In this episode, Tudor and Buck Sexton delve into pressing issues surrounding the intelligence community, government accountability, and the complexities of political empathy. They discuss the disturbing revelations about the CIA and NSA, the implications of the Epstein files, and the challenges of transparency within government operations. The conversation also touches on the ongoing conflict in Ukraine and the American public's perception of foreign involvement. The Tudor Dixon Podcast is part of the Clay Travis & Buck Sexton Podcast Network. For more visit TudorDixonPodcast.com
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Tutor Dixon Podcast. We have Buck Sexton
here with us. He is the co host of the
radio show We all Know and Love Clay and Buck.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Buck Welcome, Hey, thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
Absolutely so we had to have you because you are
a former CIA officer. We're getting into all these crazy
things that are happening, like a disturbing what is the
NSA chat room where people are saying like really disgusting things.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Yeah, that's a real thing that happened. Apparently d and
I gabbard Is has already fired them or is in
process of firing them. I'm not even sure how long
all that takes, but she said she would. Yeah. They
they had the same kind of infiltration of the intelligence
community by the gender wackos that you've seen in universities
(00:48):
and in places in corporate America all over the country.
You know, the intel community overwhelmingly recruits out of certain
kinds of colleges, universities, and a lot lot of these
international relations masters programs which are very left wing, and
the kind of people that you would think should be
(01:08):
going right to the Peace Corps or to work for
the Soros Foundation can very easily end up at the
CIA or the NSA, and that kind of stuff happened
in large numbers in particularly the last decade.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
I think that's where a lot of people don't really
consider what this means. You hear this and you're like, Oh,
everybody's got this weird section of people that they work with,
and no, No, these are the people that are giving
us intelligence. These are the people that are supposed to
be protecting the country. They had some very disturbing conversations
and one person had to be referred to as it.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Yes, yeah, yeah, And remember people that are saying those
things when they claim on this NSA, CIA, it's really
something like a bulletin board more than I think is
a live chap or whatever. The systems have all changed
since I've been there, and the actual systems in their names.
It's been years and years since I had a clearance.
I can tell you that from friends of mine who
(02:01):
are still on the inside. It's not just that the
intel weirdos that were exposed in this are there and
think this, but they also want to influence broader policy
in the institution. So we can sit here and say
the person that wants to be called it because it
is non binary or whatever non gender conforming demands that
(02:23):
HR demand that everybody do that. And that's where it
gets even weirder. Right, it's one thing for someone to
have absurd beliefs and to have a security clearance while
doing it, which I also think is a clear national
security race. They would ask you about your debts, do
you like the gamble, do you have any you know
anything that you could be used to blackmail you about
(02:43):
your sex life or like? These are all things to
get a clearance. Everyone knows this stuff all if you've
read any spine novels or watched any of the recent
CIA shows in particular, they'll talk about some of this stuff.
But if you think you're an it, that's fine. In fact,
that's protected. That has to be celebrated. If you, as
I saw on one of the chats and hatsip Chris
Rufo for being the one that exposed all this, if
(03:05):
you claim that you want to have a herm if
you want to have a hermaphrodite child, because that would
allow you to raise somebody who was truly non binary
and non gender conforming, you have big problems. And yet
these people had security clearance as top secret level security
clearances who were thinking that, not just thinking this stuff,
(03:25):
sharing this stuff with other people inside the institution. So yeah,
it's bad. It's hundreds of people too. It wasn't like
it was two or three weirdos.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
No, that's the crazy part. Over one hundred people that
have been taken out of this position because essentially it
was like deviant stuff. I mean, the things they were
saying were messed up. And here we are, we have
these people in our government. Now we have a situation
where Pam Bondi is unable to get the full Epstein files.
We think that that'll change now that cash Battel is
(03:54):
at the FBI. But I think these things are somewhat
I mean, they go together in the fact that you
have some pretty deviant stuff that's being hidden from the
American public but celebrated behind the scenes. And that to
me is scary because where does Epstein fall into the
government and why is he being protected after death?
Speaker 2 (04:13):
Well, this is where, unfortunately, Tutor I tend to be
accurate and it tends to be not very much something
that people want to hear, and it is when the
government has stuff that would be really interesting and that
would look really bad for the government, it does not
release it. And I mean even when there are people
(04:35):
who are now saying, let's say it's I know Cash, right,
I mean I've known Cash for a number of years.
He's a good guy and he wants to get the
truth out there. He's going to have to say, Okay,
I want access to the system, or I want someone
else to access the system and pull all of these files.
That doesn't mean that he's going to get the files right.
This is whatever has to understand the same thing with
the JFK stuff. And I would note that I went
(04:57):
on radio so this is very public, on the day
that Pambonni was supposed to release the files, and I said,
there's going to be nothing in these files. And there
was nothing new in the files. And this wasn't a
surprise to me at all, because I understand how the
government actually functions. It works. We all talk about the
deep state, and there's this awareness that there are people
who think that they are not accountable to the rest
(05:17):
of the executive branch. And then we think that when
we have people who want there to be accountability, that
the people who believe they're not accountable or something going
to start acting as though they are right. This is
where there's a little bit of a disconnect. I'm not
saying that that means you can't get there or that
you can't change it up and shake it up. I
think that's what Trump and his team are doing. It
just means that they're fighting in this that they're not
(05:38):
going to you know, the other side isn't going to
lay down and say, oh yeah, like we're going to
tell you all the things we didn't want to tell
you before. So everyone needs to temper their expectations a
little bit for how fast this is going to be
and how thorough this is going to be. The same
thing with the JFK files. I might add, if there
was anything really juicing the JFK files, we would know.
We would know that stuff doesn't or if if it's
(06:00):
so juicy that the system has managed to then they've
already destroyed it. You see what I mean. It's not
as simple as like there's some amazing Remember the end
of the movie The Rock. You ever see saw The Rock? Right?
It's great, I mean absurd movie. Your producer John, who
likes the absurd show Lioness, would probably like The Rock.
The Rock is an absurd hugely entertaining movie, and he says, oh,
(06:22):
you want to know who killed JFK because he found
the right microfilm. There's no microfilm that the government is
hiding in a truth of the JFK assassination file that
shows us who did it. Right, if there was, it's
been destroyed for a long time. So these are my
you know what I mean? This is like when Elon
talks about UFOs, A guy who would know a lot
about UFOs, He's like, there are no UFOs guys. So
I hate to be the one tutor. But and the
(06:44):
Epstein files, what we know is bad enough. I don't
just mean about Epstein. I mean about the government. Obviously
the Epstein stuff is horrific and monstrous and evil, But
I mean what we know about what the government did
at various stages of the Epstein It was a cover up.
So we already know there was a cover We already
know they didn't want to tell us. Druth, we already
know that.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
But you know this, this is like, this is second
nature to you. You know these things like you say
this with confidence because you've lived it. The rest of
the public still believes that there is that file where
somebody I mean, because we have watched those movies and
we're like, Okay, someone's going to find this microfision come
out and be like check it out. Look, these are
the answers. And now so you're telling us that this
(07:24):
can't happen. But I think that people have believed for
so long that it just had to be like the
good guy, the hero was going to run in and
all this was going to be exposed, and now it's
not getting exposed, and there is backlash because of that.
There are people that are, you know, very upset with
Pambondi on online. We see social media posts very upset
(07:44):
with her. The next thing is going to be cashed.
But when does reality come out exactly what you're saying.
When do people come out and say, you know, this
isn't how it works if there's bad stuff. I mean,
this is the greatest spy agency in the world. If
they're going to have something horrible, they're going to get
rid of it.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
Well, I mean, this is going to sound a little smug,
but those people should listen to me, because I hope
before Pambondi showed anything that there was going to be
nothing in those binders. But I don't know, being right,
even on the right is not always enough for some
people want to be entertained, and they want to believe
that there's huge stuff coming down or huge answers that
(08:24):
will happen. Meanwhile, I think that our sense of politics,
or rather what's possible in politics, has also just expanded
so much given the Trump comeback, the two assassination attempts,
all the criminal trials, that the true stuff is actually
kind of crazy, right, the stuff that we all just
now accept as oh, yeah, that's a thing that happened
last year. But some of the belief that we're going
(08:47):
to have bombshell revelations coming from within these government files. Yeah,
I mean there will be bombshell revelations as far as
the stuff that Elon is doing, for example at DOGE,
where the government is just light hundreds of billions of
dollars on fire essentially, or giving it to frauds ers
or giving it to you know, interests that are engaged
in corruption. But there's not some oh, here's like, let
(09:12):
me just put this out there. There are theories that Epstein,
for example, was an agent of a foreign intelligence service
and that that's why he was protected as long as
he was and that he had leverage on the US
government saying this is a theory. This is you could
say it's a conspiracy theory, a theory whatever. I promise
you if that is true, there's no file that will
ever be turned over or you will find from within
(09:33):
the FBI or the CIA voluntarily that would say oh, yeah,
this is what was really going on. That's not going
to happen. So you have to find another way to
get to that information or that truth. And you know
that's very, very hard because the people that are in
charge make it very hard. I mean, the craziest Epstein
(09:54):
story because you said, this is a second nature to me.
So I'll just give you an example of this. Right,
you might not even know this, tutor, and people that
follow this very closely don't know this. When they arrested
Epstein at Teeterborough Airport, I think it was in twenty nineteen,
so this is just kind of pre COVID. They went
to his home, and I grew up a few blocks
from where this home is, so I know this area
very well. The home they had is among the most
(10:17):
lavish at homes you could ever imagine. It's like an
eighty million dollar townhouse. In New York City, which was
a gift. Who gives somebody an eighty million dollars townhouse.
That's very strange. Start with that, he had an eighty
million dollar townhouse. They went through the townhouse. The FBI
went through the townhouse after he was arrested. And this
is all in the court transcripts. This is not my theory.
(10:38):
This is what we've been told and the FBI, and
I've told this story multiple times, and every time I
tell it, people go, is that true? Yes, it's true,
And then they look at and they text me later
they say, oh my god, this is crazy. The FBI
ransacked essentially Epstein's home. They found a safe that was hidden,
a hidden safe. Now, what would a normal person keep
(11:00):
in there? Hidden safe? Cash, jewelry, because that's the valuable stuff, right,
So this isn't a safe that's out in the open.
This is a safe that was you know, be you know,
they had to like pull off a painting on the
wall or whatever. It was hidden safe. The FBI cracks
the safe. You know what they find in a safe,
tutor videotapes.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
That's what I That is exactly what I was just
gonna say. It's videotapes.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
It's the leverage videotapes. So the guy who was clearly
running a blackmail operation had videotapes the FBI found in
a safe that they had to break into in his
home while he's under arrest. Do you want to take
a g what do you think the FBI did with
those tapes? Tutor just is going to throw a guest
(11:43):
out there. Did they take them downtown right away and
keep them secure for processing?
Speaker 1 (11:48):
They disappeared?
Speaker 2 (11:50):
They did not. The FBI called I believe in Epstein
estate attorney, and the FBI claimed that they were not
able to take the tapes. It was only they only
could search. They could not seize these tapes as evidence.
No one has ever explained me why that is, by
the way, but I can give you other things that
(12:11):
are totally inexplicable from the Epstein case that any expert
will tell you, Any law enforcement or criminal justice expert
will say, completely inexplicable about the actions of the authorities.
Somebody put aside Epstein, you know, child trafficking, horribly, human being, monster,
all that stuff. I'm talking about what the government did.
And so they left the tapes there. The FBI left
them there do you know what happened? In a few days,
(12:34):
They came back for the tapes and tutor, do you
want to guess if the tapes were there still?
Speaker 1 (12:39):
They were not.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
So then they call the Epstein a state attorney, and
they say hey, because I guess they're coordinating for some
reason about like what's in the house. And they say, hey,
do you happen to have those tapes? And they go, oh, yeah, yeah,
we've got tapes. We'll bring them right back to you.
And they brought back the tapes. Was anything bombshell on
those tapes that were still there? Definitely not. Well we
(13:04):
ever know what was really on those tapes? Probably not.
And there you have the kind of things that happened
with the Epstein case that no person another one. By
the way, I could just throw this out to you.
They gave him immunity and this was in writing. And
this cost I forget that he was the labor secretary
in a Trump first term. I'm actually forgetting a guy,
(13:25):
was it alex Acosta? Does that sound right?
Speaker 3 (13:28):
This cost him his job because he was a US
attorney in Florida, and they gave for federal charges. They
basically did a deal that covered unnamed co conspirators. No
one ever does that, Like, if you cut a deal
with the Feds, you don't get to cut a deal.
(13:48):
That's like, Oh, the people that helped me that you
don't know about, if you ever find.
Speaker 2 (13:52):
Out about them, they're covered in this deal too. Anny McCarthy,
who is perfectly willing to be critical of Trump, whatever
he said, I asked him about as he said, I've
never He was a prosecutor for twenty three years in
Southern District of New York. I said, have you ever
even heard of a prosecutor doing that? He said, absolutely not,
because there's no reason you would do it unless there
are reasons that we don't know. So that's just some
(14:13):
of the Epstein stuff that I would point to. You know,
when people say the Epstein, it's never as easy as
they're going to produce. It never as easy as they're
going to produce the binders, and the binders are going
to have everything that you ever wanted to know that.
I can tell everybody.
Speaker 1 (14:26):
More coming up with Buck Sexton after this, But let
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(15:31):
call eight eight eight four eight eight IFCJ. That's eight
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We've got more after this. There is certainly a lot
of criticism of the big show of everybody walking out
of the White house with the binders and then the
binders have nothing in them, and there's a lot of
(15:52):
criticism of that.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
It was an error. I mean it was it was
a mistake. I think on the they said there was
miscommunication early stages. They didn't know she didn't know was
in it. I've seen variations on it, but the whole
thing was not good. Now it's not the end of
the world, obviously, but it was not well thought out.
(16:14):
And if anything, though, I think you could just say
that it is a reminder for people about the Epstein
case and that they're still unanswered questions. So maybe raising
raising that has some value in the public consciousness. But
the day, no, it was a it was a debacle.
It did not work the way it was supposed to work,
and also didn't surprise me at all that that's what happened.
(16:34):
So I was kind of wondering, why didn't the people
in charge figure this out? But they didn't ask me.
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Well, they obviously should have because we've learned, you know,
quite a bit. But I'm not joking. I do think that,
I mean, these are why we have these conversations, because
they're valuable and we don't have that many people that
have been inside they can step out and tell us
about this bohemoth that is the government. And that's where
the American public is right now like they have never
been before, because I think in years past, I would
(17:03):
say even before COVID, we much more trusted our government.
There were people certainly that didn't. But after COVID that
was all gone. I believe so many people went, wait
a minute, this is a massive organization. They're sending our
money all different places, and that's why DOGE is getting
such high ratings right now. But I understand what you're
saying about not being able to find these documents, and
(17:24):
certain things that would put the country at risk are
destroyed there never We're never going to see them. But
when we go back to some of these radical policies
where they've been spending money to go into these other
countries and push push programs that would never actually work
in countries like you know, Syria going in there and
teaching DEI or whatever it is. Are we ever going
(17:46):
to find out if this is really where that money
is going, because I have got to believe that there
are people getting paid out of Washington, d C. With
some of these programs that are supposedly going to other countries.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
Yeah, I think that if anyone can find out, it's Eon.
But even he has said a few times recently that
they're they have had this system set up with no
tracking mechanism on it. So so how can you know.
You'll notice there's a theme here right with Democrats. They
want to make it impossible to track voter fraud. People say,
people say, prove the voter fraud, and I just say, well,
(18:20):
when you make it illegal to show ID in places
when it comes to voting, and you make it you
have same day registration and you have how do you
prove it's impossible to prove this right? Or you have
live ballots that are out there and there's no chain
of custody and there's just and they're sending ballots out
to you know, senior citizen homes and people are collecting
(18:41):
them all there's You're never going to prove any of
this stuff. And that's assuming that somebody actually wants to
go out and find find the truth and prove in
the first place. So with Elon, I think that we're
getting a sense of the scale of the problem and
how real it is. But tracking down you know, individual
dollars on this stuff is going to be in many
cases truly impossible is and there's just no way to
(19:03):
do it. And so then it becomes how do we
prevent this kind of stuff from happening more in the future.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
Do you think that there's just too much of the
public gives a pass too often? Like we just over
time we forget things. I mean, you brought up the
JFK files and last night my weirdly enough, last night,
my oldest were coming home from someplace and she was like,
they were talking about meeting Bobby Kennedy, and she was like, well,
did he ever find out how his uncle and his
(19:32):
dad were actually killed? Because weren't they going to put
those files out? And I'm like, huh, you know, I
actually don't even know what those files ended up saying.
It's like you kind of move on to the next
news cycle. Look at Andrew Cuomo. What in the world
suddenly he's running for mayor Are we all going to
forget what he did in New York? I mean, New
York was one of the worst, one of the worst
(19:53):
states and next to maybe Michigan, but New York, what
they did to seniors, what he did was and his
second ual assault charges. I mean, and this guy's going
to run for mayor and everybody's going to forget.
Speaker 2 (20:05):
Yeah. Well, as you know, I was living in New
York during the Cuomo reign of terror, during COVID, and
I thought he was absolutely horrendous and he's totally unrepentant,
and he's I think he's a scumbag, just top to
bottom and so many different respects. And so it's sad
to me to see that he's running away already with
the mayoral race in New York without even officially entering
(20:26):
it yet. But it's a Democrat city. It's just the
bottom line, right, I mean, for if anyone who' saying, well,
why aren't New York as because they it's eighty percent
Democrat and that's how the city of New York votes.
And so if that becomes, if you become the Democrat nominee,
you're you're effectively guaranteed to become the mayor of New York.
So I think that that's probably going to happen. I
(20:48):
think that on the on the fraud stuff, the problem
is that the numbers have all gotten so big that
it's hard you know, you know, tutor. If you found
out that a person down the street from you raised
a million dollars for a wounded veterans charity and just
went and blew it in Vegas and you know, bought
(21:08):
himself a Lamborghini, you'd be like, oh my god, like
how could and rightly, right, people like, oh my god,
how could you do something so scummy, so unethical, so terrible.
But when you find out that the USAID gave a
grant to a NNGO that had been around for less
than a year and funded it to the tune of,
(21:30):
you know, a billion dollars, So what is that? How
do you even comprehend that? Right? It's so much money,
And and yet people will say, well, that's only a
billion dollars. We're thirty six trillion dollars in debt. We
assume that. So we have this problem of scale right
in the thinking about all this, because there's an assumption
(21:53):
or there's just there's just baked into all of this
that you know, Medicaid and Medicare rather Medicare fraud is
estimated to be eighty billion dollars a year. And that's
not an Elon number, that's just the number that's been
like the government's own number for a long So when
you're losing eighty billion dollars on a single government program
to waste, fraud and abuse, and then you're finding all
(22:14):
these other little programs that are smaller, it's just tough
for people to keep it in the kind of scale
in their minds where I think they demand action, and
I think it's just almost I think it's overwhelming. I
think at some level Elon is overwhelmed. I mean not entirely,
but I think he's overwhelmed by just how gross the
swamp really is. Like he knew it would be bad
that as he's looking into it, you get the sense
(22:35):
that this whole thing is is just a it's a
runaway freight train. It's crazy.
Speaker 1 (22:40):
That's where I think the American people are too. I mean,
as we hear these things, as these numbers come out,
I mean you talk about like the Stacy Abrams organization
that received two billion dollars and then they were told
to spend it in twenty one days. I mean, you
talk about the scale of money, two billion dollars for
an organization that has never had more than one hundred
(23:00):
dollars in their pocket. Suddenly they're going to get it,
and they have to spend it in twenty one days.
It's almost impossible. And therefore, if you have to say,
what could this possible? What could possibly be going on?
You've said that you've heard rumblings inside the intelligence community
that people are kind of like, oh my gosh, Trump's back,
and this time he's actually serious.
Speaker 2 (23:22):
For sure. Yeah, I know that they It's funny because
the first time around, and I remember this very well,
the first time around Trump took over, there was initially
huge panic at oh my gosh, what's he going to do?
And this is crazy and Trump and Russia and all
this stuff, and then they kind of figured out, well,
(23:42):
you know, he's got some swampers that are around him,
and you know, we can just wait this out. That
was the attitude. We're just going to wait this out.
We'll do what we do, and unfortunately they were largely
right about that. Now, there's a lot we could talk
about with how they sabotage Trumps administration with Russia collusion.
They were actively actively working against them. They didn't just
wait them out. Okay, fine, but put that aside. This
(24:04):
time around, the attitude after he won, so I'm talking now.
The immediate days after election was yeah, you know, Trump
talks a big gay, but we know how to deal
with this guy. And here we are now in March
a few months and it's, oh my gosh, this guy
is not messing around like. He's put people in charge
this time who are intending on carrying out the agenda
(24:25):
of cleaning out the madness in these places. So they've
they've had a lot of whiplash in the in the
intelligent community. The intelligence is way too big. You have
far too many people who are doing nothing or doing
the same thing that somebody else is doing, which is
effectively the same as doing nothing. It's one of the reasons,
honestly that I left him. And as soon as the
mission under the Obama administration, you know, shifting toward climate
(24:50):
change and all kinds of crazy stuff too, I just like,
I don't want to I don't want to do this anymore.
It's an enormous source of waste. Now, you do need
an intel, You need intel latencies, because if not, you're
just going to be preyed upon by the foreign intelligence
operations of other countries. Because there's huge advantage in information obviously, right,
there's a huge advantage of knowing what your adversaries and
(25:12):
even what your allies are up to. But it needs
to be a lot better than what it is, and
it needs to be brought up to date in the
twenty first century, and it needs to not be concerned
with calling.
Speaker 1 (25:21):
People it Yeah, right, well, of course, And now we
are in the midst of I mean, he came in
at a very interesting time where we are on the
edge of World War three, or we could be on
the edge of World War three, and you've got people
who are defending this Ukrainian president who I mean, honestly,
if we're honest about Ukraine. Trump was impeached the first
(25:44):
time because people are like, oh, my gosh, Ukraine is
so corrupt. Should we actually trust what his conversation was
with the Ukraine. And now they're defending Ukraine and they're like,
we've got we've got to be there for Ukraine. But
I can't understand the American public. Do they want him
to go in and then say We're going to restore
this border and push Russia back, or do they just
(26:04):
want this war to stop because he promised to stop
the war. He didn't promise to return Ukraine. One hundred
percent make it whole.
Speaker 2 (26:12):
I think that the two primary reasons that there's opposition,
the American opposition to Trump on Ukraine and his approach
to it, come from one. Anything Trump wants must be
bad and therefore opposed. And it's the most simplistic, but
I think widespread thinking in the anti Trump world that exists. Right,
(26:33):
So Trump wants to end this war, and that's something
that would give him a win politically and it would
look good for him. Therefore, more Ukrainians and Russians tens
of thousand need to get you know, shot blown up,
et cetera, because I don't want to have to stop
flying my Ukraine flag in my bio. Right, That's one
part of it. And well, actually that kind of transitions
(26:56):
into the second part of it too, which is I
think for a lot of people they a sense of
of moral heroism from their support, just like they do
with climate change.
Speaker 1 (27:07):
Right.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
I mean, this is this is why the vax needle
emoji and the Ukraine flag emoji were side by side,
and so many people you remember this, so many people's
profiles it was they had you know, he him in
their Twitter bio or whatever, because they got to tell
us the pronouns. Of course, they should tell us their
testosteron levels, but he him and then and then they
(27:28):
would have the uh, the syringes for COVID, and then
they would have a Ukraine flag because to them it's
a it's a it's essentially a moral fad, and it
costs them nothing because they just think of it as
taxpayer dollars and you know that that that means nothing
to them, uh and it makes them feel good about themselves,
and so they won't report it for that.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
It is interesting because Elon came out and he said
he made this comment about empathy being dangerous, and I
think people were kind of like, well, how can you
say that? But I think from the government mental standpoint,
empathy can be played on. So if you have all
of these people who are empathetic to this cause without
all of the knowledge, because propaganda can then come in
(28:11):
and it can destroy nations. I mean, really, it's an
interesting thought when you look at these bios, because that
is what it is, is empathy. It's people like, oh
my gosh, I care so much. I have to show
that a care. But it's false empathy because they don't
know the whole story and that's when it becomes dangerous
for a leader, or a country or the entire world.
Speaker 2 (28:34):
Yeah, I mean, of course empathy can be dangerous, and
you could see this in so many different situations. But
you can walk past a person on the street who's
homeless and seems you're very down on his luck and
think to yourself, that's sad, and you know that's a
child of God, and I wish things were better better
for him, And you can think that. You can also
(28:54):
walk up to that person and say, you know, hey,
i'd like to give you. You know, here's five dollars.
You know, go go get yourself a hot meal. And
they may pull a knife out, put up your throat
and say I'll take the whole wallet of things. That's empathy.
That doesn't work for you, you know, And that's the
real world. I'm not saying that happens all the time.
I'm just saying that there are situations where you can
be drawn into and your empathy can be used as
(29:16):
I think. Actually, Ali Beth Stucky has a very good book,
Toxic Empathy, where she talks about the way politically our
good guy impulse on the right particularly is used against us,
and you see that all the time, constantly, right, So
you know, just just use the preferred pronouns. It's the
(29:36):
nice thing to do with the transgender debate. It's been
a huge thing, right, I don't I don't want to
offend somebody. I'm a polite person, so of course I'll
use your pronouns. Well, it starts with the pronouns, and
then it's I also want to play on the you know,
high school girls' basketball team, and I'm a six foot
tall guy. Right, one goes into the other. And this
(29:57):
is where your empathy is being used as a political
tool or weapon against you. And in the case of Ukraine,
I think there are a lot of people for whom
they they think of this like its teams and Ukraine good,
Russia bad. And you always hear this like Putin's the aggressor. Yet, yeah,
we know, but there are a lot of people who
(30:18):
are being who are being brought to the front lines
to fight in that war, who just happen to be
born in Ukraine or happening born in Russia and they're
about to get their arms blown off? Can we stop that?
Is there a way we can get that to stop happening?
Another part of this too is you know, if the
Donbas region ends up being part of the Russian Federation.
When all said and done on this, it's not Nazi Germany.
(30:41):
There are a lot of people who live in Russia.
I'm not saying it's perfect or even greater or whatever,
but you know, they have families, they have food on
the table, like they live their lives. This isn't the
end of the world. And for us to be messing
around in this way when there are nuclear weapons, thousands
of them in the hands of the Russians, there is
there's a red line which the Russians I think would
deploy those news spot.
Speaker 1 (31:02):
Let's take a quick commercial break. We'll continue next on
the Tutor Dixon Podcast. People in the United States, we've
been so spoiled that we don't understand leverage. There is
no Ukraine has no leverage here. They want the United
States to stand behind them and say we're going to
push you back and we're going to restore Ukraine. That
(31:24):
is where I have a problem. They didn't ask Obama
to get Crimea back and then go fight Russia. You know,
they were okay with Russia. Then they were okay with
Russia when they came in to Ukraine the first time.
They just said to Joe, just keep giving them money
to let them fight. Why would you want to continue
this battle? Why would you want to continue this war?
You've got this little country that if Russia eventually wants
(31:48):
to come in and take over, we are holding them back.
But if there's an opportunity to stop the bloodshed, stop
the bloodshed. I mean, even my friends in the Arab
community here, they say, understand that there is a battle here.
We want peace, we are looking for peace. Where did
when did Americans stop looking for peace?
Speaker 2 (32:09):
Well? I think also when you look at what the
options are for for Ukraine and what the Lenski's must
must be his his endgame here, and there's a lot
of different theories about it, but to me, he wants
the only way that this war can end in his
mind is if there is a promise and a guarantee
(32:32):
that the US and uh European countries will threaten to
put Do to go muzzle the muzzle with the Russians
and to fight them, you know, because this is this
came up really and then sit down where he goes, well,
what if Putin violates the ceasefire? Well, man, I mean,
we're you know, we're going to probably do some more
economic sanctions and send them a strongly word letter and
(32:54):
do what we can to make it more uncomfortable formal,
and continue to send guns and munitions and things like
that to Ukraine so they can continue their resistance. But
we're not about to drop the eighty second airborne there
and be like, all right, go fight the spetsnas. And
I think that people get very uncomfortable with Zelensky because
they start to feel like, is that what he's trying
(33:15):
to engineer here? Right? Is there? Is he trying to
get to a place where America is actually willing to
go to war with Russia to protect Ukraine? And this
is I think this is where the fundamental clash is
on this, at least from those who are trying to
be serious about policy. The answer to whether I think
we should lose a single American life to defend the dawnbosses, No, No,
(33:37):
under any circumstance.
Speaker 3 (33:38):
No.
Speaker 2 (33:39):
And so I think Zelenski knows that that are a
lot of people feel that way. And so this is
where there's all this prevarication, is talking to both sides
of his mouth. Oh yeah, I want this wor to end,
but I want security guarantees. What's going to be a
sufficient guarantee? Right? I mean, what's going to be a
sufficient guarantee for Zelenski? And I think the only one,
and he won't say this out loud, the only one
(33:59):
is that America promises that will actually enforce, will enforce
these lines ourselves with force, with guns. And I don't
want that. I mean, if Europeans want to do that,
good luck.
Speaker 1 (34:12):
Well, and I think that's where Trump is. The Europeans
can do this. This is much closer to them, but
we're doing it.
Speaker 2 (34:16):
By the way, Well, this is great. The EU is
a bigger economy than the United States. You know, they
want to form this economic union. Yeah, we're the biggest
for any single country. But they want to form this
economic union. There's plenty of resources from the EU countries
to figure this thing out and get this thing done.
And it is their backyard. It is their problem more
than ours.
Speaker 1 (34:34):
But there is definitely I mean, you have this little
country who is out there saying I want the two
nuclear powers to come fight over me, and the American
people need to recognize that's that is not a place
you ever want to be and you don't want to.
And Donald Trump is not being manipulated by this guy,
whereas I think Joe Biden was manipulated by him, or
whoever was actually in control was manipulated by him the
(34:56):
whole time. It stops today. This is the new era,
this is the Trump a and I am, for one,
interested in seeing how it goes forward, because I agree
with you we're not going to send anybody there, and
we shouldn't send anybody there. And I've taken up all
of your time, but I so I could just listen
to you talk forever, because you do know all of this,
and I don't want to. Clay is going to yell
(35:18):
at me if I make your head too big. But
I do enjoy our conversations because you do have quite
a bit of knowledge, and I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (35:25):
Thank you very much. Try to stay up on these things.
I appreciate you going to chat with you about things,
and thank you for doing so. On the client. Buck
podcast network and numbers are fantastic, Tutor, well, thank you.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
It's because of you, guys, so I don't even have
to say we enjoy having you Buck Sexton. As always,
you are always welcome on the podcast and for all
of you listening. Thank you for listening. Check us out
on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get
your podcasts and join us next time. Have a blessed
d
Welcome to the Tutor Dixon Podcast. We have Buck Sexton
here with us. He is the co host of the
radio show We all Know and Love Clay and Buck.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Buck Welcome, Hey, thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
Absolutely so we had to have you because you are
a former CIA officer. We're getting into all these crazy
things that are happening, like a disturbing what is the
NSA chat room where people are saying like really disgusting things.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Yeah, that's a real thing that happened. Apparently d and
I gabbard Is has already fired them or is in
process of firing them. I'm not even sure how long
all that takes, but she said she would. Yeah. They
they had the same kind of infiltration of the intelligence
community by the gender wackos that you've seen in universities
(00:48):
and in places in corporate America all over the country.
You know, the intel community overwhelmingly recruits out of certain
kinds of colleges, universities, and a lot lot of these
international relations masters programs which are very left wing, and
the kind of people that you would think should be
(01:08):
going right to the Peace Corps or to work for
the Soros Foundation can very easily end up at the
CIA or the NSA, and that kind of stuff happened
in large numbers in particularly the last decade.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
I think that's where a lot of people don't really
consider what this means. You hear this and you're like, Oh,
everybody's got this weird section of people that they work with,
and no, No, these are the people that are giving
us intelligence. These are the people that are supposed to
be protecting the country. They had some very disturbing conversations
and one person had to be referred to as it.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Yes, yeah, yeah, And remember people that are saying those
things when they claim on this NSA, CIA, it's really
something like a bulletin board more than I think is
a live chap or whatever. The systems have all changed
since I've been there, and the actual systems in their names.
It's been years and years since I had a clearance.
I can tell you that from friends of mine who
(02:01):
are still on the inside. It's not just that the
intel weirdos that were exposed in this are there and
think this, but they also want to influence broader policy
in the institution. So we can sit here and say
the person that wants to be called it because it
is non binary or whatever non gender conforming demands that
(02:23):
HR demand that everybody do that. And that's where it
gets even weirder. Right, it's one thing for someone to
have absurd beliefs and to have a security clearance while
doing it, which I also think is a clear national
security race. They would ask you about your debts, do
you like the gamble, do you have any you know
anything that you could be used to blackmail you about
(02:43):
your sex life or like? These are all things to
get a clearance. Everyone knows this stuff all if you've
read any spine novels or watched any of the recent
CIA shows in particular, they'll talk about some of this stuff.
But if you think you're an it, that's fine. In fact,
that's protected. That has to be celebrated. If you, as
I saw on one of the chats and hatsip Chris
Rufo for being the one that exposed all this, if
(03:05):
you claim that you want to have a herm if
you want to have a hermaphrodite child, because that would
allow you to raise somebody who was truly non binary
and non gender conforming, you have big problems. And yet
these people had security clearance as top secret level security
clearances who were thinking that, not just thinking this stuff,
(03:25):
sharing this stuff with other people inside the institution. So yeah,
it's bad. It's hundreds of people too. It wasn't like
it was two or three weirdos.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
No, that's the crazy part. Over one hundred people that
have been taken out of this position because essentially it
was like deviant stuff. I mean, the things they were
saying were messed up. And here we are, we have
these people in our government. Now we have a situation
where Pam Bondi is unable to get the full Epstein files.
We think that that'll change now that cash Battel is
(03:54):
at the FBI. But I think these things are somewhat
I mean, they go together in the fact that you
have some pretty deviant stuff that's being hidden from the
American public but celebrated behind the scenes. And that to
me is scary because where does Epstein fall into the
government and why is he being protected after death?
Speaker 2 (04:13):
Well, this is where, unfortunately, Tutor I tend to be
accurate and it tends to be not very much something
that people want to hear, and it is when the
government has stuff that would be really interesting and that
would look really bad for the government, it does not
release it. And I mean even when there are people
(04:35):
who are now saying, let's say it's I know Cash, right,
I mean I've known Cash for a number of years.
He's a good guy and he wants to get the
truth out there. He's going to have to say, Okay,
I want access to the system, or I want someone
else to access the system and pull all of these files.
That doesn't mean that he's going to get the files right.
This is whatever has to understand the same thing with
the JFK stuff. And I would note that I went
(04:57):
on radio so this is very public, on the day
that Pambonni was supposed to release the files, and I said,
there's going to be nothing in these files. And there
was nothing new in the files. And this wasn't a
surprise to me at all, because I understand how the
government actually functions. It works. We all talk about the
deep state, and there's this awareness that there are people
who think that they are not accountable to the rest
(05:17):
of the executive branch. And then we think that when
we have people who want there to be accountability, that
the people who believe they're not accountable or something going
to start acting as though they are right. This is
where there's a little bit of a disconnect. I'm not
saying that that means you can't get there or that
you can't change it up and shake it up. I
think that's what Trump and his team are doing. It
just means that they're fighting in this that they're not
(05:38):
going to you know, the other side isn't going to
lay down and say, oh yeah, like we're going to
tell you all the things we didn't want to tell
you before. So everyone needs to temper their expectations a
little bit for how fast this is going to be
and how thorough this is going to be. The same
thing with the JFK files. I might add, if there
was anything really juicing the JFK files, we would know.
We would know that stuff doesn't or if if it's
(06:00):
so juicy that the system has managed to then they've
already destroyed it. You see what I mean. It's not
as simple as like there's some amazing Remember the end
of the movie The Rock. You ever see saw The Rock? Right?
It's great, I mean absurd movie. Your producer John, who
likes the absurd show Lioness, would probably like The Rock.
The Rock is an absurd hugely entertaining movie, and he says, oh,
(06:22):
you want to know who killed JFK because he found
the right microfilm. There's no microfilm that the government is
hiding in a truth of the JFK assassination file that
shows us who did it. Right, if there was, it's
been destroyed for a long time. So these are my
you know what I mean? This is like when Elon
talks about UFOs, A guy who would know a lot
about UFOs, He's like, there are no UFOs guys. So
I hate to be the one tutor. But and the
(06:44):
Epstein files, what we know is bad enough. I don't
just mean about Epstein. I mean about the government. Obviously
the Epstein stuff is horrific and monstrous and evil, But
I mean what we know about what the government did
at various stages of the Epstein It was a cover up.
So we already know there was a cover We already
know they didn't want to tell us. Druth, we already
know that.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
But you know this, this is like, this is second
nature to you. You know these things like you say
this with confidence because you've lived it. The rest of
the public still believes that there is that file where
somebody I mean, because we have watched those movies and
we're like, Okay, someone's going to find this microfision come
out and be like check it out. Look, these are
the answers. And now so you're telling us that this
(07:24):
can't happen. But I think that people have believed for
so long that it just had to be like the
good guy, the hero was going to run in and
all this was going to be exposed, and now it's
not getting exposed, and there is backlash because of that.
There are people that are, you know, very upset with
Pambondi on online. We see social media posts very upset
(07:44):
with her. The next thing is going to be cashed.
But when does reality come out exactly what you're saying.
When do people come out and say, you know, this
isn't how it works if there's bad stuff. I mean,
this is the greatest spy agency in the world. If
they're going to have something horrible, they're going to get
rid of it.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
Well, I mean, this is going to sound a little smug,
but those people should listen to me, because I hope
before Pambondi showed anything that there was going to be
nothing in those binders. But I don't know, being right,
even on the right is not always enough for some
people want to be entertained, and they want to believe
that there's huge stuff coming down or huge answers that
(08:24):
will happen. Meanwhile, I think that our sense of politics,
or rather what's possible in politics, has also just expanded
so much given the Trump comeback, the two assassination attempts,
all the criminal trials, that the true stuff is actually
kind of crazy, right, the stuff that we all just
now accept as oh, yeah, that's a thing that happened
last year. But some of the belief that we're going
(08:47):
to have bombshell revelations coming from within these government files. Yeah,
I mean there will be bombshell revelations as far as
the stuff that Elon is doing, for example at DOGE,
where the government is just light hundreds of billions of
dollars on fire essentially, or giving it to frauds ers
or giving it to you know, interests that are engaged
in corruption. But there's not some oh, here's like, let
(09:12):
me just put this out there. There are theories that Epstein,
for example, was an agent of a foreign intelligence service
and that that's why he was protected as long as
he was and that he had leverage on the US
government saying this is a theory. This is you could
say it's a conspiracy theory, a theory whatever. I promise
you if that is true, there's no file that will
ever be turned over or you will find from within
(09:33):
the FBI or the CIA voluntarily that would say oh, yeah,
this is what was really going on. That's not going
to happen. So you have to find another way to
get to that information or that truth. And you know
that's very, very hard because the people that are in
charge make it very hard. I mean, the craziest Epstein
(09:54):
story because you said, this is a second nature to me.
So I'll just give you an example of this. Right,
you might not even know this, tutor, and people that
follow this very closely don't know this. When they arrested
Epstein at Teeterborough Airport, I think it was in twenty nineteen,
so this is just kind of pre COVID. They went
to his home, and I grew up a few blocks
from where this home is, so I know this area
very well. The home they had is among the most
(10:17):
lavish at homes you could ever imagine. It's like an
eighty million dollar townhouse. In New York City, which was
a gift. Who gives somebody an eighty million dollars townhouse.
That's very strange. Start with that, he had an eighty
million dollar townhouse. They went through the townhouse. The FBI
went through the townhouse after he was arrested. And this
is all in the court transcripts. This is not my theory.
(10:38):
This is what we've been told and the FBI, and
I've told this story multiple times, and every time I
tell it, people go, is that true? Yes, it's true,
And then they look at and they text me later
they say, oh my god, this is crazy. The FBI
ransacked essentially Epstein's home. They found a safe that was hidden,
a hidden safe. Now, what would a normal person keep
(11:00):
in there? Hidden safe? Cash, jewelry, because that's the valuable stuff, right,
So this isn't a safe that's out in the open.
This is a safe that was you know, be you know,
they had to like pull off a painting on the
wall or whatever. It was hidden safe. The FBI cracks
the safe. You know what they find in a safe,
tutor videotapes.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
That's what I That is exactly what I was just
gonna say. It's videotapes.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
It's the leverage videotapes. So the guy who was clearly
running a blackmail operation had videotapes the FBI found in
a safe that they had to break into in his
home while he's under arrest. Do you want to take
a g what do you think the FBI did with
those tapes? Tutor just is going to throw a guest
(11:43):
out there. Did they take them downtown right away and
keep them secure for processing?
Speaker 1 (11:48):
They disappeared?
Speaker 2 (11:50):
They did not. The FBI called I believe in Epstein
estate attorney, and the FBI claimed that they were not
able to take the tapes. It was only they only
could search. They could not seize these tapes as evidence.
No one has ever explained me why that is, by
the way, but I can give you other things that
(12:11):
are totally inexplicable from the Epstein case that any expert
will tell you, Any law enforcement or criminal justice expert
will say, completely inexplicable about the actions of the authorities.
Somebody put aside Epstein, you know, child trafficking, horribly, human being, monster,
all that stuff. I'm talking about what the government did.
And so they left the tapes there. The FBI left
them there do you know what happened? In a few days,
(12:34):
They came back for the tapes and tutor, do you
want to guess if the tapes were there still?
Speaker 1 (12:39):
They were not.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
So then they call the Epstein a state attorney, and
they say hey, because I guess they're coordinating for some
reason about like what's in the house. And they say, hey,
do you happen to have those tapes? And they go, oh, yeah, yeah,
we've got tapes. We'll bring them right back to you.
And they brought back the tapes. Was anything bombshell on
those tapes that were still there? Definitely not. Well we
(13:04):
ever know what was really on those tapes? Probably not.
And there you have the kind of things that happened
with the Epstein case that no person another one. By
the way, I could just throw this out to you.
They gave him immunity and this was in writing. And
this cost I forget that he was the labor secretary
in a Trump first term. I'm actually forgetting a guy,
(13:25):
was it alex Acosta? Does that sound right?
Speaker 3 (13:28):
This cost him his job because he was a US
attorney in Florida, and they gave for federal charges. They
basically did a deal that covered unnamed co conspirators. No
one ever does that, Like, if you cut a deal
with the Feds, you don't get to cut a deal.
(13:48):
That's like, Oh, the people that helped me that you
don't know about, if you ever find.
Speaker 2 (13:52):
Out about them, they're covered in this deal too. Anny McCarthy,
who is perfectly willing to be critical of Trump, whatever
he said, I asked him about as he said, I've
never He was a prosecutor for twenty three years in
Southern District of New York. I said, have you ever
even heard of a prosecutor doing that? He said, absolutely not,
because there's no reason you would do it unless there
are reasons that we don't know. So that's just some
(14:13):
of the Epstein stuff that I would point to. You know,
when people say the Epstein, it's never as easy as
they're going to produce. It never as easy as they're
going to produce the binders, and the binders are going
to have everything that you ever wanted to know that.
I can tell everybody.
Speaker 1 (14:26):
More coming up with Buck Sexton after this, But let
me first tell you about my partners at IFCJ. After
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(14:48):
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(15:31):
call eight eight eight four eight eight IFCJ. That's eight
eight eight four eight eight if CJ. Now stay tuned,
We've got more after this. There is certainly a lot
of criticism of the big show of everybody walking out
of the White house with the binders and then the
binders have nothing in them, and there's a lot of
(15:52):
criticism of that.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
It was an error. I mean it was it was
a mistake. I think on the they said there was
miscommunication early stages. They didn't know she didn't know was
in it. I've seen variations on it, but the whole
thing was not good. Now it's not the end of
the world, obviously, but it was not well thought out.
(16:14):
And if anything, though, I think you could just say
that it is a reminder for people about the Epstein
case and that they're still unanswered questions. So maybe raising
raising that has some value in the public consciousness. But
the day, no, it was a it was a debacle.
It did not work the way it was supposed to work,
and also didn't surprise me at all that that's what happened.
(16:34):
So I was kind of wondering, why didn't the people
in charge figure this out? But they didn't ask me.
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Well, they obviously should have because we've learned, you know,
quite a bit. But I'm not joking. I do think that,
I mean, these are why we have these conversations, because
they're valuable and we don't have that many people that
have been inside they can step out and tell us
about this bohemoth that is the government. And that's where
the American public is right now like they have never
been before, because I think in years past, I would
(17:03):
say even before COVID, we much more trusted our government.
There were people certainly that didn't. But after COVID that
was all gone. I believe so many people went, wait
a minute, this is a massive organization. They're sending our
money all different places, and that's why DOGE is getting
such high ratings right now. But I understand what you're
saying about not being able to find these documents, and
(17:24):
certain things that would put the country at risk are
destroyed there never We're never going to see them. But
when we go back to some of these radical policies
where they've been spending money to go into these other
countries and push push programs that would never actually work
in countries like you know, Syria going in there and
teaching DEI or whatever it is. Are we ever going
(17:46):
to find out if this is really where that money
is going, because I have got to believe that there
are people getting paid out of Washington, d C. With
some of these programs that are supposedly going to other countries.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
Yeah, I think that if anyone can find out, it's Eon.
But even he has said a few times recently that
they're they have had this system set up with no
tracking mechanism on it. So so how can you know.
You'll notice there's a theme here right with Democrats. They
want to make it impossible to track voter fraud. People say,
people say, prove the voter fraud, and I just say, well,
(18:20):
when you make it illegal to show ID in places
when it comes to voting, and you make it you
have same day registration and you have how do you
prove it's impossible to prove this right? Or you have
live ballots that are out there and there's no chain
of custody and there's just and they're sending ballots out
to you know, senior citizen homes and people are collecting
(18:41):
them all there's You're never going to prove any of
this stuff. And that's assuming that somebody actually wants to
go out and find find the truth and prove in
the first place. So with Elon, I think that we're
getting a sense of the scale of the problem and
how real it is. But tracking down you know, individual
dollars on this stuff is going to be in many
cases truly impossible is and there's just no way to
(19:03):
do it. And so then it becomes how do we
prevent this kind of stuff from happening more in the future.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
Do you think that there's just too much of the
public gives a pass too often? Like we just over
time we forget things. I mean, you brought up the
JFK files and last night my weirdly enough, last night,
my oldest were coming home from someplace and she was like,
they were talking about meeting Bobby Kennedy, and she was like, well,
did he ever find out how his uncle and his
(19:32):
dad were actually killed? Because weren't they going to put
those files out? And I'm like, huh, you know, I
actually don't even know what those files ended up saying.
It's like you kind of move on to the next
news cycle. Look at Andrew Cuomo. What in the world
suddenly he's running for mayor Are we all going to
forget what he did in New York? I mean, New
York was one of the worst, one of the worst
(19:53):
states and next to maybe Michigan, but New York, what
they did to seniors, what he did was and his
second ual assault charges. I mean, and this guy's going
to run for mayor and everybody's going to forget.
Speaker 2 (20:05):
Yeah. Well, as you know, I was living in New
York during the Cuomo reign of terror, during COVID, and
I thought he was absolutely horrendous and he's totally unrepentant,
and he's I think he's a scumbag, just top to
bottom and so many different respects. And so it's sad
to me to see that he's running away already with
the mayoral race in New York without even officially entering
(20:26):
it yet. But it's a Democrat city. It's just the
bottom line, right, I mean, for if anyone who' saying, well,
why aren't New York as because they it's eighty percent
Democrat and that's how the city of New York votes.
And so if that becomes, if you become the Democrat nominee,
you're you're effectively guaranteed to become the mayor of New York.
So I think that that's probably going to happen. I
(20:48):
think that on the on the fraud stuff, the problem
is that the numbers have all gotten so big that
it's hard you know, you know, tutor. If you found
out that a person down the street from you raised
a million dollars for a wounded veterans charity and just
went and blew it in Vegas and you know, bought
(21:08):
himself a Lamborghini, you'd be like, oh my god, like
how could and rightly, right, people like, oh my god,
how could you do something so scummy, so unethical, so terrible.
But when you find out that the USAID gave a
grant to a NNGO that had been around for less
than a year and funded it to the tune of,
(21:30):
you know, a billion dollars, So what is that? How
do you even comprehend that? Right? It's so much money,
And and yet people will say, well, that's only a
billion dollars. We're thirty six trillion dollars in debt. We
assume that. So we have this problem of scale right
in the thinking about all this, because there's an assumption
(21:53):
or there's just there's just baked into all of this
that you know, Medicaid and Medicare rather Medicare fraud is
estimated to be eighty billion dollars a year. And that's
not an Elon number, that's just the number that's been
like the government's own number for a long So when
you're losing eighty billion dollars on a single government program
to waste, fraud and abuse, and then you're finding all
(22:14):
these other little programs that are smaller, it's just tough
for people to keep it in the kind of scale
in their minds where I think they demand action, and
I think it's just almost I think it's overwhelming. I
think at some level Elon is overwhelmed. I mean not entirely,
but I think he's overwhelmed by just how gross the
swamp really is. Like he knew it would be bad
that as he's looking into it, you get the sense
(22:35):
that this whole thing is is just a it's a
runaway freight train. It's crazy.
Speaker 1 (22:40):
That's where I think the American people are too. I mean,
as we hear these things, as these numbers come out,
I mean you talk about like the Stacy Abrams organization
that received two billion dollars and then they were told
to spend it in twenty one days. I mean, you
talk about the scale of money, two billion dollars for
an organization that has never had more than one hundred
(23:00):
dollars in their pocket. Suddenly they're going to get it,
and they have to spend it in twenty one days.
It's almost impossible. And therefore, if you have to say,
what could this possible? What could possibly be going on?
You've said that you've heard rumblings inside the intelligence community
that people are kind of like, oh my gosh, Trump's back,
and this time he's actually serious.
Speaker 2 (23:22):
For sure. Yeah, I know that they It's funny because
the first time around, and I remember this very well,
the first time around Trump took over, there was initially
huge panic at oh my gosh, what's he going to do?
And this is crazy and Trump and Russia and all
this stuff, and then they kind of figured out, well,
(23:42):
you know, he's got some swampers that are around him,
and you know, we can just wait this out. That
was the attitude. We're just going to wait this out.
We'll do what we do, and unfortunately they were largely
right about that. Now, there's a lot we could talk
about with how they sabotage Trumps administration with Russia collusion.
They were actively actively working against them. They didn't just
wait them out. Okay, fine, but put that aside. This
(24:04):
time around, the attitude after he won, so I'm talking now.
The immediate days after election was yeah, you know, Trump
talks a big gay, but we know how to deal
with this guy. And here we are now in March
a few months and it's, oh my gosh, this guy
is not messing around like. He's put people in charge
this time who are intending on carrying out the agenda
(24:25):
of cleaning out the madness in these places. So they've
they've had a lot of whiplash in the in the
intelligent community. The intelligence is way too big. You have
far too many people who are doing nothing or doing
the same thing that somebody else is doing, which is
effectively the same as doing nothing. It's one of the reasons,
honestly that I left him. And as soon as the
mission under the Obama administration, you know, shifting toward climate
(24:50):
change and all kinds of crazy stuff too, I just like,
I don't want to I don't want to do this anymore.
It's an enormous source of waste. Now, you do need
an intel, You need intel latencies, because if not, you're
just going to be preyed upon by the foreign intelligence
operations of other countries. Because there's huge advantage in information obviously, right,
there's a huge advantage of knowing what your adversaries and
(25:12):
even what your allies are up to. But it needs
to be a lot better than what it is, and
it needs to be brought up to date in the
twenty first century, and it needs to not be concerned
with calling.
Speaker 1 (25:21):
People it Yeah, right, well, of course, And now we
are in the midst of I mean, he came in
at a very interesting time where we are on the
edge of World War three, or we could be on
the edge of World War three, and you've got people
who are defending this Ukrainian president who I mean, honestly,
if we're honest about Ukraine. Trump was impeached the first
(25:44):
time because people are like, oh, my gosh, Ukraine is
so corrupt. Should we actually trust what his conversation was
with the Ukraine. And now they're defending Ukraine and they're like,
we've got we've got to be there for Ukraine. But
I can't understand the American public. Do they want him
to go in and then say We're going to restore
this border and push Russia back, or do they just
(26:04):
want this war to stop because he promised to stop
the war. He didn't promise to return Ukraine. One hundred
percent make it whole.
Speaker 2 (26:12):
I think that the two primary reasons that there's opposition,
the American opposition to Trump on Ukraine and his approach
to it, come from one. Anything Trump wants must be
bad and therefore opposed. And it's the most simplistic, but
I think widespread thinking in the anti Trump world that exists. Right,
(26:33):
So Trump wants to end this war, and that's something
that would give him a win politically and it would
look good for him. Therefore, more Ukrainians and Russians tens
of thousand need to get you know, shot blown up,
et cetera, because I don't want to have to stop
flying my Ukraine flag in my bio. Right, That's one
part of it. And well, actually that kind of transitions
(26:56):
into the second part of it too, which is I
think for a lot of people they a sense of
of moral heroism from their support, just like they do
with climate change.
Speaker 1 (27:07):
Right.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
I mean, this is this is why the vax needle
emoji and the Ukraine flag emoji were side by side,
and so many people you remember this, so many people's
profiles it was they had you know, he him in
their Twitter bio or whatever, because they got to tell
us the pronouns. Of course, they should tell us their
testosteron levels, but he him and then and then they
(27:28):
would have the uh, the syringes for COVID, and then
they would have a Ukraine flag because to them it's
a it's a it's essentially a moral fad, and it
costs them nothing because they just think of it as
taxpayer dollars and you know that that that means nothing
to them, uh and it makes them feel good about themselves,
and so they won't report it for that.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
It is interesting because Elon came out and he said
he made this comment about empathy being dangerous, and I
think people were kind of like, well, how can you
say that? But I think from the government mental standpoint,
empathy can be played on. So if you have all
of these people who are empathetic to this cause without
all of the knowledge, because propaganda can then come in
(28:11):
and it can destroy nations. I mean, really, it's an
interesting thought when you look at these bios, because that
is what it is, is empathy. It's people like, oh
my gosh, I care so much. I have to show
that a care. But it's false empathy because they don't
know the whole story and that's when it becomes dangerous
for a leader, or a country or the entire world.
Speaker 2 (28:34):
Yeah, I mean, of course empathy can be dangerous, and
you could see this in so many different situations. But
you can walk past a person on the street who's
homeless and seems you're very down on his luck and
think to yourself, that's sad, and you know that's a
child of God, and I wish things were better better
for him, And you can think that. You can also
(28:54):
walk up to that person and say, you know, hey,
i'd like to give you. You know, here's five dollars.
You know, go go get yourself a hot meal. And
they may pull a knife out, put up your throat
and say I'll take the whole wallet of things. That's empathy.
That doesn't work for you, you know, And that's the
real world. I'm not saying that happens all the time.
I'm just saying that there are situations where you can
be drawn into and your empathy can be used as
(29:16):
I think. Actually, Ali Beth Stucky has a very good book,
Toxic Empathy, where she talks about the way politically our
good guy impulse on the right particularly is used against us,
and you see that all the time, constantly, right, So
you know, just just use the preferred pronouns. It's the
(29:36):
nice thing to do with the transgender debate. It's been
a huge thing, right, I don't I don't want to
offend somebody. I'm a polite person, so of course I'll
use your pronouns. Well, it starts with the pronouns, and
then it's I also want to play on the you know,
high school girls' basketball team, and I'm a six foot
tall guy. Right, one goes into the other. And this
(29:57):
is where your empathy is being used as a political
tool or weapon against you. And in the case of Ukraine,
I think there are a lot of people for whom
they they think of this like its teams and Ukraine good,
Russia bad. And you always hear this like Putin's the aggressor. Yet, yeah,
we know, but there are a lot of people who
(30:18):
are being who are being brought to the front lines
to fight in that war, who just happen to be
born in Ukraine or happening born in Russia and they're
about to get their arms blown off? Can we stop that?
Is there a way we can get that to stop happening?
Another part of this too is you know, if the
Donbas region ends up being part of the Russian Federation.
When all said and done on this, it's not Nazi Germany.
(30:41):
There are a lot of people who live in Russia.
I'm not saying it's perfect or even greater or whatever,
but you know, they have families, they have food on
the table, like they live their lives. This isn't the
end of the world. And for us to be messing
around in this way when there are nuclear weapons, thousands
of them in the hands of the Russians, there is
there's a red line which the Russians I think would
deploy those news spot.
Speaker 1 (31:02):
Let's take a quick commercial break. We'll continue next on
the Tutor Dixon Podcast. People in the United States, we've
been so spoiled that we don't understand leverage. There is
no Ukraine has no leverage here. They want the United
States to stand behind them and say we're going to
push you back and we're going to restore Ukraine. That
(31:24):
is where I have a problem. They didn't ask Obama
to get Crimea back and then go fight Russia. You know,
they were okay with Russia. Then they were okay with
Russia when they came in to Ukraine the first time.
They just said to Joe, just keep giving them money
to let them fight. Why would you want to continue
this battle? Why would you want to continue this war?
You've got this little country that if Russia eventually wants
(31:48):
to come in and take over, we are holding them back.
But if there's an opportunity to stop the bloodshed, stop
the bloodshed. I mean, even my friends in the Arab
community here, they say, understand that there is a battle here.
We want peace, we are looking for peace. Where did
when did Americans stop looking for peace?
Speaker 2 (32:09):
Well? I think also when you look at what the
options are for for Ukraine and what the Lenski's must
must be his his endgame here, and there's a lot
of different theories about it, but to me, he wants
the only way that this war can end in his
mind is if there is a promise and a guarantee
(32:32):
that the US and uh European countries will threaten to
put Do to go muzzle the muzzle with the Russians
and to fight them, you know, because this is this
came up really and then sit down where he goes, well,
what if Putin violates the ceasefire? Well, man, I mean,
we're you know, we're going to probably do some more
economic sanctions and send them a strongly word letter and
(32:54):
do what we can to make it more uncomfortable formal,
and continue to send guns and munitions and things like
that to Ukraine so they can continue their resistance. But
we're not about to drop the eighty second airborne there
and be like, all right, go fight the spetsnas. And
I think that people get very uncomfortable with Zelensky because
they start to feel like, is that what he's trying
(33:15):
to engineer here? Right? Is there? Is he trying to
get to a place where America is actually willing to
go to war with Russia to protect Ukraine? And this
is I think this is where the fundamental clash is
on this, at least from those who are trying to
be serious about policy. The answer to whether I think
we should lose a single American life to defend the dawnbosses, No, No,
(33:37):
under any circumstance.
Speaker 3 (33:38):
No.
Speaker 2 (33:39):
And so I think Zelenski knows that that are a
lot of people feel that way. And so this is
where there's all this prevarication, is talking to both sides
of his mouth. Oh yeah, I want this wor to end,
but I want security guarantees. What's going to be a
sufficient guarantee? Right? I mean, what's going to be a
sufficient guarantee for Zelenski? And I think the only one,
and he won't say this out loud, the only one
(33:59):
is that America promises that will actually enforce, will enforce
these lines ourselves with force, with guns. And I don't
want that. I mean, if Europeans want to do that,
good luck.
Speaker 1 (34:12):
Well, and I think that's where Trump is. The Europeans
can do this. This is much closer to them, but
we're doing it.
Speaker 2 (34:16):
By the way, Well, this is great. The EU is
a bigger economy than the United States. You know, they
want to form this economic union. Yeah, we're the biggest
for any single country. But they want to form this
economic union. There's plenty of resources from the EU countries
to figure this thing out and get this thing done.
And it is their backyard. It is their problem more
than ours.
Speaker 1 (34:34):
But there is definitely I mean, you have this little
country who is out there saying I want the two
nuclear powers to come fight over me, and the American
people need to recognize that's that is not a place
you ever want to be and you don't want to.
And Donald Trump is not being manipulated by this guy,
whereas I think Joe Biden was manipulated by him, or
whoever was actually in control was manipulated by him the
(34:56):
whole time. It stops today. This is the new era,
this is the Trump a and I am, for one,
interested in seeing how it goes forward, because I agree
with you we're not going to send anybody there, and
we shouldn't send anybody there. And I've taken up all
of your time, but I so I could just listen
to you talk forever, because you do know all of this,
and I don't want to. Clay is going to yell
(35:18):
at me if I make your head too big. But
I do enjoy our conversations because you do have quite
a bit of knowledge, and I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (35:25):
Thank you very much. Try to stay up on these things.
I appreciate you going to chat with you about things,
and thank you for doing so. On the client. Buck
podcast network and numbers are fantastic, Tutor, well, thank you.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
It's because of you, guys, so I don't even have
to say we enjoy having you Buck Sexton. As always,
you are always welcome on the podcast and for all
of you listening. Thank you for listening. Check us out
on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get
your podcasts and join us next time. Have a blessed
d
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