May 21, 2025 • 38 mins
In Hour 2 of the Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show, the hosts deliver a provocative and in-depth discussion centered around President Donald Trump's contentious Oval Office meeting with South African President Cyril Ramaphosa. This hour is packed with politically charged commentary, international relations analysis, and cultural critique, making it a must-listen for politically engaged audiences.
The segment opens with breaking news coverage of Trump dimming the Oval Office lights to play a four-and-a-half-minute video showing South African lawmakers allegedly calling for violence against white farmers. This dramatic move sets the stage for a broader conversation about race, immigration, and media narratives. The hosts argue that Trump is using these high-profile diplomatic meetings to dominate the news cycle and force mainstream media to cover topics they typically avoid.
A major theme in this hour is the plight of white South African farmers, with the hosts asserting that they are victims of racially motivated violence and land expropriation. They criticize the U.S. media and Democratic politicians for allegedly ignoring or downplaying these issues due to racial and political biases. The discussion also touches on the recent U.S. decision to grant asylum to a group of 59 South African farmers, which the hosts defend as a legitimate humanitarian response.
The conversation expands into a critique of what the hosts describe as a double standard in how racism is discussed in the U.S. and globally. They argue that racism can be perpetrated by any group against any other, challenging the narrative that only white people can be racist. This leads to a broader philosophical discussion about justice, equality, and the dangers of replacing one form of racial injustice with another.
Trump’s inclusion of South African golf legends Ernie Els and Retief Goosen in the Oval Office meeting is highlighted as a strategic move to lend credibility to his concerns. The golfers share personal anecdotes about violence and instability in South Africa, reinforcing the hosts’ narrative.
The hour concludes with a comparison between South Africa’s current policies and Zimbabwe’s past land seizures, warning of economic collapse and food insecurity if similar paths are followed. The hosts also draw parallels to U.S. college campus protests and the broader implications of critical race theory and intersectionality in shaping public discourse.
Follow Clay & Buck on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/clayandbuck
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to today's edition of the Clay Travis and Buck
Sexton Show podcast. Welcome back in Clay Travis Buck Sexton Show.
So just now in the Oval Office, Trump is meeting
(00:22):
with the president of South Africa.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Have you seen this yet? Buck? Oh? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (00:27):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
He dimmed the lights in the Oval Office and played
a four and a half minute video of South African
lawmakers demanding that white people be killed and their land
be sieved. And it is blowing up everywhere as we speak.
(00:51):
I am scrolling through to see how South Africa's leader responded,
but it is It is really pretty extraordinary, these moments
that Trump is having in the Oval Office with leaders
of foreign countries, whether it was Zelenski in February, now
(01:12):
the South African leader today. And of course this comes
on the heel was at fifty nine fifty some odd
South African farmers who were white being granted amnesty in
the United States, and everybody came out and said, oh
my goodness, this is on the Democrat side, unacceptable and
this has just happened. So we will pay attention to you.
(01:33):
I just want to give you a heads up, Buck.
This is something we've talked about quite a lot on
the show, and it has not gotten very much attention.
But remember one of the CNN commentators said, why don't
they just go back to where they're from? And many
of these South African white farmers have been there for
hundreds of years, some of them since the sixteen hundreds.
(01:55):
And these were people that have been victims of islands
at high levels.
Speaker 4 (02:01):
The Dutch East India Company land around the what is
it the Cape of Good Hope around sixteen fifty four,
and the Dutch didn't displace and there was no one there.
Now you could say there was somebody there in the
land that is now currently South Africa. Yeah, but it
(02:22):
was a sparsely populated land. Here's some things that people
don't ever think about when they talk about this what
was considered tribal land at that point. Well, they may
be curious to know that in the seventeenth century and
that part of Africa, the tribes almost to I think
every single one. I mean, I'm trying to think of
there's any exception.
Speaker 2 (02:41):
Clay.
Speaker 4 (02:42):
They were migrant herdsmen, if you will, So they were
constantly on the move. They would move with the seasons,
they would move with their herds. They were overwhelming a
herding societies. So what's their land or rather how much
land or what really is is why is it that
there's an assumption that to be native to Africa you
(03:04):
have to be black. There there are people now, I
know people are gonna say everybody originated from Africa, and
I'm aware of this too, and the you know, the
anthropological origins of the of the human species.
Speaker 1 (03:14):
But there's the whole northern part of Africa. Is you know,
is Egypt part of Africa. It's a fun thing to
ask people, this is Egypt part of Africa? They go, well, yes,
but so are Egyptians Africans?
Speaker 2 (03:26):
People will say no, and you say why why is
not the case? Of course they're Africans right.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
Anyway, It's interesting the way these things are spoken about
and talked about because the storyline, Now, yes, was there
a racist system of.
Speaker 4 (03:41):
Apartheid instituted that you know, needed to be overturned. Absolutely,
it happened, But they didn't overturn it with a system
that was also not race or rather that was not racist.
They overturned it with a system that was explicitly racist.
It just switched the direction of the racism and what
you see now with Trump showing everybody what's really going on,
(04:04):
is that the objection. You know, Clay, We've been covering
the immigration issue very closely every time, and I used
to have these fights. And you know, when I lived
in DC for a couple of years, I was doing
the show at the Hill. We'd have all these Democrats on.
I would say, these people are not asylum secrets.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
So yes they are.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
They deserve their day in court, they deserve to present
evidence to show. I'm like, these people are showing up
with with Q cards that say in whatever language they speak,
you know, and by the way, I mean actual QUE cards.
They actually would have this written out. Sometimes I have
a credible fear of violence in my insert the blank country,
and that was how you pass their credible fear test.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
Clay.
Speaker 4 (04:39):
I bring this up because all the media are assuming
that these fifty migrants that we've taken in from legally
taken in from South Africa are not deserving of asylum.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
They have no idea, None of.
Speaker 4 (04:52):
These people have, you know, they haven't looked into their
individual cases. Their objection to the South African migrants, and
this goes to what Trump is is explicitly I think
showing every right now is that they are white and
that they've come here legally.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:07):
Look, sorry, I'm just catching up because of this Oval
Office event reminds me of what happened with Ukraine, where
we're live on the air and we're like, oh my goodness,
like this is kind of remarkable. I'm sending some clips
in to our team so that they can be on
top of this and we can share with all of you. Look,
this is I think significant. You might say, Okay, why
(05:28):
does this matter?
Speaker 5 (05:29):
Right?
Speaker 1 (05:31):
Well, and again I'm texting in different clips that have
just happened in the Oval Office to our team so
that we can make sure that we're on top of this.
What is really happening here in the Oval Office is
and this is unique. I don't remember this happening very often.
Trump has decided that one of the best ways he
(05:51):
can dominate the news cycle and force the media to
talk about what he wants them to talk about is
do it while you have these gatherings with foreign leaders
in the Oval Office, which are traditionally just kind of banal.
There's not a lot of news that comes out of them.
They talk about how much they like each other, and
(06:12):
it's a kind of a grip and grin handshake style event.
Trump is turning them into must see television and also
forcing then the media to cover what takes place there. Now,
I can already tell you what the response to this
is going to be. Oh, Trump only cares about violence
in South Africa when it impacts white people, right, And
(06:33):
they're going to say, well, yes, there is violence against
white people in South Africa, but South Africa has huge
rates of violence overall, and black people are actually much
more likely to be victims of violence in South Africa,
which is true because they're the majority of the country.
But I'm just telling you what the talking points will
be in response to this.
Speaker 4 (06:52):
But let's keep digging into this, right, Let's keep having
this fight with them, because they're wrong, and so they'll lose.
The more that's exposed, the more that is known about this,
weaker the Democrat position becomes, which is true of almost
every Democrat position, I think, But in this case, I
think they're digging a deeper hole for themselves than they realize.
First of all, the people, and you're right about what
they're talking points will be. The people that would make
(07:12):
that case though, are also people who in this country,
for example, we say they only care about let's say
police brutality or police violence that involves members of the
black community, correct, even though guess what, overwhelmingly it is
members of the white community who suffer from state or
police violence.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
But they will say, oh, it's all about the proportion.
Speaker 4 (07:34):
Okay, Well, then let's take a look at the proportional
violence in South Africa, and let's also take a look
at the you know, the reason, the motive for that violence,
and it is in many cases explicitly anti white, and
it is encouraged by the state. So mir the people
who are objecting to the South African migrants, when they
(07:56):
apply a similar framework of state violent racism in this country,
you can see they actually have no principles to work
on whatsoever. That that that it's only what happens here
and what happens there they view as totally you know,
irrelevant comparisons when they're actually very apt comparisons.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
Well, look, I mean I use this analogy all the
time because I think it is an important aspirational goal. Lady,
justice is blind. Go look at any exact I've heard
you say that before, You've heard me say it. But
I think it's it's such an important example to use
because it's an aspirational goal for all of society that
we would weigh guilt or innocence based.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
Not in any way on what the.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
Race or gender, or ethnicity or religion or sexuality is
of the accused, that we would just look at the facts.
And in many ways, what happens is we swung right
from admittedly racism against minorities to racism is okay in
favor of minorities to make up for racism in the past,
(09:03):
and we skipped right over trying to have fair and
impartial application of justice.
Speaker 4 (09:07):
Well, now you're hitting on the critical principle that is
so upsetting. So there's the immigration component of this right,
which is America shouldn't take in any white people really
as immigrants period. I mean, that's what the Democrats actually want.
Democrats believe that a less white America will inherently be
(09:29):
a more just America because it is the white people
in America who do all the oppressing, right, if you
actually take their love, So they think that a more
just America must be a less white America. That is
a left wing Democrat belief. So that's on the immigration piece, Clay.
But the other piece, which is what you just touched on,
is in South Africa, you have a dender rights case
(09:50):
of black racism against white people as a matter of law,
as a matter of policy, and as a matter of
day to day life. Well, if it's possible there, doesn't
that go against the narrative in this country of only
white people can be racist?
Speaker 2 (10:09):
Yes, it distracts this.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
This is what I would say is a foundational idea
that I would encourage all of you to contemplate if
you haven't already come to the conclusion white, Black, Asian
and Hispanic people can all be racist. That is one
billion percent true. Kind of like we're very anti cancer here,
we're very anti racism, yes, but you know the thing
(10:32):
with like the cancer, like there's no good cancer, and
there's no good racism.
Speaker 4 (10:36):
We're anti it across the board. I'm anti any racial
animis based on skin color. I'm anti all tumors, right,
I mean this is you can be consistent. Yes, and
we wish nobody ever died. We would be very pro
immortality too. Yes, we are pro anty death, anti death,
pro living.
Speaker 1 (10:53):
But I do think that that statement that I just
made white black Asian and Hispanic people can all be racist.
Many Democrats, many left wing voters would say, no, Clay,
you're wrong.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Oh, they fundamentally reject that.
Speaker 1 (11:07):
Yes, only white people can be racist, and therefore we
can only focus on racism white in the direction of black,
Asian or Hispanic. And what's really fascinating about this is
you question me. You say, Okay, Clay, I don't disagree.
Remember when stop Asian Hate just vanished, when they decided
that Asian hate was actually being driven You know what
(11:27):
the problem with that campaign was surveillance cameras.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
Yeah, it's rough. They start rough.
Speaker 1 (11:33):
It was like two months they were like this, and
it was that post COVID they were like, this rise
of anti Asian hate is unexcepted.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
They the media was like.
Speaker 1 (11:41):
Must be guys named Billy, Bob and Maga hats and no,
it turned out it was not mostly black guys beating
up innocent Asian people. And they were like, oh, well,
Asian hate's really not that big of a deal. And look,
hate is wrong. Racism is wrong, but it can run
in many different directs. Should be condemned everywhere. By the way,
(12:01):
this is interesting too, Trump, I don't know I've ever
seen a president who loves athletes more. He's got Ernie
Els and Ratief Goosen, two famous South African golfers with.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
Him in the meeting.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
And Ernie Els and Ratief Goosen have spoken out to
say they want to see the country flourish, but they
have to end racism in the country in order for
that to happen. So those are two white golfers who
many of you out there who are golf fans will
know very well. Ernie El's Ratief Goosen, both major winners
in the PGA Tour, and just goes there just this
(12:38):
is another moment where Trump is forcing the Democrats. It's
like the MS thirteen guy and that we're all supposed
to care so much that he was deported, you know,
the bad guy. Trump is forcing the Democrats here because
he knows how they think to defend the indefensible, which
is the policies right now of South Africa. They are
morally and intellectually indefensible. If you're anti racism, yes, and
(13:00):
it's an example of moving from apartheid, which was wrong,
to now a new form of racism, which is white
no longer being in the control of the government. I
think they're seven percent of the population. I would also
point out and being discriminated against by the majority black
ruling class. Now I would also point out Elon Musk
is South African, So I think I would. I would
(13:23):
bet that one reason Trump has become more aware of
this is that Elon Musk has been outspoken about what
he has seen in his country, and I think Trump
has certainly become aware of it in a way that
he might not have.
Speaker 4 (13:37):
Think about how powerful the narrative really is that's been
sort of foisted on everybody in this country. Can you say,
if you walk into a room, you're like, Elon Musk
is an African? Do people think that you're you know
that that's weird? They there's automatically right. You say it
and they go, ohh whoa, whoa, what do you mean?
So there are land masses that are only for certain
(13:57):
like massive land masses that are only for people of
a certain skin color. Is that is not the position
that they take, but that is the position.
Speaker 2 (14:03):
That Democrats take.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
Evon Musk is factually the most successful African American in
the history of the United States.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
He's the most yeah in the world.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
Yes, maybe the most successful African American in the history
of Africa existing as we know it in civilization. Certainly
he's up near the top of the list. Maybe they'll
make a statute to him in the new African American
Museum going up on the National Mall. That would be
Can you imagine Can you imagine the reaction if Trump
(14:37):
came out and said, Hey, I think we need an
Evon musk wing in the new African American Mall that's
going up on the Capitol, the Capitol Mall. That the
reaction to that would be absolutely hysterical. All right, look,
we'll get back into this. We'll actually take you to
a couple of clips of the president here in just
a second, talking to the President of South Africa. But
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apply Welcome back in to Clay and Buck. Oh my uh.
Speaker 4 (16:10):
Play asks a great question one of the President of
South Africa, Cyril Ramaposa.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
What did he think he was walking into with this?
You know, this is a hell of a bear trap.
I mean they really set him up because think about
this now. Structurally, Trump knows that if he admits these
fifty South African farmers into the United States, Buck, that
He's going to get ripped to the high heavens by
the media who were going to say, there's no Democrats,
there's no reasonable justification for this at all. He probably
(16:40):
already had this four and a half minute video to
his staff credit done. He knows South Africa's president is
coming for a visit, and they just sprung an incredible
trap on the media and the Democrats because it is
beyond dispute that there are white people being murdered in
South Africa because of their race, and he just played it,
(17:03):
forcing everyone in that Oval office to cover this as
a news story, and he did it entirely on his terms.
It is an unbelievable master class in owning the narrative.
And I think this is a masterclass in a very
long tease that is going to extend us through the
next break, Clay, because now your additional intro has put
(17:25):
us beyond time to play the clip, So I'm going
to have to wait. I'm like, guys, I promise we're
gonna play Trump when we get back. Clay's like, wait, wait, wait.
This is like in Survivor when they're like, and we
have the results for you when we come back from
this break you know what I mean, or The Bachelor
or whatever. So se Clainos headline just got from the
(17:46):
New York Times, Buck, you know, breaking news. Trump's meeting
with South African leader turns contentious over genocide claims, as
you would expect might happen when there are genocide claims
that are made.
Speaker 4 (17:58):
We are going to jump into this. We will play
I promise you, Clay promises to this time. We're gonna
play the clips here when we come back with you
in just a minute of Trump.
Speaker 2 (18:08):
He's amazing. He's just amazing, honestly, like I love this guy.
Speaker 1 (18:13):
We also love everybody who is fighting to help keep
as many people safe as possible in Israel. I was
over there in December, as all of you know, and
it is incredibly important to provide as much support as
we can for the people of Israel. Country is not
as wealthy as you might anticipate, still a very young
(18:34):
country filled with lots of people of a variety of
different backgrounds, and what they need right now is help
dealing with war on all front and also, boy, they
really need help with being able to protect themselves, whether
it's bomb shelters, whether it's bulletproof vehicles. That's what the
International Fellowship of Christians and Jews does. They provide a
(18:57):
lifeline in the form of hot meals boxes for of
healthy food. A lot of Holocaust survivors not able to
take care of themselves necessarily, you can help at IFCJ
dot org. That's IFCJ dot org.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
Sexton on the front Lines of Truth.
Speaker 1 (19:16):
Welcome back in Clay Travis Buck Sexton Show. Okay, we're
going to play some audio from the explosive meeting with
South Africa's president here in a moment. But I told
you how this was going to be covered by many
of the same media outlets that told you that Joe
Biden was fit as a fiddle and sharp as attack
and the best version of himself that he's ever been.
Breaking news New York Times meeting with This is the
(19:38):
opening paragraph. Meeting with President Cyril Ramafosa of South Africa.
President Trump showed videos meant to back up his false
claims about mass killings of a white ethnic minority. That
is the breaking news that you would have just received
if you, like me, are a New York Times subscriber.
(20:02):
Also from Axios, headline Trump and Bush's South Africa's President
with video footage in the Oval office. There's no evidence,
says Axios, that white farmers are experience experiencing a spike
in violence, despite a few high profile cases. I mean,
(20:25):
this is really kind of amazing. But I just wanted
to tell you. You knew how this would be covered
by the same people who told you that Joe Biden
was the best version of himself. But I want to
play some of you some of this so you can
hear it yourself. Trump Cut twenty five. Let's listen to this.
Speaker 6 (20:49):
So we'll be discussing many things and some of the
things you've been reading about in the papers, in the media.
Speaker 5 (20:55):
And I would say that, look, though the President is.
Speaker 6 (21:00):
A truly respected man in many many circles, and in
some circles he is considered a little controversial. But we're
going to be discussing some of the things that are
taking place in South Africa.
Speaker 5 (21:12):
See, we can help and we want to help.
Speaker 1 (21:16):
All Right, I'm going to play several of these because
it's going to be a big news story. Cut twenty seven.
This has just happened in the last little bit. This
is Trump confronting South Africa's president about the amount of
people calling for the killing of white people.
Speaker 6 (21:32):
They have hundreds of people, thousands of people trying to
come into our country because they feel they're going to
be killed and their land is going to be confiscated.
And you do have laws that were passed that gives
you the right to confiscate land for no payment.
Speaker 7 (21:45):
You can take away land for no payment. I don't
want to clarify that, because we have a constitution. A
constitution guarantees and protects the sanctity of tenure of land ownership,
and that constitution protect all South Africans with regards to
land ownership. However, we do say, because we've got to
(22:08):
deal with the past, the government and s your government
also has their right to it's appropriate land for public use,
and we're doing that, and we've never really got in
underway with that, and we are going to be.
Speaker 5 (22:23):
Doing you're taking you're taking people's land. We have not examined.
Speaker 6 (22:27):
And those people, in many cases are being executed. They're
being executed, and they happen to be white, and most
of them happened to be farmers. And that's a tough situation.
I don't know how you explain that. How do you
explain that they're taking people's land away, and in many
cases those people are being executed.
Speaker 5 (22:47):
And in many cases it's not.
Speaker 6 (22:48):
The government that soon, it's people that kill them and
then take their land and nothing happens to them. But
we have thousands of people that want to come into
our country. They're also going to Australia owner number. But
we have thousands of people that want to come into
our country and they're white farmers, and they feel that
they're going to die in South Africa.
Speaker 5 (23:10):
And it's a bad thing.
Speaker 1 (23:14):
Wait a couple more, because it keeps getting it keeps
getting more contentious. You can't accuse Trump of being unwilling
to confront things like this. When he sees it cut
twenty eight, he says, how about the stadium rallies where
they're chanting to kill white farmers in South Africa?
Speaker 7 (23:31):
We in nineteen fifty five adopted a document which said,
so Africa belongs.
Speaker 5 (23:37):
To poor lad But why wouldn't you arrest that man?
Speaker 6 (23:41):
That man said kill the white farmers, kill the white farmers.
And then he danced, and he's dancing dancing, and it's
killed the white farmers.
Speaker 5 (23:50):
I think I'm not sure, but I think.
Speaker 6 (23:52):
If somebody got up in Parliament and started saying kill
a certain group of people that he would be in
would be arrested very quickly. That man is going all
over South Africa. And that's not a small party. That
was a stadium that holds one hundred thousand people and
I hardly saw.
Speaker 5 (24:11):
An empty sea. That's a lot of people.
Speaker 6 (24:13):
That's a lot of representation, and those crosses. We have
dead white people, dead white farmers mostly.
Speaker 5 (24:22):
And you take a look at Australia, they're.
Speaker 6 (24:24):
Being inundated and whipping inundated with people that want to
get out and their farmers valueless.
Speaker 5 (24:31):
It's valueless and they just want to get out with
their life.
Speaker 6 (24:35):
And this is a very serious situation.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
Okay, a couple of other because there's a lot going
on here. A reporter asked, hey, you're saying genocide. Have
you made up your mind as to whether you believe
genocide is occurring in South Africa?
Speaker 2 (24:54):
Cut twenty nine.
Speaker 5 (24:55):
That's a very strong word. I don't eat up your mind.
That's whether people The Times I has a crime as that.
Speaker 3 (25:02):
Was, hows why the president I'm a close secure.
Speaker 5 (25:06):
Stay well, I haven't made up my mind. I hate
to see it. Uh.
Speaker 6 (25:10):
From the same point of South Africa. But also you know,
I'm trying to save lives. I'm working with Russia and Ukraine.
Speaker 5 (25:16):
I don't have to do that. It's not our war.
It was started by other people.
Speaker 6 (25:20):
Uh, something belonged by our past administration, and we would've
never happened if I were president.
Speaker 5 (25:25):
But I'm trying to save lives and no matter where.
Speaker 6 (25:28):
Uh Rwanda, I have nothing to do with Rwanda and
the Congo. But I felt I had a very talented
person in this administration and I sent him there and
he did an unbelievable job.
Speaker 5 (25:41):
I think.
Speaker 6 (25:42):
I mean, we're gonna find out, but he's uh done
the hardest part of the job.
Speaker 5 (25:45):
It should it should happen. If I can save lives,
I wanna save the lives.
Speaker 6 (25:50):
If it's in Africa, that's great, If it's in Europe,
if it's uh wherever it may be. And uh it's
a very small investment to do, believe mean compared to
what the consequences.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
Okay, one last I mentioned that he had retief Goosen
and Ernie els Buck. You've covered this, You've talked about
it before, Zimbabwe, South Africa. Are you kind of stunned
that this is suddenly now going to be on the
public consciousness, maybe in a way that it hasn't ever before.
Speaker 4 (26:16):
Oh yeah, well, I mean I'm I'm thrilled because people
should know about this. I've been covering this issue for
a long time. I've had I have some friends who
are South African. I have a friend who's a South
African journalist. And you know, I've heard the harrowing tales
of the home invasions, the police who never show up.
Think about that. It's one thing to say that police
don't show up fast enough. Imagine if the police just
don't come after a home invasion. I mean, some of
(26:38):
the stuff that you'll hear about in that country and
the way things go are you know, just jarring. And
what's funny to me, Clay, is that a lot of
these people in you have to remember, people to hear
the Washington Post, most of the people doing the like
copywriting and the and the day to day stuff in
that newsroom are you know, twenty five to thirty five
(27:01):
year old libs who don't know anything. I mean, they
don't know. They're ass from their elbow, honestly, and they
certainly don't know anything about South Africa and So what's
funny is that these people know they know what they're
supposed to say because of the narrative here, which is like,
there's no racism in South Africa. But if you actually
know anything about South Africa or what's happened next to
(27:23):
or in Zimbabwe for that matter, it's explicitly soaked.
Speaker 2 (27:27):
In racism as a matter of policy. And the whole thing,
the whole state is.
Speaker 4 (27:31):
Being built upon, the new South African state is being
built upon explicitly racist policy. And so they've taken this
argument that what Trump is doing is wrong. But to
your point about the bear trap, they don't know they
will lose.
Speaker 1 (27:44):
This is a little bit like the you know, do
trans men really have an athletic advantage over women?
Speaker 2 (27:52):
Yes? They do.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
Is South African government South Africa's government racist against white.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
People, Yes it is. They just don't know.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Here is I mentioned Ratief Goosen and Ernie Els. These
are major winners in the PGA tour. If you're a golfer,
you certainly know these names. Ratief Goosen and Ernie Els,
both in the Oval office. Ratief Goosen says, hey, my
dad was a property developer. Some of his buddy farmers
got killed, telling you directly about his experience as a
(28:24):
South African living there.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
Here's Ratief Goosen.
Speaker 5 (28:27):
I grew up in.
Speaker 8 (28:28):
An area in South Africa that he's a farmman area,
and there's some.
Speaker 5 (28:35):
Issues up there.
Speaker 8 (28:36):
Obviously my dad was a proper develop as well as
a part time farmer. And yes, some of these buddy
farmers got killed. The farm is still going, my brothers running,
but it's a constant bethnal of farm's trying to get
trying to burn the farm's down.
Speaker 5 (28:54):
To chase you away.
Speaker 8 (28:56):
So it is it is a concern to try and
a thing as a farmer and today and they you know,
if that farm is not food on the plate, so
we need we meet the farm.
Speaker 5 (29:07):
You wouldn't do it. You wouldn't even want to do
what you'd do. They love the farming, they don't want
to leave. It's just struggle.
Speaker 4 (29:15):
So just got just another little bit of sorry, Clay.
You know, I get I'm very fared up about this.
You know what when this when they when the Dutch
landed in South Africa and this that middle of the
seventeenth century, you know it's uh, it would have been
very hard for them to steal the farms because there
was no farming going on, certainly nothing that we would
consider farming on a scale that could feed population centers
(29:38):
because there also were no major population centers. So, you know,
it's interesting as people think this through and they're trying
to decide, like, well, who's native to the land and
who's not and all this other stuff. I would also
point this out, Clay, we have we have a lot
of farmers who listen right. We got a lot of
people who either grew up on farms are still farm
you know, who are listening to our show right now.
How many of them know a farmer who's targeted and
(30:01):
murdered for being a farmer and had their farm burned down? Now, fortunately,
I think the answer is probably zero. But yet it's
a commonplace occurrence in South Africa. What does that tell you, Like,
generally farmers aren't in the crosshairs, you know what I mean?
And clearly they are in South Africa, which is why
(30:22):
Trump was showing news stories about murdered farmers.
Speaker 2 (30:29):
If you're in a farm, you're in a rural area.
Speaker 4 (30:30):
Like how many rural area home invasions that are killing
farmers in this country? Like you start to think this
through and you realize, oh, there's something going on here,
like maybe the government has incited the population against these
people as a means of distracting from the fact that
(30:51):
the South African government is one of the most clownishly
corrupt governments in the world, wildly corrupt. And also, I
think this is important to your larger context. This happened
in Zimbabwe. And when it happened in Zimbabwe, the entire
country was destroyed because the land can no longer be
(31:14):
used productively. This is not going to shock any of you.
Speaker 1 (31:17):
But when the government takes land and tries to give
it to someone else and say, hey, you use this
land more productively than the people who have farmed it
for hundreds of years, the likelihood of that land being
used more productively and producing more value is virtually zero.
I think that would be true anywhere in the world.
(31:40):
Right have you ever heard of a land confiscation by
the government that has gone better than letting individuals use
that land. When it comes to farming, this always fails.
Speaker 4 (31:50):
It generally leads to mass starvation and horrific oppression, which
is what happens next door in Zimbabwe. And said, I've
mentioned it before and some of you who said book
the name of It Mugabe and the White African. It
is a fabulous documentary. I think you can watch it
even on YouTube. I think they have the full thing
up on YouTube. Go watch it. Because Clay, to your point,
(32:12):
the politicians who take over use the racial animus of
admittedly these countries were stratified by race and oppressive where
the white minority was oppressed, and that's wrong and that
should end true one hundred percent, okay, But then they
use the animus of, oh, our government, our new government
that doesn't have that system in place, is failing you terribly.
(32:34):
It's the farmer's fault. You know what will fix it?
If we take their land, that will fix it. But
then you know what they do. They have armed men
of this you know, are basically armed thugs of the
state show up and they say get off this land,
and they murder the farmers who won't, and then they
just sell off all the farm equipment, they burn down
the houses, and then there's no food produced.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
And I think this is really important in the case
of South Africa, but I think we've seen echo of
it here in the United States. You don't typically redress
racism by having more racism from the other side, it might,
in a vengeance perspective, feel better. And I think that's
the political calculus that is often deployed by leaders in
(33:17):
those countries because it's easier to make people feel angry
and to use those emotions to propel your own power.
But it actually is ultimately destructive in the same way
that the original racism you tried to fight was as well.
Speaker 4 (33:33):
The Democrats, they see this, the case study of black
racism against a white minority, establishes firmly in the minds
of anyone paying attention the principle that racism is possible
by any person against any person of another race, and
it is a bad thing. And that is not something
(33:54):
that we have been allowed to say in this country
for a long time, because we have been told, because
of intersectionality in the left and blah blah blah critical
race theory, that it is only possible for whites to
be racist. And this is why they're so upset, because
this is one of the This is a closely held
belief by the Democrats. That's also why any conservative who
opposed this fifty African or showing up some of them
(34:16):
are people that I like, but they're wrong. They were
wrong on this issue. This is important, it's super important.
Speaker 1 (34:21):
It is also the case that this directly ties into
what happened October seventh in Israel, because, as we have
told you, Israelis are seen as white and Palestinians are
seen as brown. And the American college kids who have
been taught this critical race theory cannot conceptualize the ideas
that a brown person could be violent in an unjustified
(34:42):
manner against a white person, and that underlies virtually all
of the protests that you've seen on American college campuses. Absolutely,
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Speaker 9 (35:42):
Radio back into play in buck.
Speaker 5 (35:54):
Here.
Speaker 4 (35:54):
We got a caller calling in from Wisconsin.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
Jim, Wisconsin. Go for it.
Speaker 3 (36:01):
Hey, how are you doing?
Speaker 2 (36:02):
We're fabulous.
Speaker 3 (36:05):
Yeah, I just called this say I have my daughter
in law, my son married a girl from South Africa,
and everything you say is true. I'm a true strilled
to finally get out of there. They're not safe at
home or anywhere they go. They have to have almost
half guards. You know. They can't go shopping, you know,
(36:25):
if you're white, because they will be attacked. You know,
and everything thank you for is difficult.
Speaker 1 (36:32):
Thank you for the call. We've talked about this before,
but I'm somewhat familiar. I haven't been. I would love
to go to Africa at some point in continent. I
haven't been to but they don't require women to stop
at red lights because crime is so rampant in that country.
And it is true that the majority of the victims
of crime in South Africa are going to be black,
because the majority of South Africans are black. But it
(36:55):
is also true that racism anywhere in the world is wrong,
and that you do not cure racism by implementing more racism.
And I think South Africa is a very feakend example
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four eight two four Safe Today
Welcome to today's edition of the Clay Travis and Buck
Sexton Show podcast. Welcome back in Clay Travis Buck Sexton Show.
So just now in the Oval Office, Trump is meeting
(00:22):
with the president of South Africa.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Have you seen this yet? Buck? Oh? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (00:27):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
He dimmed the lights in the Oval Office and played
a four and a half minute video of South African
lawmakers demanding that white people be killed and their land
be sieved. And it is blowing up everywhere as we speak.
(00:51):
I am scrolling through to see how South Africa's leader responded,
but it is It is really pretty extraordinary, these moments
that Trump is having in the Oval Office with leaders
of foreign countries, whether it was Zelenski in February, now
(01:12):
the South African leader today. And of course this comes
on the heel was at fifty nine fifty some odd
South African farmers who were white being granted amnesty in
the United States, and everybody came out and said, oh
my goodness, this is on the Democrat side, unacceptable and
this has just happened. So we will pay attention to you.
(01:33):
I just want to give you a heads up, Buck.
This is something we've talked about quite a lot on
the show, and it has not gotten very much attention.
But remember one of the CNN commentators said, why don't
they just go back to where they're from? And many
of these South African white farmers have been there for
hundreds of years, some of them since the sixteen hundreds.
(01:55):
And these were people that have been victims of islands
at high levels.
Speaker 4 (02:01):
The Dutch East India Company land around the what is
it the Cape of Good Hope around sixteen fifty four,
and the Dutch didn't displace and there was no one there.
Now you could say there was somebody there in the
land that is now currently South Africa. Yeah, but it
(02:22):
was a sparsely populated land. Here's some things that people
don't ever think about when they talk about this what
was considered tribal land at that point. Well, they may
be curious to know that in the seventeenth century and
that part of Africa, the tribes almost to I think
every single one. I mean, I'm trying to think of
there's any exception.
Speaker 2 (02:41):
Clay.
Speaker 4 (02:42):
They were migrant herdsmen, if you will, So they were
constantly on the move. They would move with the seasons,
they would move with their herds. They were overwhelming a
herding societies. So what's their land or rather how much
land or what really is is why is it that
there's an assumption that to be native to Africa you
(03:04):
have to be black. There there are people now, I
know people are gonna say everybody originated from Africa, and
I'm aware of this too, and the you know, the
anthropological origins of the of the human species.
Speaker 1 (03:14):
But there's the whole northern part of Africa. Is you know,
is Egypt part of Africa. It's a fun thing to
ask people, this is Egypt part of Africa? They go, well, yes,
but so are Egyptians Africans?
Speaker 2 (03:26):
People will say no, and you say why why is
not the case? Of course they're Africans right.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
Anyway, It's interesting the way these things are spoken about
and talked about because the storyline, Now, yes, was there
a racist system of.
Speaker 4 (03:41):
Apartheid instituted that you know, needed to be overturned. Absolutely,
it happened, But they didn't overturn it with a system
that was also not race or rather that was not racist.
They overturned it with a system that was explicitly racist.
It just switched the direction of the racism and what
you see now with Trump showing everybody what's really going on,
(04:04):
is that the objection. You know, Clay, We've been covering
the immigration issue very closely every time, and I used
to have these fights. And you know, when I lived
in DC for a couple of years, I was doing
the show at the Hill. We'd have all these Democrats on.
I would say, these people are not asylum secrets.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
So yes they are.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
They deserve their day in court, they deserve to present
evidence to show. I'm like, these people are showing up
with with Q cards that say in whatever language they speak,
you know, and by the way, I mean actual QUE cards.
They actually would have this written out. Sometimes I have
a credible fear of violence in my insert the blank country,
and that was how you pass their credible fear test.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
Clay.
Speaker 4 (04:39):
I bring this up because all the media are assuming
that these fifty migrants that we've taken in from legally
taken in from South Africa are not deserving of asylum.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
They have no idea, None of.
Speaker 4 (04:52):
These people have, you know, they haven't looked into their
individual cases. Their objection to the South African migrants, and
this goes to what Trump is is explicitly I think
showing every right now is that they are white and
that they've come here legally.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:07):
Look, sorry, I'm just catching up because of this Oval
Office event reminds me of what happened with Ukraine, where
we're live on the air and we're like, oh my goodness,
like this is kind of remarkable. I'm sending some clips
in to our team so that they can be on
top of this and we can share with all of you. Look,
this is I think significant. You might say, Okay, why
(05:28):
does this matter?
Speaker 5 (05:29):
Right?
Speaker 1 (05:31):
Well, and again I'm texting in different clips that have
just happened in the Oval Office to our team so
that we can make sure that we're on top of this.
What is really happening here in the Oval Office is
and this is unique. I don't remember this happening very often.
Trump has decided that one of the best ways he
(05:51):
can dominate the news cycle and force the media to
talk about what he wants them to talk about is
do it while you have these gatherings with foreign leaders
in the Oval Office, which are traditionally just kind of banal.
There's not a lot of news that comes out of them.
They talk about how much they like each other, and
(06:12):
it's a kind of a grip and grin handshake style event.
Trump is turning them into must see television and also
forcing then the media to cover what takes place there. Now,
I can already tell you what the response to this
is going to be. Oh, Trump only cares about violence
in South Africa when it impacts white people, right, And
(06:33):
they're going to say, well, yes, there is violence against
white people in South Africa, but South Africa has huge
rates of violence overall, and black people are actually much
more likely to be victims of violence in South Africa,
which is true because they're the majority of the country.
But I'm just telling you what the talking points will
be in response to this.
Speaker 4 (06:52):
But let's keep digging into this, right, Let's keep having
this fight with them, because they're wrong, and so they'll lose.
The more that's exposed, the more that is known about this,
weaker the Democrat position becomes, which is true of almost
every Democrat position, I think, But in this case, I
think they're digging a deeper hole for themselves than they realize.
First of all, the people, and you're right about what
they're talking points will be. The people that would make
(07:12):
that case though, are also people who in this country,
for example, we say they only care about let's say
police brutality or police violence that involves members of the
black community, correct, even though guess what, overwhelmingly it is
members of the white community who suffer from state or
police violence.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
But they will say, oh, it's all about the proportion.
Speaker 4 (07:34):
Okay, Well, then let's take a look at the proportional
violence in South Africa, and let's also take a look
at the you know, the reason, the motive for that violence,
and it is in many cases explicitly anti white, and
it is encouraged by the state. So mir the people
who are objecting to the South African migrants, when they
(07:56):
apply a similar framework of state violent racism in this country,
you can see they actually have no principles to work
on whatsoever. That that that it's only what happens here
and what happens there they view as totally you know,
irrelevant comparisons when they're actually very apt comparisons.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
Well, look, I mean I use this analogy all the
time because I think it is an important aspirational goal. Lady,
justice is blind. Go look at any exact I've heard
you say that before, You've heard me say it. But
I think it's it's such an important example to use
because it's an aspirational goal for all of society that
we would weigh guilt or innocence based.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
Not in any way on what the.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
Race or gender, or ethnicity or religion or sexuality is
of the accused, that we would just look at the facts.
And in many ways, what happens is we swung right
from admittedly racism against minorities to racism is okay in
favor of minorities to make up for racism in the past,
(09:03):
and we skipped right over trying to have fair and
impartial application of justice.
Speaker 4 (09:07):
Well, now you're hitting on the critical principle that is
so upsetting. So there's the immigration component of this right,
which is America shouldn't take in any white people really
as immigrants period. I mean, that's what the Democrats actually want.
Democrats believe that a less white America will inherently be
(09:29):
a more just America because it is the white people
in America who do all the oppressing, right, if you
actually take their love, So they think that a more
just America must be a less white America. That is
a left wing Democrat belief. So that's on the immigration piece, Clay.
But the other piece, which is what you just touched on,
is in South Africa, you have a dender rights case
(09:50):
of black racism against white people as a matter of law,
as a matter of policy, and as a matter of
day to day life. Well, if it's possible there, doesn't
that go against the narrative in this country of only
white people can be racist?
Speaker 2 (10:09):
Yes, it distracts this.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
This is what I would say is a foundational idea
that I would encourage all of you to contemplate if
you haven't already come to the conclusion white, Black, Asian
and Hispanic people can all be racist. That is one
billion percent true. Kind of like we're very anti cancer here,
we're very anti racism, yes, but you know the thing
(10:32):
with like the cancer, like there's no good cancer, and
there's no good racism.
Speaker 4 (10:36):
We're anti it across the board. I'm anti any racial
animis based on skin color. I'm anti all tumors, right,
I mean this is you can be consistent. Yes, and
we wish nobody ever died. We would be very pro
immortality too. Yes, we are pro anty death, anti death,
pro living.
Speaker 1 (10:53):
But I do think that that statement that I just
made white black Asian and Hispanic people can all be racist.
Many Democrats, many left wing voters would say, no, Clay,
you're wrong.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Oh, they fundamentally reject that.
Speaker 1 (11:07):
Yes, only white people can be racist, and therefore we
can only focus on racism white in the direction of black,
Asian or Hispanic. And what's really fascinating about this is
you question me. You say, Okay, Clay, I don't disagree.
Remember when stop Asian Hate just vanished, when they decided
that Asian hate was actually being driven You know what
(11:27):
the problem with that campaign was surveillance cameras.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
Yeah, it's rough. They start rough.
Speaker 1 (11:33):
It was like two months they were like this, and
it was that post COVID they were like, this rise
of anti Asian hate is unexcepted.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
They the media was like.
Speaker 1 (11:41):
Must be guys named Billy, Bob and Maga hats and no,
it turned out it was not mostly black guys beating
up innocent Asian people. And they were like, oh, well,
Asian hate's really not that big of a deal. And look,
hate is wrong. Racism is wrong, but it can run
in many different directs. Should be condemned everywhere. By the way,
(12:01):
this is interesting too, Trump, I don't know I've ever
seen a president who loves athletes more. He's got Ernie
Els and Ratief Goosen, two famous South African golfers with.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
Him in the meeting.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
And Ernie Els and Ratief Goosen have spoken out to
say they want to see the country flourish, but they
have to end racism in the country in order for
that to happen. So those are two white golfers who
many of you out there who are golf fans will
know very well. Ernie El's Ratief Goosen, both major winners
in the PGA Tour, and just goes there just this
(12:38):
is another moment where Trump is forcing the Democrats. It's
like the MS thirteen guy and that we're all supposed
to care so much that he was deported, you know,
the bad guy. Trump is forcing the Democrats here because
he knows how they think to defend the indefensible, which
is the policies right now of South Africa. They are
morally and intellectually indefensible. If you're anti racism, yes, and
(13:00):
it's an example of moving from apartheid, which was wrong,
to now a new form of racism, which is white
no longer being in the control of the government. I
think they're seven percent of the population. I would also
point out and being discriminated against by the majority black
ruling class. Now I would also point out Elon Musk
is South African, So I think I would. I would
(13:23):
bet that one reason Trump has become more aware of
this is that Elon Musk has been outspoken about what
he has seen in his country, and I think Trump
has certainly become aware of it in a way that
he might not have.
Speaker 4 (13:37):
Think about how powerful the narrative really is that's been
sort of foisted on everybody in this country. Can you say,
if you walk into a room, you're like, Elon Musk
is an African? Do people think that you're you know
that that's weird? They there's automatically right. You say it
and they go, ohh whoa, whoa, what do you mean?
So there are land masses that are only for certain
(13:57):
like massive land masses that are only for people of
a certain skin color. Is that is not the position
that they take, but that is the position.
Speaker 2 (14:03):
That Democrats take.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
Evon Musk is factually the most successful African American in
the history of the United States.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
He's the most yeah in the world.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
Yes, maybe the most successful African American in the history
of Africa existing as we know it in civilization. Certainly
he's up near the top of the list. Maybe they'll
make a statute to him in the new African American
Museum going up on the National Mall. That would be
Can you imagine Can you imagine the reaction if Trump
(14:37):
came out and said, Hey, I think we need an
Evon musk wing in the new African American Mall that's
going up on the Capitol, the Capitol Mall. That the
reaction to that would be absolutely hysterical. All right, look,
we'll get back into this. We'll actually take you to
a couple of clips of the president here in just
a second, talking to the President of South Africa. But
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apply Welcome back in to Clay and Buck. Oh my uh.
Speaker 4 (16:10):
Play asks a great question one of the President of
South Africa, Cyril Ramaposa.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
What did he think he was walking into with this?
You know, this is a hell of a bear trap.
I mean they really set him up because think about
this now. Structurally, Trump knows that if he admits these
fifty South African farmers into the United States, Buck, that
He's going to get ripped to the high heavens by
the media who were going to say, there's no Democrats,
there's no reasonable justification for this at all. He probably
(16:40):
already had this four and a half minute video to
his staff credit done. He knows South Africa's president is
coming for a visit, and they just sprung an incredible
trap on the media and the Democrats because it is
beyond dispute that there are white people being murdered in
South Africa because of their race, and he just played it,
(17:03):
forcing everyone in that Oval office to cover this as
a news story, and he did it entirely on his terms.
It is an unbelievable master class in owning the narrative.
And I think this is a masterclass in a very
long tease that is going to extend us through the
next break, Clay, because now your additional intro has put
(17:25):
us beyond time to play the clip, So I'm going
to have to wait. I'm like, guys, I promise we're
gonna play Trump when we get back. Clay's like, wait, wait, wait.
This is like in Survivor when they're like, and we
have the results for you when we come back from
this break you know what I mean, or The Bachelor
or whatever. So se Clainos headline just got from the
(17:46):
New York Times, Buck, you know, breaking news. Trump's meeting
with South African leader turns contentious over genocide claims, as
you would expect might happen when there are genocide claims
that are made.
Speaker 4 (17:58):
We are going to jump into this. We will play
I promise you, Clay promises to this time. We're gonna
play the clips here when we come back with you
in just a minute of Trump.
Speaker 2 (18:08):
He's amazing. He's just amazing, honestly, like I love this guy.
Speaker 1 (18:13):
We also love everybody who is fighting to help keep
as many people safe as possible in Israel. I was
over there in December, as all of you know, and
it is incredibly important to provide as much support as
we can for the people of Israel. Country is not
as wealthy as you might anticipate, still a very young
(18:34):
country filled with lots of people of a variety of
different backgrounds, and what they need right now is help
dealing with war on all front and also, boy, they
really need help with being able to protect themselves, whether
it's bomb shelters, whether it's bulletproof vehicles. That's what the
International Fellowship of Christians and Jews does. They provide a
(18:57):
lifeline in the form of hot meals boxes for of
healthy food. A lot of Holocaust survivors not able to
take care of themselves necessarily, you can help at IFCJ
dot org. That's IFCJ dot org.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
Sexton on the front Lines of Truth.
Speaker 1 (19:16):
Welcome back in Clay Travis Buck Sexton Show. Okay, we're
going to play some audio from the explosive meeting with
South Africa's president here in a moment. But I told
you how this was going to be covered by many
of the same media outlets that told you that Joe
Biden was fit as a fiddle and sharp as attack
and the best version of himself that he's ever been.
Breaking news New York Times meeting with This is the
(19:38):
opening paragraph. Meeting with President Cyril Ramafosa of South Africa.
President Trump showed videos meant to back up his false
claims about mass killings of a white ethnic minority. That
is the breaking news that you would have just received
if you, like me, are a New York Times subscriber.
(20:02):
Also from Axios, headline Trump and Bush's South Africa's President
with video footage in the Oval office. There's no evidence,
says Axios, that white farmers are experience experiencing a spike
in violence, despite a few high profile cases. I mean,
(20:25):
this is really kind of amazing. But I just wanted
to tell you. You knew how this would be covered
by the same people who told you that Joe Biden
was the best version of himself. But I want to
play some of you some of this so you can
hear it yourself. Trump Cut twenty five. Let's listen to this.
Speaker 6 (20:49):
So we'll be discussing many things and some of the
things you've been reading about in the papers, in the media.
Speaker 5 (20:55):
And I would say that, look, though the President is.
Speaker 6 (21:00):
A truly respected man in many many circles, and in
some circles he is considered a little controversial. But we're
going to be discussing some of the things that are
taking place in South Africa.
Speaker 5 (21:12):
See, we can help and we want to help.
Speaker 1 (21:16):
All Right, I'm going to play several of these because
it's going to be a big news story. Cut twenty seven.
This has just happened in the last little bit. This
is Trump confronting South Africa's president about the amount of
people calling for the killing of white people.
Speaker 6 (21:32):
They have hundreds of people, thousands of people trying to
come into our country because they feel they're going to
be killed and their land is going to be confiscated.
And you do have laws that were passed that gives
you the right to confiscate land for no payment.
Speaker 7 (21:45):
You can take away land for no payment. I don't
want to clarify that, because we have a constitution. A
constitution guarantees and protects the sanctity of tenure of land ownership,
and that constitution protect all South Africans with regards to
land ownership. However, we do say, because we've got to
(22:08):
deal with the past, the government and s your government
also has their right to it's appropriate land for public use,
and we're doing that, and we've never really got in
underway with that, and we are going to be.
Speaker 5 (22:23):
Doing you're taking you're taking people's land. We have not examined.
Speaker 6 (22:27):
And those people, in many cases are being executed. They're
being executed, and they happen to be white, and most
of them happened to be farmers. And that's a tough situation.
I don't know how you explain that. How do you
explain that they're taking people's land away, and in many
cases those people are being executed.
Speaker 5 (22:47):
And in many cases it's not.
Speaker 6 (22:48):
The government that soon, it's people that kill them and
then take their land and nothing happens to them. But
we have thousands of people that want to come into
our country. They're also going to Australia owner number. But
we have thousands of people that want to come into
our country and they're white farmers, and they feel that
they're going to die in South Africa.
Speaker 5 (23:10):
And it's a bad thing.
Speaker 1 (23:14):
Wait a couple more, because it keeps getting it keeps
getting more contentious. You can't accuse Trump of being unwilling
to confront things like this. When he sees it cut
twenty eight, he says, how about the stadium rallies where
they're chanting to kill white farmers in South Africa?
Speaker 7 (23:31):
We in nineteen fifty five adopted a document which said,
so Africa belongs.
Speaker 5 (23:37):
To poor lad But why wouldn't you arrest that man?
Speaker 6 (23:41):
That man said kill the white farmers, kill the white farmers.
And then he danced, and he's dancing dancing, and it's
killed the white farmers.
Speaker 5 (23:50):
I think I'm not sure, but I think.
Speaker 6 (23:52):
If somebody got up in Parliament and started saying kill
a certain group of people that he would be in
would be arrested very quickly. That man is going all
over South Africa. And that's not a small party. That
was a stadium that holds one hundred thousand people and
I hardly saw.
Speaker 5 (24:11):
An empty sea. That's a lot of people.
Speaker 6 (24:13):
That's a lot of representation, and those crosses. We have
dead white people, dead white farmers mostly.
Speaker 5 (24:22):
And you take a look at Australia, they're.
Speaker 6 (24:24):
Being inundated and whipping inundated with people that want to
get out and their farmers valueless.
Speaker 5 (24:31):
It's valueless and they just want to get out with
their life.
Speaker 6 (24:35):
And this is a very serious situation.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
Okay, a couple of other because there's a lot going
on here. A reporter asked, hey, you're saying genocide. Have
you made up your mind as to whether you believe
genocide is occurring in South Africa?
Speaker 2 (24:54):
Cut twenty nine.
Speaker 5 (24:55):
That's a very strong word. I don't eat up your mind.
That's whether people The Times I has a crime as that.
Speaker 3 (25:02):
Was, hows why the president I'm a close secure.
Speaker 5 (25:06):
Stay well, I haven't made up my mind. I hate
to see it. Uh.
Speaker 6 (25:10):
From the same point of South Africa. But also you know,
I'm trying to save lives. I'm working with Russia and Ukraine.
Speaker 5 (25:16):
I don't have to do that. It's not our war.
It was started by other people.
Speaker 6 (25:20):
Uh, something belonged by our past administration, and we would've
never happened if I were president.
Speaker 5 (25:25):
But I'm trying to save lives and no matter where.
Speaker 6 (25:28):
Uh Rwanda, I have nothing to do with Rwanda and
the Congo. But I felt I had a very talented
person in this administration and I sent him there and
he did an unbelievable job.
Speaker 5 (25:41):
I think.
Speaker 6 (25:42):
I mean, we're gonna find out, but he's uh done
the hardest part of the job.
Speaker 5 (25:45):
It should it should happen. If I can save lives,
I wanna save the lives.
Speaker 6 (25:50):
If it's in Africa, that's great, If it's in Europe,
if it's uh wherever it may be. And uh it's
a very small investment to do, believe mean compared to
what the consequences.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
Okay, one last I mentioned that he had retief Goosen
and Ernie els Buck. You've covered this, You've talked about
it before, Zimbabwe, South Africa. Are you kind of stunned
that this is suddenly now going to be on the
public consciousness, maybe in a way that it hasn't ever before.
Speaker 4 (26:16):
Oh yeah, well, I mean I'm I'm thrilled because people
should know about this. I've been covering this issue for
a long time. I've had I have some friends who
are South African. I have a friend who's a South
African journalist. And you know, I've heard the harrowing tales
of the home invasions, the police who never show up.
Think about that. It's one thing to say that police
don't show up fast enough. Imagine if the police just
don't come after a home invasion. I mean, some of
(26:38):
the stuff that you'll hear about in that country and
the way things go are you know, just jarring. And
what's funny to me, Clay, is that a lot of
these people in you have to remember, people to hear
the Washington Post, most of the people doing the like
copywriting and the and the day to day stuff in
that newsroom are you know, twenty five to thirty five
(27:01):
year old libs who don't know anything. I mean, they
don't know. They're ass from their elbow, honestly, and they
certainly don't know anything about South Africa and So what's
funny is that these people know they know what they're
supposed to say because of the narrative here, which is like,
there's no racism in South Africa. But if you actually
know anything about South Africa or what's happened next to
(27:23):
or in Zimbabwe for that matter, it's explicitly soaked.
Speaker 2 (27:27):
In racism as a matter of policy. And the whole thing,
the whole state is.
Speaker 4 (27:31):
Being built upon, the new South African state is being
built upon explicitly racist policy. And so they've taken this
argument that what Trump is doing is wrong. But to
your point about the bear trap, they don't know they
will lose.
Speaker 1 (27:44):
This is a little bit like the you know, do
trans men really have an athletic advantage over women?
Speaker 2 (27:52):
Yes? They do.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
Is South African government South Africa's government racist against white.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
People, Yes it is. They just don't know.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Here is I mentioned Ratief Goosen and Ernie Els. These
are major winners in the PGA tour. If you're a golfer,
you certainly know these names. Ratief Goosen and Ernie Els,
both in the Oval office. Ratief Goosen says, hey, my
dad was a property developer. Some of his buddy farmers
got killed, telling you directly about his experience as a
(28:24):
South African living there.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
Here's Ratief Goosen.
Speaker 5 (28:27):
I grew up in.
Speaker 8 (28:28):
An area in South Africa that he's a farmman area,
and there's some.
Speaker 5 (28:35):
Issues up there.
Speaker 8 (28:36):
Obviously my dad was a proper develop as well as
a part time farmer. And yes, some of these buddy
farmers got killed. The farm is still going, my brothers running,
but it's a constant bethnal of farm's trying to get
trying to burn the farm's down.
Speaker 5 (28:54):
To chase you away.
Speaker 8 (28:56):
So it is it is a concern to try and
a thing as a farmer and today and they you know,
if that farm is not food on the plate, so
we need we meet the farm.
Speaker 5 (29:07):
You wouldn't do it. You wouldn't even want to do
what you'd do. They love the farming, they don't want
to leave. It's just struggle.
Speaker 4 (29:15):
So just got just another little bit of sorry, Clay.
You know, I get I'm very fared up about this.
You know what when this when they when the Dutch
landed in South Africa and this that middle of the
seventeenth century, you know it's uh, it would have been
very hard for them to steal the farms because there
was no farming going on, certainly nothing that we would
consider farming on a scale that could feed population centers
(29:38):
because there also were no major population centers. So, you know,
it's interesting as people think this through and they're trying
to decide, like, well, who's native to the land and
who's not and all this other stuff. I would also
point this out, Clay, we have we have a lot
of farmers who listen right. We got a lot of
people who either grew up on farms are still farm
you know, who are listening to our show right now.
How many of them know a farmer who's targeted and
(30:01):
murdered for being a farmer and had their farm burned down? Now, fortunately,
I think the answer is probably zero. But yet it's
a commonplace occurrence in South Africa. What does that tell you, Like,
generally farmers aren't in the crosshairs, you know what I mean?
And clearly they are in South Africa, which is why
(30:22):
Trump was showing news stories about murdered farmers.
Speaker 2 (30:29):
If you're in a farm, you're in a rural area.
Speaker 4 (30:30):
Like how many rural area home invasions that are killing
farmers in this country? Like you start to think this
through and you realize, oh, there's something going on here,
like maybe the government has incited the population against these
people as a means of distracting from the fact that
(30:51):
the South African government is one of the most clownishly
corrupt governments in the world, wildly corrupt. And also, I
think this is important to your larger context. This happened
in Zimbabwe. And when it happened in Zimbabwe, the entire
country was destroyed because the land can no longer be
(31:14):
used productively. This is not going to shock any of you.
Speaker 1 (31:17):
But when the government takes land and tries to give
it to someone else and say, hey, you use this
land more productively than the people who have farmed it
for hundreds of years, the likelihood of that land being
used more productively and producing more value is virtually zero.
I think that would be true anywhere in the world.
(31:40):
Right have you ever heard of a land confiscation by
the government that has gone better than letting individuals use
that land. When it comes to farming, this always fails.
Speaker 4 (31:50):
It generally leads to mass starvation and horrific oppression, which
is what happens next door in Zimbabwe. And said, I've
mentioned it before and some of you who said book
the name of It Mugabe and the White African. It
is a fabulous documentary. I think you can watch it
even on YouTube. I think they have the full thing
up on YouTube. Go watch it. Because Clay, to your point,
(32:12):
the politicians who take over use the racial animus of
admittedly these countries were stratified by race and oppressive where
the white minority was oppressed, and that's wrong and that
should end true one hundred percent, okay, But then they
use the animus of, oh, our government, our new government
that doesn't have that system in place, is failing you terribly.
(32:34):
It's the farmer's fault. You know what will fix it?
If we take their land, that will fix it. But
then you know what they do. They have armed men
of this you know, are basically armed thugs of the
state show up and they say get off this land,
and they murder the farmers who won't, and then they
just sell off all the farm equipment, they burn down
the houses, and then there's no food produced.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
And I think this is really important in the case
of South Africa, but I think we've seen echo of
it here in the United States. You don't typically redress
racism by having more racism from the other side, it might,
in a vengeance perspective, feel better. And I think that's
the political calculus that is often deployed by leaders in
(33:17):
those countries because it's easier to make people feel angry
and to use those emotions to propel your own power.
But it actually is ultimately destructive in the same way
that the original racism you tried to fight was as well.
Speaker 4 (33:33):
The Democrats, they see this, the case study of black
racism against a white minority, establishes firmly in the minds
of anyone paying attention the principle that racism is possible
by any person against any person of another race, and
it is a bad thing. And that is not something
(33:54):
that we have been allowed to say in this country
for a long time, because we have been told, because
of intersectionality in the left and blah blah blah critical
race theory, that it is only possible for whites to
be racist. And this is why they're so upset, because
this is one of the This is a closely held
belief by the Democrats. That's also why any conservative who
opposed this fifty African or showing up some of them
(34:16):
are people that I like, but they're wrong. They were
wrong on this issue. This is important, it's super important.
Speaker 1 (34:21):
It is also the case that this directly ties into
what happened October seventh in Israel, because, as we have
told you, Israelis are seen as white and Palestinians are
seen as brown. And the American college kids who have
been taught this critical race theory cannot conceptualize the ideas
that a brown person could be violent in an unjustified
(34:42):
manner against a white person, and that underlies virtually all
of the protests that you've seen on American college campuses. Absolutely,
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Speaker 9 (35:42):
Radio back into play in buck.
Speaker 5 (35:54):
Here.
Speaker 4 (35:54):
We got a caller calling in from Wisconsin.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
Jim, Wisconsin. Go for it.
Speaker 3 (36:01):
Hey, how are you doing?
Speaker 2 (36:02):
We're fabulous.
Speaker 3 (36:05):
Yeah, I just called this say I have my daughter
in law, my son married a girl from South Africa,
and everything you say is true. I'm a true strilled
to finally get out of there. They're not safe at
home or anywhere they go. They have to have almost
half guards. You know. They can't go shopping, you know,
(36:25):
if you're white, because they will be attacked. You know,
and everything thank you for is difficult.
Speaker 1 (36:32):
Thank you for the call. We've talked about this before,
but I'm somewhat familiar. I haven't been. I would love
to go to Africa at some point in continent. I
haven't been to but they don't require women to stop
at red lights because crime is so rampant in that country.
And it is true that the majority of the victims
of crime in South Africa are going to be black,
because the majority of South Africans are black. But it
(36:55):
is also true that racism anywhere in the world is wrong,
and that you do not cure racism by implementing more racism.
And I think South Africa is a very feakend example
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(37:21):
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