P*rn Addiction, Spiritual Warfare & How To Quit For Good | Mason Cain | Ep. 51 - The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Addiction is something that goes way deeper than just the
device to which people experience it. Right, whether it's the
line of cocaine, the syringe of heroin, the pill of fentanyl,
or the website of pornography, addiction is something that goes

(00:23):
down to an individual's core, and once they're ravaged by
this disease, it seems almost impossible to escape. In my world,
I have fourteenage daughters. One of the things that I
worry most about is who are the people who are
the men that they're going to engage with in an

(00:46):
intimate way, and where are those young boys or young men,
Where are they learning their interpretation of a healthy relationship. Unfortunately,
we live in a society world today where pornography has
taken over many of these young boys' lives and creating

(01:07):
an addiction for them. Today, I'm honored beyond measure to
welcome a fellow Christian, but more importantly, a warrior against
Satan in this horrific disease that's just encompassing the whole world.
This man is out there on the front line fighting

(01:28):
this fight day in and day out. So I'm honored
to welcome Mason Kine from unchained Leader dot com. Mason,
thank you so much for joining me.

Speaker 2 (01:38):
Thanks David, I'm really happy to be here. God's got
me on a really crazy ride. And I've noticed that
over the journey of the last couple of years that
we've started Unchained Leader, he's starting to work more and
more through connections with strategic other men, right. And I
think that in a time in a society where we
see men are not stepping up into the roles that

(02:01):
they're designed to live in, there's also this certain group
of men that are like, you know what, like we
feel called and we're going to answer that call, and
we're going to speak truth into lies. We're going to
shine light into darkness. And uh you know, it's funny,
kind of just a series of connections of seeing you
on Sean Ryan's podcast and then senior Instagram page and
just reading about what you were about.

Speaker 3 (02:22):
There was this.

Speaker 2 (02:25):
Supernatural feeling that I was just like, you know what,
David's probably one of those guys, and uh so it's
you know, I'm happy to be here, man, and thank
you for being one of the few that are willing
to speak towards this darkness because it's kind of a
taboo topic that most people don't want to touch with
this ten foot stick.

Speaker 3 (02:42):
Ah, are you kidding me?

Speaker 1 (02:43):
This has been a part of my life since I
was a little boy. I mean since you know you
find those first playboys and penhouses, you know, at your
friend's father's or you know, you know, for us, there
was this you know, this place, you know where a
rope swing was, and all these older boys would dump

(03:04):
these magazines there, and you know, and then you're you know,
it's this this sacred thing that you have to go
and sneak this, and then you know, to now where
it's like directly accessible for kids, any any young kid
that's got a laptop, an iPod, or a computer, they
can access the most depraved things sexually that humans could

(03:28):
ever fathom or create, up to including you know, abuse
of sexual situations, pedophilic demonic you know, attacks that you
can find on the dark web. I mean, it's gotten
to the point now where.

Speaker 3 (03:43):
I mean, you know, you and you.

Speaker 1 (03:44):
Know, I'm sure you'll share some of these statistics here
in a second, but it's so overwhelming and it's so
destructive to the young men and women in the world
right now that if we don't start calling it out
for what it is.

Speaker 3 (03:58):
It's only going to get worse.

Speaker 1 (04:00):
And I think that a direct effect of this is
we're seeing that the drop in marriages, the the you know,
the intensity of divorce rates, the drop in marriages, people
not wanting to get people not wanting to have children,
you know, people not being able to formulate healthy relationships,

(04:21):
and astonishing numbers. So man, like, the fact that this
is what you've you know, dedicated your life to is yeah, I'm.

Speaker 3 (04:30):
In that same boat. Man.

Speaker 1 (04:31):
You know, it's all about that protecting the future generations
for sure, and even our own. I mean there's I mean,
you know, you look at the data of the statistics.
I mean, this is a problem not just for young kids.
It's for you know, men in their twenties, their thirties,
their forties. You know, it falls off a little bit
after their fifties, but you know, it's still a massive
issue at every level. So yeah, man, I'm in the

(04:53):
fight with you on this. It's it's my honor to
have you on. Like I said, I love it, man,
And it's it's interesting what you said. You know a
lot it's times like number one, I think that we
needed to address the problem for what it is. It
is a all out spiritual assault on us.

Speaker 2 (05:11):
Right, and so we look at this as you know,
oh is it this problem? Not like from a spiritual
lens we see throughout scripture. Right, we look at David,
we look at Solomon, we look at Samson, like these
really powerful men. What is the tool that the enemy
used against these men that were dangerous to darkness?

Speaker 3 (05:32):
Right? You see in David's story it was Bathsheba. Right.

Speaker 2 (05:36):
You see in Solomon's story like with all of the
wisdom in the world, like his fall was women, multiple wives, concubines.
You see Solomon like he defeated armies of men and
Delilah was his fall.

Speaker 3 (05:50):
Right.

Speaker 2 (05:51):
And so still to this day, these patterns repeat themselves.
And these these men that are supposed to be stepping
up into the rightful place of the way that God
created them to lead their household spiritually, to lead in
the church, to lead in the community. Right, the enemy
is using this to create this agreement with them of
like starting in childhood, Hey, this is bad. You know

(06:13):
that it's bad, but it's our secret, right, And yes,
it's exposed like most men are exposed in childhood to
some degree. It's becoming increasingly earlier and earlier with the
advancement of technology, with technology getting in kids hands sooner. Actually,
the statistic now is the average age of exposure is
eight to twelve years old.

Speaker 3 (06:35):
And so that initial exposure just as.

Speaker 2 (06:39):
The initial exposure, and we work with around nine thousand
guys instid of our program. It grows every week, but
that's repeated and echoed is pretty accurate inside of our
program as well. But I think that it's also important
to mention that this isn't just a kid's problem, right,
And so the reason that I stepped into to this

(07:01):
field is because this was the most painful and deeply
challenging struggle in my life as an adult.

Speaker 3 (07:12):
Right. And so some of the statistics that we see.

Speaker 2 (07:15):
Number one, porn porn sites are the number one most
traffic thing on the Internet. There's thousands and thousands of
different porn sites. Barner Research Group is one of the
groups that have delve into this is interesting. Not a
whole lot of research groups are picking this topic up,
but pornography specifically. The last research that they just did,

(07:36):
which was published within this last year, sixty nine percent
of men consume pornography once a week. And this is
an anonymous survey inside of the church, fifty four percent
of practicing Christians. So this doesn't mean just somebody that's like, yeah,
I'm a Christian. This is they're practicing, they're actively engaging
in services, they're actively engaging in practices, fifty four percent

(07:59):
of men. And really interesting in something that we've seen
as well, sixty eight percent of pastors have either struggled
or are still struggling with this. And so pornography is
one of those things where you know, I was exposed
early in childhood, and you know, it became this thing
that I tried to quit, try to quit, tried to
give it to God, tried all these apps and blockers

(08:21):
and everything that everybody tries, you know, tells you that
you need to do. And there was this point where
I just accepted that this was going to be, you know,
my cross to carry or the thorn in my side,
or you know these Christianese sayings that people throw out,
and I just needed to keep it a secret.

Speaker 3 (08:39):
And then what's interesting is, you.

Speaker 2 (08:41):
Know, I believed that as I got older that this
problem would maybe lessen er, like maybe my sex drive
would just go down, and it didn't But something interesting
happened as I entered adulthood, as I got married, as
I had a kid and became a father, as I
started a business and became a business owner, was supposed
to be leading.

Speaker 3 (09:01):
As I started to.

Speaker 2 (09:02):
Be viewed as you know, a leader or a man
inside of the of our church, I started to go, well,
it's less acceptable for me to struggle with this problem
now as an adult, right, Like this should be a
kid's problem. And so the older that I got, the
more responsibilities that I got, the harder that it was
for me to admit the truth and admit that I

(09:24):
actually needed help with this problem. And it's not something
that I could conquer alone or with just me and God,
which is interesting, right, And so you know the confusion
there for me was I felt like, you know, through Christ,
all things are possible. Right. But there's also this verse
in the Bible that says that we need to confess

(09:46):
our sins to one another pray for one another so
that we may be healed. And that verse doesn't say,
confess your sins to God, pray with God and He's
going to heal you, just you and him, right, And
so there's this one another connection aspect that was required
for me that I didn't get for a long time.

Speaker 3 (10:03):
What was the thing? Why did you? Why did you not? What?

Speaker 1 (10:07):
What was the resistance for confessing? I love how you
use that idea. I think most people, you know, encapsulate
the idea of confession within the Catholic Church. And it's
like you're this box and you're, you know, confessing your sins.
And I've had multiple people say, well, as a kid,
you know, I wasn't a bad kid, but there wanted
me to force some confession or whatever, and it lost

(10:30):
the gravity of of of what a confessional is really
intended to do. Right, So what was the thing that
was like, all right, obviously you're conscientious about its impact
on your faith, but what was the thing that crossed
the line that was like, oh no, hey you my
swim buddy, my friend, my pastor my wife, whatever it was, Hey,

(10:51):
I've got this challenge.

Speaker 3 (10:52):
Can you help me with this?

Speaker 2 (10:55):
The the initial and I think the main reason that
I would confess other things but not this is because
the way that the enemy works, it's interesting, like he
is the tempter and the accuser, right, and so like
he tempted me with this at a young age. And
then when I gave into the temptation, the accusations, and

(11:16):
the voice in my head started, right, you're weird, you're perverted,
you're messed up, Like you're one of the only people
that struggle with this at this deep of a level. Right,
and then it's interesting, like it strengthened as I became
an adult, and again like being a business owner, being
a husband, being a father, being somebody that from the

(11:37):
outside looking in people were like, you know, Mason's got
it together, And I was very concerned about making other
people painting this illusion that I did have it together.
It became even less acceptable, and I started to buy
into the sly at an even deeper level that I
got to be one of the only, you know, strong
Christian men that look like they have it all together,

(12:00):
that have, you know, a beautiful wife and an amazing child,
they have a successful business, that are still struggling with
this childish thing in my mind. Right, there was this
point in my life where my marriage was just breaking
and it was headed towards imminent destruction.

Speaker 3 (12:21):
Right.

Speaker 2 (12:22):
My wife and I had argued, but the arguments shifted
from contention to like logistics, right, Like when we get divorced.

Speaker 3 (12:31):
How often am I going to get to see my kid?

Speaker 2 (12:34):
And there was this this just thought of At this point,
pornography was still a secret, right, And I think that's
what weighed on me most, is I was living one
life to everybody else, and then I was living this
separate secret life that was I just knew about, right,

(12:54):
And I wondered if this secret life had something to
do with my marriage falling part right, because she doesn't
know about it, like it's just it's just me and
my phone, right, like I do this in secret.

Speaker 3 (13:09):
Could these things be connected?

Speaker 2 (13:11):
And I realized that it didn't really matter if they were,
and if that's what was causing my marriage to fail,
like whether my marriage was amazing or it failed, like
if I had this secret, and if I felt guilt
and shame and like I was stuck and I couldn't
get out, I didn't want to live another day like that, right,
And and at that point, my pain of staying the

(13:35):
same became greater than the pain of admitting that I
have a problem and dealing with the consequences of it.
And so that was the way that I saw it
in my mind. But really, if we look at this
from a thirty thousand foot view, what happened is I
was being really prideful, right, Like I had this this

(13:58):
perception that I I wanted everybody to view me from.
I spent a lot of time trying to, you know,
formulate this perception, and it was really prideful like I
and biblically like I had to step into humility, which
I didn't understand I was doing at the time. I
was just broken, right, pride becomes comes before the fall,

(14:21):
and like humility is a prerequisite for healing. And so
that moment where I admitted that I had a problem,
I started trying to seek help. It was a long,
really painful journey, but that started the shift of exiting
the bondage that I was in and like the darkness
that I was trapped in, the invisible present that I
felt like I was in, to going through this journey

(14:43):
of discovering why I actually had this problem, right because
it wasn't just a behavior issue or a willpower problem
as much deeper than that. And then on the journey
that eventually led to unchained leader and you know, nine
thousand plus guys that have been you know, walked through
through our process at this point.

Speaker 1 (15:01):
That's I mean, that's the crux of this whole thing, right,
is getting to that point where you can be humble
in your own sin. And I think that's the transform
that's the transformative place, you know. I remember, for me
a big component of this I had had my first daughter.
I was traveling back and forth, you know, speaking and

(15:23):
doing these engagements and really talking about you know, these
core motivational ideas. One of them is learning to embrace fear.
And I remember I was sitting in an air in
the airplane flye and behind.

Speaker 3 (15:35):
Me this this woman.

Speaker 1 (15:37):
Probably a college aged girl, struck up a conversation with
a woman next door and they were chatting and I
don't know how it came up, but pornography came up
in some interesting way, and she made a comment that
you know what, it really effectively me because my whole

(15:58):
life growing up, my father had playboys and penthouses, you know,
in his bathroom or in his closet, and you know,
it was me and my sisters and it all affected us.
We never said anything, and then when we all kind
of got older, we it kind of came out, and
it was very tumultuous and we were very angry. You

(16:20):
know that that was a presence in our in our
home and in our life, and we wondered.

Speaker 3 (16:24):
Why our father, you know, was like that.

Speaker 1 (16:27):
And so I was like, holy cow, this is something
that I need to think about in address. And it's
you know, then all of a sudden, you as you
peel back right those layers of sin, and you you
are as you like to so adroitly describe it, as
as you unlock those chains that because you're a slave

(16:50):
to it. And I love that that metaphor. I think
it's brilliant. You start to realize, well, like you said,
why is it so common? Why is it a default
setting for me when I'm lonely or I go home
at night or whatever, I'm on the road or whatever
it is.

Speaker 3 (17:07):
Why is it so prevalent?

Speaker 1 (17:09):
And I think you know one aspect is and which
wh's amazing when you say the number nine thousand men
that are a part of your organization, you know, you
start to go, well, wow, this is really common. Yeah,
I'm not isolated in this this this this this servitude

(17:30):
towards sin. So what have you learned not only with yourself,
but as you keep bringing more men into the fold, right,
into this place. Is this you know, are the stories
similar or is it you know, what are the commonalities
across all of all of all men that have struggled.

Speaker 2 (17:52):
Or suffered or do suffer with it. Yeah, So I'll
speak to two things. One just on the fact that
it has on your household as being the spiritual leader.
If you're consumed in a world of pornography and you're
leading a household, that is something that you're struggling with,
and if you do not transform that, you end up

(18:12):
transmitting it in one way, shape or form.

Speaker 3 (18:14):
Right.

Speaker 2 (18:15):
And so that's why a lot of times we see
that guys that come into our program, they start to
discover that this has been a generational thing and one
of the things that we encourage guys to just latch onto,
like this will run into in your family until it
runs into you if you make the decision to transform
this rather than transmit it to the next generation.

Speaker 3 (18:36):
Right.

Speaker 2 (18:37):
And so that might be transmitted in a one to
one pornography problem, right, It may also be transmitted into
another way that will spiral into some other type of addiction,
which is the emotional disconnect in the household. And so
that ties into the common thread of all of the
guys that the nine thousand that we're working with currently

(18:57):
or have worked with to this point, this down to
an emotional root problem. This is not a hey, I
have a lustful eye. This is not a hey, I
have an abnormally high sex drive. Hey, I'm just perverted.
Like these I am statements are things that guys come
in believing as the problem, because that's the belief that

(19:18):
they an enemy is planted in their ear. But really,
what we discover and common thread through all these guys,
it's actually a pain problem.

Speaker 3 (19:26):
Right.

Speaker 2 (19:26):
And so when you become curious about why you have
this problem, rather than trying to just pray it away
or get rid of it, two things happen. Number One,
you start to understand that it is a pain problem.
And there's some really consistent patterns when you become curious
about it, Like when you get really stressed out high stress, right,

(19:51):
you tend to want to medicate and escape reality, and
pornography becomes a mechanism to do that, right, or just
hyper sextualized activities that get you to disconnect from reality momentarily. Right,
This giant dose of dopamine you're actually using as a
drug and the dopamine disconnects you from what's going on,

(20:12):
and so you get the medication and sedation that you
were looking for. It's actually a really good method to
accomplish that, right. The problem is the consequence on the
back end compiles in a lot of different ways, and
these guys come in and they start to realize that
there were some things that happened in childhood. They're causing

(20:32):
them to be triggered at an ultra high level when
they get stressed. Right, and so when you're getting really
stressed and you go, hey, like I can't manage this,
my brain wants to escape, that's not the problem, right,
that dynamic. The problem is why are you getting so triggered?
Why are you getting so disregulated? Well, typically we see

(20:52):
that external environments and things that are going on are
triggering deeper roots that were planted throughout childhood. This night
might be a belief of inadequacy from something that happened
at eight. Right, This might be a belief of like
somebody's going to abandon me or I'm gonna be abandoned
in the situation, right, something that happened at ten, eleven, twelve.

(21:15):
We have like my earliest memory actually ended up tracing
back to five. It was a repressed memory. And the
thing is, most adults never go back to these childhood
developmental years where most of our programming happens from a
place of intentionally unpacking it. Right, men, especially, we go

(21:36):
this stuff happened in childhood. I'm done with those childish things.
We box it up and we shove it, you know,
in the basement of our minds, and we never go
back and readdress it. And these are the very things
that hold the roots of these addictive behavior patterns, whether
again it's pornography or alcohol, or maybe it's consumer addiction
or gambling. Right, we see that these are all attached

(21:58):
to the same die and amic of these unhealed root problems.

Speaker 3 (22:03):
David Rutherford, my best friend. Welcome to the show, Sean.
Thank you for having me. It's an honor to be here.
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Speaker 1 (22:12):
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Speaker 1 (22:39):
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(22:59):
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Speaker 3 (23:17):
Thank you very much, hu Yah and God's speed. Wow.

Speaker 1 (23:21):
You know, I think there is that that apprehensiveness, and
all people in particular men obviously is to you know,
is to unpack that stuff. You know, they're what we're
beginning to find. And a lot of the guys that
are killing themselves, these gy multiple tour combat veterans, it's

(23:42):
not necessarily the what they experienced down range, Whereas it's
a lot of trauma took place in these young in
these when they were young boys in their lives, which
drove them into this desire to live in a more safe,
protective capacity they could protect and be you know, the night,
if you will, from that that archetypical need, that heroic archetype.

(24:08):
And then they get out and that fades away, and
all that stuff that was just brewing comes back with
a vengeance, and that's what collapses them, you know, And
whether they want to or not, I suppose with the
stories that you're hearing. And obviously nine thousand is a
lot more than you know, a couple hundred. I mean,
that's a massive amount of people. You've gotten to a

(24:33):
place where you have a system. How did the system emerge?
And then let's talk about what the system is to address.
The system emerged out of a debilitating level of frustration.

Speaker 2 (24:52):
Because when I reach that breaking point of I don't
want to live another day like this, I was.

Speaker 3 (25:00):
I was.

Speaker 2 (25:00):
I moved from suicide ideation to a place of I
have a this it's written in one of the books
that I wrote. But I was in the in my
garage on a cooler and I knew my pistol was
in my truck, and I stood up and started walking
over to my pistol, right like, that's that's where I
was at. And in that moment, the shift happened where

(25:26):
I decided, you know what, like, I'm going to go
all out on solving this problem. The thing is, the
frustration built because I started trying all of the stuff
that other people told me to do, right, all of
the information that was out there. I ended up in
a sex addicts anonymous group, right. I ended up installing

(25:49):
all of the blockers, installing all of the filters, getting
an accountability partner, went all out on praying more, reading
my Bible more, you know, going to Bible studies on
top of Sunday services. And I was trying all of
these things to solve this negative behavior that I had.

(26:11):
And I didn't actually start to heal until I was
in a session with a trauma informed counselor and they
asked me a question of what if the behavior is
not the problem? What if there's something deeper that's driving it? Wow,
And that started the journey of diving into childhood, diving

(26:32):
into all of these other things. And so when I
realized that I started to heal on my own. I
started to heal my marriage, and I got to this
place where I just felt like God was calling me,
Like there was no vision of unchained leader at this point.
It was just God was calling me to share my story.
And so I started talking about it on social media

(26:53):
and people started asking me like, well, what do you do,
Like what did you do that created success? And I
was like, well, I can give you one hundred things
that didn't work in like two years of miser misery
and frustration of trying all the stuff that didn't work,
but I couldn't map out like hey, you need to
go to this specific guy here, and then you need
to go to this program, and then you need to

(27:15):
read this book and this book and this book, like
you know. The way that I figured it out was
kind of like a detective in the basement with a
bunch of pictures and thumbtacks and some red yarn, right, yeah,
And so I took a look back at like, hey,
here's all of the stuff that didn't work, and then
here's the stuff that did work. And the stuff that
didn't work was behavior modification, right, and so this isn't

(27:36):
a behavior problem, the behavior showing up because of some
deep root issues. And so inside of our program, we
bring guys in with the number one thing is eliminating
the guesswork, right, And so what we did is we
set up a ninety day intensive where every single day
all of the guests were it's taken out week one.

(27:56):
Day one, you have a video module to walk it's
to explain something strategic that's going to be used in
day three for all the way to ninety you have
some self reflection work to do that's going to cause
you to start discovering what is the root issue, what's
my unique root issue? Like what are the things that
I need to know to even find the root issues
that I have? And then we stacked on top of

(28:17):
that multiple group coaching sessions a week, right, and so
the trajectory of like the deep work is mapped out
every single day. You don't have to think about it.
I'm guiding you through the exact process that helped me.
And then I think one of the key parts of
this is the group coaching in the community. Right. One
of the things that we see and you've probably experienced

(28:40):
as well, is that connection is the opposite of addiction. Right,
An addiction thrives in isolation and seclusion. And when, like me,
you believe that you're the dirtiest, nastiest, most messed up,
most perverted man on the planet and you're the only
one that deals with this, and you step into a

(29:02):
coaching call with over one hundred other guys that are
battling the same exact thing, and guys that are walking
into three four years of freedom from the temptation of it,
and you start to be able to see what's possible.
That starts to break some things inside of you, right,
That starts to break some of these chains that are
holding you back. And then it also puts you into

(29:25):
an environment where we're coaching men on how do you
actually have real brotherhood and relationships with other men? Because
you know, we start to believe, like I think that
at least I believe they'll speak for myself, that this
is something that I should be naturally good at. It
was actually a skill that I had to develop and
be intentional with. Right, And so now we're guiding men

(29:48):
into being able to walk number one in a way
that they're not still dealing with all of these subconscious
root issues that have been woven throughout the fiber of
their lives by the enemy intentionally.

Speaker 3 (29:59):
This is a spiritual attack on them. Right.

Speaker 2 (30:02):
They're also able to now walk in community and brotherhood
that some of them didn't even know that they needed, right,
Like I didn't know that I needed that type of
relationship where I can be fully known and fully loved. Right,
And so the coaching side of things in the community
are a big part of that. And then the other

(30:22):
thing that we're doing now that we have nine thousand
guys and this grows by about one hundred, one hundred
and fifty guys a week that jump into the program,
we have big pockets of people and most major metropolitan
areas in the US, a lot in Europe, Australia, and uh,
we're getting these guys to get together on the weekends
and like form in person meetups and in person relationships,

(30:46):
cause the online relationships are really powerful. And then when
you're we're also able to plug people into you know,
sitting across the coffee table from somebody, or going to
top golf or what most of our guys do, go
shooting together or something fun like that, right, shooting fish,
and you know that that deepens the level of number
one healing, but then also deepens the level of stability

(31:09):
that you have walking in freedom now out of the darkness.

Speaker 1 (31:14):
Wow, I just I think you're gonna have one hundred
thousand guys in the next five years.

Speaker 3 (31:21):
Man, I mean, I just think this is such a
massive issue.

Speaker 1 (31:26):
And just to reiterate for you know, some of the
statistics that I found in prep for this.

Speaker 3 (31:31):
You know this is from Grock.

Speaker 1 (31:34):
You know that estimates four percent of all websites globally
are dedicated to pornographic content, suggesting millions of sites potentially
over ten million active ones based on total Internet websites,
which is about two hundred and fifty million. The older
data from twenty ten. This was fascinating, indicated at least

(31:56):
forty two thousand sex related sites among the top one
million most visited websites annual inviews, impressions, and downloads.

Speaker 3 (32:06):
This was staggering.

Speaker 1 (32:08):
Global porn sites receiving enormous traffic, with porn Hub alone
reporting one hundred and thirty billion visits annually based on
ten point eight billion monthly. Other top sites like XV
video or x videos or xnxx at another one hundred
and twenty eight billion combined, pushing top platforms over two

(32:32):
hundred and fifty eight billion a year. I broke it
down by demographics young adults, fifty seven percent of those
age eighteen to twenty five watching porn at least monthly.
You had the weekly demographics by gender, sixty nine percent male,
forty percent female. You know, and it just goes on

(32:54):
and on and on. And then this was the other one.
This one was the other staggering. And this is annual
revenue of paid porn sites. The global adult entertainment market
market including paid porn estimates at seventy one point sixty
three billion dollars for twenty twenty five US pornographic websites
generating one point three billion annually. That is a that

(33:19):
is an army. That's more than an army. I mean,
that's the statistic that really stood out to me. You
said two hundred and thirty eight billion. I believe it
was total traffic.

Speaker 2 (33:29):
Yep, Okay, there's eight billion people on the planet, that's right.
And so we look at like these statistics of like
seventy eighty percent and then like the frequency of which
they're visiting, like eight billion are providing this two hundred
something billion in traffic, right, and so like that, I
think that comparison of those two statistics alone shows number one,

(33:54):
how many people are actually visiting, and like to if
we look at that, and this is what we found
from because we get a lot of feedback because we
do a lot of marketing, and like we can see
direct feedback from that. We have a running joke in
the company where it's like, you know, if I and
not to joke about you know, addiction, but we we
do a little bit.

Speaker 3 (34:11):
But like if I say you don't have some humor
in this, then that's right, that's right.

Speaker 2 (34:16):
You know, I tell our team it's like, man, if
I throw a rock into a random crowd of people,
the chances of me hitting somebody in the head with
somebody that has this problem is pretty high, right, And
we see that, we see that in our marketing. And
so these numbers of you know, sixty nine percent of
men visit once a week, fifty four percent of practicing Christians,
and sixty eight percent of pastors have struggled with it

(34:37):
or currently are. What I've seen is the real number
of people that are answering if they if everybody answered
honest yes, the numbers are much much higher than this, right,
I agree, And so like one thing, all of these numbers,
what's the point, Like, what's a really powerful point that
we can bring to the listeners, Like you're not alone, Yes,

(34:59):
you're and good company with people that are struggling with this, right,
And like the decision is am I going to continue
to try to solve this alone or with just me
and God? Or like whatever you've been doing, or are
you going to do something different to get something different
and go I need help, which men are not naturally

(35:23):
good at. It's very challenging to humble yourself to that
degree and get a change by doing something different, right,
And so like every person struggling with this, men and women,
we have a couple hundred women that work with our
Women's coach and the women's Sexual Addiction program. At the
point that you're willing to have the humility to go

(35:44):
I need help, that's the decision that you have in
the fork of the road. And like you're either a
going to intentionally decide that that's.

Speaker 3 (35:54):
Like why not? Now? Right?

Speaker 2 (35:55):
Like what are you what do you need to wait
for in order to get to that point? Because the
truth is there's a large population that take this to
the grave.

Speaker 3 (36:04):
Like I swore to.

Speaker 2 (36:07):
You know, there were things that I did, There were
things that I was doing inside of this addiction in
my life that I was like, those things are going
to the grave with me, right And I started to
realize that I was as sick as all of the
secrets that I was keeping, right and so like in
the listener's mind right now, it's like, you know, what,
what are the secrets that you're keeping in How sick

(36:29):
are those making you?

Speaker 3 (36:30):
Right now?

Speaker 1 (36:31):
I think that's the hardest thing that we all do,
Like what do we do We have those breakdowns, those
moments where we give into the temptation right where satan
whatever you want to describe it, it forces the hand,
if you will. And then immediately after, like you discuss,
you you're you know, you're consumed with shame and guilt.

(36:56):
But then you step out the door and you go
right back into your life and you look it out,
you bury it, and.

Speaker 3 (37:01):
You keep going.

Speaker 1 (37:01):
But as you said, it eventually manifests and it's going
to it's gonna it's going to play out in a
way that you don't expect it.

Speaker 3 (37:09):
And ninety nine percent of those are going to be negative.

Speaker 1 (37:13):
I have a question for you, what do you what
do you say to those people who say, you know
what you know, what do you care?

Speaker 3 (37:22):
Uh?

Speaker 1 (37:22):
You know, this is whatever I do in the confines
of my own home, you know, just let me do it.
That's my own right, that's my own you know, desire.
And if if I want to look at porn, why
why can't I look at porn?

Speaker 3 (37:36):
Why?

Speaker 2 (37:36):
You know, what's the big Yeah, what's interesting, man, is
is you're They're totally right. You can do whatever you want, man,
And and like that's where free will sometimes gets you
in trouble, right, And and here's the thing, man, Like
my goal and like what God put on my heart
was never to go You're you're wrong for looking at porn,

(37:57):
and porn's bad and all of this stuff. Like there's
so many people that are recognizing that pornography and like
their hyper sexualized mind. And here's the other thing, just
real quick and then I'll get back to this. But
this isn't just porn. Like a lot of the guys
that are like, I had an affair. I cheated on
my wife when we were separated, right, that was one

(38:19):
and the same of the pornography problem. A lot of
the guys that are coming in or are habitually visiting
massage parlors, right, some of the guys coming in are
purchasing sex. Right, Like there's there's again nothing new under
the sun. This is all stuff that was happening in
biblical times still happening now. It's all part of the
same problem. So like the question that I would propose

(38:40):
to that person that's like, you know, oh, this is
you know, my business. I can do whatever I want.
It's like, have you actually intentionally sat down and counted
the cost of the impact that it's having on you? Right,
And so just one of the things that happened to me,
And there's there's a thousand of them if you really
like it down and intentionally unpack it. But when I

(39:02):
would swear and pray and like commit to God, like
I'm never doing this again, and then I would find
myself back to the point of just having watched porn,
back to the point where I get the emotional high
turns like the dopamine high turns into a crash, and
I'm going, you freaking idiot, why did why do you

(39:24):
keep doing this? Why did you do that again? Listen
to the self talk, right, Like we think about our
relationship with other people, we think about our relationship with God,
But have you considered your relationship with yourself and how
that impacts you? And so if your self talk to
yourself and your relationship with yourself because of this habitual

(39:46):
resist fail cycle that you can't get out of and
you can't overcome, is you idiot? Why do you keep
doing this? What's wrong with you?

Speaker 3 (39:54):
Well? I carried that into being a father. I carry
that into being a husband.

Speaker 2 (39:58):
I carry that when things got really tough in business
and I needed to lean in. My tendency now was
to lean out because I viewed myself from an identity
that the enemy wanted me to view myself in, not
who God created me to be. And if we look
at you know, again going back to what you were
talking about, of these guys that you know, have these wounds,

(40:20):
they enter the service, they want to live into this
archetype or this identity of being the hero, being the savior.
They get out they realize that they're not able to
do that. There everything comes crashing back down. Originally, what
was that that was an identity lie that they believed
they tried to live out. They realized that they weren't

(40:41):
able to conquer or like, live into that in reality.
And now the identity becomes I'm not important enough, I'm
not valuable enough to live another day, and they commit suicide. Right,
And so we look at this as a porn problem,
an addiction problem. This is as serious as life and death.

(41:02):
The amount of guys that have gone along the same
journey of I'm broken, I'm this, I'm believing in an
identity of myself that is just so far out of
alignment of like who God's created me to be. I'm
not worthy of living in another day. I don't matter
to anybody else, listen to like I am, I am,
I am.

Speaker 3 (41:22):
That's repeated in scripture a lot, right.

Speaker 2 (41:24):
They buy into that to the degree that they get
to the point where they take their own lives right.
And the amount of guys that have done that from
you know, getting out of the service, believing all these
things about the traumas and stuff that they haven't intentionally
worked through. And the same thing happens with the guys
that have been struggling with the secret addiction their entire
lives and are so filled with shame that like, when

(41:46):
I was sitting on that cooler man, like, I was
praying that God would send another husband that was like
could be the husband that went my wife needed, and
would send a father that could be the father that
my kid needed, because I knew that they needed that,
not me, because I was so filled with shame and
like living in such a broken identity that I, like,

(42:08):
I just wanted some other man that was able to
be the spiritual leader that they needed to step in
and take care of them because I couldn't.

Speaker 3 (42:16):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (42:18):
Well, that's that's a powerful statement right there, And that
is the crux, right is how do we become the
best version of ourselves when we strip away all all
of these temptations to where we can be honest with ourselves.

Speaker 3 (42:36):
And who we are and what we need to be.

Speaker 1 (42:38):
Right, Why do you think this is such a massive
problem societally? And why does it keep growing? Why does
the numbers keep getting higher and higher and higher.

Speaker 2 (42:52):
Mold grows best in darkness, right, And so I think
one of the main things, and we'll just talk about
we'll talk about society in general, but then also in
the Christian culture, like this is kind of a taboo
topic that people don't really want to talk about from
the pulpit, right, Like how many how many Sunday morning

(43:13):
sermons have we heard on the topic of pornography and
sexual addiction?

Speaker 3 (43:18):
Right, there's there's not a whole lot.

Speaker 2 (43:19):
And so like, one of the things that God put
on my heart is like, just tell the truth of
your story, number one, Like, let everybody know how broken
and what a you know, kind of a piece of
crap you were for quite a while and just lied
to everybody, right, Like number one, share that, But number two,
let's shine light in these corners of darkness that we're

(43:43):
we've just like for far too long, we've been allowing
the enemy to just operate, right, And so like there's
there's this domain of shadows even inside of the church,
where it's like if we don't address it and we don'
want to talk about it, the more that we don't
address it and don't talk about it, the more taboo
and shameful it becomes. And so there's just this this
entire layer that we're giving the enemy this territory to

(44:03):
attack men and women in secret. Right, And so the
more that we don't talk about it, the more that
it continues to grow, Like we're we are allowing there
to be an environment for this mold to grow and
fester and spread.

Speaker 3 (44:19):
Right, And so the.

Speaker 2 (44:21):
More that we just bring awareness to the problem, Number
one I think is step one.

Speaker 3 (44:26):
Right, Hey, what is pornography? Like?

Speaker 2 (44:29):
Is it actually good for your brain? Is it going
to improve your life or deteriorate your life even though
it might feel good in the moment, right, Like, I
look at it as almost like the same thing as cigarettes, right, Like,
it was just common, everybody did it, and then we
started to bring awareness to like, hey, guys, here's how
this is actually affecting you. And there's a lot of
science and psychology studies have been published of how it

(44:51):
actually impacts your brain. Spiritual consequences aside, there are psychological
impacts that happen that cause you to be motivated, that
cause you to go into depression, that cause you to
experience more anxiety because you're getting these artificially super hit,
super high hits of dopamine that we were never intentionally

(45:13):
and intelligently designed to get with zero effort. Right, Dopamine
is a reward for effort. Well, we're dousing our brain
with ultra high hits of dopamine with zero effort, right,
And so that directly chemically affects your motivation to do
other things in life, affects your ambition, right, And so
bringing awareness to how this is actually affecting you as

(45:34):
number one, Number two is, hey, now that I'm aware
that this is a problem, there's another problem.

Speaker 3 (45:41):
Right.

Speaker 2 (45:41):
By solving one problem, you create another one. It's like,
I know that it's a problem, but how do I quit?
And unfortunately, the main information that's out there is, well,
you know, you install a blocker or a filter, and
like you set up all these guardrails.

Speaker 3 (45:55):
But here's here's what happens.

Speaker 2 (45:57):
You're actually taking this chain of bondage that's on your
life of this temptation and this desire, this unwanted desire
to dive into these sexual pleasures to get the dopamine hit,
to escape from life, and by using a blocker or
one of these other behavioral strategies, you're actually trying to
chain yourself to something else, right. And so it's like

(46:19):
I'm gonna try to keep myself from watching porn by
installing this blocker, but like porn's pulling me this way, right, So, like, really,
what we've done is we've taken like this one chain
and then we've wrapped another chain around our neck to
tie us this way from not doing it. And even
if you don't give into the temptation, you're still chained.

(46:39):
You're still tormented. And that's what I experienced, right. It
was like either a tormented by the shame of giving
in to the temptation and then saying, Mason, what's wrong
with you? Why can't you quit? Like you know, why
do you keep doing this? Or I'm chained to the
torment of resisting this. Right. Either way, I'm tormented until

(47:01):
I go in and I do the deeper, deeper healing work, right,
And so, like the awareness is, guys, this is not
a behavioral problem. That behaviors are just fruits of the
roots inside of you. Those are the things that we
need to dive into. Those are the things that we
need to work through, and that is the problem that
needs to be solved. Stop trying to treat this as

(47:23):
a behavior problem. And again, like I would never throw
throw rocks at the twelve step system, right, but I
would say that from the nineteen thirties, like there needs
to be kind of an update of what we're doing
and how we're practicing right, and it's just a little
bit deeper awareness of there's actually some root issues that
are causing these behaviors, and like the problem isn't your

(47:44):
behavior at all, it's what's going on that's creating the
unwanted desires for something that you don't want to do.

Speaker 3 (47:51):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (47:52):
Wow, that's about as good a description as I've ever heard.
And I've been thanks brother, trying to understand addiction.

Speaker 3 (48:00):
For a long, long, long, long time. Man. That was beautiful, Mason,
Thank you. What's up? Team? I've been writing for over
forty years.

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(48:32):
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(49:19):
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Speaker 3 (49:22):
Thank you very much. In godspeed.

Speaker 1 (49:25):
There's a component of pornography too that I think you
know often it's it's addressed in some places but not
you know, and through the lens of perhaps through.

Speaker 3 (49:38):
The male lens.

Speaker 1 (49:40):
And that's the impact that pornography has on women, not
as the users themselves. And we know you've described a
couple hundred women in your program, but more importantly the
women that are being exploited in these these situations. What
are your thoughts on that? And you know what, what
can we how can we they be helped or how

(50:03):
can they be awoken to what they're chained too, whether
it's grown self loathing or the financial challenges or whatever
it might be. Uh, how do you address that?

Speaker 3 (50:16):
It's it's Uh.

Speaker 2 (50:18):
So I tried for a really long time to figure
this out, and God planted some things and some events
that caused to click. One of them was a conversation
with Joshua Broom, who I don't know if you know.

Speaker 3 (50:29):
Who he is, but he was a performer.

Speaker 2 (50:31):
Now he's a pastor, right, and he goes around and
he shares his experience, and uh, the conversation that him
and I had where was the two sides of the
trap that was very intentionally crafted by the enemy?

Speaker 3 (50:43):
Right?

Speaker 2 (50:44):
And so when I started to understand his experience and
I started to talk to a few other people that
were on the content creation side of things, there was
a lot of really really undeniable can consistencies from the
consumer side of things as well, which is what I
was on. Right, And so the same like I would

(51:08):
I would encourage anybody to consider that maybe the creation
side is also some form of addiction as well. Right,
And so you're trying to live into an identity to
get away from the way that you actually feel and
think about yourself and some things that may have happened
in your past. You get significance from this. You get

(51:30):
a dopamine high from this.

Speaker 3 (51:32):
Right.

Speaker 2 (51:32):
You get to live into a manufactured identity that is
separated from reality.

Speaker 3 (51:39):
Right.

Speaker 2 (51:40):
And so you'll, like a lot of the people that
I've talked to from the performer side have gone, like,
I wanted a way out of this. I didn't want
to continue doing this, but like something just kept drawing
me back in. I would go through a cycle of
shame after and then I'd find myself back in the
very place that I swore i'd never be.

Speaker 3 (51:58):
What does that remind you of?

Speaker 2 (52:00):
It's an addiction cycle, right, And just to throw this
out there, because this word addiction is thrown around I
think a little bit loosely, and I'm guilty of it
sometimes too. You may be experiencing the symptoms of an addiction,
but you yourself are not an addict at the identity level.
That's not who God created you to be, right, And so, yes,

(52:21):
we're talking about an addiction, but it's important to remember
that if you're experiencing symptoms of that. It's not because
you're an addict, right, but that's the same thing that
we're seeing on that side of things.

Speaker 3 (52:32):
And so.

Speaker 2 (52:34):
The encouragement to the female or the male that is
on the content creation side of things, they feel like
it's out of alignment of maybe their moral values are like,
you know, something a little bit bigger than themselves spiritually
of what's going on in their lives, and they like
there's just this discontent of what they're doing, and they

(52:55):
know that there must be something more. I would encourage
you to consider that there's some things in your past,
and there's there's some healing of actual issues in your
life that maybe, instead of trying to push down and
run away from an escape from a performance standpoint or
a content creation standpoint, like turn back and like let's

(53:16):
look at those things, let's work through those and that's
you'll you'll find that that is the driving force of
the behavior that you're in right now.

Speaker 3 (53:27):
Oh, that's very similar. I think that's a brilliant way
to describe it.

Speaker 1 (53:32):
It is.

Speaker 3 (53:32):
It's an addiction on both sides. You know.

Speaker 1 (53:35):
I think everybody wants it to be something as simplistic
as financial, but when you look at the data right
on only fans approximately three point five million active creators worldwide,
you know, and then it's active who are actively posting
content engaging with the platform, up from about four point

(53:58):
one total million registered creators at the end of twenty
twenty three, with growing into twenty twenty five. And then
here's the thing. This was the thing I found fascinating
is that, you know, total payouts to creators was five
point three two billion, but that was only the top

(54:19):
essentially the top one percent, which was about thirty five
to forty one thousand people roughly earning thirty three percent
of all revenue an average of forty nine thousand dollars annually.
That's about four thousand monthly. And then the top ten percent,
which was three hundred and fifty to four hundred and
ten thousand, earn about seventy three percent, and that's around

(54:42):
eleven thousand dollars annually, which is abysmal. Right, you know,
everybody wants to talk about the big earners, but that's
zero point one percent of this entire group. Most people
are not getting paid, Most people are not able to
earn a living from it.

Speaker 3 (55:00):
So I think.

Speaker 1 (55:01):
That that trends towards what you're saying. What I'd love
to see is a statistic that shows people coming on
as creators, how long they last and then they fall off,
because I think that's where you start to see the
idea of what you are talking about, the addiction playing out.
Because if you're going on and you're making you know,

(55:21):
eighty bucks a month of creating content, you're doing it
every day for two or three hours a day on
your channel, you know, and you're still there sick ninety
one hundred and twenty one hundred and eighty a year,
two years into it.

Speaker 3 (55:35):
That's not about the money.

Speaker 1 (55:37):
Yeah, that's about that whatever it is inside that, that
desire to numb yourself or you know, feel wanted or whatever,
that is that.

Speaker 3 (55:48):
Deep rooted thing. So manufacturer significance.

Speaker 1 (55:51):
Yeah, manufacturers. Oh I love that term. That's fantastic. Can
you explain that a little bit more, please?

Speaker 2 (55:56):
Yeah? Like if you and what's interesting is this can
all so happened subconsciously, right, and so if you analyze
the truth of that self talk, like your relationship with yourself,
if you have an identity that is lower than you'd
like one of the just knee jerk, very low level
thinking things that all humans do instinctively is they start

(56:19):
to try to manufacture a facade of an identity of
like who they really want to be, right, And that's
that's not actually your identity. What you're doing is you're
creating a lie identity, right, And it's it's not based
on truth, it's not based on who you are, it's
based on the it's actually based on just trying to
escape who you don't want to be. And so now

(56:40):
this identity is created as like, well, I'm a content
creator and these people buy my stuff and like they
they are pursuing me. Right, There's there's a high that
you get from that because it's it's escaping from maybe
some insecurity that you have, maybe some past of abandonment
and trauma that you haven't worked through, right, And so

(57:01):
it's medicating the wounds that you haven't healed. The problem
is there's consequences for creating a identity, right, there's consequences
for medicating those wounds with things that are not in
alignment with God's intention for your life. And unfortunately, again
for these like to caution some of these content creators,
it's like yes, there's grace, Yes, there's mercy, there are

(57:26):
also consequences, and sometimes when you put something on the Internet,
it's on there forever. And we're hearing more and more
stories of these content creators coming out and going like
I can't get this stuff off the Internet, and it
horrifies me that it's going to be there permanently, right,
And that's then that's where we see suicides happen on

(57:47):
that side of things too, which is a I don't
know if you have any stats on that.

Speaker 3 (57:51):
I don't know. It's a staggering number.

Speaker 2 (57:54):
And I've I've had some conversations with some content creators
that are now out of the industry.

Speaker 3 (58:00):
They're outspoken about that.

Speaker 2 (58:01):
Joshua is one of them, and it's it's like every day,
every week, like somebody that they know has taken their life.

Speaker 3 (58:08):
So it's sad. That's so sad, all right, Mason.

Speaker 1 (58:15):
I mean, this is a powerful thing that you're engaged in,
and you know, you you talk about the enemy. You know,
how how deep of a spiritual battle is this?

Speaker 3 (58:27):
Do you think?

Speaker 2 (58:29):
I think this is the most insidious, most aggressive attack
on God's children that we've seen in modern day, like
addiction as a whole, and then if we narrow down
and just talk about the using sex and using the

(58:50):
pleasure from sex as and lust as an attack from
the mechanisms of pornography, from the mechanisms of massage parlors,
from the mechanisms of purchasing sex. Right, the numbers are staggering.
I think that it's it's the largest all out attack
that we've seen in modern day. And I think the

(59:13):
main thing that I like the God's put on my
heart to bring awareness to is that that is what
it is.

Speaker 3 (59:19):
Right.

Speaker 2 (59:20):
And so we look at this from a lot of
different contacts, and like when we really take a step
back and we really have a thirty thousand foot view
of this, we see the enemy using all of the
things that are appealing to your flesh to infiltrate your
life and pull you away from who God created you

(59:42):
to be and the calling that He placed in your
life when he placed you here on earth. And so
we talk about the attack on masculinity, the attack on
manhood of these these men stepping up and being the
spiritual leaders. Well, when you're trying, when you have a
desire to step into the spiritual leader role that God's
put on your heart, but then you also have this

(01:00:02):
li identity and this life of lies and deception that
you've created, and you start to tell yourself that you
actually can't do that right. It disables you from stepping
into the role that God created you to fill. And
so to me, it's an all out spiritual attack. I
think that the magnitude of this is beyond what most
people see at this point. My hope is that you

(01:00:23):
know you're and eyes conversation and thank you for doing this,
and any other conversation that God allows me to have
is like He's just put on my heart to bring
awareness to this and to continue speaking truth into the
lies and shining light into the darkness.

Speaker 3 (01:00:35):
Man.

Speaker 2 (01:00:35):
So I think that there's a lot of people trapped
in this that just need to hear a message like this,
and then they need to be able to see other
people that have actually conquered this, not just from a
standpoint of I resist my urges and I fight every day,
but it's like, no, man, you can actually heal to
a point where you don't feel like you're in a

(01:00:56):
life and death battle with temptation every day, and like
this this battle is gone so that you can fight
the actual war of like the things that God put
you on earth to do. But we gotta face we
got it, Like, drive into this problem and this this battle.
You got to drive into it to solve it. Stop

(01:01:18):
trying to pray it away. You'll find that when you
dive into it, it's actually a gift and you're going
to discover who you really are when you face that darkness,
you move into it and you become curious about why
do I want to do things that I don't want
to do.

Speaker 3 (01:01:33):
That's where the magic starts to happen.

Speaker 2 (01:01:34):
And that's where God really on that path, grabs a
hold of you, gives you clarity in your purpose, gives
you clarity and your mission and your assignment, and starts
guiding you in a way that you never thought was possible.

Speaker 1 (01:01:45):
Amen Mason, Where can men around the world come and
find you? And then where can they follow you and
pay attention and contribute and where can they start to heal?

Speaker 2 (01:01:59):
Yeah, there's a lot of great information on our website.
It's just unchain leader dot com. I would actually encourage
you to just google unchained Leader you can read some
of the reviews. I think that's really helpful. We have
again a little over nine thousand guys that have come
through the program. A handful of them have been willing
to publish a public testimony of like their story. You

(01:02:21):
can find some of those on Google Reviews, and we
have some videos as well. And then Instagram is probably
our biggest platform right now, but it's official Underscore Mason
Kin and that account has around four hundred thousand followers
right now. I just say that because you've probably experienced
the same thing, man, But people create, you know, fake
accounts and stuff like that. So look for the one

(01:02:42):
with like recent posts and at current date, there's around
four hundred thousand followers on that account.

Speaker 1 (01:02:47):
Well, Mason, God bless you and the work you're doing.
Thank you for all the men you've helped so far.
And I'm just honored to be able to give you
a little bit of more of a platform to spread
this word and to where we can bring these uh
young men and women back into the fold and and
and help them discover their their true selves and and

(01:03:08):
be faithful to God.

Speaker 3 (01:03:10):
Awesome, David, it was.

Speaker 2 (01:03:11):
It was a pleasure, and uh, I just again appreciate
you for being willing to have this conversation.

Speaker 3 (01:03:16):
Man.

Speaker 2 (01:03:16):
I think that the God will use this as a
powerful tool to spread the kingdom.

Speaker 3 (01:03:21):
Amen. Thank you,

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P*rn Addiction, Spiritual Warfare & How To Quit For Good | Mason Cain | Ep. 51

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}P*rn Addiction, Spiritual Warfare & How To Quit For Good | Mason Cain | Ep. 51