Colin’s college football reaction is presented by JLab!
He’s joined by John Middlekauff, host of “3 and Out” to break down the biggest storylines from college football
They discuss why head coach Ryan Day isn’t able to maximize Ohio State’s incredible talent and continues to lose big games, why Lincoln Riley hasn’t worked at USC, and why the Trojans might be trapped.
Follow Colin and The Volume on Twitter for the latest content and updates!
#Volume #Herd
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
College football reactions presented by j Jaylab has the best
audio products in the game. They're ready to take care
of you this football season, traveling to watch your favorite team,
or just streaming the game at home. Find the Blue
Box at Walmart, Target, Best Buy, or go to JLab
dot com. Love their stuff the Blue Box. Let's go
(00:27):
to Michigan thirteen, Ohio State ten. We have to talk
about a couple of college football situations. So I did
not think. I think this is the biggest in the
history of this rivalry. It's got to be the biggest upset.
Michigan passed for sixty two yards, had two picks on
the road, and still won. I mean Michigan hasn't thrown
(00:48):
the ball. Michigan's a very easy team to defend. They
can't pass, you can be hyper aggressive. So I thought.
One of the things I compared today in my car,
I did a little thing on Twitter. I compared Ryan Day,
the Ohio State coach. I wouldn't fire him, but there's
a clear hole. He's Mark Richt. So Mark Rick had
been a quarterback coach like Day, was an offensive coordinator
(01:11):
like Day, and then got a blue blood job. And
I always felt when watching Georgia under Mark Richt. He
had several top ten finishes, but in the big games,
you never felt they got the most out of the roster.
And that's exactly how I feel about Ryan Day is
that he can recruit like Ricked. He's a nice guy
(01:32):
like Ricked. But those Georgia teams never had an identity.
They just had really good players. Even when they had
like I think Matt Stafford he had like he would have.
They would they would have moments and you'd be like, Oh,
this team's the best in the country. And they won
a lot of big games. He won three out of
four games he coaches, and Ryan Day wins by out
of six games he coaches. But they have no identity.
(01:54):
And I thought that game. Here's my take. So Ryan
Day is one of those guys that you know Urban Meyer.
He went to Bowling Green, he went at Utah, he
went at Florida. By the time he gets to Ohio State,
he has got a lot of confidence. His shit works,
Jim Harbaugh, My shit works, right, Ryan Day. What does
(02:16):
he fall back on? So remember when he got really defensive,
when old Lou Holtz took a shot at him and
they won a game. In a post game, he takes
a shot at rickety old blue holes and I'm like,
wait a minute, well, why do you care about that?
Because he doesn't have a history of success Mark Rick did.
(02:40):
Neither is that when you you know, save Michigan State, LSU, Alabama, NFL,
people can take shots at you. You have a formula
that works. Ryan Day doesn't have a formula that works.
He's two and foreign bulls. He can't beat Michigan now
four years in a row. And I thought the game
plan was fascinating John. He was trying to prove how
(03:01):
tough Ohio State was in the first half. Say, bro,
you have major matchup advantages at wide receiver. He wanted
to prove, Hey, people say we're not this. This game's
always decided by rushing yards. I'm gonna approve. I'm gonna
blow this hole. I can't coach tough football teams because
(03:24):
he got very defensive with lou Holtz questioning that. And
this is Ryan Day and we'll get into Lincoln Riley
in a second. He's a little lost when you start
worrying about voices outside the building and narratives and it
starts changing your game plan. Their first half game plan
(03:45):
was embarrassing, Like what was it? He was trying to
prove we can win tough, Just win the damn game.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
You know, I've had this theory with politics for a
while that sometimes the media is detrimental to candidates and
a certain party. And I think you know CNN and
MSNBC writer in the headlines a lot, a lot that
no one's watching them anymore. They're losing a lot of viewership,
but their clips go viral and I'm on a million
(04:14):
text chains that see them constantly, and they're constantly lecturing
people that whether it was Biden's cognitive ability or that
Kamala was a great candidate, and eventually that people are like, yeah,
just come on right, pump the brakes. And I think
for a long time there has been a media apparatus
that has told everybody, you, Ohio State fans are lunatics.
(04:35):
Get lectured them that they're lunatics. And this guy is X.
Look at his record and it's like, guys, most human
beings now over thirty years old have been alive long
enough to see Pete Carroll Urban Meyer, Nick Saban k
Kirby smart dabble like they know what a really good coach.
Looks like they also know that the Big Ten, beside
(04:56):
a team or two every once in a while, is
not very good anymore. Most of these teams, like beating
Nebraska and beating Minnesota when you're at Ohio State and
you have unlimited resources, is not that impressive. So you
are basically paid to beat Penn State, Michigan and the
other top teams that you play, whether it's Notre Dame
or which you play in the playoffs and stuff. That's it, Like,
no one you get no credit for beating the shit
(05:17):
out of Minnesota and Nebraska. Whoever. You better win those games,
but no one cares. It's like James Harden scoring fifty
against Sacramento Kings in January. Like, I'm sorry, no one
puts any stock into that after a while, and I
think everyone getting lectured constantly about Ryan Day Ryan Days, Like, guys,
we've seen him in these big games, and it's something's off, right,
something's off, and in this game specifically right. The last
(05:39):
couple of years, Harbaugh has had a team that was elite,
so you get beat as happens Kirby Smart's.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
Losses last year, Michigan had better players than Ohio State, they.
Speaker 1 (05:47):
Had seventy guys drafted or whatever this year. You we've
all seen crazy games in college. We've seen twenty plus
years insane that to me, obviously, we've seen bigger outcomes
like Vince Young that was a national championship game, right,
or even Ohio State lost or won national in a
regular season game. I think that's one of the craziest
outcomes I've ever seen in my entire life. Start to
(06:08):
finish because not a person in the world, especially a
Michigan fan, would have bet on Michigan. And as the
game was going, you kept thinking yourself, this can't be happening.
But he tried to get into a heavyweight fight with
the one thing Michigan can do, and Chip deserves blame
to run it up the middle. It's like they're two
good players with the defensive tackles. You have three NFL guys.
But I keep thinking that after the game and everyone
(06:29):
shitting on Ryan Day, it's like, well, they've been lectured
for five years that he's a great coach, and it's
like I'm just waiting for him to beat another Like
we don't care that he's beaten. James Franklin now four
straight times. Yeah, like you can't beat Michigan, which in
this program clearly is borderline the equivalent of like the
national title game at this point. And he loses against
the other good teams when he plays him in big spots.
(06:50):
So you're watching him and you go the cockiness the
third base comment. Most guys that get those jobs. Jim
Harbaugh to get the Michigan job, had to coach at
San Diego Stanford and then win at the forty nine ers.
You know, this guy had never been a head coach. Yeah,
and he got the job and handed to him by
one of the greatest coaches of his era. So the
Ohio State fans literally know what it looks like with
(07:11):
urban Meyer and you go, well, we're not that physical.
We have this pass and here's I was thinking about
this too, because I've been critical of this guy for
a long time. And Sarkesey has got Texas in the
SEC Championship year one. Yeah, and I'm watching him last
night and I went to watch him live. Sark takes
his offensive guy like Ryan Day. Well, he's also the
play caller, so half the game is his baby, right,
(07:34):
and the program's his baby. But the play calling well,
Ryan Day is like turned into this CEO even though
he's this offensive minded guy, has to hire Chip Kelly
and you're watching him on offense just look terrible against
a Michigan team. Their best corner Will Johnson, who might
be like a top five pick. It's like Travis Hunter
two point zero corner is out your slicing. I was like,
what are you guys doing, Like you're supposed to be
(07:56):
an offensive mine, get chips call in the plays, and
then your team's not tough. And I do think the
look after the game where they plant the flag and
he stands there. It just listen, they're in the playoffs,
so you're not gonna fire him today. I don't see
how this moves forward. I because I I think it's
very possible that this type loss, they could just lose
(08:18):
immediately in the playoffs, depending on who they play. Yeah,
I do think Ohio State fans and I'm an Ohio
State hater, but if I was in their shoot, I'd
be tired of being lectured constantly by and listen, I
get it, Joe Klatt and all these guys at Ohio
State is a huge part of the business and they're awesome.
I like watching them too, but like we have to
riot a day, Like Kirby Smarts, the Nick Saban's like,
(08:38):
he's not Urban Myers, He's not even remotely on their level.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
No, he's not.
Speaker 1 (08:41):
He's not even debatable.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
No, No, he is much closer to Mark Richt, who
you know, George is better now without Mark Richt, who
is a really nice guy. But they I mean, I
had an NFL GM tell me years ago he'd love
drafting Georgia guys under Mark Richt. He goes, because they were.
He goes, if you drafted a Nick Saban guy at Bama,
he'd already wheezed all the juice out of the player.
He goes these Georgia guys like they still had two
(09:04):
gears of shifting, you know, like you were always like, oh,
they're way better than you think. The other thing is
that the transfer portal and the NIL have actually created parody.
When I was talking with a guy today who's he
runs a message board for Ohio State, and I said,
you know, you used to be able to years ago
(09:24):
when you had one hundred and twenty five scholarships and
the John McKay era for us. See, you'd take like
four running backs in the West Coast just to hog
them even if he didn't play him. And then we
got down to eighty five scholarships. And you can still
do a little bit of that. Nick Saban can do it.
Kirby Smart Well, Now a backup left tackle at let's
say Ohio State Louisville comes in and says, we'll pay
(09:45):
it three hundred thousand dollars you're a starter for us,
or a right tackle at Ohio State, Well, he's you
want to be a left tackle and show that scouts
that you know, whoever's got money, whatever team a Texas
and m can say, come here, start at left tackle.
So there's less depth. And then then then an Ohio
(10:05):
State could lose an elite offensive tackle where it's always
been my whole life. The top programs have tour they
have backups that would start, except for there's a first
round guy in front of them. Well that guy now
just goes and plays at a lesser program.
Speaker 1 (10:20):
Gone.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
And so if you have an injury, so let's say
you're Georgia and you lose you know, brock Bowers, and
then a tight end gets hurt and the other tight
end who you had, he got purchased by Wake Forest
or somebody or Oregon. Well, now now your tight ends
no better than the guy Purdue. So these teams like
Alabama and Georgia and Ohio State, if they have a
(10:43):
key O line injury or a linebacker injury, they don't
have great backups. Those guys have been purchased in the
NIL to go to lesser programs. And I mean I
know a program that was I mean Washington, I mean
they were in the Harbaugh Michigan teams. They were like, okay,
who's not starting that we recruited? Who's a five star guy?
(11:04):
Who's behind a you know, a sophomore who's got two
more years there that's the game. Now.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
I think Ohio State, though, if you look at this
offseason as well.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
Reported they spent twenty million.
Speaker 1 (11:14):
Yeah, I think these numbers. Yeah, it could be twenty five,
could be eighteen, could be twelve. You know, who knows
the actual number. But they spent a lot relative and
I think widely considered the most of any college football team.
And they bought Ferraris. I mean, Caleb Downs would start
for every NFL team immediately. He's great. You know, they
bought multiple sweet players and then they signed Kansas State's quarterback,
(11:36):
who some believe was not going to be their starter
anymore because the other kid that was coming up they
played this year. They were going to go to him
a little more dynamic. And you look and you go, well,
shouldn't if you're going to buy a Ferrari and a
range Rover and not have a garage. But it's a
pretty risky move, you know. The cam Ward was clearly
the guy, but you go Chip, Kelly, Ryan Day. I
(11:57):
bet they wouldn't really love cam.
Speaker 2 (11:59):
Ward a little bit.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
You know, that's not really their type player, especially Chip.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
Yeah, doing his own thing.
Speaker 1 (12:04):
Will Howard or Will Howard, that's yeah, it was much
more their type guy. And you watch Kyle McCord a
Syracuse who just takes down Miami. He's had a pretty
good year. Yeah, they blamed everything on him last year
and listen, he was up and down for him. But
I think sometimes in this nil era, when you're paying people,
especially quarterbacks, a lot of money, you can start doing
finger pointing, where in the history of the sport you
(12:25):
would just give that guy a couple of years to
be your starter and maybe that one year you look back,
you win the national championship the next year, and you go,
we live through that. Look what Harbad did with JJ
McCarthy and that crew of guys. They lost that devastating
game to Tissue TCU. Right, it was hard to stomach.
A couple of years ago, everyone came back and they
won it. Well. Now in the nil era, if you
like you're just pointing the finger, you make a couple
(12:47):
guys transfer, they're not good enough, you upgrade. You watch
how could you lose a game where the opposing team
If I told you at the start, how much money
would you put on Ohio State? If they're starting quarterback
through for sixty yards and threw two picks, you'd be like,
I bet they win the game forty to ten.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
I thought I predicted to kill him. I thought it
was gonna be I honestly thought thirty eight to thirteen
would be close. I thought it was gonna be a blowout.
Speaker 1 (13:10):
You just can't. You just can't fake toughness. And I've
been around these coaches long enough and know these guys
in these NFL teams and these programs, some guys have
it and some guys don't, and a small percentage truly
have it. Like Urban Meyer, Nick Saban, it's not about
like your size or your coach, but you're like everyone
when you walk into the room, they kind of they're
(13:31):
their shoulders. Kirby clearly has it right. It's a small
percentage of guys. And Ryan he's not bad, but he
was also handed I think the best program in the
country with unlimited resources and will do whatever he wants.
And they are regressing four straight times in Michigan. I
think he's a loss. We'll see who they end up
playing in the first round. Let's just say they play Tennessee.
(13:52):
That's why I thought if they play a team like
and they lose, I mean, you, now, who are they
gonna hire, Like it's Mike Vrabel's not coming to college
ball in this era, right, so it's like who you know,
do you hire the Iowa State coach? There's no it's
you might just get the same thing, Like you're probably
not getting Nick Saban, Urban Meyer, you know, the next
version of that. So you're just this is where they're
(14:13):
kind of you know, it's not that bad, but it's
clearly not good enough because if you can't get Michigan now,
like you just beat a team that was so desperate.
They paid a kid twelve fifteen million dollars to be
their quarterback who's seventeen years old. That's the team you
just lost to.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
All right, I want to finish up USC Notre Dame.
By the way, Marcus Freeman, the coach for Notre Dame,
Peter Schrager is reporting this, and this is the second
person I've heard it from. Marcus Freeman. The Chicago Bears
are interested culture builder. So just throw that out there.
That's being talked about in NFL circles. Notre Dame coach
Marcus Freeman.
Speaker 1 (14:49):
Would would you leave Notre Dame making ten million dollars
a year to the Bears?
Speaker 2 (14:53):
No?
Speaker 1 (14:53):
If you had to answer to Kevin Wesley and I
would not even know.
Speaker 2 (14:57):
But it's interesting. They can't get rid of Lincoln Riley.
He had his contract turned over, so it's nine years,
ninety million left. They just put three hundred million into
the facilities. They're collectives up to eighteen million, so that
it's not a money issue. They're collective and now to
eighteen million dollars. I was told by an agent yesterday
(15:19):
that's not it. But it's so they're not going to
get rid of Lincoln. They're not going to do it us.
He's not going to buy him out. It's not the SEC.
And his best talent is young, and their defensive line
talent they've recruited the last two years is much better.
Blah blah blah. But this goes back to the Ryan
Day thing. So he was handed an Oklahoma program and
(15:41):
the culture was set, and he was very clever. He
was he was a better offensive guy than Stoops. So
he goes to USC and he doesn't really have to
build a culture because Caleb Williams is so much better
than everybody else in the conference. And they win eleven games,
should have beaten two Langes at a one to twelve.
The following year, about halfway through, you're like, wow, they
have to replace the defensive staff. He deserves credit for that.
(16:03):
But if you I believe, and somebody said this to me,
they said, he's getting Why isn't he replacing offensive coaches.
They have one good, not great offensive tackle in the
program three years in. The backup left tackle is six
two three ten, he's a center. They have one really
(16:25):
nice draftable running back in three years he's leaving. They
don't have a draftable defensive player on this team. I
think Camari Ramsey, the safety's draftable next year. Notre Dame
is a better football team, should have won. It's not that,
but now we're going into year four. Forget the defense,
which is better but not elite. They don't have enough
good offensive town this quarterback. They have za Ham and Egger.
(16:47):
I mean, he either he can't read the middle of
the field or they don't trust him. Everything's up the sidelines,
everything's bubble screen up the sideline. They don't throw the
ball in the middle of the field. What I am
hearing is he is alienated LA high school coaches. I
mean they're LA recruiting stinks, so USC is trapped here.
They can't buy him out. He's gotten stubborn on the
(17:10):
offensive coaching where they're just not getting outside a receiver.
They s don't have good enough players, forgettable running backs,
forgettable tight ends, don't have any tackles outside of Elijah
paid left tackle. When they signed him to a ten
year deal, you thought you were getting a steal.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
I'm not.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
This is the first time I've really I look at
it and I'm like, wait a minute. They're getting worse
every six games from the beginning of Caleb's first year
to the next six, to the beginning of year two
to the last six. This team beat LSU at the
end of the year. The last three years, they're not
a very good football team. That is bad coaching.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
If I would have told you in August that they
would have one more win on December first than UCLA,
he would have said, John, put down the drugs. I
thought UCLA was gonna win like two games this season.
And honestly, it's not like they beat the brakes off them.
That game probably could have gone either way.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
Ye the fourth quarter close.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
Yeah, UCLA being five and seven and you being six
and six. What a disaster for the USC.
Speaker 2 (18:17):
Ucla has no money in their collective. USC has eighteen million,
So it's it's it's not a fair fight.
Speaker 1 (18:23):
Well, let's you know, we've talked about Ryan Day. He
inherits Ohio State. The recruiting mechanism was already set in place,
like what Lincoln had in Oklahoma under Bob Stoops. It
was already the guys flowing there. He just had to
keep it rolling, and he's done that. It's why his
disasters are ten and two. Everyone wants to fire him
Lincoln would die for that. Lincoln had to start it
from scratch. To me, if you don't nail the best
(18:45):
players in California, obviously the transfer portal has changed classes
a little bit. That's pretty embarrassing. And I get this
is not the Pete heyday, but like, why do Kirby
and Nick and the guys that win in the South
wind because they nail the players in their region? Yes,
and there it's harder because you have to recruit. If
you're at LSU, at Georgia, at Alabama, you know, Florida
(19:06):
ever got good Now Tennessee, you're all recruiting against each other.
Like obviously Oregon has to come down to southern California,
but you still have a huge advantage and everything. The
nostalgia of the Reggie Bush, of what it used to be,
it's just gotta be gone. If you meet someone now
and young people that work for you, and you know,
I'm around young people, Like a twenty five year old
was born in two thousand, right, So that guy in
(19:30):
the heyday of Liner and Reggie and Lindel White was
five or six years old. So those guys that are
now eighteen years old, think about it, they were like
the Clay Helton era. So this this nostalgia of what
used to be exists to me and you or older people,
not to the people that matter the most. And if
you piss off these high school coaches, like the high
(19:52):
school coaches are the lifeblood of someone's program because they
funnel you guys. I mean, they are very very important.
Obviously now money has changed hands. But to me, sc
like Caleb Downs whoever, that the equivalent of those type
players every year they should it should be between Ohio State,
USC and Texas. Like if they're not in on every
why Er Sark and Ohio State's roster is so good
(20:14):
because they're buying all the sweet players who are available.
And obviously they recruit really well. What is Lincoln gonna
have a top ten recruiting class this year in the nation.
Speaker 2 (20:24):
Top twenty with twelve to fourteen.
Speaker 1 (20:28):
And here's the problem. Ohio State, even with Ryan Day,
is not going anywhere. If they keep them for the
next five years, they're gonna win ten or eleven games
every year. Oregon clearly is going nowhere. And listen, we
can Washington see what.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
James Jedfish can recruit. So jed Fish will get that
puppy to nine wins.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Fast, and I've heard that they did not use much
nil money this year because they wanted to take a
deep breath. They're gonna be blown it this year, so
they will be aggressive and Penn State. We've already seen
the stats over the last six years or seven years.
If they would have had the playoffs, they'd be in
it every year. And the one thing James hangs his
hat on is recruiting. Yeah right, it's one thing you say.
James Franklin is great at recruiting, right in game coaching recruiting.
(21:09):
So I you could argue this could just nothing could change,
you know, six and six, maybe they're eight and four.
But I don't know. They'd have to catch lightning in
a bottle. I I don't know if you're ever going
to see the Lincoln that they bought. I think this
might be the new normal, you know, which is when
you're paying that type of premium. What was that building?
(21:30):
Was that a home game for Notre Dame?
Speaker 2 (21:32):
No, it was. It was seventy five and that was
eighty twenty usc it was a.
Speaker 1 (21:40):
Notre Dame was not an apathetic group yet, but it's
they've got to be pretty down right the big toward apathy.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
Yeah, the Big Ten saves them because the Nebraska's, Wisconsin, Iowa, Michigan,
Ohio State travels so well. That's what really saves them.
They'll have good revenue because of their collective and let's
be honest, twenty thousand Big Ten fans winner, they're going
to la to watch that game.
Speaker 1 (22:04):
To me, where you have no excuse, like listen, you
lose Oregon, you lose Ohio State, Like maybe you're not
as good. You cannot be losing to the middle of
the pack Maryland. And when you look at the middle
of the pack and the Big Ten, what is the
difference between UCLA and Rutgers and USC. Like that's that's
what would really shake me if I was a USC fan,
(22:24):
is we're not just middle of the pack. From a
talent standpoint. When I watch him play, it looks the same.
It's always been my defense of the SEC. It's like
you just watched the sect different, Like, yeah, there's just more.
Obviously Ohio State and Oregon have the equivalent, but the
middle of the Big Ten and the middle of the SEC,
even if the records are the same, the talent discreptancy
is obvious. And the USC's did they kind of had
(22:46):
an easy schedule this year. Did they play Ohio State?
Speaker 2 (22:49):
They did not play Ohio State, nor do they play
Ohio State next year. So if you look at I
mean Lincoln got a big break. He didn't get or
get her Ohio State this year. He didn't get Ohio
State next year. So even it's funny you ask, I
looked at USC schedule yesterday and they have the home
in the ways, it's a really they get Michigan at home,
(23:13):
they get a couple of their you know, they get
a couple of their tough games at home, so they're
getting They don't have an LSU on the schedule. They
play like Georgia, Southern Southwest, Missouri State. They do an
sec out a conference schedule, so that if you look
at the schedule next year, John, it is by Big
Ten standards, it is a cakewalk.
Speaker 1 (23:33):
The other thing is and obviously football at USC is
way bigger than basketball. Yeah, but Muscleman kind of has
a history of winning and just kind of playing the
party right. So he's just god. He just can shake
some hands, he can put on a smile, he can
play the part like you don't get to be just
grumpy Belichick in college, right, you can do that in
the NFL. As long as you win in college, you
(23:54):
do have to shake hands donors nil. And now they're
going to be comparing in Derek Musselman, who's been winning
at all these places, and then you got Lincoln kind
of Henri scowls, not smiling. I think you asked yourself,
and this is what I said from the beginning. Does
he even want to be there? Did he just get
an offer so gigantic that no human could turn down?
(24:15):
Where it's like he was already so rich, he's looking
at his bank account my life. Do I regret this?
I think you got to say, if he could do
if he could do it over again? Is he the
coach at USC right now? I think you'd have to
say no, right.
Speaker 2 (24:29):
I still think he believes based on the recruiting, the
interior defensive line recruiting the last couple of years. I
think he believes next year's the season. But they don't
have a quarterback. They don't have an elite quarterback, so shit,
who knows. John Middlcoff, former NFL scout, as Ola was
crushed it, buddy.
Speaker 1 (24:51):
Thanks goin, talk to you soon. The volume
The volume.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
College football reactions presented by j Jaylab has the best
audio products in the game. They're ready to take care
of you this football season, traveling to watch your favorite team,
or just streaming the game at home. Find the Blue
Box at Walmart, Target, Best Buy, or go to JLab
dot com. Love their stuff the Blue Box. Let's go
(00:27):
to Michigan thirteen, Ohio State ten. We have to talk
about a couple of college football situations. So I did
not think. I think this is the biggest in the
history of this rivalry. It's got to be the biggest upset.
Michigan passed for sixty two yards, had two picks on
the road, and still won. I mean Michigan hasn't thrown
(00:48):
the ball. Michigan's a very easy team to defend. They
can't pass, you can be hyper aggressive. So I thought.
One of the things I compared today in my car,
I did a little thing on Twitter. I compared Ryan Day,
the Ohio State coach. I wouldn't fire him, but there's
a clear hole. He's Mark Richt. So Mark Rick had
been a quarterback coach like Day, was an offensive coordinator
(01:11):
like Day, and then got a blue blood job. And
I always felt when watching Georgia under Mark Richt. He
had several top ten finishes, but in the big games,
you never felt they got the most out of the roster.
And that's exactly how I feel about Ryan Day is
that he can recruit like Ricked. He's a nice guy
(01:32):
like Ricked. But those Georgia teams never had an identity.
They just had really good players. Even when they had
like I think Matt Stafford he had like he would have.
They would they would have moments and you'd be like, Oh,
this team's the best in the country. And they won
a lot of big games. He won three out of
four games he coaches, and Ryan Day wins by out
of six games he coaches. But they have no identity.
(01:54):
And I thought that game. Here's my take. So Ryan
Day is one of those guys that you know Urban Meyer.
He went to Bowling Green, he went at Utah, he
went at Florida. By the time he gets to Ohio State,
he has got a lot of confidence. His shit works,
Jim Harbaugh, My shit works, right, Ryan Day. What does
(02:16):
he fall back on? So remember when he got really defensive,
when old Lou Holtz took a shot at him and
they won a game. In a post game, he takes
a shot at rickety old blue holes and I'm like,
wait a minute, well, why do you care about that?
Because he doesn't have a history of success Mark Rick did.
(02:40):
Neither is that when you you know, save Michigan State, LSU, Alabama, NFL,
people can take shots at you. You have a formula
that works. Ryan Day doesn't have a formula that works.
He's two and foreign bulls. He can't beat Michigan now
four years in a row. And I thought the game
plan was fascinating John. He was trying to prove how
(03:01):
tough Ohio State was in the first half. Say, bro,
you have major matchup advantages at wide receiver. He wanted
to prove, Hey, people say we're not this. This game's
always decided by rushing yards. I'm gonna approve. I'm gonna
blow this hole. I can't coach tough football teams because
(03:24):
he got very defensive with lou Holtz questioning that. And
this is Ryan Day and we'll get into Lincoln Riley
in a second. He's a little lost when you start
worrying about voices outside the building and narratives and it
starts changing your game plan. Their first half game plan
(03:45):
was embarrassing, Like what was it? He was trying to
prove we can win tough, Just win the damn game.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
You know, I've had this theory with politics for a
while that sometimes the media is detrimental to candidates and
a certain party. And I think you know CNN and
MSNBC writer in the headlines a lot, a lot that
no one's watching them anymore. They're losing a lot of viewership,
but their clips go viral and I'm on a million
(04:14):
text chains that see them constantly, and they're constantly lecturing
people that whether it was Biden's cognitive ability or that
Kamala was a great candidate, and eventually that people are like, yeah,
just come on right, pump the brakes. And I think
for a long time there has been a media apparatus
that has told everybody, you, Ohio State fans are lunatics.
(04:35):
Get lectured them that they're lunatics. And this guy is X.
Look at his record and it's like, guys, most human
beings now over thirty years old have been alive long
enough to see Pete Carroll Urban Meyer, Nick Saban k
Kirby smart dabble like they know what a really good coach.
Looks like they also know that the Big Ten, beside
(04:56):
a team or two every once in a while, is
not very good anymore. Most of these teams, like beating
Nebraska and beating Minnesota when you're at Ohio State and
you have unlimited resources, is not that impressive. So you
are basically paid to beat Penn State, Michigan and the
other top teams that you play, whether it's Notre Dame
or which you play in the playoffs and stuff. That's it, Like,
no one you get no credit for beating the shit
(05:17):
out of Minnesota and Nebraska. Whoever. You better win those games,
but no one cares. It's like James Harden scoring fifty
against Sacramento Kings in January. Like, I'm sorry, no one
puts any stock into that after a while, and I
think everyone getting lectured constantly about Ryan Day Ryan Days, Like, guys,
we've seen him in these big games, and it's something's off, right,
something's off, and in this game specifically right. The last
(05:39):
couple of years, Harbaugh has had a team that was elite,
so you get beat as happens Kirby Smart's.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
Losses last year, Michigan had better players than Ohio State, they.
Speaker 1 (05:47):
Had seventy guys drafted or whatever this year. You we've
all seen crazy games in college. We've seen twenty plus
years insane that to me, obviously, we've seen bigger outcomes
like Vince Young that was a national championship game, right,
or even Ohio State lost or won national in a
regular season game. I think that's one of the craziest
outcomes I've ever seen in my entire life. Start to
(06:08):
finish because not a person in the world, especially a
Michigan fan, would have bet on Michigan. And as the
game was going, you kept thinking yourself, this can't be happening.
But he tried to get into a heavyweight fight with
the one thing Michigan can do, and Chip deserves blame
to run it up the middle. It's like they're two
good players with the defensive tackles. You have three NFL guys.
But I keep thinking that after the game and everyone
(06:29):
shitting on Ryan Day, it's like, well, they've been lectured
for five years that he's a great coach, and it's
like I'm just waiting for him to beat another Like
we don't care that he's beaten. James Franklin now four
straight times. Yeah, like you can't beat Michigan, which in
this program clearly is borderline the equivalent of like the
national title game at this point. And he loses against
the other good teams when he plays him in big spots.
(06:50):
So you're watching him and you go the cockiness the
third base comment. Most guys that get those jobs. Jim
Harbaugh to get the Michigan job, had to coach at
San Diego Stanford and then win at the forty nine ers.
You know, this guy had never been a head coach. Yeah,
and he got the job and handed to him by
one of the greatest coaches of his era. So the
Ohio State fans literally know what it looks like with
(07:11):
urban Meyer and you go, well, we're not that physical.
We have this pass and here's I was thinking about
this too, because I've been critical of this guy for
a long time. And Sarkesey has got Texas in the
SEC Championship year one. Yeah, and I'm watching him last
night and I went to watch him live. Sark takes
his offensive guy like Ryan Day. Well, he's also the
play caller, so half the game is his baby, right,
(07:34):
and the program's his baby. But the play calling well,
Ryan Day is like turned into this CEO even though
he's this offensive minded guy, has to hire Chip Kelly
and you're watching him on offense just look terrible against
a Michigan team. Their best corner Will Johnson, who might
be like a top five pick. It's like Travis Hunter
two point zero corner is out your slicing. I was like,
what are you guys doing, Like you're supposed to be
(07:56):
an offensive mine, get chips call in the plays, and
then your team's not tough. And I do think the
look after the game where they plant the flag and
he stands there. It just listen, they're in the playoffs,
so you're not gonna fire him today. I don't see
how this moves forward. I because I I think it's
very possible that this type loss, they could just lose
(08:18):
immediately in the playoffs, depending on who they play. Yeah,
I do think Ohio State fans and I'm an Ohio
State hater, but if I was in their shoot, I'd
be tired of being lectured constantly by and listen, I
get it, Joe Klatt and all these guys at Ohio
State is a huge part of the business and they're awesome.
I like watching them too, but like we have to
riot a day, Like Kirby Smarts, the Nick Saban's like,
(08:38):
he's not Urban Myers, He's not even remotely on their level.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
No, he's not.
Speaker 1 (08:41):
He's not even debatable.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
No, No, he is much closer to Mark Richt, who
you know, George is better now without Mark Richt, who
is a really nice guy. But they I mean, I
had an NFL GM tell me years ago he'd love
drafting Georgia guys under Mark Richt. He goes, because they were.
He goes, if you drafted a Nick Saban guy at Bama,
he'd already wheezed all the juice out of the player.
He goes these Georgia guys like they still had two
(09:04):
gears of shifting, you know, like you were always like, oh,
they're way better than you think. The other thing is
that the transfer portal and the NIL have actually created parody.
When I was talking with a guy today who's he
runs a message board for Ohio State, and I said,
you know, you used to be able to years ago
(09:24):
when you had one hundred and twenty five scholarships and
the John McKay era for us. See, you'd take like
four running backs in the West Coast just to hog
them even if he didn't play him. And then we
got down to eighty five scholarships. And you can still
do a little bit of that. Nick Saban can do it.
Kirby Smart Well, Now a backup left tackle at let's
say Ohio State Louisville comes in and says, we'll pay
(09:45):
it three hundred thousand dollars you're a starter for us,
or a right tackle at Ohio State, Well, he's you
want to be a left tackle and show that scouts
that you know, whoever's got money, whatever team a Texas
and m can say, come here, start at left tackle.
So there's less depth. And then then then an Ohio
(10:05):
State could lose an elite offensive tackle where it's always
been my whole life. The top programs have tour they
have backups that would start, except for there's a first
round guy in front of them. Well that guy now
just goes and plays at a lesser program.
Speaker 1 (10:20):
Gone.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
And so if you have an injury, so let's say
you're Georgia and you lose you know, brock Bowers, and
then a tight end gets hurt and the other tight
end who you had, he got purchased by Wake Forest
or somebody or Oregon. Well, now now your tight ends
no better than the guy Purdue. So these teams like
Alabama and Georgia and Ohio State, if they have a
(10:43):
key O line injury or a linebacker injury, they don't
have great backups. Those guys have been purchased in the
NIL to go to lesser programs. And I mean I
know a program that was I mean Washington, I mean
they were in the Harbaugh Michigan teams. They were like, okay,
who's not starting that we recruited? Who's a five star guy?
(11:04):
Who's behind a you know, a sophomore who's got two
more years there that's the game. Now.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
I think Ohio State, though, if you look at this
offseason as well.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
Reported they spent twenty million.
Speaker 1 (11:14):
Yeah, I think these numbers. Yeah, it could be twenty five,
could be eighteen, could be twelve. You know, who knows
the actual number. But they spent a lot relative and
I think widely considered the most of any college football team.
And they bought Ferraris. I mean, Caleb Downs would start
for every NFL team immediately. He's great. You know, they
bought multiple sweet players and then they signed Kansas State's quarterback,
(11:36):
who some believe was not going to be their starter
anymore because the other kid that was coming up they
played this year. They were going to go to him
a little more dynamic. And you look and you go, well,
shouldn't if you're going to buy a Ferrari and a
range Rover and not have a garage. But it's a
pretty risky move, you know. The cam Ward was clearly
the guy, but you go Chip, Kelly, Ryan Day. I
(11:57):
bet they wouldn't really love cam.
Speaker 2 (11:59):
Ward a little bit.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
You know, that's not really their type player, especially Chip.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
Yeah, doing his own thing.
Speaker 1 (12:04):
Will Howard or Will Howard, that's yeah, it was much
more their type guy. And you watch Kyle McCord a
Syracuse who just takes down Miami. He's had a pretty
good year. Yeah, they blamed everything on him last year
and listen, he was up and down for him. But
I think sometimes in this nil era, when you're paying people,
especially quarterbacks, a lot of money, you can start doing
finger pointing, where in the history of the sport you
(12:25):
would just give that guy a couple of years to
be your starter and maybe that one year you look back,
you win the national championship the next year, and you go,
we live through that. Look what Harbad did with JJ
McCarthy and that crew of guys. They lost that devastating
game to Tissue TCU. Right, it was hard to stomach.
A couple of years ago, everyone came back and they
won it. Well. Now in the nil era, if you
like you're just pointing the finger, you make a couple
(12:47):
guys transfer, they're not good enough, you upgrade. You watch
how could you lose a game where the opposing team
If I told you at the start, how much money
would you put on Ohio State? If they're starting quarterback
through for sixty yards and threw two picks, you'd be like,
I bet they win the game forty to ten.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
I thought I predicted to kill him. I thought it
was gonna be I honestly thought thirty eight to thirteen
would be close. I thought it was gonna be a blowout.
Speaker 1 (13:10):
You just can't. You just can't fake toughness. And I've
been around these coaches long enough and know these guys
in these NFL teams and these programs, some guys have
it and some guys don't, and a small percentage truly
have it. Like Urban Meyer, Nick Saban, it's not about
like your size or your coach, but you're like everyone
when you walk into the room, they kind of they're
(13:31):
their shoulders. Kirby clearly has it right. It's a small
percentage of guys. And Ryan he's not bad, but he
was also handed I think the best program in the
country with unlimited resources and will do whatever he wants.
And they are regressing four straight times in Michigan. I
think he's a loss. We'll see who they end up
playing in the first round. Let's just say they play Tennessee.
(13:52):
That's why I thought if they play a team like
and they lose, I mean, you, now, who are they
gonna hire, Like it's Mike Vrabel's not coming to college
ball in this era, right, so it's like who you know,
do you hire the Iowa State coach? There's no it's
you might just get the same thing, Like you're probably
not getting Nick Saban, Urban Meyer, you know, the next
version of that. So you're just this is where they're
(14:13):
kind of you know, it's not that bad, but it's
clearly not good enough because if you can't get Michigan now,
like you just beat a team that was so desperate.
They paid a kid twelve fifteen million dollars to be
their quarterback who's seventeen years old. That's the team you
just lost to.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
All right, I want to finish up USC Notre Dame.
By the way, Marcus Freeman, the coach for Notre Dame,
Peter Schrager is reporting this, and this is the second
person I've heard it from. Marcus Freeman. The Chicago Bears
are interested culture builder. So just throw that out there.
That's being talked about in NFL circles. Notre Dame coach
Marcus Freeman.
Speaker 1 (14:49):
Would would you leave Notre Dame making ten million dollars
a year to the Bears?
Speaker 2 (14:53):
No?
Speaker 1 (14:53):
If you had to answer to Kevin Wesley and I
would not even know.
Speaker 2 (14:57):
But it's interesting. They can't get rid of Lincoln Riley.
He had his contract turned over, so it's nine years,
ninety million left. They just put three hundred million into
the facilities. They're collectives up to eighteen million, so that
it's not a money issue. They're collective and now to
eighteen million dollars. I was told by an agent yesterday
(15:19):
that's not it. But it's so they're not going to
get rid of Lincoln. They're not going to do it us.
He's not going to buy him out. It's not the SEC.
And his best talent is young, and their defensive line
talent they've recruited the last two years is much better.
Blah blah blah. But this goes back to the Ryan
Day thing. So he was handed an Oklahoma program and
(15:41):
the culture was set, and he was very clever. He
was he was a better offensive guy than Stoops. So
he goes to USC and he doesn't really have to
build a culture because Caleb Williams is so much better
than everybody else in the conference. And they win eleven games,
should have beaten two Langes at a one to twelve.
The following year, about halfway through, you're like, wow, they
have to replace the defensive staff. He deserves credit for that.
(16:03):
But if you I believe, and somebody said this to me,
they said, he's getting Why isn't he replacing offensive coaches.
They have one good, not great offensive tackle in the
program three years in. The backup left tackle is six
two three ten, he's a center. They have one really
(16:25):
nice draftable running back in three years he's leaving. They
don't have a draftable defensive player on this team. I
think Camari Ramsey, the safety's draftable next year. Notre Dame
is a better football team, should have won. It's not that,
but now we're going into year four. Forget the defense,
which is better but not elite. They don't have enough
good offensive town this quarterback. They have za Ham and Egger.
(16:47):
I mean, he either he can't read the middle of
the field or they don't trust him. Everything's up the sidelines,
everything's bubble screen up the sideline. They don't throw the
ball in the middle of the field. What I am
hearing is he is alienated LA high school coaches. I
mean they're LA recruiting stinks, so USC is trapped here.
They can't buy him out. He's gotten stubborn on the
(17:10):
offensive coaching where they're just not getting outside a receiver.
They s don't have good enough players, forgettable running backs,
forgettable tight ends, don't have any tackles outside of Elijah
paid left tackle. When they signed him to a ten
year deal, you thought you were getting a steal.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
I'm not.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
This is the first time I've really I look at
it and I'm like, wait a minute. They're getting worse
every six games from the beginning of Caleb's first year
to the next six, to the beginning of year two
to the last six. This team beat LSU at the
end of the year. The last three years, they're not
a very good football team. That is bad coaching.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
If I would have told you in August that they
would have one more win on December first than UCLA,
he would have said, John, put down the drugs. I
thought UCLA was gonna win like two games this season.
And honestly, it's not like they beat the brakes off them.
That game probably could have gone either way.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
Ye the fourth quarter close.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
Yeah, UCLA being five and seven and you being six
and six. What a disaster for the USC.
Speaker 2 (18:17):
Ucla has no money in their collective. USC has eighteen million,
So it's it's it's not a fair fight.
Speaker 1 (18:23):
Well, let's you know, we've talked about Ryan Day. He
inherits Ohio State. The recruiting mechanism was already set in place,
like what Lincoln had in Oklahoma under Bob Stoops. It
was already the guys flowing there. He just had to
keep it rolling, and he's done that. It's why his
disasters are ten and two. Everyone wants to fire him
Lincoln would die for that. Lincoln had to start it
from scratch. To me, if you don't nail the best
(18:45):
players in California, obviously the transfer portal has changed classes
a little bit. That's pretty embarrassing. And I get this
is not the Pete heyday, but like, why do Kirby
and Nick and the guys that win in the South
wind because they nail the players in their region? Yes,
and there it's harder because you have to recruit. If
you're at LSU, at Georgia, at Alabama, you know, Florida
(19:06):
ever got good Now Tennessee, you're all recruiting against each other.
Like obviously Oregon has to come down to southern California,
but you still have a huge advantage and everything. The
nostalgia of the Reggie Bush, of what it used to be,
it's just gotta be gone. If you meet someone now
and young people that work for you, and you know,
I'm around young people, Like a twenty five year old
was born in two thousand, right, So that guy in
(19:30):
the heyday of Liner and Reggie and Lindel White was
five or six years old. So those guys that are
now eighteen years old, think about it, they were like
the Clay Helton era. So this this nostalgia of what
used to be exists to me and you or older people,
not to the people that matter the most. And if
you piss off these high school coaches, like the high
(19:52):
school coaches are the lifeblood of someone's program because they
funnel you guys. I mean, they are very very important.
Obviously now money has changed hands. But to me, sc
like Caleb Downs whoever, that the equivalent of those type
players every year they should it should be between Ohio State,
USC and Texas. Like if they're not in on every
why Er Sark and Ohio State's roster is so good
(20:14):
because they're buying all the sweet players who are available.
And obviously they recruit really well. What is Lincoln gonna
have a top ten recruiting class this year in the nation.
Speaker 2 (20:24):
Top twenty with twelve to fourteen.
Speaker 1 (20:28):
And here's the problem. Ohio State, even with Ryan Day,
is not going anywhere. If they keep them for the
next five years, they're gonna win ten or eleven games
every year. Oregon clearly is going nowhere. And listen, we
can Washington see what.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
James Jedfish can recruit. So jed Fish will get that
puppy to nine wins.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Fast, and I've heard that they did not use much
nil money this year because they wanted to take a
deep breath. They're gonna be blown it this year, so
they will be aggressive and Penn State. We've already seen
the stats over the last six years or seven years.
If they would have had the playoffs, they'd be in
it every year. And the one thing James hangs his
hat on is recruiting. Yeah right, it's one thing you say.
James Franklin is great at recruiting, right in game coaching recruiting.
(21:09):
So I you could argue this could just nothing could change,
you know, six and six, maybe they're eight and four.
But I don't know. They'd have to catch lightning in
a bottle. I I don't know if you're ever going
to see the Lincoln that they bought. I think this
might be the new normal, you know, which is when
you're paying that type of premium. What was that building?
(21:30):
Was that a home game for Notre Dame?
Speaker 2 (21:32):
No, it was. It was seventy five and that was
eighty twenty usc it was a.
Speaker 1 (21:40):
Notre Dame was not an apathetic group yet, but it's
they've got to be pretty down right the big toward apathy.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
Yeah, the Big Ten saves them because the Nebraska's, Wisconsin, Iowa, Michigan,
Ohio State travels so well. That's what really saves them.
They'll have good revenue because of their collective and let's
be honest, twenty thousand Big Ten fans winner, they're going
to la to watch that game.
Speaker 1 (22:04):
To me, where you have no excuse, like listen, you
lose Oregon, you lose Ohio State, Like maybe you're not
as good. You cannot be losing to the middle of
the pack Maryland. And when you look at the middle
of the pack and the Big Ten, what is the
difference between UCLA and Rutgers and USC. Like that's that's
what would really shake me if I was a USC fan,
(22:24):
is we're not just middle of the pack. From a
talent standpoint. When I watch him play, it looks the same.
It's always been my defense of the SEC. It's like
you just watched the sect different, Like, yeah, there's just more.
Obviously Ohio State and Oregon have the equivalent, but the
middle of the Big Ten and the middle of the SEC,
even if the records are the same, the talent discreptancy
is obvious. And the USC's did they kind of had
(22:46):
an easy schedule this year. Did they play Ohio State?
Speaker 2 (22:49):
They did not play Ohio State, nor do they play
Ohio State next year. So if you look at I
mean Lincoln got a big break. He didn't get or
get her Ohio State this year. He didn't get Ohio
State next year. So even it's funny you ask, I
looked at USC schedule yesterday and they have the home
in the ways, it's a really they get Michigan at home,
(23:13):
they get a couple of their you know, they get
a couple of their tough games at home, so they're
getting They don't have an LSU on the schedule. They
play like Georgia, Southern Southwest, Missouri State. They do an
sec out a conference schedule, so that if you look
at the schedule next year, John, it is by Big
Ten standards, it is a cakewalk.
Speaker 1 (23:33):
The other thing is and obviously football at USC is
way bigger than basketball. Yeah, but Muscleman kind of has
a history of winning and just kind of playing the
party right. So he's just god. He just can shake
some hands, he can put on a smile, he can
play the part like you don't get to be just
grumpy Belichick in college, right, you can do that in
the NFL. As long as you win in college, you
(23:54):
do have to shake hands donors nil. And now they're
going to be comparing in Derek Musselman, who's been winning
at all these places, and then you got Lincoln kind
of Henri scowls, not smiling. I think you asked yourself,
and this is what I said from the beginning. Does
he even want to be there? Did he just get
an offer so gigantic that no human could turn down?
(24:15):
Where it's like he was already so rich, he's looking
at his bank account my life. Do I regret this?
I think you got to say, if he could do
if he could do it over again? Is he the
coach at USC right now? I think you'd have to
say no, right.
Speaker 2 (24:29):
I still think he believes based on the recruiting, the
interior defensive line recruiting the last couple of years. I
think he believes next year's the season. But they don't
have a quarterback. They don't have an elite quarterback, so shit,
who knows. John Middlcoff, former NFL scout, as Ola was
crushed it, buddy.
Speaker 1 (24:51):
Thanks goin, talk to you soon. The volume
Host
Colin Cowherd
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com