November 13, 2025 • 36 mins
In Hour 1 of the Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show, the hosts react to the breaking news that President Donald Trump officially signed legislation reopening the federal government after a 43-day shutdown. The segment opens with audio from Trump at the Resolute Desk, where he criticizes Democrats for what he calls an attempted “extortion” of American taxpayers to fund benefits for illegal immigrants. Clay and Buck analyze the political fallout, questioning whether Democrats will repeat shutdown tactics in 2026 as part of their midterm election strategy.
The conversation transitions into a broader discussion on Senate filibuster reform, with Clay advocating for procedural changes to prevent future shutdowns driven by minority party obstruction. Buck adds historical context, referencing past filibuster modifications and the potential consequences of further rule changes. A major portion of Hour 1 is dedicated to a deep dive into the H-1B visa program, sparked by a contentious exchange between Laura Ingraham and President Trump. Trump defends the need for foreign talent in specialized industries, while Ingraham argues that American workers should be prioritized. Buck provides data indicating that over 750,000 H-1B visa holders are currently working in the U.S., with India accounting for 75% of recent recipients. The hosts debate whether the program is being abused by corporations to undercut American wages and bypass domestic hiring.
Listeners call in to share firsthand experiences with H-1B hires, including a small business owner who sponsored highly skilled engineers from Kenya and Turkey. The hosts explore the implications of these stories, questioning whether the American education system is failing to produce enough qualified professionals in STEM fields. Clay highlights the disconnect between elite academic institutions and workforce needs, citing the prevalence of liberal arts degrees over technical expertise. The hour also touches on the impact of artificial intelligence on the future of skilled labor, suggesting that many H-1B jobs may be eliminated as AI advances. Buck warns that the “learn to code” mantra may soon be obsolete, as coding becomes increasingly automated.
Additional topics include the economic burden of illegal immigration, the misuse of public assistance by non-citizens, and the broader affordability crisis facing American families. The hosts argue that immigration policy must prioritize merit and self-sufficiency, aligning with Trump’s broader agenda to protect American workers and restore economic fairness.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
O welcome in appreciate all of you as we roll
through the Thursday edition of the program. Rejoice, the government
is back open. Last night, President Trump at ten twenty
four pm Eastern officially signed the bill, put on his
desk from the House, and we are now back up
(00:21):
and running. And let's go ahead and take you into
that evening event. If if you missed it, as many
of you may have already been in bed, or you
may not have been paying attention. Here is what Trump
said last night, sitting at the Resolute desk in the
Oval Office as he officially began the process of opening
the government by signing the bill Cut three.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
I just want to tell you the country has never
been in better shape. We went through this short term
disaster with the Democrats because they vote it would be
good politically, and it's an honor now to sign this
incredible bill and get our country working again.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
One more thing, Bucky also said, for forty three days,
Democrats had no argument. That argument has not changed. This
is cut four.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
For the past forty three days, Democrats in Congress shut
down the government of the United States and an attempt
to extort American taxpayers for hundreds of billions of dollars
for illegal aliens and people that came into our country
illegally from gangs, from.
Speaker 3 (01:30):
Prisons, from mental institutions.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
They wanted to pay them one point five trillion dollars,
which would have really hurt our healthcare businesses and our
recipients and levels never seen before. Today, we're sending a
clear message that we will never give into extortion, because
that's what it was they tried to extort. The Democrats
tried to extort our country.
Speaker 1 (01:51):
Okay, So I think the number one question most people have,
including myself, and I'm curious how you would break this
down in terms of the likelihood, is what is going
to come next?
Speaker 4 (02:00):
Buck?
Speaker 1 (02:01):
Is I'm glad that we are now back open. The
Democrats gained absolutely nothing. They seem to have made this
choice despite the fact that there was no benefit to
them at all. Why will they not just do this again,
maybe multiple times in twenty twenty six as we come
up on the midterm elections. That's question one for you, Buck,
(02:23):
and I think for everybody out there too. And the
second part here, I don't understand why we can't modify
the filibuster in this particular fashion where we don't allow
the minority party to shut down the government just over
having basically a tantrum. My concern is, yes, Democrats have
(02:45):
recognized after forty three days, hey, we didn't gain anything.
Trump's not gonna bend, but they may still believe that
they gained politically. So my concern is why would they
not do this potentially multiple times in the upcoming year
with the election cycle.
Speaker 4 (03:01):
Well, I think that the midterm is going to be
something of people over use the term referendum. Right, First
of all, what is it? You know, what does a
referendum really mean? A lot of people don't know how.
Speaker 5 (03:13):
Much of a referendum it would it would be.
Speaker 4 (03:15):
But I think the midterms will factor into the assessment
of whether this kind of tactic is effective or not
because a lot of the narrative is going to be
built off of this, Right, There's going to be a
lot of posturing about how we fought, we stood up
to Trump, and I think they'll see this as an
opening to talk about healthcare, the problem Democrats have, and
(03:37):
this is getting really deep into it and Clay, this
feels like something that has been building for a long time,
because again, I started talking about politics for a living
Right around it was the Tea party era, right around
when Obamacare was the thing. Right, Obamacare was the big
fight in this country politically at how it was, how long,
(04:01):
how far back we're going now, we're talking fifteen years.
And they managed to with the obvious advantages they had
in the media and the whole apparatus around Obama himself
and the worship and everything, they managed to both roll
out the good ease, Oh you can be on your parents' plan.
Oh we're going to expand coverage. Oh we're gonna make
(04:23):
mental health and physical health give it parody and all this,
all these things if people go, oh, well, that sounds
kind of good. With this promise of you're gonna keep
your doctor, it's going to bring down costs, it's going
to make the health care system more efficient, all of
that is a total failure. In fact, it's worse than
a failure because it went in the other direction. It
made you know, it's one thing to not achieve your goal,
(04:45):
it's another thing to make it worse. If I was
giving somebody, you know, special diet cookies and they didn't
lose weight, that's bad. If they gained fifty pounds, that's
even worse. That's what the Obama care bill has actually done.
And I think that healthcare is going to be a
big part of what the mid terms because healthcare goes
right into affordability. You're gonna hear that word affordability. I
(05:06):
might add, ad nauseum. You're all gonna get sick of it.
We're all gonna get sick of talking about it. But
it matters is this. This is the new version of
kitchen table economic issues. So clay about the shutdown, I
think it's the beginning phase of Democrats trying to convince
the American people enough of them that they can regain power. Remember,
they're not trying to gain they're not trying to convince you,
(05:27):
me or this audience. But they're trying to regain power
through convincing enough Americans that they stand against They stand
against Trump. That's point one, no matter what that means,
we stand against Trump, yes, no kings. And point two,
we're going to make your life style more affordable. Somehow,
I think that's gonna be the whole, the whole thing.
(05:49):
They don't want to say, we're gonna kick open the
borders and let criminals run wild on the streets.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
That was kind of a loser for them in twenty four.
That wasn't a good That wasn't a good take. But
I still think they're gonna do it again. And so
if you're out there and you're saying, what are the
consequences for Democrats doing this? Yes they have an internal
civil war, Yes Chuck Schumer is under siege, but I
(06:13):
don't know that they actually lost anything. And if anything,
I think there's an incentive to try this again, which
is why I would solve this. And I'm saying this
on behalf of Republicans who may be the minority party again.
Almost certainly at some point in the next decade, Republicans
won't have control of the Senate. Why in the world
(06:38):
would we not put in place procedures to stop this
from happening, Because leave aside the temper tantrum aspect of it,
I'm concerned. And I know you talked about this in
air traffic control error that led to the deadliest plane
crash if I remember, was it in Brazil. You were
talking about buck where five hundred people died when planes
(07:02):
when two planes collided. My concern is we created a
situation where that could happen in the United States when
all the air traffic control guys and gals are not
getting paid what they should have gotten paid. They're not
getting their paychecks, and we started to have to restrict
the amount of flow of airplanes all over the country,
(07:23):
and so many of you got caught up in the chaos.
We could have had a real disaster there. That's the
area I would argue of our federal government that is
most important given the consequences of being wrong. In fact,
I know you're a big fan of this show too.
Remember one of the seasons of Breaking Bad actually opens
(07:44):
with an air traffic controller losing track of what's going
on and allowing two planes to collide in the air.
For those of you out there that are also big
Breaking Bad fans, but I don't understand why we have
allowed this process to occur and why we would continue
to allow it to occur. To me, if we modified
(08:05):
the filibuster when it comes to Supreme Court appointments, then
why in the world would we not modify the filibuster
to stop the minority party from effectively throwing a temper
tantrum and shutting down the government like this? That to
me seems like an easy resolution going forward.
Speaker 4 (08:23):
There there was a lot of talk from Trump about
getting rid of the filibuster.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
And then they're getting rid of the whole philibuster block
is a step too far.
Speaker 4 (08:33):
But this is to me, would it makes sense. This
is what I'm gonna say, is that this is the
halfway measure is well on this one, On this one,
we are going to change the rule now. To be
fair and to be clear, Harry Reid did something of
a halfway measure with the judges too, right. It was
for federal judges but not for Supreme Court. And then
(08:54):
when we were in the majority, we were like, you
know what, you're gonna play that game. We're gonna play
that game. So there's something of an arms race that
occurs within the Senate procedural rules that we will be
engaging in here. But if you want Trump to be
able to have a functional government and not just allow
Democrats to throw tantrums like this, then I think that
(09:17):
this then I think it makes a lot of sense
to do. We just have to understand that there will
be a cost, there will be a consequence on the
other side at some point. I do think there's understanding
already Clay among Republicans and among the Trump faithful, among
all the Trump voters out there. Democrats will be back
in power at some point. You know, the triumphalism of
(09:38):
the first six months, because it felt like such a
sound and resounding defeat of Kamala and the forces of
evil also known as Democrats, that has given way a
little bit too. Oh wow, they can still make people
like Spamberger win in Virginia. Kamala was closer than we think,
(10:00):
as awful as she was, and that's what I always
like to remind people of. They almost won with kamalaw
and they did win. I know, the Shenanigans, but they
did win with a dementia patient and Joe Bias. So
there's a lot of Democrats out there everybody, and a
very powerful machinery around them. So we need to be
prepared not just for this midterm, but get ready for
what things are going to look like if and when
(10:21):
they take power again. All right, you want to set
up this conversation.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
Let's go ahead, because we talked about it yesterday the
H one B visas and some of you may have
strong opinions. In fact, I'll open up the phone lines
on this eight hundred and two A two two eight
A two for people who have used H one B
visas before business owners management, I would be interested in
(10:46):
hearing your experience. I candidly have not ever as a
business owner, been involved in anything involving these visas. But
there was a significant discussion between more Ingram who is
very opposed to these, and President Trump, who in general
has been in favor of them. And you mentioned yesterday,
(11:08):
Buck that this kind of blew up. It was during
Christmas break, if I remember correctly, the Vike Ramaswami stepped
into the H one B VisAD discussion on social media
and he hasn't even been that active. Viveke hasn't on
social media buy and large since.
Speaker 5 (11:25):
Look, you know I was.
Speaker 4 (11:28):
I've talked to Vike Vike a little bit in the past.
I was very skeptical of his run because to me,
it felt like it was just for attention in brand building,
and it was successful in that regard. But I liked
a lot of what he said, and I think a
lot of what he said was in earnest. That tweet
was one of the worst self destructive tweets I've ever
seen a Republican politician put out in my life because
(11:51):
it really it really was like a swipe at America
and it felt like it was something he really believed.
And that is not good. H And by the way,
you know his opponent and the Democrat opponent in Ohio.
What do you think the first thing that she's attacking
him with already on that is, I do think the
Aarica doesn't have a culture of excellence. Where do they
(12:13):
have a culture of excellence? Vivic explain that one to
Clay one of the worst tweets I've ever seen. I mean,
not as bad as writing a memoir about shooting your dog,
but but bad.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
Batch We will positive is Vivik appears to be on
track to win Ohio comfortably, which would be important, and
I do think he would be a good governor. But
when we come back, I want to hear I phone
lines are open eight hundred and two two two eight
A two. I'm not wanting your opinion on this if
you haven't interacted or used these I want people out
(12:48):
there in our audience who have used the H one
B visas we're going to dive into this. We'll talk
about it some during the course of this hour. We
also are going to be joined by our friend Bill.
Speaker 4 (13:00):
O'Reilly at the top of the next hour much to discuss,
including Bill O'Reilly. Didn't he say this? He's totally wrong
on this.
Speaker 1 (13:08):
We'll have to tell him that Gavin Newsom has no
political future in the Democrat Party basically as a president.
Speaker 4 (13:14):
We may tag team Uncle Bill on this one, Clay,
but just remember he's got old man strength.
Speaker 1 (13:20):
You know that is certainly true. I' getting to be
an old man. I think I'm starting to have some
old man strength.
Speaker 4 (13:24):
But what is it about You reach an age and
the grip, the grip strength that you have is like terrifying,
you know all you're like.
Speaker 1 (13:31):
Just it's like when people used to say that somebody
was farm strong. It's like you have lived a life
where you if you are physically active, it's carrying around kids,
it's dragging the chairs to the beach. It's just all
of the non gem related muscle musculature.
Speaker 4 (13:49):
It adds up to what it's like. I don't think
Uncle Bill would be be great at deadlifting, but I
think he could probably crack a billiard ball in his
left hand, like no problem. So we'll talk about this.
But h one b one. You guys loaded lines. I
can already see. Poor producer, Greg. I only want people
who have experienced it, not your opinion on this. I
(14:11):
want to hear from people that have actually used these.
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Speaker 6 (15:13):
Making America great again isn't just one man, It's many.
The team forty seven podcast Sunday's at noon Eastern in
the Clay and Buck podcast feed. Find it on the
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Speaker 4 (15:27):
All right, welcome back into Clay and Buck. We're going
to have a discussion that we meant to have yesterday,
but we just ran out of time because we had
so much going on the show.
Speaker 5 (15:35):
It has to do with H one B visas.
Speaker 4 (15:39):
Okay, and H one B visas are very contentious for
a whole bunch of reasons. We're going to get into,
but I want to start with this President Trump. Laura
Ingram did a really good interview on Fox News President
Trump and President Trump was talking about this issue, and
I think that it was a little people take out
(16:03):
of context, or rather aren't understanding the full context of
what Trump is saying. We'll get into this, but first,
this is the clip we do have time for, let's
play at twenty seven.
Speaker 7 (16:11):
Does that mean the H one B visa thing will
not be a big priority for your administration because if
you want to raise wages for American workers, you can't
flood the country with tens of thousands or hundreds of And.
Speaker 3 (16:22):
We also do have to bring in talent when we come.
Speaker 7 (16:25):
Of talent and you know, you don't know, you don't
we don't have talent.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
Now you don't have you don't have certain talents, and
you have to people have to learn.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
You can't take people off an unemployed like.
Speaker 2 (16:35):
An unemployment line and say I'm going to put you
into a factory.
Speaker 3 (16:38):
We're going to make missiles or I'm going.
Speaker 4 (16:40):
To how do we ever do it? Before? Well, you
and I.
Speaker 3 (16:42):
I'll give you an example.
Speaker 2 (16:43):
In Georgia, they rated because they wanted illegal immigrants.
Speaker 3 (16:48):
They had people from from South.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
Korea that need batteries all their lives. You know, making
batteries are very complicated.
Speaker 3 (16:55):
It's not an.
Speaker 2 (16:55):
Easy thing and very dangerous, a lot of explosions, a
lot of problems. They had like five or six hundred
people early stages to make batteries and to teach people
how to do it.
Speaker 3 (17:06):
Well, they wanted them to get out of the country.
You're gonna need that, Laura. I mean, I know you
and I disagree on this.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
You can't just say a country's coming in, going to
invest ten billion dollars to build a plant and going
to take people off an unemployment line who haven't worked
in five years, and they're going to start making missiles.
Speaker 3 (17:23):
It doesn't work that way.
Speaker 4 (17:25):
Okay, Clay, this is very important. We'll get into this
because there has been some further explanation of it. Some
people were a little upset with the President said what
he's saying is true in context of what he's what
he's will explain in a minute. But just you asked
a really important question that I think sets the stage
for this really Well. They always say, well, there's only
sixty five thousand, h one b's a year, that's how
(17:46):
many new ones are given. There are three quarters of
a million h one B workers in America right now,
seven hundred and fifty thousand, give or take. No matter
how safe you think your neighborhood is always the chance
you'll be the victim of a home intrusion, a burglary,
a home invasion, and it's happening across the country.
Speaker 5 (18:06):
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Speaker 1 (18:57):
Welcome back in Clay Travis buck Sexton Show.
Speaker 4 (19:01):
We appreciate all of you hanging out with us. All right.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
We just laid out a little bit of the details.
We played you the cut of Laura Ingram, who disagrees
with President Trump on this issue. There's a cap of
roughly eighty five thousand a year, but as Buck pointed out,
these can be multi year contracts that are brought in
the so called H one B visas for people with
(19:24):
special skills, they are brought into the country there. Now,
I believe Buck, under Trump is ae hundred thousand dollars
tax per H one B that is being introduced. And
these are supposedly jobs that are super skilled and difficult
to find Americans that they can do. And we got
(19:47):
a bunch of you. I actually want to hear from
some of you. Let's start with Dave in Elk Grove, California.
You are a small business owner and you sponsored two
people come here. Give us a rough idea of why
that was necessary and what your take is on the
H one B debate.
Speaker 8 (20:09):
Okay, so structural engineers, it's highly technical, takes great skills
in maths, physics, science. I'll put it in a sports analogy.
If you're putting a team together and you want to win,
you're going to draft the best players you can find
from wherever they're born on the plant. Okay to oppose
this program to me as opposing the meritocracy. Honestly, Sonya.
(20:32):
It worked out great. Sponsored one individual from Kenya, another
from Turkey, brought them on board, both PhD folks tremendous
assets contributed company, and I want to say too, we
paid them on par or more than others in the
firm because of their qualifications, so straight up it went. Also,
(20:54):
then they sponsored them through the legal process so that
they could become legal residents on the paths of citizenship.
It was a win win.
Speaker 1 (21:02):
So because you're a Trump I assume you're a Trump voter,
so this is something you would agree with the president on,
not with Laura Ingram and others. Let me ask you this,
These are people that, in your opinion, they had a
skill set from these foreign countries. You could not find
Americans to do the job that you hired these individuals for.
(21:23):
Because sometimes the counter argument is you're paying less. I
don't mean you specifically, but people who get h one
b's are paying less to foreign workers because they're desperate
to come to America instead of otherwise hiring qualified Americans.
Is that not an accurate attack in your mind based
on what you have seen in this program.
Speaker 8 (21:45):
Absolutely, the talent pool in this highly technical world, it's
so thin. You have to reach out and get the
best talent available wherever you can find it. It's not
like you're going to roll out of bed and become
an engineer. Okay. When I was in school, we make
fun of the liberal arts major just because you know,
five units for a class where I did you know
true false questions versus a reunit class and statics where
(22:08):
he failed it. You were out. I mean, it's just
it's night and day.
Speaker 4 (22:14):
Okay, thank you for the call. I mean, this is
this is so, this is where this gets a little tricky.
I'll just say that you're going. We can tell. We'll
take calls on both sides of this. I know and
I know people personally who fall on both sides of
this debate. They'll do some thing. Oh I hired, you know,
someone to do coding work from Georgia, the country, not
(22:35):
the state, and they were fantastic. Or I hired somebody
to and and I couldn't find anybody in it. Okay,
well but someone has to explain to me then a
few things. First of all, I mean, you can go
and find the Economic Policy Institute, for examples, one place
you can find all these different studies that show H
and B workers in the same role are making twenty
(22:56):
to thirty percent less than American American competitors. Okay, so that's.
Speaker 5 (23:04):
We need we need to figure out whether this is
true or not.
Speaker 4 (23:06):
I mean, if you do a simple search on this,
people can say, oh, no, we paid you know, we
paid Tony or Akhmed or whatever more than the role would. Okay,
well you can say that for the job that you hired.
But what's actually happening with the seven hundred and fifty
thousand H one B workers across the country. Also, why
are so many H one B workers from one country,
(23:27):
which is India. That's I think an interesting story in
and of itself. There's a lot of countries out there,
a lot of places that you would think would be
turning out so called talent. And remember it's supposed to
be talent that you can't that is not capable of
being found here in the marketplace. There are three hundred
and forty million Americans and god knows how many illegals.
(23:49):
You're you gonna tell me that there's no one who
can do these jobs here there's a million people that
are doing right now. To the point that Trump was
making play, I was at TSMC and tay one very
interestant time wand Trip. I've talked about it a lot.
Do we have the know how to run a fab
a fabrication facility for microchips at the level that TSMC
(24:11):
does with the current US work for No, we don't,
and that's very important. But they're changing that, and that's
what Trump was trying to talk about. I think what
people what bothers people is when Amazon is hiring h
one bs to do menial coding work or to do
phone bank stuff or you know whatever in a customer
(24:33):
service because they're cheaper and they're undercutting American workers. And
that is happening. So one individual story about oh but
I found this great h one b Okay, that's fine.
Speaker 5 (24:47):
The program is being abused on a massive scale.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
I think the biggest challenge to me is, let's presume
that what President Trump is saying is true and what
our call is or just said is true from ELK Grove, California.
Isn't it a huge indictment of the American educational system
if we aren't producing enough people with so called hard
(25:12):
education skills, which is what our caller was just talking about,
doing the hard work of going in and getting a
advanced engineering degree. My college roommate Buck went and got
a PhD in economics from Georgetown, super hard field to
get a PhD in He was the only American born
(25:34):
guy in his Georgetown PhD program.
Speaker 4 (25:38):
They were all Asian.
Speaker 1 (25:39):
And I do think this is a failure that I
think ties in with the larger educational environment. If it's
such a great advantage to get elite American academic education,
which I think to a large extent, it still is,
why would we bring in so many people from foreign countries,
train them up, and then.
Speaker 4 (26:00):
Them back to or this is the other, This is
the other, huge, huge part of the argument.
Speaker 5 (26:05):
This was even the case.
Speaker 4 (26:06):
I remember a long time ago visiting an Ivy League
school when I was looking at schools, and the guy
running their electrical engineering department told me that that they
could take three classes of Chinese, of only Chinese students
for electrical engineering with perfect you know, perfect boards, perfect testing,
And he said that there's some concern they weren't really
(26:26):
all in on the some concern that may.
Speaker 5 (26:28):
Not be a good idea.
Speaker 4 (26:29):
So yeah, one of the reasons I might add that
they still take Americans in a lot of these schools
is legacy and donation. That's why there's a lot of
That's a big that's a big argue.
Speaker 1 (26:38):
You with me there that if there are all these
great jobs in America you mentioned seven hundred and fifty
thousand of them that require incredible educations, why isn't the
United States producing those people?
Speaker 4 (26:52):
Look, I'm all, but this is I think that's not true.
Is the I think so overwhelmed. I think that if
you were to really dig into this, I'm throwing out
a number here, but based on everything I've read, and
I've read about this pretty extensively, ten to twenty percent
max of the H one B program as it exists
now is within the realm of what it's actually meant
(27:13):
to be. The rest of it is people who are
hiring for lower wages. You have less bargaining power because
you're tied to the company that you are working for.
Speaker 5 (27:20):
Oh, by the way, you also get to.
Speaker 4 (27:22):
Sponsor your family and bring them over here, and then
you get to try to get a green card. And
if you get a green card, guess what then you
can try chain migration and sponsor everybody else too. There
are huge American concerns and interests in this program that
go beyond the quarterly stock statements of whatever the company
is that is putting these people forward. Right, So that's
(27:45):
the part of this that people have started to hone
in on.
Speaker 1 (27:47):
Well, the one thing I will say is at least
these immigrants have substantial skills, whereas if we're going to
be bringing in a huge immigrant population. One of the
things that I think I've reading about that kind of
stunned me, and I bet a lot of you didn't
know this data either, is the number of immigrants we
bring in that immediately go on snap.
Speaker 4 (28:09):
Like that's a record scratch moment for me.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
Right, We're bringing in people who can't afford to feed themselves,
and you and me and all American taxpayers are bringing
in foreign residents.
Speaker 4 (28:19):
Now intentionally, I'm not talking about it. That's a violation
of immigration policy. We are you are not. This is
very clear in existing statute. You are not allowed to
be in this country and be on any form of
public assistance whatsoever. Millions and millions, tens of millions of
legal and illegal immigrants are and people are waking up
to the scam. You want to talk about affordability. Let's
(28:42):
say there are fifteen million, and by the way, I
know that's low. Okay, I know that's low. But let's
say there are fifteen million illegals in this country. They
live somewhere, they live in houses. Maybe they're you know,
doubling and tripling up in some cases with that whatever.
But you want to talk about a housing crunch and
the ways that things would move markets for people that
(29:05):
are having a tough time affording a place. You have
fifteen million people in the country who are by the way,
they're not paying they're not paying income tax, so you
start to look at the goods and services that they
are going to consume just by being here, versus the
output in many cases, Clay, this is why the more
you pull out this, the more it's just been a
massive scam. The elites have sold out the American people,
(29:27):
and a lot the American people, all Americans. And that
is the part of this that I think is really
both it's critical to deal with, but also it's shocking
and saddening that this has happened in this country, that
we've been taking advantage of in this way, and Trump
is supposed to stop it.
Speaker 8 (29:47):
Now.
Speaker 4 (29:48):
He's taken some big steps, but there's a lot more
to do. Here's the scary part. And we'll take some
more of your calls. Eight hundred and two two two
eight A two.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
I want people who have had experience with H one
VV says, I want to hear your perspectives out there
in the audience. AI may make the H one B
visa argument us just seem like it's so when you
look at the number of jobs that are going to
be eliminated, the idea that these jobs even exist, I think,
(30:17):
I think a lot of these H one B jobs
are going to vanish as.
Speaker 4 (30:20):
A part of AI too, which learned to code was
actually terrible advice because coding is about to Coding is
about to be a thing that you know. You know
when typing was a really unique skill. You remember we
learned typing class when I was in grammar school. I
was like, why don't you have to learn how to type?
What a waste of time? It turns out being able
to type pretty important. But everyone can do it. Now
coding is about to become a lot easier. It's going
(30:41):
to be like operating an iPhone today instead of operating
like a daw System computer in nineteen ninety and but
klay another thing on the H one B. Seventy five
percent of H one B visas in recent years come
from India, seventy five percent. There's over two hundred counts
in the world. This is really about. India is the
(31:02):
only place that's you know, you start to pull out
this too, what's going on there.
Speaker 5 (31:07):
There's a bit of a cartel effect happening.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
I think this is there's so many different angles to examine.
The one that frustrates me the most is there are
great jobs that, according to this argument, American educational institutions
are not producing enough of.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
Well.
Speaker 4 (31:24):
Well, and maybe part of the problem is, you know,
while we're paying NBA players thirty million, forty million dollars
a year, I don't even know some of these NBA players.
They're making this kind of money because they're in a
global marketplace for media. Right, you turn around, you say, well,
we need super geniuses coming out of you know, we
need the NBA equivalent in terms of skill set coming
out of our universities. Well, maybe we need to pay
(31:45):
them a lot more, and maybe our society needs to
get a little more attuned to we actually need people
who can do some of these things making a lot
of money. Look at what the money clay they've been
throwing around for AI recently. Crazy is astonished. But I
have no problem with it because you know what it's.
Speaker 1 (32:03):
Really important well, and also it's the ultimate meritocracy, right
There are relatively few people with incredible talents, and if
you have those talents, you can be paid a superstar
salary on a level frankly that has never occurred before.
And again, I just I want kids to be I
(32:23):
love that caller because he was kind of making fun
of the liberal arts grads.
Speaker 4 (32:27):
But you know the number of people that go to
elite schools.
Speaker 1 (32:31):
And I'm not trying to take a shot at this,
but go to elite schools and major in gender studies
and you come out and you're twenty two and you're like, hey,
I went to I don't know, I went to Northwestern
and I got a gender studies degree. And I'm looking
around like the parents, you spent four hundred k so
your kid could get a gender studies degree at Northwestern?
Speaker 4 (32:51):
It's a joe, what do you do? The whole system
is well, I mean Clay even I I got into
Columbia Business School in New York City, which was like,
oh my gosh, I can go to Columbia Business Goal.
This is fantastic. I'll get my MBA. Glenn Beck convinced
me to get in a media instead. Top five decisions
I've ever made, you know, number one marrying my wife,
and then like this is probably number three four. I
(33:12):
don't know. I'd have to think about this, but at
the time people thought I was nuts, Well, you're not
going to get an Ivy League MNBA.
Speaker 5 (33:19):
Why aren't you going to do that?
Speaker 4 (33:20):
That's such a ticket to Actually not always No, this
was much better. This is a lot more fun. I
didn't think I'd get to sit here and hang out
with you for fifteen hours a week and look how
it all happened.
Speaker 2 (33:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:30):
Look, this is part of a big picture discussion. We'll
take some of your calls. I think it's not an
easy answer, but it is something that I think many
of you are grappling with as you contemplate the rapid
evolution that is going to occur with AI, with high
tech jobs and with the people that are going to
fill them, and how those jobs are filled.
Speaker 5 (33:51):
Look.
Speaker 1 (33:52):
I love Cozy Earth. I absolutely love this product. I
slept and sleep in their sheets, and I was thinking
about this. You ever get in your bed and the
temperature is such that if you have one big cover on,
you get too warm, and you don't have enough on,
(34:12):
then you get too cold. I was just sleeping under
my Cozy Earth sheets the other night. They were absolutely perfect.
Somehow they are adjusting for my temperature. I didn't have
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And so I'm telling you right now we are what
less than six weeks I believe from Christmas. Bucks already
got his Christmas gifts. I got all my Christmas gifts
for my family in New York. Cozy Earth everything, Clay, sheets, blankets, TLEs,
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Speaker 6 (35:16):
Sometimes all you can do is laugh, and they do
a lot of it with the Sunday Hang.
Speaker 3 (35:22):
Join Clay and Buck as they.
Speaker 6 (35:24):
Laugh it up in the Clay and Buck podcast feed
on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 5 (35:30):
Welcome back in to Clay and Buck. Coming up in
a few minutes.
Speaker 4 (35:33):
Here we'll have Uncle Bill Bill O'Reilly, a huge bestselling
author commentator. You all know Bill oiley latest book Confronting Evil,
assessing the worst of the worst. And to that, I
would put people who speak on speakerphone in restaurants and
other crowded public places the worst of the worst. Clay,
(35:56):
what say you?
Speaker 1 (35:57):
I speak on speakerphone sometime, No, but I have trouble
sometimes hearing the phone. The whole the concept of using
a phone to make a phone call has basically vanished.
I can get on and you know, buy anything on
the planet and get on the internet and be great.
(36:18):
The phone basically doesn't work for me to have an
actual conversation on it anymore. So sometimes like I go
on speakerphone, not so much in public. But if I'm
like driving around in the car trying to talk to
somebody because otherwise I can't hear anything, the phone doesn't
exist to actually have conversations anymore.
Speaker 4 (36:36):
It's kind of crazy, well, that I'm sitting here defending
civilization while Clay is just helping it crumble with his
Speakerphone use in public around other human beings play, they
have to listen. Sometimes I have really interesting conversations.
O welcome in appreciate all of you as we roll
through the Thursday edition of the program. Rejoice, the government
is back open. Last night, President Trump at ten twenty
four pm Eastern officially signed the bill, put on his
desk from the House, and we are now back up
(00:21):
and running. And let's go ahead and take you into
that evening event. If if you missed it, as many
of you may have already been in bed, or you
may not have been paying attention. Here is what Trump
said last night, sitting at the Resolute desk in the
Oval Office as he officially began the process of opening
the government by signing the bill Cut three.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
I just want to tell you the country has never
been in better shape. We went through this short term
disaster with the Democrats because they vote it would be
good politically, and it's an honor now to sign this
incredible bill and get our country working again.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
One more thing, Bucky also said, for forty three days,
Democrats had no argument. That argument has not changed. This
is cut four.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
For the past forty three days, Democrats in Congress shut
down the government of the United States and an attempt
to extort American taxpayers for hundreds of billions of dollars
for illegal aliens and people that came into our country
illegally from gangs, from.
Speaker 3 (01:30):
Prisons, from mental institutions.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
They wanted to pay them one point five trillion dollars,
which would have really hurt our healthcare businesses and our
recipients and levels never seen before. Today, we're sending a
clear message that we will never give into extortion, because
that's what it was they tried to extort. The Democrats
tried to extort our country.
Speaker 1 (01:51):
Okay, So I think the number one question most people have,
including myself, and I'm curious how you would break this
down in terms of the likelihood, is what is going
to come next?
Speaker 4 (02:00):
Buck?
Speaker 1 (02:01):
Is I'm glad that we are now back open. The
Democrats gained absolutely nothing. They seem to have made this
choice despite the fact that there was no benefit to
them at all. Why will they not just do this again,
maybe multiple times in twenty twenty six as we come
up on the midterm elections. That's question one for you, Buck,
(02:23):
and I think for everybody out there too. And the
second part here, I don't understand why we can't modify
the filibuster in this particular fashion where we don't allow
the minority party to shut down the government just over
having basically a tantrum. My concern is, yes, Democrats have
(02:45):
recognized after forty three days, hey, we didn't gain anything.
Trump's not gonna bend, but they may still believe that
they gained politically. So my concern is why would they
not do this potentially multiple times in the upcoming year
with the election cycle.
Speaker 4 (03:01):
Well, I think that the midterm is going to be
something of people over use the term referendum. Right, First
of all, what is it? You know, what does a
referendum really mean? A lot of people don't know how.
Speaker 5 (03:13):
Much of a referendum it would it would be.
Speaker 4 (03:15):
But I think the midterms will factor into the assessment
of whether this kind of tactic is effective or not
because a lot of the narrative is going to be
built off of this, Right, There's going to be a
lot of posturing about how we fought, we stood up
to Trump, and I think they'll see this as an
opening to talk about healthcare, the problem Democrats have, and
(03:37):
this is getting really deep into it and Clay, this
feels like something that has been building for a long time,
because again, I started talking about politics for a living
Right around it was the Tea party era, right around
when Obamacare was the thing. Right, Obamacare was the big
fight in this country politically at how it was, how long,
(04:01):
how far back we're going now, we're talking fifteen years.
And they managed to with the obvious advantages they had
in the media and the whole apparatus around Obama himself
and the worship and everything, they managed to both roll
out the good ease, Oh you can be on your parents' plan.
Oh we're going to expand coverage. Oh we're gonna make
(04:23):
mental health and physical health give it parody and all this,
all these things if people go, oh, well, that sounds
kind of good. With this promise of you're gonna keep
your doctor, it's going to bring down costs, it's going
to make the health care system more efficient, all of
that is a total failure. In fact, it's worse than
a failure because it went in the other direction. It
made you know, it's one thing to not achieve your goal,
(04:45):
it's another thing to make it worse. If I was
giving somebody, you know, special diet cookies and they didn't
lose weight, that's bad. If they gained fifty pounds, that's
even worse. That's what the Obama care bill has actually done.
And I think that healthcare is going to be a
big part of what the mid terms because healthcare goes
right into affordability. You're gonna hear that word affordability. I
(05:06):
might add, ad nauseum. You're all gonna get sick of it.
We're all gonna get sick of talking about it. But
it matters is this. This is the new version of
kitchen table economic issues. So clay about the shutdown, I
think it's the beginning phase of Democrats trying to convince
the American people enough of them that they can regain power. Remember,
they're not trying to gain they're not trying to convince you,
(05:27):
me or this audience. But they're trying to regain power
through convincing enough Americans that they stand against They stand
against Trump. That's point one, no matter what that means,
we stand against Trump, yes, no kings. And point two,
we're going to make your life style more affordable. Somehow,
I think that's gonna be the whole, the whole thing.
(05:49):
They don't want to say, we're gonna kick open the
borders and let criminals run wild on the streets.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
That was kind of a loser for them in twenty four.
That wasn't a good That wasn't a good take. But
I still think they're gonna do it again. And so
if you're out there and you're saying, what are the
consequences for Democrats doing this? Yes they have an internal
civil war, Yes Chuck Schumer is under siege, but I
(06:13):
don't know that they actually lost anything. And if anything,
I think there's an incentive to try this again, which
is why I would solve this. And I'm saying this
on behalf of Republicans who may be the minority party again.
Almost certainly at some point in the next decade, Republicans
won't have control of the Senate. Why in the world
(06:38):
would we not put in place procedures to stop this
from happening, Because leave aside the temper tantrum aspect of it,
I'm concerned. And I know you talked about this in
air traffic control error that led to the deadliest plane
crash if I remember, was it in Brazil. You were
talking about buck where five hundred people died when planes
(07:02):
when two planes collided. My concern is we created a
situation where that could happen in the United States when
all the air traffic control guys and gals are not
getting paid what they should have gotten paid. They're not
getting their paychecks, and we started to have to restrict
the amount of flow of airplanes all over the country,
(07:23):
and so many of you got caught up in the chaos.
We could have had a real disaster there. That's the
area I would argue of our federal government that is
most important given the consequences of being wrong. In fact,
I know you're a big fan of this show too.
Remember one of the seasons of Breaking Bad actually opens
(07:44):
with an air traffic controller losing track of what's going
on and allowing two planes to collide in the air.
For those of you out there that are also big
Breaking Bad fans, but I don't understand why we have
allowed this process to occur and why we would continue
to allow it to occur. To me, if we modified
(08:05):
the filibuster when it comes to Supreme Court appointments, then
why in the world would we not modify the filibuster
to stop the minority party from effectively throwing a temper
tantrum and shutting down the government like this? That to
me seems like an easy resolution going forward.
Speaker 4 (08:23):
There there was a lot of talk from Trump about
getting rid of the filibuster.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
And then they're getting rid of the whole philibuster block
is a step too far.
Speaker 4 (08:33):
But this is to me, would it makes sense. This
is what I'm gonna say, is that this is the
halfway measure is well on this one, On this one,
we are going to change the rule now. To be
fair and to be clear, Harry Reid did something of
a halfway measure with the judges too, right. It was
for federal judges but not for Supreme Court. And then
(08:54):
when we were in the majority, we were like, you
know what, you're gonna play that game. We're gonna play
that game. So there's something of an arms race that
occurs within the Senate procedural rules that we will be
engaging in here. But if you want Trump to be
able to have a functional government and not just allow
Democrats to throw tantrums like this, then I think that
(09:17):
this then I think it makes a lot of sense
to do. We just have to understand that there will
be a cost, there will be a consequence on the
other side at some point. I do think there's understanding
already Clay among Republicans and among the Trump faithful, among
all the Trump voters out there. Democrats will be back
in power at some point. You know, the triumphalism of
(09:38):
the first six months, because it felt like such a
sound and resounding defeat of Kamala and the forces of
evil also known as Democrats, that has given way a
little bit too. Oh wow, they can still make people
like Spamberger win in Virginia. Kamala was closer than we think,
(10:00):
as awful as she was, and that's what I always
like to remind people of. They almost won with kamalaw
and they did win. I know, the Shenanigans, but they
did win with a dementia patient and Joe Bias. So
there's a lot of Democrats out there everybody, and a
very powerful machinery around them. So we need to be
prepared not just for this midterm, but get ready for
what things are going to look like if and when
(10:21):
they take power again. All right, you want to set
up this conversation.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
Let's go ahead, because we talked about it yesterday the
H one B visas and some of you may have
strong opinions. In fact, I'll open up the phone lines
on this eight hundred and two A two two eight
A two for people who have used H one B
visas before business owners management, I would be interested in
(10:46):
hearing your experience. I candidly have not ever as a
business owner, been involved in anything involving these visas. But
there was a significant discussion between more Ingram who is
very opposed to these, and President Trump, who in general
has been in favor of them. And you mentioned yesterday,
(11:08):
Buck that this kind of blew up. It was during
Christmas break, if I remember correctly, the Vike Ramaswami stepped
into the H one B VisAD discussion on social media
and he hasn't even been that active. Viveke hasn't on
social media buy and large since.
Speaker 5 (11:25):
Look, you know I was.
Speaker 4 (11:28):
I've talked to Vike Vike a little bit in the past.
I was very skeptical of his run because to me,
it felt like it was just for attention in brand building,
and it was successful in that regard. But I liked
a lot of what he said, and I think a
lot of what he said was in earnest. That tweet
was one of the worst self destructive tweets I've ever
seen a Republican politician put out in my life because
(11:51):
it really it really was like a swipe at America
and it felt like it was something he really believed.
And that is not good. H And by the way,
you know his opponent and the Democrat opponent in Ohio.
What do you think the first thing that she's attacking
him with already on that is, I do think the
Aarica doesn't have a culture of excellence. Where do they
(12:13):
have a culture of excellence? Vivic explain that one to
Clay one of the worst tweets I've ever seen. I mean,
not as bad as writing a memoir about shooting your dog,
but but bad.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
Batch We will positive is Vivik appears to be on
track to win Ohio comfortably, which would be important, and
I do think he would be a good governor. But
when we come back, I want to hear I phone
lines are open eight hundred and two two two eight
A two. I'm not wanting your opinion on this if
you haven't interacted or used these I want people out
(12:48):
there in our audience who have used the H one
B visas we're going to dive into this. We'll talk
about it some during the course of this hour. We
also are going to be joined by our friend Bill.
Speaker 4 (13:00):
O'Reilly at the top of the next hour much to discuss,
including Bill O'Reilly. Didn't he say this? He's totally wrong
on this.
Speaker 1 (13:08):
We'll have to tell him that Gavin Newsom has no
political future in the Democrat Party basically as a president.
Speaker 4 (13:14):
We may tag team Uncle Bill on this one, Clay,
but just remember he's got old man strength.
Speaker 1 (13:20):
You know that is certainly true. I' getting to be
an old man. I think I'm starting to have some
old man strength.
Speaker 4 (13:24):
But what is it about You reach an age and
the grip, the grip strength that you have is like terrifying,
you know all you're like.
Speaker 1 (13:31):
Just it's like when people used to say that somebody
was farm strong. It's like you have lived a life
where you if you are physically active, it's carrying around kids,
it's dragging the chairs to the beach. It's just all
of the non gem related muscle musculature.
Speaker 4 (13:49):
It adds up to what it's like. I don't think
Uncle Bill would be be great at deadlifting, but I
think he could probably crack a billiard ball in his
left hand, like no problem. So we'll talk about this.
But h one b one. You guys loaded lines. I
can already see. Poor producer, Greg. I only want people
who have experienced it, not your opinion on this. I
(14:11):
want to hear from people that have actually used these.
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Speaker 6 (15:13):
Making America great again isn't just one man, It's many.
The team forty seven podcast Sunday's at noon Eastern in
the Clay and Buck podcast feed. Find it on the
iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 4 (15:27):
All right, welcome back into Clay and Buck. We're going
to have a discussion that we meant to have yesterday,
but we just ran out of time because we had
so much going on the show.
Speaker 5 (15:35):
It has to do with H one B visas.
Speaker 4 (15:39):
Okay, and H one B visas are very contentious for
a whole bunch of reasons. We're going to get into,
but I want to start with this President Trump. Laura
Ingram did a really good interview on Fox News President
Trump and President Trump was talking about this issue, and
I think that it was a little people take out
(16:03):
of context, or rather aren't understanding the full context of
what Trump is saying. We'll get into this, but first,
this is the clip we do have time for, let's
play at twenty seven.
Speaker 7 (16:11):
Does that mean the H one B visa thing will
not be a big priority for your administration because if
you want to raise wages for American workers, you can't
flood the country with tens of thousands or hundreds of And.
Speaker 3 (16:22):
We also do have to bring in talent when we come.
Speaker 7 (16:25):
Of talent and you know, you don't know, you don't
we don't have talent.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
Now you don't have you don't have certain talents, and
you have to people have to learn.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
You can't take people off an unemployed like.
Speaker 2 (16:35):
An unemployment line and say I'm going to put you
into a factory.
Speaker 3 (16:38):
We're going to make missiles or I'm going.
Speaker 4 (16:40):
To how do we ever do it? Before? Well, you
and I.
Speaker 3 (16:42):
I'll give you an example.
Speaker 2 (16:43):
In Georgia, they rated because they wanted illegal immigrants.
Speaker 3 (16:48):
They had people from from South.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
Korea that need batteries all their lives. You know, making
batteries are very complicated.
Speaker 3 (16:55):
It's not an.
Speaker 2 (16:55):
Easy thing and very dangerous, a lot of explosions, a
lot of problems. They had like five or six hundred
people early stages to make batteries and to teach people
how to do it.
Speaker 3 (17:06):
Well, they wanted them to get out of the country.
You're gonna need that, Laura. I mean, I know you
and I disagree on this.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
You can't just say a country's coming in, going to
invest ten billion dollars to build a plant and going
to take people off an unemployment line who haven't worked
in five years, and they're going to start making missiles.
Speaker 3 (17:23):
It doesn't work that way.
Speaker 4 (17:25):
Okay, Clay, this is very important. We'll get into this
because there has been some further explanation of it. Some
people were a little upset with the President said what
he's saying is true in context of what he's what
he's will explain in a minute. But just you asked
a really important question that I think sets the stage
for this really Well. They always say, well, there's only
sixty five thousand, h one b's a year, that's how
(17:46):
many new ones are given. There are three quarters of
a million h one B workers in America right now,
seven hundred and fifty thousand, give or take. No matter
how safe you think your neighborhood is always the chance
you'll be the victim of a home intrusion, a burglary,
a home invasion, and it's happening across the country.
Speaker 5 (18:06):
You just want to be prepared for this.
Speaker 4 (18:07):
Hopefully if never is something you have to think about,
but it is something you have to be prepared for.
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Speaker 1 (18:57):
Welcome back in Clay Travis buck Sexton Show.
Speaker 4 (19:01):
We appreciate all of you hanging out with us. All right.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
We just laid out a little bit of the details.
We played you the cut of Laura Ingram, who disagrees
with President Trump on this issue. There's a cap of
roughly eighty five thousand a year, but as Buck pointed out,
these can be multi year contracts that are brought in
the so called H one B visas for people with
(19:24):
special skills, they are brought into the country there. Now,
I believe Buck, under Trump is ae hundred thousand dollars
tax per H one B that is being introduced. And
these are supposedly jobs that are super skilled and difficult
to find Americans that they can do. And we got
(19:47):
a bunch of you. I actually want to hear from
some of you. Let's start with Dave in Elk Grove, California.
You are a small business owner and you sponsored two
people come here. Give us a rough idea of why
that was necessary and what your take is on the
H one B debate.
Speaker 8 (20:09):
Okay, so structural engineers, it's highly technical, takes great skills
in maths, physics, science. I'll put it in a sports analogy.
If you're putting a team together and you want to win,
you're going to draft the best players you can find
from wherever they're born on the plant. Okay to oppose
this program to me as opposing the meritocracy. Honestly, Sonya.
(20:32):
It worked out great. Sponsored one individual from Kenya, another
from Turkey, brought them on board, both PhD folks tremendous
assets contributed company, and I want to say too, we
paid them on par or more than others in the
firm because of their qualifications, so straight up it went. Also,
(20:54):
then they sponsored them through the legal process so that
they could become legal residents on the paths of citizenship.
It was a win win.
Speaker 1 (21:02):
So because you're a Trump I assume you're a Trump voter,
so this is something you would agree with the president on,
not with Laura Ingram and others. Let me ask you this,
These are people that, in your opinion, they had a
skill set from these foreign countries. You could not find
Americans to do the job that you hired these individuals for.
(21:23):
Because sometimes the counter argument is you're paying less. I
don't mean you specifically, but people who get h one
b's are paying less to foreign workers because they're desperate
to come to America instead of otherwise hiring qualified Americans.
Is that not an accurate attack in your mind based
on what you have seen in this program.
Speaker 8 (21:45):
Absolutely, the talent pool in this highly technical world, it's
so thin. You have to reach out and get the
best talent available wherever you can find it. It's not
like you're going to roll out of bed and become
an engineer. Okay. When I was in school, we make
fun of the liberal arts major just because you know,
five units for a class where I did you know
true false questions versus a reunit class and statics where
(22:08):
he failed it. You were out. I mean, it's just
it's night and day.
Speaker 4 (22:14):
Okay, thank you for the call. I mean, this is
this is so, this is where this gets a little tricky.
I'll just say that you're going. We can tell. We'll
take calls on both sides of this. I know and
I know people personally who fall on both sides of
this debate. They'll do some thing. Oh I hired, you know,
someone to do coding work from Georgia, the country, not
(22:35):
the state, and they were fantastic. Or I hired somebody
to and and I couldn't find anybody in it. Okay,
well but someone has to explain to me then a
few things. First of all, I mean, you can go
and find the Economic Policy Institute, for examples, one place
you can find all these different studies that show H
and B workers in the same role are making twenty
(22:56):
to thirty percent less than American American competitors. Okay, so that's.
Speaker 5 (23:04):
We need we need to figure out whether this is
true or not.
Speaker 4 (23:06):
I mean, if you do a simple search on this,
people can say, oh, no, we paid you know, we
paid Tony or Akhmed or whatever more than the role would. Okay,
well you can say that for the job that you hired.
But what's actually happening with the seven hundred and fifty
thousand H one B workers across the country. Also, why
are so many H one B workers from one country,
(23:27):
which is India. That's I think an interesting story in
and of itself. There's a lot of countries out there,
a lot of places that you would think would be
turning out so called talent. And remember it's supposed to
be talent that you can't that is not capable of
being found here in the marketplace. There are three hundred
and forty million Americans and god knows how many illegals.
(23:49):
You're you gonna tell me that there's no one who
can do these jobs here there's a million people that
are doing right now. To the point that Trump was
making play, I was at TSMC and tay one very
interestant time wand Trip. I've talked about it a lot.
Do we have the know how to run a fab
a fabrication facility for microchips at the level that TSMC
(24:11):
does with the current US work for No, we don't,
and that's very important. But they're changing that, and that's
what Trump was trying to talk about. I think what
people what bothers people is when Amazon is hiring h
one bs to do menial coding work or to do
phone bank stuff or you know whatever in a customer
(24:33):
service because they're cheaper and they're undercutting American workers. And
that is happening. So one individual story about oh but
I found this great h one b Okay, that's fine.
Speaker 5 (24:47):
The program is being abused on a massive scale.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
I think the biggest challenge to me is, let's presume
that what President Trump is saying is true and what
our call is or just said is true from ELK Grove, California.
Isn't it a huge indictment of the American educational system
if we aren't producing enough people with so called hard
(25:12):
education skills, which is what our caller was just talking about,
doing the hard work of going in and getting a
advanced engineering degree. My college roommate Buck went and got
a PhD in economics from Georgetown, super hard field to
get a PhD in He was the only American born
(25:34):
guy in his Georgetown PhD program.
Speaker 4 (25:38):
They were all Asian.
Speaker 1 (25:39):
And I do think this is a failure that I
think ties in with the larger educational environment. If it's
such a great advantage to get elite American academic education,
which I think to a large extent, it still is,
why would we bring in so many people from foreign countries,
train them up, and then.
Speaker 4 (26:00):
Them back to or this is the other, This is
the other, huge, huge part of the argument.
Speaker 5 (26:05):
This was even the case.
Speaker 4 (26:06):
I remember a long time ago visiting an Ivy League
school when I was looking at schools, and the guy
running their electrical engineering department told me that that they
could take three classes of Chinese, of only Chinese students
for electrical engineering with perfect you know, perfect boards, perfect testing,
And he said that there's some concern they weren't really
(26:26):
all in on the some concern that may.
Speaker 5 (26:28):
Not be a good idea.
Speaker 4 (26:29):
So yeah, one of the reasons I might add that
they still take Americans in a lot of these schools
is legacy and donation. That's why there's a lot of
That's a big that's a big argue.
Speaker 1 (26:38):
You with me there that if there are all these
great jobs in America you mentioned seven hundred and fifty
thousand of them that require incredible educations, why isn't the
United States producing those people?
Speaker 4 (26:52):
Look, I'm all, but this is I think that's not true.
Is the I think so overwhelmed. I think that if
you were to really dig into this, I'm throwing out
a number here, but based on everything I've read, and
I've read about this pretty extensively, ten to twenty percent
max of the H one B program as it exists
now is within the realm of what it's actually meant
(27:13):
to be. The rest of it is people who are
hiring for lower wages. You have less bargaining power because
you're tied to the company that you are working for.
Speaker 5 (27:20):
Oh, by the way, you also get to.
Speaker 4 (27:22):
Sponsor your family and bring them over here, and then
you get to try to get a green card. And
if you get a green card, guess what then you
can try chain migration and sponsor everybody else too. There
are huge American concerns and interests in this program that
go beyond the quarterly stock statements of whatever the company
is that is putting these people forward. Right, So that's
(27:45):
the part of this that people have started to hone
in on.
Speaker 1 (27:47):
Well, the one thing I will say is at least
these immigrants have substantial skills, whereas if we're going to
be bringing in a huge immigrant population. One of the
things that I think I've reading about that kind of
stunned me, and I bet a lot of you didn't
know this data either, is the number of immigrants we
bring in that immediately go on snap.
Speaker 4 (28:09):
Like that's a record scratch moment for me.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
Right, We're bringing in people who can't afford to feed themselves,
and you and me and all American taxpayers are bringing
in foreign residents.
Speaker 4 (28:19):
Now intentionally, I'm not talking about it. That's a violation
of immigration policy. We are you are not. This is
very clear in existing statute. You are not allowed to
be in this country and be on any form of
public assistance whatsoever. Millions and millions, tens of millions of
legal and illegal immigrants are and people are waking up
to the scam. You want to talk about affordability. Let's
(28:42):
say there are fifteen million, and by the way, I
know that's low. Okay, I know that's low. But let's
say there are fifteen million illegals in this country. They
live somewhere, they live in houses. Maybe they're you know,
doubling and tripling up in some cases with that whatever.
But you want to talk about a housing crunch and
the ways that things would move markets for people that
(29:05):
are having a tough time affording a place. You have
fifteen million people in the country who are by the way,
they're not paying they're not paying income tax, so you
start to look at the goods and services that they
are going to consume just by being here, versus the
output in many cases, Clay, this is why the more
you pull out this, the more it's just been a
massive scam. The elites have sold out the American people,
(29:27):
and a lot the American people, all Americans. And that
is the part of this that I think is really
both it's critical to deal with, but also it's shocking
and saddening that this has happened in this country, that
we've been taking advantage of in this way, and Trump
is supposed to stop it.
Speaker 8 (29:47):
Now.
Speaker 4 (29:48):
He's taken some big steps, but there's a lot more
to do. Here's the scary part. And we'll take some
more of your calls. Eight hundred and two two two
eight A two.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
I want people who have had experience with H one
VV says, I want to hear your perspectives out there
in the audience. AI may make the H one B
visa argument us just seem like it's so when you
look at the number of jobs that are going to
be eliminated, the idea that these jobs even exist, I think,
(30:17):
I think a lot of these H one B jobs
are going to vanish as.
Speaker 4 (30:20):
A part of AI too, which learned to code was
actually terrible advice because coding is about to Coding is
about to be a thing that you know. You know
when typing was a really unique skill. You remember we
learned typing class when I was in grammar school. I
was like, why don't you have to learn how to type?
What a waste of time? It turns out being able
to type pretty important. But everyone can do it. Now
coding is about to become a lot easier. It's going
(30:41):
to be like operating an iPhone today instead of operating
like a daw System computer in nineteen ninety and but
klay another thing on the H one B. Seventy five
percent of H one B visas in recent years come
from India, seventy five percent. There's over two hundred counts
in the world. This is really about. India is the
(31:02):
only place that's you know, you start to pull out
this too, what's going on there.
Speaker 5 (31:07):
There's a bit of a cartel effect happening.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
I think this is there's so many different angles to examine.
The one that frustrates me the most is there are
great jobs that, according to this argument, American educational institutions
are not producing enough of.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
Well.
Speaker 4 (31:24):
Well, and maybe part of the problem is, you know,
while we're paying NBA players thirty million, forty million dollars
a year, I don't even know some of these NBA players.
They're making this kind of money because they're in a
global marketplace for media. Right, you turn around, you say, well,
we need super geniuses coming out of you know, we
need the NBA equivalent in terms of skill set coming
out of our universities. Well, maybe we need to pay
(31:45):
them a lot more, and maybe our society needs to
get a little more attuned to we actually need people
who can do some of these things making a lot
of money. Look at what the money clay they've been
throwing around for AI recently. Crazy is astonished. But I
have no problem with it because you know what it's.
Speaker 1 (32:03):
Really important well, and also it's the ultimate meritocracy, right
There are relatively few people with incredible talents, and if
you have those talents, you can be paid a superstar
salary on a level frankly that has never occurred before.
And again, I just I want kids to be I
(32:23):
love that caller because he was kind of making fun
of the liberal arts grads.
Speaker 4 (32:27):
But you know the number of people that go to
elite schools.
Speaker 1 (32:31):
And I'm not trying to take a shot at this,
but go to elite schools and major in gender studies
and you come out and you're twenty two and you're like, hey,
I went to I don't know, I went to Northwestern
and I got a gender studies degree. And I'm looking
around like the parents, you spent four hundred k so
your kid could get a gender studies degree at Northwestern?
Speaker 4 (32:51):
It's a joe, what do you do? The whole system
is well, I mean Clay even I I got into
Columbia Business School in New York City, which was like,
oh my gosh, I can go to Columbia Business Goal.
This is fantastic. I'll get my MBA. Glenn Beck convinced
me to get in a media instead. Top five decisions
I've ever made, you know, number one marrying my wife,
and then like this is probably number three four. I
(33:12):
don't know. I'd have to think about this, but at
the time people thought I was nuts, Well, you're not
going to get an Ivy League MNBA.
Speaker 5 (33:19):
Why aren't you going to do that?
Speaker 4 (33:20):
That's such a ticket to Actually not always No, this
was much better. This is a lot more fun. I
didn't think I'd get to sit here and hang out
with you for fifteen hours a week and look how
it all happened.
Speaker 2 (33:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:30):
Look, this is part of a big picture discussion. We'll
take some of your calls. I think it's not an
easy answer, but it is something that I think many
of you are grappling with as you contemplate the rapid
evolution that is going to occur with AI, with high
tech jobs and with the people that are going to
fill them, and how those jobs are filled.
Speaker 5 (33:51):
Look.
Speaker 1 (33:52):
I love Cozy Earth. I absolutely love this product. I
slept and sleep in their sheets, and I was thinking
about this. You ever get in your bed and the
temperature is such that if you have one big cover on,
you get too warm, and you don't have enough on,
(34:12):
then you get too cold. I was just sleeping under
my Cozy Earth sheets the other night. They were absolutely perfect.
Somehow they are adjusting for my temperature. I didn't have
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is an incredible company with so many different awesome offerings.
(34:33):
And so I'm telling you right now we are what
less than six weeks I believe from Christmas. Bucks already
got his Christmas gifts. I got all my Christmas gifts
for my family in New York. Cozy Earth everything, Clay, sheets, blankets, TLEs,
pajama sets, All done, all done, Thank you.
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That's right.
Speaker 1 (34:52):
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Check them out today. You're gonna love these products.
Speaker 6 (35:16):
Sometimes all you can do is laugh, and they do
a lot of it with the Sunday Hang.
Speaker 3 (35:22):
Join Clay and Buck as they.
Speaker 6 (35:24):
Laugh it up in the Clay and Buck podcast feed
on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 5 (35:30):
Welcome back in to Clay and Buck. Coming up in
a few minutes.
Speaker 4 (35:33):
Here we'll have Uncle Bill Bill O'Reilly, a huge bestselling
author commentator. You all know Bill oiley latest book Confronting Evil,
assessing the worst of the worst. And to that, I
would put people who speak on speakerphone in restaurants and
other crowded public places the worst of the worst. Clay,
(35:56):
what say you?
Speaker 1 (35:57):
I speak on speakerphone sometime, No, but I have trouble
sometimes hearing the phone. The whole the concept of using
a phone to make a phone call has basically vanished.
I can get on and you know, buy anything on
the planet and get on the internet and be great.
(36:18):
The phone basically doesn't work for me to have an
actual conversation on it anymore. So sometimes like I go
on speakerphone, not so much in public. But if I'm
like driving around in the car trying to talk to
somebody because otherwise I can't hear anything, the phone doesn't
exist to actually have conversations anymore.
Speaker 4 (36:36):
It's kind of crazy, well, that I'm sitting here defending
civilization while Clay is just helping it crumble with his
Speakerphone use in public around other human beings play, they
have to listen. Sometimes I have really interesting conversations.
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