January 14, 2020 • 19 mins
Oscar noms are out and “Joker” is leading the pack with 11 nominations, including best picture. And despite efforts to get more diversity into the Oscars, in the major categories, it was a list of mostly white nominees and women were all together left out of the Best Director category. Brent Lang, executive editor for film and media at Variety joins us to discuss the nominations and who got snubbed.
Next, in the music industry, everyone is worried about getting sued and music copyright lawsuits could be scaring away new hits. After a court ruled that “Blurred Lines” infringed on Marvin Gaye’s “Got to Give It Up”, more artists and record companies are consulting with musicologists and even getting insurance to protect them in the case that they might get sued. Amy Wang, music business editor at Rolling Stone, joins us for more.
Finally, some Generation Xers is starting to hit their midlife crisis. And while most people think a midlife crisis is about getting that new sports car, getting a trophy wife, or just some bad behavior, Generation X is is getting into yoga, meditation retreats and keto diets. Andrea Peterson, health reporter at the WSJ, joins us for the virtuous midlife crisis.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
It's Tuesday, January. I'm Oscar Ramirez in Los Angeles and
this is the Daily Dive. Oscar noms are out and
Joker is leading the pack with eleven nominations, including Best Picture.
And despite efforts to get more diversity into the Oscars
in the major categories, it was a list of mostly
(00:21):
white nominees and women were all together left out of
the Best Director category. Brent Lang, executive editor for Film
and Media at Variety, joins us to discuss the nominations
and who got snubbed next. In the music industry, everyone
is worried about getting sued and music copyright lawsuits could
be scaring away new hits. After a court ruled that
(00:43):
blurred lines infringed on Marvin Gay's Got to Give It Up.
More artists and record companies are consulting with musicologists and
even getting insurance to protect them in case they might
get sued. Amy Wang, music business editor at Rolling Stone,
joins us for more. Finally, some Generation xers are starting
to hit their midlife crisis. And what most people think
of midlife crisis is about getting a new sports car,
(01:05):
getting a trophy wife, or just some bad behavior. Generation
X is getting into yoga, meditation retreats and keto diets.
Andrea Peterson, health reporter at The Wall Street Journal, joins
us for the virtuous midlife Crisis. That's news without the noise.
Let's dive in board versus Ferrari, Peter Chernon, Jeno Topping,
(01:29):
and James Mangold. Producers The Irishman, Martin Scorsese, Robert de Niro,
Jane Rosenthal, and Emma tellinger Cosco. Joining us now was
Brent Lange, executive editor for Film and Media at Variety.
Thanks for joining us, Brent, Thanks for having me. We're
(01:50):
gonna be talking about the Academy Awards. The nominees have
come out. Joker, which is the R rated blockbuster film,
topped the list of nominations. I think they had eleven
nominations total. But as in years past, one of the
other big stories to come out of this is the
lack of diversity among some of the nominees and the
exclusion of female filmmakers completely this time around. Brent tell
(02:15):
us a little bit about how the nominations shaped up
this year. I think that there was a lot of concern,
a lot of handwritting, some outrage, frankly about the lack
of diversity in the major categories. Oscars historically have not
done a great job of recognizing female filmmakers. They've only
nominated five female filmmakers in their ninety two year history,
(02:35):
and this year was no exception. Greta Gerwig, Molina Matsuka's
Lulu Wang directed some of the most acclaimed films of
the year, and yet they were shut out from the
director's race. So I think people are upset that that happened,
that that tradition continued. I think they're kind of alarmed
a little bit. And it comes well, there's a wider
debate going on in the industry in the wake of
(02:57):
the Me Too movement, the Time's Up organization being founded,
and some actual real accomplishment because this was, when you
look at the numbers, a record year for women behind
the camera. So it's unclear why that wasn't reflected in
the nomination. I mean, one of the other things is
that they were supposed to have taken care of this
almost the Academy made strides to get more judges in there,
(03:19):
more people that we're gonna supposedly nominate other actors and
other films and things like that, and it's still a
few years on, it didn't really bear out yet. Well,
it's it seems like a step back, right from last
year where you had five people of color who were
in the major acting categories. This year there's only one
performer of color, Cynthia Revo, nominated. And as you said,
(03:43):
the Academy did take steps to kind of diversify its
ranks after sixteen, where there were two consecutive years of
all white acting nominees, and the hashtag oscar so white
sort of trending on Twitter that they really tried to
their ranks to diversify their ranks. And yet this seems
like something of a step back. So I think that
(04:04):
people are puzzled, and I think they're upset and even
maybe angry. Let's talk a little bit about Joker. It's
the second time that a comic book slash superhero movie,
whatever you want to call it, it's in that genre,
has been nominated for Best Film. And Joker itself had
kind of this roller coaster ride, you know, it had
some controversy at first. It was all over with the reviews.
(04:27):
I mean, people loved it and hated it. But yet
here it is the leading movie with eleven nominations. It's
a real turnaround for Joker because, as you said, it
was a very polarizing film. There were a lot of
people who felt it was an irresponsible film, that it
was even going to incite violence because of its depiction
of mental illness. It's a film that's very clearly influenced
(04:48):
by Taxi Driver, and yet you're right when nominations were announced,
it was the most dominated film with eleven nods, so
really kind of a staggering bowment for Joker. And it's
also kind of a coming of age for the superhero genre,
which is a genre that the Oscars have historically ignored.
This is only the second comic book movie to have
(05:09):
ever been nominated for Best Picture. Last year, Black Panther
became the first, So I think that's a pretty historic
moment too for the industry. Netflix. I think they picked
up twenty four nominations, the most of any entertainment company,
and just kind of really puts Netflix again in one
of the premier entertainment companies. Netflix has spent very aggressively
(05:31):
to get into this space. They hired a veteran awards campaigner,
Lisa take Back, to oversee their awards strategy. And then
they've backed a lot of movies from people like Martin Scorsese,
from people like Alfonso Koran, No a Bomb Back, and frankly,
their movies that major studios aren't making anymore. They've moved
away from adult dramas, from serious films in favor of
(05:53):
kind of franchise fair and comic book movies. Netflix saw
an opportunity there. They saw that that was a space
that they at phil and they believed that Oscar nominations,
Oscar buzz, and dated Oscar wins lead to subscription growth,
and that's really how they make money. I love this
line from the Washington Post. They're right about the Oscars.
Is the year Adam Sandler and Jennifer Lopez didn't receive
(06:15):
Oscar nominations and it was considered a snub. Who else
was snubbed? As you could say this year, Robert de
Niro was definitely snubbed. He got some of the best
reviews of his career for his lead role in The Irishman,
and yet he was left out and The Irishman got
like nominations. Alpacino got his ninth acting nomination. You know,
(06:36):
that's pretty rarefied company. And yet de Niro was snubbed. Aquafina,
who got some rave reviews, won a Golden Globe just
last week for The Farewell, She was overlooked. Eddie Murphy
for Dolomite Is My Name. He got some of the
best reviews of his career, and yet he came up short.
So there were a lot of really great performers who
(06:56):
deserved to be nominated, who nevertheless, we're overlooked. This here.
The Oscars are going to air on Sunday, February, and
once again they're gonna go hostless for the second year
in a row. Obviously, we know what happened with Kevin
Hard and that whole thing, so they're gonna go with
it again and see how it goes with no host.
People were sort of pleasantly surprised by how well it
(07:18):
went last year. It helps the show kind of move
a little faster, and it's a very very long night,
so I think people appreciated that. But there's something nice
about a host too. It puts viewers at ease. It's
able to kind of say the things that people at
home on their couch are saying. Look at Ricky Gervais,
you love him or hate him? He definitely generated some
(07:39):
headlines and some attention for the Golden Globes. So from
a promotional perspective, there are advantages to having a host.
Brett Lang, Executive editor for Film and Media at Variety,
Thank you very much for joining us. Thanks so much
for having me. One thing said that the vibe of
(08:03):
a song could be based such reprobuative ritual lawsuits, and
that really worried people because it's one thing to distinguish
between melodies sounding similar or too lyrics sounding really similar,
but to call two vibes very similar to your subjectives.
Joining us now is Amy Wang, music business editor at
Rolling Stone. Thanks for joining us, Amy, Thank you for
having me. We're talking about an interesting topic here in
(08:25):
the music copyright realm. There's a lot of artists across
all genres right now that have this one question the
back of their minds. Is this song gonna get me sued?
And we all know one of the most famous recent
examples when you think of the song Blurred Lines, that
was the song by Robin Thicke and Farrell and t I.
They got sued in court and they lost. They basically
(08:46):
said that it infringed on Marvin Gaye's hit got to
give it up, and it did very much sound a
lot like it. But I think in the ruling they
said that it was copying the vibe of it. But
Amy tell us a little bit about how this is
changing music and how artists really have this in the
back of the head all the times. So the Birline's
case really rattled a lot of people in the industry
(09:08):
because of what it meant for future cases going forward.
For one thing, it's said that the vible of a
song could be based as Reprobruary adventure lawsuits, and that
really worried people because it's one thing to distinguish between
melodies sounding similar or two lyrics sounding really similar, but
to call two vibes very similar to really subjective, and
it's a pretty bad president in a lot of people's mind,
(09:28):
because then you could argue that any song channels the
vible as other and sort of collect your millions if
you wanted to. You can use that same argument with
a lot of movies. There's no more original movie ideas
right now. Everything's taken from somewhere else, And even a
lot of music artists say, well, I was inspired by
so and so years past. It's kind of almost feels
logical that certain vibes will mirror each other, and when
(09:51):
that case went down, a lot of people's got really scared.
So because of that, a lot of record companies, a
lot of artists have been having this in the back
of their head, will get sued and it's really changed
what they've done. A lot of them of our consulting
musicologists to see if there might be any similarities to
anything else beforehand before they release the music. Even so,
a lot of labels now are being overly cautious and
(10:13):
having a musicologists who are a professional who are identify
the exact influences of the song and sort of know
that repertoire. They're having musicologists come in and event the
songs before they're actually released to the public, just in case.
So so you finished recording your song and the musicologists
coming in, it's like, actually, that seems quite similar to
a song in nineteen eighties die or something like that.
Maybe you want to try tweaking the bride or something
(10:35):
like that. So that is happening more and more often
as a sort of preventative measure because no label obviously
wants to be fought with a multimillion dollar lawsuits. Going
back to these lawsuits based on the vibe or other
rhythm temple, other little traits on there. You know, when
these things go to court and they're in front of
a jury, it's not a jury of musicologists. It's not
a jury of music experts that get to decide this.
(10:57):
It's everyday average people who might not necessarily have a
refined and ear as these other people who do it professionally.
So there's a lot of worry with that also, Yeah, exactly,
And the thing with copyright lawsuits is that they have
a lot of potential to rattle other industries, right, Like,
as you mentioned, bothies are one aspected that another is
coding or dancing, Like what do you decide that a
(11:18):
series of steps or a line of code is something
that is protected and when it's not. And so everybody
is really watching the music space very closely because that
could kind of precedent for a ton of other industries.
You know. Obviously, record labels have varying degrees of success
and money behind them. A lot of people can afford
to have on call musicologists or even consult with them,
(11:38):
but a lot of other artists and other record companies
go back to that tried and true form of protection.
They get insurance. It's called errors and emissions insurance, but
that is also really expensive to Most major artists are
ensured copyright insurance, and that's the part of insurance that
can help pay out for the legal costs of actual litigation.
(11:59):
To say it's two for ten million dollars, your insurance
might be able to cover a significant portion of that,
But of course that means get you paying the insurance
premium for a year or two years, or however long
you've been having it, which can add up, so you're
essentially hedging the costume will have to spend, but you
still have to spend money anyway if you get sued.
I'm sure writing music right now must be a big
mind trip having all this stuff in the back of
(12:21):
your head. And even more with how music production software
has gotten a lot cheaper and a lot more prevalent,
a lot of people are using a lot of the
same elements to make music. So I mean you're bound
to run into just things inadvertently sounding a lot alike.
And it's not like which twagers of laws, its books
or things like that where you know what the line
(12:42):
is between Twidgers of and Notch. In music right now,
a lot of people are very uncertain. So they could
be writing a song without having heard any other song
like it in the past, and then something comes out
of the woodwork and says, actually, you're very suligent by song,
and you're like, I've never heard this out of my life.
But they might still have a case because of the
way that the president has to present it. We started
off by talking about blurred Lines. That's a case that
(13:04):
has already been decided. But of all songs, there's a
led Zeppelin song that's being litigated right now. I think
they already had a ruling. They're going to it on
appeal or something. They say, maybe you could go to
the Supreme Court. Who knows if it'll get up there.
But this year people are waiting for ruling on this
led Zeppelin song to see if maybe it will clarify
things or muddy the waters even further. So there already
(13:25):
wasn't ruling in that case. But then a court of
appeals determined that the jury in that case was misled
because it's an error in the instructions, like, for instance,
they were told that they shouldn't be able to hear
a particular part with the actually was supposed to dodent
things like that. And so there's going to be a
new ruling in in the next few months, and that
could very well overturned the previous one or affirm it.
(13:46):
But whatever happens, everyone knows that it's going to say
hopefully something bigger about the state of copyright and at
least give some sort of solid framework for people going forward.
And it's been a time me. This is very very
confusing spaces, he said. She said, this song is dude,
the song it's passed. It's fun, doesn't Amy Wang, music
business editor at Rolling Stone, thank you very much for
joining us. Thank you. Gen Xers tended to marry later
(14:17):
and have children later, so a lot of Gen xers
were telling me they just simply don't have time to
have a full on midlife crisis. I mean, many of
them still have relatively young children in the house, so
they can't blow up their lives. They just want to
upgrade that. Joining us now is Andrea Peterson, health reporter
at The Wall Street Journal. Thanks for joining Sandra, Thanks
for having me. We're gonna be talking about the virtuous
(14:37):
midlife crisis. Generation X right now is really getting into
the age range where they might be going through these
quote unquote midlife crisis. There was actually an economic study
that just came out not too long ago that says
the peak age where this midlife misery is happening is
forty seven point two years of age. So right in
(14:58):
that range right there. It instead of the traditional kind
of midlife crisis thing that you hear going out and
buying that sports car, partying your ass off again. You
know a lot of people are going the more healthy route.
They want to do yoga, meditation, retreats, and even keto diets.
They want to get their health back in order. Tell
us a little bit about that. So basically, Generation xers,
(15:18):
which are defined as people that range an age from
about four fifty five, they're really redefining the rules of
the midlife crisis. This sort of period of reinvention that
often happens at this time of life where you're sort
of looking at the reality that you're at the second
half of life often kinds there's sort of a reassessment
of what is important to you and what kind of
(15:40):
things do you want to sort of let go of,
and what kind of things do you want to spend
your time on going forward, and the stereotype of it
is you get the sports car, you maybe trade in
your spouse for a different model. But gen X seems
to be really going headlong into having a more virtuous
midlife crisis, going headlong into sort of health and wellness
and yes, keto diets and taking up hiking and yoga
(16:03):
and meditation. And there's a lot of different reasons for this.
I mean, part of it is because gen xers tended
to marry later and have children later. So a lot
of gen xers were telling me they just simply don't
have time to have a full on midlife crisis. I mean,
many of them still have relatively young children in the house,
so they can't blow up their lives. They just want
to upgrade them. And not only that, are they sort
(16:23):
of constrained in terms of what they can do, but
they're very cognizant of the fact that they want to
stay around to see their kids graduate from high school
and launched into the world. So that's part of what
this pivot really towards health and wellness. There's also a
greater understanding about how important lifestyle factors like diet and exercise.
How that can really help prevent some age related diseases
(16:46):
like cancer and heart disease and even dementia. So there's
just a growing awareness that more of your health is
sort of in your control, and that's also feeling this
partly as well. It is also happening at the same
time that we're seeing this wellness industry blow up into
billion trillion dollar businesses all over the place. I mean,
you see that with things like Goop, Gwyneth Paltrow, and
(17:08):
if you end beyond that, I mean it's all over
instant and even young people. This is definitely pervasive in
the culture at large, as you know, sleep apps and botox,
and there's even sort of wellness treats for your dog.
So there's a whole sort of ecosystem that has cropped
up that is very much poised to cater to gen
xers who are looking to move in this direction. Another
(17:29):
point is is that gen xers really can't afford to
have an old school of midlife crisis anymore. Older gen xers,
you know, kind of came of age, they really entered
their working years in the early nineties recession, the two
thou eight economics downturn is when a lot of gen
xers were starting families or looking to buy their first home.
So most Gen xtras have less wealth than their parents
(17:51):
do at the same age and a lot more debt.
Can you imagine what it would be like for millennials
if you're to believe the financial stories that you hear
about how middle animals are far behind or so behind
their predecessors, you know, imagine how that midlife crisis would
even look like. And we're not they may even have
a rougher time than than gen X did because also,
you know, there's the sky recketing costs of healthcare, costs
(18:13):
of college, so costs are increasing, greater job in security,
and you know, this is just huge amounts of student
loan debts that are really weighing people down. So obviously
it's a lot cheaper to take a yoga class than
it is to go buy a sports car. So I
think in some ways gen X is just really sort
of ratching down their expectations in what kind of reinvention
they can really do in midlife because of the financial constraints,
(18:35):
and not everybody goes through this all the time. You
even noted that there was some people that said, you know,
is this kind of traditional thought of a midlife crisis
actually a myth. There's actually very little. I mean, it's
sort of want to continue. I mean, the idea of
sort of a midlife reinvention of its at you know,
a time when you kind of take stock. I mean,
that seems to be like a relatively kind of healthy
and normal kind of developmental experience that happens. But this
(18:59):
idea of like a midlife crisis where you really kind
of change your family structure, you really dramatically change your
life and the people in it is really not supported
by the scientific evidence from the experts that I talked to. So,
you know, that stereotypical midlife crisis, it's even unclear how
many baby boomers actually did it. And Ja Peterson, health
reporter at The Wall Street Journal, thank you very much
(19:20):
for joining us, Thanks for having me. Take care. That's
it for today. Join us on social media at Daily Dive,
pond in both Twitter and Instagram, leave us a comment,
give us a rating, and tell us the stories that
you're interested in. Follow us in I Heart Radio, or
(19:41):
subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. This episode of The
Daily Dive is produced by Victor Wright and engineered by
Tony Sorrentina. I'm Oscar Ramirez and this was your daily dive.
It's Tuesday, January. I'm Oscar Ramirez in Los Angeles and
this is the Daily Dive. Oscar noms are out and
Joker is leading the pack with eleven nominations, including Best Picture.
And despite efforts to get more diversity into the Oscars
in the major categories, it was a list of mostly
(00:21):
white nominees and women were all together left out of
the Best Director category. Brent Lang, executive editor for Film
and Media at Variety, joins us to discuss the nominations
and who got snubbed next. In the music industry, everyone
is worried about getting sued and music copyright lawsuits could
be scaring away new hits. After a court ruled that
(00:43):
blurred lines infringed on Marvin Gay's Got to Give It Up.
More artists and record companies are consulting with musicologists and
even getting insurance to protect them in case they might
get sued. Amy Wang, music business editor at Rolling Stone,
joins us for more. Finally, some Generation xers are starting
to hit their midlife crisis. And what most people think
of midlife crisis is about getting a new sports car,
(01:05):
getting a trophy wife, or just some bad behavior. Generation
X is getting into yoga, meditation retreats and keto diets.
Andrea Peterson, health reporter at The Wall Street Journal, joins
us for the virtuous midlife Crisis. That's news without the noise.
Let's dive in board versus Ferrari, Peter Chernon, Jeno Topping,
(01:29):
and James Mangold. Producers The Irishman, Martin Scorsese, Robert de Niro,
Jane Rosenthal, and Emma tellinger Cosco. Joining us now was
Brent Lange, executive editor for Film and Media at Variety.
Thanks for joining us, Brent, Thanks for having me. We're
(01:50):
gonna be talking about the Academy Awards. The nominees have
come out. Joker, which is the R rated blockbuster film,
topped the list of nominations. I think they had eleven
nominations total. But as in years past, one of the
other big stories to come out of this is the
lack of diversity among some of the nominees and the
exclusion of female filmmakers completely this time around. Brent tell
(02:15):
us a little bit about how the nominations shaped up
this year. I think that there was a lot of concern,
a lot of handwritting, some outrage, frankly about the lack
of diversity in the major categories. Oscars historically have not
done a great job of recognizing female filmmakers. They've only
nominated five female filmmakers in their ninety two year history,
(02:35):
and this year was no exception. Greta Gerwig, Molina Matsuka's
Lulu Wang directed some of the most acclaimed films of
the year, and yet they were shut out from the
director's race. So I think people are upset that that happened,
that that tradition continued. I think they're kind of alarmed
a little bit. And it comes well, there's a wider
debate going on in the industry in the wake of
(02:57):
the Me Too movement, the Time's Up organization being founded,
and some actual real accomplishment because this was, when you
look at the numbers, a record year for women behind
the camera. So it's unclear why that wasn't reflected in
the nomination. I mean, one of the other things is
that they were supposed to have taken care of this
almost the Academy made strides to get more judges in there,
(03:19):
more people that we're gonna supposedly nominate other actors and
other films and things like that, and it's still a
few years on, it didn't really bear out yet. Well,
it's it seems like a step back, right from last
year where you had five people of color who were
in the major acting categories. This year there's only one
performer of color, Cynthia Revo, nominated. And as you said,
(03:43):
the Academy did take steps to kind of diversify its
ranks after sixteen, where there were two consecutive years of
all white acting nominees, and the hashtag oscar so white
sort of trending on Twitter that they really tried to
their ranks to diversify their ranks. And yet this seems
like something of a step back. So I think that
(04:04):
people are puzzled, and I think they're upset and even
maybe angry. Let's talk a little bit about Joker. It's
the second time that a comic book slash superhero movie,
whatever you want to call it, it's in that genre,
has been nominated for Best Film. And Joker itself had
kind of this roller coaster ride, you know, it had
some controversy at first. It was all over with the reviews.
(04:27):
I mean, people loved it and hated it. But yet
here it is the leading movie with eleven nominations. It's
a real turnaround for Joker because, as you said, it
was a very polarizing film. There were a lot of
people who felt it was an irresponsible film, that it
was even going to incite violence because of its depiction
of mental illness. It's a film that's very clearly influenced
(04:48):
by Taxi Driver, and yet you're right when nominations were announced,
it was the most dominated film with eleven nods, so
really kind of a staggering bowment for Joker. And it's
also kind of a coming of age for the superhero genre,
which is a genre that the Oscars have historically ignored.
This is only the second comic book movie to have
(05:09):
ever been nominated for Best Picture. Last year, Black Panther
became the first, So I think that's a pretty historic
moment too for the industry. Netflix. I think they picked
up twenty four nominations, the most of any entertainment company,
and just kind of really puts Netflix again in one
of the premier entertainment companies. Netflix has spent very aggressively
(05:31):
to get into this space. They hired a veteran awards campaigner,
Lisa take Back, to oversee their awards strategy. And then
they've backed a lot of movies from people like Martin Scorsese,
from people like Alfonso Koran, No a Bomb Back, and frankly,
their movies that major studios aren't making anymore. They've moved
away from adult dramas, from serious films in favor of
(05:53):
kind of franchise fair and comic book movies. Netflix saw
an opportunity there. They saw that that was a space
that they at phil and they believed that Oscar nominations,
Oscar buzz, and dated Oscar wins lead to subscription growth,
and that's really how they make money. I love this
line from the Washington Post. They're right about the Oscars.
Is the year Adam Sandler and Jennifer Lopez didn't receive
(06:15):
Oscar nominations and it was considered a snub. Who else
was snubbed? As you could say this year, Robert de
Niro was definitely snubbed. He got some of the best
reviews of his career for his lead role in The Irishman,
and yet he was left out and The Irishman got
like nominations. Alpacino got his ninth acting nomination. You know,
(06:36):
that's pretty rarefied company. And yet de Niro was snubbed. Aquafina,
who got some rave reviews, won a Golden Globe just
last week for The Farewell, She was overlooked. Eddie Murphy
for Dolomite Is My Name. He got some of the
best reviews of his career, and yet he came up short.
So there were a lot of really great performers who
(06:56):
deserved to be nominated, who nevertheless, we're overlooked. This here.
The Oscars are going to air on Sunday, February, and
once again they're gonna go hostless for the second year
in a row. Obviously, we know what happened with Kevin
Hard and that whole thing, so they're gonna go with
it again and see how it goes with no host.
People were sort of pleasantly surprised by how well it
(07:18):
went last year. It helps the show kind of move
a little faster, and it's a very very long night,
so I think people appreciated that. But there's something nice
about a host too. It puts viewers at ease. It's
able to kind of say the things that people at
home on their couch are saying. Look at Ricky Gervais,
you love him or hate him? He definitely generated some
(07:39):
headlines and some attention for the Golden Globes. So from
a promotional perspective, there are advantages to having a host.
Brett Lang, Executive editor for Film and Media at Variety,
Thank you very much for joining us. Thanks so much
for having me. One thing said that the vibe of
(08:03):
a song could be based such reprobuative ritual lawsuits, and
that really worried people because it's one thing to distinguish
between melodies sounding similar or too lyrics sounding really similar,
but to call two vibes very similar to your subjectives.
Joining us now is Amy Wang, music business editor at
Rolling Stone. Thanks for joining us, Amy, Thank you for
having me. We're talking about an interesting topic here in
(08:25):
the music copyright realm. There's a lot of artists across
all genres right now that have this one question the
back of their minds. Is this song gonna get me sued?
And we all know one of the most famous recent
examples when you think of the song Blurred Lines, that
was the song by Robin Thicke and Farrell and t I.
They got sued in court and they lost. They basically
(08:46):
said that it infringed on Marvin Gaye's hit got to
give it up, and it did very much sound a
lot like it. But I think in the ruling they
said that it was copying the vibe of it. But
Amy tell us a little bit about how this is
changing music and how artists really have this in the
back of the head all the times. So the Birline's
case really rattled a lot of people in the industry
(09:08):
because of what it meant for future cases going forward.
For one thing, it's said that the vible of a
song could be based as Reprobruary adventure lawsuits, and that
really worried people because it's one thing to distinguish between
melodies sounding similar or two lyrics sounding really similar, but
to call two vibes very similar to really subjective, and
it's a pretty bad president in a lot of people's mind,
(09:28):
because then you could argue that any song channels the
vible as other and sort of collect your millions if
you wanted to. You can use that same argument with
a lot of movies. There's no more original movie ideas
right now. Everything's taken from somewhere else, And even a
lot of music artists say, well, I was inspired by
so and so years past. It's kind of almost feels
logical that certain vibes will mirror each other, and when
(09:51):
that case went down, a lot of people's got really scared.
So because of that, a lot of record companies, a
lot of artists have been having this in the back
of their head, will get sued and it's really changed
what they've done. A lot of them of our consulting
musicologists to see if there might be any similarities to
anything else beforehand before they release the music. Even so,
a lot of labels now are being overly cautious and
(10:13):
having a musicologists who are a professional who are identify
the exact influences of the song and sort of know
that repertoire. They're having musicologists come in and event the
songs before they're actually released to the public, just in case.
So so you finished recording your song and the musicologists
coming in, it's like, actually, that seems quite similar to
a song in nineteen eighties die or something like that.
Maybe you want to try tweaking the bride or something
(10:35):
like that. So that is happening more and more often
as a sort of preventative measure because no label obviously
wants to be fought with a multimillion dollar lawsuits. Going
back to these lawsuits based on the vibe or other
rhythm temple, other little traits on there. You know, when
these things go to court and they're in front of
a jury, it's not a jury of musicologists. It's not
a jury of music experts that get to decide this.
(10:57):
It's everyday average people who might not necessarily have a
refined and ear as these other people who do it professionally.
So there's a lot of worry with that also, Yeah, exactly,
And the thing with copyright lawsuits is that they have
a lot of potential to rattle other industries, right, Like,
as you mentioned, bothies are one aspected that another is
coding or dancing, Like what do you decide that a
(11:18):
series of steps or a line of code is something
that is protected and when it's not. And so everybody
is really watching the music space very closely because that
could kind of precedent for a ton of other industries.
You know. Obviously, record labels have varying degrees of success
and money behind them. A lot of people can afford
to have on call musicologists or even consult with them,
(11:38):
but a lot of other artists and other record companies
go back to that tried and true form of protection.
They get insurance. It's called errors and emissions insurance, but
that is also really expensive to Most major artists are
ensured copyright insurance, and that's the part of insurance that
can help pay out for the legal costs of actual litigation.
(11:59):
To say it's two for ten million dollars, your insurance
might be able to cover a significant portion of that,
But of course that means get you paying the insurance
premium for a year or two years, or however long
you've been having it, which can add up, so you're
essentially hedging the costume will have to spend, but you
still have to spend money anyway if you get sued.
I'm sure writing music right now must be a big
mind trip having all this stuff in the back of
(12:21):
your head. And even more with how music production software
has gotten a lot cheaper and a lot more prevalent,
a lot of people are using a lot of the
same elements to make music. So I mean you're bound
to run into just things inadvertently sounding a lot alike.
And it's not like which twagers of laws, its books
or things like that where you know what the line
(12:42):
is between Twidgers of and Notch. In music right now,
a lot of people are very uncertain. So they could
be writing a song without having heard any other song
like it in the past, and then something comes out
of the woodwork and says, actually, you're very suligent by song,
and you're like, I've never heard this out of my life.
But they might still have a case because of the
way that the president has to present it. We started
off by talking about blurred Lines. That's a case that
(13:04):
has already been decided. But of all songs, there's a
led Zeppelin song that's being litigated right now. I think
they already had a ruling. They're going to it on
appeal or something. They say, maybe you could go to
the Supreme Court. Who knows if it'll get up there.
But this year people are waiting for ruling on this
led Zeppelin song to see if maybe it will clarify
things or muddy the waters even further. So there already
(13:25):
wasn't ruling in that case. But then a court of
appeals determined that the jury in that case was misled
because it's an error in the instructions, like, for instance,
they were told that they shouldn't be able to hear
a particular part with the actually was supposed to dodent
things like that. And so there's going to be a
new ruling in in the next few months, and that
could very well overturned the previous one or affirm it.
(13:46):
But whatever happens, everyone knows that it's going to say
hopefully something bigger about the state of copyright and at
least give some sort of solid framework for people going forward.
And it's been a time me. This is very very
confusing spaces, he said. She said, this song is dude,
the song it's passed. It's fun, doesn't Amy Wang, music
business editor at Rolling Stone, thank you very much for
joining us. Thank you. Gen Xers tended to marry later
(14:17):
and have children later, so a lot of Gen xers
were telling me they just simply don't have time to
have a full on midlife crisis. I mean, many of
them still have relatively young children in the house, so
they can't blow up their lives. They just want to
upgrade that. Joining us now is Andrea Peterson, health reporter
at The Wall Street Journal. Thanks for joining Sandra, Thanks
for having me. We're gonna be talking about the virtuous
(14:37):
midlife crisis. Generation X right now is really getting into
the age range where they might be going through these
quote unquote midlife crisis. There was actually an economic study
that just came out not too long ago that says
the peak age where this midlife misery is happening is
forty seven point two years of age. So right in
(14:58):
that range right there. It instead of the traditional kind
of midlife crisis thing that you hear going out and
buying that sports car, partying your ass off again. You
know a lot of people are going the more healthy route.
They want to do yoga, meditation, retreats, and even keto diets.
They want to get their health back in order. Tell
us a little bit about that. So basically, Generation xers,
(15:18):
which are defined as people that range an age from
about four fifty five, they're really redefining the rules of
the midlife crisis. This sort of period of reinvention that
often happens at this time of life where you're sort
of looking at the reality that you're at the second
half of life often kinds there's sort of a reassessment
of what is important to you and what kind of
(15:40):
things do you want to sort of let go of,
and what kind of things do you want to spend
your time on going forward, and the stereotype of it
is you get the sports car, you maybe trade in
your spouse for a different model. But gen X seems
to be really going headlong into having a more virtuous
midlife crisis, going headlong into sort of health and wellness
and yes, keto diets and taking up hiking and yoga
(16:03):
and meditation. And there's a lot of different reasons for this.
I mean, part of it is because gen xers tended
to marry later and have children later. So a lot
of gen xers were telling me they just simply don't
have time to have a full on midlife crisis. I mean,
many of them still have relatively young children in the house,
so they can't blow up their lives. They just want
to upgrade them. And not only that, are they sort
(16:23):
of constrained in terms of what they can do, but
they're very cognizant of the fact that they want to
stay around to see their kids graduate from high school
and launched into the world. So that's part of what
this pivot really towards health and wellness. There's also a
greater understanding about how important lifestyle factors like diet and exercise.
How that can really help prevent some age related diseases
(16:46):
like cancer and heart disease and even dementia. So there's
just a growing awareness that more of your health is
sort of in your control, and that's also feeling this
partly as well. It is also happening at the same
time that we're seeing this wellness industry blow up into
billion trillion dollar businesses all over the place. I mean,
you see that with things like Goop, Gwyneth Paltrow, and
(17:08):
if you end beyond that, I mean it's all over
instant and even young people. This is definitely pervasive in
the culture at large, as you know, sleep apps and botox,
and there's even sort of wellness treats for your dog.
So there's a whole sort of ecosystem that has cropped
up that is very much poised to cater to gen
xers who are looking to move in this direction. Another
(17:29):
point is is that gen xers really can't afford to
have an old school of midlife crisis anymore. Older gen xers,
you know, kind of came of age, they really entered
their working years in the early nineties recession, the two
thou eight economics downturn is when a lot of gen
xers were starting families or looking to buy their first home.
So most Gen xtras have less wealth than their parents
(17:51):
do at the same age and a lot more debt.
Can you imagine what it would be like for millennials
if you're to believe the financial stories that you hear
about how middle animals are far behind or so behind
their predecessors, you know, imagine how that midlife crisis would
even look like. And we're not they may even have
a rougher time than than gen X did because also,
you know, there's the sky recketing costs of healthcare, costs
(18:13):
of college, so costs are increasing, greater job in security,
and you know, this is just huge amounts of student
loan debts that are really weighing people down. So obviously
it's a lot cheaper to take a yoga class than
it is to go buy a sports car. So I
think in some ways gen X is just really sort
of ratching down their expectations in what kind of reinvention
they can really do in midlife because of the financial constraints,
(18:35):
and not everybody goes through this all the time. You
even noted that there was some people that said, you know,
is this kind of traditional thought of a midlife crisis
actually a myth. There's actually very little. I mean, it's
sort of want to continue. I mean, the idea of
sort of a midlife reinvention of its at you know,
a time when you kind of take stock. I mean,
that seems to be like a relatively kind of healthy
and normal kind of developmental experience that happens. But this
(18:59):
idea of like a midlife crisis where you really kind
of change your family structure, you really dramatically change your
life and the people in it is really not supported
by the scientific evidence from the experts that I talked to. So,
you know, that stereotypical midlife crisis, it's even unclear how
many baby boomers actually did it. And Ja Peterson, health
reporter at The Wall Street Journal, thank you very much
(19:20):
for joining us, Thanks for having me. Take care. That's
it for today. Join us on social media at Daily Dive,
pond in both Twitter and Instagram, leave us a comment,
give us a rating, and tell us the stories that
you're interested in. Follow us in I Heart Radio, or
(19:41):
subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. This episode of The
Daily Dive is produced by Victor Wright and engineered by
Tony Sorrentina. I'm Oscar Ramirez and this was your daily dive.
The Daily Dive News
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