't have to be
rooted in what we're doing wrong? What if changing our
financial life started with focusing on what we're doing right?
(01:51):
And Lauren Simmons is the perfect voice for this conversation
because she's not just giving us permission to rethink our
money habits, she's inviting us to have the audacity to
believe we're worthy of something better. If our guest story
sounds like the stuff movies are made of, that's because
it is. There actually is a movie studio making a
movie about Lauren simmons life, Because at just twenty three
(02:12):
years old, Lauren did the impossible. She became the youngest
full time trader in the history of the New York
Stock Exchange, all without a finance degree or a background
in the stock market at all. So Lauren's story went
completely viral, and in our conversation today, she walks us
through the moment she learned that she made history as
(02:34):
only the second African American woman to become a full
time trader on the New York Stock Exchange floor. And
let me tell you, when she retells that story, chills
we both got emotional. Lauren's life undoubtedly changed after that.
She went on to write Make Money Move, which is
a book that shares her knowledge of investing and financial
(02:55):
literacy with the next generation. Lauren really is redefining what
it means to be financially empowered, and she's doing it
through this lens that you might not expect. Attachment styles. Yeah,
just like in dating, only this time it's with your
bank account. So today we're unpacking our money attachment styles,
confronting the stories we've inherited about money and making space
(03:16):
for something better. And Lauren's getting real about how she
fought for better pay even when the odds were stacked
against her, why she never let the boys Club of
Wall Street strip her of her authentic southern charm and
why audacity is truly the secret sauce for living out
our wildest dreams. All right, let's get into it with
Lauren Simmons. Lauren Simmons, Welcome to the bright Side.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
I'm so excited to be here.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
You have the brightest energy. It just fits. It works, dude.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
Your story is like the stuff that fiction is made
of in the best possible way. It's like so mind
blowing this journey that you've had from not having a
background in finance and not having any connections to the
stock market to then becoming one of the youngest traders
in the history of the New York Stock Exchange. How
(04:07):
did you become a stock trader with no finance degree
and no Wall Street connections?
Speaker 2 (04:13):
You know, I moved from Georgia to New York the
day I graduated college. I went to school for genetics.
I did not have a background in finance, and the
day that I graduated, December thirteenth, I said, I'm moving
to New York and I really couldn't pursue my genetics
background that I had intended to because what I wanted
to do, I really wanted to be able to alter
(04:35):
genetic DNA so that kids wouldn't be born with any
genetic abnormalies. I have a twin brother with a disability,
and the only place that they legally practiced that was China,
And at the time, I just didn't have the fortitude
to say, I'm going to go to China and live
on my own and you know, be a Boston this world.
(04:56):
So vivod and moved to New York and York The
Yorick was an interesting journey because it was the first
time in my life that I realized adults love projecting
their fears onto people.
Speaker 1 (05:10):
Wait, how so, how did you see that?
Speaker 2 (05:12):
In the sense of getting unsolicited advice? I wanted to
make a six figure salary, which some people were like,
that is so bold and ambitious of you. You know,
why do you think you're worthy or deserving of that?
And I had spent much of my four years in
college of meditating really getting deep, like who is Lauren Simmons?
(05:33):
How does she want to show up in this world?
That I never allowed people that you know, had their
own fears project that onto me. So while they were
questioning or trying to invalidate what I wanted, I just
never let that, you know, make me feel small. I
was going to put myself out there and that's all
really you can do. I ended up meeting a wonderful
(05:55):
man named Jason who worked at Goldman Sachs, and Jason,
within five minutes of meeting me, said, would you be
open to an equity trading position at the New York
Stock Exchange?
Speaker 1 (06:06):
Wait? How does that go down? So you don't have
a finance degree at this point? Right? What on paper?
Says to him, Yeah, she should totally do this job.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
Nothing on paper. And I think that's what's a little
bit mind blowing about for people my story in the
sense of well why not? And I think statistically seventy
six percent of people don't go into the field in
which they major in. But what I love about when
you find your allies and you find your people, they
(06:38):
always see something in you that you don't see in yourself.
And for him, even if it was just five minutes
of conversation, I think he felt like, Okay, I know
someone that can give her an entry level position and
she's either going to sink or swim. And that's kind
of really I think the theme overall when we think
about New York city, it's so many hustlers. You put
(06:59):
yourself out there either going to make it, and it
doesn't mean like in a you're going to make history,
you're going to become famous, but you're going to make
it in your own lane, or you're not and you
pivot and you do something else. And so I don't
really try to overanalyze the why he saw something. He
gave me an opportunity. That opportunity wasn't guaranteed, but it
was put yourself out there and see what comes from
(07:21):
the experience.
Speaker 1 (07:22):
What do you think he saw in you at that age?
And I know that there were other allies who are
part of your story and they saw something too, What
do you think it was?
Speaker 2 (07:30):
I think even just having the audacity to cold reach
out to him at the time on LinkedIn and to say, hey,
I would love to have an exploratory meeting. The only
connecting dot was that he had volunteered at the YMCA
in New York and I had volunteered at the YMCA
in Georgia, and that was it, you know. But I
(07:50):
think just that I would even be able to put
myself out there to ask the question of like, can
you have an exploratory meeting, you know, in the lens
of a twenty two year old at least at the time,
I think that was very bold and ambitious and like wow,
like she would do this and why would she do this?
I think the younger generation is a lot more ambitious,
(08:11):
and they reach out to any and everyone. And if
you don't, you know, the advice that I would have
slide into people's dams appropriately reach out on LinkedIn, you know,
put yourself out there. All you can do is really
shoot your shot and whatever it's meant to be will be.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
You said a word that I want to go back
to because it's one of my favorite words, audacity. Like
I'm done with empowerment, I'm even done with strength, I'm
done with all those words. I just want to talk
about audacity. And I want to talk about women who
have audacity.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
Yeah, because it's such a powerful concept. It is, it
isn't And I think for some people when they hear
the word audacity is like they can kind of sometimes negative,
but it's really just being bold, being boss, being you know,
all those empowering words that we hear, like how can
you be so audacious? And people could take that as
a negative or positive. I think it's absolutely a positive
(09:02):
through and through. And I think that there should be
more women that have the audacity to step into rooms
and spaces and to be their most empowered badass self
because we have done enough of playing small, and I
think that we should be as colorful and bright and
beautiful and amazing as we identify.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
Yes, So getting back into your story, So you slide
into this man's LinkedIn DMS. He offers you a connection. Yes,
so what does that connection lead to?
Speaker 2 (09:32):
That connection? He said, I know a gentleman that works
at the New York Stock Exchange. Would you be open
to an equity trading position at the New York Stock Exchange?
And honestly, I mean I said yes without even thinking. Right,
this is young Lauren who just came out of college
that had no background but was still in that very
like learning and eager to learn and wanting to prove
(09:54):
the world like I am, you know somebody, which I
knew at the time I was, but I just wanted
to to be given the opportunity, so I didn't have
any hesitation. And the truth of the matter is I
didn't fully conceptualize what an equity trader was because it
just wasn't in my background. But I knew that if
I was given the opportunity. I don't know how I knew.
(10:15):
I just knew that I would be great in the role,
whatever that led to, whatever that meant. And so I
just needed the opportunity. And it's funny because right after
my meeting with him, there was this ping pong match
that was happening in my head. Like one side was
very eager, excited, and I'm like, he's gonna connect me
with someone at the New York Stock Exchange. Don't even
know what I'm going to be doing, but I'm so excited.
(10:37):
And then the other side was, oh, he just wasted
my time, and he was trying to be polite because
I had been in the rhythm of meeting a lot
of individuals that said that they were going to follow up,
and they just frankly didn't. And so as I'm walking
around vibrationally with this ping pong match, I'm making my
way back to Jersey because my grandparents lived in Jersey,
(11:00):
and I'm getting on the subway and as I'm getting
on the subway, my phone slips out of my hand
through the cracks of the subway station onto the bottom
of the platform.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
Stop.
Speaker 2 (11:10):
Yeah, as if this was a movie, So.
Speaker 1 (11:13):
Like, this is what I'm saying, Your life is a
movie and this is one of those scenes. Yeah, so
your cell phone just slips into the oblivion of the subway.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Platform and it was like one of those like did
this really just happen? But it was also a moment
of just a wave of emotions came because at this
point I had moved to New York in December. It
was now early March, and nothing that I had set
out had manifested or came to life.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
I know that feeling. That's a rough feeling.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
So I and I'm getting on the subway. I just
sat down. I wasn't gonna cry in front of anyone,
made my way to Jersey, switched over to another train,
got to my grandparents' house. They opened the door, and
I'm hysterically crying, and all of my insecurities, my doubts
of like making this jump to New York, was it impulsive,
(12:06):
was I worthy enough? Was I intelligent enough? Just came
out on the forefront and I'm crying, and I'm so
grateful that I have the family that I have because
through all those tears. I finally stop crying and my
aunt she looks at me and she says, did you
ask a subway attendant to pick up your phone? And
(12:26):
I'm looking at her, like, subway attendant pick up my phone?
Speaker 1 (12:30):
Like what?
Speaker 2 (12:30):
What is a subway attendant? She so graciously goes all
the way back to New York, all the way back
to the subway station, all the way back to the platform,
comes all the way back to Jersey and she hands
me my phone. And this is one of those surreal
moments of we're always exactly where we're meant to be.
(12:51):
Trust that, and also trust that everything is going to
work out. And she hands me my phone, and on
that phone, it wasn't a crack, it wasn't a ding,
like as if nothing had ever happened to this phone.
But what there was was a voice mail inviting me
to the New York Stock Exchange the very next morning.
Speaker 1 (13:11):
Wow, so that was the beginning.
Speaker 2 (13:13):
Yeah, And I always get chills because I do remember,
as if it was yesterday, what it meant to break
away from Jason, to be walking through New York City, like, wow,
this is another dead end, but I'm going to be
positive and without me even realizing that notification would change
the course of my life.
Speaker 1 (13:34):
We've got to take a quick break, but we'll be
right back with more from Lauren Simmons. So you mentioned
that you didn't really conceptualize what it meant to be
an equity trader. You just said yes, yes, which I love.
I feel like that speaks to this willingness and this
eagerness that we have when we're younger, and some of
(13:57):
that kind of fades away and we get more hesitant
about saying yes to things. But when you're young, you're like,
I'm in I'm just going to do it. Yeah. And
so you become an equity trader, what did your day
to day actually look like? You know?
Speaker 2 (14:10):
So the first month of me being an equity trader,
the role really wasn't fully mine. I had to pass
the series nineteen, which historically has an eighty percent fail rate.
It is an in house New York Stock Exchange exam,
so it's not an exam that you can study for.
You can go online, you look for answers. They give
you a book about this big and they say good luck.
(14:32):
And the truth of the matter is is that many
men on the floor have never actually taken this exam.
Speaker 1 (14:38):
How is that possible?
Speaker 2 (14:40):
So the series nineteen is now administered under FENRA. FINRA
is the Financial industry regulatory Agency, and the New York
Stock Exchange used to be a private entity. There was
no rules, there was no regulation. The tests were in house,
and many of the men, from my understanding, they would
(15:01):
take the exam and then they would self grade the exam,
or they would give the test administrator a pack of
beer and they would pass the exam. So about the
early two thousands, once the New York Stock Exchange became
a public entity, it was now regulated under FINRA. So
now this is a I'm not going to say it
wasn't a legitimate exam before, but now there is a
(15:23):
third party who was grading this exam and all exams
for you to be licensed. And there just is no
one really that you can turn to on the floor
to say what is on this exam and how do
I prep and study for this exam? So what I did?
I studied the book cover to cover, which many men
on the floor were like at the time, why would
(15:43):
you do that? Well, I'm imagining if I'm taking this
exam and this is what been risk giving me there
must be answers that are relating to the test. And
I'll never forget that the day that I went to
take the exam, the men were openly taking bets against me.
Wait what now, I everyone always has that reaction, and
I think it's because what the men on the floor.
(16:06):
You have to understand, they bet on everything. They bet on,
like is John gonna come in with the yellow tie today?
They do a lot of betting on sports, Like it's
just the nature of the floor. Everything is like always
like do we think, flip a coin, take a bet,
do a poll. But in this particular case, they were
definitely betting against me. I'm not passing this exam, which
(16:30):
I think for me gave me even more fire. I
still have that energy today. But we're talking about twenty
two year old Lauren who just wants to prove to
people that she is worthy and that she's somebody, and
not that I grew up not ever feeling like I
wasn't somebody, but I did grow up in a high
school environment where I was bullied, people often doubted me
(16:53):
for whatever reason, and I've just really when I became
an adult, and by being an adult, I meant graduated college,
like I'm going to prove all you people wrong, and
that in her child of mine, I just really wanted
to help amplify her voice and make her feel special
and make her feel like she could do anything in
this world. And you are going to respect her.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
So you passed this test which has an eighty percent
fail rate. Yes, if I were you, I would have
rubbed it in their faces, the men who were betting
against me. But I'm sure you're much more classy than
that then I was.
Speaker 2 (17:30):
Now, I think I'm a little petty that I'm just like,
I don't care. But you know, I think when you're
that young, definitely a lot of people pleasing and trying
to make it seem like it's not a big deal.
And it was a big deal because that moment would
solidify me making history. Yes, and what's so beautiful about
me taking that test? You end up having to sign
your name literally into history, right next to the Rockefellers
(17:53):
and the Vanderbilts. And I don't think at that moment
I grasp what a big deal that was. I will
never forget. My mom flew in from Georgia. My grandparents
were there, my extended family, my aunt, they had this
beautiful ceremony. I'm in this room with I want to say,
twenty other new mail brokers and I was the single
(18:13):
woman and this red shirt like in the center of
the photo. And I'll never forget that. A New York
Stock Exchange Archives came up to me and she was like,
you don't know how amazing this moment is. And you know,
I'm thinking her saying, you know how grateful I am.
And she says to me, you are the second African
American woman in the exchange is two hundred years to
(18:36):
have ever signed this book. And I just remember like
a wave of emotions. But I'm about to cry now,
but just like almost crying because I'm like, I'm the second.
I'm the second. Like how beautiful that is? But how
sad that is? Because how are we still achieving these
kind of recognitions in two thousand and anything.
Speaker 1 (18:59):
It makes me emotional to hear you tell that story.
That's just that's so beautiful and empowering. What makes you
emotional about thinking back to.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
That moment trusting the world so much?
Speaker 1 (19:11):
What do you mean by that?
Speaker 2 (19:12):
And that's going to be really sad to say. I think,
like you said, when you're young, you just you're so
excited about life and opportunity, and I very much still am.
But as you go through your own experiences and you
go through your own journey and life, you could be
so grateful and proud in some moments and then be
(19:33):
so conflicted in other moments. I think as a woman,
certainly as a woman of color, certainly, as an African
American woman, on how much harder we have to work
than our male counterparts. And you get disappointed a little
on the journey. Not that you don't keep a smile
(19:55):
on your face and you keep moving forward, but you
just you look back on things and you're like, if
I was a white male, this would have looked a
lot differently. And I think that's the part that I
try not to attach to so much, Like I try
to go back to I'm this twenty two year old,
and you know, life is amazing and life is not
(20:18):
that hard, and affirmations are real. But you do realize
some things, and I think you realize it even more
maybe in this climate twenty twenty five where we're at,
and you start thinking, wow, why does it seem like
we've taken a few steps back when we have come
so far.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
The progress comes with a little bit of pain too. Yeah,
your story got out that you had made history, that
you had become the youngest woman to be a full
time trader for the New York Stock Exchange and only
the second African American woman. When did you realize that
that was a big deal.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
Honestly, it probably was when the story went viral, because
I had made history a year before BBC Stephen Miller
decided to run the story, and even when he came
up to me, it was very are you the only
woman at the New York Stock Exchange? And I was like, well,
I guess I am outside of like the news anchors,
(21:14):
the journalists that were working down there. Pr I just
I never equated that I was the only woman because
I was just so focused in like my work and
this is what I'm going to do that I guess
I didn't realize that I was the only woman. And
even then me being the only woman and making history,
while it was amazing for me and my family and
we you know, cherished that moment and what I did,
(21:36):
I didn't really think the story had legs or that
it would be inspirational aspirational to people, or that they
would care, and so when he said he wanted to
cover the story, cool, great, and then CNBC covered and
it just went viral. It went viral. I'm getting calls
from China, I'm getting calls in Germany, I'm getting calls
(21:58):
here in America, and it's just so grateful for it,
Like there was nothing negative about it. It just was wow,
like people care about this small town girl from Georgia
and her making history.
Speaker 1 (22:12):
What I think is so fascinating about your time at
the New York Stock Exchange is the reality versus our
perception of it. I think when we see it represented
in films like Wolf of Wall Street or Wall Street,
we have this idea that traders are making tons of money.
But you were making twelve thousand dollars a year. Is
(22:32):
that correct?
Speaker 2 (22:33):
That was correct? That was interesting. And I always ask
myself if I had to go back in time when
I do it again, Yes, absolutely, But I'm not giving
the advice to anyone to ever do something where you
are not getting paid your value or your worth. But
you also have to look at your ROI like your
(22:53):
return on interest, like what what do you think you'll
get out of it? And so I knew that I
was going to get a lot out of accepting a
job for twelve thousand dollars. But here's the thing. When
I got the job, I was always told, oh, this
is gonna be your starting like salary. Okay, cool, and
then you're gonna pass this exam, so then I would
(23:15):
actually be licensed and you're gonna make more money. Wonderful, Okay.
Once I passed the exam, I'm like, okay, So like,
what's what's this bump in salary? And the bump was
up to the twelve thousand that I was making a year,
So I was making less before I was making the
twelve thousand, and I just remember, huh. And this is
(23:37):
where again, just the curiosity, I started asking more questions, well,
how much do you make? And how much do you make?
And how much do you make? And mind you, for
people that don't understand the dynamic of the floor, there
was only about six of us that were under the
age of twenty five younger. Everyone else was forty and older.
(23:58):
So this is an older generation and where people don't
openly talk about their salary and their pay and they're
very uncomfortable with that. But we know how empowering it
is to understand what people are getting paid. It's not
a jealousy thing, but it's more as to what am
I working toward us? And does this even make sense
to stay in a position if I'm working towards nothing.
(24:20):
I remember having a conversation with a male colleague that
didn't work at my firm, but he worked at another
firm but we did the exact same position. We went
out to dinner one night and he tells me I'm
making one hundred and twenty thousand dollars and I have
a poker face when I want to at least, and
I I'm just not like yeah. He was like, you know,
(24:40):
it's just so amazing that we are young twenty year
olds coming to the New York Sock Exchange, people of color,
and we're making this much money. Yep, amazing. I go
to work the next day and my direct that I
work alongside with, who had been on the floor for
about five six years. I tell him I'm like such
(25:03):
and such as making one hundred and twenty thousand. He's like,
I don't believe you. He does another job. No he doesn't,
he doesn't do another I was like, you know what,
you know what? He does he does the exact same
thing I'm doing. He's like, it's it's just no way,
mind you. My direct who had been there for five
six years, he at the time I wanted to say
it was twenty five. I think twenty six, was only
(25:26):
making about fifty five thousand, so not even close to
what the other person was making. And that is when
I knew that I think maybe we're being a little
too loyal by default, and I think you guys have
somehow in your mind made it okay to have these
(25:46):
poor salaries when clearly there are people working, maybe not
at this firm, but right next door to you, making
actual Liverpool wages in New York City. And my mom,
she works in HR. I remember her always having a
problem with the salary, but she understood the bigger opportunity
and the networking and the connections and all of that.
(26:08):
She said to me, just address self in the room,
tell them that you're not making New York City minimum salary,
which at the time in New York the minimum salary
in New York City, New York I believe was fifty
two thousand dollars. So I put it in a company email.
Hey wanted to bring this to attention, I'm not even
making the New York minimum salary. I got an email back,
(26:31):
come up stairs immediately. They were knock going to have
this conversation with me over an email server. Come upstairs immediately.
So I come upstairs and I'm having to show them
the HR minimum wage guidelines in New York City and
what I believe this was like twenty seventeen at the time,
and they were like, well, it's no way that we're
(26:52):
gonna be able to bump you up to fifty two
from twelve. And I knew that going into it, So
we'll just pay you hourly. We'll just do forty hours
a week. The problem is I was working way over
forty hours a week, but that was the compromise that
we had. And even then, my takeaway maybe was like
twenty three thousand.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
Event everyone was.
Speaker 2 (27:11):
Like, oh there was bonuses, Oh, your position was on commission.
It was none of that. My position was not on commission.
There was never a bonus. That was what my salary was.
And pretty much once that conversation was had, I knew
surely thereafter I was going to be.
Speaker 1 (27:26):
Leaving more from Lauren Simmons after this shortbreak and we're
back with Lauren Simmons. So you did two years on
the trading floor. It sounds like you learned a lot
about how to advocate for yourself, about how to stand
your ground. After your time at the stock exchange, you
(27:49):
wrote a book called Make Money Move, and I know
that you have a big passion in educating the next
generation of investors and empowering young people around topics of
financial literacy. I've been thinking about this idea of becoming
unrecognizable in six months and how we can do that
in different areas of our life. And so one thing
(28:11):
I'd love for our listeners to be able to take
away from this conversation is like, if they wanted to
completely transform their finances in six months, what kind of
roadmap would you give them to do that.
Speaker 2 (28:24):
When we're thinking about transforming our finances or who we
want to be in the next six months, who we
want to be in the next year, so we have
to take a step back and realize what is the
work that we need to be doing to get to
that person in six months, a year, etc. Etc. And
one of the ways to do that, especially when we're
talking about finances and we're talking about mind body, wealth,
(28:44):
and how they're all interconnected. Is our different attachment styles
and how they are holding us back from the financial stability,
the financial wellness we're looking to achieve in the next
six months.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
And when you say our attachment style, you mean our
attachment styles to money. You've talked about this quite a bit.
So we've got anxious, avoidant, spiritual, fearful, and healthy attachment.
Let's start with the first one. Can you describe someone
who might be anxiously attached to money?
Speaker 2 (29:15):
So anxious attachment style something that I identify with, doesn't
matter if you were making a lot of money, a
little bit of money. You were constantly emotionally tied to
your finances. And it's typically fear based, the fear of
lack and not having enough. And these are typically people
(29:37):
that are constantly checking their banking account, They are over
budgeting and saving, they are not living their life in
the moment, and anytime they make a purchase, they feel
guilty about that purchase. Now, for me, I'm so grateful
that I'm at a place where I'm financially stable, but
anytime I make a big purchase, I'm like, can I
(29:59):
do this at my bank account? Let me look at
my Excel sheet? Did I budget enough? Did I save enough?
And larger purchases are even more scary for me. And
I came from a parent who had an anxious attachment
style to money, and so if there's anyone that's listening
that identifies with that, I think one of the best
(30:20):
practices that we can do to be more in alignment,
to have a more healthy attachment to money. Number one,
stop looking at your bank account. Number two, you budget
and saved. You know how much money you have coming in.
Stop looking at the Excel sheet, stop looking at your savings.
(30:42):
If you have enough, you know you have enough. You
haven't done any new purchases to say I don't have enough.
You have it. It's there. Breathe, relax. And the third
thing I would say, sit down, meditate, go put your
mind anywhere but finances. Go for a long walk, go where,
go go watch some mindless TV. Do something where you
(31:04):
are not attached to that bank account.
Speaker 1 (31:07):
And so kind of the on the other end of
the spectrum is avoidant attachment.
Speaker 2 (31:12):
Avoidant. Yes, yes, people shut down the conversation. They don't
like money at all. We're not talking about money. We're
not talking about money. So much that I'm actually going
to avoid paying my bills, which I as an anxious
attachment style. I'm like, oh, And I think the best
way to correct that is we have to first take
the step of talking about money. And that is scary,
(31:34):
and we don't have to do it with everyone, but
just have some conversations with your friends and family.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
And how can you tell if you have a healthy
attachment to money.
Speaker 2 (31:43):
I don't think anyone does. Our different attachment style to
money always comes from how we were raised, and depending
on how we were raised and what parents we have,
will either have their same attachment style we'll have the
exact opposite on the spectrum. But we are always constantly
being in a state of working through our different attachment styles.
(32:07):
And our personal finance journey is just that it's always
going to EBB, it's going to flow. We're going to
have more some years, we're going to have more financial
hardships than the next. But I think everyone has different
attachment styles, as everyone has different attachment styles and relationships,
and you go through therapy, you do your cues, you
(32:27):
do your steps, and you get better at it. But
I don't think you're ever going to be to a
point where you're just flawlessly secured in your finances.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
I think it's the same thing with balance For me
as a mom, I know that there are seasons of
my life that feel more balanced, that feel like I've
got my work life balance and check, and then there
are seasons where it completely goes out the window. So
it seems like you can have the same with your
attachment styles to money. You may have a period where
you're more anxious, more healthy, more avoidant, fearful.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (32:59):
Okay, before you go, Lauren, there are some famous ladies
who are making some money moves in the news and
I wanted to run them by you and get your reaction. Okay, Okay,
so you can just tell me whether this is a
green flag or a red flag. Okay. Sophia Fragara proudly
said she won't date anyone who makes less than her.
Is that a green flag or a red flag?
Speaker 2 (33:20):
That's a U flag. It's a green flag for me.
Speaker 1 (33:23):
Though, I think it's a green flag.
Speaker 2 (33:25):
It's such a hot topic for people men. I've heard
them say, we don't care how much money women make.
Speaker 1 (33:32):
That's wonderful.
Speaker 2 (33:33):
That is a heterosexual relationship, and so it's going to
look different for everyone. Yeah, But I think when it
comes to dating and money, whatever your hard fast rules are,
I think you should stick with that. I think you
should be realistic. Yeah, because if every woman out there
said I want to date a billionaire, it's only a
handful of billionaire So how was I gonna happen? But
if you want someone to make more money than you,
(33:54):
why not?
Speaker 1 (33:55):
I think it also depends on where you're at in life, Like,
she's accumulated a lot of wealth, so much wealth that
it's not even relatable to most of us. Yeah, and
so I think it makes sense for her situation.
Speaker 2 (34:07):
I think for me now, I'm thirty at this point,
I think we should at least have somewhat a financial
foundation and we're growing from there. But we don't even
have the foundation. I personally wish you the best luck
on your journey, but I don't think I'm the person.
Speaker 1 (34:22):
For you one hundred percent. You do have to think
about your own financial wellness and how getting entingled with
someone else can impact that. Okay, next one, Hailey Bieber
and Justin Bieber reportedly did not sign a prenup when
they got married. Green flag or Red flag.
Speaker 2 (34:37):
They were both really young when they got married, and
so I think they both did the best thing that
they felt they should be doing at that moment. Obviously,
fast forward, Justin and I think and I are, we're
around the same age. Haley might be a little bit younger.
She has completely blown up. I mean, talk about a
boss woman selling her company a billion dollar like just
(35:00):
incredible in so many ways, with or without her husband.
So I'm sure in hindsight she probably would make a
different decision. So I mean, yeah, I'm probably leaning towards
green flag at the moment. Red flag probably.
Speaker 1 (35:12):
Now. Yeah, Oh that's a really layered answer. I like that. Okay.
Last one, Kiki Palmer says she intentionally lives below her means,
even though she's you know, can afford whatever she wants. Now.
She said, quote, living below my means is incredibly important
to me. If I have one million in my pocket,
my rent is going to be fifteen hundred. Now I
(35:32):
think that might have been a bit of hyperbole, but
we all get her point. You know that she's going
to be conservative about her living expenses. Is this a
green flag or red flag?
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Green flag, Green flag all the way, all the way
It's something that I follow. It's something that as I've
made more money, I know people say that you should
scale and you should spend more money. But if you
are a creator, or you're someone that is not working
a typical nine to five job, we understand the nuances
that come with this kind of being an entrepreneur. You
don't always know your next paycheck will come, and yeah,
(36:04):
you probably are getting larger deals, but you want to
save that money as much as possible so you can
pay your taxes, all the fun stuff, but you tomorrow
is never guaranteed with our paychecks, right, so we have
to just be a little bit more mindful of not
blowing at all in that moment. I've always lived below
my means. You know, when CNBC a few years ago
(36:25):
did a xpos on like how much I was making,
I had so many people say, why are you only
in this apartment? You could absolutely be in a more
expensive I'm like, first of all, I'm not going to
be renting. I don't believe in that, I mean for
long term, And two, I don't need the validation. I
love my cute, little one bedroom apartment and I'm only
(36:46):
comfortable spending this amount of money, and I'm always looking
about at the long game always.
Speaker 1 (36:52):
Or and this is the financial advice we need to
start our week. Thank you so much, thank you.
Speaker 2 (36:57):
I'm so grateful to be here.
Speaker 1 (37:02):
Lauren Simmons is an author, producer, podcaster, and a New
York Stock Exchange history maker. The Brightside is a production
of Hello Sunshine and iHeart Podcasts and is executive produced
by Reese Witherspoon and me Simone Boyce. Production is by
Acast Creative Studios. Our producers are Taylor Williamson, Adrian Bain,
(37:25):
and Darby Masters. Our production assistant is Joya putnoy A.
Cast Executive producers are Jenny Kaplan and Emily Rudder. Maureen
Polo and Reese Witherspoon are the executive producers for Hello Sunshine.
Ali Perry and Christina Everett are the executive producers for
iHeart Podcasts. Tim Palazzola is our showrunner. Our theme song
is by Anna Stump and Hamilton Lakehauser.
What would it take for you to become financially unrecognizable
in the next six months. No, I'm not talking about
getting rich quick or having more money. I'm talking about
being bolder, clearer, and more in control of your money
and your mindset. Today, financial expert Lauren Simmons is here
to show us what happens when you stop waiting for
permission and start leading with audacity. She made Wall Street
(00:27):
history at twenty three years old, y'all. But she says
that real power comes when we change the stories we've
been telling ourselves about our money are worth and what's possible?
Speaker 2 (00:38):
How can you be so audacious? And people could take
that as a negative or positive. I think it's absolutely
a positive, through and through. And I think that there
should be more women that have the audacity to step
into rooms and spaces and to be their most empowered
badass self because we have done enough of playing small,
(00:59):
and I think we should be as colorful and right
and beautiful and amazing as we identify.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
I'm simone voice, and this is the bright side from
Hello Sunshine. To be honest with you, I had a
little epiphany as I was preparing for today's interview with
our fabulous financial expert Lauren Simmons. As I was doing
some research, I realized that a lot of the financial
advice that we are fed is it's predicated on guilt,
(01:28):
on telling us what we should be doing or what
we're doing wrong, like spend less, don't buy your seven
dollars lattes that bring you so much joy? What Like
I'm going to stop doing that? So I'm interested in
hearing from experts who can offer a different perspective, Like
what if our relationship with money didn't have to be
rooted in what we're doing wrong? What if changing our
financial life started with focusing on what we're doing right?
(01:51):
And Lauren Simmons is the perfect voice for this conversation
because she's not just giving us permission to rethink our
money habits, she's inviting us to have the audacity to
believe we're worthy of something better. If our guest story
sounds like the stuff movies are made of, that's because
it is. There actually is a movie studio making a
movie about Lauren simmons life, Because at just twenty three
(02:12):
years old, Lauren did the impossible. She became the youngest
full time trader in the history of the New York
Stock Exchange, all without a finance degree or a background
in the stock market at all. So Lauren's story went
completely viral, and in our conversation today, she walks us
through the moment she learned that she made history as
(02:34):
only the second African American woman to become a full
time trader on the New York Stock Exchange floor. And
let me tell you, when she retells that story, chills
we both got emotional. Lauren's life undoubtedly changed after that.
She went on to write Make Money Move, which is
a book that shares her knowledge of investing and financial
(02:55):
literacy with the next generation. Lauren really is redefining what
it means to be financially empowered, and she's doing it
through this lens that you might not expect. Attachment styles. Yeah,
just like in dating, only this time it's with your
bank account. So today we're unpacking our money attachment styles,
confronting the stories we've inherited about money and making space
(03:16):
for something better. And Lauren's getting real about how she
fought for better pay even when the odds were stacked
against her, why she never let the boys Club of
Wall Street strip her of her authentic southern charm and
why audacity is truly the secret sauce for living out
our wildest dreams. All right, let's get into it with
Lauren Simmons. Lauren Simmons, Welcome to the bright Side.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
I'm so excited to be here.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
You have the brightest energy. It just fits. It works, dude.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
Your story is like the stuff that fiction is made
of in the best possible way. It's like so mind
blowing this journey that you've had from not having a
background in finance and not having any connections to the
stock market to then becoming one of the youngest traders
in the history of the New York Stock Exchange. How
(04:07):
did you become a stock trader with no finance degree
and no Wall Street connections?
Speaker 2 (04:13):
You know, I moved from Georgia to New York the
day I graduated college. I went to school for genetics.
I did not have a background in finance, and the
day that I graduated, December thirteenth, I said, I'm moving
to New York and I really couldn't pursue my genetics
background that I had intended to because what I wanted
to do, I really wanted to be able to alter
(04:35):
genetic DNA so that kids wouldn't be born with any
genetic abnormalies. I have a twin brother with a disability,
and the only place that they legally practiced that was China,
And at the time, I just didn't have the fortitude
to say, I'm going to go to China and live
on my own and you know, be a Boston this world.
(04:56):
So vivod and moved to New York and York The
Yorick was an interesting journey because it was the first
time in my life that I realized adults love projecting
their fears onto people.
Speaker 1 (05:10):
Wait, how so, how did you see that?
Speaker 2 (05:12):
In the sense of getting unsolicited advice? I wanted to
make a six figure salary, which some people were like,
that is so bold and ambitious of you. You know,
why do you think you're worthy or deserving of that?
And I had spent much of my four years in
college of meditating really getting deep, like who is Lauren Simmons?
(05:33):
How does she want to show up in this world?
That I never allowed people that you know, had their
own fears project that onto me. So while they were
questioning or trying to invalidate what I wanted, I just
never let that, you know, make me feel small. I
was going to put myself out there and that's all
really you can do. I ended up meeting a wonderful
(05:55):
man named Jason who worked at Goldman Sachs, and Jason,
within five minutes of meeting me, said, would you be
open to an equity trading position at the New York
Stock Exchange?
Speaker 1 (06:06):
Wait? How does that go down? So you don't have
a finance degree at this point? Right? What on paper?
Says to him, Yeah, she should totally do this job.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
Nothing on paper. And I think that's what's a little
bit mind blowing about for people my story in the
sense of well why not? And I think statistically seventy
six percent of people don't go into the field in
which they major in. But what I love about when
you find your allies and you find your people, they
(06:38):
always see something in you that you don't see in yourself.
And for him, even if it was just five minutes
of conversation, I think he felt like, Okay, I know
someone that can give her an entry level position and
she's either going to sink or swim. And that's kind
of really I think the theme overall when we think
about New York city, it's so many hustlers. You put
(06:59):
yourself out there either going to make it, and it
doesn't mean like in a you're going to make history,
you're going to become famous, but you're going to make
it in your own lane, or you're not and you
pivot and you do something else. And so I don't
really try to overanalyze the why he saw something. He
gave me an opportunity. That opportunity wasn't guaranteed, but it
was put yourself out there and see what comes from
(07:21):
the experience.
Speaker 1 (07:22):
What do you think he saw in you at that age?
And I know that there were other allies who are
part of your story and they saw something too, What
do you think it was?
Speaker 2 (07:30):
I think even just having the audacity to cold reach
out to him at the time on LinkedIn and to say, hey,
I would love to have an exploratory meeting. The only
connecting dot was that he had volunteered at the YMCA
in New York and I had volunteered at the YMCA
in Georgia, and that was it, you know. But I
(07:50):
think just that I would even be able to put
myself out there to ask the question of like, can
you have an exploratory meeting, you know, in the lens
of a twenty two year old at least at the time,
I think that was very bold and ambitious and like wow,
like she would do this and why would she do this?
I think the younger generation is a lot more ambitious,
(08:11):
and they reach out to any and everyone. And if
you don't, you know, the advice that I would have
slide into people's dams appropriately reach out on LinkedIn, you know,
put yourself out there. All you can do is really
shoot your shot and whatever it's meant to be will be.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
You said a word that I want to go back
to because it's one of my favorite words, audacity. Like
I'm done with empowerment, I'm even done with strength, I'm
done with all those words. I just want to talk
about audacity. And I want to talk about women who
have audacity.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
Yeah, because it's such a powerful concept. It is, it
isn't And I think for some people when they hear
the word audacity is like they can kind of sometimes negative,
but it's really just being bold, being boss, being you know,
all those empowering words that we hear, like how can
you be so audacious? And people could take that as
a negative or positive. I think it's absolutely a positive
(09:02):
through and through. And I think that there should be
more women that have the audacity to step into rooms
and spaces and to be their most empowered badass self
because we have done enough of playing small, and I
think that we should be as colorful and bright and
beautiful and amazing as we identify.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
Yes, So getting back into your story, So you slide
into this man's LinkedIn DMS. He offers you a connection. Yes,
so what does that connection lead to?
Speaker 2 (09:32):
That connection? He said, I know a gentleman that works
at the New York Stock Exchange. Would you be open
to an equity trading position at the New York Stock Exchange?
And honestly, I mean I said yes without even thinking. Right,
this is young Lauren who just came out of college
that had no background but was still in that very
like learning and eager to learn and wanting to prove
(09:54):
the world like I am, you know somebody, which I
knew at the time I was, but I just wanted
to to be given the opportunity, so I didn't have
any hesitation. And the truth of the matter is I
didn't fully conceptualize what an equity trader was because it
just wasn't in my background. But I knew that if
I was given the opportunity. I don't know how I knew.
(10:15):
I just knew that I would be great in the role,
whatever that led to, whatever that meant. And so I
just needed the opportunity. And it's funny because right after
my meeting with him, there was this ping pong match
that was happening in my head. Like one side was
very eager, excited, and I'm like, he's gonna connect me
with someone at the New York Stock Exchange. Don't even
know what I'm going to be doing, but I'm so excited.
(10:37):
And then the other side was, oh, he just wasted
my time, and he was trying to be polite because
I had been in the rhythm of meeting a lot
of individuals that said that they were going to follow up,
and they just frankly didn't. And so as I'm walking
around vibrationally with this ping pong match, I'm making my
way back to Jersey because my grandparents lived in Jersey,
(11:00):
and I'm getting on the subway and as I'm getting
on the subway, my phone slips out of my hand
through the cracks of the subway station onto the bottom
of the platform.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
Stop.
Speaker 2 (11:10):
Yeah, as if this was a movie, So.
Speaker 1 (11:13):
Like, this is what I'm saying, Your life is a
movie and this is one of those scenes. Yeah, so
your cell phone just slips into the oblivion of the subway.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Platform and it was like one of those like did
this really just happen? But it was also a moment
of just a wave of emotions came because at this
point I had moved to New York in December. It
was now early March, and nothing that I had set
out had manifested or came to life.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
I know that feeling. That's a rough feeling.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
So I and I'm getting on the subway. I just
sat down. I wasn't gonna cry in front of anyone,
made my way to Jersey, switched over to another train,
got to my grandparents' house. They opened the door, and
I'm hysterically crying, and all of my insecurities, my doubts
of like making this jump to New York, was it impulsive,
(12:06):
was I worthy enough? Was I intelligent enough? Just came
out on the forefront and I'm crying, and I'm so
grateful that I have the family that I have because
through all those tears. I finally stop crying and my
aunt she looks at me and she says, did you
ask a subway attendant to pick up your phone? And
(12:26):
I'm looking at her, like, subway attendant pick up my phone?
Speaker 1 (12:30):
Like what?
Speaker 2 (12:30):
What is a subway attendant? She so graciously goes all
the way back to New York, all the way back
to the subway station, all the way back to the platform,
comes all the way back to Jersey and she hands
me my phone. And this is one of those surreal
moments of we're always exactly where we're meant to be.
(12:51):
Trust that, and also trust that everything is going to
work out. And she hands me my phone, and on
that phone, it wasn't a crack, it wasn't a ding,
like as if nothing had ever happened to this phone.
But what there was was a voice mail inviting me
to the New York Stock Exchange the very next morning.
Speaker 1 (13:11):
Wow, so that was the beginning.
Speaker 2 (13:13):
Yeah, And I always get chills because I do remember,
as if it was yesterday, what it meant to break
away from Jason, to be walking through New York City, like, wow,
this is another dead end, but I'm going to be
positive and without me even realizing that notification would change
the course of my life.
Speaker 1 (13:34):
We've got to take a quick break, but we'll be
right back with more from Lauren Simmons. So you mentioned
that you didn't really conceptualize what it meant to be
an equity trader. You just said yes, yes, which I love.
I feel like that speaks to this willingness and this
eagerness that we have when we're younger, and some of
(13:57):
that kind of fades away and we get more hesitant
about saying yes to things. But when you're young, you're like,
I'm in I'm just going to do it. Yeah. And
so you become an equity trader, what did your day
to day actually look like? You know?
Speaker 2 (14:10):
So the first month of me being an equity trader,
the role really wasn't fully mine. I had to pass
the series nineteen, which historically has an eighty percent fail rate.
It is an in house New York Stock Exchange exam,
so it's not an exam that you can study for.
You can go online, you look for answers. They give
you a book about this big and they say good luck.
(14:32):
And the truth of the matter is is that many
men on the floor have never actually taken this exam.
Speaker 1 (14:38):
How is that possible?
Speaker 2 (14:40):
So the series nineteen is now administered under FENRA. FINRA
is the Financial industry regulatory Agency, and the New York
Stock Exchange used to be a private entity. There was
no rules, there was no regulation. The tests were in house,
and many of the men, from my understanding, they would
(15:01):
take the exam and then they would self grade the exam,
or they would give the test administrator a pack of
beer and they would pass the exam. So about the
early two thousands, once the New York Stock Exchange became
a public entity, it was now regulated under FINRA. So
now this is a I'm not going to say it
wasn't a legitimate exam before, but now there is a
(15:23):
third party who was grading this exam and all exams
for you to be licensed. And there just is no
one really that you can turn to on the floor
to say what is on this exam and how do
I prep and study for this exam? So what I did?
I studied the book cover to cover, which many men
on the floor were like at the time, why would
(15:43):
you do that? Well, I'm imagining if I'm taking this
exam and this is what been risk giving me there
must be answers that are relating to the test. And
I'll never forget that the day that I went to
take the exam, the men were openly taking bets against me.
Wait what now, I everyone always has that reaction, and
I think it's because what the men on the floor.
(16:06):
You have to understand, they bet on everything. They bet on,
like is John gonna come in with the yellow tie today?
They do a lot of betting on sports, Like it's
just the nature of the floor. Everything is like always
like do we think, flip a coin, take a bet,
do a poll. But in this particular case, they were
definitely betting against me. I'm not passing this exam, which
(16:30):
I think for me gave me even more fire. I
still have that energy today. But we're talking about twenty
two year old Lauren who just wants to prove to
people that she is worthy and that she's somebody, and
not that I grew up not ever feeling like I
wasn't somebody, but I did grow up in a high
school environment where I was bullied, people often doubted me
(16:53):
for whatever reason, and I've just really when I became
an adult, and by being an adult, I meant graduated college,
like I'm going to prove all you people wrong, and
that in her child of mine, I just really wanted
to help amplify her voice and make her feel special
and make her feel like she could do anything in
this world. And you are going to respect her.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
So you passed this test which has an eighty percent
fail rate. Yes, if I were you, I would have
rubbed it in their faces, the men who were betting
against me. But I'm sure you're much more classy than
that then I was.
Speaker 2 (17:30):
Now, I think I'm a little petty that I'm just like,
I don't care. But you know, I think when you're
that young, definitely a lot of people pleasing and trying
to make it seem like it's not a big deal.
And it was a big deal because that moment would
solidify me making history. Yes, and what's so beautiful about
me taking that test? You end up having to sign
your name literally into history, right next to the Rockefellers
(17:53):
and the Vanderbilts. And I don't think at that moment
I grasp what a big deal that was. I will
never forget. My mom flew in from Georgia. My grandparents
were there, my extended family, my aunt, they had this
beautiful ceremony. I'm in this room with I want to say,
twenty other new mail brokers and I was the single
(18:13):
woman and this red shirt like in the center of
the photo. And I'll never forget that. A New York
Stock Exchange Archives came up to me and she was like,
you don't know how amazing this moment is. And you know,
I'm thinking her saying, you know how grateful I am.
And she says to me, you are the second African
American woman in the exchange is two hundred years to
(18:36):
have ever signed this book. And I just remember like
a wave of emotions. But I'm about to cry now,
but just like almost crying because I'm like, I'm the second.
I'm the second. Like how beautiful that is? But how
sad that is? Because how are we still achieving these
kind of recognitions in two thousand and anything.
Speaker 1 (18:59):
It makes me emotional to hear you tell that story.
That's just that's so beautiful and empowering. What makes you
emotional about thinking back to.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
That moment trusting the world so much?
Speaker 1 (19:11):
What do you mean by that?
Speaker 2 (19:12):
And that's going to be really sad to say. I think,
like you said, when you're young, you just you're so
excited about life and opportunity, and I very much still am.
But as you go through your own experiences and you
go through your own journey and life, you could be
so grateful and proud in some moments and then be
(19:33):
so conflicted in other moments. I think as a woman,
certainly as a woman of color, certainly, as an African
American woman, on how much harder we have to work
than our male counterparts. And you get disappointed a little
on the journey. Not that you don't keep a smile
(19:55):
on your face and you keep moving forward, but you
just you look back on things and you're like, if
I was a white male, this would have looked a
lot differently. And I think that's the part that I
try not to attach to so much, Like I try
to go back to I'm this twenty two year old,
and you know, life is amazing and life is not
(20:18):
that hard, and affirmations are real. But you do realize
some things, and I think you realize it even more
maybe in this climate twenty twenty five where we're at,
and you start thinking, wow, why does it seem like
we've taken a few steps back when we have come
so far.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
The progress comes with a little bit of pain too. Yeah,
your story got out that you had made history, that
you had become the youngest woman to be a full
time trader for the New York Stock Exchange and only
the second African American woman. When did you realize that
that was a big deal.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
Honestly, it probably was when the story went viral, because
I had made history a year before BBC Stephen Miller
decided to run the story, and even when he came
up to me, it was very are you the only
woman at the New York Stock Exchange? And I was like, well,
I guess I am outside of like the news anchors,
(21:14):
the journalists that were working down there. Pr I just
I never equated that I was the only woman because
I was just so focused in like my work and
this is what I'm going to do that I guess
I didn't realize that I was the only woman. And
even then me being the only woman and making history,
while it was amazing for me and my family and
we you know, cherished that moment and what I did,
(21:36):
I didn't really think the story had legs or that
it would be inspirational aspirational to people, or that they
would care, and so when he said he wanted to
cover the story, cool, great, and then CNBC covered and
it just went viral. It went viral. I'm getting calls
from China, I'm getting calls in Germany, I'm getting calls
(21:58):
here in America, and it's just so grateful for it,
Like there was nothing negative about it. It just was wow,
like people care about this small town girl from Georgia
and her making history.
Speaker 1 (22:12):
What I think is so fascinating about your time at
the New York Stock Exchange is the reality versus our
perception of it. I think when we see it represented
in films like Wolf of Wall Street or Wall Street,
we have this idea that traders are making tons of money.
But you were making twelve thousand dollars a year. Is
(22:32):
that correct?
Speaker 2 (22:33):
That was correct? That was interesting. And I always ask
myself if I had to go back in time when
I do it again, Yes, absolutely, But I'm not giving
the advice to anyone to ever do something where you
are not getting paid your value or your worth. But
you also have to look at your ROI like your
(22:53):
return on interest, like what what do you think you'll
get out of it? And so I knew that I
was going to get a lot out of accepting a
job for twelve thousand dollars. But here's the thing. When
I got the job, I was always told, oh, this
is gonna be your starting like salary. Okay, cool, and
then you're gonna pass this exam, so then I would
(23:15):
actually be licensed and you're gonna make more money. Wonderful, Okay.
Once I passed the exam, I'm like, okay, So like,
what's what's this bump in salary? And the bump was
up to the twelve thousand that I was making a year,
So I was making less before I was making the
twelve thousand, and I just remember, huh. And this is
(23:37):
where again, just the curiosity, I started asking more questions, well,
how much do you make? And how much do you make?
And how much do you make? And mind you, for
people that don't understand the dynamic of the floor, there
was only about six of us that were under the
age of twenty five younger. Everyone else was forty and older.
(23:58):
So this is an older generation and where people don't
openly talk about their salary and their pay and they're
very uncomfortable with that. But we know how empowering it
is to understand what people are getting paid. It's not
a jealousy thing, but it's more as to what am
I working toward us? And does this even make sense
to stay in a position if I'm working towards nothing.
(24:20):
I remember having a conversation with a male colleague that
didn't work at my firm, but he worked at another
firm but we did the exact same position. We went
out to dinner one night and he tells me I'm
making one hundred and twenty thousand dollars and I have
a poker face when I want to at least, and
I I'm just not like yeah. He was like, you know,
(24:40):
it's just so amazing that we are young twenty year
olds coming to the New York Sock Exchange, people of color,
and we're making this much money. Yep, amazing. I go
to work the next day and my direct that I
work alongside with, who had been on the floor for
about five six years. I tell him I'm like such
(25:03):
and such as making one hundred and twenty thousand. He's like,
I don't believe you. He does another job. No he doesn't,
he doesn't do another I was like, you know what,
you know what? He does he does the exact same
thing I'm doing. He's like, it's it's just no way,
mind you. My direct who had been there for five
six years, he at the time I wanted to say
it was twenty five. I think twenty six, was only
(25:26):
making about fifty five thousand, so not even close to
what the other person was making. And that is when
I knew that I think maybe we're being a little
too loyal by default, and I think you guys have
somehow in your mind made it okay to have these
(25:46):
poor salaries when clearly there are people working, maybe not
at this firm, but right next door to you, making
actual Liverpool wages in New York City. And my mom,
she works in HR. I remember her always having a
problem with the salary, but she understood the bigger opportunity
and the networking and the connections and all of that.
(26:08):
She said to me, just address self in the room,
tell them that you're not making New York City minimum salary,
which at the time in New York the minimum salary
in New York City, New York I believe was fifty
two thousand dollars. So I put it in a company email.
Hey wanted to bring this to attention, I'm not even
making the New York minimum salary. I got an email back,
(26:31):
come up stairs immediately. They were knock going to have
this conversation with me over an email server. Come upstairs immediately.
So I come upstairs and I'm having to show them
the HR minimum wage guidelines in New York City and
what I believe this was like twenty seventeen at the time,
and they were like, well, it's no way that we're
(26:52):
gonna be able to bump you up to fifty two
from twelve. And I knew that going into it, So
we'll just pay you hourly. We'll just do forty hours
a week. The problem is I was working way over
forty hours a week, but that was the compromise that
we had. And even then, my takeaway maybe was like
twenty three thousand.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
Event everyone was.
Speaker 2 (27:11):
Like, oh there was bonuses, Oh, your position was on commission.
It was none of that. My position was not on commission.
There was never a bonus. That was what my salary was.
And pretty much once that conversation was had, I knew
surely thereafter I was going to be.
Speaker 1 (27:26):
Leaving more from Lauren Simmons after this shortbreak and we're
back with Lauren Simmons. So you did two years on
the trading floor. It sounds like you learned a lot
about how to advocate for yourself, about how to stand
your ground. After your time at the stock exchange, you
(27:49):
wrote a book called Make Money Move, and I know
that you have a big passion in educating the next
generation of investors and empowering young people around topics of
financial literacy. I've been thinking about this idea of becoming
unrecognizable in six months and how we can do that
in different areas of our life. And so one thing
(28:11):
I'd love for our listeners to be able to take
away from this conversation is like, if they wanted to
completely transform their finances in six months, what kind of
roadmap would you give them to do that.
Speaker 2 (28:24):
When we're thinking about transforming our finances or who we
want to be in the next six months, who we
want to be in the next year, so we have
to take a step back and realize what is the
work that we need to be doing to get to
that person in six months, a year, etc. Etc. And
one of the ways to do that, especially when we're
talking about finances and we're talking about mind body, wealth,
(28:44):
and how they're all interconnected. Is our different attachment styles
and how they are holding us back from the financial stability,
the financial wellness we're looking to achieve in the next
six months.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
And when you say our attachment style, you mean our
attachment styles to money. You've talked about this quite a bit.
So we've got anxious, avoidant, spiritual, fearful, and healthy attachment.
Let's start with the first one. Can you describe someone
who might be anxiously attached to money?
Speaker 2 (29:15):
So anxious attachment style something that I identify with, doesn't
matter if you were making a lot of money, a
little bit of money. You were constantly emotionally tied to
your finances. And it's typically fear based, the fear of
lack and not having enough. And these are typically people
(29:37):
that are constantly checking their banking account, They are over
budgeting and saving, they are not living their life in
the moment, and anytime they make a purchase, they feel
guilty about that purchase. Now, for me, I'm so grateful
that I'm at a place where I'm financially stable, but
anytime I make a big purchase, I'm like, can I
(29:59):
do this at my bank account? Let me look at
my Excel sheet? Did I budget enough? Did I save enough?
And larger purchases are even more scary for me. And
I came from a parent who had an anxious attachment
style to money, and so if there's anyone that's listening
that identifies with that, I think one of the best
(30:20):
practices that we can do to be more in alignment,
to have a more healthy attachment to money. Number one,
stop looking at your bank account. Number two, you budget
and saved. You know how much money you have coming in.
Stop looking at the Excel sheet, stop looking at your savings.
(30:42):
If you have enough, you know you have enough. You
haven't done any new purchases to say I don't have enough.
You have it. It's there. Breathe, relax. And the third
thing I would say, sit down, meditate, go put your
mind anywhere but finances. Go for a long walk, go where,
go go watch some mindless TV. Do something where you
(31:04):
are not attached to that bank account.
Speaker 1 (31:07):
And so kind of the on the other end of
the spectrum is avoidant attachment.
Speaker 2 (31:12):
Avoidant. Yes, yes, people shut down the conversation. They don't
like money at all. We're not talking about money. We're
not talking about money. So much that I'm actually going
to avoid paying my bills, which I as an anxious
attachment style. I'm like, oh, And I think the best
way to correct that is we have to first take
the step of talking about money. And that is scary,
(31:34):
and we don't have to do it with everyone, but
just have some conversations with your friends and family.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
And how can you tell if you have a healthy
attachment to money.
Speaker 2 (31:43):
I don't think anyone does. Our different attachment style to
money always comes from how we were raised, and depending
on how we were raised and what parents we have,
will either have their same attachment style we'll have the
exact opposite on the spectrum. But we are always constantly
being in a state of working through our different attachment styles.
(32:07):
And our personal finance journey is just that it's always
going to EBB, it's going to flow. We're going to
have more some years, we're going to have more financial
hardships than the next. But I think everyone has different
attachment styles, as everyone has different attachment styles and relationships,
and you go through therapy, you do your cues, you
(32:27):
do your steps, and you get better at it. But
I don't think you're ever going to be to a
point where you're just flawlessly secured in your finances.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
I think it's the same thing with balance For me
as a mom, I know that there are seasons of
my life that feel more balanced, that feel like I've
got my work life balance and check, and then there
are seasons where it completely goes out the window. So
it seems like you can have the same with your
attachment styles to money. You may have a period where
you're more anxious, more healthy, more avoidant, fearful.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (32:59):
Okay, before you go, Lauren, there are some famous ladies
who are making some money moves in the news and
I wanted to run them by you and get your reaction. Okay, Okay,
so you can just tell me whether this is a
green flag or a red flag. Okay. Sophia Fragara proudly
said she won't date anyone who makes less than her.
Is that a green flag or a red flag?
Speaker 2 (33:20):
That's a U flag. It's a green flag for me.
Speaker 1 (33:23):
Though, I think it's a green flag.
Speaker 2 (33:25):
It's such a hot topic for people men. I've heard
them say, we don't care how much money women make.
Speaker 1 (33:32):
That's wonderful.
Speaker 2 (33:33):
That is a heterosexual relationship, and so it's going to
look different for everyone. Yeah, But I think when it
comes to dating and money, whatever your hard fast rules are,
I think you should stick with that. I think you
should be realistic. Yeah, because if every woman out there
said I want to date a billionaire, it's only a
handful of billionaire So how was I gonna happen? But
if you want someone to make more money than you,
(33:54):
why not?
Speaker 1 (33:55):
I think it also depends on where you're at in life, Like,
she's accumulated a lot of wealth, so much wealth that
it's not even relatable to most of us. Yeah, and
so I think it makes sense for her situation.
Speaker 2 (34:07):
I think for me now, I'm thirty at this point,
I think we should at least have somewhat a financial
foundation and we're growing from there. But we don't even
have the foundation. I personally wish you the best luck
on your journey, but I don't think I'm the person.
Speaker 1 (34:22):
For you one hundred percent. You do have to think
about your own financial wellness and how getting entingled with
someone else can impact that. Okay, next one, Hailey Bieber
and Justin Bieber reportedly did not sign a prenup when
they got married. Green flag or Red flag.
Speaker 2 (34:37):
They were both really young when they got married, and
so I think they both did the best thing that
they felt they should be doing at that moment. Obviously,
fast forward, Justin and I think and I are, we're
around the same age. Haley might be a little bit younger.
She has completely blown up. I mean, talk about a
boss woman selling her company a billion dollar like just
(35:00):
incredible in so many ways, with or without her husband.
So I'm sure in hindsight she probably would make a
different decision. So I mean, yeah, I'm probably leaning towards
green flag at the moment. Red flag probably.
Speaker 1 (35:12):
Now. Yeah, Oh that's a really layered answer. I like that. Okay.
Last one, Kiki Palmer says she intentionally lives below her means,
even though she's you know, can afford whatever she wants. Now.
She said, quote, living below my means is incredibly important
to me. If I have one million in my pocket,
my rent is going to be fifteen hundred. Now I
(35:32):
think that might have been a bit of hyperbole, but
we all get her point. You know that she's going
to be conservative about her living expenses. Is this a
green flag or red flag?
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Green flag, Green flag all the way, all the way
It's something that I follow. It's something that as I've
made more money, I know people say that you should
scale and you should spend more money. But if you
are a creator, or you're someone that is not working
a typical nine to five job, we understand the nuances
that come with this kind of being an entrepreneur. You
don't always know your next paycheck will come, and yeah,
(36:04):
you probably are getting larger deals, but you want to
save that money as much as possible so you can
pay your taxes, all the fun stuff, but you tomorrow
is never guaranteed with our paychecks, right, so we have
to just be a little bit more mindful of not
blowing at all in that moment. I've always lived below
my means. You know, when CNBC a few years ago
(36:25):
did a xpos on like how much I was making,
I had so many people say, why are you only
in this apartment? You could absolutely be in a more
expensive I'm like, first of all, I'm not going to
be renting. I don't believe in that, I mean for
long term, And two, I don't need the validation. I
love my cute, little one bedroom apartment and I'm only
(36:46):
comfortable spending this amount of money, and I'm always looking
about at the long game always.
Speaker 1 (36:52):
Or and this is the financial advice we need to
start our week. Thank you so much, thank you.
Speaker 2 (36:57):
I'm so grateful to be here.
Speaker 1 (37:02):
Lauren Simmons is an author, producer, podcaster, and a New
York Stock Exchange history maker. The Brightside is a production
of Hello Sunshine and iHeart Podcasts and is executive produced
by Reese Witherspoon and me Simone Boyce. Production is by
Acast Creative Studios. Our producers are Taylor Williamson, Adrian Bain,
(37:25):
and Darby Masters. Our production assistant is Joya putnoy A.
Cast Executive producers are Jenny Kaplan and Emily Rudder. Maureen
Polo and Reese Witherspoon are the executive producers for Hello Sunshine.
Ali Perry and Christina Everett are the executive producers for
iHeart Podcasts. Tim Palazzola is our showrunner. Our theme song
is by Anna Stump and Hamilton Lakehauser.
Host
Simone Boyce
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