March 21, 2024 • 39 mins
Chris Mannix and Rohan Nadkarni discuss the numerous gambling controversies and comments from around the sports world before breaking down the Bucks playing a competitive game against the Celtics despite Giannis Antetokounmpo's absence. We also discuss if the Pelicans are the biggest threat to the Nuggets in the west and the numerous Anthony Edwards Jordan comparisons after his massive dunk on John Collins
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Is the Crossover Sports Illustrated's NBA show, bringing down the
latest news, bloomers, and everything.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Here's your host, Chris.
Speaker 3 (00:17):
This is the Crossover NBA Podcast. I'm Chris Mannox. He
is Rohan and Rowan. On today's show, we are going
to talk about the Milwaukee Bucks as a legitimate threat
in the Eastern Conference. We're talking about the New Orleans
Pelicans as maybe a legitimate threat in the Western Conference.
(00:37):
And all these comparisons that are being made right now
with Anthony Edwards and Michael Jordan are they fair got
to get into that as well. But I want to
start the show on a more serious note, or potentially
serious note.
Speaker 4 (00:54):
In the world of Major League Baseball.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
This week, we had a story that's still developed as
we record this, where Shoey Atani, the Superstar pitcher for
the LA Dodgers, Star SI Cover Star. Yes, the Jinks
is alive and well, he is involved in some sort
of gambling scandal that involves his interpreter. Now, this story
(01:21):
has had a number of different permutations. By the time
people listen to it, there might be a new version
of it. But somehow someway millions of dollars were transferred
from shoe Aatani's account to his translator, who then funneled
them to a illegal gambler. Uh so you know, sports
(01:42):
has gambling has infiltrated Major League Baseball's biggest star, global
star in some way. And this scandal broke right around
the time that basketball was starting to get touched by it,
and you're seeing some public figures in the basketball space
(02:03):
start to weigh in audible, So I want to play
a couple of clips for you from this week. The
first one is from Tyrese Halliburton, the Pacers guard, talking
about how he feels like he's viewed by the public.
And the second one is from Cavalier's coach JB. Bickerstaff,
who discusses some of his interactions with sports gamblers.
Speaker 4 (02:25):
Take a listen, but not.
Speaker 5 (02:26):
Everybody cares to hear how we feel or dam I mean,
that's just the point, Like great, I mean, to half
the world, I'm just you know, helping them make money
on draft games or whatever. You know what I mean,
Like I'm I'm a prop you know what I mean.
Like that's what my social media mostly consists of. You know,
I think it's important for us to like have somebody
to talk to and like, I think all that stuff
(02:47):
is like it can be funny sometimes and somebody's like,
you know, I lost a thousand dollars out I don't give.
I do think. I do think that it's important for
us to just have conversations with people who really value
who as human.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Beings that we've had our own I personally have had
my own instances with you know, some of the sports
gamblers where you know, they got my telephone number and
we're sending me, you know, crazy messages about you know,
where I live and my kids and all that stuff.
So it is a dangerous game and a fine line
that we're walking for sure. Uh. It brings added pressure.
(03:23):
It brings you know, a distraction uh to the game
that can be difficult for players, coaches, referees, you know,
everybody that's involved in it. And I think that, you know,
we really have to be careful, you know, with how
close we let it get to the game. UH, and
the security of the people who are involved in it,
(03:46):
because again, it does carry a weight. You know, a
lot of times the people who are gambling like this
money you know, pays their light bill or plays their rent.
Speaker 3 (03:56):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
And then the emotions that come from that. So I
do think walking a very fine line and we have
to be extremely careful in protecting everybody who's involved. There's
no doubt about it that it's crossed the line. You
know the amount of times where you know, I'm standing
up there and we may have a ten point lead
and the spread is eleven and people are yelling at
(04:17):
me to leave the guys in so that we can
cover the spread, like it's ridiculous. But again it's I
understand the business side of it and the nature of
the business of it, but I mean, it is something
that I believe has gone too far.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
So ron it does seem like we're now seeing the
consequence of the NBA embracing sports gambling. And to be fair,
they're not the only sport out there doing and everyone
is doing it. Everyone has a deal with DraftKings or
fan duel or somebody else to be involved with sports gambling,
(04:51):
and up until now it's really been mostly upside right.
The revenues have been flowing in. People have had a
lot of fun gambling on all this. But when you
hear Halliburden say he kind of feels like a prop
or you hear JB. Bickerstaff say, I get calls from
(05:12):
people that have gambled on Cavalier games, hostile calls from them.
Do you feel like this is kind of just the
tip of the iceberg for where the negative side of
sports gambling could come in.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
Without a doubt, there's a lot I want to say here,
and I want to address your question very directly, real quick.
Another thing that has been announced and it is apparently
going to happen, is the NBA wants to add like
in game betting to NBA League Pass, you know, live betting,
you know, on different props and whatnot. And I want
(05:46):
to address what you have to say. I just need
to say real quick, as a longtime NBA League Pass subscriber,
someone who's had to move often, you know, can't just
very easily get it on my cable subscribes to the
digital version of NBA Pass, that is such a slap
in the face to the League Pass consumer, Like somebody
needs to stand up for the League Pass consumer. Adding
(06:07):
in like live betting before you fix fast forward and rewind,
before you get rid of like annoying local blackouts. Just
don't get me started on how like amateurish the NBA
League Pass product is okay, Like, it's a joke for
a billion, billion, billion, billion, multi billion dollar business to
have such a pathetic product as NBA League Pass and
(06:29):
the fact that they're prioritizing adding in game betting not
only shows just you know how far the reach of
gambling has gotten, but just how easy it would be
to fix some of these issues if they really wanted to.
So I needed to get that off my chest because
I think it's a joke and the NBA should be
embarrassed as it relates to gambling. Though I know, like
(06:50):
you've joked about, you know, partaking in it. I know
you enjoy it, and I'm like perfectly fine with it
being legal. I have no issues with it. I think
it's better that it's legal and ideally, you know, somewhat
regulated then you know, probably the way it's been happening
for the years prime and years people were gambling on
sports illegally. But I think that the NBA and all
(07:11):
these leagues are sitting on a huge problem. And you
also had Rudy Gobert kind of allude to the fact that,
oh maybe the refs had money on this game, and
he caught a huge fine for it. I did find
Gobert's idea that like the refs were conspiring to fix
this Cavs Wolves game a little funny. At the same time,
it's not implausible to think something like that could happen,
(07:32):
especially when the NBA's had issues with it already. And
you know, I understand the leagues. They're like, if all
this gambling is going on, let us get a part
of the pie here, and players benefit too, ultimately because
it brings in more revenue to the sport and makes
the cap go higher. But I do think the leagues
need to seriously reconsider or at least have some sort
(07:52):
of plan as to how they're handling all this. You know,
I think it's been a topic of discussion on NBA Twitter,
Like these sportsbooks don't exists for people who are good
at gambling, Okay, they exist for people to lose money.
That's how these companies make money. They want people to
think they're placing a casual twenty dollars bet every night,
not realizing how much it adds up the fact that
(08:14):
so much of the marketing now revolves around gambling. Like
I grew up not knowing what a spread was for
a very long time. And I found a way to
enjoy basketball, and I just think the consequences of this,
we don't know what they are, and so the leagues
are kind of just zoomed so quickly to get into
bed with these gambling companies. I think it's gonna have
unintended consequences, and they're kind of letting it be a
(08:36):
wild West right now.
Speaker 3 (08:37):
Yeah, Look, sports gambling was going to be part of
the landscape, whether sports leagues embraced it or not.
Speaker 4 (08:45):
Like this was coming.
Speaker 3 (08:46):
You know, sports gambling has not been legalized because the NBA,
the NFL, major League Baseball are or were pushing for it.
It's just an evolution of the world, same way that
you know, like marijuana has become you know, accepted as
you know, a usable drug by sports leagues.
Speaker 4 (09:09):
It's the same thing.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
It's it's I think times change, things change in the world.
So this was coming no matter what. Look, as you said,
I've been on the record, I embrace sports gambling because
I do it in a pretty responsible way. I'm more likely,
you know, I'll throw fifty bucks on some kind of
stupid parlay or I'll you know, bet a huge underdog
in boxing and hope that a twenty dollars bet pays
(09:31):
off to like a buck fifty. I'm I've never been Look,
I work hard for my money. I don't want to
lose my I've never been in that position where I've
bet a lot of money and needed something to to
happen in order to get by in a day. But
the reality is there are a lot of people that
(09:51):
gambled like that, and because of that, as JB. Bickerstaff
was alluding to, it becomes, you know, dangerous because you've
got all the these people that might lose and blame
you for it and take it out on you in
some way, shape or form. Now that might manifest itself
in booze and crazy phone calls, but maybe it manifests
(10:12):
itself in violence down the line. Like that's that's a problem.
The NBA has got to be on the lookout for.
And mean, look, we don't know at this point what
happened with Otani, so I'll put that on a shelf.
But you are naive, not you specifically, but you the audience.
Anyone is naive if you don't think that there is
a scandal coming where a player, a referee, a coach
(10:35):
is caught feeding information to someone in order to benefit
themselves with sports gambling that that is going to happen
at some point. The only response I think the NBA
can have here is maybe you do pump the brakes
a little bit on just how invested you get your
(10:56):
just how in bed you're getting with sports gambling that
probably includes league pass. I don't think you need to have,
you know, live odds on league Pass. I would say
this though, I for one, am also someone that loves
to gamble in game.
Speaker 4 (11:10):
I've been to a couple of hockey games and I
don't know anythone like and I have.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
I have been bored out of my board to tears
by hockey games, I'm telling you, and I have wound
up like betting the third period of a game, you know,
whether we do a one and a half goals the
third period, and had so much fun because of it,
Like I've been enthralled because of it.
Speaker 4 (11:28):
So that part of it's fine. You don't need it
on leagu pass.
Speaker 3 (11:30):
You also don't need like, you know, when the Clippers
were announcing their new stadium, one of the things I
thought of was a you know, ultra rich, ultra you know,
you know, look forward technologically advanced guy like Steve Bomber
might put like Microsoft surfaces on every seat like that
kind of stuff, Like making it part of the in
(11:53):
game experience might be something the NBA should want to
pump the brakes on as well. But this is this
is a snowball, This is a rock rolling down the mountain.
You are not going to be able to stop this.
The doors have been flung wide open. And while the
majority of the fallout will be good because there's a
(12:13):
lot of revenue coming in to these sports that everyone's
gonna share from, there is going to be some bad
and when it's bad, it's going to be really ugly
for the NBA.
Speaker 2 (12:23):
Right and even it could even happen innocuously, like it
could even be you know something is like you know,
a coach makes an offhand remark to a family member about,
you know, someone's gonna miss a couple more games than
we thought, like something like that. You know, there's just
so much potential for disaster here. I'm with you, Like,
I don't think we need kiosks. You know, everyone's always
(12:44):
talking about it. It's only a matter of time before we
allow people to gamble in the arena.
Speaker 3 (12:49):
You can it's some of them, like there's isn't DC.
There's a William Hill sports book in there, there's a
FanDuel one in Phoenix, like there's And I.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
Think it's terrible, like I really do. And I'm not
trying to be like the old get off my lawn
person here, and like I'm not trying to get in
the way of anyone who wants to partake in this legally,
like have at it. If that's how you enjoy spending
your money, please do. But like there has to be
I think some level of protection here, some at least
artificial wall being put up. I mean, you've seen it
(13:18):
in the NFL. Guys have gotten suspended for full seasons,
you know, having family members place bets or betting, and
you know it's I think one NFL player made the
point where it's like, if I can literally like risk
my life on Sundays, why can't I bet on my team?
I'm not sure I agree with him, but he's also
making an interesting point, So I just like, at the
(13:40):
very least, and I'm not the first person suggestice, it's like,
can we do something about the ads? Like I don't
think that this is like a something that even just
beyond a league level is like great on a societal
level that it's like if you're eight years old, like
you will only know basketball for the rest of your life.
Is like a vehicle for DraftKings and FanDuel ads Like.
I don't know that that's the way we should be
(14:01):
doing all this. So I think there are serious, big
question pig picture questions. The league needs to address it.
I don't think they are ignorant to them, but it
feels like that hasn't necessarily been a priority other than,
you know, making sure that spigot is wide open.
Speaker 4 (14:17):
Well, look, cutting back.
Speaker 3 (14:20):
The problem with that is that you run into the
same dilemma you have when you have a discussion about
reducing the number of games, which is, if you cut back,
you're taking money off the table, and both sides have
to be okay with that. The spigot being wide open,
as you framed, it benefits everybody. Everybody gets a piece of,
(14:42):
you know, the lack of a better phrase, a piece
of that action. I'm skeptical that we'll see too much
restraint shown when it comes to money, right, Like they're
going to want to capitalize as much as possible on
this gambling wave. I just think they have to put
(15:03):
in as many guard rails as they possibly can when
it comes to the integrity of a gamble of a game.
But even if they do, it's coming, you know, baseball.
Like if this turns out to be more than what
the initial reporting was that Otani was first paying off
his interpreter's gambling debt, I didn't believe that. Then it
(15:24):
was his interpreter stole four and a half million dollars. I'm
I sure as shit didn't believe that. Like, there's just like,
if it turns out to be Otani involved with sports gambling,
that is a catastrophe in Major League Baseball.
Speaker 2 (15:39):
Can we I know that this is not a baseball
podcast for one minute, can we please indulge in somewhat
reckless speculation like this Otani thing. Man, I'm with you.
It stinks to high heaven. I have some good friends
in this world, and I understand he just signed this
massive contract, Like he really gave this dude five million
to pay off his gambling debts.
Speaker 3 (15:58):
Well that was like initiation, but it was it wasn't.
It was his team team that walked it back. Like
this is whenever you change your story. It means you're
searching for an acceptable truth like that. Uh, you know,
you you'd like to give some people to benefit the
(16:19):
doubt and not accuse someone of you know, illegal or
untoward behavior. But if your story is X one day
and why another, that means you're covering up something.
Speaker 4 (16:28):
It just that's what it means. I am.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
I am fascinated to see how i MLB handles that one,
because he is by far the biggest star in that sport. Yeah,
that is going to be very interesting.
Speaker 3 (16:39):
All right, let's move on talk some basketball here. Last
night in Boston, Celtics took on the Bucks. I was
at that game last night. Took the Red Eye from
California to watch that game ro a loan expecting Giannis
to play. Turns out he was scratched from that game
with the hamstring injury early in the day. Still turned
out to be a pretty good game. The Bucks, you know,
rallied in that fourth quarter, blew the doors off the Celtics. Frankly,
(16:59):
in the they're in the fourth quarter, just came up
a little bit short at the end. And look, Boston
is a country mile ahead of Milwaukee in the standings
in the Eastern Conference, they are most likely to finish
with the best record in the NBA. But you know,
there was a perception has been a perception one that
I've kind of bought into, that the Celtics were just
going to cruise through the Eastern Conference playoffs. Based on
(17:23):
what you saw last night between the Celtics and the Bucks,
is Milwaukee a greater threat to Boston than originally thought?
Are they a threat to Boston if they wind up
playing in the conference finals?
Speaker 2 (17:35):
I do think they are a threat at the end
of the day. Jannis is such a massive factor in
a playoff season, and we saw these teams. I mean
that twenty twenty two series that Milwaukee played without Chris
Middleton that went seven games at ironically, Drew Holliday making
a huge places for in Bobby portis one of the
biggest offensive rebounds in Milwaukee Bucks history in that game five.
(17:55):
I mean, they pushed Boston to the limit in that
series without Chris Middleton. Now, last night, I don't know
if you feel this way, Like when I watch a
game and I find out like Yiannis is sitting, it's
almost like the team that's missing the star can't win
because if they win the game, you could just be like, ah,
the other team didn't get up for it, and if
they make it close, you're kind of like, it's just
hard to take away any meeting from it. But what
(18:17):
I saw that I think was really encouraging was the
play of Chris Middleton. And you remember the first time
these two teams matched up, Like, It's not only that
Middleton looked worse defensively, it's like the Celtics were hunting
him in a way that Chris Middleton, you know, they
were hunting him like he was Now I'm now going
to be like mean to someone in the NBA, but
(18:37):
I mean they were hunting him like he was the
worst defender on the floor in a playoff series. The
way they were going at him in the post, one
on one on the perimeter. I thought Middleton had a
nice game offensive last night. You shoot like eight for
eleven something like that. Really nice game offensively. Beyond that
I liked or I saw from I like what I've
seen from him recently. It looks more fluid. I think
the time that they've given him off is paying dividends,
(19:01):
so if they get a healthy version of him, And
we discussed that, like going forward in the playoffs. That
to me is a difference maker, and I think if
you're a Bucks fan, that was a really encouraging part
about last night because we know Dan can get hot.
We've seen what Yiannis can do against the Celtics in
a playoff series. And one thing that's interesting about Boston,
as great as that starting five is and as much
(19:22):
as you know, I think we're fans of it, they
will be in an interesting position defending Jannis in a
playoff series. You know, they they might maybe they'll put
holiday on him. That's something they've done time and time
again this year, putting him on Bigs. But you know,
that strategy is a little different when it's a Yo
kich Er a Yannis and they're doing that. So I
(19:43):
definitely think Milwaukee that's playing a lot better. Bobby Porters
was fantastic last night. Is a threat. Absolutely.
Speaker 4 (19:50):
You know, after the.
Speaker 3 (19:51):
Game, the Bucks said there are no moral victories. You know,
that's fine if that's their perception. I thought there was
a moral victory from Milwaukee. To be down your super
are and to really be in a one possession game
with less than a minute left, that's a big win
for them. Look, Damian Lillard just with a good defender
on him and Jalen Brown, he found a way to
(20:12):
get thirty points. Like that was impressive. Chris Middleton not
only was pretty good in that game last night, but
he also now has like what a month left in
the season to continue to build chemistry with Lillard, with Giannis,
with Doc Rivers. So I think that's gonna be valuable
time that he's gonna have. Bobby Portas is really good generally.
(20:33):
Like you know, I was doing some TV last night.
I said in the pregame show, I'm like, don't let
Bobby Portis get off, Like, this guy's not a slouch,
like you know, the starting lineup.
Speaker 4 (20:41):
He can play.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
So cooking the Suns the other day too, it's been
a little Yeah.
Speaker 4 (20:47):
He's a really good player. Pat Connan had a better game.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
Uh so you know the Bucks have have the horses there. Now,
all that being said, I can understand how the Celtics,
who by the way, were without holiday in that game.
They were y and Sam Hauser.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
So when okay, let's not get carried. The dude had
to see had ten threes the other night.
Speaker 3 (21:12):
I mean I've done Look I used to be skeptical
of the Celtics rotation guys, the back end of the
rotation guys.
Speaker 2 (21:18):
Those the benches, I mean, fast game, they've done contribution
from those.
Speaker 3 (21:24):
You know, like Pritchard's going off Porzingis, you know, not
the best Porzingis game last night, but he still found
a way to make plays down the stretch. So look,
the Celtics once Giannis went out, I believe that, you know,
some of the motivation for that game also went out
there of course, right, Like you know, I think it's
just a playing Yeah, they have. They have played in
(21:45):
so many laughers over the last month or so. It's
been like two weeks since they've lost the game. It's
been over a month until last night that they won
a game in single digits. So they have just been
cruising through everyone, especially team in the Eastern Conference. So
I can understand Giannis goes down, they a little bit
of life goes out, and then they're a big going
(22:05):
to the fourth quarter. Right, you know, There's a lot
of ways to explain why the Bucks came back, but
I think if you'rre Milwaukee, you take away that this
Celtics team is beatable, right, You're on their home floor
down Jannis in a one possession game in the closing minutes.
So that's why I take away if I'm Milwaukee now.
One of the storylines that's emerged over the last couple
of days that I want to get your take on
(22:26):
is that the vulnerability of the Celtics is that they
don't have a guy that can close games down the stretch.
And that's been kind of a pretty strong finger pointed
at Jason Tatum, saying, Jason Tatum, as great as he
is all NBA First team, probably he is not the
guy that you'd want closing games or he has some
(22:50):
vulnerability there.
Speaker 4 (22:50):
What's your take on that?
Speaker 2 (22:52):
Okay, so let me preface this by saying, as you know,
I've made it my life's work to kind of spot
Boston propaganda whenever I can see it, fight back against
all the stuff coming out from over there. It's no
secret that I grew up in South Florida. Some people
may describe me as a Heat fan. You know, I'll
let them do that some people, So I have, you know,
(23:15):
every reason to hate on Jason Tatum. It's long been
my opinion that Youdonnas Haslam would have locked up Bill Russell.
Having said all that, said all of that, I think
people are like bored when they talk about the Celtics.
I think people are bored. I think they're looking for
a reason to think that this team like can't get
it done. As if and listen, Lebron James pointed this out,
(23:37):
It's like Tatum's own success is being held against him
because he's so good that he takes the team to
the conference finals every year. People are like, well, he
can't get it done. It's like, yo, he is twenty five, right,
what is it twenty five or twenty six now? He
like he's most players would just be entering their contention
window of like six seven years at this point. He's
(24:00):
just been a good player on good teams that can
get his team this far that it's almost being held
against him. And you know, I've even seen like, you know,
I've seen fans down here and be like, Tatum can't
get it done. Like Tatum has played two of the
most incredible road game sixes in recent memory. In Milwaukee
down three to two, save their season already like forty
in that game, unbelievable performance. And then the Sixers game
(24:22):
last year terrible for forty six minutes, last two minutes
of the game, snatched it away from the Sixers while
em beating hard and just choked away another playoff win.
To me, the idea that he can't get it done.
They shoot too many threes, they can't do this, blah
blah blah, Like this team is a juggernaut. They are
a heavy favorite, and they should be. And a lot
(24:44):
of that starts with the fact that Tatum he's either
gonna take your worst defender in the post and you're
gonna double. He's gonna hit a bunch of pull up threesh.
He's improving as a playmerker. I just think people are
like deeply, profoundly searching for ways to say why the
Celtics won't get it done, Like if they lose. I
don't think that's going to be the reason why.
Speaker 3 (25:04):
No, it's not, And I agree with everything that you
said there. Now, some of Tatum's critics have pointed to
some of the clutch time advanced numbers on Tatum not
being very good. But look, as a writer, you know
you can find statistics to back up virtually any argument.
What I go with is what I see in some
(25:26):
of these games and you brought up two good ones right.
The game against Milwaukee two years ago, down three to
two Bucks at home and Tatum goes for forty six.
The game against Game six against Philadelphia last year where
Tatum stinks for three quarters and then goes off in
the fourth to help them win the game. The next game,
Tatum had fifty one points. Yes, in game seven, Yes,
(25:48):
that's a clutch performance. Now, fast forward to the Conference
Finals against Miami. In the three games the Celtics won
to rally back to even the series, Tatum had eighty
something points in those three games. And even though he
wasn't good in Game seven, that has much to do in.
Speaker 4 (26:05):
The very first play, very first.
Speaker 3 (26:07):
Play of the game, Jason Tatum gets injured and isn't
the same player throughout. So let's stop with this. Jason
Tatum is not clutch. Jason Tatum is a potential liability.
You can't rattle off more than a handful of guys
that are more effective offensively than Jason Tatum.
Speaker 4 (26:26):
And the reason that Tatum's.
Speaker 3 (26:28):
Numbers are in the thirty plus per game is because
he has sacrificed this year. He has taken a step back,
So porzingis can average twenty points per game, so Jalen
Brown can continue to develop, so Drew Holliday can find
his role with this team. Jason Tatum could easily be
averaging thirty or more points per game. He isn't because
(26:49):
he's been a good team player. So fourth quarter, end
of game situations, I still like Jayson Tatum. Look at
that into the Milwaukee game, it wasn't a flawless finish
for the Celtics, but Jason Tatum had eight points over
the final two minutes and six seconds. Eight points over
two plus minutes is a great number. So I just
(27:11):
I'm not here for that. That is not going to
be the downfall of the Boston Celtics. Jason Tatum's inability
to get it done in the fourth quarter.
Speaker 2 (27:18):
If you all I'll say is like, at the end
of the day, look at how he's defended and how
much tension teams are giving him in fourth quarters, and
that lets you know all you need to know about
how teams are scared of his ability to make shots
from anywhere on the floor in the final few minutes
of a game. Now, let me just say, having said
all that we said, if either them or the Bucks
(27:39):
can't get it done this year.
Speaker 5 (27:40):
Oh man.
Speaker 2 (27:41):
Then then then the credits, well yeah, yeah, big time,
big time.
Speaker 3 (27:46):
All right, speaking of getting it done, we all look
at the Western Conference standings and say, all right, it's
Denver's world and we're just living in it.
Speaker 5 (27:54):
Right.
Speaker 3 (27:54):
And then you look at Oklahoma City and you say
the Clippers, Okay, there are two teams that you know
could make it runs. Maybeena gets their act together. Mixed
around the back of the Western Conference bracket. There is
not enough attention being paid to the New Orleans Pelicans
right now, who are playing outstanding basketball and have been
playing outstanding basketball really since January. First, if you louw
(28:16):
the numbers, I'm gonna read some of the numbers from
January one. Since the new year, the Pelicans are third
and net rating fourth, and offensive rating fourth, in defensive
rating third, in plus minus per game fourth, and steals fifth,
and three point percentage seventh, and field goal percentage seventh
and rebounds whole bunch of great numbers. They are excellent
(28:37):
on the road twenty two road wins this year, third
most in the NBA, and they are blowing a lot
of teams out. They ranked second in the NBA in
most double digit wins this season. Zion Williamson is back
on that trajectory that we thought he was going to
be on, becoming a superstar in this league.
Speaker 4 (28:56):
Brandon Ingram I think is as good.
Speaker 3 (28:57):
A number two guy, as good as you can get,
but a really really good number two guy on that team.
Ceji McCollum, he works. Should we consider the Pelicans a
legitimate threat not just to go deep in the playoffs,
but to advance all the way to the finals with
the team they have this year?
Speaker 2 (29:16):
Ah Man, it's a really good question. And you know,
like Dan Devine was on this pod last week and
we started talking about the Pelicans case a little bit,
and as you mentioned, they've just kept rolling even more since.
It's remarkable what they've done. What worries me about the
Pelicans a little bit, Chris, is like they had that
great playoff series against the Suns two years ago twenty
(29:37):
twenty two. That first round series pushed Phoenix quite a bit,
clearly got under their skin, and then you know, things
kind of the wheels kind of fell off last year.
They had injuries, Zion was out, like they were first
in the West in December, and then things kind of
went awry. I man, the West is just such a gauntlet,
(29:58):
like if they catch the wrong first round playoff series,
Like I think right now, it's kind of invoked to say,
maybe the Clippers. I think there was a time where
it was like, wait, you're the biggest threat. Yeah, Now
all of a sudden, it's like people are doubting the Clippers,
but like, I don't want to see them in the
first the.
Speaker 3 (30:11):
Clippers, though, Clippers are four or five right now as
we record this, four or five batchups Clippers Pelicans, which.
Speaker 2 (30:16):
Is I haven't even heard it. Yeah, I have at
this current moment. I don't know who I would pick
in that series. It would be really hard to pick
against Kawhi in that scenario, but who knows where Kawhi
is going to be a month from now. So this
is all a very long winded way of saying it's
it feels impossible to handicap the West. But what I
(30:37):
really like about New Orleans is all the depth they
have in the different ways they can match up with
teams in the postseason. I think it's going to be
really interesting. We still haven't seen Zion had to play
a great defensive playoff series, and that being such an
(30:58):
unknown to me cast doubts on how far I think
they can go. But I mean they've been playing their
ass off, there's no question about it.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
Look, they've got a legit superstar in Zion. They are
one of the best isolation teams in the NBA, which
matters in the playoffs because a lot of times it
does devolve into isolation ball. Zion and Ingram are two
elite isolation player.
Speaker 4 (31:24):
CJ.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
McCollum has been shooting the three terrific this season. And
they have perimeter defenders. They've got Herb Jones, They've got
Naji Marshall like, They've got guys that can get stops
for you on the perimeter. And they've got a bunch
of floor spacers in addition out there as well. And
if you want to go big against them, whether it's
Denver anybody else, you know, Valentoun is still there to
(31:45):
be that big body that can be a deterrent to
you know, whoever it is, whether it's in you know,
Zubach in the Clippers series, or Nicola Jokic, you know.
Speaker 4 (31:52):
Down the line.
Speaker 3 (31:54):
Look, because it's the Western Conference, Yeah, they're a threat
to lose in the first round. There's no doubt about that. Like,
it wouldn't be an upset if they lost in the
first round they played the Clippers right now. But when
I look at this Pelicans team, I see depth. Their
bench has been electric all season long. I see shooting.
You know, Trey Murphy in that mix, he has been fantastic.
(32:16):
I just see a whole bunch of guys that can
get it done. And maybe they're not mature enough yet,
you know for a deep playoff run. This will be
kind of if they're fully healthy going to the playoffs,
it'll be one of the first years they're able to
do that. But man, the talent's there, and Zion is
as difficult a player to game plan for as there
is in the NBA. When he gets that ball going downhill,
(32:37):
you can throw Giannis into this equation. There's nobody hard
to stop than Zion going to the basket. I mean,
his numbers in the restricted area are insane this year.
So they're they're gonna be. They're a legitimate team right now.
Speaker 2 (32:48):
Yeah. I also just like Zion des there's a ton
of credit because he was getting killed.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
Can we stop here that we're still but the Zion
is fat stuff is still out there all the time.
Speaker 4 (33:00):
It's just so he's not unnecessary.
Speaker 3 (33:03):
Yeah, he's never gonna be like, you know, slim, Like
you know, you're not gonna see him undergo a weight
transformation where he dropped fifty pounds and is able to
play like small forward for stretches, Like.
Speaker 4 (33:13):
That's not him. He's always gonna be a big guy.
Speaker 3 (33:15):
Can he be in better shape or could he have
been in better shape to start the season? Absolutely that
somebody's gonna have to address moving forward, because you can't
work your way back into shape during the season. When
I watch him, looks fine to me, Like, still looks like,
you know, an elite player to me for the minutes
he's playing.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
No, I think he looks great, and I think for
him to respond to that, just like mountain of criticism,
a lot of it unfair, is really impressive. And I'm
good for him because when he's on man, he's still
one of the most exciting players in the NBA. And
that's a fun team to watch man. Like you mentioned
how they got like spacers and defenders like Herb Jones,
(33:52):
Jose Alvarado, Like that is a fun, gritty ass team
that I excited to see them fully healthy in the
playoffs for sure.
Speaker 3 (34:00):
All Right, last thing for you, Anthony Edwards has been
having himself, uh pretty good week. Uh just absolutely posterized
John Collins in that game against Utah.
Speaker 4 (34:11):
That was as visious a dunk as I've seen.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
Okay, hold on, I'm just gonna say, it wasn't a
dunk to me, Chris.
Speaker 3 (34:16):
I.
Speaker 4 (34:18):
Throwdown versus the dunk.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
I know, you have this bug up your ass about
Yeah it's a dunk, I do, but like he elevated
and it was a it was a poster. It's Blake
Griffin over Mosgov and you know some of that stuff
that we've seen the past.
Speaker 4 (34:31):
Anyway, he's having himself a good week.
Speaker 3 (34:34):
The Timberwolves are surging even with Karl Anthony Towns out
of the rotation, which has increased the amount of praise
being heaped on young Anthony Edwards, with some in the
media comparing him favorably to Michael Jordan of all players.
I know Chris Bursard over at Fox that he contacted
Michael Jordan, and Jordan said there were some similarities. I'd
love to know what that exchange actually looked like. But
(34:57):
you know, look Edwards is a star. I would probably
put him more on the Kobe Dwayne Wade type of
level right now because Jordan is rarefied air. I mean,
that's arguably the greatest player of all time, and Anthony
Edwards has not accomplished anything really at this point. Like
he hasn't made a deep playoff run, He hasn't done anything.
(35:18):
So you can't put him up there with Jordan just yet.
But his skill set is complete. When he's on his game, defensively,
he's as good as anyone in the NBA. He's got
great instincts, he's got great length, he can do a
lot of things on the defensive side, and offensively he's
pretty damn special. So are we He's being too much
praise on Anthony Edwards right now this early in his career.
Speaker 2 (35:44):
I mean yes and no. I understand people who say
there's like similarities to Michael Jordan in the sense of, like,
obviously he's got this like jump out of the gym
athleticism that I think for a lot of people is
reminiscent of a young Jordan. I think Kobe and Dwayne
Wade even had that element to their game that people
compared to him j in their time. So I understand
it from that. You know, I think he's a great personality.
(36:06):
It's not necessarily mj like, but I think people he
has that charisma that that people are drawn to that
Michael Jordan had. So I understand the people who say similarities.
I'm kind of with you, though. It's's like we should
just stop using Michael Jordan as example, like nothing good
can come from it, Like nothing good can come from
like Anthony Edwards trying to like compare himself to Michael
(36:26):
Jordan for his entire career. That's not to say, though,
I think he's an incredibly fun player. I love his attitude.
The competitiveness is another thing I love from him. I
mean you mentioned the defense, Like you see like late
in games, one on one situations when he's matched up
with other team's best guys, like he wants that, you know,
he's ready to go at them in those situations. It's
(36:47):
not just on the offensive end. So I love his game,
love the attitude he plays with, love that he has,
like the personality to be a legitimate star for the NBA.
It feels like a long time since someone as fun
as him has come along, But like we we just
like it's not gonna do anyone any favors to like
(37:07):
let this MJ thing play out there. Yes, there are similarities,
but let's like, let's just let's just leave it at that.
Let's try to be normal about this.
Speaker 3 (37:16):
Yeah, I mean physically there are similarities. Stylistically there are similarities,
and Edwards is unquestionably on and an ascent. He's averaging
twenty six point seven points this year. That's a career high.
His field goal percentage is a career high. His three
point percentage is his career eyes up to almost thirty
seven and a half percent from three this year. I mean,
(37:37):
there's not much this guy isn't doing this season. And
I do love that he's been able to kind of
strap this team on his back offensively during Towns' absence
and you know, keep them in that top three mix
uh in the Western right there?
Speaker 2 (37:51):
Man, only one and a half games out of first
mean impressive.
Speaker 3 (37:55):
Well we'll see how how long you know I have? Yeah,
we'll see if they can stay at that, you can
get to that number one spot. The Town's injury just
kills them like they kill They've been better defensively, but
but worse. It's Lee offensively anyway, Edwards, Let's see him
get to that like d Wade level first, Like that's
still a Hall of Fame level.
Speaker 4 (38:13):
Let's get to the Hall of Fame d Wade, you know,
Kobe level first.
Speaker 3 (38:16):
Before we start talking about Jordan, let's all see what
he does in the postseason. Like wherever the Timberwolves wind up,
it's gonna be a brutal first round matchup, you.
Speaker 4 (38:25):
Know, where they get especially out. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (38:28):
Yeah, like, let let's see if he if he has
that in him. But you know, there's nothing to complain
about with Anthony Edwards right now. He is just dynamic,
no question.
Speaker 2 (38:36):
Oh man, could you imagine if we got like Luca
and at Edwards round.
Speaker 3 (38:41):
Every I love every single potential first round matchup in
the Western Conference, I mean the Western Conference. You know,
even just talking about like Clippers Pelicans in the first round.
That's a legitimate conference finals matchup right now. Three six
is Timberwolves Kings. Like that's great defense against you know,
perennially great offense. You know, Nuggets, Mavericks in the first round, Lucas.
Speaker 2 (39:03):
Your sons, imagine Katie going back to ok C and
I mean it's incredible.
Speaker 3 (39:07):
Yeah, And that leaves the Warriors and the Lakers out,
which which Who knows what's gonna happen on that, but yeah,
the Western Confence Playoff is gonna be a lot of fun.
So all right, we will be back this time next week.
Until then, enjoy the games, MH.
Is the Crossover Sports Illustrated's NBA show, bringing down the
latest news, bloomers, and everything.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Here's your host, Chris.
Speaker 3 (00:17):
This is the Crossover NBA Podcast. I'm Chris Mannox. He
is Rohan and Rowan. On today's show, we are going
to talk about the Milwaukee Bucks as a legitimate threat
in the Eastern Conference. We're talking about the New Orleans
Pelicans as maybe a legitimate threat in the Western Conference.
(00:37):
And all these comparisons that are being made right now
with Anthony Edwards and Michael Jordan are they fair got
to get into that as well. But I want to
start the show on a more serious note, or potentially
serious note.
Speaker 4 (00:54):
In the world of Major League Baseball.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
This week, we had a story that's still developed as
we record this, where Shoey Atani, the Superstar pitcher for
the LA Dodgers, Star SI Cover Star. Yes, the Jinks
is alive and well, he is involved in some sort
of gambling scandal that involves his interpreter. Now, this story
(01:21):
has had a number of different permutations. By the time
people listen to it, there might be a new version
of it. But somehow someway millions of dollars were transferred
from shoe Aatani's account to his translator, who then funneled
them to a illegal gambler. Uh so you know, sports
(01:42):
has gambling has infiltrated Major League Baseball's biggest star, global
star in some way. And this scandal broke right around
the time that basketball was starting to get touched by it,
and you're seeing some public figures in the basketball space
(02:03):
start to weigh in audible, So I want to play
a couple of clips for you from this week. The
first one is from Tyrese Halliburton, the Pacers guard, talking
about how he feels like he's viewed by the public.
And the second one is from Cavalier's coach JB. Bickerstaff,
who discusses some of his interactions with sports gamblers.
Speaker 4 (02:25):
Take a listen, but not.
Speaker 5 (02:26):
Everybody cares to hear how we feel or dam I mean,
that's just the point, Like great, I mean, to half
the world, I'm just you know, helping them make money
on draft games or whatever. You know what I mean,
Like I'm I'm a prop you know what I mean.
Like that's what my social media mostly consists of. You know,
I think it's important for us to like have somebody
to talk to and like, I think all that stuff
(02:47):
is like it can be funny sometimes and somebody's like,
you know, I lost a thousand dollars out I don't give.
I do think. I do think that it's important for
us to just have conversations with people who really value
who as human.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Beings that we've had our own I personally have had
my own instances with you know, some of the sports
gamblers where you know, they got my telephone number and
we're sending me, you know, crazy messages about you know,
where I live and my kids and all that stuff.
So it is a dangerous game and a fine line
that we're walking for sure. Uh. It brings added pressure.
(03:23):
It brings you know, a distraction uh to the game
that can be difficult for players, coaches, referees, you know,
everybody that's involved in it. And I think that, you know,
we really have to be careful, you know, with how
close we let it get to the game. UH, and
the security of the people who are involved in it,
(03:46):
because again, it does carry a weight. You know, a
lot of times the people who are gambling like this
money you know, pays their light bill or plays their rent.
Speaker 3 (03:56):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
And then the emotions that come from that. So I
do think walking a very fine line and we have
to be extremely careful in protecting everybody who's involved. There's
no doubt about it that it's crossed the line. You
know the amount of times where you know, I'm standing
up there and we may have a ten point lead
and the spread is eleven and people are yelling at
(04:17):
me to leave the guys in so that we can
cover the spread, like it's ridiculous. But again it's I
understand the business side of it and the nature of
the business of it, but I mean, it is something
that I believe has gone too far.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
So ron it does seem like we're now seeing the
consequence of the NBA embracing sports gambling. And to be fair,
they're not the only sport out there doing and everyone
is doing it. Everyone has a deal with DraftKings or
fan duel or somebody else to be involved with sports gambling,
(04:51):
and up until now it's really been mostly upside right.
The revenues have been flowing in. People have had a
lot of fun gambling on all this. But when you
hear Halliburden say he kind of feels like a prop
or you hear JB. Bickerstaff say, I get calls from
(05:12):
people that have gambled on Cavalier games, hostile calls from them.
Do you feel like this is kind of just the
tip of the iceberg for where the negative side of
sports gambling could come in.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
Without a doubt, there's a lot I want to say here,
and I want to address your question very directly, real quick.
Another thing that has been announced and it is apparently
going to happen, is the NBA wants to add like
in game betting to NBA League Pass, you know, live betting,
you know, on different props and whatnot. And I want
(05:46):
to address what you have to say. I just need
to say real quick, as a longtime NBA League Pass subscriber,
someone who's had to move often, you know, can't just
very easily get it on my cable subscribes to the
digital version of NBA Pass, that is such a slap
in the face to the League Pass consumer, Like somebody
needs to stand up for the League Pass consumer. Adding
(06:07):
in like live betting before you fix fast forward and rewind,
before you get rid of like annoying local blackouts. Just
don't get me started on how like amateurish the NBA
League Pass product is okay, Like, it's a joke for
a billion, billion, billion, billion, multi billion dollar business to
have such a pathetic product as NBA League Pass and
(06:29):
the fact that they're prioritizing adding in game betting not
only shows just you know how far the reach of
gambling has gotten, but just how easy it would be
to fix some of these issues if they really wanted to.
So I needed to get that off my chest because
I think it's a joke and the NBA should be
embarrassed as it relates to gambling. Though I know, like
(06:50):
you've joked about, you know, partaking in it. I know
you enjoy it, and I'm like perfectly fine with it
being legal. I have no issues with it. I think
it's better that it's legal and ideally, you know, somewhat
regulated then you know, probably the way it's been happening
for the years prime and years people were gambling on
sports illegally. But I think that the NBA and all
(07:11):
these leagues are sitting on a huge problem. And you
also had Rudy Gobert kind of allude to the fact that,
oh maybe the refs had money on this game, and
he caught a huge fine for it. I did find
Gobert's idea that like the refs were conspiring to fix
this Cavs Wolves game a little funny. At the same time,
it's not implausible to think something like that could happen,
(07:32):
especially when the NBA's had issues with it already. And
you know, I understand the leagues. They're like, if all
this gambling is going on, let us get a part
of the pie here, and players benefit too, ultimately because
it brings in more revenue to the sport and makes
the cap go higher. But I do think the leagues
need to seriously reconsider or at least have some sort
(07:52):
of plan as to how they're handling all this. You know,
I think it's been a topic of discussion on NBA Twitter,
Like these sportsbooks don't exists for people who are good
at gambling, Okay, they exist for people to lose money.
That's how these companies make money. They want people to
think they're placing a casual twenty dollars bet every night,
not realizing how much it adds up the fact that
(08:14):
so much of the marketing now revolves around gambling. Like
I grew up not knowing what a spread was for
a very long time. And I found a way to
enjoy basketball, and I just think the consequences of this,
we don't know what they are, and so the leagues
are kind of just zoomed so quickly to get into
bed with these gambling companies. I think it's gonna have
unintended consequences, and they're kind of letting it be a
(08:36):
wild West right now.
Speaker 3 (08:37):
Yeah, Look, sports gambling was going to be part of
the landscape, whether sports leagues embraced it or not.
Speaker 4 (08:45):
Like this was coming.
Speaker 3 (08:46):
You know, sports gambling has not been legalized because the NBA,
the NFL, major League Baseball are or were pushing for it.
It's just an evolution of the world, same way that
you know, like marijuana has become you know, accepted as
you know, a usable drug by sports leagues.
Speaker 4 (09:09):
It's the same thing.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
It's it's I think times change, things change in the world.
So this was coming no matter what. Look, as you said,
I've been on the record, I embrace sports gambling because
I do it in a pretty responsible way. I'm more likely,
you know, I'll throw fifty bucks on some kind of
stupid parlay or I'll you know, bet a huge underdog
in boxing and hope that a twenty dollars bet pays
(09:31):
off to like a buck fifty. I'm I've never been Look,
I work hard for my money. I don't want to
lose my I've never been in that position where I've
bet a lot of money and needed something to to
happen in order to get by in a day. But
the reality is there are a lot of people that
(09:51):
gambled like that, and because of that, as JB. Bickerstaff
was alluding to, it becomes, you know, dangerous because you've
got all the these people that might lose and blame
you for it and take it out on you in
some way, shape or form. Now that might manifest itself
in booze and crazy phone calls, but maybe it manifests
(10:12):
itself in violence down the line. Like that's that's a problem.
The NBA has got to be on the lookout for.
And mean, look, we don't know at this point what
happened with Otani, so I'll put that on a shelf.
But you are naive, not you specifically, but you the audience.
Anyone is naive if you don't think that there is
a scandal coming where a player, a referee, a coach
(10:35):
is caught feeding information to someone in order to benefit
themselves with sports gambling that that is going to happen
at some point. The only response I think the NBA
can have here is maybe you do pump the brakes
a little bit on just how invested you get your
(10:56):
just how in bed you're getting with sports gambling that
probably includes league pass. I don't think you need to have,
you know, live odds on league Pass. I would say
this though, I for one, am also someone that loves
to gamble in game.
Speaker 4 (11:10):
I've been to a couple of hockey games and I
don't know anythone like and I have.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
I have been bored out of my board to tears
by hockey games, I'm telling you, and I have wound
up like betting the third period of a game, you know,
whether we do a one and a half goals the
third period, and had so much fun because of it,
Like I've been enthralled because of it.
Speaker 4 (11:28):
So that part of it's fine. You don't need it
on leagu pass.
Speaker 3 (11:30):
You also don't need like, you know, when the Clippers
were announcing their new stadium, one of the things I
thought of was a you know, ultra rich, ultra you know,
you know, look forward technologically advanced guy like Steve Bomber
might put like Microsoft surfaces on every seat like that
kind of stuff, Like making it part of the in
(11:53):
game experience might be something the NBA should want to
pump the brakes on as well. But this is this
is a snowball, This is a rock rolling down the mountain.
You are not going to be able to stop this.
The doors have been flung wide open. And while the
majority of the fallout will be good because there's a
(12:13):
lot of revenue coming in to these sports that everyone's
gonna share from, there is going to be some bad
and when it's bad, it's going to be really ugly
for the NBA.
Speaker 2 (12:23):
Right and even it could even happen innocuously, like it
could even be you know something is like you know,
a coach makes an offhand remark to a family member about,
you know, someone's gonna miss a couple more games than
we thought, like something like that. You know, there's just
so much potential for disaster here. I'm with you, Like,
I don't think we need kiosks. You know, everyone's always
(12:44):
talking about it. It's only a matter of time before we
allow people to gamble in the arena.
Speaker 3 (12:49):
You can it's some of them, like there's isn't DC.
There's a William Hill sports book in there, there's a
FanDuel one in Phoenix, like there's And I.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
Think it's terrible, like I really do. And I'm not
trying to be like the old get off my lawn
person here, and like I'm not trying to get in
the way of anyone who wants to partake in this legally,
like have at it. If that's how you enjoy spending
your money, please do. But like there has to be
I think some level of protection here, some at least
artificial wall being put up. I mean, you've seen it
(13:18):
in the NFL. Guys have gotten suspended for full seasons,
you know, having family members place bets or betting, and
you know it's I think one NFL player made the
point where it's like, if I can literally like risk
my life on Sundays, why can't I bet on my team?
I'm not sure I agree with him, but he's also
making an interesting point, So I just like, at the
(13:40):
very least, and I'm not the first person suggestice, it's like,
can we do something about the ads? Like I don't
think that this is like a something that even just
beyond a league level is like great on a societal
level that it's like if you're eight years old, like
you will only know basketball for the rest of your life.
Is like a vehicle for DraftKings and FanDuel ads Like.
I don't know that that's the way we should be
(14:01):
doing all this. So I think there are serious, big
question pig picture questions. The league needs to address it.
I don't think they are ignorant to them, but it
feels like that hasn't necessarily been a priority other than,
you know, making sure that spigot is wide open.
Speaker 4 (14:17):
Well, look, cutting back.
Speaker 3 (14:20):
The problem with that is that you run into the
same dilemma you have when you have a discussion about
reducing the number of games, which is, if you cut back,
you're taking money off the table, and both sides have
to be okay with that. The spigot being wide open,
as you framed, it benefits everybody. Everybody gets a piece of,
(14:42):
you know, the lack of a better phrase, a piece
of that action. I'm skeptical that we'll see too much
restraint shown when it comes to money, right, Like they're
going to want to capitalize as much as possible on
this gambling wave. I just think they have to put
(15:03):
in as many guard rails as they possibly can when
it comes to the integrity of a gamble of a game.
But even if they do, it's coming, you know, baseball.
Like if this turns out to be more than what
the initial reporting was that Otani was first paying off
his interpreter's gambling debt, I didn't believe that. Then it
(15:24):
was his interpreter stole four and a half million dollars. I'm
I sure as shit didn't believe that. Like, there's just like,
if it turns out to be Otani involved with sports gambling,
that is a catastrophe in Major League Baseball.
Speaker 2 (15:39):
Can we I know that this is not a baseball
podcast for one minute, can we please indulge in somewhat
reckless speculation like this Otani thing. Man, I'm with you.
It stinks to high heaven. I have some good friends
in this world, and I understand he just signed this
massive contract, Like he really gave this dude five million
to pay off his gambling debts.
Speaker 3 (15:58):
Well that was like initiation, but it was it wasn't.
It was his team team that walked it back. Like
this is whenever you change your story. It means you're
searching for an acceptable truth like that. Uh, you know,
you you'd like to give some people to benefit the
(16:19):
doubt and not accuse someone of you know, illegal or
untoward behavior. But if your story is X one day
and why another, that means you're covering up something.
Speaker 4 (16:28):
It just that's what it means. I am.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
I am fascinated to see how i MLB handles that one,
because he is by far the biggest star in that sport. Yeah,
that is going to be very interesting.
Speaker 3 (16:39):
All right, let's move on talk some basketball here. Last
night in Boston, Celtics took on the Bucks. I was
at that game last night. Took the Red Eye from
California to watch that game ro a loan expecting Giannis
to play. Turns out he was scratched from that game
with the hamstring injury early in the day. Still turned
out to be a pretty good game. The Bucks, you know,
rallied in that fourth quarter, blew the doors off the Celtics. Frankly,
(16:59):
in the they're in the fourth quarter, just came up
a little bit short at the end. And look, Boston
is a country mile ahead of Milwaukee in the standings
in the Eastern Conference, they are most likely to finish
with the best record in the NBA. But you know,
there was a perception has been a perception one that
I've kind of bought into, that the Celtics were just
going to cruise through the Eastern Conference playoffs. Based on
(17:23):
what you saw last night between the Celtics and the Bucks,
is Milwaukee a greater threat to Boston than originally thought?
Are they a threat to Boston if they wind up
playing in the conference finals?
Speaker 2 (17:35):
I do think they are a threat at the end
of the day. Jannis is such a massive factor in
a playoff season, and we saw these teams. I mean
that twenty twenty two series that Milwaukee played without Chris
Middleton that went seven games at ironically, Drew Holliday making
a huge places for in Bobby portis one of the
biggest offensive rebounds in Milwaukee Bucks history in that game five.
(17:55):
I mean, they pushed Boston to the limit in that
series without Chris Middleton. Now, last night, I don't know
if you feel this way, Like when I watch a
game and I find out like Yiannis is sitting, it's
almost like the team that's missing the star can't win
because if they win the game, you could just be like, ah,
the other team didn't get up for it, and if
they make it close, you're kind of like, it's just
hard to take away any meeting from it. But what
(18:17):
I saw that I think was really encouraging was the
play of Chris Middleton. And you remember the first time
these two teams matched up, Like, It's not only that
Middleton looked worse defensively, it's like the Celtics were hunting
him in a way that Chris Middleton, you know, they
were hunting him like he was Now I'm now going
to be like mean to someone in the NBA, but
(18:37):
I mean they were hunting him like he was the
worst defender on the floor in a playoff series. The
way they were going at him in the post, one
on one on the perimeter. I thought Middleton had a
nice game offensive last night. You shoot like eight for
eleven something like that. Really nice game offensively. Beyond that
I liked or I saw from I like what I've
seen from him recently. It looks more fluid. I think
the time that they've given him off is paying dividends,
(19:01):
so if they get a healthy version of him, And
we discussed that, like going forward in the playoffs. That
to me is a difference maker, and I think if
you're a Bucks fan, that was a really encouraging part
about last night because we know Dan can get hot.
We've seen what Yiannis can do against the Celtics in
a playoff series. And one thing that's interesting about Boston,
as great as that starting five is and as much
(19:22):
as you know, I think we're fans of it, they
will be in an interesting position defending Jannis in a
playoff series. You know, they they might maybe they'll put
holiday on him. That's something they've done time and time
again this year, putting him on Bigs. But you know,
that strategy is a little different when it's a Yo
kich Er a Yannis and they're doing that. So I
(19:43):
definitely think Milwaukee that's playing a lot better. Bobby Porters
was fantastic last night. Is a threat. Absolutely.
Speaker 4 (19:50):
You know, after the.
Speaker 3 (19:51):
Game, the Bucks said there are no moral victories. You know,
that's fine if that's their perception. I thought there was
a moral victory from Milwaukee. To be down your super
are and to really be in a one possession game
with less than a minute left, that's a big win
for them. Look, Damian Lillard just with a good defender
on him and Jalen Brown, he found a way to
(20:12):
get thirty points. Like that was impressive. Chris Middleton not
only was pretty good in that game last night, but
he also now has like what a month left in
the season to continue to build chemistry with Lillard, with Giannis,
with Doc Rivers. So I think that's gonna be valuable
time that he's gonna have. Bobby Portas is really good generally.
(20:33):
Like you know, I was doing some TV last night.
I said in the pregame show, I'm like, don't let
Bobby Portis get off, Like, this guy's not a slouch,
like you know, the starting lineup.
Speaker 4 (20:41):
He can play.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
So cooking the Suns the other day too, it's been
a little Yeah.
Speaker 4 (20:47):
He's a really good player. Pat Connan had a better game.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
Uh so you know the Bucks have have the horses there. Now,
all that being said, I can understand how the Celtics,
who by the way, were without holiday in that game.
They were y and Sam Hauser.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
So when okay, let's not get carried. The dude had
to see had ten threes the other night.
Speaker 3 (21:12):
I mean I've done Look I used to be skeptical
of the Celtics rotation guys, the back end of the
rotation guys.
Speaker 2 (21:18):
Those the benches, I mean, fast game, they've done contribution
from those.
Speaker 3 (21:24):
You know, like Pritchard's going off Porzingis, you know, not
the best Porzingis game last night, but he still found
a way to make plays down the stretch. So look,
the Celtics once Giannis went out, I believe that, you know,
some of the motivation for that game also went out
there of course, right, Like you know, I think it's
just a playing Yeah, they have. They have played in
(21:45):
so many laughers over the last month or so. It's
been like two weeks since they've lost the game. It's
been over a month until last night that they won
a game in single digits. So they have just been
cruising through everyone, especially team in the Eastern Conference. So
I can understand Giannis goes down, they a little bit
of life goes out, and then they're a big going
(22:05):
to the fourth quarter. Right, you know, There's a lot
of ways to explain why the Bucks came back, but
I think if you'rre Milwaukee, you take away that this
Celtics team is beatable, right, You're on their home floor
down Jannis in a one possession game in the closing minutes.
So that's why I take away if I'm Milwaukee now.
One of the storylines that's emerged over the last couple
of days that I want to get your take on
(22:26):
is that the vulnerability of the Celtics is that they
don't have a guy that can close games down the stretch.
And that's been kind of a pretty strong finger pointed
at Jason Tatum, saying, Jason Tatum, as great as he
is all NBA First team, probably he is not the
guy that you'd want closing games or he has some
(22:50):
vulnerability there.
Speaker 4 (22:50):
What's your take on that?
Speaker 2 (22:52):
Okay, so let me preface this by saying, as you know,
I've made it my life's work to kind of spot
Boston propaganda whenever I can see it, fight back against
all the stuff coming out from over there. It's no
secret that I grew up in South Florida. Some people
may describe me as a Heat fan. You know, I'll
let them do that some people, So I have, you know,
(23:15):
every reason to hate on Jason Tatum. It's long been
my opinion that Youdonnas Haslam would have locked up Bill Russell.
Having said all that, said all of that, I think
people are like bored when they talk about the Celtics.
I think people are bored. I think they're looking for
a reason to think that this team like can't get
it done. As if and listen, Lebron James pointed this out,
(23:37):
It's like Tatum's own success is being held against him
because he's so good that he takes the team to
the conference finals every year. People are like, well, he
can't get it done. It's like, yo, he is twenty five, right,
what is it twenty five or twenty six now? He
like he's most players would just be entering their contention
window of like six seven years at this point. He's
(24:00):
just been a good player on good teams that can
get his team this far that it's almost being held
against him. And you know, I've even seen like, you know,
I've seen fans down here and be like, Tatum can't
get it done. Like Tatum has played two of the
most incredible road game sixes in recent memory. In Milwaukee
down three to two, save their season already like forty
in that game, unbelievable performance. And then the Sixers game
(24:22):
last year terrible for forty six minutes, last two minutes
of the game, snatched it away from the Sixers while
em beating hard and just choked away another playoff win.
To me, the idea that he can't get it done.
They shoot too many threes, they can't do this, blah
blah blah, Like this team is a juggernaut. They are
a heavy favorite, and they should be. And a lot
(24:44):
of that starts with the fact that Tatum he's either
gonna take your worst defender in the post and you're
gonna double. He's gonna hit a bunch of pull up threesh.
He's improving as a playmerker. I just think people are
like deeply, profoundly searching for ways to say why the
Celtics won't get it done, Like if they lose. I
don't think that's going to be the reason why.
Speaker 3 (25:04):
No, it's not, And I agree with everything that you
said there. Now, some of Tatum's critics have pointed to
some of the clutch time advanced numbers on Tatum not
being very good. But look, as a writer, you know
you can find statistics to back up virtually any argument.
What I go with is what I see in some
(25:26):
of these games and you brought up two good ones right.
The game against Milwaukee two years ago, down three to
two Bucks at home and Tatum goes for forty six.
The game against Game six against Philadelphia last year where
Tatum stinks for three quarters and then goes off in
the fourth to help them win the game. The next game,
Tatum had fifty one points. Yes, in game seven, Yes,
(25:48):
that's a clutch performance. Now, fast forward to the Conference
Finals against Miami. In the three games the Celtics won
to rally back to even the series, Tatum had eighty
something points in those three games. And even though he
wasn't good in Game seven, that has much to do in.
Speaker 4 (26:05):
The very first play, very first.
Speaker 3 (26:07):
Play of the game, Jason Tatum gets injured and isn't
the same player throughout. So let's stop with this. Jason
Tatum is not clutch. Jason Tatum is a potential liability.
You can't rattle off more than a handful of guys
that are more effective offensively than Jason Tatum.
Speaker 4 (26:26):
And the reason that Tatum's.
Speaker 3 (26:28):
Numbers are in the thirty plus per game is because
he has sacrificed this year. He has taken a step back,
So porzingis can average twenty points per game, so Jalen
Brown can continue to develop, so Drew Holliday can find
his role with this team. Jason Tatum could easily be
averaging thirty or more points per game. He isn't because
(26:49):
he's been a good team player. So fourth quarter, end
of game situations, I still like Jayson Tatum. Look at
that into the Milwaukee game, it wasn't a flawless finish
for the Celtics, but Jason Tatum had eight points over
the final two minutes and six seconds. Eight points over
two plus minutes is a great number. So I just
(27:11):
I'm not here for that. That is not going to
be the downfall of the Boston Celtics. Jason Tatum's inability
to get it done in the fourth quarter.
Speaker 2 (27:18):
If you all I'll say is like, at the end
of the day, look at how he's defended and how
much tension teams are giving him in fourth quarters, and
that lets you know all you need to know about
how teams are scared of his ability to make shots
from anywhere on the floor in the final few minutes
of a game. Now, let me just say, having said
all that we said, if either them or the Bucks
(27:39):
can't get it done this year.
Speaker 5 (27:40):
Oh man.
Speaker 2 (27:41):
Then then then the credits, well yeah, yeah, big time,
big time.
Speaker 3 (27:46):
All right, speaking of getting it done, we all look
at the Western Conference standings and say, all right, it's
Denver's world and we're just living in it.
Speaker 5 (27:54):
Right.
Speaker 3 (27:54):
And then you look at Oklahoma City and you say
the Clippers, Okay, there are two teams that you know
could make it runs. Maybeena gets their act together. Mixed
around the back of the Western Conference bracket. There is
not enough attention being paid to the New Orleans Pelicans
right now, who are playing outstanding basketball and have been
playing outstanding basketball really since January. First, if you louw
(28:16):
the numbers, I'm gonna read some of the numbers from
January one. Since the new year, the Pelicans are third
and net rating fourth, and offensive rating fourth, in defensive
rating third, in plus minus per game fourth, and steals fifth,
and three point percentage seventh, and field goal percentage seventh
and rebounds whole bunch of great numbers. They are excellent
(28:37):
on the road twenty two road wins this year, third
most in the NBA, and they are blowing a lot
of teams out. They ranked second in the NBA in
most double digit wins this season. Zion Williamson is back
on that trajectory that we thought he was going to
be on, becoming a superstar in this league.
Speaker 4 (28:56):
Brandon Ingram I think is as good.
Speaker 3 (28:57):
A number two guy, as good as you can get,
but a really really good number two guy on that team.
Ceji McCollum, he works. Should we consider the Pelicans a
legitimate threat not just to go deep in the playoffs,
but to advance all the way to the finals with
the team they have this year?
Speaker 2 (29:16):
Ah Man, it's a really good question. And you know,
like Dan Devine was on this pod last week and
we started talking about the Pelicans case a little bit,
and as you mentioned, they've just kept rolling even more since.
It's remarkable what they've done. What worries me about the
Pelicans a little bit, Chris, is like they had that
great playoff series against the Suns two years ago twenty
(29:37):
twenty two. That first round series pushed Phoenix quite a bit,
clearly got under their skin, and then you know, things
kind of the wheels kind of fell off last year.
They had injuries, Zion was out, like they were first
in the West in December, and then things kind of
went awry. I man, the West is just such a gauntlet,
(29:58):
like if they catch the wrong first round playoff series,
Like I think right now, it's kind of invoked to say,
maybe the Clippers. I think there was a time where
it was like, wait, you're the biggest threat. Yeah, Now
all of a sudden, it's like people are doubting the Clippers,
but like, I don't want to see them in the
first the.
Speaker 3 (30:11):
Clippers, though, Clippers are four or five right now as
we record this, four or five batchups Clippers Pelicans, which.
Speaker 2 (30:16):
Is I haven't even heard it. Yeah, I have at
this current moment. I don't know who I would pick
in that series. It would be really hard to pick
against Kawhi in that scenario, but who knows where Kawhi
is going to be a month from now. So this
is all a very long winded way of saying it's
it feels impossible to handicap the West. But what I
(30:37):
really like about New Orleans is all the depth they
have in the different ways they can match up with
teams in the postseason. I think it's going to be
really interesting. We still haven't seen Zion had to play
a great defensive playoff series, and that being such an
(30:58):
unknown to me cast doubts on how far I think
they can go. But I mean they've been playing their
ass off, there's no question about it.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
Look, they've got a legit superstar in Zion. They are
one of the best isolation teams in the NBA, which
matters in the playoffs because a lot of times it
does devolve into isolation ball. Zion and Ingram are two
elite isolation player.
Speaker 4 (31:24):
CJ.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
McCollum has been shooting the three terrific this season. And
they have perimeter defenders. They've got Herb Jones, They've got
Naji Marshall like, They've got guys that can get stops
for you on the perimeter. And they've got a bunch
of floor spacers in addition out there as well. And
if you want to go big against them, whether it's
Denver anybody else, you know, Valentoun is still there to
(31:45):
be that big body that can be a deterrent to
you know, whoever it is, whether it's in you know,
Zubach in the Clippers series, or Nicola Jokic, you know.
Speaker 4 (31:52):
Down the line.
Speaker 3 (31:54):
Look, because it's the Western Conference, Yeah, they're a threat
to lose in the first round. There's no doubt about that. Like,
it wouldn't be an upset if they lost in the
first round they played the Clippers right now. But when
I look at this Pelicans team, I see depth. Their
bench has been electric all season long. I see shooting.
You know, Trey Murphy in that mix, he has been fantastic.
(32:16):
I just see a whole bunch of guys that can
get it done. And maybe they're not mature enough yet,
you know for a deep playoff run. This will be
kind of if they're fully healthy going to the playoffs,
it'll be one of the first years they're able to
do that. But man, the talent's there, and Zion is
as difficult a player to game plan for as there
is in the NBA. When he gets that ball going downhill,
(32:37):
you can throw Giannis into this equation. There's nobody hard
to stop than Zion going to the basket. I mean,
his numbers in the restricted area are insane this year.
So they're they're gonna be. They're a legitimate team right now.
Speaker 2 (32:48):
Yeah. I also just like Zion des there's a ton
of credit because he was getting killed.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
Can we stop here that we're still but the Zion
is fat stuff is still out there all the time.
Speaker 4 (33:00):
It's just so he's not unnecessary.
Speaker 3 (33:03):
Yeah, he's never gonna be like, you know, slim, Like
you know, you're not gonna see him undergo a weight
transformation where he dropped fifty pounds and is able to
play like small forward for stretches, Like.
Speaker 4 (33:13):
That's not him. He's always gonna be a big guy.
Speaker 3 (33:15):
Can he be in better shape or could he have
been in better shape to start the season? Absolutely that
somebody's gonna have to address moving forward, because you can't
work your way back into shape during the season. When
I watch him, looks fine to me, Like, still looks like,
you know, an elite player to me for the minutes
he's playing.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
No, I think he looks great, and I think for
him to respond to that, just like mountain of criticism,
a lot of it unfair, is really impressive. And I'm
good for him because when he's on man, he's still
one of the most exciting players in the NBA. And
that's a fun team to watch man. Like you mentioned
how they got like spacers and defenders like Herb Jones,
(33:52):
Jose Alvarado, Like that is a fun, gritty ass team
that I excited to see them fully healthy in the
playoffs for sure.
Speaker 3 (34:00):
All Right, last thing for you, Anthony Edwards has been
having himself, uh pretty good week. Uh just absolutely posterized
John Collins in that game against Utah.
Speaker 4 (34:11):
That was as visious a dunk as I've seen.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
Okay, hold on, I'm just gonna say, it wasn't a
dunk to me, Chris.
Speaker 3 (34:16):
I.
Speaker 4 (34:18):
Throwdown versus the dunk.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
I know, you have this bug up your ass about
Yeah it's a dunk, I do, but like he elevated
and it was a it was a poster. It's Blake
Griffin over Mosgov and you know some of that stuff
that we've seen the past.
Speaker 4 (34:31):
Anyway, he's having himself a good week.
Speaker 3 (34:34):
The Timberwolves are surging even with Karl Anthony Towns out
of the rotation, which has increased the amount of praise
being heaped on young Anthony Edwards, with some in the
media comparing him favorably to Michael Jordan of all players.
I know Chris Bursard over at Fox that he contacted
Michael Jordan, and Jordan said there were some similarities. I'd
love to know what that exchange actually looked like. But
(34:57):
you know, look Edwards is a star. I would probably
put him more on the Kobe Dwayne Wade type of
level right now because Jordan is rarefied air. I mean,
that's arguably the greatest player of all time, and Anthony
Edwards has not accomplished anything really at this point. Like
he hasn't made a deep playoff run, He hasn't done anything.
(35:18):
So you can't put him up there with Jordan just yet.
But his skill set is complete. When he's on his game, defensively,
he's as good as anyone in the NBA. He's got
great instincts, he's got great length, he can do a
lot of things on the defensive side, and offensively he's
pretty damn special. So are we He's being too much
praise on Anthony Edwards right now this early in his career.
Speaker 2 (35:44):
I mean yes and no. I understand people who say
there's like similarities to Michael Jordan in the sense of, like,
obviously he's got this like jump out of the gym
athleticism that I think for a lot of people is
reminiscent of a young Jordan. I think Kobe and Dwayne
Wade even had that element to their game that people
compared to him j in their time. So I understand
it from that. You know, I think he's a great personality.
(36:06):
It's not necessarily mj like, but I think people he
has that charisma that that people are drawn to that
Michael Jordan had. So I understand the people who say similarities.
I'm kind of with you, though. It's's like we should
just stop using Michael Jordan as example, like nothing good
can come from it, Like nothing good can come from
like Anthony Edwards trying to like compare himself to Michael
(36:26):
Jordan for his entire career. That's not to say, though,
I think he's an incredibly fun player. I love his attitude.
The competitiveness is another thing I love from him. I
mean you mentioned the defense, Like you see like late
in games, one on one situations when he's matched up
with other team's best guys, like he wants that, you know,
he's ready to go at them in those situations. It's
(36:47):
not just on the offensive end. So I love his game,
love the attitude he plays with, love that he has,
like the personality to be a legitimate star for the NBA.
It feels like a long time since someone as fun
as him has come along, But like we we just
like it's not gonna do anyone any favors to like
(37:07):
let this MJ thing play out there. Yes, there are similarities,
but let's like, let's just let's just leave it at that.
Let's try to be normal about this.
Speaker 3 (37:16):
Yeah, I mean physically there are similarities. Stylistically there are similarities,
and Edwards is unquestionably on and an ascent. He's averaging
twenty six point seven points this year. That's a career high.
His field goal percentage is a career high. His three
point percentage is his career eyes up to almost thirty
seven and a half percent from three this year. I mean,
(37:37):
there's not much this guy isn't doing this season. And
I do love that he's been able to kind of
strap this team on his back offensively during Towns' absence
and you know, keep them in that top three mix
uh in the Western right there?
Speaker 2 (37:51):
Man, only one and a half games out of first
mean impressive.
Speaker 3 (37:55):
Well we'll see how how long you know I have? Yeah,
we'll see if they can stay at that, you can
get to that number one spot. The Town's injury just
kills them like they kill They've been better defensively, but
but worse. It's Lee offensively anyway, Edwards, Let's see him
get to that like d Wade level first, Like that's
still a Hall of Fame level.
Speaker 4 (38:13):
Let's get to the Hall of Fame d Wade, you know,
Kobe level first.
Speaker 3 (38:16):
Before we start talking about Jordan, let's all see what
he does in the postseason. Like wherever the Timberwolves wind up,
it's gonna be a brutal first round matchup, you.
Speaker 4 (38:25):
Know, where they get especially out. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (38:28):
Yeah, like, let let's see if he if he has
that in him. But you know, there's nothing to complain
about with Anthony Edwards right now. He is just dynamic,
no question.
Speaker 2 (38:36):
Oh man, could you imagine if we got like Luca
and at Edwards round.
Speaker 3 (38:41):
Every I love every single potential first round matchup in
the Western Conference, I mean the Western Conference. You know,
even just talking about like Clippers Pelicans in the first round.
That's a legitimate conference finals matchup right now. Three six
is Timberwolves Kings. Like that's great defense against you know,
perennially great offense. You know, Nuggets, Mavericks in the first round, Lucas.
Speaker 2 (39:03):
Your sons, imagine Katie going back to ok C and
I mean it's incredible.
Speaker 3 (39:07):
Yeah, And that leaves the Warriors and the Lakers out,
which which Who knows what's gonna happen on that, but yeah,
the Western Confence Playoff is gonna be a lot of fun.
So all right, we will be back this time next week.
Until then, enjoy the games, MH.
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