September 3, 2025 • 36 mins
In Hour 2 of the Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show, the hosts deliver a powerful and provocative discussion centered on free speech, cultural censorship, transgender ideology, and political cowardice, with a strong emphasis on truth-telling in the face of corporate and societal pressure. This hour is a must-listen for audiences interested in cultural commentary, conservative values, and the fight against political correctness.
The segment opens with Clay Travis recounting his personal experience of losing a multi-million-dollar partnership with FanDuel due to his outspoken stance on transgender athletes in women's sports. Despite generating millions in affiliate revenue, FanDuel severed ties with Clay and his company OutKick, citing his views as “too controversial.” This story sets the tone for a broader conversation about corporate censorship, cancel culture, and the economic consequences of speaking truth in media.
The hosts then spotlight Malcolm Gladwell’s recent reversal on the transgender sports debate. Gladwell, once silent on the issue, now publicly admits he was “cowed” into dishonesty and affirms that biological men should not compete in women’s sports. Clay and Buck dissect this shift, debating whether Gladwell’s change is a genuine admission or opportunistic repositioning. They emphasize the importance of intellectual honesty, especially among public figures with influence and financial security.
A major theme throughout the hour is the erosion of free speech, particularly in Western democracies. The hosts discuss the arrest of British comedian Graham Linehan for making jokes about transgender issues, warning that speech policing in the UK is a preview of what the American left would implement if given the chance. They argue that comedy, satire, and dissent must be protected, regardless of political sensitivities.
The conversation also touches on the internal tensions within the LGBTQ+ community, with Buck suggesting that many gay and lesbian individuals are distancing themselves from the transgender movement, especially over issues like child gender surgeries. This segment explores the cultural backlash against radical gender ideology and the growing divide within progressive coalitions.
Clay and Buck further examine the moral responsibility of wealthy individuals to speak out against lies and defend truth. They criticize affluent public figures who remain silent out of fear of losing status or endorsements, asserting that “F-you money” should empower people to be honest.
The hour concludes with a discussion on U.S. foreign policy toward Venezuela, referencing the recent missile strike on a drug-smuggling vessel and the broader implications for Nicolás Maduro’s regime. The hosts highlight how Maduro is officially designated by the U.S. government as a narco-terrorist, likening him to a cartel boss running a failed socialist state. They also touch on the potential impact of regime change on Venezuelan asylum seekers in the U.S., suggesting many would return home if democracy were restored.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome back in Clay Travis buck Sexton Show. We are
having a fantastic Wednesday, no matter even though we have
as many of you probably are dealing with the official
in many ways in the summer kids season. Imagine a
lot of you are getting your kids back to school.
(00:22):
There's a lot of different moving parts. We played for you,
some of the President with the President of Poland in
the Oval Office in the first hour, and Buck, I'll
take you behind the curtain here. I don't know if
I've told this story before, but I'll tell you this
story as we start off the second hour here because
(00:42):
it directly ties in with a clip we're going to
play for you.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
And if you missed the teas.
Speaker 1 (00:47):
Malcolm Gladwell probably I think the most famous non fiction
celebrity author in America. Would you buy into that designation
in terms of book sells, I don't know that anybody
would have sold more copies than him.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
It's him and Michael Lewis probably for our good to
the last twenty years or so, those would be the
two that I think are. I met him in France,
by the way, for the iHeart events, so I actually
met mister Gladwell for the first we shook hands. I mean,
he wouldn't you know, he had no idea who I
was like, hey man, yeah, so yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
So I'm going to play a cut for him. I
imagine a lot of you have read his books. Tipping
Point is probably the most famous, but he's got a
ton of different books, and I think he has a
very popular podcast. So I would bet a huge percentage
of you are familiar with who Malcolm Gladwell is. So
let me take you behind the scenes a little bit here.
I sold my company, out Kick, to Fox in twenty
(01:39):
twenty one. On Super Bowl Sunday twenty twenty one, we
made two million dollars in affiliate revenue for from fan Duel.
That is that Super Bowl Day, the company that I ran,
we and founded. We were one of the top affiliates
(02:01):
in the entire country. So if you were watching Tom
Brady Tampa Bay Buccaneers go up against Patrick Mahomes Kansas
City Chiefs, our company and to a large extent me
made more money than anybody playing in that game. On
sports gambling affiliate referral deals. We were for FanDuel, which
(02:22):
is the biggest sports affiliate company sports gambling company in
the country. We were either their best or second best
affiliate partner in the country. Pat McAfee, who now is
at ESPN, was also wildly profitable for them. We were
their too best at helping to promote and I love
(02:44):
sports gambling obviously. We've got a great relationship with price Picks,
which ties in here with that. We made six seven
million dollars a year on that deal. That was important
for us as a part of the company. Sold the company,
FanDuel said they wouldn't work with me anymore Buck because
I was too outspoken on the trans sports issue. This
(03:09):
is a sports gambling company. They said, Clay is too
controversial because he is saying men should not be competing
in women's sports, and FanDuel is worried about the controversy
that he brings for being so outspoken on that issue.
As a result, FanDuel refused to work with me, and
(03:33):
as a result, refused to work without Kick. So me
merely saying men should not be able to compete in
women's athletics cost the company that I founded and owned
around seven million dollars a year. I don't know how
(03:53):
much money you guys make, but seven million dollars a
year for a media company is a big, huge, huge
part of what allows the company to be profitable, to
employ tons of people. But as a matter of principle,
I said, I'm not going to stop talking about this,
even though FanDuel is saying, well, you're too controversial for
saying this. So the reason why I give you that
(04:16):
backstory is it was, even though it's one hundred percent
the right thing to say, it took hutzba It took
sometimes turning away from millions of dollars to say what
I personally believe to be true and allow the company
to be at the forefront of arguing this.
Speaker 3 (04:37):
Is no, no, no, no, no, no, not you not what
you personally believe to be true, what is undeniably, unequivocably,
obviously and as clear as anything could be true, which
I think is important. You weren't penalized Clay for an opinion.
You were penalized for a fact which as a whole
(04:58):
that is Soviet Union level stuff. That is, everyone who
is starving say the grain harvest is the biggest grain
harvest of all time. That is a manufactured delusion, my friend.
Speaker 1 (05:08):
And if you wonder why did people not step up
against this across all of sports. Only OutKick and really
only me at the forefront of this.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
We're willing to make this argument.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
It's because the big advertising partners out there would grab
you by the you know what and they would squeeze
if you tried to step out a line. This is
the truth. Nobody else will even tell you this. I'm
telling you directly. Okay, Malcolm Gladwell came out. They have
(05:44):
a big sports conference, sports analytics conference at MIT, and
they had a bunch of famous Malcolm Gladwell has a
connection to sports. He's a big sports fan. He's done
sports related reporting and stories, and he and everybody else
on that panel at the I think it's the Sloan
Kettering MIT Institute or whatever, refused to speak out against
(06:10):
men competing in women's sports because the consequences were real.
What I just told you, it could cost your company
millions of dollars, It could cost you personally millions of dollars.
It could impact your employability. They were very targeted in
the way that they attacked here. And now he's come out,
this just happened yesterday, and Malcolm Gladwell says, hey, I
(06:32):
was bullied, I was cowed. I was afraid of the consequences,
and now I'm going to tell you the truth. Men
shouldn't be able to compete in women's sports.
Speaker 4 (06:39):
Listen if we did a replay of that exact panel
at the SLUNG conference this coming March, it runs in
exactly the opposite direction, and it would be I suspect
near unanimity in the room that trans athletes have no
place in the female category. I don't think this is
any I just think it was a strange I mean,
(07:02):
I felt. I mean the reason I'm ashamed of my
performance of that panel because I share your position one
hundred percent and I was count is the idea of
saying anything on this issue. I was in a I
believe in retrospect in a dishonest way. I was. I
was objective in a dishonest way.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
Okay, I give him credit for coming out and being
honest about this. I think this is so incredibly important
because there are consequences. Unfortunately, when you are willing to
speak the truth. I think your qualification is important there.
This is not This is not me arguing what the
(07:42):
tax rate in Moldova should be. And we're sitting around
and we're like, well, you know this.
Speaker 3 (07:46):
Is his dudes are not chicks, and chicks are not dudes,
and pretending they are is a lot. That is what
this is.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
Even in the world of sports.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
It's beyond that buck because you're saying men don't have
a competitive advantage, or you're sitting around you're saying, well
we have to do does.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
No man are bigger, stronger and faster than women.
Speaker 3 (08:04):
But underlying all of it, underlying all of it, and
this has to be remembered, is that trans for example,
and this is usually what we're talking about in the
sports context, trans women are women indistinguishable and to be
treated by society and the law as women, indistinguishable from
women in all respects, even though they're not women. That
is the actual foundational mandatory belief of the trans movement
(08:28):
right is that they transplate what is the phrase trans
women are women? Yeah, this is what they say. Trans
women are women, and that's why they should be able
to play in women's sports. That is a lie.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
I think this is important though, and I see this everywhere,
and people who may not be involved in media, a
lot of you sit around you say, well, how did
this happen? It was if you were willing to speak
out on this issue. Advertiser said, I can't. I won't
work with this person anymore, and I'm talking about a
friggin sports gambling company. You think that it's a coincidence
(09:05):
that that they're, of all companies that should be one
that recognized, hey, men and women's sports is ridiculous. They
actually pushed back and they said, even though you, Clay
and your company have made us tens of millions of dollars,
which we had objective reality you could look at and say, hey,
(09:26):
people love this, they wouldn't spend money with us anymore.
And this is how they control what people say, because
most people are not willing to give up the money.
They just pretend this story didn't exist. It wasn't that
everybody was as outspoken and as Gladwell is saying there,
(09:47):
it was just that a lot of companies just pretended
this didn't happen, or they would say, as they still say, now,
I don't know why you care about that, what you
even care? It doesn't happen that often. It's not that
big of a this is always that, this is always
the progression, right, It's not happening. It's not happening that much.
Why do you care. Okay, it's happening. It's happening a
little bit. Uh to, It's good, it's happening. Shut your face.
(10:10):
We're in charge now.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
And this is this is this was COVID, this is
trans this, this is that is the the slippery slope
of leftism in America today. It has to progressivism, it
has to progress The argument always has to go to
the next level. And it's all based on lies, because
of course it is happening, because they know what's happening,
and they know it's wrong, and they know they want
to do more of it, but they use an incrementalist
(10:33):
strategy to chip away at things. And for Gladwell to
come out now, Clay, yeah, because everything has changed now
now you can say it now you can actually because
people like me spoke out so hard and took the
slings and arrows. I will say Buck, I give him
some credit for acknowledging he was wrong. Because what a
lot of people are gonna do is they're going to
(10:55):
wait another couple of years and they're gonna come they're
gonna say, well, everybody knew this was ridiculous all along,
and an end that they never actually argued otherwise yeah.
I mean that's particularly gross, right, But that will happen.
I think that that is true.
Speaker 1 (11:08):
Five years from now, there will not be a single
man in America who will say I ever thought it
was okay? Oh no, no man pretending to be women were competing.
I disagree with that.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
There will be people, Clay, There are people that will
take this to the very end, and they think that
they can get a rebound with this in time. All
they have to do that. They think that they will
find their way back into power, back into the culture.
Twenty percent of the country is never going to abandon this.
Twenty percent of the country is certifiably insane. I mean
they think that Kamala Harris was a good candidate and
Joe Biden's brain was working.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
These people are nuts. Well, I say this, I mean
people who are actual.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
Sportsmans, right, because I understand on some level, if you stay,
if you don't know anything about sports and you think, like, hey,
maybe Serena Williams is better than Roger Federer at tennis,
maybe they should play and maybe the woman would win.
I actually give them a pass because they're so clueless
on the difference of biology. But any man, I mean
(12:04):
this Honestly, any man who has ever played a high school, college,
and certainly a pro sport knows that the idea of
men being able to compete in women's sports was on
its face, laughably absurd. And where it matters is if
they can get you to argue that, or if they
can get you to stay silent on that, they can
keep advancing the UH, the the the left wing agenda
(12:28):
because they cowed you into silence.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
Yeah, you well, and you're you've you've basically become complicit
in your own cowardice uh and your own silencing. And
if they can get you to say something that's that crazy,
they can get you to say anything. That's the whole point.
If they can get you to believe this, they can
get you to believe that you know that the sky
is purple, and you know the the earth is is flat,
(12:52):
and you name it. And that's that's a very powerful
tool of psychological manipulation because it's degrading when that, when
the state or society forces you to mouth a lie,
to say the slogans that they demand that you know
are false, it degrades you psychologically. Yeah, the point they
do this in Alttalitarian regimes, by the way, and they
(13:13):
do it purposefully. Yeah, and let me say this too.
Speaker 1 (13:16):
I think the one thing I will say additionally in
favor of Gladwell is this, I think America would be
far better if we all acknowledge when we get things wrong.
I don't think that anybody out there listening expects for
you or me to get everything right. I think when
we claim that we never get anything wrong, it actually
(13:37):
delegitimizes the things that we get right. And I do
think Malcolm Gladwell coming out and saying yes, it's convenient now. Yes,
the consequences and the stakes and the punishment for being
on the quote unquote wrong side of the Ledger on
this issue are much demnimized because we won this battle
so far. But I do think being willing to acknowledge
(13:59):
we've said it. I said it was gonna be a
red tsunami in twenty twenty two, didn't get it.
Speaker 2 (14:04):
I had to wear it like I was wrong.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
Now, we got a lot right about the twenty twenty
four election, but I don't think people out there trusted
us less because you got something wrong. Because everybody gets
things wrong. Well, that's a prediction too.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
Yeah, there's a difference between a prediction, which is inherently uncertain,
and telling a lie. Yes, one goes to analysis and
nobody's perfect. Another goes to you're selling out and a
lot of people I will tell you most I know
one sold out. I won't name them because don't I don't.
People can always, even people on the other side, if
(14:36):
they asked to speak to me in confidence, I keep confidence.
I know some prominent Democrats in the media, Clay who
would say to me offline, oh, the trance thing is crazy,
but the agenda's crazy. But I can't say it because
my side would eat me alive.
Speaker 1 (14:49):
Yep, yep, we'll talk. We'll take some of your calls.
Maybe some of you want to react to that. Also,
we want to talk about the arrest that happened in England,
which I actually think is connected to wrong things, which
Malcolm Gladwell was somewhat addressing in the meantime. Look, we're
a pro military show. We have tons of respect for
all the brave men and women who give so much
to defend our country and our freedoms. That's one of
(15:10):
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Speaker 3 (16:10):
Welcome back in here to Clay and Bucker'll be taking
your calls, your talkbacks, your emails this hour and want
to do some of that right now, And we have
a VIP email from William. He says, do you think
the LGB wishes they could drop the T and then
the rest of the letters and symbols They had found
so much acceptance, but now the other letters have set
(16:32):
them back. I think that there was a very large,
well funded and powerful pro gay and lesbian you know,
apparatus agenda organizations out there, and then we got to Obergafell,
and then there was this whole what do these organizations
(16:54):
do now?
Speaker 2 (16:55):
Right?
Speaker 3 (16:55):
What do they do now?
Speaker 4 (16:56):
Like?
Speaker 3 (16:56):
What's what's okay? The obergerfell happens and now and so
now what? And I think that there was a a
I'm not talking about on an individual basis so much
as an organizational entity, you know, NGO basis with Clay,
I think that the decision was made, well, now we
got to go all in on the on the trand stuff,
on the T stuff. And I do think that it
(17:18):
is it is backfiring because it is rooted in what
is fundamentally untrue, which is I think man can be
a woman and vice versa.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
I think a lot of gay people are ready to
kick the teas to the curb. I think they're like,
there is a big difference, candidly, I mean that's a
big and I don't even know what the rest of LGBTQ.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
I like, I don't even know where the rest of the.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
Intersects are a sexual and then anything else you can think, okay,
all right, So there's a big difference there, and I
think a lot of gay people are over being connected
to some of this craziness. Gay people don't think it's
right to chop kids genitals off when they're twelve.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
I mean, this is this is bonker stuff, all right.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
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Speaker 1 (18:57):
Today, Benchpireau of the Daily Wire is going to join
us at the top of the next hour. He's got
a new book out and he'll be in our New
York City studios. So just FYI, that's what's coming in
the next hour, and I bet we will get into
that with them with him. This story coming out of
(19:18):
out of England, and this to me ties in with
what I just shared with you about you're not allowed
to say that men shouldn't be able to compete in
women's sports. Oh, that's anti trans that's an unacceptable opinion.
And if you say it, We'll restrict your ability to
make a living, We'll try to attack the company that
(19:39):
you run, we will pull back from you. I think
what you are seeing is many countries in Europe that
otherwise we see as peer group nations are now severely
curtailing free speech even as it pertains to jokes. And
(20:00):
I have made this argument. It's in my new book
that's going to be out in November. I made it
in the most recent book that I wrote, American Playbook.
Sometimes there are opportunities that you never would have believed
that are real. This is one of them that I
think is out there culturally that should be grabbed by
(20:20):
the Republican Party. Republicans should be people who like jokes.
And I give credit to JD. Vance because I think
younger Republicans get it. South Park came after JD. Vance
and Marco Rubio and a lot of other people on
the right and they just laughed at it. I give
credit to people who can be targets of humor and say, hey,
(20:45):
make fun of me as much as you want.
Speaker 2 (20:47):
Jokes are good.
Speaker 1 (20:49):
And this decision that there are jokes that can be
made that would lead to when you get off of
a plane in England, five armed officers immediately grab you,
and and and and basically start the process of whether
you can enter the country or not.
Speaker 3 (21:09):
I think the content, though, of the joke, is important
to get out there right away, which is trans stuff. Yes,
that's why I'm saying it's connected, yes, right right, yeah,
But that's you make trans jokes or even just trans
statements or you know that are viewed as quote, anti trans,
you can get arrested. If you make whatterviewed as anti
Buzzlim or anti immigrant statements, you can get arrested. It's
(21:32):
very clear. You'll notice there's nothing that you can say
that will upset right wing people in the UK that
will get you arrested. That's it's only this global internationalist
sorrows sponsored leftism that and all that that encompasses that
will get you arrested in the UK. And I don't know,
(21:52):
I mean to me, the United Kingdom. I think it's
on a glide path into the side of the mountain,
so to speak. I'm not sure that they can they
can fix this clay because you don't see anybody of
any heft or particular in politics.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
You see JK.
Speaker 3 (22:09):
Rowling on the literary side on this issue. But you
know the fact that they could allow this stuff to
happen and then they arrested this guy when he came back,
and the airline was the airline coordinated, made sure that
they're I mean, the true of this guy like an
international terrorist. It's like Carlos to Jackal was getting off
the plane at Heathrow.
Speaker 1 (22:28):
I think this this directly ties in with what I
told you about what happened with fan duel and what
happened with my business. I give immense credit to JK.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
Rowling.
Speaker 1 (22:39):
She wrote probably the best children's book series of all time.
Speaker 3 (22:45):
WHOA. C. S. Lewis wants a word?
Speaker 2 (22:47):
Why? I am telling you more people read that.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
I've got my ten year old reading the Harry Potter
books right now. People don't read anymore, And I think
the reason we have any readers at all who are
in their twenties is to a large extent JK. Rowing
She was a billionaire, is a billionaire. She could have
stayed out of the fray. She was not willing to
(23:14):
stay silent, and I think most people are not JK.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
Rolly.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
They make their money and they want to stay in
the good graces and they want to get on the
right charity boards, and they want to make sure that
they're considered to be quote unquote good people, and so
they were willing to follow a lie to the point
now where comedians who make jokes about trans people. And
by the way, you should be able to make jokes
(23:39):
about everybody, white, black, Asian, Hispanic, gay, straight, trans, whatever
your background is. You should not be immune from ridicule
or use of humor against you, satire or any other
device because of your identity. And this is I think
one of the most most important things that Republicans should
(24:04):
get behind. Sometimes you get made fun of and a
joke stings. Sometimes it can even hurt. That's okay, that's
being a grown up. It's more important people. You should
see what some of the things people sometimes say, even
mean things about me. I know it's hard to believe,
but you have to accept that in a free society
(24:26):
sometimes people are going to say awful things about you
in order for free speech to flourish. And England has
basically decided if you are in a protected class in
their mind, then you are not allowed to be made
front of and you can actually arrest people. And this
is not just England, this is Germany, this is France,
this is all over the western.
Speaker 3 (24:48):
Yeah, Canada with the trans stuff in particular. But Clay,
how do you We're turning a little bit here to
the discussion about Malcolm Gladwell because you're saying I give
him credit, and when you said that, I it it,
I'm not. It grates my ears a little bit. And
I think this maybe goes to, you know, Clay as
(25:10):
the jollier, the jollier of the duo. He's the he's
the more willing to say, yeah, I like that guy,
Clay likes more. Clay likes more people than I do.
But I would say this, Uh, what's the difference or
how do you differentiate between somebody who was taking the
popular position then and someone who's just taking the more
(25:32):
popular position now, as in is it opportunism or is
it an admission? Because right now the winds of culture
are blowing very strongly in the Yeah, we can't have
two hundred guys named Tom pretending that they're named Talia
and uh and you know, crush all the girls on
the women's lacrosse team.
Speaker 1 (25:52):
I expect that most people are cowards and COVID convinced
me that most people are cowards, and much like you,
I am not over that, and some cowardice I tend
to be lenient on because sometimes the best thing for
your family can be that you be cowardly. And some
(26:16):
people are going to get fired up about that. But
what I mean by that is I think of things
as like a hierarchy.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
Right.
Speaker 1 (26:24):
Number one to me, your most responsible obligation to me,
people can argue about this is your family. I mean
people who are alive in your world, that live inside
of your home. Your job is to be absolutely loyal
to your kids, to your spouse, like that is the
(26:44):
people that you go to war for first, right, then
other family members other things.
Speaker 2 (26:50):
Right.
Speaker 1 (26:50):
So, I think there are a lot of people out
there listening who have a job, and I know that
all of you are nodding along a ton of you
right now. And they say early on in that trans world,
if I had gone out and I had said some
of the things that you said, Clay, I might have
gotten fired.
Speaker 2 (27:11):
And my number one job is to take care of right.
Speaker 3 (27:14):
You and I said, But this is a different thing now.
I'm talking about public figures with a lot of money
and a lot of influence. These are the people that
I have particular contempt for because at some point in time,
and I don't know you can draw the line on
whatever's because that's going.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
To be clear.
Speaker 3 (27:28):
I've been telling kids, like college kids for years when
they come up at like a live event or speech
or whatever. I've been doing this now for fifteen going
on sixteen years. They say, should I write a paper
where I tell my communist professor like the true I'm like, no,
write a paper where you don't lie. I think it's
Voltaire like everything you say should be true, but you
don't have to say everything that is true. Right, So lie,
(27:48):
But don't think you're gonna have some You're just gonna
get an f and then you're not gonna get the
job or the graduate opportunity you want, et cetera, et cetera. Right, Like,
there's no point in charging a machine gun nest that
you're just gonna get mowed down and being their casualty.
But we're talking about people that actually have the power,
the influence, the sway, and the and the perceived obligation
to publicly speak the truth. And what I'm asking you is,
(28:11):
you know, is Gladwell on this issue a convert or
an opportunist.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
Yeah, I think it's a good question.
Speaker 1 (28:19):
I will say that he knew what he was saying
was a lie when he said it, but at least
he's willing to admit it now, and that's where I'm
giving him some form of grace.
Speaker 2 (28:31):
And that's a distinction.
Speaker 3 (28:32):
That's a distinction.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
Yeah, a lot of people are never going to admit
that they were wrong, and in the years ahead, they're
gonna compt They're gonna they're going to pretend that they
never said or acted out in a way that that
that they have changed.
Speaker 3 (28:47):
So I think you've established that, And I'm glad we
I asked you about this because the standard really then
is maybe there were people who truly believed this then
and now they don't believe it. That's one oper that's
one possibilit as in they really your mind can happen, right,
But then there's the people who knew it was a
lie when along with it as a lie, and now
(29:09):
are no longer going along with it as a lie.
And you say, okay, what is your motivation for no
longer going along with it? Is that you're a shame
that you were lying? Or is that you realize it's
better to tell the truth. Now.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
I think there are people who are a shamed because
they know they were lying, and they are now aware
that the consequences for telling the truth are less significant,
and so they come out and they now have this
public statement. Where I give Gladwell credit is he could
just have pretended this never happened, right. A lot of
people who are wrong on things just pretend that that
(29:45):
never happened, and then they just move on and ten
fifteen years from now they would never acknowledge. For instance,
there are people listening to us right now that in
the early days of COVID were super angry at some
of the things that you and I said, and super
angry at some of the things that you and I did,
(30:06):
and then over time they realized that they had been
lied to when we were correct. I give people grace
for recognizing that they've been wrong. This is why I
try to be as public as I can about the
way that I've voted in the past. I think I
got elections wrong. I think I supported people who, in retrospect,
as I've gotten older, I shouldn't have. And that's what
(30:27):
I think age and wisdom can provide is better clarity.
You can learn from the errors of your ways in
the past. That's my hope. Basically the whole purpose of aging.
To me, if you believe the exact same things at
twelve as you did at eighty, and vice versa, I
would suggest your life experience has probably not been that
(30:47):
expansive anyway. The people that I'm still angry about, though,
are at some point, what is the point of having
FU money if you don't say exactly what you think.
That's the benefit to me of wealth is no one
can make my family have to struggle for the rest
(31:07):
of my life to live, to have lodging, to live
a high quality of life. So I don't care what
anybody thinks about any of my opinions because they can't
do anything to me. That's to me, the best thing
about having FU money. For all the people out there
that are shrinking violets and know the truth and have
more money than they could ever spend, and some of
you are listening to me right now, why are you
(31:30):
such cowards?
Speaker 2 (31:33):
Again?
Speaker 1 (31:33):
The point I was making, Bucket is I understand when
you got college tuition to pay, when you've got a
job that you got to have, when you got a
mortgage to pay. I understand why discretion can be the
better side of valor. But if you got real money,
sack up and own what you believe and stop being
a complete and total pussy willow, because those are the
people I get mad about.
Speaker 3 (31:53):
And just to bring it back to the England to
rest for one second for anyone who says, why should
we care? The Democrat part already wishes they could do
to you what just happened to this comedian in England. Yes, truly,
without exaggeration, they wish that you too could be arrested
getting off a plane for making an anti trans joke
(32:15):
or making a joke about trans period, because you're erasing trans,
because you're part of the trans genocide. They want to
do this to you too, and they want to do
it now now thanks to Trump and Conservatives and the
Republican Party and the right, currently they can't do that,
at least not really, but they want to do it.
(32:35):
And I think that's why it's important for us to
see that this is happening not in North Korea. This
is happening in England. This is happening in the United Kingdom.
This is happening in the country that other than Canada's
probably the closest to us in terms of our sense
of rule of law and freedom and everything else of
any country in the world. So it's important to take
(32:58):
note of this. You know, President Trump wants to see
our country emerge as the leader in artificial intelligence. We
had it, and then the Biden administration squandered some of
that lead. And now China, India, Russia they're working together
and they're trying to outpace us on this. This is
a big deal. Trump sees this as a crucial technology
for American leadership in national security and the economy. AI
(33:19):
is going to be the most valuable resource that we've
got going forward. And this administration is planning and that's
to meet a trillion dollar plus investment drawing in multiple partners.
It's what I call Manhattan Project too, to take back
our lead in the AI arms race and potentially engage
a handful of US firms with billions in new contracts.
And this could trigger an investment boom in a handful
of companies as soon as October fifteenth. I break it
(33:42):
all down in a brand new interview, including the companies
I believe could soar when this happens. Find this new
interview in all the details at a website. We're taking
this off air, so to speak. Go to off air
twenty five dot com. Watch this presentation and subscribe today
off air twenty five dot com. That's off air twenty
(34:05):
five dot com paid for by Paradigm Press.
Speaker 2 (34:08):
News and politics, but also a little comic relief. Clay
Travis at Buck Sexton.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
Find them on the free iHeartRadio app or wherever you
get your podcasts.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
Welcome back in here to Clay and Buck. We've got
we've got Ben Shapiro joining us in a few minutes
talk about well, what's going on in the world, and
also he's got a new book out. We're looking forward
to talking to Ben about that. We got a lot
of talkbacks and emails and all these things. Oh my,
and let's start with you know what. We haven't had
a Miami talkback in a couple of days. D d
(34:42):
Osvaldough from Miami who listens on six to ten wiod
play it, Hey.
Speaker 5 (34:47):
Clay and Buck and unintended consequence of overthrowing Maduro is
that hundreds of thousands of Venezuela's here in the United
States will no longer be able to claim political asylum,
and in fact, many thousands of them would probably be
glad to return to a true democracy if we can
achieve that. And the same goes for Cuba.
Speaker 3 (35:09):
So just to be clear, that sounds to me like
Osvaldo is like, let's overthrow Maduro, right, I mean, that's
that he said unintended consequence, But I feel like that's
the intended consequences that that would happen, right, am I
missing that?
Speaker 2 (35:20):
No?
Speaker 1 (35:21):
For people who missed it, we were talking about the
attack on the drug vessel off the coast of Venezuela.
Speaker 3 (35:28):
Missill strike on a speedboat against some drug smugglers is
what it was.
Speaker 1 (35:32):
The videotape is out there, and we have brought many
of our assets in the in the seas closer and
closer to Venezuela, and I think we are letting Maduro
know that he's on a short leash. And there are
in South Florida tons of people who have fled Venezuela
(35:52):
because the country has basically been taken over by as
you said, I mean, the Maduro's in many ways the
head of the narco terrorism that is emanating from Venezuela.
Speaker 2 (36:01):
I mean, he's mad.
Speaker 3 (36:02):
He's a designated cartel leader, the actual head of Venezuela
officially by the United States Treasury and by the US government. Therefore,
he's a designated So it's like El Chapo runs Venezuela
now more or less, although Chopo, I know he's in
prison somewhere, right, But yeah, that's like who runs Venezuela effectively,
and so what might happen there as Again, there are
(36:25):
massive amounts of American assets in the oil industry in
particular that I think there is a hope that we
can unlock in potentially new leadership.
Speaker 1 (36:38):
Again, we'll see what happens with that. We come back,
we'll talk about the Graham Lenehan that is the comedian's name.
A situation in England with Ben Shapira and cold Play.
Speaker 3 (36:49):
We're gonna beat up on cold Play.
Speaker 2 (36:51):
Let's do it.
Welcome back in Clay Travis buck Sexton Show. We are
having a fantastic Wednesday, no matter even though we have
as many of you probably are dealing with the official
in many ways in the summer kids season. Imagine a
lot of you are getting your kids back to school.
(00:22):
There's a lot of different moving parts. We played for you,
some of the President with the President of Poland in
the Oval Office in the first hour, and Buck, I'll
take you behind the curtain here. I don't know if
I've told this story before, but I'll tell you this
story as we start off the second hour here because
(00:42):
it directly ties in with a clip we're going to
play for you.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
And if you missed the teas.
Speaker 1 (00:47):
Malcolm Gladwell probably I think the most famous non fiction
celebrity author in America. Would you buy into that designation
in terms of book sells, I don't know that anybody
would have sold more copies than him.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
It's him and Michael Lewis probably for our good to
the last twenty years or so, those would be the
two that I think are. I met him in France,
by the way, for the iHeart events, so I actually
met mister Gladwell for the first we shook hands. I mean,
he wouldn't you know, he had no idea who I
was like, hey man, yeah, so yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
So I'm going to play a cut for him. I
imagine a lot of you have read his books. Tipping
Point is probably the most famous, but he's got a
ton of different books, and I think he has a
very popular podcast. So I would bet a huge percentage
of you are familiar with who Malcolm Gladwell is. So
let me take you behind the scenes a little bit here.
I sold my company, out Kick, to Fox in twenty
(01:39):
twenty one. On Super Bowl Sunday twenty twenty one, we
made two million dollars in affiliate revenue for from fan Duel.
That is that Super Bowl Day, the company that I ran,
we and founded. We were one of the top affiliates
(02:01):
in the entire country. So if you were watching Tom
Brady Tampa Bay Buccaneers go up against Patrick Mahomes Kansas
City Chiefs, our company and to a large extent me
made more money than anybody playing in that game. On
sports gambling affiliate referral deals. We were for FanDuel, which
(02:22):
is the biggest sports affiliate company sports gambling company in
the country. We were either their best or second best
affiliate partner in the country. Pat McAfee, who now is
at ESPN, was also wildly profitable for them. We were
their too best at helping to promote and I love
(02:44):
sports gambling obviously. We've got a great relationship with price Picks,
which ties in here with that. We made six seven
million dollars a year on that deal. That was important
for us as a part of the company. Sold the company,
FanDuel said they wouldn't work with me anymore Buck because
I was too outspoken on the trans sports issue. This
(03:09):
is a sports gambling company. They said, Clay is too
controversial because he is saying men should not be competing
in women's sports, and FanDuel is worried about the controversy
that he brings for being so outspoken on that issue.
As a result, FanDuel refused to work with me, and
(03:33):
as a result, refused to work without Kick. So me
merely saying men should not be able to compete in
women's athletics cost the company that I founded and owned
around seven million dollars a year. I don't know how
(03:53):
much money you guys make, but seven million dollars a
year for a media company is a big, huge, huge
part of what allows the company to be profitable, to
employ tons of people. But as a matter of principle,
I said, I'm not going to stop talking about this,
even though FanDuel is saying, well, you're too controversial for
saying this. So the reason why I give you that
(04:16):
backstory is it was, even though it's one hundred percent
the right thing to say, it took hutzba It took
sometimes turning away from millions of dollars to say what
I personally believe to be true and allow the company
to be at the forefront of arguing this.
Speaker 3 (04:37):
Is no, no, no, no, no, no, not you not what
you personally believe to be true, what is undeniably, unequivocably,
obviously and as clear as anything could be true, which
I think is important. You weren't penalized Clay for an opinion.
You were penalized for a fact which as a whole
(04:58):
that is Soviet Union level stuff. That is, everyone who
is starving say the grain harvest is the biggest grain
harvest of all time. That is a manufactured delusion, my friend.
Speaker 1 (05:08):
And if you wonder why did people not step up
against this across all of sports. Only OutKick and really
only me at the forefront of this.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
We're willing to make this argument.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
It's because the big advertising partners out there would grab
you by the you know what and they would squeeze
if you tried to step out a line. This is
the truth. Nobody else will even tell you this. I'm
telling you directly. Okay, Malcolm Gladwell came out. They have
(05:44):
a big sports conference, sports analytics conference at MIT, and
they had a bunch of famous Malcolm Gladwell has a
connection to sports. He's a big sports fan. He's done
sports related reporting and stories, and he and everybody else
on that panel at the I think it's the Sloan
Kettering MIT Institute or whatever, refused to speak out against
(06:10):
men competing in women's sports because the consequences were real.
What I just told you, it could cost your company
millions of dollars, It could cost you personally millions of dollars.
It could impact your employability. They were very targeted in
the way that they attacked here. And now he's come out,
this just happened yesterday, and Malcolm Gladwell says, hey, I
(06:32):
was bullied, I was cowed. I was afraid of the consequences,
and now I'm going to tell you the truth. Men
shouldn't be able to compete in women's sports.
Speaker 4 (06:39):
Listen if we did a replay of that exact panel
at the SLUNG conference this coming March, it runs in
exactly the opposite direction, and it would be I suspect
near unanimity in the room that trans athletes have no
place in the female category. I don't think this is
any I just think it was a strange I mean,
(07:02):
I felt. I mean the reason I'm ashamed of my
performance of that panel because I share your position one
hundred percent and I was count is the idea of
saying anything on this issue. I was in a I
believe in retrospect in a dishonest way. I was. I
was objective in a dishonest way.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
Okay, I give him credit for coming out and being
honest about this. I think this is so incredibly important
because there are consequences. Unfortunately, when you are willing to
speak the truth. I think your qualification is important there.
This is not This is not me arguing what the
(07:42):
tax rate in Moldova should be. And we're sitting around
and we're like, well, you know this.
Speaker 3 (07:46):
Is his dudes are not chicks, and chicks are not dudes,
and pretending they are is a lot. That is what
this is.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
Even in the world of sports.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
It's beyond that buck because you're saying men don't have
a competitive advantage, or you're sitting around you're saying, well
we have to do does.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
No man are bigger, stronger and faster than women.
Speaker 3 (08:04):
But underlying all of it, underlying all of it, and
this has to be remembered, is that trans for example,
and this is usually what we're talking about in the
sports context, trans women are women indistinguishable and to be
treated by society and the law as women, indistinguishable from
women in all respects, even though they're not women. That
is the actual foundational mandatory belief of the trans movement
(08:28):
right is that they transplate what is the phrase trans
women are women? Yeah, this is what they say. Trans
women are women, and that's why they should be able
to play in women's sports. That is a lie.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
I think this is important though, and I see this everywhere,
and people who may not be involved in media, a
lot of you sit around you say, well, how did
this happen? It was if you were willing to speak
out on this issue. Advertiser said, I can't. I won't
work with this person anymore, and I'm talking about a
friggin sports gambling company. You think that it's a coincidence
(09:05):
that that they're, of all companies that should be one
that recognized, hey, men and women's sports is ridiculous. They
actually pushed back and they said, even though you, Clay
and your company have made us tens of millions of dollars,
which we had objective reality you could look at and say, hey,
(09:26):
people love this, they wouldn't spend money with us anymore.
And this is how they control what people say, because
most people are not willing to give up the money.
They just pretend this story didn't exist. It wasn't that
everybody was as outspoken and as Gladwell is saying there,
(09:47):
it was just that a lot of companies just pretended
this didn't happen, or they would say, as they still say, now,
I don't know why you care about that, what you
even care? It doesn't happen that often. It's not that
big of a this is always that, this is always
the progression, right, It's not happening. It's not happening that much.
Why do you care. Okay, it's happening. It's happening a
little bit. Uh to, It's good, it's happening. Shut your face.
(10:10):
We're in charge now.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
And this is this is this was COVID, this is
trans this, this is that is the the slippery slope
of leftism in America today. It has to progressivism, it
has to progress The argument always has to go to
the next level. And it's all based on lies, because
of course it is happening, because they know what's happening,
and they know it's wrong, and they know they want
to do more of it, but they use an incrementalist
(10:33):
strategy to chip away at things. And for Gladwell to
come out now, Clay, yeah, because everything has changed now
now you can say it now you can actually because
people like me spoke out so hard and took the
slings and arrows. I will say Buck, I give him
some credit for acknowledging he was wrong. Because what a
lot of people are gonna do is they're going to
(10:55):
wait another couple of years and they're gonna come they're
gonna say, well, everybody knew this was ridiculous all along,
and an end that they never actually argued otherwise yeah.
I mean that's particularly gross, right, But that will happen.
I think that that is true.
Speaker 1 (11:08):
Five years from now, there will not be a single
man in America who will say I ever thought it
was okay? Oh no, no man pretending to be women were competing.
I disagree with that.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
There will be people, Clay, There are people that will
take this to the very end, and they think that
they can get a rebound with this in time. All
they have to do that. They think that they will
find their way back into power, back into the culture.
Twenty percent of the country is never going to abandon this.
Twenty percent of the country is certifiably insane. I mean
they think that Kamala Harris was a good candidate and
Joe Biden's brain was working.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
These people are nuts. Well, I say this, I mean
people who are actual.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
Sportsmans, right, because I understand on some level, if you stay,
if you don't know anything about sports and you think, like, hey,
maybe Serena Williams is better than Roger Federer at tennis,
maybe they should play and maybe the woman would win.
I actually give them a pass because they're so clueless
on the difference of biology. But any man, I mean
(12:04):
this Honestly, any man who has ever played a high school, college,
and certainly a pro sport knows that the idea of
men being able to compete in women's sports was on
its face, laughably absurd. And where it matters is if
they can get you to argue that, or if they
can get you to stay silent on that, they can
keep advancing the UH, the the the left wing agenda
(12:28):
because they cowed you into silence.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
Yeah, you well, and you're you've you've basically become complicit
in your own cowardice uh and your own silencing. And
if they can get you to say something that's that crazy,
they can get you to say anything. That's the whole point.
If they can get you to believe this, they can
get you to believe that you know that the sky
is purple, and you know the the earth is is flat,
(12:52):
and you name it. And that's that's a very powerful
tool of psychological manipulation because it's degrading when that, when
the state or society forces you to mouth a lie,
to say the slogans that they demand that you know
are false, it degrades you psychologically. Yeah, the point they
do this in Alttalitarian regimes, by the way, and they
(13:13):
do it purposefully. Yeah, and let me say this too.
Speaker 1 (13:16):
I think the one thing I will say additionally in
favor of Gladwell is this, I think America would be
far better if we all acknowledge when we get things wrong.
I don't think that anybody out there listening expects for
you or me to get everything right. I think when
we claim that we never get anything wrong, it actually
(13:37):
delegitimizes the things that we get right. And I do
think Malcolm Gladwell coming out and saying yes, it's convenient now. Yes,
the consequences and the stakes and the punishment for being
on the quote unquote wrong side of the Ledger on
this issue are much demnimized because we won this battle
so far. But I do think being willing to acknowledge
(13:59):
we've said it. I said it was gonna be a
red tsunami in twenty twenty two, didn't get it.
Speaker 2 (14:04):
I had to wear it like I was wrong.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
Now, we got a lot right about the twenty twenty
four election, but I don't think people out there trusted
us less because you got something wrong. Because everybody gets
things wrong. Well, that's a prediction too.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
Yeah, there's a difference between a prediction, which is inherently uncertain,
and telling a lie. Yes, one goes to analysis and
nobody's perfect. Another goes to you're selling out and a
lot of people I will tell you most I know
one sold out. I won't name them because don't I don't.
People can always, even people on the other side, if
(14:36):
they asked to speak to me in confidence, I keep confidence.
I know some prominent Democrats in the media, Clay who
would say to me offline, oh, the trance thing is crazy,
but the agenda's crazy. But I can't say it because
my side would eat me alive.
Speaker 1 (14:49):
Yep, yep, we'll talk. We'll take some of your calls.
Maybe some of you want to react to that. Also,
we want to talk about the arrest that happened in England,
which I actually think is connected to wrong things, which
Malcolm Gladwell was somewhat addressing in the meantime. Look, we're
a pro military show. We have tons of respect for
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(15:10):
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Speaker 3 (16:10):
Welcome back in here to Clay and Bucker'll be taking
your calls, your talkbacks, your emails this hour and want
to do some of that right now, And we have
a VIP email from William. He says, do you think
the LGB wishes they could drop the T and then
the rest of the letters and symbols They had found
so much acceptance, but now the other letters have set
(16:32):
them back. I think that there was a very large,
well funded and powerful pro gay and lesbian you know,
apparatus agenda organizations out there, and then we got to Obergafell,
and then there was this whole what do these organizations
(16:54):
do now?
Speaker 2 (16:55):
Right?
Speaker 3 (16:55):
What do they do now?
Speaker 4 (16:56):
Like?
Speaker 3 (16:56):
What's what's okay? The obergerfell happens and now and so
now what? And I think that there was a a
I'm not talking about on an individual basis so much
as an organizational entity, you know, NGO basis with Clay,
I think that the decision was made, well, now we
got to go all in on the on the trand stuff,
on the T stuff. And I do think that it
(17:18):
is it is backfiring because it is rooted in what
is fundamentally untrue, which is I think man can be
a woman and vice versa.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
I think a lot of gay people are ready to
kick the teas to the curb. I think they're like,
there is a big difference, candidly, I mean that's a
big and I don't even know what the rest of LGBTQ.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
I like, I don't even know where the rest of the.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
Intersects are a sexual and then anything else you can think, okay,
all right, So there's a big difference there, and I
think a lot of gay people are over being connected
to some of this craziness. Gay people don't think it's
right to chop kids genitals off when they're twelve.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
I mean, this is this is bonker stuff, all right.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
The price of goal hit another all time time high
price yesterday, more than thirty six hundred dollars an ounce.
And the reason behind that value increase world of instability,
currencies under pressure. If you saw the photos of leaders
of China, Indian and Russia together in China yesterday, that's
all you need to know. Among other things, it speaks
to future world order turmoil, and that alone can drive
(18:18):
gold prices up substantially. So if you don't own gold yet,
you should give it some serious consideration. Gold is many
things a stabilizing factor when the value for dollar fluctuates,
as it has been, lingering with lingering inflation when the
purchasing power of the cash you've saved goes down. Diversifying
your savings account by purchasing gold is the best way
to maintain value, and the price of gold will continue
to go up, particularly with all that's going on in
(18:40):
the world in the years ahead. Birch Gold Group makes
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Speaker 1 (18:57):
Today, Benchpireau of the Daily Wire is going to join
us at the top of the next hour. He's got
a new book out and he'll be in our New
York City studios. So just FYI, that's what's coming in
the next hour, and I bet we will get into
that with them with him. This story coming out of
(19:18):
out of England, and this to me ties in with
what I just shared with you about you're not allowed
to say that men shouldn't be able to compete in
women's sports. Oh, that's anti trans that's an unacceptable opinion.
And if you say it, We'll restrict your ability to
make a living, We'll try to attack the company that
(19:39):
you run, we will pull back from you. I think
what you are seeing is many countries in Europe that
otherwise we see as peer group nations are now severely
curtailing free speech even as it pertains to jokes. And
(20:00):
I have made this argument. It's in my new book
that's going to be out in November. I made it
in the most recent book that I wrote, American Playbook.
Sometimes there are opportunities that you never would have believed
that are real. This is one of them that I
think is out there culturally that should be grabbed by
(20:20):
the Republican Party. Republicans should be people who like jokes.
And I give credit to JD. Vance because I think
younger Republicans get it. South Park came after JD. Vance
and Marco Rubio and a lot of other people on
the right and they just laughed at it. I give
credit to people who can be targets of humor and say, hey,
(20:45):
make fun of me as much as you want.
Speaker 2 (20:47):
Jokes are good.
Speaker 1 (20:49):
And this decision that there are jokes that can be
made that would lead to when you get off of
a plane in England, five armed officers immediately grab you,
and and and and basically start the process of whether
you can enter the country or not.
Speaker 3 (21:09):
I think the content, though, of the joke, is important
to get out there right away, which is trans stuff. Yes,
that's why I'm saying it's connected, yes, right right, yeah,
But that's you make trans jokes or even just trans
statements or you know that are viewed as quote, anti trans,
you can get arrested. If you make whatterviewed as anti
Buzzlim or anti immigrant statements, you can get arrested. It's
(21:32):
very clear. You'll notice there's nothing that you can say
that will upset right wing people in the UK that
will get you arrested. That's it's only this global internationalist
sorrows sponsored leftism that and all that that encompasses that
will get you arrested in the UK. And I don't know,
(21:52):
I mean to me, the United Kingdom. I think it's
on a glide path into the side of the mountain,
so to speak. I'm not sure that they can they
can fix this clay because you don't see anybody of
any heft or particular in politics.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
You see JK.
Speaker 3 (22:09):
Rowling on the literary side on this issue. But you
know the fact that they could allow this stuff to
happen and then they arrested this guy when he came back,
and the airline was the airline coordinated, made sure that
they're I mean, the true of this guy like an
international terrorist. It's like Carlos to Jackal was getting off
the plane at Heathrow.
Speaker 1 (22:28):
I think this this directly ties in with what I
told you about what happened with fan duel and what
happened with my business. I give immense credit to JK.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
Rowling.
Speaker 1 (22:39):
She wrote probably the best children's book series of all time.
Speaker 3 (22:45):
WHOA. C. S. Lewis wants a word?
Speaker 2 (22:47):
Why? I am telling you more people read that.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
I've got my ten year old reading the Harry Potter
books right now. People don't read anymore, And I think
the reason we have any readers at all who are
in their twenties is to a large extent JK. Rowing
She was a billionaire, is a billionaire. She could have
stayed out of the fray. She was not willing to
(23:14):
stay silent, and I think most people are not JK.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
Rolly.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
They make their money and they want to stay in
the good graces and they want to get on the
right charity boards, and they want to make sure that
they're considered to be quote unquote good people, and so
they were willing to follow a lie to the point
now where comedians who make jokes about trans people. And
by the way, you should be able to make jokes
(23:39):
about everybody, white, black, Asian, Hispanic, gay, straight, trans, whatever
your background is. You should not be immune from ridicule
or use of humor against you, satire or any other
device because of your identity. And this is I think
one of the most most important things that Republicans should
(24:04):
get behind. Sometimes you get made fun of and a
joke stings. Sometimes it can even hurt. That's okay, that's
being a grown up. It's more important people. You should
see what some of the things people sometimes say, even
mean things about me. I know it's hard to believe,
but you have to accept that in a free society
(24:26):
sometimes people are going to say awful things about you
in order for free speech to flourish. And England has
basically decided if you are in a protected class in
their mind, then you are not allowed to be made
front of and you can actually arrest people. And this
is not just England, this is Germany, this is France,
this is all over the western.
Speaker 3 (24:48):
Yeah, Canada with the trans stuff in particular. But Clay,
how do you We're turning a little bit here to
the discussion about Malcolm Gladwell because you're saying I give
him credit, and when you said that, I it it,
I'm not. It grates my ears a little bit. And
I think this maybe goes to, you know, Clay as
(25:10):
the jollier, the jollier of the duo. He's the he's
the more willing to say, yeah, I like that guy,
Clay likes more. Clay likes more people than I do.
But I would say this, Uh, what's the difference or
how do you differentiate between somebody who was taking the
popular position then and someone who's just taking the more
(25:32):
popular position now, as in is it opportunism or is
it an admission? Because right now the winds of culture
are blowing very strongly in the Yeah, we can't have
two hundred guys named Tom pretending that they're named Talia
and uh and you know, crush all the girls on
the women's lacrosse team.
Speaker 1 (25:52):
I expect that most people are cowards and COVID convinced
me that most people are cowards, and much like you,
I am not over that, and some cowardice I tend
to be lenient on because sometimes the best thing for
your family can be that you be cowardly. And some
(26:16):
people are going to get fired up about that. But
what I mean by that is I think of things
as like a hierarchy.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
Right.
Speaker 1 (26:24):
Number one to me, your most responsible obligation to me,
people can argue about this is your family. I mean
people who are alive in your world, that live inside
of your home. Your job is to be absolutely loyal
to your kids, to your spouse, like that is the
(26:44):
people that you go to war for first, right, then
other family members other things.
Speaker 2 (26:50):
Right.
Speaker 1 (26:50):
So, I think there are a lot of people out
there listening who have a job, and I know that
all of you are nodding along a ton of you
right now. And they say early on in that trans world,
if I had gone out and I had said some
of the things that you said, Clay, I might have
gotten fired.
Speaker 2 (27:11):
And my number one job is to take care of right.
Speaker 3 (27:14):
You and I said, But this is a different thing now.
I'm talking about public figures with a lot of money
and a lot of influence. These are the people that
I have particular contempt for because at some point in time,
and I don't know you can draw the line on
whatever's because that's going.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
To be clear.
Speaker 3 (27:28):
I've been telling kids, like college kids for years when
they come up at like a live event or speech
or whatever. I've been doing this now for fifteen going
on sixteen years. They say, should I write a paper
where I tell my communist professor like the true I'm like, no,
write a paper where you don't lie. I think it's
Voltaire like everything you say should be true, but you
don't have to say everything that is true. Right, So lie,
(27:48):
But don't think you're gonna have some You're just gonna
get an f and then you're not gonna get the
job or the graduate opportunity you want, et cetera, et cetera. Right, Like,
there's no point in charging a machine gun nest that
you're just gonna get mowed down and being their casualty.
But we're talking about people that actually have the power,
the influence, the sway, and the and the perceived obligation
to publicly speak the truth. And what I'm asking you is,
(28:11):
you know, is Gladwell on this issue a convert or
an opportunist.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
Yeah, I think it's a good question.
Speaker 1 (28:19):
I will say that he knew what he was saying
was a lie when he said it, but at least
he's willing to admit it now, and that's where I'm
giving him some form of grace.
Speaker 2 (28:31):
And that's a distinction.
Speaker 3 (28:32):
That's a distinction.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
Yeah, a lot of people are never going to admit
that they were wrong, and in the years ahead, they're
gonna compt They're gonna they're going to pretend that they
never said or acted out in a way that that
that they have changed.
Speaker 3 (28:47):
So I think you've established that, And I'm glad we
I asked you about this because the standard really then
is maybe there were people who truly believed this then
and now they don't believe it. That's one oper that's
one possibilit as in they really your mind can happen, right,
But then there's the people who knew it was a
lie when along with it as a lie, and now
(29:09):
are no longer going along with it as a lie.
And you say, okay, what is your motivation for no
longer going along with it? Is that you're a shame
that you were lying? Or is that you realize it's
better to tell the truth. Now.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
I think there are people who are a shamed because
they know they were lying, and they are now aware
that the consequences for telling the truth are less significant,
and so they come out and they now have this
public statement. Where I give Gladwell credit is he could
just have pretended this never happened, right. A lot of
people who are wrong on things just pretend that that
(29:45):
never happened, and then they just move on and ten
fifteen years from now they would never acknowledge. For instance,
there are people listening to us right now that in
the early days of COVID were super angry at some
of the things that you and I said, and super
angry at some of the things that you and I did,
(30:06):
and then over time they realized that they had been
lied to when we were correct. I give people grace
for recognizing that they've been wrong. This is why I
try to be as public as I can about the
way that I've voted in the past. I think I
got elections wrong. I think I supported people who, in retrospect,
as I've gotten older, I shouldn't have. And that's what
(30:27):
I think age and wisdom can provide is better clarity.
You can learn from the errors of your ways in
the past. That's my hope. Basically the whole purpose of aging.
To me, if you believe the exact same things at
twelve as you did at eighty, and vice versa, I
would suggest your life experience has probably not been that
(30:47):
expansive anyway. The people that I'm still angry about, though,
are at some point, what is the point of having
FU money if you don't say exactly what you think.
That's the benefit to me of wealth is no one
can make my family have to struggle for the rest
(31:07):
of my life to live, to have lodging, to live
a high quality of life. So I don't care what
anybody thinks about any of my opinions because they can't
do anything to me. That's to me, the best thing
about having FU money. For all the people out there
that are shrinking violets and know the truth and have
more money than they could ever spend, and some of
you are listening to me right now, why are you
(31:30):
such cowards?
Speaker 2 (31:33):
Again?
Speaker 1 (31:33):
The point I was making, Bucket is I understand when
you got college tuition to pay, when you've got a
job that you got to have, when you got a
mortgage to pay. I understand why discretion can be the
better side of valor. But if you got real money,
sack up and own what you believe and stop being
a complete and total pussy willow, because those are the
people I get mad about.
Speaker 3 (31:53):
And just to bring it back to the England to
rest for one second for anyone who says, why should
we care? The Democrat part already wishes they could do
to you what just happened to this comedian in England. Yes, truly,
without exaggeration, they wish that you too could be arrested
getting off a plane for making an anti trans joke
(32:15):
or making a joke about trans period, because you're erasing trans,
because you're part of the trans genocide. They want to
do this to you too, and they want to do
it now now thanks to Trump and Conservatives and the
Republican Party and the right, currently they can't do that,
at least not really, but they want to do it.
(32:35):
And I think that's why it's important for us to
see that this is happening not in North Korea. This
is happening in England. This is happening in the United Kingdom.
This is happening in the country that other than Canada's
probably the closest to us in terms of our sense
of rule of law and freedom and everything else of
any country in the world. So it's important to take
(32:58):
note of this. You know, President Trump wants to see
our country emerge as the leader in artificial intelligence. We
had it, and then the Biden administration squandered some of
that lead. And now China, India, Russia they're working together
and they're trying to outpace us on this. This is
a big deal. Trump sees this as a crucial technology
for American leadership in national security and the economy. AI
(33:19):
is going to be the most valuable resource that we've
got going forward. And this administration is planning and that's
to meet a trillion dollar plus investment drawing in multiple partners.
It's what I call Manhattan Project too, to take back
our lead in the AI arms race and potentially engage
a handful of US firms with billions in new contracts.
And this could trigger an investment boom in a handful
of companies as soon as October fifteenth. I break it
(33:42):
all down in a brand new interview, including the companies
I believe could soar when this happens. Find this new
interview in all the details at a website. We're taking
this off air, so to speak. Go to off air
twenty five dot com. Watch this presentation and subscribe today
off air twenty five dot com. That's off air twenty
(34:05):
five dot com paid for by Paradigm Press.
Speaker 2 (34:08):
News and politics, but also a little comic relief. Clay
Travis at Buck Sexton.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
Find them on the free iHeartRadio app or wherever you
get your podcasts.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
Welcome back in here to Clay and Buck. We've got
we've got Ben Shapiro joining us in a few minutes
talk about well, what's going on in the world, and
also he's got a new book out. We're looking forward
to talking to Ben about that. We got a lot
of talkbacks and emails and all these things. Oh my,
and let's start with you know what. We haven't had
a Miami talkback in a couple of days. D d
(34:42):
Osvaldough from Miami who listens on six to ten wiod
play it, Hey.
Speaker 5 (34:47):
Clay and Buck and unintended consequence of overthrowing Maduro is
that hundreds of thousands of Venezuela's here in the United
States will no longer be able to claim political asylum,
and in fact, many thousands of them would probably be
glad to return to a true democracy if we can
achieve that. And the same goes for Cuba.
Speaker 3 (35:09):
So just to be clear, that sounds to me like
Osvaldo is like, let's overthrow Maduro, right, I mean, that's
that he said unintended consequence, But I feel like that's
the intended consequences that that would happen, right, am I
missing that?
Speaker 2 (35:20):
No?
Speaker 1 (35:21):
For people who missed it, we were talking about the
attack on the drug vessel off the coast of Venezuela.
Speaker 3 (35:28):
Missill strike on a speedboat against some drug smugglers is
what it was.
Speaker 1 (35:32):
The videotape is out there, and we have brought many
of our assets in the in the seas closer and
closer to Venezuela, and I think we are letting Maduro
know that he's on a short leash. And there are
in South Florida tons of people who have fled Venezuela
(35:52):
because the country has basically been taken over by as
you said, I mean, the Maduro's in many ways the
head of the narco terrorism that is emanating from Venezuela.
Speaker 2 (36:01):
I mean, he's mad.
Speaker 3 (36:02):
He's a designated cartel leader, the actual head of Venezuela
officially by the United States Treasury and by the US government. Therefore,
he's a designated So it's like El Chapo runs Venezuela
now more or less, although Chopo, I know he's in
prison somewhere, right, But yeah, that's like who runs Venezuela effectively,
and so what might happen there as Again, there are
(36:25):
massive amounts of American assets in the oil industry in
particular that I think there is a hope that we
can unlock in potentially new leadership.
Speaker 1 (36:38):
Again, we'll see what happens with that. We come back,
we'll talk about the Graham Lenehan that is the comedian's name.
A situation in England with Ben Shapira and cold Play.
Speaker 3 (36:49):
We're gonna beat up on cold Play.
Speaker 2 (36:51):
Let's do it.
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