Sweep the Deer

Justin and Carter discuss the Cleveland Cavaliers win over the Milwaukee Bucks and take a dive into the contributions of the supporting cast. From how they impact the game and what it may mean for how they are used in the postseason. As well as how the Cavs would matchup against the Bucks in a series and more!

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
This crowd rises to its me what Carlos slamming it?
Oh Carlo, left wing free ball perfect, darl then Hellift
lock the shot at the rim, pow in the left
hand and of fowl. Welcome to Chase Doown podcast, part
of the Cave Media Family. I'm your host, Justin Browan.
The Chase Down is presented by Fubo, the official streaming

(00:21):
partner of the Calves. Watch over three hundred and fifty
channels of live sports and TV, including Vanduel Sports Network
without cable. There's no cost and no commitment. Try for
free at foobotv dot com Slash Calves. The Cleveland Cavaliers
have won their fourteenth consecutive game with a comfortable win
over the Milwaukee Bucks. A good test for them, one

(00:41):
of the few teams that they are still measuring themselves
up against, a potential second round matchup for them, and they.

Speaker 2 (00:47):
Got the win in Milwaukee.

Speaker 1 (00:49):
Joining me today to discuss that and the upcoming stretch
is my co host Carter Rodriguez. Carter, how you doing, Buddy,
I'm doing great. It is a really one of the
first really lovely day of the burgeoning spring in Columbus, Ohio.
Kids were out without their coats on, playing with a
bubble machine going down the slide. It was absolutely wonderful.

(01:11):
I'm sipping on a Mystic Mama from Jackie O's I'm
in a great mood, and the Cavs certainly have done
nothing to hurt that fourteen wins in a row, and
it felt to me justin I don't know if the
matchup mattered as much as much as their approach to
the matchup mattered. You know, I think they've proven everything

(01:35):
they probably want to prove against the Bucks in the
first couple games of the year. But they you know,
we joked on our last podcast that admit it. You know,
a thirteen game win streak. Were they slumping a little?
And I felt like this game really was a demonstration

(01:58):
of what a focused Cavs team can do even when
they're not playing that well, because I thought they outplayed
the Milwaukee Bucks for forty eight minutes last night. Do
you feel that they didn't play that well last night
or they didn't shoot that well?

Speaker 2 (02:11):
But yeah, that's what I meant.

Speaker 1 (02:12):
I meant even when things aren't firing on all cylinders,
like their attention to detail and their their system and
their connectedness, all those things were going for them, and
even when they're not shooting particularly well, they're still just better.
Like I thought, Jannis brought an a game and you know,

(02:36):
he probably had six dunks through two and a half quarters.
And I jumped on to the Fear of the Sword
playback a live stream just to kind of react to
the game in real time with Tony Pesta talking about,
oh man, yeah, it's having a great game, and all
of a sudden, I look at the box scorers, like
twenty six points on twenty shots. Oh, it's not that good.

(02:56):
You know, like they really trusted their own process us
in this game, and it made it. They just kind
of ground Milwaukee down to a dust until and then
Jarrett kind of puts the puts the finishing touch with
that poster on Brook Lopez and and it looks it's

(03:18):
just a walk away victory, even when Donovan goes four
to fifteen, Darius goes four to thirteen, combined two of
fifteen from three from those guys, and it just didn't
really matter.

Speaker 2 (03:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (03:29):
It's really funny because when I reflect back on kind
of the four games that we've had against Milwaukee this season,
normally the formula when you play the bucks is, hey,
when Giannie has got it going, you want to play
that to a draw, right like you want to you know,
hang around and then when he goes to the bench,
you can make a little bit of a run and
you can pull.

Speaker 2 (03:49):
Away at that time.

Speaker 1 (03:51):
I think it's fair to say that Jannis is the
best player in the Eastern Conference. Like when I look
kind of at the best players on the best team
throughout the East or even across the league, that like
Tier one group of like yokicch Shay, Jannie Lebron, Luca,
like that group, there's really only one of them in

(04:13):
the Eastern Conference where just definitively if you go into
a series, that's the number one guy. Jason Tatum, Jlen Brown,
you know, Jalen Brunson, all those guys. If we're in
a series against them, there is a chance that someone
on the Caves is the best player in that series.
I think Giannis is one of those guys that he's
just going to be that best player no matter what,

(04:35):
and for the Cavs to win the yannest minutes in
every single one of these matchups, or at least it
feels like that. I know that was the case for
the first two and then he didn't play the third.
But in everything they did, they definitely won the minutes
with Giannis in the third matchup where he didn't play, Yeah, yeah,
we did terrific there in those minutes. But you know,

(04:57):
to outscore the Bucks by thirteen in honest's minutes again,
Like that's really really encouraging because he is tough to handle.
He's going to get his own he's going to test
your defense, and I don't think every team is built
to handle what Yannis is capable of doing offensively, the
way that he plays with so much force, going to

(05:17):
the basket with such relentlessness, the way that he's able
to get his own rebound and second chance opportunities, and
the Cavs have bodies to throw at him, right, Like
DeAndre Hunter can do a good job. Dean Wade does
a good job. Max Deane has always done a good job.
And I thought he really battled in this game because
normally he does a good job of kind of baiting

(05:37):
Giannis into his worst habits, and Giannis was not having it,
Like he was going through his chest as much as
he could. And you know, when you're Dean Wade and
you just don't have the physical advantages there. You just
got to hang on pe to your life and hope
the help comes. I thought he did. He didn't change.
You know, again at the beginning I said it was
really steadfast the game plan from the cab. I think

(06:00):
that was really emblematic in the way Dean was guarding.
You know, He's like, I'm just going to do my best.
I'm not going to go crazy. I'm not going to
reach I'm not going to try to I'm not going
to change what I'm doing. I'm just going to trust
that eventually it's going to take him one more bump
to get through me than he wants, and we're going
to be able to bring help and we're going to
get the stops we need.

Speaker 2 (06:21):
Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (06:22):
And you know, on the other end, while the Cats
held up well defensively and did a great job on
you honest, the Bucks really struggled with the cast, particularly
on the perimeter. You know, when when you look at
this matchup on paper, you would think that is the
way that this should go, right, Damian Lillard is going
to be a target on defense, not a target in
the way that you know, Boston will target Darius or Donovan,

(06:44):
were like, hey, we can shoot over these shorter guys.
You can get by name, Like you're he's going to
allow very easy penetration. It's not shooting over you're getting
by him. Gary Trent Junior I thought had a tough game.
There were times that he was a little bit pesky
and physical, but he's one of those guys that's going
to gamble a little bit too much and create opportunities.

(07:04):
And so they prints at the two just as not
also do not. It's just not enough foot speed. Yeah,
for this Cavs team, they really are lacking foot speed.
And when you look at the shot quality for the
Calves in this game, it was staggering. Like they got
a lot of open threes. They took twenty three wide
open threes without a defender within six feet. They went

(07:26):
ten of twenty three on those, so good but not
you know, great, not one of their best shooting nights.
But then they also went seven of twenty on kind
of those late contest threes where a defender is within
four to six feet, so not wide open, but you're
getting a clean look in those spots. And they felt
and they felt rhythm. You know, that's where the tracking
data can show you is are they lightly contested pull

(07:48):
ups or are they lightly contested swing? Swing swing in
the rhythm of the game. You know, ball, you know,
hitting the shooter's pocket and able to rise up like
that stuff.

Speaker 2 (08:00):
I felt like.

Speaker 1 (08:01):
I felt like even when Milwaukee was contesting, it was
one of some of those contests where it was like, yeah,
but they're probably you know, they're not really impacting the shot. Yeah,
it's forty three shots that a defender was at least
four feet away from the three point line, Like that
is an incredibly great shot quality. I thought the ball
was moving really well. And going back to what you

(08:22):
said at the start of the podcast, it really did
feel validating. It was a comforting win because they've struggled recently, right, Like,
they've had close games against lesser teams and you're never sure,
right because there are the ebbs and flows of a
season of are they in a rut and you know
this is something that they have to work their way
out of, or is this a little bit of human

(08:42):
nature of hey, we're not really playing for anything at
this point. We are eight games up on the Boston Celtics. Well,
we're like, what we're really competing against is Cavalier's history.
Can we get the win record, can we get you know,
the number one seed in the NBA Finals and keep
pace with the Okay? See, but you know, if you're
playing a shorthanded Chicago Bulls or the Charlotte Hornets, you're

(09:06):
not going to be able to get up for those
games in the same way that you would for a
matchup against Boston. But you also can't take for granted
the fact that, hey, we can just turn this on
when we need to, especially with basketball being such a
rhythm game. And even though they didn't have their best
shooting night, I felt that the intensity was there throughout
the entire night. I thought the ball movement was spectacular.

(09:28):
I thought it was a really really fun team effort.
And the thing that I really enjoy about it is,
you know the kind of old adage that role players
play well at home, they don't necessarily play well on
the road. This was one of those games where the
Cavs depth and the role guys really stepped up.

Speaker 2 (09:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (09:45):
I mean you just look at the bench scoring. You know,
Wade has nine, Hunter has a bad game and has
six bros five tied Jerome chips and nine, Merrill Chips
and nine, and then you look at the Bucks bench
and you know, it's really nothing. Gary trans Junior scored five,
Kevin Porter scored two, and that was really it. And

(10:08):
in the you know, in the competitive portion of the game,
the depth that the Calves can play is just, you know,
so overwhelming, and they I think Danny Cunningham said it
best on his podcast un Lockdown Calves, where he goes
I felt like this was like closer to a Caves
thirty point win than it was to a Bucks win. Yeah,

(10:32):
they just looked like they were on a different level
that they could absorb a Yannis a game because the
honest is also guarding pretty well. It's just, you know,
they just didn't have the personnel. Like I think there's
you know, you look at like the Bucks in a
matchup against the Celtics or something. I feel like their
positional size could help them a little bit. You know,

(10:55):
they could be okay, but they just don't get the
foot speed for these guards and the Calves machine as well.
It's not just the guards speed with the ball, it's
them getting into the paint, getting in rotation and the
ball just moves so well for this Caves team that
it's just you're just so far behind. Yeah, And I

(11:17):
think one of the toughest things for Calves opponents is,
especially when you look at Milwaukee, it's okay when Dame
and Giannis are out there, they have a fighting chance
at playing the Calves to a draw, right like, they're
able to, you know, maybe hang around. If Dame gets
hot or you know, gets a few enough trips to
the free throw line, they can maybe play that to

(11:38):
a draw. Whereas with the Calves, it's okay, our starting
lineup is very good. Now you know, Donovan and Mobili
are going to the bench, you have to deal with
Alan and Garland with a bunch of very productive role
players that are going to play well. Then Donovan and
Mobili are going to come in refreshed, ready to go.
Then we're going to come back and going to hit

(12:00):
you with that closing lineup right like. It reminds me
of the Omniman meme of look what they have to
do to mimic a fraction of our power.

Speaker 2 (12:07):
You have to have Dame and.

Speaker 1 (12:09):
The honest out there playing forty eight minutes if you
want to be as good as we are as a collective,
and when you have a night where at least eight
players have nine points for the Cavs, you know, and
your best bench scorer in DeAndre Hunter as a little
bit of an off game, but eight players with at
least nine points, ten players with at least fifteen minutes,

(12:31):
five guys coming in off the bench kind of in
that fifteen to twenty minute range.

Speaker 2 (12:35):
Like, that's a.

Speaker 1 (12:36):
Lot of depth, that's a lot of production, and it
just it really helps them put their best foot forward.
And I think it's going to be an interesting conundrum
for Kenny Atkinson of how he's going to pair this
down in the playoffs if at all. Here's the thing, man,
I just think, like, I don't think it's actually that
hard because while the depth of options is great, I

(12:58):
still do think number one strength is at the top
in the core liability in that shell. And then I
just think he's gonna play who's playing the best. You know,
it's just gonna be a form thing. You know, on
a night where DeAndre Hunter just doesn't have it, he
only plays nineteen minutes and that's fine on you know,

(13:20):
in Okoro, who I honestly think could have used a
lot more run than he got. Needed was going to
pick up a lot of those minutes. Like, I just
feel like they have so many options, dude, I'm just
so grateful over this season. Man, They've won fourteen games
in a row and lose that game to Boston to
go to forty and ten, and they respond by ripping

(13:45):
off fourteen straight wins. Dude, Like, and I just kind
of who told you that there was a winning streak
around the corner. You're good, pal, justin You're never wrong.
You're just late, buddy, I'm just early. Sorry, never late,
never late. You've never been late on a Cav's optimistic, right, Yeah,

(14:07):
if I've never been the last one to the table,
that's concerning. That would be very concerning. People need to
do a wellness check on me at that point. But
you're right, man, Like the death is a strength. But
to me, like, the interesting conundrum is, right now you're
able to go ten to eleven deep and figure out
who the hot hand is among the bench.

Speaker 2 (14:27):
Right in the.

Speaker 1 (14:28):
Playoffs, you might not have that option, right, Like, you
can go up with a really strong eight or nine,
but you know you almost have to get some first
half run. You might have to go ten in the
first half, and then in the second half you're like,
all right, these are my eight that I'm playing the
last twenty four with, right, So you rather can I

(14:48):
say that a little bit? Or you start your series
that way and then by game five you know who
can't play, you know, or who isn't fitting or isn't
giving the run. I just think that's because the series
is a small sample. But it's like one of those

(15:08):
things where you have to kind of throw out a
sample size and just be like, what's working, what's not?
And if through four games into a series, one lineup
is just getting run off the court, I do think
you got to adjust.

Speaker 2 (15:23):
I do too.

Speaker 1 (15:25):
My question for you, and where it like some clarification
is do you think because you said you're going to
figure out who can and can't play in the series,
do you think there's actually anybody that's currently within the
rotation that just like from a matchup standpoint, can't play
in a particular matchup or I think going to be
performance based where like you know, they're in a little
in their heads, they're not playing at the level that

(15:47):
they can, rather than some deficiency they have within their game.
I don't think it's I don't think that's an important
distinction to make when you're coaching in a playoff series.
I think it is like when it's the latter, it's Hey,
from the start, we know that this is going to
be a bad matchup, Like if George Nang was still
on the roster, you would know that, Hey, Boston's going

(16:09):
to be a tough matchup for him, or okay, so
he's going to be a tough matchup. When you had
Channing Fry, you knew, Hey, I can't really play him
against the Warriors. That's different than you know, giving Isaacle
corel run. And if he's turning down shots and he's
not playing confidently on the offensive end, hey, it's a
little tough for us to get him out there, even
though we value what he's doing defensively. I think that
that distinction does matter. It matters for team building, but

(16:31):
not for Kenny Atkinson. That would be my argument is, Okay,
whether it's an archetype problem or a confidence problem, eventually
you're gonna have a guy who's just it's not their series.
I agree, and it's I think you need to in
that tie, especially under duress, like if you're in the

(16:52):
first round and you're you're up, you know, three to one.
You know, maybe you don't need to make that change.
But if you're like on the ropes, yeah, if it's
five and two to two or game six and you're
down three to two or something like that, Like that's
where it's like, I don't care what it is, We're
just not gonna We can't afford to let you work

(17:13):
through this right now, whether it's a if you just
hit that shot, you know, because here's the thing. Channing
had opportunities in those Warriors series. You know, he got
chances to play and got run and had shots, and
if he had hit those shots then he would have
played more, you know, like it was a hard matchup

(17:35):
for him. But there were good switchy teams that Channing
played well against for US. But like ty Lu didn't
have the luxury of being like, well, let's just give
it a couple more games. It's like, no, we're losing.
We gotta we gotta make changes now. And like, I
do think the playoffs voist that on you. So that

(17:57):
is why I don't think the distinction matters. Do I
think I think every player on this roster could help
in every matchup. Okay, so were to be very clear,
but but the chance of a of a team just
being like, hey, we're going to blow up every Sam

(18:18):
Merril off ball action.

Speaker 2 (18:20):
It's the playoffs.

Speaker 1 (18:21):
We're going to beat the crap out of him off
ball and it's just not and they're not going to
call fouls for Sam or something like that. Like and
if those minutes aren't going well, then I would expect
him to go out of the rotation. Same thing with Isaac,
same thing with Dean. I mean there are and there's
levels to this, right, Like the top five guys aren't
going to get cut out. You know they're going to

(18:43):
go down with a ship with those guys. But like
you know, with your seven, eight, nine, ten in the rotation,
those are those fungible minutes that you might just have
to swap out and see what changes under duress. Okay,
I think we're actually on the same where it's like
game one and two. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think game

(19:05):
one and two. You know, first half you play a
deeper rotation, see who has it, see who doesn't, see
kind of what you feel out the matchup, right, Like
those first two games of a series are always a
little bit of a feeling out process, and then you
can make those assessments, right, like, hey, we probably can't
keep playing Ricky Rubio in this series. We have options here, right,
And I think if you would have asked me a

(19:26):
couple of weeks ago, I probably would have sat here
being like, you know, I don't know if Sam can
play against Boston. I think we have enough depth. I
think we can kind of make that assessment going in.
But with the way he's been playing, like especially now
that the shots falling, like you know, he's doing the
main thing he's been holding up defensively. I thought, you know,
when he got put on Dame of a couple times

(19:47):
last night, I was like, eh, that's a little too
much dip on that ship. He killed Boston the other
or Boston Milwaukee on the other end of the floor, so.

Speaker 2 (19:53):
You know he did.

Speaker 1 (19:54):
But you know, you don't have to put him on
Dame right, like you can put him on someone else.
But my point is, I think he's done a good
enough job as an all around player to merit, you know,
that opportunity to see what he's got. So I do agree.
I think as the series progresses, you're going to become
more selective with your lineups. You're going to see which
ones end up working. But to start the series, I

(20:17):
think you almost have to go ten at least in
the first half, and then in the second half it's
all right, this is our eight that we're running with.
In the second half, we're going to you know, we're
going to give you know. What the advantage of that is, too,
is you're giving your core guys and your starters a
little bit more rest in the first half so that
they can go harder in the second half so that
they can close games. You're not playing back to backs

(20:39):
in the playoffs, you're not playing three and four nights
with travel. You have the opportunity to do that. So
I think going a little deeper, not only to assess
what lineups are working and what kind of looks that
you feel good about a relative to the opponent that's
putting them in the tough spot, you have that ability
to then play your guys a little tougher in the

(20:59):
set and half when you want to close out those games.
And I do think that does reflect the sea change,
at least for me in terms of what I would
do if I were Kenny, because if I'm being honest
with myself. I was looking forward towards the playoffs and
I was thinking, it's going to annoy me if Kenny
tries to run ten guys. M I was thinking, I

(21:21):
was like, he'll I was expecting him to, and I
wasn't going to be excited about it. I was going
to be like, I'd just rather you pick the nine
and you know, and really and really pare it down,
you know, again we want a title with TYLERU. So
like there's some muscle memory here of you know, pairing
down and being cool with that. Yeah, But I think

(21:44):
that's the change is I now am of the opinion
that playing those ten, at least in the first half,
is so representative of what the team's culture is and
of what of how they play and how Kenny five
figures out who to play over the rest of the
game that I am now I'm now going in aligned

(22:08):
with that idea that he'll play ten. Now he might
surprise us in play nine. I mean, we don't know.
We're doing as we're guessing and we're doing prognostication. But
again I went and expecting to be like, h I
wish he wouldn't. And now I'm like, yeah, it's cool
if he does.

Speaker 2 (22:24):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (22:24):
And I think a big part of that is now
we have an extended track record of all these guys
coming in off the bench and providing something. Right, everyone's
won us a game. They've all bring something different to
the table, right. I think that's a big part of this.
It's not like there's big redundancies between what a lot
of them are bringing, right, Like, they all bring a
different flavor. They're bringing a track record of success within

(22:46):
the season, and when you have that track record of success,
you feel more comfortable with it, just like I feel
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(23:07):
What a year?

Speaker 2 (23:08):
What a year?

Speaker 1 (23:09):
I know, I'm sure they got to win one more game.
They got to win one more game to match your
prediction for this season. They got to win two more
for them to match mine. I think they're hitting those marks. Yeah,
and normally picking, Hey, a win total like seven higher
than the Vegas line is like all right, Homer.

Speaker 2 (23:29):
Like you know that Vegas line was nonsense.

Speaker 1 (23:32):
Though even the national guys are like, I don't know
about the Calvs, but that line looks stupid, Like, yeah,
it was awful. You made the best point. Everything went
wrong last year and they exceeded that total. There was
no reason to I think people got maybe a little
too worked up over the changes some other teams in
the Eastern Conference made right, like we always sit here

(23:54):
in the off season being like oh Man Tias Jones
going to the Phoenix Suns, They're going to win seventy.
But then you know, the offseason moves ended up not
mattering as much as they do in that transaction cycle.
And you know, I think maybe the cast standing pat
led this sum doubt there, but they have far exceeded
those expectations. And you know that I think that ties

(24:16):
into the depth. Like looking at last night, it was
really really cool to see so eight lineups played or sorry,
three lineups played at least eight minutes last night. The
starting lineup basically played Milwaukee to a draw twenty four
to twenty six. They just got outscored by two in
ten minutes. You had the Jerome Mitchell, Merrill, Hunter and
Mobiley lineup that played eight minutes that played Milwaukee to

(24:37):
a draw twenty two, twenty two. And then you had
the lineup that was the most productive last night, Garland
o'coro Struce Way to Allen, which in eight minutes outscored
Milwaukee by eleven twenty five to fourteen. You know, that
really was the biggest kind of differential on the night.
And you know, it was so cool about the Garland
o'coro Streuceway to Allen lineup. To me was like there's

(25:01):
so many ogs in there, you know, there is like
that felt like, I don't know, it's funny. I think
it was Chris fiedor or maybe it was Joe Varden
on the Athletic they talk about like what a wacky
lineup that was, and I was like, that was what
they ran. That was their team like two years ago

(25:21):
for a lot of minutes. So it was just like
kind of funny to see them and like those are
guys who have just been on this team. You know,
Strus obviously in year two, but it feels like an
older I know, but Garland's year five of Coros four. No,
maybe Garland's six, I don't remember. Either way, those guys

(25:42):
have just been here since this They a lot of
those guys got here when this team wasn't good yet,
and it's really really cool to see them out there,
Like it almost felt like like kind of like a
comfort thing, like I was watching an old movie I've
seen a hundred times and watching Kevin dwer Junr was
on the floor for the Bucks last night, and what

(26:04):
three four of those guys were on the same team
as him at one point, So it just yet it
felt like, you know, cuddling up to watch your favorite
movie you've seen a hundred times, which is why it's
funny that you know, you saw a few people talk about,
oh that that lineup one. I'm like that those guys
together have won the GAVs a lot of games and
are really crucial in this renaissance, and you know they're

(26:27):
not getting to this level without those, especially those four guys.
I mean, obviously Stews has been amazing, just hasn't been
here quite as long. And yeah, those minutes just felt
really really fun. And I mean how many times are
were we're like, oh if only we can get Okoro
and weighed on the floor with one of the bigs.
No one's going to score on us because you know,
we've just wanted them all to be healthy and in

(26:49):
form at the same time. Kind of feels like we're
getting that right now. Yeah, and you know that is
a really good defensive lineup, right, Like DG's been working
his butt off defensively. I thought he had a great
defensive game against Milwaukee, really really felt his presence there.
Of course, what Acoro does kind of goes without speaking. Max,
I'm on record, you know, he's one of my favorite

(27:10):
role players, maybe my favorite role player that I've had
watching the Cavs. I just love his energy and what
he brings to the table. He was great, wads terrific
against Gianness and Jared. Obviously we know what he does
on the defensive end, so it's no surprise that that
lineup really stepped up. And you know a Korro in particular,
what he's done to Damian Lillard. He's guarded Dame more

(27:32):
than any other player the last two years. He spent
forty minutes over forty minutes guarding Dame the last two seasons,
and in that time Dame is seven to twenty one
from the field. And while that percentage, you know, we're
talking about a small sample size here, twenty one shots,
the percentage is terrific that you know, that indicates he's
playing really good defense. I think the more significant thing

(27:52):
is twenty one shots in forty minutes for a very
high volume player that's able to get a shot off
against a lot of guys. That goes to you know,
a coorro's ability to suppress shots, to make guys uncomfortable,
to get him out of his spots. He does a
terrific job on Damian Lillard. And you know, I'd be
very embarrassed if I was a podcaster that recently said

(28:15):
Calves have no one that can guard Dame, I would
be too, And thank god, that wouldn't be our podcast.
I particularly if that same podcast or recently or after
the Okac loss said that our insanity run is over,
that would be really really embarrassing. As the Calves are
on the verge of another fifteen game winning streak, certainly

(28:35):
again could not be this podcast. I just think Okoro
is one of those guys that you're really really glad
that the Calves have hung on too, because in one
of the reasons why I think both of us were
angsty about losing him in the off season or doing
a sign and trade even for a good player back
as his name is bounced around the transactional circles, is

(28:58):
he does do a thing no one else in the
team does as well as him. Yeah, I would rather
have him on Dame Lillard than anyone else in this roster.
You know, Mobley is a better defender overall, obviously, you know,
I would probably put Alan above Oquaro as well, but
for this one chore, this one task, putting him on

(29:20):
a six foot six y one guard, Yeah, it's so nice,
you know, And I feel like in a Knick series,
it'll matter. In in a in a Bucks series, it'll matter,
you know. I don't know if Boston is the perfect
series for Ice. That's that's the funny thing, because Drew
Holiday and Derek White, like Derek White is the Calves killer,
but you know, not in the way that Ice, right,

(29:42):
it's not you know, solo isolation. Let's put him on
and try to you know, shut off the flow of
the offense. Usually, like Derek White is almost a barometer
of how you know, when their offense is rolling, the
ball is swinging getting to Derek White, and he's and
he's hitting kind of those knockout punches rather than he's
going to be the guy that's running the offense. No,
their offense runs through all right, let's find a mispatch

(30:05):
and play isolation basketball. Yeah, And that's where it just
unless you just don't give up the switch, which, by
the way, Okorra was part of them not doing that
against Boston. So I'm not saying it's not a good matchup,
but those the Knicks and the Bucks specifically are just
like the perfect Even if he's not starting, you can
you can just kind of muck up their rhythm for

(30:26):
a bit and and you know, maybe turn a game
in a five minute stretch. So I feel like Ice
is really, really in good form. And I don't know
if I've hit on this on the pod. I can't remember, honestly,
so you'll just have to hold me accountable here. But
I feel like I have to hold an ol a

(30:46):
little bit with Ice because we talked about it on
the pod in the summer, we talked about it last year,
where you know, we've kind of always been at odds
on this where you've always said, hey, man, like, parking
him in the corner isn't going to get what you
need out of him structurally. And I always said, well,

(31:10):
he's got to do more with the times he does
get the ball if he wants to get the ball
more and get to do more like because involving a
player in an action is an inherently costly thing, you know,
it's a resource thing. If Isaac is the one setting
the screen, then Evan or Jared is not the one
setting the screen, you know.

Speaker 2 (31:29):
So that's all.

Speaker 1 (31:30):
That was kind of my party line was like, hey, Isaac,
I love Isaac. He's a great player. He's hit and hit,
the jumpers come along, all this stuff. I want to
see him earn all the touches and in more activity
in the offense because the way the Cops were playing
last year, you need someone in that corner.

Speaker 2 (31:50):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (31:52):
And I think I just have to hold the LP
because Kenny has gotten Isaac a lot more involved. I mean,
he has been so good on the short roll all year.
He's been a very good off ball screener, really making
good contact, dragging that foot in just the sneaky little
way so you don't get called to get a little

(32:14):
bit more of a chip on the guy trying to recover.
I just think he's been a much more complete player.
And to your point that you've made a billion times,
you're just not as reliant on the three to go
in for him to have a good game.

Speaker 2 (32:29):
Now.

Speaker 1 (32:30):
Yeah, yeah, when you're sitting there and it's hey, you're
going to get three shots from the corner all game,
and your offensive output is going to be reliant on
how you do on those, Like that's such a low volume.
You know, Darius and Donovan, we'll go oh for three
at times, right, And the largest sample is he's been
shooting well. But I like seeing him used in more ways.

(32:51):
And I think, you know, we should probably acknowledge that
there was a foundation for this late in the past too, right,
Like this is something that we would occasionally see. Remember
the game against Miami last year where o'coro was the
role man was instrumental late in the fourth quarter of
getting great looks and getting those wins. But I think
kind of the kind of crisis situation that they were

(33:14):
in from a health perspective last year, it was tougher
to you know, let's explore some things with o'coro. Let's
let him, you know, stretch his wings here, let's you know,
experiment with other guys on the roster. The focus was
let's get Darius back on the right track. Let's Evan's
coming in back off a knee surgery. Let's try to
get him reintegrated. Oh yeah, we went eighteen and two

(33:36):
and now we're missing Donovan for the rest of the
you know, the regular season, like there is always some
sort of issue going on and made it tougher. And
I think one of the other things that's made this
easier for Ocoro coming back is since he's come back
from the injury. Now DeAndre Hunter's on the roster, that
means he's able to play almost exclusively as a shooting guard.

(33:57):
And I think that guard to guards, screening and the
ways that Kenny's using him are so much easier as
a shooting guard. That was the spot that you know,
Bruce Brown really excelled as I'm basically like functioning sometimes
as a power forward at the shooting guard position and
he has more gravity as a result of that. I

(34:18):
saw the openness ratings for three point shooters so far
this season. Dean Wade actually has a higher openness rating
than isacle Coro. Oh that's a great stat that's a
great pull, brother, And I think a large part of that,
you know, him shooting better is part of it, but
I think part of it is when you're playing as
a shooting guard, the defender has to stay connected.

Speaker 2 (34:39):
You're not going to.

Speaker 1 (34:40):
Sag off as a shooting guard defender and oh, I'm
going to fill the paint. I'm feeling the paint here
on the weak side.

Speaker 2 (34:47):
No, what are you doing.

Speaker 1 (34:48):
You're not bringing anything to the table there. As a
small forward or you know, even a power forward, you're
able to kind of change defensively.

Speaker 2 (34:55):
And let's put.

Speaker 1 (34:56):
Al Horford on isaacle Coro in the corner because he
can sag often too the paint. You're not able to
do that at the shooting guard position. And I just
feel like he is playing since he's come back with
the injury. He's hit the ground running, he is attacking
the glass, he's getting rebounds, he's doing the act of stuff.
It's both what I wanted to see and it's also

(35:19):
producing the kind of supplemental production that you really wanted
to see to continue justify giving him those minutes, Yeah,
for sure, and Brandon and the YouTube chat just also
just made a little extra comment that you know, Okoro
in action does make the Dames and the Bronsons and
the tray Youngs of the world have to guard for
twenty four seconds. Yep, there's just all these knock on

(35:43):
effects that make his life a little bit easier. And
you know, and that is the one thing I will
press on Kenny a little bit is I don't think
against Milwaukee Ocoro should be playing basically twelve competitive minutes.
I think that's a twenty minute a game matchup. And
I would take minutes from the DeAndre Hunters, the Isaac

(36:07):
I'm sorry, the Dean Wades, the Sam Merrill's of the
world to find ice those minutes because I think he
is so singularly impactful against the most volatile element of
the Bucks attack.

Speaker 2 (36:22):
Yeah, yeah, I agree.

Speaker 1 (36:23):
And you know, credit to Chris Fedor's Wanting Gold Talk podcast,
but he was mentioning a couple of games ago where
Kenny was saying he was basically looking down at the
stat sheet and said, man, I gotta find ways to
get Isaac more minutes and basically saying, hey, you know,
we close with DeAndre here, but I just as easily
could have had Isaac in that role right like what

(36:44):
he brings to the table defensively, and you know, I
do think there's differences in terms of their length, but
that's you know, that's one of those tricky conundrums because
I typically would agree with you. But I think one
of the kind of trickle down effects that we're dealing
with now when you're looking at it from a rotation standpoint,
is if this was a month or two ago where

(37:06):
Merrill's playing good defensively but the shots not falling, Okay,
that's an easier kind of transition to make now that
the shots falling and he's playing well balanced basketball. You
when you have a team this deep, it needs to
be merit based. And I think that Kenny is doing
the right things here. And I understand how different shooting

(37:26):
the crap out of the ball. I didn't realize how
good It's been three of seven, three of five, one
of two, four of four, three of five in the
month of March. And you're not losing anything with him
on the court, right Like, he stands up defensively, his
screen navigation, his footwork is terrific. There Basically the only
spot when you look at like Basketball Index is a

(37:48):
great resource for this kind of thing where it breaks
down the different defenses. The only spot where he's going
to have issues is in isolation. I think they rate
him at it like a great amount of C minus there.
But every he's doing his part, he's playing good team defense.
So I think it's great that Isaac is playing so
well and we're having these conversations because the other thing

(38:11):
that we've talked about, just reflecting on, you know, years
of Isaacle coorl conversations is hey, you know, when he
starts off the year and he's in a reduced role,
you don't feel his impact, You don't notice him out there.
And it's yeah, it's great that when he steps in
as a starter he plays really really well, but can
we get this in a reduced role, can he play
an impactful fifteen to eighteen minutes? And I think what

(38:34):
we're seeing is he came back from the injury and
immediately was doing that. That to me speaks to a
confidence in his role. And I think credit needs to
go to the coaching staff of really defining exactly what
they want from him when he's out there on the court.
Very very fair justin we got to talk about Max.
It's a disservice that we took this long to get

(38:56):
to Max, who killed mel in this game, absolutely killed them.
He was moving, he was really attacking the boards. He
had four offensive rebounds seventeen and nine. Everything about his
game last night was reflective of what I love about

(39:19):
him as a role player. He read space, He had
only two assists. He had a few unbelievable reads that
did not lead to buckets. I think he is You know,
that starting group has come under fire the last week
or so just because they haven't been starting particularly well,
even either half. Really the lineup usn't been playing that well.

(39:41):
If we're really being honest with ourselves, Max has been
playing very good basketball. And I just you know, even
in that Orlando series last year where he couldn't hit
the broadside of a barn, no one could, but I
loved his then too. I just think he is a

(40:01):
winning player, and all the things I loved about him
as a free agent signing I still love. I just
think he adds an edge to this team. He adds
a professionalist professionalism to this team. I think he is
part of the whirling dervish of movement that they can
kind of provide and put teams in that blender. I

(40:24):
just I am so appreciative of his place on this roster.
And I feel like with all the fun of the
core four and then the Ty Jerome renaissance and the
DeAndre Hunter mid season acquisition, I feel like sometimes he
is kind of the underdiscussed player on this roster. Yeah,

(40:46):
I feel like he has just been the Metrome man.
He is so reliable to play good basketball every night. Now,
sometimes the jumper goes in at a really high level.
Sometimes it doesn't, but it doesn't impact the way he
plays general. And I'm just very appreciative of him. Yeah,
he plays very intelligent basketball. And I think, you know,

(41:07):
I joked about this with you last night where I said,
I just don't understand how the fan base that came
to love and adore j R. Smith can't, you know,
sometimes embrace a streak shooter that does a lot of
other things really well, right, Like Jr's passing in his defense,
you know, was great. Like I think he was a

(41:27):
very underrated defender in his time with the Cavs. I
think he's a better defender than Max. I think, you know,
he was a more dynamic shooter, but Max brings a
lot of that same stuff to the table. And I
think his chemistry, his ability to reliably run a two
man game with Alan and Mobley is a huge asset.
And you know, when you play a team like Milwaukee, Man,

(41:51):
I don't want to be disrespectful saying this, but when
you are a team that sometimes gets disorganized defensively, that's
the exact type of team that maxters can kill because
he is so intelligent in finding those passing lanes, finding
those pockets off ball to get those shots up. Those
crawl around jumpers from the corner were absolutely absurd. And

(42:13):
you know, there's a reason why when you dive into
the kind of advanced analytics on his shot profile, he
always rates out as a better shooter than his percentages
because of his shot difficulty. You know, I think that's
something that you have to take into consideration. I would
also say at the same time, sometimes that shot difficulty

(42:34):
is based on his choices as a shooter, Like you know,
it's not always hey, you know, he's being clamped down.
Sometimes he's going to take some ridiculous threes. But I
think you need a guy like that and I think
once now that you know, we have DeAndre Hunter in
the mix, now that Dean Wade is back and playing well,

(42:54):
you have Samui, you have Isaac Corral, all these other
guys that are bringing other things to the table, being
a little less reliant on Max and having alternatives on
those evenings where it's not working. Just like, it almost
frees me up to enjoy it even more because I
really do think what he brings to the table is
valuable and it's going to matter in the playoffs. Yeah,

(43:16):
I just think he's a guy I would go to
war with ten times out of ten. And I pulled
up his basketball reference and I was like, I wonder
other numbers are actually looking because I haven't just looked
in a while, I actually look. Can I guess what
his three point percent is at go ahead? He shot
the thirty five last year? Is he at thirty eight
this year? He is at thirty eight point one, I'm sorry,

(43:37):
thirty eight point three. And he's up to three point
volume by about one three point ten per thirty six.
He's shooting a little bit better from the field three
percentage points better from three. The free throw rate is down,
which makes sense, but here's a little factoid, because remember
last year, we were so excited about his playmaking, the

(44:00):
fact that he was averaging just under five assists for
thirty six and we were like, man, we didn't know
he could do that, But we were kind of like,
is that going to play a lot of ball handling minutes? Yeah,
because Darius and Donovan were hurt so much of the year,
they didn't have ty Jerome like he had to run

(44:20):
a lot of offense. So it was one of those
things where we were glad the assist numbers were up,
but were like, maybe that's not Maybe that's reflective of
the roster situation more than anything. Yeah, his assists for
thirty six have stayed almost even. Four point six last
year is at four point four this year. You know,

(44:43):
And this is a much, much, much smaller example, but
you know, considering we have another game coming up against
them recently and we played them, it's the examples fresh
in my mind. But last year, when Memphis had all
those injuries, they let Jaron Jackson explore the space and
really paid dividends when they got healthy. I think that's

(45:03):
reflective in Max's playmaking, right, and he's not being forced
into those spots he was last year when he had.

Speaker 2 (45:09):
To play so much point guard.

Speaker 1 (45:10):
But the reads he makes, I feel like all kind
of the the the advancements he made in that category
last year are still there this year. I'm I'm surprised
that the number is so high, just because you know,
all these playmaking reps for Jerome and Mobiley and all
that stuff. I would have ASSU was cut in half

(45:31):
just by circumstance, Mobiley is taking on such a larger
part of that than he did last year. Darius has
been phenomenal. Donovan Is I think he's taken a step up.
We've talked about it. I literally didn't exist last year. Yeah, right,
Like I just I'm shocked that that is in fact
the case. But yeah, I think, you know, that's a

(45:52):
great poll. I think that's a great example of you know,
him just being kind of that connective player. And you know,
I one thing that I want to point out because
on the last podcast, I mentioned how DeAndre hadn't played
any minutes with the Core since his first you know
game with the Calves. The last two games, Kenny has
got him second half minutes with the Core four, So

(46:14):
that's at least encouraging. I'd like to continue to see that.
But you know, this current kind of balance is working
pretty well. DeAndre has been terrific as they stagger. If
I look at the cleaning the glass numbers, Carter, you're
going to laugh at this. This is this is how
reliable Kenny is when it comes to rotations. But we
know that Garland and Allen is the main pairing so

(46:36):
far with DeAndre Hunter, they've played one hundred and fifty
nine possessions. Mitchell mobleyan Hunter without Garland and Allen have
played one hundred and sixty three possessions. It's almost down, baby.
And you know you look at the Garland, he's got
a guy and the staff. That's just his rotations. Guy.

Speaker 2 (46:54):
Oh, someone's definitely doing it.

Speaker 1 (46:56):
There's no way he's remembering this while he's coaching the game. No, no, no, no,
no no, there's got to be some assistance. But to
give the numbers for those lineups, Garland, Allen and Hunter
plus twenty two net rating, Mitchell, Mobley and Hunter plus
twenty net rating, Yeah, that rocks like they are very
good in every way. And you know, I think you're

(47:18):
correct in pointing out that the starting lineup has not
been good recently. I think a lot of that has
been effort based, like they have not seemed as locked in.
The Other part is, you know, the Guards are going
through a bit of a slump. Darius had a couple
of games where it looked like, you know, was coming back.
I thought Miami was pretty good Charlotte even though he
went four of ten, it's still twenty points on ten

(47:41):
shots because he got.

Speaker 2 (47:42):
A lot of free throws there.

Speaker 1 (47:43):
But you look at the last four games, man Darius
is twenty of fifty seven from the field and twelve
of thirty four from three, and Donovan is twenty five
of sixty eight from the field and six of thirty
from three. That lineup's not going to be as good
if the Guards aren't shooting well. Yeah, absolutely, And I
do think there's slumma just a little bit, but not

(48:05):
in a way that is like, you know, horrible. I
have a little factoid for you, justin go for it.
Who do you think leads the NBA and plus minus
in the last ten games?

Speaker 2 (48:18):
Hunter?

Speaker 1 (48:18):
Sure does? Yeah, And isn't that fun that they just again,
they have all these options first off, which is just wonderful,
But isn't it fun that a guy who has been
criticized for being a pretty good stats but the IMPACT's
not there, you know, you just drop him into this

(48:40):
new environment and immediately he becomes one of the best
on off guys in the NBA.

Speaker 2 (48:49):
Is fine. It's fine. Honestly.

Speaker 1 (48:51):
I like that that trade is kind of working out
to be a win win because at Atlanta really needed
the playmaking, they needed warm bodies, they needed. They got
three playable players at the deadline. Yeah, and that helps.
And you know, George had been playing great this year.
Karris has been playing really really well up until when

(49:12):
he had that hand injury. So for those two guys
to be playing really well and given Atlanta what they need,
that's terrific. DeAndre has been giving the kvs exactly what
they need. And as we said at the time of
the trade, I was excited to see the trickle down effects.
I was excited to see Moro Kora at shooting guard.
I was excited to see, you know, having that alternative

(49:33):
to Dean weight Like, it just feels like it's been
such a bounced roster and it's no surprise that DeAndre
has had that kind of an impact and you know,
I think, just reflecting on the last couple of years here,
if Darius and Donovan were having a stretch like that,
things wouldn't be going well. Even in twenty two to
twenty three, I remember there was a January where neither

(49:55):
of them was shooting particularly well. I think the flu
was running through the team, and then went five hundred
for that month. Now you can kind of have this,
you know, a stretch like this where the shots aren't falling.
But I feel like both of them are still playing
pretty good basketball. Like I just think a five hundred
month would probably give you as many losses as we

(50:17):
have this season pretty much. But like you know, when
it comes to Darius and Donovan, even when they're not
shooting well, I still want to see those thirteen to
fifteen attempts, right, Like, don't press beyond that. But you're
good enough shooters, keep taking the right shots. I thought
the only game where Darius was like jacking up shots

(50:38):
and it felt bad with Chicago. Outside of that, I
feel like he's taking the right kinds of shots right
and Miami and Charlotte. I was very good with his games. Donovan,
even though he's not shooting all these last four games.
He's up this playmaking. He's generating opportunities for guys. He's
getting ten, generating ten assist opportunities per game over that stretch,

(51:01):
Darius thirteen. That's what you want to see. They're both
playing hard on the defensive end. You know, they're they're
chipping in on the glass. It's it just feels like,
you know you're able to weather that storm a little
bit more. And for you to play a game against
the Bucks regenerate good looks. Your guards don't shoot particularly well.

(51:21):
The you know, big time score that you brought in
in DeAndre Hunter doesn't have a good shooting game, and
you still comfortably win against a Bucks team that's had
won nine of its last eleven games. That's a pretty
damn good feeling. It absolutely is, buddy, And so is
fourteen in a row. And I got to ask you,
I know we're getting near probably near closing time here,

(51:44):
but when does this streak end?

Speaker 2 (51:46):
Dude?

Speaker 1 (51:47):
Because you go this week it's home versus Brooklyn, then
on Friday at Memphis, Sunday ABC afternoon game against Orlando.
Do they lose this week or do they go up
to seventeen. I'm going to predict. This is a fun game.

(52:07):
Predict when the Cavs are going to lose. It's hard.
Here's the one Wednesday, the nineteenth at the Kings One.
I feel I feel like we always have a funky
game there. That's the third game in four nights. You're
at a back to back, still close enough to daylight
saving time, which just sucks. I'm going through hell right

(52:28):
now everydow. You don't have children. I don't want to
talk to you. You're not allowed to talk to me
about this.

Speaker 2 (52:32):
Yeah, I'm you know, I'm tired.

Speaker 1 (52:35):
I'm oh, you're tired. Yeah, but you know three and
four you travel to La then you travel up to
Sacramento to play that back to back. I can see
it happening there. But you know, if that is the case,
and if I am right, as I so often am,
that's a franchise record winning streak.

Speaker 2 (52:52):
That's a lot of fun. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (52:53):
I mean, the only got to win two more to
set a new franchise record. So I gotta say, I
think that's a great poll. I think it's probably the
right pole. An important thing to say for the entirety
of March. The Calves do not play the same you know,
stay in the They don't have consecutive home games the
entire month, so they never are going to play in

(53:15):
the same place two games in a row, and they're
pretty much on the road in perpetuity for the entire month.
So this will be a big, you know, weight of
travel month, especially with a big schedule challenge month. Yeah,
after Brooklyn they have two days off. They don't have
two days off the rest of the month. They are

(53:36):
playing every other day, and they are flying between every
single one of those games. So I'm going to go ahead,
and I'm actually gonna say I think they're due for
a national TV stinker, and I'm going to pick Sunday
against Orlando.

Speaker 2 (53:49):
It's one.

Speaker 1 (53:50):
It's a matinee afternoon game against the team they're pretty
sure they got, you know, they just beat him by forty.
That's always a hard game because they're embarrassed and they
want to come for your throat, but you're like, we
got these suckers. It's just got like a cock. Plus

(54:10):
like that Friday Memphis game, I think is going to
be tough, and I don't know, if I had to pick,
it'll be that one. But I think your pick's probably
better than mine.

Speaker 2 (54:19):
To be honest. Okay, well, you know, my mind's a
little to.

Speaker 1 (54:22):
See him get to twenty, though I want him to
get to twenty.

Speaker 2 (54:25):
I mean, I'm staying on brand. That's really good.

Speaker 1 (54:28):
By the way, about all this is that even though
this month sucks, they do have the streak to kind
of motivate them. They do, like, because if this was
if they weren't streaking, I think they would have they
would definitely lose one of these games, just because you know,
eventually you lose, and instead they're gonna be like, I
don't want to lose the streak to Sacramento on a

(54:51):
late at night on a Wednesday, No, thank you. Yeah,
So I don't know. We'll see what if this went out.
I mean't really anything out anymore with these With these dudes.
The fun thing is, man like, seventy is still kind
of possible, you know, they if they all it's more
than kind of they're on pace for sixty nine.

Speaker 2 (55:12):
Nice.

Speaker 1 (55:13):
You know, the number that I really just wanted to
see is sixty seven because I want to get that
franchise win record. So if you drop a couple, that's fine,
but that's looking more and more feasible. Man Like, that
this is this month is going to be tricky. I
think they're they're really going to be battling the schedule.
But this is one of those spots where hey really
benefit from the depth the.

Speaker 2 (55:32):
Last topic I had.

Speaker 1 (55:34):
I think this is going to be a shorter one,
so I'm okay doing this even though we've kind of
gone along today. I wanted to ask you if you
could pick who you'd rather play, not who you think
is the better matchup for the Cavs, you as an
emotional fan, who would you rather play in the second round?
The New York Knicks or the Milwaukee Bucks. This is
less of a realistic hypothetical because the Bucks just lost
two games and kind of lost the momentum there. But

(55:57):
with Brunson, you know, missing some time here and the
Bucks being hot, it's at least a possibility that those
two flop in the stantics. Who would you rather play
in the second round? I don't Luckily I don't have
to worry about it, both narratively and basketball. I would
like to beat the New York Knicks. I don't like
I don't like that the embarrassed is two years ago.

(56:19):
I think the only way to really wash the stench
out of an ass kicking is to go get them back.
And I think this team is so well built to
get that next team back. And I don't think they're
meaningfully more talented than the Bucks, no, Like I I
think I kind of trust the Bucks more.

Speaker 2 (56:40):
Like.

Speaker 1 (56:40):
Yeah, the other advantage of playing the Knicks is I
don't think Boston's as well suited to defend you, honus
as we are, you know, Jason Gingham taking those body
blows for an entire series. I would like them after
Here's the thing. Would the Celtics sweep the Knicks? I
think they would.

Speaker 2 (56:58):
Yeah, I think they would.

Speaker 1 (57:00):
You know, maybe if the Knicks get hot, I think
the Caves and Celtics would both either sweep the next
or be a five game series if the Knicks get
hot for a particular game.

Speaker 2 (57:08):
So I would like that from a.

Speaker 1 (57:10):
Narrative standpoint, But I also kind of like I'm weighing,
you know, going into last night's game, I wanted Milwaukee
to go above them, go above the Knicks, because playing
playing the best player in the conference. That's always scary
going into a playoff series, but really validating if you win.

(57:32):
That's the thing that is such a good feather in
the cap that you know, and I feel comfortable that
we would win that series. I don't think that they
can guard us on the perimeter. I think we're well
suited to guard Jannis, and all due respect to cal Kuzma,
him being there instead of Chris Middleton does not make
me fear them more.

Speaker 2 (57:52):
So.

Speaker 1 (57:53):
I think he helps them in a lot of ways,
but not against the Cabs, not against Cats. That's that's
exactly right. So I I think if I stop caring
so much about what national podcasts are saying bringing up
the New York Knicks, I think, in my heart of hearts,
i'd say Milwaukee. Oh, I don't care what national podcasters say.

(58:14):
I want them to hurt.

Speaker 2 (58:16):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (58:16):
I want to see Nick Muse crying. If I'm honest,
if I'm honest with myself and I'm honest about what
a petty individual I am, I think the answer is
the New York Knicks. Oh, it's gotta be dude. I
want to I want I want Jared Allen to go
into the end of the Garden and a close out
Game four and to and tell them the lights are

(58:39):
perfectly bright. I want everything he's gotta wear some sunglasses
or something to the close out game.

Speaker 2 (58:47):
That'd be great.

Speaker 1 (58:49):
Oh man, how about you guys listeners dropping in the comments?
Who would you rather play in the second round? Nicks
or Bucks? A little interaction there. Big thanks to all
you guys tuning in and hanging out on youtubehere. You're
preppreciate you guys. Make sure you like and subscribe. Click
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(59:09):
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Speaker 2 (59:19):
Until next time. Jokay